Speaker 1: The following presentation is abol Marvis Studio's production.
Speaker 2: When you look on the sky, do you feel the poll?
Speaker 3: The question why.
Speaker 2: The stories told and left behind in shadows where the
Speaker 2: truth we find? They built their tails on grafts and
Speaker 2: lines on theories they stake their designed.
Speaker 1: Put down here on this solid graph the answer screen.
Speaker 2: There.
Speaker 4: Welcome back truth seekers from around the world. It's time
Speaker 4: for another edition of the flat Earth Files podcast.
Speaker 3: Yes, we are back a new year.
Speaker 4: As we record it is Thursday, January sixteenth.
Speaker 3: Twenty twenty five.
Speaker 4: It's incredible that we are already halfway through this first
Speaker 4: month of January. I hope everybody is doing well, happy
Speaker 4: and healthy. We've had it's been very wintry here, lots
Speaker 4: of snow, single digit temperatures, but we're supposed to get
Speaker 4: a bit of a reprieve for the next two days
Speaker 4: and then back to our win street ways. Ladies and gentlemen,
Speaker 4: you can check out everything flat earth Files on our website,
Speaker 4: the flat earthfiles dot com. We have a chat room.
Speaker 4: Every episode is put in the form of a blog
Speaker 4: post with all the notes of the things we've mentioned,
Speaker 4: including the podcast itself. There's a forum, lots to do
Speaker 4: it is the Flat Earthfiles dot com And if you'd
Speaker 4: like to join the program, like Justin is today and
Speaker 4: by the way, the next two weeks we'll have a
Speaker 4: couple of Canadian guests back to back. Looking forward to that,
Speaker 4: please send us an email. It is FE filesguest at
Speaker 4: gmail dot com. Again, that is FE filesguest at gmail
Speaker 4: dot com. The links to the website and the email
Speaker 4: address to join us, as always, are in the show description.
Speaker 3: Joining us for a second round.
Speaker 4: I think this is only the second or the third
Speaker 4: person to come on to join us again. He was
Speaker 4: on episode one fifty five back in March of twenty
Speaker 4: twenty four. He has recently left Sunnywarm Florida for almost
Speaker 4: and sunny is Warm Michigan in the winter, which I'm
Speaker 4: familiar with. I left Hawaii in December or the fall,
Speaker 4: i should say, and I went to upstate New York,
Speaker 4: so it's quite a transition.
Speaker 3: Justin, welcome back to the program, Sarah, How are.
Speaker 1: You, George? Thank you for having me again?
Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure, thanks for joining us.
Speaker 4: And for those who may have not caught episode one
Speaker 4: fifty five, why don't you give yourself a bit of
Speaker 4: an introduction?
Speaker 1: Okay, I am again as we did in the last episode.
Speaker 1: Would you mind if I open up with a.
Speaker 3: Word of pray, that'd be awesome? Thank you all right,
Speaker 3: ms bow our heads are having me.
Speaker 1: Father, We thank you for this day and this opportunity
Speaker 1: to come together and fellowship and to speak in regards
Speaker 1: to truth, not only truth, which there are many forms
Speaker 1: of truth, but there is only one who is the truth.
Speaker 1: And we thank you for this opportunity, Father, to be
Speaker 1: witnesses for the Word and for the truth that you
Speaker 1: have given through your creation. And also, first and foremost
Speaker 1: of your scripture, which teaches us of your son. I
Speaker 1: asked today that it not be we who speak, but
Speaker 1: it be your Holy Spirit who speaks through us. That
Speaker 1: everything that you would have us learn, we speak for, Father,
Speaker 1: and that we hear and understand. Give us eyes to see,
Speaker 1: years to hear in her to understand all that you
Speaker 1: would teach us. Today. In Jesus name, we pray Amen.
Speaker 3: Amen, thank you for that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, yeah. I don't want to go into too
Speaker 1: long of an introduction because as you said, there's another
Speaker 1: episode in regards for that. But my name is Justin Ellenboss.
Speaker 1: I am a slave of Jesus Christ, a minister of
Speaker 1: the Gospel. I have been a flat earther for years now,
Speaker 1: though I last time we talked about it, I refer
Speaker 1: to myself as a biblical cosmologist. I believe that flat
Speaker 1: earth is a fact, that is a truth. But the
Speaker 1: truth of all the creation points to Jesus Christ as Lord.
Speaker 1: And it's always just interesting to me whenever we get
Speaker 1: into these discussions, whenever you try to whenever you try
Speaker 1: to I try to bring up the truth with an individual,
Speaker 1: whether it's flat Earth or whether it's the Gospel. In
Speaker 1: regards of these things, it always offends. Just the mere
Speaker 1: conversation of it offends because what we're doing is we
Speaker 1: are tearing down worldviews and destroying them, and we're doing
Speaker 1: this by the power of the Truth, the one who
Speaker 1: has come and has revealed all things to us. So
Speaker 1: I am a husband and I have three beautiful children
Speaker 1: who I want to apologize. My wife is out at
Speaker 1: the moment. She's coming back here soon. But if I
Speaker 1: suddenly have to pause, it's because my children are doing
Speaker 1: something to destroy my house or themselves, and I will
Speaker 1: be back. But as of right now, they're all relaxed
Speaker 1: and chilling so that I can meet with you here today.
Speaker 1: We're a pretty simple family family. We live, we live easy.
Speaker 1: My wife works from home, like I do dog training
Speaker 1: with individuals as well. But I also am, as i said,
Speaker 1: a minister of the minister of the Gospel. That allows
Speaker 1: me to be a stay at home dad during the
Speaker 1: daytime as well, and then do discipleship with men in
Speaker 1: the evenings and Bible studies of those sorts as well.
Speaker 1: So it's just been a wonderfully and blessed life by
Speaker 1: the Lord that really helped to he established for us
Speaker 1: before everything happened with C. Nineteen back in the or
Speaker 1: early twenty twenties. And for as much as everything that
Speaker 1: happened with that, our daily life wasn't really affected by that. Obviously,
Speaker 1: we were affected by it in other ways, as we
Speaker 1: talked about the last time we were on here. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm just I'm just a simple man who is a
Speaker 1: slave of the Gospel and who is a believer in
Speaker 1: the truth. And I will the one hill that I
Speaker 1: will stand on and I will die on in battle
Speaker 1: of words and wit is that the world is not
Speaker 1: a globe. Outer space is a lie, and we are
Speaker 1: in a designed creation.
Speaker 4: And you know, sharing the Gospel, and then also discussing
Speaker 4: biblical cosmology with those who may not be you know
Speaker 4: that you may not know on a personal basis. I've
Speaker 4: discipled often in parking lots and outside of walmarts and
Speaker 4: things of that nature. I think it's actually harder to
Speaker 4: discuss biblical cosmology to get anybody's attention for more than
Speaker 4: ten seconds than it is to preach the gospel. And
Speaker 4: we know the Bible is very upfront and tells us
Speaker 4: that you know if you do it is number one,
Speaker 4: it's our duty to share the gospel of Jesus Christ,
Speaker 4: but we're also told we're going to be persecuted for it.
Speaker 4: But on top of that, when you try to have
Speaker 4: a discussion with biblical cosmology, it can be even more
Speaker 4: difficult to hold someone's attention.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, I mean I it's very similar because again,
Speaker 1: the truth is just going to offend. When you are
Speaker 1: talking to an individual and you are basically telling an
Speaker 1: individual you have been deceived your entire life and you
Speaker 1: have believed a lie, it's going to offend because what
Speaker 1: we're doing is we're undermining, even if they don't know
Speaker 1: it consciously, we are undermining foundational beliefs that they've held
Speaker 1: on to for so long, that have upheld many different beliefs,
Speaker 1: and especially like when it comes to a fellow Christians,
Speaker 1: there are so many arguments out there that are not
Speaker 1: biblically based that are used in regards to the universal
Speaker 1: model that the heliocentric model provides that people will make
Speaker 1: to try to prove God. In regards to the expanding
Speaker 1: of the universe and the creation of the universe and
Speaker 1: the Big Banganese and all these things, you will have
Speaker 1: Christians who will talk about how these things which are
Speaker 1: actually a lie point to Jesus Christ. What's up, buddy,
Speaker 1: it's an It should be in the bedroom right over there.
Speaker 1: I don't know, you need a look, sorry about that.
Speaker 1: And so when I'm even when I'm trying to talk
Speaker 1: to my fellow believers, they they they're so rooted. There's
Speaker 1: there's this I remember at one time, it's what we
Speaker 1: do is this ice of Jesus instead of exe Jesus.
Speaker 1: In regards to the scripture, where I've seen pastors who
Speaker 1: talk about like the destruction of Sodom and Gomorah, well,
Speaker 1: how do we how do we how do we come
Speaker 1: to grips with that? In terms to that with that
Speaker 1: with modern or today is modern day understanding by science
Speaker 1: will again, science is the word science just means knowledge.
Speaker 1: So even the concept of science today, if it is
Speaker 1: not biblically based, if it is not in line with
Speaker 1: the scriptures, is actually a lie. And therefore it is
Speaker 1: only really scientism. But you get pastors who will talk
Speaker 1: about Sodom and Gomorah and how that was destroyed, and
Speaker 1: how God sent meteors from space down onto the Earth,
Speaker 1: and how this proves the Bible that well, you the
Speaker 1: finding and in the discovery of meteors in the twentieth
Speaker 1: century proves that the that the Lord could send fire
Speaker 1: down for heaven and destroy these destroy these cities, when
Speaker 1: in fact, what it really is is there's no outer space.
Speaker 1: Meteors are a lie. And that's because oh yeah, and
Speaker 1: that's another thing when you when you're reading spiritual statements
Speaker 1: made all throughout the Old Testament and through Revelation, where
Speaker 1: the Lord says that the stars will fall from heaven.
Speaker 1: I've heard very popular pastors, the YouTube pastors and things
Speaker 1: like that, and things like that. I won't name any
Speaker 1: names at this time because I'm not here to scrutinize them.
Speaker 1: But they'll say, well, the stars falling from heaven doesn't
Speaker 1: speak of the planet's falling, it speaks of meteors. Because
Speaker 1: what they're doing is they're interjecting their understanding of a
Speaker 1: universal creation based off the herealocentric model into their interpretation
Speaker 1: of the scriptures, instead of taking what the scriptures say
Speaker 1: and interpreting the world around them through It's it's a
Speaker 1: flip that is happened and has completely undermined much of
Speaker 1: much of our evangelism, because what we're doing is we're
Speaker 1: putting down our sword, which is the scripture, and we
Speaker 1: are picking up these twigs of human knowledge and human
Speaker 1: understanding that human wisdom is how we should understand truth
Speaker 1: instead of what God has declared, that his word is
Speaker 1: the sword of the spirit, and his word is mighty
Speaker 1: for the tearing down a strongholds, that his word is
Speaker 1: sharper than any two edged sword. And so we've actually
Speaker 1: gone in. The enemy has looked at us, and they
Speaker 1: look at us and they say, well, hold on a second,
Speaker 1: don't Bible thump me. That's unfair. You can't fight me
Speaker 1: with that sword. And we're like, okay, well, yeah, I
Speaker 1: want to be respectful of your opinion. No, I don't
Speaker 1: want to be respectful of your opinion. You believe a lie.
Speaker 1: I'm not going I'm not going to entertain your presuppositions
Speaker 1: that oppose what my Lord has declared. But we have
Speaker 1: so many modern evangelis who don't want to offend that
Speaker 1: instead of taking up the sword and holding faster it.
Speaker 1: You're right, this isn't going to be much of a
Speaker 1: fight if I carry this Bible. I'm gonna put the
Speaker 1: Bible down and I'm gonna pick up worldly knowledge. I'm
Speaker 1: gona pick up human science and let's talk about DNA,
Speaker 1: and let's talk about the expanding of the universe and
Speaker 1: outer space and how these things prove God. Have men
Speaker 1: done that in a sense, yes, But it's still putting
Speaker 1: down the greater weapon, which is the written Word. So
Speaker 1: I totally agree with you. It's harder because the Christian mindset,
Speaker 1: even in modernay apologetics, has been turned toward using science
Speaker 1: as their weapon instead of the Bible.
Speaker 4: Right, you have people stand in the pulpit and tell
Speaker 4: you that everything should be based on the Holy Word,
Speaker 4: and then you get into this particular conversation and they
Speaker 4: like exactly what you said. They want you to explain
Speaker 4: it scientific terms. And I've found, because I get emails
Speaker 4: all the time, if you can't answer one particular question,
Speaker 4: then it should automatically default back to the globe.
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, it just does if you are not the
Speaker 1: arbiter of truth who knows every single aspect of it.
Speaker 1: No matter how you can answer fifty questions correctly and
Speaker 1: provide them information, and they'll be like, but what about suctions?
Speaker 1: What about the stars? And if you can't prove it
Speaker 1: to them in the moment, well, then the whole thing
Speaker 1: is just a lie. And I will give it to
Speaker 1: Dave Weiss and a couple other flat earthers. I've heard,
Speaker 1: I've always, I always. The example is like, tell me
Speaker 1: the shape of your floor, or by looking at your lights,
Speaker 1: or excuse me, he says, look at your lights and
Speaker 1: the ceiling and tell me the shape of your floor.
Speaker 1: Like that is a perfect That is a perfect analogy
Speaker 1: of what these people are trying to do, because they
Speaker 1: can't win the argument by looking at the earth itself,
Speaker 1: so they have to look up to the sky. And
Speaker 1: I mean, in truth, they still don't actually have a
Speaker 1: winning argument there because they're still basing all of their
Speaker 1: information on what they're seeing in the sky, on what
Speaker 1: NASA presents to them, not on what can actually be
Speaker 1: seeing through a telescope when they when you look at
Speaker 1: the stars and you see they're not planets out there,
Speaker 1: They're lights that have ripples and water effects and different
Speaker 1: varying changes within their structure, though they maintain their structure,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: Absolutely?
Speaker 4: Yeah, And Saturn is an interesting one as well. You know,
Speaker 4: if you look at it from how NASA shows you
Speaker 4: to actually what it looks like through a powerful telescope,
Speaker 4: and there is a what's the proper terminology here? Saturn
Speaker 4: is worshiped among occultists, and that in itself is a
Speaker 4: whole nother you know, conversation speaking of you know, evidence,
Speaker 4: and we can't explain, you know, something that has occurred
Speaker 4: since we last spoke, and I guess we can address
Speaker 4: it and get your thoughts. You know, if we take
Speaker 4: the final experiment, we just assume that, okay, there is
Speaker 4: a twenty four hour sun down there, and then people
Speaker 4: automatically just everything that they've researched and came to know
Speaker 4: over the last several years. Many people just said, well,
Speaker 4: I guess we're on a ball and they just walked
Speaker 4: away from it. And to me, I just laughed. You know,
Speaker 4: I didn't even get involved in the Oh those guys
Speaker 4: are shills, this, that and the other thing. I wasn't
Speaker 4: going to be a part of that.
Speaker 3: That's just let's say, okay, we'll take it as they said.
Speaker 4: They actually went to Antarctica and they witnessed a twenty
Speaker 4: four hour son. Going back to what you said, I
Speaker 4: think it's extremely cocky, and I'm sure there's other terms
Speaker 4: we could use that we as humans mere mortals, can
Speaker 4: can understand God's creation.
Speaker 1: Sorry I say that again, cut out there a second.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no problem.
Speaker 4: I was just saying, how cocky it is of us
Speaker 4: that we understand God's creation, you know, to be able
Speaker 4: to decipher how everything was made, how it works.
Speaker 1: Well, I meanis Genesis one is given to us for
Speaker 1: that understanding? Because Genesis one has always refuted any other
Speaker 1: cosmological legend myth story from ancient time, even back to
Speaker 1: the Babylonians and there and their gods, and to the
Speaker 1: Egyptians and their gods, because the gods of these other
Speaker 1: cultures have always been creatures of the creation and matter
Speaker 1: was eternal, which in a sense if you truly break
Speaker 1: it down, that which is eternal is God. So therefore
Speaker 1: matter is God in their worldviews. But they have these
Speaker 1: sub gods who were able to be formed out of
Speaker 1: the eternal and make and start to provide order to
Speaker 1: the chaos. It's the order out of chaos that they
Speaker 1: always go to. But you have God providing to Moses
Speaker 1: the antithesis of this and saying, no, I made this,
Speaker 1: this is how I've done it. And yet at the
Speaker 1: same time it's also to be understood spiritually because this
Speaker 1: world is not the final creation. This is where we
Speaker 1: run into so many problems, is because mankind is Hebrews
Speaker 1: chapter two teaches us has been enslaved to the devil
Speaker 1: through the fear of death their entire lives. We look
Speaker 1: at what we see as death, which is the death
Speaker 1: of the physical, the material, as the end of all things,
Speaker 1: and what is beyond it is unknown. And yet if
Speaker 1: you look at the scriptures, and you read the scriptures
Speaker 1: through the spirit, as he teaches us, Christ who is
Speaker 1: the resurrection, and the life comes and he provides the
Speaker 1: hope that death is not the end, and the death
Speaker 1: that we actually see is not true death, it is sleep.
Speaker 1: He teaches this to the disciples in John chapter eleven,
Speaker 1: when he's going to Lazarus, or going to see Lazarus,
Speaker 1: he withholds for four days and he says to them,
Speaker 1: first and foremost Lazarus is sleeping. And they said, They
Speaker 1: say to them, well, if he's sleeping, then great, we
Speaker 1: don't have to worry about it. He'll recover. And then
Speaker 1: he speaks to them plainly, which is another way of
Speaker 1: saying to them, he speaks to them carnally, No, Lazarus
Speaker 1: is dead. And this is the same thing you get
Speaker 1: in the early parts of the Psalm where the psalmist
Speaker 1: David states that let me sleep the sleep of death,
Speaker 1: because spiritually speaking, the death that we see in this life,
Speaker 1: which is the end of this physical world, is rest.
Speaker 1: It's sleep. Revelation or excuse me, Jude talks about and
Speaker 1: I think it's Jude eleven amount clear exactly on that
Speaker 1: where he says that there are those who are twice dead,
Speaker 1: and you hear about in Revelation in chapter twenty those
Speaker 1: who will be harmed by the second death, and Scripture
Speaker 1: even talks about how death will the Lord will kill death,
Speaker 1: Death will be swallowed up and will die because there
Speaker 1: is a true eternal death that the Lord commands, not
Speaker 1: that the devil has the power that will eventually come
Speaker 1: over all things. But we have been so enamored with
Speaker 1: this world and we fall into these pits and these
Speaker 1: traps of loving all of these carnal things, that we
Speaker 1: do not set our minds and our treasures on that
Speaker 1: which is eternal, which is unseen, and therefore we get
Speaker 1: lost in this slavery for our entire lives, and we
Speaker 1: can't see out of it.
Speaker 3: That's such a great point.
Speaker 4: And you know, we talk about this often about being
Speaker 4: spun up in the matrix and how they have created
Speaker 4: it so that like everything else we discuss, whether it
Speaker 4: be heliocentrism, evolution, big Bang theory, making you work sixty
Speaker 4: hours a week, keeping you away from your family, and
Speaker 4: keeping you away from your Bible time, all of that
Speaker 4: is intentionally done, this matrix they've created, and it's up
Speaker 4: to us, like you said, to not lose focus of
Speaker 4: the true goal of being a Christian, which is eternal
Speaker 4: life and sharing the Gospel of Jesus absolutely.
Speaker 1: And I mean to turn back, not to take away
Speaker 1: from speaking of the gospel, but also to speak on
Speaker 1: because This is a flat Earth podcast cosmology podcast. But
Speaker 1: one of the things I always say to people is
Speaker 1: no lie will ever lead anyone to the truth. You
Speaker 1: have individuals who come to the knowledge of the truth
Speaker 1: the flat Earth, and they have to posit God, they
Speaker 1: have to recognize him. That in itself is a proof
Speaker 1: of the fact that the Earth is not a globe,
Speaker 1: because no lie leads you to God. Every lie is
Speaker 1: built and designed by the wicked one to lead you
Speaker 1: away from God. So if the very thing that you
Speaker 1: are coming to understand, and you are coming to a
Speaker 1: knowledge of truth leads you to the understanding, hey, God exists,
Speaker 1: that's a proof. It's one that we don't really recognize
Speaker 1: and we don't really hold to because it's a little
Speaker 1: abstract if we don't think about it, because then we're like, Okay,
Speaker 1: well now I know God exists, so I need to
Speaker 1: go find out more proof of him. Well, you already
Speaker 1: you know he exists because you have proof of him.
Speaker 1: You are in a created system. That is sall nineteen
Speaker 1: Berner von Brown understood it sall nineteen to a t
Speaker 1: in the cardinal sense. In the spiritual sense, it's more
Speaker 1: in regards to the Scripture but we have shackled ourselves
Speaker 1: so much in our minds. It's a mental prison. And
Speaker 1: when I say mental, what I mean is spiritual. It
Speaker 1: is a spiritual prison. We have shackled our spirit willingly
Speaker 1: because all of us only ever make one free will
Speaker 1: choice in our life. It's from Deuteronomy chapter thirty one,
Speaker 1: where the Lord says to Israel, I call heaven and
Speaker 1: earth to witness against you today. I give you a choice.
Speaker 1: Choose life and good or death and evil. That is
Speaker 1: the decision every single person in this world makes every
Speaker 1: single day. And that's not again, just what is life
Speaker 1: and good? Well, we have to define that first and
Speaker 1: foremost by who or what does God say is life?
Speaker 1: And who or what does God say is good? Well, Jesus,
Speaker 1: who is our teacher, as we spoke about in the
Speaker 1: last podcast, who is God who teaches us? Says there
Speaker 1: is no one good but God. Additionally, in John chapter eleven,
Speaker 1: the same chapter where He's where he goes to resurrect Lazarus,
Speaker 1: he says, I am the resurrection and the Life. So
Speaker 1: when scripture says choose life and good or death and evil,
Speaker 1: you are being told to choose God, who is Christ
Speaker 1: or anything? Else, God, who is Christ, who also declares
Speaker 1: himself not only to be the life, but the truth,
Speaker 1: the very truth that Roman's one point eighteen says, men
Speaker 1: suppress in their own righteousness. They try to kill him
Speaker 1: in their own righteousness because they don't want him. We
Speaker 1: are building our own prison. He opened the door of ourselves,
Speaker 1: and we pull the door closed again and say, no,
Speaker 1: I want to live in darkness. I want to live
Speaker 1: in ignorance. So we are literally warning spiritually when we
Speaker 1: have these discussions in these spaces, These are spiritual warfare.
Speaker 1: Scripture constantly paints this spiritual imagery of how words are
Speaker 1: like weapons, how the teeth of it talks about how
Speaker 1: false teachers their teeth are like the fangs, or excuse me,
Speaker 1: their teeth are like swords, their tongue are like spears,
Speaker 1: their words are like arrows that strike the soul and
Speaker 1: kill men. And he talks about there are men out
Speaker 1: there who breathe fire like dragons. I don't know about you,
Speaker 1: but I have never seen anybody physically breathes fire like
Speaker 1: a dragon, unless you're talking about a fire a swallower
Speaker 1: who you know has gasoline in his mouth, or however
Speaker 1: they do it or you know, a fire accelerate in
Speaker 1: his mouth and blows it out. But talking about is
Speaker 1: words that kill, because James chapter three tells us that
Speaker 1: the tongue is a world of unrighteousness and it sets
Speaker 1: the whole world around on around it on fire, like
Speaker 1: the fires of hell. Because when we speak lies, we're
Speaker 1: speaking like the father of lies, who is the dragon.
Speaker 1: So that's what these men are doing. It is a
Speaker 1: spiritual war that is happening in every single one of
Speaker 1: our lives daily, and we either choose God, who is
Speaker 1: life and good, and even continues in Deuteronomy in that part,
Speaker 1: for he literally says that Yahweh is your life, which
Speaker 1: again is a proof that Jesus Christ is God with
Speaker 1: the Father, and that the spirit was testifying of him
Speaker 1: because Yahweh is life. He is our life according to Deuteronomy,
Speaker 1: and Christ says, I am the life. So these two
Speaker 1: are one and the same. But when we have this
Speaker 1: well orchestrated worldview, this well designed deception that is built
Speaker 1: on a globe earth, you build aliens off of that,
Speaker 1: you build the Big Bang off of that, you build
Speaker 1: evolution off of that, you build dinosaurs off of that,
Speaker 1: you start stacking all of these all of these lies
Speaker 1: that are antithetical to the truth that is given in scripture,
Speaker 1: like bricks in a wall, and you build a wall
Speaker 1: of lies. So the flat Earth comes along, and when
Speaker 1: the Lord gives the revelation of that, what it does
Speaker 1: is it rips the foundation out from out under all
Speaker 1: those lies. If the Earth is If the Earth is flat,
Speaker 1: outer space isn't probably what they say it is.
Speaker 4: And then people start questioning why they're seventy million dollars
Speaker 4: a day is going to NASA.
Speaker 1: Exactly this organization that keeps sending me pictures of outer space?
Speaker 1: Why do they keep pointing to outer space? Why do
Speaker 1: they keep trying to turn your eyes somewhere other than
Speaker 1: the floor that you're standing on, because they don't want
Speaker 1: you to see where you are, because what you where
Speaker 1: you see when you see where you are exactly what
Speaker 1: Sauw nineteen says that all creation testifies that God exists.
Speaker 4: That's right, that's right. Even within the last hour. By
Speaker 4: the way, I'm not even sure if you caught this.
Speaker 4: The SpaceX starship disintegrated shortly after it left Texas, and
Speaker 4: there's videos all over from people in the Caribbean of
Speaker 4: it just raining down and again you're talking. You know,
Speaker 4: people in California have lost their homes, people in Asheville,
Speaker 4: North Carolina. You know, the trials and tribulations of people
Speaker 4: in this country. And this faux industry which costs that
Speaker 4: starship that disintegrated costs between depending who you ask, five
Speaker 4: and ten billion dollars and it costs one hundred million
Speaker 4: just to launch just you know, up in flames, and
Speaker 4: people don't think of anything of it.
Speaker 3: And you try to even ask people, what in the
Speaker 3: last sixty years since this quote unquote space program has
Speaker 3: has begun, what has it done, uh for our country
Speaker 3: that we can put a pin on that says we
Speaker 3: got to the moon first? Yeah, I mean really that's
Speaker 3: and when you start to, like you said, when you
Speaker 3: start to tear down the wall of lies, and then
Speaker 3: you truly see the evil in this world.
Speaker 4: How they mock us. And that's what a lot of
Speaker 4: it is mockery, especially with NASA and how they name uh,
Speaker 4: the these whether it's Artemis or Apollo after these Greek gods.
Speaker 3: All of that is mockery.
Speaker 5: It is.
Speaker 3: It's very important and you realize.
Speaker 1: How also at the same sense, what they're doing is
Speaker 1: they're calling on the sorcery of their their demons because
Speaker 1: the because the idols themselves uh power. But there we understand,
Speaker 1: and Scripture even tells us that all the gods of
Speaker 1: the nations are demons. So what they're actually doing is
Speaker 1: they are invoking demonic power. Well, what is demonic power.
Speaker 1: Demonic power is lies into section, So they are actually
Speaker 1: when they're when they're doing these things. One, it is
Speaker 1: a mocking but it is also ritualistic to come to
Speaker 1: call upon and conjure the power of those powers that
Speaker 1: oppose God. So it's it's it's probably even more than twofold.
Speaker 1: I mean, just at the at the superficial level, it's
Speaker 1: mocking us and saying this is what they're telling us.
Speaker 1: And that's one thing I always hear, and I've always
Speaker 1: heard people say and ask is why do they always
Speaker 1: reveal it beforehand? And people can never understand why do
Speaker 1: they reveal it beforehand? And people say, well, and I
Speaker 1: hear people say, well, they have to do it because
Speaker 1: there's some sort of law that tells them they have
Speaker 1: to do it. No, the reason the enemy reveals to
Speaker 1: us beforehand is because God in the scripture says that
Speaker 1: he does nothing without first revealing it to his profits.
Speaker 1: The enemy desires to be like God. So the reason
Speaker 1: that he will reveal what he is doing beforehand is
Speaker 1: because God has declared he will do nothing. Say that
Speaker 1: he refers reveals it to his profits. So the enemy
Speaker 1: must reveal what he does and is going to do
Speaker 1: ahead of time in order to try to be like
Speaker 1: the most High. It is a part of his vain hubris.
Speaker 1: It's not for our sake that if we you know, well,
Speaker 1: if you could stop it, you would. No, he wouldn't.
Speaker 1: He doesn't want us to stop anything. He hates us,
Speaker 1: He wants us to be destroyed. He does it because
Speaker 1: he wants to be God. And that is the reason.
Speaker 1: So like for all, I hear this all the time
Speaker 1: with these people saying, why do they put it out
Speaker 1: ahead of time? Why do we see it in the Simpsons?
Speaker 1: Why are they always telegraphing it? Because if they are
Speaker 1: trying to become God, which is what they are, the
Speaker 1: same thing they did, Because what they're actually trying to
Speaker 1: do is if you really look at the scripture, the
Speaker 1: concept of names is very important. The entire purpose of
Speaker 1: the Tower of Babbel was to create a name for himself,
Speaker 1: because the one who names you has authority over you.
Speaker 1: If you notice, God gives dominion to Adam over all
Speaker 1: of the creatures that he creates, and only names Adam.
Speaker 1: He does not name the animals. He leaves it to
Speaker 1: Adam to name the animals. So when at the Tower
Speaker 1: of Battle, mankind starts building this tower, they say, let
Speaker 1: us make a name for ourselves. What they're actually saying
Speaker 1: is let us become our own authority, our own God.
Speaker 1: And that's what they're constantly doing, is they're renaming themselves.
Speaker 1: That's when Christ comes and he starts naming his apostles
Speaker 1: and renaming them. And even this concept in Revelation. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: so again that whole concept. And this is why, this
Speaker 1: is the entire reason why the enemy does what he does,
Speaker 1: is he is attempting to be his own God. He
Speaker 1: is a created slave who desires to be his own master.
Speaker 1: He wants to do everything that the Most High does.
Speaker 1: Four the Most High has declared he will do nothing
Speaker 1: unless he first reveals it to his profits. So the
Speaker 1: enemy must also reveal his intended plans ahead of time
Speaker 1: in order that he may mimic the Most High.
Speaker 4: Did you know that the term Tower of Babel was
Speaker 4: used to describe this collaboration between NASA and the Russian
Speaker 4: Space Agency. And with that kind of piggyback off of
Speaker 4: do you believe that NASA is a is a continuation
Speaker 4: and you can include SpaceX, I guess of the Tower
Speaker 4: of Babel.
Speaker 1: I think it's their attempt, you know, back to Project
Speaker 1: Fishbowl and project in Project Dominic fishful of the Lord,
Speaker 1: that thing where they allegedly shot nukes up into the
Speaker 1: stratosphere and impacted them against the Dome. I mean, I
Speaker 1: haven't done a deep dive into that aspect. The continuation
Speaker 1: of the Tower of Babel is actually continued in the
Speaker 1: Horror of Babylon and Revelation, where throughout the scriptures the
Speaker 1: Lord talks about how mankind's sin has reached up to Heaven,
Speaker 1: just as they were attempting to do in the physical
Speaker 1: sense with Babylon. Because what really is happening is we
Speaker 1: when we continue, if we're piling on all these lives,
Speaker 1: we're piling up all these sins, something is being built spiritually,
Speaker 1: Something is being built inside of a man spiritually, and
Speaker 1: it is a spiritual Tower of Babel, where once again
Speaker 1: each and every one of us is attempting, through our sin,
Speaker 1: which we are building up and collecting and collect and gathering,
Speaker 1: to create our own name, to become our own God,
Speaker 1: to become the final authority, to be the arbiter of
Speaker 1: truth for ourself. So as much as I mean it
Speaker 1: doesn't surprise me that they do these things, the problem
Speaker 1: for them is, I shouldn't say a problem for them.
Speaker 1: Praise be to God. They are rnally minded and cannot
Speaker 1: understand spiritual things. So everything they do is is enacted
Speaker 1: in the in the flesh. They cannot recognize spiritual truth.
Speaker 1: Praise be to God. He won't allow them. He tells
Speaker 1: us that he tells us so much in scripture. So
Speaker 1: this is, yes, the most likely it is there continued attempt.
Speaker 1: It's a feeble and useless attempt because God is spirit
Speaker 1: and nothing physical can will ever be effective against him.
Speaker 1: Nothing spiritual will be effective against him either, because there
Speaker 1: is no counsel that will ever ever be effective against
Speaker 1: the Lord. But yeah, that all they can do is
Speaker 1: vain physical things, and it's it's all a masquerade. It's
Speaker 1: all exception, right.
Speaker 4: That is the one word I use often when we
Speaker 4: talk about basically anything that is Satan's most powerful tool
Speaker 4: is deception, and it's cleverly designed, and it's been woven
Speaker 4: within the fabric of the matrix and dissection. Deceit even
Speaker 4: what's another D word we could use, distract? Right, we're
Speaker 4: distracted on a daily basis, like this sleight of hand
Speaker 4: by a magician. You know, we should be focused here
Speaker 4: and all the while we're looking over here, over there
Speaker 4: and everywhere.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's why I even I even try to
Speaker 1: warm individuals about again flat earth. Like the devil operated
Speaker 1: perfectly fine for thousands of years in a world that
Speaker 1: knew a biblical cut. Well, they wouldn't, they would just
Speaker 1: knew the true cosmology. Now his deception has gone and
Speaker 1: has has turned in another way. He had plenty of
Speaker 1: nations that knew that this world was created, it had
Speaker 1: it had a dome around it, Like you can go
Speaker 1: back and search throughout history. How all of the previous
Speaker 1: cultures used to believe that we were in a creative
Speaker 1: system under a dome structure with a flat earth with
Speaker 1: a deep below us, just as it, just as is
Speaker 1: described in the scripture. And the devil still operated perfectly
Speaker 1: well within that system. He does not care if you
Speaker 1: know that the earth is flat. He cares that you
Speaker 1: do not know who Jesus is. The reason now that
Speaker 1: flat earth is such an issue is because it is truth.
Speaker 1: So it is starting after the Crucifixion, the false gods
Speaker 1: and the magic of the enemy were slaughtered. According to
Speaker 1: the early church leaders, they basically talk about Justin Martyr,
Speaker 1: not exactly certain one of them, see, I think it's
Speaker 1: ignacious or Justin Martyr. One of them talks about how
Speaker 1: the Cross, one of its efficacies was actually to destroy
Speaker 1: magic and the power of that deceit by the wicked one.
Speaker 1: So when nowadays you have someone come to a flat earth,
Speaker 1: the predominant understanding is that there is one God. It's
Speaker 1: not that it's oh wait, we're in a created system.
Speaker 1: Oh well, that means thor and odin Ary. No, because
Speaker 1: they're they still fall under these create the fill fall
Speaker 1: under the category of these created beings with supernatural power,
Speaker 1: but they themselves are not the creator. You know what
Speaker 1: I mean? What will most likely start to happen eventually
Speaker 1: and you see it a little bit is oh, what's
Speaker 1: his name? Debay is modern day mysticism and gnosticism the
Speaker 1: concept of Nasiism because they still have to account for
Speaker 1: a creator who is greater than the creation. If if
Speaker 1: I make a table, I am not If I build,
Speaker 1: design and carve out a table and create it, the
Speaker 1: table is not the masterpiece. The one who made the
Speaker 1: table can declare it a masterpiece. But truly, the one
Speaker 1: who made the table is greater than the table that
Speaker 1: was made. When you have all of these other religious systems,
Speaker 1: all of their gods are created in the order of
Speaker 1: the eternal matter. The only one that stands apart from
Speaker 1: all of that is Jesus Christ. And that's why gnosticism
Speaker 1: has to air still incorporates him, and that's why so
Speaker 1: many of these other gnostic beliefs still have to answer
Speaker 1: for him and incorporate him into it. So that if
Speaker 1: you really want to see why the enemy is fighting
Speaker 1: so hard against the flat Earth, it's not because flat
Speaker 1: Earth itself saves, but because the True God, through his crucifixion,
Speaker 1: has killed all the other gods. And so therefore, when
Speaker 1: you start to come to a knowledge of creation, there
Speaker 1: is only truly one way you can go unless you
Speaker 1: continue in deceit.
Speaker 4: So perfectly said, and you can go back to all
Speaker 4: the ancient cultures, the Mayans, the Hindus, the Egyptians, the Incas,
Speaker 4: you know, all the way back that they all believed,
Speaker 4: you know, the circle of the earth. It was you know,
Speaker 4: quote unquote flat you know obviously mountains, hills, water, et cetera.
Speaker 4: But the important facet of this we weren't spinning and
Speaker 4: we had a dome over top of is just as
Speaker 4: the Word of God has been you know, written, And
Speaker 4: that is something I want to kind of briefly segue
Speaker 4: into you as someone who you know is in the
Speaker 4: ministry when you see people like say Justin Peters, who
Speaker 4: has got a pretty big YouTube following, and I used
Speaker 4: to listen to his stuff, but he went on an
Speaker 4: absolute rampage about flat Earth and I was taken aback
Speaker 4: a bit. And most of these people have PhDs and
Speaker 4: are familiar on how to use strong concordance, et cetera.
Speaker 4: I mean, I don't see how people I don't know
Speaker 4: how to phrase the question, but I guess it shocks
Speaker 4: me still to this day, especially once again after twenty twenty,
Speaker 4: that people don't take the time to actually sit down
Speaker 4: research because there's a lot of granted yes, Google and
Speaker 4: those type of you know, search engines, still do a
Speaker 4: good job of hiding the quality material that's out there.
Speaker 3: But why are.
Speaker 4: These people who are so, you know, so deep in theology,
Speaker 4: why won't they take the time to research it and
Speaker 4: they just shun it without really looking at it.
Speaker 1: Because they're carnally minded. So one Corinthians, chapter two, verse
Speaker 1: fourteen says this, the natural person does not accept the
Speaker 1: things of the spirit of God, for they are folly
Speaker 1: to him, and he is not able to understand them
Speaker 1: because they are spiritually discerned. Now, I know a lot
Speaker 1: of people will are going to probably be like, hold
Speaker 1: on a second, Justin Peters, Jeff Durbin, Joe Shimmel, a
Speaker 1: lot of these And I want to be very clear,
Speaker 1: these men have aspects of their ministries that do have
Speaker 1: the truth.
Speaker 3: I agree, right, But it.
Speaker 1: Goes back again to this concept of they are holding
Speaker 1: fast to science. Again, science just isn't is knowledge. So
Speaker 1: if you and I are going to sit here and
Speaker 1: say that I'm going to hold the science, what I'm
Speaker 1: truly saying is I'm going to hold the knowledge Jesus
Speaker 1: Christ is the knowledge of God. There is a battle
Speaker 1: between the knowledge of the world and the knowledge of God.
Speaker 1: There is the wisdom of the world and the wisdom
Speaker 1: of God. Ecclesiastes is really big on this aspect about
Speaker 1: how all wisdom is weariness and the gathering of knowledge
Speaker 1: puffs people up and destroys men, because but what knowledge
Speaker 1: is it talking about? What wisdom is it talking about?
Speaker 1: It's talking about worldly wisdom. These men are still holding
Speaker 1: fast to these carnal teachings that they have received. Justin
Speaker 1: Peters can't accept flat earth because his foundational apologetics are
Speaker 1: based on reasoning in the atheistic world model. He has
Speaker 1: to presuppose that the atheist is honest in his belief,
Speaker 1: so therefore he has to he has to engage with
Speaker 1: it as if it's actually a valid argument. So if
Speaker 1: he starts arguing flat earth, he no longer can hold
Speaker 1: to that apologetic. Sorry, I'm trying to make sure I'm
Speaker 1: saying this as simple as I can.
Speaker 3: Right, You're doing a great job.
Speaker 4: And it's it's funny to me because when I look back,
Speaker 4: because I watched him for probably a year or two
Speaker 4: before that event happened, the one thing I always did
Speaker 4: notice he always had a globe or two behind him,
Speaker 4: or maybe it was on his desk.
Speaker 1: I guess the easiest, I guess the easiest way I
Speaker 1: can say it is they're always trying to find common
Speaker 1: ground in their apologetics in which they can make an
Speaker 1: inroad into an argument. And one of the ways they
Speaker 1: do this is holding fast to science. Well, yeah, you
Speaker 1: accept science as the atheist. We accept science who is
Speaker 1: the Christian because we have all scientists, you know, all
Speaker 1: old scientists were Christians and things like that. But again,
Speaker 1: what they're actually doing is they're appealing to human authority
Speaker 1: instead of what they're doing again is they're putting down
Speaker 1: the sword of the spirit because the enemy is looking
Speaker 1: at them and saying, man, that sored is too big.
Speaker 1: You can't fight me with that sword. That's not a
Speaker 1: fair fight. And they're like, you're right, man, I can't
Speaker 1: bible thump you. So I'm gonna set this sword down.
Speaker 1: Let me pick up this stick over here, you know,
Speaker 1: let me pick up this twig of materialistic arguments, and
Speaker 1: I'll come at you with that apologetic And you know what,
Speaker 1: I'm actually what sord are you using? Let me use
Speaker 1: the same sort as you. When we step out of
Speaker 1: arguing from the scripture alone, we are literally disarming ourselves
Speaker 1: from God. Because God not only, not only as if
Speaker 1: he's in six, he says, are we to put on
Speaker 1: the armor of God? The armor is not only God's armor.
Speaker 1: God is the armor himself. He is the helm of salvation.
Speaker 1: Isaiah chapter ten, verse two says God is my salvation.
Speaker 1: God has become my salvation. So when I put on
Speaker 1: the helm of salvation, what am I doing? I'm putting
Speaker 1: on God the brest place of righteousness. Jeremiah chapter twenty three,
Speaker 1: verse six says, the Lord is our righteousness. So if
Speaker 1: I'm putting on the breastplate of righteousness, is what am
Speaker 1: I doing? I'm putting on God to pick up the
Speaker 1: sword of the Spirit. Well, it even says it in parentheses,
Speaker 1: they're the sword of the Spirit is the Word of God.
Speaker 1: Who is the Word of God. But John chapter one,
Speaker 1: verse one and two, in the beginning was the Word,
Speaker 1: and the Word was with God and was God, and
Speaker 1: the Word became flesh and dwelt among us. This is
Speaker 1: it's we're literally told put on Jesus Christ. But what
Speaker 1: we're doing is we're taking this book that has been
Speaker 1: given us that says that Christ himself. And John five
Speaker 1: thirty nine says testifies of me, and you refuse to
Speaker 1: come to me so that you may have life. You
Speaker 1: search the scriptures because you think in them you have
Speaker 1: eternal life. But I tell you it is these that
Speaker 1: testify of me, and you refuse to come to me
Speaker 1: so that you may have life. And we're like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't need to fight you with this. I'm going
Speaker 1: to fight you with logic of men and reason of men.
Speaker 1: And I'm very honest. There are many arguments that have
Speaker 1: swayed men. They will sway, they will sway men. And
Speaker 1: God will use those as inroads, because he will go
Speaker 1: in through crooked ways to lead men to the straight path,
Speaker 1: which is Christ. And he will start to undermine and
Speaker 1: ship away because the enemy's own lies. He's he's so
Speaker 1: the enemy is so outlandish in his schemes that he
Speaker 1: doesn't care if he contradicts himself. He doesn't care if
Speaker 1: you believe this lie, that contradicts this lie, as long
Speaker 1: as you just believe a lie. But what that ends
Speaker 1: up doing is he starts undermining his own work and
Speaker 1: tearing himself down. He did. If Satan is divided against himself,
Speaker 1: how can his kingdom stand? He does this all the time,
Speaker 1: He divides it against himself and his kingdom crumbles, the
Speaker 1: kingdom of darkness, of ignorance and doubt and fear that
Speaker 1: he operates in in the hearts and mind men. And
Speaker 1: but you get to take it back to the question
Speaker 1: in regards to like Justin Peters, and you know Jeff
Speaker 1: Durbin and Joe Shimmel, because Joe Shimmel is from Good
Speaker 1: Fight Ministries is the man and that really was very
Speaker 1: instrumental and early on helping me to come to a
Speaker 1: walk in faith. And I truly believe he is a
Speaker 1: man of God. I believe Justin Peters is a man
Speaker 1: of God. I should not agree with them on everything,
Speaker 1: but there are aspects of their ministry where they hold
Speaker 1: fast to the materialistic worldview. And I can't say exactly
Speaker 1: for the reasoning for doing that. I have my I
Speaker 1: have my assumptions based on the testimonies I've heard from
Speaker 1: them of why they hold fast to it. But what
Speaker 1: happens when they do that is they automatically give up
Speaker 1: the spirit in their argument. That doesn't mean the Spirit
Speaker 1: leads them or abandons them, but in that argument, in
Speaker 1: that discussion, they're weaponless. They've set the scripture aside and
Speaker 1: they've gone instead to the knowledge and wisdom of men, which,
Speaker 1: as one Printine's three eighteen teaches us, will trap men
Speaker 1: in their own conceit so.
Speaker 4: Well said, and I think a lot of it may
Speaker 4: Again I've mentioned some of this being subconscious through television entertainment,
Speaker 4: but also something I don't think we talk about enough
Speaker 4: is how the Department of Education, you know, the federal government,
Speaker 4: hijacked it in seventy eight, seventy nine. And if you
Speaker 4: take a look, and I've taken the time to research,
Speaker 4: there are a lot of seminaries, Bible colleges that have
Speaker 4: instituted astronomy as part of their curriculum.
Speaker 1: Yep, yeah, I mean, well, what was it. I think
Speaker 1: it was when did King Kong, the original King King
Speaker 1: Kong come out nineteen twenty seven.
Speaker 3: Yeah, something like that.
Speaker 1: That was like the very first example of universal I remember.
Speaker 1: I still remember to this day as a kid, because
Speaker 1: I have the old vhs. You have one of those
Speaker 1: old like by wing planes circling around a spinning planet.
Speaker 1: It's they've been putting this out even before NASA was
Speaker 1: a thing, even before they could quote unquote go into space.
Speaker 1: They were telling you this is what space looks like
Speaker 1: they've been put They've been building this in doctrination. The
Speaker 1: enemy has been preparing this in doctrination for a very
Speaker 1: long time, and unfortunately it's very pervasive, it's very insidious.
Speaker 1: It has And again, what I if I had to surmise,
Speaker 1: why I think these men refuse to look at flat Earth,
Speaker 1: these otherwise generally very strong Christian men. It's the same
Speaker 1: reason they won't acknowledge who true Israel is. And they
Speaker 1: look at this carnal nation in the Middle East and
Speaker 1: they say, those are true Israelites. They don't understand what
Speaker 1: a true Jew according to the Spirit actually is, and
Speaker 1: they say they look at these people in the Middle
Speaker 1: East and say, well, they're genealogical blood lined and they're Jews.
Speaker 1: And yet you have a clear testimony in scripture of
Speaker 1: who Israel is, who the Jews are. It's the same thing.
Speaker 1: And the Scripture gives you a clear understanding of a
Speaker 1: flat Earth with orbiting celestial bodies above it. But they
Speaker 1: can't give into these things because it undermines the worldview
Speaker 1: that they have based their life in. Is that science
Speaker 1: upholds the scripture. Men, man made science upholds the scripture.
Speaker 1: It doesn't it never does. And what I mean by like,
Speaker 1: if we're talking about the DNA argument and like how
Speaker 1: that is evidence for God. That's not man made science.
Speaker 1: That is man acknowledging looking at God's creation. Man made
Speaker 1: science is outer space. Man made science is the Big Bang.
Speaker 1: Like if I'm going if I'm going to look at
Speaker 1: something that God has created, which is DNA, and say
Speaker 1: this points to God. Yes, that is knowledge and wisdom
Speaker 1: from God. But if I'm going to look at things
Speaker 1: that men and the enemy has instituted and say, well,
Speaker 1: look at look.
Speaker 6: At the vast expanse of billions of star systems expanding
Speaker 6: at an ever increasing rate, as we have these massive
Speaker 6: balls of gas that are just spinning and pulling, pulling
Speaker 6: planets in around them.
Speaker 1: That's a lie. It will never uphold the scripture. A
Speaker 1: lie will never lead you to the truth. The truth
Speaker 1: always leads you. A truth will always lead you to
Speaker 1: the truth. And that's but they hold so fast to
Speaker 1: these arguments, and they've they've built strong arguments against the
Speaker 1: atheistic and agnostic worldview through undermining these false teachings, but
Speaker 1: yet still holding that there's some semblance of truth in
Speaker 1: these teachings. Does that make sense.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, it does.
Speaker 1: Like teaching us about space wrong but space still exists. No,
Speaker 1: anything you tell me about outer space is wrong lie,
Speaker 1: because space is not what they tell us. It's not
Speaker 1: this giant vacuum that for some reason we aren't being
Speaker 1: sucked out into without a barrier around us. But they
Speaker 1: have to hold that supposition. They hold to the atheistic model,
Speaker 1: which it baffles me too, because if you really look
Speaker 1: at everything about the atheistic model of creation, it is
Speaker 1: anesthetical to Genesis. I try to have this discussion with
Speaker 1: my friend one time about how the Bible truly proves
Speaker 1: that outer space is a lie. Well one, first and foremost,
Speaker 1: gravity is a false god because gravity. Everything that Stephen
Speaker 1: Hawking declared about gravity I can't remember. It was a
Speaker 1: seminal work before he passed where he made a statement
Speaker 1: is that because gravity exists, the universe could and would
Speaker 1: make itself. But what does that make gravity? A pre
Speaker 1: existent force by which all things came into creation? The
Speaker 1: air go? Gravity is God. Gravity is the power that
Speaker 1: holds and brings all things together. And yet Colossians chapter
Speaker 1: one tells us that all things are brought together and
Speaker 1: held together through Christ. It's gravity like time it again.
Speaker 1: You just look at that. You look at the characteristics
Speaker 1: of gravity, and gravity is a god. It is given
Speaker 1: all of this power, but it's not a personal god.
Speaker 1: It's not a god that gives you laws. Well, I
Speaker 1: guess it gives you laws, but not laws that pertain
Speaker 1: to sin. But Genesis chapter one is anesthetical to the
Speaker 1: atheistic agnostic world model of creation, the evolution story of
Speaker 1: these things. So the easiest part is is in the
Speaker 1: beginning there was light, or God said, let there be light.
Speaker 1: The Sun and the moon aren't created till the fourth day,
Speaker 1: I believe it is, But there's a pre existent light.
Speaker 1: And yet the earth. In the beginning, God created the
Speaker 1: heavens and the earth. That's Genesis one to one. And
Speaker 1: yet the Sun and the moon and the stars aren't
Speaker 1: even created until the fourth day. Yet, if you look
Speaker 1: at the atheistic world model of outer space, the creation
Speaker 1: the sun had to pre exist the Earth in order
Speaker 1: to create a gravity well in which to draw in
Speaker 1: all of the matter into the circular rotation, to create
Speaker 1: this mass that became our planet. So Genesis one one says,
Speaker 1: in the beginning God created the heavens and the Earth,
Speaker 1: and on the fourth Day, and that was even prior
Speaker 1: to the first day, because the first day was the light,
Speaker 1: so even before the days, God created the heavens and
Speaker 1: the earth. The fourth day was when the sun and
Speaker 1: the moon and the stars came into creation. But in
Speaker 1: the atheistic world model, the sun had to pre exist
Speaker 1: the creation of the earth. And I tried to explain
Speaker 1: this to my friend, he was a Christian, explain to
Speaker 1: him how the heliocentric world model is godless, and he
Speaker 1: looked at me straight up. He read the whole passage
Speaker 1: with me. He looked at me straight up, and he says,
Speaker 1: I don't see how these things are contradictory. Wow. And
Speaker 1: I don't know what to do with that point other
Speaker 1: than them say okay.
Speaker 4: Yeah, There's only so much you can do, because, like
Speaker 4: we say, if you try to force feed, just like
Speaker 4: feeding a child, you try to force it, they're going
Speaker 4: to close their mouth and turn away.
Speaker 3: It is frustrating.
Speaker 4: And I know we all have our victories in our
Speaker 4: defeats as far as you know, certainly with sharing biblical cosmology.
Speaker 4: And I guess I could ask you that question since
Speaker 4: last March, have you had any successes in sharing biblical
Speaker 4: biblical cosmology.
Speaker 1: Any success.
Speaker 4: I didn't mean to put it like that, like in
Speaker 4: the last year, but I mean because it is difficult for.
Speaker 1: Lack of telling, because I I sugarcoat nothing and I
Speaker 1: put a bunch of people come. When they come and
Speaker 1: they start talking these things like I my mother in
Speaker 1: law came to me one point and started talking to
Speaker 1: me about evolution and how some things about it didn't
Speaker 1: make sense. I'm like, of course, it doesn't make sense.
Speaker 1: Evolution is a lie. And immediately her words were, well,
Speaker 1: we're not going to talk about this, and I wanted
Speaker 1: to get in this discussion with you. Always what it
Speaker 1: is is it's just discussion and just becomes shut down.
Speaker 1: It's so deeply ingrained and so instrumental to men's denial
Speaker 1: of God, because that's really what all of this is doing.
Speaker 1: Because the moment we recognize who not only that God exists,
Speaker 1: but who he says he is, we have to acknowledge
Speaker 1: who he says we are. And that is so hard
Speaker 1: because not only is it so hard, it's actually second
Speaker 1: Thessalonians chapter two tells us it's the Great Deception. A
Speaker 1: lot of people think the Great Deception is going to
Speaker 1: be a continuation of this of this helio centric world
Speaker 1: model and the coming of aliens upon the world. The
Speaker 1: devil has already enslaved the whole world. Aliens added to
Speaker 1: it is not going to do that. People say, well,
Speaker 1: they'll make some Christians turn away. No, even if that happens,
Speaker 1: it's because they already had a carnal mindset and weren't
Speaker 1: in the Word to understand spiritually what is happening. The
Speaker 1: great deception that will slay man is this, I am
Speaker 1: a good person.
Speaker 3: So that in itself can get me into heaven.
Speaker 1: What's that?
Speaker 4: So are you saying that deception is I'm a good person,
Speaker 4: therefore I get into heaven?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, exactly, Because here's the thing. Scripture says there
Speaker 1: is no one good, not one, No one is good.
Speaker 1: But God Christ doesn't even give a direct sermon on it.
Speaker 1: He literally just states to his own disciples, if you
Speaker 1: who are evil know how to give good gifts. Well,
Speaker 1: if the apostles who are disciples Christ can point to
Speaker 1: them and say, you who are evil, what then does
Speaker 1: that say about me as a man? Rabbi Zacharias, for
Speaker 1: all the problems people have with him, made one statement
Speaker 1: that has always stuck with me from very early on
Speaker 1: in my walk and faith, which is the depravity of
Speaker 1: mankind is simultaneously the most empirically verifiable fact and the
Speaker 1: most intellectually resisted. We absolutely recognize that we are evil,
Speaker 1: and we lie to ourselves and we say I'm good.
Speaker 1: If I am a good person, I don't need a savior.
Speaker 1: That's the great deception. Like there's these these. God is not.
Speaker 1: God is not cruel in the way that he interacts
Speaker 1: with mankind. He is very simple. He acts. He interacts
Speaker 1: with us with the simplicity of acting, interacting with children.
Speaker 1: Like So when you get to this, what is the
Speaker 1: great deception? The great deception is this is I tell
Speaker 1: myself I'm a good person, and therefore God says you're
Speaker 1: not a good person. You need to go to the
Speaker 1: one who is good. Well, no, I am good. What
Speaker 1: am I doing. I'm exalting my understanding against the word
Speaker 1: of God and saying you say I'm not good, I
Speaker 1: say I'm good. What am I doing? I'm making myself
Speaker 1: an enemy of God. And then people will also come
Speaker 1: and they will say, well, what is the unforgivable sin?
Speaker 1: I've done all of these things, Like they'll give you
Speaker 1: all of these different explanations about the unforgivable sin. The
Speaker 1: unforgot givable sin is very simply this, according to the scripture, unbelief.
Speaker 1: Because Christ says the unforgivable sin will not be forgiven
Speaker 1: in this life for the next. Why will it be
Speaker 1: forgiven in this life? Because if you do not believe
Speaker 1: in Christ, you will never come to him for forgiveness.
Speaker 1: So therefore you will not be forgiven because you will
Speaker 1: never repent and approach Him for forgiveness. And then you
Speaker 1: will not be forgiven in the next life because you
Speaker 1: never repented and sought him for forgiveness. We go after
Speaker 1: carnal understanding. We take the scriptures and we try to
Speaker 1: push it on the world, and we try to look
Speaker 1: at all of these things when outside of the scripture,
Speaker 1: when God is saying it's all about my son, it
Speaker 1: declares to you who he is and who you are
Speaker 1: not and who you are, and we try to put
Speaker 1: it about everything else other than Him. That's why you
Speaker 1: know those two hundred proofs of flat earth in the Bible,
Speaker 1: I don't ascribe to that. You and I talked about
Speaker 1: this last time. I'll go to Joshua ten day night
Speaker 1: because God very simply in a factorial It's incident where
Speaker 1: the Israelites are warring against the Canaanites, says that he
Speaker 1: stopped the sun in the heavens Sun the heavens. I
Speaker 1: have two things I can do there. I can either
Speaker 1: trust my indoctrinated worldview that says, well, hold on, the
Speaker 1: sun doesn't move, we rotate around it. And therefore, though
Speaker 1: the scripture says that God stopped the sun in the
Speaker 1: moon in the heavens, what's really happening is he stopped
Speaker 1: the rotation of the earth. That is me trusting my
Speaker 1: own understanding and the authority of men, instead of the
Speaker 1: simple explanation of the scriptures that says God stopped the sun.
Speaker 1: And yet scripture tells me that God will not lie.
Speaker 1: So if God, if scripture tells me God will not lie,
Speaker 1: says also God cannot lie. Then he stopped the sun
Speaker 1: in the moon. He didn't stop the earth and do
Speaker 1: what some men try to say as well, He was
Speaker 1: trying to reason with them as far as they're understanding.
Speaker 1: He had him write it in regards to how men
Speaker 1: would understand it. No, God wants us to understand truth.
Speaker 1: So if we thought, well, oh, the sun and the
Speaker 1: moon are rotating over us, and we thought so wrong.
Speaker 1: Our thinking was wrong and corrupted and twisted. God would
Speaker 1: correct us. He would not lead us further into a deception.
Speaker 1: He would say, I stopped the rotating earth so that
Speaker 1: the sun and the moon stayed in the sky above them.
Speaker 1: What we're doing again is we're putting our own understanding
Speaker 1: and our authority. We are disobeying Proverbs three five, which
Speaker 1: says trust the Lord your God with all your heart,
Speaker 1: and ly not on your own understanding.
Speaker 3: That's right, same as was it Psalms one, eighteen eight.
Speaker 3: I believe put your trust in God, not man.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 4: And we were always quick to go back to what
Speaker 4: we were taught in school. But my science teacher and
Speaker 4: Ted Craige told me this. Yeah, and they're just telling
Speaker 4: us what they were told. And you know, the university
Speaker 4: professor who taught your teacher was just telling them what
Speaker 4: they were told. That is the entire doctrination process.
Speaker 1: Yeah, every single one of us makes an appeal to
Speaker 1: authority in every argument we make of us. Every single
Speaker 1: one of us were either we're either we're either appealing
Speaker 1: to Carl Sagan or Newton or Richard Dawkins or some scientists,
Speaker 1: and you know a lab code or a doctor in
Speaker 1: his in his scrubs, Like, we're always making an appeal
Speaker 1: to an authority. So if we're going to make an
Speaker 1: appeal to an authority, we should make our appeal to
Speaker 1: the highest authority and every time, in every sense, and
Speaker 1: there is no higher authority than God. God says to himself,
Speaker 1: because there was no one greater than him by which
Speaker 1: he could swear, he swore upon himself that he would
Speaker 1: not lie, that he would hold covenant with it. There
Speaker 1: is no one greater than God. So when we make
Speaker 1: an appeal to authority in our arguments, let the authority
Speaker 1: be the authority. And he says, he stopped the sun
Speaker 1: in the moon in the sky, that is, and this
Speaker 1: is an argument. Men hate this because we have to
Speaker 1: subject ourselves to one greater than ourselves and therefore admit
Speaker 1: we're not God and we are not the final authority.
Speaker 1: So when a man, when people will sit there and say, well,
Speaker 1: why why do I have to believe that? Because he
Speaker 1: said so, men hate that argument. And that argument, when
Speaker 1: made for fallible men, is a terrible argument because I
Speaker 1: said so, Well, you're a liar, justin why should I
Speaker 1: believe anything you say? Well, because I said so, Well,
Speaker 1: I don't trust you because you're a liar. But here's
Speaker 1: the thing. God is not a liar. So when the
Speaker 1: argument is because he said so, that is absolute, concrete,
Speaker 1: and irrefutable. And he says he stopped the sun and
Speaker 1: the moon in the sky. He also when Hezekiah came
Speaker 1: to pray for him and was or came to pray
Speaker 1: to him to have his life extended. I believe it was.
Speaker 1: And he sent the prophet to meet with him. The
Speaker 1: prophet said, would you have the will you have the
Speaker 1: shadow go up the steps or down the steps? Hezekiah said,
Speaker 1: it's no, it's no small or he said, it's an
Speaker 1: easy thing for the shadows to continue to progress forward.
Speaker 1: Let them go back a degree. And I'd have to
Speaker 1: look at it, because I spent a long time since
Speaker 1: I looked this up. It's one of the passages. I
Speaker 1: believe it's in Second Kings. I could be wrong on that.
Speaker 1: It might be in chronicles where it says that the
Speaker 1: sun moved pack that the Lord withdrew the shadow because
Speaker 1: the sun moved back in the sky. I'd have to
Speaker 1: look back at it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it is both in the Second Book of Kings
Speaker 3: and Second Chronicles.
Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, it's one. One passage just talks only about
Speaker 1: the shadows, so you have to make it inference in
Speaker 1: regards to well, why do shadows extended lengthen, well, because
Speaker 1: the sun moves in its course. But another one, one
Speaker 1: of the other ones I believe, directly references that the
Speaker 1: sun moved back at degree. I'd have to look back
Speaker 1: at it a while ago. Those are if you really
Speaker 1: want to get down to where in the scripture I
Speaker 1: hold to the heliocentric model, and again that doesn't prove
Speaker 1: to me that the Earth is flat. That proves to
Speaker 1: me that the heliocentric model is a lie. Precisely, those
Speaker 1: are if I had to, if somebody was to sit here,
Speaker 1: what are the diehard biblical references you will make to
Speaker 1: show that we are not in the heliocentric model. I
Speaker 1: will go to Joshua ten and I will go to
Speaker 1: Second Kings and Second Chronicles in the passage where Hezekiah
Speaker 1: receives a sign to show that the Lord will be
Speaker 1: merciful to him, because both of those directly reference that
Speaker 1: the sun directly referenced the movement of the Sun. I
Speaker 1: don't go I don't ascribe to all of these two
Speaker 1: hundred other or two hundred proofs of a flat earth,
Speaker 1: because again we taught we touched on this last time,
Speaker 1: and what we never really got into the discussion of it.
Speaker 1: When the scripture is talking about these pillars upon which
Speaker 1: the world is founded, when it talks about many of
Speaker 1: these different proofs, I don't want to get too far
Speaker 1: gone into the weeds on it, but that's a big one.
Speaker 1: It's talking in spiritual language because the Lord speaks in
Speaker 1: parable meaning, he speaks spiritually to his people. He references
Speaker 1: physical things to tell us spiritual truth. But because as
Speaker 1: we read in second or First Corinthians, chapter two, verse
Speaker 1: fourteen earlier, carnal men cannot understand spiritual things. This is
Speaker 1: why the law was closed onto men, and they could
Speaker 1: not in Israel could not accept who Christ was when
Speaker 1: they when he came, because they read the law for
Speaker 1: the letter, not for the spirit. And First Corinthians chapter
Speaker 1: nine this fact when it references back to Deuteronomy, when
Speaker 1: it talks when he or Paul saying that we are
Speaker 1: speaking spiritual truth to you, references about animal husbandry, about
Speaker 1: how you are not to tether an ox while it's
Speaker 1: plowing out the grain. And he says very clearly, there
Speaker 1: is the lower concerned about the ox. No, this is
Speaker 1: spoken in regards to you. Why, because we are the
Speaker 1: ox who's treading out the grain, the grain which is
Speaker 1: the word which has been sown in the hearts of men,
Speaker 1: which is the earth. Because again even you know as
Speaker 1: much as like And this is again why I think
Speaker 1: men like Justin Peters and things like that cannot accept
Speaker 1: the flat earth biblical cosmolgy worldview because Genesis one. They
Speaker 1: view Genesis one only in the connal understanding. When what
Speaker 1: Genesis Chapter one actually is is God tells us in
Speaker 1: the scriptures, I have declared the end from the beginning. Well,
Speaker 1: what is he referencing there? First and foremost, He's referencing
Speaker 1: the scripture in regard to that. So Genesis chapter one
Speaker 1: should actually be understood to be the end where God
Speaker 1: creates the new heavens and the new Earth in Jesus Christ.
Speaker 1: And how do we know this? It's very simple. Christ
Speaker 1: tells us in John art John five thirty nine that
Speaker 1: all the scriptures testify from him, testify of him repeatedly
Speaker 1: throughout the Scriptures. It tells us that all of Moses,
Speaker 1: all the prophets, and the psalms testified of Jesus Christ. So, therefore,
Speaker 1: with that understanding, I should be able to go to
Speaker 1: the very first verse of the scriptures and find Jesus there.
Speaker 1: Not the proto evangelion in Genesis three fifteen, where everyone says, well,
Speaker 1: that's the very first declaration of the Gospel. No, the
Speaker 1: very first declaration of the Gospel is Genesis one to one.
Speaker 1: How do I know that in the beginning God created
Speaker 1: the heavens and the earth? First, excuse me, Colossians one
Speaker 1: eighteen tells me that Jesus Christ is the beginning. There
Speaker 1: go buy scripture's own testimony that all the scripture testifies
Speaker 1: to Jesus Christ, and Jesus Christ is declared to be
Speaker 1: the beginning. Not only is the alphab wonemaga at the
Speaker 1: beginning and the end as well, you can go to
Speaker 1: that as well. So when it says in the beginning
Speaker 1: God created the heavens and the earth, that can be
Speaker 1: appropriately translated in Jesus Christ. God created the heavens and
Speaker 1: the earth. It is a declaration of the Gospel. It
Speaker 1: is a declaration of the sovereignty of our Lord. It
Speaker 1: is a declaration of the creation and the created order
Speaker 1: from one God, just as he said, And he slaughtered
Speaker 1: all the lies of Babylon, all the lies of Egypt.
Speaker 1: He slaughters all the lies of the atheists. They all
Speaker 1: break against him, all their walls shatter and are torn down.
Speaker 1: When you hold fast to the truth, flat Earth will
Speaker 1: lead you to him, if you're truly seeking the truth.
Speaker 1: But you get so many of these people who come
Speaker 1: to flat Earth and that becomes their hill, that becomes
Speaker 1: the point at which they say, I'm going this far
Speaker 1: and no further, And they say, I recognize the order
Speaker 1: is created. I don't need to know who the creator is.
Speaker 1: This goes back again to earlier when we're talking about it.
Speaker 1: I can sit here and I can look at the
Speaker 1: table and say that table is created. That tells me
Speaker 1: nothing about the creator. I have to look for his signature.
Speaker 1: I have to find some reference and evidence of him.
Speaker 1: And he says, all of it is written about him,
Speaker 1: all of it testifies of him. So I love flat Earth.
Speaker 1: But it must lead us to the truth. It is
Speaker 1: a fact, it is a truth. It must lead us
Speaker 1: to the truth because it will not save anyone, and
Speaker 1: you get so many men who just start leading into
Speaker 1: other gnostic, deistic worldviews, and the enemy laughs at them
Speaker 1: because they're still his slave.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I can tell you the beautiful thing about it is
Speaker 4: it has led many people back to God or to
Speaker 4: God for the first time, and that is something that.
Speaker 3: Is awesome. But like you said, it doesn't stop there. Yeah,
Speaker 3: it has to lead you to the Bible and the
Speaker 3: Gospel of Jesus Christ. As we start to wind down,
Speaker 3: I did want you to if you wouldn't mind sharing
Speaker 3: what you told me before we hit the record button
Speaker 3: about your observation of the sun between Florida and Michigan.
Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, absolutely. I also I also want to again
Speaker 1: because I I'm a big believer in simplifying things to
Speaker 1: so simple that a child can understand them. I remember
Speaker 1: when we first emailed for the first you had me
Speaker 1: like six you had me write out like six proofs.
Speaker 1: One of the easiest, and I can tell you it
Speaker 1: stumps everyone because they've all seen it, they all recognize it,
Speaker 1: they all know it to be true. They just you
Speaker 1: can literally watch as it starts chipping away at their
Speaker 1: foundational belief of a heliocentric model. But they just can't
Speaker 1: come to grass with it. Is if we're going to
Speaker 1: spend all of this time focusing on the stars and
Speaker 1: in the final experiment into how there's a twenty four
Speaker 1: hour sun, find explain to me how in June, I
Speaker 1: can see the Big Dipper, I can see Orian's Belt,
Speaker 1: the Little Dipper, and all the other constellations. And then
Speaker 1: six months later, I can look up in the sky
Speaker 1: when I am facing the exact opposite direction, trillions of
Speaker 1: billions of miles, completely focused with the backside of the
Speaker 1: Earth and the Sun between me and the direction I
Speaker 1: was previously facing, and I will still see the Big Dipper,
Speaker 1: Oriyan's Belt, the Little Dipper, and all the other constellations.
Speaker 1: That is impossible in a heliocentric model. And all you
Speaker 1: have to do is hold your fist up and say,
Speaker 1: here's the Sun, and take your finger in your other hand.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna turn my camera so you can see this.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you can see me, So you
Speaker 1: hold this up. Here's the Sun. Here, here's June. I'm
Speaker 1: looking out in this direction of the universe, and I
Speaker 1: see all those constellations. Six months later, I'm here and
Speaker 1: I'm looking out this direction in the universe and see
Speaker 1: the same exact constellations.
Speaker 7: It's impossible. It's it's so infeasible, it doesn't make sense.
Speaker 7: And I just it's a it's a very simple demonstration.
Speaker 7: You just put your fist up. Here's the Sun ninety
Speaker 7: three billion miles away. Here's the Earth. You're looking.
Speaker 1: You're on the back side. Because here's the Sun, it's
Speaker 1: lighting up this side of the Earth. You're facing in
Speaker 1: this direction. This is the dark side of the Earth.
Speaker 1: You're facing out here. There's the big Dipper, there's a
Speaker 1: Ryon's bell, little dipper. All the rest go the other side.
Speaker 1: You're looking in this direction. This is the dark side
Speaker 1: of the Earth. Sun's here, light side of the Earth.
Speaker 1: You're seeing the same exact constellations. It doesn't work that
Speaker 1: to me the moment I realized that, because you know,
Speaker 1: I've seen it all my life. I look up the
Speaker 1: stars in January, I'm like, oh, yeah, there's a big dipper.
Speaker 1: Oh where's a Ryan's bell. Oh there it is. And
Speaker 1: I go and I do it again in June. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: there's a big dipper, there's a Ryan's bell. I would
Speaker 1: just you know, you look your stargazing. You're just thinking
Speaker 1: about it, but you never think about this and what
Speaker 1: the implications of it mean.
Speaker 3: Yep.
Speaker 1: But the moment you I actually stop and think and
Speaker 1: look at their their model that I had this massive
Speaker 1: glowing ball in between me and this and also the
Speaker 1: other side of the planet. It doesn't work. It automatically
Speaker 1: destroys it. And it's so interesting to see the faces
Speaker 1: of people when you just use the simple demonstration. They
Speaker 1: know it doesn't make sense, but they can't. They just
Speaker 1: they just kind of throw their hands up and say, well,
Speaker 1: you know, that still doesn't mean that.
Speaker 4: They're flat, right, they go right back to their uh yeah,
Speaker 4: conditioning or you know.
Speaker 1: But in regards to it, yeah, I've had I've had
Speaker 1: the I've had a distinct privilege of living down in
Speaker 1: southwest Florida, so the most part of the U of
Speaker 1: the United States. I lived in north Fort Myers. And
Speaker 1: the way the sun is down there, there is no question,
Speaker 1: there's no feasible way you can think that the Sun
Speaker 1: is ninety three million miles away. Crepuscular divergent rays are
Speaker 1: so prominent and evident you can actually see them the
Speaker 1: clouds down there on a on certain evenings, and I
Speaker 1: have I have pictures of this. Not only can you
Speaker 1: see them descending down and hitting the earth a divergent
Speaker 1: you can actually see the way the clouds are cutting them.
Speaker 1: You can see them going up into the sky like
Speaker 1: so you can see the whole radius of the way
Speaker 1: the Sun actually its lights radiate out from the center
Speaker 1: point instead of just parallel rays coming directly at you,
Speaker 1: as would have to be the case if the Sun
Speaker 1: was as massive and as far away as it is.
Speaker 1: There's no way that you could have these rays diverging
Speaker 1: as they do, not only downward, but also left right
Speaker 1: up from center. And you can you can literally, like
Speaker 1: when the clouds are in front of the sun, you
Speaker 1: can you can look at where they are, can trace
Speaker 1: them back up and pinpoint there's there's where the sun
Speaker 1: is because the lines just all go right to the
Speaker 1: same center point. A small localized sun. But the one
Speaker 1: you were talking about is one that I've always loved
Speaker 1: is up here in Michigan. You get the same sunlight
Speaker 1: during the daytime, but the sun up here in the
Speaker 1: winter descends quote unquote earlier than it does down in Florida.
Speaker 1: And that was something I remember one time my mother
Speaker 1: in law, who never wants to talk to me about
Speaker 1: flat Earth or the Bible, was like we were on
Speaker 1: the phone with her and she's like and Lindsay's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's still light out here, and she's like, it's light
Speaker 1: out there. It's been dark here for hours. How is
Speaker 1: that possible when summer here and it's not there for you?
Speaker 1: And it was excuse me when it was winter here
Speaker 1: and not there for you, And I pointed in my head,
Speaker 1: I'm like, it's because we are still physically closer to
Speaker 1: the local small sun, which is now in the other
Speaker 1: in the southern hemisphere. It's not sorry, not southern hemisphere.
Speaker 1: Is it on in the southern tropic making its orbit
Speaker 1: around the flat earth. But it's still closer to us
Speaker 1: physically than it is to you and the north. So
Speaker 1: when it starts ant arcing away from you, it actually
Speaker 1: draws light away from you earlier than it does from us.
Speaker 1: I didn't get to say that, because again I told
Speaker 1: you about this before. She just will not engage with
Speaker 1: me in these conversations, and anytime I do, it just
Speaker 1: creates an argument. So I've had to learn to bite
Speaker 1: my tongue with her. But the one that I absolutely
Speaker 1: love is it can be wintertime down there in Florida.
Speaker 1: It's so crazy. You get temperatures that drop like you'll
Speaker 1: be eighty eighty five degrees in the daytime and by
Speaker 1: the morning you're down into the thirties. You get like
Speaker 1: a fifty You can get up to like a fifty
Speaker 1: degree swing. It's not always that drastic. It's usually somewhere
Speaker 1: like twenty to thirty. So if like, say the daytime
Speaker 1: it was sixty, you'll you can get down into the
Speaker 1: low to mid thirties. And even while I was running Dopey,
Speaker 1: we got all the way down to like twenty eight
Speaker 1: at like two am, and then I got sixty during
Speaker 1: the daytime. But this, there's this wonderful thing. And I've
Speaker 1: heard Dave Weiss talk about this as well. When I
Speaker 1: get up in Michigan and I go outside and I
Speaker 1: look at the sun rise, I feel no heat, none.
Speaker 1: It's the sun is rising. It's beautiful, right, It's illuminating
Speaker 1: all of the heavens in the sky and the earth below.
Speaker 1: And you can't feel the heat. Florida. Whenever that sun
Speaker 1: cress over the horizon, you feel the heat immediately, and
Speaker 1: the temperature immediately starts to rise. You can have if
Speaker 1: you have like a watch that tracks it, you can
Speaker 1: literally watch the temperature rising in minutes, in minutes.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it was the same way. I lived
Speaker 4: in Texas for about a decade. It was the same way.
Speaker 4: When the sun came up in whatever, November, December, January,
Speaker 4: you felt the warmth of the sun. And I think
Speaker 4: I don't I'm not sure we had that drastic of
Speaker 4: you know, it was certainly a thirty degree difference between
Speaker 4: day and night. But then Colorado was the same thing.
Speaker 4: Blinding son. Obviously you're you're five thousand feet above sea level,
Speaker 4: blinding son, but no heat, no warmth, I should say, yeah.
Speaker 1: No, Actually, just again evidence, I mean, I guess, just
Speaker 1: evidence from experience. So it's obviously subjective in a sense.
Speaker 1: But when we were hunting, doping, and we were doing
Speaker 1: the marathon in the early morning hours, it was so free,
Speaker 1: so frigid during the marathon, and it was it wasn't
Speaker 1: as cold as some of the other days, but it
Speaker 1: was colder because the wind show like the wind was
Speaker 1: going and it was just cut cutting through you, and
Speaker 1: my hands were dead numb, and I remember, I'm just
Speaker 1: sitting there and I'm jogging along. I'm just like, I
Speaker 1: need that sun to come up. I think that sun
Speaker 1: to come up, because I needed. I literally, just as
Speaker 1: the sun started coming up, I just put the back
Speaker 1: of my hands towards the sun so the sun could
Speaker 1: start heating my hands to act as like a hand warner,
Speaker 1: because that's how strong it is. It's so strong that
Speaker 1: in the early morning hours, if you go in the shade,
Speaker 1: it's still like a ten degree difference. Wow, it like
Speaker 1: it's you. The sun was up in the sky, and
Speaker 1: if the shadows from the trees on your on our
Speaker 1: left the way we were running were there, you freeze it.
Speaker 1: Then the second you step into the sun you warm again.
Speaker 1: That doesn't happen if the sun is ninety three million
Speaker 1: miles away with any difference. You know, in these vast
Speaker 1: numbers that they throw out, there of millions of miles
Speaker 1: and degrees compared to billions, if Michigan is only a few.
Speaker 1: And I actually think, according to Dave Weiss, I've never
Speaker 1: looked into this. I think during the winter time, the
Speaker 1: north is actually closer and the south is actually further
Speaker 1: unquote ancording to their model, by the tipping the tilt
Speaker 1: of the Earth. I've not really ever looked into that.
Speaker 1: But even if we were just a few degrees, which
Speaker 1: was a few million miles, you would not have that
Speaker 1: level of variance in the differential between Florida and Michigan
Speaker 1: the sun would It would be so infintesively small in
Speaker 1: comparison to ninety three billion miles you would feel no difference.
Speaker 1: You feel it immediately it hits you, and it is
Speaker 1: immediately rejuvenating, immediately refreshing, and during the summertime it's immediately oppressive,
Speaker 1: absolutely turns the heat up.
Speaker 4: Justin It's been just awesome to visit with you again,
Speaker 4: and I appreciate all your wisdom and everything you shared
Speaker 4: over the last ninety minutes. But before we go, I
Speaker 4: want to give you an opportunity for any last closing words.
Speaker 1: Yeah, taking a little bit of a divergence off of
Speaker 1: just the flat earth, but because it goes again to
Speaker 1: this core understanding of how flat earth leads men to
Speaker 1: a knowledge of truth, because flat earth is true, but
Speaker 1: that must lead us to the truth, the truth being
Speaker 1: God himself, who is Jesus Christ. Where he says, I
Speaker 1: am the way, I am the truth, I am a
Speaker 1: life in John fourteen six. One of the actually one
Speaker 1: of the things the enemy has done to undermine the
Speaker 1: truth is to deny who he is as Israel Israel,
Speaker 1: and this would probably be more of a fact hunter
Speaker 1: discussion than a flat earth discussion with you one day.
Speaker 1: Israel is not a nation in the Middle East that
Speaker 1: is defined and bound by borders. Israel is a person,
Speaker 1: the person of Jesus Christ. He is the one who
Speaker 1: wrestles with power. He did so in Matthew chapter four
Speaker 1: when the devil came to tempt him in the wilderness.
Speaker 1: He is the Israel who is faithful as compared to
Speaker 1: the Israel who is unfaithful, which is mankind. We as
Speaker 1: men live in a generation now where the deceit of
Speaker 1: Israel is so of who Israel is is so pervasive,
Speaker 1: because we have a carnal Israel existing. The early Church
Speaker 1: leaders knew this. Justin Martyr, in his dialogue with Trifle,
Speaker 1: openly argued again and again, you are not a true Israelite.
Speaker 1: The true Israelites are anyone throughout all time who has
Speaker 1: ever professed faith in Jesus Christ, from Adam to the
Speaker 1: last man. And people will say, well, Jesus Christ wasn't
Speaker 1: around with Adam. Jesus Christ is God from the beginning.
Speaker 1: He is with the Father from the beginning. He is
Speaker 1: the very God that Adam knew. So when Adam put
Speaker 1: his faith in God for salvation, he was putting his
Speaker 1: faith in Jesus Christ Christ. The nation of Israel is
Speaker 1: a nation of faith, not a nation of borders and physicality.
Speaker 1: A true Jew, according to Romans Chapter two, verse twenty
Speaker 1: eight and nine, is one not circumcised according to the flesh,
Speaker 1: but who's circumcised in his heart. We have today this
Speaker 1: pervasive lie of who Israel is and who a Jew is,
Speaker 1: that modern day Christians will openly war against the testimony
Speaker 1: of scripture that all believers throughout all time, whoever profess
Speaker 1: faith in Jesus Christ, are true Israelites and true Jews.
Speaker 1: And Jesus Christ, who is the King of Israel, who
Speaker 1: is Israel himself, who is the Kingdom of God in
Speaker 1: the hearts and minds of men. Why does the enemy
Speaker 1: do this? Because he is trying to undermine the fear
Speaker 1: of the Lord. Because Proverbs one seven tells us that
Speaker 1: the beginning of all knowledge is the fear of the Lord.
Speaker 1: But fools despise instruction. Proverbs nine ten teaches us the
Speaker 1: beginning of all wisdom is the fear of the Lord,
Speaker 1: and knowledge of the Holy One is insight. So the
Speaker 1: enemy who hates us has read the scriptures and he
Speaker 1: knows the beginning of all knowledge and all wisdom is
Speaker 1: the fear of the Lord. So what must he make
Speaker 1: men do not fear God? And He has done this
Speaker 1: with Christians, with Israelites, true believers, true Jews, by telling
Speaker 1: you you are not an Israelite, and Jesus Christ you
Speaker 1: are not a Jew. How does that undermine the fear
Speaker 1: of the Lord, Because if you are not an Israelite,
Speaker 1: then the Old Testament curses do not belong to you.
Speaker 1: You do not have to fear, even though the scripture
Speaker 1: repeatedly tells you to work out your salvation fear and trembling.
Speaker 1: Revelation chapter eleven tells you be mindful always of the
Speaker 1: kindness and severity of God. God tells you that stricter
Speaker 1: judgment will come upon those who have or who have
Speaker 1: forsaken such a great salvation. Whereas with Moses, the enemies
Speaker 1: of God died on the witness of two ear excuse
Speaker 1: me on the testimony of two or three witnesses, how
Speaker 1: much greater of a punishment and fall upon the one
Speaker 1: who tramples under underfoot the salvation the blood of the
Speaker 1: Sun by which they receive salvation and sanctification. It's Hebrews
Speaker 1: chapter ten. If we do not fear God, and we
Speaker 1: do not recognize the truth, we will we will not
Speaker 1: one testify rightly. Two we will not understand the scripture rightly.
Speaker 1: We will not know knowledge and wisdom. One Corinthians chapter one,
Speaker 1: verse twenty four and thirty tells us that Jesus Christ
Speaker 1: is the wisdom of God. So if you cannot even
Speaker 1: have wisdom without the fear of God, you will not
Speaker 1: have Jesus Christ, because he is the wisdom that God gives.
Speaker 1: The flat earth will lead you to a fat It
Speaker 1: will lead you to a truth. You must then continue
Speaker 1: and press forward. Do not throw your hands up like
Speaker 1: so many have done, and say, well, I know that
Speaker 1: there's a God, But let that God be whoever you
Speaker 1: think it is. No, you must know Him who has
Speaker 1: given you this creation to live in, to dwell in.
Speaker 1: What has he said to you, What has he provided
Speaker 1: for you? What has he commanded? You? Do not fall
Speaker 1: back into deceit after you have already stepped out from
Speaker 1: one lie to then fall back into another. Fear the
Speaker 1: Lord your God, and work out your salvation and fear
Speaker 1: and trembling. Trust the Lord your God with all your
Speaker 1: heart and lee, not on your own understanding. Any and
Speaker 1: all people throughout all time who have ever professed faith
Speaker 1: in Jesus Christ and hope fast to it to the
Speaker 1: end are true Israelites and trued you. That's all I
Speaker 1: really have to say at that.
Speaker 4: Point, a man, thank you so much, very powerful ninety minutes,
Speaker 4: and I'm gonna talk to you offline. I'd love to
Speaker 4: have you on the Fact Hunter uh in the coming
Speaker 4: weeks and months to go very deep dive into that.
Speaker 4: It is something we touched about often on that podcast.
Speaker 4: So again, justin thank you so much, and I'm glad
Speaker 4: to hear that your move wentz. I assume went smoothly.
Speaker 4: And you're you're you're getting adapted to the climate change,
Speaker 4: for lack of better words, climate change. But that is
Speaker 4: a drastic one, I'm sure.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Oh yeah, it's been drastic. I mean, it's okay,
Speaker 1: I'm used to it. It's it's the gray. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think you're from you were did you
Speaker 1: say you're like lived in Minnesota before or something like that.
Speaker 3: I can't remember upstate New York.
Speaker 4: That the constant gray basically from you know, December through March.
Speaker 1: Yeah, going from seeing the sun every single day like
Speaker 1: you down in Florida. You may get a passing rainstorm
Speaker 1: and the sun is obscure, you may get a few
Speaker 1: cloud covers here and there, but is sunlight, daylight every
Speaker 1: single day up here in Michigan. It's just clouds from
Speaker 1: horizon to horizon and it's depressing, that's right, Like, oh
Speaker 1: my gosh, I just want to see the sun.
Speaker 3: All right.
Speaker 4: Well, well, all the best and thanks again for sharing
Speaker 4: all your knowledge and your wisdom. And again God bless
Speaker 4: you and your family, and enjoy the Michigan There's lots
Speaker 4: of fishing up there.
Speaker 3: I'm sure the summer is going to be beautiful.
Speaker 4: And I'd especially like to thank all the listeners who
Speaker 4: have been with us for over two years now as
Speaker 4: we continue on. As I stated before, we have a
Speaker 4: couple of Canadian listeners that'll be joining us in the
Speaker 4: following weeks, and if you would like to join us
Speaker 4: as well, please do send us an email to fe
Speaker 4: files at gmail dot com and look forward to getting
Speaker 4: everyone scheduled and having a great late winter into spring.
Speaker 4: So God bless everyone, and keep your head on swivel.
Speaker 4: And until we meet again, my friends, we will see you.
Speaker 1: I know it's been a strug gone. I don't know
Speaker 1: you've had spain. I'm not feeling tired.
Speaker 5: Tell down all the way. Yeah, I know you feeling are.
Speaker 1: You smile? Ain't the same? That's all way to go
Speaker 1: from here.
Speaker 5: I feel like you've lost your way.
Speaker 1: Don't give it. No, don't give it, and never is home.
Speaker 1: Don't let call the primise. It ain't done yet.
Speaker 8: He's got a plaid.
Speaker 5: Why it's a way? Time got up?
Speaker 1: May we come?
Speaker 5: Why? Why come up?
Speaker 8: I can see the street beside you. Childs are putting
Speaker 8: up the five.
Speaker 1: Oh, you're stronger than any thing. You are. Yeah, you're
Speaker 1: gonna be all right.
Speaker 3: You're accepting a dead found beautiful. You're shoving ride.
Speaker 8: Yeah, you're live and breathing, moveing. You can hold your
Speaker 8: head a pie. Don't give up. No, don't give in.
Speaker 1: Never loss home.
Speaker 5: Don't they gone on the primise?
Speaker 1: Me? Ain't done yet?
Speaker 7: It's God.
Speaker 2: I let wan a way down, the God of me recall,
Speaker 2: don't give up, no, don't give in you never love home,
Speaker 2: don't let go on the primise.
Speaker 1: It ain't gone off. It's worth living. What's a way down?
Speaker 3: The god baby call?
Speaker 1: Why's a pray down? God steamy cold?
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, what's a pray down? The god baby colt?
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, gottav Oh, don't give.
Speaker 1: Up, no, don't give in. Never's home? Do they go
Speaker 1: on the primise? I mean, and they's got I'm playing.
Speaker 5: Watch Doe, the god of if it comes, and don't.
Speaker 8: Give it no dog giving, never this hole, don't let
Speaker 8: go of the crowds.
Speaker 5: Getting done, Lovers worth living, watched the God of every
Speaker 5: coors Ah, the god of needs, gos Wat's done, the
Speaker 5: god of a case.
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Fact Hunter Radio Network. Just the facts, ma'am,