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<v Speaker 1>Celeste Mono was just twenty three years old when her

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<v Speaker 1>life was stolen in the middle of the night, murdered

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<v Speaker 1>in her own bed by a man she barely knew.

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<v Speaker 1>For over a year, she had been stalked, harassed, and

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<v Speaker 1>ignored by a system that failed to protect her despite

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<v Speaker 1>all the warning signs. This is the heartbreaking and infuriating

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<v Speaker 1>story of how kindness was mistaken for consent, and how

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<v Speaker 1>inaction cost a young woman her future.

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<v Speaker 2>My name's Ben, I'm Nicole, and you're listening to Wicked Ingram.

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<v Speaker 1>A true crime podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>Warning.

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<v Speaker 1>The following podcast and material intended for a mature audience.

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<v Speaker 1>Listener discretion is advised.

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<v Speaker 2>Did you notice my little stall in there? I like

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<v Speaker 2>forgot for a hot minute? Again, What the hell I

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<v Speaker 2>was supposed to say? Because I went and I'm Nicole?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh shit, I'm more.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, you got it. You did it?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh wow.

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<v Speaker 1>I think if you paused any longer, it would have

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<v Speaker 1>been like awkward. But I think you paused just long

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<v Speaker 1>enough that it was like different, in a little bit suspenseful,

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<v Speaker 1>you know what I mean.

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<v Speaker 2>And no one would have noticed if I didn't say

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<v Speaker 2>anything unless you did. Because you've seen the fear in

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<v Speaker 2>my eye for hot minute that I was like, oh no,

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<v Speaker 2>I have more.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I'm sure people listening like caught that it was different,

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<v Speaker 1>but they would have assumed it was on purpose. But

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<v Speaker 1>now you outed yourself, So good job I did. We

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<v Speaker 1>got an interesting story today, and in our pre show

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<v Speaker 1>over on Patreon, you brought up something in the intro

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<v Speaker 1>that you wanted to highlight, kindness was mistaken for consent.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and I was like, wow, there's a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>truth there.

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<v Speaker 1>There really is, And I really want to highlight the

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<v Speaker 1>word mistaken because in this story, this individual doesn't misunderstand

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<v Speaker 1>the kindness for consent. They mistake kindness for consent. And

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<v Speaker 1>so when I really want to highlight that and show

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<v Speaker 1>is that they specifically take it as consent. They choose

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<v Speaker 1>they don't misunderstanding it and misunderstand it and oh, I'm

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<v Speaker 1>so sorry, my bad sort of thing. It's a persistent continuing.

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<v Speaker 1>They choose to take it as consent.

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<v Speaker 2>They twist it to be what they want it to

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<v Speaker 2>be exactly. Yeah. So so yeah, there's two coins there,

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<v Speaker 2>but I mean both is terrible.

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<v Speaker 1>Two sides to the coin.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah yeah, yeah, so I don't know, I just yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>I just when you read that, I was like, I

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<v Speaker 2>hate that. That is just terrible, because, oh, you don't

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<v Speaker 2>want to be an asshole. But then sometimes you have to, like,

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<v Speaker 2>I don't be firm. I guess is what it is.

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<v Speaker 1>More so, well, definitely, and in this case you'll find

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<v Speaker 1>out that, I mean, Celeste, who is the victim. She

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<v Speaker 1>wasn't being an asshole, She wasn't leading anyone on. She

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<v Speaker 1>wasn't being overly kind or overly for flirtatious in any

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<v Speaker 1>sort of the word. She just simply was being nice.

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<v Speaker 2>Wasn't being rude or yeah, it wasn't.

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<v Speaker 1>Being rude, and she was being she was cutting, shutting

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<v Speaker 1>it down when necessary, but it was still a choice

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<v Speaker 1>to continue and persist. And it's unfortunate how often that

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<v Speaker 1>actually happens in the real world still today.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, yeah, it's not good.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, there is a difference to being like no

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<v Speaker 1>means no. We totally get that no does mean no,

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<v Speaker 1>But when someone's like no, stop, like, that's a little different.

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<v Speaker 1>You read the situation. But if someone's like no stop, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>you better fucking stop.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>But if someone specifically says no, yeah, consent is important.

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<v Speaker 1>And this guy in this story, trust me does not

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<v Speaker 1>understand consent because it goes a lot farther and unfortunately,

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<v Speaker 1>a lot farther than it should have.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, well, let's hear it. Okay, let's dive in.

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<v Speaker 1>In the early hours of November sixteenth, twenty twenty, the

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<v Speaker 1>quiet of a suburban Melbourne street was shattered by the

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<v Speaker 1>sound of breaking glass. Inside the Mono family home, twenty

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<v Speaker 1>three year old Celeste was asleep in her bed. She

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<v Speaker 1>had spent the evening making plans for her upcoming birthday

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<v Speaker 1>with her mother, and just said good night the way

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<v Speaker 1>that she always did, with love, warmth and a smile.

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<v Speaker 1>Moments later, her life, unfortunately, though, was stolen in an

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<v Speaker 1>act of violence that would never have been expected to happen,

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<v Speaker 1>and never should have happened either. Her mother, Aggie, was

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<v Speaker 1>jolted awake by the crashing sound of glass breaking. She

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<v Speaker 1>rushed to Celeste's room just steps away, only to walk

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<v Speaker 1>in into a nightmare. Shards of glass the floor, blood

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<v Speaker 1>was everywhere, and there, lying motionless on her bed was Celeste.

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<v Speaker 1>What followed would devastate a family, stun a nation, and

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<v Speaker 1>leave many asking the same gut wrenching question, how could

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<v Speaker 1>this happen? Now, as it turns out, this wasn't some

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<v Speaker 1>random act of violence. It wasn't a mystery. In fact,

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<v Speaker 1>the warning signs had been there for well over a year.

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<v Speaker 1>Celeste had done everything she was supposed to do, blocked

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<v Speaker 1>her stalker, report him to police, asked for help, and

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<v Speaker 1>unfortunately she just lived in fear. Yet the system that

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<v Speaker 1>was meant to protect her simply didn't. Now, before we

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<v Speaker 1>get into anything else, let's start right at the beginning

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<v Speaker 1>of the story. Celeste Mona was a daughter, a sister,

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<v Speaker 1>and a friend. She had bright light that shone into

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<v Speaker 1>the world of everyone who knew her. She was born

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<v Speaker 1>on November twenty second, nineteen ninety six in Italy and

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<v Speaker 1>later moved with her family to Melbourne, Australia. She grew

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<v Speaker 1>up with two brothers, an older half brother, Jaden and

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<v Speaker 1>a younger brother, Alessandro. The bond she shared with them,

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<v Speaker 1>especially with her mom, Aggie, was incredibly strong. Celeste had

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<v Speaker 1>that rare kind of warmth that just pulled people in.

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<v Speaker 1>She was the kind of person who made everyone feel included,

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<v Speaker 1>whether it was at school or work or just out

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<v Speaker 1>with friends. She had a way of making people feel

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<v Speaker 1>seen and feel valued and safe. She loved dancing, music,

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<v Speaker 1>good food, and simple joys in life. She found beauty

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<v Speaker 1>in everyday moments, and she gave love freely, without hesitation

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<v Speaker 1>or without judgment.

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<v Speaker 2>She sounds incredible.

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<v Speaker 1>She definitely does seem like.

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<v Speaker 2>A special person, like hard to find kind of those people, one.

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<v Speaker 1>Of those hidden gems sort of say. But the thing though,

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<v Speaker 1>is though she she just wasn't She wasn't just kind.

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<v Speaker 1>She was also very smart and driven too. So Less

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<v Speaker 1>studied criminology and psychology university because she wanted to understand

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<v Speaker 1>people better.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh I feel like this would make that even worse.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Not just for her own curiosity though, but she

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<v Speaker 1>wanted to help others. So when she said that she

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<v Speaker 1>wanted to understand people better, it wasn't because she's just like, Oh,

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<v Speaker 1>I just want to understand people and know what makes

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<v Speaker 1>them tick and you know, maybe tricks how I can improve,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, connections with people at work to better my career. No,

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<v Speaker 1>she actually wanted to help others because her dream was

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<v Speaker 1>to become a psychologist and support people through their struggles.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh wow, yeah, that's awesome.

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<v Speaker 1>She wanted to be a guide for those who felt lost.

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<v Speaker 1>Basically now at the time, of her death, she was

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<v Speaker 1>working as a team leader at a call center in Melbourne,

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<v Speaker 1>North Northeast. It was there that she met her boyfriend

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<v Speaker 1>Chris Risdale. Ridsdale, Ridsdale. There, Ridsdale, Ridsdale. The D is

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<v Speaker 1>before the S, not Risdale. It's r I D S

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<v Speaker 1>D so Ridsdale. Okay, okay, yeah, it'll trip you up

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<v Speaker 1>if you look at it real quick. You gotta really

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<v Speaker 1>be careful, because trust me, it tripped me up several

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<v Speaker 1>times in research and even well the first time trying

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<v Speaker 1>it on here.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and it might again, Yeah, it probably will. Now.

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<v Speaker 1>Their relationship was still new, but it was full of

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<v Speaker 1>laughter and late night phone calls that never ended up

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<v Speaker 1>with one of them volunteering to hang up first. It was,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, like, oh you hang up first, you hang

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<v Speaker 1>up first, the sweet little like you know, relationships so cute.

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<v Speaker 1>Chris later described loving Celeste as effortless. To quote him,

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<v Speaker 1>she just had this energy. She made you want to

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<v Speaker 1>do better.

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<v Speaker 2>Holy shit, that's so nice. Just effortless like that is nice.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Celeste was at that beautiful point in life where

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<v Speaker 1>the future that felt wide open. She had dreams that

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<v Speaker 1>she was working towards people who loved her deeply and

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<v Speaker 1>a big heart that still had so much more to

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<v Speaker 1>give now. In twenty eighteen, Luey Seiko was hired as

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<v Speaker 1>a customer service rep at the same call center where

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<v Speaker 1>Celesti had worked. He wasn't particularly social or successful at

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<v Speaker 1>his job. In fact, co workers described him as quiet, introverted,

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<v Speaker 1>and often quite withdrawn. By twenty nineteen, just a year in,

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<v Speaker 1>he was unfortunately let go from that position due to

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<v Speaker 1>poor performance. Now Celeste was his team leader at the time.

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<v Speaker 1>They weren't close by any means, they didn't hang out,

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<v Speaker 1>and in fact, they barely interacted at all. But when

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<v Speaker 1>the day came for Luey to leave, she did as

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<v Speaker 1>she always did. She was kind. She walked him out

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<v Speaker 1>of the building, wished him well and kept things polite

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<v Speaker 1>and professional, and offered him a handshake as she gave

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<v Speaker 1>him those well wishes. Right, you know, I wish you

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<v Speaker 1>all the best.

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<v Speaker 2>It just sucks she's doing her job, but exactly what

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<v Speaker 2>it is.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but what Celeste saw as a brief compassionate gesture

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<v Speaker 1>in that handshake, Luey misread completely. Before she could even

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<v Speaker 1>turn away, he held onto her hand in that handshake

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<v Speaker 1>and leaned in and kissed her on the cheek. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>Celeste was very much so caught off guard.

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<v Speaker 2>Uh huh.

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<v Speaker 1>And when she got home, she told her mom and

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<v Speaker 1>younger brother what had happened and how embarrassed and uncomfortable

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<v Speaker 1>she felt in that moment and even still lingering in

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<v Speaker 1>that in this conversation as she told it to her family.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, that's like awkward as shit. But she didn't

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<v Speaker 2>do anything.

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<v Speaker 1>She didn't. Eggie tried to calm her nerves, assuming it

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<v Speaker 1>was just a harmless goodbye, maybe a misunderstood crush, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>telling her that he probably liked her the entire time

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<v Speaker 1>that he worked there and just act on impulsive nerves

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<v Speaker 1>in the moment. Right, But whatever it was, that kiss

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<v Speaker 1>was the moment something darker clicked into place for Lue.

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<v Speaker 1>Just weeks later, he began to message her online.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, but just really quick. Her boyfriend worked there too,

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<v Speaker 2>right at the call center.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know if he continued to work there. I

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<v Speaker 1>know he met her there.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, yeah, okay, but still, like I mean, I'm sure

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<v Speaker 2>there was no signs that she was given this dude,

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<v Speaker 2>that they were anything more than just.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh definitely not It was the handshake, it was the

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<v Speaker 1>walking him out of the bill, the goodbye, trying to

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<v Speaker 1>be nice and you know and compassionate in a hurtful moment.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, it's not easy being let go from a

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<v Speaker 1>job like that. So she's just trying to be, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>a good person to.

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<v Speaker 2>Him, trying to make it like as little as less

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<v Speaker 2>awkward for him as possible.

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<v Speaker 1>Really, but yeah, now, at first the messages came in

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<v Speaker 1>from his real account. He thanked her again for her kindness,

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<v Speaker 1>and then he professed his love. He told her she

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<v Speaker 1>was all he could think about, that he was infactuated, captivated,

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<v Speaker 1>and fascinated by her. He said the image of her

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<v Speaker 1>was interfering with his ability to even function. It was

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<v Speaker 1>obsessive right from the start, and he admitted as much.

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<v Speaker 1>So least being the kind person she was, responded as

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<v Speaker 1>gently as she could to begin with. She thanked him

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<v Speaker 1>for the kind words, but made it clear that she

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<v Speaker 1>didn't feel the same way. To quote her, I only

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<v Speaker 1>feel a professional way towards you. I wish you all

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<v Speaker 1>the best in your new job and journey.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh that is that is so awkward, that message, It

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<v Speaker 2>really is. I feel like I wouldn't even know if

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<v Speaker 2>I would have responded, so I.

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<v Speaker 1>Probably wouldn't have responded either. I probably would have just

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<v Speaker 1>like blocked. Done. Now, most people would move on one

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<v Speaker 1>way or another. You know, when they, you know, profess

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<v Speaker 1>their love to someone over let's say it's Instagram. I'm

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<v Speaker 1>not sure if it was. I think it was, but

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<v Speaker 1>I might actually haven't hear written later on what platforms

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<v Speaker 1>he used, but regardless, let's just say Instagram. For the

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<v Speaker 1>heat of the moment. For someone who professes their love

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<v Speaker 1>on Instagram to someone and that person turns them down,

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<v Speaker 1>I feel professional towards you. Good luck on your journey.

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<v Speaker 1>You're probably going to take the hint. At least most

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<v Speaker 1>people would you move on. But Luey, he's not most people.

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<v Speaker 1>He messaged her again, and he messaged her again, and

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<v Speaker 1>once Les finally stopped replying, he created a new Instagram account.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>See there were God it was Instagram to reach out

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<v Speaker 1>to her, so he wouldn't she wouldn't ignore these messages,

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<v Speaker 1>so that she sees this account messaging her. Now yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>she's like, I'm not responding and blocking you whatever. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>And now he created a new one so new messages

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<v Speaker 1>would come in, so she would see it.

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<v Speaker 2>That's like a big escalation, really it is.

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<v Speaker 1>However, when this happened, the tone of the messages began

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<v Speaker 1>to shift. They were less poetic and more desperate. Then

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<v Speaker 1>came the anger. To quote him, You're no different to

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<v Speaker 1>the majority of women. I will devote every ounce of

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<v Speaker 1>energy I have to climbing up and providing to the proving,

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<v Speaker 1>sorry to the world, that I am somebody. This is

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<v Speaker 1>my promise to you. It's very cryptic and weird and

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<v Speaker 1>odd and strange.

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<v Speaker 2>Well yeah, maybe just do that to prove it to yourself.

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<v Speaker 1>Right. Still, she tried to handle it herself. She blocked him,

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<v Speaker 1>ignored the messages, and hoped it would just stop eventually,

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<v Speaker 1>and unfortunately it didn't. It persisted as the weeks rolled

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<v Speaker 1>into months. Luay Seiko's obsession with Celesti. It didn't fade.

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<v Speaker 1>It intensified. When she blocked one Instagram account, he simply

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<v Speaker 1>created another, than another, and she blocked that one and another.

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<v Speaker 1>He messaged her from over a dozen different usernames, each

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<v Speaker 1>time with the same goal to get a response from her,

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<v Speaker 1>and when she didn't respond, his messages would get darker.

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<v Speaker 1>At first, they were filled with declarations of love as

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<v Speaker 1>I mentioned, and he wrote about how she was the

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<v Speaker 1>only one he could ever you know, really see a

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<v Speaker 1>future with, or the only person to ever made him

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<v Speaker 1>feel this way, that he couldn't sleep, that he couldn't work,

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<v Speaker 1>that she was his quote sun that shines. Oh man, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>it was disturbing, but still yeah, yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Like, what does he think is going to happen with this?

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<v Speaker 2>It almost seems like he's unwell. I think that's unwell.

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<v Speaker 2>It's going to be what we soon find out for sure,

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<v Speaker 2>But like for him to just keep messaging and does

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<v Speaker 2>he just think she's all of a sudden going to

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<v Speaker 2>change her mind or some shit or I don't know.

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<v Speaker 1>But the messages they would turn very sexual soon. Oh no,

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<v Speaker 1>in graphic vulgar detail. In fact, Luey began describing things

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<v Speaker 1>he wanted to do to her. Some were very explicit.

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<v Speaker 1>That's less. Family later said they couldn't even bring themselves

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<v Speaker 1>to repeat. In interviews, one message read quote, have you

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<v Speaker 1>ever had a beast pounce on you? I would pounce

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<v Speaker 1>on you like a pit bull.

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<v Speaker 2>That's so disturbing.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there's nothing romantic about that, honestly, that's only just

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<v Speaker 1>like I as domination. That's scary. That's fucking rapee.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Celeste was horrified.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh man, I can only imagine just how she's feeling.

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<v Speaker 2>Like this would consume her, really her life, it would.

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<v Speaker 1>It wasn't any was at first. It was uncomfortable, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>something maybe she could push out of the back of

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<v Speaker 1>her mind, you know by you know, putting on a podcast,

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00:15:47.600 --> 00:15:49.960
<v Speaker 1>listening to music, going for a drive at work, you know,

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00:15:50.039 --> 00:15:53.080
<v Speaker 1>getting your mind off things one way or another. But this,

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<v Speaker 1>at this point was no longer something that you could

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<v Speaker 1>just you know, distract yourself from. This was beginning to

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<v Speaker 1>be very scary. She told him clearly to stop. She

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<v Speaker 1>said the messages were making her deeply uncomfortable. She said

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<v Speaker 1>no repeatedly, but Lui, he wasn't listening. He responded by

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00:16:12.840 --> 00:16:16.240
<v Speaker 1>blaming her. When she asked him to stop contacting her,

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<v Speaker 1>He accused her of being like quote the rest, He

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00:16:20.519 --> 00:16:25.159
<v Speaker 1>made himself the victim, painting her rejection as cruelty, and

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00:16:25.240 --> 00:16:29.919
<v Speaker 1>of course, once again it got worse. Seles started to

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<v Speaker 1>worry that Luey was beginning to follow her, and unfortunately

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00:16:34.639 --> 00:16:38.360
<v Speaker 1>she was right. One day, she saw him parked outside

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00:16:38.360 --> 00:16:40.600
<v Speaker 1>her work. He wasn't supposed to know where she was

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00:16:40.639 --> 00:16:43.360
<v Speaker 1>working anymore. He wasn't even supposed to know what car

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00:16:43.480 --> 00:16:46.399
<v Speaker 1>she drove. It felt like he was everywhere and that

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<v Speaker 1>he was watching. The fear was starting to change her life.

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<v Speaker 1>She began sharing her location with her mom. She asked

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<v Speaker 1>her boss to walk her to her car after every shift.

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<v Speaker 1>She tried to be careful online, but she couldn't live

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<v Speaker 1>her life in total silence just because someone refused to

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<v Speaker 1>take no for a fucking answer. The emotional toll was mounting,

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00:17:05.680 --> 00:17:07.960
<v Speaker 1>so less couldn't sleep. She was on the edge at

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<v Speaker 1>all times. She told coworkers, quote, he's really going to

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<v Speaker 1>kill me by the early twenty twenty, sorry by the

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<v Speaker 1>early twenty to me by early twenty twenty.

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<v Speaker 2>There we go.

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<v Speaker 1>Ce Lessa and her mom and Aggie had enough. The

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00:17:22.960 --> 00:17:26.599
<v Speaker 1>messages weren't stopping, the fear was growing, and Luai's behavior

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00:17:26.640 --> 00:17:30.160
<v Speaker 1>had gotten far out of control. It's now disturbing to

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00:17:30.599 --> 00:17:35.359
<v Speaker 1>outright threatening levels. So they did what anyone would hope

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00:17:35.559 --> 00:17:39.079
<v Speaker 1>to be the right thing. They went to police. They

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<v Speaker 1>brought them the screenshots of the messages, accounts evidence. They

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00:17:42.400 --> 00:17:45.279
<v Speaker 1>explained everything, how Celeste had tried to cut out contact,

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<v Speaker 1>how he'd ignore her, requests how he kept creating new

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00:17:48.759 --> 00:17:51.640
<v Speaker 1>accounts and pestering her, how she'd seen and parked outside

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<v Speaker 1>her work, and how she was scared, genuinely scared for

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<v Speaker 1>her safety. But the response they got it was dismissive, cold,

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<v Speaker 1>and honestly just useless.

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<v Speaker 2>How the shit could it be? Are they not doing

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00:18:05.079 --> 00:18:06.359
<v Speaker 2>their job well?

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00:18:06.400 --> 00:18:09.920
<v Speaker 1>According to Eggie, the officer barely skimmed the messages. What

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00:18:10.440 --> 00:18:14.119
<v Speaker 1>the he told them There was no crime here. He said, quote,

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00:18:14.160 --> 00:18:17.319
<v Speaker 1>it's social media. If you don't like it, get off

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00:18:17.359 --> 00:18:18.000
<v Speaker 1>social media.

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00:18:19.000 --> 00:18:22.400
<v Speaker 2>Wow, yeah, okay, that's not okay.

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00:18:22.599 --> 00:18:26.039
<v Speaker 1>Reportedly, he didn't even take Luey Seiko's name down. No

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00:18:26.279 --> 00:18:32.079
<v Speaker 1>formal report, no warning, no documentation, nothing, just basically saying, well,

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<v Speaker 1>get off social media.

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<v Speaker 2>Then, you know, I feel like I often am like, oh,

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<v Speaker 2>like someone like they're trying, like I always try to

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<v Speaker 2>see like, you know, the good, but this guy is

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00:18:43.599 --> 00:18:46.079
<v Speaker 2>just shit at his job. There is like no offens

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<v Speaker 2>buts about it. He sucks.

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<v Speaker 1>Agreed that guy should not be in authority session.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely not.

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<v Speaker 1>That guy should just be like Luey and get let

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<v Speaker 1>go for not being a fucking good off.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah period, Yeah, you suck at your job.

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<v Speaker 1>Sorry, Bye bye bye now, lest was stunned at this

355
00:19:01.599 --> 00:19:05.240
<v Speaker 1>response as far as that though as far as this

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00:19:05.359 --> 00:19:08.319
<v Speaker 1>visit went, she was obviously on her own.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, and I just have to say too, it probably

358
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<v Speaker 2>took so much courage for even going there, for sure,

359
00:19:13.279 --> 00:19:16.079
<v Speaker 2>and then to be faced with that that is just yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>so bad.

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<v Speaker 1>For the next several months, nothing changed. Seless continued to

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<v Speaker 1>be harassed online. The messages became more aggressive, more frequent,

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<v Speaker 1>and more unhinged. Some days she'd block multiple new accounts

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<v Speaker 1>within hours. She couldn't post online without wondering if he'd

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00:19:31.160 --> 00:19:34.519
<v Speaker 1>see it, which obviously he was. Yeah, she couldn't walk

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<v Speaker 1>to her car without watching over her shoulder and looking

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00:19:37.119 --> 00:19:39.799
<v Speaker 1>back behind her to see if he was there. Then,

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<v Speaker 1>in July twenty twenty, after nearly a year of this,

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<v Speaker 1>Celeste and Aggie went back to police, and this time

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<v Speaker 1>they came prepared. They brought a Manila envelope filled with

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<v Speaker 1>printed screenshots of everything, every account, every warning she had

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<v Speaker 1>tried to give. And this time they found an officer

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<v Speaker 1>who took them seriously. Okay, he read through the material,

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00:20:01.319 --> 00:20:04.240
<v Speaker 1>he asked questions, and then he said something that made

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<v Speaker 1>Aggie's heart sink. Well, before I tell you the exact quote.

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00:20:10.519 --> 00:20:14.240
<v Speaker 1>He asked, you've been to police already and they're like, yeah,

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00:20:14.279 --> 00:20:19.319
<v Speaker 1>how'd you know? And then he said, quote, let's just

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<v Speaker 1>say some of us do our job better than others.

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00:20:22.640 --> 00:20:26.440
<v Speaker 2>Oh no, yeah, So it was just like a known

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<v Speaker 2>thing that this one guy just doesn't give a shit

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<v Speaker 2>about anything.

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00:20:29.559 --> 00:20:33.119
<v Speaker 1>One guy or others who knows. But this officer clearly

383
00:20:33.400 --> 00:20:37.119
<v Speaker 1>was taking it more seriously and is aware that there

384
00:20:37.279 --> 00:20:40.839
<v Speaker 1>is holes in the system because people just suck.

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00:20:41.920 --> 00:20:45.000
<v Speaker 2>That just angers me. That is such bullshit. It is.

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00:20:45.079 --> 00:20:48.599
<v Speaker 1>But unfortunately, I mean, when a system fails, that's the

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00:20:48.640 --> 00:20:50.039
<v Speaker 1>sort of situation you're left with.

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00:20:50.640 --> 00:20:52.759
<v Speaker 2>I mean, yeah, and we hear it's like that happens

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00:20:52.759 --> 00:20:54.079
<v Speaker 2>in many areas.

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00:20:53.960 --> 00:20:56.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, way too often, but especially.

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00:20:56.400 --> 00:20:58.799
<v Speaker 2>In an area like that. I just feel like you

392
00:20:58.880 --> 00:21:02.759
<v Speaker 2>can't suck at your job. That's like that is I mean,

393
00:21:02.799 --> 00:21:04.680
<v Speaker 2>it affects people's lives, for God's sake.

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00:21:04.759 --> 00:21:08.079
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it does. Now this officer, he of course, was

395
00:21:08.119 --> 00:21:11.000
<v Speaker 1>doing his job, and he immediately recommended that they file

396
00:21:11.119 --> 00:21:15.240
<v Speaker 1>for a personal safety intervention order or a PSIO. It's

397
00:21:15.319 --> 00:21:19.400
<v Speaker 1>basically a restraining order under Victorian law in Australia, meant

398
00:21:19.440 --> 00:21:23.440
<v Speaker 1>to protect someone from harassment or threats, and within days

399
00:21:23.880 --> 00:21:26.000
<v Speaker 1>that order was granted.

400
00:21:25.880 --> 00:21:27.720
<v Speaker 2>Because someone was doing their.

401
00:21:27.680 --> 00:21:31.480
<v Speaker 1>Job exactly now, for the first time in over a year,

402
00:21:31.640 --> 00:21:36.559
<v Speaker 1>Celeste felt something close to peace. That PSIO gave her

403
00:21:36.680 --> 00:21:41.839
<v Speaker 1>legal ground to stand on. It was finally officially on

404
00:21:41.920 --> 00:21:46.440
<v Speaker 1>the record. Luey Seiko was not allowed to contact her,

405
00:21:47.400 --> 00:21:51.440
<v Speaker 1>and for a while it worked. There were no new messages,

406
00:21:51.839 --> 00:21:55.720
<v Speaker 1>no accounts, no sightings of him. It finally felt like

407
00:21:55.880 --> 00:22:01.039
<v Speaker 1>she could exhale and relax. But then just weeks later,

408
00:22:01.160 --> 00:22:05.640
<v Speaker 1>something arrived in her inbox. It was a long handwritten

409
00:22:05.720 --> 00:22:10.640
<v Speaker 1>letter from lue three pages, begging her to drop the order.

410
00:22:11.200 --> 00:22:13.880
<v Speaker 1>He promised things like he wasn't gonna do any more

411
00:22:13.920 --> 00:22:17.000
<v Speaker 1>threats or saying that it was just all Instagram dms,

412
00:22:17.039 --> 00:22:20.759
<v Speaker 1>whatever that means, and he said she didn't need to worry,

413
00:22:20.880 --> 00:22:23.240
<v Speaker 1>and at the bottom of the letter it was finished

414
00:22:23.240 --> 00:22:27.160
<v Speaker 1>off with a little smiley face. The only problem with

415
00:22:27.200 --> 00:22:31.200
<v Speaker 1>this letter is he had violated the order again, and

416
00:22:31.279 --> 00:22:33.599
<v Speaker 1>yet again, Celeste had to be the one to bring

417
00:22:33.640 --> 00:22:36.640
<v Speaker 1>it to the police. So in August of twenty twenty,

418
00:22:36.880 --> 00:22:40.599
<v Speaker 1>after sending Celeste that three page letter violating the intervention order,

419
00:22:41.279 --> 00:22:42.680
<v Speaker 1>he was arrested.

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00:22:43.079 --> 00:22:44.839
<v Speaker 2>Okay, good, now.

421
00:22:44.720 --> 00:22:49.359
<v Speaker 1>For a moment, it felt like maybe things were finally done, finally,

422
00:22:49.400 --> 00:22:52.480
<v Speaker 1>you know, turning into sleste favor. Maybe now the law

423
00:22:52.480 --> 00:22:55.839
<v Speaker 1>would protect her, maybe this whole nightmare would finally be over.

424
00:22:55.960 --> 00:23:03.519
<v Speaker 1>But the very next day, Luey was released from custom.

425
00:23:01.640 --> 00:23:07.319
<v Speaker 2>One day, one night, Yeah, one day, which honestly, isn't

426
00:23:07.480 --> 00:23:08.680
<v Speaker 2>that bad.

427
00:23:08.880 --> 00:23:11.319
<v Speaker 1>Understandably, he just sent her a letter. He just like,

428
00:23:11.359 --> 00:23:12.839
<v Speaker 1>you know, there's a little bit of stocking going on.

429
00:23:12.880 --> 00:23:15.359
<v Speaker 1>He just sent her one more message. Okay, keep that

430
00:23:15.400 --> 00:23:18.319
<v Speaker 1>in mind. But the worst part about this part of

431
00:23:18.319 --> 00:23:21.960
<v Speaker 1>the situation is once he was released, there was no

432
00:23:22.160 --> 00:23:27.039
<v Speaker 1>monitoring in place. There was no heightened restrictions, no safety nets, nothing,

433
00:23:27.599 --> 00:23:31.359
<v Speaker 1>just you broke the law one night in jail. Okay, bye, No,

434
00:23:31.519 --> 00:23:31.839
<v Speaker 1>that's it.

435
00:23:32.279 --> 00:23:35.079
<v Speaker 2>So it's sort of in his mind, well that didn't

436
00:23:35.079 --> 00:23:36.640
<v Speaker 2>really like that wasn't that bad?

437
00:23:37.359 --> 00:23:40.759
<v Speaker 1>Maybe? Yeah, I mean, we'll touch on what he thought

438
00:23:40.799 --> 00:23:43.559
<v Speaker 1>about it here in a minute. But there was nothing

439
00:23:43.599 --> 00:23:46.039
<v Speaker 1>to go along with it to ensure that they're mitigating

440
00:23:46.079 --> 00:23:50.079
<v Speaker 1>any sort of risks. Dang, there's no consequences to his

441
00:23:50.119 --> 00:23:54.559
<v Speaker 1>actions other than just you know, spending the night. Yeah,

442
00:23:54.599 --> 00:23:56.920
<v Speaker 1>and there's nothing to prevent him from doing it again

443
00:23:57.319 --> 00:24:02.279
<v Speaker 1>or escalating any further. Now and Aggie were stunned. After everything,

444
00:24:02.319 --> 00:24:04.799
<v Speaker 1>after all the messages, the fear, the warning signs, they

445
00:24:04.960 --> 00:24:11.039
<v Speaker 1>just let him go and worse now, he was enraged.

446
00:24:11.480 --> 00:24:14.599
<v Speaker 1>It was like being rejected all over again, but this

447
00:24:14.720 --> 00:24:18.839
<v Speaker 1>time with legal consequences. To him. That wasn't justice, it

448
00:24:19.039 --> 00:24:19.960
<v Speaker 1>was betrayal.

449
00:24:20.680 --> 00:24:22.960
<v Speaker 2>Really. See, I also thought maybe that could just scare

450
00:24:23.000 --> 00:24:24.559
<v Speaker 2>the shit out of him a bit, and okay, this

451
00:24:24.640 --> 00:24:27.440
<v Speaker 2>is you know, this is going to affect my life

452
00:24:27.519 --> 00:24:29.119
<v Speaker 2>now or whatever, so I'll stop.

453
00:24:29.200 --> 00:24:33.119
<v Speaker 1>But he was directly pissed right at Celeste for that.

454
00:24:33.400 --> 00:24:36.079
<v Speaker 1>He was blaming her for him getting arrested. It was

455
00:24:36.200 --> 00:24:38.599
<v Speaker 1>her fault. How dare she do that to him?

456
00:24:39.000 --> 00:24:39.359
<v Speaker 2>Wow?

457
00:24:39.720 --> 00:24:42.599
<v Speaker 1>He didn't send her any messages after that, He didn't

458
00:24:42.599 --> 00:24:45.720
<v Speaker 1>show up to her work again. It looked like things

459
00:24:45.759 --> 00:24:51.599
<v Speaker 1>had gone quiet. But that quiet shouldn't be mistaken for peace,

460
00:24:51.799 --> 00:24:53.200
<v Speaker 1>because it wasn't peace.

461
00:24:53.400 --> 00:24:54.200
<v Speaker 2>He was plotting.

462
00:24:54.440 --> 00:24:59.319
<v Speaker 1>He was planning. Unbeknownst to Celeste or anyone else, Luey

463
00:24:59.440 --> 00:25:03.559
<v Speaker 1>was preparing for something much darker. See, he had started researching.

464
00:25:04.160 --> 00:25:07.039
<v Speaker 1>He studied her social media photos and posts to confirm

465
00:25:07.079 --> 00:25:10.799
<v Speaker 1>her address. He used online maps to view her street

466
00:25:11.160 --> 00:25:13.440
<v Speaker 1>and somehow managed to get a floor plan of her

467
00:25:13.440 --> 00:25:16.599
<v Speaker 1>house and he figured out which room was hers.

468
00:25:17.160 --> 00:25:17.480
<v Speaker 2>Shit.

469
00:25:18.599 --> 00:25:21.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, now, I'm not saying it was like the floor

470
00:25:21.079 --> 00:25:23.359
<v Speaker 1>plan was like blueprints or anything like that, but he

471
00:25:23.400 --> 00:25:25.359
<v Speaker 1>figured out some floor plans and he was able to

472
00:25:25.359 --> 00:25:28.599
<v Speaker 1>figure out which was hers from pictures, clues, watching the street,

473
00:25:28.680 --> 00:25:31.039
<v Speaker 1>all these sort of things. He knew which window of

474
00:25:31.079 --> 00:25:32.359
<v Speaker 1>the house was her room.

475
00:25:32.680 --> 00:25:34.640
<v Speaker 2>Holy shit, that's terrifying.

476
00:25:35.599 --> 00:25:38.319
<v Speaker 1>Once he had all this figured out, he purchased a

477
00:25:38.359 --> 00:25:45.640
<v Speaker 1>large kitchen knife, a hammer, and he waited. Three months passed.

478
00:25:46.039 --> 00:25:49.680
<v Speaker 1>There was no contact, nothing suspicious, nothing at all. Just

479
00:25:50.279 --> 00:25:53.400
<v Speaker 1>that quiet that I said was not peace.

480
00:25:53.960 --> 00:25:56.400
<v Speaker 2>Well. Yeah, and in that time, though, she's probably letting

481
00:25:56.400 --> 00:25:57.359
<v Speaker 2>her guard down a little.

482
00:25:57.599 --> 00:26:00.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, she believed that maybe this is really over. She

483
00:26:00.319 --> 00:26:02.759
<v Speaker 1>was starting to, you know, move forward in life again,

484
00:26:02.960 --> 00:26:05.960
<v Speaker 1>putting her energy into her relationship with her boyfriend Chris.

485
00:26:06.279 --> 00:26:09.240
<v Speaker 1>She was now planning her twenty fourth birthday. She posted

486
00:26:09.240 --> 00:26:11.799
<v Speaker 1>a photo with Chris on a rooftop bar, their first

487
00:26:11.960 --> 00:26:16.279
<v Speaker 1>date since lockdowns began, erasing you know, their public appearance

488
00:26:16.279 --> 00:26:21.640
<v Speaker 1>because hey COVID, Yeah, yep, she looked happy, lighthearted, safe.

489
00:26:21.720 --> 00:26:23.640
<v Speaker 1>It was the kind of photo most of us wouldn't

490
00:26:23.680 --> 00:26:28.319
<v Speaker 1>think twice about sharing, but for Luway Seiko, that photo

491
00:26:28.400 --> 00:26:30.440
<v Speaker 1>of them was a trigger.

492
00:26:30.720 --> 00:26:32.920
<v Speaker 2>Pissed him right off. I'm sure I guess yeah.

493
00:26:33.480 --> 00:26:37.759
<v Speaker 1>Seeing Celeste smiling, living her life, loving someone else, it

494
00:26:37.920 --> 00:26:41.279
<v Speaker 1>shattered the fantasy he'd been clinging to. To him, it

495
00:26:41.400 --> 00:26:43.799
<v Speaker 1>wasn't just a post. It was proof that she'd quote

496
00:26:43.839 --> 00:26:47.839
<v Speaker 1>moved on, that she'd chosen someone else, that she'd rejected him,

497
00:26:47.880 --> 00:26:52.279
<v Speaker 1>not just in words, but an actuality within life. He

498
00:26:52.319 --> 00:26:55.079
<v Speaker 1>couldn't accept it, and so in the early hours of

499
00:26:55.079 --> 00:26:58.640
<v Speaker 1>November sixteenth, twenty twenty, he put his plan into action.

500
00:26:59.440 --> 00:27:02.400
<v Speaker 1>He left his home and he drove to Celeste's. He

501
00:27:02.440 --> 00:27:06.400
<v Speaker 1>circled a block and parked his car. Then he climbed

502
00:27:06.440 --> 00:27:10.319
<v Speaker 1>the fence, walked into her backyard and stood beneath her

503
00:27:10.359 --> 00:27:14.440
<v Speaker 1>bedroom window in the pitch black of night. Just after

504
00:27:14.519 --> 00:27:17.160
<v Speaker 1>four a m. He managed to get to her window.

505
00:27:17.720 --> 00:27:22.200
<v Speaker 1>He raised the hammer and shattered that thin glass barrier

506
00:27:22.279 --> 00:27:27.279
<v Speaker 1>that was separating him from Celeste. The Mono family home

507
00:27:28.359 --> 00:27:33.079
<v Speaker 1>in Mirnda, a quiet suburb of Melbourne, was jolted into chaos.

508
00:27:33.160 --> 00:27:36.880
<v Speaker 1>A loud crash of shattering glass woke Celeste's mother, Angie

509
00:27:36.920 --> 00:27:39.960
<v Speaker 1>from her Sorry Aggie from her sleep. Something felt wrong.

510
00:27:40.440 --> 00:27:44.839
<v Speaker 1>Immediately deeply wrong. She bolted from bed and ran barefoot

511
00:27:44.880 --> 00:27:47.759
<v Speaker 1>down the hallway towards her daughter's room. She's calling out

512
00:27:47.799 --> 00:27:50.559
<v Speaker 1>to her, but what Aggie found on the other side

513
00:27:50.559 --> 00:27:55.079
<v Speaker 1>of that door was every parent's worst nightmare. Celeste was

514
00:27:55.200 --> 00:27:58.519
<v Speaker 1>just twenty three years old, and there she was, lying

515
00:27:58.559 --> 00:28:03.160
<v Speaker 1>motionless on her bed, soaked in blood. Her bedroom window

516
00:28:03.200 --> 00:28:06.640
<v Speaker 1>had been smashed, shards of glass scattered across the floor,

517
00:28:07.319 --> 00:28:09.960
<v Speaker 1>A large kitchen knife lay on the bed near her feet.

518
00:28:10.759 --> 00:28:13.720
<v Speaker 1>In a panic, Aggie screamed her daughter's name and rushed

519
00:28:13.720 --> 00:28:16.400
<v Speaker 1>to her side, not even realizing she was running and

520
00:28:16.440 --> 00:28:19.039
<v Speaker 1>stepping on broken glass, cutting her feet along the way,

521
00:28:19.359 --> 00:28:21.640
<v Speaker 1>and she tried desperately to pull her from the bed,

522
00:28:21.960 --> 00:28:25.799
<v Speaker 1>away from all the glass. Begging her to respond. She

523
00:28:25.960 --> 00:28:29.720
<v Speaker 1>called the emergency services and began CPR, but it was

524
00:28:29.920 --> 00:28:30.519
<v Speaker 1>too late.

525
00:28:31.559 --> 00:28:33.160
<v Speaker 2>That seems so quick.

526
00:28:35.079 --> 00:28:40.440
<v Speaker 1>In under three minutes, lest had been stabbed twenty three times.

527
00:28:40.480 --> 00:28:46.039
<v Speaker 1>What wounds to her chest, abdomen, legs, and arms and

528
00:28:46.119 --> 00:28:48.960
<v Speaker 1>defensive wounds that showed she tried to fight back, but

529
00:28:49.000 --> 00:28:52.319
<v Speaker 1>according to the corner, it was the first stab wound,

530
00:28:52.559 --> 00:28:55.839
<v Speaker 1>the one that pierced her heart, that killed her.

531
00:28:56.559 --> 00:28:59.640
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so she just really didn't stand a chance, I

532
00:28:59.640 --> 00:29:00.680
<v Speaker 2>guess nope.

533
00:29:01.279 --> 00:29:04.920
<v Speaker 1>The rest were described as overkill, an explosion of rage

534
00:29:04.960 --> 00:29:09.240
<v Speaker 1>and brutality. The attack was so swift and efficient that

535
00:29:09.279 --> 00:29:13.519
<v Speaker 1>by the time Aggie reached the bedroom, the killer had

536
00:29:13.559 --> 00:29:18.119
<v Speaker 1>already vanished. WHOA now the man who took selest life

537
00:29:18.160 --> 00:29:21.519
<v Speaker 1>was no surprise here. Luey Seiko, the man who had

538
00:29:21.559 --> 00:29:24.640
<v Speaker 1>stalked her for over a year. He didn't try to hide. Instead,

539
00:29:24.680 --> 00:29:28.319
<v Speaker 1>he drove himself directly to a local police station. Still

540
00:29:28.519 --> 00:29:32.799
<v Speaker 1>covered in celeste blood. He calmly handed over celeste address

541
00:29:32.880 --> 00:29:38.240
<v Speaker 1>and told officers, quote, she's dead, go have a look. Then,

542
00:29:38.279 --> 00:29:42.799
<v Speaker 1>with a chilling detachment from reality, he added, you know

543
00:29:42.839 --> 00:29:44.640
<v Speaker 1>what happened, It's your fault.

544
00:29:45.240 --> 00:29:46.279
<v Speaker 2>Oh.

545
00:29:46.359 --> 00:29:51.640
<v Speaker 1>He also tried to provoke officers into shooting him. They didn't. Instead,

546
00:29:51.920 --> 00:29:53.680
<v Speaker 1>they arrested him.

547
00:29:54.039 --> 00:29:59.880
<v Speaker 2>Unbelievable. This guy is unbelievable. Yeah, he just blames every

548
00:30:00.000 --> 00:30:01.160
<v Speaker 2>anyone else for everything.

549
00:30:01.480 --> 00:30:02.240
<v Speaker 1>Everything.

550
00:30:03.000 --> 00:30:05.559
<v Speaker 2>Gosh, I just like to spise him.

551
00:30:05.720 --> 00:30:09.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, nothing's his fault. Back at the Mono home, paramedics

552
00:30:09.759 --> 00:30:13.079
<v Speaker 1>arrived quickly, but there was nothing they could do. Celeste

553
00:30:13.319 --> 00:30:17.079
<v Speaker 1>was already gone. The young woman who had dedicated her

554
00:30:17.079 --> 00:30:19.599
<v Speaker 1>life to kindness, who wanted to be a psychologist to

555
00:30:19.599 --> 00:30:23.000
<v Speaker 1>help other people, who had done everything in her power

556
00:30:23.039 --> 00:30:26.599
<v Speaker 1>to protect herself from a man she barely knew. She

557
00:30:26.759 --> 00:30:30.240
<v Speaker 1>was murdered in her own bed just days before her

558
00:30:30.279 --> 00:30:31.839
<v Speaker 1>twenty fourth birthday.

559
00:30:32.279 --> 00:30:33.359
<v Speaker 2>That's so young.

560
00:30:34.680 --> 00:30:38.920
<v Speaker 1>Luey Seiko had stalked her, harassed her, violated legal orders,

561
00:30:38.960 --> 00:30:41.279
<v Speaker 1>and told her exactly the kind of man he was,

562
00:30:41.400 --> 00:30:44.799
<v Speaker 1>and still nothing had been done to stop him. Now

563
00:30:44.920 --> 00:30:47.680
<v Speaker 1>Celeste was gone, and everyone who loved her was left

564
00:30:47.680 --> 00:30:51.359
<v Speaker 1>to pick up those pieces. In the days following celest

565
00:30:51.440 --> 00:30:55.319
<v Speaker 1>Mono's murder, the grief that settled over her family was immeasurable.

566
00:30:55.880 --> 00:30:59.079
<v Speaker 1>Her mother Aggie, who had cradled her daughter's body just

567
00:30:59.200 --> 00:31:02.920
<v Speaker 1>minutes after the attack, was now left with the unbearable

568
00:31:02.960 --> 00:31:04.920
<v Speaker 1>silence of a home that would never be the same.

569
00:31:05.799 --> 00:31:09.559
<v Speaker 1>Her younger brother Alessandro, once just down the hall, now

570
00:31:09.599 --> 00:31:13.160
<v Speaker 1>stood in a space defied by loss, defined by loss sorry.

571
00:31:14.039 --> 00:31:18.000
<v Speaker 1>And her father Tony and older brother Jaden, they each

572
00:31:18.039 --> 00:31:21.000
<v Speaker 1>shattered in their own way, joined in a morning process

573
00:31:21.160 --> 00:31:25.359
<v Speaker 1>that would never truly end. More than one hundred people

574
00:31:25.359 --> 00:31:29.480
<v Speaker 1>attended Sles's funeral. She was remembered not just for the

575
00:31:29.519 --> 00:31:31.599
<v Speaker 1>tragic way that her life ended, but for the light

576
00:31:31.680 --> 00:31:36.400
<v Speaker 1>that she brought to others while she was here, her laughter,

577
00:31:36.599 --> 00:31:41.759
<v Speaker 1>her warmth end, as I mentioned many times, her immense kindness.

578
00:31:42.519 --> 00:31:46.200
<v Speaker 1>The community rallied behind the Mono family, devastated by the

579
00:31:46.240 --> 00:31:52.559
<v Speaker 1>senseless murder that just occurred. Meanwhile, luey Seiko was in custody.

580
00:31:53.200 --> 00:31:55.519
<v Speaker 1>In the weeks and months that followed, the legal proceedings

581
00:31:55.519 --> 00:32:00.279
<v Speaker 1>would drag on. It would be far from smooth to

582
00:32:00.319 --> 00:32:04.319
<v Speaker 1>manipulate the justice system from inside his cell. He fired

583
00:32:04.319 --> 00:32:09.039
<v Speaker 1>and rehired lawyers multiple times, delayed hearings, classic every move

584
00:32:09.079 --> 00:32:12.200
<v Speaker 1>in the book sort of thing, to prolong whatever he could.

585
00:32:12.759 --> 00:32:16.200
<v Speaker 1>He changed his plea and even attempted to represent himself

586
00:32:16.240 --> 00:32:18.680
<v Speaker 1>in court. At one point, he tried to argue that

587
00:32:18.720 --> 00:32:23.720
<v Speaker 1>he'd only inflicted two wounds, even though they were twenty three.

588
00:32:24.079 --> 00:32:26.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah, good luck with that one, buddy.

589
00:32:26.680 --> 00:32:32.599
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it was easily disproved. He leaned heavily on claims

590
00:32:32.640 --> 00:32:35.920
<v Speaker 1>of mental illness, of course, telling psychiatrists he'd been influenced

591
00:32:35.920 --> 00:32:40.680
<v Speaker 1>by a hallucinated figure named Isaiah, But multiple forensic experts

592
00:32:40.759 --> 00:32:44.880
<v Speaker 1>they saw right through it. They noted that his descriptions

593
00:32:44.960 --> 00:32:49.319
<v Speaker 1>matched textbook criteria too closely, almost like someone who had

594
00:32:49.359 --> 00:32:53.440
<v Speaker 1>studied the symptoms rather than someone truly suffering from them.

595
00:32:53.799 --> 00:32:56.839
<v Speaker 1>In one psychiatrist's view, the hallucinations that he claimed were

596
00:32:56.920 --> 00:32:59.920
<v Speaker 1>likely just Luay's way of separating himself from the violent

597
00:33:00.119 --> 00:33:03.519
<v Speaker 1>side of his personality, basically an easy way to deflect

598
00:33:03.559 --> 00:33:08.480
<v Speaker 1>the blame. Despite these manipulations, the court eventually found Luey

599
00:33:08.559 --> 00:33:12.839
<v Speaker 1>Seiko fit to stand trial. He pled guilty to celess

600
00:33:12.920 --> 00:33:16.200
<v Speaker 1>murder in early twenty twenty four, over three years after

601
00:33:16.240 --> 00:33:20.440
<v Speaker 1>the crime. On February twenty ninth, twenty twenty four, Justice

602
00:33:20.559 --> 00:33:25.759
<v Speaker 1>Jane Dixon handed down the sentence thirty six years in prison,

603
00:33:26.119 --> 00:33:29.960
<v Speaker 1>with a possibility of parole after thirty The courtroom was

604
00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:32.920
<v Speaker 1>packed with seless family and friends, dressed all in black,

605
00:33:33.200 --> 00:33:36.160
<v Speaker 1>holding each other tightly. As the judge read the sentence.

606
00:33:36.200 --> 00:33:39.000
<v Speaker 1>There were tears, not just for the grief they carried,

607
00:33:39.000 --> 00:33:43.119
<v Speaker 1>but for the sense that justice once again had fallen short.

608
00:33:44.079 --> 00:33:48.240
<v Speaker 1>Aggie Mono had written two speeches that day, one for

609
00:33:48.400 --> 00:33:52.119
<v Speaker 1>if her daughter's killer received life and one if he didn't.

610
00:33:52.920 --> 00:33:56.519
<v Speaker 1>When the judge spared him the harshest sentence available under

611
00:33:56.599 --> 00:33:59.400
<v Speaker 1>Victorian law, Aggie tore up the first speech and delivered

612
00:33:59.440 --> 00:34:03.599
<v Speaker 1>the second, her voice shaking with anger and heartbreak. She

613
00:34:03.720 --> 00:34:07.920
<v Speaker 1>called the decision outrageous, accusing the court of showing mercy

614
00:34:07.960 --> 00:34:11.639
<v Speaker 1>to a man who had shown her daughter none to

615
00:34:11.719 --> 00:34:15.599
<v Speaker 1>quote her at least just a little. It's unbelievable that

616
00:34:15.679 --> 00:34:19.239
<v Speaker 1>the system protected him more than it protected her. I

617
00:34:19.280 --> 00:34:22.760
<v Speaker 1>don't believe in parole. I don't believe in releasing murderers

618
00:34:22.920 --> 00:34:28.639
<v Speaker 1>to murder again. Celestiano's murder wasn't random it was It

619
00:34:28.679 --> 00:34:32.400
<v Speaker 1>wasn't unpredictable either. It was the end result of a

620
00:34:32.480 --> 00:34:36.920
<v Speaker 1>system that saw the warning signs over and over, and

621
00:34:37.000 --> 00:34:39.920
<v Speaker 1>yet it just failed to act in time. For more

622
00:34:39.920 --> 00:34:43.440
<v Speaker 1>than a year, Celeste was stalked, harassed, and threatened by Luet.

623
00:34:43.920 --> 00:34:46.840
<v Speaker 1>She blocked him, reported him, took legal steps to protect herself,

624
00:34:46.840 --> 00:34:49.280
<v Speaker 1>and even told police that she feared he might kill her.

625
00:34:49.360 --> 00:34:53.559
<v Speaker 1>Yet at every critical point where intervention could have made

626
00:34:53.599 --> 00:34:58.280
<v Speaker 1>a difference, the system faltered. When she first went to police,

627
00:34:58.360 --> 00:35:01.239
<v Speaker 1>she and her mother were dismissed. The officer they spoke

628
00:35:01.280 --> 00:35:04.559
<v Speaker 1>to didn't take notes or records or names, nothing as

629
00:35:04.599 --> 00:35:06.880
<v Speaker 1>I mentioned. Instead, celest was told to just ignore it

630
00:35:06.880 --> 00:35:10.119
<v Speaker 1>and get off social media. No form of action was taken,

631
00:35:10.440 --> 00:35:13.199
<v Speaker 1>no follow up was done. It wasn't until the second

632
00:35:13.280 --> 00:35:17.159
<v Speaker 1>visit months later with pages of evidence in hand that

633
00:35:17.239 --> 00:35:21.079
<v Speaker 1>a personal safety intervention order was finally granted because someone

634
00:35:21.119 --> 00:35:24.800
<v Speaker 1>actually did their job. Even then, the protection was fragile.

635
00:35:25.159 --> 00:35:28.719
<v Speaker 1>When Luey violated the order with a letter being sent

636
00:35:28.800 --> 00:35:33.639
<v Speaker 1>to Celest. There was no electronic monitoring after he was released,

637
00:35:33.760 --> 00:35:38.840
<v Speaker 1>no risk assessment protocol, no consistent enforcement of legal boundaries

638
00:35:38.880 --> 00:35:40.800
<v Speaker 1>to keep her safe.

639
00:35:40.960 --> 00:35:41.119
<v Speaker 2>Now.

640
00:35:41.199 --> 00:35:46.840
<v Speaker 1>Unfortunately, this whole issue isn't unique to Celeste case. Between

641
00:35:46.840 --> 00:35:50.719
<v Speaker 1>twenty eleven and twenty twenty, the Australian Victoria Police received

642
00:35:51.039 --> 00:35:55.920
<v Speaker 1>over one hundred thousand applications for personal safety intervention orders.

643
00:35:56.920 --> 00:36:01.000
<v Speaker 1>During that same period, they recorded nearly twenty six thousand

644
00:36:01.079 --> 00:36:04.960
<v Speaker 1>breaches of those orders. That is over twenty five percent

645
00:36:05.559 --> 00:36:10.320
<v Speaker 1>breaching the order, along with more than two thy one

646
00:36:10.400 --> 00:36:14.800
<v Speaker 1>hundred stocking offenses. Despite the volume of reports, few of

647
00:36:14.800 --> 00:36:19.079
<v Speaker 1>these cases result in significant criminal consequences unless the behavior

648
00:36:19.239 --> 00:36:23.039
<v Speaker 1>escalates to violence. So they let it escalate to violence

649
00:36:23.039 --> 00:36:25.320
<v Speaker 1>before they do anything, is essentially what I'm.

650
00:36:25.199 --> 00:36:30.360
<v Speaker 2>Saying, huh okay, that's so alarming.

651
00:36:31.320 --> 00:36:35.760
<v Speaker 1>After sless deaths, death public pressure grew. In twenty twenty one,

652
00:36:36.000 --> 00:36:39.559
<v Speaker 1>the Victorian Law Reform Commission conducted an in depth review

653
00:36:39.599 --> 00:36:42.920
<v Speaker 1>of the state's stalking laws. The report included forty five

654
00:36:42.960 --> 00:36:47.920
<v Speaker 1>recommendation measures that would improve early detection, expand to definitions

655
00:36:47.920 --> 00:36:52.119
<v Speaker 1>of stalking, and introduce better tools for police response, but

656
00:36:52.159 --> 00:36:54.000
<v Speaker 1>as of twenty twenty four, not a single one of

657
00:36:54.039 --> 00:36:58.719
<v Speaker 1>those recommendations has been fully implemented. One tool that did

658
00:36:58.760 --> 00:37:03.119
<v Speaker 1>emerge was a screening process known as SASH, a Screening

659
00:37:03.159 --> 00:37:08.039
<v Speaker 1>Assessment for stocking and harassment. It was designed for police

660
00:37:08.719 --> 00:37:12.400
<v Speaker 1>to help these officers identify high risk cases early and

661
00:37:12.519 --> 00:37:18.360
<v Speaker 1>intervene before violence do occur, but four years after Celest's death,

662
00:37:18.760 --> 00:37:22.440
<v Speaker 1>the tool still hasn't been rolled out across all police stations,

663
00:37:22.599 --> 00:37:26.840
<v Speaker 1>so it's still a work in progress. When pressed about

664
00:37:26.840 --> 00:37:30.559
<v Speaker 1>the delay, Victorian Attorney General acknowledged the importance of the initiative,

665
00:37:30.559 --> 00:37:34.559
<v Speaker 1>but offered no clear timeline for full implementation. She said

666
00:37:35.239 --> 00:37:38.199
<v Speaker 1>there are no easy fixes, a statement that didn't sit

667
00:37:38.239 --> 00:37:41.039
<v Speaker 1>well with those who knew Celest or understood how preventable

668
00:37:41.079 --> 00:37:43.920
<v Speaker 1>her death truly was. And in all honesty, it just

669
00:37:44.000 --> 00:37:47.559
<v Speaker 1>shows that she doesn't have a fire lit under her

670
00:37:47.559 --> 00:37:52.000
<v Speaker 1>ass because this is a system that could save lives. Yeah,

671
00:37:52.039 --> 00:37:55.000
<v Speaker 1>and to say that there's no easy fixes, yeah, you're right,

672
00:37:55.760 --> 00:37:59.440
<v Speaker 1>But you can help save people if you get this

673
00:38:00.119 --> 00:38:01.039
<v Speaker 1>implemented soon.

674
00:38:01.440 --> 00:38:03.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, if you light a fire and on your ass. Yeah.

675
00:38:03.599 --> 00:38:08.400
<v Speaker 1>So while what what she's saying is true, it also

676
00:38:08.480 --> 00:38:12.239
<v Speaker 1>shows that she's a little bit too lax celest mother,

677
00:38:12.320 --> 00:38:15.119
<v Speaker 1>Aggie has been vocal about these failures. She filed a

678
00:38:15.119 --> 00:38:18.440
<v Speaker 1>civil suit against Victoria Police, accusing them of negligence and

679
00:38:18.519 --> 00:38:22.320
<v Speaker 1>a breach of duty. Her argument is simple. If police

680
00:38:22.360 --> 00:38:25.440
<v Speaker 1>had conducted a proper risk assessment, if there had if

681
00:38:25.480 --> 00:38:28.000
<v Speaker 1>they had taken sless fears seriously from the start, if

682
00:38:28.039 --> 00:38:32.639
<v Speaker 1>they had enforced the law with urgency the urgency had deserved,

683
00:38:32.760 --> 00:38:36.559
<v Speaker 1>her daughter might still be alive. After losing her daughter

684
00:38:36.639 --> 00:38:40.199
<v Speaker 1>in this horrific way, the most horrific way imaginable. Honestly,

685
00:38:40.719 --> 00:38:44.079
<v Speaker 1>Aggie could have disappeared into grief, no one would have

686
00:38:44.079 --> 00:38:47.599
<v Speaker 1>blamed her. She had experienced what most people can even comprehend,

687
00:38:47.679 --> 00:38:50.039
<v Speaker 1>the death of a child, not by accident, but through

688
00:38:50.960 --> 00:38:54.280
<v Speaker 1>a slow and painful build up of fear, warning signs

689
00:38:54.519 --> 00:38:59.159
<v Speaker 1>and inaction resulting in murder. In fact, she was even

690
00:38:59.199 --> 00:39:02.039
<v Speaker 1>there to hold her as her body was still bleeding out.

691
00:39:03.880 --> 00:39:06.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I don't even know how you move forward from that.

692
00:39:06.880 --> 00:39:11.360
<v Speaker 1>Really well, she managed to because instead of retreating, Aggie

693
00:39:11.440 --> 00:39:14.519
<v Speaker 1>chose to fight. In the days following seless murder, she

694
00:39:14.559 --> 00:39:17.239
<v Speaker 1>made a promise not just to herself but to her daughter.

695
00:39:17.880 --> 00:39:21.679
<v Speaker 1>She would get justice, not just in the courtroom, but

696
00:39:22.039 --> 00:39:25.280
<v Speaker 1>in the laws, the systems, and the protections that failed

697
00:39:25.320 --> 00:39:29.440
<v Speaker 1>so badly. Her first step was going public. She stood

698
00:39:29.440 --> 00:39:32.480
<v Speaker 1>in front of news cameras, not as a spokesperson but

699
00:39:32.599 --> 00:39:35.760
<v Speaker 1>as a mother, a mother furious that her daughter's killer

700
00:39:35.880 --> 00:39:38.519
<v Speaker 1>was shown mercy by the courts whilst Lest herself had

701
00:39:38.519 --> 00:39:42.079
<v Speaker 1>been shown none. When Luey Seiko was sentenced to thirty

702
00:39:42.119 --> 00:39:45.840
<v Speaker 1>six years with a non parole period of thirty Aggie

703
00:39:45.920 --> 00:39:50.480
<v Speaker 1>ripped up her speech and of course made her resentment

704
00:39:50.599 --> 00:39:54.719
<v Speaker 1>quite clear. But she didn't stop at that microphone. Aggie

705
00:39:54.719 --> 00:39:58.840
<v Speaker 1>began pushing for real legislative change. She called for mandatory

706
00:39:58.880 --> 00:40:02.480
<v Speaker 1>electronic monitoring of anyone under a personal safety intervention order,

707
00:40:02.880 --> 00:40:06.000
<v Speaker 1>arguing that if Luey had been tracked, lest might still

708
00:40:06.039 --> 00:40:09.559
<v Speaker 1>be alive. She rallied for law enforcement to treat stalking

709
00:40:09.599 --> 00:40:12.639
<v Speaker 1>not as a nuisance or inconvenience, but as a credible threat,

710
00:40:12.719 --> 00:40:18.199
<v Speaker 1>because her daughter that's what it was to her. She

711
00:40:18.239 --> 00:40:21.360
<v Speaker 1>also started working with advocacy groups with and legal experts

712
00:40:21.840 --> 00:40:24.599
<v Speaker 1>to pressure the Victorian government to implement the full list

713
00:40:24.639 --> 00:40:28.519
<v Speaker 1>of reforms recommended by the Law Reform Commission. She highlighted

714
00:40:28.519 --> 00:40:31.840
<v Speaker 1>the delay in rolling out the SASH assessment tool, calling

715
00:40:31.840 --> 00:40:34.519
<v Speaker 1>it a lack of resources dedicated to early intervention in

716
00:40:34.559 --> 00:40:39.880
<v Speaker 1>stocking cases. Her mission is ongoing. She doesn't just want reform,

717
00:40:39.960 --> 00:40:45.000
<v Speaker 1>she wants transformation, and she's not backing down. For every

718
00:40:45.039 --> 00:40:47.639
<v Speaker 1>parent who's ever worried about their child's safety, for every

719
00:40:47.719 --> 00:40:51.039
<v Speaker 1>woman who's felt unsafe walking to her car, and for

720
00:40:51.079 --> 00:40:55.880
<v Speaker 1>every stalking victim who's been told just ignore it, Aggie

721
00:40:55.920 --> 00:40:59.079
<v Speaker 1>is determined to be the voice that says this isn't

722
00:40:59.119 --> 00:41:03.360
<v Speaker 1>good enough any more. And above all, she's doing it

723
00:41:03.480 --> 00:41:08.840
<v Speaker 1>for her daughter, Celeste. And that's the story of Celeste Mono.

724
00:41:09.920 --> 00:41:15.440
<v Speaker 2>Who man, that one just guts Yeah. Yeah. Also, like

725
00:41:15.519 --> 00:41:18.119
<v Speaker 2>her mom is incredible, but it's not surprising being that,

726
00:41:18.239 --> 00:41:22.239
<v Speaker 2>like she raised also such an incredible person.

727
00:41:22.920 --> 00:41:25.559
<v Speaker 1>Well, and I want to say, Aggie is our badass

728
00:41:25.559 --> 00:41:27.000
<v Speaker 1>of the day. I went on quite a bit of

729
00:41:27.000 --> 00:41:29.559
<v Speaker 1>a rent there at the end about Aggie and what

730
00:41:29.599 --> 00:41:32.840
<v Speaker 1>she's doing and what she's trying to fight for because

731
00:41:34.079 --> 00:41:37.559
<v Speaker 1>I watched there's some interviews with her, and she is

732
00:41:38.079 --> 00:41:42.679
<v Speaker 1>like in fucking tears and she's describing in detail what happened,

733
00:41:43.000 --> 00:41:45.039
<v Speaker 1>and she's fighting through it all to make sure that

734
00:41:45.039 --> 00:41:47.800
<v Speaker 1>she's giving her daughter and other people in that situation

735
00:41:48.320 --> 00:41:52.400
<v Speaker 1>a voice and trying to reform the situation and ensure

736
00:41:52.400 --> 00:41:56.119
<v Speaker 1>that people do their fucking job and that the system

737
00:41:56.159 --> 00:41:59.280
<v Speaker 1>doesn't fail others and end up in lives being lost.

738
00:41:59.360 --> 00:42:03.400
<v Speaker 1>So Aggie is one percent or badass of the day. Yeah,

739
00:42:03.400 --> 00:42:04.920
<v Speaker 1>so shout out to her totally.

740
00:42:05.440 --> 00:42:10.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. The fact that she's just using like her daughter's

741
00:42:10.800 --> 00:42:14.119
<v Speaker 2>death for the for good really and giving her power

742
00:42:14.159 --> 00:42:16.719
<v Speaker 2>to like, hopefully this doesn't happen to someone else kind

743
00:42:16.719 --> 00:42:20.360
<v Speaker 2>of Yeah, so because it will, Like that's it will

744
00:42:20.519 --> 00:42:22.639
<v Speaker 2>it will if nothing's changed, right.

745
00:42:22.599 --> 00:42:24.800
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Well, unfortunately we live in a world where there

746
00:42:24.840 --> 00:42:26.719
<v Speaker 1>are people who don't give a shit and just say

747
00:42:26.719 --> 00:42:27.800
<v Speaker 1>we'll get off social media.

748
00:42:27.840 --> 00:42:33.559
<v Speaker 2>Then oh yeah. But the thing is, like, especially this guy,

749
00:42:33.719 --> 00:42:38.679
<v Speaker 2>he was like persistent, and you know, if she got

750
00:42:38.679 --> 00:42:41.559
<v Speaker 2>off social media like he, it wouldn't matter, No, it wouldn't.

751
00:42:41.639 --> 00:42:43.679
<v Speaker 2>He'd find other ways and it wouldn't.

752
00:42:43.719 --> 00:42:46.519
<v Speaker 1>And honestly, why can't she be on social media? She

753
00:42:46.519 --> 00:42:47.519
<v Speaker 1>doesn't have to be off it?

754
00:42:47.559 --> 00:42:49.639
<v Speaker 2>One hundred percent. But I'm just saying if she say

755
00:42:49.800 --> 00:42:52.400
<v Speaker 2>followed that it's not going to change anything, she just

756
00:42:52.400 --> 00:42:54.920
<v Speaker 2>then wouldn't be able to like post shit that she

757
00:42:54.920 --> 00:42:57.480
<v Speaker 2>wants to post with her friends. I know, so that's

758
00:42:57.519 --> 00:42:58.440
<v Speaker 2>not okay.

759
00:42:58.280 --> 00:43:00.280
<v Speaker 1>But in all honesty, like if we were on the

760
00:43:00.280 --> 00:43:03.400
<v Speaker 1>clock back to the seventies, right before there was the internet,

761
00:43:03.440 --> 00:43:06.400
<v Speaker 1>before there was social media, we're in the seventies, okay,

762
00:43:06.639 --> 00:43:08.519
<v Speaker 1>and someone's stocking you in the seventies, how do they

763
00:43:08.559 --> 00:43:10.159
<v Speaker 1>stalk you? If they're going to be messaging you over

764
00:43:10.199 --> 00:43:13.480
<v Speaker 1>and over, they deliver shit to your house so you

765
00:43:13.519 --> 00:43:17.039
<v Speaker 1>get physical mail at your mailbox, right, Yeah, Now, imagine

766
00:43:17.079 --> 00:43:20.840
<v Speaker 1>taking letters from a stalker to an officer and he

767
00:43:20.880 --> 00:43:23.719
<v Speaker 1>looks at them and says, well, don't have an address,

768
00:43:23.760 --> 00:43:25.000
<v Speaker 1>then get out of that house.

769
00:43:25.760 --> 00:43:26.480
<v Speaker 2>Are you kidding me?

770
00:43:26.880 --> 00:43:30.000
<v Speaker 1>In today's society, you almost need to be on social media.

771
00:43:30.440 --> 00:43:32.639
<v Speaker 1>If you're going to apply for a job, they pretty

772
00:43:32.679 --> 00:43:35.320
<v Speaker 1>much always look at your LinkedIn your social history.

773
00:43:35.079 --> 00:43:37.079
<v Speaker 2>Like it would probably be weird if you had nothing.

774
00:43:37.320 --> 00:43:40.039
<v Speaker 1>Exactly how do you keep in contact? Like it's the

775
00:43:40.079 --> 00:43:42.599
<v Speaker 1>internet is a part of our daily lives now.

776
00:43:42.800 --> 00:43:45.000
<v Speaker 2>I mean fact, I just have to clarify weird for

777
00:43:45.000 --> 00:43:47.440
<v Speaker 2>an employer, not necessarily, Like I actually think having no

778
00:43:47.519 --> 00:43:50.639
<v Speaker 2>social media would be awesome, but then we all, like

779
00:43:50.760 --> 00:43:52.920
<v Speaker 2>lots of people need it for their jobs and stuff too,

780
00:43:53.000 --> 00:43:56.719
<v Speaker 2>Like we post on there to advertise and stuff.

781
00:43:56.800 --> 00:44:01.320
<v Speaker 1>So exactly our job is, well, line is this podcast

782
00:44:01.840 --> 00:44:04.360
<v Speaker 1>to tell me to get off social media. That's my living,

783
00:44:04.440 --> 00:44:08.400
<v Speaker 1>that's what I do. You can't do that to someone, no, no,

784
00:44:08.760 --> 00:44:12.360
<v Speaker 1>so I'm sorry, but right now to that officer, fuck you.

785
00:44:12.480 --> 00:44:15.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, well I know you almost hope that guy doesn't

786
00:44:15.159 --> 00:44:16.199
<v Speaker 2>have a job anymore.

787
00:44:16.400 --> 00:44:17.440
<v Speaker 1>Really, I honestly do.

788
00:44:18.599 --> 00:44:20.960
<v Speaker 2>But then the numbers you gave to it was so

789
00:44:21.199 --> 00:44:25.079
<v Speaker 2>many numbers. It's like you almost wonder if they have enough,

790
00:44:26.639 --> 00:44:29.920
<v Speaker 2>you know, people in position to do something when they're

791
00:44:29.920 --> 00:44:32.760
<v Speaker 2>getting that many drastic numbers of like I can't remember

792
00:44:32.800 --> 00:44:35.440
<v Speaker 2>what it was called, but these people getting this protection

793
00:44:35.559 --> 00:44:36.760
<v Speaker 2>and shit right, yeah.

794
00:44:36.719 --> 00:44:40.880
<v Speaker 1>It was the SI. We'll just call it a restraining

795
00:44:40.960 --> 00:44:43.239
<v Speaker 1>order because that's basically what it is, but just specifically

796
00:44:43.280 --> 00:44:47.280
<v Speaker 1>under the Victorian Australian law. But yeah, the restraining orders,

797
00:44:47.880 --> 00:44:49.920
<v Speaker 1>it was like one hundred thousand within that time period

798
00:44:49.960 --> 00:44:53.199
<v Speaker 1>I gave and it was over just over twenty five

799
00:44:53.239 --> 00:44:57.280
<v Speaker 1>percent of them being breached, like are you kidding me? So, yeah,

800
00:44:57.440 --> 00:45:00.920
<v Speaker 1>is there enough people in a position to actually enforce

801
00:45:01.119 --> 00:45:03.000
<v Speaker 1>mandaties and process them.

802
00:45:02.920 --> 00:45:06.039
<v Speaker 2>Because I feel like that's something. I mean, that one

803
00:45:06.079 --> 00:45:09.360
<v Speaker 2>guy one hundred percent wasn't doing his job, But then

804
00:45:09.440 --> 00:45:11.880
<v Speaker 2>some people they might also be like spread away too thin,

805
00:45:12.039 --> 00:45:16.760
<v Speaker 2>too right, So true, I don't know. It's honestly really

806
00:45:16.840 --> 00:45:19.519
<v Speaker 2>alarming that there is even that many that people are

807
00:45:19.519 --> 00:45:21.280
<v Speaker 2>that messed up, that there's that many.

808
00:45:21.519 --> 00:45:25.079
<v Speaker 1>Well, that's those are the ones that are actually reporting it. Yeah,

809
00:45:25.159 --> 00:45:28.400
<v Speaker 1>those are the case. That's the Probably it's probably at

810
00:45:28.519 --> 00:45:31.719
<v Speaker 1>least double that, probably way more. But just for argument's sake,

811
00:45:32.000 --> 00:45:34.679
<v Speaker 1>let's just say it's fifty percent of the actual cases,

812
00:45:34.719 --> 00:45:36.840
<v Speaker 1>fifty percent of them get reported, and the other fifty

813
00:45:36.880 --> 00:45:40.920
<v Speaker 1>percent just go unreported. So say two hundred thousand in

814
00:45:40.960 --> 00:45:45.320
<v Speaker 1>that period. That's terrible because how many people don't trust

815
00:45:45.360 --> 00:45:47.239
<v Speaker 1>the police or feel like they can't go to police,

816
00:45:47.440 --> 00:45:49.719
<v Speaker 1>or in a position where they can't speak up, or

817
00:45:49.840 --> 00:45:52.480
<v Speaker 1>they just think nothing's going to happen. I'm gonna try

818
00:45:52.480 --> 00:45:54.440
<v Speaker 1>and take matters into my own hands, try and solve it.

819
00:45:54.480 --> 00:45:57.239
<v Speaker 1>They move, they do, get off social media, you know

820
00:45:57.320 --> 00:45:58.199
<v Speaker 1>that sort of stuff.

821
00:45:58.800 --> 00:46:02.679
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's what kind of makes you scared shit, let's

822
00:46:02.719 --> 00:46:04.920
<v Speaker 2>say about this this world.

823
00:46:05.239 --> 00:46:10.599
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but then you have people like Aggie yes, oh my,

824
00:46:10.800 --> 00:46:13.679
<v Speaker 1>and the officer who actually did do his job. There

825
00:46:13.719 --> 00:46:15.559
<v Speaker 1>are good people out there too well.

826
00:46:15.480 --> 00:46:18.280
<v Speaker 2>And that officer too, Like I'm sure that this whole

827
00:46:18.320 --> 00:46:21.280
<v Speaker 2>thing just like gutted him, and that first guy probably

828
00:46:21.320 --> 00:46:24.920
<v Speaker 2>didn't give a shit at all, which is maddening.

829
00:46:25.159 --> 00:46:27.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, like I said to him, fuck you. He's a

830
00:46:27.920 --> 00:46:30.039
<v Speaker 1>douche canoe through and through. But anyways, thank you for

831
00:46:30.079 --> 00:46:32.639
<v Speaker 1>being here. Hopefully enjoyed this episode. It is a frustrating one.

832
00:46:32.639 --> 00:46:35.760
<v Speaker 1>I can understand if you're probably screaming at us over

833
00:46:35.800 --> 00:46:38.800
<v Speaker 1>on the other side of this, if you're on headphones

834
00:46:38.880 --> 00:46:41.360
<v Speaker 1>or speakers, whatever. But if you do want to check

835
00:46:41.360 --> 00:46:43.559
<v Speaker 1>out some other episodes, if you want to get into Patreon,

836
00:46:43.639 --> 00:46:45.599
<v Speaker 1>some other of our social media links, because we ain't

837
00:46:45.599 --> 00:46:48.559
<v Speaker 1>getting off social media all. In the description of this podcast,

838
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<v Speaker 1>you can check it out if you want to give

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<v Speaker 1>us a review. We're an indie podcast, produced research host

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<v Speaker 1>on our own. There's no big corporation pulling strings like

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<v Speaker 1>puppeteering us. We do what we want, when we want,

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<v Speaker 1>how we want it, and if you like that, we'd

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<v Speaker 1>appreciate a good review from you because it really helps us.

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<v Speaker 2>We sure would, we sure would.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Anyways, thank you for being here, and until next time,

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<v Speaker 1>stay wicked.