Speaker 1: By Billy Cunningham, the great American. Of course, a few
Speaker 1: weeks ago this thing came out of shall I say nowhere,
Speaker 1: and the history of it is apparent to politics, not
Speaker 1: apparent to coroners like doctor Somarco or doctor Russell Updegrove,
Speaker 1: who is the elected corner of Warren County. But somebody
Speaker 1: without any fingerprints on it put a couple of sentences
Speaker 1: in a bill which is like five thousand pages long,
Speaker 1: to make sure that county recorders are not elected by
Speaker 1: the people but rather appointed by county commissioners. And so
Speaker 1: when doctor Samarco, the elected Hamley County corner, told me
Speaker 1: about this, I said, I can't believe that Republicans would
Speaker 1: take away the people's right to vote. So what I
Speaker 1: did then was I had to contact to Governor Mike
Speaker 1: DeWine put him on. Then I contacted the most powerful
Speaker 1: man in Columbus, allegedly his Speaker of the House, Mount Huffman,
Speaker 1: put him on about this issue, and they both said
Speaker 1: they don't think that's going to fly. However, Matt Huffman,
Speaker 1: the Speaker of the House, who last year was the
Speaker 1: President of the Senate, a guy who knows where the
Speaker 1: bodies are buried. Said, you know, it may make some
Speaker 1: sense and some counties to not elect corners. And I said,
Speaker 1: what are you talking about? And Huffman said, well, there
Speaker 1: are some small counties in which you might elect an
Speaker 1: optometrist or a might elect a veterinarian to be the
Speaker 1: county corner. And so I want to put the questions
Speaker 1: of these two elected corners. And first of all, doctor
Speaker 1: Somarco and doctor Uppegrove, both of you welcome to the
Speaker 1: Bill Cunningham Show. And beginning with doctor Somarco, when this
Speaker 1: tell the American people, Doc, how this came out of
Speaker 1: the blue and why county corners like you and doctor
Speaker 1: Updegrove should be elected.
Speaker 2: Thanks for having us on, Willie. As usual, you get
Speaker 2: right to the point. So we found out about it
Speaker 2: about five hours before the House voted on it. And
Speaker 2: when I reached out to several of our state reps
Speaker 2: for our area, they had no idea it was even
Speaker 2: in there. So you know, I'm not sure how that gets. Well,
Speaker 2: I guess I do know how that gets. I'm told
Speaker 2: this is pretty common practice that when you want something passed,
Speaker 2: and you know, you added to some big bill and
Speaker 2: it just sort of slips through. I'm not sure what
Speaker 2: the purpose was. I don't even know if there were
Speaker 2: any perceived problems because nobody, not one person reached out
Speaker 2: to any of us to say, hey, we think this
Speaker 2: might be a good idea, can we talk about it?
Speaker 3: Not one.
Speaker 2: And you know what, as a voter, as an American citizen,
Speaker 2: I resent anybody taking the power away from me to
Speaker 2: elect my officials. And I mean across the board.
Speaker 1: So you know, yeah, it's doctor Russell ufter Grovel Warren County.
Speaker 1: You're the elected corner there. Why are elected county corners
Speaker 1: better than being appointed by the county commissioner in Warren County?
Speaker 4: Why is it better?
Speaker 3: Well, I think part of the problem is some of
Speaker 3: the misinformation in what you just mentioned previously about worried
Speaker 3: about the optometrists or dentist or things being appointed as corner.
Speaker 3: One of the additional heaviats in the law that was
Speaker 3: put in in the o RC as far as in
Speaker 3: the Corner's Law in December, is that it is a
Speaker 3: requirement to a corner be MD or a DO in
Speaker 3: order to be able to elect a corner. So we're
Speaker 3: not going to be electing non qualified people the situation.
Speaker 3: As far as why with corners being elected, I think
Speaker 3: number one, as you mentioned, I think the people have
Speaker 3: the ability in their county to elect somebody based on
Speaker 3: their track record, their performance, and their qualifications. If you
Speaker 3: just remove the corners of elected officials, and then it's
Speaker 3: left in the hands of these county commissioners to appoint
Speaker 3: somebody who could be significantly less experienced or less qualified
Speaker 3: than the status quo that is president in that county
Speaker 3: at that particular time.
Speaker 1: And doctor Samarco I was told that there's a movement
Speaker 1: of foot over the next five to ten years to
Speaker 1: take away the right of people to vote for like sheriff, auditor, recorder,
Speaker 1: clerk of courts.
Speaker 4: Who do administrative functions.
Speaker 1: How do you respond to the argument that this is
Speaker 1: saving money, it's a better approach to have a qualified
Speaker 1: person selected by politicians instead of selected by the people.
Speaker 1: Do you see this as the first of many fights
Speaker 1: in the years ahead.
Speaker 2: Well, I would hope that the voters will defend democracy
Speaker 2: and the right that they have to elect the officials
Speaker 2: they have now. I mean, we have been doing this
Speaker 2: in Ohio for two hundred years, and you know nobody
Speaker 2: has yet to show me how it's broken. So, like
Speaker 2: I said the other day at the press conference, this
Speaker 2: is a solution looking for our problems. And you know,
Speaker 2: there are smaller counties where they had nobody that stood
Speaker 2: for election as corner. But already in the Ohio Revised
Speaker 2: Code is a provision that allows county leaders to appoint
Speaker 2: somebody to that position, and they have. And in the
Speaker 2: ten counties where they didn't have anybody standing for corner,
Speaker 2: there were five that were appointed, and then five counties
Speaker 2: where they contracted with adjacent county corners to take over
Speaker 2: the responsibilities. So if you're talking about expense, you know,
Speaker 2: it always boils down to money, doesn't it, Willie.
Speaker 4: It's about it's always.
Speaker 2: Money, right, if you're talking about expense. Our salaries are legislated, Okay,
Speaker 2: they are determined by a high legislation and they're put
Speaker 2: into place if you're going to appoint somebody. And there
Speaker 2: are two counties in Ohio that actually do appoint. It's
Speaker 2: a slightly different government system, right, and they have a
Speaker 2: charter government and they appoint their county corner and the
Speaker 2: county sheriff, by the way, but both of those counties
Speaker 2: pay their corners significantly more than we get paid because
Speaker 2: they appoint somebody and they basically have to pay the
Speaker 2: going rate, right for a physician who's going to take
Speaker 2: over as a full time position for those for those counties.
Speaker 2: And you know the appointed sheriff in Cayhoe County, well, gosh,
Speaker 2: they've had a hard time keeping the sheriff. They've had
Speaker 2: nine sheriffs in like the last twelve years. Because now
Speaker 2: they're considering going back to an elected juriff position because
Speaker 2: they're having a thirty hard time keeping sheriffs. But it's
Speaker 2: important for county corners to be elected because we are
Speaker 2: answerable to the people of the county. I basically have
Speaker 2: nine hundred thousand bosses, right, I mean the nine hundred
Speaker 2: thousand voters in the county, not three people, not a board,
Speaker 2: not a group of or a small group of people
Speaker 2: that appoint me. And so I have the independence. I
Speaker 2: have the ability to be objective. I have the ability
Speaker 2: to look at the evidence, to look at the scene,
Speaker 2: to look at the medical records, to look at what
Speaker 2: is being presented to me and make an objective independent
Speaker 2: you know, medical decision, investigative decision based on the evidence
Speaker 2: at hand and not be influenced by a certain group
Speaker 2: of people or you know, their friends or their colleagues
Speaker 2: or fellow politicians. And we have the ability to do
Speaker 2: that because we are independently elected and we want.
Speaker 3: To keep it that one.
Speaker 1: So on that point, doctor Samarco, if you're appointed by
Speaker 1: county commissioners in this it might be two out of
Speaker 1: the three, or would appoint someone they could put the scale.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying it's happened, but they could put their
Speaker 1: thumb on the scales and say, we appoint you. You
Speaker 1: kind of work for us. We don't think this is
Speaker 1: a suicide. This might be a homicide. What do you think, doc?
Speaker 1: Are you worried about political wins blowing into the corner's
Speaker 1: office in Amlin the county that's not there.
Speaker 2: Now, we're all human, and you know there are going
Speaker 2: to be county corners that are going to feel that
Speaker 2: pressure to and you know sort of the influence and
Speaker 2: the pressure to rule a certain way when you're being
Speaker 2: asked by your bosses, and I think you know, to
Speaker 2: stay in a position or to stay in that job.
Speaker 2: I think that keeping it objective and keeping it independent
Speaker 2: will result in justice for the victim and the families
Speaker 2: and you know, as well as the suspect. And I
Speaker 2: think it's important for us to maintain.
Speaker 1: That right, Doctor Russell upter Grove. Warren County is a
Speaker 1: great county. It's a smaller county compared to Hamilton County. However,
Speaker 1: there's counties in Ohio that has ten to twelve thousand
Speaker 1: total residents in a completely different situation. So when Matt
Speaker 1: Huffman talked about maybe a veterinarian or an optometrist becoming
Speaker 1: county corner, who would want to do that for the
Speaker 1: amount of money paid in a small county? But do
Speaker 1: you living in Warren County, if you have a situation
Speaker 1: where you would like to, as an elected corner bring
Speaker 1: in another corner from another county, from Hamilton County or
Speaker 1: Montgomery County, you currently have the ability to do that
Speaker 1: without the law telling you you have to do it.
Speaker 1: You have the option to do what they want to
Speaker 1: do anyway.
Speaker 3: Well, I mean in Warren County, we don't perform autopsies there,
Speaker 3: so the bodies that will require an autopsy are sent
Speaker 3: to either Montgomery County or Hamilton County based upon on
Speaker 3: the geography of the circumstances. What I think a lot
Speaker 3: of people don't understand is there's a lot more to
Speaker 3: the corner job than just looking at people who are
Speaker 3: being autopsied. We're responsible for dealing with death certificates on
Speaker 3: individuals who die of oftentimes natural causes, who either have
Speaker 3: not seen a doctor in a long time, where their
Speaker 3: doctor refuses to sign the death certificate for various reasons,
Speaker 3: and all of those deaths fall in the lap of
Speaker 3: the corner to deal with. So there's a lot more
Speaker 3: to the job than just sending a body off to
Speaker 3: some other place for an autopsy. And that's the end
Speaker 3: of it.
Speaker 1: And so when this came out about a week or
Speaker 1: two ago, that your job's probably important to you, but
Speaker 1: more importantly, the issue is more important. I'm sure both
Speaker 1: of you could go into the private sector and make
Speaker 1: a lot more money than you make as a corner Well,
Speaker 1: when this thing eroved, doctor Upgrove, when this came out
Speaker 1: two weeks ago, politically, what do you do of anything
Speaker 1: to try to stop it? Because you have some powerful
Speaker 1: people in Warren County. Is this a political matter? Do
Speaker 1: you think that needs to be addressed or is it
Speaker 1: a medical matter? Which one is it?
Speaker 3: Well, it came out of the blue, really and without
Speaker 3: really having much warning that this was going on. So
Speaker 3: the original question is you know, well, who's behind this
Speaker 3: and what is the reason that this driving this? And
Speaker 3: I think it's personally. I think it has something to
Speaker 3: do more with just making a corner an appointed position
Speaker 3: and removing it as an elected official. I think that
Speaker 3: would open the door to the possibility down the road
Speaker 3: for this using the term regionalization, where it would make
Speaker 3: it easier for some of these counties that were maybe
Speaker 3: smaller counties to do away with having a single corner
Speaker 3: for a single county and try to lump two three
Speaker 3: counties together and under one corner. Now, the problem would
Speaker 3: be who would want to take on all that extra
Speaker 3: work and responsibility. If this is supposedly about a cost
Speaker 3: saving measure. If it's hard enough to get people to
Speaker 3: run for foreigner, now, what would be the motivation to
Speaker 3: do it? To do more work for the same amount of.
Speaker 1: Money, And doctor Somarco, you could make two, three, four
Speaker 1: times what you're making. If money is the motivation, you're
Speaker 1: kind of sacrificing to be the corner. And what they
Speaker 1: want to do now is after your term is up.
Speaker 1: I guess in January of twenty nine is to have
Speaker 1: you go away, which might, in a sense financially benefit
Speaker 1: you because you'll make more money. However, you're not motivated
Speaker 1: by money and doing this in the first place, correct, Willie?
Speaker 2: What I get paid right now? I made more my
Speaker 2: first year in practice, my first year out of training
Speaker 2: nineteen ninety five, I made more that's three years ago
Speaker 2: in my first year in practice that I make now
Speaker 2: as a corner. So it's not about the money, that's
Speaker 2: for sure. But you know, it is about public service.
Speaker 2: It is about trying to do something in my neighborhood,
Speaker 2: in my neck of the woods, in serving the public
Speaker 2: and assuring justice and giving some answers to the families
Speaker 2: and giving them some peace of mind, and answering some
Speaker 2: really important questions like, hey, we had a sudden death
Speaker 2: of an athlete. Could this be genetic? Is there anybody
Speaker 2: else in the family that's at risk? You know, let's
Speaker 2: do this investigation and see if we can get some
Speaker 2: answers for the family. There are so many public health
Speaker 2: implications here. You know, when COVID hit, everybody wanted to know,
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, you know how many people are dying?
Speaker 2: Of COVID and is this something we need to worry about,
Speaker 2: and how contagious is it? And what do you do
Speaker 2: with the bodies that come in and what kind of
Speaker 2: precautions do you take. I think the corner in most
Speaker 2: counties in Ohio pay a pivotal play, a pivotal role
Speaker 2: in working with public health as well as law enforcement.
Speaker 2: So it's both. It's both medicals and is both law
Speaker 2: enforcement and about justice.
Speaker 1: I tell you both you, I tell you what's going
Speaker 1: to happen now in the next few weeks. It has
Speaker 1: to be done by June thirtieth. Likely it's going to
Speaker 1: be done around Memorial Day. There's going to be the
Speaker 1: House passed the bill which includes getting rid of corners.
Speaker 1: The Senate says they're not going to put that in there.
Speaker 1: So if they don't put it in there, that means
Speaker 1: there will be a reconciliation process in which the governor
Speaker 1: gets involved, and then they go to the Governor's office
Speaker 1: and the two of the bills are worked together. What's in,
Speaker 1: what's out? What do we give the Browns, what do
Speaker 1: we give the Bengals? Do they get nothing? To get everything?
Speaker 1: And likely the corner issue is so small and so
Speaker 1: down the list of worries of the state that I
Speaker 1: have a concern that it's going to stay in there
Speaker 1: without any of the parties really discussing it or knowing
Speaker 1: about it, because they care about the big issues, and
Speaker 1: to me, this is a big issue. And so what
Speaker 1: I'm going to do is just one person is every
Speaker 1: couple of weeks, I'll talk to the Wine and I'll
Speaker 1: talk to Matt Huffman, and I'll talk to Bill Blessing
Speaker 1: and keep telling them that when the powwow takes place
Speaker 1: around Memorial Day and here's the House bill, and here's
Speaker 1: the Senate bill, which is different, and the governor's recommendation
Speaker 1: are different, that when everyone's sitting around everyone agrees to
Speaker 1: take out the provision about county commissioners appointing corners and
Speaker 1: make sure that's not in there. I have a concern
Speaker 1: it's going to slip through under the door and at
Speaker 1: the end of the day, and so I'll do my part,
Speaker 1: and I know you too will do your part. You're
Speaker 1: a Republican and doctor Somarco is a Democrat. This is
Speaker 1: not political and it's not not r D. It's about
Speaker 1: competency and about the power of voters to select those
Speaker 1: who govern aspect of their lives. I want to keep
Speaker 1: the ballot box open so if corner gets out of hand,
Speaker 1: we can get them out of office because they are
Speaker 1: answerable to me as a voter and not the county commissioners.
Speaker 4: Well, both of you, I got to go. I'll be
Speaker 4: in touch off the air.
Speaker 1: But doctor Somarco and doctor Uptegrove, once again, thank you
Speaker 1: for coming on the Bill Cunningham Show, and both of you.
Speaker 1: The fight continues past this afternoon, but both of you,
Speaker 1: thank you very much.
Speaker 3: Thank you.
Speaker 4: I appreciate it.
Speaker 1: God bless you. Let's continue with more. Their fight today
Speaker 1: will be you'll fight tomorrow. And I think the ballot
Speaker 1: box out of remain open in case we have a
Speaker 1: bad corner, we can get rid of that person instead
Speaker 1: of having county commissioners of appointing.
Speaker 4: I want to be.
Speaker 1: I want to I want to elect those who govern
Speaker 1: my affairs. Bill Cunningham News Radio seven hundred WLDW