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That's Chumbuck 23 00:00:56.920 --> 00:00:57.960 Casino dot com. 24 00:00:57.759 --> 00:01:01.000 No'll producess avery. I lost e terms. It is at play. 25 00:01:02.280 --> 00:01:03.679 Block to Padian. 26 00:01:12.719 --> 00:01:16.159 You are now listening to True Murder, the most shocking 27 00:01:16.239 --> 00:01:19.280 killers in true crime history and the authors that have 28 00:01:19.359 --> 00:01:26.640 written about them Gasey, Bundy, Dahmer, The Nightstalker, DTK. Every 29 00:01:26.680 --> 00:01:30.359 week another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and 30 00:01:30.480 --> 00:01:34.640 infamous killers in true crime history. True Murder with your 31 00:01:34.680 --> 00:01:50.719 host journalist and author Dan Zupansky, Good Evening, a successful 32 00:01:50.840 --> 00:01:54.840 entertainment executive making two million dollars a year his former 33 00:01:54.879 --> 00:01:58.400 beauty queen wife. They're two sons on the fast track 34 00:01:58.680 --> 00:02:03.400 to success, but it was all a facade. The killing 35 00:02:03.439 --> 00:02:06.640 of Jose and Kitty Menendez on a quiet Sunday evening 36 00:02:06.640 --> 00:02:09.759 in Beverly Hills didn't make the cover of People magazine 37 00:02:10.159 --> 00:02:13.599 until the arrest of their sons seven months later, and 38 00:02:13.680 --> 00:02:17.759 the case developed an intense cult following. When the first 39 00:02:17.840 --> 00:02:21.840 Menendez trial began in July nineteen ninety three, the public 40 00:02:21.919 --> 00:02:25.000 was convinced that Lyle and Eric were a pair of greedy, 41 00:02:25.080 --> 00:02:29.199 rich kids who had killed loving the voted parents, but 42 00:02:29.280 --> 00:02:33.240 the real story remained buried underneath years of dark secrets 43 00:02:34.080 --> 00:02:39.159 until now. Journalist Robert Wren, who originally reported on the 44 00:02:39.199 --> 00:02:42.360 case for the Miami Herald and Playboy, has followed the 45 00:02:42.360 --> 00:02:45.639 Menendez murders from the beginning and has continued investigating and 46 00:02:45.719 --> 00:02:50.000 interviewing key sources for twenty eight years. Rand is the 47 00:02:50.039 --> 00:02:53.280 only reporter who covered the original investigation as well as 48 00:02:53.280 --> 00:02:58.000 both trials. With unparalleled access to the Menendez family and 49 00:02:58.039 --> 00:03:01.759 their history, including interviews with both brothers before and after 50 00:03:01.800 --> 00:03:06.199 their arrest, Rand has uncovered extraordinary details that certainly would 51 00:03:06.240 --> 00:03:09.039 have changed the fate of the brother's first degree murder 52 00:03:09.080 --> 00:03:14.840 conviction and sentencing to life without parole. Rand shares these intimate, 53 00:03:14.960 --> 00:03:19.000 never before revealed findings, including a deeply disturbing history of 54 00:03:19.080 --> 00:03:23.719 child abuse and sexual emolestation in the Menendez family going 55 00:03:23.759 --> 00:03:27.719 back generations, and the shocking admission O. J. Simpson made 56 00:03:27.759 --> 00:03:30.639 to one of the Menendez brothers when they were inmates 57 00:03:30.680 --> 00:03:34.479 at the La County Men's Central Jail. The book that 58 00:03:34.520 --> 00:03:38.719 we're featuring this evening is The Menendez Murders, The shocking, 59 00:03:38.800 --> 00:03:42.159 untold story of the Menendez Family and the killings that 60 00:03:42.280 --> 00:03:45.520 stunned the nation, With my special guest journalist and author 61 00:03:46.039 --> 00:03:48.680 Robert Rand. Welcome to the program and thank you very 62 00:03:48.719 --> 00:03:49.840 much for greeing this interview. 63 00:03:50.199 --> 00:03:54.560 Robert Rand Hello, Dan, thank you very much for having 64 00:03:54.560 --> 00:03:54.879 me on. 65 00:03:56.120 --> 00:04:00.759 Thank you very much. This is an incredible, incredible book, 66 00:04:00.840 --> 00:04:05.360 and finally we get to talk about this incredible case, 67 00:04:05.560 --> 00:04:09.439 one of the most shocking cases in true crime history. 68 00:04:10.919 --> 00:04:14.120 It's a very complex I was just going to say, 69 00:04:14.120 --> 00:04:18.120 it's a very complex story with many different levels, and 70 00:04:19.240 --> 00:04:22.959 it took me thirty years to really compile this entire story. 71 00:04:24.240 --> 00:04:30.240 Yes, incredible. Tell us where you were working professionally at 72 00:04:30.240 --> 00:04:34.759 the time this has occurred. August twentieth, nineteen eighty nine. 73 00:04:37.120 --> 00:04:41.079 In August of nineteen eighty nine, I was a freelance 74 00:04:41.160 --> 00:04:46.360 journalist writing six thousand word feature stories for the Sunday 75 00:04:46.360 --> 00:04:51.120 magazine of the Miami Herald, and a few weeks before 76 00:04:51.279 --> 00:04:54.759 the night of the Menendus murders, I was in Las 77 00:04:54.839 --> 00:04:58.000 Vegas at a trade show for the home video business 78 00:04:58.120 --> 00:05:02.879 called the Video Software Dealers Convention, and I was researching 79 00:05:03.000 --> 00:05:05.839 just a general story about the home video business, which 80 00:05:05.920 --> 00:05:10.639 was an enormous business in the nineteen eighties. And the 81 00:05:10.680 --> 00:05:15.680 morning after Jose and Kitty died, I received a phone 82 00:05:15.720 --> 00:05:19.079 call in the newsroom at the Miami Herald from a 83 00:05:19.120 --> 00:05:21.680 friend of mine, Steve Apple, who was the editor of 84 00:05:21.759 --> 00:05:25.040 a trade magazine for the video business, and he told 85 00:05:25.120 --> 00:05:30.480 me that a high profile home video executive, Jose Menendez, 86 00:05:30.759 --> 00:05:34.160 and his wife had been blown away the previous evening 87 00:05:34.439 --> 00:05:38.920 in Beverly Hills, and I knew that. I quickly found 88 00:05:38.920 --> 00:05:42.000 out that Jose Menendez was Cuban American, and so that 89 00:05:42.120 --> 00:05:45.920 made it a potential interest to people in Miami. And 90 00:05:46.199 --> 00:05:49.639 the initial media coverage of the Menendez murders was really 91 00:05:50.600 --> 00:05:53.360 only on the national media radar for two or three 92 00:05:53.439 --> 00:05:58.240 days after the murders, and then it just there was 93 00:05:58.240 --> 00:06:02.000 some local LA coverage. There were seven months between the 94 00:06:02.160 --> 00:06:06.519 night of the murders and March eighth, nineteen ninety, when 95 00:06:06.600 --> 00:06:10.720 Lyle Menendez was arrested in Beverly Hills. 96 00:06:11.439 --> 00:06:16.720 Right now, what did you do to start these articles? 97 00:06:16.959 --> 00:06:20.160 I mean, obviously these articles progressed to where we are today, 98 00:06:20.199 --> 00:06:22.839 as he said, almost thirty years later, tell us how 99 00:06:22.879 --> 00:06:26.519 you started. What was the beginning of those articles and 100 00:06:26.560 --> 00:06:28.879 your research therein. 101 00:06:28.720 --> 00:06:32.360 Sure, well, after I got this phone call from my 102 00:06:32.439 --> 00:06:35.920 friend tipping me off, you know that Jose Menendez, a 103 00:06:36.040 --> 00:06:41.959 high profofile home video executive, had been killed, I did 104 00:06:42.000 --> 00:06:44.240 a little research and found out that he has sister 105 00:06:44.720 --> 00:06:47.199 who lived in West Palm Beach, about an hour and 106 00:06:47.240 --> 00:06:50.920 a half north of Miami. And this is nineteen eighty nine, 107 00:06:51.759 --> 00:06:53.800 you know, before the internet, no cell phones. I got 108 00:06:53.800 --> 00:06:56.079 out the West Palm Beach phone book and I looked 109 00:06:56.160 --> 00:07:02.959 up the sister, Jose Menendez and called her up. And 110 00:07:03.199 --> 00:07:06.560 my call was five percent to make a condolence call 111 00:07:06.800 --> 00:07:09.360 and ninety five percent to possibly hit on her for 112 00:07:09.439 --> 00:07:15.240 a story. And after I introduced myself, Marta Cano, the 113 00:07:15.279 --> 00:07:18.879 aunt of Eric and Linel Menendez, immediately invited me to 114 00:07:18.920 --> 00:07:21.959 come up to West Palm Beach and meet her, and 115 00:07:22.000 --> 00:07:28.240 we spent four hours that afternoon discussing the Menenda's family history, 116 00:07:28.279 --> 00:07:32.120 which was a fascinating story. The family originally was from Spain. 117 00:07:33.240 --> 00:07:38.000 They had been very poor, became wealthy, lost everything, immigrated 118 00:07:38.000 --> 00:07:43.240 to Cuba, had no money, became successful, wealthy all over again, 119 00:07:43.639 --> 00:07:46.519 and then Castro came into power and they had to 120 00:07:47.040 --> 00:07:51.439 leave Cuba and the family restarted for a third time 121 00:07:51.680 --> 00:07:56.040 in the States. Jose Menendus arrived in the US at 122 00:07:56.079 --> 00:07:58.720 the age of sixteen. He had nothing. He had been 123 00:07:58.800 --> 00:08:03.319 leading a country club lifestyle, upper middle class, very comfortable 124 00:08:03.319 --> 00:08:06.560 lifestyle in Cuba, and suddenly he was living with distant 125 00:08:06.600 --> 00:08:11.160 relatives in an attic in northeast Pennsylvania, and once again 126 00:08:11.199 --> 00:08:14.079 in the States, the family became successful all over again. 127 00:08:14.839 --> 00:08:18.759 So I went back to my editor at the Tropic 128 00:08:18.839 --> 00:08:21.879 magazine Sunny Magazine of the Herald and said, look, we 129 00:08:21.879 --> 00:08:24.720 don't know much about this murder investigation, and the police 130 00:08:24.720 --> 00:08:28.240 were being very tight, but I said, but I said, 131 00:08:28.279 --> 00:08:32.159 this family has a very interesting story, and so I 132 00:08:32.159 --> 00:08:35.360 think we should do a biography of Jose Menendez Rags 133 00:08:35.360 --> 00:08:39.679 to Rich's Cuban American story ends in a terrible tragedy. 134 00:08:40.279 --> 00:08:43.879 And my editor liked that idea, and I began my 135 00:08:44.039 --> 00:08:45.639 initial reporting on the case. 136 00:08:48.720 --> 00:08:53.759 How athletic was Jose and how much of a factor 137 00:08:53.879 --> 00:08:55.879 was that in this story. 138 00:08:57.360 --> 00:09:04.120 Well, Jose Menendez was a star athlete who was actually 139 00:09:04.159 --> 00:09:12.360 a swimmer in high school in Pennsylvania, and he was 140 00:09:12.399 --> 00:09:18.600 also a tennis player, and so he was, you know, 141 00:09:18.759 --> 00:09:22.519 very athletic himself. And when his sons were born, he 142 00:09:22.559 --> 00:09:26.440 wanted his sons to become star athletes, and so he 143 00:09:26.519 --> 00:09:30.720 spent a lot of time with them. You know, he 144 00:09:30.960 --> 00:09:35.799 initially he was interested in them becoming competitive swimmers, and 145 00:09:35.879 --> 00:09:39.039 then he switched his focus and the folks and the 146 00:09:39.039 --> 00:09:43.799 brothers to tennis, and both brothers became nationally ranked tennis players. 147 00:09:44.200 --> 00:09:46.200 Was Aman used to wake them up at four in 148 00:09:46.200 --> 00:09:49.039 the morning and have them hit balls for three hours 149 00:09:49.080 --> 00:09:50.120 before they would go to school. 150 00:09:50.159 --> 00:09:56.799 When they were little kids, tell us about Mary Louise 151 00:09:57.240 --> 00:10:02.320 they called their kiddie, and how they met and their relationship. 152 00:10:03.399 --> 00:10:07.879 Well. Kitty Menendez was born in a suburb of Chicago, 153 00:10:08.639 --> 00:10:12.720 and she went to college at Southern Illinois University, and 154 00:10:13.200 --> 00:10:16.840 Jose and Kitty Menandez shared several classes. One of their 155 00:10:16.879 --> 00:10:20.039 favorite classes was a debate a debate class where they 156 00:10:20.120 --> 00:10:23.200 used to debate each other and they began a romantic 157 00:10:23.639 --> 00:10:28.600 relationship and they wanted to get married, but Jose was 158 00:10:28.720 --> 00:10:32.240 under eighteen and in Illinois you had to be eighteen 159 00:10:32.279 --> 00:10:36.440 to get married or you had to have the permission 160 00:10:37.039 --> 00:10:40.480 of your parents. And so Jose and Kitty Menendez Elope 161 00:10:40.799 --> 00:10:44.159 went to Indiana and didn't tell their family until after 162 00:10:44.200 --> 00:10:49.200 they were married. His father was somewhat upset. His father, 163 00:10:49.200 --> 00:10:53.159 whose nickname was Peppine his real name was also Jose, 164 00:10:54.440 --> 00:10:56.919 But Jose Men's father told them, you're too young to 165 00:10:56.960 --> 00:11:01.200 get married, and you know you shouldn't do this, but 166 00:11:01.759 --> 00:11:04.000 Jose had made up his mind decided he wanted to 167 00:11:04.039 --> 00:11:08.639 do it, and the young couple did get married, and 168 00:11:08.919 --> 00:11:13.039 then the family was happy after they kept the secrets 169 00:11:13.039 --> 00:11:15.440 for a few months, but the family was happy after 170 00:11:15.480 --> 00:11:16.279 everything came out. 171 00:11:19.320 --> 00:11:23.440 Now, tell us how they eventually get to again where 172 00:11:23.440 --> 00:11:28.039 he's this executive at Coronicle Pictures, producer of the Rambo 173 00:11:28.080 --> 00:11:31.600 and Terminator movies. Tell us how they get finally to 174 00:11:32.080 --> 00:11:37.159 where they are in Beverly Hills. What's the route? 175 00:11:38.559 --> 00:11:43.080 It's an interesting story because after Jose and Kitty Minas 176 00:11:43.120 --> 00:11:46.399 were married, they moved to New York City, where Jose 177 00:11:46.720 --> 00:11:52.840 was continuing school at Queen's College, and Jose and Kitty 178 00:11:52.879 --> 00:11:57.639 were broke. They really were just barely getting by. Kitty 179 00:11:57.759 --> 00:12:01.840 was doing some work as a substitute teacher. Jose was 180 00:12:02.200 --> 00:12:05.279 actually when he was in college, he was selling encyclopedias 181 00:12:05.360 --> 00:12:09.039 door to door. There was one anecdote I heard from 182 00:12:09.039 --> 00:12:13.320 the family in which he sold encyclopedia to a woman, 183 00:12:13.360 --> 00:12:17.559 an elderly woman, who after the day the evening after 184 00:12:17.600 --> 00:12:19.879 he sold it to her, he felt guilty. He didn't 185 00:12:19.879 --> 00:12:22.080 think she could really afford it, and he went back 186 00:12:22.120 --> 00:12:26.600 the next day and you took the encyclopedia back and 187 00:12:27.000 --> 00:12:30.320 gave refunded the woman her money. He was also working 188 00:12:30.399 --> 00:12:36.480 as a dishwasher at the twenty one Club in New York, 189 00:12:37.159 --> 00:12:41.879 and so they were really struggling financially. Jose graduated from 190 00:12:41.960 --> 00:12:45.919 Queen's College and was able to land the job with 191 00:12:46.039 --> 00:12:48.799 Cooper's what was then Cooper's Library and one of the 192 00:12:48.799 --> 00:12:56.080 big eight accounting firms, and from there he went through 193 00:12:56.440 --> 00:12:59.759 a couple other jobs as an executive with different companies, 194 00:13:00.480 --> 00:13:03.120 and then one of the biggest jobs in his career 195 00:13:03.320 --> 00:13:07.120 was when he became head of US operations for Hurtz Rannakar. 196 00:13:07.759 --> 00:13:11.759 And after a couple of years of success as Hurts RCA, 197 00:13:11.919 --> 00:13:16.840 the corporate owner moved Jose to one of the top 198 00:13:16.879 --> 00:13:22.360 executives with RCA Records, and so Jose was hoping to 199 00:13:22.360 --> 00:13:29.480 become the top executive, the CEO of RCA Records, and 200 00:13:29.519 --> 00:13:33.039 when that didn't happen, he pulled the cord on a 201 00:13:33.039 --> 00:13:38.080 golden parachute, walked away with a million dollars and began 202 00:13:38.159 --> 00:13:41.080 looking for some type of new work in the entertainment business. 203 00:13:41.879 --> 00:13:46.399 And one of the offers that came his way was 204 00:13:46.559 --> 00:13:49.799 to run the home video division of Cara Coole Pictures. 205 00:13:50.440 --> 00:13:53.399 Care Cole Pictures was one of the hottest independent studios 206 00:13:53.440 --> 00:13:57.960 in the nineteen eighties. They released the Rambo movies starring 207 00:13:57.960 --> 00:14:03.919 Sylvester Stallone. They released the famous Sharon Stone movie Basic Instinct, 208 00:14:04.720 --> 00:14:08.440 and in the nineteen eighties the home video divisions had 209 00:14:08.480 --> 00:14:11.159 become a gold mine for the studios. It was a 210 00:14:11.200 --> 00:14:15.360 new business. It was really kind of found money and 211 00:14:15.399 --> 00:14:19.480 that's the way people were consuming movies long before streaming. 212 00:14:20.240 --> 00:14:27.600 People had, you know, home had VCRs beta machines in 213 00:14:27.639 --> 00:14:32.240 their homes and played movies. And so Jose and Kitty 214 00:14:32.279 --> 00:14:35.559 Menendez had lived in Princeton, New Jersey for twenty years 215 00:14:35.559 --> 00:14:37.960 with their sons, Eric and Lyle, and they picked up 216 00:14:38.000 --> 00:14:41.440 the family and moved out to California. At one point, 217 00:14:41.480 --> 00:14:46.960 Jose Menendez talked with his wife Kitty and suggested that 218 00:14:47.000 --> 00:14:50.519 he and Eric come out to California and the Kitty 219 00:14:50.559 --> 00:14:53.519 and Lyle stay in Princeton. Lyle was about to start 220 00:14:53.559 --> 00:14:57.720 school at Princeton University and Kitty man and this was 221 00:14:57.840 --> 00:15:01.960 very involved in charitable groups and the community activities, but 222 00:15:02.159 --> 00:15:05.840 she quickly turned that down. So the entire family moved 223 00:15:05.879 --> 00:15:09.159 to Los Angeles, and initially for a year and a 224 00:15:09.200 --> 00:15:13.399 half they lived in the La suburb of Calabasas, which 225 00:15:13.440 --> 00:15:16.240 nobody had heard of in nineteen eighty nine on a 226 00:15:16.600 --> 00:15:21.320 national international level. But of course we've since, you know, 227 00:15:21.320 --> 00:15:24.759 known Calabasas as the home of the Kardashians. 228 00:15:25.200 --> 00:15:29.399 Right now, you talk about Mary Louise, and she was 229 00:15:29.440 --> 00:15:32.639 involved in some volunteer work, but she was not really 230 00:15:33.200 --> 00:15:35.519 pleased with the move from Princeton. She was pretty happy 231 00:15:35.559 --> 00:15:38.240 with her friends and her life there, wasn't she. 232 00:15:39.559 --> 00:15:43.960 That's correct. Kenny Menendez had, you know, lived in that 233 00:15:44.000 --> 00:15:48.679 community for twenty years. She had a lot of friends, 234 00:15:48.960 --> 00:15:55.240 she was involved in different activities. Jose Menendez. Jose Menendez 235 00:15:55.279 --> 00:15:59.399 had a sister, Terry Perolt, and her husband, Carlos Parolt, 236 00:15:59.480 --> 00:16:01.960 and they had the brals had four daughters, and they 237 00:16:01.960 --> 00:16:05.240 lived down the street from Menanda's. The two families were 238 00:16:05.360 --> 00:16:09.519 very close, and so for Kitty Menendaz, the idea of 239 00:16:09.639 --> 00:16:13.919 uprooting her life and moving to California after twenty years 240 00:16:13.919 --> 00:16:19.120 in Priston was really something she was not She did 241 00:16:19.159 --> 00:16:23.120 not really want to do that, but at a certain point, 242 00:16:23.240 --> 00:16:27.039 after some friction between I was saying Kitty, she did 243 00:16:27.120 --> 00:16:30.600 agree to move to Los Angeles. As I said, the 244 00:16:30.600 --> 00:16:32.600 family lived in Calabasas for about a year and a 245 00:16:32.639 --> 00:16:38.759 half and then Eric Menendez was involved in a fight 246 00:16:39.039 --> 00:16:42.159 at Calabasas High School. Eric was a star player on 247 00:16:42.279 --> 00:16:48.120 the Calabasas High tennis team and one day some members 248 00:16:48.120 --> 00:16:51.159 of the tennis team became involved in a fight with 249 00:16:51.240 --> 00:16:55.840 some gang members and there were some threats being made 250 00:16:55.879 --> 00:16:59.759 against the Menenda's family, and so that was one of 251 00:16:59.759 --> 00:17:04.039 the that Jose and Kitty decided to move to Beverly 252 00:17:04.119 --> 00:17:08.079 Hills and they purchased a mansion on the North Elm 253 00:17:08.160 --> 00:17:11.359 Drive in the fall of nineteen eighty eight and made 254 00:17:11.359 --> 00:17:14.519 that move to Beverly Hills. 255 00:17:15.880 --> 00:17:18.519 Now, how old was Eric at that time and where 256 00:17:18.599 --> 00:17:22.000 was he in terms of his schooling and where was Lyle? 257 00:17:22.319 --> 00:17:25.680 And there's four years almost four years difference in age, 258 00:17:25.680 --> 00:17:29.759 But tell us where they were age wise and education 259 00:17:29.839 --> 00:17:31.480 wise at that point what they were doing. 260 00:17:32.519 --> 00:17:35.640 Sure, well, in the fall of the nineteen eighty eight, 261 00:17:36.440 --> 00:17:42.440 Eric Menendez was would have been seventeen years old, and 262 00:17:43.480 --> 00:17:47.400 he was he had been going to Calabasas High School 263 00:17:48.119 --> 00:17:54.240 and Lyle had just started his first year at Princeton, 264 00:17:55.200 --> 00:18:01.119 and I mentioned the gang fight that Eric was involved 265 00:18:01.119 --> 00:18:04.799 in as being one problem that was going on, you know, 266 00:18:04.880 --> 00:18:09.960 within the family. But there was another incident that took 267 00:18:10.000 --> 00:18:15.880 place in which Eric was involved in some burglaries in Calabasas, 268 00:18:17.319 --> 00:18:21.960 which he committed with a close friend and they were 269 00:18:22.039 --> 00:18:27.920 and actually Eric Menandez the first burgulary he was involved 270 00:18:27.920 --> 00:18:36.000 in the house where they committed the burglary was the 271 00:18:36.039 --> 00:18:41.440 home of the parents of a friend of Eric's and 272 00:18:41.720 --> 00:18:45.119 another friend of his who was involved in the burglary, 273 00:18:45.160 --> 00:18:48.839 Craig Signarelli, and the parents were out of town. They 274 00:18:48.839 --> 00:18:54.079 were in Europe on vacation, and Eric's friend whose parents 275 00:18:54.119 --> 00:18:56.640 were out of town, actually gave Eric and Craig the 276 00:18:56.720 --> 00:19:02.279 combination to his parents safe and they took quite a 277 00:19:02.319 --> 00:19:07.000 bit of property out of the house and include property 278 00:19:07.000 --> 00:19:13.200 worth about one hundred thousand dollars. And so then they 279 00:19:13.319 --> 00:19:19.079 decided to do a second burglary, and Lyle Menendas was 280 00:19:19.200 --> 00:19:21.680 very upset when he heard about this and he didn't 281 00:19:21.720 --> 00:19:26.200 want He was also concerned about the relationship between Eric 282 00:19:26.240 --> 00:19:30.079 Menendez and his best friend, Craig Signorelli. 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And 312 00:20:54.680 --> 00:20:57.200 because you know, there have been some talking among the 313 00:20:57.279 --> 00:21:02.680 kids at Calabasas High, Eric Mann was accused of taking 314 00:21:02.759 --> 00:21:06.680 part in these burglaries, but they were able to shield 315 00:21:07.759 --> 00:21:12.079 Lyle because he was over eighteen, and so Eric basically 316 00:21:12.799 --> 00:21:15.359 took the fall for both of them and was charged 317 00:21:15.400 --> 00:21:21.440 as a juvenile. And most of the property was returned 318 00:21:22.200 --> 00:21:25.440 and Jose Menendez were a check to cover the rest 319 00:21:25.519 --> 00:21:29.359 of the missing property. And that was another reason why 320 00:21:29.440 --> 00:21:32.160 the family moved from Calabasas to Beverly Hills, because this 321 00:21:32.359 --> 00:21:37.680 was very embarrassing for Jose and Kitty Menendez. And Jose 322 00:21:37.839 --> 00:21:41.559 Menendez actually had some thoughts in his head that he 323 00:21:41.720 --> 00:21:45.319 might run for political office in the future. His sister 324 00:21:45.440 --> 00:21:47.559 told me that he wanted to retire from the entertainment 325 00:21:47.599 --> 00:21:51.000 business in five or six years and run for the 326 00:21:51.119 --> 00:21:58.440 US Senate in Florida. So Jose you know, hired a 327 00:21:58.519 --> 00:22:06.839 high profile geraldchaliff and the burglary was the burglary case 328 00:22:07.039 --> 00:22:12.960 was took place in juvenile court and as part of 329 00:22:13.079 --> 00:22:18.640 the resolution of the burglary case, Eric Menandas was ordered 330 00:22:18.680 --> 00:22:23.440 to be evaluated by a therapist, and Kitty Menanda's therapist 331 00:22:23.960 --> 00:22:26.799 recommended the doctor by the name of Jerome Oziel to 332 00:22:26.920 --> 00:22:30.960 do that evaluation with Eric, and so doctor Oziel, who 333 00:22:31.039 --> 00:22:35.079 later plays a major role in the Menendez murder case, 334 00:22:37.079 --> 00:22:40.400 that was his initial contact with the Menendez family to 335 00:22:40.559 --> 00:22:46.440 prepare this evaluation for juvenile court, and doctor Ozield saw 336 00:22:46.680 --> 00:22:52.599 Eric Menendez alone in sessions, but Jose and Kitty Menendez 337 00:22:52.640 --> 00:22:55.960 had doctor Oziel has Eric Menanda's sign a release so 338 00:22:56.079 --> 00:22:58.880 that doctor Oziel could tell them everything that went on 339 00:22:59.039 --> 00:23:02.519 in the therapy session. And there were also some group 340 00:23:02.599 --> 00:23:07.119 sessions with the entire Menendez family. But this burgulary incident, 341 00:23:07.720 --> 00:23:10.440 along with the s gang fight that I mentioned both 342 00:23:10.519 --> 00:23:15.119 contributed motivated the family motivated Jose Menendez to decide to 343 00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:19.079 move the family from Calabasas to Beverly Hills, and so 344 00:23:19.240 --> 00:23:23.559 they actually made the move to Beverly Hills around Thanksgiving 345 00:23:23.680 --> 00:23:27.599 nineteen eighty eight, about eight months before August twentieth, nineteen 346 00:23:27.640 --> 00:23:28.960 eighty nine, the night of the murders. 347 00:23:31.119 --> 00:23:35.240 What did Jose say to was his boys in his 348 00:23:35.480 --> 00:23:39.839 obvious disappointment with them regarding his will. 349 00:23:42.279 --> 00:23:48.640 Well, in the spring of nineteen eighty nine, several months 350 00:23:49.920 --> 00:23:54.960 before the murders, Jose Menendez spoke with Carlos Berrault, his 351 00:23:55.079 --> 00:23:57.960 brother in law, who was the executor of his estate, 352 00:23:58.640 --> 00:24:01.920 and he told Barol that he wanted to remove Eric 353 00:24:01.960 --> 00:24:05.039 and Lyle from his will. He was frustrated with them, 354 00:24:05.200 --> 00:24:09.440 he was disappointed about the situation with the calabas burglaries, 355 00:24:10.119 --> 00:24:13.839 and he just you know, wanted wanted to make a 356 00:24:13.920 --> 00:24:20.920 change in his estate planning. The Jose also had discussions 357 00:24:21.000 --> 00:24:25.759 with his sister Martiano the in West Combach, Florida, and 358 00:24:26.000 --> 00:24:29.799 he wanted to you know, told her that he was 359 00:24:29.880 --> 00:24:35.839 going to be drawing up a new will. But Jose 360 00:24:36.039 --> 00:24:40.319 was a very busy entertainment executive and he never got 361 00:24:40.359 --> 00:24:44.680 around the following through on those plans to create a 362 00:24:44.759 --> 00:24:50.200 new will. And so that this was obviously an important 363 00:24:50.240 --> 00:24:55.119 issue and important information during this testimony during the brothers trials. 364 00:24:57.759 --> 00:25:01.519 Let's talk about August twentieth eighty nine, and you take 365 00:25:01.640 --> 00:25:10.039 us there in nineteen eighty nine, a Sunday night. But 366 00:25:10.200 --> 00:25:13.519 before we get that, there's a phone call to someone 367 00:25:13.680 --> 00:25:21.119 named Perry Berman. Again, I'll maybe get ahead of myself here. 368 00:25:22.000 --> 00:25:24.920 Tell us who Perry Berman is, and then tell us 369 00:25:25.960 --> 00:25:29.680 about the Sunday night, or pardon me, the Sunday in 370 00:25:29.799 --> 00:25:34.119 the day, what happens at the home of the Menendez home, 371 00:25:35.000 --> 00:25:36.599 and then tell us about Perry Berman. 372 00:25:37.720 --> 00:25:41.480 Sure. On Sunday, August twentieth, nineteen eighty nine, it was 373 00:25:41.559 --> 00:25:48.480 a beautiful, warm August afternoon. The Menanda's family was spent 374 00:25:48.559 --> 00:25:52.160 the day around the house. They lived in an eight 375 00:25:52.240 --> 00:25:55.599 thousand square foot mansion on the north Elm Drive, just 376 00:25:55.680 --> 00:26:02.799 below Sunset Boulevard in a very upscale section of Beverly Hills, 377 00:26:03.640 --> 00:26:08.559 and the Menendez mansion had an Olympic sized swimming pool 378 00:26:08.960 --> 00:26:12.079 behind the house, and there was also a tennis court 379 00:26:12.279 --> 00:26:16.119 since both brothers were nationally rereg tennis players and practicing frequently, 380 00:26:17.079 --> 00:26:19.680 so most of the day the family was around the 381 00:26:19.759 --> 00:26:23.559 house in the pool. The brothers were playing tennis, and 382 00:26:23.960 --> 00:26:31.119 at one point the Lyle Menandez had a phone call 383 00:26:31.359 --> 00:26:35.119 Perry Berman, a former tennis coach of the brothers and 384 00:26:35.319 --> 00:26:39.079 a friend of both brothers, and they talked about meeting 385 00:26:39.200 --> 00:26:44.119 up at a food tasting festival in Santa Monica, about 386 00:26:44.240 --> 00:26:48.079 twenty minutes west of Beverly Hills, near the beach, and 387 00:26:49.599 --> 00:26:52.480 so they made tenative plans to meet at this food festival. 388 00:26:54.599 --> 00:27:00.279 The brothers said they wanted to order Chinese food. Kidding 389 00:27:00.359 --> 00:27:05.720 In was cooking fish, she made dinner, and then the 390 00:27:05.839 --> 00:27:11.359 brothers left the house and went to see the movie 391 00:27:11.440 --> 00:27:17.319 Batman at a nearby movie theater, and that was basically 392 00:27:17.440 --> 00:27:21.759 the original narrative of you Know What the Brothers said 393 00:27:21.839 --> 00:27:28.039 took place. Perry Berman was at the food festival waiting 394 00:27:28.119 --> 00:27:31.319 to meet Eric and Lyle, and they never showed up, 395 00:27:32.680 --> 00:27:39.680 and about eleven thirty at night, Lyel Menendez called Perry 396 00:27:39.680 --> 00:27:43.680 Berman and said, where are you? You know, we're here 397 00:27:43.720 --> 00:27:48.640 in Santa Monica at the food festival, and Berman said, well, hey, 398 00:27:48.680 --> 00:27:54.720 It ended about ten o'clock and he said, you know, 399 00:27:54.799 --> 00:27:57.359 I'm just going to bed. Can we talk tomorrow? And 400 00:27:57.839 --> 00:28:00.559 Lyle was kind of frantic and he said, no, I 401 00:28:00.640 --> 00:28:02.720