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Speaker 1: Hey, it was a going welcome to cleeve to and

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tick what do you? My name is Ben and I

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am joined by the one, the only Jay Dyer.

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Speaker 2: What's going on? Brother? What's up? Man? Glad to be back.

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Whether you had a great time at the conference in

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the soupro with you and glad to be back on

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your channel.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, man, that was a great time. Are you going

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to do the conference again next year?

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Speaker 2: I would imagine. So, of course it's up to Father Vladimir,

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but my assumption is that he would he would probably

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want to do it, and he'd probably want to try

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to expand it. I know Neil's really hyped about expanding

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it to maybe get instead of two hundred people, maybe

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getting three, four or five hundred people. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that there was a lot of people at this

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last conference. I was telling I was telling my wife,

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I'm like, you should have came, because I got her

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a ticket to go anyway, but she ends up having

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to work because she's getting a promotion, so she's like

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locked in right now. But I was like, I could

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have convinced her that I was actually famous, because a

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bunch of people came up and like, hey, you're cleave,

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you know, it's like I got a trickter Man. You

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don't get that anywhere else except for like the world.

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But it was a good time, man. But thanks for

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coming on the show. This will be an interesting talk,

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kind of a little bit controversial, but I think good

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info stuff that nobody's really talking about. It's kind of

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shocking to me. I feel like people don't really know

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the geopolitical backdrop to what is going on. This is

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all kind of just coming out of the blue for

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a lot of people. So I'm excited to have this

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discussion for sure.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for having me on, man. Yea, I love to

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talk about this topic. It's It's one that I've covered

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for a long time and I don't really I never

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shy away from it. But you're right, it is kind

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of controversial, and hopefully we can bring some clarity and

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some insight. I approach it not as a conspiracy thereist,

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but as somebody you know that really tries to get

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into the actual geopolitical texts and the history. And we've

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done many interviews with experts and special us even in

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this field. We've done interviews with my buddy Mark Hackert,

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who's serbing Orthodox guy, and he's a Russia analyst. He

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did his grad work on history of Russia and Russian

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language studies, so he's done a lot of really deep

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research into old KGB texts that were only recently translated.

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And then we did an interview some years back with

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Metropolitan Jonah on the history of the Russian Church because

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that's an area that he also knows quite a bit in.

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And then of course Jim Jottras as well. We've done

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many many interviews going back six seven years with Jim.

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So I apologize, I'm a little bit still congested and sick,

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but we'll make it work. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely, I saw that interview with Metropolitan Jonah.

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Speaker 2: It was very good.

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Speaker 1: So there's a lot of things that have happened in

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the past year. So we have now an American pope,

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We've got the anti Russian pro EP narrative that is

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emerging in the United States. As far as we saw

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this with that one representative that was posting Wilson, Yeah, Rep.

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Joe Wilson that was posting basically a kind of dialectic.

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He was like, look, these are the two versions of Orthodoxy.

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And then you have the the EP, which is like,

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you know, this is the nice uh you know, kind

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of Americanized or more amenimal to American values Orthodoxy, and

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then you've got all the wicked, evil Russian you know, Orthodox.

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This is kind of dialectic that's emerging. You see it

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also some of the prep work kind of taking place

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right now. We see in the Greek Orthodox Argidiocese right

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now they're fighting for control of parishes financially. Jim johntriss

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I was posting about this not that long ago, with

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that fight with the one parish in New York City

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where LP de Forrest was fighting for control of the

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finances over that particular parish. They actually gave them alone

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to be able to take control of that. So, you know,

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it's kind of angling up. From my perspective, it seems

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like all of the leg work, the groundwork is being

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laid so that later on, if there is any kind

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of descent, it would make it near and possible for

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anybody that would disagree with any kind of union there.

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But a lot that's happened in this year. I think

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maybe a good part to start with would be the

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historical geopolitical backdrop that kind of underpins all of this.

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This is one thing that you talk about quite a bit,

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but maybe a good place to start with would be

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Operation Claudia. We could talk about the Roman Catholic side

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and then move into maybe some of the similar geopolitical

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ties and the EP.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, one little anecdote story before we get into that.

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I remember when I first came into Orthodoxy and was

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meeting with some of the first clergy and the first

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bishop that I met. We went to dinner, and I

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didn't think much of this at the time, but I

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mentioned in passing that I had begun doing quite a

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bit of social media and an alternative media type stuff

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and I was really putting information. And this may have

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been twenty sixteen seventeen, this was almost ten years ago.

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Many of the clergy perked up when I said that

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I had done an interview with Alexander Dugan. They were

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very alert and concerned that do we have a Duga

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night here that's going to be entering into and infesting

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the church with these errors or something. And you know,

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it's funny because that all came about just because I

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merely by sending a DM. And what I think a

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lot of people don't realize is that when people want

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to promote a book, if somebody's having a new book

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put out. They're pretty accessible when it comes to doing interviews.

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And I didn't have a very big channel ten years

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ago or a podcast. It was kind of a you know,

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small to mid tier outlet relatively speaking. And the first

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time I sent the email or the message on Facebook,

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I didn't hear back from Dugan for about a year,

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and then a year later, around twenty fifteen sixteen, he

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replied and we did a podcast, and that was right

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when twenty sixteen, Russia Gate, Trump, all of that was

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beginning to kick off. I had not yet been on

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a Jones's show, but Alex had Dugan on. It became

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a huge controversy back then, in twenty sixteen or whatever,

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because now they were trying to portray Alex, who at

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that time was early very pro Trump, you know, pushing

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the Trump Maga line. Back then, they were trying to say, well,

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he's a Russian agent. So I was kind of being

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inadvertently adjacently lumped into Russian agent even from the very

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earliest days of me coming into orthodoxy back at that time.

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And it was a difficult situation because it wasn't just that,

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it was also you know, I had some of these

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other controversial positions and takes, and I would also do

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podcasts on the relationship between intelligence agencies in geo's think

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tanks and the Church as a form of soft power.

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So I think from the outset for me, this has

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kind of been an immediate problem, more struggle with being

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in the world of orthodoxy, and it did obviously contribute to,

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you know, why I ended up ultimately out of ro

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Corp Church. But people should understand too that contrary to

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representative Joe Wilson, rope Corps is pretty much independent. It's

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in communion with the Moscow patriarchy, but Moscow patriarchy doesn't

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like tell us everything to do or whatever, so there's

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quite a bit of independence and freedom to you know,

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disagree with this or that policy, or this or that

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geopolitical stance. So a lot of this is I think

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built on Boomer era people with Cold War era mindsets

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and misconceptions about where we are now today, what the

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concerns are now today. Someone like Joe Wilson, I think,

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considers this sort of a you know, hold over the

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Russians or the bad people. But just think about the

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failure of the Russia Gate narrative and the Russia collusion

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narrative with Trump, I said day one a manute video

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in twenty seventeen calling it out as fake. Eventually I

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was totally vindicated in that analysis because it was all

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cooked up by British intelligence and Christopher Steele, the Steele dossier,

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et cetera out of the UK as a targeted political situation.

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Now that doesn't mean I'm wholesale behind everything Trump does.

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I have plenty of criticisms of Trump, and I've always

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had those criticisms from day one, But definitely the Russia

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collusion narrative was concocted and was obviously part of a

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kind of a psychological warfare political campaign. So to bring

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that full circle back to Gladio, maybe before getting into

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the Gladio, you know, I rambled quite a bit there.

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If you have anything to say on that, it's your show,

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I'll let you out, let you reply. But suffice to say,

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like Dugan, I think is a very marginal kind of figure.

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I don't really think he has that much influence and power.

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I think that, you know, he's got a lot of

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these kind of fringy type of views, and even from

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the first time I did that inner with Dugan. It

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was when his book Fourth Political Theory came out. I

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read the book and had significant disagreements with the last chapter.

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The last chapter was very gnostic. I don't know that Eurasianism,

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where Islam and Christianity unite in some sort of cultural,

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you know, war against Western liberalism. I don't really think

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that's very feasible. So I've never really been totally on

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board with that stuff. I just as a person coming

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out of academia, I read a lot of geopolitical stuff.

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I read all the you know, big guys like Brazienski, Kissinger,

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jack Out to Lee. So it seemed natural to me

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to read somebody like a Dugan and try to have

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a conversation. But you know, so a lot of people

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will just sort of draw conclusions from merely talking to

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somebody who or doing an interview, even if you stress

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all the areas where you disagree. That's kind of died

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away though. That was a significant criticism ten years ago,

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but we're still sort of lingering in. As you noted,

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I think this era of this older generation of people

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that are Americanized in the Orthodox Church specifically, and Americanism

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is first and foremost above Orthodoxy. I've seen this, you know,

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since I came in, and it's more important for them

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to be an Americanist or to hold to the Enlightenment

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ideals of Americanism than traditional Orthodox ideas. I think that

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the solution is the other way around. Orthodoxy should come first,

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the ethos of Orthodoxy, and then we judge that we

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judge Americanism through that right, not the other way around.

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So I think that's a big part of the picture here,

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and that's not to cast dispersions on all boomers. Of course,

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there's many great, great boomers in the Orthodox world. My

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godfather Dean Arnold, love him to death. Jim Jatras, great dude,

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love him to death. So there's plenty of great you know,

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baby boomers. But before we get to Gladio, I'm sorry.

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I'll let you reply here to any of that if

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you want to.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, No, I think I think you brought up a

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very important point when you're talking about this kind of

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like Cold War dialectic, because it's really where a lot

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of this starts, with some of these geopolitical ties into

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both camps. Because really what we're going to be focusing

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on and discussing we'll probably branch out into some other topics,

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But is the geopolitical ties between the Roman Catholic Church

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and then also within the EP that could potentially influence

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them into some sort of union in the future. Now

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we're not saying this is like an imminent thing, like

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this is going to happen. Now, let's all panic. So

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I don't think that's the case. Usually it's about two

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steps forward, one step back, so on and so forth.

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It's we're going to make you know the statements to

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the opposition. But what I would like to examine today,

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I guess is some of the geopolitical backdrop. I've got

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a lot of information I've reported on this for quite

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some time regarding some of the geopolitical ties of the EP,

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specifically during the time of the Cold War, which is actually,

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interestingly enough, the same time that these same geopolitical ties

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kind of present themselves into the Roman Catholic Church. Now,

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I know you're not. You don't necessarily think Freemasonry has

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a big impact today, But at the time this was happening,

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they kind of did play intermediate between some of these

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major geopolitical powers, and as you were saying, they were

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trying to make inroads to assert soft power using these institutions,

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and you really have to realize the kind of dialectic there.

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Once they have the inroads into the Roman Catholic Church,

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they you know, they have some standing within Europe, but

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then you look at the East, well, what's going on there.

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They're trying to push back against Soviet power, so they

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need to get their foothold where they can and where

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they tried to do that was basically within the ecumenical patriarchy,

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which we'll talk about in a little bit.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. I mean, I think you're right to point

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to both sectors here, both Orthodoxy and you know, the

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Roman Catholic world would definitely play huge roles in the

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Cold War, and also the evangelical world too. We can't

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forget that even figures like Billy Graham were discussed by

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the CIA as figures that could be kind of mouthpieces

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for Western Theism, Evangelical Christianity, et cetera, also being crucial

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forms of self power. And to bring that to the

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present day, you can even see that in the Ukraine today.

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In fact, the CIA State Department put a lot of

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in a lot of money and support behind a lot

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of charismatic groups, believe it or not in the Ukraine

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because charismaticism humanism, because ultimately it has its roots and

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being kind of a Western geopolitical project, it would play

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a key role in helping to dislodge and break up

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the Orthodox ethos that existed in the Ukraine so that

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they can want and more easily sort of split the

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country and move it into the under the sphere of

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Western influence of the Anglo powers, so to speak. But yeah,

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to bring in the Roman Catholic world. And I think

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the Roman Catholic world is easier to see in this

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regard because the papacy is such a focal point for

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that whole, for the West, in Christianity in general, and

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you know, for the Roman Communion, when the papacy changes

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or does something significant in this way, everyone can see it.

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So when we have a massive change in the doctrine

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or the theology or the ethos of Vatican two, for example,

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with the humanism and whatnot, we might be tended to

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think that there's only theology nerds behind this. But in reality,

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as I was when I was a tradcat, especially the

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more I got into the history of the Church and

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geopolitics and studying espionage. Even in grad school, I started

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to realize that no, actually, uh, there's other factors at play.

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There are geopolitical power block interests that definitely wants to see.

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I mean, if you were the state, imagine yourself as

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a ruler president, You're you're at the CIA of the

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state department. Wouldn't you want a powerful institution like the

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Vatican with almost a billion adherents back then that could

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turn this whole engine right towards the West. That's a huge,

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tremendous entity. And so now it's just natural to power

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struggles and power relations that you would want that. But

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it was the same for the Soviets. The Soviets also

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had many programs that targeted Catholic clergy, targeted the Vatican.

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They had spies in the Vatican. In fact, there's actually

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a good book by a CIA guy that we covered

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on my channel. His name is Eric kaylor k O

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e h l E R. And I think he's a

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writer used to be in the CIA, and then he's

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a writer post CIA about espionage topics and espionage history.

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He wrote a book about the Soviet spies and the Vatican,

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and I recommend that book because it's from the establishment,

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basically saying, yeah, this is what the CIA was involved in. Yeah,

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this is why Gladio, you know, was kind of necessary.

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But I also recommend people read the appraisals of Gladio too.

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Like Paul Williams is a Catholic writer, and he's kind

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of the opposite of the Paul Kayler perspective where he

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writes a book saying this is really a signifier of

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high level corruption in the Vatican and particularly in the

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Church in Italy. So the focus of Operation Gladio was

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what's called stay behind units where they would train people

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who are sort of black ops, guys, sabotage guys, assassins,

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you name it, to be able to engage in radical

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big T type actions should there be a Soviet NKVD

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Stalinist invasion of Europe. So the justification was the Cold

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War necessitates this kind of of an emergency scenario in

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the case of you know, Russia expanding into Europe. And

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so I think to be nuanced, you know, we can

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understand why people would think that way. So this is

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not about a good guy bad guy thing. Okay, we're

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not saying everybody on this side is bad or whatever

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in the calogy Church. I understand the modus operanda and

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why they would have thought this way. The problem is

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that when you allow yourself to make these big level

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alliances with introduced like the Central Intelligence Agency or the

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Soviets as well, you're then kind of in bed with

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and you're kind of locked into a relationship. It's very

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difficult to untangle from and with Gladio. It's not just

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about these cells that were trained to do stay behind

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big t events and assassinations. It also ends up being

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high level money laundering and weapons trafficking, banking, you name it,

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at the level of the Vatican Bank, all sort of

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masterminded by people like William Colby, Alan Dulles, cord Meyer,

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other famous socioperatives, and probably most famously James Jesus Angleton,

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who was I think at the Rome, the CIA desk

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in Rome before Colby was. And you know, Colby was

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interesting too because he's he's a tragic figure in that

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he was this key cold warrior guy, very involved in

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setting up the relationship between the CIA and Pius the

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Twelfth's Vatican Bank, and then he ends up after many

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years of being a traditional Latin Latin mass attending Catholic

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he just disappears one day on his boat. So this

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is the problem that even if you serve these system

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and these guys, you're still very disposable. And that's what

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you have to understand, I think, is that this is

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not the domain of people acting ethically and fair and morally,

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and they don't care about set aside your concern for theology,

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spurgism and accuracy. This is about power relations, this is

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about compromise, blackmail. It's Epstein type stuff. And I think

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that just to kind of put a cap on this,

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the most shocking thing probably about the Gladio stuff was

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when it pertained to and this came out in the

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Italian press, by the way, when it when it pertained

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to the clergy. It reached all the way up to

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the cardinals in Italy, and many of them had been

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compromised through figures connected to organized crime like Michelsondona and

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Leccio Gelli, who was the partisan of many of the

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P two lodges. And these these were sort of weird

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Masonic lodges that weren't communistic, they were actually fascists. So

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there were some of these lodges that were left over

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after Mussolini because Mussolini had appeared where he persecuted and

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tried to get rid of freemasonry, didn't get rid of

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all of them because some of these lodges that remained were

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actually pro Mussolini. So there was a handful of these

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P two lodges that they're called propaganda duet is what

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that stands for, and they they were utilized by the

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CIA via according to Williams Henry Kissinger, So Kissinger seems

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to be according to to Williams and another guy who

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wrote a PhD thesis on this, Daniel Ganzer wrote on

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NATO's Secret Armies. Again, these are not conspiracy books. This

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is an academic text. So what people understand that what

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I'm citing for you today and books like Michael Gratziano's

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book Aaron into the Wilderness of Cia and Religion, these

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aren't conspiracy texts. These are out of the world of academia.

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So they're much more credible and sourced than you know,

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David Iike's theories about what happened. Right, So anyway, long

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story short, they had compromised many of the clergy in

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what we're called bunga bunga parties. And if you doubt

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me on this, go look up. Even back to twenty twelve,

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you can still find on YouTube CNN interviews and news

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reports from people like Anderson Cooper and others talking about

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the Bunga Bunga parties that Silvio Berlusconi was involved in.

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And these are really just o rgies that included high

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level politicians. It's basically o'bsteine type stuff, right, And that

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was going on, according to Williams even at the time

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of the late sixties and seventies as part of Gladio

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to ensure that people would be on the right side,

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so to speak.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, there was a lot of fallout from from the

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Operation Gladio stuff. I know, the Vatican Bank was almost

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to the point of bankruptcy at one point when the

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P two lodge infiltrated and basically caused a collapse of

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Banco and Brosiano. This was released in the Italian press

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during that time, I think around the I think that

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was in the seventies that that was released as well,

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so it was a little later on. But what a

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lot of people they hear all of this stuff and

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maybe they're not able to process it. They think they

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hear Freemasonry, they hear the CIA, they hear the Roman

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Catholic Church collusion. It's like, oh, this is you know,

385
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conspiracy theory stuff. But how do these things all tie in?

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I mean, just look at the founding of the United

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States of America. We've had free Masonic ties since the

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very beginning. Our George Washington, first president, was a prolific Freemason.

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In one of his letters that he wrote immediately after

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he was elected, he basically wrote back to his lodge

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and he said, I will always serve the interest of

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the lodge by which I am a member, or in

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which I'm a member of. So these ties are very

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They're very deep, and what they basically have done throughout

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history has played the role of power broker. And we

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see this in several different theaters. We see this not

397
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only within Gladio. We also see this around the same

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time during the Cold War. They're very active. We see

399
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them playing the role of power broker between the OSS

400
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and the soon to be ecumenical patriarch Ethnogorus. So I

401
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think that might be a good segue to talk about that.

402
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I have a lot of information on that particular topic.

403
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I could share a little bit then if you want

404
00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:55,200
to dive into it. So again, not conspiracy texts. I'm

405
00:22:55,200 --> 00:22:56,640
just going to share my screen just so you can

406
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see where I'm pulling this from. So this is I'm

407
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going to be citing from public. These are CIA documents

408
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that were made public. This was posted on Orthodox History,

409
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which is the gentleman Matthew name, who actually has been

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on several different shows. He was on Ancient Faith back

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in the day, but he published this whole thing, which

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is kind of surprising because they're you know, kind of

413
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a little more I don't know tame on some of

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this stuff.

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Speaker 2: But he well, I will say this. I mean, I'm

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not nothing about him person or anything like that. But

417
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when I talked about these topics ten years ago, you're

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not supposed to talk about this, right, I got called

419
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every name in the book. So I consider it a

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blessing and thank god that people are, you know, discussing

421
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this stuff now ten years later.

422
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Speaker 1: Absolutely. Yeah, it's very it's very interesting. This is certainly

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a controversial topic, but I feel like it needs to

424
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be discussed because what I've what I've realized, it's a

425
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bit of a blessing for me because I've been reporting

426
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on this for so long that going into the Orthodox Church,

427
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I'm not going to be scandalized when I see these

428
00:24:03,519 --> 00:24:05,880
things pop up. I'm already prepared. I'm able to see that.

429
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So I think it's good that we don't shy away

430
00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:10,880
from this stuff. We just we have to tell people

431
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kind of what the history was. So absolutely right at

432
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one point on that Cleve. I think you're so right

433
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on that.

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Speaker 2: And the reason that it might as well just be

435
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addressed is because even if we were to try to

436
00:24:23,599 --> 00:24:26,440
take some sort of practical, pragmatic approach that it's not

437
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worth addressing these things. Let's just kind of show it away.

438
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Somebody's going to bring it up, Yes, and if somebody.

439
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We're in the age now where everything basically just makes

440
00:24:36,559 --> 00:24:38,200
it on the Twitter, whether we like it or not.

441
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So given that reality, we might as well address it.

442
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If it's the nineteen nineties, I understand not really making

443
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that public. It's not that relevant to the laity. They

444
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don't need it doesn't matter. But we're not in the

445
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nineteen nineties. We're in twenty twenty five. We're in Buck Rogers.

446
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Everything's going to be potentially out there now, so we

447
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might as well address it.

448
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Speaker 1: Absolutely. Yeah, I think it's something that needs to be addressed.

449
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But one of the beauties about the Orthodox Church is

450
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that we have a conciler, your church governance system, so

451
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that kind of protects us from a lot of the stuff.

452
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Even if there were to be somebody who was maybe

453
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influenced by state actors, so on and so forth, it's

454
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not the end of Orthodoxy. We've seen this several times

455
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throughout church history where the patriarchy Constantinople has been in

456
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the past a heretic, So I mean it's not an

457
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ender for our system.

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Speaker 2: And also the state as an entity trying to control

459
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for installed bishops, right, it's not everybody knows about KGB bishops,

460
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KVD bishops. We've all heard this coming out of the

461
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cold warm but people forget that there were Aryan emperors

462
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that tried to install and control the church with Aryan

463
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priests and bishops. There were iconoclass emperors that try to

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control and steer the church. And one evidence I think

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that the church is the true church is that if

466
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those emperors couldn't turn the church into some big heresy factory,

467
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it's the true church because they tried everything to do.

468
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Speaker 1: So all right, I'm gonna go ahead and share my

469
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screen and I'm just gonna dive through some of these

470
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documents here in this article that was actually very very good.

471
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This is on Orthodox history. This is Matthew nameI was.

472
00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:17,039
I was the author of this article here. So this

473
00:26:17,119 --> 00:26:19,599
is a statement from the Greek archbishop at the time

474
00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:23,880
soon to be ecumenical patriarch Ethenogoris. This was the Greek

475
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:27,480
archbishop to the protos Cia. Basically the OSS, your directions

476
00:26:27,519 --> 00:26:30,920
will be executed faithfully. This was a public letter that

477
00:26:31,039 --> 00:26:33,359
was released. So I'm gonna go ahead and I'll just

478
00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:35,759
I'll read the pertinent citation here and then I'm gonna

479
00:26:35,799 --> 00:26:38,920
jump into part two of his article here. So in

480
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:41,440
an OSS, I'm gonna zoom in so you can actually

481
00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:45,680
read this. In an OSS Enter Office memo dated March

482
00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:49,359
twenty sixth, nineteen forty two, an intelligence agent named Julius

483
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:53,039
l Amos wrote to his fellow OSS agent named David

484
00:26:53,079 --> 00:26:56,680
Burns's familiar name for some people here. The archbishop was

485
00:26:56,799 --> 00:26:59,759
extremely pleased at having met and lunched with you. He

486
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:03,319
told me that the entire facilities of his organization are

487
00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:06,359
at our disposal. He puts it in these words, I

488
00:27:06,440 --> 00:27:09,960
have three bishops, three hundred priests in a large and

489
00:27:10,079 --> 00:27:14,480
far flung organization. Everyone under my order is under yours.

490
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:17,720
You may command them for any service you require. There

491
00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:20,119
will be no questions asked, and your directions will be

492
00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:23,720
executed faithfully. Please tell mister Burns for me that this

493
00:27:23,759 --> 00:27:26,440
is so. So the context of this letter is we

494
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:29,319
are in the heat of the basically what's ramping up

495
00:27:29,359 --> 00:27:33,920
to be the Cold War. The then soon to be

496
00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:39,400
Patriarch Athenagoras, he's now archbishop, is basically writing back and

497
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:42,519
forth between the oss letting him know that his people

498
00:27:42,599 --> 00:27:46,240
are at his disposal whatever can serve the United States

499
00:27:46,319 --> 00:27:48,680
cause at the time when they were kind of a

500
00:27:48,799 --> 00:27:53,160
conflict with the Russians. And here's a picture after this

501
00:27:53,279 --> 00:27:56,039
is right before he has made ecumenical patriarch, President Truman

502
00:27:56,079 --> 00:28:00,799
and Archbishop Athenogoras basically meetings, you know, kissing the President's

503
00:28:00,839 --> 00:28:03,960
head here. So the more I guess, so this is

504
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:07,279
a very shocking statement. He's basically just plunging his undying

505
00:28:07,319 --> 00:28:10,079
support for an intelligence agency.

506
00:28:10,599 --> 00:28:14,079
Speaker 2: So now can I add to that real quick? And

507
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:15,880
I want to steal your thunder because I want you

508
00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:17,400
to go through this article as much as you want,

509
00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:21,559
but this is very relevant to accumenism because Athenagoras is

510
00:28:21,599 --> 00:28:24,400
precisely the patriarch that meets with Paul the Six to

511
00:28:24,519 --> 00:28:28,279
announce that we're all one church again, there's no more

512
00:28:28,319 --> 00:28:33,720
anathemas supposedly, and we can try to move towards reunion.

513
00:28:34,359 --> 00:28:37,200
That's the famous, you know, meeting between the Athenagoras and

514
00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:39,880
Paul the Six. But if we know the history of

515
00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:41,599
Paul the Six, and I know quite a bit about

516
00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:44,240
him from being a trad cat for many years, Paul

517
00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:48,440
the Six was also helped to come into office by

518
00:28:48,519 --> 00:28:52,599
the CIA, and that comes from many Catholic writers, not

519
00:28:52,759 --> 00:28:55,759
just critics like Paul Williams, but even John Kaylor in

520
00:28:55,799 --> 00:28:59,319
his book admits that the CIA was very nervous about

521
00:28:59,519 --> 00:29:03,079
the overtures that John the twenty third gave to the Soviets.

522
00:29:03,519 --> 00:29:05,519
John the twenty third was beginning to do these really

523
00:29:06,319 --> 00:29:11,880
suspicious sort of ecumenical parties and actions and celebrations. This

524
00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:15,319
has discussed in Xavier Wren's book on him. And then

525
00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:20,559
I'm about a continue, i should say, And then he

526
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:25,319
had these this idea that the Soviets weren't that bad

527
00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:28,079
and that perhaps we could have this open sort of

528
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:35,240
ajornamento he called it, and reprochemont Perhaps. This really worried

529
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:37,400
a lot of people in the CAA, and so they

530
00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:40,920
wanted to be sure that the next person coming in

531
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:44,480
would be on board. And so they actually met with

532
00:29:44,559 --> 00:29:49,039
Montini before he became pope and they basically said, Kissinger

533
00:29:49,079 --> 00:29:50,839
wants you. We're going to make sure that it's you

534
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:55,640
to be clear that we don't get into anything dealing

535
00:29:55,680 --> 00:29:58,079
with the Vatican Bank. Now there's a lot of drag

536
00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:00,640
cats that have what's called the Serie thesis, Cardinal SyRI

537
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:02,799
and all this, but whatever is going on with the

538
00:30:02,839 --> 00:30:06,960
Serie thesis and Cardinal Siri, they were concerned that when

539
00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:09,839
he was elected, when he was he was considered a

540
00:30:09,839 --> 00:30:13,240
potential electee, he was gonna look into the Vatican Bank.

541
00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:16,920
John Paul the first this is another reason that he died,

542
00:30:17,440 --> 00:30:20,680
most likely was also interested in looking at the Vatican Bank.

543
00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:24,000
So this touch is directly on Gladio p two and

544
00:30:24,039 --> 00:30:27,119
the CIA connection to the Vatican Vatican Bank. Because as

545
00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:30,160
I mentioned with William Colby, it's Colby that initially helped

546
00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:34,599
set up the first sixty five million dollar loan from

547
00:30:34,599 --> 00:30:37,160
the DOSS or from the CIA should say, to the

548
00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:39,880
Vatican Bank in nineteen forty seven. So there's this long

549
00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:42,680
standing relationship again going back to Pis the twelfth Arab

550
00:30:43,359 --> 00:30:47,680
and that can't be touched or messed with. At the

551
00:30:47,759 --> 00:30:51,319
same time, the CIA believes and this is actually not

552
00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:54,319
just from all the histories of accumunism that you could read,

553
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:58,240
including the David Wimhoff book. But even though I didn't

554
00:30:58,279 --> 00:31:01,400
expect this when I read the Grazziano tech that when

555
00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:04,240
he talks about ecumenism, he speaks of it as something

556
00:31:04,279 --> 00:31:07,720
that the OSS and CA were absolutely supportive of. They

557
00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:10,319
were huge supporters of ecumenism because they felt like if

558
00:31:10,319 --> 00:31:14,079
they could get Paul the six and Athenagorus together, if

559
00:31:14,119 --> 00:31:17,440
they could reunite the church in this sort of new

560
00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:22,119
ecumenist movement, this would be a powerful force against Sovietism

561
00:31:22,119 --> 00:31:24,039
and the Cold War. Yep.

562
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:29,960
Speaker 1: Absolutely, yeah, that was kind of you see that ramping

563
00:31:30,039 --> 00:31:32,319
up now in the political discourse. They're trying to drive

564
00:31:32,319 --> 00:31:36,359
this dialectic between Russian Orthodoxy and this kind of americanized

565
00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:38,799
ecumenical patriarch at Orthodoxy, and they're trying to make this

566
00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:42,519
dialectic very clear, and you see people like Rep. Joe

567
00:31:42,559 --> 00:31:48,920
Wilson publicly calling for investigations of Rocorps churches, so on

568
00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:51,880
and so forth. So this is still happening today, and

569
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:55,640
there's no it's not a coincidence that these meetings and

570
00:31:55,799 --> 00:31:57,880
all of these things that are circulating. The statement by

571
00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:01,640
the Arkans which was basically saying at the UOC church

572
00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:06,839
it was like attacking the OCU parishioner, so on and

573
00:32:06,839 --> 00:32:12,519
so forth. Did you see that statement the Greek Arkons. Yeah,

574
00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:15,279
Arcon's accused the UOC of targeting and killing members of

575
00:32:15,279 --> 00:32:17,880
the OCU. So we see multiple statements like this. There

576
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:20,160
was a statement by LP Deforos not too long ago,

577
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:23,119
very recently. I'll just go ahead and read that says,

578
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,079
Russia presented itself as a protector of Orthodoxy. This was

579
00:32:26,119 --> 00:32:29,960
after the visit between Leo and Bartholomew. This is a

580
00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:34,119
statement by Lpdiforos. He's talking about the collapse of Syria

581
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:37,319
during the revolution, recent revolution. Says one of the best

582
00:32:37,319 --> 00:32:40,519
things that happened was it was released from the Russian tutelage.

583
00:32:40,519 --> 00:32:43,880
He's trying to draw this dialectic here, Russia presented itself

584
00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:46,759
as a protector of Orthodoxy, but in reality it used

585
00:32:46,880 --> 00:32:51,359
Orthodox ideology, just as communist ideology once was, as an

586
00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:56,079
ideological cloak for national and global ambitions. Our faith becomes

587
00:32:56,119 --> 00:32:59,039
a tool of state interest. This is dangerous for both

588
00:32:59,039 --> 00:33:02,640
the church and its people. So he's not just attacking

589
00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:09,160
Russia geopolitically, he's actually attacking the Russian Orthodox as well

590
00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:12,039
in that statement, saying that they're basically a tool of

591
00:33:12,079 --> 00:33:14,000
the state, which was the same thing that we saw Rep.

592
00:33:14,079 --> 00:33:16,079
Joe Wilson saying. So. I don't know about you, but

593
00:33:16,119 --> 00:33:19,079
my spider sense goes off when I start to see

594
00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:24,839
statements by hierarchs and statements of politicians match the same

595
00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:28,160
exact tune within a week of these ecumenical meetings. So

596
00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:29,640
I don't think it's any coincidence.

597
00:33:30,839 --> 00:33:34,240
Speaker 2: No, And in fact, we know that this link is

598
00:33:34,359 --> 00:33:37,440
absolutely verified. In fact, there's many many articles going back

599
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:41,599
many years over at Orthochristian dot com that detailed the

600
00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:46,960
intimate connection between former CIA heads John McCain State Department,

601
00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:50,240
even publicly lauding and praising their actions and operations on

602
00:33:50,279 --> 00:33:54,759
Twitter in Ukraine in setting up the Schismatic Church using

603
00:33:54,880 --> 00:33:59,519
a formerly defract guy named Dumenko, formerly of the KGB,

604
00:34:00,599 --> 00:34:05,240
who the Patriarch of Constant and Noble previously said was

605
00:34:05,359 --> 00:34:09,360
defrauct So suddenly now it's he's all good, everything's cool,

606
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:11,800
And we've got to remember that. You know, the EP

607
00:34:12,039 --> 00:34:16,760
reversed its own stance on the schism in Ukraine, presumably

608
00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:20,119
because of US and State Department pressure. Mike Pompeo, who

609
00:34:20,199 --> 00:34:22,440
was the CIA director at the time, even publicly talked

610
00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:25,480
about how happy he was that he had helped Zelenski

611
00:34:26,119 --> 00:34:29,159
create this a schism in the Orthodox Church. So that's

612
00:34:29,199 --> 00:34:31,679
all public record, and you can just find tons of

613
00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:34,519
archived articles at Ortho Christian YEP.

614
00:34:34,599 --> 00:34:38,480
Speaker 1: Absolutely, and when the US aid spending became public, they

615
00:34:38,559 --> 00:34:40,639
realized that a lot of this was actually going towards

616
00:34:40,639 --> 00:34:46,840
funding disunity within that within that UOCO CU. Absolutely, So

617
00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:52,599
this point, this is basically intelligence agencies finally funneling money

618
00:34:52,639 --> 00:34:57,239
to drive division within this region, and it's to disrupt

619
00:34:57,480 --> 00:35:01,320
basically from their standpoint, Russia's effort. But also what it

620
00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:03,679
does is it drives disunity within the church itself.

621
00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:07,480
Speaker 2: Yes, they did the same thing by the way in Macedonia,

622
00:35:07,639 --> 00:35:12,840
exact same move with Orthodoxy there. They've tried it in

623
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:15,320
places like Georgia as well, So it's the same model.

624
00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:20,280
So this is not some unique thing they'll do. They'll

625
00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:22,480
run the same sort of script in a lot of

626
00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:25,519
those you know, Baltic Era area countries.

627
00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:28,880
Speaker 1: M Yeah, we see it time and time again. All right,

628
00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:31,039
let me dive into this and then I'll give you

629
00:35:31,079 --> 00:35:33,039
the floor after I go through this article here, because

630
00:35:33,039 --> 00:35:35,320
I think this will this will be interesting. This is

631
00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:38,559
probably something that people don't know very much about. So

632
00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:41,840
this was the deposition of Maximos the fifth and this

633
00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:45,920
is according to CIA records that were made public. So

634
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:49,360
this is Maximos the fifth being deposed and then the

635
00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:54,119
propping up of Archbishop Ethnogorus, who then becomes the ecumenical

636
00:35:54,119 --> 00:35:57,480
Patriarch Ethnogoris, who for those of you that are not familiar,

637
00:35:57,559 --> 00:36:02,639
he's he was a The patriarch Athenagoras was a level.

638
00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:05,880
He was a thirty three degree Freemason. This is actually

639
00:36:05,960 --> 00:36:08,559
public record. If you were to look at the Greek

640
00:36:08,639 --> 00:36:12,320
Freemason Free Masonic Lodge, they actually have them listed on

641
00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:15,960
their website as a thirty third degree Mason. So he

642
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:18,840
did have free Masonic ties there, so that probably played

643
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:21,880
that part is not in this article but that probably

644
00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:25,719
played a link as far as how they made contact

645
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:28,280
to him to begin with, because they typically do play

646
00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:30,360
that role as a kind of power brokers.

647
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:33,519
Speaker 2: There. There's also prior to I forget the guy's name,

648
00:36:33,559 --> 00:36:42,000
but the guy prior to Athenagoras, there's also a declassified

649
00:36:42,039 --> 00:36:46,840
cable with him as well talking to the OSS. Anyway, sorry,

650
00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:48,800
go ahead, yep, no worries.

651
00:36:48,519 --> 00:36:51,079
Speaker 1: All right, So I'm going to dive into this. So

652
00:36:51,159 --> 00:36:53,920
basically the context of this, so we remember in the

653
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:56,880
previous article we were looking the OSS had already made

654
00:36:56,960 --> 00:37:01,400
contact with the then Archbishop of Agorus. He pledged the

655
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:04,880
service of all of his bishops and his priests to

656
00:37:05,039 --> 00:37:06,679
the OSS during the Cold War.

657
00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:09,840
Speaker 2: So sorry, I'm sorry. You had the picture up of

658
00:37:11,119 --> 00:37:13,840
are you reading the one that has Maximus the Fifth

659
00:37:13,840 --> 00:37:17,239
at the top? Yes, okay, that's the other one. I'm sorry,

660
00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,519
that's what I was talking about. I have to look

661
00:37:19,559 --> 00:37:22,159
at two different screens. So Maximus the Fifth is the

662
00:37:22,159 --> 00:37:23,360
other one that I was talking about.

663
00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:26,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, Yeah, that's that's actually going to be discussed

664
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:30,760
a little bit in this in this y No, no,

665
00:37:30,760 --> 00:37:32,639
no worries at all. I appreciate you coming on and

666
00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:35,480
discussing this. This is a good discussion. Not a lot

667
00:37:35,519 --> 00:37:42,119
of people know this information. So basically, the the backdrop

668
00:37:42,199 --> 00:37:45,920
to this is the OSS has already made contact with Athenagoras.

669
00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:50,559
He's pledged his support to the American Intelligence Agency. The OSS,

670
00:37:50,599 --> 00:37:52,360
for those of you that don't know, is a precursor

671
00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:56,599
to the CIA. So Athenagorus has already pledged his support

672
00:37:56,719 --> 00:37:59,760
his bishops and his priests. So now we're going to

673
00:38:00,119 --> 00:38:01,320
fast forward a couple of years.

674
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:03,679
Speaker 2: Oh, this is the guy who succeeded him, not his predecessor.

675
00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:05,519
I'm sorry, yeah, so.

676
00:38:07,039 --> 00:38:09,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, Athenagorus succeeded Maximos.

677
00:38:09,599 --> 00:38:13,719
Speaker 2: Oh wait, no, I was right, Okay, were said, I'm

678
00:38:13,719 --> 00:38:15,000
just getting confused.

679
00:38:15,679 --> 00:38:17,880
Speaker 1: No worries, all right, So I'm gonna go ahead and

680
00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:20,119
I'll dive through this. So a source in close contact

681
00:38:20,159 --> 00:38:23,639
with the patriarch reports that Maximos Maximos, who was currently

682
00:38:23,639 --> 00:38:26,400
the ecumenical patriarch at the time this is forty six

683
00:38:26,559 --> 00:38:30,079
in the previous article, we were around nineteen forty two,

684
00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:34,679
I believe. So Maximos is suffering from an acute nervous

685
00:38:34,679 --> 00:38:37,760
attack and shows grave symptoms of insanity. So he had

686
00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:42,239
some severe mental health issues, and the situation was relatively unstable.

687
00:38:42,639 --> 00:38:45,199
So basically what the CIA was thinking was they were

688
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:49,280
going to kind of capitalize on the situation and put

689
00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:51,760
their own man in the position, because they'd already made

690
00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:55,199
inroads with Athenogoras. So the game plan was basically to

691
00:38:55,280 --> 00:38:59,599
depose Maximos and to put in Athanagorus. Let's let's read

692
00:38:59,639 --> 00:39:02,079
through some of these kind of back and forths here.

693
00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:06,280
January sixteenth, the CIA reported serious thought is being given

694
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:08,599
to the deposition of the patriarch, but his followers are

695
00:39:08,639 --> 00:39:11,119
reluctant to take such a step until they are satisfied

696
00:39:11,119 --> 00:39:15,280
by the doctors that maximus condition is incurable. Meanwhile, an

697
00:39:15,360 --> 00:39:18,320
unrelated scandal emerged. It seemed that in nineteen forty four,

698
00:39:18,360 --> 00:39:21,480
Greek attorneys engaged by the patriarch it had stolen money

699
00:39:21,519 --> 00:39:24,599
that a wealthy benefactor had bequeathed to the patriarch and

700
00:39:24,679 --> 00:39:28,800
his will, and the patriarch at in as well. Although

701
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:31,880
the late Patriarch Benjamin led the Ecumenical patriarch A in

702
00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:35,719
nineteen forty everyone knew then that Metropolitan Maximos was the

703
00:39:35,760 --> 00:39:39,320
real power behind the throne. The CIA observed as Patriarch

704
00:39:39,360 --> 00:39:41,800
Maximos was in complete charge of the patriarch at nineteen

705
00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:45,639
forty when the late Patriarch Benjamin was ill. Certain elements

706
00:39:45,639 --> 00:39:48,840
in the final wish Maximos to assume some of the

707
00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:53,679
responsibility for the scandal. So the scandal is resurfacing, it's

708
00:39:53,719 --> 00:39:56,400
kind of come to the surface. The CIA is writing

709
00:39:56,440 --> 00:39:58,519
back and forth that serious thought is being taken to

710
00:39:58,639 --> 00:40:01,480
his deposition, and they're basically going to be putting in

711
00:40:01,519 --> 00:40:02,159
their own person.

712
00:40:02,679 --> 00:40:05,960
Speaker 2: And note too that just as with what I was

713
00:40:06,039 --> 00:40:10,400
claiming about the papacy, if they're concerned about a patriarch,

714
00:40:11,039 --> 00:40:12,800
they're definitely going to be concerned about a pope too.

715
00:40:12,840 --> 00:40:14,480
So it's not going to be outlandish to think that

716
00:40:14,519 --> 00:40:17,679
the CIA is very concerned about whether Paul the six

717
00:40:17,719 --> 00:40:18,559
gets elected or not.

718
00:40:19,239 --> 00:40:22,880
Speaker 1: Absolutely, Yep, They're concerned on both fronts, and ultimately, like

719
00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:25,960
you said, the goal would be to have these two

720
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:33,000
fronts rejoin. It's no coincidence that Thinagoras being propped up

721
00:40:33,039 --> 00:40:37,159
basically by the predecessors of the CIA, the OSS and

722
00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:41,760
American geopolitical power being put into this position. Is the

723
00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:45,920
first ecumenical patriarch in five hundred years to meet with

724
00:40:46,039 --> 00:40:50,559
the pope and have unity talks the first ecumenical patriarch

725
00:40:50,559 --> 00:40:52,239
to meet with the pope in five hundred years. You

726
00:40:52,280 --> 00:40:54,440
think that's a coincidence. So the first one that's prompt

727
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:57,440
up by American geopolitical power is the first one that's

728
00:40:57,440 --> 00:41:00,760
pushing for humanism. And this is actually talked about by

729
00:41:01,119 --> 00:41:03,880
Saint Paiisios as well. He has several statements he writes

730
00:41:03,880 --> 00:41:07,440
about Patriarch Athenagoras during this time as well, which I'll

731
00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:09,519
get into maybe a little later if we have time.

732
00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:12,519
I posted it on my ex page a little while back,

733
00:41:12,519 --> 00:41:14,000
so you can go and read that citation if you

734
00:41:14,079 --> 00:41:20,320
want so. Any we'll continue on a February fourteenth CIA report.

735
00:41:20,360 --> 00:41:22,760
The Turkish papers have published a statement to the effect

736
00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:25,679
that the Soviet Council General had been had placed the

737
00:41:25,760 --> 00:41:29,559
Russian Summer Embassy at the disposal of the patriarch. If

738
00:41:29,599 --> 00:41:33,719
and our officials insist, however, there is no foundation to

739
00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:36,119
this report and are of the opinion. Two papers in

740
00:41:36,199 --> 00:41:39,519
question obviously rich to create difficulties for the Patriarch by

741
00:41:39,519 --> 00:41:42,920
giving the impression of close collaboration with the Soviets. So

742
00:41:42,960 --> 00:41:46,639
you have these two kind of factions fighting for control

743
00:41:46,800 --> 00:41:49,599
during this time. This is the narrative that they're pushing.

744
00:41:49,639 --> 00:41:55,159
So they're pushing the necessity of their intervention into the

745
00:41:55,159 --> 00:41:57,840
ecumenical patriarch. They're saying, if we don't put our guy

746
00:41:57,920 --> 00:41:59,960
in here, the Soviets are going to put their guy

747
00:42:00,039 --> 00:42:02,800
in here. That's kind of the that's the false crisis

748
00:42:02,800 --> 00:42:06,159
that they're setting up. A few days prior to that

749
00:42:06,239 --> 00:42:08,119
CIA report, the one that we were just talking about,

750
00:42:08,119 --> 00:42:11,440
where they manufactured the narrative of the Soviets putting their

751
00:42:11,440 --> 00:42:16,039
person into this position, Archbishop Athenagoras was in Washington awarding

752
00:42:16,079 --> 00:42:18,800
President Truman with a piece of the True Cross. This

753
00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:21,760
was when the famous photo was taken of Athenagoras kissing

754
00:42:21,760 --> 00:42:26,079
Truman on the head. So just a few days prior

755
00:42:26,119 --> 00:42:28,599
to that CIA report, you get this famous picture here.

756
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:32,440
This is Athenagoras here. All right, I'm gonna skip down

757
00:42:32,440 --> 00:42:38,239
a little bit and we'll discuss the actual deposition and

758
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:42,639
when athentic Gorse is put into power. May twenty first,

759
00:42:42,679 --> 00:42:45,679
the CIA reported that Maximos was traveling to Athens to

760
00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:48,639
consult with specialists. If he is found to be incurable,

761
00:42:48,679 --> 00:42:51,800
it is believed that his resignation as patriarch will be accepted,

762
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:54,280
but a bit later July third, the CIA seems to

763
00:42:54,280 --> 00:42:57,800
have corrected itself, saying the real reason for maximos visit

764
00:42:57,920 --> 00:43:01,599
degrees was not the reported health issues, but for consultation

765
00:43:01,760 --> 00:43:05,599
concerning three major issues. Whether Maximos should resign in favor

766
00:43:05,719 --> 00:43:08,960
of a stronger personality, If he should resign, what candidate

767
00:43:08,960 --> 00:43:12,039
would be favorable to Athens? And how can the final

768
00:43:12,119 --> 00:43:15,559
deal with the increasing prestige of Patriarch Alexei of Moscow.

769
00:43:15,639 --> 00:43:19,360
So you have these two kind of you have this

770
00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:25,360
geopolitical issue brewing between not only geopolitical powers, but within

771
00:43:25,440 --> 00:43:30,320
the two patriarchs. CIA explained why the patriarch would need

772
00:43:30,320 --> 00:43:32,119
to go to Athens to discuss these matters. The f

773
00:43:32,639 --> 00:43:35,960
is the Final in Istanbul is dominated financially by the

774
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:39,599
Greek government. All right, so we skip down a little bit.

775
00:43:40,079 --> 00:43:41,760
I'm going to get to the statements in which he

776
00:43:41,840 --> 00:43:50,239
is he is deposed, well on one moment, mm hmm. Anyway,

777
00:43:50,320 --> 00:43:53,960
So long story short, the CIA helps in the deposition

778
00:43:54,119 --> 00:44:00,719
of Maximos and places a Thinagoras on the Ecumenical patriarch throne.

779
00:44:01,280 --> 00:44:03,360
So a new day of dawn for the Ecumenical Patriarch

780
00:44:03,480 --> 00:44:06,079
and for world Orthodoxy, with the Thinogoras on the throne,

781
00:44:06,199 --> 00:44:09,079
the US finally had a reliable, stable leader that could

782
00:44:09,079 --> 00:44:12,000
help in the fight against communism. So again you have

783
00:44:12,119 --> 00:44:16,119
this Cold war kind of rhetoric here. This is all

784
00:44:16,119 --> 00:44:18,800
about the fight against communism. That's why this is necessary.

785
00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:22,280
That's why these inroads were necessary. The same exact rhetoric

786
00:44:22,320 --> 00:44:26,480
that you see with the links between the USS and

787
00:44:26,719 --> 00:44:29,880
the Roman Catholic Church during the time of Operation Gladio.

788
00:44:30,039 --> 00:44:32,280
This is all this is a necessary evil. We have

789
00:44:32,360 --> 00:44:36,079
to ally with these people because it's all about the

790
00:44:36,079 --> 00:44:39,280
fight against communism. Amongst all sorts of evidence for this,

791
00:44:39,400 --> 00:44:42,159
see the nineteen fifty one CAA report. Anyway, I'm going

792
00:44:42,199 --> 00:44:44,800
to link this document in the link to this video,

793
00:44:45,280 --> 00:44:49,559
but this is pertinent information. So we have the patriarch

794
00:44:49,559 --> 00:44:54,360
Athenagoras at the time, who basically when he was an archbishop,

795
00:44:54,760 --> 00:44:58,800
pledged his full support to the OSS. I mean, it

796
00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:01,960
doesn't get much more clear than that, I have X

797
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:04,159
amount of bishops, I have X amount of priests. They

798
00:45:04,159 --> 00:45:06,519
are all under your command. We won't ask any questions.

799
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:11,760
That's basically what he says to them.

800
00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:15,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. And to tie this in also to the

801
00:45:15,480 --> 00:45:19,679
Roman Catholic world, you added. Back in the nineteen fifties,

802
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:22,960
under the direction of a guy named Ceed Jackson, who

803
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:25,920
worked in a psychological warfare for the CIA also worked

804
00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:28,199
in Hollywood, by the way, he came up with this

805
00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:31,159
idea called the doctrinal Warfare program. And you can actually

806
00:45:31,199 --> 00:45:35,920
look up these documents. One is called the Psychology Strategy

807
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:40,079
Board Directive D thirty three or PSB D thirty three.

808
00:45:40,800 --> 00:45:45,000
This is a declassified effort to counter communist ideology through propaganda,

809
00:45:45,440 --> 00:45:50,679
cultural and doctrinal influence, targeting institutions like the Roman Catholic Church.

810
00:45:51,599 --> 00:45:54,559
In two thousand and two, there were FOYA documents that

811
00:45:54,679 --> 00:45:58,360
got some of these, but it was fully declassified. In

812
00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:03,559
twenty thirteen, full on CD Jackson Edward P. Lilly Doctrinal

813
00:46:03,599 --> 00:46:06,960
Warfare Program was declassified, which basically proves all of this.

814
00:46:07,039 --> 00:46:09,280
So it's not a conspiracy theory. You have to understand

815
00:46:09,360 --> 00:46:14,679
that what we're talking about here are real declassified cables, discussions, communicates,

816
00:46:14,719 --> 00:46:18,960
and documents that discuss how to turn these religious institutions

817
00:46:19,000 --> 00:46:22,840
into forms of American soft power. Now you might say, well,

818
00:46:22,840 --> 00:46:26,079
but it's justified because we got to fight the atheistic Soviets. Well,

819
00:46:27,000 --> 00:46:29,920
the problem is when you make the sort of an alliance.

820
00:46:29,960 --> 00:46:34,360
When you say, as the patriarch did here, all of

821
00:46:34,400 --> 00:46:38,519
my priests and my whole jurisdiction is at your disposal,

822
00:46:39,119 --> 00:46:42,000
You're opening it up to a lot of corruption. That's

823
00:46:42,039 --> 00:46:45,440
the problem here because now you're basically saying we have

824
00:46:45,480 --> 00:46:49,800
a new master. It's basically choosing two masters, right, or

825
00:46:49,880 --> 00:46:53,079
choosing between two different thieves, as one article put it.

826
00:46:53,280 --> 00:46:56,119
So you have KGB and you got the CIA. And

827
00:46:56,679 --> 00:46:59,159
even though yeah, it might be the case that a

828
00:46:59,159 --> 00:47:01,320
lot of people were aided by British intelligence in the

829
00:47:01,360 --> 00:47:05,039
CIA when they fled Bolsheviks, when they fled the KVD,

830
00:47:05,119 --> 00:47:08,760
when they fled the Soviets, when they fled Cholchesku in Romania.

831
00:47:09,199 --> 00:47:13,360
I know, you know Orthodox priests that were under Romanian persecution,

832
00:47:13,400 --> 00:47:16,639
for example, who've come to the West, and they don't

833
00:47:16,679 --> 00:47:19,119
all immediately just love and worship the CIA. They point

834
00:47:19,119 --> 00:47:21,760
out that now you're under the same thing that we

835
00:47:21,760 --> 00:47:24,880
were under. You're going into, you know, the sort of

836
00:47:24,880 --> 00:47:28,360
communist socialist persecution in America that we went through where

837
00:47:28,360 --> 00:47:32,039
we fled. So they're recognizing the same things. And these

838
00:47:32,079 --> 00:47:35,039
agencies and these institutions are not your friend. They're they're

839
00:47:35,039 --> 00:47:40,079
really engines of power. They're not necessarily they're only as

840
00:47:40,119 --> 00:47:43,519
good as the people that are in those institutions. And

841
00:47:43,679 --> 00:47:48,039
if the institutions are staffed with woke, purple haired people,

842
00:47:48,079 --> 00:47:50,039
as the CIA has been for for a long time,

843
00:47:50,559 --> 00:47:51,920
it's not gonna it's not going to be a good

844
00:47:51,960 --> 00:47:52,599
thing for the church.

845
00:47:54,280 --> 00:47:56,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I think a lot of that honestly

846
00:47:56,519 --> 00:47:59,079
has to do And I know our opinions might disagree

847
00:47:59,119 --> 00:48:00,920
on you might have just agree with my opinion on

848
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:02,800
this particular take, but I think a lot of that

849
00:48:03,599 --> 00:48:08,760
wokeness probably comes from the early Freemasonic ties that basically

850
00:48:08,800 --> 00:48:11,920
influenced the United States Founding. I mean, we have major

851
00:48:12,000 --> 00:48:15,159
figures within the Founding of the United States. George Washington

852
00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:18,599
himself was loyal to his lodge, by which he was

853
00:48:18,639 --> 00:48:22,000
a member. We have several of the founding found fathers that

854
00:48:22,039 --> 00:48:26,519
were Freemasons. They were very prevalent within the Founding of

855
00:48:26,519 --> 00:48:30,000
the United States. Also, George Washington was a member of

856
00:48:30,000 --> 00:48:33,519
the Episcopal Church, and there are several free Masonic ties

857
00:48:33,599 --> 00:48:37,320
to that particular organization. And we already know that the

858
00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:41,559
Freemasons had multiple different ties to intelligence agencies such as

859
00:48:41,599 --> 00:48:43,880
the USS which is the precursor to the CIA later

860
00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:46,119
on in its development, they played the role of powerbroker.

861
00:48:46,159 --> 00:48:50,119
They did this also for British intelligence, so it was

862
00:48:50,159 --> 00:48:52,400
a it was kind of it's kind of like a

863
00:48:52,440 --> 00:48:54,840
spider organization. They don't have as much power as they did,

864
00:48:54,880 --> 00:48:59,000
but you could call it by another name. I'm sure

865
00:49:00,000 --> 00:49:02,079
probably read the Ault of Indida I have.

866
00:49:03,480 --> 00:49:04,920
Speaker 2: Let me let me be clear, I don't at all

867
00:49:04,960 --> 00:49:08,039
disagree with you what Maybe some people misunderstood what I

868
00:49:08,079 --> 00:49:10,639
said on a live stream a while back. Somebody asked

869
00:49:10,639 --> 00:49:13,360
about whether I think Freemasons are running everything. What I

870
00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:16,400
said was that amongst younger people, I don't think there's

871
00:49:16,519 --> 00:49:19,760
much of a concern for Freemasonry. So like people that

872
00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:23,400
are in seminary nowadays, I doubt many of them, the

873
00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:27,159
younger up and coming clergy are members of the lodge.

874
00:49:27,159 --> 00:49:29,679
I'm sure there's some, but I think that if you

875
00:49:29,719 --> 00:49:32,559
get into, like you know, the the Boomers, I'm sure

876
00:49:32,559 --> 00:49:36,360
there's plenty of Boomer clergy in the Orthodox Church, bishops

877
00:49:36,360 --> 00:49:38,719
that are that are members of the lodge. Absolutely. In fact,

878
00:49:38,920 --> 00:49:42,199
I know in Greece it's very widespread. Many Greek prelates

879
00:49:42,440 --> 00:49:45,079
are are members of the Lodge, and I'm sure in

880
00:49:45,159 --> 00:49:47,480
Russia there's there's prelates that are members of the lodge

881
00:49:47,480 --> 00:49:51,599
as well, So I don't at all discount that. Ultimately,

882
00:49:52,360 --> 00:49:55,760
I just meant that amongst the like, the younger you go,

883
00:49:55,880 --> 00:49:59,039
I think there's less and less interest in Freemasonry, but

884
00:49:59,239 --> 00:50:03,920
not that. Freemasonry has always had a very close relationship

885
00:50:03,960 --> 00:50:06,960
to the ecumenist movement. They've always had they're sort of

886
00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:11,519
the proto Ecumenists. So now I totally think you're on board,

887
00:50:11,920 --> 00:50:15,039
moving in the right direction to say that, yeah, Masonry

888
00:50:15,079 --> 00:50:16,559
plays a big role in ecumenism.

889
00:50:16,559 --> 00:50:19,199
Speaker 1: Absolutely, absolutely, And I was going to say you could

890
00:50:19,239 --> 00:50:21,639
probably even if you were to say that the organization

891
00:50:21,719 --> 00:50:24,280
of the Freemasons doesn't have as much power, you could

892
00:50:24,320 --> 00:50:25,920
just call them by another name. You can call them

893
00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:29,760
by the ecumenical movement. I mean, it's the same mindset,

894
00:50:29,800 --> 00:50:32,440
it's the same goals, it's the same end goal. And

895
00:50:32,480 --> 00:50:34,840
the Alt of Indida it basically laid out the game

896
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:37,400
plan for the subversion of the Roman Catholic Church. For

897
00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:38,880
those of you that are not aware of the Alt

898
00:50:38,880 --> 00:50:41,440
of Indida is the permanent instructor of the Alt of Indida.

899
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:45,519
This is a free Masonic playbook basically for their subversion

900
00:50:46,079 --> 00:50:48,920
of the Roman Catholic Church, not to put a Freemason

901
00:50:49,039 --> 00:50:54,239
on the throne of Peter, but to basically instill Enlightenment

902
00:50:54,280 --> 00:50:58,920
ideas and liberal axioms into the Roman Catholic Church so

903
00:50:59,039 --> 00:51:02,400
that eventually will be elected a pope that is amenable

904
00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:07,199
to these Enlightenment ideas and liberal axioms. So within the

905
00:51:07,199 --> 00:51:11,519
Alt of Indida, the strategy that was advanced is basically

906
00:51:11,559 --> 00:51:14,599
the dissemination of liberal ideas and actioms throughout society, within

907
00:51:14,800 --> 00:51:17,480
the institutions of the Catholic Church, so that the laity

908
00:51:17,480 --> 00:51:20,679
and prelates would over the years be imbued with progressive

909
00:51:20,679 --> 00:51:25,880
principles and basically it would just be spread across the board.

910
00:51:26,119 --> 00:51:29,519
That's kind of the goal. And the motto of the

911
00:51:29,559 --> 00:51:32,480
Alt of Indida was basically, the soldier dies, the war

912
00:51:32,519 --> 00:51:35,639
goes on. So it's not just a one time play.

913
00:51:35,679 --> 00:51:37,840
This is something that they're in it for the long

914
00:51:37,960 --> 00:51:41,559
They're in it for the long haul. I mean, ultimately

915
00:51:41,639 --> 00:51:45,639
it seems like it seems like it's had some effect.

916
00:51:45,760 --> 00:51:47,559
The reason I bring it up at all, so we

917
00:51:47,679 --> 00:51:52,039
look at the free Masonic ties of Athenagoras, right, he

918
00:51:52,079 --> 00:51:54,679
was a member of the lodge, the Greek Lodge. He

919
00:51:55,079 --> 00:51:59,239
was a thirty third degree Freemason. And we look at

920
00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:04,960
the current archbishop of the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese who wrote

921
00:52:05,039 --> 00:52:09,920
be forward to a book on geopolitics that was written

922
00:52:09,960 --> 00:52:12,280
by Master Mason Nicholas Laus Laus.

923
00:52:12,400 --> 00:52:15,360
Speaker 2: Yes, I used to interact and debate with Laos on Facebook,

924
00:52:16,280 --> 00:52:18,079
and uh, funny you said that I was going to

925
00:52:18,119 --> 00:52:21,960
bring out Laos as an example of a modern Greek

926
00:52:22,679 --> 00:52:26,800
Orthodox rabbit Mason as you went right where I was

927
00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:27,159
going to go.

928
00:52:27,639 --> 00:52:29,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, we've got the mind meld going on right now.

929
00:52:29,880 --> 00:52:33,360
Speaker 2: Man. By the way, the guy the the also, the

930
00:52:33,360 --> 00:52:40,679
guy that was involved in the Greek church calendar issue

931
00:52:40,800 --> 00:52:42,719
was a Mason too, like one hundred years or over

932
00:52:42,719 --> 00:52:49,280
one hundred years ago. His name is Metac Soksis. Yeah,

933
00:52:49,480 --> 00:52:51,840
there's another one of these guys going back even further

934
00:52:51,960 --> 00:52:53,159
that was a Mason too. Do you know what I'm

935
00:52:53,159 --> 00:52:58,559
talking about? No, So when that this was so, when

936
00:52:58,559 --> 00:53:00,880
the when you had the old calendar schism in Greece,

937
00:53:01,920 --> 00:53:04,320
one of the reasons that the schism happened was because

938
00:53:04,599 --> 00:53:10,880
the patriarch was a Freemason. If I recall, I'm not

939
00:53:11,239 --> 00:53:13,159
saying that that makes schism good. I'm just saying like,

940
00:53:13,199 --> 00:53:19,679
because it's a really complicated issue I'm making. Look, I'm

941
00:53:19,719 --> 00:53:21,039
looking this up, but anyway, go ahead.

942
00:53:22,239 --> 00:53:24,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, we literally have an icon worth and of course

943
00:53:24,480 --> 00:53:26,639
is depicted as outside of the church yep. And they

944
00:53:26,639 --> 00:53:30,039
have the demon of Freemasonry behind him in that arc

945
00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:32,039
icon yep. I've seen that as well.

946
00:53:32,880 --> 00:53:33,079
Speaker 2: Yeah.

947
00:53:33,079 --> 00:53:35,880
Speaker 1: But Archbishop Elpeter Foress wrote the introduction to the Greek

948
00:53:36,000 --> 00:53:39,519
version of the book by Master Mason Nicholas Laus titled

949
00:53:39,760 --> 00:53:41,960
new Opolitic. So if you want to check out this

950
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:44,679
book and you're watching this live stream, the book is

951
00:53:44,719 --> 00:53:49,159
titled Neuopolitic. This is what lpter Foros wrote and this basically,

952
00:53:49,239 --> 00:53:52,880
basically this book is about free Masonics version of political systems.

953
00:53:53,320 --> 00:53:56,480
Speaker 2: By the way, Matthew and me at Orthodox History, I

954
00:53:56,519 --> 00:53:58,880
just realized he has an article on this. It's it's

955
00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:04,039
called uh a brief life of Malitios Semataksakis, and he

956
00:54:04,239 --> 00:54:11,119
is the e humanist free Masonic patriarch in the nineteen

957
00:54:11,159 --> 00:54:14,800
twenties yep.

958
00:54:14,840 --> 00:54:17,840
Speaker 1: So it's that definitely played a role, I think in

959
00:54:18,320 --> 00:54:22,440
some of these ties and changes. So he wrote the

960
00:54:22,599 --> 00:54:26,000
LPD Forrest wrote the foreword to the book Neopolitic. This

961
00:54:26,039 --> 00:54:28,559
is basically what had have wrote it. He wrote, with

962
00:54:28,639 --> 00:54:31,559
great joy and deep satisfaction, I read the work of

963
00:54:31,639 --> 00:54:35,480
the exceptional intellectual Nicholas Laus in this area of philosophy,

964
00:54:35,519 --> 00:54:38,599
theology and politics. It is a bright work which is

965
00:54:38,639 --> 00:54:42,039
filled with an academic strictness and also great boldness. With

966
00:54:42,079 --> 00:54:45,360
all my soul, I congratulate Nicholas Laus for his sharpness

967
00:54:45,800 --> 00:54:48,480
during the writing of this work, which fills a great

968
00:54:48,519 --> 00:54:51,679
absence in this area of philosophy, theology and political science.

969
00:54:52,800 --> 00:54:55,199
So he wrote, he writes the foreword and endorses this

970
00:54:55,239 --> 00:55:00,880
book on Freemasonic political subversion. Just talking about the alt

971
00:55:00,880 --> 00:55:03,320
of Indida and what were the goals of that dissemination

972
00:55:03,519 --> 00:55:09,880
of Enlightenment ideas and liberal axioms amongst these kind of

973
00:55:09,880 --> 00:55:16,079
theological frameworks. So let's fast forward to Francis some of

974
00:55:16,119 --> 00:55:20,159
the statements that were made by him. All religions are

975
00:55:20,159 --> 00:55:22,639
a path to heaven, that kind of thing. You actually

976
00:55:22,679 --> 00:55:26,039
see Alp Deporos say just about the same statement, not

977
00:55:26,159 --> 00:55:28,679
that long after Francis said it. So where do you

978
00:55:28,679 --> 00:55:30,599
think these ties come from? That's just kind of where

979
00:55:30,639 --> 00:55:35,079
my mind goes. It seems like they did their task

980
00:55:35,320 --> 00:55:37,440
in these two particular areas.

981
00:55:38,920 --> 00:55:42,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember when I was a trad cat back

982
00:55:42,159 --> 00:55:44,480
in the two thousands, when I first read the Alta Indida,

983
00:55:44,559 --> 00:55:46,119
was kind of blown away, and it prompted me to

984
00:55:46,159 --> 00:55:50,039
then go and read the at that time Vatican's response,

985
00:55:50,159 --> 00:55:53,599
because you had several popes going all the way back

986
00:55:53,599 --> 00:55:55,400
to the seventeen hundreds during the time of the French

987
00:55:55,440 --> 00:55:59,400
Revolution that had actually written in cyclicals against Freemasonry, warning

988
00:55:59,480 --> 00:56:03,360
that they had plot to destroy Christian civilization. I think

989
00:56:03,559 --> 00:56:05,280
one of the clements was one of the first in

990
00:56:05,320 --> 00:56:08,159
the seventeen hundreds, all the way up to Lee of

991
00:56:08,239 --> 00:56:12,320
the Thirteen's famous and cyclical Humani Generis, which is a

992
00:56:12,440 --> 00:56:16,679
really expansive rejection of all the free Masonic principles which

993
00:56:16,679 --> 00:56:22,199
he calls in that work organized Naturalism. So same strategy here,

994
00:56:22,239 --> 00:56:25,840
and it's not accidental that the Free Masonic patriarchs are

995
00:56:25,840 --> 00:56:28,840
saying the same thing as the post dat it into

996
00:56:29,159 --> 00:56:32,280
popes are saying absolutely.

997
00:56:31,960 --> 00:56:33,280
Speaker 1: All right, let me take a moment. I'm going to

998
00:56:33,320 --> 00:56:35,039
get to some super chats and then we can continue

999
00:56:35,039 --> 00:56:38,440
with this discussion here. This is a great discussion. Temple

1000
00:56:38,480 --> 00:56:41,000
are good to see man great collab and next we

1001
00:56:41,079 --> 00:56:45,880
need ben on Alex Jones. That'd be awesome. I don't

1002
00:56:45,880 --> 00:56:49,599
think that would ever happen, but that would be cool. James,

1003
00:56:49,639 --> 00:56:51,639
five dollars, Thank you so much. Jay. Have you noticed

1004
00:56:51,639 --> 00:56:55,840
the trend of Presbyterian and CREC group sending missionaries to

1005
00:56:56,039 --> 00:56:58,599
Orthodox countries. Do you think it's organic or influenced?

1006
00:57:00,480 --> 00:57:02,480
Speaker 2: You know, I have a lot of questions about Doug Wilson.

1007
00:57:03,480 --> 00:57:06,239
I mean, I've interacted with that group going all the

1008
00:57:06,280 --> 00:57:08,519
way back to the early two thousands when I first

1009
00:57:08,599 --> 00:57:13,760
left Reformed Theology for at that time Catholicism, and I

1010
00:57:13,800 --> 00:57:18,320
remember having some email dialogue things trying to set up

1011
00:57:18,320 --> 00:57:20,719
a debate with either Douglas Jones, who was at that

1012
00:57:20,800 --> 00:57:23,679
time Doug Wilson's right hand man, or Doug Wilson. I

1013
00:57:23,719 --> 00:57:25,719
don't think Doug Wilson ever replied, but I had a

1014
00:57:25,760 --> 00:57:28,920
significant back and forth with Doug Jones. I don't know

1015
00:57:28,920 --> 00:57:31,159
whatever happened to that dude, if he's still around, or

1016
00:57:31,199 --> 00:57:34,679
if he went to something else. But I think what's

1017
00:57:34,719 --> 00:57:38,119
interesting is that many, many, many CREC people have become

1018
00:57:38,239 --> 00:57:41,639
Orthodox over the last two decades, and that we like

1019
00:57:41,719 --> 00:57:46,360
to see and I don't know if you guys, I'll

1020
00:57:46,400 --> 00:57:51,280
just say this, there might be a large platform Doug

1021
00:57:51,320 --> 00:57:55,119
Wilson debate in the near future. We'll see come up

1022
00:57:55,199 --> 00:57:59,679
with me. But I would not be surprised if there's

1023
00:57:59,679 --> 00:58:02,239
not something going on there. I know that people sort

1024
00:58:02,239 --> 00:58:07,079
of documented some jd Vance Doug Wilson connections. I've not

1025
00:58:07,199 --> 00:58:08,920
looked a whole lot into that, so I don't know

1026
00:58:08,960 --> 00:58:12,400
exactly how deep that goes. But I do think that

1027
00:58:12,679 --> 00:58:17,320
Doug Wilson's Christian nationalism, I mean there's some some some

1028
00:58:17,360 --> 00:58:19,519
good ideas there. I just don't think it's really gonna

1029
00:58:19,800 --> 00:58:25,159
come to much fruition given how divided, you know, Protestantism

1030
00:58:25,159 --> 00:58:28,559
and Evangelicalism is. And I did not know that they

1031
00:58:28,599 --> 00:58:33,559
were sending out missionaries into Orthodox countries. But that's it's unfortunate. Yeah,

1032
00:58:33,559 --> 00:58:34,320
that is unfortunate.

1033
00:58:34,719 --> 00:58:37,400
Speaker 1: One thing that I can bring up about the Presbyterian

1034
00:58:37,480 --> 00:58:40,280
Church is this is something very interesting. When I was

1035
00:58:40,400 --> 00:58:45,880
doing a deep dive in Freemasonry and anti Freemasonic polemics

1036
00:58:45,920 --> 00:58:49,480
and free Masonic history of political subversion, there was a

1037
00:58:49,480 --> 00:58:51,800
text I had Actually I did a call in back

1038
00:58:51,800 --> 00:58:53,440
when I was still a Protestant into your show, and

1039
00:58:53,440 --> 00:58:55,400
we were talking about freemasonry a little bit. I don't

1040
00:58:55,400 --> 00:58:56,960
know if you remember that discussion at all, but I

1041
00:58:57,000 --> 00:59:01,920
brought up a text that was by a say Irish

1042
00:59:02,000 --> 00:59:05,760
Roman Catholic priest, forget his name, but it was basically

1043
00:59:05,840 --> 00:59:10,880
it's called Freemasonry and the anti Christian movement. And there

1044
00:59:10,920 --> 00:59:12,880
was a snippet of that that I thought was very interesting.

1045
00:59:12,920 --> 00:59:16,119
It was a dialogue between that priest and a master Mason.

1046
00:59:16,199 --> 00:59:19,159
They were writing letters back and forth and he's making

1047
00:59:19,199 --> 00:59:21,599
the master Mason is making the case that they're not

1048
00:59:21,760 --> 00:59:26,280
like the Southern European Masons, which were engaged in political

1049
00:59:26,320 --> 00:59:27,559
subversion and all this were.

1050
00:59:27,400 --> 00:59:30,840
Speaker 2: The good guys basically.

1051
00:59:31,199 --> 00:59:34,000
Speaker 1: But his case was crazy to me because this was

1052
00:59:34,039 --> 00:59:36,079
his case. He said. This was a snippet of it.

1053
00:59:36,119 --> 00:59:40,719
I save this because I thought it was wild. We're accused,

1054
00:59:40,719 --> 00:59:42,880
this is the master Mason writing back to the priest.

1055
00:59:43,000 --> 00:59:46,760
We're accused of being irreligious and even worse, devil worshippers

1056
00:59:46,800 --> 00:59:49,679
and synagogues of Satan. Now in Ireland, most of the

1057
00:59:49,719 --> 00:59:52,119
bishops and higher dignitaries of the Church of Ireland, as

1058
00:59:52,159 --> 00:59:56,320
well as a large percent percentage of the minor clergy

1059
00:59:56,599 --> 01:00:00,920
and the heads of the Presbyterian Church belonged to order. Ye,

1060
01:00:01,440 --> 01:00:03,039
so they're all Freemasons basically.

1061
01:00:03,159 --> 01:00:07,119
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, I think Freemasonry originally historically found a

1062
01:00:07,159 --> 01:00:14,440
lot more of its adherents amongst Protestants, particularly Protestant nobility, kings,

1063
01:00:14,440 --> 01:00:17,000
et cetera. You know, after the fifteen hundreds, as lodges

1064
01:00:17,039 --> 01:00:20,840
start spreading throughout Europe, speculative lodges. I mean, even prior

1065
01:00:20,880 --> 01:00:24,480
to the establishment of the Grand Lodge in London in

1066
01:00:24,519 --> 01:00:29,400
the seventeen hundreds, there was already a growing interest amongst

1067
01:00:29,440 --> 01:00:34,000
nobility and statesman to get involved in specultive Freemason, primarily

1068
01:00:34,079 --> 01:00:38,480
amongst the Protestants. It then kind of spread to particularly

1069
01:00:38,480 --> 01:00:41,119
out of London when they established a Grand Lodge. It became,

1070
01:00:41,639 --> 01:00:44,679
as other historians have noted, like Jessica Harland Jacobs, kind

1071
01:00:44,679 --> 01:00:47,639
of the intelligence network of the British Empire. That's why

1072
01:00:47,639 --> 01:00:51,079
it's so integral I think for them. But then as

1073
01:00:51,119 --> 01:00:54,320
time goes by, I think maybe you can combinant with

1074
01:00:54,639 --> 01:01:00,559
the rise and spread of Protestant evangelical ideology, it just

1075
01:01:00,599 --> 01:01:03,039
became easier and easier and easier for people in the

1076
01:01:03,159 --> 01:01:07,199
Orthodox and the Roman Calic world to become Freemasons because

1077
01:01:07,239 --> 01:01:09,760
they just assumed and operated on all those same Enlightenment

1078
01:01:09,800 --> 01:01:13,480
presubpositions that the that the Masons had always supported.

1079
01:01:14,920 --> 01:01:16,800
Speaker 1: You actually you see that that's a that's a great

1080
01:01:16,840 --> 01:01:19,880
point about it being very prevalent within Protestant circles, because

1081
01:01:19,880 --> 01:01:23,280
it's way, way, way more prevalent within each of the

1082
01:01:23,320 --> 01:01:25,920
main lines. I did a video on this a long

1083
01:01:25,960 --> 01:01:29,840
time ago that was basically tracking the progression of all

1084
01:01:29,960 --> 01:01:34,440
of the mainline denominations within Protestantism that have gone extremely

1085
01:01:34,480 --> 01:01:37,960
liberal and their ties to Freemasonry within their hierarchy. So

1086
01:01:38,039 --> 01:01:40,000
you see the Episcopal Church the way that they've gone,

1087
01:01:40,119 --> 01:01:44,000
I mean multiple ties to free Masonic organizations. There's even

1088
01:01:44,039 --> 01:01:47,159
been archbishop and Archbishop of Canterbury has been a Master

1089
01:01:47,239 --> 01:01:51,840
Mason in the past. We already talked about George Washington

1090
01:01:52,119 --> 01:01:54,360
being a Mason. He was a member of the Episcopal Church.

1091
01:01:54,920 --> 01:02:00,320
All of the donations towards the Washington National Cathedral, which

1092
01:02:00,400 --> 01:02:04,239
is an Episcopal cathedral, we're funded by Freemasons. I mean,

1093
01:02:04,280 --> 01:02:06,960
it's it's just it's across the board. You see this

1094
01:02:07,039 --> 01:02:09,519
within the Presbyterian Church. Look at where look at where

1095
01:02:09,519 --> 01:02:13,280
they're at today with the pc USA, so really redeem Zoomer.

1096
01:02:13,320 --> 01:02:15,159
If you want to do some kind of reconquista, you

1097
01:02:15,159 --> 01:02:16,519
got to kick all the Freemasons out first.

1098
01:02:16,559 --> 01:02:19,480
Speaker 2: Exactly. That's what I think he doesn't understand, Like you'd

1099
01:02:19,480 --> 01:02:21,599
have to get rid of a lot bigger institutions than

1100
01:02:21,760 --> 01:02:25,920
just the Libs. You're also dealing with NGO's think tanks, foundations.

1101
01:02:25,440 --> 01:02:25,880
Speaker 1: Et cetera.

1102
01:02:26,360 --> 01:02:27,880
Speaker 2: And just to give a shout out to our friend

1103
01:02:28,079 --> 01:02:31,119
Rachel Wilson, she wrote a really good article to see

1104
01:02:31,119 --> 01:02:35,880
this point, which also applies to free from Masonic infiltration

1105
01:02:36,119 --> 01:02:39,559
and subversion. She wrote an article on her subsect called

1106
01:02:40,000 --> 01:02:43,559
how big foundation money is subverting Traditional Christianity, and she

1107
01:02:43,599 --> 01:02:46,360
goes through a lot of NGO's, a lot of thing tanks,

1108
01:02:46,440 --> 01:02:49,800
a lot of big Rockefeller Foundation type things, Ford Foundation,

1109
01:02:49,960 --> 01:02:53,039
Eli Lilly, all these kinds of things will put tons

1110
01:02:53,079 --> 01:02:56,239
and tons of money into churches and say things like, well,

1111
01:02:56,280 --> 01:02:58,960
look we'll build you a seminary building, but you're going

1112
01:02:59,039 --> 01:03:02,119
to install the people that we want to teach your seminary.

1113
01:03:02,920 --> 01:03:05,400
This goes all the way back to the Rockfellers biography.

1114
01:03:05,400 --> 01:03:07,440
There's whole there's a great chapter in their book about

1115
01:03:07,480 --> 01:03:11,159
how they did this. In an admission chapter, and that's

1116
01:03:11,199 --> 01:03:14,519
how they were very successful in subverting a lot of

1117
01:03:14,519 --> 01:03:17,480
the mainline Protestant nominations. And so it's the same with

1118
01:03:17,559 --> 01:03:19,440
It's the same principle with masonry as well, is that

1119
01:03:19,480 --> 01:03:22,960
you can kind of in a in a back doorway,

1120
01:03:23,039 --> 01:03:27,440
so to speak, subvert through both money and the sort

1121
01:03:27,480 --> 01:03:29,480
of secret society network that we're talking about.

1122
01:03:31,079 --> 01:03:33,119
Speaker 1: Absolutely all right, I'm gonna I'm gonna get through some

1123
01:03:33,159 --> 01:03:34,679
of these super chats here. If y'all want to send

1124
01:03:34,679 --> 01:03:36,960
in superchats, I really appreciate it. Helps out the channel

1125
01:03:36,960 --> 01:03:40,679
a lot. The sky high I like seals high. J

1126
01:03:40,840 --> 01:03:44,840
Dyer high cleave to antiquity. Thanks, good to see you. Jay.

1127
01:03:44,880 --> 01:03:47,239
Any hair tips asking for a friend.

1128
01:03:48,199 --> 01:03:50,280
Speaker 2: Haretics or hair tip?

1129
01:03:50,800 --> 01:03:52,800
Speaker 1: Hair tips tips on how to do his hair good?

1130
01:03:52,840 --> 01:03:56,199
Speaker 2: I guess hair a tic? This is my hair a tic.

1131
01:03:57,119 --> 01:04:00,679
There you go. I'm assuming that's a a joke because

1132
01:04:00,719 --> 01:04:03,280
all I do is just wake up and just run

1133
01:04:03,320 --> 01:04:04,840
my hair my hand through and that's it. So I

1134
01:04:04,840 --> 01:04:07,840
don't have any I'm a heteroflectual man. I don't give

1135
01:04:07,840 --> 01:04:08,920
hair tips.

1136
01:04:10,480 --> 01:04:14,599
Speaker 1: There you go, Penny ten dollars here for this type

1137
01:04:14,639 --> 01:04:16,719
of content and discussion. Thank you both for the reading

1138
01:04:16,800 --> 01:04:19,039
y'all do and share with us and sharing these sources

1139
01:04:19,039 --> 01:04:22,679
with us. Absolutely, this is a good discussion. Yeah, I

1140
01:04:22,719 --> 01:04:24,320
think I think this needs to be talked about more

1141
01:04:24,360 --> 01:04:26,960
because I didn't see anybody bringing up these points when

1142
01:04:27,000 --> 01:04:29,800
any of these talks were happening. It's like nobody was.

1143
01:04:29,800 --> 01:04:31,119
They were just kind of like, oh, well, I don't

1144
01:04:31,159 --> 01:04:34,280
think they're focusing on the theology aspect, but that really

1145
01:04:34,360 --> 01:04:37,559
doesn't have much to do with these unification talks, to

1146
01:04:37,599 --> 01:04:38,039
be honest.

1147
01:04:38,440 --> 01:04:41,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, and people, I think, you know, geopolitics is a big,

1148
01:04:41,639 --> 01:04:46,000
kind of hefty subject, so it's kind of difficult to

1149
01:04:46,000 --> 01:04:48,800
to hit all the bases. And you know, it took me,

1150
01:04:49,000 --> 01:04:51,039
and I'm not saying I'm even an expert on all this,

1151
01:04:51,159 --> 01:04:55,440
but it took me many, many years of studying. Really

1152
01:04:55,440 --> 01:04:56,840
what got me into this was a lot of the

1153
01:04:56,920 --> 01:04:59,000
Vatican two history. When I was a track cat, I

1154
01:04:59,039 --> 01:05:02,480
was really really really interested in all the players, all

1155
01:05:02,519 --> 01:05:06,199
the influences at Vatican two. I even read like, not

1156
01:05:06,280 --> 01:05:09,320
just trad cat critiques of Vatican two, I read liberal

1157
01:05:09,840 --> 01:05:13,039
appraisals of Vatican two. For example, there's a journalist that

1158
01:05:13,079 --> 01:05:15,760
wrote a famous book, Paul Blanchard, wrote a book about

1159
01:05:15,800 --> 01:05:18,079
Vatican Two, and he was a sort of super progressive

1160
01:05:18,159 --> 01:05:20,719
lib who is like, this is the greatest thing ever

1161
01:05:20,800 --> 01:05:23,760
we have actually finally won, you know, in taking over

1162
01:05:23,800 --> 01:05:28,239
the Church and even going into shall we say, certain

1163
01:05:28,320 --> 01:05:33,360
Middle Eastern countries and their influence Ontate and Vatican Two. So,

1164
01:05:33,840 --> 01:05:35,639
you know, it is a subject that I'm really happy

1165
01:05:35,679 --> 01:05:38,119
to see people kind of waking up to and getting

1166
01:05:38,199 --> 01:05:42,199
some sense of, because if you just think about it theologically,

1167
01:05:42,239 --> 01:05:45,239
which I think that's the most important aspect of it,

1168
01:05:45,320 --> 01:05:47,840
but it's very limiting because that's not the only concern,

1169
01:05:48,079 --> 01:05:50,079
you know, when we get into these you know, big

1170
01:05:50,679 --> 01:05:54,119
power block issues and who's interested in Vatican Two. And

1171
01:05:54,440 --> 01:05:57,679
I mean it's kind of obvious why Nosra Tate has

1172
01:05:57,719 --> 01:06:01,840
the language that has when you have that homosexual priest

1173
01:06:02,239 --> 01:06:07,800
who was a so called Jewish convert basically writing the document.

1174
01:06:07,960 --> 01:06:10,880
I mean that should tell you everything right there. But

1175
01:06:10,960 --> 01:06:12,920
I did a talk a couple months ago called how

1176
01:06:12,920 --> 01:06:15,880
the Papacy became a Captured Institution, And I did a

1177
01:06:15,880 --> 01:06:18,239
whole four hour talk kind of going through a lot

1178
01:06:18,280 --> 01:06:19,960
of not the stuff that we're talking about today. It

1179
01:06:19,960 --> 01:06:22,639
wasn't mainly focused on the EP but focused mainly on

1180
01:06:22,719 --> 01:06:26,239
like the papacy itself. That if you're interested, people can

1181
01:06:26,280 --> 01:06:28,239
look at that talk on my wall. Yeah.

1182
01:06:28,480 --> 01:06:30,679
Speaker 1: Absolutely, yeah. You've done a lot of really good talks

1183
01:06:30,719 --> 01:06:34,840
on this particular issue I've seen over the years. All right,

1184
01:06:34,880 --> 01:06:38,519
let's check this out. Wait, five dollars for your goal.

1185
01:06:38,599 --> 01:06:41,719
Appreciate you man, thank you X type game he became

1186
01:06:41,760 --> 01:06:44,199
a member or gifted a membership, Thank you so much,

1187
01:06:45,480 --> 01:06:48,880
iron giant man double seven, five dollars. You see the muzzle.

1188
01:06:48,960 --> 01:06:51,559
Mayor of London had to sing Christ is Born, the

1189
01:06:51,559 --> 01:06:54,559
Newborn King during Christmas Light Festival. He looked disgusted. Yeah,

1190
01:06:54,559 --> 01:06:58,119
I saw that he's fidgeting. He was like, he was like, oh,

1191
01:06:58,159 --> 01:06:59,760
I got to sing this next. He's like looking around,

1192
01:06:59,800 --> 01:07:04,800
forking out. That was funny. Good stuff, guys. This is

1193
01:07:04,840 --> 01:07:07,440
the tip of the spear and modern discourse. More like this.

1194
01:07:07,519 --> 01:07:10,480
Please absolutely yeah. Jay can come on the show whenever

1195
01:07:10,519 --> 01:07:15,199
he wants. These are good, good talks. Ah, let's see

1196
01:07:15,599 --> 01:07:17,559
you got a nice crowder almost six hundred.

1197
01:07:17,559 --> 01:07:18,360
Speaker 2: I think looks like.

1198
01:07:18,960 --> 01:07:22,639
Speaker 1: Yeah, people, I think people are really interested in this

1199
01:07:22,679 --> 01:07:26,079
particular discussion. I think people aren't really aren't talking about

1200
01:07:26,119 --> 01:07:28,440
this side of this thing. Well, we were warning for many,

1201
01:07:28,480 --> 01:07:29,079
many years.

1202
01:07:29,119 --> 01:07:32,400
Speaker 2: In fact, if I recall, there's a podcast about seven

1203
01:07:32,440 --> 01:07:36,320
years ago on my channel about the coming push for

1204
01:07:36,400 --> 01:07:41,800
this union with the ep in Rome. No, there's two. Actually,

1205
01:07:41,880 --> 01:07:44,679
there's one called the Spooky Subversion of Orthodoxy talking about

1206
01:07:44,679 --> 01:07:47,519
spooks and spies, and there's one about the ep and

1207
01:07:47,559 --> 01:07:50,360
rem more theologically focused. That was about seven or eight years ago.

1208
01:07:52,960 --> 01:07:58,960
Speaker 1: Interesting, we're not really doing theological questions today, but I

1209
01:07:59,000 --> 01:08:02,480
appreciate your super chat, my friend, God bless you come

1210
01:08:02,519 --> 01:08:04,440
back for one of the Q and A streams and

1211
01:08:04,480 --> 01:08:07,239
we do more theological stuff and I'll, you know, have

1212
01:08:07,320 --> 01:08:11,599
priests on that they can answer your theology questions. Trey

1213
01:08:11,840 --> 01:08:14,599
ten dollars, being new to Orthodoxy, observing the most basic

1214
01:08:14,599 --> 01:08:19,199
differences between Orthodoxy and quote unquote Catholicism reveals the incompatibility

1215
01:08:19,199 --> 01:08:21,000
of the two. What could be the motive of the

1216
01:08:21,039 --> 01:08:24,199
Pope's ecumenical outreach. That's a good question, because it's kind

1217
01:08:24,239 --> 01:08:25,319
of what we're discussing today.

1218
01:08:25,880 --> 01:08:28,520
Speaker 2: Well, on a very basic level, I mean, the papacy

1219
01:08:28,840 --> 01:08:30,840
is all about and it has always been about numbers.

1220
01:08:30,920 --> 01:08:34,079
So just think about the papacy as the world's oldest megachurch,

1221
01:08:35,520 --> 01:08:38,159
and I think you can go back to, you know,

1222
01:08:38,319 --> 01:08:41,199
the eleventh century. The best book on this by far

1223
01:08:42,079 --> 01:08:48,039
is the Papadoccus Mayandorf book on the Papacy from eleven

1224
01:08:48,119 --> 01:08:51,239
hundred to fourteen fifty three and or for the eleventh

1225
01:08:51,279 --> 01:08:53,479
century to fourteen fifty three, because they really go into

1226
01:08:54,279 --> 01:09:01,760
the geopolitical turn. Certainly the papacy had geopolitical interest prior

1227
01:09:01,840 --> 01:09:05,159
to that, but with the Gregorian reforms there's a very

1228
01:09:05,279 --> 01:09:07,840
key switch, and this is admitted by a Catholic historians.

1229
01:09:07,880 --> 01:09:10,600
You can read East Congar, you can read Fence, this

1230
01:09:10,640 --> 01:09:14,000
Princes Devornik, both of whom you know are Roman Catholic,

1231
01:09:14,000 --> 01:09:17,039
writing about this key shift period in the eleventh century

1232
01:09:17,239 --> 01:09:21,279
when the papacy really takes on a world power approach.

1233
01:09:21,399 --> 01:09:23,560
That's when we get the Tatas Pape. A couple of

1234
01:09:23,600 --> 01:09:25,439
centuries later, we get when I'm signing to them saying

1235
01:09:25,479 --> 01:09:27,479
that you have to believe in the temporo supremacy to

1236
01:09:27,479 --> 01:09:30,680
be saved. So I think those are that's a key

1237
01:09:30,840 --> 01:09:34,840
time to look at the eleventh century, and that's even

1238
01:09:34,840 --> 01:09:40,399
when you had German kings, Frankish kings. German kings were

1239
01:09:40,399 --> 01:09:43,640
actually we're appointing the pope for almost one hundred years,

1240
01:09:45,159 --> 01:09:48,399
So so much for Cesero papism or saying that the

1241
01:09:48,439 --> 01:09:51,439
East is Cesero Papists or whatever. I mean, that's papal

1242
01:09:51,479 --> 01:09:55,439
o crism right there. So that's I think where you

1243
01:09:55,479 --> 01:09:59,199
can go back to to see the real roots of this.

1244
01:09:59,399 --> 01:10:02,479
I think Florence is another example. If you read the

1245
01:10:02,520 --> 01:10:05,279
Ostromov book, you get the picture of how the Medici's

1246
01:10:05,319 --> 01:10:09,920
were very interested in a geopolitical union, supposedly to fight

1247
01:10:09,960 --> 01:10:12,800
the Turks, this kind of stuff. But all the false

1248
01:10:12,880 --> 01:10:15,359
union councils they always have a kind of a geopolitical

1249
01:10:15,399 --> 01:10:17,319
motive as well. It's not just about the theology. But

1250
01:10:17,600 --> 01:10:20,960
if you're the papacy. You know, we made this argument

1251
01:10:20,960 --> 01:10:23,520
when Sneck was on back when for Tellytuti came out,

1252
01:10:23,640 --> 01:10:25,800
Why wouldn't you want to be the pope of all

1253
01:10:25,840 --> 01:10:28,880
the world religions, Peter, If not just the keyholder for

1254
01:10:28,960 --> 01:10:32,359
the Roman See and Communion, why not be the keyholder

1255
01:10:32,399 --> 01:10:35,920
and the head of all the religions in concentric circles.

1256
01:10:36,239 --> 01:10:37,880
That's kind of the model you get if you read

1257
01:10:37,880 --> 01:10:40,199
for Teletutius. The Pope's kind of here in the center,

1258
01:10:40,279 --> 01:10:43,439
this is Rome outside. That's the Orthodox, than the Anglicans,

1259
01:10:43,680 --> 01:10:46,960
then the Protestants, the phenomenom nationalists, and then even the Muslims.

1260
01:10:47,439 --> 01:10:50,239
So just pure power, I think can tell you right

1261
01:10:50,239 --> 01:10:53,279
there why the Pope would want mega numbers and to

1262
01:10:53,359 --> 01:10:58,199
be the head of a giant syncretist religion. Yeah.

1263
01:10:58,319 --> 01:10:59,720
Speaker 1: One thing that I would add on too that because

1264
01:10:59,720 --> 01:11:03,600
I think it's very true when I was talking about

1265
01:11:04,119 --> 01:11:07,000
I mentioned earlier, I said theology isn't the main kind

1266
01:11:07,000 --> 01:11:09,560
of the main focus. I really am talking about from

1267
01:11:09,560 --> 01:11:12,399
the Roman Catholic perspective, because look at any Uniate group

1268
01:11:12,479 --> 01:11:15,720
that has not just Eastern or like not just Eastern

1269
01:11:15,840 --> 01:11:18,479
Uniate groups. We can talk about Assyrian Uniate groups. We

1270
01:11:18,520 --> 01:11:24,239
could talk about the Miro Salabar or zero Malabar Uniates,

1271
01:11:24,680 --> 01:11:26,159
who then Aerate Nestorius.

1272
01:11:26,399 --> 01:11:31,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, theology, it's just about geopolitical numbers in Union, correct. Yeah,

1273
01:11:31,840 --> 01:11:34,199
I believe what you want, just submit to ron. That's

1274
01:11:34,199 --> 01:11:36,960
always been the Uniate model that Pope will basically say.

1275
01:11:37,119 --> 01:11:38,800
In fact, you can go back to some of the

1276
01:11:38,920 --> 01:11:41,880
Union offers where he would say stuff like I'll build

1277
01:11:41,880 --> 01:11:46,560
you schools, uh, and you can believe whatever you want.

1278
01:11:46,680 --> 01:11:47,600
Just come into commune with me.

1279
01:11:48,680 --> 01:11:51,359
Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, and we see the We see the framework

1280
01:11:51,439 --> 01:11:57,119
for this being set. Now you think that the sinidelity

1281
01:11:57,199 --> 01:12:00,640
push is a just a kind of coincident. So within

1282
01:12:00,680 --> 01:12:03,520
the Roman Catholic system, there's a reason they're trying to

1283
01:12:03,560 --> 01:12:05,840
move to this more sonodal model. It's to make it

1284
01:12:05,880 --> 01:12:10,359
more amenable to a potential Orthodox union in the future.

1285
01:12:10,680 --> 01:12:13,199
That's the entire purpose. You think it's just them becoming

1286
01:12:13,239 --> 01:12:16,880
a liberal or something. That's not the case. So yeah,

1287
01:12:16,920 --> 01:12:19,760
we see this with several other unia groups. The Eastern

1288
01:12:19,800 --> 01:12:21,960
Catholics are able to venerate Palamas, so they don't see

1289
01:12:21,960 --> 01:12:24,239
the philioqua. Now we have Leo saying he's not going

1290
01:12:24,319 --> 01:12:28,520
to be saying the philioqua anymore. These are major moves

1291
01:12:28,720 --> 01:12:31,520
in that direction. So the framework isn't just being placed

1292
01:12:31,680 --> 01:12:35,520
on the Orthodox side with the EP and LP Deforo's

1293
01:12:35,600 --> 01:12:41,560
taking control over churches financially so that they can't put

1294
01:12:41,640 --> 01:12:43,439
up any kind of opposition if there were to be

1295
01:12:43,479 --> 01:12:45,680
some kind of false union. We see this also in

1296
01:12:45,680 --> 01:12:47,319
the Roman Catholic side as well.

1297
01:12:47,399 --> 01:12:54,319
Speaker 2: And that's exactly why anybody from our sphere priest, bishop, clergy, laity,

1298
01:12:54,399 --> 01:12:57,920
apologist who is not an ecumenist is thus a problem

1299
01:12:58,000 --> 01:13:01,199
person in the Orthodox world.

1300
01:13:01,239 --> 01:13:04,359
Speaker 1: I'm saying, yep, absolutely yep, and they'll they'll they'll push

1301
01:13:04,399 --> 01:13:10,960
back for sure. Let's see, Andrew five dollars, what is

1302
01:13:11,000 --> 01:13:14,239
the largest thing that is non essential to orthodoxy quote

1303
01:13:14,279 --> 01:13:16,760
unquote compromise that Jay would be okay with it if

1304
01:13:16,800 --> 01:13:18,680
the two were to unite.

1305
01:13:20,239 --> 01:13:22,039
Speaker 2: I don't know if that's because you read it again?

1306
01:13:22,079 --> 01:13:23,640
What shout out to me again?

1307
01:13:24,119 --> 01:13:27,680
Speaker 1: He's he's basically, it's kind of it's kind of seems

1308
01:13:27,720 --> 01:13:30,359
like a question where he's like, what orthodox doctrine would

1309
01:13:30,359 --> 01:13:34,039
you be willing to throw into the trash for unity?

1310
01:13:34,680 --> 01:13:36,680
Speaker 2: I mean, I think you could probably come up with

1311
01:13:36,720 --> 01:13:43,880
some things that are audiofera or uh, you know, not dogmatic.

1312
01:13:47,119 --> 01:13:48,880
I have to think about it for a minute. I mean,

1313
01:13:48,920 --> 01:13:51,039
I really just tend to focus on, you know, the

1314
01:13:52,119 --> 01:13:54,960
thirty or so things. I would focus on the thirty

1315
01:13:55,000 --> 01:13:59,960
yel thirty ish things that are kind of uh, you know,

1316
01:14:01,319 --> 01:14:05,880
points of non compromise, and then anything outside of those things.

1317
01:14:05,960 --> 01:14:08,119
I still cannot find my tweet from several years ago

1318
01:14:08,159 --> 01:14:10,319
where I have found a list of these from Metropolitan

1319
01:14:10,319 --> 01:14:14,560
Seraphim a Prius. But I don't I mean, I don't

1320
01:14:14,560 --> 01:14:16,479
have to think about that. I don't know that's a tough.

1321
01:14:16,319 --> 01:14:21,439
Speaker 1: One, James. Five dollars. Jay, When when can we expect

1322
01:14:21,439 --> 01:14:24,399
to collab with Father Stephen Young? He defended you on

1323
01:14:24,439 --> 01:14:26,640
this very show not too long ago. Thank you for

1324
01:14:26,680 --> 01:14:28,600
your work, man. Yeah he did when he was on

1325
01:14:28,640 --> 01:14:28,960
the show.

1326
01:14:29,079 --> 01:14:31,520
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I'm going to always be open to that.

1327
01:14:31,600 --> 01:14:35,000
I think I even maybe mentioned that back when Orthodox

1328
01:14:35,000 --> 01:14:38,039
Shahda had Father Stephen Young on when when they were

1329
01:14:38,760 --> 01:14:43,680
reading his Religion of Apostles book. I just haven't got

1330
01:14:43,680 --> 01:14:45,399
to the book yet, is really the only reason I

1331
01:14:45,399 --> 01:14:47,960
haven't reached out, Because if I'm going to have somebody on,

1332
01:14:48,000 --> 01:14:49,600
I don't want to be like, oh, yeah, I didn't

1333
01:14:49,600 --> 01:14:51,159
read your book, but you want to come on, So

1334
01:14:52,000 --> 01:14:54,560
maybe I need to get through the text first before

1335
01:14:55,479 --> 01:14:58,159
before I set up. But i'd absolutely absolutely be able to,

1336
01:14:58,720 --> 01:14:59,399
would be willing to.

1337
01:14:59,800 --> 01:15:02,399
Speaker 1: He challenge you to a debate on Twin Peaks, Man.

1338
01:15:03,279 --> 01:15:06,520
Speaker 2: That could be fun. It could be fun. Yeah I'm

1339
01:15:06,560 --> 01:15:07,399
running because I'm scared.

1340
01:15:07,880 --> 01:15:10,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, runn because you're scared of the Twin Peaks debate.

1341
01:15:10,720 --> 01:15:13,199
Speaker 2: It's over. I don't I didn't even I heard him

1342
01:15:13,199 --> 01:15:14,760
say that, but I didn't really get the like does

1343
01:15:14,840 --> 01:15:16,960
he just doesn't like it? Or what was the I

1344
01:15:16,960 --> 01:15:19,439
think that's what the joke was. Okay, that could be funny.

1345
01:15:19,520 --> 01:15:21,920
Speaker 1: Yeah you're saying that was the only that was the

1346
01:15:21,960 --> 01:15:26,840
only disagreement you guys have was twin peaks. Let's see

1347
01:15:26,840 --> 01:15:29,800
a member member chatted in thanks for being a member.

1348
01:15:30,279 --> 01:15:33,439
York writers claim conservatives based on the schism from extreme

1349
01:15:33,479 --> 01:15:35,720
Italian right, which is the difference between.

1350
01:15:36,239 --> 01:15:38,720
Speaker 2: I don't know, but thanks for He's talking about the

1351
01:15:38,840 --> 01:15:42,479
York right masonry masons. I think, oh yes, yeah, yeah.

1352
01:15:42,520 --> 01:15:45,000
And that was one of the guys that argued with

1353
01:15:45,079 --> 01:15:46,800
me one time. This is years ago. He was actually

1354
01:15:46,840 --> 01:15:49,800
a c r C guy and he was a York

1355
01:15:49,920 --> 01:15:52,960
right I'm not saying everybody in the series season, but

1356
01:15:53,119 --> 01:15:55,039
say this guy was. And he was like, oh, Jay,

1357
01:15:55,079 --> 01:15:58,279
you gotta you gotta let me explain to you that,

1358
01:15:58,399 --> 01:16:01,359
you know, York right masonry is the real Christian masonry

1359
01:16:01,399 --> 01:16:03,199
and all this stuff. I was just say whatever, due,

1360
01:16:04,359 --> 01:16:05,760
I never I didn't find it convincing.

1361
01:16:06,960 --> 01:16:11,760
Speaker 1: Two dollars super chat for Michael, Thank you, Thank you, Harris.

1362
01:16:12,479 --> 01:16:15,319
Five dollars super chat. I would like to see n

1363
01:16:15,399 --> 01:16:18,960
KdV and KGB archives published about the Russian Church, like

1364
01:16:19,000 --> 01:16:24,520
the Appointed patriarchs since nineteen forty three from Stalin et cetera.

1365
01:16:25,560 --> 01:16:28,760
Speaker 2: That would be really interesting. I mean, you should reach

1366
01:16:28,800 --> 01:16:30,960
out to Mark Hackard because he would know all about that.

1367
01:16:31,039 --> 01:16:34,520
He's translated a lot of those KGB archives and stuff

1368
01:16:34,720 --> 01:16:36,239
into English.

1369
01:16:37,000 --> 01:16:39,640
Speaker 1: Vale Orthodox ten dollars. Good to see you, man, Good

1370
01:16:39,680 --> 01:16:42,600
chat gents for Turkey hair transplants. Talk about for me

1371
01:16:43,279 --> 01:16:46,520
and do an irl stream with Irhan while they're oh,

1372
01:16:46,760 --> 01:16:49,479
and me and David Arhan will probably do extream when

1373
01:16:49,479 --> 01:16:52,840
I get back from my cruise next week, so we'll

1374
01:16:52,840 --> 01:16:56,960
probably be hanging out there. How much timed you you going?

1375
01:16:56,960 --> 01:16:59,760
Speaker 2: You said you're going with Ted Cruz ted Cruise.

1376
01:17:00,079 --> 01:17:02,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm gonna go hang out with Ted Cruz next week.

1377
01:17:02,119 --> 01:17:05,000
We're gonna go. We're gonna strike up a deal. I

1378
01:17:05,000 --> 01:17:08,079
gotta go through a Freemasonic ritual for you.

1379
01:17:08,159 --> 01:17:13,359
Speaker 2: Gotta go join the the Southern Confederate Scottish Lodge of

1380
01:17:13,399 --> 01:17:17,399
the Sons of Israel. I just made up. I just

1381
01:17:17,399 --> 01:17:19,840
made up a lodge, but it sounds real. That's true.

1382
01:17:19,920 --> 01:17:21,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, you'll see me. You'll see me in some Wikipedia

1383
01:17:22,000 --> 01:17:25,199
article later on. But how how long do you have? Ja?

1384
01:17:25,239 --> 01:17:26,239
Do you have more than you want to? Add to

1385
01:17:26,319 --> 01:17:28,119
this discussion or whatever you want to do.

1386
01:17:28,159 --> 01:17:30,199
Speaker 2: I mean, I can, I can. You're gonna have to

1387
01:17:30,199 --> 01:17:32,560
make a decision because I'll talk forever about Gladio and

1388
01:17:32,800 --> 01:17:35,119
I mean, it's it's entirely up to you. Man.

1389
01:17:35,399 --> 01:17:37,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, let's keep going. This is good stuff.

1390
01:17:37,439 --> 01:17:39,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, I want to throw this in here. Here's here's

1391
01:17:39,600 --> 01:17:43,319
a pretty wild one in Michael Gratziano's academic text, just

1392
01:17:43,319 --> 01:17:45,199
to give you an idea of how kind of crazy

1393
01:17:45,960 --> 01:17:48,119
the O, S, S and C. I have been when

1394
01:17:48,119 --> 01:17:52,640
it comes to religion. They came up with this idea

1395
01:17:54,560 --> 01:17:59,039
for an ecumenist project. They didn't actually end up doing it,

1396
01:17:59,119 --> 01:18:01,600
but I thought this was funny. I never day might

1397
01:18:01,640 --> 01:18:04,960
talk about this, but I'll just read a little bit

1398
01:18:04,960 --> 01:18:08,239
of it. Retired intelligence officers received strange mail at times.

1399
01:18:08,239 --> 01:18:11,279
In nineteen seventy six, a Catholic priest named Father John

1400
01:18:11,359 --> 01:18:17,479
Ireland Gallery wrote to CIA operative Ed Lansdale with a

1401
01:18:17,520 --> 01:18:21,159
plan for world peace. The great religious traditions of the

1402
01:18:21,199 --> 01:18:26,520
West were squabbling too much. Father Gallery thought that Turkish

1403
01:18:26,600 --> 01:18:29,239
Muslims and Greek Christians were always at each other's throats

1404
01:18:29,319 --> 01:18:32,640
over Cyprus, and the Soviets were waiting to pounce. Father

1405
01:18:32,720 --> 01:18:36,920
Gallery then suggested a creative solution, get NATO to rebuild

1406
01:18:36,960 --> 01:18:41,279
the ancient city of Ephesus along the Turkish coast, using

1407
01:18:41,359 --> 01:18:44,319
the Vaticans archives to figure out what ancient buildings existed

1408
01:18:44,319 --> 01:18:47,560
in Ephesus. Father Gallery thought that a new holy city

1409
01:18:48,119 --> 01:18:52,479
second to Jerusalem could be rebuilt to heal the thousand

1410
01:18:52,560 --> 01:18:55,479
year schism with the Orthodox. They could also bring Greece

1411
01:18:55,520 --> 01:18:59,479
and Turkey into union against the Soviets, the real enemy.

1412
01:19:00,079 --> 01:19:03,199
This NATO peace project might seem to be an odd suggestion,

1413
01:19:03,960 --> 01:19:06,640
but it had a lot going for it. Rebuilding emphasis

1414
01:19:06,680 --> 01:19:09,680
would supply the free world with a religious center of gravity,

1415
01:19:10,399 --> 01:19:12,920
a place that major Western religions could then call home.

1416
01:19:13,479 --> 01:19:16,640
This was an existentially important topic because it was the

1417
01:19:16,680 --> 01:19:21,479
West religious backbone that enabled it to challenge Communism's godless aggression.

1418
01:19:22,039 --> 01:19:24,680
As an added bonus, NATO would strengthen its ties with

1419
01:19:24,840 --> 01:19:29,319
Israel and rebuild ancient synagogues in Ephesus. Gallery wanted ed

1420
01:19:29,399 --> 01:19:32,880
Lansdale to know that the American taxpayer should not fear,

1421
01:19:33,319 --> 01:19:37,279
even though they would pay for it. Secretary of Defense

1422
01:19:37,600 --> 01:19:40,439
Donald Rumsfeld offered to set up a meeting with President

1423
01:19:40,479 --> 01:19:43,279
Gerald Ford if they had gone through with this plan,

1424
01:19:43,479 --> 01:19:47,359
but they didn't. So there's an example of what we've

1425
01:19:47,399 --> 01:19:50,880
been talking about. And I don't know this, but the

1426
01:19:50,920 --> 01:19:57,119
emphasis project, Well, that sounds curiously like Francis's Abu Dhabi

1427
01:19:57,279 --> 01:19:59,560
Multi Faith Center, doesn't it, So that I think they

1428
01:19:59,640 --> 01:20:02,159
just went with some other thing. And then the last

1429
01:20:02,199 --> 01:20:05,560
thing I'll mention is that Ed Lansdale also came up

1430
01:20:05,600 --> 01:20:07,880
with the idea, which they didn't actually do. But this

1431
01:20:07,920 --> 01:20:11,399
gives you an idea how just ruthless they are. The

1432
01:20:11,479 --> 01:20:16,439
idea of a staged second Coming of Christ, buried in

1433
01:20:16,479 --> 01:20:21,600
the footnote of a nineteen seventy five bureaucratic memorandum, was

1434
01:20:21,680 --> 01:20:26,399
a audacious, audacious plan of Ed Lansdale to use Christian

1435
01:20:26,520 --> 01:20:31,439
eschatology to manipulate Cuba to oppose Castro. More simply, he

1436
01:20:31,520 --> 01:20:34,600
wanted to use a CIA to simulate a second Coming

1437
01:20:34,600 --> 01:20:39,520
of Christ over Cuba under oath. CIA officer Thomas Parrett

1438
01:20:39,600 --> 01:20:45,319
testified this was an example of Landale's perspicacity. He had

1439
01:20:45,319 --> 01:20:48,079
a wonderful plan to get rid of Castro. This would

1440
01:20:48,079 --> 01:20:50,399
be the spreading of the word the second Coming of Christ,

1441
01:20:50,399 --> 01:20:52,720
that it was imminent and that Christ was going to

1442
01:20:52,760 --> 01:20:56,159
fight against Castro, who was the Antichrist. They ended up

1443
01:20:56,159 --> 01:20:58,279
not doing this because it was kind of outlandish, but

1444
01:20:58,720 --> 01:21:01,039
it gives you an idea of the type of religious

1445
01:21:01,039 --> 01:21:04,560
manipulation that the CIA is absolutely involved in.

1446
01:21:05,279 --> 01:21:08,800
Speaker 1: Mm hmm. Yeah, there was a lot. Uh, there's a

1447
01:21:08,840 --> 01:21:12,439
lot that has come to light recently too with did

1448
01:21:12,439 --> 01:21:18,600
you hear about the the geo fencing, Uh, yeah, with Israel.

1449
01:21:18,319 --> 01:21:22,920
Speaker 2: Geofencinganicals based on yeah, exactly, geofen.

1450
01:21:23,640 --> 01:21:25,800
Speaker 1: Well, what's what's interesting is, you know, I come I

1451
01:21:25,840 --> 01:21:28,640
come from a Protestant background. I was a non denominational

1452
01:21:28,720 --> 01:21:31,560
pastor and uh, our church had a bit of a

1453
01:21:32,199 --> 01:21:35,800
like SBC type history, so you get dispensationalists that would

1454
01:21:35,800 --> 01:21:38,239
come through the church. We didn't teach dispensationalism, but you'd

1455
01:21:38,239 --> 01:21:42,399
get people from that background. The brainwashing that these people

1456
01:21:42,399 --> 01:21:46,039
have been through is absolutely absurd, and it's no wonder.

1457
01:21:46,279 --> 01:21:51,640
I mean, they're literally getting paid targeted ad campaigns, uh,

1458
01:21:52,079 --> 01:21:55,560
paid by foreign interests to drive these ideas into their

1459
01:21:55,600 --> 01:21:58,319
head and get them to support these causes financially. It's

1460
01:21:58,359 --> 01:22:01,800
it's wild. I've seen I've seen things as absurd as

1461
01:22:02,520 --> 01:22:07,720
Christian Israel packed where you can sponsor a Israeli family

1462
01:22:08,319 --> 01:22:11,239
uh and pay for them. It's like, you know the

1463
01:22:11,479 --> 01:22:13,800
you have like the old ads where they have like

1464
01:22:13,800 --> 01:22:15,840
the dogs like in the Arms of the Age. But

1465
01:22:15,840 --> 01:22:20,720
it's just like a It's like, but.

1466
01:22:20,720 --> 01:22:25,760
Speaker 2: You're actually just paying for some Jewish chicks breast enlargement.

1467
01:22:25,840 --> 01:22:30,279
Probably that's why you're cleavage to antiquity. You were just

1468
01:22:30,279 --> 01:22:32,520
paying for those Jewish chicks to get big old knockers.

1469
01:22:32,520 --> 01:22:33,359
That's what was going on.

1470
01:22:33,560 --> 01:22:37,279
Speaker 1: That's right, it's cleavage to antiquity. You can you can sponsor,

1471
01:22:37,600 --> 01:22:40,600
you can sponsor big knockers in the fifty super chat.

1472
01:22:41,880 --> 01:22:45,800
Speaker 2: That's why Ben Shapiro's sister has what she has. Cleavage

1473
01:22:45,800 --> 01:22:49,880
to antiquity was behind that, and that was it was

1474
01:22:49,960 --> 01:22:51,479
me all along.

1475
01:22:50,600 --> 01:22:54,640
Speaker 1: You can thank me for the Kazar Milkers there.

1476
01:22:55,399 --> 01:22:58,880
Speaker 2: By the way, I'm glad you mentioned that because that

1477
01:22:58,920 --> 01:23:04,439
whole evangelical domain is another awesome example of religious engineering,

1478
01:23:04,800 --> 01:23:08,560
not so much from CIA State Department, but obviously Rothschild.

1479
01:23:08,920 --> 01:23:12,640
You know, Israeli interest wanting to convince American evangelicals through

1480
01:23:12,680 --> 01:23:16,199
things like, as you said, dispensationalism, Schofield study Bible, that

1481
01:23:16,319 --> 01:23:19,079
Russia and China or gog and magogue and we're locked

1482
01:23:19,079 --> 01:23:21,800
in and you know in times conflict. We recently covered

1483
01:23:21,800 --> 01:23:26,399
this on my channel with discussions about Calvary Chapel their

1484
01:23:26,520 --> 01:23:29,399
history of promoting a lot of that stuff. Uh, Dallas

1485
01:23:29,439 --> 01:23:35,199
Theological Seminary. Yeah, so that Hal Lindsay and his late

1486
01:23:35,239 --> 01:23:35,880
great Planter Earth.

1487
01:23:36,680 --> 01:23:39,000
Speaker 1: Yeah. I saw a stream you did not that long

1488
01:23:39,039 --> 01:23:44,439
ago where you were talking about within the evangelical music industry.

1489
01:23:44,720 --> 01:23:49,279
There's a lot of intelligence interaction there. You want to

1490
01:23:49,279 --> 01:23:50,199
talk about that a little bit.

1491
01:23:50,199 --> 01:23:55,319
Speaker 2: Maybe, I don't know if you remember, I mean what,

1492
01:23:55,359 --> 01:23:57,800
I don't remember that one specifically, but I'm not.

1493
01:23:58,279 --> 01:23:59,720
Speaker 1: I think it was. I don't remember if it was.

1494
01:24:01,000 --> 01:24:03,439
Katy Perry was one of these pop stars that had

1495
01:24:04,079 --> 01:24:06,319
oh yeah.

1496
01:24:06,239 --> 01:24:11,720
Speaker 2: Oh okay, yeah yeah. So basically, yeah, Katy Perry's dad

1497
01:24:11,760 --> 01:24:13,960
is a megachurch pastor. A lot of people don't know that,

1498
01:24:14,039 --> 01:24:19,079
but prior to being this pastor, he was involved in

1499
01:24:19,600 --> 01:24:22,439
a lot of odd kind of situations and connections. He

1500
01:24:22,560 --> 01:24:25,720
was used to hand out LSD with Tim Leary, so

1501
01:24:25,760 --> 01:24:28,199
he was kind of in those and of course tim

1502
01:24:28,279 --> 01:24:30,960
Leary was openly part of you know, CIA operations and

1503
01:24:31,359 --> 01:24:35,159
projects to hand out LSD and kind of get people

1504
01:24:36,079 --> 01:24:39,479
experimenting and tuning out, tune in turn on, drop out,

1505
01:24:39,520 --> 01:24:42,359
whatever his phrase is. He actually brags about this too.

1506
01:24:42,359 --> 01:24:44,000
You can still find the clip on YouTube. If you

1507
01:24:44,079 --> 01:24:45,880
doubt me. He says, you can thank the CIA for

1508
01:24:45,920 --> 01:24:50,479
all the you know, sixties LSD stuff. So it's interesting that,

1509
01:24:50,560 --> 01:24:53,279
you know, Katy Perry's dad was involved in that, and granted,

1510
01:24:53,359 --> 01:24:55,439
maybe he later turned around or whatever. He may have

1511
01:24:55,439 --> 01:24:58,600
been a sincere convert at some point, but you know,

1512
01:24:58,680 --> 01:25:04,159
she describes her upbringing as very weird kind of Pentecostal

1513
01:25:04,239 --> 01:25:07,159
and authentic kind of Christianity, and I actually tend to

1514
01:25:07,159 --> 01:25:11,199
believe Katie. And in that case, not that I'm excusing

1515
01:25:11,239 --> 01:25:14,520
all of her sort of you know, pop pop star stuff,

1516
01:25:14,600 --> 01:25:19,560
but he was also involved in some sort of megachurch

1517
01:25:20,079 --> 01:25:22,640
that ended up in a big scandal. I'm not accusing

1518
01:25:22,800 --> 01:25:24,920
him of being directly involved in the scandal. I don't

1519
01:25:24,960 --> 01:25:27,279
know the details of it, but whatever megachurch he was

1520
01:25:27,319 --> 01:25:30,520
involved in, there was some adjacent as is usually the

1521
01:25:30,560 --> 01:25:34,119
case with you know, multimillion dollar megachurches, there's some money

1522
01:25:34,399 --> 01:25:39,479
laundering scandal going on there. But in the case of TBN,

1523
01:25:39,800 --> 01:25:42,720
which is where Katie Perry got her start, everybody's seen

1524
01:25:42,920 --> 01:25:46,159
you know TV preacher Pink haired TBN people back in

1525
01:25:46,199 --> 01:25:49,039
the day she was a Christian singer and then you know,

1526
01:25:49,159 --> 01:25:53,119
eventually morphed into whatever she is. But TBN has a

1527
01:25:53,239 --> 01:25:57,039
very suss you know, obviously sus background with money laundering

1528
01:25:57,159 --> 01:26:01,520
and organized crime connections, and BI even investigated them at

1529
01:26:01,520 --> 01:26:06,039
one point, and eventually they shut down. And so they

1530
01:26:06,039 --> 01:26:07,840
shut some of their stuff down and they sold out,

1531
01:26:07,920 --> 01:26:10,279
I think to Hillsong, which is now kind of the big,

1532
01:26:10,920 --> 01:26:14,479
you know, evangelical megachurch thing that owns everything. I've not

1533
01:26:14,520 --> 01:26:19,279
looked into a lot of CIA intelligence connections, necessarily to Hillsong,

1534
01:26:19,319 --> 01:26:24,000
but John Adams, who's a longtime friend, musician and researcher,

1535
01:26:24,800 --> 01:26:26,399
He's the one that kind of hit me to the

1536
01:26:26,399 --> 01:26:30,039
fact that Calvary Chapel, which was created by people coming

1537
01:26:30,079 --> 01:26:34,560
out of military intelligence in the CIA, they actually burned

1538
01:26:34,760 --> 01:26:37,079
the Christian music scene, which I didn't I didn't even

1539
01:26:37,119 --> 01:26:40,520
know that. So I'm not saying that CIA operators are

1540
01:26:40,520 --> 01:26:45,199
sitting around like literally mind controlling every Christian musician, but

1541
01:26:45,880 --> 01:26:49,680
it's it's a very clearly kind of tailored created thing,

1542
01:26:50,760 --> 01:26:54,079
if that makes sense. And I think that, you know,

1543
01:26:54,600 --> 01:26:57,439
that makes it kind of suspect, not not that Keith

1544
01:26:57,479 --> 01:26:59,960
Green is a CIA opert or whatever.

1545
01:27:00,079 --> 01:27:02,760
Speaker 1: But you know what I'm saying, Yeah, well, it's it's

1546
01:27:02,800 --> 01:27:04,600
not just a matter of being like a good singer

1547
01:27:04,720 --> 01:27:07,039
or something. You could be very talented and never make

1548
01:27:07,079 --> 01:27:10,880
it anywhere. You kind of almost have to be picked up,

1549
01:27:11,840 --> 01:27:13,479
especially in the like if you want to be like

1550
01:27:13,520 --> 01:27:16,279
a megastar, you want to be one of the mainstream individuals,

1551
01:27:16,319 --> 01:27:17,880
it almost seems like you do have to be picked

1552
01:27:17,960 --> 01:27:22,479
up by one of these interest groups and sponsored exact.

1553
01:27:23,399 --> 01:27:24,880
And I know you were talking about that a bit

1554
01:27:24,880 --> 01:27:28,039
in your lecture on the subject, but I absolutely agree.

1555
01:27:28,119 --> 01:27:32,600
And going back to the going back to the religious realm,

1556
01:27:32,800 --> 01:27:36,279
it almost seems like in order to get into these

1557
01:27:36,319 --> 01:27:39,840
positions like in the Roman Catholic Church, you have to

1558
01:27:39,880 --> 01:27:42,560
be I was talking about this with DPH not that

1559
01:27:42,680 --> 01:27:47,039
long ago, and we're talking about the benefits of the

1560
01:27:47,760 --> 01:27:51,319
Orthodox system of governance versus the Roman Catholic system of governance.

1561
01:27:51,399 --> 01:27:54,279
It's not very difficult to compromise one guy. It's not

1562
01:27:54,319 --> 01:27:57,359
difficult at all. I mean, it would be super easy

1563
01:27:57,399 --> 01:28:01,680
to subvert one individual in an institution, and then his

1564
01:28:03,079 --> 01:28:06,239
successors are basically going to be in line with with

1565
01:28:06,279 --> 01:28:09,399
the with the predecessor had and that's basically what Francis did.

1566
01:28:09,439 --> 01:28:11,279
If you were following that at all. Tim Gordon did

1567
01:28:11,279 --> 01:28:13,720
a good discussion on this. He had some of the

1568
01:28:13,720 --> 01:28:18,319
best coverage when Leo was elected. He frior to Leo's

1569
01:28:18,319 --> 01:28:22,159
election and posts that he did a whole expose on

1570
01:28:22,600 --> 01:28:26,199
Lavender mafia stuff, Saint Gallan mafia stuff. He was going

1571
01:28:26,239 --> 01:28:31,079
into the subversion of these institutions as well as some

1572
01:28:31,159 --> 01:28:35,000
of the the things that were set up before Leo's

1573
01:28:35,560 --> 01:28:39,000
election and then after. He was one of the only

1574
01:28:39,119 --> 01:28:41,319
Roman Catholics I think that actually called it when Leo

1575
01:28:41,439 --> 01:28:43,039
was elected that he's going to be a Francis two

1576
01:28:43,039 --> 01:28:46,760
point zero because this was this was an individual that

1577
01:28:47,159 --> 01:28:51,199
had met with Francis several times. There were reports that

1578
01:28:51,239 --> 01:28:53,159
were published that he had met with them like every

1579
01:28:53,279 --> 01:28:56,720
Saturday or something. So this was obviously set up for

1580
01:28:56,880 --> 01:29:00,239
him to succeed Francis. We knew that he was going

1581
01:29:00,239 --> 01:29:02,000
to carry on the legacy. His own brother said he

1582
01:29:02,039 --> 01:29:05,119
was going to carry on the legacy of Francis, and

1583
01:29:05,279 --> 01:29:10,640
he actually knew what was it. It was before the

1584
01:29:10,680 --> 01:29:16,920
cardinals had even finished voting that his brother was basically

1585
01:29:17,600 --> 01:29:19,479
the next pope. It was it was riculous. I mean,

1586
01:29:19,520 --> 01:29:21,079
there was all sorts of stuff that we're that were

1587
01:29:21,119 --> 01:29:25,760
circulated about this, But yeah, that's the beauty that goes

1588
01:29:25,760 --> 01:29:30,399
into this. This super chat question that was asked in

1589
01:29:30,520 --> 01:29:33,840
em Andy asks I was I was testing YouTube. Won't

1590
01:29:33,880 --> 01:29:37,359
let me type out Masons. It's getting censored for some reason. Question.

1591
01:29:37,479 --> 01:29:41,479
Do other jurisdictions have known high level Masons? I think

1592
01:29:41,600 --> 01:29:44,119
I think the concern behind this question is, well, now

1593
01:29:44,119 --> 01:29:46,000
that I know this information, like what do I do

1594
01:29:46,359 --> 01:29:49,000
you know? Is this is this a defeater for our worldview?

1595
01:29:49,000 --> 01:29:52,760
Absolutely not. I I knew this before I even stepped

1596
01:29:52,920 --> 01:29:56,079
a foot into an Orthodox church. This was all stuff

1597
01:29:56,119 --> 01:29:59,520
that I had been engaging in. I think, if anything,

1598
01:29:59,560 --> 01:30:02,720
it's a tech testimony to the power of uh the

1599
01:30:02,840 --> 01:30:09,359
Orthodox UH system of governance. It is actually divinely uh

1600
01:30:09,560 --> 01:30:12,439
guided by God, and the way that God has set

1601
01:30:12,520 --> 01:30:15,399
up the church is not so that one person who's

1602
01:30:15,439 --> 01:30:19,399
easily uh subverted is basically he's like you know, the

1603
01:30:19,399 --> 01:30:23,479
the uh uh what what's the term you use from

1604
01:30:23,680 --> 01:30:31,920
from Dune? Yeah, basically basically, so it's it's not as

1605
01:30:31,960 --> 01:30:34,359
if there is like one universal super being or whatever

1606
01:30:34,399 --> 01:30:37,520
that's like ruling over the entirety of Christendom. No, it's

1607
01:30:38,119 --> 01:30:40,279
it's a noble church governance. So that way, if you

1608
01:30:40,359 --> 01:30:44,920
do have uh these uh you know, one particular patriarchy

1609
01:30:45,000 --> 01:30:48,760
that ends up being used for geopolitical uh means you

1610
01:30:48,800 --> 01:30:51,479
have all of these other jurisdictions that can kind of

1611
01:30:51,479 --> 01:30:54,880
help to keep that in check. But what doesn't help

1612
01:30:55,039 --> 01:30:56,560
is when we decide that we're just going to be

1613
01:30:56,640 --> 01:30:59,000
quiet about these issues. Because if they don't get pushed

1614
01:30:59,039 --> 01:31:03,000
back then and they just go they go forward as planned,

1615
01:31:03,520 --> 01:31:05,800
and this thing, these things happen a lot quicker. This

1616
01:31:06,000 --> 01:31:09,079
kind of the purpose of them doing these meetings. From

1617
01:31:09,119 --> 01:31:11,640
my perspective, it seems like to see what the reaction is,

1618
01:31:12,159 --> 01:31:14,359
how much they are going to get, and they're kind

1619
01:31:14,359 --> 01:31:16,279
of like they're dipping a toe in the water. It's

1620
01:31:16,600 --> 01:31:19,279
it's two steps forward, one step back. Oh, dip my

1621
01:31:19,319 --> 01:31:20,800
toe in the water. I'm going to kind of backtrack

1622
01:31:20,840 --> 01:31:23,760
a little bit. We'll see how they react. Oh nope, nope,

1623
01:31:23,800 --> 01:31:26,560
too much blowback. Oh I got too much blowback after

1624
01:31:26,600 --> 01:31:31,039
I baptized the uh uh you know, the the baby

1625
01:31:31,039 --> 01:31:32,600
of the gay couple. Now I gotta I gotta take

1626
01:31:32,600 --> 01:31:35,119
a couple of steps back or that was like with

1627
01:31:36,359 --> 01:31:38,920
a fiducias Supplekans. They came out and they were saying,

1628
01:31:39,359 --> 01:31:44,159
you can bless gay couples. Boom, huge explosion, massive pushback,

1629
01:31:44,600 --> 01:31:47,119
and then oh later, oh well actually we're just talking

1630
01:31:47,119 --> 01:31:48,039
about the individuals.

1631
01:31:48,359 --> 01:31:53,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you know, yeah, it's I noticed this when

1632
01:31:53,319 --> 01:31:55,560
I was a trad cat that you know, would always

1633
01:31:55,640 --> 01:32:00,960
be uh frustrated with the bureaucrates of the Vatican, that

1634
01:32:01,000 --> 01:32:04,159
they would always throw bones. You know, it's like things

1635
01:32:04,159 --> 01:32:07,119
will get really really bad, and then the Vatican would

1636
01:32:07,119 --> 01:32:09,119
throw a bone to the trads. Oh maybe we'll let

1637
01:32:09,119 --> 01:32:10,800
you have a Latin mass. This is back under like

1638
01:32:10,880 --> 01:32:14,600
John paul A second and Benedict right, because I remember

1639
01:32:14,600 --> 01:32:17,439
when when Benedict was elected, there was this you know,

1640
01:32:17,560 --> 01:32:21,079
great trad hope that everybody was very oh, he's gonna

1641
01:32:21,399 --> 01:32:23,560
do the motu proprio and we're going to have the

1642
01:32:23,640 --> 01:32:26,760
Latin mass restored. And this there was this this air

1643
01:32:26,800 --> 01:32:30,199
of hope which was soon dashed because it didn't really

1644
01:32:30,239 --> 01:32:33,039
go anywhere. And again, you know, the shutting down the

1645
01:32:33,119 --> 01:32:35,960
Latin mass. I think it is another huge indicator, not

1646
01:32:36,079 --> 01:32:39,880
that Latin is magical, but you know, it's it's a

1647
01:32:39,920 --> 01:32:43,800
clear indicator of a kind of destruction of the liturgical

1648
01:32:43,840 --> 01:32:49,079
heritage of the of the West. So, you know, the

1649
01:32:49,079 --> 01:32:51,439
more that you would see that kind of as you said,

1650
01:32:51,800 --> 01:32:55,640
two steps forward, one step back approach. I mean, these

1651
01:32:55,640 --> 01:32:58,199
are people who are you know, experts. I'm talking about.

1652
01:32:58,239 --> 01:33:01,079
The Vatican is very I mean, it's the the world's

1653
01:33:01,079 --> 01:33:05,479
oldest existing propaganda outlet. And if you don't know that,

1654
01:33:05,479 --> 01:33:08,359
that's what the Holy Office is. The Holy Office of

1655
01:33:08,399 --> 01:33:11,880
the Inquisition was also known for being kind of the

1656
01:33:11,880 --> 01:33:15,640
Holy Office of propaganda. That's originally where it comes from.

1657
01:33:16,079 --> 01:33:20,039
So the notion of propaganda itself is a kind of

1658
01:33:20,039 --> 01:33:21,920
an invention in the modern world as an invention actually

1659
01:33:21,960 --> 01:33:23,880
of the Vatican. People don't know that. But so the

1660
01:33:24,079 --> 01:33:29,560
very adept at the strategy of how to rule and

1661
01:33:29,600 --> 01:33:32,399
how to keep people in line. And when you start

1662
01:33:32,520 --> 01:33:36,000
sensing that, oh, you know, people think you're going to live, well,

1663
01:33:36,199 --> 01:33:38,720
throw a bone to the trads and then that'll kind

1664
01:33:38,720 --> 01:33:41,880
of you know, the pendulum will swing back this way, right.

1665
01:33:42,399 --> 01:33:44,920
But it's also a technique of moving the over to

1666
01:33:45,000 --> 01:33:48,640
window to you do something really radical, walk it back,

1667
01:33:49,199 --> 01:33:51,319
do something you can be more radical, walk it back,

1668
01:33:51,359 --> 01:33:53,119
and while you do this, you just kind of as

1669
01:33:53,159 --> 01:33:55,880
everybody hopefully everybody knows what moving over to window is, right,

1670
01:33:55,960 --> 01:33:57,199
so that's that's what they do.

1671
01:33:58,000 --> 01:34:00,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, you could. You could definitely see very clearly with

1672
01:34:00,880 --> 01:34:03,159
what happened in the Vatican not that long ago with

1673
01:34:03,239 --> 01:34:07,159
the LGBT pilgrimage, and they they that was the big

1674
01:34:07,279 --> 01:34:09,680
that was the big explosion, moving the Overton window in

1675
01:34:09,720 --> 01:34:13,439
that direction, and they immediately walk it back. Now they have

1676
01:34:14,760 --> 01:34:17,600
you know, the statements where they say, oh, well we

1677
01:34:17,680 --> 01:34:21,840
just we did our y'all, we're going to investigate women

1678
01:34:22,359 --> 01:34:25,560
ordained deacons. Oh well actually no, now we've decided we're

1679
01:34:25,560 --> 01:34:27,760
not going to do women ordained deacons. Yeah, but just

1680
01:34:27,800 --> 01:34:29,560
a couple of months ago, you were doing an entire

1681
01:34:29,920 --> 01:34:34,239
LGBT pilgrimage into the Vatican where the Poge literally sent

1682
01:34:34,439 --> 01:34:37,880
a bishop that was on record stating that he was

1683
01:34:38,239 --> 01:34:44,640
pro giving unrepentant sodomites, you Christ. So he's the guy

1684
01:34:44,720 --> 01:34:48,359
that is doing the Pride Mass at the LGBT pilgrimage.

1685
01:34:48,680 --> 01:34:51,199
I literally sent him. This has approved basically from the

1686
01:34:51,279 --> 01:34:54,199
top down. Big swing. Now we're going to walk them

1687
01:34:54,199 --> 01:34:55,960
back a little bit. Oh, we're not going to do

1688
01:34:55,960 --> 01:34:59,560
women deacons at least in this investigation we can we

1689
01:34:59,560 --> 01:35:01,840
can invest get it later, but for now, we're gonna

1690
01:35:01,840 --> 01:35:05,640
give your little your little uh based pellets. We'll toss you.

1691
01:35:07,159 --> 01:35:09,119
I don't know how you come back from doing that, though,

1692
01:35:10,560 --> 01:35:14,359
having a literal like rainbow flag in the rainbow cross

1693
01:35:15,000 --> 01:35:16,840
in Basilica at the.

1694
01:35:16,840 --> 01:35:24,000
Speaker 2: Vatican, Yeah, I mean that one was just I mean

1695
01:35:24,039 --> 01:35:26,199
sometimes you just wonder like, is there at any point

1696
01:35:26,279 --> 01:35:29,800
at which like it's the breaking point or is it

1697
01:35:29,880 --> 01:35:33,960
just no, there is no breaking point, right, Like, I mean,

1698
01:35:34,840 --> 01:35:37,319
try and be charitable, but I just can't understand why

1699
01:35:37,319 --> 01:35:41,239
anybody would want to stay stay in the Roman Catholic world.

1700
01:35:41,279 --> 01:35:44,840
Speaker 1: But yeah, I can't either, especially with everything that's going

1701
01:35:44,840 --> 01:35:48,279
on lately and all of the pushes that they're I mean,

1702
01:35:48,399 --> 01:35:51,039
basically any anybody. I feel bad for the trads. I

1703
01:35:51,079 --> 01:35:53,439
really do, because I like people like I like people

1704
01:35:53,479 --> 01:35:56,359
like Tim Gordon, I like the guys from avoiding Babylon,

1705
01:35:56,439 --> 01:35:59,199
I like Anthony Stein. I like the trads. I have

1706
01:35:59,239 --> 01:36:01,840
a lot of respect for some of them. Some of

1707
01:36:01,880 --> 01:36:04,760
them obviously could be a little combative, but I've I've

1708
01:36:04,800 --> 01:36:07,279
I have a lot of respect for them. But I

1709
01:36:07,600 --> 01:36:10,640
mostly I just feel bad. It's it's got to be

1710
01:36:10,880 --> 01:36:15,319
it's got to be exhausting to have to deal with basically,

1711
01:36:15,359 --> 01:36:17,039
I mean, your entire life. If you're going to remain

1712
01:36:17,119 --> 01:36:18,840
Roman Catholic, it's got to be exhausting.

1713
01:36:18,880 --> 01:36:19,079
Speaker 2: Man.

1714
01:36:19,880 --> 01:36:23,079
Speaker 1: You think eventually they would, you know, wake up and

1715
01:36:23,439 --> 01:36:25,439
decide it's well, it's time to become orthodox.

1716
01:36:29,640 --> 01:36:38,520
Speaker 2: Yes. I don't know who's We're either going to have

1717
01:36:38,520 --> 01:36:42,600
a debate with Trent Horn if he'll do it, or

1718
01:36:42,640 --> 01:36:46,119
with Doug Wilson. So maybe maybe one more Trent Horn

1719
01:36:46,199 --> 01:36:49,319
debate can swing some of these people in the right direction.

1720
01:36:49,399 --> 01:36:51,039
I don't know, but we'll have to see.

1721
01:36:52,520 --> 01:36:54,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, that'll be interesting, man. But this has been a

1722
01:36:54,760 --> 01:36:57,000
good This has been a good discussion. A lot of

1723
01:36:57,000 --> 01:37:00,239
really interesting stuff covered in this talk. And can you

1724
01:37:00,239 --> 01:37:01,680
want to plug before we're going.

1725
01:37:01,600 --> 01:37:06,640
Speaker 2: To wrap up here? Let's see what's what's going on. No,

1726
01:37:06,720 --> 01:37:09,840
I don't think there's much going on with other than

1727
01:37:09,920 --> 01:37:13,079
just kind of the typical live streams. I did do

1728
01:37:13,199 --> 01:37:17,279
a kind of a hefty breakdown yesterday with on the

1729
01:37:17,319 --> 01:37:19,520
topic of Professor Dave. I don't know people saw that

1730
01:37:19,720 --> 01:37:22,520
I finally got around to looking at the smug sort

1731
01:37:22,560 --> 01:37:25,840
of atheist pseudo professor turns out he's apparently not an

1732
01:37:25,840 --> 01:37:29,039
actual professor. He is a chiropractic degree or something, but

1733
01:37:29,479 --> 01:37:33,640
says he's professor Dave the Atheist Giant YouTube channel. Well,

1734
01:37:33,680 --> 01:37:38,199
he responded to me and Jim Bob talking about God's

1735
01:37:38,199 --> 01:37:42,840
existence and Darwinism and whatnot, and there wasn't really any

1736
01:37:42,840 --> 01:37:45,119
substance to the response. He's basically just calling a city.

1737
01:37:45,119 --> 01:37:47,359
It's the whole time. And then I did a stream

1738
01:37:47,359 --> 01:37:52,600
prior to that on the False Union. So yeah, that's

1739
01:37:52,800 --> 01:37:54,439
that's really all that's going on with me. You can

1740
01:37:54,479 --> 01:37:57,279
get my books, of course, signed copies in the shop

1741
01:37:57,319 --> 01:37:58,600
at Jason alsos dot com.

1742
01:37:59,520 --> 01:38:01,479
Speaker 1: Sounds good. Thanks so much for coming on, Jay, I

1743
01:38:01,479 --> 01:38:04,600
really appreciate it. If y'all want to watch this after

1744
01:38:04,640 --> 01:38:06,279
the fact, I'm gonna leave it up for a little

1745
01:38:06,279 --> 01:38:07,880
bit and then I'm gonna market members. But if you

1746
01:38:07,920 --> 01:38:11,199
want to consider becoming a member, really helps out the channel. Again.

1747
01:38:11,239 --> 01:38:12,960
Would love to have you back at some point, Jay,

1748
01:38:12,960 --> 01:38:14,600
And at some point, you know, I can pop on

1749
01:38:14,680 --> 01:38:16,239
your show and we can chat about something. Sure.

1750
01:38:16,279 --> 01:38:18,319
Speaker 2: Absolutely, All right.

1751
01:38:18,159 --> 01:38:19,920
Speaker 1: Y'all, thank you so much for watching. You'll have a

1752
01:38:19,920 --> 01:38:31,000
good day.