WEBVTT

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<v Speaker 1>Hey, it's Bob Pickett. We are on our way to

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<v Speaker 1>the legendary Broken Spoke. Come on, let's get out the

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<v Speaker 1>truck and head inside.

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<v Speaker 2>And damn you're proud of it.

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<v Speaker 1>Come on, it's going side, getting ready for another Tale

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<v Speaker 1>from the Broken Spoke mony. And I had such a

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<v Speaker 1>great time visit with Bob Livingsteen. Let's get back to

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<v Speaker 1>part two of our conversation. And we're also going to

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<v Speaker 1>find out how the name the Lost Gun So Bad

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<v Speaker 1>came about more with the conversation Bob Livingston on Tails

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<v Speaker 1>from the Broken.

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<v Speaker 2>Spoke, you know, and then you just talk about you know,

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<v Speaker 2>Stephen Fromholt, one of the greatest songwriters ever, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>and just all y'all passing songs back and forth and

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<v Speaker 2>inspiring each other, and you know, and and B. W.

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<v Speaker 3>Stevenson was right right of course, right man.

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<v Speaker 2>And then you just became a bass player because the

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<v Speaker 2>gig didn't have a bass player. And then that's what

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<v Speaker 2>you wound up doing.

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<v Speaker 3>It was like base with me.

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<v Speaker 4>I just remember that I was so my record deal

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<v Speaker 4>fell through. They'd given me money. You know, I had

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<v Speaker 4>the good girlfriend, right, I'm living up in the mount

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<v Speaker 4>till you don't thing is rolling, you know, and and

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<v Speaker 4>then it's off.

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<v Speaker 3>And I just remember, I had no Plan B. That's

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<v Speaker 3>the name.

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<v Speaker 4>That's one of the working tiles for my book. It's

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<v Speaker 4>on Texas Tech Press, Fixing come Out. And uh, there

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<v Speaker 4>was no Plan B. And there wasn't all of a

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<v Speaker 4>sudden that what you said, those gifts, those synergistic happenings

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<v Speaker 4>were just.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, because then you look back when you're writing

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<v Speaker 2>the book and go, it's a straight line, but you're

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<v Speaker 2>doing it, you know. But it's like, I remember one

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<v Speaker 2>of those great stories that Texas pickers is when when

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<v Speaker 2>Buddy Holly hired Whalen to play bass on that last tour.

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<v Speaker 2>But Whalen never held held the base before Bud. He said,

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<v Speaker 2>here's a bass, here's my two albums. We lead in

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<v Speaker 2>three weeks weeks, you know, and so you know what

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<v Speaker 2>it's like. He's twenty, he'd never been outside of Texas

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<v Speaker 2>before in the biggest star in the world, and so

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<v Speaker 2>he just hunkers down and he does this and he's

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<v Speaker 2>and after the second gig, Whaling told me and Brent

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<v Speaker 2>Brent Wilson with Wagoneers waiting, came up to Buddy. It's

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<v Speaker 2>all excited because Buddy, this is just the first four

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<v Speaker 2>strings of the guitar. After two gigs, he said, Holly

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<v Speaker 2>goes how you could have gone off in day without

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<v Speaker 2>telling me that.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, you're bringing up You're bringing up Buddy Holly and

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<v Speaker 1>whaling the love of connection. You spent a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>time in Lubock.

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<v Speaker 4>Well, I was when I was ten years old. My

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<v Speaker 4>parents were in the church business. They were at a

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<v Speaker 4>church in San Antonia, Laura Heights Methodists, and so I

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<v Speaker 4>was living in barn until I was ten. Then we

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<v Speaker 4>moved to Lobbock so they could get the job the

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<v Speaker 4>first Methodist church in lobook and Uh, I made friends.

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<v Speaker 4>I went to Lubbock High School. I found out that

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<v Speaker 4>the beginning of her career, Miss Honey taught Buddy Holly

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<v Speaker 4>senior English.

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<v Speaker 3>I got to sit in his desk. Wow.

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<v Speaker 4>And you know, I tell people, you know a lot

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<v Speaker 4>of some of this is not true. I just want

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<v Speaker 4>to say that, but he she did teach him, and

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<v Speaker 4>it was just, you know, Buddy was on my mind

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<v Speaker 4>because he was only you know, just a little bit gone,

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<v Speaker 4>and then all of a sudden you learn who he is.

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<v Speaker 4>It's like when one of your friends you should have pad,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, you should hung out more and you learn

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<v Speaker 4>more about him.

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<v Speaker 3>And uh so, yeah, it was. It was kind of

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<v Speaker 3>a but you.

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<v Speaker 2>Know, you think about it, that era of love of Hi,

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<v Speaker 2>whatever was going on, whatever they were inspiring y'all, somebody

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<v Speaker 2>at that school, English teacher, music teacher, was inspiring kids

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<v Speaker 2>to dream. Yeah, you had you come out of that era,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, within five years, a buddy, you had Bob

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<v Speaker 2>Montgomery come out of there, Buddy Holly came out of there,

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<v Speaker 2>Jerry Allison came out of there, Davis mac Davis, Job Malden,

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<v Speaker 2>Glenn Harden.

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<v Speaker 1>You know something about.

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<v Speaker 2>High school that was something about that. You know, what

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<v Speaker 2>is it? Tom s love of Kai that made y'all

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<v Speaker 2>dream about things that that people in rural areas don't

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<v Speaker 2>really do. That's amazing.

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<v Speaker 4>And you know joe Ely and Butch and Jimmy, they

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<v Speaker 4>they went to Monterey High School and they're a couple

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<v Speaker 4>of years older than me. I didn't really know him

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<v Speaker 4>that well because you know, two years is everything. And

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<v Speaker 4>then but I did end up going to see Joey.

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<v Speaker 4>He was Joey then. Yeah, and uh he was playing

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<v Speaker 4>this place in Altura Towers. It was like apartment. They

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<v Speaker 4>had a club at the top. So I go see

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<v Speaker 4>him and he's sitting on a on a showman amp

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<v Speaker 4>with his that guitar with seashells glim you know, that

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<v Speaker 4>funky Gibson, and that was plugged Barcus Berry plugged into

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<v Speaker 4>the amp. And then he has a high hat and

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<v Speaker 4>he's playing the high hat with his left foot and

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<v Speaker 4>he's playing and it's like he's a one man band,

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<v Speaker 4>and this is the coolest thing I'd ever seen. He

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<v Speaker 4>was so nonchalant. He was just like he's not trying

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<v Speaker 4>to do any kind of show. He is just do

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<v Speaker 4>a song after song and every once in a while say

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<v Speaker 4>something off the wall. But I just thought this is

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<v Speaker 4>he was like my first big influence, and you know,

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<v Speaker 4>my brother was, but but this guy was like, oh wow,

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<v Speaker 4>that's real. And so the next day I was down

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<v Speaker 4>at the pawn shop. I got a pawn I got

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<v Speaker 4>a high hat, and my brother loaned me his amp

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<v Speaker 4>and I had this lectric guitar and I plugged it

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<v Speaker 4>in and I became you know, for a.

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<v Speaker 2>While, it's so cool. But you know the thing about

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<v Speaker 2>Elie is, you know, the music is so great. The

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<v Speaker 2>songs are so great. But if you're ever you know,

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<v Speaker 2>he got like the charisma of like ten movie stars.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, it really is a commanding presence where you really,

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<v Speaker 2>to this day you have to be in the room

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<v Speaker 2>about it. I wanted to ask you something when I

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<v Speaker 2>was doing, you know, because it's so you know, I

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<v Speaker 2>grew up listening to y'all's records. Of course, then I

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<v Speaker 2>got to see it be around y'all a little bit,

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<v Speaker 2>particularly like from Holts. He was always real good to

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<v Speaker 2>me when I was coming up. He was the first

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<v Speaker 2>like professional songwriter I ever met. I was twelve. I

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<v Speaker 2>somehow wound up into Craig Hillis's house on Sharon Lane,

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<v Speaker 2>and I walked in there and I saw Stephen Fromholtz.

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<v Speaker 2>It was just like, you know, I couldn't like seeing

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<v Speaker 2>Davy Crockett or something. I'd never seen a professional songwriter before.

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<v Speaker 2>When I was twelve, for some reason, I blurted out,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm going to be a songwriter, you know, And he

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<v Speaker 2>laughed so hard, not at me, but he just thought

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<v Speaker 2>it was great. And he said, man, don't let anybody

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<v Speaker 2>talk you out of it. It was just so great, like, oh,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, not finished school, don't let anybody talk you out.

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<v Speaker 2>But for years after he would go, I'm so sorry

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<v Speaker 2>I said that, but now tell me about it if

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<v Speaker 2>you and you know, I got this all flying, so

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sure it's bullshit, but I'd never I'd never known

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<v Speaker 2>about this mountain music farm.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, what is that?

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<v Speaker 4>Well, so I pick up a hitchhiker. Murphy calls me,

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<v Speaker 4>a we need to meet. I drive up to Rightwood, California.

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<v Speaker 4>He's living in the it's in the foothills of the

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<v Speaker 4>San Gabriels, but it's in the mountains right Wood, across

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<v Speaker 4>the Highway four five or.

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<v Speaker 3>Whatever it is from.

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<v Speaker 4>Maybe it's ten from Lake Haarrawhead and Barstow and San

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<v Speaker 4>Bernardino are down below in the desert. And you know,

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<v Speaker 4>I was sitting in my cabin looking down at the

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<v Speaker 4>desert and I'm you know, five feet snowed in for

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<v Speaker 4>ten days and it was just a you know, fantastic time.

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<v Speaker 4>And we started writing, you know, a song or two together.

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<v Speaker 4>And Murphy, of course, anything that happens, he has a

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<v Speaker 4>song about he finds a bird that with a broken

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<v Speaker 4>wing and he picks it up and he and he

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<v Speaker 4>takes it home and he feeds it and stuff.

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<v Speaker 3>Like that, and we're looking at it.

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<v Speaker 4>Like two days later, I come back and I hear

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<v Speaker 4>this banjo playing and I look in this his little

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<v Speaker 4>music room, and his back is to me. He's playing

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<v Speaker 4>the banjo and this bird is on his shoulder and

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<v Speaker 4>he's singing.

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<v Speaker 2>Wild bird, I have men did your.

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<v Speaker 4>Wings, and I'm wondering if my cold white hands can

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<v Speaker 4>let go this hold on your fluttering heart. It's this beautiful,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, and he he get right and the moment okay,

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<v Speaker 4>So at that moment, I had gone down to the

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<v Speaker 4>to the desert and met this guy named Calvin Black,

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<v Speaker 4>and he was just he had a roadside attraction. I

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<v Speaker 4>took you know, it's just dolls and weird. You know,

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<v Speaker 4>he's a desert rat. And he wrote a song about him.

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<v Speaker 4>And took him down there and he started. And he

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<v Speaker 4>went further down and went to Knotsbury Farm, which the

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<v Speaker 4>is it was the not it was owned by Knotsberry's form,

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<v Speaker 4>but it was the Calico's Ghost Town, and it was

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<v Speaker 4>it had been a silver mining town.

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<v Speaker 3>And Murphy wrote.

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<v Speaker 4>This piece, this beautiful piece called Calico Silver, and he

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<v Speaker 4>had written he got with Larry Cancelor they wrote this

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<v Speaker 4>whole thing and they pitched it to somehow or another.

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<v Speaker 4>They had a manager named Marty Muschatt and they pitched

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<v Speaker 4>it to Kenny Rodgers in the first edition and they

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<v Speaker 4>did it. It was a double album, uh, the first

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<v Speaker 4>country rock opera, The Ballad of Calico.

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<v Speaker 3>Willie Matthews did the cover. It was just incredible.

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<v Speaker 4>But it was a total flop and it was just

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<v Speaker 4>too you know. They were used to just jopped in

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<v Speaker 4>to see what my condition was, and and uh, it

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<v Speaker 4>was just too I don't know. It didn't ever go

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<v Speaker 4>very well. And that's when Murphy started thinking of going.

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<v Speaker 4>But in the meantime, this guy, Marty Michhadd had introduced

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<v Speaker 4>us to Roger Miller and somehow talked him into maybe

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<v Speaker 4>he would bankroll a publishing concern and it was going

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<v Speaker 4>to be called the Mountain Music Farm. And Guy Clark

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<v Speaker 4>was there, Murphy and I was there, you know, and

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<v Speaker 4>so just the.

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<v Speaker 2>Four y'all, Guy Murphy, you and Roger Miller.

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<v Speaker 4>Roger Miller but I don't know if he was going

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<v Speaker 4>to be part, but we met him a few times

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<v Speaker 4>and what a character that and uh, but so that's

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<v Speaker 4>what that was. Wow, it was and it never We

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<v Speaker 4>made some demos, some of which I might have somewhere,

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<v Speaker 4>but for the most part and nothing ever came of it.

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<v Speaker 2>I remember reading in uh Kenny Rogers book or a

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<v Speaker 2>book about him. He interviewed for it, and it was

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<v Speaker 2>talking about Calico. They were coming off these enormous records

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<v Speaker 2>and were they on was it? Were they on CBS?

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<v Speaker 2>It was a capital anyway. Rogers said that they did

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<v Speaker 2>a million pressings, they pressed a million records to meet demand.

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<v Speaker 2>And Roger said in his record and they missed it

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<v Speaker 2>by nine hundred thousand units.

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<v Speaker 1>Totally different styles when it comes to Murphy and Jerry Jeff.

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<v Speaker 1>Totally different styles, right.

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<v Speaker 4>Yes, in a way, yes, Uh, you know, you have

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<v Speaker 4>to deal with someone, you know, when you play with them,

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<v Speaker 4>especially when you're on the road a long time, you

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<v Speaker 4>have to deal so that it's hard to It was

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<v Speaker 4>hard for me to in private and in public to

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<v Speaker 4>not have a you know, to make them the same.

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<v Speaker 4>It was kind of hard for me to do because

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<v Speaker 4>I knew how Murphy kind of was, uh in private,

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<v Speaker 4>and then we'd be on stage and I mean he

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<v Speaker 4>was he was demanding. He'd say things like that a

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<v Speaker 4>string is is is a little sharp, and I said,

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<v Speaker 4>I'm right in the middle of the song. You'd stop

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<v Speaker 4>and say that I'm playing bass, And he says, uh,

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<v Speaker 4>at a gig, at a gig on stage, and he says,

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<v Speaker 4>you need to get that.

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<v Speaker 3>And to just pull it, just just pull that, pull it,

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<v Speaker 3>pull it, pull it in, pull it in.

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<v Speaker 4>And in one case when he did that, he jerked

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<v Speaker 4>the string right off the bass by mistake.

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<v Speaker 2>So you something else he could pull right.

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<v Speaker 4>This is gonzo, you know. And so Murphy was like that,

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<v Speaker 4>Jerry Jeff Murphy, though when I think about it, it

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<v Speaker 4>was do He never told me exactly what to play.

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<v Speaker 4>He never told any of us. He relied on whatever

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<v Speaker 4>we did. Herb Steiner's in the band with Murphy, you know,

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<v Speaker 4>Craig Hill. This is a guitar player, Gary Nuns playing

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<v Speaker 4>the piano, Michael McGary and that same band went to

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<v Speaker 4>Jerry Jeff, and Jerry Jeff just looked for us to,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, help with arrangements and throw out things, and

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<v Speaker 4>we would do anything that he wanted to do.

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<v Speaker 3>He might and egg yhim on.

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<v Speaker 4>Like there's some a few tracks where like in that

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<v Speaker 4>first record or not that actually the third album, Collectibles

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<v Speaker 4>that the track completely falls apart, and the song is

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<v Speaker 4>called winging It Home to Texas, and the chorus says,

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<v Speaker 4>winging it Home to Texas. Home on the morning, plane,

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<v Speaker 4>winging it home to Texas, and I lost my bags again,

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<v Speaker 4>and that Daliss Airport sucks.

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<v Speaker 2>That's the cours.

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<v Speaker 1>Were you were you in La that time that Jerry

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<v Speaker 1>Jeff tried to take Rodney Crow's dog back to Texas?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I heard that story.

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<v Speaker 1>You were there when it happened.

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<v Speaker 3>No, No, I wasn't.

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<v Speaker 4>I mean I was on that tour, yeah, and but

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<v Speaker 4>I know I didn't see.

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<v Speaker 1>Rodney told us that story here about that totally unbelievable

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<v Speaker 1>and stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, because I just for the listener there and everything,

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<v Speaker 2>like when you're in the studio man, one of the

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<v Speaker 2>you're always just looking for a vibe, you know, you

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<v Speaker 2>just want if you got great pickers. You're not worried

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<v Speaker 2>about the sound or the sonics. It's just like, is

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<v Speaker 2>there it does it feel right? He doesn't feel right?

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<v Speaker 2>You know, And the fact that you just y'all just

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<v Speaker 2>did it and didn't hear any playbacks. Like when I

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<v Speaker 2>record one of the quickest ways to just bring a

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<v Speaker 2>session to a screeching halt and said, everybody stop what

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<v Speaker 2>they're doing and go listen to the tape before. I

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<v Speaker 2>do not believe in listening to playback and unless there's

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<v Speaker 2>just something not right. But if it's just you can

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<v Speaker 2>sit there and going, if you have somebody you can trust, producer,

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<v Speaker 2>engineer or something, that was.

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<v Speaker 4>It, guys, and you can listen to it at the

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<v Speaker 4>end of the yeah, and for the rest of your life. Well.

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<v Speaker 4>The one thing I would wonder though, if he says,

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<v Speaker 4>this was it and that's your record, see it, we

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<v Speaker 4>don't need to do anymore.

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<v Speaker 3>I would want to hear it. But maybe at the

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<v Speaker 3>end of the evening.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well, yeah, that's what I mean.

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<v Speaker 2>End of the day, and you just go. But you

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<v Speaker 2>just go because otherwise you when you're listening to a playback, Actually,

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<v Speaker 2>when you're listening to a record, you can't not just

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<v Speaker 2>not focus on yourself. What did you do? Did you

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<v Speaker 2>hit a clam? Is there something there? And it takes

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<v Speaker 2>a while before you can just listen to a record collectively.

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<v Speaker 2>But also something kind of magical happens very quickly you forget.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, initially I just thought, you know, wonder if you

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<v Speaker 4>didn't you didn't listen to a playback, and you just

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<v Speaker 4>go to the next song, and you do that a

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<v Speaker 4>couple of times, whatever you need, and then go to

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<v Speaker 4>the next song. You don't ever listen, kind of like

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<v Speaker 4>Jerry Jeff did. We were forced into doing that. But

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<v Speaker 4>it breaks it up, not just it's not so static

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<v Speaker 4>we're gonna bore our hearts into this one song, analyze it,

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<v Speaker 4>listen to it, but rather just go on. And you know,

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<v Speaker 4>both those guys allowed, especially Jerry Jeff allowed clams, I

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<v Speaker 4>mean clams men.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, I like it, right, you know, well it's like, well,

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<v Speaker 2>we you know, think of how many incredible Ray Charles

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<v Speaker 2>and Beatles records would have been ruined by people fixing

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<v Speaker 2>the mistakes because they're not mistakes. They're they're they're a

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<v Speaker 2>little glimpses of humanity. Like if there's a clam that

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<v Speaker 2>ruins a take, but if there's just something that gives

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<v Speaker 2>it character or nobody really knows. And I just think,

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<v Speaker 2>live it the fuck alone.

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<v Speaker 4>The Beatles with this new documentary that came out there

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<v Speaker 4>the great you know, mind blowing just how they did

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<v Speaker 4>it and they're playing live and they record let it

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<v Speaker 4>Be and all those songs get.

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<v Speaker 2>Back right right, and they're asking you, so what about this?

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<v Speaker 2>And no that's not a good lyric. He goes, what

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<v Speaker 2>that's let it be right? But it's so wild because

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<v Speaker 2>they just it's the process and you can get I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>you know in the studio, you can get precious in

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<v Speaker 2>a hurry and ruin a record. And my lord, did

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<v Speaker 2>y'all do the exact opposite with those records and just

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<v Speaker 2>and and just allowing the collective of the whole song

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<v Speaker 2>now that somebody's individual parts. It's uh, I think what

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<v Speaker 2>what a music major would call clams? I just called

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<v Speaker 2>magic especically on Beaver to Linguy, you.

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<v Speaker 1>Know, yes, especially how'd you guys come up with a

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<v Speaker 1>name Los Gonzo band?

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<v Speaker 4>Well, so for that first album, which was Elle Freeway

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<v Speaker 4>on it, we had that album out and so we

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<v Speaker 4>were playing a few gigs. We were still kind of

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<v Speaker 4>with Murphy, but we were playing some Jerry Jeff gigs

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<v Speaker 4>and I would always introduce the band Theadies and Gentlemen's

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<v Speaker 4>Jerry Jeff Walker and the Unborn Calves or one one

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<v Speaker 4>thing that stuck the Rodeo do O d riff Raff.

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<v Speaker 4>And it was always a different name every night and

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<v Speaker 4>I was reading Hunter Thompson, uh so, Fear and Loathing

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<v Speaker 4>in Las Vegas and it was Gonzo this and Gonzo

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<v Speaker 4>that had Gonzo states of band.

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<v Speaker 3>I was reading it to the guys.

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<v Speaker 4>We were in Gary Nunn had a black checker cab

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<v Speaker 4>whatever it was, checker cab sprayed black. He brought it

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<v Speaker 4>down from New York and that was our band vehicle.

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<v Speaker 4>Had the big you know seat in the back. We

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<v Speaker 4>could put our equipment there. In the trunk it held

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<v Speaker 4>a lot.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, the trunk's enormous. It's a trillian to you said,

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<v Speaker 2>as a band.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, vehicle, And here we are bumping around and I'm

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<v Speaker 4>reading Fear and Loathing and I said, guys, tonight will

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<v Speaker 4>be the Gonzo band.

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<v Speaker 3>How about the Lost Gonzo Band? And they're going whatever.

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<v Speaker 4>But when we when I introduced it that night, it's

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<v Speaker 4>Castle Creek Jerry, Jeff Walker and Lost Gonzo Band. Jerry

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<v Speaker 4>turned to.

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<v Speaker 3>Me and said, I like that.

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<v Speaker 4>Wow, So that became an and we had already cut,

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<v Speaker 4>so that becomes the name. But we had already recorded

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<v Speaker 4>viavature Lingua, but it was being processed and it hadn't

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<v Speaker 4>the cover had not been finalized, and so he said,

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<v Speaker 4>put that lost Gonzo band Jerry Jeff Walker in the

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<v Speaker 4>Lost gon you were just written yeah wow, And so.

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<v Speaker 3>He put that there.

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<v Speaker 1>Great story.

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<v Speaker 2>Great story.

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<v Speaker 1>Next week, we're going to talk to Bob about the

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<v Speaker 1>making of the album Viva Terror Linguo, which is celebrating

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<v Speaker 1>his fiftieth anniversary this year. That's next week as we

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<v Speaker 1>continue our conversation with Bob Livingston on Tales from the

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<v Speaker 1>Broken Spoke.

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<v Speaker 4>Tales from the Broken Spoke is recorded live at The

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<v Speaker 4>Broken Spoke in Austin, Texas, hosted by Country Radio Hall

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<v Speaker 4>of Fame broadcaster Bob Pickett and Monty Warden, recorded mixed

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<v Speaker 4>down and produced by Mike Rivera