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<v Speaker 1>My friend Thomas Fry, and together we are going to

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<v Speaker 1>talk about the future. Now, Thomas, you sent me a

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<v Speaker 1>column today and immediately I was like, can I go

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<v Speaker 1>ahead and sign up for that digital copy of my life?

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, can we go ahead and jump on that?

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<v Speaker 1>Can I be a beta tester for the digital copy

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<v Speaker 1>of myself and my life? Let's start there. First of all,

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<v Speaker 1>good to see you again, my friend.

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<v Speaker 2>Great to see you too. Yes, I think we're going

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<v Speaker 2>to have this very soon.

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<v Speaker 3>You can be wearing smart glasses and record everything that

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<v Speaker 3>you see, and it can also record everything that you hear,

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<v Speaker 3>and then with a few censors, you'll be able to

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<v Speaker 3>record everything that you taste, touch and feel, and you

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<v Speaker 3>can record your entire life experience in and so then

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<v Speaker 3>you have a digital copy of you that you start

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<v Speaker 3>in your personal cloud.

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<v Speaker 1>So how do you This is what? Because I got

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<v Speaker 1>to tell you this would be a game changer in

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<v Speaker 1>marital arguments, right, because most marital arguments are because someone

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<v Speaker 1>heard something differently than the other person thought they said it.

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<v Speaker 3>Right.

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<v Speaker 1>So can you imagine being in a in a firm

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<v Speaker 1>discussion with your loved one and saying things like no,

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<v Speaker 1>that's not what I said and you're like, digital Mandy,

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<v Speaker 1>what did I say? And then with digital made like

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<v Speaker 1>in my world, Thomas, digital Mandy would shoot out a

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<v Speaker 1>hologram of me actually saying whatever it was that I said,

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<v Speaker 1>and therefore boom, I win the argument. What I'm afraid Actually,

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<v Speaker 1>what happened is that I find out I'm wrong way

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<v Speaker 1>more than I think I'm right. Right, So, I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>how far away from from we are some of this stuff.

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<v Speaker 1>We've already got the glasses, but being able to sort

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<v Speaker 1>of instantly data mine what's been recorded. That is the

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<v Speaker 1>challenging part, Isn't.

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<v Speaker 2>It that that'll be part of it too.

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<v Speaker 3>I mean, once we record all of this and put

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<v Speaker 3>it into some personal cloud, then it's whatever interface would

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<v Speaker 3>come up with to interact.

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<v Speaker 2>With that cloud, right.

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<v Speaker 3>I mean the article talks about having a voice in

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<v Speaker 3>your ear, Well, what if it's just instantly you were recalling.

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<v Speaker 2>It because you have that mind to mind interface? That

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<v Speaker 2>would be much more efficient mind.

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<v Speaker 1>To mind interface. Sounds like something has to be implanted

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<v Speaker 1>in my brain and I'm not sure I'm ready for

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<v Speaker 1>that yet. So Thomas Ai, at this point, I'm now

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<v Speaker 1>looking at AI programs that can look at the longer

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<v Speaker 1>version of the YouTube show that I do with my

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<v Speaker 1>friend deb Flora and pull out snippets so I can

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<v Speaker 1>have them ready to go for social media. And one

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<v Speaker 1>of the most shocking things that one of these programs

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<v Speaker 1>that I'm looking at, it can go through and it says,

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<v Speaker 1>let me pick the best parts of your show. And

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<v Speaker 1>you're thinking to yourself, how does say I know if

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<v Speaker 1>it's if it's the best? The reality is it does

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<v Speaker 1>a pretty dang good job. So that now we're talking

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<v Speaker 1>about being able to think about whether something is a

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<v Speaker 1>great point, or it's funny or what makes I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>the speed with which this stuff happened is amazing, right,

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, it's crazy what's happening now.

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<v Speaker 3>This is ramping up at exponential pace, and so this

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<v Speaker 3>is giving us all these extra capabilities that we never

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<v Speaker 3>knew existed in the past. So the things that we

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<v Speaker 3>can accomplish in a single day are just going to

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<v Speaker 3>ramp up dramatically. That's what I find really interesting because

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<v Speaker 3>a lot of these things we never even knew we

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<v Speaker 3>could possibly consider in the past, and suddenly they're at

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<v Speaker 3>our doorstep ready to be unfolded.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, there's a lot of fear right now, and

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<v Speaker 1>we've talked about this in terms of AI replacing jobs

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<v Speaker 1>and AI replacing people, and I think that some industries.

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<v Speaker 1>I actually have a video from mister Beast, who is

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<v Speaker 1>by far the most popular YouTuber in the world, and

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<v Speaker 1>in it he says AI is going to be the

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<v Speaker 1>death of the YouTube creator because people are no longer

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<v Speaker 1>going to have to fund the kind of videos that

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<v Speaker 1>he's been funding and they can just use AI to

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<v Speaker 1>create them. But to your point, aren't we looking sort

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<v Speaker 1>of shortsightedly about what we don't know is going to

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<v Speaker 1>happen next? Does that make sense the way I just asked.

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<v Speaker 3>That, Yeah, you're What you're really asking is do we

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<v Speaker 3>still need the human and the loop?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah? And how can we do things impersonally?

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<v Speaker 3>I think we'll for a long time still know the

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<v Speaker 3>difference if humans are involved or if they're not involved. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>but I think we might cross that Turing test threshold

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<v Speaker 3>and not too distant future. But things are changing just

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<v Speaker 3>at and ask stronomical pace right now, and so it's

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<v Speaker 3>really tough keeping up and all this shifting and changing

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<v Speaker 3>going on.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, let's go from this conversation about digital clones into

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<v Speaker 1>your three rules of exponential capabilities, because I feel like

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<v Speaker 1>that's kind of what we're talking about, right, Like this

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<v Speaker 1>is taking us in a direction that we can't wrap

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<v Speaker 1>our head around. Just like I'm guessing that people who

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<v Speaker 1>lived on a farm in the agricultural period of the

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<v Speaker 1>world before the Industrial Revolution probably had no way of

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<v Speaker 1>understanding what the Industrial Revolution was going to unleash on society.

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<v Speaker 1>Are we kind of at that same precipice?

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<v Speaker 3>Now, Yeah, I'll just mention one other thing about digital clones.

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<v Speaker 2>First.

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<v Speaker 3>The digital clones will enable you to they will go

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<v Speaker 3>on a date for you to test out the other person.

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<v Speaker 3>So two digital clones will be testing out dating.

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<v Speaker 1>No, no, no, that is not a thing. We're not

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<v Speaker 1>going to do that. I'm not I show up for

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<v Speaker 1>coffee and someone's digital clone shows up, I am leaving

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<v Speaker 1>right away. I'm like, nope, no.

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<v Speaker 2>Not like that.

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<v Speaker 3>But they can date each other online and you don't

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<v Speaker 3>have to be involved at all. So they date a

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<v Speaker 3>thousand different people and pick the very best two or

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<v Speaker 3>three that you should test on personally.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh wait, so it's all in the in the digital world.

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<v Speaker 1>They're all dating, right, What can I get a report

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<v Speaker 1>from my digital clone? Like, oh, I see you had

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<v Speaker 1>a date with Bob, tell me about it? Is my

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<v Speaker 1>digital clone gonna be like, girl, he is not for you.

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<v Speaker 1>And here's why. I mean, like, what is that exchange

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<v Speaker 1>even gonna sound like?

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<v Speaker 2>You know, it'll sound just like that. Yeah, there you.

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<v Speaker 1>Go, girl, Bob was no, Bob is no. He's a

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<v Speaker 1>hard pass on that one. Well that actually sounds okay,

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<v Speaker 1>But then how does that get used against you? Like

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<v Speaker 1>if you're going for a job and they're like, I'm sorry,

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<v Speaker 1>your digital clone is going to have to come in

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<v Speaker 1>and do the work, you know, for three days, and

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<v Speaker 1>we'll just test out your digital clone to see how

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<v Speaker 1>it works. What if my digital clone is an idiot?

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<v Speaker 1>What if they have no idea what they're doing and

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<v Speaker 1>they prevent me from getting that job.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, there's a lot of unexplored territories, so we will

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<v Speaker 3>have to test these things out.

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<v Speaker 2>To make sure they all work right.

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<v Speaker 3>And there's there's no end to all the things that

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<v Speaker 3>are going to go wrong between.

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<v Speaker 2>Now and then.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I did get this text message Mandy digital Mandy

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<v Speaker 1>needs rewind sound effects. That would be pretty cool, Like

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<v Speaker 1>I feel like that this person asks a better question, though, Mandy.

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<v Speaker 1>Most of this new technology sounds fantastic, But how do

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<v Speaker 1>we power it and where does all the data go?

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<v Speaker 1>How secure will it be? Aren't we putting the cart

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<v Speaker 1>before the horse? And that is a genuine concern. I

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<v Speaker 1>don't need everybody having access to my entire life. I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>that's none of anybody. I don't need anybody to have

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<v Speaker 1>access to me flossing my teeth or standing there in

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<v Speaker 1>my underwear or any of the other millions of things

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<v Speaker 1>that I do every single day. So what does that

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<v Speaker 1>look like? And in terms of data storage, isn't that

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<v Speaker 1>kind of a problem that we're already running into.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I think you have to have your own personal

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<v Speaker 3>clone cloud storage. So it's your own personal cloud that

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<v Speaker 3>you store all of life details in and you guard

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<v Speaker 3>and protect that and you grant minimal access to whoever

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<v Speaker 3>you want to. But it's very very much discretionary on

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<v Speaker 3>your part. So it's not like the storage that we

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<v Speaker 3>have nowadays that gets when you store something on AI,

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<v Speaker 3>everybody has access to it.

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<v Speaker 2>That's that's not going to work.

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<v Speaker 3>We need we need a lot of protections in place,

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<v Speaker 3>and you're hitting on all the right the right pieces.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, it sounds like it would be one of

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<v Speaker 1>those things that you would want your own little dedicated

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<v Speaker 1>server for rather than off source it to a server farm.

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<v Speaker 2>Right right, Yeah, so you have to have that.

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<v Speaker 3>It might be in a server farm, but it's only

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<v Speaker 3>accessible by you.

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<v Speaker 1>Right right. Okay, now now we're talking. That sounds far

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<v Speaker 1>more reasonable to me. So I mean, are we on

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<v Speaker 1>the horizon in the next five years with stuff like

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<v Speaker 1>this or is it because just for yeah, I love you,

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<v Speaker 1>I love you.

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<v Speaker 2>Thirty I think, oh wow, because.

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<v Speaker 1>I love the thing in your article where you use

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<v Speaker 1>the example of you're in a business meeting with a

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<v Speaker 1>client and they said, yeah, in our last meeting six

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<v Speaker 1>months ago, remember we talked about and you have no

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<v Speaker 1>idea what they're talking about. Like for me, that would

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<v Speaker 1>be a godsend. It's just to be able to stay

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<v Speaker 1>on top of those little things in my life. So

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<v Speaker 1>I'm not kidding Thomas. Before you started coming on the show,

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<v Speaker 1>I was a complete luddite. I was like, I'll never

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<v Speaker 1>have a self driving car. Now I'm like, can I

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<v Speaker 1>have one?

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<v Speaker 2>Now?

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<v Speaker 3>Right?

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<v Speaker 1>So you're turning me, Thomas, you're turning me. Let's talk

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<v Speaker 1>about the laws of exponential capabilities before we run out

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<v Speaker 1>of time there, because this is very interesting to me.

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<v Speaker 3>The first law is with automation, every exponential decrease and

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<v Speaker 3>effort creates an equal and opposite exponential increase in capabilities.

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<v Speaker 1>What does that mean?

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<v Speaker 3>So as things get easier to do, you're just going

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<v Speaker 3>to do more of it, and you're going to be

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<v Speaker 3>much much more capable because you can get so many

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<v Speaker 3>more things done just because they become easier to do. Now,

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<v Speaker 3>I put these these together ten years ago, and it

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<v Speaker 3>seems like they all still hold up today.

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<v Speaker 2>So I thought that was kind of it.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I mean using the example of now, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>five six years ago, if you were a person like

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<v Speaker 1>me with limited technoledge, you had to hire someone to

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<v Speaker 1>build a decent website. Well, now there are AI platforms

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<v Speaker 1>that can take an idiot like me and walk me

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<v Speaker 1>through the entire process and AI handles all of the

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<v Speaker 1>little tricky coding things that I don't know how to do,

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<v Speaker 1>and you can build your own website. So is that

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<v Speaker 1>kind of an example of law number one?

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<v Speaker 2>That's a great, great example.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, now let's go to law number two. In this

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<v Speaker 1>As today's significant accomplishments become more common, mega accomplishments will

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<v Speaker 1>take their place. What are we talking about here.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, let's think about I've been joking around that the

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<v Speaker 3>Crazy Horse monument up in South Dakota.

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<v Speaker 2>We'll be able to.

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<v Speaker 3>Three D print it before they ever finished the original one.

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<v Speaker 1>And I love that monument. But that's funny. That is

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<v Speaker 1>really funny, Thomas. That's well done.

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<v Speaker 2>So, but I.

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<v Speaker 3>See taking on massive, huge projects because as we become

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<v Speaker 3>much more capable, we just have to set our sites

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<v Speaker 3>higher and we can get so many more things done.

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<v Speaker 3>So rather than making a statue that's ten feet high,

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<v Speaker 3>we make it one hundred feet higher, two hundred feet higher,

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<v Speaker 3>even a thousand foot high.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, the.

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<v Speaker 3>Buildings that we're going to start creating are going to

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<v Speaker 3>be massively intricate and complicated in ways that we can't

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<v Speaker 3>even imagine right now. That they're not just going to

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<v Speaker 3>be square boxes. So we said on the street corner.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I will tell you the best example of this

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<v Speaker 1>that I can think of is going back in time

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<v Speaker 1>to the first modem that Mandy Connell ever owned. And

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<v Speaker 1>I remember, I remember this clearly, Thomas. The first day

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<v Speaker 1>I got fifty six K speed on my modem, I

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<v Speaker 1>thought I had literally gone to heaven. I had died

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<v Speaker 1>and gone to heaven. And now if an entire film

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<v Speaker 1>doesn't load on my phone in three minutes, I'm mad, right,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm so those kind of things that we were like,

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<v Speaker 1>our expectations were so low, and now there on the

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<v Speaker 1>other side, it's like, if I can't get it instantly

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<v Speaker 1>in a mobile device that I hold in my hand,

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<v Speaker 1>what are you even doing? So our expectations have gone

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<v Speaker 1>from oh my gosh, I got fifty six K to

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<v Speaker 1>give me my film in three seconds. I think that's

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<v Speaker 1>a good example of that.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, when you talk to your computer or to your

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<v Speaker 3>phone and it doesn't recognize what you're saying.

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<v Speaker 1>Exactly, or when the voice to text puts in a

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<v Speaker 1>bunch of extra words and you're like, I didn't say this. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>yeah we did, we did get Law number three is

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<v Speaker 1>as we raise the bar for our achievements, we also

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<v Speaker 1>reset the norm for our expectations. That's kind of also

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<v Speaker 1>what I was just talking about. I mean, now we

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<v Speaker 1>expect that kind of speed where it was something to

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<v Speaker 1>wonder at not that long ago.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, so you're you're suddenly at work, you're getting ten

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<v Speaker 3>times as much done as you used to get done.

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<v Speaker 3>Now suddenly the boss just normally expects you to get

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<v Speaker 3>ten times as much done.

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<v Speaker 1>Correct. That's why I keep my output at work very

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<v Speaker 1>very low, Thomas, It's very low, even keeled low kind

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<v Speaker 1>of thing. Don't want to get too ahead of myself there.

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<v Speaker 1>So I got a couple questions going back to the

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<v Speaker 1>personal digital clone, and one of them is where does

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<v Speaker 1>your personal cloud info go when you die? Who gets that?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah? I think that's part of your will.

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<v Speaker 1>Could you imagine? And your family would be like, oh God,

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<v Speaker 1>who has to take care of digital?

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<v Speaker 2>Mom?

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<v Speaker 1>Like this sucks? Like now somebody's got to be in

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<v Speaker 1>charge of the storage. We're never gonna watch it again.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know I would actually put it into my

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<v Speaker 1>will that like, put it on a thumb drive and

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<v Speaker 1>smash it with a hammer, right Like. I don't want

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<v Speaker 1>all of that to go on beyond me. I think

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<v Speaker 1>that my time on earth will be well spent. But

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<v Speaker 1>after that, do I really matter in the grand scheme

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<v Speaker 1>of things? And oddly I'm okay with the answer being no.

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<v Speaker 3>So if somebody goes to your cemetery site and it's

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<v Speaker 3>all built into your tombstone and they can talk to

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<v Speaker 3>you right there.

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<v Speaker 1>Chuck my husband, he loves the idea of that, Thomas,

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<v Speaker 1>But I don't even want a headstone. I want to

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<v Speaker 1>be put in the ground, wrapped in a shroud, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>ashes to ashes, dust to dust, like, keep it natural.

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<v Speaker 1>And if I do have a headstone, it will be

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<v Speaker 1>because my children demand it, not because I felt the

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<v Speaker 1>need to live on in some kind of digital fashion

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<v Speaker 1>like Mandy headroom or something that's just you know, if

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<v Speaker 1>my family wanted it, then that's great. They could do it,

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<v Speaker 1>and more power to them. But I'm gonna be dead, right,

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<v Speaker 1>So I'm okay with that. How about this one? With

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<v Speaker 1>all of these advances in computing, will there be any

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<v Speaker 1>more room for Thomas Edison's meaning? What is left to discover?

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<v Speaker 3>Right?

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<v Speaker 1>What is left to invent? And I know that seems

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<v Speaker 1>like a silly question because there's always something, But is

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<v Speaker 1>it harder to cross that barrier or is it easier

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<v Speaker 1>now because of the technology.

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<v Speaker 3>I actually think it'll be easier, and I think there's

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<v Speaker 3>going to be It'll be up to people to actually

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<v Speaker 3>cross the chasm for what would exists today into what

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<v Speaker 3>can I just tomorrow. So we'll we'll have to come

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<v Speaker 3>up with that be our imagination. So that's one of

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<v Speaker 3>the barriers that AI has that can only work with

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<v Speaker 3>what's already existence. So to come up with something new

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<v Speaker 3>and original, it'll be strictly a human thing.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, yeah, because I mean, Thomas, I have been using

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<v Speaker 1>I've now officially hired chat gpt as my assistant and

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<v Speaker 1>I'm using it. But what an incredible tool it is.

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<v Speaker 1>Now it's not going to replace what I think about things,

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<v Speaker 1>but in terms of gathering up large sums of data

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<v Speaker 1>and creating a chart, oh my gosh, something that would

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<v Speaker 1>have taken me a half hour of my own personal

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<v Speaker 1>time now takes me ninety seconds. So that allows me

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<v Speaker 1>to do a whole bunch of other stuff that I

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<v Speaker 1>have time for because I'm not trying to dig up

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<v Speaker 1>the data that chat gpt can find in ninety seconds.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I'm using it to cross to cross check everything

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<v Speaker 3>that I'm doing. Is this the best approach? What am

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<v Speaker 3>I doing wrong? What are the failures in this model?

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<v Speaker 3>And it instantly on that helps me all the wholes

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<v Speaker 3>that I have, So it's hugely valuable.

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<v Speaker 1>Now let me ask you this question from a texter,

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<v Speaker 1>and I'm going to glow up their question just a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit. Even though it's a good question. And this

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<v Speaker 1>question is Mandy asked Thomas, if we have a digital clone,

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<v Speaker 1>could we not put fake quality qualities and misrepresent yourself

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<v Speaker 1>to get your job or get your date, Because let's

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<v Speaker 1>be real, there are times in every job interview where

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<v Speaker 1>they ask you a question that you don't know the

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<v Speaker 1>answer to, so you bluff your way through it. Is

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<v Speaker 1>our digital clone going to have those same sink fast

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<v Speaker 1>on my feet, bluff my way through it? Bs qualities

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<v Speaker 1>that we have.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, cosmetic surgery for your digital clone. Yes, I'm sure

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<v Speaker 3>somebody's going to come out with that.

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<v Speaker 1>That.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, the whole drone and hence and strategy.

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<v Speaker 1>I can just see it now. There's going to be

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<v Speaker 1>a whole cottage industry on how to glow up your

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<v Speaker 1>digital clone in such a way that's passable. Not obviously

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<v Speaker 1>well glowed up, but you could just throw it out

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<v Speaker 1>there to do all kinds of stuff, and then when

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<v Speaker 1>the real you shows up, they're like, wait a minute,

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<v Speaker 1>that's not at all one of us. This texter said, Mandy,

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<v Speaker 1>can you address water usage and AI? And I think

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<v Speaker 1>that's a bigger question about power usage water usage? Why

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<v Speaker 1>does AI take so much of both?

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<v Speaker 3>It takes so much compute power just grinding away on

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<v Speaker 3>all of the things that it has access to, and

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<v Speaker 3>that brings up this whole topic of where our data

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<v Speaker 3>centers are going to be in the future, which is

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<v Speaker 3>Jeff Bezos says that we should be putting our data

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<v Speaker 3>centers in space because they have access to solar twenty

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<v Speaker 3>four to seven, and so that's naturally we can we

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<v Speaker 3>could do things much cheaper because we don't have the

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<v Speaker 3>energy costs involved. That's that's one of the roadblocks right

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<v Speaker 3>now moving at the speed we want to move at.

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<v Speaker 2>So my thinking is that both him and.

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<v Speaker 3>Elon Musk are going to be shooting up rockets that

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<v Speaker 3>have digital centers on them into space, huge huge solar

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<v Speaker 3>panels on the side collecting all that energy, and we

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<v Speaker 3>can we can shoot stuff back and forth into space

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<v Speaker 3>all the time, anytime we want to. It raises lots

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<v Speaker 3>of interesting questions, So because who's who's in control of

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<v Speaker 3>things that are in space? I mean, which laws? So

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<v Speaker 3>if as an example, you have a US patent on

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<v Speaker 3>something and somebody has a business model running on that

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<v Speaker 3>satellite that is violating your patent and patent infringement or

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<v Speaker 3>are sat outside of the bounds of earth.

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<v Speaker 1>That's a fine question, one that I don't have the

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<v Speaker 1>answer to. But that's why we talked to Thomas Fry

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<v Speaker 1>because I need more things to keep you up at

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<v Speaker 1>night wondering the answers to, because these are all problems

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<v Speaker 1>that we're going to have to solve. This text or

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<v Speaker 1>asks an interesting question. Will digital clones give off pheromones

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<v Speaker 1>for that dating scenario that you were talking about? Will they?

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<v Speaker 1>Will they have that intangible something that makes things work?

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<v Speaker 2>Ah, that's a great question.

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<v Speaker 3>I am certain somebody's going to be working on that,

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<v Speaker 3>but I don't have a good answer for that.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Well we'll find out about that at some other time.

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<v Speaker 1>Thomas Fry is our futurist and you can find him

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<v Speaker 1>at Future a Speaker. I've also put a link on

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<v Speaker 1>the blog as well to all of these articles so

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<v Speaker 1>you can continue to read. Good to see my friend.

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<v Speaker 1>We'll see you next time, Thomas.

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<v Speaker 2>All right, great to be on your show, Mandy.

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<v Speaker 3>All right.

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<v Speaker 1>That is Thomas Fry, our Futurist.