WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.520 --> 00:00:04.400 Welcome to Wine Soundtrack USA. Listen to the passion with 2 00:00:04.440 --> 00:00:07.960 which producers narrate their winery and their world team thirty 3 00:00:08.000 --> 00:00:12.000 answers discover their stories, personalities, and passions. 4 00:00:12.640 --> 00:00:15.839 Hello, friends and listeners of Wine Soundtrack. This is Alison Levine, 5 00:00:15.880 --> 00:00:18.320 and today I have the pleasure, the privilege, and the 6 00:00:18.359 --> 00:00:21.359 honor to be sitting with Greg Lafollett, the proprietor and 7 00:00:21.359 --> 00:00:24.359 whymaker of Marshall Wines. And while you may not be 8 00:00:24.399 --> 00:00:28.199 familiar with Marshall Win's a younger brand, the name probably 9 00:00:28.359 --> 00:00:30.480 you've heard of over the years, because Greg has pretty 10 00:00:30.519 --> 00:00:34.000 much been everywhere anywhere any winery you name, which we're 11 00:00:34.039 --> 00:00:36.359 going to talk about now. But we're sitting here in 12 00:00:36.439 --> 00:00:41.600 his lovely vineyard in Occidental in Sebastopol, California. And Greg, 13 00:00:41.640 --> 00:00:44.119 welcome to Wine Soundtrack and tell us about Marshall Wines. 14 00:00:44.759 --> 00:00:49.600 Well, Marshall Wines was the idea of my now managing partner, 15 00:00:49.640 --> 00:00:54.119 business partner, Kevin Lee. I had a brand called Alchemista 16 00:00:55.000 --> 00:00:59.240 and before that Lafolllett Wines. But the same goreer as 17 00:00:59.240 --> 00:01:01.880 I've had for gosh, almost forty years, a lot of 18 00:01:01.880 --> 00:01:05.040 them have just gone with me with each project, and 19 00:01:05.079 --> 00:01:09.319 so I started Alchemista as a white tablecloth brand, and 20 00:01:09.439 --> 00:01:13.959 during the pandemic, of course, all the restaurants closed. 21 00:01:13.760 --> 00:01:16.280 And we're white tablecloth restaurants for a while, right. 22 00:01:16.640 --> 00:01:22.480 So what happened was I've been making wine for Single Thread, 23 00:01:22.640 --> 00:01:25.200 which is knocked the French laundry off their perch, is 24 00:01:25.840 --> 00:01:30.200 the top dog restaurant. They got all three Michelin stars 25 00:01:30.239 --> 00:01:32.200 in two years and are now rated one of the 26 00:01:32.239 --> 00:01:35.079 top fifty restaurants in the world. And they'd been buying 27 00:01:35.120 --> 00:01:37.959 some of my Alchemista wines. They called me up and said, 28 00:01:38.280 --> 00:01:40.359 we want you to make our house white. 29 00:01:40.359 --> 00:01:42.200 And two provisos. 30 00:01:42.239 --> 00:01:44.159 It's got to be from Sonoma County because they're in 31 00:01:44.159 --> 00:01:47.599 Healsburg and it can't be chardonay. Well, I'd been working 32 00:01:47.680 --> 00:01:52.000 on a Columbard project from vines planted in nineteen oh 33 00:01:52.079 --> 00:01:54.519 two that had kind of been abandoned with Clark and 34 00:01:54.560 --> 00:01:58.719 Bonnie Lestra, and we've been resuscitating these vines together and 35 00:01:58.840 --> 00:02:01.359 just doing it out of passion. When Single Thread called 36 00:02:01.400 --> 00:02:03.719 me up and I said, boy, I've got just the 37 00:02:03.760 --> 00:02:04.280 thing for you. 38 00:02:04.319 --> 00:02:06.719 Columbard. Who's heard of that, you know? 39 00:02:06.799 --> 00:02:09.000 Even though it was the most widely planted white wine 40 00:02:09.039 --> 00:02:12.319 grape up until the early seventies or late sixties. 41 00:02:12.719 --> 00:02:15.639 No one does it anymore, and so. 42 00:02:15.639 --> 00:02:17.680 They loved it. They loved the idea. I made the 43 00:02:17.680 --> 00:02:21.000 wine for them. The pandemic hit and then they quote 44 00:02:21.039 --> 00:02:23.240 sold me back for a song and a dance. Thirty 45 00:02:23.280 --> 00:02:26.960 five cases of Columbard. 46 00:02:28.960 --> 00:02:30.360 Who knows about that? What are you going to do 47 00:02:30.400 --> 00:02:30.639 with it? 48 00:02:30.879 --> 00:02:34.439 Yeah, well it's so unknown that it's hip and it 49 00:02:34.520 --> 00:02:35.360 was all Shiner's. 50 00:02:35.840 --> 00:02:37.240 So I said, well what am. 51 00:02:37.120 --> 00:02:39.960 I going to do with thirty five cases of Columbard? 52 00:02:40.520 --> 00:02:43.120 And Kevin at the time he was helping el Chemista, 53 00:02:43.199 --> 00:02:47.599 because I don't know anything about it or computers or anything. 54 00:02:48.319 --> 00:02:50.120 He said, well, here's what we're going to do, Greg, 55 00:02:50.159 --> 00:02:52.680 We're going to start a brand. We'll name it after 56 00:02:52.800 --> 00:02:56.360 our wives, Mara and Michelle, so we'll call it Marshall 57 00:02:57.159 --> 00:03:01.439 and his thirteen year old daughter designed the label, and 58 00:03:01.520 --> 00:03:03.960 we're going to name some of the wines after our 59 00:03:04.000 --> 00:03:07.639 best friends. And I was thinking, well, if you've been 60 00:03:07.639 --> 00:03:09.840 in this industry for forty years and you don't name 61 00:03:09.879 --> 00:03:12.120 a brand after your wives and have your kids designed 62 00:03:12.159 --> 00:03:14.439 the labels and name after your friends, what are you 63 00:03:14.479 --> 00:03:18.039 doing in this business? So that was the birth of 64 00:03:18.520 --> 00:03:23.560 Marshall with thirty five cases of the lowly Columbard grape. 65 00:03:23.759 --> 00:03:26.360 Wow. And I know you still make Columbard, But what 66 00:03:26.840 --> 00:03:29.719 are you making today and what is your total case production? 67 00:03:31.000 --> 00:03:35.120 Well, I have six kids, we're stopping there and a 68 00:03:35.120 --> 00:03:39.000 bit we're getting grandkids now. But we make on a 69 00:03:39.080 --> 00:03:44.039 yearly basis around nine hundred cases. Most of our different 70 00:03:44.199 --> 00:03:48.199 lots of wine are between fifty and one hundred cases 71 00:03:48.240 --> 00:03:51.879 of wine, so we don't make a whole lot. It's 72 00:03:52.039 --> 00:03:56.479 very artisanal and it's hard to find, so but that's 73 00:03:56.520 --> 00:03:59.319 the way I like it. And my wine maker ev 74 00:03:59.319 --> 00:04:02.800 and Domiano, we've promoted him to winemaker last year. Go 75 00:04:02.919 --> 00:04:05.840 through every barrel all the time, every barrel counts. We 76 00:04:05.879 --> 00:04:10.639 only have about, oh like ninety barrels or so. And 77 00:04:11.680 --> 00:04:14.120 we are starting a custom crush facility so that we 78 00:04:14.159 --> 00:04:16.360 can make our own wines the way we want them 79 00:04:16.399 --> 00:04:18.639 and bring some of our friends on board too, and 80 00:04:18.720 --> 00:04:21.000 we'll do about one hundred tons this year. 81 00:04:21.439 --> 00:04:23.639 Great, and so of those nine hundred you've got, I 82 00:04:23.680 --> 00:04:26.560 know you do some traditional varieties like chardonnay and pino noir, 83 00:04:27.000 --> 00:04:30.399 and then you're doing weird varieties wonderful weird varieties like colmbard. 84 00:04:30.439 --> 00:04:34.160 What other lesser known forgotten grapes are you working with? 85 00:04:34.720 --> 00:04:35.040 Well. 86 00:04:35.959 --> 00:04:40.720 In addition to Colmbard, we make a one carbonic maceration 87 00:04:40.920 --> 00:04:43.560 Pino manne. And for those of you who haven't heard 88 00:04:43.560 --> 00:04:47.079 of pinomnie, it is the most widely planted red grape 89 00:04:47.079 --> 00:04:51.439 in Champagne. It's one of the three Champagneoi grapes, and 90 00:04:52.040 --> 00:04:54.199 very little of it's ever made into a table wine, 91 00:04:54.279 --> 00:04:58.360 let alone carbonic macerations, So that's really odd. For the 92 00:04:58.399 --> 00:05:01.040 wine officionado who's had everything that will not have had 93 00:05:01.120 --> 00:05:05.560 a table wine Pinomine especially done carbonic maceration. And it's 94 00:05:05.600 --> 00:05:08.920 really good, yes, and it's one of my wife's favorites. 95 00:05:09.519 --> 00:05:12.439 We also make a charbono from the Freddioni vineyard in 96 00:05:12.439 --> 00:05:15.360 the Napa Valley, planted around nineteen twenty. 97 00:05:17.160 --> 00:05:17.879 We make. 98 00:05:19.199 --> 00:05:22.720 Some sins from the world's oldest and sou vineyard, the 99 00:05:22.759 --> 00:05:26.959 Bechtold Vineyard in the mccoulmay River Aba. We make one 100 00:05:27.000 --> 00:05:33.160 of the oldest zinfandel vineyards wines ever, the Royal Tea Vineyard, 101 00:05:33.160 --> 00:05:36.199 also in the mccoulmay River Aba, that was planted in 102 00:05:36.240 --> 00:05:40.079 the eighteen eighties, and then we make a Carinnon that 103 00:05:40.319 --> 00:05:42.759 was planted in nineteen hundred, so it's only one hundred 104 00:05:42.800 --> 00:05:45.800 and twenty four years old. But these grapes all have 105 00:05:46.199 --> 00:05:49.120 real weird o varietals in them, like the Carinon has 106 00:05:49.279 --> 00:05:53.959 an almost extinct white grape varietal called Manbadon, and it's 107 00:05:54.240 --> 00:05:57.319 about ten percent of the Carinon is actually one hundred 108 00:05:57.360 --> 00:06:00.399 percent whole cluster. Manbadon, a white grape put in the 109 00:06:00.439 --> 00:06:03.839 bottom of the fermentner and then done semi carbonic. And 110 00:06:03.879 --> 00:06:07.360 when we press that wine, we have to hand press 111 00:06:07.839 --> 00:06:10.959 the manvad on because it has a very gelatinous parrot carp, 112 00:06:11.040 --> 00:06:13.839 meaning it's really hard to press. We also press it 113 00:06:13.879 --> 00:06:16.279 in a little wooden one ton basket press, and it's 114 00:06:16.279 --> 00:06:19.720 so gentle I won't pop those clusters. Shown you pictures 115 00:06:19.759 --> 00:06:23.240 of my wife actually stomping the grapes in the fermenter 116 00:06:23.319 --> 00:06:27.720 and crushing the manvad on by hand. 117 00:06:27.800 --> 00:06:30.040 Yeah, you put her to work. She has to do. 118 00:06:30.199 --> 00:06:31.519 The winery is named after her. 119 00:06:32.199 --> 00:06:32.959 Yes, that's right. 120 00:06:33.079 --> 00:06:37.319 But I wouldn't be here without her because when I 121 00:06:37.360 --> 00:06:42.319 had my brand tandem, she fed our entire crew, twenty 122 00:06:42.360 --> 00:06:45.360 four people of the custom crush facility had then seven 123 00:06:45.439 --> 00:06:48.199 days a week for eleven weeks, and she ran a 124 00:06:48.279 --> 00:06:50.959 daycare center for my crew who had been together so 125 00:06:51.000 --> 00:06:52.800 long they were starting to pair up and have babies 126 00:06:52.839 --> 00:06:53.240 and such. 127 00:06:53.519 --> 00:06:53.959 Wow. 128 00:06:54.160 --> 00:06:59.240 Wow, so you've been in the wine industry a long time. 129 00:06:59.240 --> 00:07:01.519 I know that this. You've been doing it for forty 130 00:07:01.600 --> 00:07:04.160 years and since you've worked around the world you've done 131 00:07:04.199 --> 00:07:06.439 I think you said this will be your sixty ninth harvest. 132 00:07:06.800 --> 00:07:10.399 But I'm curious, what is your first memory relevant to wine? 133 00:07:10.720 --> 00:07:12.439 How old were you and what do you remember? 134 00:07:14.240 --> 00:07:17.560 My parents, when we lived in Europe, would drag me 135 00:07:17.639 --> 00:07:22.279 through every keller and shae on the continent, and I 136 00:07:22.360 --> 00:07:25.040 just remember visiting a lot of these wineries, but the 137 00:07:25.040 --> 00:07:27.600 ones that impressed me the most were the ones on 138 00:07:27.639 --> 00:07:30.279 the Rhine River with lots of castles around, like right 139 00:07:30.279 --> 00:07:34.879 around the Laurel Eye. So Schlos Johannesburg was an early 140 00:07:34.920 --> 00:07:37.079 memory for me. That was around seven years old. 141 00:07:37.319 --> 00:07:37.680 Wow. 142 00:07:38.240 --> 00:07:40.560 And then when you got a little older and could 143 00:07:40.600 --> 00:07:43.600 drink wine, is there I mean, in your illustrious career 144 00:07:44.000 --> 00:07:46.600 and with all the wines you make. I hate to 145 00:07:46.639 --> 00:07:48.800 ask if there's one, because I'm sure there are many. 146 00:07:48.920 --> 00:07:51.879 But what is one of those memorable wines that sticks 147 00:07:51.920 --> 00:07:53.759 out to you that you had in aha moment with 148 00:07:53.839 --> 00:07:55.360 I mean, was it at the beginning of your career? 149 00:07:55.439 --> 00:07:57.959 Was it somewhere along the way? Did it surprise you 150 00:07:58.000 --> 00:07:59.879 when you tasted that because you were so much f 151 00:08:00.199 --> 00:08:00.759 in your career. 152 00:08:01.600 --> 00:08:04.279 Well, yeah, one of the most profound moments was when 153 00:08:04.319 --> 00:08:07.199 I was in the cellar at Domain Romani Conti and 154 00:08:07.480 --> 00:08:12.519 got to taste a sixty one macachet. 155 00:08:11.720 --> 00:08:15.079 And I guess nothing comparison to that. 156 00:08:15.720 --> 00:08:18.480 Yeah, that was pretty spectacular. I really felt like I 157 00:08:18.600 --> 00:08:22.800 was home at that point. So that's probably the single 158 00:08:23.800 --> 00:08:26.800 most peak, or the first one of my life. But 159 00:08:26.839 --> 00:08:30.040 I have others that I've since done since then. 160 00:08:31.240 --> 00:08:33.639 I love that. So if we were to come home 161 00:08:33.679 --> 00:08:36.440 to your house now and go into your cellar, what 162 00:08:36.519 --> 00:08:39.159 kind of wines would we find? What do you like 163 00:08:39.200 --> 00:08:41.679 to drink, what do you like to collect? 164 00:08:42.000 --> 00:08:45.759 Well, my house burned down, unfortunately, and so my whole 165 00:08:45.759 --> 00:08:47.840 life's work. I had verticals of a lot of the 166 00:08:47.879 --> 00:08:50.519 wines that I've made over the years, like Porter Bass, 167 00:08:50.600 --> 00:08:53.240 dating all the way back from my Flowers days in 168 00:08:53.279 --> 00:08:57.679 the mid nineties, and so I now have the philosophy 169 00:08:58.519 --> 00:09:02.000 not to collect wine. I just drink it and I 170 00:09:02.080 --> 00:09:07.639 trade it. But I love drinking pinos and Chardonnays. Of course, 171 00:09:08.159 --> 00:09:12.639 I love these ancient vine varietals, and so I've really 172 00:09:12.679 --> 00:09:16.919 put my focus into ancient vines and the pinot and 173 00:09:17.000 --> 00:09:18.159 chardonnay spectrum. 174 00:09:18.799 --> 00:09:21.600 And are there particular regions in the world that you 175 00:09:21.639 --> 00:09:23.320 have in affinity to or is it a lot of 176 00:09:23.399 --> 00:09:24.799 like local wines you like to drink. 177 00:09:25.559 --> 00:09:27.639 Well, there's a lot of local wines. But I also 178 00:09:28.440 --> 00:09:30.919 I love wines from all over the world. I used 179 00:09:30.919 --> 00:09:32.960 to live in Australia and I made wine there for 180 00:09:33.000 --> 00:09:36.159 many years, and so I love the wines from the 181 00:09:36.240 --> 00:09:39.360 Hunter especially what they call Hunter River Revelings, which are 182 00:09:39.360 --> 00:09:45.720 actually semi on. I love the pinos from the Ara Valley, 183 00:09:45.799 --> 00:09:51.840 where one of my kids was born. And I love 184 00:09:51.879 --> 00:09:56.159 a lot of the wines from Beechworth and the outlands 185 00:09:56.159 --> 00:09:57.200 of the Snowy Mountains. 186 00:09:58.200 --> 00:10:00.320 I love New Zealand wines. It's hard for me not 187 00:10:00.360 --> 00:10:01.320 to love any of these. 188 00:10:01.399 --> 00:10:04.600 So is there a wine you opened up recently that 189 00:10:04.720 --> 00:10:08.159 drank really well? 190 00:10:08.480 --> 00:10:12.639 Yes? I had an six. 191 00:10:13.960 --> 00:10:18.120 Peloton recently that some Assemolier brought to me when we 192 00:10:18.120 --> 00:10:21.960 were doing the Pino Forum and boy, that wine was 193 00:10:21.960 --> 00:10:24.720 still singing. The Peloton is a blend of between eight 194 00:10:24.759 --> 00:10:27.600 and eleven grapes. It's like a mongrel, but it's meant 195 00:10:27.639 --> 00:10:30.120 to be the winner of the first empty glass to contest. 196 00:10:30.240 --> 00:10:32.639 And I didn't mean it to age for a long time. 197 00:10:32.639 --> 00:10:34.000 But it was tasting really good. 198 00:10:34.240 --> 00:10:38.559 Wow. Wow, So you're working you know, you said that 199 00:10:38.639 --> 00:10:41.200 you love Peano Noi and chardonnay, but you like these 200 00:10:41.240 --> 00:10:45.120 odd ball varieties. And you've worked with so many different 201 00:10:45.120 --> 00:10:48.240 grapes and had such an illustrious career. I'm curious if 202 00:10:48.279 --> 00:10:50.759 you think there's a such thing as a perfect variety. 203 00:10:51.639 --> 00:10:53.919 No, no such thing. 204 00:10:53.960 --> 00:10:57.159 They're all perfect, all perfect in their own ways. 205 00:10:57.480 --> 00:11:00.519 Yes, just like the cherry blossoms in the Last Samurai. 206 00:11:00.559 --> 00:11:01.440 They are all perfect. 207 00:11:03.759 --> 00:11:06.919 So then talking about perfection in your career with all 208 00:11:06.960 --> 00:11:09.200 the wines, and you've worked for some big name wineries 209 00:11:09.240 --> 00:11:15.879 b V. Flowers, La Crema, Hartford, all hardcourts. Are you 210 00:11:16.039 --> 00:11:19.559 so many great wines that have gotten big reputations and 211 00:11:19.600 --> 00:11:23.320 big scores. What's your opinion on wine scores and critics? 212 00:11:23.360 --> 00:11:24.759 I mean, what kind of a role do they play 213 00:11:24.799 --> 00:11:27.039 for you as a winemaker and now working with a 214 00:11:27.039 --> 00:11:29.960 smaller brand. You know what does that mean for you? 215 00:11:31.000 --> 00:11:34.799 Well, wine scores are helpful, I think to the general public, 216 00:11:34.879 --> 00:11:37.039 especially people who don't get a chance to taste a 217 00:11:37.080 --> 00:11:40.759 lot of wines. But I think rather than looking at 218 00:11:40.799 --> 00:11:45.480 wine scores, I think listening to a critic who maybe 219 00:11:45.519 --> 00:11:49.639 doesn't even give scores, but instead describes the wine and 220 00:11:49.720 --> 00:11:50.559 talks about it. 221 00:11:50.720 --> 00:11:52.120 And it's kind of like films. 222 00:11:52.639 --> 00:11:55.919 You know, it's much better to not give a film 223 00:11:56.559 --> 00:11:59.639 a rating and listen to a critic that you really like, 224 00:12:00.440 --> 00:12:04.519 And if you have tasted wines that this critic likes 225 00:12:04.559 --> 00:12:06.279 and believe in them, then you can use them as 226 00:12:06.279 --> 00:12:10.080 a guidepost. A good example is Dan Berger. He doesn't 227 00:12:10.080 --> 00:12:13.360 give any scores, but he is very very good at 228 00:12:13.559 --> 00:12:16.759 describing wines and talking about how they're made, and he 229 00:12:16.840 --> 00:12:19.840 researches his notes really thoroughly. Those are the kind of 230 00:12:19.840 --> 00:12:22.240 critics that I really admire. 231 00:12:23.600 --> 00:12:27.360 So as a wine drinker, taking the critic out of it, 232 00:12:28.039 --> 00:12:35.080 red whiter rose, Yes, still are sparkling, Yes, equal opportunist. 233 00:12:35.759 --> 00:12:38.679 It's whatever my wife likes best at that time. She 234 00:12:38.720 --> 00:12:41.679 happens to really love bubbles, and I've made bubbles all 235 00:12:41.720 --> 00:12:43.159 over the world. 236 00:12:43.399 --> 00:12:44.480 But with Marshall. 237 00:12:44.600 --> 00:12:47.879 We started making sparkling wine because she loves sparkling wine. 238 00:12:47.879 --> 00:12:49.799 And it's a sparkling old wine Co Lombard. 239 00:12:50.480 --> 00:12:53.320 Yeah, I mean not your typical but quite delicious because 240 00:12:53.320 --> 00:12:55.399 I've had the pleasure to drink that one as well. 241 00:12:55.480 --> 00:12:58.720 So sparkling co Lombard that you've never heard of? 242 00:12:58.720 --> 00:13:02.759 That no, And in fact Co Lombard is the perfect 243 00:13:02.960 --> 00:13:08.360 grape grown in Sonoma County for sparkling because it never 244 00:13:08.360 --> 00:13:10.519 gets really ripe, It never gets above ten and a 245 00:13:10.559 --> 00:13:14.320 half or eleven percent alcohol, So you pick it at 246 00:13:14.320 --> 00:13:16.559 the end of October just when it is not going 247 00:13:16.600 --> 00:13:19.960 to rot all the help and you can make both 248 00:13:20.799 --> 00:13:23.200 a regular table wine from it, but it's low enough 249 00:13:23.200 --> 00:13:26.600 alcohol that you can do a charge to it and 250 00:13:27.519 --> 00:13:30.720 do a secondary fermentation. 251 00:13:31.120 --> 00:13:32.799 And then your wife loves you. 252 00:13:34.279 --> 00:13:38.399 Well, your wife cooks these great meals for well, she 253 00:13:38.440 --> 00:13:40.799 did cook these great meals for your harvest teams and 254 00:13:40.840 --> 00:13:42.279 such like that. It sounds like she's. 255 00:13:42.120 --> 00:13:42.679 A good cook. 256 00:13:42.960 --> 00:13:45.320 And food probably plays a very important role in what 257 00:13:45.360 --> 00:13:48.440 you do. So how do you pair those combinations of 258 00:13:48.480 --> 00:13:50.919 wine and food? Do you follow rules? Do you think 259 00:13:50.960 --> 00:13:52.759 there are rules people have to follow? You know, the 260 00:13:52.799 --> 00:13:55.720 old saying of white wine and fish, red wine and meat, 261 00:13:55.879 --> 00:13:59.080 or do you have other guidelines that you suggest when 262 00:13:59.360 --> 00:14:01.279 selecting a wine to pair with your food or a 263 00:14:01.320 --> 00:14:02.519 dish to pair with your wine. 264 00:14:03.200 --> 00:14:06.000 Well, I don't really have any guidelines, but someone who 265 00:14:06.039 --> 00:14:09.080 really knows a lot about that is Randy Caparoso, and 266 00:14:09.159 --> 00:14:12.480 he's actually writing a new book right now that goes 267 00:14:12.519 --> 00:14:14.519 over that much more in depth than I ever could. 268 00:14:14.519 --> 00:14:18.240 I'm just good at stuff putting. I'm good at putting 269 00:14:18.240 --> 00:14:20.679 wine into a bottle, not taking it out and pairing 270 00:14:20.720 --> 00:14:22.879 it with food. I tend to leave that more to 271 00:14:23.919 --> 00:14:29.679 Mara my wife, are winemaker Evan and Jackson, who's our 272 00:14:29.720 --> 00:14:33.000 trustee every man. He's really good at food and wine pairings. 273 00:14:33.440 --> 00:14:34.840 I lead that up to the pros. 274 00:14:35.480 --> 00:14:37.440 Do you open up the wine and then let them 275 00:14:37.480 --> 00:14:39.879 pair the food or they pick the food and then 276 00:14:40.159 --> 00:14:41.039 the wine comes later. 277 00:14:41.639 --> 00:14:43.799 We usually have so many different wines that we're opening. 278 00:14:43.879 --> 00:14:45.840 I have been trying out that there's bound to be 279 00:14:45.879 --> 00:14:47.159 something else that goes with them. 280 00:14:47.600 --> 00:14:49.919 And we make so many different kinds of food. 281 00:14:50.080 --> 00:14:52.840 We grow a lot of our own vegetables, we make 282 00:14:52.879 --> 00:14:56.480 our own bread. My wife pretty much makes everything from scratch. 283 00:14:56.840 --> 00:15:00.360 So and there's a lot of food going on around 284 00:15:00.399 --> 00:15:04.000 all the time, and there's always wine. There's always good food, 285 00:15:04.200 --> 00:15:07.200 and we were always finding amazing things to pair with them. 286 00:15:07.360 --> 00:15:09.200 I love that. God, I want to just kind of 287 00:15:09.240 --> 00:15:12.200 hang out here all day. So for somebody who hasn't 288 00:15:12.200 --> 00:15:14.679 had the pleasure to taste your wines yet, what do 289 00:15:14.679 --> 00:15:15.720 you think they're missing out on? 290 00:15:17.240 --> 00:15:20.720 Well, I think I'm best known for mouthfeel, so one 291 00:15:20.759 --> 00:15:22.919 of the threads all of my wines are really different. 292 00:15:23.000 --> 00:15:27.399 So when you taste like a Bien Decito Chardonnay or 293 00:15:27.480 --> 00:15:31.639 a Lorenzo Chardenay, one of my blends, I really want 294 00:15:32.320 --> 00:15:35.279 that particular wine to speak of that particular site. So 295 00:15:36.879 --> 00:15:39.080 if people want to explore my wines, they're going to 296 00:15:39.159 --> 00:15:42.559 explore the different tear war that I do, and they're 297 00:15:42.600 --> 00:15:46.159 also going to explore mouthfeel. I did my postgraduate work 298 00:15:46.200 --> 00:15:49.879 on Helpergundian wine making techniques affect mouthfeel. It was actually 299 00:15:49.919 --> 00:15:52.919 the first person to elucidate mouthfeel and wine. It had 300 00:15:52.960 --> 00:15:55.600 been done in beer and milk before, but not in wine. 301 00:15:56.080 --> 00:15:59.720 So that's kind of my claim to fame is mouthfeel. 302 00:15:59.799 --> 00:16:03.320 And how do you achieve mouthfeel with wine? And how 303 00:16:03.360 --> 00:16:06.360 do you describe that to somebody who may not quite 304 00:16:06.399 --> 00:16:08.080 understand what Mauthfeeld means. 305 00:16:08.679 --> 00:16:12.320 Well, I actually wrote a book on it. Well it's 306 00:16:12.399 --> 00:16:15.279 very so horrific if you have trouble sleeping at night. 307 00:16:15.639 --> 00:16:20.399 But basically, mouthfeel is the presentation of how a wine 308 00:16:21.039 --> 00:16:24.440 feels in your mouth and how the flavor persists after 309 00:16:24.919 --> 00:16:30.200 the wine is swallowed or expectorated. And it involves things 310 00:16:30.320 --> 00:16:35.000 like viscosity, salivatory response, and how much salivation you have, 311 00:16:35.960 --> 00:16:44.919 fruit characters, late palette, temporal aspect. So it's quite complex, 312 00:16:46.559 --> 00:16:49.759 but it's all about how the wine tastes in your mouth. Actually, 313 00:16:49.840 --> 00:16:51.600 So that's probably the best way to put it. 314 00:16:52.360 --> 00:16:54.879 And so if space aliens were to land on your 315 00:16:54.879 --> 00:16:57.960 property right now, walk on over here, which of your 316 00:16:57.960 --> 00:16:59.960 wines would you say, Welcome to Marrow? 317 00:17:01.639 --> 00:17:04.720 Oh boy, I'd probably say the Pino mine that's done 318 00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:09.119 carbonic maceration, because it's very light in color. It's a 319 00:17:09.160 --> 00:17:12.920 light red, very pretty color, but it packs a lot 320 00:17:12.960 --> 00:17:15.839 of mouthfeel. It just fills your mouth up with flavors 321 00:17:16.160 --> 00:17:20.799 and persists a long time. And I think I wouldn't 322 00:17:20.799 --> 00:17:26.440 want to spoil my extraterrestrial friends on some big ass 323 00:17:26.559 --> 00:17:28.079 Cabernet or something like that. 324 00:17:28.480 --> 00:17:30.160 You don't make that kind of stuff, do you. 325 00:17:31.240 --> 00:17:31.640 I do. 326 00:17:32.000 --> 00:17:33.799 I've made a lot of cabernets over the years, and 327 00:17:33.839 --> 00:17:36.039 I still consult a little bit in the Napa Valley. 328 00:17:36.880 --> 00:17:40.960 But and I'd like making cabernet too, But really my 329 00:17:41.079 --> 00:17:44.400 favorites to make are these ancient vines and pino and chardonnay, 330 00:17:44.599 --> 00:17:46.599 and the pino mignet has been a real delight from 331 00:17:46.599 --> 00:17:48.839 the Vandercamp vineyard is just one of the best places 332 00:17:48.839 --> 00:17:50.279 in the world to grow pino mine. 333 00:17:52.519 --> 00:17:55.680 So we're sitting here in your vineyard. You have three 334 00:17:56.000 --> 00:17:59.720 point three three acres of pino and shard and then 335 00:17:59.799 --> 00:18:03.759 of courser sourcing fruit. You've worked around the world, You've 336 00:18:03.759 --> 00:18:06.400 worked for sixty nine harvests, are coming up on sixty 337 00:18:06.519 --> 00:18:09.359 nine harvests, and we know that every vintage tells a 338 00:18:09.359 --> 00:18:12.839 different story. In your experience, especially in a place like this, 339 00:18:13.039 --> 00:18:15.279 do you see more variation from year to year? Do 340 00:18:15.279 --> 00:18:18.000 you see more commonality? Have you what is your sort 341 00:18:18.039 --> 00:18:20.599 of assessment of looking at vintage variation? 342 00:18:21.559 --> 00:18:23.599 Well, when I've worked for big companies, and I work 343 00:18:23.640 --> 00:18:27.079 for big and small, you look for sameness. You try 344 00:18:27.079 --> 00:18:29.599 to have a product that from year to year is 345 00:18:29.680 --> 00:18:33.039 very reliable, and that's not a bad thing. But for 346 00:18:33.200 --> 00:18:35.799 my own wines, which I make in very small quantities, 347 00:18:35.880 --> 00:18:39.519 like two to four barrels for each lot, I am 348 00:18:39.599 --> 00:18:42.559 looking for a story that's being told for each vintage 349 00:18:42.599 --> 00:18:45.559 and for each block of wine. And for instance, where 350 00:18:45.599 --> 00:18:48.119 we are right now, we've gone through some big swings. 351 00:18:48.200 --> 00:18:51.599 We've had three years of drought, which was very, very 352 00:18:51.680 --> 00:18:53.960 different than the last two years of copious water. 353 00:18:54.359 --> 00:18:55.119 And I want my. 354 00:18:55.160 --> 00:19:00.400 Vines to tell the story of the year as well 355 00:19:00.440 --> 00:19:02.079 as of the plot of land. I don't want them 356 00:19:02.119 --> 00:19:03.960 to be the same, but there are there are There 357 00:19:03.960 --> 00:19:08.079 are similarities that you find through these things. Like the 358 00:19:08.119 --> 00:19:12.400 Lorenzo Chardonnay has almost an oiliness to it. It's it's 359 00:19:12.480 --> 00:19:16.519 almost very viscous. The Haikup Vineyard has a really great 360 00:19:17.160 --> 00:19:21.960 single thread of vicinity running into it, and they can't 361 00:19:22.400 --> 00:19:25.759 you couldn't have different wines than those two. And you 362 00:19:25.880 --> 00:19:28.440 got to taste the Haikup from the barrel and then 363 00:19:28.480 --> 00:19:30.839 the Lorenzo so ah. 364 00:19:30.880 --> 00:19:34.000 And so are there any sort of signs or predictors 365 00:19:34.000 --> 00:19:35.720 that you look for that are going to tell you 366 00:19:35.880 --> 00:19:37.000 what a vintage is going to be? 367 00:19:38.799 --> 00:19:40.400 No, not particularly. 368 00:19:40.720 --> 00:19:42.960 I kind of take it all in as it comes, 369 00:19:43.200 --> 00:19:46.319 and I take each vintage as it has. Of course, 370 00:19:46.720 --> 00:19:50.359 you do look at the upcoming weather. You take a 371 00:19:50.359 --> 00:19:52.519 look at whether or not you're going to have a 372 00:19:52.599 --> 00:19:55.519 drought year. That's going to affect how you prune your vines, 373 00:19:56.079 --> 00:20:00.000 and we do prune differently. We do a vine has 374 00:20:00.079 --> 00:20:05.119 been throughout the year differently with different vintages. An example 375 00:20:05.200 --> 00:20:09.480 is three years ago when we were in drought. We 376 00:20:09.519 --> 00:20:13.440 actually had a freak rain right at bloom and normally 377 00:20:13.440 --> 00:20:15.960 I would pull my leaves right around bloom to create 378 00:20:15.960 --> 00:20:19.240 a little bit of shatter and make an open cluster architecture. 379 00:20:19.480 --> 00:20:21.799 But with the rain, I knew that that was already 380 00:20:21.799 --> 00:20:24.119 going to create shatter and if I pulled leaves at 381 00:20:24.119 --> 00:20:24.920 that time. 382 00:20:25.240 --> 00:20:26.759 I would have very little crop. 383 00:20:26.920 --> 00:20:30.440 So we pulled leaves after the rains changed, and that 384 00:20:30.519 --> 00:20:32.319 changed the character of the wine. 385 00:20:32.559 --> 00:20:34.799 So you have to adapt with mother nature and kind 386 00:20:34.839 --> 00:20:37.920 of go with the flow in what you do instead 387 00:20:37.920 --> 00:20:40.960 of predicting something and then walking away. 388 00:20:41.720 --> 00:20:46.319 Yes, Mother Nature is who we should really be listening to. 389 00:20:46.759 --> 00:20:52.680 And our job as winemakers is to translate the speech 390 00:20:52.720 --> 00:20:55.720 of the land into the glass. And it's a great 391 00:20:56.319 --> 00:20:59.200 honor and it's a privilege to be able to do that. 392 00:21:00.039 --> 00:21:02.160 And I think in order to be able to make 393 00:21:02.160 --> 00:21:06.599 that translation, you have to first really listen to the land, 394 00:21:06.880 --> 00:21:10.160 Listen to the grapes, hear what they have to say. 395 00:21:10.200 --> 00:21:16.240 And because the speech of the land is more powerful 396 00:21:16.240 --> 00:21:17.920 than any of us, I'm going to be dust in 397 00:21:17.960 --> 00:21:21.079 the wind in a few years. But the voice of 398 00:21:21.119 --> 00:21:23.759 the land is eternal. The rocks, the sun, the wind, 399 00:21:23.920 --> 00:21:27.599 the rain. And who am I to add even a 400 00:21:27.720 --> 00:21:32.079 letter to the voice of the land without first sitting 401 00:21:32.119 --> 00:21:35.799