1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,759 Speaker 1: The word is cannibal and it appears in the files 2 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:03,799 fifty two. 3 00:00:03,759 --> 00:00:06,759 Speaker 2: Times fifty two times. And just so we are perfectly 4 00:00:06,839 --> 00:00:09,560 clear right out of the gate here we are not 5 00:00:09,759 --> 00:00:13,080 talking about some corporate metaphor, right. We aren't talking about 6 00:00:13,080 --> 00:00:17,679 a business strategy where one company, you know, cannibalizes another sales. 7 00:00:18,239 --> 00:00:21,879 We are looking at text searches within a massive document 8 00:00:21,960 --> 00:00:27,399 cash where the word cannibal or cannibalism is explicitly used 9 00:00:27,399 --> 00:00:28,000 in a way. 10 00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:29,359 Speaker 1: That just it makes the hair on the back of 11 00:00:29,399 --> 00:00:31,079 your neck stand up, It really does. 12 00:00:31,120 --> 00:00:31,920 Speaker 2: It's horrifying. 13 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:35,399 Speaker 1: I have to admit when I first started reading through 14 00:00:35,399 --> 00:00:39,359 the specific stack of documents and the sheer volume of 15 00:00:39,399 --> 00:00:44,439 it is just staggering. You go in expecting the financial crime, sure, 16 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:47,840 the money laundering exactly, You expect the fraud, the tax evasion, 17 00:00:47,880 --> 00:00:50,840 you even expect the really sleazy solicitations, But then you 18 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:54,640 hit this wall of just well, absolute bizarre horror. There 19 00:00:54,679 --> 00:00:57,640 is a reference to a restaurant actually named cannibal. Yeah, 20 00:00:57,679 --> 00:01:01,799 there are repeated, really uncon comfortable mentions of jerky in 21 00:01:01,880 --> 00:01:03,920 context that just feel completely wrong. 22 00:01:04,280 --> 00:01:06,599 Speaker 2: Right, And I know there are plenty of Internet sleuths 23 00:01:06,599 --> 00:01:09,079 out there who immediately jump to code words, and we 24 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:11,599 will absolutely get to the coded language later in this 25 00:01:11,719 --> 00:01:13,719 deep dive, because there is plenty of it, and it 26 00:01:13,799 --> 00:01:17,159 is deeply disturbing. It is, but some of this appears 27 00:01:17,159 --> 00:01:21,120 to be terrifyingly literal. There is a file detailing an 28 00:01:21,120 --> 00:01:24,239 interview between FBI officials and an anonymous man back in 29 00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:28,519 twenty nineteen. This man claimed on the record, under penalty 30 00:01:28,519 --> 00:01:31,760 of pertry, that back in two thousand he witnessed acts 31 00:01:31,799 --> 00:01:34,200 of sacrifice on board Jeffrey Epstein's yacht. 32 00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:37,680 Speaker 1: Sacrifice. Just let that word hang there for a second. 33 00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:40,239 We're not talking about sacrificing profits for growth. 34 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:43,280 Speaker 2: No, we are talking about ritualistic acts. Now. We have 35 00:01:43,359 --> 00:01:46,120 to be rigorous here, as always. He provided no physical 36 00:01:46,159 --> 00:01:48,959 evidence at the time of the interview, but the fact 37 00:01:49,000 --> 00:01:51,560 that this is in the FBI purview that this is 38 00:01:51,599 --> 00:01:54,560 the world we are stepping into it sets the stage 39 00:01:54,560 --> 00:01:57,120 for everything else we're about to discuss today. We aren't 40 00:01:57,120 --> 00:01:59,840 just talking about a hedge fund manager who committed financial fraud. 41 00:02:00,439 --> 00:02:03,480 We are entering a world of the occult, coded language, 42 00:02:03,719 --> 00:02:08,439 bizarre obsessions, and a complete total vacuum where moral boundaries should. 43 00:02:08,159 --> 00:02:10,000 Speaker 1: Be welcome to thrilling Threads. 44 00:02:10,360 --> 00:02:12,879 Speaker 2: It is good to be here even if the topic 45 00:02:13,039 --> 00:02:15,000 is well incredibly heavy. 46 00:02:15,039 --> 00:02:18,599 Speaker 1: Today it's the heaviest, but that's the mission of thrilling Threads. 47 00:02:19,159 --> 00:02:21,439 We pull at the loose threads of a story until 48 00:02:21,439 --> 00:02:24,560 the entire sweater unravels. And today I gotta say the 49 00:02:24,599 --> 00:02:27,120 sweater is ugly. It's moth eaten and stained. 50 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:27,919 Speaker 2: Definitely. 51 00:02:28,120 --> 00:02:31,439 Speaker 1: We are looking at the specific factual revelations from the 52 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:35,240 Epstein files, specifically analyzing the data dump that was recently 53 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:36,759 covered by the Infographic Show. 54 00:02:36,919 --> 00:02:39,439 Speaker 2: And we need to make a very serious disclaimer right 55 00:02:39,520 --> 00:02:43,840 up front. This topic is radioactive. It involves politically charged 56 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:46,840 figures from every single side of the aisle, left, right, 57 00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:48,919 center and international exactly. 58 00:02:49,039 --> 00:02:51,039 Speaker 1: We are not here to campaign for anyone. We aren't 59 00:02:51,039 --> 00:02:53,479 here to defend anyone either. We are here to act 60 00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:57,159 as neutral observers for you, the listener. We are reporting 61 00:02:57,280 --> 00:02:59,759 strictly on what the files say. If a name is 62 00:02:59,800 --> 00:03:02,400 in the documents, we talk about it, whether it's a president, 63 00:03:02,439 --> 00:03:03,680 a prince, or a prime minister. 64 00:03:04,039 --> 00:03:07,199 Speaker 2: We follow the thread no matter where it leads. So 65 00:03:07,319 --> 00:03:09,479 if you're ready to look into the abyss. 66 00:03:09,360 --> 00:03:10,919 Speaker 1: Let's open the file. And I want to start not 67 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:14,520 with the people, but with the place, the physical reality 68 00:03:14,599 --> 00:03:17,319 of Epstein's world, because before we get to the famous 69 00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:20,400 names and the rolodex, we really have to understand the 70 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:23,039 environment they were walking into. We have to talk about 71 00:03:23,039 --> 00:03:24,000 the household manual. 72 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:27,240 Speaker 2: Oh, the manual. This is such a fascinating document because 73 00:03:27,240 --> 00:03:30,000 it gives us a glimpse into the psychology of the 74 00:03:30,039 --> 00:03:33,759 man before we even see the actual crimes. Yeah, this 75 00:03:33,919 --> 00:03:36,719 wasn't just a rich guy who liked things tidy. This 76 00:03:36,879 --> 00:03:40,240 was an obsession with micromanagement that bordered on and I 77 00:03:40,240 --> 00:03:43,479 don't use this term lightly here, cult leader tactics. 78 00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:45,919 Speaker 1: I was reading through the requirements for the Palm Beach 79 00:03:45,919 --> 00:03:48,639 house and the temperature rule just blew my mind. The 80 00:03:48,680 --> 00:03:52,319 manual stated in bold text that the main bedroom had 81 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:56,719 to be exactly sixty degrees fahrenheit. That's fifteen degrees celsius 82 00:03:56,840 --> 00:03:58,000 at all times. 83 00:03:57,719 --> 00:04:00,400 Speaker 2: Which is freezing. That is not just a cool that 84 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:01,800 is an absolute ice box. 85 00:04:02,039 --> 00:04:04,919 Speaker 1: Right, most people keep their ac at seventy or seventy two. 86 00:04:05,039 --> 00:04:08,319 Sixty degrees is physiological. It makes you shiver. It requires 87 00:04:08,319 --> 00:04:10,960 you to be under heavy blankets or wearing layers and doors. 88 00:04:11,240 --> 00:04:14,800 Speaker 2: It's about environmental control. Think about it. If you control 89 00:04:14,840 --> 00:04:17,800 the temperature to an extreme, you control the comfort level 90 00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:20,279 of everyone in that room. You keep them alert, or 91 00:04:20,319 --> 00:04:23,360 you keep them seeking warmth, which usually means seeking the bed. Wow. 92 00:04:23,480 --> 00:04:26,560 It's a very subtle form of physical dominance. And the 93 00:04:26,639 --> 00:04:29,040 manual was explicit for the staff too. It wasn't just 94 00:04:29,360 --> 00:04:32,040 do your job and go home. The golden rule written 95 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:35,120 out was see nothing, hear nothing, say nothing. 96 00:04:34,879 --> 00:04:38,279 Speaker 1: Which is the classic mobster rule, oh Merta, but here 97 00:04:38,319 --> 00:04:41,680 it's being applied to housekeepers and groundskeepers. It creates this 98 00:04:41,879 --> 00:04:46,079 insulated bubble where reality doesn't apply. And then there's the 99 00:04:46,120 --> 00:04:46,680 gun rule. 100 00:04:46,839 --> 00:04:49,439 Speaker 2: Yes, the manual specified the guns were to be kept 101 00:04:49,439 --> 00:04:52,600 in the bedside drawers in the master bedroom at all times. 102 00:04:52,759 --> 00:04:55,680 Speaker 1: That paints a really vivid picture, doesn't it. You have 103 00:04:55,720 --> 00:04:58,920 this freezing cold room, a demand for total silence from 104 00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:01,800 the invisible staff, and a loaded gun right in the nightstand. 105 00:05:02,120 --> 00:05:04,360 It feels less like a luxury home and more like 106 00:05:04,360 --> 00:05:06,319 a fortress. 107 00:05:05,680 --> 00:05:08,839 Speaker 2: Or a bunker, a fortress of surveillance. Yeah, because that's 108 00:05:08,879 --> 00:05:10,839 the other side of the architecture here. It wasn't just 109 00:05:10,879 --> 00:05:13,720 about keeping people out, It was about watching everyone who 110 00:05:13,759 --> 00:05:16,360 was in. We need to talk about Larry Vasoski. 111 00:05:16,079 --> 00:05:18,680 Speaker 1: The pilot. I saw his name pop up repeatedly in 112 00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:19,319 the slight logs. 113 00:05:19,519 --> 00:05:22,120 Speaker 2: Right, Vasoski wasn't just flying the planes. He was part 114 00:05:22,160 --> 00:05:25,800 of the logistics of the house. Epstein commissioned Veasosky to 115 00:05:25,839 --> 00:05:30,040 buy motion detected cameras, but not just standard security cameras 116 00:05:30,079 --> 00:05:32,959 to the front gate to see who's pulling up. Vassosky 117 00:05:33,079 --> 00:05:35,759 noted they were tiny. He described them as the size 118 00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:36,759 of a thumbnail drive. 119 00:05:37,519 --> 00:05:39,680 Speaker 1: And he didn't go to Best Buy or call a 120 00:05:39,759 --> 00:05:42,560 high end security company to install them. He bought them 121 00:05:42,560 --> 00:05:44,839 from a spy shop down in Florida exactly. 122 00:05:45,040 --> 00:05:48,839 Speaker 2: This is pure tradecraft equipment, and Vasoski admitted he had 123 00:05:48,879 --> 00:05:52,879 already begun installing these cameras inside clean xboxes cn xboxes. 124 00:05:52,920 --> 00:05:56,120 Speaker 1: That is I mean, it's voyeurism. Obviously, it's incredibly creepy, 125 00:05:56,399 --> 00:05:59,120 but it also feels so tactical. You put a camera 126 00:05:59,160 --> 00:06:01,759 in a clean xbox in a bedroom or a bathroom, 127 00:06:02,040 --> 00:06:04,199 that's not for security, that's for leverage. 128 00:06:04,560 --> 00:06:08,680 Speaker 2: It is incredibly tactical. And this is where the thrilling 129 00:06:08,759 --> 00:06:12,279 thread leads us to a much darker possibility than just 130 00:06:12,319 --> 00:06:17,399 a perview billionaire. There's a cryptic email regarding the installation 131 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:20,680 of these cameras. The text says, remember what we spoke about. 132 00:06:20,720 --> 00:06:22,600 If you want to put cameras in the house, it 133 00:06:22,639 --> 00:06:25,000 will have to be very discreetly done. The Russians may 134 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:25,639 come in handy. 135 00:06:25,800 --> 00:06:28,240 Speaker 1: The Russians may come in handy. Okay, let's unpack this 136 00:06:28,279 --> 00:06:30,959 for a second, because that sounds straight up like espionage. 137 00:06:31,040 --> 00:06:34,240 Speaker 2: It certainly raises a massive question. Was Epstein just a 138 00:06:34,279 --> 00:06:36,800 predator with a camera fetish or was he an asset? 139 00:06:37,199 --> 00:06:39,720 Was he building a blackmail library on the world's elite. 140 00:06:40,319 --> 00:06:43,360 When you look at the guests, the scientists, the politicians, 141 00:06:43,519 --> 00:06:45,959 the royals, and then you realize they were likely being 142 00:06:45,959 --> 00:06:50,040 filmed from a Kleenex box while in compromising situations. 143 00:06:49,439 --> 00:06:52,519 Speaker 1: It changes the dynamic of every interaction we're about to discuss. 144 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:56,199 It means every handshake, every party, every private meeting was 145 00:06:56,199 --> 00:07:00,040 potentially being archived for later use. And speaking of the 146 00:07:00,199 --> 00:07:03,000 valance and hidden spots, we have to go to the 147 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:04,759 island Little se Js. 148 00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:05,920 Speaker 2: The epicenter of the whole operation. 149 00:07:06,160 --> 00:07:09,279 Speaker 1: There are two specific architectural features on the island that 150 00:07:09,319 --> 00:07:11,680 show up in these files that really truly disturbed me. 151 00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:15,480 The first is the trap door. I feel like every 152 00:07:15,519 --> 00:07:17,959 villain's layer in fiction has a trapdoor, but this is 153 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:19,120 real life. 154 00:07:19,199 --> 00:07:21,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, there is visual evidence in the files of a 155 00:07:21,199 --> 00:07:25,399 trapdoor with rusty handholes leading down into dark water. Now 156 00:07:25,399 --> 00:07:28,959 the Internet, naturally has gone completely wild with this, theories 157 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:32,399 about body disposals, secret submarine entrances, you name it. 158 00:07:32,399 --> 00:07:35,240 Speaker 1: It's hard not to speculate when you see something that ominous. 159 00:07:35,279 --> 00:07:37,199 But what do the actual fact checkers say? 160 00:07:37,519 --> 00:07:41,279 Speaker 2: The prevailing innocent explanation is that it's for water filtration 161 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:45,759 or maintenance machinery for the island's infrastructure, which, to be fair, 162 00:07:45,920 --> 00:07:49,519 is plausible. Private islands need heavy infrastructure to function. 163 00:07:49,720 --> 00:07:52,399 Speaker 1: Okay, fine, water pumps. I can accept that. But then 164 00:07:52,439 --> 00:07:55,439 there's the temple, and I don't think there's any maintenance 165 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:56,839 explanation for this one. 166 00:07:57,079 --> 00:08:00,759 Speaker 2: No, the temple is strange. It's located the highest point 167 00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:03,600 of the island. It's painted in these striking blue and 168 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:07,920 white stripes, massive double doors, and it has a Zodiac 169 00:08:08,000 --> 00:08:10,879 mural painted on the ceiling. It looks like something out 170 00:08:10,879 --> 00:08:14,680 of a ritualistic cult. But the files described the interior 171 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:18,639 as totally unfinished. There were scraps of wood everywhere, and 172 00:08:18,720 --> 00:08:21,920 most chillingly mattresses covered in yellow shrink wrap. 173 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:25,480 Speaker 1: That juxtaposition is what gets me. You build this grand, 174 00:08:25,560 --> 00:08:29,959 almost religious exterior temple, and inside it's just cheap mattresses 175 00:08:29,959 --> 00:08:31,759 on the floor. It doesn't look like a place for 176 00:08:31,839 --> 00:08:34,879 prayer or meditation. It looks like a place for something else. Entirely. 177 00:08:34,960 --> 00:08:37,600 Speaker 2: It looks like a stage set, a trap. And that's 178 00:08:37,639 --> 00:08:40,679 really what the whole island was, fundamentally, a beautiful trap 179 00:08:40,720 --> 00:08:43,320 designed to compromise the most powerful people in the world. 180 00:08:43,559 --> 00:08:46,279 You lured them in with luxury, and then well, the 181 00:08:46,279 --> 00:08:47,519 mattresses tell the rest of the. 182 00:08:47,519 --> 00:08:50,120 Speaker 1: Story, which brings us to the Rolodex, Because if the 183 00:08:50,159 --> 00:08:52,960 island was the trap, the Rolodex was the bait. I 184 00:08:53,000 --> 00:08:54,960 want to look at the people who were in this orbit, 185 00:08:55,159 --> 00:08:57,759 and let's start with Hollywood and the wellness crowd. 186 00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:00,679 Speaker 2: It's a who's who of influence. She shows just how 187 00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:02,279 deep his reach actually was. 188 00:09:02,639 --> 00:09:05,559 Speaker 1: Let's start with Woody Allen. His name appears in the 189 00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:07,559 files over seven thousand. 190 00:09:07,159 --> 00:09:10,320 Speaker 2: Times seven thousand. Just think about the sheer volume of 191 00:09:10,320 --> 00:09:14,000 that for a second. That implies a daily, almost obsessive 192 00:09:14,080 --> 00:09:16,159 level of contact. That's not an acquaintance you see at 193 00:09:16,200 --> 00:09:18,559 a gala once a year. That's a dependency. 194 00:09:18,799 --> 00:09:21,159 Speaker 1: There's a quote in the files that really highlights how 195 00:09:21,159 --> 00:09:25,120 open the secret was. A correspondent emails Epstein asking where 196 00:09:25,120 --> 00:09:29,120 he is, and he replies, Paris with Woody Allen. And 197 00:09:29,159 --> 00:09:32,320 the correspondent replies, and I quote directly, here are you 198 00:09:32,399 --> 00:09:34,000 going to a pedophile convention? 199 00:09:34,279 --> 00:09:37,559 Speaker 2: It was a joke, a dark, cynical joke between friends. 200 00:09:38,039 --> 00:09:40,639 But that joke is incredibly revealing. It shows that the 201 00:09:40,679 --> 00:09:43,799 reputation was known. It wasn't a secret in their circle 202 00:09:43,840 --> 00:09:46,360 at all. It was punchline material. They knew what they 203 00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:48,080 were doing, they knew who they were hanging out with. 204 00:09:48,399 --> 00:09:50,879 Speaker 1: And then you have Peggy Siegeal. She's the Oscar guru, right, 205 00:09:50,879 --> 00:09:55,240 the woman who gets movies nominated, a massively influential publicist 206 00:09:55,320 --> 00:09:56,279 in New York and LA. 207 00:09:56,519 --> 00:09:59,039 Speaker 2: She was absolutely the gatekeeper to Hollywood for him. 208 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:01,720 Speaker 1: She sent an e to Epstein while she was visiting 209 00:10:01,759 --> 00:10:04,559 Kenya and this, I have to say, this actually made 210 00:10:04,600 --> 00:10:08,720 me feel physically sick reading it. She wrote, do you 211 00:10:08,759 --> 00:10:10,759 want me to bring a little baby back for you? 212 00:10:11,159 --> 00:10:13,279 Or two boys or girls? 213 00:10:13,519 --> 00:10:14,240 Speaker 2: It's horrific. 214 00:10:14,399 --> 00:10:17,080 Speaker 1: It's the casual nature of it, that's the words part. 215 00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:20,080 It's not written like a criminal conspiracy. It's written like 216 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:23,000 she's offering to pick up duty free chocolate at the airport. 217 00:10:23,399 --> 00:10:24,679 Want me to grab you a baby? 218 00:10:24,759 --> 00:10:27,919 Speaker 2: That is the banality of evil we always talk about. Yeah, 219 00:10:27,960 --> 00:10:31,480 in their world, human trafficking language had become casual banter. 220 00:10:32,039 --> 00:10:34,840 Whether she was serious or not almost doesn't matter. The 221 00:10:34,879 --> 00:10:37,480 fact that she felt comfortable typing that to him, hitting 222 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:40,320 send and knowing he wouldn't be offended. It tells you 223 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:42,279 everything you need to know about the culture they were 224 00:10:42,279 --> 00:10:42,799 operating in. 225 00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:46,039 Speaker 1: It extends to the wellness world too. Deepak Chopra, the 226 00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:49,080 man is practically synonymous with peace and healing. 227 00:10:49,399 --> 00:10:53,039 Speaker 2: His name appears thousands of times. He invited Epstein to 228 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:56,200 Israel and explicitly asked him to bring his girls. 229 00:10:56,559 --> 00:10:59,159 Speaker 1: Bring his girls, not bring your staff, not bring your family. 230 00:10:59,279 --> 00:11:03,080 Speaker 2: Decisely and Peter Attia, the longevity uru. He's huge right 231 00:11:03,120 --> 00:11:05,440 now in the biohacking and health optimization space. 232 00:11:05,879 --> 00:11:09,039 Speaker 1: I listened to his stuff. He's brilliant on science. But here. 233 00:11:09,799 --> 00:11:13,720 Speaker 2: Antia has since apologized and claimed ignorance that the emails 234 00:11:13,799 --> 00:11:17,960 show he admitted to going into withdrawal without Epstein. He 235 00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:20,480 wrote that Epstein's life was outrageous, and that he can't 236 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:21,039 tell a soul. 237 00:11:21,159 --> 00:11:22,879 Speaker 1: Can't tell a soul. You don't say that about a 238 00:11:22,960 --> 00:11:24,919 nice dinner party. You say that about things that would 239 00:11:25,000 --> 00:11:29,360 ruin your reputation. It implies a deep complicity of silence exactly. 240 00:11:29,759 --> 00:11:31,759 Speaker 2: And speaking of ruin, we have to look at the 241 00:11:31,759 --> 00:11:34,759 British royal family. This is where the power dynamics get 242 00:11:34,840 --> 00:11:35,879 really really interesting. 243 00:11:36,039 --> 00:11:39,120 Speaker 1: Prince Andrew, or as he's called in the files, the Duke. 244 00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:42,200 Speaker 2: The emails are cozy. We two cozy, delighted for you 245 00:11:42,240 --> 00:11:45,720 to come here to VP. That's Buckingham Palace. Epstein wasn't 246 00:11:45,759 --> 00:11:48,399 just hanging out at VIP parties. He was being invited 247 00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:50,480 into the very heart of the British monarchy. 248 00:11:50,559 --> 00:11:53,919 Speaker 1: But the Sarah Ferguson emails, the Duchess of York, these 249 00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:56,600 are just sad and bizarre. She calls Epstein the brother 250 00:11:56,679 --> 00:11:58,960 I have always wished for. She asked for twenty thousand 251 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:01,600 pounds to cover her and then she signs off with 252 00:12:01,960 --> 00:12:04,360 I am at your service, just marry me. 253 00:12:04,720 --> 00:12:08,200 Speaker 2: It reeks of total desperation, but it shows exactly how 254 00:12:08,200 --> 00:12:12,159 Epstein operated. He found people who had massive status but 255 00:12:12,240 --> 00:12:15,720 needed cash. Like Ferguson or people who had money but 256 00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:19,000 needed something else. He filled the gaps in their lives. 257 00:12:19,320 --> 00:12:21,960 He paid her debts, He acted as a confidant, and 258 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:23,360 once he was in he owned them. 259 00:12:23,399 --> 00:12:27,000 Speaker 1: It wasn't just British royals either. Crown Princess met Mrit 260 00:12:27,039 --> 00:12:30,679 of Norway. She called him a sweetheart. They discussed a 261 00:12:30,679 --> 00:12:34,080 wife hunt, noting that Scandinavian women are better wife material. 262 00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:36,600 Speaker 2: It was a global network. He was collecting royalty like 263 00:12:36,639 --> 00:12:37,279 trading cards. 264 00:12:37,399 --> 00:12:40,039 Speaker 1: Let's talk about the tech Titans. Elon Musk. 265 00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:42,919 Speaker 2: Musk is an interesting case here. There is an email 266 00:12:42,919 --> 00:12:45,159 where he asks what day or night will be the 267 00:12:45,200 --> 00:12:46,519 wildest party on your. 268 00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:49,519 Speaker 1: Island, which sounds pretty incriminating on the face of it. 269 00:12:49,519 --> 00:12:50,960 Speaker 2: It does, but we do have to look at the 270 00:12:50,960 --> 00:12:54,919 full context. The plans apparently fell through. Musk claims he 271 00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:58,519 never went and he declined repeated invitations, but the fact 272 00:12:58,559 --> 00:13:01,159 that he was asking about the wildest party suggests he 273 00:13:01,240 --> 00:13:04,080 knew the reputation of the place. He knew exactly what 274 00:13:04,159 --> 00:13:06,080 kind of wild Epstein provided. 275 00:13:05,720 --> 00:13:06,559 Speaker 1: And Richard Branson. 276 00:13:06,799 --> 00:13:11,720 Speaker 2: Epstein thanked Branson for hospitality. Branson replied, hoping Epstein would 277 00:13:11,720 --> 00:13:12,679 bring his harem. 278 00:13:12,399 --> 00:13:13,399 Speaker 1: Next time harem. 279 00:13:13,559 --> 00:13:16,559 Speaker 2: Yeah. Branson claimed later that haram just referred to the 280 00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:19,919 women Epstein happened to travel with, but again the language 281 00:13:19,960 --> 00:13:23,440 reveals the mindset perfectly. Women were accessories, a harem to 282 00:13:23,480 --> 00:13:25,799 be brought along like luxury luggage. 283 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:28,159 Speaker 1: And Steve Chish, the owner of the New York Giants, 284 00:13:28,200 --> 00:13:31,200 he's emailing asking if a woman is a pro or 285 00:13:31,360 --> 00:13:36,399 a civilian, and Epstein literally offers him a Tahitian woman 286 00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:37,039 as a present. 287 00:13:37,320 --> 00:13:40,879 Speaker 2: A present, a human being is a gift. This is 288 00:13:40,879 --> 00:13:43,879 the commodification of people at the absolute highest level of 289 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:47,399 business and sports. It's treating people like party favors. 290 00:13:47,639 --> 00:13:50,240 Speaker 1: Okay, so we've covered Hollywood, tech and royals. Now we 291 00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:52,279 have to step into the political arena. And I really 292 00:13:52,279 --> 00:13:55,080 want to remind everyone listening we are neutral observers here. 293 00:13:55,360 --> 00:13:58,360 The files implicate everyone. This isn't a partisan issue. 294 00:13:58,399 --> 00:14:01,120 Speaker 2: It's a power issue at the US presidency. 295 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:04,320 Speaker 1: Donald Trump, he is one of the most mentioned names 296 00:14:04,360 --> 00:14:05,960 in the entire cash of files. 297 00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:10,320 Speaker 2: He is There is an FBI spreadsheet detailing calls alleging involvement. 298 00:14:11,039 --> 00:14:15,360 Now important context here. Investigators at the time deemed those 299 00:14:15,399 --> 00:14:20,720 specific tips not credible, but the connection was undeniably there. 300 00:14:20,759 --> 00:14:24,120 They were in the exact same social circles for decades. 301 00:14:24,240 --> 00:14:26,840 Speaker 1: There's an email sent right after the twenty sixteen election, 302 00:14:27,200 --> 00:14:30,360 and associate Panics asks Epstein, what's going to happen now 303 00:14:30,360 --> 00:14:33,480 that Trump won? And Epstein just replies, it's okay. 304 00:14:33,720 --> 00:14:36,639 Speaker 2: It's okay. Two words. And you can interpret that in 305 00:14:36,639 --> 00:14:39,360 so many ways. Does that mean don't worry he's a friend, 306 00:14:39,519 --> 00:14:42,200 or don't worry I have leverage, or just it doesn't 307 00:14:42,200 --> 00:14:44,240 matter who is president. We don't really know, but it 308 00:14:44,279 --> 00:14:47,399 suggests Epstein wasn't afraid of a Trump presidency. He felt 309 00:14:47,519 --> 00:14:48,720 entirely secure. 310 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:51,200 Speaker 1: And looking at the other side the Clinton era figures 311 00:14:51,679 --> 00:14:52,879 Larry Summers. 312 00:14:52,639 --> 00:14:57,120 Speaker 2: Former Treasury secretary, a massive, massive figure in global economics, 313 00:14:57,320 --> 00:15:00,919 Dean Epstein exchanged jokes mocking Trump and told him your 314 00:15:00,960 --> 00:15:03,840 world does not understand how dumb he really is. Summers 315 00:15:03,879 --> 00:15:06,200 has since admitted deep regret for staying in touch, but 316 00:15:06,279 --> 00:15:08,519 he was in deep he was flying on the plane, 317 00:15:08,559 --> 00:15:09,879 he was communicating regularly. 318 00:15:09,919 --> 00:15:11,879 Speaker 1: And Howard Lutnik, the Commerce secretary. 319 00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:14,840 Speaker 2: This is the part that disturbs me the most about Lettnik. 320 00:15:15,279 --> 00:15:18,120 He visited the island, but he didn't just go alone 321 00:15:18,159 --> 00:15:20,759 for a wild party. He took his wife, he took 322 00:15:20,799 --> 00:15:22,320 his kids, he took the nannies. 323 00:15:22,440 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 1: He took his kids to Epstein's island. 324 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:29,279 Speaker 2: Yes, and that is a psychological strategy on Epstein's part. 325 00:15:29,519 --> 00:15:32,279 If you bring your family, it normalizes the environment. It 326 00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:35,519 makes it feel perfectly safe. Look, it's just a vacation spot. 327 00:15:35,559 --> 00:15:38,320 The kids are playing in the sand. It provides incredible 328 00:15:38,360 --> 00:15:41,039 cover for everything else happening there. It makes the highly 329 00:15:41,080 --> 00:15:43,120 abnormal feel totally normal. 330 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:45,399 Speaker 1: We also have Steve Bannon in. 331 00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:47,559 Speaker 2: Twenty eighteen, and this is late in the game. Remember 332 00:15:47,559 --> 00:15:51,159 this is after Epstein's first conviction. Estein was boasting to 333 00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:53,759 Bannon that he could organize one on ones with world 334 00:15:53,840 --> 00:15:57,720 leaders for him. Epstein was acting as a shadow diplomat. 335 00:15:57,480 --> 00:16:00,120 Speaker 1: And he clearly had the contacts to back it up. 336 00:16:00,159 --> 00:16:02,639 Ahud Barak, the ex Prime Minister of Israel, he. 337 00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:05,120 Speaker 2: Called Epstein a collector of people, which is the most 338 00:16:05,159 --> 00:16:06,480 accurate description I've heard yet. 339 00:16:06,519 --> 00:16:10,919 Speaker 1: Miroslavloshkak, the Slovakian diplomat, there's an exchange about a girl, 340 00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:13,759 the mi I girl, and Epstein replies, you can have 341 00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:15,360 them both and their. 342 00:16:15,240 --> 00:16:19,600 Speaker 2: Sisters and their sisters. It's relentless. It's like he has 343 00:16:19,639 --> 00:16:21,279 an unlimited supply of human beings. 344 00:16:21,399 --> 00:16:24,879 Speaker 1: Peter Mandelssohn a UK official for our American listeners, He's 345 00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:28,120 essentially a political architect in the UK, very high up. 346 00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:31,200 He was leaking market sensitive information to Epstein. 347 00:16:31,399 --> 00:16:34,960 Speaker 2: That's direct corruption, that's trading state secrets for access or 348 00:16:34,960 --> 00:16:37,559 for money or for whatever else Epstein was providing on 349 00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:38,000 the island. 350 00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:40,360 Speaker 1: And then the big one, Vladimir Putin. 351 00:16:40,559 --> 00:16:44,159 Speaker 2: Putin's name appears over a thousand times. Epstein was trying 352 00:16:44,159 --> 00:16:46,679 to arrange a meeting between twenty thirteen and twenty eighteen. 353 00:16:47,240 --> 00:16:50,320 We don't have hard confirmation they ever actually met, but 354 00:16:50,440 --> 00:16:53,919 the effort was intensely there. Epstein wanted the full set. 355 00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:56,200 He wanted the leaders of the East and the West. 356 00:16:56,240 --> 00:16:57,840 Speaker 1: Why though, what was the ultimate end goal? 357 00:16:58,159 --> 00:17:01,759 Speaker 2: Power protection. If you have dirt on everyone, or if 358 00:17:01,799 --> 00:17:05,240 you are useful to everyone, you are practically untouchable. And 359 00:17:05,319 --> 00:17:07,000 for a very long time he was. He was the 360 00:17:07,039 --> 00:17:07,720 hub of the wheel. 361 00:17:07,799 --> 00:17:10,759 Speaker 1: But it wasn't just about political power. And this is 362 00:17:10,759 --> 00:17:13,559 where the story takes a hard right turn into something 363 00:17:13,599 --> 00:17:16,839 that feels like a bad sci fi movie. We really 364 00:17:16,839 --> 00:17:19,599 have to talk about the mad science. This section often 365 00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:22,400 gets overlooked because the abuse is so horrific, but the 366 00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:24,799 science aspect explains the why of it all. 367 00:17:25,079 --> 00:17:28,799 Speaker 2: Absolutely. Epstein wasn't just a predator. He was a eugenicist. 368 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:33,440 He believed in the genetic superiority of certain people, specifically himself. 369 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:35,680 Speaker 1: He wanted to improve the human race according to his 370 00:17:35,720 --> 00:17:37,359 own twisted standards exactly. 371 00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:40,240 Speaker 2: He was obsessed with designer babies. He wanted to fund 372 00:17:40,279 --> 00:17:43,799 research to modify embryos. He wasn't just interested in curing 373 00:17:43,839 --> 00:17:46,400 genetic diseases, he was interested in enhancement. 374 00:17:46,599 --> 00:17:51,799 Speaker 1: And this wasn't just abstract scientific curiosity. It was deeply racist. 375 00:17:51,559 --> 00:17:54,599 Speaker 2: Deeply racist. There are emails with Joshua Back and Noam 376 00:17:54,680 --> 00:17:59,119 Chomsky Brilliant Minds where Epstein is theorizing about modifying genes 377 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:02,480 and black people to improve intelligence or working memory. 378 00:18:02,559 --> 00:18:04,519 Speaker 1: It's pseudoscientific white supremacy. 379 00:18:04,759 --> 00:18:08,240 Speaker 2: It is. He was dressing a bigotry as intellectual curiosity, 380 00:18:08,759 --> 00:18:11,920 and he was using his massive wealth to get serious 381 00:18:11,960 --> 00:18:15,400 scientists to entertain these conversations. He was buying credibility for 382 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:16,160 his racism. 383 00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:18,880 Speaker 1: And then there was the baby factory. This sounds like 384 00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:21,759 a wild conspiracy theory, but it's literally right there in 385 00:18:21,799 --> 00:18:22,319 the files. 386 00:18:22,640 --> 00:18:25,519 Speaker 2: This was his plan to impregnate twenty women at a 387 00:18:25,559 --> 00:18:29,400 time at his new Mexico ranch. He wanted to spread 388 00:18:29,440 --> 00:18:33,440 his own DNA. He truly believed his DNA was superior 389 00:18:33,839 --> 00:18:35,880 and it was his duty to seed the population. 390 00:18:36,319 --> 00:18:40,359 Speaker 1: That is textbook narcissism. It's also utterly terrifying. It's the 391 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:43,799 logic of a cult leader or a historical dictator. I 392 00:18:43,839 --> 00:18:46,119 am the peak of evolution, so I must replicate. 393 00:18:46,319 --> 00:18:49,160 Speaker 2: He was also obsessed with immortality. He paid two hundred 394 00:18:49,160 --> 00:18:52,359 thousand dollars to mass General to sequence his genome. But 395 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:54,480 and this is classic Epstein, he only paid the first 396 00:18:54,519 --> 00:18:55,599 two thousand dollars the bill. 397 00:18:55,839 --> 00:18:58,480 Speaker 1: Classic grifter move. Even when trying to become an immortal god, 398 00:18:58,519 --> 00:19:00,440 he stiffs the hospital bill always. 399 00:19:00,839 --> 00:19:04,079 Speaker 2: But he was discussing the biological consequences of time travel 400 00:19:04,119 --> 00:19:08,440 with Harvard professors. He emailed Yell professor David gellinter about 401 00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:10,559 experiences allowing time travel to the past. 402 00:19:11,039 --> 00:19:14,519 Speaker 1: Was he completely delusional or did he think his money 403 00:19:14,519 --> 00:19:15,759 could actually buy physics. 404 00:19:16,559 --> 00:19:19,079 Speaker 2: I think when you have that much money and you've 405 00:19:19,119 --> 00:19:22,400 controlled powerful people for that long, you start to believe 406 00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:26,559 the fundamental laws of nature are just another negotiation. He 407 00:19:26,599 --> 00:19:28,960 thought he could negotiate with death, He thought he could 408 00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:32,160 negotiate with time itself. He surrounded himself with yes men 409 00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:34,799 who took his money and probably just nodded along to 410 00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:35,759 his crazy theories. 411 00:19:35,799 --> 00:19:38,960 Speaker 1: He also discussed creating a female via agra with Nathan 412 00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:39,799 Wolfe to. 413 00:19:39,839 --> 00:19:42,680 Speaker 2: Increase female sex tries. Again, it all comes back to 414 00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:46,839 control and exploitation. Even his scientific interests were purely geared 415 00:19:46,880 --> 00:19:49,720 towards making women more available to him. It wasn't about 416 00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:53,160 women's health or well being. It was about his access. 417 00:19:53,079 --> 00:19:56,319 Speaker 1: Which leads us to the codes. Because despite all this power, 418 00:19:56,440 --> 00:19:59,319 despite the arrogance, they knew what they were doing was 419 00:19:59,359 --> 00:20:01,880 illegal and wrong. They knew they had to hide it 420 00:20:01,920 --> 00:20:02,599 in plain sight. 421 00:20:02,839 --> 00:20:06,279 Speaker 2: The language of dehumanization is the very first code referring 422 00:20:06,279 --> 00:20:09,839 to women as it it is arriving. It needs a visa, 423 00:20:10,119 --> 00:20:11,319 not she, not a person. 424 00:20:11,440 --> 00:20:15,160 Speaker 1: It comparing them like commodities, the Moldavian versus the Ukrainian, 425 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:16,680 like you're comparing vintage wines. 426 00:20:16,799 --> 00:20:19,279 Speaker 2: Yeah. And the email where he casually writes, I love 427 00:20:19,359 --> 00:20:20,279 the torture video. 428 00:20:20,400 --> 00:20:22,960 Speaker 1: Got that one stops me cold every single time I 429 00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:23,359 read it. 430 00:20:23,519 --> 00:20:25,559 Speaker 2: We don't know what video. That is is it a movie? 431 00:20:25,680 --> 00:20:28,880 Is it's something real he commissioned, But given everything else 432 00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:31,519 we know, it just chills the blood. 433 00:20:31,599 --> 00:20:32,920 Speaker 1: And then there's the pizza code. 434 00:20:33,240 --> 00:20:37,640 Speaker 2: The word pizza appears over nine hundred times in the communications. 435 00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:40,279 Speaker 1: Pizza and grape soda better than a Chinese cookie. 436 00:20:40,519 --> 00:20:43,519 Speaker 2: Look, maybe the man really liked pizza. But in the 437 00:20:43,559 --> 00:20:47,440 specific context of human trafficking rings, food words are very 438 00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:51,079 often used as code for specific types of victims or acts. 439 00:20:51,839 --> 00:20:55,079 When you see a grown billionaire emailing other powerful men 440 00:20:55,119 --> 00:20:58,559 about pizza and grape soda being better than a Chinese cookie, 441 00:20:59,079 --> 00:21:02,359 you have to suspend disbeliefs entirely to think they're talking 442 00:21:02,359 --> 00:21:04,839 about lunch. It doesn't fit the profile of how these 443 00:21:04,920 --> 00:21:06,000 men speak to each other. 444 00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:07,480 Speaker 1: And the word whoops. 445 00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:10,480 Speaker 2: Appears four hundred times, and not for spilling coffee on 446 00:21:10,519 --> 00:21:13,599 a desk. He used it when reacting to Ritke Junior's 447 00:21:13,599 --> 00:21:15,960 wife being found dead. He used it in the context 448 00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:17,559 regarding permission to kill someone. 449 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:19,799 Speaker 1: Whoops, like oops, they died, Oh well. 450 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:24,079 Speaker 2: It displays a sociopathic lack of empathy. It treats human 451 00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:26,960 life and death as a minor clerical error. 452 00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:29,279 Speaker 1: We mentioned the cannibal hook at the start of the show. 453 00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:31,960 On a circle back to that now the restaurant named 454 00:21:31,960 --> 00:21:34,200 Cannibal the Jerky again. 455 00:21:34,279 --> 00:21:37,160 Speaker 2: It could be a trendy, edgy restaurant name, ye, but 456 00:21:37,319 --> 00:21:41,599 combined with the FBI witness reporting acts of sacrifice, it 457 00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:44,119 paints a picture of a group of people pushing the 458 00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:47,960 absolute boundaries of taboo. They were bored with regular luxury. 459 00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:50,519 They wanted to transgress. They wanted to do things that 460 00:21:50,599 --> 00:21:53,359 normal people wouldn't even dream of in their worst nightmares. 461 00:21:53,440 --> 00:21:55,319 Speaker 1: And then there's the theory of the hidden children. 462 00:21:55,759 --> 00:21:57,759 Speaker 2: This is one of the darkest threads we have to pull. 463 00:21:57,880 --> 00:22:00,720 Speaker 1: There's a two thousand and seven email from Gislaane Maxwell. 464 00:22:01,200 --> 00:22:05,039 She gives instructions for an Epstein's sperm sample. This highly 465 00:22:05,079 --> 00:22:08,720 implies a shared child or some sort of surrogacy arrangement, and. 466 00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:11,920 Speaker 2: Sarah Ferguson emailing him congratulating him on a baby boy in. 467 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:15,759 Speaker 1: The Diary, a victim's journal entry claiming Epstein impregnated her 468 00:22:15,880 --> 00:22:17,720 and the baby was forcibly taken away. 469 00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:21,279 Speaker 2: If true, it means there are living heirs to this 470 00:22:21,440 --> 00:22:24,920 horror out there right now, children who were created as 471 00:22:25,039 --> 00:22:27,839 part of a genetic experiment or a twisted whim and 472 00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:31,319 then removed. It's the ultimate form of treating humans like 473 00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:35,839 manufactured products. Where are these children now? Who raise them? 474 00:22:36,079 --> 00:22:39,240 Speaker 1: Let's move to the end, the final days of this empire, 475 00:22:39,839 --> 00:22:42,480 because for all the science and the immense power, it 476 00:22:42,559 --> 00:22:43,680 did eventually end. 477 00:22:44,039 --> 00:22:46,920 Speaker 2: The art he collected tells the story of the end perfectly. 478 00:22:47,559 --> 00:22:49,960 In his home, there was a table. The legs of 479 00:22:50,039 --> 00:22:52,559 the table were literally statues of crying babies. 480 00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:54,880 Speaker 1: Who buys that? Who puts that in their living room 481 00:22:54,920 --> 00:22:55,640 to look at every day? 482 00:22:55,720 --> 00:22:58,960 Speaker 2: Someone who feeds on misery. There was also a mural 483 00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:02,440 of a naked figure dawning well demons watched. He surrounded 484 00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:05,839 himself with imagery of deep suffering and the demonic. It 485 00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:08,400 wasn't even hidden, it was proudly on display. 486 00:23:08,119 --> 00:23:11,279 Speaker 1: Which brings us to that Bannon interview again. Bannon asked 487 00:23:11,319 --> 00:23:13,279 him straight up, are you the devil himself? 488 00:23:13,519 --> 00:23:15,759 Speaker 2: And Epstein replied no, but I have a good mirror. 489 00:23:15,799 --> 00:23:17,720 Speaker 1: I have a good mirror. That implies he sees the 490 00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:18,559 devil when he looks at his. 491 00:23:18,599 --> 00:23:21,799 Speaker 2: Own reflection, And then he added, the devil scares me. 492 00:23:22,759 --> 00:23:25,799 It's a rare moment of actual vulnerability, or maybe just 493 00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:29,839 pure theatricality. But he knew what he was. He knew 494 00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:32,160 he was the villain of the story and the money. 495 00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:35,839 Speaker 1: The nineteen fifty three trust Karina Shuliac. 496 00:23:36,440 --> 00:23:39,640 Speaker 2: She was listed as the biggest beneficiary, Yeah, fifty million 497 00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:43,920 dollars in cash, real estate, diamonds. She was the last 498 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:45,559 person he called before he died. 499 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:49,279 Speaker 1: And other beneficiaries were pilots, his brother and children of 500 00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:50,240 political figures. 501 00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:53,200 Speaker 2: That's the ultimate insurance policy. If I pay your kids, 502 00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:55,680 you can't turn on me. If your children's trust fund 503 00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:58,440 depends entirely on my estate, you're going to protect my 504 00:23:58,599 --> 00:23:59,720 estate at all costs. 505 00:24:00,039 --> 00:24:03,640 Speaker 1: Two weeks before his death, his lawyers met with federal prosecutors. 506 00:24:03,799 --> 00:24:06,519 Speaker 2: He was reportedly ready to finally cooperate. He was looking 507 00:24:06,519 --> 00:24:08,759 at a life sentence in a concrete box, and he 508 00:24:08,839 --> 00:24:12,200 was a man who loved extreme comfort. The working theory 509 00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:13,880 is that he was ready to trade names for a 510 00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:16,799 better sell. He was ready to open the Rolodex, and 511 00:24:16,839 --> 00:24:18,640 then he was dead, And then he was dead, and 512 00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:21,559 the Rolodex did closed. Mostly, So let's wrap this up. 513 00:24:22,039 --> 00:24:25,519 Speaker 1: We've covered the spy cameras and the Kleenex boxes, the 514 00:24:25,559 --> 00:24:29,640 eugenics and the racism, the royal wife hunts the codes 515 00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:31,119 about pizza and sacrifice. 516 00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:33,640 Speaker 2: It wasn't just a rich man behaving badly. It was 517 00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:38,759 a global web. It was systemic blackmail, It was pseudoscience. 518 00:24:38,839 --> 00:24:41,720 It was abuse on an industrial scale. It was a 519 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:45,640 perfectly oiled machine designed to entrap the world's elite and 520 00:24:45,839 --> 00:24:49,000 feed the boundless ego of one single man. 521 00:24:49,079 --> 00:24:52,039 Speaker 1: And the most terrifying part isn't even what's explicitly in 522 00:24:52,119 --> 00:24:54,720 the files. It's the sheer volume of powerful people who 523 00:24:54,799 --> 00:24:57,559 knew him, emailed him, visited him, And now look at 524 00:24:57,559 --> 00:24:59,880 the cameras and say, I didn't know they knew something. 525 00:25:00,039 --> 00:25:01,799 Speaker 2: Maybe they didn't know the absolute worst of it, or 526 00:25:01,839 --> 00:25:04,000 maybe they did, but they knew he was the collector 527 00:25:04,079 --> 00:25:06,480 of people, and they were perfectly happy to be collected 528 00:25:06,519 --> 00:25:08,759 as long as the checks cleared and the parties were wild. 529 00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:11,119 Speaker 1: So here's the question for you listening right now, after 530 00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:13,839 hearing all the details about the hidden cameras, the spy 531 00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:17,079 shot purchases, the Russians may come in handy email, do 532 00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:20,440 you believe Jeffrey Epstein was running a calculated blackmail operation 533 00:25:20,559 --> 00:25:23,359 for a foreign government or was this purely a personal 534 00:25:23,519 --> 00:25:24,720 enterprise of depravity? 535 00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:29,279 Speaker 2: Was he a spy or just a monster, or maybe both. 536 00:25:29,599 --> 00:25:31,279 Speaker 1: Let us know your stand in the comments. We really 537 00:25:31,319 --> 00:25:32,599 want to hear what you think about this one. 538 00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:34,359 Speaker 2: It's a thread that just keeps unraveling. 539 00:25:35,160 --> 00:25:38,200 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to thrilling threads. We'll see you next time.