Speaker 1: Meaning a light Man like this man letting butterfly flapping
Speaker 1: his wing.
Speaker 2: They've bound in a force.
Speaker 1: Man, it gonna cause a tree fall, letting five thousand
Speaker 1: miles away.
Speaker 3: Man, nobody see Nobody else might see that. You don't
Speaker 3: need know it. Man, we don't.
Speaker 4: They'd like you followed another story and you got back
Speaker 4: to like that.
Speaker 2: That's the man got back to na on the Panama Man.
Speaker 3: Now you don't bag no matter, man, okay.
Speaker 1: In one of my recent episodes, we talked about the
Speaker 1: system of social control the wizardgree that they use to
Speaker 1: control public opinion. But something that we didn't get into
Speaker 1: that really stuck in my mind is well, what do
Speaker 1: you do when there's not one unified public to control?
Speaker 1: When there's no real cultural consensus. Society has been so
Speaker 1: fracture due to changing demographics the Internet age, that becomes
Speaker 1: very difficult to have a unified narrative on anything. We
Speaker 1: see this quite often in criminal cases. The murder of
Speaker 1: Austin Metcalf by Carmelo Anthony is a classic example that
Speaker 1: concept of self defense a trial by your peers. It's cultural,
Speaker 1: it is contextual, and it falls apart when people don't
Speaker 1: have the same cultural ties, and this is something I've
Speaker 1: noticed for a while in my mind. The last real
Speaker 1: top down narrative push was the pandemic. It was quite
Speaker 1: clear what the official narrative was. And ever since then,
Speaker 1: any one of the big pushes, the times where they
Speaker 1: really tried to all get us to think the same thing,
Speaker 1: well it's fizzled. And maybe part of that is the
Speaker 1: pandemic that many people, whether they have a particularly sophisticated
Speaker 1: system or not realized all at once that well, whatever
Speaker 1: they're telling me, it's probably not true. But I think
Speaker 1: there's another element, which is simply we are too disunited
Speaker 1: of a country. There is not one pop culture. There
Speaker 1: are millions of different subcultures. Some of them are simply
Speaker 1: aesthetic y two k fashion goths, the sort of stuff
Speaker 1: that would kind of make sense in a John Hughes movie,
Speaker 1: just amplified by social media. But also, well, if people
Speaker 1: don't even speak the same language, don't have the same holidays,
Speaker 1: don't have the same culture, how could we expect them
Speaker 1: to have the same opinion on anything. This is one
Speaker 1: of the suicidal parts of multiculturalism, and the deep irony
Speaker 1: is that it is boast the weapons that our elites
Speaker 1: are using against us, and also something which seems to
Speaker 1: be dooming their project to failure. Tower of Babel Babel,
Speaker 1: depending on how you say it, is sort of an
Speaker 1: interesting example of this. This isn't Bible thumping. You can
Speaker 1: treat it as a mythic story and see exactly the
Speaker 1: point I'm about to make, this grand world spanning project,
Speaker 1: the tower that will reach to Heaven ultimately, Falters men
Speaker 1: are divided given their different tongues, the idea that they're
Speaker 1: going to create this one world system or that they
Speaker 1: are going to create this totalizing system of control. Well,
Speaker 1: human nature rebels against that, Entropy rebels against that, and
Speaker 1: both of those are things we can't manage our way
Speaker 1: out of, despite our best attempts to do so. And look,
Speaker 1: that doesn't mean things will be particularly pleasant or fun.
Speaker 1: Entropy is a very real thing, but I don't think
Speaker 1: they can pull it off. Seemingly, they've already lost the
Speaker 1: level of narrative control they had ten let alone twenty
Speaker 1: years ago. For all of the reason that I laid
Speaker 1: out today's episode is with a stalwart Tim Kelly of
Speaker 1: our interesting times, a man you've no doubt heard before,
Speaker 1: been around for a long time, ten years plus or minus.
Speaker 1: In fact, I've been an interview on a show and
Speaker 1: I had one of his co hosts, Joe Atwell, on
Speaker 1: not too long ago. I remember where I was the
Speaker 1: first time I heard his podcast with Pete Conyonez, probably
Speaker 1: five or six years ago now. But he does good work.
Speaker 1: He's interesting thinker, and I think that this is a
Speaker 1: productive conversation poking around that what are they going to
Speaker 1: do as culture crumbles, because it is both a weapon,
Speaker 1: as I've said, but also they move through those waters.
Speaker 1: They need social cohesion so that when they push culture
Speaker 1: one way, it all goes. It's sort of like you're
Speaker 1: trying to push a bag of sand across the floor,
Speaker 1: versus you've turned that bag over, there's nothing contain it,
Speaker 1: constraining it. Try to move the same number of grains
Speaker 1: of sand. It's a much messier, much more difficult process,
Speaker 1: especially in time in which they are getting less competent.
Speaker 1: They are doing worse this sort of push pull that
Speaker 1: has kept competent people out of government as ham stringing them.
Speaker 1: It's an interesting thing that multiple trend lines moving at once.
Speaker 1: And let's be honest, this is also a funny episode
Speaker 1: it's not really mostly about jokes, but Tim, he's he's
Speaker 1: a good time a clever guysout further Ado. Let's get
Speaker 1: into the episode as per usual. If you want the
Speaker 1: episodes early in ad free throw me a few bucks Patreon,
Speaker 1: Substack or gum Road. Check out our sponsor, Axios Remote
Speaker 1: Fitness and Coaching, an app I use almost daily. Great
Speaker 1: guy there, JD who runs it. You should give him
Speaker 1: your money and uh hey you'll get fit, which is
Speaker 1: probably something you guys need. Anyway, here's Tim. All right,
Speaker 1: Tim Kelly, welcome to the Jay Burdon Show How You
Speaker 1: Do It?
Speaker 3: Man? Well, thanks for having me on.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm glad to have you on. I was on
Speaker 1: your program. I mean I was gonna say not too
Speaker 1: long ago, but time flies on the internet. It's been
Speaker 1: longer than I thought. And obviously I had your co
Speaker 1: host on not too long ago. So I'm really glad
Speaker 1: to have you on.
Speaker 3: Man.
Speaker 1: It's funny. I was talking about this, you know, because
Speaker 1: I got a little Maudlin hit, you know, the five
Speaker 1: hundredth episode, and I was thinking, like, you know what
Speaker 1: got me here?
Speaker 3: And a cheeze.
Speaker 1: It would have been four years ago, but you had
Speaker 1: done an episode with Pete during the whole you know,
Speaker 1: pandemic situation. And it's been years. I don't even know
Speaker 1: what episode it is, but I remember exactly where I
Speaker 1: was listening to that right before I started. And so
Speaker 1: I've been listening to your work for a long time
Speaker 1: and I'm real glad to have you on.
Speaker 3: Oh, thank you the uh I guess uh entertaining you
Speaker 3: for well.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's an interesting thing that you know, people always have,
Speaker 1: you know, where were you when JFK was shot and
Speaker 1: all that? And you know, the version for our guys is, well,
Speaker 1: where were you when X y Z racist podcasts happened?
Speaker 3: You know?
Speaker 1: And I was at an absolutely horrible industrial park and
Speaker 1: the bad side of Richmond. Wouldn't recommend it, But we're
Speaker 1: not here merely to reminisce. Before we got started, you
Speaker 1: and I were talking covered a number of subjects, but
Speaker 1: you mentioned this phrase that I'd never heard before that
Speaker 1: I really liked, the hollow state, which I think comprises
Speaker 1: a couple of different ideas that a lot of people
Speaker 1: have felt are kind of thrown around. And so I'm curious, Tim,
Speaker 1: what does this term meant?
Speaker 4: Well, I didn't coin it. I happened to come across
Speaker 4: it and just serendipitously you asked the question. I said, well,
Speaker 4: you know what you know about the idea of the
Speaker 4: lack of narrative and some of the big events, the
Speaker 4: inability forgover to explain itself and just to not incline
Speaker 4: to provide narratives what they're do anymore. It's just that
Speaker 4: they're all over the place, and I surmise that might
Speaker 4: be one of the things why we have this is
Speaker 4: a hollow state. They don't preside over a cohesive people anymore.
Speaker 4: It's been atomized. The nation state has been shattered or
Speaker 4: sort of been transcended by globalism and those who enforce it,
Speaker 4: those those groups that enforce it or have created it.
Speaker 4: And so there are politicians who don't really represent us,
Speaker 4: are inclined to even have to justify their actions anymore,
Speaker 4: and they don't have They don't have a they don't
Speaker 4: have a cohesive people who are have enough time to
Speaker 4: pay attention or inclined to pay attention, or to have
Speaker 4: a clear thought or to have They don't think that
Speaker 4: the public has an intention span that requires narratives at
Speaker 4: least to have some pretext or some basis in truth
Speaker 4: or reality in the past, I mean, the things that
Speaker 4: governments do, particularly wars and some of the particularly the
Speaker 4: crises that we've been confronted with in the twentieth century,
Speaker 4: they're never really the what they what they're marketed as.
Speaker 4: And the governments are never doing things for the reasons
Speaker 4: that they that they retailed to the public. You know,
Speaker 4: pick any war out in the past, you know, since
Speaker 4: I don't know, since nineteen hundred or eighteen ninety eight,
Speaker 4: it's never really for what it's for. I mean, we
Speaker 4: didn't go to war with Spain over the main that
Speaker 4: was the pretext.
Speaker 3: Of course. We didn't enter World War One to make.
Speaker 4: The world safe for democracy, order to check Teutonic tyranny
Speaker 4: or whatever. We didn't enter World War two to stop Hitler,
Speaker 4: or in a sense we did, but we Hitler had
Speaker 4: to be stopped for reasons that weren't there, weren't retail
Speaker 4: to the public. We didn't get into Career or Vietnam
Speaker 4: for the reasons that they said we did.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 4: In fact, you know, there was a Gulf of Tonkin
Speaker 4: instant that never occurred. Of course, in the nineteen sixties,
Speaker 4: I've quipped that in the nineteen sixties, there was a naval incident,
Speaker 4: an incident, see that didn't happen which led to a
Speaker 4: full scale war.
Speaker 3: Then there was an attack against US ships, it didn't
Speaker 3: lead to a war or something referring to the US
Speaker 3: as liberty incident.
Speaker 4: So and of course we can talk about, you know,
Speaker 4: the the Gulf War nineteen ninety or even that two
Speaker 4: thousand and three Iraq war, and of course this current excursion,
Speaker 4: one hundred day excursion against Iraq, I mean Iran, rather
Speaker 4: not for what it remember, it's not it wasn't started.
Speaker 3: For what for the reasons that the well, actually they
Speaker 3: did kind of admit it originally, didn't.
Speaker 4: They say that they we attacked because Israel was going
Speaker 4: to attack, so we had to attack preemptively or something.
Speaker 4: And then these other narrators started popping up. So that's
Speaker 4: that's kind of what. So there's no reasonability to have
Speaker 4: to present a coherent narrative to these things because the nations,
Speaker 4: particularly America, is so shattered that it's just possis don't
Speaker 4: feel the need to it anymore, you know.
Speaker 1: Well, definitely, and I realized this is going to date
Speaker 1: this horribly when inevitably we're plunged into nuclear fire, you know,
Speaker 1: fifteen minutes after this episode is public. But I just
Speaker 1: got a text message and then confirmed. It seems as
Speaker 1: if both Trump and the Iranian president have signed whatever
Speaker 1: peace deal will conclude this not real war. I think
Speaker 1: that what's interesting is like you look at Vietnam, right,
Speaker 1: and there is there's an official narrative, right, there's an explanation,
Speaker 1: and there's a delta between that and what actually happened, right,
Speaker 1: And then maybe this is just a recency bias, you know,
Speaker 1: what I've lived through. But when I look at things
Speaker 1: like you know, the Vegas shooting or you know, the
Speaker 1: attempted assassination of Trump in Butler, PA, it seems as
Speaker 1: if the official narrative is basically just to forget about it.
Speaker 1: There's no real explanation. I mean, I think the nominal
Speaker 1: explanation for you know, Vegas is, of course, you know,
Speaker 1: Paddick and Curb gambling debts and so decided to shoot
Speaker 1: people who weren't in the casino, you know. Or in Butler,
Speaker 1: it seems to just be he was angry, which you know,
Speaker 1: I assume that's at least part of it. You know,
Speaker 1: that seems to stand to reason, but it doesn't quite
Speaker 1: explain the whole situation and the point about you know,
Speaker 1: the actual like people who make up a nation fracturing.
Speaker 1: I mean, this is something I noticed. I've told this
Speaker 1: story before, but you know, a few months back, I
Speaker 1: was having a conversation with my wife and my grandmother
Speaker 1: and she asked me, you know, well, what kind of
Speaker 1: music to people your age listen to? Which you know,
Speaker 1: on its face a perfectly sensible question, but it's actually
Speaker 1: one that's quite difficult to answer because of music streaming
Speaker 1: apps and algorithms. Because you know, tim, you may have
Speaker 1: a song that for you is the you know, the
Speaker 1: summer of nineteen ninety six, you know the song that
Speaker 1: you hear and it takes you right back. You know,
Speaker 1: it was everywhere, And yeah, sure I do too, for
Speaker 1: you know, when I was in college or whatever. But
Speaker 1: that song wasn't on the radio, it wasn't centralized. It
Speaker 1: was whatever the algorithm decided to feed me and the
Speaker 1: ten kids next to me walking through the halls or
Speaker 1: listening to something completely and totally different. And that's that's
Speaker 1: a very innocuous version. You know, all of those ten
Speaker 1: kids may well have you know, had very similar cultural
Speaker 1: and genetic groups that I did. And that's simply the
Speaker 1: kind of disintegration of culture, let alone, right, the fallout
Speaker 1: of multiculturalism, which is, well, they have no culture in
Speaker 1: common whatsoever. You know, it seems that this kind of
Speaker 1: strip culture America, you know, where every one simply comes
Speaker 1: to make money, Well it's really only that it's this
Speaker 1: sort of you know, commercial zone, and the only thing
Speaker 1: people are at least phenominally linked by is like the
Speaker 1: worship of the US dollar. And that doesn't seem to
Speaker 1: bind the culture enough to even deserve a narrative, if
Speaker 1: I'm not stretching too much.
Speaker 4: Tim Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, because there's no shared
Speaker 4: culture that no, but that I share cultures, no shared values.
Speaker 4: And had you had you governors society like that, really
Speaker 4: well you do it through trauma, fear and constant diversion
Speaker 4: and just so there's no yeah, So, I mean that's
Speaker 4: this was something that Walter Littmann wrote a bat in
Speaker 4: the early part of the twentieth century, even as early
Speaker 4: as nineteen twenty one, that America was too complex to
Speaker 4: govern under Jeffersonian principles. So it was the job of
Speaker 4: experts like him to provide the pictures, the narratives, the
Speaker 4: imagery that would controlled people's thoughts, and from that you
Speaker 4: could sort of confect a public opinion. I mean, public
Speaker 4: opinion wasn't really genuine. It was always being manipulated and
Speaker 4: confected to largely to imagery. And this is something that
Speaker 4: was mass democracy. As they're expanding the franchise and you
Speaker 4: first to I guess, emancipated slaves, black men, then to women.
Speaker 3: And then to you know, eighteen year olds, eventually.
Speaker 4: It becomes it becomes sort of negates itself because it
Speaker 4: has to be manipulated. And the theory behind that is
Speaker 4: those who are voting are being informed by the media
Speaker 4: institutions and academia. But then if academian media is sort
Speaker 4: of in a conspiracy, if you will, if I can
Speaker 4: use that term to manipulate public opinion, then it is
Speaker 4: self negating because the people aren't being informed, there being
Speaker 4: constantly manipulated. So you know, when you ask me about
Speaker 4: you know, let's let's repeal the twenty first Amendment or sorry,
Speaker 4: the nineteenth amendment. Twenty first sackol the nineteenth Amendment because
Speaker 4: women shouldn't vote, And I was like, well, yeah, it's true, but.
Speaker 3: Most people shouldn't vote, so don't get insulted.
Speaker 4: And you know, if you're a woman, I say that
Speaker 4: there's a lot of things, a lot of people just
Speaker 4: most people just aren't politically competent, you know. And and
Speaker 4: theoretically those in charge could, I think, edify and inform
Speaker 4: the public and make them more competent. But if they're competent,
Speaker 4: how do you screw them over? You can't because they'reiblitically competent.
Speaker 4: So it's it's it's the ability to lead to kind
Speaker 4: of the desire to rule over people. You know, they'd
Speaker 4: lust for to rule liberta dominandi, and they don't want, uh,
Speaker 4: you know. And so it's if you know, in America
Speaker 4: in the twentieth century, you did have this sort of
Speaker 4: confected monoculture.
Speaker 3: There was forged out of two World Wars.
Speaker 4: The Great Depression, you had the managerial state, and it
Speaker 4: was just sort of this American culture. Although you know,
Speaker 4: if you really put a microscope on America, you see
Speaker 4: a lot of different regional you see different regional interests
Speaker 4: and dies. Obviously there's the South, there's Midwest and the
Speaker 4: West Coast and all that. But you know, through CBS, ABC, NBC,
Speaker 4: first through radio, then TV, than Hollywood. They did create
Speaker 4: an American culture, a monoculture that was shattered kind of
Speaker 4: like after the Cold War because everything they just didn't
Speaker 4: they didn't think they needed anymore. They didn't need the
Speaker 4: you know, the fodder to man the army and to
Speaker 4: hold back the Communists, if you or that, you know
Speaker 4: that that to contain communism, if that was ever really
Speaker 4: you know the objective of the Cold War. But you
Speaker 4: see what I'm getting at there, I mean kind of
Speaker 4: like it's circumstances changed. You know, we've never really have
Speaker 4: a democracy. These things, these things have always been an illusion,
Speaker 4: you know. Frank Zappets, that's something to say about that.
Speaker 4: And of course he was obviously a checkered figure.
Speaker 3: Wouldn't rely on him. But Laura Canyon and all that, that's.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, sidebar. It's like there there are a
Speaker 1: number of these, you know, very much of their time,
Speaker 1: Baby Boomer figures, you know, Zappa, a few others that
Speaker 1: you just sort of can't help. But like you know
Speaker 1: that there's no real identifiable ideology there. It comes across
Speaker 1: as very genuine, But I think a lot about the fact.
Speaker 4: They probably say, that's sort of asked, man's sort of
Speaker 4: a satanic figure.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's probably a more I.
Speaker 4: Can't say curse words of my records. Man, you're a fascist,
Speaker 4: you know that sort of thing. Yeah, what was tip
Speaker 4: of Gore is the fastest? That's I don't you're probactaria
Speaker 4: remember all that. But the tip Gore used to be
Speaker 4: a conservative. Al Gore was a Southern Democratic conservative back
Speaker 4: in the eighties.
Speaker 3: From Tennessee, and she wanted to put warning.
Speaker 4: Labels on records because of the material, you know, so
Speaker 4: typical or led that charge the late eighties.
Speaker 1: Well, the there's one thing I want to I want
Speaker 1: to bring up, uh when you you speak about that
Speaker 1: sort of lust for power, right, the sort of flebido domanandi,
Speaker 1: And I hadn't realize like a large part of that
Speaker 1: book is talking about something different sidebar issue. But the
Speaker 1: the thing that I think about a lot is how
Speaker 1: clearly a certain segment of our elites are pushing for
Speaker 1: this kind of global brasilification, you know, the idea that
Speaker 1: we will simply you know, rule over you know, countless
Speaker 1: teeming hordes of you know, low IQ.
Speaker 2: Morons, which, by the way, as someone who's sort of
Speaker 2: interested in uh Brazilian film.
Speaker 1: He watched that and uh, okay, look I get it.
Speaker 1: It's a movie. It's it's not one hundred percent accurate.
Speaker 1: But the Brazilians are making this about themselves. Uh you
Speaker 1: think O block is bad? You know, like when they
Speaker 1: get up to it real like say what you will.
Speaker 1: When don Quavius goes to write, goes to rob the
Speaker 1: gas station, he's at least civilized enough to use a
Speaker 1: block with a switch, not to stuff stuff you inside
Speaker 1: a tire and set you on fire. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: so it's it's it's the it's the little things that
Speaker 1: make you know your country feel like home. And at
Speaker 1: least getting shot is uh, you know, better than it
Speaker 1: could be. But in all seriousness, obviously, once you see
Speaker 1: that's sort of hard to ignore it. Everywhere, you know,
Speaker 1: the the underlying assumption is that you know, I can
Speaker 1: destroy the country because I will still be in charge
Speaker 1: no matter what. And one of the things that I've
Speaker 1: been interested to watch is in these immigrant groups. You
Speaker 1: see it in the UK, you know, where there's this
Speaker 1: new alliance. The Labor Party has lost a lot of
Speaker 1: the Muslims and now there's this weird, you know, alliance
Speaker 1: between some independent Muslims and also the Green Party. You know,
Speaker 1: they're becoming more of a power player instead of purely
Speaker 1: a client group. They're acting in their own interest on
Speaker 1: their own But also if you look at you know,
Speaker 1: elections in you know, deep deep blue areas heavily immigrant,
Speaker 1: they're basically like engineering their own race wars. But you
Speaker 1: know it's instead of you know, the kind of like
Speaker 1: nineteen nineties vintage stuff, you know, Rodney King and all that,
Speaker 1: it's you know, the Asians versus the Hispanics. You know,
Speaker 1: like politics doesn't cease and that idea that you know,
Speaker 1: we will continue to be the elect no matter what.
Speaker 1: Rolling down from our ivory castle, it's like, well, guess what,
Speaker 1: you know, a little bit later, Camp of the Saints
Speaker 1: happens to you two. You know, except instead of your
Speaker 1: beautiful oak door, it could be like your AI data center.
Speaker 1: You know, it's the same thing, no matter what, you know,
Speaker 1: it's just this kind of arrogance to assume the entrope
Speaker 1: wal halt at exactly the moment it would inconvenience me.
Speaker 3: Yeah, It's like there's.
Speaker 4: Aristocrats who supported the French Revolution because they saw themselves
Speaker 4: as perhaps getting the throne if the king was taken out,
Speaker 4: and revolutions devour their children, as they say, right, so.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it is sort of this continual kind
Speaker 1: of human behavior, like the wisdom of Ecclesiastes, right, there's
Speaker 1: nothing new under the sun, Like yeah, okay, sure, you know,
Speaker 1: obviously there's the technical aspect to it, but that's what
Speaker 1: sort of adds to the to the.
Speaker 3: Horror of this.
Speaker 1: Like if you are a student of history at all,
Speaker 1: you're like, oh, wait, you know, I've seen this before,
Speaker 1: and it was way more comfortable to watch it to
Speaker 1: happen to someone else, you know, with two thousand years
Speaker 1: of distance.
Speaker 3: I want to I want to read about it. I
Speaker 3: don't want to live it.
Speaker 1: Right, yeah, yeah, exactly. Reading about barbarians is much more
Speaker 1: fun than be beheaded by them.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and he kind of let me look good. Examples.
Speaker 4: Look what happened out in Los Angeles the election out
Speaker 4: there for mayor, and I do there's no way special
Speaker 4: Practice could win.
Speaker 3: They're not gonna let him win, you know.
Speaker 4: But there's no because there's no real at least there's
Speaker 4: not a solid majority constituency for a reasonable politician right
Speaker 4: out there, he's making all the sense and like they're
Speaker 4: not going to allow that. You know, he'll peel it
Speaker 4: a lot to a lot of people, because you know,
Speaker 4: there's always a lot of people who haven't gone crazy yet.
Speaker 3: Same thing, you know in New York.
Speaker 4: That yeah, in the nineties there was actually a constituency
Speaker 4: for for Juliani. There isn't anymore, at least not a
Speaker 4: majority for it, because they've been able to uh, well
Speaker 4: pretty much water the stock, if you will, dilute it
Speaker 4: with you know, mass immigration, you know, and this is
Speaker 4: what you got that they you know, and the system
Speaker 4: isn't going to work. Seemly, the jury system doesn't work.
Speaker 4: You know, why was Kamala Why was Carmello Anthony convicted?
Speaker 4: They say there was no black on the jury. Well,
Speaker 4: in a sense, they're kind of right, what does that
Speaker 4: say though he was guilty as hell? I mean, there's
Speaker 4: no one there just to uh to stop it to
Speaker 4: you know, to uh to hang the jury out of
Speaker 4: a out of a sense of racial solidarity with a murderer.
Speaker 4: It's because these groups aren't able to utilize, at least
Speaker 4: unwilling or unable to maintain or utilize these institutions. That
Speaker 4: they were bequeathed to them because it's white supremacy, you know,
Speaker 4: like the jury trial law in order.
Speaker 3: You know, uh, we were talking off call.
Speaker 4: There was the reaction to Cammella Anthony the burg you know,
Speaker 4: Shaupie Surprise is guilty, okay, And Matt Walsh was he
Speaker 4: was watching some of the reactions and he was watching
Speaker 4: a video of the some of the protesters, the black
Speaker 4: the blacks protesting outside the courthouse where come ol An
Speaker 4: I think it was, was convicted. And you know there's
Speaker 4: one lady doing the outraged black lady saying what am
Speaker 4: I supposed to do? What do I tell my sons?
Speaker 4: And Matt Walsh kicks me, goes, I don't know, tell
Speaker 4: about the stab people. Just do something else, you know,
Speaker 4: take up crossroad puzzling. Just don't stab.
Speaker 1: People, you know, well, you know, and I guess that's
Speaker 1: the that's the sort of arrogance of this. And you
Speaker 1: see this even at the kind of you know, laptop class,
Speaker 1: you know, middle class types, which is the assumption that
Speaker 1: you can take you can completely and totally change the culture,
Speaker 1: and you know, the actual people that live in a
Speaker 1: country and all of the institutions will keep working, and
Speaker 1: it turns out, you know, Demestra is just eternally vindicated
Speaker 1: on this point. The but you know, a constitution, the
Speaker 1: laws aren't just magic. They're an expression of a culture,
Speaker 1: expression of a people. And you mentioned Jerry trial, which
Speaker 1: is sort of a poignant example, because that's something that has,
Speaker 1: you know, very very old roots in English common law.
Speaker 1: It's a system that sort of you know, made sense
Speaker 1: for those people. And okay, yeah, back then they had
Speaker 1: a more developed system in certain ways. If you were
Speaker 1: a noble, you wouldn't just be judged by a random
Speaker 1: allotment of other Englishmen, but you know, other nobles. And likewise,
Speaker 1: if you were a common person, and the idea was, well,
Speaker 1: you know, you have a lot in common, so you
Speaker 1: can understand what is reasonable behavior and what is not.
Speaker 1: And well, very clearly that system breaks down when you
Speaker 1: have people that have, to put it kindly, Tim, very
Speaker 1: different understandings of what reasonable behavior is. I can't remember
Speaker 1: if it was Jasmine Crockett or Joey Reid. I know
Speaker 1: it was the two of them talking. And okay, Tim,
Speaker 1: you might ask, why were you watching this?
Speaker 3: Look really different people?
Speaker 4: Uh?
Speaker 1: Yes, because Jasmine Crockett has fake hair and has no hair.
Speaker 1: Right to be fair, I do think Joy Reid is
Speaker 1: like three times her size. Uh point is you know
Speaker 1: what directionally? You're correct? Functionally, But I'm actually I'm so
Speaker 1: upset Jazzmine Crockett's out of politics. She was one of
Speaker 1: my favorites and that we've lost her. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: I mean you have to take your victories where you can,
Speaker 1: and she was a great source of entertainment and I'm
Speaker 1: really devastated that we had.
Speaker 4: To funny things. I mean, she actually she's competent enough
Speaker 4: to be a US senator. Maybe she is now, but well,
Speaker 4: Kamala Harris.
Speaker 1: Was I was about to say, in what direction? Do
Speaker 1: you mean that? On like a technical level? Because I
Speaker 1: think you know, you remember how long the technically living
Speaker 1: corpses of both Dianne Feinstein and Mitch McConnell. We're an afic,
Speaker 1: So apparently even the criteria of having a pulse, you know,
Speaker 1: isn't a barrier to entry. So you know what, you
Speaker 1: say what you will about Jasmine Crockett. She is alive
Speaker 1: and so I think she hears that parrier no problem.
Speaker 3: But she's actually smarter than she lets on. She just
Speaker 3: does the ghetto racket just for politics.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, there's videos of her earlier in life, and
Speaker 1: she sounds completely normal, like I think her parents are
Speaker 1: like upper middle class, private, well educated.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not going to pretend she's a Rhodes scholar,
Speaker 1: but she's smarter than she would have you believe. Again,
Speaker 1: maybe damning by faint praise there, But the point is
Speaker 1: that these two women are talking and you know, one
Speaker 1: of them brings up the idea that like, well, you know,
Speaker 1: clearly this idea of you know, a lethal weapon is
Speaker 1: a three inch knife a lethal weapon? And I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, judging by the fact that Austin Metcleft is deceased,
Speaker 1: I would say yes, just based on the evidence alone.
Speaker 1: But the underlying theme there is, well that is like
Speaker 1: we're witnessing a radically different understanding of how the law
Speaker 1: works and what is reasonable. You can see this in
Speaker 1: jury decision, which is that, you know, white Americans tend
Speaker 1: to treat other groups fairly. They tend to have a
Speaker 1: pretty narrow band on guilty versus innocent. The same fairness
Speaker 1: is not returned by particularly black Americans. They view themselves
Speaker 1: as you know, a minority group and act accordingly, Well,
Speaker 1: he's one of ours, so I won't commit again. You
Speaker 1: mentioned that with the fact that there was even discussion
Speaker 1: of this in mainstream media, you know, with the jury selection.
Speaker 1: But you're watching exactly that core problem, which is that institution,
Speaker 1: jury trial, that social technology. Even a culture that has
Speaker 1: been here for good or for ill for four hundred years,
Speaker 1: you know, is about as close to not literally but
Speaker 1: has been in proximity to quote unquote American culture for
Speaker 1: the longest time. It doesn't work at all. And okay,
Speaker 1: if that didn't work with four hundred years to try
Speaker 1: and understand one another, well, how does that break down
Speaker 1: with you know, one Carlo Garcia who got here fifteen
Speaker 1: minutes ago.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and this is the problem to thinking that you know,
Speaker 4: you have America consists of its magic dirt theory where
Speaker 4: you come here and you're an American, right, you know
Speaker 4: whatever that means. And you know, there's there's the idea
Speaker 4: that again, that you can flood the country intentionally, mind
Speaker 4: you with you know, twenty thirty forty million people from
Speaker 4: countries whose cultures are far different than American and Western
Speaker 4: culture and have it and then give them a vote,
Speaker 4: put them access to benefits subsidized housing which the native
Speaker 4: population has to subsidize, and and then think it's not
Speaker 4: going to have a qualitative effect on nations politics and
Speaker 4: its economy. You know, it's again it's it's obviously it's
Speaker 4: a hostile uh measure or you know, action on the part,
Speaker 4: and it's being done and intentionally to bring back the
Speaker 4: very thing that we're saying, you know, to create uh
Speaker 4: uh you know, a a hollow state and to create
Speaker 4: a shattered, adamized people uh uh, diverse uh you know,
Speaker 4: a series of favalas. If you will, it can be uh,
Speaker 4: you can be ruled over. And that's what California has become,
Speaker 4: meaning that it's so shattered it isn't say there aren't
Speaker 4: tens of millions of people probably in California who see
Speaker 4: the problem for what it is, but they don't have
Speaker 4: any political agency or representation anymore. And that leads leaves
Speaker 4: the elite in a position where they can continue to
Speaker 4: plunder the country. A good example the plunder in California
Speaker 4: is just it's astronomicals beyond comprehension. The billions that have disappeared,
Speaker 4: whether it's the you know, the high speed rail, even
Speaker 4: the billions have gone missing supposedly there. Uh they've spent
Speaker 4: billions for homeless. You know, that hasn't seen to improve
Speaker 4: the situation. It's just being stolen.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 4: Rot insote an article a couple of years ago and
Speaker 4: he was talking about the h the Jewish mafia in California,
Speaker 4: how they took over California and it kind of went unreported.
Speaker 4: I think Gus Russo wrote a book called Super Mob
Speaker 4: wrote a lot about it about into who's with the
Speaker 4: Chicago outfit, how a lot of these Jews were out
Speaker 4: run from Chicago to California, which was ripe to be
Speaker 4: taken over it, you know, in the middle twentieth century.
Speaker 4: And he's talked about how some of the There was
Speaker 4: a judge Basilon was his name, Bazilon.
Speaker 3: I think his Baseilin was his name. He was a
Speaker 3: Jew that that Truman appointed to the h I think
Speaker 3: the Court of Appeals to avert a A I. R.
Speaker 3: S investigation or something.
Speaker 4: But he oversaw the the UH sale of UH seized
Speaker 4: assets from the Japanese UH that were you know, they
Speaker 4: had the cellar assets and they were putting internman camps
Speaker 4: during the war, and a lot of his assets were
Speaker 4: given to to to a lot of uh well connected
Speaker 4: Jewish families. I think the Hyatt family and also the
Speaker 4: you know what's the family out of Chicago, you know,
Speaker 4: the governor of Illinois, Uh Pritzker. We're benefair sharies of that.
Speaker 4: But he was also he became a judge, became a
Speaker 4: very liberal judge. But civil liberties and ron ols theorized
Speaker 4: that this was wasn't made not have been just about
Speaker 4: guilt getting at him for his you know, criminal activity
Speaker 4: is plunder and the way he heeded the Japanese it
Speaker 4: might have been as a strategy to some of the
Speaker 4: liberal rulings of the sixties that led to sort of
Speaker 4: California deteriorating, was to promote things like street crime and disorder,
Speaker 4: so the public's attention would be would be focused on
Speaker 4: that and not the high level.
Speaker 3: Plunder that was going on. So it's sort of a
Speaker 3: governing strategy.
Speaker 1: Well, I mean then that's clearly one that they love
Speaker 1: to use, right because as this wonderful benefit of motivating
Speaker 1: people to support an increase to state power. And look,
Speaker 1: that may sound like a libertarian talking point, that's not
Speaker 1: exactly how I mean it at all. But you know,
Speaker 1: Sam Francis is in ourco tyranny essays just eternally vindicated, right,
Speaker 1: that crime is really not a problem for them to
Speaker 1: a certain point. You know, it is beneficial in multiple ways. One,
Speaker 1: it opens you know, kind of a number of different
Speaker 1: avenues for patronage, one, policemen and support staff. Okay, there's
Speaker 1: a lot of money flowing around there, which you can,
Speaker 1: you know clearly, as we've seen, use for your own benefit,
Speaker 1: either directly or indirectly. But also it gives you a
Speaker 1: sort of endless political machine. You know, the cops beat
Speaker 1: a hood rat. Awesome, that's political energy. The you know,
Speaker 1: the community gets activated, they decide we want major police reform.
Speaker 1: Oh great, awesome, we can take that that. The people
Speaker 1: getting robbed, you know, the people getting beaten are for
Speaker 1: the most part either so deeply in the coalition. It
Speaker 1: doesn't matter, right, you know again, is oh Block going
Speaker 1: to go for Trump?
Speaker 3: Really?
Speaker 1: You know, apparently no matter how violent it gets or
Speaker 1: their enemies, in which case, great, you saved us the trouble. Again,
Speaker 1: you saw this all through the you know, the the
Speaker 1: George Floyd ryots right, the kind of most recent round
Speaker 1: where again for them, you know, for the machine a
Speaker 1: small businessman being put out of business is no problem
Speaker 1: at all. If anything, it's an advantage to them. That's
Speaker 1: someone who is no longer fully you know, independent, And
Speaker 1: I get it. Maybe this sounds too tinfoil hat, but
Speaker 1: just look at the direction in which things have gone,
Speaker 1: Like who do they hate, Like who are on their
Speaker 1: their hit list of of you know, countries and dictators
Speaker 1: quote unquote, well naive Bukel, he's right up there. And
Speaker 1: in the grand scheme of things, like he's been relatively kind,
Speaker 1: you know, like we haven't seen you know, the streets
Speaker 1: lined with you know, would hanged corpses, which you know,
Speaker 1: maybe I would support, but you could at least understand
Speaker 1: why someone would you know, feel a little gross about that.
Speaker 1: But even you know, the relative liberal solution of just
Speaker 1: imprisoning all the murders and murderers in the country has
Speaker 1: turned him, you know, in Western media at least, into
Speaker 1: a pariah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, just like the simple crackdown on illegal immigration and
Speaker 4: all these white liberals come out and start protesting on
Speaker 4: their behalf the government New Jersey's doing that, protesting an
Speaker 4: ice facility, And it's the fetish they have towards supporting
Speaker 4: illegal immigrants, and they're not just their presence but their
Speaker 4: access to benefits and these things. It's a weird this
Speaker 4: assumption that some of the whole world as a constitutional
Speaker 4: right to enter coming to America and access its benefits,
Speaker 4: you know, and that's been sort of presumption now because
Speaker 4: it becomes almost like a it's a virtue signaling.
Speaker 3: You know. It's kind of like that you see.
Speaker 4: Signs that in our house everyone who's welcome, you know,
Speaker 4: there's no one's illegal.
Speaker 3: And I'm like, what would you lock your doors? It's like,
Speaker 3: can I walk in and steal your stuff? Right? And
Speaker 3: I'm not illegal? Right? You know, of course they don't
Speaker 3: really believe it. It's good example.
Speaker 4: I was highlighted that's political stunt that the governor of
Speaker 4: Texted and the governor of Florida did a few years
Speaker 4: ago when they they started shipping you know, migrants to
Speaker 4: uh tony liberal areas, you know, Martha's Vineyard.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 4: They tolerated them for two days, I think all two
Speaker 4: days National guards shipped them out, send them off to
Speaker 4: the mainland summer.
Speaker 3: But you know, uh, it's uh yeah, it's.
Speaker 1: It is.
Speaker 4: It's it's idea you make life miserable and uh, it's
Speaker 4: in ourco tyranny. And you do that obviously, a like
Speaker 4: a community of like minded pumbogeneous community with businesses and
Speaker 4: independent means of support income. That's a constituency or a
Speaker 4: power block you have to compete with and appeal to.
Speaker 4: And they're not going to be They're not going to
Speaker 4: be as manageable as say, you know, just a block,
Speaker 4: you know, like a you know, an urban mob or
Speaker 4: ump and proletariat that can be it's easily excitable and
Speaker 4: you know, low agency. And that's that's that's what modern
Speaker 4: urban politics is now. You know, it was always corrupt,
Speaker 4: but it was already if you go back one hundred
Speaker 4: years ago or even even sixty years ago to the
Speaker 4: daily machine in Chicago, it was corrupt, but it worked.
Speaker 4: You know, there was a level of competency had to
Speaker 4: be maintained because the expectations of the public were higher.
Speaker 4: That's one thing they don't like with heritage Americans or
Speaker 4: white Americans is white Americans have a higher expectation from
Speaker 4: their government.
Speaker 3: I think it's naive.
Speaker 4: You know, obviously there's a lot a lot of naivete there,
Speaker 4: but they expect a lot more. And so that's why
Speaker 4: One of the reasons is why you see this sort
Speaker 4: of attempt to replace them, because they don't want to
Speaker 4: deal with a independent, broadly prosperous middle class that has
Speaker 4: high expectations of their you know, of the political class,
Speaker 4: because the political class really is what the oligarchs want,
Speaker 4: is the political class just to serve them, you know,
Speaker 4: and a broadly prosperous middle class they can have to
Speaker 4: kind of compete with at the very least to share
Speaker 4: the wealth a little bit, distribute the wealth a little more.
Speaker 4: And they I think they decided they don't want to
Speaker 4: do that, you know, and that creates political instability, which
Speaker 4: they think they can I think they can navigate or
Speaker 4: exploit to their benefit.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 3: It's very cynical, of course, but well the.
Speaker 1: Additionally on that point, the the the essay by Spandrel
Speaker 1: from fifteen years ago by a Leninism, yeah, describes exactly
Speaker 1: this point that for the system as it exists, it
Speaker 1: doesn't actually want particularly competent, capable people. It wants clients,
Speaker 1: you know, it wants people who owe everything to the system.
Speaker 1: And you know, if you were the kind of guy
Speaker 1: that all right, you know, maybe I'm working in government,
Speaker 1: but you know, if that position dries up, I can
Speaker 1: probably make more money in the private sector, you know,
Speaker 1: or I could start something on my own. We'll never
Speaker 1: be as loyal as the guy who realizes if this
Speaker 1: gig goes away, I go back to being a peasant.
Speaker 1: The reason, of course he uses the term Bioleninism is
Speaker 1: that Lenin figured this out and he took guys out
Speaker 1: of prisons. He took your kind of sexual debiance, people
Speaker 1: who are very low status and raised them up because
Speaker 1: they know, like, if this revolution fails, I go right
Speaker 1: back to the bottom at best. And look, I don't
Speaker 1: think this is some kind of official top down policy,
Speaker 1: you know. I don't think this is some kind of
Speaker 1: you know, like smoky boardroom plan. I think it's just
Speaker 1: kind of the physics of governments that and Spander will
Speaker 1: use the example of, you know, the troons and Somalis.
Speaker 1: You know, groups that, by objective standards, do not tend
Speaker 1: to perform well in uh should we say, high pressure,
Speaker 1: high status settings on average, of course, but they're promoted endlessly.
Speaker 1: And the question is why, Well, the answer is loyalty, right,
Speaker 1: They are loyal at least to you know, the hand
Speaker 1: that feeds them. In a certain perspective, and you know,
Speaker 1: the big expose of the kind of you know, welfare
Speaker 1: scheme in you know, obviously you know, California, Wisconsin, a
Speaker 1: few other places. The question from a lot of conservatives is, well,
Speaker 1: why don't they understand they must be getting some kickbacks?
Speaker 1: And sure they probably are, you know, at least to
Speaker 1: some percentage, but you don't think the other part of
Speaker 1: it is that they're stacking the deck. You know, they're
Speaker 1: putting their loyalists in place. Like you mentioned the you know,
Speaker 1: the the kind of daily daily system in Chicago, even
Speaker 1: the you know, the tweet stuff in New York.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 1: These machines, again, they're kind of what humans default to.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: There's a certain amount of corruption that we just seem
Speaker 1: to create in any system. But the problem is when
Speaker 1: that becomes too much for the system to bear. And
Speaker 1: I think that you just kind of tie this up.
Speaker 1: Then naivete of our elite is that they can manage
Speaker 1: that catabolic collapse, that they can halt it when they want.
Speaker 1: You know, the weapons that they have used, you know,
Speaker 1: will will not harm them. And I think that that's
Speaker 1: the sort of grim irony of the situation we're in
Speaker 1: and look like you could even look at the situation
Speaker 1: with you know, Israel in the US, you know, turning
Speaker 1: the US into this this sort of monster, you know,
Speaker 1: putting a puppet on the seat of power has in
Speaker 1: a weird way, screwed them worse than almost anything. You
Speaker 1: know that not today, not tomorrow, per se. But if
Speaker 1: you an item had sat down and designed a program
Speaker 1: on how to completely and totally alienate the American populace
Speaker 1: from you know, Israel, could we have done it any better?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 1: It's sort of some kind of black irony in all
Speaker 1: of this.
Speaker 4: Yeah, they totally the great revelation of the Jewish lobby
Speaker 4: and its power. Where they always did better when they
Speaker 4: were working behind the scenes and practicing dynamic silence and
Speaker 4: openly coming out and calling for censorship, the crackdown the universities.
Speaker 4: Characters like Bill Ackman, these insufferable billionaires. You know, if
Speaker 4: you do cast those spot on how they made their money,
Speaker 4: it's always some vice or some scheme.
Speaker 3: They never really add value.
Speaker 4: To anything, you know, a casino as a casino added value, right,
Speaker 4: you know, Or it's some sort of you know, pumping
Speaker 4: up stock scheme or something that they did, or like
Speaker 4: Jeffrey Epstein in in the Like when he was in
Speaker 4: his interview with Steve Bannon says, this is how the
Speaker 4: Jews make money, this is how the going.
Speaker 3: They have to work for it, more or less what
Speaker 3: he was saying.
Speaker 4: So it's so this exposure not just the obvious, uh,
Speaker 4: you know, the disproportionate and in order to influence that
Speaker 4: the Jewish lobby has over our government, you know, over
Speaker 4: our Congress, the White House, and just what the war exposed,
Speaker 4: the slaughter and gaza.
Speaker 3: They couldn't do. Really, you're right, You're right.
Speaker 4: You couldn't design a better way to expose you know, uh,
Speaker 4: just the criminal nature of the Jewish lobby. And it's
Speaker 4: and it's sort of it's the grip, you know that
Speaker 4: it's that the Jewish octopus has over over the country,
Speaker 4: over the West, and it's it's this voracious you know, uh,
Speaker 4: like the vampire squid, you know, and there's no way
Speaker 4: to and you know, I guess the old people aren't
Speaker 4: admitting it.
Speaker 3: Are the people who, guess who still want to.
Speaker 4: I think they can get some sort of favor from them,
Speaker 4: or don't think it's polite, but anyone who's keen to
Speaker 4: the scene, if you will, would have to admit it,
Speaker 4: and it's it's been fully exposed, and you know, so
Speaker 4: they've totally blown their cover and they have no moral
Speaker 4: credibility anymore. And so if they lose soft power, they
Speaker 4: have to revert to hard power, and that's something they'd
Speaker 4: never been good at because there's such a small minority.
Speaker 4: So they have to rely on I guess, financial leverage
Speaker 4: or manipulation. They buy up media, legacy media, like Larry
Speaker 4: Ellison buying up you know, CBS and installing Barry Weiss,
Speaker 4: you know, no credibility there anywhere CBS News if they
Speaker 4: there wasn't any any remaining there, or you know, the
Speaker 4: forced sale of TikTok, right, which is such an obvious
Speaker 4: maneuver because that's where Israel's being criticized. Let's buy TikTok,
Speaker 4: you know, and say it's because of the Chinese, you know,
Speaker 4: but it's obvious at this point. And now it's you know,
Speaker 4: you know. And now apparently with this piece deal that
Speaker 4: there appears to be some daylight between Washington and Tel Aviv,
Speaker 4: and we'll see if that holds. See what the what
Speaker 4: the Jews try to do now because they're the you know,
Speaker 4: this is the uh. They haven't confessed this much since
Speaker 4: the end, since the resurrection, so we'll see.
Speaker 1: I like that turn of phrase. I think I'm gonna
Speaker 1: steal it the uh. Yeah, And that's that's I guess.
Speaker 1: One of the the interesting trends lines right is is
Speaker 1: can their capacity for control in the short run outrun
Speaker 1: entropy because you know, you look at the the kind
Speaker 1: of alarmism around you know, flock cameras and the kind
Speaker 1: of AI control tools that you know, companies like Palanteer
Speaker 1: are bringing over the market, let alone what we've seen
Speaker 1: you know, in the Europe and in Europe and the UK.
Speaker 1: And there's certainly some kind of chapter of you know,
Speaker 1: people who basically look at as you know, it's all over,
Speaker 1: it will be this kind of global you know, school
Speaker 1: teacher panopticon managing what you're allowed to deal with.
Speaker 4: The holl of state reserts, resorts to tyrannical measures because
Speaker 4: it has no credibility or legitimacy, uh with the public,
Speaker 4: so asked the resort to police state tax. That's why
Speaker 4: the UK is becoming airstrip one right so well.
Speaker 1: And you know, much like the Greater Israel Project, I'm
Speaker 1: quite convinced that there are people who want that to happen,
Speaker 1: who would like for that to be the case. But
Speaker 1: someone wanting it and having the ability to do it,
Speaker 1: I mean, those are two different buckets there, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think like I can want that.
Speaker 4: America lacks the military might do it, the political will
Speaker 4: to do it, and Israel certainly lacks the resources do it.
Speaker 4: They rely on American muscle to do this, and America
Speaker 4: is shown that it cannot do it. So now what's
Speaker 4: their next move?
Speaker 1: And apparently, at least as far as I can tell,
Speaker 1: I don't know if they have a clear idea. You know,
Speaker 1: there are certain times and maybe this is again just
Speaker 1: a historical anomaly where it feels like you can tell
Speaker 1: the direction the wind is blowing, and maybe not on
Speaker 1: a cultural level, but the direction the elites are pulling.
Speaker 1: And this was very very clear, you know, during the
Speaker 1: kind of pandemic years and then the inn to Biden.
Speaker 1: You know, there were these phrases kind of echoing everywhere.
Speaker 1: You know, of course, you know, build back Better as
Speaker 1: an infamous one, but you know many others that sort
Speaker 1: of signaled the direction in which the good people are
Speaker 1: going and obviously there's the kind of normal stuff around,
Speaker 1: you know, President Trump, who I get the feeling Tim
Speaker 1: you and I are not exactly staunch supporters of. But
Speaker 1: other than that, I can't really tell what the direction is.
Speaker 1: The signaling seems very very muddled. And the kind of
Speaker 1: old stalwarts, right, the things you could always count on
Speaker 1: as sort of a you know, a I guess you
Speaker 1: would call it like a narrative slumpbuster. Well those have
Speaker 1: been gone for a long time, Like when was the
Speaker 1: last time you heard about climate change? That one was
Speaker 1: kind of dropped off the face of the map. And
Speaker 1: maybe I'm just gun shy, you know, maybe I'm just
Speaker 1: overly pessimistic, which I'm willing to take as a criticism,
Speaker 1: but I sort of have this feeling of like, you know,
Speaker 1: what's the narrative, Like, what's the thing coming down the pike?
Speaker 1: Because I think we've seen a sort of half hearted
Speaker 1: attempt to make that Aliens in UFOs, but that didn't
Speaker 1: really go anywhere. No one seemed to care.
Speaker 3: No, there's that movie that's that right, Yeah, yeah, by.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it's.
Speaker 4: Gonna what undermine Christianity or something. So he said his movie,
Speaker 4: I mean his movies has been doing that for fifty years.
Speaker 1: That's what I was gonna say. It would be the
Speaker 1: first time, wouldn't be the first time.
Speaker 4: I mean, but at my point is he's saying this,
Speaker 4: he said apparently, well it would also undermine Chris.
Speaker 3: You know, really religion anymore. It's it's a it's a
Speaker 3: it's an identity.
Speaker 4: It's not really so, I guess, but it's kind of
Speaker 4: like he said, it would undermine it do the worst.
Speaker 4: The biggest start to Christianity was something to the effect that,
Speaker 4: you know, the biggest challenge of Christianity ever something Africa
Speaker 4: with these that quote, it's like, why it's a movie,
Speaker 4: I mean as opposed to like the subset of that
Speaker 4: part of it is, well, we'll look at that a
Speaker 4: the UFOs I mean's god the Christ doesn't exist or
Speaker 4: it didn't exist or doesn't exist what he means by that.
Speaker 3: But my joke is disclosure.
Speaker 4: When it was coming out and I said, oh, look
Speaker 4: to this, it's a challenge to religion is so that
Speaker 4: means Israel and all that clean to right issual isn't
Speaker 4: doesn't exist.
Speaker 3: Then so we can forget all about that.
Speaker 1: Well, look, we understand how this works right one way.
Speaker 1: It sure is interesting that but I mean that that's
Speaker 1: another interesting element of this is that the central.
Speaker 3: Yeah, uphology or you aliens, all, that's all.
Speaker 1: That's that's like CIA, right, but I mean like say
Speaker 1: what you will about the Dolf of Gulf of Tonkin. Wow, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a professional podcaster. I can't speak. But you know, uh,
Speaker 1: it worked. You know, they got their war. The majority
Speaker 1: of people who went there actually signed up to do it.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: Okay, they kind of had a gun to their head,
Speaker 1: I guess, but you know, it produced the desired result,
Speaker 1: where with this it's like, well what is it produced?
Speaker 3: The movies?
Speaker 1: Okay, it's only been out for a week, but it
Speaker 1: doesn't seem to be doing particularly well at least a
Speaker 1: week in. You know, it's it's made its budget back.
Speaker 1: We understand that that means it lost money when you
Speaker 1: you know, account for other things.
Speaker 4: From in a sense not well executed. I didn't I
Speaker 4: don't tend to see it. But people say it's just
Speaker 4: not a good movie, which.
Speaker 1: Right, it's like not even the kind of bad where
Speaker 1: it's fun, you know, the kind of bad at least
Speaker 1: from what I've heard, where it's like you can sort
Speaker 1: of chuckle.
Speaker 3: Take me where there's a lot of stark. It's propaganda,
Speaker 3: but it was fun propaganda. Oh yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1: I don't like the movie.
Speaker 3: By the way, Yeah, the Nazis did not not control
Speaker 3: Egypt of nineteen thirty six. Where's the Lost start?
Speaker 1: You know, I'm gonna go ahead out and go out
Speaker 1: on a limb to him and say, that might not
Speaker 1: be the biggest factual departure in that movie, but that
Speaker 1: is a very relevant one.
Speaker 4: Well, yeah, yeah, but it's very entertaining. You gotta give
Speaker 4: it is actually very entertaining. A great movie, you know,
Speaker 4: And I don't really anything see anything particularly serversive in.
Speaker 3: Jaws, you know.
Speaker 1: Oh, well, don't you know the shark's last name Bruce.
Speaker 3: And the name is Bruce. You're supposed to be Jewish?
Speaker 3: Oh okay.
Speaker 4: And the Christopher's girl that dies is miss Watkins, who's
Speaker 4: caflic because she's just as she's being Debora, she's calling
Speaker 4: out Catholic prayers as she's dying.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so.
Speaker 1: It turns out you could make fascinating conversations about movies
Speaker 1: when you make up all the details.
Speaker 3: Uh, Price Leeperwitz, that's right. Well, plus he.
Speaker 1: Already had the operation, but the uh anyway, the departure
Speaker 1: from Shark Biology.
Speaker 3: But how many alien movies has people have made? I
Speaker 3: was like, obviously it's close Accounts of Three Counts is first? Right?
Speaker 3: Et right? Et? I guess you could say War the Worlds. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 3: and this am I right at it. Yes, I mean
Speaker 3: one of the one of the sequels to as well
Speaker 3: start involved aliens.
Speaker 1: Right, I'm pretty sure Crystal whatever that last one that
Speaker 1: not so, Yes, he did the Crystal skull, Chrystal Scull.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so there's that.
Speaker 4: And you know, so I remember seeing it close downs
Speaker 4: the third time when it first came out in the theater, uh,
Speaker 4: late seven.
Speaker 3: I'm that old. I remember when to go see the theater. Uh.
Speaker 4: That movie was very well executed, and it has scenes
Speaker 4: that they were very good. He got to give see
Speaker 4: his due. He know he was or is or was
Speaker 4: at least a very talented director. But there's every see
Speaker 4: the scene where the uh in the clost counslerd Kim went,
Speaker 4: they're doing the air traffic control. So yeah, very good,
Speaker 4: it's riveting. It's a very simple scene. He just draws
Speaker 4: you in and but yeah, of the movie. He was
Speaker 4: a Richard Dreyfus. You know, uh, Richard Dreyfus. Dreyfus, the
Speaker 4: fairies actually related to that guy.
Speaker 3: He leaves his family to go off with the alliens.
Speaker 3: Remember I was that guy was ten years old and
Speaker 3: I came out and watching them, like, that's awful. He's
Speaker 3: got a family, which.
Speaker 1: By the way, I realized I'm like the probably millionth
Speaker 1: person to make this point. But the fact that this
Speaker 1: man uh directed and produced both Jurassic Park and Schindler's
Speaker 1: List in the same year is one, you know, full credit, Uh,
Speaker 1: I have to give him credit for a work ethic.
Speaker 1: And two that's gotta be some tonal whiplash, you know,
Speaker 1: walking from.
Speaker 4: One Jones Michael Jones said that shielsis he got everyone
Speaker 4: to believe in the Holocaust. Now he's hoping this we
Speaker 4: got everyone to believe in all.
Speaker 1: Right, that's a good line. I'll give him credit, and.
Speaker 4: He tweeted that it was very funny, as you know.
Speaker 4: But this questioned Schiller's List is when he reveals that
Speaker 4: the showers are all actually showers. I remember watching the
Speaker 4: theater thinking, I know the narrative here, I know what
Speaker 4: to expecting. Wait, there's showers.
Speaker 1: It's also the genesis of UH. I probably the funniest
Speaker 1: joke in Seinfeld history, which is Jerry Seinfeld making out
Speaker 1: with his girlfriend.
Speaker 3: During you made out during.
Speaker 1: It's like, okay, that's a that's a good joke.
Speaker 4: It's the showers and of course it's the shower scene, Chris,
Speaker 4: the shower scene. They're killing a bunch of women, so
Speaker 4: you're throw in a bunch of naked women. So you're
Speaker 4: watching that, of course on the on the large screen, right,
Speaker 4: that's gonna get your attention. But you know, there's there
Speaker 4: was Howard Stern years later when SISIs was broadcasting ABC uninterrupted,
Speaker 4: remember a network premiere event you have to watch just
Speaker 4: back when the network television still existed, right, I mean
Speaker 4: people still watched it, and uh they showed an uninterrupted
Speaker 4: uncut And of course there are sex scenes in that movie.
Speaker 4: Of course, there's a shower scene, a lot of nudity
Speaker 4: and all that sort of stuff in the in there
Speaker 4: in it, and it's not just contexture. It's like sexual
Speaker 4: that sort of thing in the movie, you know. And
Speaker 4: Horod Starman was complaining because Harrod Sttern had had his
Speaker 4: you know, is true with the UH with the FCC
Speaker 4: with obscenity, and he was all he was complaining. He
Speaker 4: was covetching You go, jeez man, letting him show that
Speaker 4: on television. This is just for saying things. Is you
Speaker 4: want to show new to the on television, just kill
Speaker 4: a bunch of Jews.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: The uh, the reason I guess that I wanted to
Speaker 1: to bring up the whole aliens thing is not that
Speaker 1: I particularly care, but just that it seems like everyone
Speaker 1: doesn't care. You know. It's this kind of like weird,
Speaker 1: half hearted attempt at you know, uh, injecting relevance again.
Speaker 1: And obviously people are more political than ever, but it's
Speaker 1: just that everything is so divided. There's no real sort
Speaker 1: of overwhelming narrative about anything like And I was even thinking,
Speaker 1: I was this is sort of those naive thoughts I
Speaker 1: remember as a teenager, thinking, you know what we need,
Speaker 1: We need some big, scary external threat to just unify
Speaker 1: this country, you know, another nine to eleven if you will.
Speaker 3: And Independence Day was right the movie exactly.
Speaker 1: Yea, yeah, you could at least, you know, as a teenager,
Speaker 1: it seemed logical enough.
Speaker 3: In movie, by the way, awful movie.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it didn't age well. The one that came out
Speaker 1: in the twenty tens was No Better. That was kind
Speaker 1: of one of the first China movies I ever saw.
Speaker 1: Were like, wait a minute, why why are there a
Speaker 1: bunch of Chinese actors featuring prominently? And the plot is
Speaker 1: basically about how the Chinese government saves everyone. And you're like, all, right,
Speaker 1: rolling emeric. I get at times they're tough, but you know,
Speaker 1: do you really have to go to je'son paning to
Speaker 1: fund this? And the answered apparently yes, but right, whether
Speaker 1: it was simply you know, the proliferation of the Internet
Speaker 1: or the further disintegration of American culture.
Speaker 3: Black and a Jew that saved the world, so well, you.
Speaker 1: Know, it is my favorite documentary, so I guess we
Speaker 1: have to make all, uh make a conclusion off of that.
Speaker 1: But the uh but in all seriousness, right, like I
Speaker 1: don't I was, you know, alive for not alive, and
Speaker 1: I don't have memories of it, but from friends and
Speaker 1: family they speak about this at least feeling of you know,
Speaker 1: national unity for a few weeks, and at least in
Speaker 1: the you know, the twenty odd years that separated that
Speaker 1: in you know, the pandemic, it seems like that ability
Speaker 1: to manufacture some kind of good feeling, and consensus just
Speaker 1: went completely out the window. In each case there was
Speaker 1: this kind of external threat. And that shows you, right,
Speaker 1: at least, I feel like that's one good explanation the
Speaker 1: downsides to a completely totally splintered culture that even when
Speaker 1: you have that rally behind the flag moment, well, people
Speaker 1: are so different. They have such different ideas, such different
Speaker 1: understandings of concepts like you know, fairness and justice, you
Speaker 1: know what's appropriate action, that even in that sort of
Speaker 1: stress test, you can't make it work.
Speaker 3: No, No, Chris, I am old enough to remember nine eleven,
Speaker 3: I was now an adult.
Speaker 4: And one thing, they actually got people buying duct tape
Speaker 4: to seal their houses from a chemical attack.
Speaker 3: There's a round on duct tape. They didn't work. Well,
Speaker 3: no one died from a chemical attack, so it did work, right.
Speaker 1: So I think it worked one hundred percent. Where it's
Speaker 1: like Homer Simpson's, uh, you know tiger repellent or whatever.
Speaker 3: Exactly, yeah, exactly, tigers, See it works.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 3: They used to have to remember the color. You probably
Speaker 3: don't remember the color. You might remember the the colored
Speaker 3: alerts on Fox News.
Speaker 1: Uh, is this like the terrorism DHS. Yes, I remember
Speaker 1: that as airports.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we hear, we hear chatter, there's chatter, and uh
Speaker 4: they would issue yellow red.
Speaker 3: Based on vague chatter.
Speaker 1: Like it's smoky the bear warning you about a wildfire.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yep.
Speaker 4: And the NYPD admitted that they would often just set
Speaker 4: off sirens and go buzzing down.
Speaker 3: The streets just to freak people out. They remember the soldiers,
Speaker 3: troops armed with like a machine guns on street corners.
Speaker 3: You know that, you're just there. What's that going to do? Right?
Speaker 3: So it's just it's all about, yeah, creating a climate
Speaker 3: of fear.
Speaker 4: Of course, that not to get into the whole the
Speaker 4: true nature of those of those date of that day's event, right,
Speaker 4: the you know, the attacks and who is behind them
Speaker 4: and what really happened. But yeah, it maybe maybe exultso
Speaker 4: because that air, that feeling of unity was exploited to
Speaker 4: start another war, right a couple of years later in
Speaker 4: March of two thousand and three, And.
Speaker 3: It was cynically exploited.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, well, and that's the thing. Maybe this is
Speaker 1: me being both too naive than too cynical at once.
Speaker 1: But I would like to believe the people in charge
Speaker 1: are competent enough to engineer a situation like that. And
Speaker 1: you know, maybe it's just the culture won't bear it,
Speaker 1: or maybe they're just too dumb. I'd be willing to
Speaker 1: hear either case.
Speaker 4: Well again, it's uh, I think what we're saying is
Speaker 4: it's kind of decadence an entropy. Right, It's what we
Speaker 4: see is progress is like decadence an entropy. And so yeah,
Speaker 4: after a while, if you look at look at our diplomats,
Speaker 4: look at our look at our ambassador Israel, Mike Kabee.
Speaker 4: He recently said that his job is there to defend Israel.
Speaker 1: Well Tim even worse than that, he did, you know,
Speaker 1: his special cover of Sweet Home, Alabama in Sweet Homierushel,
Speaker 1: which you know, I think if we can send someone
Speaker 1: to the Hague for being embarrassing, he might be a
Speaker 1: good first candidate really for his own benefit, if not others.
Speaker 1: It's it's like the violence you do to yourself?
Speaker 3: Is that what they also the sectuary state.
Speaker 4: I'm I don't Lincoln Blincoln, no blinking Blincoln did a
Speaker 4: summer I thing because Lincoln likes to play the guitar.
Speaker 1: Was the two of them? Yeah, I know it was Huckabee.
Speaker 3: Yeah, another one.
Speaker 1: I can't remember what the song you covered was, but
Speaker 1: he decided that that wasn't enough. He needed to come
Speaker 1: back for more.
Speaker 3: Was it Freebird or something?
Speaker 1: And well, Tim, this has been a ton of fun.
Speaker 1: I appreciate you coming on and just kind of shooting
Speaker 1: the breeze with me. I always enjoy it.
Speaker 3: So what was the talk? Dude?
Speaker 1: Do you think I know all? I want to talk
Speaker 1: about narrative aliens? I don't know. We talked about circumcised
Speaker 1: sharks halfway through this, Uh, I mean.
Speaker 4: He's he really was a twenty seven foot shark, got
Speaker 4: twenty twenty foot or twenty five three tons of them.
Speaker 3: I'm not counting the circumcision.
Speaker 1: Where can people fly to your work? Can they fly
Speaker 1: your work?
Speaker 3: Oh? It's my podcast. I've been doing it for is
Speaker 3: it twelve years? Twelve years? Wow?
Speaker 4: It's our interesting times. It's on potomatic. You can find
Speaker 4: it on YouTube. It's also on substack. There you can
Speaker 4: actually support it kicking a few bucks. And of course
Speaker 4: I also do a weekly show. It's a conversation that
Speaker 4: evered Joe outwell. So people always comment, you know, stop
Speaker 4: interrupting your guest.
Speaker 3: It's not my guest. It's it's a show. We talked,
Speaker 3: we talk back and forth.
Speaker 1: Is a piece of podcasting technique I never quite figured
Speaker 1: out the problem is. It's like, look like an interview
Speaker 1: is kind of boring. It's like, you you want to
Speaker 1: actually have a conversation, and uh, I'm just this rude
Speaker 1: in person.
Speaker 3: Tim.
Speaker 1: It's not merely an effect I put onto the internet.
Speaker 4: So yeah, it's it's. Uh, people always have their own ideas.
Speaker 4: You know, they constantly will putting mean comments, constans.
Speaker 3: Like why do you listen to me? Then?
Speaker 1: Exactly? You know, when you know it's free. If I
Speaker 1: hated it this much, I'd just turn it off. Uh,
Speaker 1: which is, you know, probably not the best podcasting advice,
Speaker 1: tell your audience to leave, but uh, you know it's
Speaker 1: it's the business strategy I've gone with again, Tim, this
Speaker 1: was a ton of fun. To everyone at home, keep
Speaker 1: your head up. I can't last Trapper.
Speaker 3: Good night. That's that's that's the
Speaker 2: Gay Lagari Program.