Speaker 1: Hello, this is the Itchy and Bitchy Podcast because being
Speaker 1: itchy is bitchy and our medical system sucks. I'm doctor
Speaker 1: Keith Nolica, a vetnary, allergist and dermatologist.
Speaker 2: And I'm Stephen Miller, a doctor of nursing practice and
Speaker 2: a Q Care nurse practitioner.
Speaker 1: Send us your questions at ask at itch not dot com.
Speaker 1: We love you, but we're not your doctors. The information
Speaker 1: we discuss is not direct medical advice. Please talk to
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Speaker 1: send us a quest question at ask at itchnot dot com.
Speaker 1: Thanks welcome back, and I hope this finds you well.
Speaker 1: How are you doing, Doc?
Speaker 2: I'm good. I hope everyone's good. It's a rainy day
Speaker 2: here in Knoxville.
Speaker 1: All right, So this episode is titled Menopause Science, the
Speaker 1: hormone dumpster Fire and pituitary Chaos. Explain so simple even
Speaker 1: a husband can understand, and that may sound a little derogatory,
Speaker 1: but I realized after talking to Karen, who's taught me
Speaker 1: so much, Thank you very much, Karen, and doing an
Speaker 1: episode on menopause, that I actually didn't really understand menopause.
Speaker 1: And I'm even a veterinarian. I did a master's which
Speaker 1: turned out at Auburn University to be in endochronology, just
Speaker 1: because that's what was their expertise. But so I thought
Speaker 1: today that we would try to explain menopause and I
Speaker 1: educate myself in the process. And one of the couple
Speaker 1: other things that kind of stimulated this was my realization
Speaker 1: that I didn't quite understand, and being embarrassed to tell
Speaker 1: Karen that I didn't quite understand. And then I saw
Speaker 1: this really great We try to be trendy and pay
Speaker 1: attention to social trends, but there was this really cute
Speaker 1: Facebook post with this teenage boy and his mom, and
Speaker 1: the teenage boy was talking about I think this was
Speaker 1: all AI generated, but if they were actors, kudos to you.
Speaker 1: But the teenage boy was explaining how the mom was
Speaker 1: going through cougar puberty, and so cougar is the slang
Speaker 1: is for sort of a semi aggressive woman who's self
Speaker 1: empowered and willing to date younger men and out and
Speaker 1: about in the world. And so, but that really funny
Speaker 1: thing was basically how menopause is like puberty, and I
Speaker 1: started thinking that, you know, that actually is probably pretty accurate.
Speaker 1: So we clinically talk about medical issues, and what we
Speaker 1: deal with clinically predominantly is single hormone deficits, so like
Speaker 1: low thyroid and then we do a thyroid test and
Speaker 1: supplement the thyroid hormones.
Speaker 2: Is that correct, Stephen, Yeah, I mean in medicine we
Speaker 2: do certainly hormone replacement therapy on many levels, not just
Speaker 2: estrogen or progesterone, but things like thyroid hormone and testosterone
Speaker 2: and that kind of thing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So it's so clinically though, it's very much sort
Speaker 1: of a single item kind of concept. So the way
Speaker 1: the system works. And I really like Jesus for a
Speaker 1: variety of reasons, but one of the reasons I like
Speaker 1: Jesus is that he told a lot of stories and
Speaker 1: parables to make things very simple, and so, like the
Speaker 1: story of the mustard seed, a little bitty problem can
Speaker 1: turn into a great big issue. And so that's kind
Speaker 1: of where we're headed with this. So I'm going to
Speaker 1: try to explain the whole pat tuitu a teary hormone
Speaker 1: access in the frame of your toilet, And that sounds
Speaker 1: really crazy. Hold sick with me, doc here, but and
Speaker 1: you're gonna check fact check me as we go along.
Speaker 1: But I think this will make sense even though it
Speaker 1: sounds really really crazy. So there are a lot of
Speaker 1: different terms and many many many names, and various hormones
Speaker 1: and pre hormones that are involved in this. So they
Speaker 1: have names like act H and TSH and prolactin and
Speaker 1: all of these kinds of things. And if you want
Speaker 1: us to do a whole episode on what the terms
Speaker 1: mean and the actual names, we can do that send
Speaker 1: this comment at ask at itchna dot com. But we're
Speaker 1: going to ignore all the big words for now. So
Speaker 1: the peturitary releases all of these hormones and then they
Speaker 1: affect various glands in your body, your testicles, your ovaries,
Speaker 1: your adrenal glands, and there's this big cycle. But the
Speaker 1: way that it really works is kind of like your toilet.
Speaker 1: So you have a toilet bowl and then a tank
Speaker 1: of water which represents the hormones and so when you
Speaker 1: flush your toilet, you get a surge of water, you
Speaker 1: get a surge of hormones, and most of these are
Speaker 1: on a circadian rhythm, So like when you sleep, a
Speaker 1: lot of hormones get released to help kids grow and
Speaker 1: help you your brain regenerate and all of these good things.
Speaker 1: So daytime, nighttime, even seasonal in animals. So that's kind
Speaker 1: of the water tank. But then when your hormones are low,
Speaker 1: the pituitary gland in your brain, just a little BITDP
Speaker 1: sized thing in the base of your brain release recognizes that.
Speaker 1: So it's like the flute valve in your toilet that
Speaker 1: the water goes down and it says, oh, we need
Speaker 1: more water, and it the pituitary gland fills, turns on
Speaker 1: and starts filling up the hormones, and so your brain
Speaker 1: then sends signals to the glands the test testicles, ovaries,
Speaker 1: adrenal glands to start producing more hormone and then there's
Speaker 1: a negative feedback loop that the when the water gets
Speaker 1: high enough, the float valve recognizes that and it turns off.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so the pituitary gland starts to produce stimulating hormones,
Speaker 2: and that's the s in many are releasing hormones, so
Speaker 2: they're pre hormones.
Speaker 1: That's Sh'S thyroid stimulating hormone and that comes from the petuitary.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, and so that technically is considered sort of
Speaker 2: this feedback loop, and that's why it's called the petuitary axis.
Speaker 1: And so the body says we need more hormones, the
Speaker 1: petuitary says, okay, well this is how you make more hormones,
Speaker 1: and it goes and it says how to make the hormones,
Speaker 1: and then the glands make more hormones. So but the
Speaker 1: whole system very simple. So toilet more water, the petuitary
Speaker 1: produces more water, you flesh, get the cycles. All of
Speaker 1: that makes sense. Imagine if you have fifteen toilets all
Speaker 1: lined up in a row and they're all interconnected, and
Speaker 1: that's actually what the hormone system and petuitary gland is
Speaker 1: doing in our bodies.
Speaker 2: Yes, So there's five different axes, and without getting too
Speaker 2: thick in the weeds here, the thyed axis, the adrenal axis,
Speaker 2: the gunadal axis, the growth hormone axis, and prolactin axis,
Speaker 2: and all of those axes help control varying hormone levels
Speaker 2: throughout the body.
Speaker 1: So what happens during menopause and why this is such
Speaker 1: a crazy time, and why it actually is pretty fitting
Speaker 1: to compare it to puberty. So this cougar puberty little
Speaker 1: Facebook post actually was pretty clever. Is that menopause is
Speaker 1: not like a program stop sign. So in animals, when
Speaker 1: they cycle through estrus and fertility periods, it's a very
Speaker 1: organized stop sign kind of event and then it can restart.
Speaker 1: What menopause is is this chaotic, crazy situation where the
Speaker 1: ovaries basically burn out and they stop producing the estrogen
Speaker 1: and the progestine, which provide the negative feedback to the
Speaker 1: pituitary gland, and so the pituitary gland goes crazy producing
Speaker 1: all of these pre hormones, which then stimulate all of
Speaker 1: the other glands in the body. And it's like you're
Speaker 1: toilets overflowing and going crazy because the float valve is broken.
Speaker 1: But in addition, it's all five of these access so
Speaker 1: all fifteen toilets in are connected and it's all going crazy,
Speaker 1: and it's this giant dumpster fire of hormone imbalance, and
Speaker 1: the protuitary is trying to get the body to make more,
Speaker 1: but the body doesn't have more to make and it's
Speaker 1: just insane. So that's what menopause is. We're going to
Speaker 1: take a break here and we're going to be back
Speaker 1: and we're going to talk about the four other medical
Speaker 1: conditions where the same kind of crazy dumpster fire and
Speaker 1: hormone chaos can occur. So we'll be right back right,
Speaker 1: we're back, and we're going to talk about the dumpster
Speaker 1: fire of menopause. But actually there are four events that
Speaker 1: happen in our lifetime that are similar where the peituitary
Speaker 1: gland and the bodies glands like the testicles, ovariase, adrenal
Speaker 1: glands are just totally going crazy. So menopause is one
Speaker 1: we talked about that now it's not an organized stop sign,
Speaker 1: it's just total pituitary hormone chaos. The other situations are
Speaker 1: true puberty. So we've all most of us, I guess
Speaker 1: listeners have gone through puberty, and we can remember we've
Speaker 1: watched our teenagers go through puberty. And it's another one
Speaker 1: of these times where the peturitary gland is secreting huge
Speaker 1: amounts of hormones to get the body to do all
Speaker 1: sorts of different things. So it's producing estrogen's progestins testosterone,
Speaker 1: but it's also precing growth hormone. The prolactin controls the
Speaker 1: circadian rhythms. We have cortisol levels that are being increased,
Speaker 1: and so you can imagine all of these fifteen toilets
Speaker 1: connected and the body is trying to regulate them to
Speaker 1: get your body as a child to mature into an
Speaker 1: adult and become sexually functional. So that's a really really
Speaker 1: complex period and a lot of chaos going through and
Speaker 1: it really is pretty similar to menopause. So if you
Speaker 1: think about increased hair growth is happening, you think about
Speaker 1: mucous membrane is changing, you think about skin pigment occurring,
Speaker 1: skin thickness, flakiness, oil secretions in the skin, it's just
Speaker 1: a turmoil. So the other couple of situations are sleep disorders.
Speaker 1: So if you're not getting enough sleep, that's when a
Speaker 1: lot of hormones are released and a lot of pituitary
Speaker 1: activity happens due to the circadian rhythm, and prolactin may
Speaker 1: regulate a lot of that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I think it's important to point out melatonin
Speaker 2: is produced by the pineal gland, which is in the
Speaker 2: center of the brain, and then the pituitary gland does
Speaker 2: interact with melatonin in that it interacts with the circadian
Speaker 2: rhythms and hormone influences sleep wake cycles, which is influenced
Speaker 2: by growth hormone actchtsaging the gonadotropins. So there is definite
Speaker 2: interaction between the pituitary gland and melatonin that's produced by
Speaker 2: the pineal gland.
Speaker 1: And that's why you'll hear a lot about taking melatonin
Speaker 1: to improve sleep, which then improves hormone balance. And we
Speaker 1: have a condition in dogs called geriatric hormone imbalance that
Speaker 1: has melotonin sensitivity, and so melatonin can help sort of
Speaker 1: stabilize a lot of these hormone axes. It doesn't really
Speaker 1: replace deficient hormones, but it just makes the whole system
Speaker 1: kind of wake up and function a little bit more normally.
Speaker 1: And then the fourth one is aging. So as we age,
Speaker 1: all of our hormones tend to change. And part of
Speaker 1: that is like with menopause, where they max, the ovaries
Speaker 1: may burn out and not be able to produce the hormones,
Speaker 1: which messes up the whole feedback loop and the pituitary
Speaker 1: gland goes crazy. But all of the hormones tend to
Speaker 1: kind of slow down as we age, and that causes
Speaker 1: a lot of dysregulation, and that's starting to be recognized
Speaker 1: now in dogs with this geriatric hormone imbalance that responds
Speaker 1: to melatonin every evening. So it's kind of this weird
Speaker 1: rejuvenating kind of effect that we see in dogs. Is
Speaker 1: that happening in people where older people are responding to
Speaker 1: melatonin beneficially?
Speaker 2: Yeah, they do, and certainly there are certain forms of it,
Speaker 2: and there's a lot of science that has gone into
Speaker 2: levels of oral melatonin that people should and should not take.
Speaker 2: So I always encourage people to discuss these issues with
Speaker 2: their provider.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we are not your doctors. Please talk to your provider.
Speaker 1: So that's sort of the controversy between high dose melatonin
Speaker 1: and low dose melatonin. We use high dose melatonin, but
Speaker 1: they can't tell us if they're uncomfortable or have insomnia
Speaker 1: or a variety of things like that. So humans may
Speaker 1: be much more sensitive to some of the side effects.
Speaker 1: The nice thing about melatonin is that there's really not
Speaker 1: a toxic dose in dogs at least. Definitely check with
Speaker 1: your provider about the human issues if you're going to
Speaker 1: take any supplements. Again, we're not your doctors. So we're
Speaker 1: going to take a break here and we'll be back
Speaker 1: and talk about some of the treatments that we can
Speaker 1: do for these disorders. Again, the four big disorders we
Speaker 1: talked about, menopauses the starting place for this chaos of
Speaker 1: fifteen toilets all interconnected that are overflowing, and that's the
Speaker 1: pituitary gland and the body's glands. And then we have
Speaker 1: real puberty and teenagers, we have aging and sleep disorders.
Speaker 1: So we'll be back in a second and I'll talk
Speaker 1: about what maybe we can do about some of those.
Speaker 1: All right, we're back, and I hope you're still with us.
Speaker 1: So we're going to talk about some possible easy therapies.
Speaker 1: Really nothing prescription at this point, although Stephen may want
Speaker 1: to add some things. But so, the four disorders that
Speaker 1: cause the fifteen toilets to overflow in the pituitary hormone
Speaker 1: axis dumpster fire are menopause, puberty, aging, and sleep disorders.
Speaker 1: So what do you want to talk about first?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean we can we can address the sleep
Speaker 2: disorder pee certainly. I think sleep apnea contributes to so
Speaker 2: many issues, including heart a rhythmias and many cardiovascular issues
Speaker 2: as well as aging. Sleep's very important for our bodies
Speaker 2: to heal, and so I think it's important for people
Speaker 2: to have a sleep regimen that's been set for, like
Speaker 2: this sleep hygiene which we've talked about in another episode,
Speaker 2: where people begin to prepare for sleep at nine, turn
Speaker 2: off stimulants, turn off their computers and their iPhones, and
Speaker 2: turn the lights down in the house.
Speaker 1: And I think if there's one single thing that I
Speaker 1: could say makes a huge difference having kids and teenagers
Speaker 1: and even with myself, is really get rid of the
Speaker 1: smartphone and the tablet, Like having those in the bedroom
Speaker 1: really affects your sleep and sort of this scheduled relaxation
Speaker 1: process getting ready to go to sleep is also really important.
Speaker 1: And part of that needs to be to get rid
Speaker 1: of the smart devices and get off of social media
Speaker 1: and stop dooms growing and brain rot and get your
Speaker 1: body ready to have a good night sleep.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think it is vital to avoid
Speaker 2: caffeine and stimulants after about five pm.
Speaker 1: Any chocolate or any caffeine after four pm.
Speaker 2: Yeah zero, and sort of get the body prepared for sleep.
Speaker 2: So I think that's the sleep hygiene piece. Making sure
Speaker 2: that your bedrooms put together in a way that's conducive
Speaker 2: to quietness and peacefulness and darkness.
Speaker 1: So how much do you think melatonin helps? So? And
Speaker 1: dogs melatonin really doesn't seem to make them sleepy at all,
Speaker 1: but they sleep twenty hours a day, so it's hard
Speaker 1: to know. Does melatonin actually help sleep in people or
Speaker 1: is it working in a different.
Speaker 2: No, it helps people sleep and certain the issue is
Speaker 2: and there are lots of issues around melatonin. A lot
Speaker 2: of people overplace their melatonin, which then suppresses their internal
Speaker 2: production of melotone.
Speaker 1: What do you mean overplaced?
Speaker 2: Taking thirty milligrams of melatonin at night as opposed to
Speaker 2: starting off with lower doses that would just stimulate melatonin
Speaker 2: production in your body, and so you can suppress melatonin
Speaker 2: production and then that.
Speaker 1: Causes issues as well.
Speaker 2: You have to retrain your body to sort of get
Speaker 2: all that worked out. So, but melatonin is very effective.
Speaker 2: I think people historically have either taken too little or
Speaker 2: taken too much and not had good results based upon
Speaker 2: their lack of knowledge around melatonin utilizations.
Speaker 1: Okay, so definitely talk to your provider about that. Also,
Speaker 1: sleep apnea, that's something that you would talk to your
Speaker 1: provider and get a sleep study and medically. You know,
Speaker 1: people can die with sleep apnea, so that can be
Speaker 1: a really serious medical issue.
Speaker 2: Well, and I think too people believe sleep apnea is
Speaker 2: only obstructive sleep apnea, and I think it's important to
Speaker 2: sort of help our audience understand that they're varying forms
Speaker 2: of sleep apnea that are treated very differently. So some
Speaker 2: folks have central sleep apnea.
Speaker 1: Which is like a brain neurologic nerve.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I mean, I think it's really really important
Speaker 2: that if you have symptoms of sleep apnea. There there's
Speaker 2: a screening tool called the stop bang which you can
Speaker 2: find anywhere online and take it and if you achieve
Speaker 2: certain number of points on that, then certainly consulting with
Speaker 2: your provider to get a sleep evaluation.
Speaker 1: Okay. Aging also kind of relates, So as we age
Speaker 1: with a sleep app near you're typically we gain weight.
Speaker 1: At least I've gained a fair amount of weight, and
Speaker 1: so you know that may be part of the issue.
Speaker 1: But as we age, all of our hormones tend to
Speaker 1: slowly decrease, and it's almost just kind of like the
Speaker 1: body's wearing out. But it also relates to other things.
Speaker 1: So as we age, we stop exercising as much, we
Speaker 1: don't move around as much, we become more sedentary, we
Speaker 1: definitely can gain weight, and our whole metabolism, fatty liver syndrome,
Speaker 1: a lot of those things can happen as well. And then,
Speaker 1: like I said, in the dogs, we're recognizing this geriatric
Speaker 1: hormone imbalance that we don't really have a specific disorder,
Speaker 1: but we give a melotone and they seem to kind
Speaker 1: of rejuvenate a little bit. So what would be some
Speaker 1: simple aging things exerc mobile.
Speaker 2: So in humans, the reduction of growth hormone is kind
Speaker 2: of referred to as somematopause, sort of like menopause, but somematopause.
Speaker 1: Somatotropin is like growth hormone, and.
Speaker 2: So somatopause which is decreasing growth hormone and IGF it
Speaker 2: leads to things like reduction in muscle mass, increasing body fat,
Speaker 2: low energy, decreased bone density, and reduced exercise tolerance.
Speaker 1: And that sounds like aging.
Speaker 2: It sounds like aging because it is aging, and so
Speaker 2: certainly there are many things we can do to offset that,
Speaker 2: like exercise, a routine exercise regimen, you know, five to
Speaker 2: seven days a week. If some form of aerobic and
Speaker 2: muscle resistance training.
Speaker 1: Get up and Move. Used to do this Facebook post
Speaker 1: where it was get up and Move. It was even
Speaker 1: just parking at the end of the parking lot so
Speaker 1: you would walk more steps.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I did that in an effort to encourage people,
Speaker 2: for the patients and friends to continue to push it.
Speaker 2: Even though you're tired, you need to move, and so
Speaker 2: daily ways to incorporate more movement would be to part
Speaker 2: further away from the building, take the steps instead of
Speaker 2: the elevator, you know, lifting objects to use your upper
Speaker 2: body muscles.
Speaker 1: Certainly, I think even simple nutrition can play a big role.
Speaker 1: So as we get older and exercise less gain weight
Speaker 1: than just better nutrition pain attention to it. Yes, what
Speaker 1: we're putting in our.
Speaker 2: Bodies low fat and then certainly higher protein intakes. So
Speaker 2: in order for our bodies to build muscle, we need
Speaker 2: good protein intake, and so protein really becomes vital to
Speaker 2: us as we age.
Speaker 1: All right, So the other issues are than puberty, and
Speaker 1: there's not much that we can actually do to help
Speaker 1: puberty other than get through it. But definitely mental health
Speaker 1: is important during puberty. So it's a crazy time young people,
Speaker 1: you know, they're not wise and worldly like some of
Speaker 1: this older people, and so you know, understanding counseling, but
Speaker 1: also for them, you know, make sure that they're having
Speaker 1: really good sleep, that they're prepared for sleep, get rid
Speaker 1: of those iPads and smartphones, you know, really even prepare them.
Speaker 1: With my daughter, we were really good about trying to
Speaker 1: set up a pre bedtime sort of events, even starting
Speaker 1: as a young child, with that continued into her teenage years,
Speaker 1: sort of getting this relaxation schedule, getting ready to go
Speaker 1: to sleep. So that can be really important for teenagers.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then on the other end of the spectrum,
Speaker 2: you've got things as we human beings age, you get
Speaker 2: a reductions in LH and FSAH, the gonautotropic hormones, and
Speaker 2: so then people suffer side effects from rectile dysfunction, infertility,
Speaker 2: low energy level, and so certainly there are some HRT
Speaker 2: options for those things as we as we get.
Speaker 1: Also hormone replacement therapy. So that's more of the menopause,
Speaker 1: which is the next kind of section, the last of
Speaker 1: the four. So in menopause again it's that the big
Speaker 1: problem is not just that you run out of estrogen,
Speaker 1: but that you run out of estrogen progesterones LHFSH and
Speaker 1: then that signals the pituitary to produce more pre hormones
Speaker 1: and the whole system goes crazy, so your fifteen toilets
Speaker 1: start overflowing. So some of the therapies for that is
Speaker 1: one just recognizing that this isn't just a behavioral mental
Speaker 1: disorder of older women. That's kind of where a lot
Speaker 1: of medicine used to be for way too long, and
Speaker 1: so now with hormone replacement therapy, it really can help
Speaker 1: to just provide some of the hormones like estrogen that
Speaker 1: reverse some of these negative symptoms like mucous membran drying,
Speaker 1: some of the sleep disorders, erectile dysfunctions as men age
Speaker 1: and have kind of the menopause man version that can
Speaker 1: happen as well. But what else could women do with menopause.
Speaker 2: That would be well, I mean, I certainly think that
Speaker 2: Karen Nicol, who initiated this podcast years ago, would be
Speaker 2: the expert and certainly has had many episodes on HRT
Speaker 2: and of course on HRT.
Speaker 1: So she has two hundred and seventeen episodes and they're
Speaker 1: all at the website which is Itchy andbitchi dot com
Speaker 1: So if you want to hear the expert actually talk
Speaker 1: in an expertise rather than a toilet metaphor or parable,
Speaker 1: that's your source.
Speaker 2: Yeah, when it comes to hormone replacement therapy, it is
Speaker 2: such a complex topic, a complex treatment plan and individualized
Speaker 2: treatment plan, and certainly I think, can you know, having
Speaker 2: consultation with an expert talk just in hormones becomes something
Speaker 2: that I think is extremely beneficial.
Speaker 1: Okay, we're going to take another break, and when we
Speaker 1: come back, we're going to do our legit or bullshit section,
Speaker 1: So we're going to be talking about microplastics. Stick with us,
Speaker 1: all right, we're back, and this is the legit or
Speaker 1: bullshit section where we have some interesting medical science facts
Speaker 1: and we try to determine if this is something that's
Speaker 1: real or if this is really just insane. So are
Speaker 1: you ready, doctor Miller? Yeah, okay, So here we go.
Speaker 1: So this is about microplastics. So this actually topic came
Speaker 1: up again. We try to be trendy and stick with
Speaker 1: the times here. So we were at a dinner event
Speaker 1: with our dearest friends. I'll leave all the names out,
Speaker 1: but you know who you are, and they are very smart, educated,
Speaker 1: curious people, and it turns out that one of our
Speaker 1: guy friends a straight guy, which will become important in
Speaker 1: the future in the story, but was horrified to learn
Speaker 1: during the day that microplastics were found in penile tissue
Speaker 1: in men. So is that real? Stock?
Speaker 2: It is? It is, and certainly, you know, we are
Speaker 2: learning more and more there's emerging research and emerging data
Speaker 2: on this particular target topic. There was a twenty twenty
Speaker 2: four study that was done looking at microplastics in the
Speaker 2: tissue of men undergoing surgery for a rectile dysfunction. Okay, well,
Speaker 2: they found polyethylene, tetraphalite, and polypropylene in erectile tissue. And
Speaker 2: so microplastics or nanoplastics can enter the body through food
Speaker 2: and water, air inhalation, packaging material, synthetic fibers, and in
Speaker 2: very very tiny particles nanoplastics they enter through the intestinal barriers,
Speaker 2: the lung tissues, and so that's leak like that.
Speaker 1: Kind of situation, which we'll have other episodes on. So
Speaker 1: what I found really funny about the story, just to
Speaker 1: kind of give you the details, is that all of
Speaker 1: the straight men, so we're two gay men here, and
Speaker 1: I think that kind of made things on our side
Speaker 1: a little bit less panicky, but anyway, they were horrified
Speaker 1: that they may have microplastics in their penis, let alone
Speaker 1: that they've been found in placentas and female ovaries and
Speaker 1: brain tissue. But for some reason this penile microplastic thing.
Speaker 1: The whole evening revolved around the horrible finding of microplastics
Speaker 1: in their penis.
Speaker 2: So that was just I do want to make sure
Speaker 2: the audience understands these are emerging evidence. These are not
Speaker 2: huge randomness trials. So it's important to know that the
Speaker 2: current clinical evidence is based upon very small studies. Small
Speaker 2: sample size. Detection methods are not consistent. They vary what
Speaker 2: is considered normal.
Speaker 1: We don't know. So, doctor Miller, what organ has the
Speaker 1: highest And I don't want you to look this up
Speaker 1: before I ask you? So what organ in the body
Speaker 1: has been identified to have the highest micro plastic So
Speaker 1: I'm going to give you some options. So is it
Speaker 1: the penis or the placenta which I mentioned before? Would
Speaker 1: it be the kidney, the liver, or the brain? So
Speaker 1: you have several options there. What do you think I
Speaker 1: would pick the liver? Yeah, and that makes sense because
Speaker 1: the liver normally filters out toxins and does a lot
Speaker 1: of really good stuff for us, the cytochrome P four
Speaker 1: fifty enzyme pathway, all of that really good stuff. It
Speaker 1: turns out it's the brain. The brain has twenty times
Speaker 1: more level of microplastic than the liver or the kidney.
Speaker 1: So that's you know, again, this comes back to our
Speaker 1: dear friend that was really worried about the microplastic and
Speaker 1: their penis rather than their brain, and their brain has
Speaker 1: twenty times more. So I think Karen would appreciate the
Speaker 1: sarcasm in that that the men would of course be
Speaker 1: worried about their sexual organs more than their neurologic cognitive organs. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So then the last question here is there's all sorts
Speaker 1: of craziness and part of this whole discussion about having
Speaker 1: microplastics in your organs and your penis specifically is oh
Speaker 1: my gosh, what is it going to do? Is my
Speaker 1: junk going to fall off? And so does do these
Speaker 1: microplastics cause disorders like dementia, a rectile dysfunction, inflammation in
Speaker 1: the body.
Speaker 2: So again, as I said earlier, the issue comes down
Speaker 2: to we're not sure because the studies are not consistent.
Speaker 2: There's small sample size in this that We're not sure
Speaker 2: what the clinical outcome becomes, but we do know that
Speaker 2: these microplastics are plastics cause things like oxidative stress and
Speaker 2: inflammation and that type of thing. So there may be
Speaker 2: some correlation with autoimmune issues or whatever. We just don't
Speaker 2: really know.
Speaker 1: And this gets back to previous discussions we've had about
Speaker 1: the medical system with causation versus correlation, that just because
Speaker 1: we have some plastics in our brain and penis doesn't
Speaker 1: absolutely mean that they cause disease, and so we do
Speaker 1: need more studies, We need more information. And it sounds
Speaker 1: horrible to have plastics in your body. I think we
Speaker 1: all don't want plastics in our body. But it's also
Speaker 1: wrong to assume that they're immediately going to kill us
Speaker 1: based on a TikTok, Facebook or social media post as well.
Speaker 2: I think we need a valid evidence that's been peer
Speaker 2: reviewed and you know, sample size bigger to represent represent
Speaker 2: population impact and that sort of thing.
Speaker 1: So I would say this microplastic thing is both legit
Speaker 1: and bullshit. So it's a mixture of both. What do
Speaker 1: you think.
Speaker 2: I don't know that I would call it bullshit. I
Speaker 2: think I think it's it could be legit. It's it's
Speaker 2: still sort of questionable what what we know it's there,
Speaker 2: so again it comes down to what what's the clinical impact?
Speaker 1: All right, So that ends this podcast and thank you
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