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<v Speaker 1>Good stuff today to start off with a historic weekend

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<v Speaker 1>at Augustin National historic weekend for the Jazz just not

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<v Speaker 1>a good way. Sixty five l's our next guest. Good

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<v Speaker 1>to see her this morning. Asking the great questions that

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<v Speaker 1>we've become accustomed to. From Sarah Todd, Utah Jazz be

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<v Speaker 1>writer from the des Red News.

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<v Speaker 3>Sarah, Happy Monday. How are you?

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<v Speaker 2>I'm good? And it feels like at the end of

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<v Speaker 2>every season NBA season, and particularly this one, after the

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<v Speaker 2>year the Jazz had, I think I want to sleep

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<v Speaker 2>for like three days straight.

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<v Speaker 1>I was going to ask you what the energy level

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<v Speaker 1>is like? And it is a grind for everybody, but

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<v Speaker 1>you guys on the beat, it's a different grind for

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<v Speaker 1>you than it is for those of us that aren't

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<v Speaker 1>there every night and asking questions every night?

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<v Speaker 3>What was this like? To cover? What was history?

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<v Speaker 1>For all the wrong reasons And we'll get to the

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<v Speaker 1>potential reasons it could be right for this seventeen and

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<v Speaker 1>sixty five Utah Jazz team.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I was kind of having this conversation last night.

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<v Speaker 2>I think that it was it was for sure fatiguing,

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<v Speaker 2>and it felt like maybe maybe not that it was

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<v Speaker 2>like that it felt longer than any other season in particular,

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<v Speaker 2>but that it felt like it dragged on. And I

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<v Speaker 2>think that maybe one of the reasons that it did

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<v Speaker 2>is because the if you're looking at like the process

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<v Speaker 2>Ara Sixers and their tanking, you don't even have to

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<v Speaker 2>think about any of those players because there's no intention

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<v Speaker 2>of them being a part of the future. The whole

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<v Speaker 2>point was get players together that aren't NBA ready so

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<v Speaker 2>that they will lose to every NBA team, And so

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<v Speaker 2>it wasn't really even about developing talent. But if you

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<v Speaker 2>look at the like the Oklahoma City Thunder their tanking season,

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<v Speaker 2>it was about finding specific players to place around Shay

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<v Speaker 2>because they already had their central figure piece. And it's

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit different with the Jazz because I think

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<v Speaker 2>through so much of the season, like you know, they're

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<v Speaker 2>investing so much time, but also I'm investing so much

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<v Speaker 2>time and trying to figure out, like do I really

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<v Speaker 2>care about Knte George? Am I supposed to care? Am

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<v Speaker 2>I supposed to care about Isaiah Collier? Is this really

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<v Speaker 2>a player I need to think about? Worry about his development?

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<v Speaker 2>In terms of the Utah Jazz's future and when they

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<v Speaker 2>eventually do start trying to win championships, and so I

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<v Speaker 2>think that they're kind of in this middle ground where

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<v Speaker 2>there's no central figure to place players around. There's not

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<v Speaker 2>really types of players that they need to add because

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<v Speaker 2>they don't know what types of players they really have yet,

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<v Speaker 2>and so it's just there's this middle ground that just

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<v Speaker 2>feels really tedious. Right now.

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<v Speaker 1>Well said, and you know today with Jay z and

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<v Speaker 1>Will addressing the media contingent and for listeners out there,

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<v Speaker 1>of course, we have it on our website.

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<v Speaker 3>We just played Zank, We're going to play well tomorrow.

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<v Speaker 1>They're all saying the right things, and it's one thing,

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<v Speaker 1>and that's the trouble and kind of the complications Sarah

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<v Speaker 1>covering a team in the spot that the Jazz are

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<v Speaker 1>in because it's almost like political filibustering, like they're saying

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<v Speaker 1>things that have portions of truth. Yes, they are laying

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<v Speaker 1>a foundation, they're in the middle of building a culture,

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<v Speaker 1>in the beginning of building culture, quite frankly, and they're

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<v Speaker 1>trying to learn about their young players, this, that, and

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<v Speaker 1>the other. But they're also so non competitive. I wonder

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<v Speaker 1>from your perspective, getting to know the coaches in the

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<v Speaker 1>front office and the players. Who do you think is

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<v Speaker 1>this the hardest song, who the continuous losing, the non

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<v Speaker 1>serious approach about being competitive. Who do you think has

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<v Speaker 1>the hardest time with what they're trying to do over there?

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<v Speaker 2>I think i'd totally put Will Hardy at the front

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<v Speaker 2>of that, because he's the one that has to get

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<v Speaker 2>players buying in and playing at a level that then

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<v Speaker 2>makes the front office believe that they can evaluate with

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<v Speaker 2>some accuracy whether or not those players are capable of

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<v Speaker 2>being role players in the future. And he has to

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<v Speaker 2>get the players also believing that about themselves. You know,

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<v Speaker 2>they look at the win loss record and they're having

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<v Speaker 2>the doors beaten off by the Oklahoma States Under C team,

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<v Speaker 2>and I think that that's probably a hard place to

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<v Speaker 2>be in for Will. And then I also think about

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<v Speaker 2>kind of the more veteran players on this team, John Collins,

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<v Speaker 2>Jordan Clarkson, Colin Sexton, Larry Markinn. Some of those guys

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<v Speaker 2>are either in their prime or they're in the final

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<v Speaker 2>years of their in Jordan's case, the final years of

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<v Speaker 2>his career, and they're seeing it kind of go away

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<v Speaker 2>with tanking years and not being near being on a

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<v Speaker 2>competitive team or being able to win and I think

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<v Speaker 2>that it's probably hard for them to think about this

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<v Speaker 2>being the place where it might end.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, And we'll see what the off season brings.

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<v Speaker 1>Justin was asked about that today. But of course, Sarah,

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<v Speaker 1>the lottery and the draft will determine what the rest

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<v Speaker 1>of the off season looks like. So let's dig into

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<v Speaker 1>that for a moment, and let's start with a fun hypothetical.

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<v Speaker 1>The Jazz have the worst record in the league. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>the Flatten lottery odds mean that it's a fourteen percent

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<v Speaker 1>chance to get number one, but it also means they

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<v Speaker 1>will have a top five.

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<v Speaker 3>Pick, which is good.

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<v Speaker 1>Of course, I don't know where you're at with this

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<v Speaker 1>this group. You know, the top five according to most

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<v Speaker 1>in some sort of way with maybe certain variants, is

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<v Speaker 1>Cooper Flagg at one, then Dylan Harper, Ace Bailey, vj Edgecomb,

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<v Speaker 1>and Trey Johnson out of Texas, and most people then

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<v Speaker 1>analyze prospects as far as what they do for a

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<v Speaker 1>living every day, believe all five of them have a

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<v Speaker 1>chance to be very good. But of course there does

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<v Speaker 1>appear to be one tier at the top, and that

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<v Speaker 1>is Cooper. So let's have fun and say, on May

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<v Speaker 1>the twelfth Lady Luck shines on the Jazz and the

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<v Speaker 1>way that it never has and Cooper Flag is the

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<v Speaker 1>selection at one. How does that color the context and

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<v Speaker 1>the approach of what you think jay Z and Danny

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<v Speaker 1>and everyone else is going to do this offseason?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, I think I think that that at

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<v Speaker 2>least creates a bit more urgency in the timeline, not

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<v Speaker 2>a ton because we have to remember that Cooper Flag

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<v Speaker 2>turned to eighteen years old in December, and so he's

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<v Speaker 2>got a long time. But then you kind of are

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<v Speaker 2>able to do what I was talking about a couple

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<v Speaker 2>of minutes ago, where well, you've got Cooper, you've got Walker,

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<v Speaker 2>you've got Lowry and you can and you've got Colin Sexton.

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<v Speaker 2>At that point, maybe you don't even have to worry

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<v Speaker 2>about trading away too many things. You probably want to

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<v Speaker 2>open up the roster a little bit, but at that

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<v Speaker 2>point you're starting to look at trying to create lineups

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<v Speaker 2>and pick players that you think are actually going to

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<v Speaker 2>work well together. It's not so much about just identifying

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<v Speaker 2>talent for talents sake, but identifying the right kind of

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<v Speaker 2>talent to put around someone like Cooper Flag who has

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<v Speaker 2>the potential to be a number one guy in the future.

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<v Speaker 2>And then also if you get a guy like Cooper

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<v Speaker 2>and you have kind of this nice looking foundation of

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<v Speaker 2>a basketball team, then that might look a lot better

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<v Speaker 2>for players potentially coming here to play with that group.

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<v Speaker 2>Trading is a lot more specific, because again you're looking

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<v Speaker 2>for specific pieces that are going to work around Cooper,

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<v Speaker 2>and so it just it gives more direction when you

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<v Speaker 2>have a piece like that on the team instead of

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<v Speaker 2>just kind of trying to just gather and mess talent

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<v Speaker 2>without knowing where it's all going to fit into the puzzle.

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<v Speaker 1>If it is not number one overall, if it's not

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<v Speaker 1>Cooper flag and I suppose it just depends on how

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<v Speaker 1>well you know what the calculation is on some of

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<v Speaker 1>these other players, and only you know Danny and Justin

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<v Speaker 1>and their staff know what they think about Dylan Harper

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<v Speaker 1>at two, or Ace Bailey at three, or VJ at

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<v Speaker 1>four or Trey at five or whatever you know the

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<v Speaker 1>take is on those other four players. But it does

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<v Speaker 1>feel like those are the top five players as far

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<v Speaker 1>as all the mocks I look at in whatever order

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<v Speaker 1>you want to go. So, if it's not Cooper and

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<v Speaker 1>it's one of these secondary yet very good players.

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<v Speaker 3>How does that color what do you think the offseason

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<v Speaker 3>looks like?

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<v Speaker 2>Again, I think that because some of these players are

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<v Speaker 2>coming in with such a higher profile than some of

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<v Speaker 2>the other young players that are already on this Jazz team,

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<v Speaker 2>even if it's not Cooper, it starts to give a

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<v Speaker 2>little bit of directionality. So like, if it's Dylan, then

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<v Speaker 2>I think, you know, you picked Dylan at number two,

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<v Speaker 2>then you you kind of have to go into that

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<v Speaker 2>pick with you know, the money that would be guaranteed

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<v Speaker 2>to that contract, and think, this is our point guard

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<v Speaker 2>of the future. So then you're not experimenting with Keyante

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<v Speaker 2>Isaiah anymore. You can make Isaiah a backup point guard

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<v Speaker 2>if you want to, but you know that's something that

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<v Speaker 2>can be kind of nearly set in stone, is like,

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<v Speaker 2>we're going to put him in this position, and that's

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<v Speaker 2>our plan so long as it pans out. And so,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, last year's rookie class was I mean, it

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<v Speaker 2>was no secret that it was weaker compared to this one.

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<v Speaker 2>And so if you get one of those top five players,

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<v Speaker 2>it at least gives you somewhere to begin to start

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<v Speaker 2>to like kind of put in place things that feel

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<v Speaker 2>like they're a little bit more solid than they are now,

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<v Speaker 2>because right now things just feel like so fluid and

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<v Speaker 2>kind of like a big shrug emoji.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, accurate, Yes, that's an accurate emoji to use in

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<v Speaker 1>this scenario. All right, Justin and Will in a different

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<v Speaker 1>sort of way, they were both kind of asked today

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<v Speaker 1>what will next year look like? And I'm asking you

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<v Speaker 1>to read teeleies. I'm asking you to look into a

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<v Speaker 1>Sarah Crystal ball because.

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<v Speaker 3>We have no idea.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, the NBA these days, with the amount of

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<v Speaker 1>player movement, coaches being fired, good players being traded, as

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<v Speaker 1>Jay Z alluded to, with the Jazz clean books and

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<v Speaker 1>draft capital, they are prepared should something exciting come their way.

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<v Speaker 1>There are a lot of teams with very high payrolls

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<v Speaker 1>that have decisions to make. Phoenix is going to move

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<v Speaker 1>off of Durant. They might even have to move off

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<v Speaker 1>of Booker because they don't own it their own draft

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<v Speaker 1>capital in twenty thirty two, and there are other teams

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<v Speaker 1>that are going to have financial decisions to make where

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<v Speaker 1>they're gonna have to jettison off good players. So we'll

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<v Speaker 1>have to see what the lottery brings. We'll have to

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<v Speaker 1>see what the draft brings. We'll have to see what

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<v Speaker 1>the roster construction looks like. But there is this draft

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<v Speaker 1>coming up next year with the Boozer Twins, with aj

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<v Speaker 1>DEBANTSI is going to be playing at BYU that has thought,

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<v Speaker 1>and there are a bunch of other young kids. I

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<v Speaker 1>don't know, but what I read about them, there are

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of draft analysts that believe next year's draft

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<v Speaker 1>has a chance to be as good, if not better

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<v Speaker 1>than this year's draft. So the Sarah Todd take, what

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<v Speaker 1>the six Utah Jazz seasons go look like?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I've been saying that for a while, and I

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<v Speaker 2>fully expect for the Jazz to tank again next season.

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<v Speaker 2>I think that there are obvious variables that you're talking

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<v Speaker 2>about that could change that. If the Jazz get Cooper

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<v Speaker 2>and then chaos around the league this summer does end

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<v Speaker 2>up with them getting kind of a blue chip player

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<v Speaker 2>like Devin Booker for example, or like you know, if

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<v Speaker 2>if Yannis or Devin Booker or someone of that ilk

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<v Speaker 2>and somewhere in between those players, right, if someone like

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<v Speaker 2>that would be traded to the Jazz or for them

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<v Speaker 2>to be able to offer a contract to someone like that,

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<v Speaker 2>then the timeline changes because then you've got Cooper and

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<v Speaker 2>like a top twenty player, and and whether or not

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<v Speaker 2>you're able to keep guys like Lowry or Walker throughout

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<v Speaker 2>whatever trade it would take to get that kind of

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<v Speaker 2>a player to come to Utah. But still then you've

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<v Speaker 2>got kind of a foundation where it's too good to tank,

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<v Speaker 2>and you might that's going to accelerate the timeline and

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<v Speaker 2>it start to start it's time to start trying to

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<v Speaker 2>win games. That being said, I think that if the

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<v Speaker 2>Jazz get Cooper but not like a big blockbuster trade

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<v Speaker 2>player over the off season, they are not going to

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<v Speaker 2>want to go into the twenty twenty six draft and

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<v Speaker 2>not have a pick, because they that's going to be

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<v Speaker 2>a very good draft. And you mentioned aj Debonsa and

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<v Speaker 2>Cameron Boozer, and I also know that there's a lot

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<v Speaker 2>of people within the Jazz front office that really like

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<v Speaker 2>Darren Peterson. He's I'm pretty sure that he's out of Ohio.

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<v Speaker 2>He's one of the guys that plays on these prep

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<v Speaker 2>teams that plays against a bonsa and he's very very good.

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<v Speaker 2>He's incredibly developed for his age, and he's going to

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<v Speaker 2>be a player that a lot of teams are going

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<v Speaker 2>to want and so that's you know, top three right there.

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<v Speaker 2>And I think that the Jazz would be more than

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<v Speaker 2>happy to have any one of those three. And I

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<v Speaker 2>don't think that they want to miss out on that.

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<v Speaker 2>And so if there's not a very very clear cut,

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<v Speaker 2>big blockbuster move that happens, then I fully expect for

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<v Speaker 2>the Jazz to tank again next season.

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<v Speaker 1>How do you think that resonates with this fan base?

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<v Speaker 1>You know, justin today the first thing he referenced, and

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of it was blate boilerplate stuff, and so

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<v Speaker 1>you kind of have to focus and pay attention and

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<v Speaker 1>then take away the things that actually are real. But

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<v Speaker 1>one of the things Jay Z referenced is the Jazz

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<v Speaker 1>fans packing that building. I think it's three hundred and

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<v Speaker 1>thirty three straight sellouts or something like that. And I

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<v Speaker 1>think I was there for ten or eleven home games,

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<v Speaker 1>which is the fewest in years.

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<v Speaker 3>I mean, once upon a time, I was there, as

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<v Speaker 3>you know.

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<v Speaker 1>For everyone, and every game I was there, even if

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<v Speaker 1>the opponent wasn't all that exciting.

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<v Speaker 3>The building was packed.

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<v Speaker 1>Now TV were down massively, Sarah, as you know, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>during the heyday of the Quinn Gobert Mitchell Jazz.

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<v Speaker 3>The Jazz were second.

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<v Speaker 1>In the NBA and local TV ratings to the Warriors.

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<v Speaker 1>And the Warriors, of course, with Stephen Durant and Clay

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<v Speaker 1>and Draymond and that group were must see TV for

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<v Speaker 1>everybody locally and nationally, and the Jazz what I read,

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<v Speaker 1>they had the worst drop outside of one other team

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<v Speaker 1>in local TV ratings in the league. So fans showed up,

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<v Speaker 1>but a lot of fans turn their TVs off. And

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<v Speaker 1>we've seen organizations in the past, including when you covered

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<v Speaker 1>in Philadelphia with Sam Hinkey. You said, look, trust the process,

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<v Speaker 1>that was this whole thing, and after a while, Philly,

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<v Speaker 1>a great basketball city, was like I'm out. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>fans started, you know, they started just not just turning

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<v Speaker 1>it off on TV. They stopped showing up at the

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<v Speaker 1>spectrum whatever they're calling it these days. So what's an

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<v Speaker 1>expectation for these fans to keep staying loyal if next

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<v Speaker 1>year is a lot like this year?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I think you know. Jay Z was talking about

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<v Speaker 2>it today, The players have talked about it before. Will

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<v Speaker 2>Hardy has mentioned it multiple times. The fans in the

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<v Speaker 2>building and even just like general support when any of

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<v Speaker 2>these guys are seen out in public is very high

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<v Speaker 2>and has remained high in impressive way. It doesn't surprise

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<v Speaker 2>me at all, but ratings are down because like, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>going out for a night to a basketball game, potential

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<v Speaker 2>to see like stars on the incoming, you know, visiting

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<v Speaker 2>team that all feels like kind of a night out

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<v Speaker 2>and a fun activity. But it's not really a fun

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<v Speaker 2>activity to watch a tanking team lose every night on TV.

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<v Speaker 2>Like that's not fun. So I get that. But I

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<v Speaker 2>think one of the reasons that you know, the Jazz

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<v Speaker 2>brass have all been so adamant about how much they

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<v Speaker 2>appreciate the fan base and the engagement being so high

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<v Speaker 2>still is because they know how important it is, and

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<v Speaker 2>they know that it's unusual. They know that it's abnormal.

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<v Speaker 2>We've seen I mean, I include myself because I've seen

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<v Speaker 2>all these NBA arenas in person. Bad teams don't get

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<v Speaker 2>packed houses the way that the Jazz do. The Delta

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<v Speaker 2>Center is very very unique in that, and I think

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<v Speaker 2>that they know that this year might not be the

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<v Speaker 2>end of that, and so it's they're kind of the

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<v Speaker 2>lack of a They're not begging, but it's kind of

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<v Speaker 2>like subtle wink wink, begging like, please stay with us

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<v Speaker 2>just a little bit longer, right, because it's probably not

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<v Speaker 2>going to be like this for much longer. I would

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<v Speaker 2>I fully expect after this upcoming season, the twenty five

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<v Speaker 2>to twenty six season, I would expect for that to

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<v Speaker 2>be the Jazz's last tank year. I think that after

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<v Speaker 2>that they really have to start going for it and so,

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<v Speaker 2>and it may not be good that that might not

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<v Speaker 2>mean making the playoffs right away, but it'll mean trying

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<v Speaker 2>to win games for real and trying to put together

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<v Speaker 2>a roster that is actually going to be able to

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<v Speaker 2>contend within the next couple of years. And so I

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<v Speaker 2>think that there's a sentiment behind all of these words

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<v Speaker 2>and platitudes that's just like, please stay with us just

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit longer.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, and we'll see.

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<v Speaker 1>Only the fans can decide, And if you decide that

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<v Speaker 1>you want to tap out for a while, doesn't make

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<v Speaker 1>you a bad fan, because this is a tough ask

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<v Speaker 1>for a community that's used to competitive basketball. Before I said,

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<v Speaker 1>you LuSE Sarah, one of the things that Will talked

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<v Speaker 1>about that kind of perked my ears up when he

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<v Speaker 1>was asked, I'll use the three examples that he kind

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<v Speaker 1>of used the same desire for their off season with Keyante,

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<v Speaker 1>with Bryce and with Isaiah. He referenced with all three

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<v Speaker 1>of them, they need to be in better shape.

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<v Speaker 3>He used different adjectives.

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<v Speaker 1>I think he said for Isaiah his conditioning needs to

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<v Speaker 1>be a superpower. Said the same thing about Keyante. Then

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<v Speaker 1>reference Bryce his body has to be his first priority.

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<v Speaker 1>That stood out to me. I was not expecting to

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<v Speaker 1>hear that with all read those players. What were you

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<v Speaker 1>what's your takeaway with that, that dynamic that will use

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<v Speaker 1>to describe all three of them this offseason.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, couldn't agree more honestly. I think, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>for I'll just go through all three of them, and

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<v Speaker 2>I'll even include uh, Kyle Filipowski is a fourth one,

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<v Speaker 2>and that like we saw so many times and and

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<v Speaker 2>Will actually, I mean he said I need Kyle to

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<v Speaker 2>be more solid on defense, and the you know the

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<v Speaker 2>sub tweet and that is like, your lower body needs

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<v Speaker 2>to be stronger because you're getting pushed off the block

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<v Speaker 2>constantly by guys that are.

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<v Speaker 3>Smaller than you.

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<v Speaker 2>So the it's all about the things that the that

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<v Speaker 2>Will sees as potentially like points of potential for these players.

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<v Speaker 2>But if they aren't able to maximize their literal physical

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<v Speaker 2>strength and get into condition that makes them, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>an athlete that can survive playing high minutes and heavy

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<v Speaker 2>minutes in the NBA, then they're not going to be

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<v Speaker 2>able to sick. And so for Bryce, like he cut

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<v Speaker 2>down a ton of weight between last season and this

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<v Speaker 2>season during the off season last year, and he needs

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<v Speaker 2>to just continue to do it. He needs to just

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<v Speaker 2>continue getting in better shape because while he's a good shooter,

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<v Speaker 2>he's not able to like run quickly off screen kind

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<v Speaker 2>of a lah JJ Reddick right or Steph Curry. I'm

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<v Speaker 2>not saying that he's going to be that type of

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<v Speaker 2>shooter for either of them, but like that, that's what

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<v Speaker 2>really good shooters need to do, is they need to

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<v Speaker 2>be a threat, not just a spot up or maybe

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<v Speaker 2>you know, dribbling into the shot, but coming around screens

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<v Speaker 2>really fast, and you have to be in really good

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<v Speaker 2>shape to do that. For Keyante, he has to be

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<v Speaker 2>able to be just a defender. I don't want to

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<v Speaker 2>say a good defender or a great defender. He just

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<v Speaker 2>has to play defense and he needs to get stronger

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<v Speaker 2>to be able to do that. And part of it

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<v Speaker 2>is his strength, but part of it is the effort.

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<v Speaker 2>He really has to put in some effort on that

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<v Speaker 2>side of the wall, but it's tied to how much

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<v Speaker 2>detail and attention he pays to his body this summer.

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<v Speaker 2>And Isaiah also as a defender as someone who's going

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<v Speaker 2>to be creating their own shot potentially and someone who

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<v Speaker 2>runs with the pace that he does. And that's probably

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<v Speaker 2>the biggest piece is that, like he's a really fast player,

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<v Speaker 2>which can be a huge superpower for a player who

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<v Speaker 2>plays point guard when they play with that kind of speed,

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<v Speaker 2>but he has to be able to do it for

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<v Speaker 2>longer without getting tired, and for eighty two games a

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<v Speaker 2>year plus.

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<v Speaker 1>Sarah, great stuff. Proud of you for not taking a

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<v Speaker 1>bite of a bagel. Then try to ask your question

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<v Speaker 1>like our buddy Andy did today. You handle yourself like

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<v Speaker 1>a pro. Have a great week. We'll get you back

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<v Speaker 1>on soon.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, all right, thanks a lot, Ben.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, Sarah Todd You Todd Jazz beat rider for

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<v Speaker 1>the Desert Red News. You can get her on Twitter

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<v Speaker 1>to follow all of her work, the two times Utah

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<v Speaker 1>Sports Rider of the Year at NBA.

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<v Speaker 3>Sarah is where you find her