WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.480 --> 00:00:06.040 It's Night Side with Dan Ray. I'm WBZ Koston's new radio. 2 00:00:06.559 --> 00:00:09.039 I'm delighted to welcome back a guest who hasn't been 3 00:00:09.039 --> 00:00:12.240 with me for at least two or three years. Dr 4 00:00:12.320 --> 00:00:16.320 Marty McCarry and doctor McCarey, welcome back to Nightside. 5 00:00:17.280 --> 00:00:19.160 Hey, good to hear your voice. Good to be back. 6 00:00:19.239 --> 00:00:21.879 Thanks Dan Well, I remember you very well as one 7 00:00:21.879 --> 00:00:25.039 of my favorite guests. You've just written in a new book, 8 00:00:25.079 --> 00:00:27.280 which we will talk about, but we're here to talk 9 00:00:27.320 --> 00:00:30.559 about cell phones. The book is called blind Spots, When 10 00:00:30.640 --> 00:00:34.200 Medicine Gets It Wrong and what it means to our health. 11 00:00:35.159 --> 00:00:37.399 I do want to reserve some time to talk about 12 00:00:37.399 --> 00:00:41.039 the book, if you'd be so kind, But I also 13 00:00:41.079 --> 00:00:43.399 want to talk about the subject at hend, and that 14 00:00:43.640 --> 00:00:47.679 is cell phones in school. You're pretty clear on this. 15 00:00:48.840 --> 00:00:53.719 You believe that cell phones really should be banned from schools. 16 00:00:54.320 --> 00:00:55.560 I tend to agree with you on that. 17 00:00:55.600 --> 00:00:57.840 Tell us why well. 18 00:00:57.920 --> 00:01:02.560 Two thirds of teenagers say that they are distracted during 19 00:01:02.719 --> 00:01:06.760 class because of their cell phones, and there's a secondhand 20 00:01:06.799 --> 00:01:11.400 smoke effect. From the research, fifty percent of teenagers who 21 00:01:11.439 --> 00:01:14.040 are not using their phones say they're distracted by other 22 00:01:14.120 --> 00:01:19.120 people checking their phone. Constantly during class. Now, these are 23 00:01:19.200 --> 00:01:24.159 highly addictive substance devices, and we wouldn't allow addictive substances 24 00:01:24.159 --> 00:01:27.719 in class. It's stealing their attention by design. As how 25 00:01:27.760 --> 00:01:31.680 the phones work, the average kid is getting two hundred 26 00:01:31.680 --> 00:01:35.840 and seventy three notifications per day. There's no way teachers 27 00:01:35.840 --> 00:01:39.480 can compete with that. These absent phones are designed to 28 00:01:39.519 --> 00:01:41.640 steal their attention and hold on to it as long 29 00:01:41.680 --> 00:01:46.719 as possible. It is creating impulsive behavior in some kids, 30 00:01:46.760 --> 00:01:49.200 and the kids don't like being addicted to the phones 31 00:01:49.280 --> 00:01:51.799 if you really get down to it. A study found 32 00:01:51.799 --> 00:01:55.400 that forty four percent of children say that their phones 33 00:01:55.599 --> 00:01:59.519 make them anxious. We have an anxiety and depression epidemic, 34 00:01:59.560 --> 00:02:02.719 we have a mental health crisis, we have learning loss 35 00:02:02.760 --> 00:02:07.840 that's severe after COVID, and we have a teacher retention problem. 36 00:02:08.240 --> 00:02:11.240 And in part they are citing the culture around the 37 00:02:11.280 --> 00:02:15.400 cell phones and social media. So we can address all 38 00:02:15.439 --> 00:02:19.439 three in part by making doing this one simple thing 39 00:02:19.599 --> 00:02:21.800 that says, when you're in the classroom, you got to 40 00:02:21.840 --> 00:02:23.960 focus on the teacher and the learning. 41 00:02:25.240 --> 00:02:28.039 You know, it's funny. I'm sure you're familiar with the 42 00:02:28.080 --> 00:02:31.639 acronym fomo fear of missing out and I'm sure that 43 00:02:31.840 --> 00:02:35.879 secondary impact the fifty percent who are distracted by other 44 00:02:35.919 --> 00:02:39.520 students being distracted when they see the other student reaching 45 00:02:39.520 --> 00:02:43.080 for their cell phone and reacting in some form or fashion, 46 00:02:43.479 --> 00:02:46.879 they probably have a little fomo moment. They feel that 47 00:02:46.919 --> 00:02:50.039 they're missing something out at that moment because they're not 48 00:02:50.240 --> 00:02:53.719 using their cell phone, which is I can see that. 49 00:02:53.879 --> 00:02:57.960 I can understand that explanation. This seems to be a 50 00:02:58.000 --> 00:03:03.960 trend in schools as classes begin in high schools that 51 00:03:04.280 --> 00:03:08.319 that schools are now saying keep the cell phone separate. 52 00:03:08.439 --> 00:03:11.319 I guess they put them in some sort of package. 53 00:03:11.360 --> 00:03:14.080 The kids can drop them off pick them up at 54 00:03:14.080 --> 00:03:17.080 the end of the day. Do you think that that's 55 00:03:17.120 --> 00:03:19.039 a trend we're going to see happening more often. 56 00:03:20.840 --> 00:03:25.039 Yeah, I think so. And I don't know the perfect solution. 57 00:03:25.400 --> 00:03:28.439 There is no perfect solution. We've got these kids addicted, 58 00:03:28.759 --> 00:03:31.319 and forty percent of kids will have a mental health 59 00:03:31.400 --> 00:03:34.960 diagnosis by the time they turn eighteen. So the epidemic 60 00:03:35.039 --> 00:03:40.520 is already pretty bad. Of impulsive behavior, depression, anxiety, addiction 61 00:03:40.680 --> 00:03:45.639 to the cell phones, a lack of human connection. You know, 62 00:03:45.719 --> 00:03:47.479 some kids don't even know how to shake your hand 63 00:03:47.520 --> 00:03:50.599 or look at you straight so I do think we're 64 00:03:50.639 --> 00:03:54.039 going to see moving in this direction. Banning the cell 65 00:03:54.039 --> 00:03:57.199 phones in this classroom, by the way, in the ways 66 00:03:57.199 --> 00:03:59.080 that you describe locking them up or putting them in 67 00:03:59.120 --> 00:04:03.159 a palace or something, is entirely feasible. School districts have 68 00:04:03.199 --> 00:04:08.599 already decided to move in this direction. It's bipartisan. In 69 00:04:08.719 --> 00:04:13.639 the world of everybody disagreeing and the polarization of politics, 70 00:04:14.319 --> 00:04:17.720 both Governor Kathy Hoschel in New York and Governor Glenn 71 00:04:17.759 --> 00:04:22.079 Youngkin in Virginia have both made announcements saying they want 72 00:04:22.079 --> 00:04:26.000 this done. A matter of fact. Virginia, where the Youngkins, 73 00:04:26.079 --> 00:04:29.639 the governor and I have advised him, he assigned an 74 00:04:29.639 --> 00:04:32.920 executive order saying that he wants to move towards a 75 00:04:33.079 --> 00:04:40.199 self free, cell phone free school classroom K through twelve. 76 00:04:40.519 --> 00:04:45.519 So it's doable. This is something we can do, and 77 00:04:45.600 --> 00:04:47.920 I think hopefully we can move in this direction. Because 78 00:04:48.000 --> 00:04:50.040 kids meet help, they're begging for help. 79 00:04:50.560 --> 00:04:54.120 There was a time not so long ago when the 80 00:04:54.519 --> 00:04:58.959 advent of cell phones, when my children were young, and 81 00:04:59.000 --> 00:05:01.680 there was a lot of pressure because one kid would 82 00:05:01.680 --> 00:05:03.279 have a cell phone, or two or three kids would 83 00:05:03.319 --> 00:05:05.240 have a cell phone, and then all the other kids 84 00:05:05.319 --> 00:05:07.319 wanted a cell phone, and I think a lot of 85 00:05:07.360 --> 00:05:11.160 parents of my generation, baby boomers, felt like, well, we'd 86 00:05:11.199 --> 00:05:14.160 be denying our children access, and we made up excuses 87 00:05:14.160 --> 00:05:16.439 in our mind that, well, they have to have a 88 00:05:16.480 --> 00:05:18.360 cell phone in case they need to reach us during 89 00:05:18.399 --> 00:05:23.920 the day, all of which I think was phony and flawed. 90 00:05:25.680 --> 00:05:28.000 Do you agree that there was a period of time 91 00:05:28.040 --> 00:05:32.600 where parents allowed young children third and fourth grade children 92 00:05:32.639 --> 00:05:37.120 to make really important decisions that the parents should have 93 00:05:38.040 --> 00:05:41.120 recognized that the decisions that they were being i think 94 00:05:41.199 --> 00:05:42.319 forced to make were wrong. 95 00:05:44.240 --> 00:05:47.879 Yeah, I do agree. I think there's multiple components. Number one, 96 00:05:48.120 --> 00:05:51.199 Big tech has been lying to us for decades. They've 97 00:05:51.199 --> 00:05:55.000 been telling us that more technology is always good and 98 00:05:55.040 --> 00:05:58.199 if there's a problem that it creates, more technology on 99 00:05:58.240 --> 00:06:02.920 top of that can fix those problems. And we've ushered 100 00:06:02.920 --> 00:06:06.839 in a giant mental health crisis. Suicide is increasing. We've 101 00:06:06.839 --> 00:06:11.439 got fifty percent of children now are obese or overweight. 102 00:06:11.519 --> 00:06:14.120 Some can't even run a couple of blocks. We've got 103 00:06:14.160 --> 00:06:18.600 a depression at an epidemic level. So big tech has 104 00:06:18.639 --> 00:06:21.560 been lying to us. The second thing is some parents 105 00:06:21.560 --> 00:06:23.639 don't want to be parents. They want to just give 106 00:06:23.639 --> 00:06:26.920 their kids a screen and not have to spend time 107 00:06:26.959 --> 00:06:29.079 with the kids. Kids don't want the screens, they don't 108 00:06:29.079 --> 00:06:32.879 want your money, they want your time. And so there's 109 00:06:33.120 --> 00:06:40.800 that factor in some cases. And then finally, the phones 110 00:06:41.120 --> 00:06:45.680 and the apps are creating a culture right now, and 111 00:06:45.720 --> 00:06:48.199 there's this sense of I need to do what everyone 112 00:06:48.199 --> 00:06:51.519 else is doing. I don't understand it, but it's everyone 113 00:06:51.519 --> 00:06:54.879 else is doing it. And so that peer pressure is 114 00:06:54.920 --> 00:06:57.560 creating the dogma out there that, oh, I have to 115 00:06:57.600 --> 00:06:59.759 give my kids a phone. You don't have to give 116 00:06:59.800 --> 00:07:03.079 your hit a phone. My sister did not give her 117 00:07:04.199 --> 00:07:07.600 kids phones. They're both in their early teens. They still 118 00:07:07.600 --> 00:07:11.360 don't have phones. They're doing great. They can shake your hand, 119 00:07:11.759 --> 00:07:14.680 they can talk to you. They're wonderful kids. They got 120 00:07:14.680 --> 00:07:18.759 great manners, they're engaged. And you don't have to do 121 00:07:18.839 --> 00:07:20.560 it just because everyone else is doing it. 122 00:07:21.000 --> 00:07:22.879 You know, everything that you said to me has just 123 00:07:23.279 --> 00:07:26.160 ring so true. It's funny. Last Hour during our first 124 00:07:26.160 --> 00:07:28.040 hour at night of the eight o'clock hour in the show, 125 00:07:28.079 --> 00:07:31.079 we now talked to four a different guests about various 126 00:07:31.160 --> 00:07:34.360 a wide variety of subjects, and two of our guests 127 00:07:34.480 --> 00:07:39.480 Last Hour, doctor Gregory Jans, research at Harvard University Graduate 128 00:07:39.519 --> 00:07:42.720 School of Education is found it's not adolescentines that are 129 00:07:42.720 --> 00:07:46.639 struggling most with their mental health, but college aged young adults. 130 00:07:46.959 --> 00:07:49.399 And then we talked to a doctor from Canada, doctor 131 00:07:49.480 --> 00:07:55.720 Rob Frasier, with a group called Molecular You Millennials and 132 00:07:55.839 --> 00:08:01.240 jen xers facing higher risk of certain cancers seventeen cancers 133 00:08:01.240 --> 00:08:05.240 than boomers, which means the boomers who were born in 134 00:08:05.319 --> 00:08:09.079 the late forties and into the fifties are theoretically more 135 00:08:09.160 --> 00:08:13.680 healthy in many respects than those regenerations that came after 136 00:08:13.920 --> 00:08:17.000 millennials and gen xers. And he ascribed a lot of 137 00:08:17.040 --> 00:08:20.360 it to the idea that a lot of the millennials 138 00:08:20.360 --> 00:08:24.160 in gen xers sit in front of screens, cell phone screens, 139 00:08:24.399 --> 00:08:26.600 do not get out, do not interact with other people, 140 00:08:26.639 --> 00:08:31.959 do not exercise, and their diet is also poor. So 141 00:08:32.679 --> 00:08:35.320 all with this, what I have tonight is a chorus 142 00:08:35.600 --> 00:08:38.799 of doctors who are all saying in effect the same thing, 143 00:08:39.240 --> 00:08:42.360 particularly as it applies to these cell phones. And by 144 00:08:42.399 --> 00:08:45.639 the way, as you say, a lot of big corporations 145 00:08:46.159 --> 00:08:51.279 Meta amongst most, they've made a lot of money off 146 00:08:51.320 --> 00:08:54.399 of cell phones and off of the misery that young 147 00:08:54.440 --> 00:08:57.399 people now are experiencing and isn't that iron. 148 00:09:00.200 --> 00:09:05.519 You're absolutely right. We've given kids the impression that they 149 00:09:05.559 --> 00:09:09.559 can get a dopamine surge if they swipe one more time, 150 00:09:09.679 --> 00:09:11.600 if they check one more time, there's going to be 151 00:09:11.679 --> 00:09:15.960 some amazing message. All your friends love you and they're 152 00:09:15.960 --> 00:09:18.559 going to throw a party for you tomorrow and they'll 153 00:09:18.600 --> 00:09:21.360 get to bite off these people. And so there's this. 154 00:09:22.039 --> 00:09:25.080 We've messed with their minds, right, We've played with the 155 00:09:25.120 --> 00:09:28.120 minds of these children. And it's not you and I, 156 00:09:28.200 --> 00:09:32.720 it's Meta and Instagram and TikTok and all these companies 157 00:09:32.720 --> 00:09:36.759 that have figured out the psychology of stealing their attention 158 00:09:36.840 --> 00:09:38.799 and holding on to it as long as possible. 159 00:09:39.440 --> 00:09:40.159 And if you think. 160 00:09:40.000 --> 00:09:42.320 About what we're doing, if you take a step back, Dan, 161 00:09:43.559 --> 00:09:47.039 look at what we as a society are doing to 162 00:09:47.200 --> 00:09:51.480 our children. We wake them up before they're Shircadian rhythm. 163 00:09:51.480 --> 00:09:55.200 We have them sit in a sedentary classroom for hours 164 00:09:55.200 --> 00:09:59.440 on hours. We give them screen time as the enjoyment 165 00:09:59.519 --> 00:10:07.240 for or break from that classroom time. We give them 166 00:10:07.320 --> 00:10:12.360 food that's highly addictive, ultra processed foods that's got all 167 00:10:12.399 --> 00:10:16.320 sorts of chemicals. It messes the microbiome is deplete of nutrients, 168 00:10:16.960 --> 00:10:19.759 and then we're wondering why we have an epidemic of 169 00:10:19.879 --> 00:10:24.039 childhood depression and fertility is going up, and chronic diseases 170 00:10:24.120 --> 00:10:27.759 and pcos. So it's not hard to figure out. It's 171 00:10:27.840 --> 00:10:31.360 just somebody has to stand up for kids. 172 00:10:30.960 --> 00:10:35.360 And it's almost when you think about it, it's almost Pavlovian. 173 00:10:35.879 --> 00:10:38.679 We know what their reaction will be, just as when 174 00:10:38.679 --> 00:10:41.200 the dog that has been kicked is going to cower 175 00:10:41.240 --> 00:10:43.679 in the room, when someone walks in the room that 176 00:10:44.559 --> 00:10:47.960 does young people just want that hit, that additional hit 177 00:10:48.320 --> 00:10:51.759 from the cell phone. My guest is doctor Marty McCarey. 178 00:10:52.679 --> 00:10:54.919 His new book is called blind Spots. We want to 179 00:10:54.919 --> 00:10:57.960 talk about that when medicine gets it wrong and what 180 00:10:58.039 --> 00:11:00.440 it means to our health. But if we like to 181 00:11:00.480 --> 00:11:02.720 talk about cell phones. I hope you'll take a few 182 00:11:02.720 --> 00:11:07.120 phone calls from my listeners. Doctor you bet, okay, we'll 183 00:11:07.120 --> 00:11:09.440 open up the phone line six one, seven, two, five, 184 00:11:09.519 --> 00:11:13.320 four ten thirty six one seven nine three one ten thirty. 185 00:11:13.399 --> 00:11:17.720 That'll get you through. We were talking initially about cell phones, 186 00:11:17.759 --> 00:11:19.759 and then I do want to get to this book, 187 00:11:19.799 --> 00:11:23.000 blind Spots, When medicine gets it wrong and what it 188 00:11:23.080 --> 00:11:26.960 means to our health. I have watched doctor mcarey for 189 00:11:27.000 --> 00:11:31.440 many years. I have had him on my show previously, UH, 190 00:11:31.480 --> 00:11:34.720 and he is an independent thinker. If you look up 191 00:11:34.759 --> 00:11:38.039 the word independent thinker or the phrase independent thinker in 192 00:11:38.080 --> 00:11:41.000 the dictionary, his picture is most likely going to be 193 00:11:41.039 --> 00:11:44.360 there back on night Side right after this. By the 194 00:11:44.759 --> 00:11:47.240 by the Red Sox have just one three zip. They 195 00:11:47.399 --> 00:11:51.639 they finally snapped out of their their slump with Toronto 196 00:11:51.840 --> 00:11:54.759 great pitching performance tonight by Bao their young pitcher. We'll 197 00:11:54.799 --> 00:11:56.360 be back on night Side right after. 198 00:11:56.159 --> 00:12:00.279 This now bet to Dan Way live from the Into 199 00:12:00.320 --> 00:12:04.440 World Life Side Studios on Dumb and Bzy News Radio. 200 00:12:04.799 --> 00:12:08.120 My guest is doctor Marney McCarry. He's been a guest 201 00:12:08.159 --> 00:12:11.799 on this program UH in the past. He is an 202 00:12:11.840 --> 00:12:16.000 independent thinker, and I hope you understand, Doctor I I 203 00:12:16.039 --> 00:12:19.000 cannot offer higher praise to anyone than to call them 204 00:12:19.000 --> 00:12:22.759 an independent thinker in this UH day, and I hope 205 00:12:23.320 --> 00:12:27.080 take that as the ultimate compliment trust me, UH, because 206 00:12:27.080 --> 00:12:30.159 there are too few independent thinkers in my opinion at 207 00:12:30.159 --> 00:12:32.080 this point. Let us get to the phone. It's gonna 208 00:12:32.080 --> 00:12:37.799 go to Bud, who is in onset. I assume that's onset, Massachusetts. Right, Bud. 209 00:12:39.039 --> 00:12:40.279 Oh, I'm sorry, Todd. 210 00:12:41.600 --> 00:12:46.879 It's it's what Hello, Hi is Todd Todd? Okay, Bud, 211 00:12:46.879 --> 00:12:52.600 but but it's written Bud, but it's Todd. That's no. 212 00:12:52.720 --> 00:12:54.519 We're gonna make you Todd what you are? But you're 213 00:12:54.519 --> 00:12:56.000 an onset? Is that down the cape? 214 00:12:56.879 --> 00:13:00.399 Yes? It is, well not quite the cape? So all right, 215 00:13:00.440 --> 00:13:02.679 well you're on with Talktor. We don't cross the bridge. 216 00:13:02.799 --> 00:13:05.240 Okay, that's why I don't know it. Okay, you're you're 217 00:13:05.279 --> 00:13:09.320 on with Talk to Bonnie maccari and mccarrey excuse me. 218 00:13:09.600 --> 00:13:13.240 And we're talking about basically having kids go to school 219 00:13:13.279 --> 00:13:15.919 the old fashioned way, sitting in class, listening to the teachers, 220 00:13:15.960 --> 00:13:19.000 interacting with the teachers and fellow students. Yeah, no cell phones, 221 00:13:19.039 --> 00:13:20.159 Thank you very much. What do you think? 222 00:13:20.240 --> 00:13:25.639 Yeah? Yeah, so I am forty six years old. I 223 00:13:25.759 --> 00:13:28.799 believe like my generation, if you want to call that 224 00:13:28.919 --> 00:13:31.960 was on the cusp of that technology. You know, when 225 00:13:31.960 --> 00:13:35.240 I was in sixth seventh grade, eighth grade, there was 226 00:13:35.240 --> 00:13:37.480 no such thing as cell phones. Maybe the occids from 227 00:13:37.559 --> 00:13:41.080 person had one of those old fashioned car phones, right, Yeah. 228 00:13:40.919 --> 00:13:43.519 You were born in seventy eighth then if I'm not mistaken. 229 00:13:43.600 --> 00:13:46.559 Yeah, okay, fine, yeah, yeah, seventy eight. So while I 230 00:13:46.639 --> 00:13:51.200 graduated in nineteen ninety six, okay, and I felt like 231 00:13:51.679 --> 00:13:53.399 I was an old soul. I was one of the 232 00:13:53.480 --> 00:13:56.399 last of my friends to use text messages. You know, 233 00:13:56.480 --> 00:13:58.759 why would you text message somebody when you could just 234 00:13:58.799 --> 00:14:00.679 talk to them? You know, I couldn't understand that. 235 00:14:00.759 --> 00:14:04.080 And then over the years, weekly, weekly, do you have 236 00:14:04.120 --> 00:14:07.960 a question or that Doctor McCarry might want to respond to? 237 00:14:08.440 --> 00:14:12.919 So, so, okay, I'm sorry. So I believe we can 238 00:14:12.960 --> 00:14:17.200 fight this. I think that's this is a technology that's 239 00:14:17.519 --> 00:14:20.799 just going to always be a part of our lives. 240 00:14:21.279 --> 00:14:24.519 And I totally agree with the doctor about, you know, 241 00:14:24.600 --> 00:14:28.279 getting these phones out of kid's hands and trying to 242 00:14:28.279 --> 00:14:31.080 like listen to human beings. But I almost thinking we're 243 00:14:31.080 --> 00:14:33.440 shooting ourselves in the foot because I don't see how 244 00:14:33.639 --> 00:14:37.200 this would ever change. This is the future. It's it's 245 00:14:37.240 --> 00:14:39.039 almost like we don't Okay. 246 00:14:38.799 --> 00:14:41.080 So you think that you think we've lost the war. 247 00:14:41.240 --> 00:14:43.360 Not only have we lost the battle, let's say, yeah, 248 00:14:43.399 --> 00:14:44.320 we lost the war. 249 00:14:44.480 --> 00:14:47.399 We we we want to hold on and fight. And 250 00:14:47.480 --> 00:14:49.639 I get. 251 00:14:49.399 --> 00:14:55.080 If doctor McCarry has a less dystopian view of the circumstances, 252 00:14:55.080 --> 00:14:58.039 Doctor McCarey, can we can we turn this around? 253 00:14:59.120 --> 00:14:59.399 Well? 254 00:14:59.519 --> 00:15:03.480 I appreci Todd's comments because I'm also from that generation 255 00:15:03.600 --> 00:15:06.200 where we went to school, we interacted with people, we 256 00:15:06.320 --> 00:15:09.519 had a human connection, and when the teacher was teaching, 257 00:15:09.559 --> 00:15:14.519 we would listen. Today it's very different, and I do 258 00:15:14.600 --> 00:15:19.200 think there is a recognition that the promise of big 259 00:15:19.279 --> 00:15:22.759 tech has failed us, and that the idea that free 260 00:15:22.799 --> 00:15:26.519 internet and free information with unlimited apps and constant access 261 00:15:26.960 --> 00:15:31.360 would be good for child development and learning has backfired. 262 00:15:31.960 --> 00:15:35.440 And they don't need more internet access. What they need 263 00:15:35.519 --> 00:15:38.840 is more human connection. So there's a lot of parents 264 00:15:38.840 --> 00:15:41.440 now who are saying we've gone too far and we 265 00:15:41.600 --> 00:15:44.840 go back, and people have said it's not possible, but 266 00:15:44.879 --> 00:15:45.559 I'm encouraged. 267 00:15:45.600 --> 00:15:48.720 And then then I'm telling you we can't go back. 268 00:15:48.799 --> 00:15:52.000 There's no going back. There is no way that whatever 269 00:15:52.120 --> 00:15:54.279 can go back. I don't believe that there is only 270 00:15:54.360 --> 00:15:56.639 going to get more and more invasive. It's going to 271 00:15:56.720 --> 00:15:59.720 make more and more easy. It's you to go back. 272 00:16:00.519 --> 00:16:02.279 God, I'm telling you we got to fight it. To 273 00:16:02.519 --> 00:16:02.799 come on. 274 00:16:04.519 --> 00:16:10.519 I get it. I agree, I do. I have so 275 00:16:11.120 --> 00:16:13.240 and this is this is if you got a minute 276 00:16:13.399 --> 00:16:17.399 so I again, I grew up like that. I I resisted. 277 00:16:17.879 --> 00:16:21.600 I like to think that I'm old school. I have 278 00:16:21.679 --> 00:16:25.320 older friends. Anyways, I was the last one of my 279 00:16:25.519 --> 00:16:30.440 friends to join. And now I'll be honest. And my 280 00:16:30.519 --> 00:16:33.600 son's eighteen. He just graduated high school. He made it, 281 00:16:33.720 --> 00:16:37.639 but I'm telling you it was fighting with the phones 282 00:16:38.000 --> 00:16:42.320 and the homework and everything that doctor said is absolutely correct. 283 00:16:42.639 --> 00:16:45.120 And and I'll make one more other comment, which really 284 00:16:45.240 --> 00:16:48.159 kind of bothers me, as my sons are very responsible, 285 00:16:48.159 --> 00:16:51.320 like very lucky with this young man. And I noticed 286 00:16:51.360 --> 00:16:54.759 and more and more he's doing the text whay he's 287 00:16:54.840 --> 00:16:58.639 driving and I try to remind him that he can wait. 288 00:16:59.000 --> 00:17:02.799 And I'm that is just a whole other issue. I 289 00:17:02.840 --> 00:17:06.640 believe that, Oh God, yeah, absolutely. And you know what, 290 00:17:06.799 --> 00:17:09.440 it's happened in more and more these young kids, they 291 00:17:10.160 --> 00:17:13.880 really the whole don't texted drive thing is just not 292 00:17:13.960 --> 00:17:15.480 getting them, you know what I mean? Just like that. 293 00:17:15.640 --> 00:17:18.359 You know, I'm finally scared to drink in less than driving, 294 00:17:18.400 --> 00:17:21.039 thank god. But I don't know what's worse. I mean, well, 295 00:17:21.079 --> 00:17:23.279 I know it's worse, but you know what I'm. 296 00:17:23.119 --> 00:17:26.319 Saying, Immortality when you're eighteen is a lot stronger. 297 00:17:26.440 --> 00:17:28.799 Yeah, I mean, and you know he's always responsible, So 298 00:17:29.039 --> 00:17:31.119 there's a lot of We're going to. 299 00:17:31.160 --> 00:17:33.400 Have doctor mccarrey in here for one second and let 300 00:17:33.440 --> 00:17:35.039 me try to have him try to pick up your 301 00:17:35.039 --> 00:17:39.039 mood here, because you can't. You can't quit here, doctor McCarry, 302 00:17:39.039 --> 00:17:40.519 What would you say to Dodd here? 303 00:17:41.759 --> 00:17:44.960 Well, I think I look, I appreciate what I's saying, 304 00:17:45.079 --> 00:17:51.079 because there are there are times in human development in 305 00:17:51.200 --> 00:17:54.160 modern history where we thought there's no way we'll be 306 00:17:54.200 --> 00:17:57.799 doing things differently. We thought there's no way we'll go 307 00:17:57.920 --> 00:18:02.519 back to a shared economy where people share a ride 308 00:18:02.799 --> 00:18:05.200 like with an uber or lyft. We thought there's no 309 00:18:05.240 --> 00:18:09.160 way people would stop subscribing to cable. Now we've got 310 00:18:09.200 --> 00:18:12.640 a record number of cord cutters. So I am optimistic 311 00:18:12.759 --> 00:18:16.599 because ultimately the truth prevails. And when people see the 312 00:18:16.880 --> 00:18:21.480 terrible consequences of cell phone and app addiction, the mental 313 00:18:21.519 --> 00:18:26.720 health epidemic of anxiety and depression induced by TikTok and 314 00:18:26.799 --> 00:18:30.599 Instagram and Meta and all these companies, people will say, hey, 315 00:18:30.680 --> 00:18:34.079 we want to have a school that restores human connection. 316 00:18:34.279 --> 00:18:37.640 So we're starting to see that, and I'm gonna be 317 00:18:37.759 --> 00:18:39.640 optimistic and hope that things improve. 318 00:18:40.400 --> 00:18:43.559 All right, Todd, I appreciate it. Stick with us, don't 319 00:18:43.559 --> 00:18:46.039 give up. You've got a great eighteen year old son. 320 00:18:46.599 --> 00:18:49.160 Emphasize to him all the things that you believe in. 321 00:18:50.359 --> 00:18:56.880 He deserves that. Okay, thanks, Todd. I think we met 322 00:18:56.880 --> 00:19:00.920 a lost Todd there, down and down. I'm sorry you 323 00:19:00.960 --> 00:19:05.480 didn't respond. Uh, doctor McCarry, let's we gotta take a 324 00:19:05.519 --> 00:19:07.480 quick news break. We'll take another call or two, and 325 00:19:07.480 --> 00:19:08.799 then I want to talk about your book and I'll 326 00:19:08.839 --> 00:19:10.359 let you go at nine forty five, I promise. 327 00:19:10.400 --> 00:19:12.359 Okay, sound's good. 328 00:19:12.480 --> 00:19:14.799 That's a deal. Great, Okay, take a break. Coming back 329 00:19:14.880 --> 00:19:16.920 on Nightside right after the news at the bottom of 330 00:19:16.960 --> 00:19:17.319 the hour. 331 00:19:18.359 --> 00:19:21.640 You're on Night Side with Dan Ray on w BEZ, 332 00:19:22.039 --> 00:19:23.279 Boston's news radio. 333 00:19:23.640 --> 00:19:27.200 My guest is doctor Marty McCarey. He's with John Hopkins. 334 00:19:27.680 --> 00:19:30.799 He's a brilliant physician, written a book, Blind Spots When 335 00:19:30.839 --> 00:19:33.039 medicine gets it wrong and what it means for our help. 336 00:19:33.039 --> 00:19:35.200 But we're going to take a couple more calls here 337 00:19:35.279 --> 00:19:39.960 on cell phones in schools, in school Robert in Wellesley, 338 00:19:40.039 --> 00:19:42.720 You're on with doctor McCarry. Go right ahead, Robert. 339 00:19:43.759 --> 00:19:46.039 Could he mean Dan could even to your guests, Doctor 340 00:19:46.240 --> 00:19:48.640 Marty McCarry, I hope I'm pronouncing the name correctly. 341 00:19:48.759 --> 00:19:49.960 You are correct, go right ahead. 342 00:19:50.680 --> 00:19:53.400 Well, I have a comment which could also be a question, 343 00:19:54.160 --> 00:19:58.640 and I think that I one thing, I'm sympathetic and 344 00:19:58.680 --> 00:20:02.039 a respectful the knowledge of comments of doctor McCarey, and 345 00:20:02.079 --> 00:20:06.400 also sympathetic to the comments of your color Todd. And 346 00:20:06.480 --> 00:20:10.839 I think that there is already made solution that that 347 00:20:11.319 --> 00:20:14.000 may well have been overlooked, something that exists. I think 348 00:20:14.039 --> 00:20:19.200 it's a solid idea, and that is that cell phones 349 00:20:19.720 --> 00:20:25.000 are a special purpose two way radio and they fall 350 00:20:25.079 --> 00:20:28.599 in the under an actual science subject, the study of 351 00:20:28.680 --> 00:20:32.240 radio and and two way radio. It was actually a 352 00:20:32.279 --> 00:20:36.480 prototype for cell phones were developed by amateur radios operators, 353 00:20:36.519 --> 00:20:41.119 as you maybe may be aware, the and this can 354 00:20:41.839 --> 00:20:46.079 my feeling is that faculty and students and family parents 355 00:20:46.079 --> 00:20:49.920 included really need to be trained in the in the 356 00:20:49.960 --> 00:20:53.039 study of of radio needs there needs to be a 357 00:20:53.039 --> 00:20:54.319 curriculum approach to it. 358 00:20:55.440 --> 00:21:00.359 I get, I get the idea I got doctor McCarry's time. 359 00:21:01.000 --> 00:21:03.960 Doctor McCarey, I think that could be a subject in school, 360 00:21:04.359 --> 00:21:06.720 but I think it has to be a subject that 361 00:21:06.839 --> 00:21:10.680 is designated, you know, Junior year senior year as one 362 00:21:11.480 --> 00:21:14.119 portion of a curriculum. Go ahead. 363 00:21:16.319 --> 00:21:20.640 Robert's comments. Because communication is not that communication is good. 364 00:21:21.160 --> 00:21:24.359 It's the highly addictive nature of some of these notifications 365 00:21:24.359 --> 00:21:29.599 and apps. So some alternatives that parents have used are 366 00:21:29.799 --> 00:21:33.160 phones that don't have apps, that don't have internet access, 367 00:21:33.720 --> 00:21:37.000 or where they can control remotely whether or not the 368 00:21:37.119 --> 00:21:41.599 child who they can call. So some phones are set 369 00:21:41.640 --> 00:21:44.480 up so they have no internet access, they have no 370 00:21:44.799 --> 00:21:48.559 social media apps, but they can call nine to one 371 00:21:48.640 --> 00:21:53.039 one and they can call their parents. For very young children, 372 00:21:53.279 --> 00:21:56.480 that may be a reasonable option. What's not working is 373 00:21:56.519 --> 00:21:59.240 when the kids are checking their phone every five seconds. 374 00:21:59.400 --> 00:22:02.279 And look as adults get in this scenario too. There's 375 00:22:02.319 --> 00:22:05.200 a lot going on, there's information, you're waiting on a 376 00:22:05.200 --> 00:22:08.480 call or a text, and you find yourself more jittery. 377 00:22:09.160 --> 00:22:11.839 That doesn't make sense when a teacher is trying to 378 00:22:11.920 --> 00:22:13.680 teach math or English. 379 00:22:13.720 --> 00:22:16.920 Absolutely, Robert, appreciate your calling, your observation. I just got 380 00:22:16.960 --> 00:22:18.359 to get one more in here before I have to 381 00:22:18.440 --> 00:22:22.039 let you doctor McCarry go. Thanks, thank you, Robert, thank 382 00:22:22.039 --> 00:22:24.000 you much, thank you. I would go to ed and 383 00:22:24.079 --> 00:22:28.240 Wooster Edward tight on time with doctor mcarrey. You got 384 00:22:28.240 --> 00:22:29.920 a question or comic right head ed. 385 00:22:31.480 --> 00:22:32.319 Yeah, Mike comments. 386 00:22:32.319 --> 00:22:34.359 And I've been saying this for several years. I think 387 00:22:34.400 --> 00:22:38.039 the smartphones are the cigarettes of our era, and they 388 00:22:38.079 --> 00:22:40.160 even look that way. Fifty years ago you would have 389 00:22:40.160 --> 00:22:42.839 seen people holding a pack of cigarettes and lighting up 390 00:22:42.880 --> 00:22:46.039 a cigarette, and here you see everybody with a smartphone 391 00:22:46.039 --> 00:22:47.359 in their hands, tapping away. 392 00:22:48.400 --> 00:22:52.200 And I think apps are the cigarette vending machines of 393 00:22:52.279 --> 00:22:54.400 our era, and I think we've got to start by 394 00:22:54.480 --> 00:22:59.200 curving those and getting the getting. 395 00:22:58.880 --> 00:23:02.160 The tech CEOs up in from of Congress. I don't 396 00:23:02.160 --> 00:23:04.480 know if you remember thirty years ago. I think in 397 00:23:04.559 --> 00:23:06.440 the early nineties there was a hearing where they got 398 00:23:06.480 --> 00:23:08.920 all the tobacco CEOs up in front of the sent 399 00:23:09.000 --> 00:23:11.680 of hearing at the same time, and that was really 400 00:23:11.680 --> 00:23:14.640 the beginning of the end for the tobacco company that 401 00:23:14.680 --> 00:23:15.119