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See 50 00:02:01.560 --> 00:02:02.480 website for details. 51 00:02:12.479 --> 00:02:15.919 You are now listening to True Murder, The most shocking 52 00:02:16.000 --> 00:02:19.039 killers in true crime history and the authors that have 53 00:02:19.080 --> 00:02:26.400 written about them. Gasey, Bundy, Dahmer, The Nightstalker BTK. Every 54 00:02:26.439 --> 00:02:30.080 week another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and 55 00:02:30.199 --> 00:02:34.719 infamous killers in true crime history. True Murder with your host, 56 00:02:35.120 --> 00:02:37.639 journalist and author Dan Zufanski. 57 00:02:47.400 --> 00:02:51.840 Good evening on a fall evening in Corvallis, Oregon. In 58 00:02:51.960 --> 00:02:56.199 nineteen sixty seven, seventeen year old Dick Kitchell, a senior 59 00:02:56.240 --> 00:03:00.560 at the high school, disappeared after attending a party. Ten 60 00:03:00.639 --> 00:03:03.280 days later, his body was spotted by two children as 61 00:03:03.319 --> 00:03:07.000 it floated down the Willamette River. He had been beaten 62 00:03:07.159 --> 00:03:11.319 and strangled. The investigation into his murder played out during 63 00:03:11.360 --> 00:03:15.280 one of the most dramatic years in America. Life in Corvallis, 64 00:03:15.280 --> 00:03:19.840 a college town, had offered a protective, idyllic life to many, 65 00:03:20.439 --> 00:03:24.719 but in nineteen sixty seven nineteen sixty eight Vietnam a 66 00:03:24.800 --> 00:03:28.879 presidential campaign, the assassinations of Martin Luther King Junior and 67 00:03:28.960 --> 00:03:32.520 Robert Kennedy and the murder of Dick Kitchell changed and 68 00:03:32.560 --> 00:03:35.879 all that his friends thought his death was ignored because 69 00:03:35.919 --> 00:03:39.039 Dick was from the wrong side of the tracks. Police 70 00:03:39.039 --> 00:03:41.840 in the district attorney thought they knew who had murdered 71 00:03:41.840 --> 00:03:45.479 the boy, but never made an arrest. Decades later, a 72 00:03:45.520 --> 00:03:49.680 cold case detective believed he too, had solved the case. However, 73 00:03:49.719 --> 00:03:54.520 once again justice was elusive. Now, nearly fifty years later, 74 00:03:54.879 --> 00:03:59.479 a classmate, New York Times bestselling author Rebecca Morris, returns 75 00:03:59.520 --> 00:04:01.599 to her home town to write about how the murder 76 00:04:01.680 --> 00:04:04.840 changed the town and the lives of Dick Kitchell's friends. 77 00:04:05.400 --> 00:04:07.919 Rebecca Morris is the New York Times Best knowing author 78 00:04:07.960 --> 00:04:11.599 If I Can't Have You, Susan Powell, her mysterious disappearance 79 00:04:11.639 --> 00:04:14.800 and the murder of her children, Killing an Amish Country, 80 00:04:15.240 --> 00:04:17.759 Ted and Ann, and other books. The book that we're 81 00:04:17.800 --> 00:04:21.800 featuring this evening is A Murder in My Hometown, was 82 00:04:21.879 --> 00:04:26.240 my special guest journalist and author Rebecca Morris. Welcome to 83 00:04:26.319 --> 00:04:28.600 the program, and thank you very much for agreeing to 84 00:04:28.639 --> 00:04:33.079 this interview. Rebecca Morris, I think, hi. 85 00:04:33.040 --> 00:04:35.600 Dan, thanks so much for having me inviting me on. 86 00:04:36.959 --> 00:04:40.639 Thank you very much. Like I had mentioned. This is 87 00:04:40.680 --> 00:04:44.920 a very very personal story for you, and let's get 88 00:04:45.040 --> 00:04:48.959 right to this. Tell us a little bit about Corvallis, 89 00:04:49.040 --> 00:04:54.439 Oregon to let people know the size, and you talk 90 00:04:54.480 --> 00:04:59.399 about the racial mix in the city, in the small town, 91 00:04:59.480 --> 00:05:02.040 I should say, but tell us about the size and 92 00:05:02.160 --> 00:05:05.319 where it is, and a little bit more about Cravallis, 93 00:05:05.360 --> 00:05:07.040 Oregon to introduce this story. 94 00:05:08.399 --> 00:05:13.560 Well, Cravallis is, Uh, I mean, Oregon is almost all 95 00:05:13.600 --> 00:05:17.240 small towns except for except for Portland. And it's one 96 00:05:17.240 --> 00:05:19.839 of the towns in the in the Willamette Valley that 97 00:05:20.279 --> 00:05:22.920 you know, the pioneers came on the Oregon Trail and 98 00:05:23.480 --> 00:05:27.040 settled along the Willamette River and in Oregon because of 99 00:05:27.079 --> 00:05:30.680 the what would be rich farmland. Uh. It's it's been 100 00:05:30.720 --> 00:05:35.600 a college town since I think the eighteen seventies and uh, 101 00:05:35.680 --> 00:05:40.120 growing from what was basically an agricultural college uh into 102 00:05:40.439 --> 00:05:45.240 Oregon State University. The our rival school is University of Oregon, 103 00:05:45.759 --> 00:05:48.759 which is in Eugene, just forty miles south. So the 104 00:05:48.800 --> 00:05:53.560 two main universities are are pretty close geographically. But Cravallis, 105 00:05:54.240 --> 00:05:56.360 I mean, one of the things I learned doing during 106 00:05:56.360 --> 00:06:00.480 this book, uh Dan, is that I I had no idea. 107 00:06:00.560 --> 00:06:03.079 You know, you're when we're in grade school, we're taught 108 00:06:03.079 --> 00:06:06.680 Oregon history. But I had no idea that there were 109 00:06:06.879 --> 00:06:10.959 slaves that came on the wagon trains to Oregon, and that, 110 00:06:12.240 --> 00:06:15.600 as a couple of historians describe it, Oregon's always had 111 00:06:15.600 --> 00:06:22.480 a schizophrenic relationship with race and UH. In fact, Southern 112 00:06:22.879 --> 00:06:27.959 Southerners were most of the group that came west, and 113 00:06:28.000 --> 00:06:30.839 what they wanted to do was create another Southern state 114 00:06:31.399 --> 00:06:36.360 with slavery and other uh southern uh ways of life. 115 00:06:37.120 --> 00:06:41.319 And so that when when Oregon gained statehood in eighteen 116 00:06:41.360 --> 00:06:46.480 fifty nine, there was a law that slavery was outlawed, 117 00:06:46.680 --> 00:06:52.040 but African Americans couldn't live in the state, and it's remained. 118 00:06:52.120 --> 00:06:56.800 Portland even now is considered the widest city in the country. 119 00:06:57.759 --> 00:07:01.279 And UH, there was one, you know, one black student 120 00:07:01.279 --> 00:07:04.839 in my high school class, and I think, I think 121 00:07:04.879 --> 00:07:08.279 it's one of the contributors to, uh, the kind of 122 00:07:08.279 --> 00:07:14.120 elitism and the town and gown feel of the college, 123 00:07:14.160 --> 00:07:17.680 which became a n an issue in this murder investigation 124 00:07:17.879 --> 00:07:20.879 because you know, we were all white, but there was 125 00:07:20.959 --> 00:07:24.319 a a class, a class difference that really kicked in. 126 00:07:27.879 --> 00:07:31.839 You talk about October you right about October twenty first, 127 00:07:31.879 --> 00:07:39.160 in nineteen sixty seven, specifically, there was a couple Dan Eccles, 128 00:07:39.639 --> 00:07:43.519 a young guy thirteen and fourteen year old friend Jim Crawford. 129 00:07:44.600 --> 00:07:48.680 We talked about the Molt River. Yeah, and they spotted 130 00:07:48.720 --> 00:07:51.759 a body. So tell us what they what they were 131 00:07:51.759 --> 00:07:55.160 doing and what they spotted. Yeah, and then the police 132 00:07:55.199 --> 00:07:59.720 response reintroduced, uh, Sergeant Montgomery. 133 00:07:59.839 --> 00:08:02.600 Well, Dan Echos was uh thirteen or fourteen, as you said, 134 00:08:02.639 --> 00:08:05.000 and he and his cousin were fishing off the dock. 135 00:08:05.160 --> 00:08:08.720 Dan's father had been a sheriff in Los Angeles, a 136 00:08:08.920 --> 00:08:11.759 w sheriff in Los Angeles, and had moved the family 137 00:08:11.879 --> 00:08:14.680 up to Oregon and bought this marina. So the boys 138 00:08:14.720 --> 00:08:18.600 were fishing in those days. The Malamat River was one 139 00:08:18.600 --> 00:08:23.040 of the most polluted in in America. It's also I 140 00:08:23.120 --> 00:08:26.000 think one of just two rivers that actually run up 141 00:08:26.040 --> 00:08:30.439 hill that runs south to north. So Uh, anyway, they 142 00:08:31.000 --> 00:08:34.679 cleaned up the river later, but in nineteen sixty seven, 143 00:08:35.720 --> 00:08:39.879 I know, it was really filthy and and uh therefore 144 00:08:39.919 --> 00:08:42.759 the fish that the boys caught, uh, well, the one 145 00:08:42.799 --> 00:08:45.480 time they they tried eating, you know, frying it up 146 00:08:45.480 --> 00:08:48.480 and eating made them, made the family sick, so they 147 00:08:48.559 --> 00:08:52.679 just fished for fun. So Dan was, you know, fishing 148 00:08:52.720 --> 00:08:55.559 off the dock and here came this body floating and 149 00:08:55.600 --> 00:08:58.320 he started to reach for it. It was faced in 150 00:08:59.039 --> 00:09:01.480 and he had this kind of irrational fear that, well, 151 00:09:01.480 --> 00:09:04.840 what if the arm came off if he grabbed it, 152 00:09:05.279 --> 00:09:07.799 So he let it float by, but he ran for 153 00:09:07.879 --> 00:09:12.360 his father, who of course knew how to contact the 154 00:09:12.399 --> 00:09:16.360 sheriff's office and the city police, and they brought the 155 00:09:17.200 --> 00:09:21.759 body ashore and it was the body of Dick Kitchell, 156 00:09:21.919 --> 00:09:25.879 a seventeen year old high school student who had been 157 00:09:26.120 --> 00:09:29.759 missing for ten days. 158 00:09:30.799 --> 00:09:38.679 Now, autopsies were done right away basically, and another captain 159 00:09:39.480 --> 00:09:45.600 if I get this pronunciation wrong, Hakima and also Hakama okay, 160 00:09:45.799 --> 00:09:50.279 and also right away the district attorney, Frank Knight. There's 161 00:09:50.279 --> 00:09:55.480 a corner doctor Rosendahller involved. What you say the autopsies 162 00:09:55.519 --> 00:09:58.679 were conducted at the funeral homes. What did they find 163 00:09:58.720 --> 00:10:00.480 in those autopsies? Immediately? 164 00:10:00.840 --> 00:10:03.120 Yeah, in those days, I thought that was really interesting 165 00:10:03.159 --> 00:10:07.879 that autopsies were uh, and you know, later bodies became 166 00:10:07.960 --> 00:10:10.720 you know, they were sent to Portland, but it was 167 00:10:10.960 --> 00:10:14.480 uh uh what they found uh And Dick's father and 168 00:10:14.519 --> 00:10:18.159 stepmother uh came in and identified him and then left. 169 00:10:18.600 --> 00:10:22.639 But he was he was a little guy, and uh, 170 00:10:22.679 --> 00:10:24.360 he was just five foot two and one hundred and 171 00:10:24.399 --> 00:10:30.279 twenty five pounds. And you know, I I've never unearthed 172 00:10:30.279 --> 00:10:34.720 any information that he was bullied or teased or anything. 173 00:10:35.159 --> 00:10:39.720 But he was actually well liked across across the different 174 00:10:39.840 --> 00:10:43.440 clicks that that had formed in high school. But he 175 00:10:43.519 --> 00:10:48.159 had been beaten up pretty badly. Both his eyes were bruised, 176 00:10:48.200 --> 00:10:52.919 his hands were bruised, you know, there were defensive uh 177 00:10:52.960 --> 00:10:56.639 bruising on his body. And he'd been strangled. And they 178 00:10:56.840 --> 00:10:59.840 concluded that, uh, he'd been strangled not so much with 179 00:11:00.320 --> 00:11:04.480 hands as with an arm or a piece of cloth. 180 00:11:05.279 --> 00:11:10.879 And then he'd been put into the river, probably in 181 00:11:11.039 --> 00:11:15.559 the spot uh off off the main road and Crabalos 182 00:11:15.639 --> 00:11:18.919 off the drain. Main road means only a block or two, uh, 183 00:11:19.600 --> 00:11:22.320 but uh where two rivers meet the Marys River and 184 00:11:22.840 --> 00:11:26.799 in the Willamert River. And then he'd he'd I don't 185 00:11:26.960 --> 00:11:29.759 think he'd surfaced for a few days, but eventually he'd 186 00:11:29.840 --> 00:11:35.440 surfaced and and floated probably probably just about a mile 187 00:11:35.759 --> 00:11:38.120 from where he was putting the river to the Marina. 188 00:11:39.600 --> 00:11:41.279 So he'd put up a s you know, he'd put 189 00:11:41.360 --> 00:11:47.120 up a struggle and you know, uh, he'd he'd been 190 00:11:47.159 --> 00:11:50.879 at a party uh that night, Uh at a home 191 00:11:51.039 --> 00:11:54.840 of some older, you know, kids in the early twenties 192 00:11:54.960 --> 00:11:59.440 who sort of provided a place and and alcohol for 193 00:12:00.000 --> 00:12:03.679 teenagers that wanted to go there, and the teenagers would 194 00:12:03.720 --> 00:12:06.600 chip in a little bit for you know, beer or liquor. 195 00:12:07.080 --> 00:12:11.080 But he'd been in a scuffle that night. He was 196 00:12:11.200 --> 00:12:13.519 known the last couple of years of his life for 197 00:12:14.120 --> 00:12:18.840 getting into fights. He especially he had you know, brutal 198 00:12:18.840 --> 00:12:22.039 fist fights with his father, and in fact, the very 199 00:12:22.080 --> 00:12:25.360 first police officer who arrived at the scene at the 200 00:12:25.440 --> 00:12:29.360 river when they were bringing the body ashore, had been 201 00:12:29.399 --> 00:12:32.440 an officer who'd been called to the kitchen home more 202 00:12:32.480 --> 00:12:35.919 than once to break up fights between Dick and his father. 203 00:12:38.519 --> 00:12:41.120 Now you talk about his father, Ralph and his stepmother 204 00:12:41.279 --> 00:12:46.320 Sylvia his real mother's names Joan. But at this time 205 00:12:47.480 --> 00:12:50.360 you say that he was discovered on October twenty first, 206 00:12:50.480 --> 00:12:54.960 nineteen sixty seven. However, when was he reported missing? And 207 00:12:55.000 --> 00:12:57.000 by who tell us about this? 208 00:12:57.799 --> 00:13:04.399 Okay, Well, the party he had been at was ten 209 00:13:04.480 --> 00:13:08.320 days before, basically the night of October tenth and early 210 00:13:08.440 --> 00:13:13.200 the morning of October eleventh, and he was missing for 211 00:13:13.240 --> 00:13:16.399 five or six days before his father and stepmother went 212 00:13:16.440 --> 00:13:18.440 to the police. And this is just one of many 213 00:13:18.519 --> 00:13:22.759 things that I found, uh, really shocking and actually quite 214 00:13:23.000 --> 00:13:28.559 different than probably how something would be done today. But 215 00:13:28.840 --> 00:13:33.320 they waited, and I just shrugged off his disappearance and 216 00:13:33.360 --> 00:13:36.240 thought maybe he'd gone to the coast with friends, and 217 00:13:36.440 --> 00:13:39.320 you know, sometimes they'd go he and friends would disappear 218 00:13:39.360 --> 00:13:41.799 for a few days. But finally, when he didn't show 219 00:13:41.879 --> 00:13:44.840 up on a school day on a Monday, then they 220 00:13:45.000 --> 00:13:48.000 they went to the police. 221 00:13:49.200 --> 00:13:52.879 Now, once police speak with Ralph and Sylvia, they compile 222 00:13:52.960 --> 00:13:56.360 a list through these the parents, a list of Dick's friends, 223 00:13:57.000 --> 00:14:00.039 and then they do find out about this party and 224 00:14:00.080 --> 00:14:04.200 more about the behavior of Dick and his reputation and 225 00:14:04.279 --> 00:14:09.600 how this might have happened. So before we talk about Montgomery, 226 00:14:10.559 --> 00:14:15.399 the Texas Montgomery and Hakinema going into this party and 227 00:14:15.919 --> 00:14:18.960 speaking to the people that hosted that party, let's talk 228 00:14:19.000 --> 00:14:23.519 a little bit about who Dick was. You've mentioned the 229 00:14:23.960 --> 00:14:26.799 rocky relationship he had with his father, but tell us 230 00:14:26.840 --> 00:14:30.120 a little bit more about Dick and this idea that 231 00:14:30.200 --> 00:14:32.840 he had friends on the other side of the tracks. 232 00:14:32.879 --> 00:14:34.480 You said he was well liked. Tell us a little 233 00:14:34.480 --> 00:14:38.639 bit more about Dick and his life with Ralph and Sylvia. 234 00:14:39.120 --> 00:14:43.799 Yes, well, I knew Dick a little bit. We went 235 00:14:44.000 --> 00:14:47.799 to the same junior high school in those days of 236 00:14:48.120 --> 00:14:52.200 junior high school. And he signed two of my yearbooks. 237 00:14:52.320 --> 00:14:55.080 And there's at least one photograph in one of the 238 00:14:55.120 --> 00:14:58.240 yearbooks that shows he's in my I guess my social 239 00:14:58.279 --> 00:15:02.600 studies class. And he did sign my yearbook and and 240 00:15:02.679 --> 00:15:04.519 I write that. You know, I don't know if it's 241 00:15:04.639 --> 00:15:09.960 because of his uh very chaotic childhood or in spite 242 00:15:09.960 --> 00:15:12.000 of it, but he was the only boy and or 243 00:15:12.039 --> 00:15:13.799 one of the only boys in junior high school to 244 00:15:13.799 --> 00:15:15.799 show up a picture day, you know, in a shirt 245 00:15:15.840 --> 00:15:18.240 and tie. And he'd been a he was a really 246 00:15:18.559 --> 00:15:19.759 he'd been a sweet kid. 247 00:15:20.080 --> 00:15:20.279 Uh. 248 00:15:20.360 --> 00:15:23.279 I interviewed a lot of his you know, uh close 249 00:15:23.360 --> 00:15:27.480 friends for the book, and they still call him, you know, 250 00:15:27.759 --> 00:15:30.639 fifty years after he's been murdered, they still call him Dickie, 251 00:15:30.840 --> 00:15:35.240 which was his childhood name and his his closest friends 252 00:15:35.279 --> 00:15:40.360 he made in uh grade school, Uh from uh you know, 253 00:15:40.399 --> 00:15:42.080 he went to Harding School, and he also went to 254 00:15:42.120 --> 00:15:45.200 a couple other grade schools in craballs but they were 255 00:15:45.320 --> 00:15:50.480 on uh you know, uh summer baseball teams, and he 256 00:15:50.559 --> 00:15:53.639 was on one called the Crocodile's and you know they 257 00:15:54.559 --> 00:15:58.600 the way they spent their days outside of school was 258 00:15:58.799 --> 00:16:02.840 you know, writing byic goals and playing baseball and and 259 00:16:03.320 --> 00:16:07.120 the the main uh issue for for Dick in his 260 00:16:07.120 --> 00:16:10.360 life was that his parents had divorced. His mother moved 261 00:16:10.360 --> 00:16:13.600 back to Washington State where she was from. On on 262 00:16:13.679 --> 00:16:16.960 occasion he would live in Washington State with her, and 263 00:16:17.000 --> 00:16:20.159 then he, I don't know would be sent back to Craballis. 264 00:16:20.960 --> 00:16:25.600 And when Dick by by our senior year, he was 265 00:16:26.600 --> 00:16:29.639 his second step mother was living with him. So that 266 00:16:29.759 --> 00:16:33.720 was his father's third marriage. And his father was a 267 00:16:33.759 --> 00:16:37.240 small business owner. He owned a a shoe repair shop 268 00:16:37.440 --> 00:16:40.879 in Craballis and they did live south of town where 269 00:16:41.480 --> 00:16:44.480 you know, geography is kind of important in Craballis. It 270 00:16:44.679 --> 00:16:48.000 says a lot about what kind of social class you 271 00:16:48.080 --> 00:16:53.000 fall into. And south of town is is you know, uh, 272 00:16:53.159 --> 00:16:59.120 just less fancy and and simpler and moller you know, 273 00:16:59.200 --> 00:17:04.640 modest home and no uh, no shame in that. But 274 00:17:04.960 --> 00:17:08.680 and his parents, he was an only child, but he had, 275 00:17:09.319 --> 00:17:12.200 you know, a couple of step brothers that sometimes lived 276 00:17:12.759 --> 00:17:15.839 with Ralph and Sylvia and him, and sometimes they didn't. 277 00:17:16.640 --> 00:17:20.920 And uh, Dick was he just became kind of you 278 00:17:20.960 --> 00:17:26.160 know lost when he reached his teenage years, and you know, 279 00:17:26.240 --> 00:17:29.599 because there wasn't well there was summer baseball, but he 280 00:17:29.640 --> 00:17:32.759 had friends who you know, would take up snow skiing 281 00:17:32.799 --> 00:17:35.960 in the winter. Well, Dick couldn't afford anything like that, 282 00:17:36.279 --> 00:17:40.599 and he began to drink. His his parents were drinkers 283 00:17:40.680 --> 00:17:44.720 and spent a lot of time, you know, bowling or 284 00:17:44.759 --> 00:17:47.480 at the Moose Club or the Elks Club in Cravalis, 285 00:17:47.519 --> 00:17:49.960 and that was kind of their their social life. And 286 00:17:50.519 --> 00:17:53.759 Dick had a car that meant the world to him, 287 00:17:53.839 --> 00:17:57.359 this baby Blue Ford, and he had a a jacket 288 00:17:57.440 --> 00:18:00.480 and those were the most important things. A uh uh 289 00:18:01.680 --> 00:18:04.880 kind of swayed, you know, uh, jacket and those were 290 00:18:05.319 --> 00:18:09.920 his two belongings that were so important to him. And 291 00:18:11.440 --> 00:18:14.599 on Labor Day weekend, nineteen sixty seven, so just before 292 00:18:15.480 --> 00:18:17.240 the party he went to in the last night of 293 00:18:17.279 --> 00:18:21.559 his life, he'd cracked up his car and been arrested 294 00:18:21.599 --> 00:18:26.759 for drug driving and resisting arrest. And you know, it 295 00:18:26.799 --> 00:18:30.039 was kind of a rather spectacular accident, kind of right 296 00:18:30.119 --> 00:18:33.039 in the middle of town, and one of his girlfriends 297 00:18:33.400 --> 00:18:37.480 was with him in the car, and so, uh, his 298 00:18:37.519 --> 00:18:42.240 first mention and the local newspaper was as this miner 299 00:18:42.319 --> 00:18:45.720 who'd been in the spectacular car rack and because he 300 00:18:45.759 --> 00:18:50.000 was a minor, his name wasn't mentioned. But of course 301 00:18:50.799 --> 00:18:54.039 a few weeks later he'd be murdered, and and then 302 00:18:55.079 --> 00:18:57.839 you know, his life was kind of a fair game. 303 00:18:58.200 --> 00:19:00.920 And one of the things I think so interesting is 304 00:19:00.960 --> 00:19:05.119 how how our hometown newspaper, you know, wrote about this 305 00:19:05.279 --> 00:19:08.480 or or didn't write about this. I think the town 306 00:19:08.640 --> 00:19:11.400 was embarrassed by the murder. 307 00:19:14.279 --> 00:19:17.839 You taught. You write about that to explain to our 308 00:19:17.880 --> 00:19:20.240 audience that you say, he's a very small guy five 309 00:19:20.240 --> 00:19:23.000 foot two hundred and twenty five pounds, but despite that, 310 00:19:23.880 --> 00:19:27.000 his I guess his family life and again you'd say, 311 00:19:27.119 --> 00:19:31.240 turn different when he was a teen, became much more angry. 312 00:19:31.440 --> 00:19:36.200 You write about that fighting was not foreign to him whatsoever. 313 00:19:36.279 --> 00:19:41.640 Maybe explain that, Yeah, well, I I now I know, 314 00:19:41.759 --> 00:19:44.279 and I think I knew at the time how naive 315 00:19:44.400 --> 00:19:44.880 I was. 316 00:19:44.960 --> 00:19:48.079 I mean, when I when I was researching the case 317 00:19:48.119 --> 00:19:51.519 and found out that these parties and even the night 318 00:19:51.640 --> 00:19:54.400 Dick disappeared was it was a week, was a school night, 319 00:19:54.960 --> 00:19:57.960 you know school nights. You know, I know where I was. 320 00:19:58.039 --> 00:20:07.319 I was at home, but he had he was He 321 00:20:07.440 --> 00:20:09.279 was gone a lot because he wanted to get out 322 00:20:09.319 --> 00:20:11.799 of the house. And that's what he and his friends 323 00:20:11.880 --> 00:20:14.400 uh had in common. Uh some of his friends is 324 00:20:14.640 --> 00:20:16.200 they wanted to get out of the house and they 325 00:20:16.240 --> 00:20:20.319 wanted to get uh out of care balance and uh. 326 00:20:20.759 --> 00:20:25.119 But but Dick was you know, Dick was really uh 327 00:20:25.160 --> 00:20:29.960 he had friends in in all all all areas of life. 328 00:20:30.240 --> 00:20:33.359 It began to split bit a bit more in in 329 00:20:33.400 --> 00:20:37.119 his teenage years in high school, as you know, as 330 00:20:37.200 --> 00:20:39.400 some of the kids he grew up with in grade 331 00:20:39.440 --> 00:20:44.000 school became, you know s more serious students, and you know, 332 00:20:44.039 --> 00:20:47.599 they were trying to get into good colleges and they 333 00:20:47.640 --> 00:20:50.759 were in and we were in you know I I 334 00:20:50.920 --> 00:20:56.000 uh college placement advanced placement classes. And Dick, who w 335 00:20:56.079 --> 00:20:58.319 you know, was just an average or a little bit 336 00:20:58.359 --> 00:21:01.920 below average student, was taking you know a shop and 337 00:21:01.920 --> 00:21:06.480 and uh car mechanics and and things like that. So 338 00:21:08.079 --> 00:21:12.240 his friends were I think more aware. They stayed friends 339 00:21:12.279 --> 00:21:16.400 with him, but they were busy with different things. They 340 00:21:16.440 --> 00:21:20.119 had less in common in in their teenage years than 341 00:21:20.119 --> 00:21:24.839 they'd had in common when when they were young, and uh, 342 00:21:24.920 --> 00:21:28.039 I think Dick was lonely. He'd he certainly there was 343 00:21:28.119 --> 00:21:32.680 alcohol around the house. But he became known, as you know, 344 00:21:32.720 --> 00:21:36.039 as a partier. And there were a number of places 345 00:21:36.079 --> 00:21:39.240 in town where uh, it was im you know, you'd 346 00:21:39.279 --> 00:21:41.839 go to BC for fee or to be seen. One 347 00:21:41.880 --> 00:21:45.359 of them was Seatants drive in, which didn't have indoor seating. 348 00:21:45.440 --> 00:21:48.880 It was, uh, you stayed in your car to eat, 349 00:21:49.240 --> 00:21:52.039 and so kids moved between the cars a lot to 350 00:21:52.200 --> 00:21:55.440 talk and socialize. And he was called the Mayor of 351 00:21:55.480 --> 00:21:58.319 Seatans because you know, he was there all the time 352 00:21:58.920 --> 00:22:02.480 and uh had this huge network of people. But he'd 353 00:22:02.480 --> 00:22:04.240 begun to fight a lot. And one of the other 354 00:22:04.319 --> 00:22:08.559 things I was naive about is that at least an 355 00:22:08.599 --> 00:22:10.599 maybe this is true. I've never I've never been a 356 00:22:11.039 --> 00:22:16.440 teenage boy. But in in his uh you know, his 357 00:22:16.440 --> 00:22:22.680 his group, there were these fights and he would he 358 00:22:22.920 --> 00:22:25.240 would try to pick a fight with somebody, or he'd 359 00:22:25.240 --> 00:22:28.599 try to have a friend of his fight this kid 360 00:22:28.680 --> 00:22:33.599 for him. And I don't know how often there actually 361 00:22:33.880 --> 00:22:36.839 were fights, but that he talked about it a lot, 362 00:22:37.599 --> 00:22:41.960 and and all through the police report. Uh, when the 363 00:22:41.960 --> 00:22:45.160 the dis two detectives interviewed Dick's friends. This is a 364 00:22:45.759 --> 00:22:49.119 it's a theme that keeps coming up that Dick asked 365 00:22:49.160 --> 00:22:51.079 so and so if they would fight so and so 366 00:22:51.200 --> 00:22:56.920 for him, And and I I just, you know, myself, 367 00:22:56.960 --> 00:23:00.200 didn't really know that that was one of the things 368 00:23:00.240 --> 00:23:06.160 that occupied at least, you know, some teenage boys days 369 00:23:06.200 --> 00:23:10.160 and nights. It was thinking about fights. But I assume 370 00:23:10.200 --> 00:23:15.720 there's some you know, some psychological connection to his relationship 371 00:23:15.720 --> 00:23:19.359 with his father in all of that is that, you know, 372 00:23:19.559 --> 00:23:22.160 he he was angry, and he was the night he 373 00:23:22.200 --> 00:23:28.119 showed up for that party, he was uh, you know, 374 00:23:28.559 --> 00:23:33.359 looking forward to some kind of altercation. He was also drunk, 375 00:23:33.880 --> 00:23:39.240 and and there was an argument at the at the party, 376 00:23:39.359 --> 00:23:43.880 and and you know it, I always thought, well, that 377 00:23:43.960 --> 00:23:47.680 must have led to his disappearance, But it was actually 378 00:23:47.759 --> 00:23:48.640 something quite different. 379 00:23:50.839 --> 00:23:54.200 Let's talk about you talking with Detective Montgomery and h. 380 00:23:54.559 --> 00:24:02.599 Hakama and assistant Chief Akama assistant yeah, and and Chief Burright. 381 00:24:02.759 --> 00:24:07.960 And they went to Paul and Judy Everett's home. Yes, now, 382 00:24:08.039 --> 00:24:11.440 who who were who were there? And it's it's really 383 00:24:11.519 --> 00:24:16.720 interesting what they were doing when the detectives and the 384 00:24:17.160 --> 00:24:20.559 chief went there. What were they doing? Who were they 385 00:24:20.559 --> 00:24:24.160 were on the list given by Ralph and Sylvia to 386 00:24:24.279 --> 00:24:27.839 the detectives. So who was on that list that was 387 00:24:28.599 --> 00:24:33.720 at this home the day after this event apparently happened. 388 00:24:34.720 --> 00:24:38.119 Well, I think you're talking about after the day his 389 00:24:38.240 --> 00:24:41.440 body is found, which is ten days after he disappeared. 390 00:24:41.599 --> 00:24:43.960 The day the body is brought out of the river. 391 00:24:44.680 --> 00:24:48.799 Late that night, the DA and the assistant police chief 392 00:24:48.839 --> 00:24:52.160 and the two detectives go to the home where they 393 00:24:52.200 --> 00:24:54.920 know Dick had been to this party the last night 394 00:24:54.960 --> 00:24:58.880 of his life. And what they find this is pretty 395 00:24:58.960 --> 00:25:01.720 much the makeup of the people who'd been there the 396 00:25:01.759 --> 00:25:06.960 same uh night as Dick's last night. There's uh Paul 397 00:25:06.960 --> 00:25:09.920 and Judy Efforts, who are the runners of the house 398 00:25:10.039 --> 00:25:13.559 and who are also grad you know from our high school, 399 00:25:13.599 --> 00:25:16.559 but are a little bit older twenty two, twenty three 400 00:25:16.599 --> 00:25:20.039 years old. There are a couple of other seventeen year 401 00:25:20.039 --> 00:25:24.960