WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.120 --> 00:00:02.319 But only in I think only in Divinity School are 2 00:00:02.319 --> 00:00:04.759 they least approaching the text by saying, I'm not trying 3 00:00:04.759 --> 00:00:06.440 to destroy it. I need to love it, and I 4 00:00:06.440 --> 00:00:07.360 don't know how to love it. 5 00:00:07.639 --> 00:00:12.759 Ask not what your country can do for you, Ask 6 00:00:12.880 --> 00:00:14.720 what you can do for your country. 7 00:00:15.439 --> 00:00:19.280 Mister Gorbucha, tear down this wall. 8 00:00:20.519 --> 00:00:23.640 It's the Ricansirat Podcast with Stephen Hayward, who myself, James Flllingx, 9 00:00:23.679 --> 00:00:25.640 and Rob Long is back because we're going to talk 10 00:00:25.679 --> 00:00:29.239 to Ross Doubtfuit about his new book, Why You Should 11 00:00:29.239 --> 00:00:31.480 Be Religious. So let's say reselves a podcast. 12 00:00:31.839 --> 00:00:35.399 The threat to democracy, Indeed, the existential threat to democracy 13 00:00:35.759 --> 00:00:39.719 is the unelected bureaucracy of lifetime tenured civil servants who 14 00:00:39.759 --> 00:00:42.759 believe the answer to no one, who believe they can 15 00:00:42.799 --> 00:00:45.840 do whatever they want without consequence, who believe they can 16 00:00:45.880 --> 00:00:48.759 set their own agenda no matter what Americans vote for. 17 00:00:49.159 --> 00:00:54.119 Federal bureaucrats who are defying democracy by failing to implement 18 00:00:54.320 --> 00:00:57.560 his lawful orders, which are the will of the whole 19 00:00:57.640 --> 00:00:58.719 American people. 20 00:00:59.560 --> 00:01:03.119 Welcome everybody. It's the Ricochet Podcast, number seven and twenty nine. 21 00:01:03.560 --> 00:01:07.079 I'm James Lylyx here in CRISP Bright Minneapolis, Stephen Hayward 22 00:01:07.120 --> 00:01:09.680 probably somewhere out there on the West coast, and Rob 23 00:01:09.719 --> 00:01:13.319 Long is back with us, not to say yeah Stephen, right, okay, 24 00:01:13.319 --> 00:01:15.480 but Rob James, how are you? 25 00:01:15.799 --> 00:01:18.239 I'm doing well. How are yourself? How are you James? 26 00:01:18.239 --> 00:01:21.000 It's the most important question, how are you well? 27 00:01:21.120 --> 00:01:25.840 That is a fraud question at the moment, with many 28 00:01:25.879 --> 00:01:29.439 facets glinting dully in the dark cave of night. 29 00:01:30.200 --> 00:01:33.200 But you are the same basically from that's actually where 30 00:01:33.359 --> 00:01:35.879 where I, uh, where I left, and. 31 00:01:35.840 --> 00:01:38.000 You are in You are in New York right now, 32 00:01:38.040 --> 00:01:40.239 and you are where the last time we met you. 33 00:01:40.239 --> 00:01:42.560 Of course I am not in New York. You're not Princeton, 34 00:01:42.560 --> 00:01:43.079 New Jersey. 35 00:01:43.400 --> 00:01:43.920 Oh right? 36 00:01:43.959 --> 00:01:47.159 Is that where you were conducting your your Yeah, that's 37 00:01:47.159 --> 00:01:49.280 where I'm conducting my certain my studies. 38 00:01:49.400 --> 00:01:51.120 I don't know how to quite a describe How would 39 00:01:51.120 --> 00:01:56.719 I describe it exactly? Your your studies, your theological studies, James, 40 00:01:56.719 --> 00:01:59.359 so that you can call that anything you want. An 41 00:01:59.519 --> 00:01:59.760 m D. 42 00:02:00.760 --> 00:02:03.799 Mastered Divinity, which I have always secretly been, but now 43 00:02:03.799 --> 00:02:05.599 I really am gonna I'm going to have the license. 44 00:02:06.359 --> 00:02:08.800 What is the step below master of Divinity? Because Master 45 00:02:08.840 --> 00:02:11.599 of Divinity really does sound like a commanding position from 46 00:02:11.599 --> 00:02:14.080 which you can do all sorts of things. You've been invested, 47 00:02:14.120 --> 00:02:17.400 You've been imbued that you are a master of divinity, mastery. 48 00:02:17.759 --> 00:02:20.080 What's below that, acolyte of divinity? 49 00:02:21.039 --> 00:02:22.560 I don't think there is. I think you're either a 50 00:02:22.599 --> 00:02:23.639 master or you're just nothing. 51 00:02:24.039 --> 00:02:26.840 Okay, so we're all just here, journeyman of light, Stephen, 52 00:02:26.840 --> 00:02:27.520 how are you today? 53 00:02:28.000 --> 00:02:30.599 I'm just fine, James Good and Dandi. 54 00:02:30.759 --> 00:02:32.479 Well, we have a world to discuss. We could take 55 00:02:32.479 --> 00:02:36.960 a couple of angles about it. We could talk foreign affairs, ivault. 56 00:02:37.280 --> 00:02:40.759 But I would almost like to reserve Ukraine for another 57 00:02:41.159 --> 00:02:43.280 day because it's big and thorny, and I want to 58 00:02:43.280 --> 00:02:45.159 see how it all shakes out. And I'm reading all 59 00:02:45.199 --> 00:02:47.199 sorts of things, and I understand, of course, why the 60 00:02:47.199 --> 00:02:50.240 president would want some mineral rights, because Ukraine provides seventy 61 00:02:50.280 --> 00:02:52.960 percent of the neon gas to the world, and if 62 00:02:53.000 --> 00:02:54.560 we're going to make America great, that means a lot 63 00:02:54.599 --> 00:02:58.280 of neon signs over you know, main streets and Hambiger 64 00:02:58.319 --> 00:03:00.360 shops and the rest of it. But the rest of it, 65 00:03:00.400 --> 00:03:02.520 I'm still trying to figure out what is going on 66 00:03:02.599 --> 00:03:04.919 beyond the obvious talk about Israel, if we want to 67 00:03:04.919 --> 00:03:07.439 put our heart in the gutter because it seems to 68 00:03:07.479 --> 00:03:14.240 be an extraordinarily unfathomably amoral situation on the part of Mamas, 69 00:03:15.199 --> 00:03:18.560 or we could find something that gladdens the heart of all, 70 00:03:18.599 --> 00:03:20.840 and that is the complete and total realignment of the 71 00:03:20.840 --> 00:03:23.759 deep state, the swamp, and the federal government. I don't 72 00:03:23.759 --> 00:03:25.479 know if you guys saw this yesterday. In the flurry 73 00:03:25.520 --> 00:03:28.000 of executive orders that came out, there was one implementing 74 00:03:28.039 --> 00:03:33.000 the President's Department of Government Efficiency Workforce Optimization Initiative. Sounds good, 75 00:03:33.280 --> 00:03:37.919 DC ish, Are either you guys familiar with this latest 76 00:03:38.039 --> 00:03:42.759 EO about how they're going to completely completely transform the 77 00:03:42.759 --> 00:03:43.439 federal government. 78 00:03:44.240 --> 00:03:46.439 No, I've completely missed this, although it fits into the 79 00:03:46.520 --> 00:03:49.439 larger piece. I think that what the Trump administration is 80 00:03:49.439 --> 00:03:54.080 determined to do is restore presidential control over the entire 81 00:03:54.120 --> 00:03:56.439 executive branch, meaning the ability of the president of fire 82 00:03:56.560 --> 00:04:00.840 essentially anyone. And this will evolve over earning at least 83 00:04:00.879 --> 00:04:03.879 one old Supreme Court case, the you know, famous Humphreys 84 00:04:03.919 --> 00:04:06.479 executor from the nineteen thirties, and won't get off into 85 00:04:06.479 --> 00:04:09.199 the legal swamp there. But I think they have a 86 00:04:09.400 --> 00:04:12.560 grand strategy involved here, and I think they're likely to 87 00:04:12.759 --> 00:04:14.080 win many of these battles. 88 00:04:14.759 --> 00:04:19.800 Yeah, the administration, you mean, yes, yeah, yes, I think so, Toru. 89 00:04:19.839 --> 00:04:21.480 And I actually I think it's I mean, you know, 90 00:04:21.759 --> 00:04:26.040 as you know, I'm a I have a feelings, but 91 00:04:26.399 --> 00:04:29.800 it is in fact a good idea for the executive 92 00:04:29.800 --> 00:04:33.800 branch to be allowed to execute and for the legislative 93 00:04:33.920 --> 00:04:36.680 branch to be allowed to appropriate and legislate. I mean 94 00:04:36.720 --> 00:04:38.399 that that's kind of how it's set up. And we've 95 00:04:39.519 --> 00:04:42.120 you know, the most interesting about DOGE has been not 96 00:04:42.600 --> 00:04:44.120 the waste in the fraud of debut. I mean the 97 00:04:44.120 --> 00:04:45.560 waste of the fraud. Maybe I don't know. I've been 98 00:04:45.560 --> 00:04:47.600 hearing that story forevery now right. It's fine, if that 99 00:04:47.600 --> 00:04:50.360 floats your boat, fine, go ahead. But what's been amazing 100 00:04:50.360 --> 00:04:52.839 to me is just how much it's been, how much 101 00:04:52.879 --> 00:04:57.759 the federal government's doing, how huge that Leviathan has become. 102 00:04:58.600 --> 00:05:02.519 And I mean I was just driving here, as you know, 103 00:05:02.639 --> 00:05:04.800 I was driving around and I was listening to NPRS 104 00:05:04.920 --> 00:05:08.720 is my want during the day, and it's a big 105 00:05:08.759 --> 00:05:12.279 SOB story on NBR about people complaining about the scientific research, 106 00:05:12.279 --> 00:05:14.120 scientific research, and you know, they're going to cut the 107 00:05:14.120 --> 00:05:18.120 scientificgure in Columbia and at Coloya University, I mean not 108 00:05:18.720 --> 00:05:22.399 the country. And I came home and I didn't quite 109 00:05:22.439 --> 00:05:23.879 get it yet, but I'm going to get it because 110 00:05:23.879 --> 00:05:30.360 I thought, Okay, Columbia, big university. What is the endowment 111 00:05:31.480 --> 00:05:36.480 for Columbia University? And the endowment it's popping up right 112 00:05:36.519 --> 00:05:40.399 now is going to be as of June thirtieth, twenty 113 00:05:40.439 --> 00:05:42.480 twenty four, so as of you know, six months ago, 114 00:05:42.519 --> 00:05:48.160 basically fourteen billion dollars. 115 00:05:48.199 --> 00:05:49.720 That's a rainy day fund though. 116 00:05:49.800 --> 00:05:52.480 Yeah, and that's actually small, right, I mean, Harvard's bigger, 117 00:05:52.480 --> 00:05:57.879 at Yale's bigger. Universities are bigger. So there is there 118 00:05:57.959 --> 00:06:00.279 is this giant, vast pool of money that you used 119 00:06:00.319 --> 00:06:03.800 to be used by in universities to engage in research. 120 00:06:04.759 --> 00:06:06.680 Uh and all the things that they think are very important, 121 00:06:07.959 --> 00:06:10.399 all the all the great scientific discoveries that we have 122 00:06:10.639 --> 00:06:12.360 that we're you know, people have been talking about, certainly 123 00:06:12.399 --> 00:06:16.000 on the NPR uh uh show I was listening to 124 00:06:17.000 --> 00:06:21.160 happened outside the realm of the federal government and federal 125 00:06:21.279 --> 00:06:24.600 ar jests. So there is an argument to be made 126 00:06:24.800 --> 00:06:26.680 that you know, a little bit of you know, breaking 127 00:06:26.680 --> 00:06:29.920 some glass and shaking things up may not be a 128 00:06:29.959 --> 00:06:34.199 bad idea, and and and that, and that the and 129 00:06:34.240 --> 00:06:37.319 that the fact that the American people, although not the 130 00:06:37.319 --> 00:06:39.639 majority of them, but the huge plurality of them, seemed 131 00:06:39.639 --> 00:06:44.959 to be supporting This suggests that the problem has been 132 00:06:45.000 --> 00:06:47.720 lying in the universities and the research organizations and the 133 00:06:47.759 --> 00:06:50.959 medical and scientific establishment, which have been telling us all 134 00:06:51.000 --> 00:06:52.759 sorts of things for years and years and years and years, 135 00:06:52.759 --> 00:06:54.639 like we're all going to die in climate change, or 136 00:06:54.639 --> 00:06:56.639 we're all going to die if you don't wear the mask, 137 00:06:56.720 --> 00:07:00.000 and schools that we call all that stuff. Right, Yeah, 138 00:06:59.759 --> 00:07:03.800 that's credibility they lost. They can't come crying now about it. 139 00:07:04.839 --> 00:07:06.920 Well, so here's here's an odd bit of trivia that 140 00:07:07.000 --> 00:07:10.279 is unknown to just about everybody. Is that for decades, 141 00:07:10.839 --> 00:07:13.839 science funding from the federal government has actually risen faster 142 00:07:14.040 --> 00:07:17.800 under Republican administrations than democratic administrations. Lots of reasons why 143 00:07:17.839 --> 00:07:20.199 that turns out to be true, and there's lots of problems. 144 00:07:20.560 --> 00:07:22.079 But two things right now jump out of me. 145 00:07:22.120 --> 00:07:25.759 One is you mentioned the discrediting of the scientific establishment 146 00:07:25.759 --> 00:07:28.639 from COVID and whatnot. And I have a headline I 147 00:07:28.680 --> 00:07:31.279 found this morning from inside Higher Ed and I'll just 148 00:07:31.319 --> 00:07:36.439 give you the headline Voodoo doll study explores why scientists 149 00:07:36.600 --> 00:07:39.839 get harassed? So that was probably for it by a 150 00:07:39.879 --> 00:07:40.560 federal grant. 151 00:07:40.560 --> 00:07:42.120 Okay, well, I'm in favor of that. We need more 152 00:07:42.120 --> 00:07:47.399 research on voodoo, you know, right well, or voodoo economics, right, 153 00:07:47.439 --> 00:07:47.759 I mean. 154 00:07:48.000 --> 00:07:53.000 Of course that's the subject for a study. Who you 155 00:07:53.120 --> 00:07:55.600 do doll study? As much as I love to say it, 156 00:07:55.639 --> 00:07:58.240 I want to know where this was conducted. Was there 157 00:07:58.279 --> 00:08:00.079 somehow a USA idea. 158 00:08:00.160 --> 00:08:03.639 Creation to the Vanderbilt University, which then gave two million 159 00:08:03.720 --> 00:08:07.120 dollars to Tides Foundation, which then gave on twenty thousand 160 00:08:07.160 --> 00:08:09.480 dollars to a Haiti group which I went out and 161 00:08:09.560 --> 00:08:11.720 asked a bunch of people about which kinds of knives 162 00:08:11.720 --> 00:08:17.199 and pins they particularly use. Who who did the voodoo study? 163 00:08:17.319 --> 00:08:20.040 That voodoo study you do? So well, yeah, I'll have 164 00:08:20.079 --> 00:08:20.439 to pull. 165 00:08:20.279 --> 00:08:21.839 It up again because I don't have it handy. 166 00:08:21.879 --> 00:08:26.439 But it was some university where they actually had they 167 00:08:26.439 --> 00:08:29.560 actually had people in a room saying, you know, pok 168 00:08:29.560 --> 00:08:33.159 a voodoo doll to give in response to questions about 169 00:08:33.159 --> 00:08:36.960 scientists and science. I mean, it sounds perfectly preposterous, but 170 00:08:37.039 --> 00:08:39.240 beyond the sort of the frivolous things you can point 171 00:08:39.279 --> 00:08:40.360 to which you know we can. 172 00:08:40.440 --> 00:08:41.519 We've done that forever, right. 173 00:08:42.159 --> 00:08:42.240 Uh. 174 00:08:42.399 --> 00:08:45.240 The other thing going on is the Trump administration saying 175 00:08:45.279 --> 00:08:49.360 we're going to cap overhead on federal funding for science 176 00:08:49.480 --> 00:08:52.840 at I think fifteen percent fift The great scandal here 177 00:08:52.879 --> 00:08:56.360 is most universities take forty percent. Some take as much 178 00:08:56.639 --> 00:09:01.039 as fifty percent. I've seen sixty Yeah, I know one 179 00:09:01.200 --> 00:09:04.440 university where it's fifty six percent. And and the point 180 00:09:04.519 --> 00:09:06.279 is is that this has become a slush fund to 181 00:09:06.279 --> 00:09:09.559 cross subsidize universities. The universities say, oh, we need that 182 00:09:09.639 --> 00:09:13.759 to provide the labs and equipment and administer the grants. Well, 183 00:09:13.799 --> 00:09:16.519 the labs are mostly built and any new lab equipment 184 00:09:16.519 --> 00:09:18.759 would be part of the grant that goes to the researcher. 185 00:09:18.879 --> 00:09:20.639 So I love this. 186 00:09:21.159 --> 00:09:25.679 I think that this is an absolutely solitary development by 187 00:09:25.679 --> 00:09:28.360 the government to say, no, you can't you have universities, 188 00:09:28.360 --> 00:09:31.600 We're not going to cross subsidize your bloated administrations. 189 00:09:31.679 --> 00:09:33.080 But before I toss it to Rob again, I have 190 00:09:33.120 --> 00:09:34.840 to note that one of the things that this administrator, 191 00:09:34.879 --> 00:09:37.200 this executive order says is that there is dose is 192 00:09:37.240 --> 00:09:39.720 going to go through Rooten branch and look at all 193 00:09:39.759 --> 00:09:41.600 of the regulations and they have to I mean the 194 00:09:41.639 --> 00:09:43.960 man hours required to look at that as extraordinary that 195 00:09:44.000 --> 00:09:47.879 have been promulgated by agencies outside of their specific congressional mandate. 196 00:09:48.240 --> 00:09:49.919 In other words, you guys don't get to make that 197 00:09:50.039 --> 00:09:52.879 rule up. That's the job of the legislature. And the 198 00:09:52.960 --> 00:09:55.759 number of encumbrances that have been placed upon innovation and 199 00:09:55.799 --> 00:09:58.279 business and the rest of these things, because the guys 200 00:09:58.279 --> 00:10:01.320 are just throwing these rigs out everywhere that if they 201 00:10:01.360 --> 00:10:04.039 have no statutory basis, they've got to go. And I 202 00:10:04.080 --> 00:10:05.960 seem to remember that there was a reason Supreme Court 203 00:10:06.000 --> 00:10:09.600 kurd fluffle about this. So this when people talk about 204 00:10:09.879 --> 00:10:12.879 the intractability of the deep state, I mean they're essentially 205 00:10:12.960 --> 00:10:16.240 referring to a civil service that regarded itself as being 206 00:10:16.279 --> 00:10:19.519 a permanent overclass that you know, does the work of 207 00:10:19.559 --> 00:10:21.679 governance no matter who's in the White House. Well, this 208 00:10:21.840 --> 00:10:24.320 changes that, and if they move fast and swift enough, 209 00:10:24.320 --> 00:10:26.919 we may see the most consequential change actually to American 210 00:10:26.919 --> 00:10:29.480 governance since I don't know, since FDR started, like you know, 211 00:10:29.799 --> 00:10:32.039 draping this stuff and doing what he did back in 212 00:10:32.039 --> 00:10:33.600 the thirties, Rob, what's the. 213 00:10:33.720 --> 00:10:36.679 Use well maybe. I mean the problem is that everybody 214 00:10:36.720 --> 00:10:39.440 thinks that the government spending stupid money on everybody else, 215 00:10:39.480 --> 00:10:42.320 but everybody thinks the government spending really good money on them. 216 00:10:42.639 --> 00:10:43.000 I don't. 217 00:10:43.080 --> 00:10:44.919 And so there's a lot of this, Like you know, 218 00:10:44.960 --> 00:10:46.879 you can go back and forth on all of this stuff, 219 00:10:46.919 --> 00:10:49.919 but you know where the money is is in entitlements 220 00:10:49.919 --> 00:10:52.759 and we're not going to touch those. And you know, 221 00:10:53.039 --> 00:10:56.159 Republicans have been flinty and mean about this for years 222 00:10:56.200 --> 00:11:02.879 and we get nowhere with it. But if you're under forty, 223 00:11:03.360 --> 00:11:05.919 your social security is going to be different from mine. 224 00:11:06.200 --> 00:11:08.600 And if you're under thirty, it's going to be vastly 225 00:11:08.639 --> 00:11:11.360 different from if you're under forty, and your retirement age 226 00:11:11.399 --> 00:11:13.919 is going to be seventy or seventy five, it's not 227 00:11:13.960 --> 00:11:17.279 going to be sixty whatever. And that is just the truth. 228 00:11:17.320 --> 00:11:19.559 And nobody wants to tell anybody that, but just hoping 229 00:11:19.600 --> 00:11:22.639 it kind of seeps into the groundwater so that everybody 230 00:11:22.720 --> 00:11:25.080 under thirty, which I think is kind of true. Any 231 00:11:25.080 --> 00:11:27.519 smart person under thirty, if you ask them, they know 232 00:11:27.559 --> 00:11:30.600 it's not going to be there. But nothing's going to 233 00:11:30.679 --> 00:11:33.639 change until that happens, until we accept that, and really 234 00:11:33.679 --> 00:11:36.600 sort of internalize that and stop lying to people about 235 00:11:36.600 --> 00:11:39.080 how if you're on a left, if you're a Democrat, 236 00:11:39.200 --> 00:11:40.440 how it's all going to be fined. All we have 237 00:11:40.440 --> 00:11:42.279 to do is raise the text on the ridge, or 238 00:11:42.600 --> 00:11:45.159 if you're a Republican this current present, lying to people 239 00:11:45.159 --> 00:11:46.440 saying no, we don't have to touch it. I'm never 240 00:11:46.480 --> 00:11:48.759 going to touch it, because that's just simply a lie. 241 00:11:49.559 --> 00:11:51.440 And as long as we're not doing that, we're just 242 00:11:51.480 --> 00:11:57.080 going to be firing some scientists and listening to outrageous 243 00:11:57.320 --> 00:12:01.320 but basically financially economically trivial story on talk radio and 244 00:12:01.360 --> 00:12:04.399 on Twitter. But we're not actually going to be changing 245 00:12:04.519 --> 00:12:06.639 the future direction of this country in a way we 246 00:12:06.679 --> 00:12:10.279 deploy resources because we're still going to be spend a 247 00:12:10.320 --> 00:12:13.399 lot of money on entitlements. And then the second thing is, 248 00:12:14.360 --> 00:12:17.080 I mean, the other big giant pot when Stevie chime 249 00:12:17.120 --> 00:12:21.279 in here is is defense. And we on the one hand, 250 00:12:21.320 --> 00:12:23.600 we have an America First policy right now, which is 251 00:12:24.639 --> 00:12:27.279 we agree with the disagree with it, is a policy 252 00:12:27.320 --> 00:12:33.080 that argues for a much much much smaller armed forces. 253 00:12:34.360 --> 00:12:36.840 If we're America First, we don't have to go overseas. 254 00:12:37.320 --> 00:12:41.519 We just have to protect our borders. So we should 255 00:12:41.559 --> 00:12:43.240 be shrinking. If we're going to be America first, we 256 00:12:43.279 --> 00:12:45.799 should shrink. If we're not going to be America first, 257 00:12:45.840 --> 00:12:47.799 we should stop saying because the worst thing in the 258 00:12:47.799 --> 00:12:52.679 world to be is America first. But except for some 259 00:12:52.759 --> 00:12:56.080 foreign and tendments, that is, that's a recipe for disaster. 260 00:12:56.240 --> 00:12:58.679 So we have to as a country and as a policy, 261 00:12:58.679 --> 00:13:00.320 we have to sort of unify those two things. 262 00:13:00.919 --> 00:13:02.279 Well at two quick points. 263 00:13:02.399 --> 00:13:04.600 One, Rob, I take your point about the waste, fraud 264 00:13:04.639 --> 00:13:06.600 and abuse theme has been overdone over the years. You know, 265 00:13:06.600 --> 00:13:08.799 the Reagan people made a big deal of that, and 266 00:13:08.840 --> 00:13:11.039 they found there wasn't very much in nineteen eighty one, 267 00:13:11.080 --> 00:13:15.679 and that's why seriously cutting spending then involved changing eligibility formulas. 268 00:13:15.720 --> 00:13:19.039 However, I do think that that is less true today. 269 00:13:19.080 --> 00:13:23.480 I mean even the Biden administration GAO found what last 270 00:13:23.519 --> 00:13:27.360 year sometimes that potential fraud in Medicare and Medicaid was 271 00:13:27.399 --> 00:13:29.960 between two hundred and fifty and five hundred billion dollars, 272 00:13:30.240 --> 00:13:32.240 I mean real money now, So I think there is 273 00:13:32.240 --> 00:13:33.879 more going on. And I have a theory on this 274 00:13:34.399 --> 00:13:37.600 that if we do a full scale forensic examination of 275 00:13:37.639 --> 00:13:39.720 the last fifteen years, I think we're going to find 276 00:13:40.399 --> 00:13:42.480 that the kind of things that just have dripped out 277 00:13:42.519 --> 00:13:45.080 now from doges about USAID and so forth, We're going 278 00:13:45.120 --> 00:13:49.200 to find that that kind of you know, frivolous spending 279 00:13:49.240 --> 00:13:51.879 and subsidies for liberal client groups and all kinds of 280 00:13:51.879 --> 00:13:55.480 crazy things. But that exploded under Obama and especially you 281 00:13:55.519 --> 00:13:58.000 know that that eight hundred billion dollar package, and it's 282 00:13:58.039 --> 00:14:02.159 only grown bigger during uh, the Biden administration. I don't 283 00:14:02.159 --> 00:14:05.840 think the first Trump administration was looking hard at this, uh, 284 00:14:05.840 --> 00:14:08.919 and so I think that they're actually, if this works, 285 00:14:09.279 --> 00:14:11.000 that's a big if. I think we're going to find 286 00:14:11.000 --> 00:14:15.559 substantial savings that then might make possible the conversation about entitlements, 287 00:14:15.559 --> 00:14:17.519 because you're right that it won't get us close to 288 00:14:17.519 --> 00:14:18.200 where we need to be. 289 00:14:18.840 --> 00:14:21.200 Uh. But okay, that's point one. Point two. 290 00:14:21.320 --> 00:14:24.200 I have sorry about Medicare before we talk about defense. 291 00:14:24.240 --> 00:14:27.080 I mean, the Medicare is true, but the Medicare rises 292 00:14:27.080 --> 00:14:29.360 in Medicare costs and waste, broaden, use, all those things. 293 00:14:29.960 --> 00:14:32.639 I mean, I mean, they accelerated under a bomb obviously, 294 00:14:32.879 --> 00:14:37.440 but they always go up because price controls do not work, 295 00:14:37.919 --> 00:14:41.519 and Medicare is a price control program. So every time 296 00:14:41.919 --> 00:14:43.559 by the you know, it takes five years for this 297 00:14:43.600 --> 00:14:46.240 big Medicare review because obviously the health care business is 298 00:14:46.240 --> 00:14:49.000 really be huge. So we have this five year review 299 00:14:49.039 --> 00:14:52.120 on procedures and what will pay for a procedure. Meanwhile, 300 00:14:52.159 --> 00:14:55.320 the procedures become redefined and one procedure is now three 301 00:14:55.320 --> 00:15:00.200 small procedures or six procedures. And then the costs always, always, 302 00:15:00.240 --> 00:15:05.039 always go up because Medicare is a is a single 303 00:15:05.080 --> 00:15:08.360 payer program, whether you like it or not. It's socialized medicine, 304 00:15:08.360 --> 00:15:10.159 whether you like it or not. And we have a 305 00:15:10.159 --> 00:15:13.559 federal government, a behemoth trying to control prices and that 306 00:15:14.879 --> 00:15:19.480 it's only one system in the world that ever accurately 307 00:15:19.879 --> 00:15:25.159 and efficiently controls prices, and that is a market. And 308 00:15:25.200 --> 00:15:27.399 if you don't have a market, it doesn't matter. You 309 00:15:27.480 --> 00:15:30.440 can have you can give Elon Musk the keys to 310 00:15:30.480 --> 00:15:33.600 the kingdom, and dose could be given, you know, app 311 00:15:33.720 --> 00:15:37.200 carte blanche. It's never going to happen, and because people 312 00:15:37.240 --> 00:15:38.960 don't want it to have. Look a lot of elderly 313 00:15:39.000 --> 00:15:41.240 people who work walking around with maga hats, driving around 314 00:15:41.279 --> 00:15:43.799 in their golf carts. The villages are going to get really, 315 00:15:43.840 --> 00:15:46.200 really a pissed when they discover that medicare is going 316 00:15:46.240 --> 00:15:48.159 to cover this or that procedure that they think they want. 317 00:15:48.840 --> 00:15:50.720 Yeah, oh, I mean he did agreement with you about that, 318 00:15:51.320 --> 00:15:51.799 just quickly. 319 00:15:51.840 --> 00:15:55.039 On defense, a lot to be said there, But one 320 00:15:55.159 --> 00:15:58.159 place where I think we need to think hard is 321 00:15:58.399 --> 00:16:02.159 whether we have in America first posture or not. Is 322 00:16:02.240 --> 00:16:04.320 I wonder if we can continue to afford having a 323 00:16:04.360 --> 00:16:06.960 gold plated military. By that, I mean, we seem to 324 00:16:06.960 --> 00:16:10.480 build the most expensive fighter planes, the most expensive ships. 325 00:16:11.279 --> 00:16:13.279 And we've always thought and this goes back to the 326 00:16:13.279 --> 00:16:16.080 Cold War years when we countered the superior numbers of 327 00:16:16.080 --> 00:16:18.519 the Soviet Union in terms of troops with better technology, 328 00:16:19.200 --> 00:16:21.759 and you know, I, you know, I don't really have 329 00:16:21.840 --> 00:16:23.759 a firm grasp on that, but I know there's lots 330 00:16:23.799 --> 00:16:26.799 of intelligent criticisms of things like the F thirty five 331 00:16:26.840 --> 00:16:30.559 fighter plane. It's unbelievably expensive, and you know, I don't know, 332 00:16:30.639 --> 00:16:32.840 maybe drones are better, but I think there needs to 333 00:16:32.840 --> 00:16:34.399 be a top to bottom review. And by the way 334 00:16:34.519 --> 00:16:38.279 heg sathas seemingly indicating that he's open to some of 335 00:16:38.279 --> 00:16:40.519 that inquiry. 336 00:16:40.080 --> 00:16:42.519 You know, I was actually, I mean, I disagree with 337 00:16:42.639 --> 00:16:48.679 the policy, but I believe that the policy itself has ramifications, 338 00:16:50.039 --> 00:16:51.799 and I think that it is one thing to be 339 00:16:51.919 --> 00:16:55.600 America first, and that is a completely legitimate policy. You 340 00:16:55.639 --> 00:16:58.360 can't be America first unless that is your that's the 341 00:16:58.440 --> 00:17:04.000 primary h P, a foundational point. As you're gonna if 342 00:17:04.000 --> 00:17:07.279 you're going to rebuild or remodel the US military, we 343 00:17:07.359 --> 00:17:11.000 are not going to be protecting You're not going to 344 00:17:11.039 --> 00:17:14.240 be protecting Ukraine. We are not going to be in Taiwan. 345 00:17:14.599 --> 00:17:15.920 We're not going to be doing any of that. That's 346 00:17:15.920 --> 00:17:18.400 that's not America first, America versus the opposite of that. 347 00:17:19.440 --> 00:17:22.039 All that's fine, but that means that we don't need 348 00:17:22.559 --> 00:17:24.000 a lot of things. What do we really need? We 349 00:17:24.039 --> 00:17:27.200 need to protect our shipping lanes. I guess we need 350 00:17:27.240 --> 00:17:30.000 to protect our borders and then we're done. And if 351 00:17:30.039 --> 00:17:33.400 you if the waiver on that, then you gotta then 352 00:17:33.400 --> 00:17:36.240 you're on a very slippery slope. The one thing about 353 00:17:36.279 --> 00:17:38.920 Reagan said is that we are there to protect the world, 354 00:17:39.240 --> 00:17:42.160 So we're going to build, build, build. If we're not 355 00:17:42.160 --> 00:17:43.839 there to protect the world, we're just here to protect 356 00:17:43.880 --> 00:17:47.480 our borders in our country, then we don't need half 357 00:17:47.519 --> 00:17:49.359 the things that we buy. We just don't need them. 358 00:17:49.920 --> 00:17:53.759 And that you can't have it both ways. The worst 359 00:17:53.759 --> 00:17:56.839 thing for us to be is have an interventionist, even 360 00:17:56.839 --> 00:18:00.200 a quasi interventionist posture in the world, and also so 361 00:18:00.279 --> 00:18:02.920 have a military that can't handle that. That's just having 362 00:18:02.920 --> 00:18:08.000 a big mouth with no follow through, And unfortunately, I 363 00:18:08.200 --> 00:18:12.640 believe that describes our current president. But it's a very 364 00:18:12.680 --> 00:18:16.039 dangerous position to be in. It's one thing to say, world, 365 00:18:16.119 --> 00:18:18.799 you're on your own. It's something to say, world, you're 366 00:18:18.839 --> 00:18:20.119 kind of on your own. And we're going to reduce 367 00:18:20.160 --> 00:18:22.000 our military, but we're also going to when we want to, 368 00:18:22.279 --> 00:18:23.559 we want to get involved in something, We're going to 369 00:18:23.559 --> 00:18:25.559 get involved in something. I mean, what do we care 370 00:18:25.640 --> 00:18:28.039 if Russia takes over Ukraine? What do we care if 371 00:18:28.119 --> 00:18:30.720 China takes over Taiwan. If we care, then we need 372 00:18:30.759 --> 00:18:35.559 to prepare and spend. If we don't care, then we 373 00:18:35.599 --> 00:18:37.000 don't have to prepare or spend. 374 00:18:38.759 --> 00:18:40.599 Well, it's remarkable it took six minutes to go from 375 00:18:40.599 --> 00:18:42.319 my original point, which was how this is going to 376 00:18:42.359 --> 00:18:46.640 impact the housing values in McLean, Virginia to a projection 377 00:18:46.680 --> 00:18:50.200 of power and Rob, You're absolutely right. My point put 378 00:18:50.240 --> 00:18:52.279 a boa and the whole thing is that not that 379 00:18:52.359 --> 00:18:53.920 I expect any of what is DOJA is doing or 380 00:18:53.920 --> 00:18:57.079 the executive orders in reshaping the bureaucracy is going to 381 00:18:57.079 --> 00:19:00.680 necessarily get us out of the spending problems that I mean, 382 00:19:00.720 --> 00:19:03.640 the deficit is what it is, and you're right, entitlements are. 383 00:19:03.559 --> 00:19:04.039 What they are. 384 00:19:04.359 --> 00:19:06.640 But it will, in the future, I think, result in 385 00:19:06.680 --> 00:19:10.119 a leaner government that has less control and less intervention 386 00:19:10.200 --> 00:19:14.240 and less invasive tentacles into the body politic and body, 387 00:19:14.720 --> 00:19:17.319 economic and social and whatnot. And that's a good thing, 388 00:19:17.720 --> 00:19:20.039 and it's going to be hard to rebuild if they 389 00:19:20.079 --> 00:19:22.039 want to do it well the next time they get 390 00:19:22.039 --> 00:19:26.079 their hands on the levers of power. But maybe perhaps 391 00:19:26.079 --> 00:19:28.519 there is but one lever of power, and it is 392 00:19:29.079 --> 00:19:32.559 in the grasp of things way beyond our ken and 393 00:19:32.599 --> 00:19:35.519 we small little ants here struggling in the muck trying 394 00:19:35.559 --> 00:19:38.319 to comprehend our place in the universe, oftentimes turn to 395 00:19:38.359 --> 00:19:41.880 things that can't be necessarily empirically quantified. And that is 396 00:19:42.079 --> 00:19:44.880 why we're going to talk to Ross Ross Dout, the 397 00:19:44.920 --> 00:19:46.960 columnists from The New York Times, host of Matter of 398 00:19:47.000 --> 00:19:50.160 Opinion podcast, author of many books, and most recently, as 399 00:19:50.200 --> 00:19:54.200 of just last week, believe why everyone should be religious. 400 00:19:54.440 --> 00:19:55.599 Russ Welcome back. 401 00:19:55.720 --> 00:19:58.440