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Speaker 1: Hello everybody, and welcome back to the Sure that You

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Can't Be Serious Podcast. We are here today with our

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special guest host Jeff Johnson from the A film by

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podcast What's Up?

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Speaker 2: Jeff?

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Speaker 3: Not a whole lot d Thank you for having me

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back again so soon. Had a great time with you

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and Jason last time.

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Speaker 1: Last time was a barrel of fun and matter of fact,

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we've gotten together several times and the last couple of

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big episodes that we got together on were another couple

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of what the heck Happened episodes, and that was on

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Jaws The Revenge and Superman The Quest for Peace and

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What the heck Happened premise is something that my co

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host Jason Colvin came up with because there are movies

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that he just can't figure out what the heck happened with.

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Speaker 4: That's right, Those episodes were a lot of fun. Today,

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Not sure there's gonna be a lot of fun for

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my part.

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Speaker 1: Today, we are here to talk about Alien cubed. We

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are here to talk about three where in the theater

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everyone can hear you scream. Specifically, they can hear Jason

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stand up at the credits at the opening and say,

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what the fuck you can't kill Newt and Hicks and

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then throw his popcorn at the screen. Guys. I figure,

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with the depression that's going to ensue from this episode,

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I decided we needed to start with a joke. You

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guys ready for my joke?

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Speaker 4: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Do you know what happens when you give David Fincher

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a bunch of lemons? He makes lemonaien three.

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Speaker 4: Oh my gosh, I know you're a father because that

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is a dad joke. Okay, so you're kidding around, but

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I was really I told Jeff today, I called you,

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and I'm like, I am still angry and bitter about

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this movie. I am so mad, and after doing my research,

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I am more.

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Speaker 1: Mad, more mad because it didn't have to be this way.

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Speaker 4: It did not have these guys aft it up.

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Speaker 5: Man.

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Speaker 1: Well, Jeff, I don't know. Do you hate this movie

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as much as Jason does.

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Speaker 3: I don't hate it at all. Point of fact, I

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happened to like Alien three. You know, when we're talking

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about theatrical cut and when we're talking about the two

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thousand and three assembly cut, I happened to love it.

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Speaker 4: So this cannot be true. Jeff.

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Speaker 1: It is a true apologist.

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Speaker 3: Much like the superintendent of Fury one six y one.

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I am here for rumor control and to deliver the facts.

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Speaker 1: So before we jump right in with this, you guys,

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remember what you were doing in nineteen ninety two, other

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than throwing your popcorn at the screen.

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Speaker 4: I was so mad. Okay, So in ninety two, I

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just completed my first year of college, excited for a

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blockbuster year at the movies, and this got us kicked off.

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May twenty second, nineteen ninety two, kind of early in

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the summer. I was with my now wife Catherine, and

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we went to see this movie and we both loved,

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absolutely loved the James Cameron nineteen eighty six classic, which Jeff,

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I told you that's the best movie of nineteen eighty six, right,

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So I absolutely love Aliens. And when we saw it

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in the theater, I was so mad, but I did

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not leave. Stayed for the entire punishment of this movie.

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So just a great time in my life. But this

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was not a good day for me. I can remember

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watching this in the theater. Was This would have been,

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I guess the summer before my junior year of high school,

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so I was at least driving at this point. I

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didn't detest it, but I was really bored.

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Speaker 1: I also was Aliens fan, right, I'm not the super

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fan that you are, but I don't even know if

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I had seen the original Alien at that point. I

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loved Aliens, thought it kicked, but I saw that one

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with my dad, really loved that one, was excited for

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something like that in this and then when I got there,

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I was just like, this is kind of dull. I

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didn't have that visceral reaction that you did at the

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beginning when the two died because I just didn't care

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that much. But how it ultimately played out, I was

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just like, Eh, this is kind of a letdown. That's it.

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Speaker 3: So I'm turning sixteen this year. But I do remember

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going to the movies to see Alien three with my buddies.

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I didn't love it the way I love it now, because,

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like you, I was expecting more of Aliens. But I

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remember us walking out and one of my buddies going,

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holy shit, they killed Hicks and Newt the little Girl,

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and I'm like, no, holy shit, they killed Ripley. I

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remember just leaving kind of stunned at the big risks

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that the movie took at the time, and not really

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feeling okay with them, but also still thinking like, Okay,

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that was that was different. That was not what I expected.

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It's not what I thought I was walking into. But

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I still still dig it.

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Speaker 4: I still like it, all right. So it's it's our

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job to untangle the mass of problems that happened on

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this picture.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, what do you got for us? Man? Okay, so

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we get done with Aliens. It's a massive monumental success, right,

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mind blowingly good. Whole lot of people saying it's better

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than the first one. Right, it's an yes, Jason among

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those folks.

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Speaker 4: Absolutely.

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Speaker 1: And by the way, guys, if you haven't heard our

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Alien Versus Aliens episode, it's one of my favorites. We

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talk about Dan O'Bannon and his journey to get this thing.

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By the way, I sent a text to you, guys.

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I was watching Alien three on Hulu and no less

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than three times did the advertisement give me an advertisement

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for medication for Crohn's disease. I was like, seriously, guys,

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do you get the joke here? I mean, not only

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did it inspire the author to have the chest burst scene,

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but it also killed him. Yeah, yeah, how about that?

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So that was a little weird too. In our episodes,

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we talked about all of the stuff behind Alien Aliens

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and those two pictures and which one we like better

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of the two. Now, I'm not going to go into

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all of that. We just know that after Aliens, we

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have got a winner on our hand. Right, We have

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got a series that potentially is getting better as it

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goes along, right, and a following that is mirroring that

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of like Star Wars or Star trek I didn't realize

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how big the franchise follow in this world are, but

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there's a lot of them that are hardcore as much

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as Trekki's or what do they call these guys xenomorphs,

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what do they call for xenaheads? Xenophiles?

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Speaker 4: I don't know, but John Reid is one of them.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, John is another Aliens three apologist, right he is.

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Speaker 4: We'll hear from here a little bit.

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Speaker 1: So Brandywine is the production company. You have Geiler and

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you have Hill, the two main guys of brandy Wine.

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They're the guys that are the force behind the movie

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at the outset, and so they've got this property on

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their hands, and Fox is like, let's make another one, guys,

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and they are genuinely not that interested. What yeah, what right?

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Speaker 5: Right?

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Speaker 3: Doesn't make sense?

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Speaker 1: Well, so it's not that they disliked the franchise. They

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just thought, and this is a reasonable thought, they thought,

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we want to make something new and different, and if

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we're going to do something with Alien, we want it

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to be new and different. And we don't know what

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to do. We've had horror, we've had action. What do

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we do next? And so they're like, okay, let us

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give this to a young on fire writer and see

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what he can do with it. And so they give

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it to a guy that we've talked about before, mister

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William Gibson, the guy who in the early eighties brought

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us Neuromancer, the whole idea of cyberpunk. They say, hey,

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we want you to write a script not just for

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part three, but for parts three and four back to back.

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Speaker 4: Yeah. So they approached James Cameron, and James Cameron said, listen,

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I'm working on the Abyss right now, but if you

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get Ridley Scott to do part three, I'll do part four.

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Speaker 1: Yes, So do that? Right?

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Speaker 4: Is that a no brainer of no brainers?

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Speaker 1: Right? So you know what they did, They actually made

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the right choice. They went to Ridley Scott. The problem

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was Ridley was interested, but he was too busy as well.

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He had other things going on and they wanted to

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get this out. While I say, while the iron is hot,

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this is late eighties, this is we haven't got to

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the nineties either, right, and this is late eighties that

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they're trying to get this problem solved. So he's not interested.

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But they've got William Gibson working on the script and

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he comes up with what he calls space commis hijack

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alien eggs. You get a big problem in a mall world.

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Speaker 3: Okay. So what happens in his.

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Speaker 1: Script is the Silaco is boarded and towed to a

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place called Anchor Point. And so that's why you'll sometimes

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hear about the Anchor Point script. This is William Gibson's

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original script. And I told you guys, ultimately he produces

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this as an audiobook. He gets Michael Bean to come

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in and voice, He gets Lance Hendrickson to come in

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and voice. I mean this is decades later, so Lance

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Hendrickson sounds like one hundred and five year old man.

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But it's out there. If you guys want to hear

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the William Gibson version of this script. You can download

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the audio book.

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Speaker 4: The fact that Hicks has lines I'm already liking this better, well.

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Speaker 1: That was his big deal. So what happens in this

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script is that Hicks becomes the protagonist. Ripley makes a

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cameo appearance at the beginning, and then basically go into

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a coma. Hicks becomes the guy who's the driving force

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behind the plot of the movie, and he discovers that

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I'm sorry, the Wiland Yanni Corporation Wayland Utani. Yeah, that's

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why I'm not gonna say it, because they get it

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wrong every time. All my vows mixed up. I'm just

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going to call them the WY Corporation, all right. Or

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the company finds out that the WY Corporation is manufacturing aliens,

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and one of the guys who's helping in the manufacturer

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knows this is a bad idea, and he basically tells Hicks,

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you have to go back to the source of the

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aliens in order to stop them. And so it becomes

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this mission to go back to the home world. And

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again it's more like Aliens, where you've got the marines,

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heavy action. Let's go to the alien home world. And

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kick some ass.

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Speaker 4: Sounds great, Let's make it now.

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Speaker 1: Like I said, this was late eighties and so this

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was largely kind of allegorical for the Cold War. And

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so he gives this script to Hill and Geiler of

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Brandywine and they look at it and they're like, Okay,

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it's good, but now it's kind of missing something. And

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what they're thinking is it's missing the cyberpunk, which is

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the reason we hired you in the first freaking place.

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He's just basically written an Alien's Part two. So what

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they do, of course, what they always do, They say, Okay,

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we can't get Ridley Scott. We need to find another director.

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And so the first guy that they go to is

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Rennie Harlan because he has just finished with Nightmare on

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Elm Street Part four, which was a Nightmare on Elm

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Street back right. It was very well received Nightmare on

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Elm Street. But Rennie only sticks around so long. By

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the way, I'll ask this question, now, have you guys

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seen the other alien movies? Like I've seen Alien Aliens,

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Alien three, and about three quarters of Alien Resurrection. And

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then when she had the Alien Baby, I walked out

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of the theater. My popcorn was empty, or I would

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have thrown it at the screen.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I have actually seen them all. I own them all,

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with exception to the Alien Versus Predator spinoff movies that

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that happened because I'm not a fan of those. My

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feelings for them mirror Jason's feelings for Alien three.

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Speaker 4: Yes, I have seen them. I'm like a heroin addict

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who keeps going back and trying to get that high,

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and I have yet to find anything coming close to

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nineteen eighty six.

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Speaker 1: Well, I really feel like there's hope because last year

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Prey came out. I mean I would have felt the

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same way about Predator and all its incarnations, and then

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we got Prey and it was fan for fantastic.

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Speaker 4: That's true.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so there's always hope. There's always hope that they

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will really resurrect the Alien series. So anyway, I just

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know from reading about it that this going back to

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the Home World. They kind of recycled that for Prometheus, right, Yes,

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give me a little bit of it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, Yeah, those movies suck too, but keep going.

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Speaker 3: Well, they didn't suck that, okay, So they suffer from

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the same thing that I think Alien three suffers from

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is the allegiance to the Cameron Aliens film, which is stellar.

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I love it. It's an awesome sci fi action war film.

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But it was time to do something different. And while

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we're on the William Gibson script, because Jason, I know

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you said you love you love the idea, let's go.

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Let's think about two things. First off, do you really

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want to retread of Aliens? And secondly, remember, as d

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pointed out, Sigourney Weaver's Ripley character, she is pretty much

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the whole movie. She's in a coma. And why would

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Sigourney Weaver sign off on something like that. Well, that's

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because she was still upset with Fox over how they

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treated the Aliens cut, because they cut out a bunch

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of our backstory, which is thankfully available and the director's

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cut of that film. So she was like, sure, I'll

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show up and take a nap and just not do anything.

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Speaker 4: Fine, I don't want to get us off track, but

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let me just address what you're saying right there. I

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don't want to retread of Aliens, but I think back

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to there's like this alternate universe where we could have

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had a movie where Hicks is the protagonist and he's

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kicking butt. You know, we're not living in Ripley's unended nightmare,

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So I think that there's there were just bad decisions made,

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But I don't want to get off on that.

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Speaker 1: Keep going well and and just to touch on it,

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you know, I feel like she is a key factor.

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She's a force in this storyline. But her perspective, I

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think I share her perspective on it, Sigourney Weaver's perspective,

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which is, where's my character going to go from here?

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I mean, she's gone from blue collar worker to basically

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Lieutenant Ripley leading and fighting the alien one on one,

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becoming a mother figure when she had been very much

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a solo figure before, right, even without the backstory, right,

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And so she's like, I don't really know where else

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this character is gonna go. And that's why she's good

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to go to sleep for two thirds of the movie.

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And then maybe she comes back at the end and

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she's you know, God from the Machine or the Savior

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or whatever, and that's great. But to have her be

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absent from so much of the movie, when she's such

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a key part, it's kind of tricky. It's could be

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hard to pull off. So they said William Gibson try

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it again. He said, I'm done. Thanks, guys, appreciate you.

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So before Rennie leaves, before Rennie Harlan leaves, he says,

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check out Eric Red. He can help you out with

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the rewrites, and so Eric Red takes it.

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Speaker 4: Eric Redd is the writer of The Hitcher, which Jack

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on your podcast. That movie is spectacular.

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Speaker 3: Love that movie, Eric Red. Now listen if you're leaving

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Gibson behind, Eric Redd is a great way to go

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because in addition to The Hitcher, Let's not forget, he

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does one of the coolest vampire films ever, which happens

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to Starlance Hendrickson. This is the guy behind Near Dark.

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Speaker 1: His version kills everyone and has an entire new set

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of characters fight the Aliens, talk about the worst of

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both worlds. He not only kills Ripley right off the bat,

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he kills Hicks and Newt as well. Right they're all

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gone and there's an entirely new fight and it takes

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place you're ready for this in a small town America

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in space, which, of course, because you guys have seen it,

301
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you know, they recycled this for Aliens Versus Predator Part two. Yeah,

302
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when they got that They're like, you're fired. I mean

303
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you killed everyone, right, Yeah, no, get the heck out

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of here. So they fire him. So both Harlan and

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Red are gone. So they hired David Toohey, who is

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the guy who did Chronicles of Ritic. They hire him

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to improve on William Gibson's original script. But by this time,

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the Cold War is over. It can't be your source

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material anymore because communism has fallen. So Tooey turns Anchor

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Point into a space station that is populated by convicts. Yeah,

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and so okay, so we're seeing the beginnings of what

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we know will be the ultimate end. Again, the WY

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Corporation is conducting illegal experiments on the inmates. At this point,

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Joel Roth, who is the president of Fox Studios, says,

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wait a minute, did you guys say you don't have

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Ripley in the first two thirds of the movie. Yeah,

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that's not going to be okay, you'd need to put

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her back in. And so this, of course is what

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switches and why Hicks gets killed off, which obviously Michael

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Bean is not happy about that. I mean he's been

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involved in this process the whole time. He thinks, oh,

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I'm going to become the star of the show and

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then he's told no you die in the opening credits.

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Speaker 4: Not only is he not happy about it, he's megapisted.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well so. And then Sigourney Weaver comes onto the

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set because they're they're doing stuff.

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Speaker 4: They're like, they're building set, they're.

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Speaker 1: Building sets, they're doing special effects, and she calls up

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Michael Bean and she's like, hey, uh, did you give

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them permission to like create a dummy of you? And

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he's like, what are you talking about. She's like, I

332
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was there and they have a full on chest burster

333
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explosion dummy model with your face on it. And so

334
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he gets on the horn with his agent and he's like,

335
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no fucking way, man, and they're like, how about if

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we pay you? And he says not all of the

337
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money in the world. When I'm listening to him say this,

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he goes, I was very young and stupid at that moment.

339
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And so what we get is this kind of grainy

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when we see the movie, you don't see his face,

341
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but it's not recognizable as him.

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Speaker 4: Right in the movie, there's like a steel beam that

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goes through his face.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you can't see his face at all?

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Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, yeah, well you can't in the theatrical cut.

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Now in the assembly cut in two thousand and three,

347
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it is, you know, and again it's a cleaner you know.

348
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They went in, they cleaned up the movie. They did,

349
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they did a lot more work on it before they

350
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released it. And while you can't see that it is

351
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Michael Bean, you can see what might have been left

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of Michael Bean. And it's a gruesome shot because you

353
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get a better the whole salvage operation of getting the

354
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survivors there is much more clear, and his jaw is

355
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kind of he gets impaled, and his jaw's kind of

356
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like hanging like a skew, and it's pretty pretty, pretty gruesome.

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Speaker 1: Eventually, the studio calls him back and they say, okay,

358
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we're not going to use a model of you. We

359
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would like to use your picture. And so he's smartened

360
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up a little bit by this time, and he's like,

361
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lots of money, give me lots and lots of money.

362
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They end up paying him almost as much money for

363
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the use of his picture as they did for the

364
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first movie he was in.

365
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Speaker 3: I had the opportunity to meet him a couple months ago.

366
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Fascinating guy, a lot of fun to talk to, I

367
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knew that this was a source subject, so I steered

368
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clear of it. We never aliens never even came up

369
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until we were leaving, and he was. He was gracious

370
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enough to say, hey, if your listeners want something, let

371
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him know.

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Speaker 1: This.

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Speaker 3: My favorite character that I ever played when we're talking

374
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about a hero character is Corporal Hicks. I love that character.

375
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I wish I could have done more with him.

376
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Speaker 4: And I heard him talking about this. This is like

377
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David Fincher's first duty as director. They're like, hey, mister director,

378
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call Michael Bean and tell him that we're killing him off.

379
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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh.

380
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Speaker 4: So he's like okay, and they're like, oh, by the way,

381
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ask him if we can.

382
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Speaker 1: Use his picture.

383
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Speaker 4: So David Fincher is like, you know, he's a young

384
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guy and this is an opportunity to make a blockbuster

385
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sequel and he's happy to have the job. Excuse me,

386
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mister Michael Bean, this is David Fincher. I know you

387
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don't know who I am, but I've directed music videos

388
00:19:00,079 --> 00:19:03,480
on MTV. You've probably seen you know who Madonna is. Right,

389
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we're gonna kill off your character. And Michael Bean said,

390
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if you and if you guys for doing this to

391
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me and just like went on a tirade, you know.

392
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Dave Fincher's like, okay, all right, well how about a

393
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picture no if you you know, And it was just

394
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one of those phone calls.

395
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Speaker 1: Yeah, they've they've at least got Weaver, who is, like

396
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I said, only kind of partially interested in it in

397
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the first place, right, and really bought in because she thought,

398
00:19:26,880 --> 00:19:29,359
I'm only going to be in the third act, right,

399
00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:31,480
That's the only part I have to worry about. But

400
00:19:31,599 --> 00:19:34,519
they are saying, okay, well, we're going to give you

401
00:19:34,599 --> 00:19:36,720
five million dollars, but you do have to be in

402
00:19:36,759 --> 00:19:40,799
the whole movie. And so after that offer, she says, okay,

403
00:19:40,880 --> 00:19:43,480
I have two conditions. The story has to be better

404
00:19:43,480 --> 00:19:52,200
than it is right now and no guns. I'm sorry,

405
00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:57,279
what what? And there's this famous bit where like during

406
00:19:57,319 --> 00:20:01,400
the production of Aliens, she called James Cameron over and

407
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she's like, hey, I get excited when I read a script,

408
00:20:04,240 --> 00:20:06,440
and I don't necessarily read all of the side notes.

409
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I'd kind of just read my lines and other people's lines,

410
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and I didn't really realize how much gun play was

411
00:20:12,599 --> 00:20:15,359
involved in this, and I'm not really comfortable with it.

412
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I am anti gun and James Cameron says, you should

413
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probably read the side notes.

414
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Speaker 4: Okay, so let's talk about this for a second, because

415
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that's one of the major problems with this movie is

416
00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:31,839
they play hide and seek for two hours. There's nothing

417
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going on, in my opinion, just just running around the

418
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idea that your lead actor can have that kind of

419
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influence and pull out there's no weapons, there's no real guns.

420
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That's just stupid. Somebody should have stood up to her

421
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and said no, no.

422
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Speaker 1: I don't have any problem with the complicating factor of

423
00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:53,240
there are no guns. I mean, in real prisons here

424
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in the US today, even if you are law enforcement,

425
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you cannot go into the prison with a firearm. They

426
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don't let it happen. So it makes sense on a

427
00:21:02,839 --> 00:21:06,319
prisoner world that they wouldn't have firearms. But it's not

428
00:21:06,359 --> 00:21:09,960
as though those are the only weapons that exist. I mean,

429
00:21:10,039 --> 00:21:12,839
in the first movie, you've got flame throwers if you

430
00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:15,119
want to pull up Prey for example. You've got bows

431
00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:18,759
and arrows, you've got spears, you've got clubs. You've got

432
00:21:18,799 --> 00:21:21,559
all kinds of weapons that you can find a way

433
00:21:21,559 --> 00:21:23,799
to use creatively. And they just didn't do a really

434
00:21:23,799 --> 00:21:24,440
good job.

435
00:21:24,240 --> 00:21:28,720
Speaker 3: Of that on this respectfully, I have to disagree while

436
00:21:28,759 --> 00:21:31,559
I agree with Sigourney here, if not for anything else,

437
00:21:31,680 --> 00:21:35,039
it levels the playing field because in the first movie,

438
00:21:35,319 --> 00:21:39,000
like Jason said, we've got flamethrowers. Yeah, the Nostromo has

439
00:21:39,039 --> 00:21:43,359
an intelligent crew that can at least use the technology

440
00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:46,599
they have to create weapons. And then we up the

441
00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:50,240
stakes in aliens because now we've got the colonial Marines.

442
00:21:50,279 --> 00:21:52,839
We've got all the pulse rifles in the world. And

443
00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:55,480
that's a good thing because now we've got a whole

444
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hive of these things running around. So again the playing

445
00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:01,519
field was level. Now we come to the third one,

446
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and if we know the idea is we're going back

447
00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:07,799
to basics. We're going back to the one loan alien

448
00:22:07,839 --> 00:22:10,400
that's gonna hunt the people on Fury one six one.

449
00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:12,319
We can't have all these guns because it's it's not

450
00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:14,920
a fair fight, and it's not the tension, isn't there

451
00:22:15,000 --> 00:22:18,079
for for someone like me, I I feel like, Okay, yeah,

452
00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:20,519
it's a prison, and she points out, you know it's

453
00:22:20,559 --> 00:22:23,039
a prison, Where's where's the weapons? And like d said,

454
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in a real prison, you do not have weapons because

455
00:22:26,079 --> 00:22:28,200
it's it's a safety threat. Because if the if the

456
00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:30,440
prisoners get ahold of them, then you've got a real problem.

457
00:22:30,519 --> 00:22:33,279
So I love the idea of them going we don't

458
00:22:33,319 --> 00:22:35,759
have weapons, we don't have anything. Nothing works. You know,

459
00:22:35,799 --> 00:22:39,720
this is a defunct, you know, mining operation, and we're

460
00:22:39,759 --> 00:22:42,079
just the guys that are here as the Steward's you know,

461
00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:44,480
keeping keeping the lights on. I think it works for

462
00:22:44,519 --> 00:22:45,200
that that reason.

463
00:22:52,039 --> 00:22:55,480
Speaker 1: I think that there's I think there is definitely an

464
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opportunity to be creative that they but they missed it

465
00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:01,200
and missed the opportunity to be care or on Writer

466
00:23:01,319 --> 00:23:04,200
number three at this point David Towey, and now he's

467
00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:07,400
got the task of writing it the way that Sigourney

468
00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:11,640
Weaver wants it, and he's modifying writer number one script,

469
00:23:11,799 --> 00:23:16,799
so he rewrites William Gibson's script with zero Guns. But

470
00:23:16,839 --> 00:23:20,839
they still don't have a director yet because thet's he left,

471
00:23:21,319 --> 00:23:25,359
So they approach Vincent Ward. Vincent Ward has just done

472
00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:29,000
The Navigator. He's a young hot shot and so they're like,

473
00:23:29,119 --> 00:23:31,599
we want you to come on and direct, and at

474
00:23:31,599 --> 00:23:34,400
first he's like, no, I'm good. And if you look

475
00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:37,119
at his body of work, I can't imagine him doing

476
00:23:37,279 --> 00:23:41,759
a big budget studio picture like this. It's not his style.

477
00:23:42,079 --> 00:23:45,119
But he ultimately comes back and he says, listen, I'll

478
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:47,359
do it, but I want to be able to rewrite

479
00:23:47,359 --> 00:23:49,720
it with my own ideas. He tells what some of

480
00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:52,200
those ideas are, and they're like, yeah, those sound great,

481
00:23:52,599 --> 00:23:55,079
let's do that. And so he says, all right, I

482
00:23:55,119 --> 00:23:58,640
got a writing partner. His name is John Fossano. That's

483
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:02,680
writer number four, keep and tally here including Sigourney Weaver

484
00:24:02,759 --> 00:24:05,359
as part of the writing I don't know. Yeah, okay,

485
00:24:05,599 --> 00:24:07,759
So he comes in to help him turn out a

486
00:24:07,759 --> 00:24:11,759
full script. But part of what writers do, not just

487
00:24:11,799 --> 00:24:14,480
as a professional courtesy, but as just kind of a

488
00:24:14,559 --> 00:24:18,799
requirement with the WGA. If you're rewriting another writer script,

489
00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:21,400
you call and you let them know what's going on. Well,

490
00:24:21,440 --> 00:24:24,160
the problem is they had not mentioned to David Tooey

491
00:24:24,599 --> 00:24:28,160
that they were having his script rewritten. So Fassano calls

492
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:33,160
Tuey and Twoy has no idea. He calls Fox and

493
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:37,839
they flat out lie to him. They're like, uh no, no, no, no,

494
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:43,640
the Faisano's working on Alien four, Alien four and two.

495
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:46,440
He's like, okay, all right. He calls Fasano back and

496
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:50,759
Fasano's like, no, I'm working on Alien three, I assure you,

497
00:24:51,319 --> 00:24:54,319
And so he calls Fox back again and they're like yeah, okay,

498
00:24:54,359 --> 00:24:56,559
so no, no, yeah, you're right, you're right, but we

499
00:24:56,599 --> 00:25:01,240
will still use your script for part four, and Tuey

500
00:25:02,039 --> 00:25:06,119
throws a hissy fit and just says, I'm just going

501
00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:08,880
to satisfy my contract. I'm going to finish this script

502
00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:10,960
and then screw you guys, I'm going home. Yeah that's

503
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:14,519
the fourth writer we've lost so far. Okay. So Ward

504
00:25:14,519 --> 00:25:17,440
and Fersano they come up with a script that has

505
00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:21,079
a wooden space station, a wooden planet, if you will.

506
00:25:22,079 --> 00:25:24,880
That's no moon, it.

507
00:25:24,839 --> 00:25:26,480
Speaker 4: Does it looks like a wooden dusk star.

508
00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:29,839
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's no moon. It's a terrarium.

509
00:25:32,279 --> 00:25:36,400
Speaker 1: They change it to a wooden space station and monks

510
00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:40,920
who are anti technology living on this wooden space station.

511
00:25:41,759 --> 00:25:45,880
And then the monks believe that Ripley is sent to

512
00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:48,640
them as a test of their faith, and the alien

513
00:25:49,039 --> 00:25:52,599
is sent to them as punishment for their sins. And

514
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,000
again we have some of this carry over into the

515
00:25:55,039 --> 00:25:59,880
actual movie, but apparently there was with Ward and Fasano's script,

516
00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:04,400
there was a lot more Judeo Christian imagery and according

517
00:26:04,440 --> 00:26:07,359
to the fan base, according to the Xenophiles, If you Will,

518
00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:12,160
it is regarded as one of the best screenplays never made.

519
00:26:12,319 --> 00:26:13,880
I don't know if I'm going to go out and

520
00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:16,400
agree with that. If you've got a wooden space station

521
00:26:16,799 --> 00:26:20,640
and monks fighting the alien sounds like a yawnfest to me,

522
00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:24,000
But I haven't read it, so I don't know. So

523
00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:28,200
now they say, okay, we like your script, but Ripley

524
00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:33,480
has to live at the end. And Asano's like, uh,

525
00:26:33,839 --> 00:26:37,319
thought she wanted to die. They like, we don't care

526
00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:41,519
what she wants. She has to live. And so he's like, okay,

527
00:26:42,079 --> 00:26:46,200
hang up, call Sigourney. Uh yeah, they said they want

528
00:26:46,240 --> 00:26:49,920
you to live. She says, if I do not die

529
00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:52,440
at the end, I am not doing any more on

530
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:56,960
this movie. And so he, I guess, tries to split

531
00:26:57,000 --> 00:27:02,680
the difference. And so his solution is she dies almost

532
00:27:03,079 --> 00:27:06,759
like the alien's like coming up. The monk has given

533
00:27:06,799 --> 00:27:09,799
her some sort of herbal serum, and she hasn't eaten

534
00:27:09,799 --> 00:27:13,279
the whole movie, right, Like she's basically pregnant with this

535
00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:17,640
alien in her Yeah, and the monk gives her this

536
00:27:18,039 --> 00:27:21,000
serum which is going to cause her to vomit up

537
00:27:21,039 --> 00:27:24,839
the alien and then he takes it into himself and

538
00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:27,680
then sends her off of the planet to let the

539
00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:29,720
planet burn and kill the alien.

540
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:33,079
Speaker 4: These people should all be fired. These are all terrible ideas.

541
00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:37,240
Speaker 3: I think this guy was probably just hung up on

542
00:27:37,279 --> 00:27:39,960
an ending and maybe was watching The Exorcist the night

543
00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:41,720
before it's due and goes, hey, that's a good idea.

544
00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:44,279
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'll just great idea.

545
00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:47,119
Speaker 3: Yeah. Well no, I'm just talking like, all right, well

546
00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:50,440
the demon is inside the person, I'll get it out.

547
00:27:50,559 --> 00:27:52,279
I'll take it into me and then I'll kill myself,

548
00:27:52,519 --> 00:27:54,880
you know, thut myself down a flight of steps, or

549
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:56,440
I'll burn down a monk's planet.

550
00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:56,839
Speaker 5: You know.

551
00:27:57,000 --> 00:27:58,279
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a terrible.

552
00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:01,839
Speaker 1: Idea, right, well, so you know who else thoughts so Fox,

553
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:04,799
and they're like, wooden planet is a terrible idea. Let's

554
00:28:04,839 --> 00:28:08,200
do something else. And Ward is like, no, wooden't planet.

555
00:28:08,279 --> 00:28:10,759
I am dying on this hill. And they say, okay,

556
00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:14,880
they're dead. Yeah, so there you go, Director number I

557
00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:18,519
don't know, I've lost count is gone. They get rid

558
00:28:18,599 --> 00:28:20,480
of the writer that came on with him as well,

559
00:28:20,519 --> 00:28:24,000
of course, and they go to yet another writer, mister

560
00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:32,079
Larry Ferguson, who brought us Beverly Hills Cop three pu Yeah,

561
00:28:32,200 --> 00:28:35,440
so they bring him on, takes he takes another swing,

562
00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:39,680
and he churns one out in only two months and

563
00:28:40,039 --> 00:28:45,960
everyone loved it. No wait, I'm sorry, hated it. Everyone

564
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:51,079
hated it, and he immediately gets fired. So at this

565
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:54,960
point they have got a multitude of scripts, different drafts

566
00:28:55,039 --> 00:28:58,839
of all of them. So Geiler and Hill basically take

567
00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:02,400
all of these scripts and just start cutting and pasting

568
00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:06,039
and ripping and shreading and trying to put a Frankenstein's

569
00:29:06,039 --> 00:29:11,680
Monster together to make one good script. And so we

570
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:16,039
are once again no director, no writer. What do we do?

571
00:29:17,000 --> 00:29:20,559
Bring in David Fincher. Why because he is one of

572
00:29:20,599 --> 00:29:24,559
the greatest directors of all time. No, because he is

573
00:29:24,599 --> 00:29:26,000
somebody that we can push around.

574
00:29:26,319 --> 00:29:29,079
Speaker 3: They expect a yes man when they get this guy.

575
00:29:29,319 --> 00:29:32,079
Speaker 1: Now, his big claim to fame was that he had

576
00:29:32,319 --> 00:29:37,920
just won the Video Music Award from MTV for one

577
00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:41,960
of his music videos. They bring him on to do

578
00:29:42,079 --> 00:29:44,440
a follow up movie to two of the biggest movies

579
00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:48,319
of all time. Oh, by the way, five weeks until

580
00:29:48,319 --> 00:29:52,079
shooting has to begin, we have ten drafts of three

581
00:29:52,359 --> 00:29:58,200
unfinished screenplays that nobody likes and seventeen million dollars of

582
00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:01,480
your fourteen million dollars dollar b it has already been spent.

583
00:30:02,319 --> 00:30:05,640
Oh yeah, they've also built the set based on the

584
00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:08,079
Ward and Fasano script, which we're not using.

585
00:30:08,319 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 4: That's a terrible way to come into a job. Yeah.

586
00:30:11,599 --> 00:30:14,319
Now here's the thing. We all know David Fincher on

587
00:30:14,319 --> 00:30:20,039
this side of history, right, Fight Club, Panic Room, Social Network, seven.

588
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:22,000
Speaker 1: Gone Girl, Girl, The Dragon Tattoo.

589
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:27,319
Speaker 4: Yes, I mean, brilliant, unbelievable movies. He's a talented guy,

590
00:30:27,680 --> 00:30:32,640
he's a smart guy. This is a toxic situation.

591
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:37,319
Speaker 1: Right, and so with this toxic situation, the logical conclusion

592
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:40,279
as the director is, they're gonna give me some more

593
00:30:40,359 --> 00:30:43,759
time to fix this multitude of problems. Right, They're gonna

594
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:46,119
they're gonna let me get this. You know, they're gonna

595
00:30:46,119 --> 00:30:47,839
push things out so that I can get this done.

596
00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:51,599
But here's the problem. The trailer had already been released, yes,

597
00:30:52,039 --> 00:30:55,200
long before, and ladies and gentlemen, if you'd like to

598
00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:58,960
go watch the original trailer for Alien three, you are

599
00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:02,160
going to be in incredibly surprised at what they have.

600
00:31:02,799 --> 00:31:08,920
Speaker 2: In nineteen ninety two, we would discover on Earth, everyone

601
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:12,880
can hear you scream?

602
00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:16,039
Speaker 4: Yeah, so I just watched it clearly indicating that this

603
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:17,480
battle is going to happen on Earth.

604
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:22,079
Speaker 1: Yeah. The tagline for the trailer was on Earth, everyone

605
00:31:22,119 --> 00:31:24,400
can hear you scream.

606
00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:27,480
Speaker 4: Listen. Okay, stop right there. That's the best idea that

607
00:31:27,519 --> 00:31:30,160
they've had the entire time they've been working on this. Yeah,

608
00:31:30,359 --> 00:31:32,960
get this thing going on Earth. This would be amazing.

609
00:31:33,119 --> 00:31:34,079
Speaker 1: Yeah, it still would be.

610
00:31:34,119 --> 00:31:37,880
Speaker 4: They could make this today. I'd go see them. Let's go, right.

611
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:41,680
Speaker 1: I mean, if your part three is the Aliens come

612
00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:43,680
to Earth, and then you know that you're coming into

613
00:31:43,759 --> 00:31:46,240
part four and you give us a to be continued

614
00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:49,599
ending where it's like the only way that we can

615
00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:52,119
defeat them is we have to go to their homeworld,

616
00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:56,000
and so part four takes place on xenomorph world.

617
00:31:56,079 --> 00:31:56,640
Speaker 4: Sounds great.

618
00:31:56,759 --> 00:31:59,359
Speaker 1: Yes, those are two fantastic movies that don't seem like

619
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:00,720
they'd be that hard to write.

620
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:02,720
Speaker 3: You know what the problem with this is the three

621
00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:05,440
of us aren't in the writer's room. That's right, nineteen two,

622
00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:06,039
that's right.

623
00:32:06,039 --> 00:32:08,240
Speaker 1: Because they would wait, what a order, backing this thing

624
00:32:08,319 --> 00:32:12,599
throughout the whole process here. Gosh, So the trailer had

625
00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:16,880
already set the release date. So Fincher comes into this

626
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:20,319
toxic waste dump, like you've said, and he has one

627
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:24,559
year to get everything shot edited. He didn't even have

628
00:32:24,599 --> 00:32:27,759
a finished script. He says, will you give me ninety

629
00:32:27,799 --> 00:32:32,759
three days for principal photography? Studio says seventy. James Cameron

630
00:32:32,839 --> 00:32:35,640
had over twice as much time. Keep in mind, he

631
00:32:35,799 --> 00:32:39,160
had Terminator under his belt at this point, right, Fincher

632
00:32:39,279 --> 00:32:43,039
had the Vogue video.

633
00:32:47,039 --> 00:32:49,240
Speaker 4: That's great video, by the way, it is good, but

634
00:32:49,359 --> 00:32:51,119
it's hardly Aliens, right.

635
00:32:51,319 --> 00:32:51,799
Speaker 1: True.

636
00:32:52,119 --> 00:32:55,519
Speaker 4: Fincher said to all directors, hey, listen, don't take a

637
00:32:55,559 --> 00:32:58,640
project like this unless you've got something big under your belt.

638
00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:01,319
Cameron had Terminator, and he could push back and say, no,

639
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:04,720
I'm not doing this. Fincher head the Vogue video, It's

640
00:33:04,759 --> 00:33:05,960
not happening, right.

641
00:33:06,079 --> 00:33:09,240
Speaker 1: So then this is where the problems really begin. It

642
00:33:09,359 --> 00:33:11,519
was not with the cast and crew. Everybody on the

643
00:33:11,559 --> 00:33:14,839
cast absolutely loved Fincher. They revered him. They were like,

644
00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:17,640
this dude has got it together. He knows what he's doing.

645
00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:21,000
He's doing brilliant new things. Sigourney Weaver was talking about

646
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:23,039
the first time that they met and they have this

647
00:33:23,119 --> 00:33:26,440
long talk about the script, and so at the end,

648
00:33:26,599 --> 00:33:30,039
she's like about to leave and she's like, so, how

649
00:33:30,039 --> 00:33:33,000
do you see my character in all of this? And

650
00:33:33,079 --> 00:33:37,720
he says, I don't know, bald and she says, I

651
00:33:37,799 --> 00:33:39,279
fell in love with him at that moment.

652
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:42,799
Speaker 3: Everyone was falling in love with this guy though, because

653
00:33:42,839 --> 00:33:45,240
for all the problems that he was dealing with with

654
00:33:45,279 --> 00:33:48,000
the studio, he wasn't bringing it to the workplace. He

655
00:33:48,039 --> 00:33:49,599
wasn't bringing it to set. This is the guy that's

656
00:33:49,640 --> 00:33:51,759
like twenty six, twenty seven years old. You know. One

657
00:33:51,759 --> 00:33:54,079
thing I always think about is like Terry Rollins, who

658
00:33:54,160 --> 00:33:56,440
was the editor on this movie, him and the crew,

659
00:33:56,640 --> 00:34:00,200
they talked about how this guy he knows actors, he

660
00:34:00,359 --> 00:34:03,279
likes actors. He was walking around the set going, hey,

661
00:34:03,599 --> 00:34:06,359
I'm influenced by Hitchcock and john Ford and wait till

662
00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:08,440
you see this shot is going to be a Hitchcock shot,

663
00:34:08,519 --> 00:34:10,079
or this SHOT's gonna be a Fod shot. They're eating

664
00:34:10,159 --> 00:34:12,400
him up. They love him, and I think that says

665
00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:14,519
a lot about his character. He can come into such

666
00:34:14,519 --> 00:34:17,519
a mess and not let it bleed out and deal

667
00:34:17,519 --> 00:34:19,039
with the career. Because they're all like, oh, yeah, we

668
00:34:19,079 --> 00:34:20,719
had a great time on the film. We had no

669
00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:22,280
idea all these problems were existing.

670
00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:25,199
Speaker 1: So yeah, I got to tell you that, knowing what

671
00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:27,760
he came into at this point, knowing what he came

672
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:31,400
into and seeing the movie that he put out that

673
00:34:31,519 --> 00:34:35,480
he had so little control over, I have all the

674
00:34:35,519 --> 00:34:38,239
admiration in the world for him, and I am impressed

675
00:34:38,559 --> 00:34:41,159
that it is actually as good as it is and

676
00:34:41,159 --> 00:34:43,360
that it got released in the first place. And he

677
00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:45,800
even talks about that. He's like, you would think that

678
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:48,519
the studio would want to put out the best product

679
00:34:48,559 --> 00:34:51,519
that they can, but what is more important to them

680
00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:53,400
is just that it be released.

681
00:34:53,519 --> 00:34:55,519
Speaker 4: I'm with you. I don't put any of this on Fincher.

682
00:34:55,639 --> 00:34:58,159
In fact, I think it's admirable the job that he did.

683
00:34:58,280 --> 00:34:59,960
In fact, I'd like to talk to you guys about

684
00:35:00,119 --> 00:35:02,000
a few things that I think they got right.

685
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:04,119
Speaker 1: This is perfect time to talk about it. Okay, I

686
00:35:04,119 --> 00:35:05,800
was just about to hit that spot in my notes.

687
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:08,639
Speaker 4: Okay, Well, my number one thing is what did they

688
00:35:08,639 --> 00:35:09,519
get right? Number one?

689
00:35:09,599 --> 00:35:10,039
Speaker 1: Not much?

690
00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:13,280
Speaker 4: Okay, not much, But in my opinion, here's what they

691
00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:17,760
did right. Sigourney Weaver. She is a great actress. We

692
00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:23,079
love Ripley. They brought her back. Number two David Fincher. Yes,

693
00:35:23,159 --> 00:35:26,199
they handcuffed him. I mean, they made life impossible for.

694
00:35:26,199 --> 00:35:26,760
Speaker 1: Him to work.

695
00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:30,920
Speaker 4: But he is a brilliant director and ultra talented. They

696
00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:33,599
got lucky, I think. And then some of the effects

697
00:35:33,679 --> 00:35:36,639
I thought were really good, particularly the close ups of

698
00:35:36,639 --> 00:35:38,960
the aliens I thought looked great. Some of the other

699
00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:41,280
stuff it looked like a marionette. I didn't like all

700
00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:43,800
the effects, but the close ups. In the tone of

701
00:35:43,840 --> 00:35:46,639
the movie I thought was dark and scary for the

702
00:35:46,679 --> 00:35:49,159
most part. That's all I got. I mean, Jeff, what

703
00:35:49,199 --> 00:35:50,679
did they do right in your eyes?

704
00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:54,719
Speaker 3: Well, in addition to Sigourney Weaver and David Fincher, the

705
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:58,519
main villain for me in this movie is the studio execs. However,

706
00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:02,119
I'll give them credit because they knew how to market

707
00:36:02,119 --> 00:36:03,679
a movie. And I'm not talking about the bait and

708
00:36:03,679 --> 00:36:06,079
switch they do with this teaser, this little thirty second

709
00:36:06,119 --> 00:36:09,000
teaser where on Earth everyone can hear you scream. I'm

710
00:36:09,039 --> 00:36:11,840
talking about what they did with Fincher's work. Let's think

711
00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:13,679
about this for a quick second. I think there's three

712
00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:16,880
iconic images when you talk about the Alien franchise, and

713
00:36:17,039 --> 00:36:18,320
you could just put them up on a screen and

714
00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:20,679
everyone goes, ooh, I know that. If it's alien, we're

715
00:36:20,679 --> 00:36:23,559
talking about the cracked egg. Right. If it's aliens, I

716
00:36:23,599 --> 00:36:26,840
always think of Ripley. She's got Newton one arm, she's

717
00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:28,000
got a pulse rifle in the other.

718
00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:28,559
Speaker 1: Yeah.

719
00:36:28,639 --> 00:36:32,039
Speaker 3: Okay, this is the one that is probably one of

720
00:36:32,079 --> 00:36:35,079
the more terrifying iconic images because I'm talking about that

721
00:36:35,159 --> 00:36:38,599
tight shot, that close up of the alien right in

722
00:36:38,639 --> 00:36:43,000
Sigourney Weaver's face, and it's amazing because he says, Hey,

723
00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:45,400
we're gonna do this this. The execs say, no, we're not,

724
00:36:45,519 --> 00:36:47,159
don't do that. We don't want to ever see a

725
00:36:47,199 --> 00:36:49,239
face to face with them. He says, hell with these guys.

726
00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:51,320
He shoots it anyways, and then it gets back to

727
00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:53,119
him and then they go ooh, we love it.

728
00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:56,519
Speaker 1: Right he snuck away and did it handheld himself.

729
00:36:57,000 --> 00:37:00,559
Speaker 3: Yeah. I mean, this guy's awesome. So you know, I

730
00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:02,960
give him full credit for it, but I give the

731
00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:05,519
marketing team credit for saying this is what's going to

732
00:37:05,599 --> 00:37:07,199
put butts in the seat. One thing I think they

733
00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:12,320
definitely got right is Tom Woodriff Junior, who plays the alien. Now,

734
00:37:12,519 --> 00:37:15,079
this is a situation where Jason, you mentioned like, hey,

735
00:37:15,119 --> 00:37:17,719
the close ups, the shots look good, the movement of

736
00:37:17,760 --> 00:37:20,119
the alien itself. This is a situation where for the

737
00:37:20,159 --> 00:37:22,480
first time it's got a little bit of a character.

738
00:37:22,639 --> 00:37:25,199
And we can thank Sigourney Weaver for that because according

739
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:28,679
to Woodriff, who was just a visual effects guy, he

740
00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:32,400
takes the job of playing quote unquote the alien and

741
00:37:32,440 --> 00:37:34,559
she says, she pulls him aside. She says, hey, don't

742
00:37:34,559 --> 00:37:36,360
be a guy in a suit, be an actor.

743
00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:37,239
Speaker 4: Act.

744
00:37:38,079 --> 00:37:41,079
Speaker 3: So he gives this this creature a little bit of

745
00:37:41,079 --> 00:37:43,320
personality for the first time ever. We got to remember

746
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:45,880
this is one of the last films shot with the

747
00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:48,199
old school optics, you know, before everything goes digital. The

748
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:50,840
rod puppets that they use for the dog alien as

749
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:53,800
it's known, and a lot of those are Woodroff just

750
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:55,880
jumping around and jumping out of corners. They got it

751
00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:57,920
right when they let him give the creature a little

752
00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:01,000
bit of personality. And then the last thing they got right, well,

753
00:38:01,159 --> 00:38:02,599
one of the last things I think they got right,

754
00:38:02,719 --> 00:38:07,480
this nihilistic, desolate atmosphere. Ripley is just she's how much

755
00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:10,199
more trauma can one person take? And I think that

756
00:38:10,320 --> 00:38:13,719
the location kind of ups the Annie once again and

757
00:38:13,760 --> 00:38:16,400
puts her in a really nasty environment where she's now

758
00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:19,800
Ripley's going up against the alien, she's going up against inmates,

759
00:38:20,320 --> 00:38:22,559
and she's got to go up against the company. You know,

760
00:38:22,599 --> 00:38:24,960
waylan Utani is waiting there as like the final boss,

761
00:38:25,119 --> 00:38:26,119
you know, for her to defeat.

762
00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:28,760
Speaker 1: Every good thing I have to say about this probably

763
00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:34,079
has to do with David Fincher, because this movie does

764
00:38:34,119 --> 00:38:37,000
not look like any of the other Aliens. Like you,

765
00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:41,440
it has not the same look. Granted, Aliens seemed like

766
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:44,079
a far cry from what Alien was, but it is

767
00:38:44,239 --> 00:38:48,039
nothing compared to how different Alien three looks than all

768
00:38:48,079 --> 00:38:50,079
of the other movies. You got to credit him with

769
00:38:50,119 --> 00:38:53,159
that because it's not just the set design, which is fantastic.

770
00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:57,440
He does these camera angles that are bizarre. I mean,

771
00:38:57,480 --> 00:39:01,119
he's he's got stuff from floor shots up and it's

772
00:39:01,199 --> 00:39:04,559
not stuff that you see in Scott's or Cameron's visions.

773
00:39:04,760 --> 00:39:07,960
It is his own ideas and it's cool. And he's

774
00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:10,599
the guy who gives us the xenomorph camp, you know,

775
00:39:10,639 --> 00:39:14,320
the kind of weird fish eye running through the hallways.

776
00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:17,440
It's great. It's like Jaws. It's like the sharp vision

777
00:39:17,599 --> 00:39:19,920
in Jaws. I loved it. I thought it was perfect.

778
00:39:20,039 --> 00:39:23,400
It raises the steaks. You see the guys running away

779
00:39:23,480 --> 00:39:26,320
in fear, which is more terrifying most of the time

780
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:29,039
than actually seeing the monster chase them. Even with the

781
00:39:29,079 --> 00:39:32,519
part that you hate, Jason, it is that every act

782
00:39:32,559 --> 00:39:36,599
of destruction is an act of creation. It's without without

783
00:39:36,639 --> 00:39:41,320
destroying Newt and Hicks, you don't have the storyline that

784
00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:44,280
gives us the entire movement. And then I also will say,

785
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:48,039
you know, great job to these actors because they all

786
00:39:48,039 --> 00:39:53,119
have shaved heads, and they almost all have British or

787
00:39:53,199 --> 00:39:57,960
Irish or some UK accent, and they're all distinct even

788
00:39:58,039 --> 00:40:00,800
though they've got that. It's I mean, there are some

789
00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:02,960
that I'm like, okay, this is a wash. I don't

790
00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:05,199
know which guy this is. But there are a handful

791
00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:09,000
of guys that set themselves apart as we are characters

792
00:40:09,079 --> 00:40:11,960
beyond just the bald head and the different accent.

793
00:40:12,679 --> 00:40:14,719
Speaker 4: Okay, once again, I would say that that's a terrible

794
00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:18,199
decision made by the execs or the people in charge.

795
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:21,599
The actors did the best they could. But when everybody

796
00:40:21,679 --> 00:40:24,760
has that thick British accent, they're all white, they're all

797
00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:28,000
shaved heads, it is very difficult for me to tell

798
00:40:28,119 --> 00:40:29,360
anybody apart.

799
00:40:29,119 --> 00:40:32,480
Speaker 1: Let me finish my story. Go ahead, because even though

800
00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:36,360
when you think nothing else can go wrong, here's what happens. Right. So,

801
00:40:36,400 --> 00:40:40,159
we've lost writer after writer, director after director. We've had

802
00:40:40,199 --> 00:40:42,239
no wiggle room at all from the studio who's thrown

803
00:40:42,320 --> 00:40:46,039
us into a toxic waste situation. But hey, good news.

804
00:40:46,519 --> 00:40:50,679
We have got Jordan Croninwealth, the guy who gave us

805
00:40:50,719 --> 00:40:54,039
the cinematography for Blade Runner. We are bringing him in

806
00:40:54,079 --> 00:40:56,920
and he's going to be the DP for this show.

807
00:40:57,119 --> 00:41:01,159
Fantastic excited, the crew said. The cast and the crew said,

808
00:41:01,639 --> 00:41:04,320
this is the guy that David Fincher would speak to

809
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:07,880
with absolute reverence, like he was like a student at

810
00:41:07,880 --> 00:41:11,119
his feet. Just loved talking to this guy. The problem

811
00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:15,599
was is that the first assistant notices these little ticks

812
00:41:15,800 --> 00:41:18,800
that he's having, And because the first assistant's dad has

813
00:41:18,840 --> 00:41:23,199
passed away from Parkinson's, he realizes that Jordan cronin with

814
00:41:23,599 --> 00:41:28,000
is at the last stages of Parkinson's disease. And he says,

815
00:41:28,199 --> 00:41:30,719
you can't keep trying to fight this. I mean, think

816
00:41:30,719 --> 00:41:33,119
of all the things going wrong. You can't keep trying

817
00:41:33,119 --> 00:41:35,960
to fight this battle. You will kill yourself doing this.

818
00:41:36,280 --> 00:41:39,920
So Ultimately they lose cronin with and they bring in

819
00:41:40,239 --> 00:41:43,840
Alex Thompson, who's not bad. He had done Legend by

820
00:41:44,079 --> 00:41:47,119
Ridley Scott, so not a bad replacement. But they've lost

821
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:50,159
again a major player that seemed to be something that

822
00:41:50,239 --> 00:41:54,480
was on the positive category for this movie. So Fincher

823
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:57,800
starts arguing with Hill and Geiler about the script or

824
00:41:57,880 --> 00:42:02,039
the lack thereof John Lando, the executive, is involved in

825
00:42:02,079 --> 00:42:04,199
these arguments. You know, They're like, well, we'll go to Fox,

826
00:42:04,239 --> 00:42:06,400
and they go to Fox, and Lando's like, I agree

827
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:08,719
with Fincher's He's right, you guys are messing us up

828
00:42:08,719 --> 00:42:11,239
and screwed it up. And so finally Hill and Geyler

829
00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:13,679
are like, screw you guys. We'll go back home, and

830
00:42:13,760 --> 00:42:16,800
so they go back to La. So he doesn't Fincher

831
00:42:16,800 --> 00:42:19,800
doesn't have to argue with the Brandywine guys anymore. But

832
00:42:20,039 --> 00:42:23,159
now he has to justify every single take and every

833
00:42:23,159 --> 00:42:26,559
single expense that he's that he has with Landau, the

834
00:42:26,559 --> 00:42:29,360
Fox executive that used to be the guy, the Brandywine

835
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:31,440
guy's job. Now he's got to do it. So he

836
00:42:31,440 --> 00:42:34,559
would shoot all day long and then at midnight he'd

837
00:42:34,559 --> 00:42:37,519
get on the phone call Fox and start trying to

838
00:42:37,639 --> 00:42:40,039
persuade them to pay for what he wanted to shoot

839
00:42:40,039 --> 00:42:42,840
the next day. So now he and Landau are arguing

840
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:46,280
so much that Fincher just finally says, ship me back

841
00:42:46,280 --> 00:42:48,280
home and take my name off of this piece of

842
00:42:48,920 --> 00:42:53,400
Landau shuts down the production. He brings everybody back. They

843
00:42:53,480 --> 00:42:56,199
put together a rough cup and they say he's going

844
00:42:56,239 --> 00:42:57,960
to like, we're going to figure out what we're missing

845
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:00,400
and we're going to go from there. So there's three

846
00:43:00,559 --> 00:43:03,800
hours of footage in the rough cut. The studio says,

847
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:06,719
cut all the gore, and you've got all these subplots

848
00:43:06,760 --> 00:43:11,719
going on. They're confusing. Our test audience was confused. They

849
00:43:11,719 --> 00:43:13,639
don't mention that their test audience was a bunch of

850
00:43:13,639 --> 00:43:16,360
eighteen year old kids. They just said, too confusing. Let's

851
00:43:16,360 --> 00:43:19,119
get rid of those. Now they have to reshoot things

852
00:43:19,159 --> 00:43:22,519
because there's these giant holes in the plot because they've

853
00:43:22,519 --> 00:43:26,920
taken out the subplots. And Fincher says, okay, you give

854
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:31,320
me one day, one scene of shooting and I can

855
00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:38,679
fix it all. And the studio said no, no, and

856
00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:43,079
so they end up shooting some other scenes. Sigourney Weaver's

857
00:43:43,079 --> 00:43:45,199
hair has grown back at this point, she's wearing a

858
00:43:45,239 --> 00:43:48,920
bald cap through parts of the movie. Gosh. So finally

859
00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:51,639
Fincher is able. He's got all his footage, he's able

860
00:43:51,639 --> 00:43:54,639
to sit down, he's ready to start editing, and the

861
00:43:54,679 --> 00:43:56,519
studio says, oh, yeah, by the way, we need to

862
00:43:56,559 --> 00:44:00,679
have this under two hours runtime. And he's like, why,

863
00:44:01,679 --> 00:44:03,800
oh well, if we have it under two hours, they

864
00:44:03,840 --> 00:44:05,679
can show up more times in a day, and so

865
00:44:05,719 --> 00:44:08,639
that'll be more money from the theater. He puts his

866
00:44:08,639 --> 00:44:12,519
middle finger in the air and says, I'm gone, and

867
00:44:12,599 --> 00:44:16,599
he does not come back. During the promotion of the movie,

868
00:44:16,639 --> 00:44:20,280
he gave one interview where he complimented the cast and crew,

869
00:44:20,719 --> 00:44:24,920
complimented the special effects, and bit his tongue. He has

870
00:44:25,079 --> 00:44:28,639
never done any other press, no promotion, never even went

871
00:44:28,679 --> 00:44:31,480
to a screening of this movie. When they came to

872
00:44:31,559 --> 00:44:34,679
him to do the director's cut, he said, I'll do

873
00:44:34,760 --> 00:44:37,400
the director's cut if you let me burn the negative

874
00:44:37,519 --> 00:44:38,880
and reshoot the entire movie.

875
00:44:39,280 --> 00:44:45,519
Speaker 4: Yes, let's go. Okay, you've unleashed the tiger in me. Okay,

876
00:44:45,880 --> 00:44:47,639
I'm jeff I'm sorry if I'm stepping on you here,

877
00:44:47,679 --> 00:44:50,719
but I take solace in the fact that I hate

878
00:44:50,719 --> 00:44:55,119
this movie. Okay, I burn with passion against this movie.

879
00:44:55,320 --> 00:44:57,880
But I love the fact that David Fincher is out

880
00:44:57,880 --> 00:45:00,000
there and he says, you know what, I hate it more.

881
00:45:00,559 --> 00:45:02,960
I hate it more. I've even seen a quote where

882
00:45:02,960 --> 00:45:05,599
he says that in nineteen ninety two the La riots,

883
00:45:05,639 --> 00:45:07,719
the fires were coming close to the I hope the

884
00:45:07,760 --> 00:45:10,760
fires come close enough with it catches the negative on fire. Jeff,

885
00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:12,880
I'm sorry, I can't. I can't go with you, man,

886
00:45:12,960 --> 00:45:15,400
I can't. I can't go with you on this. Let's

887
00:45:15,480 --> 00:45:18,719
let's talk about what so we know what happened. Let's

888
00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:20,559
talk about the bad stuff in this movie.

889
00:45:21,199 --> 00:45:22,079
Speaker 3: Okay, let me.

890
00:45:22,079 --> 00:45:27,800
Speaker 4: Just start off with Newt. Hicks and Bishop are killed

891
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:30,360
in the first three minutes of this movie, literally in

892
00:45:30,400 --> 00:45:35,440
the opening credits. That totally screws the Cameron movie. The

893
00:45:35,519 --> 00:45:37,800
great victory at the end of the Cameron movie is

894
00:45:38,159 --> 00:45:42,400
Ripley saves Hicks, she saves Bishops, she saves Newt. They

895
00:45:42,440 --> 00:45:45,199
get off the planet and it explodes, and that's the

896
00:45:45,199 --> 00:45:48,039
great victory and it steals that from Aliens. So to me,

897
00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:50,920
it's impacts a movie that I love. Number two, I

898
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:53,800
think everybody else sucks like I. All the other characters.

899
00:45:53,840 --> 00:45:57,480
I care nothing about, even guy who plays Dylan. I

900
00:45:57,480 --> 00:46:00,199
mean Dylan's okay, Dylan does some stuff and then they

901
00:46:00,239 --> 00:46:01,840
run around and they play hide and seek the whole

902
00:46:01,840 --> 00:46:05,280
time and nothing happens, literally nothing. They just guys are

903
00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:06,159
getting picked off.

904
00:46:06,039 --> 00:46:06,559
Speaker 3: Here and there.

905
00:46:06,679 --> 00:46:09,000
Speaker 4: And then finally, you know, one of the things that

906
00:46:09,079 --> 00:46:11,679
bugged me is the hair thing. And I know this

907
00:46:11,760 --> 00:46:14,679
is a fincher deal. Sigourney Weaver shaves her head because

908
00:46:14,679 --> 00:46:17,960
they make one mention about space Liise, they never revisit it.

909
00:46:18,039 --> 00:46:21,320
There's no impact. We don't ever see them. Nothing ever

910
00:46:21,360 --> 00:46:23,679
happens with this. It's totally weird, and we get to

911
00:46:23,679 --> 00:46:27,000
look at a weird looking Sigourney Weaver the rest of

912
00:46:27,000 --> 00:46:27,440
the movie.

913
00:46:27,559 --> 00:46:31,000
Speaker 3: Man, I offer a rebuttal to you your three concerns.

914
00:46:31,440 --> 00:46:33,800
Speaker 4: I'm ready, man, Okay, help me, O got this movie.

915
00:46:34,760 --> 00:46:38,079
Speaker 3: I'll try. But but let me touch on the the

916
00:46:38,119 --> 00:46:41,440
three things you just mentioned. Okay, So there's nothing wrong

917
00:46:41,480 --> 00:46:43,679
with what you said about Aliens and what it does,

918
00:46:43,840 --> 00:46:46,360
but we have to remember Aliens. You know, it's a

919
00:46:46,360 --> 00:46:48,679
war movie in space. It's got the themes of the

920
00:46:49,159 --> 00:46:54,400
nuclear family and the heroic military saviors. It's a product

921
00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:56,679
of its time. It's a Reagan era thing where we

922
00:46:56,679 --> 00:46:58,440
were We love it. I mean I still love it,

923
00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:01,239
we all still love it, but we can't do that again.

924
00:47:01,360 --> 00:47:04,079
We can't just remake it. When Fincher comes along, the

925
00:47:04,119 --> 00:47:06,960
one idea that he shares with most of these writers

926
00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:09,400
and directors that were in the mix is we got

927
00:47:09,440 --> 00:47:12,079
to do something different. So while I hate the idea

928
00:47:12,079 --> 00:47:15,320
of Hicks meeting an unfortunate end, I understand why it

929
00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:17,000
had to happen. If we're not going to do the

930
00:47:17,119 --> 00:47:20,280
script with him leading the resistance against Whylan Utani, and

931
00:47:20,320 --> 00:47:22,239
we're not gonna do the script where he's on the

932
00:47:22,519 --> 00:47:24,880
anchor point, we had to do something new. And this

933
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:28,480
is what we get. With regards to the characters. You know,

934
00:47:28,559 --> 00:47:30,800
I think these are some of the coolest characters we

935
00:47:30,840 --> 00:47:33,599
can get in this franchise. Because, yeah, everyone's running around

936
00:47:33,639 --> 00:47:36,480
with the shaved head and their inmates that are kind

937
00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:40,159
of this religious sect. I get that, But I love

938
00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:44,400
Charles Dancing. This as the one soft person that Ripley

939
00:47:44,400 --> 00:47:47,440
can finally bond with after all the trauma. She could

940
00:47:47,480 --> 00:47:50,519
just have one moment of comfort with somebody, and Charles Dance.

941
00:47:50,679 --> 00:47:52,440
We know he's an inmate, but when we find out

942
00:47:52,920 --> 00:47:55,960
the story behind why he's there, you're like, yeah, it's bad,

943
00:47:56,000 --> 00:47:58,960
but it's not like he's a psychopath. It's not like

944
00:47:59,000 --> 00:48:02,079
he's a serial murder and rapist like Dylan, who is

945
00:48:02,079 --> 00:48:04,559
played amazingly by Charles S. Dutton. This is a situation

946
00:48:04,599 --> 00:48:06,519
where you got Charles and Charles. I love both these

947
00:48:06,519 --> 00:48:08,880
guys in this film. The moment where he has that

948
00:48:09,000 --> 00:48:11,719
scene in the mess hall after the funeral and she's

949
00:48:11,880 --> 00:48:13,800
offering thanks, and you know that whole you don't want

950
00:48:13,800 --> 00:48:15,960
to know me, lady. What she says to him, it

951
00:48:16,039 --> 00:48:18,440
lets me know, lets the audience know, Hey, you know what, Ripley.

952
00:48:18,559 --> 00:48:21,000
She might be damaged, but she is still very strong,

953
00:48:21,199 --> 00:48:23,800
she's still very cold, she's still very fearless because she

954
00:48:24,239 --> 00:48:27,079
delivers that line where you're like, what, that's how you're

955
00:48:27,079 --> 00:48:29,360
coming back to I'm a murderer and rapist of women.

956
00:48:29,679 --> 00:48:32,159
She's awesome in that moment. And lastly, with the lice.

957
00:48:32,400 --> 00:48:36,440
This is a situation where I might apologize for Alien

958
00:48:36,519 --> 00:48:41,159
three theatrical cut, but I will applaud the assembly cut

959
00:48:41,199 --> 00:48:43,199
because it's one of those things where you got you

960
00:48:43,199 --> 00:48:47,199
gotta remember there's like thirty three minutes of footage not

961
00:48:47,320 --> 00:48:49,840
in the movie that you haven't seen. It answers all

962
00:48:49,880 --> 00:48:52,360
the plot holes and it explains things, you know. It

963
00:48:52,400 --> 00:48:54,239
doesn't just clean up the movie and give it some

964
00:48:54,280 --> 00:48:58,199
better digital effects. Those missing scenes are paramount to the

965
00:48:58,239 --> 00:49:01,239
movie story. You would care more about Clemens, who's played

966
00:49:01,239 --> 00:49:03,960
by Charles Dance. There's a conversation that he has when

967
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:05,400
they're on the way to the morgue. It's a whole

968
00:49:05,400 --> 00:49:07,480
conversation about newt and it kind of lets you know, like, hey,

969
00:49:07,519 --> 00:49:09,559
this guy he means well, he's one of the good

970
00:49:09,559 --> 00:49:11,920
guys in this place, and you bond with him over

971
00:49:11,960 --> 00:49:15,800
that conversation. The opening is entirely different, you know, because

972
00:49:15,840 --> 00:49:18,239
again we see a little bit more of how the

973
00:49:18,280 --> 00:49:21,159
Sleucco gets into trouble. We see the crash, him finding

974
00:49:21,239 --> 00:49:23,800
Ripley on the beach is it just looks fantastic, And

975
00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:25,800
that's where you really get to see the life situation.

976
00:49:25,960 --> 00:49:29,320
This whole planet is infested with these large lice. And

977
00:49:29,360 --> 00:49:31,920
the fun fact they actually use you know, and you

978
00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:33,880
can see the lice and there it's gross. The fun

979
00:49:33,880 --> 00:49:36,719
fact here is that they actually use baby crickets for

980
00:49:36,800 --> 00:49:38,800
all those scenes. So every time they come in and

981
00:49:38,840 --> 00:49:41,199
they slough off their jackets and they're covered in lice.

982
00:49:41,320 --> 00:49:43,639
Or every time the dog or in the assembly cut,

983
00:49:43,679 --> 00:49:46,719
the oxen they're moving around, they're covered. You know, Ripley's

984
00:49:46,719 --> 00:49:49,480
covered in these little creepy crawly things. So you get

985
00:49:49,519 --> 00:49:51,159
a lot more of that and you understand that in

986
00:49:51,199 --> 00:49:52,800
the assembly cut. So it's again it's one of those

987
00:49:52,800 --> 00:49:54,760
things that everyone shaves their heads. Is it just the

988
00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:57,440
cool thing to do? Is it the look on Fury

989
00:49:56,920 --> 00:49:59,239
one six one? Or is there an epidemic? And it's

990
00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:01,239
it's because there's a serious problem with lice.

991
00:50:01,400 --> 00:50:03,440
Speaker 4: Interesting, So you get to see that in the assembly cut.

992
00:50:03,599 --> 00:50:07,360
Speaker 3: Yes, the movie, the assembly cut is superior to the

993
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:09,960
theatrical cut. While I'm not gonna tell you, I promise

994
00:50:10,039 --> 00:50:12,440
you'll love Alien three when you watch the Assembly cut,

995
00:50:12,480 --> 00:50:14,559
but I think you walk away from it going Okay,

996
00:50:14,719 --> 00:50:17,639
that wasn't bad, but still no Hicks, no money. You know,

997
00:50:17,800 --> 00:50:19,960
I'm still not happy. So because you're not gonna get

998
00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:21,159
Hicks in the assembly cut.

999
00:50:21,239 --> 00:50:24,199
Speaker 4: But there's no version where Hicks and Newton Bishop live.

1000
00:50:24,280 --> 00:50:27,280
Speaker 3: Huh No, the mega terrific happy ending for those guys

1001
00:50:27,559 --> 00:50:31,000
does not exist. And I'm sorry for that, but I

1002
00:50:31,039 --> 00:50:32,920
think if you if you had the chance to see

1003
00:50:32,920 --> 00:50:37,000
the assembly cut, some of your frustrations would be abated.

1004
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:39,280
Speaker 4: Okay, well, that's good, I'll check it out. I do

1005
00:50:39,400 --> 00:50:42,159
think just to rebut your rebut if at the beginning

1006
00:50:42,239 --> 00:50:44,639
of Return of the Jedi, if we started off in

1007
00:50:44,679 --> 00:50:47,320
the first three minutes of Return the Jedi we found

1008
00:50:47,360 --> 00:50:49,719
out that han Lea and Chui were killed off screen,

1009
00:50:49,800 --> 00:50:51,519
there would be rioting in the streets.

1010
00:50:52,039 --> 00:50:53,920
Speaker 3: Would you riot if Lando had been killed?

1011
00:50:54,320 --> 00:50:54,480
Speaker 5: No?

1012
00:50:54,760 --> 00:50:57,119
Speaker 3: Okay. The reason I make that point is because you're

1013
00:50:57,159 --> 00:51:00,000
talking about gloved characters that we have been with since

1014
00:51:00,000 --> 00:51:02,400
It's the beginning. Everyone you mentioned was in Star Wars

1015
00:51:02,559 --> 00:51:04,480
and then they were all an empire and we wanted

1016
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:06,159
them to come back in Jedi. We've been with Ripley

1017
00:51:06,159 --> 00:51:08,199
since the beginning, and these are a couple characters that

1018
00:51:08,239 --> 00:51:10,719
she picked up in the second movie. While we love them,

1019
00:51:10,920 --> 00:51:13,840
we haven't bonded with them the way we've bonded with Ripley.

1020
00:51:13,840 --> 00:51:16,639
I love Bishop, I love Hicks, and I love Newt,

1021
00:51:16,639 --> 00:51:18,920
but I didn't have the same connection to them the

1022
00:51:18,920 --> 00:51:21,599
way I did with Ripley because I've been with Ripley

1023
00:51:21,639 --> 00:51:22,880
since the Nostromo.

1024
00:51:23,000 --> 00:51:25,280
Speaker 1: Here's my two cents on that opening three minutes. Okay,

1025
00:51:25,400 --> 00:51:29,280
I don't have a problem with the death of major

1026
00:51:29,599 --> 00:51:32,039
characters in the movie. I think it raises the stakes

1027
00:51:32,039 --> 00:51:34,360
of the movie. You know, spoiler alert for the new

1028
00:51:34,440 --> 00:51:36,719
Star Wars movies, even though they're years old at this point.

1029
00:51:36,880 --> 00:51:40,360
Like I started crying before Hans Solo died because I

1030
00:51:40,400 --> 00:51:42,519
knew it was about to happen, and I still loved

1031
00:51:42,559 --> 00:51:45,960
it because it was special and meaningful. They could have

1032
00:51:46,519 --> 00:51:50,000
killed off Newt and Hicks in the first twenty five

1033
00:51:50,079 --> 00:51:52,519
minutes instead of the first three minutes, and it would

1034
00:51:52,519 --> 00:51:55,119
have been a much more compelling story. But what they

1035
00:51:55,119 --> 00:51:57,239
did instead is they do it in the opening credits.

1036
00:51:57,320 --> 00:51:59,760
I think, probably largely not to have to pay people

1037
00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:02,800
to come back and be actors. The other problem that

1038
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:05,679
I have with the first three minutes is you immediately

1039
00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:09,960
see the alien. This is ultimately based on a horror movie.

1040
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:13,719
You can't show the monster in the first thirty seconds

1041
00:52:13,840 --> 00:52:16,280
of the movie. There's got to be mystery. There's got

1042
00:52:16,280 --> 00:52:18,719
to be a question mark. If the ship had crashed

1043
00:52:18,920 --> 00:52:21,800
and their pods were wrecked and we didn't really know

1044
00:52:21,880 --> 00:52:24,880
what had happened, and there were signs that were curious,

1045
00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:27,239
but we don't really know whether this is a result

1046
00:52:27,239 --> 00:52:31,000
of the wreck or is this alien acid, blood or whatever.

1047
00:52:31,119 --> 00:52:33,880
And then you've got the other question mark of have

1048
00:52:34,039 --> 00:52:36,920
they been infected, have what's gone on with them? And

1049
00:52:36,960 --> 00:52:39,840
do we ultimately lose them along the way, which they

1050
00:52:39,880 --> 00:52:42,719
did well with Ripley, but they could have easily done

1051
00:52:42,760 --> 00:52:47,039
with the entire crew there, and then potentially we lose

1052
00:52:47,320 --> 00:52:50,599
Newt and Hicks in that first act. But it's not

1053
00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:55,199
an outrage because you're given closure. You're not suddenly faced

1054
00:52:55,239 --> 00:52:58,320
with the immediate death of people who you had grown

1055
00:52:58,360 --> 00:53:00,960
attached to and were rooted four at the end of

1056
00:53:01,119 --> 00:53:01,719
part two, I.

1057
00:53:01,639 --> 00:53:03,679
Speaker 4: Totally agree with that. If there had been a mystery

1058
00:53:03,920 --> 00:53:06,440
and you know, crash landing and here are the bodies

1059
00:53:06,480 --> 00:53:08,519
and they're in a coma or whatever, and you know

1060
00:53:08,559 --> 00:53:10,960
they've got a hookup Bishop to find out what happened,

1061
00:53:11,039 --> 00:53:13,280
that would have been better. I wrote this down. So

1062
00:53:13,559 --> 00:53:15,760
at one oh nine into the movie you have the

1063
00:53:15,800 --> 00:53:18,079
opening of an alien egg, which number one, how did

1064
00:53:18,079 --> 00:53:20,199
in the freak did that alien egg get on the ship?

1065
00:53:20,880 --> 00:53:24,039
At one twenty six, Newts glass breaks. Okay, at four

1066
00:53:24,039 --> 00:53:27,320
minutes and twenty five seconds, Newt drowns and Hicks dies

1067
00:53:27,360 --> 00:53:30,599
when the ship crashes into the ocean. John Reid actually

1068
00:53:30,639 --> 00:53:32,159
made a joke with me. I told him I was like,

1069
00:53:32,280 --> 00:53:34,760
I was out at that point. I was done. I

1070
00:53:34,880 --> 00:53:37,880
was out of the movie. He said, So in your case,

1071
00:53:38,199 --> 00:53:41,400
Alien the Little Three stood for three minutes before I

1072
00:53:41,440 --> 00:53:44,800
was done with the movies. Yep, Alien Three.

1073
00:53:45,079 --> 00:53:45,719
Speaker 1: I love John.

1074
00:53:46,840 --> 00:53:49,440
Speaker 4: I told you I have a softball metaphor for you

1075
00:53:49,519 --> 00:53:52,679
on this Okay, So my softball metaphor for this movie

1076
00:53:52,800 --> 00:53:55,000
is you were coming off one of the best movies

1077
00:53:55,039 --> 00:53:57,559
of the nineteen eighties. The bases are loaded. Oh by

1078
00:53:57,559 --> 00:53:59,639
the way, the count's three to zero. All we need

1079
00:53:59,719 --> 00:54:01,519
is one run to win the game. You don't have

1080
00:54:01,519 --> 00:54:03,079
to hit a home run, and you swing at a

1081
00:54:03,079 --> 00:54:04,960
bad pitch and you ground out to the picture. This

1082
00:54:05,039 --> 00:54:09,000
is what this is. It is a horrible, blown opportunity.

1083
00:54:09,039 --> 00:54:11,360
I told you, it's not just that the movie's bad.

1084
00:54:11,480 --> 00:54:15,199
It's that it destroys a line and a character and

1085
00:54:15,239 --> 00:54:18,239
a movie that I loved. And to me, they committed

1086
00:54:18,280 --> 00:54:23,519
the unforgivable sin the first three minutes the end, huh.

1087
00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:24,800
Speaker 3: Let me ask you a question.

1088
00:54:24,800 --> 00:54:27,920
Speaker 4: Tell us how you really, but let me ask you

1089
00:54:27,920 --> 00:54:28,360
a question.

1090
00:54:28,599 --> 00:54:31,639
Speaker 3: Yeah, Okay, let's let's go to the alternate universe where

1091
00:54:31,639 --> 00:54:33,679
we can watch the movies that we want to watch. Yes,

1092
00:54:33,880 --> 00:54:36,360
because what the danger there is that there's certain movies

1093
00:54:36,360 --> 00:54:39,400
that don't exist because of decisions made here. Right.

1094
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:40,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, So let's.

1095
00:54:40,679 --> 00:54:44,440
Speaker 3: Say Fincher is a yes man, and let's the studio

1096
00:54:44,840 --> 00:54:48,079
bully him around and make the movie that they think

1097
00:54:48,400 --> 00:54:50,920
should be made. Okay, Or I'll do you one better.

1098
00:54:51,039 --> 00:54:53,199
Let's say he's a yes man and we get one

1099
00:54:53,239 --> 00:54:56,320
of the multiple scripts where Hicks is saving the day.

1100
00:54:56,440 --> 00:54:59,599
So now you've got basically you've got an alien's reducs

1101
00:54:59,760 --> 00:55:02,440
with Fincher at the helm. Okay, and it probably is awesome.

1102
00:55:02,480 --> 00:55:05,559
It probably we're today years later, we're probably talking about

1103
00:55:05,559 --> 00:55:07,559
how it was pretty awesome. But I mean it's kind

1104
00:55:07,559 --> 00:55:10,159
of like aliens say, the same way that The Force

1105
00:55:10,199 --> 00:55:12,639
Awakens is basically Star Wars all over again.

1106
00:55:12,920 --> 00:55:13,079
Speaker 2: Right.

1107
00:55:13,360 --> 00:55:15,800
Speaker 3: I feel like that's what Fincher would have done. Now,

1108
00:55:15,920 --> 00:55:18,320
if that would have happened, I think we miss out

1109
00:55:18,400 --> 00:55:21,599
on the Fincher that we love today. If Fincher goes

1110
00:55:21,599 --> 00:55:23,840
down that road, then we don't get seven, we don't

1111
00:55:23,840 --> 00:55:27,840
get the social network, we don't get all of these great, dark, nihilistic,

1112
00:55:28,239 --> 00:55:31,920
gritty David Fincher films that we love him for. If

1113
00:55:31,960 --> 00:55:35,960
he gives us the Colvin cut of Alien three, I don't.

1114
00:55:35,960 --> 00:55:36,880
I don't think it happens.

1115
00:55:37,079 --> 00:55:37,280
Speaker 2: Man.

1116
00:55:37,440 --> 00:55:42,039
Speaker 4: You're asking me to choose between myself and David Fincher's career.

1117
00:55:42,719 --> 00:55:45,639
That's tough, man, because I love his nineties work.

1118
00:55:45,679 --> 00:55:47,440
Speaker 3: Think of the greater good here Jason.

1119
00:55:48,960 --> 00:55:50,960
Speaker 4: Calvin Cutt goes by the wayside.

1120
00:55:51,320 --> 00:55:54,199
Speaker 1: I think it's obvious in listening to the cast talk

1121
00:55:54,239 --> 00:55:57,159
about him that he was already This movie wasn't going

1122
00:55:57,199 --> 00:56:01,159
to destroy him, but it obviously hit him pretty hard.

1123
00:56:01,199 --> 00:56:03,719
I mean, this came out in ninety two. He had

1124
00:56:03,760 --> 00:56:06,920
a TV episode to go direct after this, and that

1125
00:56:07,079 --> 00:56:10,000
was all he had. But fortunately somebody threw a script

1126
00:56:10,039 --> 00:56:13,840
on his desk called seven Yeah, and so thank the

1127
00:56:13,880 --> 00:56:17,360
Lord that that one got greenlit before before he decided

1128
00:56:17,360 --> 00:56:19,840
to go do something else. But I think the lessons

1129
00:56:19,840 --> 00:56:22,880
that he got from this movie probably made him not

1130
00:56:23,119 --> 00:56:26,440
just a great director, but made him We're talking about

1131
00:56:26,599 --> 00:56:30,239
classic for history. This guy is going this guy's is

1132
00:56:30,400 --> 00:56:32,519
it should be in any top ten list of all

1133
00:56:32,559 --> 00:56:33,760
of the directors of all time.

1134
00:56:33,840 --> 00:56:35,719
Speaker 4: I think there's a case to be made. That really

1135
00:56:35,760 --> 00:56:38,199
Scott made one of the best movies of the seventies,

1136
00:56:38,280 --> 00:56:40,519
James Cameron made one of the best movies of the eighties,

1137
00:56:40,760 --> 00:56:43,519
and that David Venture made the best movie.

1138
00:56:43,239 --> 00:56:47,280
Speaker 1: Of the nineties, the best, the best. You're calling seven

1139
00:56:47,400 --> 00:56:48,840
the best movie I've seen?

1140
00:56:49,000 --> 00:56:51,000
Speaker 4: It is in the conversation Wow.

1141
00:56:51,199 --> 00:56:53,679
Speaker 3: I had the opportunity to speak with Dayton Johnson on

1142
00:56:53,719 --> 00:56:56,559
the docum based seventy seven podcast about seven. I can't

1143
00:56:57,159 --> 00:56:59,159
rightfully say it might be the best movie of the

1144
00:56:59,199 --> 00:57:02,400
nineteen nineties, but it is absolutely in the conversation. I

1145
00:57:02,440 --> 00:57:04,760
remember what I was wearing when I left the theater

1146
00:57:04,920 --> 00:57:08,199
with my co host Brad Kozo, and we just walked

1147
00:57:08,239 --> 00:57:10,320
out of the theater and there was about ten minutes

1148
00:57:10,320 --> 00:57:13,800
of silence because we couldn't believe the ending to seven

1149
00:57:13,800 --> 00:57:14,480
that we just saw.

1150
00:57:14,559 --> 00:57:16,360
Speaker 1: I felt the same way about Light Club.

1151
00:57:16,760 --> 00:57:18,599
Speaker 4: All Right, guys, we got anything more to say about

1152
00:57:19,039 --> 00:57:19,920
Alien three.

1153
00:57:19,840 --> 00:57:22,119
Speaker 1: Well, at least we know what the heck happened.

1154
00:57:22,239 --> 00:57:25,679
Speaker 3: I'll go on banging the drum for Alien three, primarily

1155
00:57:25,719 --> 00:57:29,119
the assembly cut, because it really capped off a great

1156
00:57:29,400 --> 00:57:32,280
what I feel would be a good trilogy for this franchise,

1157
00:57:32,320 --> 00:57:35,480
because the first time out, we got a haunted house

1158
00:57:35,519 --> 00:57:38,320
movie in space, and the second time out we got

1159
00:57:38,320 --> 00:57:41,119
a war movie in space. And this third time out,

1160
00:57:41,119 --> 00:57:44,199
they said, let's pick a new sub genre. And they said, okay,

1161
00:57:44,239 --> 00:57:48,000
how about prison drama in space? And it works. You know,

1162
00:57:48,360 --> 00:57:51,639
from the cold gray white of the first movie to

1163
00:57:51,719 --> 00:57:54,719
the cool, hazy blues of the second movie, we devolve,

1164
00:57:54,760 --> 00:57:58,199
I should say, into this Cipia tone, these yellows and browns,

1165
00:57:58,360 --> 00:58:01,880
and it's grimy and Finnure gives us a situation where

1166
00:58:01,960 --> 00:58:04,119
it's claustrophobic and we want to get out just as

1167
00:58:04,159 --> 00:58:06,400
bad as Ripley does. And for that, I think it's

1168
00:58:06,400 --> 00:58:06,920
a good movie.

1169
00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:09,239
Speaker 1: I'll tell you this. When I got done with it,

1170
00:58:09,400 --> 00:58:11,280
I literally I saw it in the theater. I have

1171
00:58:11,400 --> 00:58:14,360
not seen it since then until I watched it yesterday.

1172
00:58:14,519 --> 00:58:17,719
At the end, when she's throwing herself into the fire,

1173
00:58:18,039 --> 00:58:22,000
I thought, how the heck do we get Alien Resurrection?

1174
00:58:22,239 --> 00:58:24,960
So I actually keep in mind, this is one of

1175
00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:27,599
the very few movies that I walked out of. Yeah,

1176
00:58:27,800 --> 00:58:31,639
I put Alien Resurrection on to see what they did,

1177
00:58:31,960 --> 00:58:35,599
and some no name guy named Joss Whedon wrote this

1178
00:58:35,719 --> 00:58:41,119
ridiculous script and I watched for the I probably watched

1179
00:58:41,119 --> 00:58:46,159
it for five minutes and I see them growing a ripley.

1180
00:58:46,199 --> 00:58:48,239
I'm like, well, of course it was a clone. Yeah,

1181
00:58:48,320 --> 00:58:51,480
she predicted that when when asked about what's going to

1182
00:58:51,519 --> 00:58:52,960
happen if they kill you at the end of this, Oh,

1183
00:58:53,000 --> 00:58:56,079
I'm sure I didn't really die, or somebody's going to

1184
00:58:56,119 --> 00:58:58,920
clone me. And she does end up getting cloned, and

1185
00:58:59,079 --> 00:59:04,360
somehow the clone of her also has the alien baby

1186
00:59:04,480 --> 00:59:06,920
still in it. I could have walked out at that point.

1187
00:59:07,079 --> 00:59:13,400
I'd like, what what it produces, the parasite that was

1188
00:59:13,440 --> 00:59:15,719
implanted in from her? What?

1189
00:59:15,920 --> 00:59:18,360
Speaker 3: I want to be careful because I know I'm dangerously

1190
00:59:18,360 --> 00:59:21,960
close to to explaining or defending alien resurrection and I

1191
00:59:22,000 --> 00:59:26,000
am not here to do that. I said, I owned

1192
00:59:26,000 --> 00:59:28,559
the movie, and I own it that for the same

1193
00:59:28,599 --> 00:59:31,239
reason I own Superman The Quest for Peace. It's part

1194
00:59:31,280 --> 00:59:35,159
of the box set. Okay, doesn't mean I'm gonna watch it.

1195
00:59:35,320 --> 00:59:37,840
I had to take with the rest of them had Yeah,

1196
00:59:37,880 --> 00:59:39,840
it was they're handing them out. I had to take it.

1197
00:59:39,880 --> 00:59:42,519
But the whole idea, and I don't like the idea,

1198
00:59:42,639 --> 00:59:45,280
but we have to remember when Clemens is, you know,

1199
00:59:45,480 --> 00:59:48,039
attending to her, you know, he does take blood you

1200
00:59:48,039 --> 00:59:50,599
know he does. You know he does what a surgeon's

1201
00:59:50,639 --> 00:59:55,280
going to do. So the blood sample has Ripley's DNA

1202
00:59:55,880 --> 00:59:59,679
and the xenomorph DNA, and that's how you get this

1203
01:00:00,480 --> 01:00:02,719
ridiculous I'm not I know you shake. I see you

1204
01:00:02,719 --> 01:00:05,320
shaking your head, and I'm not telling you. Hey, it's

1205
01:00:05,320 --> 01:00:07,480
a good idea. I'm just I'm just trying to clarify. Well,

1206
01:00:07,679 --> 01:00:09,679
you know, it had the DNA of both, and that's

1207
01:00:09,679 --> 01:00:13,800
how you get this. So, you know, so superhero Ripley, we've.

1208
01:00:13,679 --> 01:00:18,239
Speaker 1: All forgotten that the xenomorphous blood is acid. Did we

1209
01:00:18,280 --> 01:00:21,360
forget that part? Oh? Yeah, this is the same as

1210
01:00:21,559 --> 01:00:25,800
human blood with chromosomes, just like every other thing, except

1211
01:00:25,840 --> 01:00:28,159
that it burns through everything.

1212
01:00:28,920 --> 01:00:35,400
Speaker 3: What hey, I'm not here to teach xenomorphinatomy. I can't

1213
01:00:35,440 --> 01:00:38,079
speak to that. I got one more thing. COVID COLVID

1214
01:00:38,119 --> 01:00:39,920
did not make me aware of the b biology on

1215
01:00:39,960 --> 01:00:40,599
this episode.

1216
01:00:42,480 --> 01:00:44,639
Speaker 4: I got one more thing for you guys. Okay, So,

1217
01:00:44,880 --> 01:00:48,400
after watching Aliens a billion times, I find it hard

1218
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:53,159
to believe that the mother alien could poot you out

1219
01:00:53,159 --> 01:00:56,559
a couple of eggs that somehow got inside the escape

1220
01:00:56,599 --> 01:01:00,559
ship that ends up killing Newton Hicks and all this problems. Right,

1221
01:01:00,800 --> 01:01:02,800
I'm not buying it from the get go. I'm like, no,

1222
01:01:02,880 --> 01:01:06,000
that's bull crap. The eggs. She didn't have time to

1223
01:01:06,199 --> 01:01:09,800
lay eggs inside the ship. Okay, So here's a theory

1224
01:01:09,800 --> 01:01:14,239
that I saw on the internet. Bishop actually placed the

1225
01:01:14,280 --> 01:01:16,800
eggs there, that he was a double agent for the

1226
01:01:16,840 --> 01:01:20,920
company the whole time and managed to save those eggs,

1227
01:01:21,159 --> 01:01:23,679
and that Bishop is actually a bad guy.

1228
01:01:24,079 --> 01:01:30,360
Speaker 3: I col hate that. No, Na, not after what he did,

1229
01:01:30,400 --> 01:01:33,000
not after the sacrifice he made for Ripley and new

1230
01:01:33,360 --> 01:01:35,559
I'm not buying that that dog won't hunt.

1231
01:01:36,559 --> 01:01:39,119
Speaker 4: I don't like it either, But somehow those eggs got

1232
01:01:39,119 --> 01:01:39,920
inside that ship.

1233
01:01:39,960 --> 01:01:44,719
Speaker 1: Well, guys, you've heard our take on Alien three. I

1234
01:01:45,119 --> 01:01:49,400
am middle of the road. Jeff is a defender. Jason

1235
01:01:49,679 --> 01:01:55,119
is an eviscerating hater. Imagine the scene between the Queen

1236
01:01:55,239 --> 01:01:58,360
and Bishop at the end of a That is how

1237
01:01:58,440 --> 01:02:03,239
Jason feels about Alien three. But we have our dear

1238
01:02:03,280 --> 01:02:08,519
friend Joan Reid from the thirty something Movie podcast who

1239
01:02:08,599 --> 01:02:11,559
has an opinion on this as well. To hear his thoughts.

1240
01:02:11,679 --> 01:02:13,920
Speaker 5: Hey, everybody, this is John Reid from the thirty something

1241
01:02:14,079 --> 01:02:16,519
Movie Podcast. Thank you so much. Jason and Dee for

1242
01:02:16,639 --> 01:02:18,159
invite me to come on and send you all a

1243
01:02:18,239 --> 01:02:20,960
surely showcase for Alien three as part of your what

1244
01:02:21,000 --> 01:02:24,280
the heck Happened comparison with Last Action Hero. I'm going

1245
01:02:24,360 --> 01:02:26,239
to start off real quick by saying thanks a lot,

1246
01:02:26,280 --> 01:02:29,559
guys for giving me what maybe two to three minutes

1247
01:02:29,559 --> 01:02:31,400
to talk about one of my favorite movies, when you

1248
01:02:31,599 --> 01:02:33,760
know I could talk for two to three hours. My

1249
01:02:33,880 --> 01:02:36,719
history with the Alien franchise is I watched Alien with

1250
01:02:36,760 --> 01:02:38,840
my dad when I was a kid, I watched Aliens

1251
01:02:38,840 --> 01:02:41,159
with friends, and then when Alien three was coming out,

1252
01:02:41,199 --> 01:02:43,280
I was actually living in England, so it was being

1253
01:02:43,360 --> 01:02:45,559
filmed over there. There were comics, there were books, there

1254
01:02:45,559 --> 01:02:48,679
were behind the scenes features, there were live events, all

1255
01:02:48,760 --> 01:02:53,239
kinds of stuff. I was hooked on the Alien franchise immediately.

1256
01:02:53,920 --> 01:02:57,480
What do I love about Alien three? I love the performances.

1257
01:02:57,559 --> 01:03:01,719
Charles S. Dutton as Dylan is amazing. Sigourney Weaver as Ripley,

1258
01:03:02,159 --> 01:03:04,880
She's been developed over the course of the last two movies,

1259
01:03:05,079 --> 01:03:07,360
and I really think this movie gives her an opportunity

1260
01:03:07,400 --> 01:03:11,119
to take that even further. Charles Dance as Clemens is

1261
01:03:11,159 --> 01:03:14,559
also a great character in this movie. I love the visuals.

1262
01:03:14,920 --> 01:03:17,119
This movie really goes back to what I think the

1263
01:03:17,159 --> 01:03:19,679
heart of the Alien franchise is, and it is that

1264
01:03:19,760 --> 01:03:23,639
things are bleak, things are dark, they are sickly and diseased.

1265
01:03:24,039 --> 01:03:26,880
There This movie is kind of yellow and brown tones

1266
01:03:27,239 --> 01:03:29,639
and very dark, whereas things were a little bit lighter

1267
01:03:29,719 --> 01:03:35,039
and sci fi blue in Aliens. I love the spiritual

1268
01:03:35,119 --> 01:03:38,199
religious aspects of this movie and kind of the motherhood

1269
01:03:38,239 --> 01:03:41,039
aspects that come into the whole franchise. But some of

1270
01:03:41,039 --> 01:03:42,960
the early comic books I read around about the time

1271
01:03:42,960 --> 01:03:45,199
when I first started getting hooked on Aliens, that there

1272
01:03:45,280 --> 01:03:47,599
was a kind of almost a cult that had grown

1273
01:03:47,679 --> 01:03:50,199
up on Earth around the idea of the Aliens and

1274
01:03:50,239 --> 01:03:53,079
maybe how they were an image of God. And I thought, well,

1275
01:03:53,079 --> 01:03:55,559
that's that's not what I believe, but that's really interesting.

1276
01:03:55,599 --> 01:03:57,800
So I really kind of got interested in some of

1277
01:03:57,800 --> 01:03:59,880
those stories and kind of what it brought to the

1278
01:04:00,000 --> 01:04:03,199
Alien franchise, And of course this one, the religious guys

1279
01:04:03,280 --> 01:04:06,239
on the prison Planet take that a step further. Absolutely,

1280
01:04:06,280 --> 01:04:08,360
this is the biggest thing for me. It continues the

1281
01:04:08,440 --> 01:04:11,000
message that was set up in Alien. You are a

1282
01:04:11,039 --> 01:04:12,559
cog in the machine. If you want to look at

1283
01:04:12,599 --> 01:04:15,360
this as a metaphor for capitalism. You're just a cog

1284
01:04:15,360 --> 01:04:17,239
in the machine and the company does not care about you.

1285
01:04:17,480 --> 01:04:23,280
The state of life in space is, to quote Hobbes Leviathan, solitary, poor, nasty, brutish,

1286
01:04:23,280 --> 01:04:26,039
and short. And then here's my favorite one, even when

1287
01:04:26,079 --> 01:04:29,559
you win, you lose. Ripley won in alien but ultimately

1288
01:04:29,559 --> 01:04:32,239
she lost because she came back and her daughter had

1289
01:04:32,559 --> 01:04:34,800
died of old age and she was gone. Everything had

1290
01:04:34,840 --> 01:04:37,800
been lost. She regains a daughter in Aliens. But then

1291
01:04:37,800 --> 01:04:40,199
in this one, even though I know it's gut wrenching,

1292
01:04:40,440 --> 01:04:43,599
I absolutely agree with the death of Newt and Hicks

1293
01:04:43,639 --> 01:04:46,239
at the beginning of this she loses everything again. I

1294
01:04:46,239 --> 01:04:49,280
think that fits perfectly with the message of the Alien movies.

1295
01:04:49,559 --> 01:04:52,920
The Alien Queen even seemingly wins but ultimately loses. And

1296
01:04:52,960 --> 01:04:56,280
if you want to find a better scene for this,

1297
01:04:56,760 --> 01:04:59,400
you gotta watch. You should watch the assembly cut of

1298
01:04:59,440 --> 01:05:02,280
the movie. But then at the end switch it over

1299
01:05:02,320 --> 01:05:04,760
to the theatrical cut. That's a much better When when

1300
01:05:04,760 --> 01:05:05,840
we get to the end of the movie and you

1301
01:05:05,840 --> 01:05:07,599
want to see that part of it, switch to the

1302
01:05:07,599 --> 01:05:11,480
theatrical for when Ripley dives off the platform, it's a

1303
01:05:11,559 --> 01:05:14,280
much better ending to the movie in my opinion, Guys,

1304
01:05:14,280 --> 01:05:16,639
thank you so much. Love what you're doing, love your show.

1305
01:05:16,920 --> 01:05:20,079
This has been John Reid, last surviving fan of Alien three,

1306
01:05:20,679 --> 01:05:21,320
signing off.

1307
01:05:22,360 --> 01:05:25,760
Speaker 4: Okay, Jeff, you and John can go hold hands.

1308
01:05:25,519 --> 01:05:28,159
Speaker 3: Hey John, Yeah, I just want to thank John for

1309
01:05:28,639 --> 01:05:32,159
zooming in like Bishop did on that platform at the

1310
01:05:32,239 --> 01:05:35,519
end of Aliens, because I appreciate the support. Thank you, brother.

1311
01:05:36,559 --> 01:05:38,559
Speaker 1: I got to say, when I listen to the thirty

1312
01:05:38,559 --> 01:05:42,079
something movie podcast, I start thinking things as they're talking,

1313
01:05:42,440 --> 01:05:45,599
and literally as I think those things, then John says

1314
01:05:45,679 --> 01:05:48,000
the things that I think. It blows my mind how

1315
01:05:48,079 --> 01:05:50,039
much we are on the same page. My mind is

1316
01:05:50,119 --> 01:05:52,760
equally blown at this point at how much we are

1317
01:05:52,880 --> 01:05:55,239
not on the same page as far as this movie.

1318
01:05:55,320 --> 01:05:59,079
Speaker 4: G Jeff, will you come back next week with us

1319
01:05:59,079 --> 01:06:06,199
so we can talk about Last Action Hero and what

1320
01:06:06,320 --> 01:06:08,199
the heck happened with that movie?

1321
01:06:08,239 --> 01:06:10,880
Speaker 3: You know I will be glad to do that. We

1322
01:06:10,960 --> 01:06:13,920
covered Last Action Hero a couple months back on its

1323
01:06:14,320 --> 01:06:17,960
anniversary date. We had Andy Frye with us on that episode,

1324
01:06:17,960 --> 01:06:20,840
and you know, I feel like that was good training

1325
01:06:20,880 --> 01:06:22,920
between what him and Brad had to say about Last

1326
01:06:22,920 --> 01:06:25,199
Action Hero and the shots they were taken. I feel

1327
01:06:25,199 --> 01:06:28,320
like that was like the the undercard fight for for

1328
01:06:28,400 --> 01:06:31,400
what I probably am walking into next week when I

1329
01:06:31,400 --> 01:06:32,039
show up again.

1330
01:06:32,519 --> 01:06:35,519
Speaker 1: Here I at this moment, I've still not seen The

1331
01:06:35,599 --> 01:06:36,320
Last Action Hero.

1332
01:06:36,519 --> 01:06:36,920
Speaker 2: Not once.

1333
01:06:36,960 --> 01:06:39,880
Speaker 1: Didn't see the theater, didn't rent it. Never ever have

1334
01:06:39,920 --> 01:06:43,719
I seen it except like, you know, it's been what

1335
01:06:43,960 --> 01:06:45,159
thirty how many years?

1336
01:06:45,239 --> 01:06:45,440
Speaker 2: Now?

1337
01:06:45,480 --> 01:06:50,199
Speaker 1: Thirty? It's ninety three, so it's been thirty years since

1338
01:06:50,199 --> 01:06:52,960
the movie came out. So there have been times where

1339
01:06:53,079 --> 01:06:55,960
I'm channel surfing back when I still did that, and

1340
01:06:56,119 --> 01:06:58,440
I was like, oh, this looks like a good movie.

1341
01:06:58,480 --> 01:07:00,800
Oh wait a minute, this I've heard this is terrible

1342
01:07:00,840 --> 01:07:02,480
and I didn't watch the rest of it. So I've

1343
01:07:02,519 --> 01:07:04,679
caught little bits here and there, but I have never

1344
01:07:04,679 --> 01:07:06,840
seen the movie from beginning to end. So I can't

1345
01:07:06,880 --> 01:07:08,840
tell you whether I'm going to be an advocator or

1346
01:07:08,880 --> 01:07:09,519
a denouncer.

1347
01:07:09,639 --> 01:07:11,880
Speaker 4: Okay, this is the last movie I walked out of,

1348
01:07:12,039 --> 01:07:14,000
jeff If you'll come back with us, we will dive

1349
01:07:14,039 --> 01:07:17,199
in next week to Last Action Hero.

1350
01:07:17,400 --> 01:07:18,039
Speaker 3: Happy to do it.

1351
01:07:18,079 --> 01:07:19,840
Speaker 1: Bye, guys, see you guys next week later.

1352
01:07:21,639 --> 01:07:24,320
Speaker 4: Jeffrey Madamy, Absolutely not, man.

1353
01:07:24,360 --> 01:07:25,639
Speaker 3: I love these kinds of episodes.

1354
01:07:25,639 --> 01:07:27,679
Speaker 4: Are you kidding me, good, good, okay,