Speaker 1: You're listening to Petlifradio dot com and.
Speaker 2: Good morning or go down afternoon to all of you
out there in radio land. You are here with doctor
Jeff Werber for the next thirty minutes or so here
on pet Life Radios Ask the vets with doctor Jeff.
And this is a show for you. It's a show
for you and your pets. It's a show just to
pick my brain. Listen to me. If no one's gonna
pick my brain. I'm going to talk about something and
just hopefully sort of enhance strengthen that bond between you
and your pet. The best way to do that is
to understand how they work, whether it's behavior, whether it's
a medical issue, whether it's a surgical issue. I want
to be here to help you, just to ask me questions.
You know. I know veterinarians are busy and maybe get
the time that you need. We may not understand something else,
you know. I have to say it's sometimes an art
to be able to and don't take this the wrong
way to anybody out there, but as we say, dumb
me up because you don't have the knowledge of the
terms and the rationale behind certain treatments, because you never
went to venerate school, So we tried. What I like
to do is try to make it so easy for
you to understand. So if you have a decision to make,
or it might be a tough decision, we can help
you along the way.
Speaker 3: A number of ways to get a hold of me.
Speaker 2: First of all, the most the easiest is to give
us a call at eight seven seven three eight five
eight eight A two once again toll free eight seven
seven three eight five eight eight eight two. You can
also join us online. You click on go on to
pet Life Radio, click on the ask the best with
Doctor Jeff tab on the left and you will be
into our page and you could just join in on
the conversation. And lastly, if you're not currently in the
computer on pet Life Radio, you can also just send
an email to Dr Jeff. That's doctor Jeff at Petlife
radio dot com and Mark in our studio back in Florida.
We'll send that to me asap real time and we
can talk about it that way. Now, of course, we're
here with the help of our sponsors, protests, pet products,
con toys, So go ahead and send me a question,
ask me anything, and we'll go from there. Now, it's
interesting this week, we had a very very interesting question
from someone who clearly is pretty knowledgeable, and I'm going
to put my little glasses on. It comes from Victoria
and she writes HI new treatment options for canine B
cell lymphoma called T cell infusion therapy, And now we're
talking very very new stuff out there, T cell infusion therapy,
and it's really really it's a cool concept and what
we're learning, you know, it's funny. I have to go
back one of my mentors when I was in veterinary school,
doctor Barbara Kitchell. She was doing her medicine residency at
UC Davis while I was there. She then went on
to do her residency in oncology, also under the internal
medicine umbrella, so she was double boarded. And then since
that wasn't enough for Barb, she then went on to Stanford.
So we're not we're talking no dummy here for a
PhD in comparative oncology. So we are talking an extremely
high power driven individual. And I saw her at a
conference and she was, you know, a very good friend
going through that school, and I told her about this
one case I had, and knowing here that she's not
only board certified in introm medicine. She's board certified in veterancology,
and then she went goes and gets a PhD in
comparative oncology. She'd be a perfect person to kind of
explain to me what happened here and basically to give
you a little rundown on the case, because it was
really fascinating.
Speaker 3: I had a five.
Speaker 2: Year old rottweiler come in with advanced bone cancer. Now
bone cancer called osteo sarcoma is really a lousy diagnosis.
It is going to be pretty much one hundred percent fatal.
And the best we had at the time was amputation
and a particular chemo protocol that might buy us. Oh god,
any we're from twelve to nineteen months, I mean, not
really a good prognosis for this dog and the owner
it was a big boy, and she did not want
to amputate.
Speaker 3: That was out of the question.
Speaker 2: You can also do some what we call palliative radiation
that will shrink the tumor a little bit, by us
a little time of a decent quality, and hopefully allow
the dog to keep its leg. But she had read
online and this is one of those things where where
I always I'm so hesitant when people.
Speaker 3: Say, oh, where'd you hear about that?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 2: I got it on the internet, because, as I often say,
the internet is truly it's probably one of the newest
number one sources of information, but unfortunately it's also one
of the number one sources of misinformation.
Speaker 3: But she read this thing as a protocol.
Speaker 2: It was a naturopathic protocol, came from some naturopathic veterinarian.
It was a mega vitamin therapy plan and some herbs,
and she brought it to me.
Speaker 3: I said, look, I don't even know if it's going
to work.
Speaker 2: It. I don't know why it's gonna work, but you know,
if it's good for you, let's do it now. Mind you,
when you get your definitive diagnosis, which we did, it
often requires a bone box. Now you can get a
defendidyt You can get a pretty good idea just on
that radiographs alone and the rapid growth. But she wanted
to know exactly what it was. We did the bone biopsy.
Now you have this tumor picture of this. You have
to make a little hole in the skin right to
do your bone biopsy. So, as you know, we sew
it up and this dog would be coming in every week,
and the stitches continue to rip open because the tumor
was getting so big. I mean, it was three times
the size of the regular leg. So it was a challenge.
But we're doing this megavitamin therapy, the herbs, he's coming in,
We're doing this ivy drip, and obviously, for the first
several few weeks, I'm seeing nothing other than continuing to
have to re suture the original incision site where we
took the biopsy from. And then something miraculous happened by
week four, not that it was gone away, but I
did not have to resow the skin. It actually stopped growing.
And then by week five, I'm getting a little loose
skin around this thing. I'm taking long story short, this
dog literally went into full remission. If you took an
X ray. Three years later, the dog finally lived to eleven,
which is pretty good for a rottweiler with no bone cancer.
And I am amazed. I'm saying, there's no way that
this therapy could really do this. I had used it
two other throughout three other times, once on a Golden retriever.
Now I mind you on the Golden retriever. Because we
had so much evidence and met all the radiographic criteria.
We did not do a bone boxy, but I did
employ the same treatment and guess what, it also resolved,
and then two or three other cases it didn't. So again,
in anything, just because it works for one patient, that
doesn't mean diddley. But I will tell you that I
witnessed personally my own cases two of.
Speaker 3: These success stories.
Speaker 2: So I'm so intrigued that when I bumped into doctor
Kitchell Barb at a conference, I said, Barbara, I gotta
tell you, And I told her all about the story
I just told you, and she says, I'm not surprised.
I go to You're not surprised, he goes, the first
thing that I could tell you, the most important thing
I learned in my PhD program is.
Speaker 3: How little we know about cancer.
Speaker 2: So here she is double boorded in veterinary, internal medicine
and oncology, a PhD, and she's admitting how little we
know about cancer. And she thought even then that she
said that the future of cancer treatment is going to
be immunotherapy the immune system. And what she thinks is
that all the vitamins and the antioxidists and everything we
did to this body enhanced these two dogs that were
successful in their own immune system and it wasn't obviously,
it wasn't a mega vitamins that killed the cancer, but
it was enough to stimulate the dog's own immune system
to beat the cancer. So let's talk about this in
this T cell infusion therapy. T cells are one of
the cells that often is afflicted with cancer. And as
we say, there's B cell imp foma this is called lymphosarcoma,
and there's T cell them foma. We say B is
bad and TA is terrible. So when you have B
cellom foma, which fortunately is the more common and also
it is a little bit more responsive to treatment, and
we have a lot of different modalities and treatments so
we can get these dogs into emission.
Speaker 3: But here's the theory.
Speaker 2: This is some research that's coming out of Texas A
and M University School of Terine Medicine. What they do
is when when you give chemotherapy to a dog or person,
you are literally obliterating the immune system as well as
trying to kill.
Speaker 3: The rapidly dividing cells.
Speaker 2: And typically cancer cells are dividing more rapidly than regular cells.
So the goal is to give enough chemo to not
completely eradicate all the cells, but at the very least
try to slow down or kill the very rapidly dividing
So before chemo they start killing off. They save some
T cells, take a few T cells out.
Speaker 3: All right.
Speaker 2: Now they do the chemo, which is going to destroy
even other T cells, and it's going to suppress the
immune system a bit, in which case there's no ability
for the body to fight its own cancer.
Speaker 3: Ah.
Speaker 2: So what do they do after the pet the dog
is in remission. They infuse back those T cells that
were taken out before the chemo, before they had a
chance to be weakened or destroyed by the chemotherapy, along
with all the other cells. And now the bodies healthy,
strong T cells are able to beat the cancer because
what we realize is that when the chemotherapy does work
on the cancer cells, it increases their antigenicity on their
cell wall, which means it makes them more attackable by
a healthy T cell. And that's what healthy T cells do,
they attack the bad cells. So in essence, we are
harvesting the healthy T cells before any chemo. We are
obliterating as much as we can from the chemo and
increasing the antigenicity along the wall of the cancer cells
the B cells, and by infusing now back in the
healthy T cells, it is the T cells that are
killing the cancer. The dogs own T cells and not
the chemo. So it really is fascinating that the early
reports of this modality have been extremely positive, and I
think that is such a cool thing. And I think
that these are going to be some of the advancements
that we are going to employ in venting medicine, and
that will also probably work with human medicine as well.
And this is how sort of we grow together.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 3: It's interesting.
Speaker 2: Years and years ago, and I'm talking thirty forty years ago,
veterinar medicine was truly not as sophisticated. We didn't have
the budgets and the schools to do this kind of research,
and therefore we always lagged behind and we would borrow
or steal, if you will, treatment modalities, drugs, etc. From
the human side, piggybacking on their research. But now veterini
medicine is in the forefront, and you'll see, especially when
it comes to things like vaccine, there are going to
be many modalities that may be discovered first on the
veterinary side, and then they're going to try them and
see how they work as well if they do on
the human side. So I think it's pretty cool. So anyway,
time for that break, Victory. I want to thank you
for the question, A great question. I hope you're listening.
If not, and you play this later. If you have
any questions, you can get a hold of me directly
at DRGF Doctor Jeff at petlifradio dot com.
Speaker 3: And don't go away. We're going to be right back
after this short break.
Speaker 1: We'll be right back right after these messages. Stay tuned.
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Speaker 2: Com, And welcome back to here with Live with Doctor Jeff.
Wore where your host here on pet Live Radios asked
the vets with Doctor Jeff once again, I want to
thank Victory for that amazing question and uh hopefully that
if if this is your pet, you're dealing with this
so you might want to consider it right now. I
think it's only being done at Texas A and M.
That might make a bit difficult because these cells have
to be removed and harvested, the tea cells, the healthy
tea cells, et cetera.
Speaker 3: But the best of luck.
Speaker 2: A couple of other things I just got back from.
I was in New York last week. I was on
Al Roker's weather show, First Thing in the morning, wake
Up with Al.
Speaker 3: It was great.
Speaker 2: We talked about some summertime tips for pets. We also
had a chance to talk to them about here.
Speaker 3: A couple of weeks ago.
Speaker 2: And one thing that I know I have to sort
of reiterate because it comes up every single time we
do anything about summer pets for tips, and that is
dogs or cats left in cars, and I just have
to tell you it is unacceptable. It is extremely dangerous,
even if you park in the shade. And I'll tell
you why. You know, just some basic physiology. I'm sure
you guys all know this that dogs and cats only
sweat from two locations on their body, one the pads
of the feet to the tip of the nose.
Speaker 3: That's it.
Speaker 2: So they don't have the e crime, which is the
sweatland that we have over most of our bodies that
helps us regulate top body temperature and as you know,
when we get very hot, perspire. So the problem is
with dogs is that because the surface area of the
pads and the nose is not enough to regulate that
body temperature to normalize their heat, what do they do?
Speaker 3: They pant?
Speaker 2: Now, if you ever put your hand, remember dog's body
temperature normal one hundred and a half, use the one
hundred and one to two.
Speaker 3: As you get really hot, it might go to one
hundred and three.
Speaker 2: So I want you to put your hand in front
of a panting dog's mouth and feel the breath the
air coming out.
Speaker 3: And it's hot, it's very warm.
Speaker 2: So it's not necessarily the ambient temperature outside that is
always contributing to this problem. It's being in a car
with the windows pretty much up. Yeah, you might be
a bit, but that's not gonna be enough, and they
are getting anxious. Sometimes it's not even that they're overheating.
Speaker 3: Anxious, they're just anxious.
Speaker 2: They're in this car and they start to pant, and
the more they pant, the warmer the car gets. The
warmer the car gets, the hotter they get, the more
they have to pant. So you can clearly see this
vicious cycle happening before your eyes and the inside of
that car, between the combination of the dog, the anxiety,
the heat that he or she is generating, plus being
outside even though it's in the shade, it's still hot,
and before you know it, fifteen minutes, twelve minutes, you
have a car that's one hundred and fourteen hundred and
twenty degrees. That is like a sweat box. And that's
why these dogs overheat, and that's why these dogs die.
Speaker 3: So never a good idea.
Speaker 2: I mean, if you want to leave them in the
car in a covered garage with an air conditioner on
for five minutes.
Speaker 3: You could probably do that.
Speaker 2: But just to leave them in and think, well, no,
it's in the shade, I parked under tree, or I
even park in a garage and I have the windows cracked,
makes no difference.
Speaker 3: So just be really, really really careful. Now, coming up.
Speaker 2: On Saturday, as we all know, is the fourth of July,
and you know I always I think we talked about
this last year as well, and I wanted to remind
you all that be very careful if your dogs seem
or cats seem to be very freaked out by those
loud sounds, whether it's Worth of July fireworks, whether it's
the thunder and lightning, whatever it is, construction, sonic booms. Many,
many dogs have a very difficult time with this, and
it's up to us to make sure to keep them
as comfortable as we can. If you have dogs that
you know are miserable, then you might want to consider
talk to your veterinarian. Of course, some sort of mild
relaxing agent. It could be something very naturopathic, something like
for example, our pro sense calming tabs that are basically,
oh it's a camameal and valerian root and passion flower.
There's a product out there called zil keene, which is
basically the calming agent that is derived from milk protein.
We all know and that the observations have been made
for years that nursing puppies and kittens and even nursing.
Speaker 3: Babies overall calmness about them. And why is that.
Speaker 2: Well, there's actually there's a substance in milk protein and
caseine that has a natural calming effect, something like benadrula.
We don't really take advantage of benajol. We don't use
it for allergies because histamine is not a major mediator
of the canine allergic response. Therefore, anti histamine to battle
theology is not going to be helpful. However, older antihistamine, steifen, hydromine, chlorophenaramine,
the ones that are drowsy, they work very well. And
this is you know, so you can avoid things like
xanax and valume and acepromazine. More of the drugs and
these work well. But we mentioned this last year, we'll
do it again. The best thing to do is prevent
this behavior through behavior modification. That is where we exercise
some common sense. We want to desensitize our pets to
these sounds, and then we want to counter condition them.
We want them to actually, if it's possible, look forward
to it.
Speaker 3: How do we do it?
Speaker 2: I want you to go online, and you have enough
time to do it this time, unless you have a really,
really really good dog, or you've been sort of starting
this already and you only have a few days left.
But what I want you to do is go online
and get a sound effects tape CD. You can download
them very easily, and you want to get the sound
effect for fireworks. What you do is you sit there
with your dog and his favorite treat, and he's at
your feet, he's on your lap, you're petting, and you
start playing the volume so low that you don't even
hear it, but they do and just go, oh my god,
you such a good point, and give them a treat
and turn off your computer. And that's less than one
and the next day come back, same scenario, but now
you're gonna play a little bit louder and a little
bit longer, and then you stop and you go, oh
my god, you're so good, and hugs and kisses in
a treat. And you continue to do this daily or
every other day, increasing the volume, until the dog is
going to now associate the a loud noises with hugs
kisses in a tree. So instead of being fearful, they'll
probably come running to you and say, okay, give the
noise in the background, where's my treat?
Speaker 3: And you can actually get them.
Speaker 2: To I wouldn't say it like it, but they'll start
making the association that by this is that allows sounds
are pretty cool.
Speaker 3: I mean it's raining and thunder.
Speaker 2: I'm having a blaste because I'm getting my streets instead
of running and hiding. And the other mistake that we
always make is when we have a dog that we
know is fearful.
Speaker 3: So what happens The noise starts, and what do they do?
Your tail is between their legs.
Speaker 2: They start running to you for comfort, or they go
hiding under the bed or under a coffee table, whatever
it is.
Speaker 7: What do we do?
Speaker 3: Because we love our pets so much, we call them
over and say, oh, you poor thing, come here a cases,
So what are you doing?
Speaker 2: Then you're actually reinforcing the fearful behavior. They're gonna learn
to be fearful because they know that way. They're that way,
you're gonna call them over and give them smooches and
give them a treat and hug them. Well, duh, that's
a snow breaker. Of course they're gonna continue to show fear.
So it's a short notice. But you have a week.
Speaker 3: We have all week at least you can. You can
still get.
Speaker 2: Honest, but you want to not show, not exhibit that
to reinforce the fearful behavior. So anyway, I want to
thank you for joining me here on this glorious Sunday
here it's still morning here in the West Coast and
the East Coast. Again, during the week, if you think
of something you want to talk about, something you want
to share, a story, something about this happened with you
and your pet, or anything, please send it to me
here at doctor zeph pet Life Radio, and all the
even be forwarded to me. And once again next week,
hopefully when you get the courage and we're gonna talk
about how well your pet did or didn't do with
all the fireworks, aren't.
Speaker 3: The fourth of July eight seven, three eighty eight, eight
e two. Once again I want to thank.
Speaker 2: Pro sent Pet Products and com for sponsoring us, and
we'll see you.
Speaker 3: Here next week.
Speaker 1: Let's talk pets every week on demand only on petlife
Radio dot com