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<v Speaker 1>In the winter of eighteen o three, a London neighborhood

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<v Speaker 1>was gripped by fear as reports of a ghostly figure

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<v Speaker 1>haunting the streets of Hammersmith spread like wildfire. But when

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<v Speaker 1>a man with a gun ran into the specter in

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<v Speaker 1>the streets, the line between folklore and tragedy vanished in

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<v Speaker 1>a single fatal shot. This is the true story of

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<v Speaker 1>the Hammersmith Ghost Murder, where panic and superstition, plus a

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<v Speaker 1>deadly mistake all collided in one of Britain's strangest legal cases.

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<v Speaker 2>My name's Ben, I'm Nicole, and you're listening to Wicked Ingram.

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<v Speaker 1>A true crime podcast. The following podcast and material intended

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<v Speaker 1>for a mature audience. Listener discretion is advised.

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome to Wicked and Grim.

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<v Speaker 1>And I'm naked today.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh my gosh, that sounds not okay.

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<v Speaker 1>Why I'm in my own home. Why can't be naked?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but just like sitting here recording a podcast, buckus.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm done with nude. I don't have headphones. I feel

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<v Speaker 1>naked and broke his headphones. Yeah, so I got to

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<v Speaker 1>buy some new headphones. It feels weird, does.

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<v Speaker 2>Feel really weird? I know I've recorded a couple, not

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<v Speaker 2>for breaking them, but because I just had a shower

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<v Speaker 2>and then I didn't want to dent my hair from

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<v Speaker 2>the top of my headphones, so brutal.

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<v Speaker 1>It it feels different when you're not wearing headphones.

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<v Speaker 2>It doesn't feel quite as legit or professional, really, I

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<v Speaker 2>think is something.

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<v Speaker 1>It doesn't And for me a big thing is if

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<v Speaker 1>I have the headphones on, I can really understand when

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<v Speaker 1>we're overlapping each other in a conversation.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it really.

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<v Speaker 1>Helps focus in on that. And when I don't have

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<v Speaker 1>the headphones, you and I can talk to each other

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<v Speaker 1>and we can overlap and understand each other easy, but

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<v Speaker 1>it doesn't betray the same way in audio, and it's

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<v Speaker 1>harder to differentiate.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, well hopefully, I mean I'm more in mine.

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<v Speaker 2>Hopefully I'm catching things, but I don't quite have the

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<v Speaker 2>ear as you do for this.

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<v Speaker 1>Is that the right term? I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't even know.

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<v Speaker 1>But we have a really interesting case for you guys today.

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<v Speaker 1>This is a paranormal case about a ghost and then

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<v Speaker 1>it transitions into a murder, so you get a ghost

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<v Speaker 1>story and a murder story all wrapped up in one.

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<v Speaker 2>Sounds very intriguing.

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<v Speaker 1>Plus it's in the eighteen hundreds.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so it's crazy.

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<v Speaker 1>What more could you ask for it this case.

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<v Speaker 2>Early eighteen hundred.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, literally has everything you could ask for. Like,

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know why this isn't a movie or something yet,

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<v Speaker 1>because it's it's quite the story.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, let's make it a movie.

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<v Speaker 1>Let's make it a movie. Let's do it. Let's just

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<v Speaker 1>start filming it. Someone quickly give us a budget of

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<v Speaker 1>several million dollars so we can make this movie.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you probably need about them. I have no idea

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<v Speaker 2>how much you need to make a movie, but people

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<v Speaker 2>probably do it for less. But then you can tell.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you generally can tell, that's for sure. And especially

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<v Speaker 1>I mean if we're gonna do this and if we're

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<v Speaker 1>gonna have Chris Hemsworth be the main character, oh my god,

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<v Speaker 1>which we can't do it without obviously.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's our ticket of fame to meet him.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean yeah, I mean, picture like eighteen hundreds, like

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<v Speaker 1>streets outside of London and you have like a rugged

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<v Speaker 1>ghost spectral thing happening, and someone's out in the streets

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<v Speaker 1>with a gun hunting the ghost, obviously shirtless, and it's

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<v Speaker 1>Chris Hemsworth.

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<v Speaker 2>Obviously shirtless, obvious.

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<v Speaker 1>JESU tell me you wouldn't watch that movie. I'm a dude, No, homo,

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<v Speaker 1>I'd still watch that movie.

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<v Speaker 2>I'd watch that movie. I watched out of that movie exactly.

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<v Speaker 1>Call Chris Hemsworth, get him on this now. See, we

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<v Speaker 1>need to make this happen. Anyways, let's get going. In

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<v Speaker 1>the early winter of eighteen oh three in Hammersmith, a

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<v Speaker 1>quiet village just outside of London, and the streets were

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<v Speaker 1>colder than usual, just not from the chill, but also

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<v Speaker 1>from fear. Now. At the time, Hammersmith felt more like

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<v Speaker 1>a countryside than a city. Its narrow lanes were lined

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<v Speaker 1>with hedgerows and scattered cottages, and at night, the only

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<v Speaker 1>light came from the lanterns or whale oil lamps without

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<v Speaker 1>gaslight er police patrols. Darkness held power, and that December

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<v Speaker 1>the dark seemed to be hiding something more than just

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<v Speaker 1>the silence.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, darkness held power. Yeah that's a good line, thank you.

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<v Speaker 2>That might be one of our best lines. So ah, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>that just blew me away. Well done.

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<v Speaker 1>Now imagine Chris Hemsworth, shirtless, walking through the dark with

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<v Speaker 1>oil lamps going glistening off his bottom.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh, oil up, body, he is brutal ware going with this.

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<v Speaker 1>That's my last reference of Chris Hemsworth. I'm done. I'm

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<v Speaker 1>done until maybe at the very end, but probably not now.

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<v Speaker 1>Rumors began to swirl through the tavern and the homes.

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<v Speaker 1>People spoke of a tall, pale figure drifting through the

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<v Speaker 1>village after sundown, sometimes wrapped in a white cloak, and

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<v Speaker 1>others said to have maybe horns or glowing eyes as well.

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<v Speaker 1>The stories varied, but the message was always the same.

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<v Speaker 1>There was something or someone haunting the churchyard at night.

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<v Speaker 1>Some villagers claimed it was the ghost of a man

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<v Speaker 1>who had taken his own life the year before. He

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<v Speaker 1>was buried improperly in the churchyard of Saint Paul's, just

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<v Speaker 1>off Black Lion Lane Now. At the time, it was

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<v Speaker 1>widely believed that those who died by suicide shouldn't be

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<v Speaker 1>buried in consecrated ground, so doing so people feared would

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<v Speaker 1>keep their souls restless and even dangerous. It didn't take

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<v Speaker 1>long for superstition to turn into obsession, and by mid December,

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<v Speaker 1>locals were claiming that the ghost had attacked people. He

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<v Speaker 1>had chased them right through the night and even scared

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<v Speaker 1>a pregnant woman to death. Panic set in, and the

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<v Speaker 1>lines between myth and reality were blurring each more every night.

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<v Speaker 1>In an era where people were fearing the supernatural just

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<v Speaker 1>as much as actual crime, it wasn't hard to believe

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<v Speaker 1>something otherworldly might be walking in those streets that time.

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<v Speaker 1>But what no one in Hammersmith realized was that their

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<v Speaker 1>ghost story, real or imagined, was about to lead to

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<v Speaker 1>a very real death, also a dramatic murder trial, and

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<v Speaker 1>a legal dilemma that would haunt British law for nearly

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<v Speaker 1>two hundred years. So that's our intro to the story.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay.

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<v Speaker 1>Now, in the early eighteen hundreds, Hammersmith wasn't yet part

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<v Speaker 1>of the sprawling metropolis of London. It was a semi

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<v Speaker 1>rural type village tucked along the north banks of the

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<v Speaker 1>River Thames, with open fields, narrow footpaths, and just enough

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<v Speaker 1>development to hint at a city that it would eventually become.

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<v Speaker 1>At the center of the village stood at Saint Paul's Church,

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<v Speaker 1>surrounded by a quiet graveyard, and this is where that

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<v Speaker 1>ghost story began, or at least where it was most

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<v Speaker 1>often said to be seen. The first reported sighting came

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<v Speaker 1>in November of eighteen oh three, locals began whispering of

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<v Speaker 1>a strange, white clad figure that appeared after nightfall. According

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<v Speaker 1>to some accounts, it floated, Others said it walked silently

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<v Speaker 1>through the mist. People claimed the ghosts would spring out

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<v Speaker 1>from behind gravestones, chase passers by, or simply stand there

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<v Speaker 1>in the darkness, just watching and waiting.

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<v Speaker 2>Gosh, that's creepy, yeah, no kidding.

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<v Speaker 1>Descriptions were not exactly consistent. Some said the figure was

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<v Speaker 1>covered in a white shroud like a burial cloth. Others

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<v Speaker 1>swore yes, large horns or big glassy eyes, or it

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<v Speaker 1>wore a cloak made of calf skin. A few thought

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<v Speaker 1>it was seven feet tall, unnaturally silent, and capable of

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<v Speaker 1>vanishing in an instant. Now, whatever it was, it scared

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<v Speaker 1>people badly enough to avoid certain roads altogether after dusk,

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<v Speaker 1>and that's where, hey, the darkness has its power, right.

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<v Speaker 1>The villagers soon settled into a theory the ghost was

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<v Speaker 1>the restless spirit of a man who died by suicide

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<v Speaker 1>the year before. He'd been buried in the churchyard. Against

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<v Speaker 1>custom and belief at the time in the early nineteenth century,

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<v Speaker 1>many people believed that such a burial would actually leave

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<v Speaker 1>the deceased soul trapped and condemned to wander for all eternity. Stories,

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<v Speaker 1>of course, piled up quickly. One Brewer's assistant, Thomas Groom,

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<v Speaker 1>told of walking through the churchyard at night when something

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<v Speaker 1>lunged at him from behind a tombstone. It grabbed him

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<v Speaker 1>by the throat and spun him around, and when he

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<v Speaker 1>threw a punch, she felt it hit something soft like

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<v Speaker 1>a great coat quote unquote, but he saw no one there.

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<v Speaker 1>In another case, a pregnant woman reportedly fainted after the

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<v Speaker 1>ghost wrapped its arms around her. She was found hours later,

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<v Speaker 1>still unconscious and died not long after the encounter.

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<v Speaker 2>Really, so she could have had a heart attack.

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<v Speaker 1>Or something ain't Potentially, yes, though it's impossible to confirm

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<v Speaker 1>the story, it only added fuel to the hysteria. I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>you can't necessarily say that this woman who's found unconscious

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<v Speaker 1>encountered the ghost because she wasn't conscious to say that

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<v Speaker 1>she did or did not, right, she could.

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<v Speaker 2>Have just said had something wrong with her that night.

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<v Speaker 1>She may have just yeah, she may have just been

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<v Speaker 1>walking home and just had a heart attack. And then

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<v Speaker 1>with all the ghost hysteria, someone's like she obviously encountered

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<v Speaker 1>the ghost, and then that word spreads like wildfire, and

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<v Speaker 1>you have a pregnant woman who just got attacked and

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<v Speaker 1>killed by a ghost.

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<v Speaker 2>Or I mean, yeah, something could have even gone wrong

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<v Speaker 2>with her pregnancy or something.

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<v Speaker 1>Who knows. Yeah, but one way or another, it was

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<v Speaker 1>just hysteria and this was just fuel for that fire.

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<v Speaker 1>Then came the stagecoach incident. One night, a carriage driver

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<v Speaker 1>hauling sixteen passengers saw a ghostly figure rise from the roadside.

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<v Speaker 1>In a panic, he abandoned the horses, the wagon, and

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<v Speaker 1>every single passenger on board, and he just sprinted away

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<v Speaker 1>into the night.

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<v Speaker 2>I didn't laugh, but was that you.

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<v Speaker 1>Me in a past life?

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<v Speaker 2>Maybe?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah? Now the horses were found still, just standing in place, untouched,

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<v Speaker 1>just not knowing what's going on. Right, there's like, okay,

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<v Speaker 1>buddy just ran off. What do we do now?

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<v Speaker 2>And I feel like horses a lot get spooked too, right,

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<v Speaker 2>They can get spooped.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean they're giant, is what horses are. So now,

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<v Speaker 1>by late December of eighteen oh three, Hammersmith had crossed

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<v Speaker 1>a threshold from a worried curiosity to a full blown

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<v Speaker 1>ghost panic. What had started as a whisper and an

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<v Speaker 1>eerie sighting became a village wide obsession. The stories were

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<v Speaker 1>growing darker and the fear more intense. People weren't just

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<v Speaker 1>avoiding the churchyard. Instead, they were now arming themselves with superstition, hearsay,

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<v Speaker 1>and in some cases, yes, even weapons. Now, there was no

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<v Speaker 1>official police force in London at the time. This was

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<v Speaker 1>decades before Robert Peel's Metropolan Police, so law enforcement came

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<v Speaker 1>in the form of night watchmen, volunteer patrols, and the

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<v Speaker 1>occasional constable. With villagers reporting attacks by a ghost. Even

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<v Speaker 1>the authorities weren't sure how they should respond to the situation.

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<v Speaker 1>They did what they could, though. They started patrolling the

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<v Speaker 1>streets at night in shifts, hoping to catch whoever was

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<v Speaker 1>behind the hauntings, or maybe whatever was behind the hunts.

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<v Speaker 1>But patrolling nineteenth century Hammersmith wasn't easy. The village was

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<v Speaker 1>full of narrow, twisting paths and dark hedgerows, making it

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<v Speaker 1>nearly impossible to cover every single route in or out,

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<v Speaker 1>and with the sheer number of ghost stories now floating around,

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<v Speaker 1>it was hard to tell which sightings were actually credible

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<v Speaker 1>and which were simply fear. Taking over One of the

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<v Speaker 1>men involved in the patrols was William Girdler, a local

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<v Speaker 1>night watchman. On the night of December twenty ninth, Girdler

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<v Speaker 1>reported seeing the figure himself. He described chasing a white

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<v Speaker 1>cloaked form through the churchyard, only for it to tear

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<v Speaker 1>off the sheet and disappear into the night.

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<v Speaker 2>He actually chased this thing. Hey, but I guess that's

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<v Speaker 2>what he was there.

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<v Speaker 1>For exactly now, left behind there was a tablecloth dropped

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<v Speaker 1>during that escape.

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<v Speaker 2>Huh wild Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>It was the first solid proof that at least some

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<v Speaker 1>of the ghost sightings were the work of a person

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<v Speaker 1>in disguise. Literally, have someone classic Charlie Brown sheet draped

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<v Speaker 1>over him, left exactly, and it's hey, this is a tablecloth,

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<v Speaker 1>like you know, like we know someone in the village

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<v Speaker 1>who's making these or something like that. Like this is

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<v Speaker 1>an actual tablecloth. Someone had it draped over him. That

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<v Speaker 1>was a person. They ripped it off and they ran.

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<v Speaker 1>Now this only added to the confusion. Though if the

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<v Speaker 1>ghost was just a prankster, it was no longer harmless fun.

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<v Speaker 1>It was at this point dangerous, especially now that citizens

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<v Speaker 1>were arming themselves in hopes of catching it. Rumors spread

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<v Speaker 1>even faster. Some believed the ghosts could breathe fire, had claws,

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<v Speaker 1>or moved without touching the ground. Others were convinced there

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<v Speaker 1>were multiple people dressing up as ghosts and they were

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<v Speaker 1>the source. Each and every new account added layers and

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<v Speaker 1>layers of panic. By the time the calendar turned to

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<v Speaker 1>January eighteen oh four, Hammersmith was a village living on

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<v Speaker 1>high alert. The ghost wasn't just a curiosity anymore. It

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<v Speaker 1>was a serious public threat, and people were growing desperate

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<v Speaker 1>to put a stop to it. Seemed like everyone had

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<v Speaker 1>a story. Some had seen the ghosts with their own eyes,

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<v Speaker 1>Others knew someone who had chased it or been chased

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<v Speaker 1>by it, and a few claimed they've even lost loved

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<v Speaker 1>ones in the frights from it. Whether it was real

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<v Speaker 1>or imagined, the fear felt real enough to shape daily

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<v Speaker 1>life here. Families refused to go out after sunset. Roads

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<v Speaker 1>at once bustled with evening foot traffic now stood silent

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<v Speaker 1>and empty. Even the taverns had started to clear out

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<v Speaker 1>earlier than usual, and yet the ghosts kept appearing, or

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<v Speaker 1>at least someone pretending to be did. The white figure

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<v Speaker 1>was said to stalk the area near Black Lion lane

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<v Speaker 1>close to the churchyard late at night. That made it

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<v Speaker 1>the hotspot for citizen patrols, men from the community, some

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<v Speaker 1>armed with pistols, others with clubs or shotguns. They took

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<v Speaker 1>turns walking the village, hoping to catch the ghosts in

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<v Speaker 1>the act. The patrols weren't organized or trained. These were

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<v Speaker 1>civilians acting on fear and frustration, and they weren't always

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<v Speaker 1>coordinated with each other either. The lack of structure would

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<v Speaker 1>soon prove to be a serious problem. Still, some seemed

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<v Speaker 1>genuinely motivated to by desire to protect the village. One

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<v Speaker 1>of them Francis Smith, the twenty nine year old excise officer,

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<v Speaker 1>essentially a government tax collector. He wasn't a soldier or

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<v Speaker 1>a constable, but he felt responsible for his neighborhood safety.

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<v Speaker 1>He thought that someone could be dressing up and terrorizing people,

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<v Speaker 1>especially when someone believed a woman had already died and

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<v Speaker 1>on fright right. That enraged him. Others in the village

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<v Speaker 1>were beginning to believe that the ghost was, yes, a prankster.

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<v Speaker 1>It was shifting more this way, perhaps a local with

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<v Speaker 1>a grudge or a sense of cruel humor. But even then,

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00:15:52.159 --> 00:15:55.879
<v Speaker 1>the line between superstition and reality was still blurred. The

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<v Speaker 1>people of Hammersmith weren't just dealing with a physical threat.

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<v Speaker 1>They are reacting to a community wide delusion built on

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<v Speaker 1>fear and superstition fan by rumor, and now given the

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<v Speaker 1>weight of real danger.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm kind of on the page where I think there's

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of people that could just be dressing up

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<v Speaker 2>and kind of like playing on this a little bit,

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<v Speaker 2>having fun.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, Well, definitely, I mean if you look back,

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<v Speaker 1>like that sort of thing happened not too long ago

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<v Speaker 1>with the whole like clown sightings that were going on,

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<v Speaker 1>Like I think that was pre COVID or maybe like

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<v Speaker 1>twenty or seventeen.

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<v Speaker 2>I forgot about that.

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<v Speaker 1>Like there was a hysteria because like there was a

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<v Speaker 1>clown sighting or two, and it was like obviously it's

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<v Speaker 1>a person, right, but it's like this person seems very

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<v Speaker 1>aggressive and malice intent, right, And then all of a sudden,

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<v Speaker 1>more and more people started dressing up with this clown

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<v Speaker 1>doing this and pranking people. Yeah, so okay, is this

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00:16:51.600 --> 00:16:54.360
<v Speaker 1>the same sort of situation? But that also you need

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00:16:54.399 --> 00:16:56.440
<v Speaker 1>to ask yourself, Okay, what started this?

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00:16:57.360 --> 00:16:58.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, something did for sure?

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00:16:59.039 --> 00:17:01.759
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, was it a peron in a sheet that started it?

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<v Speaker 1>Or was there an actual specter that started this, because

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<v Speaker 1>remember there are accounts of people saying that there was

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<v Speaker 1>something that disappeared or this one individual, like I said,

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00:17:11.680 --> 00:17:14.279
<v Speaker 1>is the specter wrapped its arms around him and he

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00:17:14.359 --> 00:17:15.799
<v Speaker 1>hit it with his fists and he felt it like

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00:17:15.839 --> 00:17:17.960
<v Speaker 1>he was hitting a great coats But then there was

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00:17:18.000 --> 00:17:22.160
<v Speaker 1>nothing there. So you have ghostly stories and encounters, and

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00:17:22.200 --> 00:17:27.799
<v Speaker 1>you also have more real reality human stories and encounters.

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00:17:28.519 --> 00:17:30.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Well, I mean the one person that was wearing

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00:17:30.759 --> 00:17:33.720
<v Speaker 2>the sheet and then it got taken off or he

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00:17:33.839 --> 00:17:37.319
<v Speaker 2>let it drop and then looked to just disappear, like

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00:17:37.359 --> 00:17:39.319
<v Speaker 2>he could have just been wearing dark clothes, right and

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00:17:39.359 --> 00:17:42.000
<v Speaker 2>then just like yeah, disappeared in the night. It's hard

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<v Speaker 2>to see someone wearing all black or like all white.

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<v Speaker 1>True, And I mean in that same sense too, if

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<v Speaker 1>you're a hundred yards away you see this ghost in

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<v Speaker 1>a graveyard, right, and all of a sudden you see

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00:17:55.200 --> 00:17:57.839
<v Speaker 1>it disappear. Maybe that's someone in dark clothes and all

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<v Speaker 1>you see is the white sheet dropped to the ground,

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<v Speaker 1>and that's quote unquote disappearing.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but I don't disagree that there was something that

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<v Speaker 2>started this, and you know, Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>There needed to be a spark that started the fuck yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>and what was that? It's hard to say. Now, some

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00:18:15.079 --> 00:18:17.440
<v Speaker 1>stopped waiting for a solution and started taking matters into

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00:18:17.480 --> 00:18:20.440
<v Speaker 1>their own hands. And that's exactly what Francis Smith decided

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<v Speaker 1>to do. On the evening of January third, eighteen oh four,

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<v Speaker 1>Francis Smith left his home in Hammersmith with a loaded

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<v Speaker 1>shotgun in hand and a plan in mind. He was

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<v Speaker 1>going to patrol the streets and, if possible, put an

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<v Speaker 1>end to the so called Ghost's reign of terror once

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<v Speaker 1>and for all. Now, Smith wasn't a soldier or part

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<v Speaker 1>of any official militia. He was a civilian, an excise

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<v Speaker 1>officer responsible for collecting taxes on goods like alcohol. By

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<v Speaker 1>most accounts, he was an honest and respectable man, not

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<v Speaker 1>known for violence or even reckless behavior. Like many in Hammersmith.

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<v Speaker 1>He simply just had enough now. Earlier that evening, Smith

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00:19:01.359 --> 00:19:04.680
<v Speaker 1>had reportedly spent some time at a local tavern, the

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00:19:04.720 --> 00:19:08.480
<v Speaker 1>White Heart Inn, possibly to gather his courage. It's unclear

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00:19:08.519 --> 00:19:10.559
<v Speaker 1>how much he drank, but by the time he headed

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00:19:10.559 --> 00:19:15.880
<v Speaker 1>out he was tense and determined and carrying a Blunderbuss

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00:19:15.920 --> 00:19:20.440
<v Speaker 1>style shotgun, a powerful short barreled weapon loaded with lead shot.

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00:19:22.039 --> 00:19:25.960
<v Speaker 1>Around ten thirty pm, while walking along Black Lion Lane,

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00:19:26.200 --> 00:19:30.720
<v Speaker 1>Smith encountered William Girdler, the same watchman who had chased

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00:19:30.759 --> 00:19:34.119
<v Speaker 1>the ghost just days prior. Now, Smith told Girdler he

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00:19:34.200 --> 00:19:37.200
<v Speaker 1>planned to hunt the ghost that night, and Girdler agreed

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<v Speaker 1>to meet up with him after finishing his patrol and

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00:19:40.160 --> 00:19:44.440
<v Speaker 1>calling the hour at eleven pm. The two men even

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00:19:44.480 --> 00:19:48.640
<v Speaker 1>devised a password exchange, a call in response of who

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00:19:48.680 --> 00:19:54.240
<v Speaker 1>comes there and friend advance friend, so they wouldn't mistake

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00:19:54.279 --> 00:19:55.519
<v Speaker 1>each other in the dark.

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<v Speaker 2>Right they're taking this real seriously?

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00:19:57.359 --> 00:20:00.799
<v Speaker 1>They definitely are. Now it's worth remember how dark the

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00:20:00.799 --> 00:20:03.519
<v Speaker 1>streets of Hammersmith were at the time. There were no

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<v Speaker 1>street lights, the sky was moonless, the narrow lanes were

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00:20:06.960 --> 00:20:10.359
<v Speaker 1>lined with hedges and stone walls, making visibility close to

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00:20:10.480 --> 00:20:14.319
<v Speaker 1>zero in that setting. With his nerves frayed and his

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00:20:14.359 --> 00:20:17.759
<v Speaker 1>weapon ready and a drink or two in his system,

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00:20:18.119 --> 00:20:22.640
<v Speaker 1>Smith continued on alone. It was just past eleven pm

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00:20:22.839 --> 00:20:26.720
<v Speaker 1>on January third, eighteen oh four, when Francis Smith, still

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00:20:26.720 --> 00:20:32.279
<v Speaker 1>patrolling that black lined lane, saw something or someone emerge

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<v Speaker 1>from the darkness ahead of him. What he saw match

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00:20:35.880 --> 00:20:39.920
<v Speaker 1>the ghost stories perfectly, a figure dressed entirely in white,

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00:20:40.039 --> 00:20:43.240
<v Speaker 1>moving through the gloom. What he didn't know was that

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<v Speaker 1>figure wasn't a ghost. It was Thomas Millwood, a twenty

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<v Speaker 1>nine year old bricklayer, returning home after visiting his parents

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<v Speaker 1>and sister. He was dressed as bricklayers typically were at

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00:20:54.519 --> 00:20:58.680
<v Speaker 1>the time, in white linen trousers, a white flannel waistcoat,

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<v Speaker 1>and a white apron, his standard work attire. This wasn't

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<v Speaker 1>the first time Millwood had been mistaken for the ghost either.

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00:21:07.160 --> 00:21:09.519
<v Speaker 1>Days earlier, he'd been confronted by a man and two

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<v Speaker 1>women riding in a carriage who shouted that he looked

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<v Speaker 1>like the infamous apparition. According to his wife and sister,

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<v Speaker 1>Millwood had even joked about it afterwards, but refused suggestions

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<v Speaker 1>to wear a coat over his work clothes.

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<v Speaker 2>That night. Yeah this is not going to end well.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Smith spotted Millwood from across the narrow lane in

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<v Speaker 1>the pitch black night, and with adrenaline running high already,

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<v Speaker 1>Smith believed he had finally found the ghost he was

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<v Speaker 1>searching for. Without taking time to confirm who or what

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<v Speaker 1>he was looking at, Smith raised his shotgun and shouted quote,

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00:21:43.680 --> 00:21:46.680
<v Speaker 1>damn you, who are you? And what are you? Damn you?

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00:21:46.759 --> 00:21:50.359
<v Speaker 1>I'll shoot. Then almost immediately after, he pulled the trigger

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<v Speaker 1>and fired.

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00:21:51.359 --> 00:21:51.920
<v Speaker 2>Oh no.

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00:21:52.599 --> 00:21:56.279
<v Speaker 1>The shot hit Thomas Millwood in the lower left jaw,

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00:21:56.519 --> 00:22:00.400
<v Speaker 1>shattering bone, severing part of his spine, and in instantly

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00:22:00.440 --> 00:22:03.839
<v Speaker 1>dropping him to the ground. He died right there where

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00:22:03.839 --> 00:22:04.319
<v Speaker 1>he fell.

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00:22:04.640 --> 00:22:06.680
<v Speaker 2>Holy shits.

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00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:10.880
<v Speaker 1>Inside the nearby house, Milwood's sister Anne had just seen

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00:22:10.960 --> 00:22:11.440
<v Speaker 1>him off.

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00:22:12.000 --> 00:22:16.119
<v Speaker 2>Oh like, he was just leaving the house of the family.

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00:22:15.880 --> 00:22:16.440
<v Speaker 1>Just leaving.

391
00:22:16.720 --> 00:22:17.240
<v Speaker 2>Oh no.

392
00:22:17.799 --> 00:22:20.880
<v Speaker 1>From her window, she heard the confrontation, the shout from

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00:22:20.920 --> 00:22:24.759
<v Speaker 1>the blast. She rushed outside to find her brother motionless

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00:22:24.799 --> 00:22:28.319
<v Speaker 1>in the street, blood spreading across his white clothes.

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00:22:28.680 --> 00:22:30.960
<v Speaker 2>Oh no, that is terrible.

396
00:22:32.240 --> 00:22:35.880
<v Speaker 1>Meanwhile, Smith remained at the scene, stunned, shakened, and pale.

397
00:22:36.559 --> 00:22:40.519
<v Speaker 1>A few others arrived, including watchman William Girdler, and neighbors

398
00:22:40.599 --> 00:22:44.200
<v Speaker 1>John Locke and George Stow. Smith admitted to what he

399
00:22:44.240 --> 00:22:46.359
<v Speaker 1>had done, but he said he hadn't meant to kill

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00:22:46.400 --> 00:22:50.200
<v Speaker 1>a man. He truly believed he had shot a ghost.

401
00:22:50.599 --> 00:22:53.200
<v Speaker 1>Now Thomas Millwood, the man whose life was cut short

402
00:22:53.200 --> 00:22:57.240
<v Speaker 1>in a case of mistaken identity. He wasn't some shadowy

403
00:22:57.240 --> 00:23:00.200
<v Speaker 1>figure or town outsider. Milwood was a local, born and

404
00:23:00.319 --> 00:23:03.319
<v Speaker 1>raised in Hammersmith, and he was dead.

405
00:23:03.920 --> 00:23:08.160
<v Speaker 2>Twenty nine year old. Yeah huh, but I mean, gosh,

406
00:23:08.160 --> 00:23:11.319
<v Speaker 2>what is he thinking. He probably knew that these people

407
00:23:11.680 --> 00:23:13.240
<v Speaker 2>were doing a watch, right.

408
00:23:13.319 --> 00:23:15.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but he probably never thought he would have been shot.

409
00:23:15.599 --> 00:23:18.359
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, well, no, this is no reason that the

410
00:23:18.400 --> 00:23:20.440
<v Speaker 2>guy like, that's not good that the guy shot him.

411
00:23:20.480 --> 00:23:22.559
<v Speaker 2>He should have definitely, you know, maybe gone a little

412
00:23:22.599 --> 00:23:26.880
<v Speaker 2>closer and ensured that this was like a bad figure

413
00:23:26.960 --> 00:23:27.440
<v Speaker 2>or whatever.

414
00:23:27.759 --> 00:23:29.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but it could.

415
00:23:28.839 --> 00:23:30.920
<v Speaker 2>Have also just been as simple as that guy wearing

416
00:23:30.960 --> 00:23:34.880
<v Speaker 2>a dark coat or something exactly. Ah.

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00:23:35.279 --> 00:23:37.480
<v Speaker 1>Now, Like many tradesmen at the time, no Wood wore

418
00:23:37.480 --> 00:23:41.039
<v Speaker 1>a very distinctive uniform that unfortunately played a central role

419
00:23:41.079 --> 00:23:44.720
<v Speaker 1>in his death. His white linen trousers, waistcoat and apron

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00:23:44.720 --> 00:23:48.920
<v Speaker 1>were typically the standard workwear for bricklayers in the early

421
00:23:48.960 --> 00:23:52.839
<v Speaker 1>eighteen hundreds. These garments were easy to bleach and wash,

422
00:23:52.920 --> 00:23:55.559
<v Speaker 1>and after a day spent working with mortar and brick dust,

423
00:23:56.559 --> 00:23:59.160
<v Speaker 1>it was, you know, wash it and good to go again.

424
00:23:59.240 --> 00:24:01.799
<v Speaker 1>But at night, under poor lighting, they made him look

425
00:24:01.880 --> 00:24:05.480
<v Speaker 1>early similar to the ghost that people were talking about.

426
00:24:06.839 --> 00:24:10.200
<v Speaker 1>This wasn't lost on his family. Milwood's wife and sister

427
00:24:10.279 --> 00:24:13.880
<v Speaker 1>had both warned him, as I mentioned, wear a cloak,

428
00:24:14.079 --> 00:24:19.559
<v Speaker 1>oat or something. He did shit. His wife even testified

429
00:24:19.640 --> 00:24:22.200
<v Speaker 1>later that Thomas had previously frightened a group of people

430
00:24:22.240 --> 00:24:25.559
<v Speaker 1>by accident, the same ones we mentioned, and she pleaded

431
00:24:25.559 --> 00:24:28.680
<v Speaker 1>with him to change his appearance to avoid trouble, but

432
00:24:29.400 --> 00:24:33.000
<v Speaker 1>he was confident there was nothing to worry about. On

433
00:24:33.000 --> 00:24:35.039
<v Speaker 1>the night of January third, he left his parents home

434
00:24:35.079 --> 00:24:37.759
<v Speaker 1>on Black Lion Lane and stepped out into the cold,

435
00:24:38.200 --> 00:24:41.000
<v Speaker 1>dressed as the usual, you know, just all in white.

436
00:24:41.759 --> 00:24:44.759
<v Speaker 1>It was only a short walk from his home, just

437
00:24:44.799 --> 00:24:48.480
<v Speaker 1>down the lane. He likely didn't see Francis Smith until

438
00:24:48.519 --> 00:24:50.400
<v Speaker 1>it was too late, or if he did, he had

439
00:24:50.400 --> 00:24:52.319
<v Speaker 1>no reason to suspect that the men was pointing a

440
00:24:52.319 --> 00:24:56.559
<v Speaker 1>loaded shotgun at him. Either. Melwood didn't provoke Smith, he

441
00:24:56.559 --> 00:24:59.319
<v Speaker 1>made no threats, he carried no weapon, and as far

442
00:24:59.359 --> 00:25:02.400
<v Speaker 1>as witnesses, Cautel didn't even have time to respond to

443
00:25:02.440 --> 00:25:08.359
<v Speaker 1>Smith's shouting before the trigger was pulled. The shooting stunned

444
00:25:08.359 --> 00:25:12.960
<v Speaker 1>the small community of Hammersmith. Francis Smith visibly shaken. He

445
00:25:13.000 --> 00:25:16.200
<v Speaker 1>stayed at that scene. He didn't run, he didn't flee.

446
00:25:16.279 --> 00:25:20.240
<v Speaker 1>He stayed nearby in shock, clearly of what just happened,

447
00:25:20.880 --> 00:25:24.400
<v Speaker 1>and when local watchman William Girdler arrived moments later, Smith

448
00:25:24.480 --> 00:25:28.319
<v Speaker 1>confessed everything that he'd done. His exact words weren't recorded,

449
00:25:28.319 --> 00:25:32.640
<v Speaker 1>but multiple witnesses described him as agitated, pale, and very remorseful.

450
00:25:33.799 --> 00:25:36.640
<v Speaker 1>Shortly after the shootings, Millwood's body was carried to the

451
00:25:36.680 --> 00:25:39.400
<v Speaker 1>nearby Black Lion Pub, where it was laid out on

452
00:25:39.440 --> 00:25:42.519
<v Speaker 1>a table. A surgeon named mister Flower was called in

453
00:25:42.559 --> 00:25:46.559
<v Speaker 1>to examine his remains. His report was grim. The shot

454
00:25:46.599 --> 00:25:49.359
<v Speaker 1>had entered his lower left jaw, shattered bone, and passed

455
00:25:49.920 --> 00:25:52.599
<v Speaker 1>through the vertebrae of his neck, injuring the spinal marrow.

456
00:25:53.240 --> 00:25:55.319
<v Speaker 1>Death would have been instantaneous.

457
00:25:55.519 --> 00:26:00.839
<v Speaker 2>Okay, oh man, I mean it makes like it's his

458
00:26:01.039 --> 00:26:03.119
<v Speaker 2>right to wear what he wants. But then especially if

459
00:26:03.119 --> 00:26:05.400
<v Speaker 2>he's out and a boat at night, you know, yeah,

460
00:26:05.440 --> 00:26:07.680
<v Speaker 2>just at night, maybe just put something else on.

461
00:26:09.039 --> 00:26:10.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, fair enough.

462
00:26:10.119 --> 00:26:12.200
<v Speaker 2>This is terrible. This is so sad.

463
00:26:12.480 --> 00:26:15.319
<v Speaker 1>It puts him in the way of danger for sure.

464
00:26:15.359 --> 00:26:16.559
<v Speaker 1>But it's not his fault.

465
00:26:16.720 --> 00:26:19.039
<v Speaker 2>No, I'm not saying it is his fault in any way,

466
00:26:19.920 --> 00:26:23.880
<v Speaker 2>but like I guess, it just could have been preventable. Oh,

467
00:26:23.920 --> 00:26:25.440
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, but yeah, that one guy. He's a

468
00:26:25.519 --> 00:26:26.720
<v Speaker 2>murderer now he is.

469
00:26:26.920 --> 00:26:32.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Now, Smith did not resist. When local constables arrived,

470
00:26:32.359 --> 00:26:36.440
<v Speaker 1>he surrendered himself voluntarily and was taken into custody. News

471
00:26:36.440 --> 00:26:39.640
<v Speaker 1>of the shooting spread quickly through Hammersmith, a community already

472
00:26:39.680 --> 00:26:42.279
<v Speaker 1>on edge from weeks of ghostly sightings. They now had

473
00:26:42.319 --> 00:26:45.119
<v Speaker 1>to confront a far more tangible horror. A man had

474
00:26:45.160 --> 00:26:49.000
<v Speaker 1>been killed not by a spirit but basically just by fear,

475
00:26:49.880 --> 00:26:53.400
<v Speaker 1>and the public's reaction was conflicted. On one hand, many

476
00:26:53.480 --> 00:26:56.880
<v Speaker 1>saw Smith as a man who had been simply, you know,

477
00:26:57.000 --> 00:26:59.680
<v Speaker 1>swept up in panic, that had been hold taking hold

478
00:26:59.720 --> 00:27:02.680
<v Speaker 1>of the whole village. He had no known history of violence,

479
00:27:02.880 --> 00:27:06.279
<v Speaker 1>he had turned himself in, he was cooperative and deeply remorseful.

480
00:27:06.920 --> 00:27:10.440
<v Speaker 1>On the other hand, he had armed himself with this gun,

481
00:27:10.599 --> 00:27:13.920
<v Speaker 1>going out looking for a confrontation, which is exactly what

482
00:27:13.960 --> 00:27:18.119
<v Speaker 1>he found. The next step was, of course inevitable. Smith

483
00:27:18.119 --> 00:27:22.319
<v Speaker 1>would be tried for murder. The trial began on January thirteenth,

484
00:27:22.319 --> 00:27:25.680
<v Speaker 1>eighteen oh four, just ten days after the shooting. It

485
00:27:25.759 --> 00:27:29.799
<v Speaker 1>took place at Old Bailey, London's Central Criminal Court and

486
00:27:29.880 --> 00:27:34.799
<v Speaker 1>quickly drew public attention. The facts weren't in question. Smith

487
00:27:34.839 --> 00:27:37.839
<v Speaker 1>had openly admitted to firing the fatal shot. The only

488
00:27:37.880 --> 00:27:42.279
<v Speaker 1>real issue was what the law made of it. Smith

489
00:27:42.400 --> 00:27:45.400
<v Speaker 1>entered a plea of not guilty, arguing that the killing

490
00:27:45.519 --> 00:27:48.839
<v Speaker 1>had been a tragic mistake. He believed he was shooting

491
00:27:48.880 --> 00:27:52.559
<v Speaker 1>a ghost and not a man. Witnesses testified to what

492
00:27:52.599 --> 00:27:55.279
<v Speaker 1>had happened on the night of the shooting, and Millwood,

493
00:27:55.359 --> 00:28:00.000
<v Speaker 1>Thomas's sister gave a heartbreaking account watching her brother walk

494
00:28:00.119 --> 00:28:03.000
<v Speaker 1>out into the dark street, only to hear Smith shout

495
00:28:03.079 --> 00:28:07.400
<v Speaker 1>and fire and leave him dead in seconds. Smith's own

496
00:28:07.440 --> 00:28:10.559
<v Speaker 1>statements were also shared in the court. He admitted he

497
00:28:10.720 --> 00:28:13.440
<v Speaker 1>yelled at the figure and given it time before firing.

498
00:28:13.880 --> 00:28:17.960
<v Speaker 1>While some described his behavior as impulsive, others, especially the defense,

499
00:28:18.319 --> 00:28:20.720
<v Speaker 1>emphasized that Smith had been frightened, caught up in the

500
00:28:20.799 --> 00:28:24.119
<v Speaker 1>hysteria of ghost panic, and acted under a mistaken belief

501
00:28:24.160 --> 00:28:26.160
<v Speaker 1>that he was confronting something supernatural.

502
00:28:26.799 --> 00:28:30.160
<v Speaker 2>I'm doubting that he gave much time after shouting.

503
00:28:30.400 --> 00:28:34.960
<v Speaker 1>By all accounts, he did not. It was he shouted

504
00:28:34.960 --> 00:28:36.319
<v Speaker 1>and pulled the trigger at the same time.

505
00:28:36.400 --> 00:28:38.319
<v Speaker 2>Yeah yeah.

506
00:28:38.440 --> 00:28:41.200
<v Speaker 1>A number of character witnesses spoke up for Smith, calling

507
00:28:41.279 --> 00:28:45.119
<v Speaker 1>him mild mannered, responsible, and deeply regretful, but none of

508
00:28:45.119 --> 00:28:48.000
<v Speaker 1>this swayed the most important figure in the room, Lord,

509
00:28:48.039 --> 00:28:52.680
<v Speaker 1>Chief Baron, Sir Archibald McDonald. That is a name and title.

510
00:28:52.960 --> 00:28:53.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, no kidding.

511
00:28:54.240 --> 00:28:58.119
<v Speaker 1>He was the presiding judge, so I'll call him Judge McDonald.

512
00:28:58.480 --> 00:28:59.759
<v Speaker 1>Judge McDonald was blunt.

513
00:29:00.200 --> 00:29:00.799
<v Speaker 2>In his view.

514
00:29:00.839 --> 00:29:05.160
<v Speaker 1>Smith had intentionally fired a loaded weapon at another person,

515
00:29:05.599 --> 00:29:10.119
<v Speaker 1>and whatever his belief, it didn't matter to quote him

516
00:29:10.559 --> 00:29:14.720
<v Speaker 1>all killing whatever amounts to murder unless justified by law

517
00:29:15.000 --> 00:29:19.240
<v Speaker 1>or in self defense. He told the jury, even if

518
00:29:19.240 --> 00:29:21.519
<v Speaker 1>the figure had turned out to be someone pretending to

519
00:29:21.559 --> 00:29:25.200
<v Speaker 1>be a ghost, that still wouldn't justify shooting them. Pretending

520
00:29:25.240 --> 00:29:28.759
<v Speaker 1>to be a ghost while irritating and irresponsible was not

521
00:29:28.880 --> 00:29:32.400
<v Speaker 1>a capital crime. The law was clear Smith had acted

522
00:29:32.480 --> 00:29:37.160
<v Speaker 1>outside of it. Jud MacDonald also told the jury that

523
00:29:37.240 --> 00:29:44.680
<v Speaker 1>quote malice was not required for a murder conviction. Intent

524
00:29:44.759 --> 00:29:48.920
<v Speaker 1>to kill or intent to do grievous harm was enough,

525
00:29:49.400 --> 00:29:52.720
<v Speaker 1>and Smith, he argued, had made the deliberate decision to shoot,

526
00:29:53.319 --> 00:29:59.039
<v Speaker 1>and that in itself is murder. After an hour of deliberation,

527
00:29:59.440 --> 00:30:04.200
<v Speaker 1>the jury turned with a verdict of manslaughter, a lesser

528
00:30:04.319 --> 00:30:07.759
<v Speaker 1>charge that acknowledged rum doing but not full intent. Yeah,

529
00:30:08.440 --> 00:30:12.960
<v Speaker 1>the court however, wasn't having it. Uh Oh, Judge McDonald

530
00:30:13.039 --> 00:30:14.839
<v Speaker 1>rejected the verdict outright.

531
00:30:15.160 --> 00:30:17.440
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, I didn't see that coming.

532
00:30:17.599 --> 00:30:22.200
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, quote, the court cannot receive such a verdict. He

533
00:30:22.279 --> 00:30:27.039
<v Speaker 1>reminded the jury to choose either murder or acquittal, nothing

534
00:30:27.079 --> 00:30:27.559
<v Speaker 1>in between.

535
00:30:28.279 --> 00:30:32.000
<v Speaker 2>Huh. But the manslaughter kind of makes sense though, so

536
00:30:32.039 --> 00:30:33.039
<v Speaker 2>that okay.

537
00:30:33.079 --> 00:30:36.839
<v Speaker 1>Yes, it makes sense for nowadays. You're also thinking, not

538
00:30:36.880 --> 00:30:40.960
<v Speaker 1>thinking that this case is early eighteen hundred. Yeah, true, true,

539
00:30:41.720 --> 00:30:44.119
<v Speaker 1>So face with no other option. The jury returned with

540
00:30:44.160 --> 00:30:48.559
<v Speaker 1>a new verdict guilty of murder, and Judge McDonald handed

541
00:30:48.559 --> 00:30:51.559
<v Speaker 1>down the sentence death by hanging.

542
00:30:51.799 --> 00:30:56.240
<v Speaker 2>Oh no, yeah, I don't know why. I didn't think

543
00:30:56.279 --> 00:30:58.480
<v Speaker 2>that was gonna happen either. Holy shit.

544
00:30:58.839 --> 00:31:00.680
<v Speaker 1>Once again, you're talking eighteen hundreds.

545
00:31:00.759 --> 00:31:02.119
<v Speaker 2>Yep. Dang.

546
00:31:02.599 --> 00:31:05.119
<v Speaker 1>So even those who agreed with Francis Smith had broken

547
00:31:05.119 --> 00:31:08.000
<v Speaker 1>the law were unnerved by severity of the punishment here.

548
00:31:08.400 --> 00:31:11.160
<v Speaker 1>He wasn't a violent man, he hadn't acted at a cruelty,

549
00:31:11.240 --> 00:31:14.880
<v Speaker 1>your personal malice. He had made a terrible mistake born

550
00:31:14.880 --> 00:31:17.319
<v Speaker 1>out of fear, superstition, mass hysteria, whatever you want to

551
00:31:17.319 --> 00:31:20.200
<v Speaker 1>call it. And now for that mistake, he was going

552
00:31:20.240 --> 00:31:21.880
<v Speaker 1>to be executed.

553
00:31:21.440 --> 00:31:24.559
<v Speaker 2>But that mistake did cost another man his life.

554
00:31:24.599 --> 00:31:28.440
<v Speaker 1>It did, yes, And this is where it's that blurred line.

555
00:31:29.119 --> 00:31:31.799
<v Speaker 1>So where do you draw this line?

556
00:31:32.000 --> 00:31:34.960
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I'm sitting here being like, yeah, manslaughter, that

557
00:31:35.000 --> 00:31:38.279
<v Speaker 2>makes sense. And then he just goes to jail. I

558
00:31:38.319 --> 00:31:42.279
<v Speaker 2>do think he needs to pay some consequences, agreed, But

559
00:31:42.400 --> 00:31:47.240
<v Speaker 2>then back then too gosh to be hung. Oh I

560
00:31:47.240 --> 00:31:49.799
<v Speaker 2>don't know. Now I'm really really torn.

561
00:31:50.240 --> 00:31:55.839
<v Speaker 1>Well you might appreciate what comes next. Public reaction was swift.

562
00:31:56.200 --> 00:31:59.599
<v Speaker 1>Many believed the punishment didn't fit the circumstances. There was

563
00:31:59.599 --> 00:32:02.440
<v Speaker 1>a growing sense that Smith wasn't a cold blooded killer,

564
00:32:02.480 --> 00:32:05.400
<v Speaker 1>but rather a man swept up in a collective panic, trying,

565
00:32:05.720 --> 00:32:09.920
<v Speaker 1>however misguidedly, to protect his neighbors. Even the judge, Lord

566
00:32:09.960 --> 00:32:12.920
<v Speaker 1>Chief Baron MacDonald appeared to understand the gravity of what

567
00:32:12.960 --> 00:32:16.079
<v Speaker 1>had happened. After sentencing Smith, he referred to the case

568
00:32:16.160 --> 00:32:20.640
<v Speaker 1>to the King for consideration, who signaling that he didn't

569
00:32:20.640 --> 00:32:25.119
<v Speaker 1>personally believe this should have ended in the gallows. Behind

570
00:32:25.119 --> 00:32:30.240
<v Speaker 1>the scenes, Smith's reporters worked quickly filing appeals and requesting clemency,

571
00:32:30.559 --> 00:32:34.920
<v Speaker 1>and within a matter of days, the Crown responded, Okay, just.

572
00:32:34.920 --> 00:32:36.960
<v Speaker 2>Wait, I'm confused he was kind of the one that

573
00:32:37.119 --> 00:32:39.000
<v Speaker 2>sort of sent it to the gallows? Is he not?

574
00:32:39.680 --> 00:32:43.640
<v Speaker 1>Yes, because he's gone by the book. Okay, he's saying

575
00:32:43.720 --> 00:32:46.759
<v Speaker 1>it's he killed a man. It's either he's guilty of

576
00:32:46.839 --> 00:32:50.799
<v Speaker 1>murdering him or he's not guilty of murdering him. Okay, Okay,

577
00:32:50.920 --> 00:32:53.319
<v Speaker 1>he murdered him. Okay, you murdered him, then.

578
00:32:53.240 --> 00:32:54.160
<v Speaker 2>This is the punishment.

579
00:32:54.240 --> 00:32:55.079
<v Speaker 1>This is the punishment.

580
00:32:55.240 --> 00:32:55.599
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

581
00:32:55.920 --> 00:32:59.880
<v Speaker 1>But even the judge is like, this doesn't seem right,

582
00:33:00.640 --> 00:33:02.519
<v Speaker 1>so he passes it on to the king to be like,

583
00:33:03.039 --> 00:33:03.920
<v Speaker 1>what do you think.

584
00:33:03.759 --> 00:33:06.759
<v Speaker 2>We need like a higher opinion here.

585
00:33:06.599 --> 00:33:09.799
<v Speaker 1>We need someone to oversee this. So it was just

586
00:33:09.920 --> 00:33:12.839
<v Speaker 1>three weeks after the shooting on January twenty fifth, eighteen

587
00:33:12.839 --> 00:33:16.960
<v Speaker 1>oh four, King George the Third issued a royal pardon.

588
00:33:18.039 --> 00:33:21.720
<v Speaker 1>The death sentence was commuted to a far less severe punishment,

589
00:33:22.160 --> 00:33:24.279
<v Speaker 1>one year of hard labor.

590
00:33:24.880 --> 00:33:26.759
<v Speaker 2>Oh so, yes, he was.

591
00:33:26.799 --> 00:33:30.279
<v Speaker 1>Guilty of murder, but he was no longer being sentenced

592
00:33:30.279 --> 00:33:32.480
<v Speaker 1>to the gallows. He was sentenced to one year of

593
00:33:32.519 --> 00:33:33.119
<v Speaker 1>hard labor.

594
00:33:33.480 --> 00:33:36.160
<v Speaker 2>Huh, what the shit is hard labor? Exactly? Because I

595
00:33:36.200 --> 00:33:38.200
<v Speaker 2>kind of like this, this is like actually getting shit

596
00:33:38.279 --> 00:33:41.359
<v Speaker 2>done for the community, right, instead of him just sitting

597
00:33:41.400 --> 00:33:44.079
<v Speaker 2>in jail for a year doing buck all like he's

598
00:33:44.119 --> 00:33:47.839
<v Speaker 2>gonna get things done. Yeah, huh, okay, I don't mind that.

599
00:33:48.240 --> 00:33:51.920
<v Speaker 1>And honestly they'll probably use his knowledge, you know, and

600
00:33:52.000 --> 00:33:55.119
<v Speaker 1>his trade to you be okay, go build some shit.

601
00:33:55.039 --> 00:33:57.720
<v Speaker 2>Right, yeah for free, get to work exactly.

602
00:33:58.319 --> 00:34:00.519
<v Speaker 1>So it was still a sentence and Smith serve it.

603
00:34:00.599 --> 00:34:03.279
<v Speaker 1>But it was also a clear acknowledgment by the Crown

604
00:34:03.359 --> 00:34:06.400
<v Speaker 1>that the court had been placed in an impossible situation.

605
00:34:07.160 --> 00:34:09.639
<v Speaker 1>The law as it stood hadn't accounted for a case

606
00:34:09.719 --> 00:34:12.840
<v Speaker 1>like this one where belief, however rational, had played such

607
00:34:12.840 --> 00:34:16.840
<v Speaker 1>a central role in someone's actions. Now, not long after

608
00:34:16.880 --> 00:34:19.159
<v Speaker 1>the shooting, and once the story had made its way

609
00:34:19.199 --> 00:34:22.599
<v Speaker 1>into newspapers across London, the truth about the Hammersmith Ghost

610
00:34:22.840 --> 00:34:26.880
<v Speaker 1>began to surface, and it turned out the ghost probably

611
00:34:26.960 --> 00:34:29.559
<v Speaker 1>wasn't a ghost at all. In fact, it wasn't even

612
00:34:29.599 --> 00:34:30.199
<v Speaker 1>one person.

613
00:34:31.239 --> 00:34:33.639
<v Speaker 2>Oh, it was just numerous people playing tricks.

614
00:34:34.480 --> 00:34:36.760
<v Speaker 1>The first major clue came from a local man named

615
00:34:36.840 --> 00:34:41.920
<v Speaker 1>John Graham, a shoemaker an occasional singer at the Hammersmith Church.

616
00:34:41.920 --> 00:34:45.840
<v Speaker 1>Even after the incident, Graham came forward and admitted that

617
00:34:45.960 --> 00:34:48.719
<v Speaker 1>he had dressed up as a ghost using a white

618
00:34:48.719 --> 00:34:52.840
<v Speaker 1>sheet with the intention of frightening his apprentices. Now, according

619
00:34:52.840 --> 00:34:55.679
<v Speaker 1>to Graham, the young men had been scaring his children

620
00:34:55.719 --> 00:34:58.360
<v Speaker 1>with ghost stories, and he wanted to teach them a lesson.

621
00:34:58.880 --> 00:35:00.679
<v Speaker 1>So it's like, you're scaring my kid with ghost stories,

622
00:35:00.719 --> 00:35:02.519
<v Speaker 1>I'm gonna scare you with a ghost story sort of thing.

623
00:35:02.599 --> 00:35:02.800
<v Speaker 2>Right.

624
00:35:03.599 --> 00:35:06.280
<v Speaker 1>He didn't expect the entire village to go into a panic,

625
00:35:06.320 --> 00:35:09.480
<v Speaker 1>and he certainly didn't anticipate that somewhood would be killed

626
00:35:09.559 --> 00:35:14.679
<v Speaker 1>as a result. But while Graham's confession explained one part

627
00:35:14.679 --> 00:35:18.400
<v Speaker 1>of the mystery, it didn't account for all the reported encounters.

628
00:35:18.920 --> 00:35:23.519
<v Speaker 1>There'd been multiple sightings stretching across weeks. Witnesses had described

629
00:35:23.559 --> 00:35:25.920
<v Speaker 1>wildly different versions of the ghosts. Some said it was

630
00:35:25.960 --> 00:35:30.000
<v Speaker 1>covered in white shroud Others described horns, glass eyes, or

631
00:35:30.039 --> 00:35:33.920
<v Speaker 1>even calf skin garments. This led many to believe that

632
00:35:34.000 --> 00:35:36.000
<v Speaker 1>more than one person may have been dressing up to

633
00:35:36.039 --> 00:35:40.079
<v Speaker 1>impersonate the ghost. Some were likely copycats, taking advantage of

634
00:35:40.079 --> 00:35:43.920
<v Speaker 1>the legend or playing pranks simply to start chaos. Others

635
00:35:44.000 --> 00:35:47.400
<v Speaker 1>may have been mistaken identities, like Thomas Millwood.

636
00:35:47.039 --> 00:35:51.039
<v Speaker 2>Himself, but it could also just be stories escalating to right.

637
00:35:51.400 --> 00:35:57.159
<v Speaker 1>Exactly definitely, and in many cases with mass hysteria. It's

638
00:35:57.199 --> 00:36:00.000
<v Speaker 1>also likely that some of the sightings never even happened

639
00:36:00.119 --> 00:36:02.360
<v Speaker 1>at all. Kind of like what you were alluding to,

640
00:36:02.480 --> 00:36:05.440
<v Speaker 1>you know, right, people were on edge, anxious and prime

641
00:36:05.559 --> 00:36:08.800
<v Speaker 1>to believe. In an age before electric light, television or

642
00:36:08.840 --> 00:36:12.920
<v Speaker 1>even you know, regular policing, stories had power, and fear

643
00:36:12.960 --> 00:36:17.280
<v Speaker 1>could be contagious and disease. So while John Graham might

644
00:36:17.320 --> 00:36:20.480
<v Speaker 1>have started it, the full truth of the Hammersmith Ghost

645
00:36:20.679 --> 00:36:23.280
<v Speaker 1>may never be known. Whether it was a prank gone

646
00:36:23.280 --> 00:36:26.840
<v Speaker 1>too far, multiple impersonators, or the wild imagination of a

647
00:36:26.880 --> 00:36:31.079
<v Speaker 1>frightened public, the result was the same. A man had

648
00:36:31.119 --> 00:36:36.559
<v Speaker 1>lost his life and another's life was changed forever. Now,

649
00:36:36.559 --> 00:36:38.719
<v Speaker 1>the case of Francis Smith didn't just grip the public.

650
00:36:38.719 --> 00:36:41.719
<v Speaker 1>It also left an enduring mark in the British legal system.

651
00:36:42.079 --> 00:36:43.760
<v Speaker 1>At the time of his trial in eighteen oh four,

652
00:36:43.800 --> 00:36:46.480
<v Speaker 1>there was no legal protection for someone acting under a

653
00:36:46.519 --> 00:36:51.079
<v Speaker 1>mistaken belief, even if that belief was sincere. Smith believed

654
00:36:51.119 --> 00:36:53.440
<v Speaker 1>he was shooting at a ghost, not a person, but

655
00:36:53.559 --> 00:36:57.159
<v Speaker 1>under law as it stood, that did not matter. The

656
00:36:57.199 --> 00:36:59.679
<v Speaker 1>court had no legal grounds to accept his intentions as

657
00:36:59.679 --> 00:37:03.199
<v Speaker 1>a mitigating factor. As far as the judge was concerned,

658
00:37:03.199 --> 00:37:06.119
<v Speaker 1>Smith had fired a loaded weapon at human being and

659
00:37:06.199 --> 00:37:10.360
<v Speaker 1>that is murder, simple as that, but legal scholars, judges,

660
00:37:10.400 --> 00:37:14.119
<v Speaker 1>and philosophers continue to debate the case for decades from here,

661
00:37:14.599 --> 00:37:18.719
<v Speaker 1>asking the central question should someone be held fully responsible

662
00:37:18.760 --> 00:37:21.519
<v Speaker 1>for their actions if they genuinely believed they were preventing

663
00:37:21.559 --> 00:37:25.679
<v Speaker 1>harm or acting in self defense, even if they were mistaken.

664
00:37:27.159 --> 00:37:30.440
<v Speaker 1>This question lingered in British law until it was finally

665
00:37:30.480 --> 00:37:36.440
<v Speaker 1>addressed nearly one hundred and eighty years later. Well, it

666
00:37:36.519 --> 00:37:39.159
<v Speaker 1>came up and was addressed in the case of R V.

667
00:37:39.239 --> 00:37:45.400
<v Speaker 1>Williams Gladstone in nineteen eighty four. In this case, a

668
00:37:45.400 --> 00:37:48.400
<v Speaker 1>man named Gladstone Williams saw what he believed was an

669
00:37:48.440 --> 00:37:52.760
<v Speaker 1>assault in progress, a man dragging a youth down the street.

670
00:37:53.199 --> 00:37:56.599
<v Speaker 1>Thinking he was defending that victim, Williams intervened and attacked

671
00:37:56.639 --> 00:38:00.199
<v Speaker 1>the man who was dragging the youth. But the man

672
00:38:00.239 --> 00:38:04.199
<v Speaker 1>he hit wasn't an attacker. Instead, he was a good

673
00:38:04.239 --> 00:38:06.639
<v Speaker 1>samaritan restraining a suspected thief.

674
00:38:08.239 --> 00:38:08.639
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

675
00:38:09.519 --> 00:38:12.519
<v Speaker 1>Williams was arrested and charged with assault, but at his trial,

676
00:38:12.599 --> 00:38:14.880
<v Speaker 1>the court ruled that if a person acts under a

677
00:38:14.920 --> 00:38:18.280
<v Speaker 1>mistaken belief that their actions are necessary to prevent a

678
00:38:18.320 --> 00:38:22.280
<v Speaker 1>crime or defend someone, and if the belief is honestly held,

679
00:38:22.639 --> 00:38:26.800
<v Speaker 1>then they should not be automatically criminally liable even if

680
00:38:26.800 --> 00:38:31.800
<v Speaker 1>the belief is mistaken. This marked a major shift in

681
00:38:31.840 --> 00:38:35.440
<v Speaker 1>English law and effectively addressed the question raised by the

682
00:38:35.480 --> 00:38:41.320
<v Speaker 1>Hammersmith Ghost case nearly two centuries earlier. The principal established

683
00:38:41.360 --> 00:38:44.920
<v Speaker 1>in the rv. Williams case was eventually written into statue

684
00:38:45.159 --> 00:38:48.719
<v Speaker 1>and the Criminal Justice and Immigration Act in two thousand

685
00:38:48.760 --> 00:38:53.280
<v Speaker 1>and eight, which formally recognized that self defense could include

686
00:38:53.440 --> 00:38:57.920
<v Speaker 1>honest but mistaken beliefs as long as the belief was

687
00:38:58.280 --> 00:39:02.960
<v Speaker 1>genuine Others. Had that law existed in eighteen oh four,

688
00:39:03.119 --> 00:39:06.519
<v Speaker 1>Francis Smith may never have been convicted of murder in

689
00:39:06.599 --> 00:39:07.440
<v Speaker 1>the first place.

690
00:39:08.280 --> 00:39:10.199
<v Speaker 2>I think it's got to be different though. The one

691
00:39:10.320 --> 00:39:14.159
<v Speaker 2>was an attack, right, I'm assuming the person he attacked

692
00:39:14.280 --> 00:39:16.920
<v Speaker 2>ends up being okay, yeah, But this other one's murder.

693
00:39:16.960 --> 00:39:20.599
<v Speaker 2>It's it's it's two different spectrums, in my opinion.

694
00:39:20.400 --> 00:39:24.119
<v Speaker 1>Two different spectrums, but it's the same principle. The result

695
00:39:24.239 --> 00:39:27.039
<v Speaker 1>is different, but the same principle occurred in between.

696
00:39:27.159 --> 00:39:28.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I guess.

697
00:39:28.599 --> 00:39:32.400
<v Speaker 1>So if if this guy attacked him and he ended

698
00:39:32.440 --> 00:39:35.199
<v Speaker 1>up dying, it was the same scenario, Like you still

699
00:39:35.199 --> 00:39:37.800
<v Speaker 1>need to figure out how to handle that situation.

700
00:39:38.960 --> 00:39:42.119
<v Speaker 2>Hmm. That is tough because yeah, I feel like most

701
00:39:42.119 --> 00:39:46.559
<v Speaker 2>people would see something like that and think, you know,

702
00:39:46.719 --> 00:39:52.000
<v Speaker 2>the person dragging the other person, you know they weren't okay, Yeah,

703
00:39:52.039 --> 00:39:54.559
<v Speaker 2>so oh that is so tough.

704
00:39:54.920 --> 00:39:57.760
<v Speaker 1>Well, I've even seen some like TikTok reels and instagram

705
00:39:57.800 --> 00:40:02.480
<v Speaker 1>stuff on like small movie set, small productions, indie films, right,

706
00:40:03.079 --> 00:40:05.199
<v Speaker 1>and it's like they're in a street. There's like a

707
00:40:05.320 --> 00:40:08.119
<v Speaker 1>camera and like a boom operator. There's like three or

708
00:40:08.199 --> 00:40:10.159
<v Speaker 1>four crew members working on this, and they have two

709
00:40:10.199 --> 00:40:12.280
<v Speaker 1>actors in the street. They're running down a sidewalk and

710
00:40:12.320 --> 00:40:14.840
<v Speaker 1>it's like a woman being assaulted by a man sort

711
00:40:14.880 --> 00:40:17.679
<v Speaker 1>of thing, and someone in the background like runs in

712
00:40:17.800 --> 00:40:21.480
<v Speaker 1>to help defend and it's like the crew is like whoa, stop, stop,

713
00:40:21.480 --> 00:40:23.800
<v Speaker 1>like we're filming something, and it's like oh shit, okay,

714
00:40:24.639 --> 00:40:27.880
<v Speaker 1>like you know, okay, because it's a misunderstood situation.

715
00:40:30.440 --> 00:40:32.519
<v Speaker 2>But you I mean, you don't want to change that

716
00:40:33.079 --> 00:40:36.119
<v Speaker 2>right where people don't try it and go and help.

717
00:40:36.119 --> 00:40:38.920
<v Speaker 1>No, definitely not. But if it ends up getting to

718
00:40:38.960 --> 00:40:42.239
<v Speaker 1>the point where they do go and help, but it

719
00:40:42.320 --> 00:40:46.320
<v Speaker 1>goes too far under a misunderstanding, it needs, those people

720
00:40:46.360 --> 00:40:51.000
<v Speaker 1>need to be protected. Yeah, right, because it's clearly a misunderstanding. Yeah,

721
00:40:51.360 --> 00:40:56.800
<v Speaker 1>but that also brings in the oh, I totally misunderstood

722
00:40:56.800 --> 00:40:57.599
<v Speaker 1>those situation.

723
00:40:58.000 --> 00:41:01.119
<v Speaker 2>I know. I was just thinking that, I'm gosh, people

724
00:41:01.119 --> 00:41:03.960
<v Speaker 2>could get away with things that they just were quick

725
00:41:04.000 --> 00:41:06.239
<v Speaker 2>on their feet and came up with a freaking story.

726
00:41:06.320 --> 00:41:08.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So it's got to be genuine. As long as

727
00:41:08.920 --> 00:41:11.599
<v Speaker 1>you can prove genuine and non genuine.

728
00:41:11.239 --> 00:41:12.840
<v Speaker 2>I guess now.

729
00:41:12.840 --> 00:41:15.199
<v Speaker 1>The Hammersmith Ghost Case remains one of the strangest and

730
00:41:15.239 --> 00:41:19.280
<v Speaker 1>most enduring tales in British legal and paranormal history. It's

731
00:41:19.320 --> 00:41:21.880
<v Speaker 1>a story that blends ghost lore and a courtroom drama,

732
00:41:22.199 --> 00:41:24.960
<v Speaker 1>plus a chilling reminder of how fear, superstition, and a

733
00:41:25.039 --> 00:41:28.639
<v Speaker 1>rumor can spiral into real world tragedy. For the people

734
00:41:28.679 --> 00:41:31.159
<v Speaker 1>of Hammersmith in eighteen oh three and eighteen oh four,

735
00:41:31.599 --> 00:41:34.079
<v Speaker 1>the ghost wasn't just a campfire tale. It was a living,

736
00:41:34.199 --> 00:41:38.079
<v Speaker 1>breathing threat. Women fainted, locals refused to quote. At night,

737
00:41:38.400 --> 00:41:41.519
<v Speaker 1>men formed armed patrols, and one of those men, fueled

738
00:41:41.519 --> 00:41:46.360
<v Speaker 1>by fear and alcohol, killed an innocent person, Thomas Millwood.

739
00:41:46.400 --> 00:41:48.719
<v Speaker 1>The victim was just trying to walk home in his

740
00:41:48.760 --> 00:41:52.639
<v Speaker 1>work clothes. His death was not just a personal loss

741
00:41:52.639 --> 00:41:54.760
<v Speaker 1>for his family, it became a symbol of what happens

742
00:41:54.920 --> 00:41:59.159
<v Speaker 1>when fear overrides all reason. And while Francis Smith escaped

743
00:41:59.199 --> 00:42:02.280
<v Speaker 1>the gallows thanks to a royal pardon, which that in

744
00:42:02.320 --> 00:42:06.360
<v Speaker 1>itself is super rare, the Hammersmith ghost hell was retold

745
00:42:06.360 --> 00:42:10.360
<v Speaker 1>in newspapers, pamphlets and books for generations, and in the

746
00:42:10.400 --> 00:42:13.800
<v Speaker 1>decades that followed. London would go on to be haunted

747
00:42:13.840 --> 00:42:19.320
<v Speaker 1>by other supposed apparitions, including springhel Jack, a leaping, fire

748
00:42:19.360 --> 00:42:22.679
<v Speaker 1>breathing figure also said to terrorize women in the eighteen thirties.

749
00:42:23.679 --> 00:42:26.880
<v Speaker 1>Even in the twentieth century, the ghost of Hammersmith remains

750
00:42:26.960 --> 00:42:30.599
<v Speaker 1>part of the local lore. In nineteen fifty five, exactly

751
00:42:30.639 --> 00:42:33.920
<v Speaker 1>one hundred and fifty years after the shooting, a ghost

752
00:42:34.039 --> 00:42:37.119
<v Speaker 1>hunter's gap or a group of ghost hunters gathered at

753
00:42:37.159 --> 00:42:40.280
<v Speaker 1>Saint Paul's churchyard, hoping to catch a glimpse of the

754
00:42:40.320 --> 00:42:44.480
<v Speaker 1>specter that had once caused so much chaos. Some claim

755
00:42:44.519 --> 00:42:47.760
<v Speaker 1>to see a white figure float amongst the tombstones, Others

756
00:42:47.800 --> 00:42:52.360
<v Speaker 1>predictably saw nothing. The Black Lion Pub, where Thomas Millwood's

757
00:42:52.360 --> 00:42:56.000
<v Speaker 1>body was brought back to still stands today and some

758
00:42:56.039 --> 00:43:01.280
<v Speaker 1>say his ghost remains there, still restless, like the legend

759
00:43:01.840 --> 00:43:02.639
<v Speaker 1>that took his life.

760
00:43:03.599 --> 00:43:04.719
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I could see that.

761
00:43:06.519 --> 00:43:10.239
<v Speaker 1>In all this case, it's more than just a ghost,

762
00:43:10.480 --> 00:43:13.760
<v Speaker 1>ghost hail mixed with tragedy. It forces us to ask

763
00:43:13.800 --> 00:43:17.639
<v Speaker 1>some difficult questions. How do we handle fear, how do

764
00:43:17.679 --> 00:43:20.360
<v Speaker 1>we balance justice and human error? And how do we

765
00:43:20.400 --> 00:43:23.840
<v Speaker 1>protect against from harm not just from threats outside of us,

766
00:43:23.880 --> 00:43:28.280
<v Speaker 1>but from the ones we create ourselves. Even in the end,

767
00:43:28.320 --> 00:43:30.480
<v Speaker 1>it may or may not have been a ghost that

768
00:43:30.519 --> 00:43:35.079
<v Speaker 1>haunted Hammersmith, but it was certainly fear, and fear, when

769
00:43:35.159 --> 00:43:38.800
<v Speaker 1>left unchecked, can be the deadliest spirit of all.

770
00:43:40.440 --> 00:43:42.519
<v Speaker 2>Dunt dunt dum.

771
00:43:42.760 --> 00:43:44.559
<v Speaker 1>And that's when Chris Hemsworth walked.

772
00:43:44.360 --> 00:43:49.519
<v Speaker 2>Out, Oh my god, no, oh wow.

773
00:43:50.039 --> 00:43:52.440
<v Speaker 1>And that's the tale of the Hammersmith Ghost Murder.

774
00:43:52.480 --> 00:43:53.880
<v Speaker 2>That is quite a tale.

775
00:43:53.960 --> 00:43:55.920
<v Speaker 1>I love this story so much.

776
00:43:56.400 --> 00:44:01.800
<v Speaker 2>Huh, holy shit. It's it's wild, it's all over the place.

777
00:44:01.599 --> 00:44:04.559
<v Speaker 1>It is, it has literally everything in it.

778
00:44:05.000 --> 00:44:07.039
<v Speaker 2>It should definitely be a movie. I do agree with that.

779
00:44:07.199 --> 00:44:11.039
<v Speaker 1>It's got paranormal it's got impersonations. You know, it's got

780
00:44:11.239 --> 00:44:14.239
<v Speaker 1>chaos being cause, it's got fear, it's got a murder,

781
00:44:14.360 --> 00:44:18.079
<v Speaker 1>it's got a quittle it's got a like.

782
00:44:18.199 --> 00:44:22.280
<v Speaker 2>It could be a series for God's really, like honestly,

783
00:44:22.320 --> 00:44:23.639
<v Speaker 2>not even a few episodes.

784
00:44:24.239 --> 00:44:26.280
<v Speaker 1>Sorry, it wasn't technically acquittal. He got murdered. It was

785
00:44:26.320 --> 00:44:29.159
<v Speaker 1>just a sentencing changed. I should clarify that. But it

786
00:44:29.199 --> 00:44:35.079
<v Speaker 1>went to the fucking crown to have the sentencing changed. Yeah,

787
00:44:36.480 --> 00:44:40.719
<v Speaker 1>like this, you could not write a better fucking story,

788
00:44:41.559 --> 00:44:43.440
<v Speaker 1>Don't get me wrong, Like my heart goes out to

789
00:44:43.480 --> 00:44:45.840
<v Speaker 1>the guy who lost his life like that is absolutely

790
00:44:46.159 --> 00:44:48.960
<v Speaker 1>horrible that Thomas Millwood had to get shot like that.

791
00:44:49.039 --> 00:44:50.800
<v Speaker 2>Well, and the fact too that it was like right

792
00:44:50.840 --> 00:44:55.719
<v Speaker 2>there with his sister basically, you know, seeing the aftermath

793
00:44:55.760 --> 00:44:58.920
<v Speaker 2>of that instantly frig so.

794
00:44:59.559 --> 00:45:02.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, as soon as I found out about this tale,

795
00:45:02.079 --> 00:45:03.840
<v Speaker 1>I knew I had to cover it right away. I

796
00:45:03.880 --> 00:45:06.719
<v Speaker 1>was like, damn son, this is this is wow.

797
00:45:07.159 --> 00:45:09.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you did a good job. This definitely seems like

798
00:45:09.920 --> 00:45:10.599
<v Speaker 2>a ben tail.

799
00:45:11.000 --> 00:45:14.360
<v Speaker 1>Thank you. I think the only way I could have

800
00:45:14.400 --> 00:45:17.599
<v Speaker 1>told this better is if it was involving Chris Hemsworth

801
00:45:18.559 --> 00:45:19.880
<v Speaker 1>on the silver screen.

802
00:45:20.480 --> 00:45:21.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, let's do it.

803
00:45:22.239 --> 00:45:22.880
<v Speaker 1>Let's do it.

804
00:45:23.000 --> 00:45:25.559
<v Speaker 2>Let's do it. Get in contact with him.

805
00:45:25.760 --> 00:45:28.440
<v Speaker 1>It's getting caught. He why not, let's do it?

806
00:45:28.559 --> 00:45:29.440
<v Speaker 2>How old is he? No?

807
00:45:30.039 --> 00:45:30.199
<v Speaker 1>Oh?

808
00:45:30.239 --> 00:45:34.199
<v Speaker 2>I have no idea, huh, because, yeah, maybe we should

809
00:45:34.199 --> 00:45:38.280
<v Speaker 2>do his brother not him. Maybe He's like, maybe I

810
00:45:38.280 --> 00:45:38.840
<v Speaker 2>have no idea.

811
00:45:38.960 --> 00:45:40.800
<v Speaker 1>I sound like I'm a Chris Hemsworth fan.

812
00:45:40.920 --> 00:45:43.239
<v Speaker 2>You sound like you're obsessed with him.

813
00:45:43.360 --> 00:45:45.880
<v Speaker 1>I'm honestly not even that obsessed. He's just a really

814
00:45:45.920 --> 00:45:48.480
<v Speaker 1>good looking man. I'm not even gonna lie he is.

815
00:45:48.679 --> 00:45:49.599
<v Speaker 1>You can't deny it.

816
00:45:50.199 --> 00:45:52.599
<v Speaker 2>No, Yeah, I mean both both of them. Are they

817
00:45:52.679 --> 00:45:53.639
<v Speaker 2>good genes? I guess.

818
00:45:53.639 --> 00:45:55.920
<v Speaker 1>And we know he looks good with his long thor hair.

819
00:45:56.320 --> 00:45:58.360
<v Speaker 1>So you put him in a ponytail at this time,

820
00:45:58.800 --> 00:46:01.400
<v Speaker 1>put him in some eighteen hundred's clothes and some loafers

821
00:46:01.400 --> 00:46:03.239
<v Speaker 1>walking down the street with a shotgun in his arm

822
00:46:03.400 --> 00:46:04.119
<v Speaker 1>and no shirt.

823
00:46:04.480 --> 00:46:08.800
<v Speaker 2>I almost think, I don't know, I almost envisioned him

824
00:46:08.840 --> 00:46:10.480
<v Speaker 2>a little bit more of the guy that gets shot,

825
00:46:10.559 --> 00:46:14.079
<v Speaker 2>though he could be for some reason.

826
00:46:14.159 --> 00:46:18.920
<v Speaker 1>Oh what if it was Liam and Chris Hemsworth one

827
00:46:18.920 --> 00:46:20.480
<v Speaker 1>of the brothers shoots the other brother.

828
00:46:20.559 --> 00:46:23.840
<v Speaker 2>Oh they looked too much the same. They look like twins.

829
00:46:23.960 --> 00:46:26.079
<v Speaker 1>That's the only way you could make the story better

830
00:46:26.119 --> 00:46:29.880
<v Speaker 1>for a silver screenwriting is if the guy patrolling is

831
00:46:29.960 --> 00:46:33.639
<v Speaker 1>on his way home after patrolling, and then he finally

832
00:46:33.679 --> 00:46:36.559
<v Speaker 1>sees the figure and he shoots it and it's actually

833
00:46:36.599 --> 00:46:39.280
<v Speaker 1>his brother he shot, who is just leaving, who was

834
00:46:39.360 --> 00:46:40.159
<v Speaker 1>visiting his family.

835
00:46:40.320 --> 00:46:43.119
<v Speaker 2>We would know though that his brother dresses this way

836
00:46:43.159 --> 00:46:45.639
<v Speaker 2>and stuff, and this guy knew.

837
00:46:45.440 --> 00:46:46.880
<v Speaker 1>That Bricklayers dressed that way.

838
00:46:47.199 --> 00:46:49.960
<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, and we don't exactly know how many Yeah,

839
00:46:50.280 --> 00:46:55.719
<v Speaker 2>you know, Bevy's he he had. True, but there's a courage, right.

840
00:46:55.760 --> 00:46:58.360
<v Speaker 1>There's also the time variance as well. How long how

841
00:46:58.440 --> 00:47:01.440
<v Speaker 1>much time had passed between pulling trigger and when drinking

842
00:47:01.519 --> 00:47:03.400
<v Speaker 1>in the pub, So how much did he sober up

843
00:47:03.440 --> 00:47:07.719
<v Speaker 1>and metabolize that I'll call in a system.

844
00:47:06.880 --> 00:47:09.480
<v Speaker 2>You know, I still love that idea that of well,

845
00:47:09.519 --> 00:47:12.480
<v Speaker 2>I think they do have that actually in some prisons

846
00:47:12.480 --> 00:47:16.239
<v Speaker 2>and stuff where they do like community type work.

847
00:47:16.440 --> 00:47:19.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, they do. Like it's usually like trash clean up

848
00:47:19.039 --> 00:47:19.760
<v Speaker 1>and that sort of story.

849
00:47:19.800 --> 00:47:23.960
<v Speaker 2>Or like I think ours they build up. I've heard

850
00:47:24.000 --> 00:47:26.480
<v Speaker 2>of that they build like picnic tables and stuff, yeah,

851
00:47:26.840 --> 00:47:27.599
<v Speaker 2>or things like that.

852
00:47:27.840 --> 00:47:28.480
<v Speaker 1>So they do.

853
00:47:28.719 --> 00:47:31.000
<v Speaker 2>But I kind of love that idea of like pay

854
00:47:31.000 --> 00:47:32.119
<v Speaker 2>it in labor.

855
00:47:31.920 --> 00:47:36.280
<v Speaker 1>Put them to work. Anyways, Hopefully you guys enjoyed that story.

856
00:47:36.280 --> 00:47:38.719
<v Speaker 1>This is definitely one of the favorites that I think

857
00:47:38.719 --> 00:47:41.519
<v Speaker 1>we've ever produced. For me, I'm in love with this story.

858
00:47:41.559 --> 00:47:44.559
<v Speaker 1>If I haven't told you already, I will tell you again.

859
00:47:44.679 --> 00:47:47.079
<v Speaker 1>I love this story. You sure do so hopefully you

860
00:47:47.159 --> 00:47:48.559
<v Speaker 1>liked it. If you want to check out the links

861
00:47:48.679 --> 00:47:51.000
<v Speaker 1>for our podcasts, they're all in the description down below.

862
00:47:51.840 --> 00:47:54.519
<v Speaker 1>Just check it out. You got website, Instagram, Facebook, do

863
00:47:54.639 --> 00:47:57.199
<v Speaker 1>all the good stuffs down there, Patreon, merch you can

864
00:47:57.239 --> 00:47:59.079
<v Speaker 1>go check it out. If you want to support the show.

865
00:47:59.280 --> 00:48:01.519
<v Speaker 1>Patreon's a great way of doing it, and so is

866
00:48:01.760 --> 00:48:06.440
<v Speaker 1>giving us a rating. We're an indie podcast, produced, host hosted, written,

867
00:48:06.880 --> 00:48:09.719
<v Speaker 1>all of it done by ourselves, and a good rating

868
00:48:09.840 --> 00:48:12.119
<v Speaker 1>goes a long way, so we'd really appreciate it. But

869
00:48:12.119 --> 00:48:14.800
<v Speaker 1>of course, be honest, rate us what you think we

870
00:48:14.800 --> 00:48:17.400
<v Speaker 1>were worth. I think we're worth five, but you may

871
00:48:17.400 --> 00:48:17.920
<v Speaker 1>think different.

872
00:48:18.039 --> 00:48:20.400
<v Speaker 2>I agree, yeap created in our a little tiny ome.

873
00:48:20.599 --> 00:48:23.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so thank you for being here, and until next time,

874
00:48:23.760 --> 00:48:25.280
<v Speaker 1>stay wicked.
