WEBVTT

1
00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:05.719
<v Speaker 1>And I think NFTs posed this challenge, which was how

2
00:00:05.719 --> 00:00:10.320
<v Speaker 1>do we hyper align a creator with their community and

3
00:00:10.400 --> 00:00:14.599
<v Speaker 1>have nothing in between? What could happen? Right? That was

4
00:00:14.679 --> 00:00:16.199
<v Speaker 1>like the big big thing.

5
00:00:16.480 --> 00:00:24.519
<v Speaker 2>And so this episode is brought to you by Uphold,

6
00:00:24.559 --> 00:00:27.199
<v Speaker 2>which is a great crypto platform that makes it easy

7
00:00:27.239 --> 00:00:31.120
<v Speaker 2>to buy, sell, and stay crypto assets. Uphold has over

8
00:00:31.320 --> 00:00:35.000
<v Speaker 2>three hundred plus cryptocurrencies, including Bitcoin in all the top

9
00:00:35.039 --> 00:00:38.600
<v Speaker 2>all coins, and they offer a crypto staking on over

10
00:00:38.799 --> 00:00:42.359
<v Speaker 2>nineteen crypto assets. I've been a user of the platform

11
00:00:42.399 --> 00:00:45.840
<v Speaker 2>for many years. They are safe and reliable, they don't

12
00:00:45.840 --> 00:00:49.119
<v Speaker 2>commingle or lend out your crypto funds, and they are

13
00:00:49.200 --> 00:00:53.079
<v Speaker 2>one hundred percent reserve. You can review their transparency report.

14
00:00:53.399 --> 00:00:57.000
<v Speaker 2>Uphold also offers an amazing rewards program where you can

15
00:00:57.079 --> 00:01:00.079
<v Speaker 2>earn up to five point two five percent on stable coin.

16
00:01:00.560 --> 00:01:03.640
<v Speaker 2>This rewards program also allows you to get twenty four

17
00:01:03.719 --> 00:01:07.120
<v Speaker 2>hour early access to new tokens that they list, and

18
00:01:07.200 --> 00:01:10.159
<v Speaker 2>to participate, you just simply have to open the app

19
00:01:10.200 --> 00:01:13.120
<v Speaker 2>once per month, deposit fifty dollars once per month, and

20
00:01:13.200 --> 00:01:16.159
<v Speaker 2>trade fifty dollars once per month. And the stable coins

21
00:01:16.200 --> 00:01:19.439
<v Speaker 2>that they support includes Ripples, r l USD. You can

22
00:01:19.480 --> 00:01:22.560
<v Speaker 2>earn up to five percent on that stable coin and

23
00:01:22.680 --> 00:01:26.159
<v Speaker 2>five point twenty five percent on USBC. So if you

24
00:01:26.200 --> 00:01:28.319
<v Speaker 2>do like to learn more about Uphold and all the

25
00:01:28.319 --> 00:01:31.599
<v Speaker 2>great services they offer, visit the link in the description.

26
00:01:32.319 --> 00:01:35.599
<v Speaker 2>Welcome into the Thinking Crypto Podcast. I'm your host Tony Edward,

27
00:01:35.719 --> 00:01:38.480
<v Speaker 2>and joining me today is Ash Pompati, who is the

28
00:01:38.519 --> 00:01:41.640
<v Speaker 2>head of ecosystem at the app tossk Foundation.

29
00:01:42.079 --> 00:01:43.200
<v Speaker 3>Ash. Great to have you on.

30
00:01:44.239 --> 00:01:46.159
<v Speaker 1>Thanks Tony, I'm excited to be here.

31
00:01:46.760 --> 00:01:50.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Ash, I'm really excited to speak with you, not

32
00:01:50.040 --> 00:01:53.480
<v Speaker 2>only about app toss, but your background in working on

33
00:01:53.560 --> 00:01:56.799
<v Speaker 2>YouTube and you know, working with different initiatives around the

34
00:01:56.840 --> 00:01:59.120
<v Speaker 2>creator economy and myself being creator and I want to

35
00:01:59.480 --> 00:02:02.159
<v Speaker 2>explore different ideas and thoughts with you around that and

36
00:02:02.200 --> 00:02:04.799
<v Speaker 2>how that fits into Web three. But before we get

37
00:02:04.840 --> 00:02:06.959
<v Speaker 2>to all that, love to get to know you a

38
00:02:06.959 --> 00:02:09.240
<v Speaker 2>bit better. Tell us about yourself, where you're from, and

39
00:02:09.280 --> 00:02:10.319
<v Speaker 2>your professional background.

40
00:02:10.599 --> 00:02:16.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's great. I'm Ash. I have lived in New

41
00:02:16.080 --> 00:02:19.400
<v Speaker 1>York for about nineteen years, so I'm technically a New Yorker,

42
00:02:19.439 --> 00:02:24.120
<v Speaker 1>but grew up in rural eastern Kentucky, which was an

43
00:02:24.159 --> 00:02:31.719
<v Speaker 1>exciting character building experience. I got into working for software companies,

44
00:02:31.960 --> 00:02:37.479
<v Speaker 1>primarily through a company called Spotify. So when it was

45
00:02:37.560 --> 00:02:39.879
<v Speaker 1>launching in the US, it was a product that fell

46
00:02:39.919 --> 00:02:43.719
<v Speaker 1>in love with. I was actually vpning it for twelve

47
00:02:43.759 --> 00:02:47.080
<v Speaker 1>months prior when it wasn't available in the US, joined

48
00:02:47.120 --> 00:02:49.879
<v Speaker 1>as one of the first marketers there to lead growth marketing,

49
00:02:51.280 --> 00:02:55.199
<v Speaker 1>and then graduated over to the big mothership of Google

50
00:02:55.800 --> 00:03:00.360
<v Speaker 1>to focus on music product growth across the company. And

51
00:03:00.400 --> 00:03:03.800
<v Speaker 1>then I've been in Web three professionally since twenty twenty

52
00:03:03.800 --> 00:03:07.280
<v Speaker 1>two and now here at Avtos Foundation leading the ecosystem.

53
00:03:08.120 --> 00:03:10.919
<v Speaker 2>So when did you first Well you mentioned the year

54
00:03:11.120 --> 00:03:13.240
<v Speaker 2>you kind of made the transition, but what was your

55
00:03:13.280 --> 00:03:16.240
<v Speaker 2>first encounter with crypto blockchain and what was your home

56
00:03:16.280 --> 00:03:18.960
<v Speaker 2>moment and how did that lead to you jumping industries?

57
00:03:19.759 --> 00:03:22.360
<v Speaker 1>Well, you know, I can't lie and say I was

58
00:03:22.400 --> 00:03:25.599
<v Speaker 1>a Bitcoin MAXI on the forums. That's not when I

59
00:03:25.599 --> 00:03:30.240
<v Speaker 1>got onboarded. I actually got onboarded while I was at YouTube.

60
00:03:30.840 --> 00:03:34.159
<v Speaker 1>You know, my primary focus there was how do we

61
00:03:34.280 --> 00:03:39.639
<v Speaker 1>take YouTube, which has pioneered in trailblazed the native web

62
00:03:39.680 --> 00:03:45.319
<v Speaker 1>creator economy, and divert that energy towards artists and musicians

63
00:03:45.360 --> 00:03:50.439
<v Speaker 1>who are kind of held back by legacy systems. I

64
00:03:50.479 --> 00:03:53.879
<v Speaker 1>saw creators and video creators going up into the right

65
00:03:54.080 --> 00:03:56.719
<v Speaker 1>in terms of their exposure, the money they were generating,

66
00:03:56.840 --> 00:03:59.800
<v Speaker 1>the agency they had over their business. And I saw

67
00:03:59.840 --> 00:04:03.280
<v Speaker 1>our artists and musicians kind of stuck in this stasis.

68
00:04:03.520 --> 00:04:08.599
<v Speaker 1>They weren't extracting enough value from the Internet in terms

69
00:04:08.639 --> 00:04:11.439
<v Speaker 1>of modernization. They weren't able to decide where their content

70
00:04:11.479 --> 00:04:15.360
<v Speaker 1>could be, they weren't able to own their fans, and

71
00:04:15.400 --> 00:04:17.240
<v Speaker 1>so that was a nut I was trying to crack

72
00:04:17.279 --> 00:04:19.279
<v Speaker 1>over the seven and a half years I was over there,

73
00:04:19.360 --> 00:04:23.839
<v Speaker 1>And then about twenty twenty one we saw the NFT

74
00:04:24.040 --> 00:04:28.439
<v Speaker 1>craze happening on eth but I was actually introduced to

75
00:04:28.600 --> 00:04:33.040
<v Speaker 1>NFTs on Solana and so in my kind of research,

76
00:04:33.120 --> 00:04:35.680
<v Speaker 1>because every year, you know, I was the one who

77
00:04:35.720 --> 00:04:38.240
<v Speaker 1>would compile all the fresh ideas to present to the

78
00:04:38.319 --> 00:04:40.480
<v Speaker 1>CEO and say, hey, we need to do this. Here's

79
00:04:40.480 --> 00:04:44.759
<v Speaker 1>the justification. So even starting in twenty twenty one, I

80
00:04:44.800 --> 00:04:46.759
<v Speaker 1>was like, we need to explore Web three. There's a

81
00:04:46.759 --> 00:04:50.519
<v Speaker 1>burgeoning creator economy over there. I don't think that YouTube

82
00:04:50.560 --> 00:04:53.560
<v Speaker 1>is set up to actually attract this segment of creators,

83
00:04:53.600 --> 00:04:56.600
<v Speaker 1>and it's the first time we've probably been boxed out

84
00:04:56.759 --> 00:05:03.319
<v Speaker 1>from a true native Internet creator economy. And so you know,

85
00:05:03.399 --> 00:05:06.800
<v Speaker 1>I was doing my explorations, I was obviously seeing NFTs

86
00:05:06.879 --> 00:05:10.279
<v Speaker 1>kind of break through the mainstream, but I was onboarded

87
00:05:10.279 --> 00:05:15.560
<v Speaker 1>through Solana, so Magic Eden and Phantom, and in that experience,

88
00:05:15.800 --> 00:05:19.399
<v Speaker 1>I kind of experienced the opposite of the horror stories

89
00:05:19.480 --> 00:05:22.199
<v Speaker 1>I would see on Reddit of people trying to buy NFTs,

90
00:05:22.279 --> 00:05:25.439
<v Speaker 1>whether it's like paying exorbit in gas skees or high

91
00:05:25.519 --> 00:05:30.439
<v Speaker 1>floor prices or transactions not coming through. You know, I

92
00:05:30.519 --> 00:05:33.120
<v Speaker 1>went into Phantom, I went into Magic Eaton, bought my

93
00:05:33.160 --> 00:05:36.120
<v Speaker 1>first NFT and the ux was as smooth as what

94
00:05:36.279 --> 00:05:39.199
<v Speaker 1>I was accustomed to as a Web two user. And

95
00:05:39.240 --> 00:05:43.199
<v Speaker 1>that's when I said, okay, like I need to fully

96
00:05:43.279 --> 00:05:46.360
<v Speaker 1>jump in both feet in this space. I can't wait

97
00:05:46.439 --> 00:05:50.120
<v Speaker 1>till YouTube, with all of its diversified interest areas to

98
00:05:50.240 --> 00:05:55.319
<v Speaker 1>kind of come along with the new economy that's building

99
00:05:55.600 --> 00:05:59.720
<v Speaker 1>that's being built out here. And so I left fully

100
00:05:59.759 --> 00:06:03.959
<v Speaker 1>two feed in joined a company called Metaplex, which spun

101
00:06:04.000 --> 00:06:07.079
<v Speaker 1>out of Solona Labs, which was the base layer of

102
00:06:07.759 --> 00:06:11.839
<v Speaker 1>token infrastructure for Solona. So that's how I got introduced

103
00:06:11.879 --> 00:06:15.319
<v Speaker 1>and very quickly jumped in the boat to work professionally.

104
00:06:16.120 --> 00:06:19.759
<v Speaker 2>That's amazing as a creator, you know, I'm waiting for

105
00:06:19.839 --> 00:06:25.439
<v Speaker 2>today where YouTube integrates blockchain for profiles, web monetization, maybe

106
00:06:25.519 --> 00:06:29.560
<v Speaker 2>payouts and tokens and even some sort of NFT marketplace

107
00:06:30.000 --> 00:06:33.360
<v Speaker 2>built in in some way where I can reward my subscribers.

108
00:06:33.879 --> 00:06:36.600
<v Speaker 2>Were there any talks about those type of things. I

109
00:06:36.600 --> 00:06:38.240
<v Speaker 2>don't know if you can disclose that and if you're

110
00:06:38.279 --> 00:06:40.680
<v Speaker 2>under NDA and things like that, but were there any

111
00:06:40.720 --> 00:06:42.800
<v Speaker 2>talks about those things down the road?

112
00:06:44.040 --> 00:06:46.920
<v Speaker 1>So we were always trying to think of ways in

113
00:06:47.000 --> 00:06:52.040
<v Speaker 1>which creators could build direct relationships with their users or

114
00:06:52.079 --> 00:06:56.720
<v Speaker 1>their viewers or their fans, and also monetized that more

115
00:06:56.759 --> 00:06:59.560
<v Speaker 1>directly so that they had more control whether it's the

116
00:06:59.600 --> 00:07:04.800
<v Speaker 1>brand they wanted to support or they you know, margin

117
00:07:04.839 --> 00:07:07.000
<v Speaker 1>they wanted to get from, like the revenue that was

118
00:07:07.040 --> 00:07:11.240
<v Speaker 1>generating on platform. You know, advertising is this big beast, right,

119
00:07:11.399 --> 00:07:14.959
<v Speaker 1>And really the majority of revenue from advertising comes from

120
00:07:15.000 --> 00:07:20.240
<v Speaker 1>like seven big CpG brands, right, And so those folks

121
00:07:20.279 --> 00:07:23.120
<v Speaker 1>have a very specific opinion on where they want their

122
00:07:23.160 --> 00:07:27.480
<v Speaker 1>content to be exposed and where they're willing to pay

123
00:07:27.879 --> 00:07:32.160
<v Speaker 1>for that premium inventory. And so for creators, they may

124
00:07:32.279 --> 00:07:35.040
<v Speaker 1>flood into that zone for a period of time, but

125
00:07:35.120 --> 00:07:38.160
<v Speaker 1>they also may graduate out of it. When they have

126
00:07:38.439 --> 00:07:42.160
<v Speaker 1>a more niche or loyal audience. And so what we

127
00:07:42.160 --> 00:07:45.920
<v Speaker 1>were always trying to figure out is when a creator

128
00:07:46.000 --> 00:07:50.279
<v Speaker 1>kind of either before they hit that that leap into

129
00:07:50.360 --> 00:07:53.120
<v Speaker 1>the public mainstream consciousness where they're at the front page

130
00:07:53.120 --> 00:07:57.040
<v Speaker 1>of YouTube and they're alongside like you know, you know,

131
00:07:57.120 --> 00:08:00.480
<v Speaker 1>Netflix shows and HBO shows and they're creating content on

132
00:08:00.600 --> 00:08:04.639
<v Speaker 1>par What can we do to create sickness? And so

133
00:08:04.720 --> 00:08:07.879
<v Speaker 1>there was a lot of thoughts around digital goods. There

134
00:08:07.959 --> 00:08:11.639
<v Speaker 1>was a lot of thoughts around you know, paygated content

135
00:08:11.759 --> 00:08:14.519
<v Speaker 1>for exclusive you know, I can subscribe, I can pay

136
00:08:14.560 --> 00:08:17.839
<v Speaker 1>to subscribe to mister Visa channel to get exclusive content.

137
00:08:18.639 --> 00:08:21.360
<v Speaker 1>But you know, from my personal opinion and not speaking

138
00:08:21.399 --> 00:08:25.759
<v Speaker 1>on behalf of YouTube, this was always a hard challenge

139
00:08:25.800 --> 00:08:28.720
<v Speaker 1>to solve for the creator in the sense that they

140
00:08:28.759 --> 00:08:33.840
<v Speaker 1>were already working so hard to get into that mainstream exposure.

141
00:08:33.879 --> 00:08:36.000
<v Speaker 1>Like the amount of content you need to create, and

142
00:08:36.120 --> 00:08:39.639
<v Speaker 1>I'm sure Tony you know yourself, right, Like the amount

143
00:08:39.759 --> 00:08:43.120
<v Speaker 1>of velocity you need to have to push out content

144
00:08:43.240 --> 00:08:47.759
<v Speaker 1>to stay on be That's like you're basically like running

145
00:08:47.759 --> 00:08:50.559
<v Speaker 1>on a treadmill at full speed, and you're probably any

146
00:08:50.600 --> 00:08:53.200
<v Speaker 1>money you're getting you're putting back into the content, right,

147
00:08:54.919 --> 00:08:58.279
<v Speaker 1>So what additional capacity does the creator have to like

148
00:08:58.399 --> 00:09:02.240
<v Speaker 1>start to support new verticals that may have different modernization principles,

149
00:09:02.919 --> 00:09:05.879
<v Speaker 1>And so you have to do that balance of Okay,

150
00:09:06.080 --> 00:09:08.799
<v Speaker 1>I need to get into the mainstream, right, I need

151
00:09:08.840 --> 00:09:11.360
<v Speaker 1>to break through on the front page algorithm, and it's

152
00:09:11.399 --> 00:09:12.799
<v Speaker 1>going to take a lot of work and a lot

153
00:09:12.799 --> 00:09:14.679
<v Speaker 1>of time, and there's tons of people competing with me.

154
00:09:17.679 --> 00:09:20.960
<v Speaker 1>Can I clone myself right to like actually so you know,

155
00:09:21.039 --> 00:09:24.200
<v Speaker 1>support these other verticals And the majority of the answer

156
00:09:24.360 --> 00:09:28.799
<v Speaker 1>was no, Like creators didn't have the capacity to say,

157
00:09:28.840 --> 00:09:32.200
<v Speaker 1>now I do content for paygated folks, or now like

158
00:09:32.639 --> 00:09:34.480
<v Speaker 1>I have a bunch of new things to like sell

159
00:09:34.480 --> 00:09:39.240
<v Speaker 1>digital goods, And so for me, that's that's generally. I

160
00:09:39.279 --> 00:09:43.960
<v Speaker 1>think a core insight from that was the way in

161
00:09:44.039 --> 00:09:47.080
<v Speaker 1>which web two generally works, which is like broad distribution

162
00:09:47.240 --> 00:09:51.080
<v Speaker 1>model works for a few, and unless you're that few,

163
00:09:51.600 --> 00:09:54.519
<v Speaker 1>you're kind of out on past to pasture with being

164
00:09:54.519 --> 00:09:58.200
<v Speaker 1>able to like earn a living being a creator. And

165
00:09:58.279 --> 00:10:01.080
<v Speaker 1>so my perspective it was there needs to be a

166
00:10:01.120 --> 00:10:04.279
<v Speaker 1>new model, and that model needs to be needs to

167
00:10:04.279 --> 00:10:06.879
<v Speaker 1>be supported by great professionals working in it.

168
00:10:07.200 --> 00:10:10.639
<v Speaker 2>So on that note of that new model. Do you

169
00:10:10.720 --> 00:10:14.679
<v Speaker 2>see eventually YouTube and all these platforms are going to

170
00:10:14.720 --> 00:10:16.840
<v Speaker 2>have to capitulate in one way or the other to

171
00:10:17.120 --> 00:10:20.399
<v Speaker 2>integrate into Web three because I don't know.

172
00:10:20.480 --> 00:10:22.039
<v Speaker 3>Usually there's that first mover.

173
00:10:22.320 --> 00:10:25.399
<v Speaker 2>Who's the big domino to fall, and then game theory

174
00:10:25.440 --> 00:10:28.120
<v Speaker 2>plays out? You know, how do you see that maybe

175
00:10:28.159 --> 00:10:30.960
<v Speaker 2>in five years? You know, is it YouTube that capitulates

176
00:10:30.960 --> 00:10:32.720
<v Speaker 2>because they're like, hey, we need to catch up and

177
00:10:32.720 --> 00:10:33.919
<v Speaker 2>we need to stay ahead of the curve.

178
00:10:34.919 --> 00:10:40.639
<v Speaker 1>I don't. I can't anticipate YouTube capitulating on something that extreme.

179
00:10:41.679 --> 00:10:44.399
<v Speaker 1>You know. My perspective with a lot of these traditional

180
00:10:45.279 --> 00:10:49.720
<v Speaker 1>media technology firms is that the creator is the algorithm,

181
00:10:50.879 --> 00:10:55.559
<v Speaker 1>Like their algorithm becomes the creator, and that creator can

182
00:10:55.600 --> 00:10:58.120
<v Speaker 1>wear many different hats, it can have very different voices,

183
00:10:58.279 --> 00:11:02.039
<v Speaker 1>it can be from many different places. But that's essentially

184
00:11:02.080 --> 00:11:06.200
<v Speaker 1>what's happening, right. I mean, you see other companies just

185
00:11:06.279 --> 00:11:08.720
<v Speaker 1>creating their own content. They're like scanning the data, they're

186
00:11:08.720 --> 00:11:11.039
<v Speaker 1>seeing what people are vibing with and they're like making

187
00:11:11.039 --> 00:11:13.159
<v Speaker 1>a movie or a show like in the next three months,

188
00:11:13.159 --> 00:11:15.000
<v Speaker 1>and like they made it, you know what I mean.

189
00:11:15.039 --> 00:11:18.240
<v Speaker 1>And that's what's on the front page. The question to

190
00:11:18.320 --> 00:11:21.360
<v Speaker 1>me is can they continue to do that if they

191
00:11:21.360 --> 00:11:24.399
<v Speaker 1>don't have a pipeline of long tailed creators continuing to

192
00:11:24.480 --> 00:11:28.919
<v Speaker 1>engage with the platform. And so from my perspective, I

193
00:11:28.960 --> 00:11:31.399
<v Speaker 1>don't know what the time horizon is on whether that

194
00:11:31.480 --> 00:11:35.759
<v Speaker 1>becomes a problem, but eventually you could imagine it would. Right,

195
00:11:35.960 --> 00:11:38.200
<v Speaker 1>So if you don't have a two way economy and

196
00:11:38.240 --> 00:11:41.080
<v Speaker 1>you don't have two ways signal, like your algorithm isn't

197
00:11:41.159 --> 00:11:44.200
<v Speaker 1>just it isn't going to be as good to produce

198
00:11:44.240 --> 00:11:46.399
<v Speaker 1>the thing that the user or your viewer would want.

199
00:11:47.200 --> 00:11:51.519
<v Speaker 1>And I think an element to that is can I

200
00:11:51.559 --> 00:11:55.120
<v Speaker 1>be a creator on your platform and not have another

201
00:11:55.279 --> 00:11:59.559
<v Speaker 1>job if I only have a thousand subscribers? That's that's

202
00:11:59.600 --> 00:12:03.759
<v Speaker 1>the question, right, Like can I earn a living right

203
00:12:04.639 --> 00:12:09.279
<v Speaker 1>being someone who only has a thousand subscribers? And maybe

204
00:12:09.360 --> 00:12:12.360
<v Speaker 1>I'm not creating content to have a million subscribers, right,

205
00:12:14.440 --> 00:12:17.399
<v Speaker 1>And I think that's like the question yet to be answered,

206
00:12:18.720 --> 00:12:21.320
<v Speaker 1>and I already see it, Like you know, I'm from

207
00:12:21.360 --> 00:12:26.440
<v Speaker 1>the music industry. From a tech perspective, you don't see

208
00:12:26.480 --> 00:12:29.039
<v Speaker 1>you see a lot of artists now who could have

209
00:12:29.080 --> 00:12:32.879
<v Speaker 1>been great getting a job and stopping artists like you're

210
00:12:32.919 --> 00:12:37.759
<v Speaker 1>seeing that every single day, right, And The question is

211
00:12:37.840 --> 00:12:41.279
<v Speaker 1>what happens when when that thing prolongs for a period

212
00:12:41.320 --> 00:12:45.120
<v Speaker 1>of time. And my perspective from where I've always worked

213
00:12:45.200 --> 00:12:48.759
<v Speaker 1>is nothing good happens. We don't get good experiences, we

214
00:12:48.799 --> 00:12:52.559
<v Speaker 1>don't get good content, we don't actually build interests that

215
00:12:52.639 --> 00:12:56.879
<v Speaker 1>are unique as people. But I don't know the time

216
00:12:56.919 --> 00:12:59.600
<v Speaker 1>horizonal when that would be felt or when a huge

217
00:12:59.600 --> 00:13:01.919
<v Speaker 1>company like YouTube would feel like they need to make

218
00:13:01.919 --> 00:13:02.399
<v Speaker 1>a shift.

219
00:13:03.279 --> 00:13:06.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's interesting because I don't know what that catalystism

220
00:13:06.480 --> 00:13:08.440
<v Speaker 2>is myself. But I think about these things being in

221
00:13:08.480 --> 00:13:11.679
<v Speaker 2>Web three and you know, certain industries, what would be

222
00:13:11.720 --> 00:13:14.559
<v Speaker 2>the tipping point for mainstream adoption? And I don't know

223
00:13:14.600 --> 00:13:17.879
<v Speaker 2>if it has to be other brands out there, whether

224
00:13:17.919 --> 00:13:21.000
<v Speaker 2>it's in the sports or gaming world where they onboard

225
00:13:21.080 --> 00:13:23.960
<v Speaker 2>a ton of people on chain with via NFTs and

226
00:13:24.000 --> 00:13:27.600
<v Speaker 2>then the public in general becomes more educated and aware

227
00:13:27.639 --> 00:13:29.720
<v Speaker 2>of this, and then they're like, hey, why can't I

228
00:13:29.720 --> 00:13:32.600
<v Speaker 2>get it from mister Bees and mister Beest then says.

229
00:13:32.440 --> 00:13:35.000
<v Speaker 3>Okay, I can offer it, but I can offer a YouTube.

230
00:13:35.039 --> 00:13:36.440
<v Speaker 3>I want you off YouTube.

231
00:13:36.440 --> 00:13:38.519
<v Speaker 2>Maybe that's where YouTube's like, no, I don't want them

232
00:13:38.519 --> 00:13:40.840
<v Speaker 2>to leave, I want to stay the on the platform.

233
00:13:41.159 --> 00:13:42.200
<v Speaker 3>Maybe something like that.

234
00:13:43.200 --> 00:13:46.399
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think it's it's interesting you say that because

235
00:13:46.879 --> 00:13:49.879
<v Speaker 1>you know, when I was there, we would often debate, right, like,

236
00:13:50.600 --> 00:13:54.720
<v Speaker 1>you know, YouTube kind of from its from its core

237
00:13:55.000 --> 00:13:58.159
<v Speaker 1>in terms of like the thesis of why it was

238
00:13:58.200 --> 00:14:02.360
<v Speaker 1>important to society was it was like the library of Alexandria.

239
00:14:03.000 --> 00:14:06.080
<v Speaker 1>Like in today's age, anything you could have wanted to

240
00:14:06.159 --> 00:14:12.360
<v Speaker 1>know ever know was there. Now principally we had to

241
00:14:12.399 --> 00:14:18.440
<v Speaker 1>start to peel back that notion because now you have creators,

242
00:14:18.799 --> 00:14:22.840
<v Speaker 1>You have creators who became brands, you have music, you

243
00:14:22.919 --> 00:14:28.759
<v Speaker 1>have all of these things that are meant to want

244
00:14:28.799 --> 00:14:32.039
<v Speaker 1>to be everywhere. Right, So not just YouTube, but if

245
00:14:32.080 --> 00:14:37.279
<v Speaker 1>YouTube has to have everything there, it really creates a

246
00:14:37.320 --> 00:14:41.080
<v Speaker 1>big risk exposure for them to like just basically keep

247
00:14:41.080 --> 00:14:44.879
<v Speaker 1>paying upwards and upwards of everything you know, of licensing

248
00:14:44.919 --> 00:14:48.639
<v Speaker 1>to like keep everything there. So I think where I

249
00:14:48.840 --> 00:14:50.960
<v Speaker 1>kind of from my vantage point at the company, we

250
00:14:51.320 --> 00:14:54.039
<v Speaker 1>kind of sat and said, actually, you know what, it's

251
00:14:54.039 --> 00:14:57.320
<v Speaker 1>a distribution platform. So like, if you're an artist and

252
00:14:57.360 --> 00:14:59.799
<v Speaker 1>you have an album coming out, we don't need the

253
00:14:59.799 --> 00:15:02.399
<v Speaker 1>whole album on there, but you should probably create a

254
00:15:02.480 --> 00:15:06.360
<v Speaker 1>video that's compelling, that's interesting, or a series of videos

255
00:15:06.399 --> 00:15:09.759
<v Speaker 1>that fits with what we know, the algorithm rewards to

256
00:15:09.960 --> 00:15:12.759
<v Speaker 1>push people to that thing, and we always kind of

257
00:15:13.200 --> 00:15:16.320
<v Speaker 1>positioned it as advertising that pays, you know what I mean,

258
00:15:17.240 --> 00:15:20.039
<v Speaker 1>if you invest in the platform and you push the

259
00:15:20.120 --> 00:15:23.279
<v Speaker 1>right content and you actually understand how thumbnails work and

260
00:15:23.320 --> 00:15:26.200
<v Speaker 1>like how the algorithm is triggered, and what atomic networks

261
00:15:26.200 --> 00:15:28.320
<v Speaker 1>of creators you have to have promote you, and how

262
00:15:28.399 --> 00:15:34.159
<v Speaker 1>comments like input into like your velocity for viewership that

263
00:15:34.200 --> 00:15:36.399
<v Speaker 1>can be a jumping off point for you to like

264
00:15:36.480 --> 00:15:39.120
<v Speaker 1>push people to deeper experiences. And by the way, you

265
00:15:39.159 --> 00:15:42.960
<v Speaker 1>get paid, like that's monetized and everything. So it was

266
00:15:43.080 --> 00:15:46.559
<v Speaker 1>kind of a slight nuance in terms of how we

267
00:15:46.639 --> 00:15:51.039
<v Speaker 1>pivoted our positioning because I think that's true, right, and

268
00:15:51.080 --> 00:15:53.320
<v Speaker 1>I think a lot of people use YouTube as that

269
00:15:53.399 --> 00:15:58.279
<v Speaker 1>front door to like push something elsewhere. Yeah, but you know,

270
00:15:58.360 --> 00:16:02.399
<v Speaker 1>if YouTube continues to being effective distribution platform for creators

271
00:16:02.440 --> 00:16:06.000
<v Speaker 1>to push people in different areas, it will always be important.

272
00:16:06.480 --> 00:16:08.759
<v Speaker 3>M I appreciate that perspective.

273
00:16:08.799 --> 00:16:11.960
<v Speaker 2>It's it's I'm really fascinated by what's going to happen

274
00:16:12.039 --> 00:16:14.919
<v Speaker 2>with YouTube and the creator economy, and you know, given

275
00:16:14.919 --> 00:16:17.120
<v Speaker 2>how big the platform is, but we'll have to wait

276
00:16:17.120 --> 00:16:20.080
<v Speaker 2>and see. So on that note though, is app toss

277
00:16:20.159 --> 00:16:22.639
<v Speaker 2>you and the folks at apt halls going knocking the

278
00:16:22.679 --> 00:16:26.440
<v Speaker 2>door of these companies saying, hey, let's explore web three together.

279
00:16:27.600 --> 00:16:33.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So I think the history of aptos definitely so,

280
00:16:33.759 --> 00:16:37.600
<v Speaker 1>like you know, crypto is kind of these cycles of

281
00:16:37.720 --> 00:16:42.399
<v Speaker 1>huge catalytic moments that propel or pull forward adoption. And

282
00:16:42.480 --> 00:16:46.679
<v Speaker 1>so I think I was onboarded with NFTs. I wasn't

283
00:16:46.679 --> 00:16:52.320
<v Speaker 1>onboarded with icos or bitcoin mining or whatever. And I

284
00:16:52.320 --> 00:16:57.679
<v Speaker 1>think NFTs posed this challenge, which was how do we

285
00:16:57.799 --> 00:17:02.600
<v Speaker 1>hyper align a creator with their community and have nothing

286
00:17:02.639 --> 00:17:04.680
<v Speaker 1>in between? What could happen?

287
00:17:05.079 --> 00:17:05.279
<v Speaker 3>Right?

288
00:17:05.920 --> 00:17:09.359
<v Speaker 1>That was like the big big thing. And so when

289
00:17:09.400 --> 00:17:12.240
<v Speaker 1>I was with the Salon ecosystem, that was everything right like,

290
00:17:12.279 --> 00:17:15.039
<v Speaker 1>because that's that's what kind of bootstrapped a lot of

291
00:17:15.039 --> 00:17:21.359
<v Speaker 1>the ecosystem. Was this attention around NFTs, the financialization of communities,

292
00:17:21.680 --> 00:17:25.319
<v Speaker 1>the discourse within communities of why this project is the best,

293
00:17:25.359 --> 00:17:28.599
<v Speaker 1>why that project isn't the best, the transfer of communities

294
00:17:28.599 --> 00:17:31.920
<v Speaker 1>from one community to another. There was so much communal

295
00:17:32.000 --> 00:17:37.440
<v Speaker 1>activity right that bootstrapped all these products while phantom like

296
00:17:37.559 --> 00:17:40.759
<v Speaker 1>magic eaten like you know, and really set the foundation

297
00:17:41.000 --> 00:17:44.759
<v Speaker 1>for I think what like truly financialized communities became with

298
00:17:44.880 --> 00:17:49.400
<v Speaker 1>for mem coils, right, and that kind of like sprouted out.

299
00:17:49.640 --> 00:17:52.160
<v Speaker 1>I think for a blockchain like aptoss, you know, we

300
00:17:52.400 --> 00:17:55.000
<v Speaker 1>need to push to where we think the puck is going,

301
00:17:55.640 --> 00:17:59.920
<v Speaker 1>and so you know, I think for us NFTs we

302
00:18:00.119 --> 00:18:03.119
<v Speaker 1>a vibrant like you know, collection and community of NFTs

303
00:18:03.599 --> 00:18:06.400
<v Speaker 1>on app toss. But I kind of see them as

304
00:18:06.720 --> 00:18:10.440
<v Speaker 1>a way in which to have a signal within the

305
00:18:10.559 --> 00:18:16.359
<v Speaker 1>ecosystem of loyal supporters that are highly networked that if

306
00:18:16.359 --> 00:18:18.519
<v Speaker 1>you're a new project coming to app toss and you

307
00:18:18.640 --> 00:18:21.519
<v Speaker 1>tap into those, you'll immediately be distributed. It's kind of

308
00:18:21.559 --> 00:18:26.000
<v Speaker 1>like these micro radio towers, right that have a brand

309
00:18:26.039 --> 00:18:29.720
<v Speaker 1>presence online because everyone has a PfP or you know,

310
00:18:29.920 --> 00:18:32.480
<v Speaker 1>can socially signal and there's a discord where people are

311
00:18:32.480 --> 00:18:34.880
<v Speaker 1>like meeting up and talking all day about every topic

312
00:18:34.960 --> 00:18:39.200
<v Speaker 1>in the world. So I think they're important to basically

313
00:18:39.200 --> 00:18:43.119
<v Speaker 1>be these radio towers to help ecosystems bootstrap and also

314
00:18:43.240 --> 00:18:46.680
<v Speaker 1>just represent the brand of aptosts from a bottoms up perspective,

315
00:18:46.759 --> 00:18:50.559
<v Speaker 1>So I think in the traditional sense of what NFTs

316
00:18:50.599 --> 00:18:53.960
<v Speaker 1>were represented as, that's still important, but on the technology

317
00:18:54.000 --> 00:18:58.559
<v Speaker 1>perspective of what an NFT is to me, it is

318
00:18:59.200 --> 00:19:01.559
<v Speaker 1>the way I think about it is it is a

319
00:19:01.559 --> 00:19:05.720
<v Speaker 1>better retention mechanism which would thus give you better monetization

320
00:19:06.079 --> 00:19:09.680
<v Speaker 1>of your customers. Right. So I think about it as

321
00:19:10.079 --> 00:19:12.400
<v Speaker 1>every you know, B two C or B to B

322
00:19:12.599 --> 00:19:15.480
<v Speaker 1>app like in web two, right, they have, you know,

323
00:19:15.519 --> 00:19:19.400
<v Speaker 1>if they're a good operating team, they really have a

324
00:19:19.440 --> 00:19:23.440
<v Speaker 1>tight growth funnel analysis and they monitor each element of

325
00:19:23.480 --> 00:19:27.119
<v Speaker 1>that right of to say, okay, when someone signs up

326
00:19:27.799 --> 00:19:30.839
<v Speaker 1>on day one, what activities are they taking? Based on

327
00:19:30.880 --> 00:19:33.480
<v Speaker 1>those activities, what's to drop off to day two retention?

328
00:19:33.839 --> 00:19:35.400
<v Speaker 1>And then you zoom out all the way to thirty

329
00:19:35.480 --> 00:19:37.440
<v Speaker 1>day returned And now you're all of a sudden thinking

330
00:19:37.440 --> 00:19:40.480
<v Speaker 1>about retention overall for your product, and you make decisions

331
00:19:40.960 --> 00:19:44.400
<v Speaker 1>and fts to meet are, if executed the right ways

332
00:19:44.400 --> 00:19:47.799
<v Speaker 1>of core technology a better way to drive retention and

333
00:19:47.920 --> 00:19:50.759
<v Speaker 1>less churn from that moment you log in and use

334
00:19:50.799 --> 00:19:55.240
<v Speaker 1>the app. Right, And so I think as a core technology,

335
00:19:55.319 --> 00:19:59.400
<v Speaker 1>they're actually going to be an accelerant to how scaling

336
00:19:59.519 --> 00:20:04.200
<v Speaker 1>B two C or beat it be apps actually drive monetization.

337
00:20:04.839 --> 00:20:09.160
<v Speaker 2>Interesting and do you foresee there being what maybe called

338
00:20:09.279 --> 00:20:12.799
<v Speaker 2>dynamic NFT is that maybe the longer you're a customer

339
00:20:12.920 --> 00:20:17.160
<v Speaker 2>or you're loyal to the brand, the NFT continues to

340
00:20:17.279 --> 00:20:19.559
<v Speaker 2>unlock and open up new things for you. So it's

341
00:20:19.559 --> 00:20:22.839
<v Speaker 2>not just okay, it's static monkey japag, but it's more

342
00:20:22.880 --> 00:20:25.799
<v Speaker 2>than that, right, and it kind of like a digital

343
00:20:25.880 --> 00:20:28.279
<v Speaker 2>key so to speak. It just unlocks new features and

344
00:20:28.319 --> 00:20:30.200
<v Speaker 2>things the longer you're a customer.

345
00:20:31.000 --> 00:20:33.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean, I think that's the other kind of

346
00:20:33.759 --> 00:20:37.920
<v Speaker 1>like adjacent application to the two things I mentioned, which

347
00:20:38.000 --> 00:20:42.480
<v Speaker 1>is it is an identity token in a way. Now

348
00:20:42.480 --> 00:20:46.839
<v Speaker 1>what context that identity is contextualized is dependent, right. It

349
00:20:46.880 --> 00:20:49.680
<v Speaker 1>could be a soul bound NFT where like this is

350
00:20:49.799 --> 00:20:53.039
<v Speaker 1>only for you, and because you have this, it's locked

351
00:20:53.039 --> 00:20:55.759
<v Speaker 1>to you, you can't even transfer to anyone else even

352
00:20:55.759 --> 00:20:58.960
<v Speaker 1>if I want to pay. It could be an identity

353
00:20:58.960 --> 00:21:01.400
<v Speaker 1>of you within a community, so you have a unique

354
00:21:01.400 --> 00:21:03.839
<v Speaker 1>PfP that's like one on one and you're part of

355
00:21:03.839 --> 00:21:05.759
<v Speaker 1>a community that everyone else has a different one on

356
00:21:05.759 --> 00:21:08.640
<v Speaker 1>one and that's you, you know, like I'm punk xys,

357
00:21:09.319 --> 00:21:12.640
<v Speaker 1>like you know what I mean. And so I think

358
00:21:12.680 --> 00:21:16.799
<v Speaker 1>the concept of what is an identity and a truly

359
00:21:16.839 --> 00:21:21.359
<v Speaker 1>permissionless and trustless world, NFTs have brought a lot of

360
00:21:22.240 --> 00:21:26.039
<v Speaker 1>context to but I certainly think there's tons more room

361
00:21:26.119 --> 00:21:29.119
<v Speaker 1>to establish what the what I guess like the killer

362
00:21:29.240 --> 00:21:29.799
<v Speaker 1>use cases?

363
00:21:30.519 --> 00:21:31.160
<v Speaker 3>Oh for sure.

364
00:21:32.039 --> 00:21:34.160
<v Speaker 2>Now, for those who may not know about app toss,

365
00:21:34.440 --> 00:21:37.160
<v Speaker 2>tell us a bit about the blockchain and you know

366
00:21:37.640 --> 00:21:39.680
<v Speaker 2>what makes it different from other blockchains.

367
00:21:40.440 --> 00:21:44.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So app toos is a highly performance layer one

368
00:21:44.480 --> 00:21:49.519
<v Speaker 1>blockchain built with a native programming language called Move. It

369
00:21:49.599 --> 00:21:53.000
<v Speaker 1>was actually incubated or started with the liber dm project

370
00:21:53.000 --> 00:21:56.759
<v Speaker 1>at Meta, which, if some of your viewers may know

371
00:21:56.880 --> 00:22:02.480
<v Speaker 1>or you may know Tony, was essentially the plan or

372
00:22:02.519 --> 00:22:08.519
<v Speaker 1>the strategy to transfer value across metas super app economy.

373
00:22:09.000 --> 00:22:11.640
<v Speaker 1>So you have Instagram, you have WhatsApp, right, you have

374
00:22:11.680 --> 00:22:17.000
<v Speaker 1>Facebook itself. How can those users actually send assets or

375
00:22:17.119 --> 00:22:21.200
<v Speaker 1>money across that ecosystem. Well, you need a blockchain to

376
00:22:21.240 --> 00:22:23.079
<v Speaker 1>do that, and you probably need a currency on that

377
00:22:23.119 --> 00:22:27.880
<v Speaker 1>blockchain to do that. So app toss was principle by principle,

378
00:22:28.880 --> 00:22:31.759
<v Speaker 1>the exact architecture of what was being built at Meta,

379
00:22:31.799 --> 00:22:35.359
<v Speaker 1>And obviously in twenty twenty that project was shut down,

380
00:22:35.480 --> 00:22:38.759
<v Speaker 1>and so what happened was app toos fun out and

381
00:22:39.680 --> 00:22:43.279
<v Speaker 1>became available to everyone as a highly performance L one.

382
00:22:43.680 --> 00:22:46.119
<v Speaker 1>I would say the way I think about app tooss is,

383
00:22:47.279 --> 00:22:51.960
<v Speaker 1>you know, you had you had Ethereum, which was smart contracts, right,

384
00:22:52.039 --> 00:22:57.119
<v Speaker 1>but you know very now looking back, hard to use

385
00:22:57.160 --> 00:23:00.920
<v Speaker 1>for any scalable use case. Right. Then you had Layer

386
00:23:00.920 --> 00:23:03.200
<v Speaker 1>twos kind of building on top of that. Then you

387
00:23:03.240 --> 00:23:05.880
<v Speaker 1>had Solana, right, and a few other chains, but Solana

388
00:23:05.920 --> 00:23:08.720
<v Speaker 1>is the one we know which was basically like no,

389
00:23:08.960 --> 00:23:12.119
<v Speaker 1>this needs to be like amazing ux and we're really fast.

390
00:23:12.559 --> 00:23:14.880
<v Speaker 1>And then there's this another tranch of blockchains which are

391
00:23:14.880 --> 00:23:18.359
<v Speaker 1>even faster and more performance, and aptos is one of

392
00:23:18.440 --> 00:23:22.960
<v Speaker 1>the leading ones. I would say. The thing that adds

393
00:23:23.079 --> 00:23:27.880
<v Speaker 1>additional context to aptas's specific architecture is move, the native

394
00:23:27.920 --> 00:23:32.880
<v Speaker 1>programming language of Move and Move was developed at Meta

395
00:23:33.039 --> 00:23:37.240
<v Speaker 1>specifically for them because they needed a higher level security

396
00:23:37.240 --> 00:23:41.480
<v Speaker 1>on the smart contract level to manage possibly the trillions

397
00:23:41.480 --> 00:23:45.000
<v Speaker 1>of dollars that would pass through their economy. So smart

398
00:23:45.039 --> 00:23:49.440
<v Speaker 1>contract architecture outside of that was not sufficient for Meta's

399
00:23:49.559 --> 00:23:52.720
<v Speaker 1>use case. So we are the bearer of those fruits.

400
00:23:52.720 --> 00:23:58.079
<v Speaker 1>And when you think about apas's positioning in the market,

401
00:23:59.079 --> 00:24:01.279
<v Speaker 1>I would say, in the past last couple of years,

402
00:24:01.400 --> 00:24:04.519
<v Speaker 1>we've really built a lot of headway with institutions that

403
00:24:04.640 --> 00:24:08.200
<v Speaker 1>really see blockchain as the future to power their business.

404
00:24:09.559 --> 00:24:12.599
<v Speaker 1>So companies like black Rock with the middle front, or

405
00:24:13.240 --> 00:24:17.279
<v Speaker 1>Franklin Templeton and Ave now who is going through governance

406
00:24:17.319 --> 00:24:20.839
<v Speaker 1>to come to MAInet as the first non EVM chain

407
00:24:21.880 --> 00:24:25.519
<v Speaker 1>with app toos. They all look at security and performance

408
00:24:25.720 --> 00:24:29.960
<v Speaker 1>and reliability, right, They're not making any sort of guesses

409
00:24:30.240 --> 00:24:33.799
<v Speaker 1>in this framework, and so when when you audit and

410
00:24:33.920 --> 00:24:36.400
<v Speaker 1>kind of look at aptos from that context, it's a

411
00:24:36.440 --> 00:24:40.799
<v Speaker 1>no brainer in terms of those things. Now, when I

412
00:24:40.839 --> 00:24:43.599
<v Speaker 1>think about when I think about where we want to go,

413
00:24:45.240 --> 00:24:50.519
<v Speaker 1>what we want to do as a network is establish

414
00:24:51.000 --> 00:24:56.079
<v Speaker 1>establish successful businesses and founders on app toss. So that's

415
00:24:56.200 --> 00:24:58.920
<v Speaker 1>kind of my job, like building an ecosystem. What does

416
00:24:58.960 --> 00:25:03.839
<v Speaker 1>that mean? It's having successful founders and projects within the ecosystem,

417
00:25:03.880 --> 00:25:06.400
<v Speaker 1>building on the app tost network and pushing the mission

418
00:25:06.480 --> 00:25:10.920
<v Speaker 1>forward in their opinionated way. That's really kind of the

419
00:25:10.920 --> 00:25:12.079
<v Speaker 1>next phase of rep toss.

420
00:25:12.920 --> 00:25:14.519
<v Speaker 3>Talk to us a bit about the building.

421
00:25:14.559 --> 00:25:17.559
<v Speaker 2>So let's say I'm a business, I'm a CEO listening

422
00:25:17.559 --> 00:25:20.200
<v Speaker 2>to this podcast once it goes live, right, and I

423
00:25:20.279 --> 00:25:25.240
<v Speaker 2>want to build on app toss. Am I building a

424
00:25:25.279 --> 00:25:27.519
<v Speaker 2>layer to one app toss? How does that work? If

425
00:25:27.559 --> 00:25:31.000
<v Speaker 2>I want to create maybe my own network.

426
00:25:30.599 --> 00:25:34.240
<v Speaker 1>So to speak? So we built the L one so

427
00:25:34.279 --> 00:25:37.200
<v Speaker 1>you need never need to build a layer two. You know,

428
00:25:37.240 --> 00:25:41.000
<v Speaker 1>traditionally in the sense of why layer twos is because

429
00:25:41.200 --> 00:25:45.759
<v Speaker 1>the base layer isn't proficient enough at handling what you

430
00:25:45.799 --> 00:25:49.799
<v Speaker 1>need to handle. So with Ethereum it's slow, like or

431
00:25:49.920 --> 00:25:52.920
<v Speaker 1>high gas fees, and so it forced like all of

432
00:25:52.960 --> 00:25:55.559
<v Speaker 1>these abstraction layers right to come and say, well, we

433
00:25:55.599 --> 00:25:58.759
<v Speaker 1>can't support a social app on Ethereum, so we're going

434
00:25:58.799 --> 00:26:00.680
<v Speaker 1>to build a L two to like track some of

435
00:26:00.680 --> 00:26:04.759
<v Speaker 1>that away to make it easier. With highly performance l ones,

436
00:26:04.880 --> 00:26:08.559
<v Speaker 1>the goal is to not have or need an L

437
00:26:08.640 --> 00:26:13.119
<v Speaker 1>two to manage a task, right, That's why we were built.

438
00:26:13.119 --> 00:26:15.079
<v Speaker 1>That's why you know, the beauty of why we were

439
00:26:15.079 --> 00:26:17.519
<v Speaker 1>built is we were built to handle like Instagram or

440
00:26:17.559 --> 00:26:22.319
<v Speaker 1>WhatsApp level like of connectivity. Now, I think there are

441
00:26:22.599 --> 00:26:25.519
<v Speaker 1>ways in like what you what people do is they

442
00:26:25.519 --> 00:26:29.920
<v Speaker 1>build protocols or applications on app toss, right, So if

443
00:26:29.960 --> 00:26:32.279
<v Speaker 1>you had if you were building in the trading space,

444
00:26:32.319 --> 00:26:35.200
<v Speaker 1>you would build a protocol on top of that app tooss. Right.

445
00:26:35.319 --> 00:26:39.079
<v Speaker 1>So app toss is the network. You build a protocol

446
00:26:39.200 --> 00:26:43.000
<v Speaker 1>to manage the network a certain way, but you don't

447
00:26:43.000 --> 00:26:46.519
<v Speaker 1>have to manage a blockchain, you just focus on your customer,

448
00:26:46.599 --> 00:26:49.839
<v Speaker 1>you focus on your use case, and the rest is

449
00:26:49.960 --> 00:26:50.960
<v Speaker 1>kind of set for you.

450
00:26:51.799 --> 00:26:52.160
<v Speaker 3>Got it.

451
00:26:52.240 --> 00:26:55.319
<v Speaker 2>And then from a privacy standpoint, so if you have

452
00:26:55.799 --> 00:26:59.039
<v Speaker 2>a variety of companies building on app toss, what are

453
00:26:59.119 --> 00:27:02.920
<v Speaker 2>the what is the infrastructure there to prevent data from

454
00:27:03.000 --> 00:27:05.039
<v Speaker 2>certain data from being public and things like that.

455
00:27:06.240 --> 00:27:08.480
<v Speaker 1>It's a really good question. I mean, I think it's

456
00:27:08.559 --> 00:27:13.880
<v Speaker 1>a concept that the industry is discussing, right. So when

457
00:27:13.880 --> 00:27:17.559
<v Speaker 1>you think about native crypto builders, their intention is to

458
00:27:17.680 --> 00:27:21.400
<v Speaker 1>tap into shared liquidity and understanding of what's happening. Right.

459
00:27:21.440 --> 00:27:25.880
<v Speaker 1>That's why open and permissionless networks have been really successful

460
00:27:25.880 --> 00:27:29.599
<v Speaker 1>at bootstrapping startups, right, I mean you know what I mean?

461
00:27:29.640 --> 00:27:32.759
<v Speaker 1>You see kind of like you see a startup incubate

462
00:27:32.839 --> 00:27:36.039
<v Speaker 1>for one month, go to main net, launch drive users.

463
00:27:36.079 --> 00:27:38.480
<v Speaker 1>Now they're making like tens of not hundreds of millions

464
00:27:38.480 --> 00:27:42.440
<v Speaker 1>of revenue. That's because of the built in network and

465
00:27:42.519 --> 00:27:47.720
<v Speaker 1>liquidity right that ecosystems have managed to do. The question

466
00:27:47.880 --> 00:27:52.720
<v Speaker 1>then comes down to, Okay, that next layer of enterprise

467
00:27:53.119 --> 00:27:57.680
<v Speaker 1>or businesses or retail users, what will it take for

468
00:27:57.839 --> 00:28:01.440
<v Speaker 1>them to do simple things right for for in their

469
00:28:01.519 --> 00:28:05.200
<v Speaker 1>day or for their customers. And when I think about

470
00:28:05.559 --> 00:28:10.559
<v Speaker 1>what that is is privacy is a big piece, right

471
00:28:10.559 --> 00:28:14.880
<v Speaker 1>because blockchains are uh you know, it's a record of

472
00:28:14.880 --> 00:28:19.200
<v Speaker 1>something happening, but you may have a reason to make

473
00:28:19.240 --> 00:28:23.440
<v Speaker 1>sure that record isn't fully public or let's say it

474
00:28:23.480 --> 00:28:28.200
<v Speaker 1>needs to be partially private. Number one. Number two is

475
00:28:28.240 --> 00:28:32.200
<v Speaker 1>the transactions themselves. You know, if you if if if

476
00:28:32.240 --> 00:28:36.799
<v Speaker 1>we are using on chain rails to send payments to

477
00:28:36.880 --> 00:28:40.839
<v Speaker 1>my landlord, right, do I want that transaction to be

478
00:28:40.920 --> 00:28:43.799
<v Speaker 1>public that every every month I'm sending so and so

479
00:28:43.880 --> 00:28:47.279
<v Speaker 1>to this address that this is my address? No? Absolutely

480
00:28:47.319 --> 00:28:53.119
<v Speaker 1>not right like and so I think, uh, the the

481
00:28:54.559 --> 00:28:59.039
<v Speaker 1>I think we will see a ton of there's already

482
00:28:59.079 --> 00:29:01.759
<v Speaker 1>a lot of company is that are already thinking about privacy,

483
00:29:01.799 --> 00:29:07.000
<v Speaker 1>as you know, in the blockchain space. But I think

484
00:29:07.039 --> 00:29:11.440
<v Speaker 1>you will see more ideas from networks like us on

485
00:29:11.480 --> 00:29:15.359
<v Speaker 1>how to manage these controls and how to leave choice

486
00:29:15.480 --> 00:29:18.079
<v Speaker 1>up to the customer, the builder, right or the user

487
00:29:18.200 --> 00:29:22.880
<v Speaker 1>to toggle them because I think we are not going

488
00:29:22.960 --> 00:29:27.880
<v Speaker 1>to get a wide scale mainstream adoption by having every

489
00:29:28.000 --> 00:29:31.200
<v Speaker 1>all of the information publicly for any bad actor to

490
00:29:31.240 --> 00:29:34.799
<v Speaker 1>go and you know, use for their own advantage.

491
00:29:36.039 --> 00:29:38.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that makes sense. There's a follow up question I

492
00:29:38.599 --> 00:29:42.960
<v Speaker 2>have because you mentioned, you know, up toss is history

493
00:29:43.000 --> 00:29:45.720
<v Speaker 2>and genesis coming out from Facebook and things like that.

494
00:29:46.839 --> 00:29:48.799
<v Speaker 2>I don't know if you can answer this, but there

495
00:29:48.880 --> 00:29:51.880
<v Speaker 2>was a report recently about Facebook looking to go back

496
00:29:51.920 --> 00:29:55.160
<v Speaker 2>to that DM project, maybe not in the same capacity,

497
00:29:55.200 --> 00:29:57.519
<v Speaker 2>but doing some sort of stable coin. Now that stable

498
00:29:57.519 --> 00:30:00.759
<v Speaker 2>coin legislation's on the way, are you guys going back

499
00:30:00.759 --> 00:30:03.799
<v Speaker 2>to your colleagues or the folks their Facebook saying hey,

500
00:30:04.240 --> 00:30:06.039
<v Speaker 2>this is the chain to do it on or anything

501
00:30:06.079 --> 00:30:06.400
<v Speaker 2>like that.

502
00:30:08.680 --> 00:30:12.680
<v Speaker 1>We always have connectivity with folks like Beta, but like

503
00:30:13.599 --> 00:30:17.400
<v Speaker 1>every big company that's exploring crypto, I can't really speak on,

504
00:30:17.720 --> 00:30:21.799
<v Speaker 1>you know, where they're at with their development phase or

505
00:30:22.039 --> 00:30:25.720
<v Speaker 1>their psychology or psychology around solving the problem. Now I

506
00:30:25.720 --> 00:30:27.279
<v Speaker 1>can't speak on behalf of them.

507
00:30:27.720 --> 00:30:29.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I'm curious as to what they're going to do

508
00:30:30.519 --> 00:30:33.880
<v Speaker 2>because I know when DM was being worked on, Congress

509
00:30:34.319 --> 00:30:37.599
<v Speaker 2>came with a sledgehammer and shut that down, right, And

510
00:30:38.119 --> 00:30:40.400
<v Speaker 2>I think we look back in hindsight and get why

511
00:30:40.400 --> 00:30:42.480
<v Speaker 2>they weren't ready. The government was not ready at all

512
00:30:42.599 --> 00:30:45.039
<v Speaker 2>to handle this and to monitor it. But now that

513
00:30:45.359 --> 00:30:48.680
<v Speaker 2>legislation's coming, folks are a bit more educated as to

514
00:30:48.720 --> 00:30:51.720
<v Speaker 2>what's happening. It looks like a lot of these companies

515
00:30:51.720 --> 00:30:54.839
<v Speaker 2>can now create their own stable coins within their ecosystem.

516
00:30:55.960 --> 00:30:57.559
<v Speaker 2>And I don't know, I don't know if there's gonna

517
00:30:57.559 --> 00:30:59.920
<v Speaker 2>be oversaturation, but it's fascinating. What do you think of

518
00:31:00.519 --> 00:31:03.000
<v Speaker 2>you know, maybe Microsoft is going to go next Google,

519
00:31:03.039 --> 00:31:05.079
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, creating your own stable coins.

520
00:31:05.279 --> 00:31:09.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean this is just me giving you an

521
00:31:09.160 --> 00:31:13.839
<v Speaker 1>opinion from where I see the market. Sure, it is

522
00:31:13.880 --> 00:31:21.680
<v Speaker 1>an existential motive for the United States to make sure

523
00:31:21.920 --> 00:31:24.160
<v Speaker 1>the stable coin that's adopted is pegged to the dollar,

524
00:31:25.400 --> 00:31:27.920
<v Speaker 1>you know what I mean. So, like this is happening.

525
00:31:29.079 --> 00:31:32.359
<v Speaker 1>This is the next frontier of Okay, what's this actually

526
00:31:32.400 --> 00:31:34.279
<v Speaker 1>going to be pegged two? That's going to hand you know,

527
00:31:34.319 --> 00:31:37.839
<v Speaker 1>the biggest thing since the concept of global free trade,

528
00:31:38.119 --> 00:31:40.960
<v Speaker 1>you know what I mean? Like, and so I don't

529
00:31:40.960 --> 00:31:43.279
<v Speaker 1>think it's more I don't think it's about saturation of

530
00:31:43.440 --> 00:31:46.000
<v Speaker 1>number of stable coins. It's more about what are those

531
00:31:46.000 --> 00:31:49.240
<v Speaker 1>stable coins pegged two in value? What are they anchored to?

532
00:31:49.960 --> 00:31:52.519
<v Speaker 1>And so that's why I think you see so much

533
00:31:52.720 --> 00:31:57.319
<v Speaker 1>openness right today in terms of stable coin regulation. I

534
00:31:57.359 --> 00:32:00.680
<v Speaker 1>know that's still yet to be determined, but obviously we

535
00:32:00.759 --> 00:32:03.279
<v Speaker 1>in the industry are very excited about where we're sitting

536
00:32:03.640 --> 00:32:08.200
<v Speaker 1>in terms of the doorstep, in terms of how that's

537
00:32:08.240 --> 00:32:13.119
<v Speaker 1>executed across a variety of verticals. You know, let's see, right, Like, sure,

538
00:32:13.200 --> 00:32:16.119
<v Speaker 1>like every company can have their stable their own you know,

539
00:32:16.240 --> 00:32:18.799
<v Speaker 1>unique stable coin, but but why, right, what are they

540
00:32:18.799 --> 00:32:23.920
<v Speaker 1>trying to do with it? The natural need now today,

541
00:32:23.920 --> 00:32:28.319
<v Speaker 1>as we sit for the foreseeable future is, you know,

542
00:32:28.759 --> 00:32:33.519
<v Speaker 1>unless everywhere accepts stable coin as a transfer of value,

543
00:32:33.599 --> 00:32:35.599
<v Speaker 1>you will always need to on and off ramp. It's

544
00:32:35.680 --> 00:32:39.359
<v Speaker 1>fiat and like pay your house to do this thing, right,

545
00:32:39.440 --> 00:32:43.119
<v Speaker 1>So I think it's still still kind of TBD in

546
00:32:43.240 --> 00:32:45.240
<v Speaker 1>terms of the actual execution.

547
00:32:46.359 --> 00:32:50.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, for sure. I wanted to talk about some

548
00:32:50.480 --> 00:32:53.480
<v Speaker 2>of the recent developments news items that I saw around

549
00:32:53.480 --> 00:32:56.440
<v Speaker 2>app toss and versus two hundred million dollars in a

550
00:32:56.519 --> 00:32:59.519
<v Speaker 2>new DeFi grant or defight grants and investments.

551
00:32:59.680 --> 00:33:00.440
<v Speaker 3>Tell us about that.

552
00:33:01.559 --> 00:33:05.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So for app toss, when you think about a

553
00:33:05.759 --> 00:33:10.799
<v Speaker 1>highly performance blockchain existing in today's market, what should its

554
00:33:10.799 --> 00:33:15.000
<v Speaker 1>focus be? And that's a question that every ecosystem or

555
00:33:15.039 --> 00:33:18.640
<v Speaker 1>blockchain founder is asked. Right, blockchains can do many things,

556
00:33:19.200 --> 00:33:24.599
<v Speaker 1>but given we are in such an emergent and exciting industry.

557
00:33:25.119 --> 00:33:27.400
<v Speaker 1>What opinion are you taking right in terms of the

558
00:33:27.440 --> 00:33:30.920
<v Speaker 1>directionality from the tech that you're building from the ADOS

559
00:33:31.039 --> 00:33:34.799
<v Speaker 1>lab side to the startup you're onboarding from the aptest

560
00:33:34.880 --> 00:33:43.759
<v Speaker 1>foundation side. And my perspective is trading within crypto markets

561
00:33:43.759 --> 00:33:47.039
<v Speaker 1>as a product market fit for multiple cycles that is

562
00:33:47.079 --> 00:33:49.640
<v Speaker 1>only going to accelerate in terms of adoption with the

563
00:33:49.680 --> 00:33:55.559
<v Speaker 1>institutional interests. Defies the backbone, but there will be additional

564
00:33:56.200 --> 00:33:59.319
<v Speaker 1>ideas and use cases brought into the fold. Right, So

565
00:34:00.240 --> 00:34:03.839
<v Speaker 1>when you think about what is defied today, you know,

566
00:34:04.400 --> 00:34:08.559
<v Speaker 1>it's risk tolerance versus yields, it's trading crypto native assets.

567
00:34:09.719 --> 00:34:13.320
<v Speaker 1>You know, maybe in other ecosystems it's trading you know,

568
00:34:14.679 --> 00:34:19.119
<v Speaker 1>creator assets or mean coins, or speculating on trends in

569
00:34:19.199 --> 00:34:23.320
<v Speaker 1>the market. And so what I think is what I

570
00:34:23.400 --> 00:34:26.559
<v Speaker 1>believe is going to happen is you're going to see

571
00:34:27.159 --> 00:34:29.800
<v Speaker 1>highly liquid assets start coming on chain that have been

572
00:34:29.840 --> 00:34:35.519
<v Speaker 1>off chain equities, gold, things in between. And so for me,

573
00:34:35.679 --> 00:34:38.679
<v Speaker 1>what I wanted to basically state is we are fully

574
00:34:38.679 --> 00:34:43.000
<v Speaker 1>invested in seeing a diverse and robust, defied trading ecosystem.

575
00:34:43.559 --> 00:34:46.440
<v Speaker 1>And in that kind of post, I kind of detailed

576
00:34:46.440 --> 00:34:48.840
<v Speaker 1>some of the elements of products and use cases that

577
00:34:48.880 --> 00:34:50.960
<v Speaker 1>we need. And so every day from the app tas

578
00:34:51.000 --> 00:34:54.199
<v Speaker 1>foundation side and my team side, we go and try

579
00:34:54.239 --> 00:34:59.360
<v Speaker 1>to find founders building in those interesting areas. And so

580
00:35:00.320 --> 00:35:02.239
<v Speaker 1>you know, the fund is kind of broken down as

581
00:35:02.280 --> 00:35:05.559
<v Speaker 1>a signal in the sense that we invest in these projects,

582
00:35:05.960 --> 00:35:09.920
<v Speaker 1>we also help accelerate those projects to come to market

583
00:35:10.840 --> 00:35:15.760
<v Speaker 1>and things like that. So that's like a huge focus

584
00:35:15.800 --> 00:35:18.840
<v Speaker 1>for us is having a robust trading environment on app

585
00:35:18.880 --> 00:35:23.320
<v Speaker 1>toss and we believe that US as a blockchain finally

586
00:35:23.360 --> 00:35:27.519
<v Speaker 1>brings the technology to a web to like experience. So

587
00:35:27.679 --> 00:35:30.360
<v Speaker 1>trading on robin Hood is no different than trading on

588
00:35:30.400 --> 00:35:34.920
<v Speaker 1>a crypt native app, but instead here it's fully decentralized.

589
00:35:35.159 --> 00:35:37.599
<v Speaker 1>You have a much more diverse portfolio of assets you

590
00:35:37.599 --> 00:35:42.559
<v Speaker 1>can participate in, and you can participate in interesting defive experiences

591
00:35:42.599 --> 00:35:46.440
<v Speaker 1>as well. So that's kind of what our focus has been.

592
00:35:46.519 --> 00:35:50.360
<v Speaker 1>And that was the flag in the sand to show

593
00:35:50.400 --> 00:35:51.039
<v Speaker 1>where we're going.

594
00:35:51.519 --> 00:35:52.159
<v Speaker 3>That's great.

595
00:35:52.400 --> 00:35:55.440
<v Speaker 2>And then the other item I read was Runa from

596
00:35:55.559 --> 00:35:59.880
<v Speaker 2>saying that right an EI driven white label event infrastructure platform.

597
00:36:00.159 --> 00:36:01.639
<v Speaker 2>You guys formed a partnership with them.

598
00:36:02.960 --> 00:36:06.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Runa is an exciting project. One of the biggest

599
00:36:06.559 --> 00:36:09.800
<v Speaker 1>They throw some of the biggest festival networks in the world.

600
00:36:11.559 --> 00:36:16.320
<v Speaker 1>Very tech forward founders, And what's interesting about Runa is

601
00:36:17.519 --> 00:36:20.840
<v Speaker 1>going back to what I said earlier about NFTs and

602
00:36:20.880 --> 00:36:24.559
<v Speaker 1>the underlying technology of what they can do. They're building

603
00:36:24.679 --> 00:36:27.920
<v Speaker 1>deeper and more retentive connections with people who go to

604
00:36:28.039 --> 00:36:32.880
<v Speaker 1>festivals and what happens after. And so for us, that's

605
00:36:32.920 --> 00:36:37.679
<v Speaker 1>an exciting project business to bring on app toss And

606
00:36:37.800 --> 00:36:41.880
<v Speaker 1>for them, they can't go on any other any blockchain.

607
00:36:42.119 --> 00:36:45.920
<v Speaker 1>They have to be on the fastest and most performant blockchain,

608
00:36:46.119 --> 00:36:49.280
<v Speaker 1>right because their consumer is not someone who's going to

609
00:36:49.280 --> 00:36:53.440
<v Speaker 1>tolerate something going down. They could just use something else,

610
00:36:53.559 --> 00:36:57.760
<v Speaker 1>right and web two to manage that experience. So Runa

611
00:36:57.840 --> 00:37:00.159
<v Speaker 1>is kind of a flagship partner that we're bringing to

612
00:37:00.239 --> 00:37:03.840
<v Speaker 1>the ecosystem, but it is a representation of products and

613
00:37:03.880 --> 00:37:06.760
<v Speaker 1>founders that we believe can thrive on apps us.

614
00:37:07.440 --> 00:37:10.119
<v Speaker 2>That's great, And you know what do you see kind

615
00:37:10.159 --> 00:37:13.880
<v Speaker 2>of the convergence of AI and blockchain? How's that playing out?

616
00:37:14.320 --> 00:37:17.880
<v Speaker 2>Are they kind of is it kind of a symbiotic

617
00:37:17.960 --> 00:37:21.679
<v Speaker 2>relationship where they benefit each other. Blockchain being used to

618
00:37:21.880 --> 00:37:24.960
<v Speaker 2>police AI in some way, deep fakes and all that

619
00:37:25.280 --> 00:37:27.880
<v Speaker 2>while AI is enhancing blockchain attributes.

620
00:37:28.760 --> 00:37:32.159
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean my personal perspective is I think less

621
00:37:32.199 --> 00:37:38.039
<v Speaker 1>about blockchaining policing AI and more about how is AI

622
00:37:38.159 --> 00:37:43.039
<v Speaker 1>and accelerate to make blockchains more useful? And I think

623
00:37:43.079 --> 00:37:46.880
<v Speaker 1>about that in a few capacities, one is trading, right,

624
00:37:46.960 --> 00:37:51.719
<v Speaker 1>So how does AI actually help folks manage their risk

625
00:37:51.840 --> 00:37:56.599
<v Speaker 1>tolerance and return in a systematic way? Right? Because using

626
00:37:57.199 --> 00:38:00.119
<v Speaker 1>or even interacting with define, no matter what ecosystem and

627
00:38:00.159 --> 00:38:03.519
<v Speaker 1>you you are in, is not even remotely close for

628
00:38:03.679 --> 00:38:05.760
<v Speaker 1>just a regular user who has one hundred things going

629
00:38:05.760 --> 00:38:09.119
<v Speaker 1>on the other day. Right, So I think about AI

630
00:38:09.440 --> 00:38:13.079
<v Speaker 1>as a way in which to enhance that experience, to

631
00:38:13.119 --> 00:38:15.760
<v Speaker 1>broaden the customer made base, to bring more people in.

632
00:38:16.880 --> 00:38:19.239
<v Speaker 1>Same thing with payments. You know, when I think about

633
00:38:20.599 --> 00:38:23.800
<v Speaker 1>from an agentic framework, if they're supposed to do things

634
00:38:23.840 --> 00:38:26.920
<v Speaker 1>for us, what do they do when we when they

635
00:38:26.960 --> 00:38:29.559
<v Speaker 1>need to pay for something? What are they going to do?

636
00:38:30.079 --> 00:38:31.639
<v Speaker 1>What is an agent going to do? Are they going

637
00:38:31.719 --> 00:38:34.320
<v Speaker 1>to go to a bank and then get into your account. No,

638
00:38:34.320 --> 00:38:37.400
<v Speaker 1>They're going to use blockchain, they can use your stable coins.

639
00:38:37.639 --> 00:38:40.559
<v Speaker 1>They're going to do micro transactions like you could imagine

640
00:38:40.559 --> 00:38:44.360
<v Speaker 1>a world where I don't know self driving cars, right,

641
00:38:44.480 --> 00:38:47.800
<v Speaker 1>everyone is in a self driving car and my car

642
00:38:48.599 --> 00:38:51.440
<v Speaker 1>I need to overtake this car. Maybe this car needs

643
00:38:51.440 --> 00:38:53.599
<v Speaker 1>to pay a micro transaction to that car so it

644
00:38:53.639 --> 00:38:57.880
<v Speaker 1>can actually you know, coordinate between each other. This is

645
00:38:57.920 --> 00:39:00.199
<v Speaker 1>a very radical example, but you can see where I'm

646
00:39:00.199 --> 00:39:01.559
<v Speaker 1>going with it. What are they going to use. They're

647
00:39:01.599 --> 00:39:04.719
<v Speaker 1>going to use blockchains and on chain rails because you

648
00:39:04.760 --> 00:39:08.000
<v Speaker 1>can send a scent for no cost. Where can you

649
00:39:08.039 --> 00:39:11.199
<v Speaker 1>send a scent to someone In traditional banking rails, you

650
00:39:11.199 --> 00:39:14.079
<v Speaker 1>can't send a cent to anyone. AI will need to write.

651
00:39:14.079 --> 00:39:16.760
<v Speaker 1>They will need to be able to send things at

652
00:39:16.760 --> 00:39:20.079
<v Speaker 1>that level and at a higher frequency to manage the

653
00:39:20.119 --> 00:39:25.119
<v Speaker 1>coordination of the Internet of things. I think there's a

654
00:39:25.159 --> 00:39:29.559
<v Speaker 1>third area, which you know, I haven't gone that deep into,

655
00:39:29.719 --> 00:39:34.599
<v Speaker 1>but you know you have all of these you know,

656
00:39:35.039 --> 00:39:39.239
<v Speaker 1>large language models like chat, GBT andthropic and Rock and

657
00:39:39.320 --> 00:39:42.519
<v Speaker 1>all of these things that all have their own way

658
00:39:42.559 --> 00:39:47.000
<v Speaker 1>of kind of coming up with what you want. What

659
00:39:47.079 --> 00:39:49.119
<v Speaker 1>if you were someone who said, I want to take

660
00:39:49.199 --> 00:39:52.000
<v Speaker 1>this from chat GPT, I want to take this from Rock,

661
00:39:52.079 --> 00:39:53.679
<v Speaker 1>I want to take this and I want to localize

662
00:39:53.679 --> 00:39:56.440
<v Speaker 1>my ll M. And there's things blockchains can do to

663
00:39:56.480 --> 00:40:01.440
<v Speaker 1>increase transparency of code across those things, and developer tooling

664
00:40:01.480 --> 00:40:04.239
<v Speaker 1>to help people who want to build I don't know,

665
00:40:04.320 --> 00:40:09.760
<v Speaker 1>their own personalized LLM, but that's a much more greener

666
00:40:09.800 --> 00:40:11.679
<v Speaker 1>pasture in terms of what can be done.

667
00:40:12.480 --> 00:40:16.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and I'm really fascinated by that and to see

668
00:40:16.360 --> 00:40:19.239
<v Speaker 2>how that unfolds. It just seems that there's a lot

669
00:40:19.280 --> 00:40:22.599
<v Speaker 2>of possibilities. And I'm exploring a may in how to

670
00:40:22.639 --> 00:40:25.400
<v Speaker 2>create maybe an AI agent and see how it can

671
00:40:25.440 --> 00:40:27.840
<v Speaker 2>be leveraged in different ways and that can monetize it.

672
00:40:27.920 --> 00:40:33.320
<v Speaker 1>But yeah, yeah, I mean, look, I look at crypto

673
00:40:33.360 --> 00:40:40.199
<v Speaker 1>and AI as two parallel tracks. And what I'm excited

674
00:40:40.239 --> 00:40:43.599
<v Speaker 1>about is whenever we look at a founder, whenever we

675
00:40:43.639 --> 00:40:47.639
<v Speaker 1>see a project, whether it's trading or payments, the question

676
00:40:47.760 --> 00:40:49.840
<v Speaker 1>we always ask and dive into is how are you

677
00:40:49.880 --> 00:40:53.960
<v Speaker 1>thinking about AI to level up your experience? Right? We

678
00:40:54.039 --> 00:40:58.039
<v Speaker 1>always go through that question and answer, and more often

679
00:40:58.039 --> 00:41:00.280
<v Speaker 1>than not, most of the founders have a good answer.

680
00:41:01.199 --> 00:41:05.360
<v Speaker 2>Hm, what's on your roadmap? But what can you share

681
00:41:05.199 --> 00:41:06.280
<v Speaker 2>that we can expect?

682
00:41:08.400 --> 00:41:11.039
<v Speaker 1>So you know, we don't really have a roadmap, right,

683
00:41:11.079 --> 00:41:15.199
<v Speaker 1>We're in an ecosystem, so our roadmap is finding great founders.

684
00:41:16.800 --> 00:41:20.119
<v Speaker 1>But generally, what we are looking for from a trading

685
00:41:20.199 --> 00:41:26.079
<v Speaker 1>perspective is folks that are building there's a couple of things,

686
00:41:26.800 --> 00:41:32.559
<v Speaker 1>Folks that are building interesting trading environments to tokenize real

687
00:41:32.599 --> 00:41:37.119
<v Speaker 1>world assets. Right, A lot of they only really use

688
00:41:37.199 --> 00:41:39.880
<v Speaker 1>real world asset right now as stable coins, but there's

689
00:41:39.920 --> 00:41:42.760
<v Speaker 1>some of the real world assets that are tokenizer can

690
00:41:42.840 --> 00:41:46.400
<v Speaker 1>be tokenized. How do those things get utilized in a

691
00:41:46.480 --> 00:41:50.519
<v Speaker 1>defined environment for a regular user. That's an area in

692
00:41:50.559 --> 00:41:55.079
<v Speaker 1>which that we're hyper focused on. When I think about payments,

693
00:41:55.760 --> 00:42:01.000
<v Speaker 1>what I'm really looking for is, you know, the next

694
00:42:01.159 --> 00:42:05.760
<v Speaker 1>founder or project that's going to build the next HR

695
00:42:05.920 --> 00:42:09.519
<v Speaker 1>payment software fully on chain, or the next P two

696
00:42:09.559 --> 00:42:14.199
<v Speaker 1>P payments app fully on chain using stables. And one

697
00:42:14.199 --> 00:42:18.000
<v Speaker 1>of the ideas that is interesting for me with kind

698
00:42:18.000 --> 00:42:21.320
<v Speaker 1>of the adoption and pull forward institutional and mainstream interest

699
00:42:21.400 --> 00:42:25.519
<v Speaker 1>in stable coins is there are markets in the world

700
00:42:26.000 --> 00:42:31.639
<v Speaker 1>that need stable coins from an existential perspective. Their local

701
00:42:31.639 --> 00:42:35.320
<v Speaker 1>currencies debate, their government can't be trusted. But there's high

702
00:42:35.360 --> 00:42:39.480
<v Speaker 1>intellectual capital in those markets, right, There's a broad culture

703
00:42:39.519 --> 00:42:43.400
<v Speaker 1>of education and innovation and all these things. And so

704
00:42:43.480 --> 00:42:45.559
<v Speaker 1>with the adoption of stable coins and kind of this

705
00:42:45.679 --> 00:42:49.280
<v Speaker 1>true global economy what you're going to start to see

706
00:42:50.039 --> 00:42:55.800
<v Speaker 1>is the average revenue per user right in Web three

707
00:42:56.920 --> 00:43:01.519
<v Speaker 1>outpace in the average revenue per user in Web two

708
00:43:02.039 --> 00:43:05.599
<v Speaker 1>in emerging markets, right because Web two can't solve this problem.

709
00:43:05.679 --> 00:43:10.360
<v Speaker 1>So you know, unless an advertiser can monetize and pay

710
00:43:10.400 --> 00:43:13.800
<v Speaker 1>the top dollar fee for that inventory in that market,

711
00:43:13.960 --> 00:43:16.719
<v Speaker 1>or that user can pay twelve dollars a month for

712
00:43:16.760 --> 00:43:21.559
<v Speaker 1>a subscription, there's no answer to generating revenue from those

713
00:43:21.639 --> 00:43:24.639
<v Speaker 1>users directly in emerging markets. In Web three, that's going

714
00:43:24.719 --> 00:43:27.679
<v Speaker 1>to be different, right, You're basically going to have stable

715
00:43:27.719 --> 00:43:30.960
<v Speaker 1>coins as like the way in which to transfer value

716
00:43:31.000 --> 00:43:34.920
<v Speaker 1>at speed and reliability. The folks that are building or

717
00:43:34.960 --> 00:43:39.880
<v Speaker 1>innovating or incubating in emerging markets now have higher purchasing power,

718
00:43:41.760 --> 00:43:45.039
<v Speaker 1>and you can basically start to see unicorns just be

719
00:43:45.119 --> 00:43:47.800
<v Speaker 1>built solely in these localized markets, which is going to

720
00:43:47.800 --> 00:43:53.559
<v Speaker 1>be fascinating to see. So that's kind of it's less

721
00:43:53.599 --> 00:43:56.119
<v Speaker 1>of a roadmap because we're not a product and tech company,

722
00:43:56.159 --> 00:43:59.360
<v Speaker 1>but a focus of where you'll see us onboarding new projects.

723
00:44:00.039 --> 00:44:01.280
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that absolutely makes sense.

724
00:44:02.039 --> 00:44:05.119
<v Speaker 2>I'd love to get your take on the crypto market

725
00:44:05.119 --> 00:44:07.880
<v Speaker 2>at large, and you know, legislation on the CUSP of

726
00:44:07.920 --> 00:44:13.079
<v Speaker 2>being passed. I saw every chain the CEO app toss

727
00:44:13.199 --> 00:44:17.559
<v Speaker 2>Labs testify this morning on Capitol Hill. It seems like

728
00:44:17.639 --> 00:44:19.440
<v Speaker 2>things are moving in the right direction. We have a

729
00:44:19.519 --> 00:44:22.280
<v Speaker 2>much more favorable environment. You know, how how do you

730
00:44:22.320 --> 00:44:25.840
<v Speaker 2>feel being on the building side and you know, maybe

731
00:44:26.199 --> 00:44:28.920
<v Speaker 2>under less pressure after the past four years?

732
00:44:30.280 --> 00:44:36.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you know, I I feel lucky that I came

733
00:44:36.079 --> 00:44:38.719
<v Speaker 1>at a time where so many people went through the

734
00:44:38.840 --> 00:44:43.119
<v Speaker 1>pain to let us be able to have this conversation.

735
00:44:43.480 --> 00:44:48.079
<v Speaker 1>You know, for more than a decade fifteen years, right,

736
00:44:48.159 --> 00:44:51.920
<v Speaker 1>people have been pushing this space forward, pushing for decentralization,

737
00:44:52.119 --> 00:44:57.280
<v Speaker 1>pushing for self sovereignty. Paid for the price of being

738
00:44:57.360 --> 00:44:59.880
<v Speaker 1>first to push for that, and now we're here at

739
00:45:00.159 --> 00:45:05.360
<v Speaker 1>moment where everyone sees blockchain as a core technology to

740
00:45:05.679 --> 00:45:09.320
<v Speaker 1>move society forward. And so, you know, Avery is the

741
00:45:09.360 --> 00:45:13.679
<v Speaker 1>CEO of Aptos Labs. I'm very grateful to him for

742
00:45:13.840 --> 00:45:18.519
<v Speaker 1>going and speaking to the public who have tons of

743
00:45:18.599 --> 00:45:25.239
<v Speaker 1>variant concerns right in terms of their market, their economy,

744
00:45:25.280 --> 00:45:27.320
<v Speaker 1>how they're going to put food on the table, and

745
00:45:27.400 --> 00:45:30.760
<v Speaker 1>being able to explain blockchain in a way in which

746
00:45:30.840 --> 00:45:34.440
<v Speaker 1>that they can understand and also start to apply to

747
00:45:34.639 --> 00:45:37.840
<v Speaker 1>manage their own outcomes. That's where we're at, and so

748
00:45:38.519 --> 00:45:42.840
<v Speaker 1>we're moving past this bubble of Okay, there's a select

749
00:45:42.920 --> 00:45:47.920
<v Speaker 1>few here, they're really powerful users, they're very loyal, they're

750
00:45:48.039 --> 00:45:51.400
<v Speaker 1>very vocal, they're very high signal, and we're moving to

751
00:45:51.480 --> 00:45:53.599
<v Speaker 1>a point of there are people with a lot of

752
00:45:53.639 --> 00:45:55.719
<v Speaker 1>things on their mind and a lot of other things

753
00:45:55.760 --> 00:45:59.280
<v Speaker 1>they do, and they're interested, but how do we relate

754
00:45:59.360 --> 00:46:03.880
<v Speaker 1>to them? So that's why I think now is really

755
00:46:03.920 --> 00:46:06.840
<v Speaker 1>important for the entire industry, no matter if your naptos

756
00:46:06.880 --> 00:46:11.920
<v Speaker 1>ecosystem sol on, ecosystem theory, and ecosystem to all kind

757
00:46:11.960 --> 00:46:14.920
<v Speaker 1>of come together and start to explain this thing in

758
00:46:15.079 --> 00:46:19.000
<v Speaker 1>uniform terms. So that's you know, at the end of

759
00:46:19.039 --> 00:46:22.440
<v Speaker 1>the day, this blockchain can be widely, widely accepted and adopted.

760
00:46:23.239 --> 00:46:28.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, great points. I'm hoping fingers crossed Congress gets

761
00:46:28.599 --> 00:46:32.199
<v Speaker 2>everything through this year. It'll be amazing for this industry.

762
00:46:32.239 --> 00:46:34.480
<v Speaker 2>It feels like this could be part of the next

763
00:46:34.519 --> 00:46:37.440
<v Speaker 2>economic boom, you know, kind of what happened after a

764
00:46:37.559 --> 00:46:40.599
<v Speaker 2>legislation was passing nineteen ninety six Pty Internet and just

765
00:46:40.639 --> 00:46:43.840
<v Speaker 2>opening up all types of innovations and wealth creation. So

766
00:46:43.880 --> 00:46:47.360
<v Speaker 2>I'm really excited. It was certainly really rough over the

767
00:46:47.440 --> 00:46:50.280
<v Speaker 2>past four years, but you know brighter days are ahead.

768
00:46:50.880 --> 00:46:52.239
<v Speaker 1>Hey we're still here, Tony.

769
00:46:52.679 --> 00:46:56.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah right, good stuff, man. So I got some wrap

770
00:46:56.320 --> 00:46:59.159
<v Speaker 2>up questions here for you. First, If you could create

771
00:46:59.159 --> 00:47:00.599
<v Speaker 2>your own metaverse, the theme be.

772
00:47:02.199 --> 00:47:05.360
<v Speaker 1>I could create my own metaverse, the theme would be nature.

773
00:47:06.079 --> 00:47:08.800
<v Speaker 3>Nice rapid fire questions. Favorite food.

774
00:47:10.280 --> 00:47:12.480
<v Speaker 1>My favorite food is pizza, Come on, man, New York

775
00:47:13.360 --> 00:47:13.840
<v Speaker 1>for sure.

776
00:47:14.440 --> 00:47:15.960
<v Speaker 3>Favorite musician or band.

777
00:47:17.199 --> 00:47:24.480
<v Speaker 1>My favorite musician is Wow. That's so hard to answer,

778
00:47:25.639 --> 00:47:31.920
<v Speaker 1>but I will say Sergel Simpson. Favorite movie Glenn gerrig

779
00:47:32.000 --> 00:47:32.679
<v Speaker 1>and Ross.

780
00:47:33.280 --> 00:47:34.719
<v Speaker 3>I don't think I've heard that. I got to check

781
00:47:34.760 --> 00:47:35.119
<v Speaker 3>that out.

782
00:47:35.440 --> 00:47:40.119
<v Speaker 1>You have to check it out. Classic favorite book. My

783
00:47:40.239 --> 00:47:46.039
<v Speaker 1>favorite book is And you're catching me on not reading enough?

784
00:47:46.239 --> 00:47:49.199
<v Speaker 1>I mean, can I count Twitter threads? Can I say

785
00:47:49.199 --> 00:47:50.760
<v Speaker 1>that's one of my favorite books?

786
00:47:51.880 --> 00:47:54.159
<v Speaker 2>I've been saying like podcast lately because I haven't ready

787
00:47:54.159 --> 00:47:55.440
<v Speaker 2>read a book with podcasts.

788
00:47:55.480 --> 00:47:57.719
<v Speaker 3>You know, I've been helpful in learning.

789
00:47:57.480 --> 00:47:59.559
<v Speaker 1>From my favorite book, or let's say the one that

790
00:47:59.639 --> 00:48:02.400
<v Speaker 1>influence me. The most professionally old man in the sea.

791
00:48:03.920 --> 00:48:05.639
<v Speaker 3>And when you're not working at app toss, what are

792
00:48:05.679 --> 00:48:06.280
<v Speaker 3>you doing for fun?

793
00:48:08.360 --> 00:48:11.679
<v Speaker 1>I'm blessed to have a beautiful family, so I spend

794
00:48:11.679 --> 00:48:14.119
<v Speaker 1>as much time as I can watching my kids grow

795
00:48:14.239 --> 00:48:15.880
<v Speaker 1>up and making memories with my wife.

796
00:48:16.599 --> 00:48:19.920
<v Speaker 3>That's awesome, man, Ash, pleasure chatting with you.

797
00:48:20.039 --> 00:48:21.679
<v Speaker 2>We're gonna have to do the next one in person

798
00:48:21.719 --> 00:48:24.039
<v Speaker 2>because we're not far from each other, you know, and

799
00:48:24.079 --> 00:48:26.840
<v Speaker 2>where you guys are located. And I'm looking forward to

800
00:48:26.880 --> 00:48:28.960
<v Speaker 2>the future updates around aptos. But thank you so much

801
00:48:29.000 --> 00:48:29.519
<v Speaker 2>for joining me.

802
00:48:30.159 --> 00:48:31.960
<v Speaker 1>Appreciate you, Tony. Thanks for the time