Speaker 1: Hey, Wicked Fam, I already fucked that up. Hey Wicked Fam.
Speaker 2: I'm Nicole, I'm Ben, And you're listening to Wicked and Grim,
Speaker 2: a true gram podcast. Good morning following podcast.
Speaker 1: At your audience listener, just watch well, hello, hello, Hello,
Speaker 1: Happy Tuesday. If you're listening to this on Tuesday.
Speaker 2: And if you're listening to any other day of the week,
Speaker 2: happy any other day of the week.
Speaker 1: There you go. We are like hair straight back around here.
Speaker 2: Oh my god. I feel like we talk about that
Speaker 2: every podcast, but well, it just its.
Speaker 1: Like our life right now because we're listening our hosts.
Speaker 1: This week, the tie home gets delivered. This week, I'm
Speaker 1: traveling to Victoria to shoot a wedding. It's just like
Speaker 1: it's a busy.
Speaker 2: Week and I'm on a frantic treasure hunt.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, you should have been doing that today.
Speaker 2: I should have long story, shortly work put out a
Speaker 2: treasure hunt for seven grand hidden in a cash out
Speaker 2: in the bush.
Speaker 1: So yeah, and you're not on it, Like what the heck?
Speaker 2: Well, I think tomorrow after work, I'm going to go
Speaker 2: look for it because I think I solve the riddle.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I have a feeling that it could already
Speaker 1: be gone, I don't know.
Speaker 2: I work with a lot of people who are not
Speaker 2: known for their IQ, so I think I might be golden.
Speaker 1: No comment, it's true, no comment.
Speaker 2: I work in an industry where post secondary isn't a requirement.
Speaker 2: In fact, high school graduation isn't a requirement.
Speaker 1: Oh really yeah, Oh I didn't even know that. I
Speaker 1: didn't know that.
Speaker 2: Actually, well, I mean for majority of them, they want
Speaker 2: it just for the sake of it. But yeah, my
Speaker 2: specific work site does not require high school graduation.
Speaker 1: But you've graduated high school. Just to clarify, I have you,
Speaker 1: thank god, Yeah, and I have post secondary. Just to
Speaker 1: let everyone know you do. Actually, yeah, we both do.
Speaker 2: Yeah we're smarties. Boom.
Speaker 1: Okay, okay, this is so exciting, you know, it's like
Speaker 1: really shit.
Speaker 2: Also, I just want to say, you guys are too
Speaker 2: good on Instagram.
Speaker 1: Oh I know, Okay, one day we're going to win
Speaker 1: one day.
Speaker 2: One day I thought we had them for sure.
Speaker 1: I did, and I knew for sure. I was like,
Speaker 1: that's too easy.
Speaker 2: Well, I was like, okay, there might be one or
Speaker 2: two people who like know this case specifically, and they'll
Speaker 2: guess it. Maybe if we're lucky or if they're lucky.
Speaker 2: But clearly this is more of a like a well
Speaker 2: known thing or something. I don't know. I never heard
Speaker 2: boom boom boom. Everyone just knew.
Speaker 1: I know. But I mean, like they're true crime junkies, Like, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's the thing.
Speaker 2: I feel like we're the amateurs, even though sometimes like.
Speaker 1: I know what that is and I was like, really,
Speaker 1: I just learned about it the other day.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well either, but anyway, we're gonna make it harder,
Speaker 3: maybe even blurring photos.
Speaker 2: Out from here on out.
Speaker 1: And now I know a lot about this case.
Speaker 2: Yeah, a lot, a lot.
Speaker 1: So you ready?
Speaker 2: Wait?
Speaker 1: No, no yet, oh right.
Speaker 2: Now, I'm ready.
Speaker 1: Now it's official. Now we can officially get our shit
Speaker 1: together out here.
Speaker 2: I'm going white girl today with white Claw.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Mango. The cherry is the best though, no it's not.
Speaker 1: I think cherry is the best. Okay. So this is
Speaker 1: the story of Caitlin Coleman. But she went by Katie. Katie,
Speaker 1: Katie Coleman.
Speaker 2: Let's hear about Katie Katie. What's your story?
Speaker 1: Oh? Man, you know what, it's just shitty, But that's okay.
Speaker 2: Well I kind of know a little bit. And yeah, but.
Speaker 1: It was January twenty fifth, two thousand and five, and
Speaker 1: it started out just like any other day.
Speaker 2: That's good. It's good, sun was shining maybe.
Speaker 1: But you know when someone says it started out just
Speaker 1: like any other day, you can't know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's shit. You know the rest is going down here?
Speaker 1: Am I right? So Katie woke up pad breakfast prepared
Speaker 1: for her day, and her father John Okay, so I
Speaker 1: already fucked this upisode to go, had breakfast prepared her
Speaker 1: mom Angela okay, and then her father John drove her
Speaker 1: to school.
Speaker 2: Okay. That's a huge difference there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I mean she's still prepared for her day.
Speaker 1: I mean, I just I missed that her mom made
Speaker 1: her lovely breakfast, and that just shows that her mom's
Speaker 1: probably pretty cool.
Speaker 2: Yeah, cheers to those moms out there doing that hard
Speaker 2: work for those kids.
Speaker 1: Exactly, they work hard.
Speaker 2: Those dads too, don't forget that.
Speaker 1: Well, the dad drove to school exactly. There you go,
Speaker 1: all those parents. Yeah, she attended Crawl. Oh, we already
Speaker 1: went over this Crowther Crotherson, Crowthersville.
Speaker 2: It was Brother by the Sea, Brother Brother.
Speaker 1: See. I listened to it like I'm pronounced, and then
Speaker 1: I'm like reading it on I already forgot Okay, Crothersville, Crothersville,
Speaker 1: Brothersville nailed it. Now, you guys are all gonna remember.
Speaker 1: So she attended Crothersville Elementary School in Indiana. Once school
Speaker 1: was out for the day, Katie headed home as per usual,
Speaker 1: this was around three o'clock. She arrived home to find
Speaker 1: her mom busy preparing dinner.
Speaker 2: Good mom doing the good mom stuff.
Speaker 1: And breakfast now making dinner like cool And this makes
Speaker 1: her sound like an absolute little angel, but she wanted
Speaker 1: to help her mom out, so she volunteered to walk
Speaker 1: to the nearby store to pick up some toilet paper
Speaker 1: because the family was like pretty much out of ass white.
Speaker 2: She's a little angel, they're out of ass white. Way
Speaker 2: to just drink that?
Speaker 1: I don't know, Well, like what a sweet little.
Speaker 2: Girl, right, definitely, I can just picture now, he mom,
Speaker 2: do you need me to go to the store to
Speaker 2: pick up some ass?
Speaker 1: Why she didn't say ass white.
Speaker 2: I'm sure she did. I'm picturing it. She did.
Speaker 1: She said it, And I don't even think I actually
Speaker 1: mentioned this in here. But she's like ten, she's ten
Speaker 1: years old. I don't think I said that. So she's
Speaker 1: this little bean, you know, yeah, her mom agreed and
Speaker 1: gave her some money. The store she was heading to
Speaker 1: was about a block and a half away, and Katie
Speaker 1: did do this trek often. It wasn't like her first role,
Speaker 1: She's done it before. And I wanted to mention that
Speaker 1: the town they lived in, Bruthersville, was a small town
Speaker 1: about like fifteen hundred.
Speaker 2: People are so, okay, it's definitely small.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is small. So everyone knew everyone, and it
Speaker 1: came across as a as a relative safe town. But
Speaker 1: we'll we'll dive into that.
Speaker 2: One of those places like maybe you can like leave
Speaker 2: your door unlocked it nights sort of thing.
Speaker 1: Well, I mean like everyone was up in everyone's business.
Speaker 1: So and here's okay, this is like a little side
Speaker 1: story that I wanted to include.
Speaker 2: Let's hear it, what you got.
Speaker 1: It has nothing to do with Katie, but it just
Speaker 1: gives some contexts on like the size of the town.
Speaker 1: That it appeared to be somewhat of a religious town,
Speaker 1: and that, like I said, everyone you know knows knows
Speaker 1: your business.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So a porn store opened in two thousand and five
Speaker 1: called lions Den. Do you dig it?
Speaker 2: Lies?
Speaker 1: Then? Actually, yeah, means the name I'm taking a sip
Speaker 1: of water here?
Speaker 2: Do it take that sip hydrate? It's important.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, it's hot here, it's.
Speaker 2: Like thirty five degrees celsius right.
Speaker 1: Now, it's I think it's twenty five. You're way wrong.
Speaker 2: Then Why do I like sweat just for laying in bed?
Speaker 2: Like what the fuck?
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure it's only twenty five stories.
Speaker 2: Dude, No malarkey, I call malarkey. It's twenty eight.
Speaker 1: Oh gosh, I was closer.
Speaker 2: And it's seven thirty pm right now, so it's been
Speaker 2: cooling off a bit.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so okay. So from the day the store opened,
Speaker 1: Christian protesters set up a platform alongside the fence of
Speaker 1: the property in order to photograph people walking in and
Speaker 1: out of the store dick move. This was done day
Speaker 1: and night, with the photos later being posted to a
Speaker 1: website that they alleged they said, we'll get two million views,
Speaker 1: like sure. The protest organizer was the pastor of the
Speaker 1: First Baptist Church, and the group called themselves the Union
Speaker 1: Town Watchdogs. Among writing down license plates and notifying trucking
Speaker 1: companies if their drivers stopped at the store, they would
Speaker 1: sometimes yell comments at people entering this porn store and
Speaker 1: offer them free bibles.
Speaker 2: I would be one of those people who goes in
Speaker 2: repeatedly and makes my face known. I would go into
Speaker 2: the store and I would come out with a blow
Speaker 2: up doll blown up under my arm and being like something.
Speaker 1: Just to stir up, stir. Yes, it's a bit much like, oh, definitely,
Speaker 1: just let people live their life, Like, let them just
Speaker 1: live their life.
Speaker 2: If someone wants to get their kink on, let them
Speaker 2: get the kink on, don't kink shame.
Speaker 1: And I mean it's a store, it's not like it's
Speaker 1: like against the law, yep. Anyway, So several complaints were
Speaker 1: also made because at night, the Uniontown Watchdogs would shine
Speaker 1: a floodlin light in the faces of drivers like passing by,
Speaker 1: like in preparation to take their photo. So this is
Speaker 1: like a freaking safety hazard. You imagine driving along the
Speaker 1: road and thou and this thing just shines right in
Speaker 1: your face.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that that's a major car accident waiting to happen.
Speaker 2: You think, I get someone drive by with like just
Speaker 2: not even high on me at night, like a little
Speaker 2: extra bright lights, and I'm like about to hit the ditch.
Speaker 1: I know. Yeah, And I mean it was like our
Speaker 1: Am I getting abducted by an alien here or what's
Speaker 1: going on? So the store was eventually shut down, Like,
Speaker 1: I mean, it's just inevitable, with the reason that the
Speaker 1: store violated a country licensing or ordinance being in operation
Speaker 1: within a thousand feet of a residence. Oh god, So
Speaker 1: I mean they just like, I don't know, that just
Speaker 1: sounds like made up shiit to me. But anyway, So
Speaker 1: that's that's the town. Sweet so little Christian Brouthersville. Welcome
Speaker 1: to Crothersville.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the good old Brothersville. You know, just porn shaming
Speaker 2: people and stuff.
Speaker 1: Oh gosh, okay, So the katy So she was on
Speaker 1: route to pick up the toilet paper, right and the toilet.
Speaker 1: This place, I think it was like a dollar store,
Speaker 1: was about a block and a half away from her home,
Speaker 1: so not really that far.
Speaker 2: She knows the root sort of thing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, she's good, yea, yeah, totally. Like she's ten. I
Speaker 1: mean probably at that age you kind of can venture,
Speaker 1: especially if you're in a small town.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, you know. I grew up on a dirt
Speaker 2: road out in the sticks, like I was by ten,
Speaker 2: biking kilometers up the road, going out in the bush,
Speaker 2: playing with friends, and stuff.
Speaker 1: So yeah, and I like, I lived pretty close to
Speaker 1: my elementary school, so I'm pretty sure by then I
Speaker 1: was like expected.
Speaker 2: To walk home. Yeah, most likely.
Speaker 1: So after purchasing the toilet paper. However, the ass, white
Speaker 1: ass white.
Speaker 2: Get that, get it right, Come.
Speaker 1: On now, Katie did not return home. Katie, she did
Speaker 1: not return home. Initially, Katie's mom wasn't really worried. Katie
Speaker 1: was a very popular girl with a lot of friends
Speaker 1: along the route that she traveled, so the mom kind
Speaker 1: of just figured that she got caught up playing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, didn't really realize.
Speaker 2: The time shit happens.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean I think that's like something a ten
Speaker 1: year old would do. But she did start making some
Speaker 1: calls to see if anyone knew where her daughter was.
Speaker 1: When Nole came of this, and by this time, Katie's
Speaker 1: father was also home from work, they started getting a
Speaker 1: bit more worried for their daughter's safety and went out
Speaker 1: themselves to search for their little girl, following the route
Speaker 1: that she would have taken.
Speaker 2: Again back in that good old parenting. Yeah, they're doing
Speaker 2: their thing. They're doing it right, They're doing.
Speaker 1: A good job. I like these parents, yeah, because they're
Speaker 1: good parents. But I mean they probably, like I imagine
Speaker 1: like the mom probably feels guilty, probably, which is really shitty.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're a little bit off your microphone, You're you're
Speaker 2: drifting a bit.
Speaker 1: Well, because we're not facing each other, you're bothering me.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm sorry that we're in an awkward room right
Speaker 2: now because we're trying to make our house look good
Speaker 2: to sell it. Yeah, just turn your points towards your
Speaker 2: mouth a bit more like this. There you go, because
Speaker 2: I have a feeling you might drift and like to
Speaker 2: probably do it again. Yeah, talking like this and you
Speaker 2: can't really hear shit because you're over here sort of thing,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: Okay, So it was around seven thirty eight when they
Speaker 1: called the police to report their daughter missing, gotcha, and
Speaker 1: she left to go to the story around three, so
Speaker 1: it was a little bit of time in there, right.
Speaker 1: So when the police arrived at Katie's house, there were
Speaker 1: already hundreds of people out searching for Katie. Oh wow,
Speaker 1: you know, like they all want to do their part.
Speaker 1: Their search went through the night. They had a helicopter
Speaker 1: and sent dogs on it. Katie's scent led the dogs
Speaker 1: to the nearby train tracks, but then the scent was
Speaker 1: lost again.
Speaker 2: Oh shit.
Speaker 1: A neighbor did tell Katie's family that on the day
Speaker 1: she disappeared, she had come to their house to let
Speaker 1: them know their dog had been killed on the train tracks.
Speaker 1: So she was over there and one of the neighbors
Speaker 1: did know, which is shitty that the dog died too.
Speaker 2: I was thinking, like someone like drug her over there
Speaker 2: and on the train.
Speaker 1: Or something I know, I know, or like that she
Speaker 1: just took off on a train or.
Speaker 2: Well, by the sounds of it, I can't see Katie
Speaker 2: taking off on her own sEH.
Speaker 1: I don't think she would do that. So it wasn't
Speaker 1: until two days later that an amber alert was issued.
Speaker 1: There was no initial evidence of an abduction until an
Speaker 1: eyewitness came forward claiming they saw a girl who looked
Speaker 1: like Katie in a white pickup truck. The witness described
Speaker 1: the driver as a very skinny, white man about six
Speaker 1: feet tall, with short, dark hair and a fair complexion. Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: So a sketch was a released of this, and I
Speaker 1: should almost like the sketches just like horrific. Like I
Speaker 1: saw the sketch and I was like, holy shit, I
Speaker 1: could be a sketch artist. Should because it's like not good,
Speaker 1: Like like I'm saying that because I'm a terrible driver
Speaker 1: or driver.
Speaker 2: I mean you will kind of all gay.
Speaker 1: Actually I'm an amazing driver.
Speaker 2: You have road rage out the ass, Okay.
Speaker 1: But that's not really bad though, yes, is bad. I
Speaker 1: don't ever like I just like swear when I'm driving,
Speaker 1: I don't do anything.
Speaker 2: And then you speed up and tailgate the guy that
Speaker 2: you all know.
Speaker 1: I do not tailgate. That's like my pet peeve, like,
Speaker 1: don't tailgate. Don't tailgate. That will make me just like
Speaker 1: lose my shit.
Speaker 2: See, I'm like, if someone pisses me off, I don't swear,
Speaker 2: I don't curse, but well maybe a little bit, but
Speaker 2: I don't get mad, but I will fucking tailgate the
Speaker 2: ship that of them, and I will let them know that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've been tail getting is the worst. Like if
Speaker 1: someone if I'm just like driving to work and someone's
Speaker 1: tailing to me, instantly, my day's shit. It's like back off, okay,
Speaker 1: if I may.
Speaker 2: I've got a bit of a story for everyone listening
Speaker 2: out there. We own a Chevy Silverado, bright fucking orange
Speaker 2: pickup truck.
Speaker 1: Like it's think of a pylon because like Ben likes
Speaker 1: to be noticed.
Speaker 2: I like bright colors. I'm an out there kind of guy.
Speaker 2: It's like a pylon color, like in a construction zone.
Speaker 2: For whatever reason, this thing is just a magnet for
Speaker 2: people cutting you off. Like I can drive a car,
Speaker 2: another truck, suv, whatever, other people's vehicle, never get cut off.
Speaker 2: Drive this truck. You will get cut off two or
Speaker 2: three times just going downtown.
Speaker 1: And I've been driving it recently just because our car
Speaker 1: isn't like doing the best of shape. And yeah, you're right,
Speaker 1: it's ridiculous.
Speaker 2: I don't understand.
Speaker 1: It is actually is crazy, like it just blows your mind. Okay,
Speaker 1: you're down. What's the story?
Speaker 2: Sorry?
Speaker 1: You done?
Speaker 2: I digress. I'm sorry.
Speaker 1: Okay, that's fine. Now we all know. Okay, So the
Speaker 1: witness also mentioned the girl in the truck did not
Speaker 1: appear to be in distress.
Speaker 2: Okay, I don't know.
Speaker 1: I just thought i'd throw it in there. Missing person
Speaker 1: posters described Katie as being four feet six inches with
Speaker 1: chin length, brown hair and brown eyes. She was last
Speaker 1: spotted wearing a red shirt, black sweatpants with a stripe
Speaker 1: down the leg, black tennis shoes, and a medium light
Speaker 1: blue winter coat. It also described Katie as having a
Speaker 1: lazy eye.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, but as soon as you described the sweatpants
Speaker 2: with a stripe down the leg, I was just taken
Speaker 2: back to like two thousand and three with like juicy
Speaker 2: written across some booty.
Speaker 1: I don't know why, Yeah, well this okay, I'm just
Speaker 1: trying to think in two thousand and five, like I
Speaker 1: guess we would have been a little bit older. Hey yeah,
Speaker 1: oh yeah, we.
Speaker 2: Were school two thousand and six.
Speaker 1: Okay, never mind, we're older. Because I was like, I
Speaker 1: probably have pants like that.
Speaker 2: Did you? Did you have juicy booty? No?
Speaker 1: I didn't do the juicy booty sweatpants, but I definitely
Speaker 1: had like the track pant that had like the buttons
Speaker 1: on it that you.
Speaker 2: Could just like the tarraways. Yeah, yeah, you.
Speaker 1: Know I had. They were red and they had purple accents.
Speaker 2: Well we should do is we should get tearaway sweatpants
Speaker 2: with Juicy written on them on the bottom.
Speaker 1: And sell them for money.
Speaker 2: No, just you and me wear them.
Speaker 1: No one would buy that.
Speaker 2: We'd walk around town just wearing juicy terrorways.
Speaker 1: Wow, we would have no friends.
Speaker 2: Oh, you can have Juicy on it and mine can
Speaker 2: say booty there.
Speaker 1: We go, we'll walk down the street together.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it'll be juicy booty or booty juicy.
Speaker 1: I guess. Okay. So these parents issued a written statement
Speaker 1: pleading for their daughter's safer turn, saying, please do not
Speaker 1: harm her. We asked you just drop her off anywhere
Speaker 1: so that she may return to a family and community
Speaker 1: loves her very much and misses her dearly. Like I
Speaker 1: can only imagine like these four parents like that, what heartbreaking.
Speaker 1: So it was on the fifth day of the search,
Speaker 1: so January thirtieth, that the search would end for the town,
Speaker 1: but not in the way that everyone wanted it to end.
Speaker 2: Of course.
Speaker 1: Katie's parents received news that Katie's body had been found
Speaker 1: in a creek by an Indiana State Police trooper, the
Speaker 1: creek being in the I think it's Cypress Lake area,
Speaker 1: around nineteen miles away from Katie's home. Her hands were
Speaker 1: bound behind her back. She had been raped, and her
Speaker 1: final cause of death was drowning. Poor Katie, Like my
Speaker 1: heart just like sinks for her.
Speaker 2: That's that's just so sad.
Speaker 1: It's like ten, like she just didn't get to like live.
Speaker 2: Her life, no kidding, and to go through something like
Speaker 2: that at ten years old too. Yeah, God, whoever did by?
Speaker 1: People are bringing nasty.
Speaker 2: You're nasty.
Speaker 1: I mean I say that so often, but it's just
Speaker 1: like people are disgusting, Like they're disgusting your nasty. Not
Speaker 1: long after Katie's body was found, Charles Hickman confessed to
Speaker 1: the crime and it was arrested and charged with Katie's murder.
Speaker 2: He just up and just be like, yo, I did it. Yeah,
Speaker 2: oh shit.
Speaker 1: He confessed the police that he and another man, Timothy Sullivan,
Speaker 1: had abducted Katie. I didn't find a lot about this,
Speaker 1: but some articles mentioned there was maybe a third unnamed
Speaker 1: mail around seventeen, but there was no name or anything.
Speaker 1: His story being that Katie witnessed an illegal drug transaction
Speaker 1: on her way home and they wanted to try and
Speaker 1: scare her into silence. They brought her to Tim's house
Speaker 1: and then the creek in a borld white pickup truck,
Speaker 1: where they tied up her hands and she fell into
Speaker 1: the creek and accidentally drowned, which point they fled the scene.
Speaker 1: That's not accidentally drowning.
Speaker 2: No kidding. So if you're sitting here trying to scare
Speaker 2: a child, and there's three potential two potentially three of you. Yeah, creek, Yeah,
Speaker 2: and this child falls I'm assuming face first into the creek.
Speaker 2: You're gonna go oh no, and just like watch she's
Speaker 2: accidentally drowning. We should probably do something like no, you
Speaker 2: get her out, she's not gonna.
Speaker 1: Drown And I'm sorry, but that's not accidental. That's freaking murder. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like you murdered her.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you stood there, she drowned. That's well, I'm not
Speaker 2: sure if it's straight up murder, but it's definitely.
Speaker 1: Manslaughter, right, that's what that'd be called, because it's not We.
Speaker 2: Really need to learn our terminology for that sort of Well,
Speaker 2: it wasn't like they tended to go murder her.
Speaker 1: They were intending to just scare her. So yeah's manslaughter.
Speaker 2: I don't know, I'm not too sure. We got to
Speaker 2: learn her definitions.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So this Charles Hickman, I like Charles Hickman. I
Speaker 1: kind of just like that name. For some reason, dude
Speaker 1: was known within the town as being a bit odd.
Speaker 1: Charles often standing in his yard gazing at nothing less,
Speaker 1: which he thought was weird. But like, really he's just
Speaker 1: like high out of his rick and mind. Probably Like
Speaker 1: when I read that, I was like, well, he's just high. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and he did have a record. At the time of
Speaker 1: Katie's murder, Jackson Country, which includes Cruthersville, was seeing a
Speaker 1: rise in meth related crime and arrests.
Speaker 2: Okay, so he was just high in Crystal.
Speaker 1: So for an example, here in two thousand and four,
Speaker 1: there was one hundred and sixteen meth related arrests compared
Speaker 1: to two thousand and two when there was only twenty nine.
Speaker 1: So like for a low small population town like that
Speaker 1: is like a jump, oh definitely. Or was it sixteen
Speaker 1: thousand people fifteen hundred fifty or fifteen.
Speaker 2: Hundred Oh shit, I thought it was thousand, okay.
Speaker 1: And then in one year, I mean, this is a
Speaker 1: bigger area than just the town. But in one year,
Speaker 1: one hundred and sixteen. Yeah, you know that's a lot.
Speaker 2: That's a significant jump. Holy shit.
Speaker 1: So after Katie's death, two facilities making bootleg meth were discovered.
Speaker 1: So her death did seem to bring an end to this,
Speaker 1: which is good. Like there was an article about like
Speaker 1: this brought something good to the town because the facilities
Speaker 1: were shut down. It was said, shady characters no longer
Speaker 1: stalk the streets of the one stop like town. However,
Speaker 1: ribbons of blue, Katie's favorite color, lace the streets and porches,
Speaker 1: but all and also were gone were the bike riding
Speaker 1: and dog walking children. Oh no, kids only went out
Speaker 1: to play when their parents were with them. One father
Speaker 1: said he would make a mental note each morning what
Speaker 1: his ten and seven year old were wearing for fear
Speaker 1: of needing to describe them to the police. Oh God,
Speaker 1: like all, can you imagine I just destroyed this town? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean it's fifteen hundred people and a freaking ten
Speaker 1: year old murdered, Like, yes, what the shit? I think
Speaker 1: he'd be like literally looking around at everyone like who
Speaker 1: are you actually? You know?
Speaker 2: And how long after uh katy was discovered did this
Speaker 2: guy confess to this? Because this was this going on
Speaker 2: after his arrest?
Speaker 1: Still, what was going on? Sorry?
Speaker 2: Where people were not walking their dogs?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, like it was so I wonder if.
Speaker 2: The general public was not believing this confession.
Speaker 1: I mean I think it just made them think differently, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I guess, Like I think as far as they knew,
Speaker 1: they had their person. But well, we're going to dive
Speaker 1: into this event more. Okay, So it appeared to the
Speaker 1: police that they had their dude right with Charles Hickman.
Speaker 1: He was shady and the story made sense with the
Speaker 1: current meth problem the town was facing. But when the
Speaker 1: police questioned his friend Timothy, he wasn't omitting anything, of course,
Speaker 1: and he had an alibi. Oh so the story Charles
Speaker 1: was telling would also change almost every time they talked
Speaker 1: to him, leaving police to think they needed to keep
Speaker 1: investigating as this may not actually be their guy.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, it's just someone who could potentially just
Speaker 2: be high out of his mind.
Speaker 1: Well yeah, and he was odd and I don't know,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm not saying much more here.
Speaker 2: I think you've got an opinion. Maybe we'll discuss that.
Speaker 1: We'll discuss that later. So that's exactly what the police did.
Speaker 1: They started to dig a little bit deeper. That is,
Speaker 1: when they would have a match of DNA evidence. They
Speaker 1: found a cigarette butt at the crime scene matching DNA
Speaker 1: they had found on Katie's body, and the DNA was
Speaker 1: not a match to Charles oh shit, but rather belonged
Speaker 1: to an Anthony Ray Stockelman. I think that's how he say.
Speaker 1: Is Stockelmann, who was not local but was in town
Speaker 1: visiting his mother when Katie went missing. Anthony, he was
Speaker 1: married with two children at the time, had no previous
Speaker 1: convictions for felonies or sex offenses, so he had had
Speaker 1: a clean slate then. Yeah, like I think there was
Speaker 1: like minor things like yeah, like minor, like nothing like huge,
Speaker 1: So I didn't really even dive in that deep. So
Speaker 1: investigators though, had previously interviewed Anthony because he and his
Speaker 1: truck matched the description giving to the police by that eyewitness,
Speaker 1: and he was like nothing but cooperative. I said, I
Speaker 1: said that really wrong, like cooperative? Okay, he like answered them,
Speaker 1: He answered them. He was willing to cooperated. Yeah, he
Speaker 1: was willing to, like you know, he wouldn't seem shady
Speaker 1: like he did what they wanted. So they wanted to
Speaker 1: search his truck and they didn't have a warrant, so
Speaker 1: he let them search his truck. He also took a
Speaker 1: lie detector test passed. He passed, flying colors passed.
Speaker 2: Though, to be fair, detector tests are pretty shady in themselves.
Speaker 1: Well, I have no idea, but like I feel like
Speaker 1: it just me being the person I am, I probably
Speaker 1: wouldn't have even murdered someone and taken a lie detector test,
Speaker 1: and I wouldn't pass, like, right, ship, maybe I did
Speaker 1: where I'd be like sweating.
Speaker 2: Did I sleep walk? Did I Did I dream something
Speaker 2: weird that night? Maybe I don't know. Yeah, no, I
Speaker 2: feel that through and through.
Speaker 1: So I don't know. I know, I don't actually know
Speaker 1: if light detector tests do they even use them?
Speaker 2: Still, they do, but I don't think they use them
Speaker 2: very often. I think it's like one of those like
Speaker 2: kind of last resort to They just they just are
Speaker 2: digging for something.
Speaker 1: They're just no, I just think that those now. So
Speaker 1: he was dismissed as a suspect when he passed the
Speaker 1: light detector test and Charles had confessed right yeah. But
Speaker 1: a few weeks later, they arrived once again to collect
Speaker 1: a DNA sample from Anthony. The DNA and he gave
Speaker 1: it to them, so he willingly did so. The DNA
Speaker 1: sample come back as a match, so he was like
Speaker 1: fucking shocked, apparently. So also matched were red carpet fibers
Speaker 1: taken from Katie's body, matching a rug in the home
Speaker 1: of Anthony's mother, So like, that's that's some freaking evidence.
Speaker 2: There, Yeah, no kidding.
Speaker 1: He was arrested charged. Oh sorry, I wrote that wrong
Speaker 1: in my notes. So he was arrested charge and he
Speaker 1: was up against the death penalty for abducting, molesting, and
Speaker 1: murdering little Katie.
Speaker 2: Yeah, rightfully.
Speaker 1: So his sentencing was scheduled for April seventeenth, two thousand
Speaker 1: and five. So like this is all pretty quick. Hey,
Speaker 1: Like her body was discovered in January thirtieth. Yeah, like
Speaker 1: they did good work here.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, I'm sure it's a small town sort
Speaker 2: of thing, so there's.
Speaker 1: How many suspects do they have, really well.
Speaker 2: And what other crimes are they're dealing with. They probably
Speaker 2: were able to expedite the process quite a bit.
Speaker 1: That's true. Okay. So he was scheduled to have a sentencing,
Speaker 1: but he took a plea agreement. The agreement being if
Speaker 1: he pleaded guilty to the charges, the death penalty he
Speaker 1: was facing would be taken off the table. Like he
Speaker 1: didn't want the death penalty.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 1: He was sentenced to life imprisonment, imprisonment and an additional
Speaker 1: thirty years for raping Katie Good. The verdict did have
Speaker 1: mixed reviews though, like with the family and the people
Speaker 1: of the town because they wanted him to basically pay
Speaker 1: the ultimate price, and that was the death penalty, right,
Speaker 1: Like they were happy that he was still going to
Speaker 1: be rotting in jail, but like, I don't know, I
Speaker 1: don't know what would be better, Like if I had
Speaker 1: someone that did something bad to a loved one, would
Speaker 1: I rather than rot or just die? Probably just die.
Speaker 2: I mean it's not like he got away with it,
Speaker 2: per se. He is there for life. And you said
Speaker 2: without the chance of parol.
Speaker 1: Yeah, let me just see life. Yeah, life imprisonment yet
Speaker 1: an additional thirty years, So like, yeah, he was in
Speaker 1: there for life.
Speaker 2: Okay, I mean he's put away for life, so it's
Speaker 2: not like, I mean, he's gonna rot. It's not the
Speaker 2: death penalty, but it's better than him getting fifteen years
Speaker 2: or something.
Speaker 1: Do you unimaginable ship? And then they're just like, oh, okay,
Speaker 1: it's better than nothing. This is where the story takes
Speaker 1: a bit of a satisfying turn.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is the part I was waiting for, and
Speaker 2: this is the part everyone's waiting for him.
Speaker 1: So karma, revenge, whatever you want to call it, is
Speaker 1: freaking sweet sweet my friends. Anthony was sent to Wabash
Speaker 1: Valley Correctional Facility being that he was convicted of raping
Speaker 1: and killing a ten year old girl, like his time
Speaker 1: in prison was just gonna be shitting, like you know, your.
Speaker 2: Shit rapists and all that sort of stuff. They do
Speaker 2: not have a good time in prison. Mm hmm nasty.
Speaker 1: But do you want to know what would make it
Speaker 1: even less fun?
Speaker 2: I'm pretty sure I already know.
Speaker 1: But detail a cross paths with the relative of Katie's
Speaker 1: while in prison, like that is so cool?
Speaker 2: Like someone maybe I don't know Katie's uncle.
Speaker 1: It's not it's not wrong, it wrong, get it wrong.
Speaker 1: So on September nineteenth, two thousand and six, Jared Harris
Speaker 1: Was who was also serving or sorry, who was serving
Speaker 1: a burglary sentence, was transferred to the same prison wing
Speaker 1: as Anthony. Jared was Katie's cousin.
Speaker 2: Okay, close enough, you were wrong. I was wrong.
Speaker 1: And this is where the story gets real good. And
Speaker 1: I should, okay, I should say like I don't like
Speaker 1: condone violence or anything, but I do believe in karma.
Speaker 1: And I think if you're a ship bag motherfucker, a
Speaker 1: shit bag motherfucker, that you deserve anything that comes to you.
Speaker 2: If you're a ship bag motherfucker, you deserve shit bag
Speaker 2: motherfucker shit.
Speaker 1: So, like, I don't condone this, but like karma, I
Speaker 1: think I think karma is just should just always be
Speaker 1: a Thingama's.
Speaker 2: A bitch, Karma is a ship bag motherfucker.
Speaker 1: Okay. So, on Setember twenty second, two thousand and six,
Speaker 1: Jared slipped into Anthony's open cell and waited for him
Speaker 1: to return. When he did, Jared closed the cell door
Speaker 1: behind him, causing it to lock and trapping Anthony in
Speaker 1: the cell with him. He put his hand around Anthony's
Speaker 1: throat and told him I'm either going to stick you
Speaker 1: and leave you bleed in, or I'm going to tattoo you. So,
Speaker 1: giving like these two options, Anthony chows the tattoo. I'm
Speaker 1: pretty sure anyone would probably choose the tattoo. Jared then
Speaker 1: forcefully started applying the tattoo with a makeshift tattoo gun.
Speaker 1: And would you like to know what the tattoo was? Oh?
Speaker 2: Do tell? Let's hear it well.
Speaker 1: Spanning basically his entire forehead in capital letters, Jared tattooed
Speaker 1: Katie and below it, in smaller lettering the word revenge. Yes,
Speaker 1: so if he didn't already have a freaking red flag
Speaker 1: above his head, right right.
Speaker 2: Kidding, Like you said, everyone in this town knows everybody,
Speaker 2: everyone knows who Katie is. So Katie's Revenge is gonna
Speaker 2: stick out big.
Speaker 1: Oh absolutely, Like he now has the words Katie's Revenge
Speaker 1: tattooed across the span of his forehead yeap, giving himself
Speaker 1: and others a daily reminder of his crime. Like yes,
Speaker 1: like that is just I don't know.
Speaker 2: Fucking amazing, this douche canoe is fucking stuck with this
Speaker 2: stamp in his forehead of how much of a fucking
Speaker 2: douchebag piece of shit motherfucker he is?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I literally think it's like the best thing ever.
Speaker 1: Hell yeah, like I just I just think it just
Speaker 1: like it just makes my day really okay. So apparently
Speaker 1: not much makes my day, like.
Speaker 2: Apparently it takes prison tattoos revenging little girls to make
Speaker 2: your Yeah yeah, I mean that that is a daymaking
Speaker 2: things so okay.
Speaker 1: So unfortunately, though, two prison guards suspected of supplying the
Speaker 1: leaked photo of Anthony's new ink were fired.
Speaker 2: That's stupid is that that infamous phoone? Oh that's all
Speaker 2: ye across.
Speaker 1: Google because it should never have been released, I guess,
Speaker 1: and I couldn't find a lot of information on this,
Speaker 1: but allegedly jared sentence was also increased. Gotcha, Like, come on, judge, like,
Speaker 1: just let them have it. Let them have this, no kidding,
Speaker 1: but I mean tattoos are against prison regulations.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but also raping and killing little girls is against
Speaker 2: society's regulations.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but this is interesting. Inmates, like they would often
Speaker 1: give each other tattoos with like instruments with plastic utensils
Speaker 1: and needles. Yeah, Like I don't even understand how that
Speaker 1: works or how they would do it. I mean, I
Speaker 1: need to watch a video or something on this.
Speaker 2: If you look at like how tattoos were originally done,
Speaker 2: it's like came from like tribes and I don't know
Speaker 2: where exactly, but Ethiopia, Africa wherever they originated from. They
Speaker 2: start with basically just like a stick and then like
Speaker 2: a fragment of I don't know, bone or a needle
Speaker 2: of sort, and they dip it in whatever ank or
Speaker 2: pigment and the just kind of repeatedly stabbed I been
Speaker 2: sticking poke the oh.
Speaker 1: So like there's no gun or anything. They're just repeatedly
Speaker 1: doing it like with their hand.
Speaker 2: Most most likely, I doubt they would find any sort
Speaker 2: of motors in prison to do it. Yeah, but they might,
Speaker 2: I mean maybe smuggle some shit in electric toothbrush or
Speaker 2: some shit. I don't know.
Speaker 1: Well honestly, like, well, I mean we have a glimpse
Speaker 1: of the photo, will post another one on Instagram. But
Speaker 1: like he did a good job then yeah, like really.
Speaker 2: We also better be posting the sketch on Instagram.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well many, well, yeah, I'll post like a little
Speaker 1: gallery of things. Okay, Okay, I do want to show
Speaker 1: you the sketch.
Speaker 2: Okay, it's crazy if you guys want to see a
Speaker 2: sketch hit up or Instagram.
Speaker 1: Wicked and grim as simple as that and grim.
Speaker 2: Okay, keep going.
Speaker 1: Okay, So one final stone to turn and turn it
Speaker 1: in the rabbit hole that I that I went down,
Speaker 1: you know, is a blog post by none other than
Speaker 1: Anthony himself. Is so itchy right.
Speaker 2: Now, that shite get a finger on the inside on
Speaker 2: an inside job.
Speaker 1: So the the story. The blog post was titled my Story.
Speaker 1: It starts off by saying that he's serving a life
Speaker 1: sentence for a crime he did not commit. Oh it's
Speaker 1: a pretty long post, so we'll put like the link
Speaker 1: if you want to read it yourself, but I'll touch
Speaker 1: on like a few of the points.
Speaker 2: The link will be in this description for the podcast.
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, yeah, yeah, sorry, I'm like you always do that.
Speaker 1: I'm like, I don't even know where the link is,
Speaker 1: but it'll be there.
Speaker 2: I'm the editor and i'm the posters, so.
Speaker 1: It will be like in the notes of the podcast, right,
Speaker 1: that's right, they're put Okay, the episode description.
Speaker 2: That's where all the notes usually are the links and everything,
Speaker 2: and a link to our website. Yes, a little bit
Speaker 2: of a self promotion there.
Speaker 1: There you go. We got a website, we got on Instagram,
Speaker 1: we got a Facebook, though we're like pretty shitty at
Speaker 1: Facebook for some reason. I'm trying to fix that. That's you anyway. Okay,
Speaker 1: So this is kind of where some like discussion here
Speaker 1: is going to happen.
Speaker 2: Let's discuss.
Speaker 1: I got some more stuff to read, but it's like, it's.
Speaker 2: Interesting, let's hear this blog stuff first, like that I
Speaker 2: didn't ever know that he came up with this blog.
Speaker 1: Saying well, and it was in like I think it
Speaker 1: was in two thousand and eight. So it talked about
Speaker 1: his surprise when prosecutors claimed his DNA matched when he
Speaker 1: was like willing to give a sample and everything, So
Speaker 1: like I mean someone willing to generally, But no, we've
Speaker 1: had other cases where people willing to do because at
Speaker 1: that point I think they know they're just they're done.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And howe how he took the plea because he
Speaker 3: was in quotations convinced that would be in his best interest.
Speaker 2: Well, either you die or you go away for life.
Speaker 2: What are you going to pick?
Speaker 1: Yeah? But I think technically, like if he had went
Speaker 1: through the whole trial, if he didn't do it, maybe
Speaker 1: they wouldn't have had enough evidence in like you know,
Speaker 1: you know, but he was convinced to take this plea.
Speaker 1: There was also some sketchiness happening with his lawyer, who
Speaker 1: he thought had had his best interest but he didn't.
Speaker 2: Oh shit.
Speaker 1: To give an example of this, and this is sketch,
Speaker 1: he said he had his friends and family donate money
Speaker 1: to pay for retesting of the DNA evidence, but his
Speaker 1: lawyer was unable to explain what he did with those
Speaker 1: donations really, so like took the money and like never
Speaker 1: used it for this purpose.
Speaker 2: I guess just probably out getting that freaking meth on
Speaker 2: the night outstaring at shit in his front lawn.
Speaker 1: So his wife was also on his side, like through
Speaker 1: most of this until one day she just wasn't and
Speaker 1: testified against him in court. What Yeah, So that's like
Speaker 1: a little weird, you know. And he talked a lot
Speaker 1: about how Charles Hickman, the man who had like originally confessed. Yeah,
Speaker 1: how the story Charles supplied was like just abruptly discharged
Speaker 1: with no reason as to why by the police. So
Speaker 1: and then even after leaving jail, Charles still maintained that
Speaker 1: he knew he was there and he saw and he
Speaker 1: knew what happened, and that the police were charging the
Speaker 1: wrong man.
Speaker 2: Really, so he's saying police are charging the wrong people Charles,
Speaker 2: Holy shit?
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I mean just wait where am I here?
Speaker 1: I'm getting.
Speaker 2: Getting your fuffled.
Speaker 1: How credible is Charles? You know?
Speaker 2: How credible is anyone though? Too? How credible is is Anthony?
Speaker 2: How credible is yeah? The entire system?
Speaker 1: So, like this thing, I read it and I was like,
Speaker 1: holy shit, Like he had some freaking convincing arguments in there,
Speaker 1: and I was just like, oh my gosh, like do
Speaker 1: they not do they not have the wrong do they
Speaker 1: have the wrong person? But then like I was like,
Speaker 1: he's been in jail for a while, he's had like
Speaker 1: a lot of time to think, can you really argue
Speaker 1: with DNA?
Speaker 2: Well, his DNA was there.
Speaker 1: But then he even said like he was like maybe
Speaker 1: they took the cigarette from my truck when they searched it.
Speaker 1: But then his DNA was also on the body and
Speaker 1: stuff right and in in the the string that was
Speaker 1: used to tie Katie's wrists. Can you plant that kind
Speaker 1: of shit?
Speaker 2: I'm sure you can, because I mean, all it really
Speaker 2: takes maybe that cigarette, but they just rubbed shit everywhere.
Speaker 2: I don't know, I don't know if there is someone
Speaker 2: trying to plant evidence. I'm sure there's a way to
Speaker 2: get his DNA over.
Speaker 1: The ball like semen too, though, Yeah, that's.
Speaker 2: Was there, CNA, CNA, DNA, semen DNA there was, Yeah,
Speaker 2: it was okay, and then explain the red fibers.
Speaker 1: Then exactly so I don't know.
Speaker 2: The description of his truck.
Speaker 1: I was literally like reading this and I was like
Speaker 1: I was feeling almost bad, and I was like, holy shit,
Speaker 1: like he just got this like tattoo on his forehead
Speaker 1: and like what I think's not the right person. But
Speaker 1: then and I forgot to mention this actually the year
Speaker 1: prior he had appealed, okay, saying that he was that
Speaker 1: he committed the crime and that he was under the
Speaker 1: influence of extreme mental or emotional disturbance. He testified that
Speaker 1: his father had died six months before the crime after
Speaker 1: a long boat with cancer, and that he was basically
Speaker 1: like taking care of his father and this had like
Speaker 1: impacted his mental and emotional state. But he mentioned that
Speaker 1: he said he did it. So it's like the year
Speaker 1: prior he freaking did it and he was under all
Speaker 1: this dire duress or whatever because his dad died of
Speaker 1: cancer and he had to watch that, which is shit
Speaker 1: to watch. And then the next year he's like putting
Speaker 1: on a blog post saying that he's innocent.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he just lost all credibility in my mind.
Speaker 1: I know, because so when I saw that that in
Speaker 1: that he appealed the previous year and had said that
Speaker 1: he committed and he had taken the polea. So it's
Speaker 1: like he's all over the place.
Speaker 2: There are people who have been wrongfully imprisoned for whatever crime,
Speaker 2: oh absolutely, And there are people who have been who
Speaker 2: take the plea because their lawyer convinces them whatever the situation,
Speaker 2: they take that plea even though they're innocent because it
Speaker 2: seems like that's the right choice.
Speaker 1: Well, and it could be a financial thing too, potentially, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it could have been, like I mean, it's cost a
Speaker 1: lot of money to like be on trial and stuff.
Speaker 2: So just for Devil's advocate sake, here, just say he
Speaker 2: was one of those people who is innocent and took
Speaker 2: the plea because of whatever X reasoning. So now he
Speaker 2: is in prison and he is innocent. He's gonna lose
Speaker 2: credibility by saying, you know, I did do it, but
Speaker 2: here's all my shit that why I did it. And
Speaker 2: then the next year, Yeah, that didn't work. So I'm
Speaker 2: just gonna just confess. No, you're gonna confess and say
Speaker 2: I'm innocent first exactly. That doesn't go through. You're going
Speaker 2: to maybe say, okay, sure I did it, but I
Speaker 2: like you're going to start grasping there.
Speaker 1: Well, his appeal, like he probably was trying to get
Speaker 1: some sort of because you can get maybe more lenient
Speaker 1: sentence if like you had some sort of mental illness
Speaker 1: or something that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if you're innocent, why are you gonna grasp for
Speaker 2: a more lenient sentence? Wouldn't you grasp for I'm innocent.
Speaker 2: I don't deserve this. I should be free. Yeah, that
Speaker 2: doesn't make sense. If they don't believe that you're innocent,
Speaker 2: if you can't get free, then you're going to grasp
Speaker 2: for the leniency and then you're gonna plead for the insanity.
Speaker 2: That's what an innocent person would do in my mind.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so he literally I don't know. I had read
Speaker 1: his story his blog posts first and then and then
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, man, like I feel bad for him,
Speaker 1: Like I think that they might have stored up. And
Speaker 1: then I came across the appeal that he had done
Speaker 1: the previous year and not like no, you can't have that,
Speaker 1: you can't have this DNA, you can't have like the
Speaker 1: red fibers, the matching truck. Like there's there's a lot,
Speaker 1: but it it does seem weird that this other man
Speaker 1: had confessed and said he knows. It almost makes you
Speaker 1: think that there's more to the story that's like drug
Speaker 1: related and and they're almost connected or I don't.
Speaker 2: Know, maybe they are connected maybe.
Speaker 1: But that the police said that that Anthony and Charles
Speaker 1: were not oh really, yeah, that was something that they had.
Speaker 2: Found well, shit, I guess the guy's just a fucking
Speaker 2: tweaker and Anthony's a fucking rapist, murderer, piece of shit, douchebags. Coum,
Speaker 2: what'd you say?
Speaker 1: You? Oh? What did I say?
Speaker 2: Nasty mother? No, motherfucking something, piece of shit, motherfucker. I
Speaker 2: don't know.
Speaker 1: I don't even know, but I mean I all in
Speaker 1: all honesty, just like poor Katie, like she was a
Speaker 1: little girl that had her whole life ahead of her.
Speaker 1: And whether it be Anthony, which I want to, I
Speaker 1: think it's Anthony that's the one serving his sentence. He
Speaker 1: took that, he took that, and it's just heartbreaking.
Speaker 2: And he's now go to fucking banner across his for it. Yes,
Speaker 2: I really hope that he cannot get that removed.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I kind of. There was one report that had
Speaker 1: said some medical person offered to like remove it, fuck them,
Speaker 1: But I really don't think that it should be removed,
Speaker 1: Like why would it? Why? Like just this is just
Speaker 1: like karma, Like just let karma play out here. Yeah,
Speaker 1: can we please have that moment? So anyway, that's the story. Dang, Yeah,
Speaker 1: there's a lot more to it than I think you
Speaker 1: probably originally.
Speaker 2: Thought it Oh yeah, because I've never researched a story.
Speaker 2: I've never listened to a podcast. Nothing. I just kind
Speaker 2: of few articles, like short Facebook articles that have read
Speaker 2: in the past. That's it. So I knew the basics.
Speaker 2: I thought it was an uncle. Clearly was a cousin.
Speaker 2: I was close.
Speaker 1: That's close ish an uncle's.
Speaker 2: Child would be a cousin. So there you go. I
Speaker 2: was in the same family.
Speaker 1: There you go. Anyway, thanks so much for listening.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we appreciate you guys being here. Make sure you
Speaker 2: check out the Instagram. Yes, the website, the Facebook, the
Speaker 2: whatever else we got. Do we have anything else?
Speaker 1: I think that's it.
Speaker 2: We should get a tweeter, tweeter a Twitter. We should
Speaker 2: get a Twitter, and then we cannot use that.
Speaker 1: I actually vote against that. I have never really used Twitter.
Speaker 1: I don't even know where.
Speaker 2: I'm not a Twitter person either. Yeah, so, but check
Speaker 2: them all out. Our website links down below, and on
Speaker 2: desktop we have links to our social media. I really
Speaker 2: got to get that change so it goes onto like
Speaker 2: mobile as well for the social media links.
Speaker 1: But until I get that all set up, make sure
Speaker 1: you guys do Wicked Friends