Speaker 1: Welcome to ouch. Was that a ghost? This podcast may
Speaker 1: contain graphic material which some listeners may find disturbing. Listener
Speaker 1: discretion is advised, is advice?
Speaker 2: Yu me?
Speaker 1: Now that we covered that, here's your host list.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to Oach. Was that a ghost? I have
Speaker 2: with me an amazing co host today, Miss Daisy from
Speaker 2: the Film Joe podcast and also.
Speaker 3: From Adventures in eighty Cinema, Yes, Adventures in eighty Cinema
Speaker 3: dun Dune.
Speaker 2: It has been so long since I've seen you, Daisy.
Speaker 3: I missed you. I missed you too. Oh, I totally
Speaker 3: missed you. But I'm glad I'm back and we get
Speaker 3: to talk about some cool stuff today.
Speaker 2: I was like, of, what is a nickname for Daisy?
Speaker 2: Daisy is the nickname?
Speaker 3: People they call me different things. I've been called.
Speaker 2: Days, that's not a lot of effort.
Speaker 3: I've been called blazy, Okay, I like that that that's
Speaker 3: for a totally different reason. The most common is days.
Speaker 2: There's no really, yeah, I can't really think of anyone.
Speaker 3: Well, my brother calls me Beauford for while he was
Speaker 3: calling me Butch, and I wanted to kick hiss Aster
Speaker 3: for that.
Speaker 2: Brothers. That's so annoying.
Speaker 3: I think Beauford. I think that's the name of a monkey.
Speaker 3: Oh no, that was Clyde. That was another name that
Speaker 3: he called me was Clyde from the from this movie
Speaker 3: Clint Eastwood movie where he had an orangutang and his
Speaker 3: name is cly So he would call me Clyde. He
Speaker 3: calls me Beauford. And the thing is is that I'll
Speaker 3: be like all the way on the other side in
Speaker 3: a party full of people, and he'll yell out and
Speaker 3: I will turn around and I will.
Speaker 2: Respond feeding into it. You have to cut the cord.
Speaker 3: I know, I know, I know. Unfortunately I never did
Speaker 3: come up with the cooling nickname for my brother, you know, dumbass,
Speaker 3: I mean, you know that's kind of generic.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're gonna have to workshop something for Joe.
Speaker 3: We are, we are.
Speaker 2: That'll be the after show. We'll be workshopping there you go.
Speaker 3: So, what do you got for me today? What kind
Speaker 3: of stories he got for me today?
Speaker 2: Everyone knows well. Most people have heard of the Salem
Speaker 2: witch trials, right that started in sixteen ninety two, where
Speaker 2: nineteen people were sentenced to death. Fourteen women and five
Speaker 2: men were executed by hanging on Gallows Hill, and one
Speaker 2: man was pressed to death right because he didn't want
Speaker 2: to give his land away. That's not accounting for the
Speaker 2: people who died in jails while awaiting trial due to
Speaker 2: the horrendous conditions. This well known witch hunt was not
Speaker 2: the first of its kind. Today, we're going to talk
Speaker 2: about the Pendle witch trials.
Speaker 3: Trials, all right, all right, let's do this.
Speaker 2: They occurred over only two days most in I'm gonna
Speaker 2: say this wrong. I think it's lancash Lancashire, Lancashire. It's
Speaker 2: spelled like Lancaster. But I think it's Lancashire. I've heard
Speaker 2: people say even though it doesn't look like.
Speaker 3: It really, so it's spelled Lancaster. Yeah, I would go
Speaker 3: with Lancaster.
Speaker 2: Okay, we'll do Lancaster. Make all the UK people hate me.
Speaker 2: One of the trials was held in York. This was
Speaker 2: about eighty years prior to the sale In witch trial,
Speaker 2: and resulted in twenty people being accused, some were acquitted,
Speaker 2: one was found not guilty and sentenced to the pillory.
Speaker 2: You know what that is, right when you sit in
Speaker 2: town and you're like hanging, so everyone can walk by
Speaker 2: and be like haha, idiot.
Speaker 3: You know, kind like a shame kind of deal. They're
Speaker 3: shaming you, shame game with you.
Speaker 2: One died in prison while awaiting her trial, and ten
Speaker 2: were executed by hanging. These numbers were huge for the
Speaker 2: area because in England this accounted for two percent of
Speaker 2: those executed for witchcraft over two days.
Speaker 3: Chris, So, what, okay, because I know that that you know,
Speaker 3: these people they were you know, sentenced to death or
Speaker 3: you know, they were put through these trials for really
Speaker 3: really stupid things. Like what were some of the reasons
Speaker 3: that they would you know, they would do this.
Speaker 2: It's kind of like Salem. It's like anything you were
Speaker 2: a woman and like your cow didn't give milk, or
Speaker 2: like your neighbor's tomato plants didn't grow. It was basically
Speaker 2: things like that, like because people needed something to blame, right,
Speaker 2: So it's not science. It's either like good or evil
Speaker 2: or witches.
Speaker 3: Or just you know, just like a means to get
Speaker 3: back at somebody, Like somebody slept with somebody else's husband
Speaker 3: and she's like she's a witch. She put a spell
Speaker 3: on my husband.
Speaker 2: No other explanation.
Speaker 3: Were there children involved in these trials?
Speaker 2: There's a child witness.
Speaker 3: Oh, really oh great, mm hmm, totally credible.
Speaker 2: But that's what Salem had too, that's kind of what
Speaker 2: started it, and this was kind of the blueprint for Salem.
Speaker 3: Oh shit, okay.
Speaker 2: England in total has executed less than five hundred people
Speaker 2: in over three hundred years. But the only reason we
Speaker 2: know so much about these trials is because Thomas Potts
Speaker 2: recorded the trials in the Wonderful Discoveries of Witches in
Speaker 2: the County of I'm going to say Lancaster, but I
Speaker 2: don't think that's how I think it's Lancashire.
Speaker 3: But that's fine.
Speaker 2: Let's get into it. So there's a hill located in
Speaker 2: the east of Wlancashire, England, that dominates the landscape called
Speaker 2: Pendall Hill. Sheeps grays on its slope, Stonewall divides ancient fields,
Speaker 2: and quiet villages sit beneath its shadow. At first glance,
Speaker 2: Pendall Hill looks peaceful, but it's not.
Speaker 3: It's not.
Speaker 2: It became the setting for one of England's most infamous
Speaker 2: witch trials. It's not simply a story about witches. It's
Speaker 2: a story about poverty, family rivalries, religious tension, fear, and
Speaker 2: the terrifying consequences of what can happen when suspicion is
Speaker 2: accepted as evidence.
Speaker 3: That's tough.
Speaker 2: To understand what happened in Pendel, we need to travel
Speaker 2: back to the fifteenth century. There was a book published
Speaker 2: in fourteen eighty six in Germany titled the Malleus Maleficarium
Speaker 2: Melficarum Melificarium Melficarum, or with the Hammer of the Witches.
Speaker 3: There you go, that's right, we'll roll with that.
Speaker 2: It was written by clergyman Henricus Instittur.
Speaker 3: The heck U is up with these names? Good God?
Speaker 3: What's wrong with good old fashioned bob? You know, good
Speaker 3: Lord Henricus Hendericus.
Speaker 2: So the book explained which powers and gave instructions on
Speaker 2: how to hunt witches and if which was found. It
Speaker 2: explained how you had to torture and lie two said witches,
Speaker 2: and this would help obtain a confession during a trial.
Speaker 3: Oh my dear God, that is awful. I would have failed.
Speaker 3: I would have been burned at the stake.
Speaker 2: Me too, I'm not even really a witch, but I
Speaker 2: would be burnt anyways, because my familiar immediately Yeah.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's scary. That's really scary. I think
Speaker 3: those times would have been horrible to live in. I mean,
Speaker 3: you're afraid to talk to anybody. And at that if
Speaker 3: you don't talk to anybody they call you a witch,
Speaker 3: you're you're fucked out of the way. It's good guard.
Speaker 2: It did say that men could be witches too, but
Speaker 2: most were women because they're more susceptible, because women are
Speaker 2: weaker and they're promiscuous.
Speaker 3: Ah, bullshit, God damn it.
Speaker 2: Man, if you didn't know it was a man that
Speaker 2: wrote the book.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no shit, huh. Just just be honest, how many
Speaker 3: actual practicing witches did they actually get? You know, I'm
Speaker 3: pretty sure none of these people were practicing witches.
Speaker 2: Well, a witch back then could also just be a healer,
Speaker 2: like if you knew that AlOH is good for a sunburn,
Speaker 2: then huh yeah, practice in witchcraft, which is just you know,
Speaker 2: holistic medicine witchcraft.
Speaker 3: I would have kept that to myself, like you burned,
Speaker 3: good luck.
Speaker 2: But it was a way to make money and a
Speaker 2: lot of people were struggling.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2: So the book was basically a witch hunting book, and
Speaker 2: because some religious figures endorsed it, it became very popular.
Speaker 2: Many many many people read it, including King James the
Speaker 2: sixth of Scotland, who later was King James the First
Speaker 2: of England, which is kind of confusing, but he was
Speaker 2: ruled in Scotland then in England. That's why he has
Speaker 2: a different title. Okay, he studied, like studied this book,
Speaker 2: and King James himself went on to write his own
Speaker 2: book of how to Hunt Witches and not nineteen in
Speaker 2: fifteen ninety seven. The book was called Demonology, which encouraged
Speaker 2: belief in witches and explained why they should be hunted.
Speaker 2: This was the king, so authorities and people took this
Speaker 2: matter seriously. It's not like Joe Schmoe wrote this, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean?
Speaker 3: Like that was their king exactly.
Speaker 2: King James was terrified of witchcraft. In sixteen oh four,
Speaker 2: he passed the Witchcraft Act, which replaced the previous Act
Speaker 2: that Queen Elizabeth I had passed, making witchcraft a capital felony,
Speaker 2: punishable by death if the witchcraft performed was harmful to others.
Speaker 2: So at least it had the caveat you could practice,
Speaker 2: but it's only punishable by death if you're hurting somebody exactly.
Speaker 3: I mean did they really believe this though? I mean, yeah,
Speaker 3: they believed in witchcraft.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well he did. I don't know if everybody did,
Speaker 2: but he really really feared it.
Speaker 3: And of course, because you know, he was so reputable,
Speaker 3: did I say, right, yeah, you know they believed him.
Speaker 3: You know that's crazy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So that was the climate of the time. A
Speaker 2: king on a witch hunt. In the year sixteen twelve.
Speaker 2: England is ruled by King James the First and only
Speaker 2: a few years earlier he had the gunpowder plot, which
Speaker 2: nearly destroyed Parliament. I don't know if you ever heard
Speaker 2: of that, with the guy fowx masks, which you've seen
Speaker 2: in other things. No, well he was he basically it
Speaker 2: was like King James versus the Catholic Church, and Catholics
Speaker 2: weren't allowed to practice, so he wanted to stop King
Speaker 2: James from preventing that. So they did the gunpowder plot,
Speaker 2: which tried to blow up wow, everything so they could
Speaker 2: go back to it.
Speaker 3: Damn, that's crazy.
Speaker 2: Religious conflict just divided the nation, and the supernatural was
Speaker 2: accepted as part of everyday life. People believe that angels
Speaker 2: walked among them, demons did too. If your child became
Speaker 2: ill overnight, if your crops failed, if your cow suddenly died,
Speaker 2: there had to be a reason, and often the reason
Speaker 2: was witchcraft.
Speaker 3: Not because of you know, some kind of disease or no.
Speaker 3: It's rough.
Speaker 2: Life around Pendle was not easy. People struggled. Most families
Speaker 2: survived through farming, but harvests are unreliable. Food shortages were common.
Speaker 2: Medical care barely existed, and many relied on the law healers,
Speaker 2: usually older women who knew herbs and traditional remedies. Some
Speaker 2: of those remedies worked and some didn't. If they failed,
Speaker 2: the healer could suddenly become a suspect.
Speaker 3: Oh man, that sucks. I mean, that would make me
Speaker 3: not want to do shit. I wouldn't even risk it.
Speaker 2: I agree. But if that's the only way you can
Speaker 2: support your family, like to put food on the table
Speaker 2: for your kids, versus maybe I'm gonna get hung damn.
Speaker 3: I mean, you really got to believe in what you're
Speaker 3: doing and be really confident in what you're doing, because
Speaker 3: that's your life. You're not just getting fired and you
Speaker 3: can be like, oh, I could just fall for you know,
Speaker 3: unemployment or you know, look for another job. They're gonna
Speaker 3: kill you. That's scary.
Speaker 2: Which unemployment?
Speaker 3: Wow, oh my god, that's the trip.
Speaker 2: Among the poorest families were two who already despised each other,
Speaker 2: the Demdikes, who was headed by the elderly widowed Elizabeth
Speaker 2: Southerns who they called Old dem Day Well okay, and
Speaker 2: the other rival family was the Chattoxes. This was also
Speaker 2: headed by a widowed, elderly woman, which is strange for
Speaker 2: the time that they have two matriarchs, like a female
Speaker 2: heading each family. Yeah, her name was Anne Whittle or
Speaker 2: Mother Chattox. They competed for money earning through healing like begging,
Speaker 2: selling charms, but they had old grudges that simmered beneath
Speaker 2: the surface. Something about the Chattox family supposedly stole something
Speaker 2: from the Demdike family years ago.
Speaker 3: So there were like the hot Fields and the McCoys.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this was like, I think somewhere said like fifty
Speaker 2: years they were like despising each other because both of
Speaker 2: these women were like eighty years old, so they've spent
Speaker 2: like most of their life like hating the other family.
Speaker 3: Damn, that's that's some shit. I'm sorry. What was the
Speaker 3: reason for their dislike for each other?
Speaker 2: So in some sites it says because one family stole
Speaker 2: something from the other, and there's another account that one
Speaker 2: family was supposed to pay oatmeal to the other family,
Speaker 2: like eight pounds of oatmeal every year, and one year
Speaker 2: they didn't, so the father died. So they're like, oh,
Speaker 2: and they were given the oatmeal to make sure that
Speaker 2: they didn't harm the other family.
Speaker 3: Holy, I don't know, damn o man. Shit was serious
Speaker 3: that people dying from lack of oatmeal. Ye I'm looking
Speaker 3: at oatmeal through different Oh wow, Okay, now I'm sorry,
Speaker 3: go ahead. Oatmeal thing just got me going.
Speaker 2: Nobody imagined those grudges would eventually send people to the gallows.
Speaker 2: Everything changed on a spring day when a young girl
Speaker 2: I've seen she was ninety and this was so long ago,
Speaker 2: like you get different ages, but she seems like a
Speaker 2: eighteen nineteen year old girl.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 2: Her name was Alison. It's al I z o n
Speaker 2: like not Alison, but Alison. That's a pretty name.
Speaker 3: Like Alis.
Speaker 2: That's a good nickname for Allison.
Speaker 3: Yeah right.
Speaker 2: She was Alison Device, the granddaughter of old dem Dyke.
Speaker 2: She was walking down a country road and she encountered
Speaker 2: a traveling peddler named John Law and she asked him
Speaker 2: for some pins. Pins were surprisingly valuable at the time,
Speaker 2: like just metal pins. They were like handmade. Some were
Speaker 2: used for like medicinal purposes or spells or charms. I'm
Speaker 2: not sure if she was asking for free pins or
Speaker 2: if she had money, but either way, Law refused to
Speaker 2: sell or give her pins, and moments later, the story
Speaker 2: goes that a dog appeared next to Alison, a familiar
Speaker 2: I guess, and asked Alison what she wanted the dog
Speaker 2: to do to the man, that he could lame him.
Speaker 2: And then John Law suddenly got a pain down the
Speaker 2: left side of his arm and then he collapsed.
Speaker 3: Oh shit, she gave him a stroke.
Speaker 2: That's exactly it. Some say he suffered a curse or
Speaker 2: a stroke. Nobody knows though, but that does sound modernly
Speaker 2: like a stroke, yeah, exactly. Rumors spread immediately. People claimed
Speaker 2: that Alison had cursed him, and even Alison herself reportedly
Speaker 2: confessed that she had bewitched the man. What nobody knows
Speaker 2: if that was like she really believed she had powers,
Speaker 2: or if she had guilt, or if it was like
Speaker 2: pressure from authorities, because you know how you can pressure witches.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but we'll never know, or I mean maybe maybe
Speaker 3: in her mind she's like, you're not going to give
Speaker 3: me a pen. I hope you fucking die, I mean,
Speaker 3: and then you know he saw the freaking dog freaked out,
Speaker 3: had a stroke and died.
Speaker 2: That could happen. It was just like a terrible series
Speaker 2: what is it? A series of unfortunate events exactly?
Speaker 3: Maybe she legit felt like she actually did it.
Speaker 2: The incident said in motion something that nobody can stop.
Speaker 2: The case reached local magistrate Roger Knowle, which a magistrate.
Speaker 2: It was like the law enforcer back then. Now we
Speaker 2: see him just kind of in courts, but they were
Speaker 2: like the law right. So when Roger Nole found out,
Speaker 2: it wasn't the same as like village gossip. He had
Speaker 2: legal authority, so he began questioning suspects, and the accusations,
Speaker 2: like in Salem, just kept growing. Families that held decade
Speaker 2: long feud now had an outlet to openly an act
Speaker 2: revenge against one another. Old Demdike, who is now over
Speaker 2: eighty years old. She was pretty much blind too. She
Speaker 2: admitted to making charms and performing spells. Old Chaddix also
Speaker 2: admitted to using magic to an act revenge on how
Speaker 2: her daughter was treated, and the magistrate, Roger Knowles, saw
Speaker 2: this as an opportunity to impress the king who was
Speaker 2: obsessed with hunting witches. So he just continued questioning the locals,
Speaker 2: trying to get answers, plicate more people.
Speaker 3: So he's bringing everybody down.
Speaker 2: And Alison started implicating her own family members.
Speaker 3: What was it to save herself or.
Speaker 2: I don't think so, because she admitted herself too, which
Speaker 2: I don't get. I mean, it could have been like
Speaker 2: we're both healers, our family is the real one, right,
Speaker 2: or it could be like I really don't know.
Speaker 3: That is crazy.
Speaker 2: So the families are hurling accusations back and forth. Alison
Speaker 2: said that Chaddix murdered four men, including her own father,
Speaker 2: like the deal that I talked about earlier, that the
Speaker 2: father was so afraid of old Chatticks that he paid
Speaker 2: her every year eight pounds of oatmeal not to hurt
Speaker 2: their family.
Speaker 3: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: And when he was on his deathbed, he said that
Speaker 2: Chaddix did it because he hadn't paid her that year.
Speaker 3: Where's my oatmeal, you bitch.
Speaker 2: Others accused their own neighbors. Old disputes resurfaced, and stories
Speaker 2: from decades earlier suddenly became evidence. One witness remembered seeing
Speaker 2: a dead cow. Another recalled an unexplained illness.
Speaker 3: Oh my god. So they're just digging up all kinds
Speaker 3: of shit from the past.
Speaker 2: Mm hmmm, damn, this is like next level petty.
Speaker 3: Yeah, seriously, like, oh my god, like damn, like shit
Speaker 3: that they were peeved from back then that really didn't
Speaker 3: get resolved, Like it's getting resolved now.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like your cow pooped on my lawn. I remember that.
Speaker 2: That was twenty five years ago to the day. I
Speaker 2: didn't forget that.
Speaker 3: I still got it under my shoe. God dang.
Speaker 2: Others said that strange words were spoken after an argument. Individually,
Speaker 2: none of this proved witchcraft, but together they formed a
Speaker 2: frightening picture in the minds of investigators and one of
Speaker 2: the women who was accused, Alice Nutter, she wasn't like
Speaker 2: you know, how the Chaddix and the Demdikes were. They
Speaker 2: didn't really have a lot of money. They were known
Speaker 2: to beg around town. Alice Nutter was not a beggar.
Speaker 2: In fact, she was a well off landowner. But it's
Speaker 2: rumored that she had a land dispute with Robert Knowle,
Speaker 2: who was doing the investigation, so he wanted her land.
Speaker 3: So when Yeah, so they saw this as a perfect opportunity.
Speaker 2: Mm hmm. Then came one of the most famous moments
Speaker 2: in the entire case. On Good Friday, several relatives and
Speaker 2: neighbors gathered at a place known as Malclin Tower, which
Speaker 2: is the home of the Demdikes. You hear malcl Tower
Speaker 2: and you're thinking, like, gorgeous tower, right right. But Malclin
Speaker 2: or Makin Tower was more of a hut. And Malcln
Speaker 2: is slaying for slut and Macin is slaying for shit.
Speaker 2: So I don't know if it was slut tower or
Speaker 2: shit tower.
Speaker 3: Oh wow, I don't know which one is worse. It's
Speaker 3: a slut tower. Wow, damn. So what were they doing
Speaker 3: in this in the tower?
Speaker 2: So it could have been the tower the hut. I
Speaker 2: know it is a tower, but some think it was
Speaker 2: a secret witches meeting, or it could just be a
Speaker 2: family gathering because their family members are imprisoned. They're trying
Speaker 2: to figure out some sort of plan to get them
Speaker 2: out or to grieve or whatever. But authorities claimed it
Speaker 2: was a gathering to plan an escape of those accused,
Speaker 2: that they were going to blow up the castle freely
Speaker 2: accused and kill the jailer.
Speaker 3: And what proof did they have?
Speaker 2: Oh, they knew this. They were men that said it. Daisy,
Speaker 2: come on now, oh.
Speaker 3: My god, Oh that's right. That they didn't need any proof.
Speaker 2: I mean, somebody could have just said that to them
Speaker 2: just to get heat off themselves. We'll never know exactly
Speaker 2: what happened that night, but we do know that anyone
Speaker 2: that was said to be present at the meeting was
Speaker 2: arrested and imprisoned, and those accused were marched to Lancaster
Speaker 2: Castle where they would have their day in court. The
Speaker 2: locals filled the court with anticipation. The witness that was
Speaker 2: brought into the courtroom was nine year old Janet Device,
Speaker 2: the granddaughter to Elizabeth Southern's or Old Chaddocks. She was
Speaker 2: the only one that was not arrested from the Malkin
Speaker 2: Tower meeting, and she was also the only bastard child
Speaker 2: of the family, which back then mattered. So I'm assuming
Speaker 2: she was treated worse than the other kids because having
Speaker 2: a kid out.
Speaker 3: Of wedlock back then. Yeah, I was wrong.
Speaker 2: I was gonna say which only, but yeah, it's wrong.
Speaker 3: She's a witch.
Speaker 2: But this was a child. This was a key witness,
Speaker 2: the daughter of Elizabeth, the sister of Allison and sister
Speaker 2: of James who was also accused and arrested. She said, quote,
Speaker 2: at noon, about twenty people came to our house. My
Speaker 2: mother told me that they were all witches. My mother
Speaker 2: is a witch, and that I know to be true.
Speaker 2: I've seen her spirit in the likeness of a brown dog,
Speaker 2: which she calls Ball. The dog did ask what she
Speaker 2: would have him do, and she answered that she would
Speaker 2: have him help her kill God.
Speaker 3: They treated her like shit.
Speaker 2: The dog's name ball.
Speaker 3: Why not.
Speaker 2: It just sounds like a little kid in the corner,
Speaker 2: like coming up with something really quick. And then and
Speaker 2: this happened, and then they started pasty circle.
Speaker 3: And they all got naked.
Speaker 2: Her mother was furious, as the record say, and she
Speaker 2: had to be escorted from the courtroom. She said, then
Speaker 2: after that, Janet stood on the table and can chase you.
Speaker 2: In her testimony or accusations, I should say the child
Speaker 2: may or may not have been coached. I wasn't there.
Speaker 2: She openly accused her own family members and neighbors and
Speaker 2: others of bea witches, including her mother, her brother, her sister.
Speaker 2: Her testimony led to the arrest of ten more people.
Speaker 3: So I'm guessing yeah, she was the Bestard child, kind
Speaker 3: of like treated like John Snow. John Snow was treated
Speaker 3: like shit, I'm sure, and this was her way to
Speaker 3: get back at them. That's that's how I'm seeing it.
Speaker 2: I'm picturing not even a candy bar like something equivalent
Speaker 2: back then. I don't even know what they had for
Speaker 2: candy or anything good. Back then, it was like here
Speaker 2: you can have a piece of mutton or something.
Speaker 3: Put some beans here. That sucks.
Speaker 2: So in modern court such testimony would raise serious questions,
Speaker 2: but in sixteen twelve it helps secure convictions. That's what
Speaker 2: they wanted.
Speaker 3: Of course, they got the perfect witness.
Speaker 2: And she's just literally going down the line like, Okay,
Speaker 2: she was there, he was there, he was there, And
Speaker 2: the court, I guess, asked like if people were there
Speaker 2: that they knew were not and she got them all right,
Speaker 2: So they were like, oh, she's credible.
Speaker 3: Damn yeah, they knew what they were doing.
Speaker 2: Whether she believed it or she just repeated what authorities
Speaker 2: expected to hear, we don't know. But her testimony carried
Speaker 2: enormous weight. And the accused were held inside Lancaster Castle.
Speaker 2: Conditions were grim. They had cold stone walls, barely any
Speaker 2: food disease, you know, water coming through the walls. Many
Speaker 2: prisoners waited months before trial, and some never left alive.
Speaker 3: Oh that is horrible. The picture in my head is
Speaker 3: just it's yeah, those conditions that you're living in no
Speaker 3: some light, you know, just darkness. And you know, I'm
Speaker 3: pretty sure they didn't have toilets inside the you know,
Speaker 3: you just had to poop in the corner.
Speaker 2: Yeah. And the two families that despise each other in
Speaker 2: there together.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, that didn't help.
Speaker 2: So proceedings finally began in August of sixteen twelve. The
Speaker 2: evidence consisted largely of confessions, accusations, rumors, and witness testimony.
Speaker 2: There was no forensic science, no physical proof. Belief itself
Speaker 2: often became evidence, and on August seventeenth, the verdict was read.
Speaker 2: One after another, they were delivered guilty, guilty, and guilty.
Speaker 2: Ten people connected to the Pendal case were sentenced to death.
Speaker 2: Old Demdike died in prison before her trial, possibly due
Speaker 2: to the conditions when she was old. Yeah, I mean
Speaker 2: back then, you're over eighty. That's super impressive.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly, geez.
Speaker 2: Even though she died, Old Demdike was still found guilty,
Speaker 2: along with her daughter Elizabeth, her granddaughter Alison Allison's brother James.
Speaker 2: Also guilty was Old Demdyke's other daughter Anne Redfern, and
Speaker 2: the very next day, on August twentieth, the guilty were
Speaker 2: brought by carts to Gallows Hill near Lancaster, where priests
Speaker 2: went to give their last rites. Some prayed, some pled,
Speaker 2: and some were just silent. A crowd watched on as
Speaker 2: those convicted were executed by hanging. And this wasn't like
Speaker 2: a hanging like you'd think, like you snapped the neck
Speaker 2: and that's it. They would like put a noose around
Speaker 2: you and the rope would slowly strangle. You could take ten, fifteen,
Speaker 2: twenty minutes to die.
Speaker 3: My god, that is horrible, horrific. I'd rather have my
Speaker 3: head chopped off.
Speaker 2: Yeah, something quick.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2: And you have the whole town like sitting down watching
Speaker 2: that makes it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, like eating fucking popcorn. Oh, look at that.
Speaker 3: That's horrible, that's sadistic.
Speaker 2: I'm laughing because I'm uncomfortable. Yeah. Those executed were Anne Whittle,
Speaker 2: Elizabeth Device, Alice Nutter, Catherine Hewitt, James Bullcock and Redfern
Speaker 2: and Device, James Device, Jane Bolcock, Isabelle Robi And although
Speaker 2: not brought to the gallows. Elizabeth Southern, who died while
Speaker 2: awaiting trial. I mean she basically old Dumdyke was part
Speaker 2: of that. And the only one that was allowed to
Speaker 2: live was Margaret Pearson. She was found not guilty of
Speaker 2: capital witchcraft, but she was guilty of non capital witchcraft
Speaker 2: for something she did to a horse, and she was
Speaker 2: sentenced to four days of pillaring. So that's like the
Speaker 2: shame shame, okay, I'll take it in different squares. Also
Speaker 2: a public whipping Ooh and she had to spend another
Speaker 2: year in Lancaster Castle.
Speaker 3: Oh and jail. Come on, yeah, that would have killed
Speaker 3: me meant there. Oh shit, that's horrible.
Speaker 2: Their names became part of English history, not because anyone
Speaker 2: could prove they possessed supernatural powers, but because they became
Speaker 2: victims of one of the country's most famous witch trials.
Speaker 3: That's that. That is so fucking sad. You know, I
Speaker 3: can imagine you know, the energy you know in that area,
Speaker 3: you know, the the unquiet spirits of those who were
Speaker 3: you know, who were you know, falsely accused.
Speaker 2: Why didn't I take notes on that too, because there
Speaker 2: are a lot of headless women seen in that area. Oh,
Speaker 2: there's a lot of paranormal Oh.
Speaker 3: I believe it. I definitely believe that. You know that. Yeah,
Speaker 3: they're not resting. They're definitely not resting. And that's oh
Speaker 3: my god, that is so freaking horribly sad. The least
Speaker 3: they I would wish that they would, you know, move
Speaker 3: on to the next world. That's sad.
Speaker 2: PRO just want to get those guys back that wrote
Speaker 2: the freaking books.
Speaker 3: Actually I would. I would definitely. You know what, if
Speaker 3: I was a spirit and something like that happened to me,
Speaker 3: I would walk with every single one of them.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, girls saying I'm too petty. I'd be
Speaker 2: sitting on this plane just for that reason.
Speaker 3: Yeah, pretty much. Oh man, yep, I mean pulling people's feet,
Speaker 3: making them go crazy thinking, you know is Yeah, I
Speaker 3: would totally punish the hell out of them. That's that's unfortunate.
Speaker 2: So history doesn't even show if they were actually witches.
Speaker 2: Most historians say they weren't. Instead, they just point towards
Speaker 2: a combination of poverty, personal rivalries, religious beliefs in a
Speaker 2: legal system that accepted spectral evidence, confessions, and hearsay in
Speaker 2: a way that wouldn't meet modern standards. But for the
Speaker 2: people of sixteen twelve, that danger felt real when illness
Speaker 2: struck without explanation or harvest failed unexpectedly, Many sought answers
Speaker 2: in the supernatural. Accusations of witchcraft provided a way to
Speaker 2: explain suffering and to settle old scores. The Pendal Trial
Speaker 2: reminds us that fear can reshape communities once suspicion takes hold.
Speaker 2: Ordinary disagreements can become evidence, and neighbors can become enemies.
Speaker 3: Yeah that's just so said. But yeah, you know, I
Speaker 3: definitely believe that, you know, that excuse of you know,
Speaker 3: pointing the fingers saying witch, it's just a means, you know,
Speaker 3: to get back at you. You know, even if there
Speaker 3: were witches, I don't believe that they're able to cause
Speaker 3: harm in the way that they you know, they were suspecting.
Speaker 3: It was just like I said, I wouldn't survive in
Speaker 3: a time like that. Me and my mom, we would
Speaker 3: not survive in a time like that.
Speaker 2: I always said, if I was born back then, I
Speaker 2: would get married young off my husband so I could
Speaker 2: have money, because widows had so much more power, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean. If you weren't married, you had
Speaker 2: to have all these escorts and all that you couldn't
Speaker 2: have all whatever, But at least if you had like
Speaker 2: an okay brother and you were a widow, yeah, and
Speaker 2: you trust it enough to handle the finances.
Speaker 3: You put a lot of thought into this.
Speaker 2: I did.
Speaker 3: Yeah. It's just not a nice time to I mean fuck,
Speaker 3: I mean being a woman period was just really hard.
Speaker 3: You know. You had to dress a certain way, you
Speaker 3: had to act a certain way. Yeah, you know, and
Speaker 3: if you didn't behave know, shit like that happened?
Speaker 2: Mm hmm.
Speaker 3: And for why exactly? For what? You know? Whatever? Does
Speaker 3: anything say? An is there any where the says what
Speaker 3: happened to that little girl?
Speaker 2: There is to tell? Let me just I'll finish this
Speaker 2: and then we'll.
Speaker 3: Talk about her. Okay, Okay, I'm just gonna.
Speaker 2: Ramble front of the second. So Pendall Hill still stands today.
Speaker 2: Visitors still walk its path. Most come for the scenery,
Speaker 2: some come for the history, and a few come searching
Speaker 2: for echoes of a story that has lingered for more
Speaker 2: than four centuries. Whether you believe in witches, ghosts or not,
Speaker 2: one truth remains. The greatest danger in Pendall was never magic.
Speaker 2: It was fear. Fear of the unknown. As for Janet, device.
Speaker 2: Not too much more is known about her after her
Speaker 2: part and the death of her two siblings, mother or grandmother,
Speaker 2: basically her whole family. Yeah, except that in sixteen thirty
Speaker 2: three she found herself in court again. This time she
Speaker 2: was on the other side of the table when a
Speaker 2: young boy named Edmund Robinson claimed that he was kidnapped
Speaker 2: by witches. He said, I was picking when I saw
Speaker 2: two greyhounds. I tried to get them to chase a hair,
Speaker 2: but they didn't run, so I beat them off with
Speaker 2: a stick. One of the dogs turned into a witch
Speaker 2: and the other into a boy. The witch then turned
Speaker 2: him into a horse. The witch took me away on
Speaker 2: that horse to a house hostones, and their barn was
Speaker 2: full of witches, maybe sixty of them, And from the
Speaker 2: ceiling there were all these ropes hanging down, and they
Speaker 2: were pulling on the ropes, and amazing food came falling down.
Speaker 2: I was so frightened. I ran away, and they chased
Speaker 2: me for ages. And before I got home, I met
Speaker 2: a boy with cloven hooves, so I fought him. And
Speaker 2: that's why I'm so scruffy. It's not my fault. This
Speaker 2: was an excuse, he told his parents why he was late.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, wow, and talk about karma.
Speaker 2: So he named seventeen witches, one of which was Janet Device.
Speaker 2: Now she was an adult herself, because this was over
Speaker 2: twenty years later and she was being accused by a child.
Speaker 2: Her body was checked and was said to have two
Speaker 2: witches marks. I wonder what witch's marks can be, like
Speaker 2: a freckle, pimple, or you know how some people have
Speaker 2: like third nipples or whatever. Then there are the devil's.
Speaker 3: Teats, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: They're supposed to suckle on you or your that's for you,
Speaker 2: for you're familiar to suckle on or whatever.
Speaker 3: I've always had an issue with that word. Suckle. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I don't know why. It's just so cross.
Speaker 2: But succulence isn't as bad, but suckle makes.
Speaker 3: It like suckle at my teet.
Speaker 2: Yeah. But or it could be a war. It could
Speaker 2: be like just some I don't know, anything on your
Speaker 2: body that looks out of the ordinary, I'd be screwed.
Speaker 2: I have freckles all over me.
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I have one like right here, which.
Speaker 2: Which And a doctor later inspected the Marx and who
Speaker 2: was like, yeah, no, they're not. After months of Edmund
Speaker 2: being brought around to different places and standing in churches
Speaker 2: and pointing at people who were supposedly witches. That he
Speaker 2: says he admitted to making up the story because you
Speaker 2: didn't want to get in trouble for getting home late.
Speaker 2: What an ass And Janet was not executed, but that
Speaker 2: didn't mean she could leave. This was a time where
Speaker 2: you had to work off the debt that you accrued
Speaker 2: while you were in prison for like room and board,
Speaker 2: So it's not really clear if she ever got out.
Speaker 3: Shit.
Speaker 2: That's kind of like Salem too. They had that thing
Speaker 2: where you had to pay off your debt before you
Speaker 2: could leave, even though you're there against your will.
Speaker 3: So they put you in jail against your and you
Speaker 3: had you had to pay. Wow, yep, that's crazy. That
Speaker 3: is some shit. Yeah, we have you know, the people
Speaker 3: in our jail system, the taxpayers are the ones who
Speaker 3: pay for that. Right, We paid for that, so I mean,
Speaker 3: you know, if you're guilty, I see why you would
Speaker 3: have to pay it back. But if you're not guilty,
Speaker 3: you had you shouldn't have to pay anything.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're exonerated, but you still have to pay all
Speaker 2: that time you were sitting rotten in jail and you
Speaker 2: couldn't work.
Speaker 3: That's a bullshit.
Speaker 2: Salem accusations were thrown around regardless of evidence. The impoverished
Speaker 2: were easy targets, not having the means to fight back.
Speaker 2: The one that we can reasonably guess had a stroke
Speaker 2: snowballed into all these people losing their lives. The Pendle
Speaker 2: witch trials acted as a blueprint setting case law and
Speaker 2: precedent to be used in Salem, allowing children to hurl
Speaker 2: accusations and targeting those who were either not liked in
Speaker 2: the community, poor, elderly, or in.
Speaker 3: Some way vulnerable. I would have been poor.
Speaker 2: I wouldn't have been because I would have offered my husband.
Speaker 3: And I would That's how would you have done it?
Speaker 2: Because you didn't have a way to google, Like witch
Speaker 2: plants are poisonous, so you'd have to find a trusted
Speaker 2: friend or experiment. But I wouldn't want to experiment on animals.
Speaker 2: I'd find someone that had, like some sort of disease
Speaker 2: and be like, why don't you go have dinner with them?
Speaker 2: And then I'd take off for a few weeks so
Speaker 2: they'd catch it. If I had to try that, I'd
Speaker 2: find a way where there's a will there's a way.
Speaker 3: I think I would have just gone to the forest
Speaker 3: and picked every single, every single te pick every single
Speaker 3: type of barry one of those haves to hit.
Speaker 2: Mmm, mushroom and berry soup.
Speaker 3: Come on, honey, there you go, there you go. Jesus,
Speaker 3: Oh my god. Okay, yeah, we just did not talk
Speaker 3: start talking about murdering our husbands. That's that's crazy though.
Speaker 3: I've never heard of that before. Though, Like I said,
Speaker 3: I've always heard of the famous Salem witch trials. This
Speaker 3: happened before.
Speaker 2: Yeah, long before, and this kind of spiraled into it.
Speaker 2: I didn't hear about I never knew about this either.
Speaker 2: I just recently heard about it and I started to
Speaker 2: look into it and I was like, damn, but just
Speaker 2: over two days. The way that their trial was so
Speaker 2: quick and they were like, oh, guilty, guilty, just because
Speaker 2: one kid said something, the one that was probably upset.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because she was being treated differently. That's what I
Speaker 3: got from that. She was being treated differently, and you know,
Speaker 3: the child of you know, a bastard child always got mistreated.
Speaker 3: So she saw this way of you know, getting back
Speaker 3: at them, because I mean, why else was she do that?
Speaker 3: She just killed all of her family, you know, now
Speaker 3: she's all by herself.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'm sure that stigma stayed with her her
Speaker 2: whole life, you know what I mean, Like you're the
Speaker 2: kid of the witches. I'm sure her life sucked even
Speaker 2: more after that.
Speaker 3: Well yeah, and it's just karma that that smacked her
Speaker 3: in the face when she got accused.
Speaker 2: But at nine too, at nine, you're so you're so impressionable.
Speaker 2: So I'm sure if the judges were like, oh, we'll
Speaker 2: give you this, this, this, and then after they didn't
Speaker 2: eat her anymore, so they just threw it on the
Speaker 2: side too.
Speaker 3: Sounds surprised. I surprised she survived into adulthood. That's that's
Speaker 3: just that's that's horrible. That's it's a lot of ignorance,
Speaker 3: and like you said, it's a lot of fear, you know,
Speaker 3: the fear of the you known, because you know, witchcraft
Speaker 3: is it's not a bad thing. It's not a bad
Speaker 3: thing at all. Yeah, what is it? Pagan's They don't
Speaker 3: believe in a devil, there's no such that's a Christian thing.
Speaker 3: That's a Christian concept.
Speaker 2: And these women were more known to be healers than
Speaker 2: anything else in the community.
Speaker 3: Exactly exactly. Yeah, you know they used uh, they used
Speaker 3: they used their herbs, you know, for healing, for bringing prosperity,
Speaker 3: you know.
Speaker 2: Not like I would to my husband back then.
Speaker 3: Oh my God. And I think you know that the
Speaker 3: Catholic Church had a lot to do with putting these
Speaker 3: ideas into the air because they wanted to be known
Speaker 3: as you know, the religion, you know, just one God.
Speaker 2: Well this was the same King James that rewrote the Bible.
Speaker 2: Oh really, but he was very against Catholicism. Yeah, he
Speaker 2: wanted Protestant or nothing.
Speaker 3: It's sad because I'm a Catholic. I believe in God,
Speaker 3: but it's just said how how religion it's just, you know,
Speaker 3: causes so many conflicts in the world.
Speaker 2: As long as it's not hurting anybody else. What you believe,
Speaker 2: believe it. But he would literally send his minions out
Speaker 2: into Catholic masses and have them take notes of who
Speaker 2: was taking communion and who was going there. It was
Speaker 2: like it was bad. It was bad back then, Jesus.
Speaker 2: Like even Queen Elizabeth the first way before way off top.
Speaker 2: But same thing about the witchcraft. She was on that
Speaker 2: hunt and she would hunt down like popes and any
Speaker 2: clergy and have them killed. So they used to have
Speaker 2: to hide around town. They had like certain hiding spots
Speaker 2: to avoid her men finding them.
Speaker 3: That reminds me of this show that I that I
Speaker 3: saw a year ago. It's called The Discovery of Witches.
Speaker 3: Have you ever watched that? I have not. I want
Speaker 3: you though watch it. It's it's based it's based around
Speaker 3: actual historical figures from that time, from the you know,
Speaker 3: from the Witch Trials. What was the name of that author?
Speaker 3: I read the books first. They have the show. I
Speaker 3: want to say on Netflix that it's a I want
Speaker 3: to say, it's three seasons. Ooh, and it's really really good. Yeah,
Speaker 3: Netflix watching it, Yeah, Deborah Harkness. So it has vampires,
Speaker 3: witches and I want to say shape shifters.
Speaker 2: Oh, shape shifters scare me.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So it's it's really really good. This chick, you know,
Speaker 3: she's a witch and she falls in love with the
Speaker 3: vampire and now all of a sudden they want to
Speaker 3: hunt them, so they disappear into the past. She's able
Speaker 3: to somehow take them to the past and they take
Speaker 3: them to when he was you know, a young vampire,
Speaker 3: and it's it's it's really freaking cool. I suggest you
Speaker 3: watch that if you're looking for something to bitch. Watch it.
Speaker 3: It's awesome.
Speaker 2: Well it sounds like right up your ally too.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah yeah. I read the books and I fell
Speaker 3: in love with the books, and then I found out
Speaker 3: that they were making a series and I'm like, oh,
Speaker 3: hell yeah, and I watched it. They did a beautiful
Speaker 3: job with it.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I think witches get such a cinematic reputation that
Speaker 2: people don't actually look into what each because any type
Speaker 2: of religion, practice whatever has different levels.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: There's extreme, right, you know what I mean, there's all
Speaker 2: sorts of different things. And I think when people hear
Speaker 2: which they think one certain.
Speaker 3: Thing exactly, and you know, they are the first thing
Speaker 3: that pops into their head is you know, somebody with
Speaker 3: the pointed hat and a green face, and yeah, it's
Speaker 3: it's a whole lot more than that.
Speaker 2: Margaret Hamill is fantastic.
Speaker 3: But Margret, oh that's.
Speaker 2: Right, But she did, I think add to the stereotype.
Speaker 3: Oh absolutely awesome too. Yeah, well yeah, really yeah, you
Speaker 3: know or not that that witch from Bugs Bunney.
Speaker 2: Oh, she used to scare me when I was a kid.
Speaker 3: She's freaky as hell. What the hell was her name?
Speaker 3: The ward?
Speaker 2: The ward I had a problem with the rest of
Speaker 2: her I could deal with.
Speaker 3: It was the war with me. I think her name
Speaker 3: was Hazel or something like that. But yeah, yeah, which
Speaker 3: is definitely get a bad reputation. And yeah, they were,
Speaker 3: like you said, there were mainly healers. And you know,
Speaker 3: my mom, she was into a form of witchcraft. It's
Speaker 3: called uh Speedyismo, and it's a Puerto Rican practice and
Speaker 3: it was just based on on healing. It was just
Speaker 3: a lot of healing. She remembers her grandmother. She would
Speaker 3: have people come in. They would bring her like fruits
Speaker 3: or something they made, you know, some kind of food
Speaker 3: as payment that you're gonna say, oat male, No, don't oatmeal. Yeah,
Speaker 3: So you know, they would bring over some kind of
Speaker 3: food as payment or not. They would bring her candles
Speaker 3: or you know, something that she needed. And often they
Speaker 3: would come by with like some kind of ailment and
Speaker 3: she would heal them. She remembers, actually, this one time,
Speaker 3: this guy or I don't remember a guy or a woman.
Speaker 3: This person came over and they wanted to love spell.
Speaker 3: They wanted to be with this particular person, and she's
Speaker 3: the way did. My mom described that there was two
Speaker 3: needles that were put into water and eventually they if
Speaker 3: they were meant to be together, the two needles would
Speaker 3: touch each other head on, but if they passed each other,
Speaker 3: they weren't meant for each other. And my mom she
Speaker 3: was like really fascinated, and she would be watching this,
Speaker 3: you know, and she says that she actually saw the
Speaker 3: needles moving towards each other. And yeah, she was. She
Speaker 3: was so fascinating, you know, these stories that she would
Speaker 3: tell me. I'm like, this little boy came in with
Speaker 3: like I believe they did.
Speaker 2: I believe they did be hanging on that part.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I want to say that they did touch. This
Speaker 3: other story, a little boy came in with the bloated
Speaker 3: belly and she she would rub something on his stomach
Speaker 3: and she said that she saw, little by little, the
Speaker 3: stomach going down, going down, just by my grandmother rubbing
Speaker 3: his stomach with some kind of ointment. So yeah, my
Speaker 3: grandmother was really really known in the area that she
Speaker 3: they lived in as the healer. Oh wow. Yeah, so
Speaker 3: my mom she learned, she learned some stuff from from her.
Speaker 3: She was able to you know, she she's really good
Speaker 3: with herbs and stuff.
Speaker 2: And even if people don't believe in that, I mean,
Speaker 2: reflexology is yeah, like a recognized thing if it's you
Speaker 2: know what I mean, there's so many accia pressure, there's
Speaker 2: all different things. So just movement pressing, you know what
Speaker 2: I mean, it's practices, even if you don't believe in witchcraft.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. I want to say in Mexico, Mexico, there's
Speaker 3: a there's a person called as you know, somebody who rubs,
Speaker 3: and somebody had told me to go check this person
Speaker 3: out because I thought I couldn't have more kids. And
Speaker 3: I was that close to you know, to you know,
Speaker 3: checking this out. But apparently they rub your abdominal area.
Speaker 3: Oh and start moving stuff around in there to help
Speaker 3: you be able to conceive. And people swear by this
Speaker 3: that it works.
Speaker 2: It couldn't hurt. It's not like he's hurting you, even
Speaker 2: if it doesn't.
Speaker 3: Work, right, Yeah, exactly. So yeah, I was, I was
Speaker 3: about to go, but then I got pregnant. I'm like, yes,
Speaker 3: it works. Yeah, all of that stuff fascinates me. I've
Speaker 3: always been so interested in, you know, learning about different
Speaker 3: types of crafts, you know, whether it's you know, speedy
Speaker 3: dismal santeria, which I'm very interested in, Voodoo, which I
Speaker 3: think also gets a very bad reputation. I'm fascinating with
Speaker 3: it all. I like learning about all this stuff. You know,
Speaker 3: I may not use it. I think it's good to
Speaker 3: learn about these things. Is like voodoo. You know, a
Speaker 3: lot of people think that voodoo is a bad thing.
Speaker 3: I think it's the person that is using that craft.
Speaker 3: That's how it's determined if it's better or good. You know,
Speaker 3: it all depends on who's doing it. You're a good person,
Speaker 3: You're you're gonna do good things with it. But there's
Speaker 3: bad people that would, you know, obviously use it for
Speaker 3: negative reasons. I think that's with any kind of craft.
Speaker 2: Really, Yeah, totally your intent of how and why?
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly exactly.
Speaker 2: So everyone, let's not be ignorant and look into things
Speaker 2: before we prejudge people. How about that? So we don't
Speaker 2: have another one.
Speaker 3: Of these, you know what, you never know, it could,
Speaker 3: it could happen against someday you never know.
Speaker 2: Hopefully it won't. The world is just crazy now they're
Speaker 2: saying aliens underwater, Like just I got to do an
Speaker 2: alien episode with your brother because he's the alien man.
Speaker 3: Oh my God, yes, it is just the world.
Speaker 2: Is this feels like we're in a simulation?
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I've heard that too, you know, And I
Speaker 3: seriously feel like the aliens are litt They're there, They're
Speaker 3: up there somewhere, they're watching us. They don't want to
Speaker 3: come down here.
Speaker 2: They're like, figure stuff out, guys.
Speaker 3: When I come down there yet, I wouldn't. You guys
Speaker 3: are hot mess?
Speaker 2: How much of eggs?
Speaker 3: Yeah we'll wait? Oh my, I remember that that was insane.
Speaker 2: Jesus was Supermarket's still insane.
Speaker 3: Price of beef is just ridannculous. Oh my gosh. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I got skirt steak last week as like a thing,
Speaker 2: and just for four of us, I spent over one
Speaker 2: hundred dollars, which is crazy.
Speaker 3: I'll only eat steak if I go out to dinner,
Speaker 3: I'll order myself a steak. But to buy it for
Speaker 3: the house, you know, I'm like, my kid's too young
Speaker 3: for steak.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've been having chicken, chicken sometimes, hamburgerna, eat ground,
Speaker 2: try whatever's one sale. But I look at the steak prices,
Speaker 2: I'm like, eh, yeah, so no steak this week.
Speaker 3: Yeah, my pork is fine, turkey is fine. I don't
Speaker 3: even buy ground beef. I buy ground turkey. When I
Speaker 3: screw that, I'm good.
Speaker 2: So thank you so much for coming on Daisy. I
Speaker 2: so appreciate it.
Speaker 3: Thank you for having me. It's it's always awesome. Well,
Speaker 3: thank you, ladies and gentlemen for joining us on ouch.
Speaker 3: Was that a ghost?
Speaker 2: Bye bye?
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