Speaker 1: Oh hey, it's your sister's high school friend who is
Speaker 1: eating frozen custard in the background of a hometown date
Speaker 1: on The Bachelor. Not really. Ali warret back with an
Speaker 1: episode You're gonna hate Maybe I dare you to listen.
Speaker 1: It is packed with bananas information about the human mind
Speaker 1: and psyche, and about fear and power and social contagions
Speaker 1: and delightful squeals. But it is absolutely not soothing whatsoever.
Speaker 1: Don't fall asleep to this. Don't play this with your
Speaker 1: grandpa recovering from surgery on the couch next to you.
Speaker 1: Don't turn to me if you're having anxiety about your
Speaker 1: kolonoscopy prep. Not the episode, not the episode for that
Speaker 1: at all. This one is going to tear at the
Speaker 1: fabric of your sanity. And this ologist offers so much
Speaker 1: cocktail party trivia. Hoo boy. So he did his undergrad
Speaker 1: and animal behavior and got a master's in psychology and
Speaker 1: a PhD in zoology, a post doc with primates at
Speaker 1: Rockefeller University, and is now a professor in the Department
Speaker 1: of peche Collogy at Emory, where he has been since
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty four. And if you have seen an article
Speaker 1: about the study of human screams. It is likely that
Speaker 1: this person has been quoted, So here we go. But first,
Speaker 1: thank you to all the patrons who submitted wonderful questions
Speaker 1: for this You can join the patreon at patreon dot
Speaker 1: com slash ologies for a buck a month and submit questions.
Speaker 1: Also thanks for spreading the word about the show, telling friends,
Speaker 1: and leaving reviews, which helps so much. This one this
Speaker 1: week holy shit, so worth it. I'm going to put
Speaker 1: the review at the end of the episode as the
Speaker 1: secret I want to read the whole thing anyway, Onto screamology.
Speaker 1: So the word scream it's said to come from a
Speaker 1: Scandinavian term meaning to terrify or cry aloud, so vocalization
Speaker 1: via forced air, and the term screamology was coined in
Speaker 1: the press years ago about this guy, so I reached out.
Speaker 1: Luckily we had some help in booking him. We talked
Speaker 1: before the holidays, on a day when Emory was having
Speaker 1: some giant fundraising drive on campus, but luckily his office
Speaker 1: appeared to be soundproofed, so we warmed up our voices
Speaker 1: and chatted about movie screams, which animals scream, the difference
Speaker 1: between yelling versus screaming, happy screaming, scream queens, screamed kings,
Speaker 1: the decibels and distance of screams, screaming in your nightmares,
Speaker 1: boy bands, dictators, death metal, and more. With plenty of
Speaker 1: examples in here that we try to keep quiet, but
Speaker 1: they're in there, so get ready with primatologists, research psychologists,
Speaker 1: and one of the world very few professional dedicated screamologists,
Speaker 1: doctor Harold Gazulas. Once again, that name.
Speaker 2: Is Harold Kazoulis. It's a Greek name, three syllables, so
Speaker 2: pretty simple for a Greek name, and he him.
Speaker 1: Kind of like someone who's been a victim of a
Speaker 1: kazoo theft and is now kazouls Hi Ali, Hi, you
Speaker 1: sound great.
Speaker 2: Well, let's hope. I was almost at heart attack coming
Speaker 2: down here. Atlanta traffic is notorious and Friday afternoon is
Speaker 2: the worst, and it just turned out to be one
Speaker 2: of those worst case scenarios. Oh no, And I was
Speaker 2: rushing to get down here and managed. And then I
Speaker 2: discovered that the campus is a very noisy place today
Speaker 2: because Emory my University, is kicking off their big capital
Speaker 2: campaign and so there's music playing everywhere.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 2: Fortunately, my office seems to be tucked away just sufficiently well,
Speaker 2: so it's not really noticeable. I don't know if you
Speaker 2: can hear anything in the background.
Speaker 1: No, I can't at all.
Speaker 2: Okay, good, good?
Speaker 1: Now is does your office have to be well insulated
Speaker 1: in case there are screams or is it just lost?
Speaker 2: Well, well, my lab is more isolated, and yet the
Speaker 2: story goes that people walk by and will hear some
Speaker 2: of the screams that we're listening to and talking about
Speaker 2: within the lab with my students and wondering what's going on,
Speaker 2: and so they have to hear. Oh, that's just doctor
Speaker 2: Gozulis's scream research. Don't worry about it, don't panic, don't
Speaker 2: run for the hills.
Speaker 1: How long have people been calling you a screamologist?
Speaker 2: Only quite recently within the context of ologies, I would
Speaker 2: first be a biologist. That's where my degree is in
Speaker 2: and it's actually in zoology my PhD. And I'm working
Speaker 2: in a psychology department and have been for thirty seven years.
Speaker 2: If that can actually be the true, Wow, you're it, Emory. Yes,
Speaker 2: And my training is in ethology, which is the study
Speaker 2: of animal behavior, and the animals I work with mostly
Speaker 2: are non human primates, so technically I'm a primatologist. As well.
Speaker 1: Oh, you're so many ologies underweos.
Speaker 2: I have a lot of ologies. But I was talking
Speaker 2: to a reporter I don't know a year and a
Speaker 2: half ago. He said, wow, is it okay if I
Speaker 2: refer to you as a screamologist, And at the time
Speaker 2: I thought, hmm, that's a little a little off, but
Speaker 2: go ahead if you'd like. If it's if it's something
Speaker 2: that would enhance your piece, please screamology would be fine.
Speaker 1: Ah well, it's lucky for me because after that came out,
Speaker 1: I had a lot of people screencapping it and saying,
Speaker 1: there's a screamologist. You have to find him, Please ask
Speaker 1: him everything, Please find him right out. So yeah, I've
Speaker 1: had my sights on you for a while.
Speaker 2: Oh well, that's cool. And I must say that my
Speaker 2: daughter in law is one of your biggest fans. When
Speaker 2: I mentioned the possibility of this interview, she was so excited,
Speaker 2: So it's really cute.
Speaker 1: So yes, thank you for vouching for a Sam. We
Speaker 1: absolutely owe you on. And I know that you would
Speaker 1: expect this episode in October everyone, but right now it's
Speaker 1: January and it's cold, and the snow is dirty and slushy.
Speaker 1: My roof is leaking. Is it a good time to
Speaker 1: bellow your throat raw? What would you say time of year?
Speaker 1: As a culture people scream the most. Do you think
Speaker 1: it's in the summer when people are getting squirted with
Speaker 1: water guns? Is it during haunted house season? Is it
Speaker 1: when they get their bills after the holidays? When do
Speaker 1: we scream the most either?
Speaker 2: That is very interesting. I don't think I've ever had
Speaker 2: that question, But I would say people in general, you
Speaker 2: probably hear more screams outside in the summer, and they
Speaker 2: come mostly from children because they're at swimming pools and
Speaker 2: playgrounds and just a lot of social interaction. As any
Speaker 2: parent and most adults can appreciate and know children just
Speaker 2: scream all the time they get them together. So I
Speaker 2: would say summer, I think probably that's what I would think.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was my hypothesis. I'm glad that it holds
Speaker 1: a little bit of water. But what is a scream
Speaker 1: and who does it? What animals can we classify as screaming?
Speaker 1: What's the difference between a call and a behavior and
Speaker 1: a scream?
Speaker 2: Right, Screams are a particular category of vocalization in the
Speaker 2: repertoire of many different species, and we can come back
Speaker 2: to that in a bit. But you know, there isn't
Speaker 2: a precise and absolutely formal and totally accepted definition of
Speaker 2: a scream, but there are key features of screams, so
Speaker 2: they in terms of the length of a particular utterance,
Speaker 2: it would be from half a second to about a
Speaker 2: second and a quarter, maybe stretching it to two seconds,
Speaker 2: but anything beyond that begins to sound unnatural. Screams are
Speaker 2: high pitched and there are often harmonics around the fundamental frequency,
Speaker 2: but screams also break into chaotic noise as well, so
Speaker 2: they're not pure tones. Although some people tend to produce
Speaker 2: screams that are more tonal and frequency modulated, and others
Speaker 2: have more noisy, harsh sounding screams. So does some individual
Speaker 2: variation as well. There's an acoustic parameter that's referred to
Speaker 2: as roughness. It's rapid variation and modulation of amplitude fluctuation
Speaker 2: in a particular range is characteristic of screams, and there's
Speaker 2: one group of researchers, Luke Arnall has claimed that in
Speaker 2: fact it is definitive that is what inherently categorizes a scream,
Speaker 2: but subsequent research has shown that other kinds of human
Speaker 2: vocalizations also have this characteristic of roughness, and so it
Speaker 2: can't be exclusive to screams.
Speaker 1: You know what, Let's go through a few quick vocal
Speaker 1: basics here, shall we. So frequency of the sound waves
Speaker 1: determines their pitch, and that is measured in something called hurts.
Speaker 1: But the amplitude is the height of the sound wave,
Speaker 1: and that determines the volume, and amplitude is measured in decibels,
Speaker 1: which you've probably heard of. So the roughness, what does
Speaker 1: the roughness mean? That is the rate of change in volume,
Speaker 1: And the more the volume fluctuates in a scream, even
Speaker 1: though it seems imperceptible to you, it'll land is more
Speaker 1: shrill and it'll probably freak you out more. Infants crying
Speaker 1: exhibit roughness, as does a human whistling, just in case
Speaker 1: we've ever heard either of those and just wanted to
Speaker 1: put on earmuffs and then just descend into a sewer
Speaker 1: hole in the middle of the city street when you
Speaker 1: hear it.
Speaker 2: That's normal. So coming back to your question, we all
Speaker 2: I recognized screams. One of the projects that we did
Speaker 2: was to play screams and other kinds of vocalizations, including
Speaker 2: yells and moans and laughter and even sounds like sneezes,
Speaker 2: And it sounds like a simple, silly little project. But
Speaker 2: what we were looking to see is whether participants agree
Speaker 2: as to what constitutes a scream. And with humans, of course,
Speaker 2: we scream in a variety of different contexts. I'm literally
Speaker 2: screaming right now, and that we can come back to later,
Speaker 2: perhaps because that distinguishes us from other species. I know
Speaker 2: that was part of your question what other species scream?
Speaker 2: So we were interested to see whether people agree as
Speaker 2: to what constitutes a scream. So that's independent of formal
Speaker 2: scientific definitions. Do we know a scream when we hear it?
Speaker 2: And the answer is very clearly yes. Species that scream
Speaker 2: very considerably. In some species of frogs scream. You pick
Speaker 2: up the frog and it produces a vocalization that is
Speaker 2: clearly scream like wow. Rabbit scream are very popular and
Speaker 2: you can probably find it. There are videos of rabbits screaming.
Speaker 2: Somebody picks the rabbit out of the hutch, out of
Speaker 2: the cage, and it just belts out a scream that
Speaker 2: is so human like, and I think it gets a
Speaker 2: lot of hits. It gets a lot of clicks because
Speaker 2: people just find it so funny that a rabbit sounds
Speaker 2: so human like, and goats as well.
Speaker 1: Yes, I was gonna say, I've seen videos of goats
Speaker 1: screaming and it seems like someone's dubbing over.
Speaker 2: An I know. Yeah, yes, it is very deep. That's
Speaker 2: the perfect imitation of a goat scream, by the way,
Speaker 2: But yes, indeed that that is. They're all human like
Speaker 2: and sound like. And what that says is that as
Speaker 2: a vocalization type, screams are evolutionarily conserved, so they don't
Speaker 2: vary all that much. But people find it surprising that
Speaker 2: animal screams sound as much like human screams as they do.
Speaker 1: Do they though, Well, yes, according to the Google search
Speaker 1: that I started with what animal sounds like? That then
Speaker 1: auto filled a woman screaming, So apparently a lot of
Speaker 1: people here are red fox and then call the cops.
Speaker 1: Barn owlshh, sound like your ancestor coming back from the
Speaker 1: grave to haunt you for taking such bad care of
Speaker 1: your skin. Even caterpillars apparently will yell their heads off,
Speaker 1: as evidenced in this YouTube clip uploaded by Matt C
Speaker 1: whomse fingers I'm assuming are the ones in frame gently
Speaker 1: squeezing the butt of a neon green moth larvae. But
Speaker 1: that air, I learned is likely coming out of spiracles,
Speaker 1: so scientifically not a scream. A scream itself is when
Speaker 1: air is passed through the vocal cords with greater than
Speaker 1: usual force. My friend Workipedia says this can be performed
Speaker 1: by any creature possessing lungs, including humans, so larva and spiracles.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, you're just doing some kind of respiratory fart
Speaker 1: at anyone who squeezes your butt. I don't blame you,
Speaker 1: but yes, according to doctor harr Casulis, screams require a
Speaker 1: lot of vocal force and cause the vocal folds to
Speaker 1: vibrate in a chaotic, inconsistent way. So that is some
Speaker 1: of the what, But onto the why.
Speaker 2: And of course, if we want to dive into some
Speaker 2: of the sort of evolutionary questions, the original screams and
Speaker 2: species like frogs and rabbits probably served as a way
Speaker 2: to elude capture by a predator. Predator has you in
Speaker 2: its grasp, and it's the last ditch effort in essence
Speaker 2: to escape. A loud sudden vocalization could sometimes at least
Speaker 2: occasionally startle the predator and give the prey, the victim,
Speaker 2: some small chance of escape. And there's also suggestions in
Speaker 2: the literature that screams could attract other predators and thus
Speaker 2: thwart the efforts of the first predator that's got the prey.
Speaker 2: So by screaming, it attracts attention. That's another characteristic of screams.
Speaker 2: They definitely attract attention from by listeners. So that's how
Speaker 2: screams probably started as one way to defend against predators
Speaker 2: and predation.
Speaker 1: Okay, but frogs don't gather at the pond, giggle screeching
Speaker 1: during water fights, or turn trees into money and then
Speaker 1: give that money to other frogs who have created a
Speaker 1: haunted pond for them. So what's happening in primate brain
Speaker 1: like mine?
Speaker 2: But then in the evolution of sociality in species like
Speaker 2: monkeys and apes, where complex social interactions are dictated and
Speaker 2: governed by vocalizations, screams come to serve another purpose, and
Speaker 2: that is to solicit support from your friends, your allies,
Speaker 2: your relatives, and especially in the context of dominance interactions, because,
Speaker 2: as you might know, in monkeys and apes, it's not
Speaker 2: how big, how strong, how tough you are, it's who
Speaker 2: you know, and so you have your allies. And in
Speaker 2: the monkeys that I've studied in the past and continue
Speaker 2: to be interested in, the social relationships are primarily among
Speaker 2: females and female matrilineal groups. They're the lifelong residents of
Speaker 2: the social group. Whereas the males high tail it out
Speaker 2: of the group at sexual maturity and find their way
Speaker 2: into another group for mating and to live the rest
Speaker 2: of their lives. But the females stay together for their
Speaker 2: entire social lives, and they help one another develop and
Speaker 2: maintain their dominance positions in the social group. And of course,
Speaker 2: if you're going to have an ally, you need a
Speaker 2: way to recruit that ally. And so screams again acoustically,
Speaker 2: similar to what you see in frogs and rabbits and goats,
Speaker 2: and so evolved in a more complex way and diversified
Speaker 2: acoustically so that the monkeys can communicate more subtle details
Speaker 2: about the fights that they're in. Is the opponent dominant,
Speaker 2: is the opponent subordinate? Is the aggression intense or is
Speaker 2: it modest and mild? So what we think happened is that,
Speaker 2: at least within the context of fights, and what the
Speaker 2: scientific literature refers to as agonistic interactions. There has been
Speaker 2: diversification to send more subtle and nuanced messages about what
Speaker 2: kind of fight and who the opponent is. And that's
Speaker 2: information that's pertinent to an ally, a relative, for example,
Speaker 2: the mom of the victim or the sister who might
Speaker 2: be out of sight, you know, foraging in dense vegetation
Speaker 2: or something. But adhere's the vocalization, and of course that
Speaker 2: implies that it has to recognize who the screamer is,
Speaker 2: and it's very clear that that's the case. It's my daughter,
Speaker 2: it's my cousin, it's my aunt, and they come to
Speaker 2: the rescue and intervene in a way that is consistent
Speaker 2: and appropriate for the kind of fight that is taking place.
Speaker 2: That's information that they get through the screams.
Speaker 1: I'm learning a lot. And is there something about the
Speaker 1: frequency or the amplitude of the sound that hits our
Speaker 1: brains differently because of instinct and genetics, or is that
Speaker 1: something that really has to be learned by primates from
Speaker 1: a age through social connections and responses.
Speaker 2: They scream naturally, and even human babies in their first
Speaker 2: vocal efforts. Crying is of course distinct and separate from screaming,
Speaker 2: But screams can be part of the vocal output that
Speaker 2: very young babies produce.
Speaker 1: Any new parents out there, maybe you're up nursing at
Speaker 1: four am or whatever, just think of your baby as
Speaker 1: emitting vocal output, not screaming. Maybe that'll help you not
Speaker 1: want to stuff it back into your womb for another year.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I have a very old quiet doc,
Speaker 1: so I'm not sure how it works. But when it's
Speaker 1: a happy child and it's shrieking in delight, just know that,
Speaker 1: in doctor Cazulaz's speculation, it's doing that. So that if
Speaker 1: a large raptor swoops down and tries to pick up
Speaker 1: your small child out of a group of many small children,
Speaker 1: and your back is turned, you think, wait, that sounds
Speaker 1: like the spine tingling yell of my offspring. So thanks evolution. Also,
Speaker 1: do we learn this or is it just hardwired in
Speaker 1: our jiggly goopy complex brains.
Speaker 2: I don't think you have to learn to scream. Yeah,
Speaker 2: The interesting question is whether or not humans have to
Speaker 2: learn to distinguish different kinds of screams that we produce
Speaker 2: in different contexts. Because, of course, unlike other species, we
Speaker 2: as everybody knows, When you point this out, they all
Speaker 2: nod and say, sure, humans will scream in fear, pain, aggression, frustration, excitement,
Speaker 2: particular forms of excitement like sex, I'll have what she's having,
Speaker 2: And in startle situations. Lots of people, including my wife,
Speaker 2: will produce a startle scream when she sees a cockroach
Speaker 2: or some people with a mouse, or you know that
Speaker 2: kind of situation.
Speaker 1: So the core of a screamologists job is to figure
Speaker 1: out if humans can distinguish screams in different contexts and
Speaker 1: to note what the hell is up man. I hope
Speaker 1: they collect some kind of huge catalog of screams. That
Speaker 1: would be amazing.
Speaker 2: And one of the ways that we've done that is
Speaker 2: to collect a huge catalog of screams. So we've got
Speaker 2: literally a scream library, oh my god, that has been
Speaker 2: harvested from the Internet and YouTube, because, of course, as
Speaker 2: we know, everybody posts their entire life history on the
Speaker 2: internet these days, and so you can see there are
Speaker 2: many examples of naturally occurring, real screams that we can
Speaker 2: use in the research. And then of course there's the
Speaker 2: opportunity to take screams from TV shows or movies and
Speaker 2: those acted renditions of screams.
Speaker 1: And how has your research changed over thirty seven years
Speaker 1: as people have more access to recording devices and platforms
Speaker 1: to share them.
Speaker 2: Oh gosh, yes, it makes a huge, huge difference to
Speaker 2: how the research is done and as possible back when
Speaker 2: we started and with my wife and I that began
Speaker 2: studying screams when we were postdocs at the Rockefeller University
Speaker 2: in New York.
Speaker 1: Wait, is this screamologist married to another screamologist? I'm screaming so,
Speaker 1: Doctor Sally Gazulis spent time as a behavioral biologist working
Speaker 1: with non human primates and also worked with some human primates,
Speaker 1: namely Harold.
Speaker 2: And we were working with a very prominent primarily he
Speaker 2: was a bird researcher, Professor Peter Marler was his name,
Speaker 2: very well known animal behaviorist, and he kind of dabbled
Speaker 2: in primate vocalizations as well. Again, his prime research was
Speaker 2: in bird song and bird song acquisition, but he always
Speaker 2: wanted to have some graduate students and postdocs working on
Speaker 2: primate vocalizations, and the pair of researchers who had preceded
Speaker 2: us in his lab had studied alarm calls in a
Speaker 2: species of African monkey called the Vervet monkey. And that
Speaker 2: work revealed that this species of monkey had evolved different
Speaker 2: kinds of alarm calls acoustically, different alarm calls that they
Speaker 2: gave in response to different kinds of predators, and the
Speaker 2: primary predators were leopards, marshall eagles, and pythons. Now, those
Speaker 2: predators hunt and attack in different ways, they have different strategies,
Speaker 2: and thus the response to the presence of one of
Speaker 2: those different kinds of predators will be different. So you
Speaker 2: can't make do if you're a vervet monkey with one
Speaker 2: kind of alarm call. They had to come up with
Speaker 2: a system that had different vocalizations in essence associated with
Speaker 2: those predators.
Speaker 1: So you waltzed into this episode casual, maybe leaned against
Speaker 1: a wall and thought, this is just going to be
Speaker 1: about horror films. But now you know that monkeys can
Speaker 1: straight up talk well if you ask me, But is
Speaker 1: it talking? Is it language? So Harold an Ape uses
Speaker 1: language to make speech about the history of the perception
Speaker 1: of communication.
Speaker 2: Dating back to Darwin. In eighteen seventy two, he published
Speaker 2: Expression of the Emotions in Men and Animals, and expression
Speaker 2: of the Emotions is the key part of that title,
Speaker 2: because that is what everybody believed animals communicate about their emotions,
Speaker 2: and that remained true, and that's what was the conventional
Speaker 2: wisdom about animal communication, that while we humans can with
Speaker 2: language talk about the external world and anything we can imagine,
Speaker 2: animals were restricted to communicating about their emotions aggression, fear, sex.
Speaker 2: But that Vervet monkey work that came out in the
Speaker 2: late nineteen seventies in early nineteen eighties revealed that there
Speaker 2: were some animals that could use vocalizations to index, to
Speaker 2: refer to particular occurrences in the external world, namely the
Speaker 2: presence of different kinds of predators.
Speaker 1: Wait, so what is screaming and what is a warning?
Speaker 1: Is screaming emotional? But alarm calls are informational alarm calls.
Speaker 2: People sometimes confuse alarm calls because screams can be alarming,
Speaker 2: But in the animal behavior literature, when they talk about
Speaker 2: an alarm call, it's a specific kind of vocalization that
Speaker 2: refers to the presence of a predator. Whereas a scream.
Speaker 2: You can scream when a predator has you in its jaws,
Speaker 2: but that's not alerting others about the presence of that predator.
Speaker 2: That's again a different kind of evolutionary adaptation to avoid
Speaker 2: being the dinner or the lunch of that predator.
Speaker 1: So, as a post doc working with monkey screams for science,
Speaker 1: Harold was listening for vocalizations that might convey information about
Speaker 1: external events. So were they screaming for help? And so
Speaker 1: by playing tapes of their alarm calls they can learn
Speaker 1: who showed up for whom And hopefully that did not
Speaker 1: cause a lot of monkey riffs from just sowing distrust
Speaker 1: like a monkey who cried leopard.
Speaker 2: Anyway, we've pursued it in different ways with different species
Speaker 2: of monkeys. Looked at the difference between males and females, because,
Speaker 2: as I mentioned earlier, the males end up leaving the
Speaker 2: group that they're born into and they enter a group
Speaker 2: and they don't have allies. Maybe they might have a
Speaker 2: brother or a cousin who also migrated to that same group,
Speaker 2: But it's the females that have these persistent, long lasting
Speaker 2: social relationships, and they tend to scream, whereas males drop
Speaker 2: screaming from their repertoires as they reach sexual maturity. Really, yes,
Speaker 2: in these monkeys, and is.
Speaker 1: That a learned social behavior? Then do not scream so
Speaker 1: as to differentiate yourself from the females.
Speaker 2: Well, it does, indeed seem to be learned. But it's
Speaker 2: learned because when a male screams, he gets attention, unwanted
Speaker 2: attention from the dominant males you're talking to me, and
Speaker 2: sometimes even high ranking females. And so what we think,
Speaker 2: and what has been suggested in the literature is that
Speaker 2: because they get attacked when they scream, because they draw
Speaker 2: attention when they scream, they just stop screaming.
Speaker 1: So males stifling their emotions.
Speaker 2: I think so.
Speaker 1: In other species as well. Dudes out there, let it
Speaker 1: out you're human, scream it into a jar, release it
Speaker 1: on a mountaintop like Yosemite, Sam, and those people who
Speaker 1: sell their farts on Etsy. What about in humans? Is
Speaker 1: there a biologic sex difference or a learned gender difference
Speaker 1: in terms of who screams when?
Speaker 2: Well, just in terms of your experience, what would you think?
Speaker 2: What would you say?
Speaker 1: I would say, we think people who identify as women
Speaker 1: would scream more than those who do not.
Speaker 2: That's a very well stated hypothesis. Yes, and I agree,
Speaker 2: And I think if you look on YouTube again in
Speaker 2: particular contexts, there's some interesting contexts such as opening a
Speaker 2: present and of course, everybody again records Christmas and birthdays,
Speaker 2: and then it's up on and you can see when
Speaker 2: somebody opens a present and it turns out to be
Speaker 2: unexpected and just terribly exciting. Often there's a lot of screaming.
Speaker 2: But who does that screaming? It's young girls, it's women.
Speaker 2: I've never seen a boy or a male an adult
Speaker 2: males scream in that kind of context. So there are
Speaker 2: at the very least contexts in which there are gender
Speaker 2: differences in terms of the production of screams. Think about
Speaker 2: the movies. I mean, we've been watching James Bond since
Speaker 2: the nineteen sixties, right, and all the different actors. Have
Speaker 2: you ever heard James Bond scream?
Speaker 1: No, of course not, but I don't think so. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't think it's so probably cultural too, and.
Speaker 2: I agree absolutely.
Speaker 1: One notable exception, though, is Daniel Craig and Casino Royale
Speaker 1: being tortured. Okay, so to set this up, he's getting
Speaker 1: whipped in the nards with a ship rope and being
Speaker 1: told that he won't be recognized as a man when
Speaker 1: this guy's done with him. But since emasculation is apparently
Speaker 1: illegal in the Bond universe, his screams turn into kind
Speaker 1: of a sexualized joy. Yes, yes, and then victory. Sorry spoiler.
Speaker 2: No, it's not that men cannot scream. They certainly can.
Speaker 2: And again those aggressive screams. Just to go back to
Speaker 2: the movies. Have you ever seen the movie Braveheart with Melison, Yes,
Speaker 2: of course, yes, yeah. The you know, the fights between
Speaker 2: the Scots and the English, they're prefaced with these loud,
Speaker 2: aggressive screams on the part of the Scots. It screams
Speaker 2: are used as a way to intimidate opponents as well.
Speaker 2: It's not that males don't scream, but they don't scream
Speaker 2: in the kinds of contexts that women tend to scream in.
Speaker 2: And another interesting difference is rock concerts. And I've thought
Speaker 2: about this a lot. It's not anything that could be
Speaker 2: easily tested in a formal scientific way. But again, we've
Speaker 2: all seen footage of the early shows Ed Sullivan and
Speaker 2: and the Beatles, and.
Speaker 4: So for ladies and gentlemen, the Beatles.
Speaker 2: And who is it that's doing the screaming. Well, it's
Speaker 2: the young female fans. And that's true before the Beatles,
Speaker 2: you know, when it was Elvis Presley. It's true when
Speaker 2: it was before Elvis Presley, Frank Sinatra and after the
Speaker 2: Beatles one direction and Justin Bieber, and you know, it
Speaker 2: goes on and on. And even with a concert with
Speaker 2: somebody like Katy Perry. You know, megastar attractive, but you
Speaker 2: don't get that kind of screaming reaction that you do
Speaker 2: with the boy bands. And so it's an interesting question.
Speaker 2: Why is it that there's some tends to be this
Speaker 2: difference in certain kinds of contexts. I've kind of playfully suggested,
Speaker 2: and I hope no one finds it offensive.
Speaker 1: Hey, this dude is a literal screamologist and he's got
Speaker 1: an idea.
Speaker 2: But it seems to me that the screaming and that
Speaker 2: context is almost competitive. It. Again, it's not conscious. I
Speaker 2: don't believe it's conscious, but I think there's emotional contagion
Speaker 2: and the sort of arousal level tends to be expressed
Speaker 2: not yelling, but in screaming. And it might be in
Speaker 2: a sort of evolutionary sense, a way to say, look
Speaker 2: at me again. Screams always attract attention, and by screaming,
Speaker 2: perhaps these megastars are what is prompting the screaming. Just
Speaker 2: a little less fun example of that. There are historical
Speaker 2: descriptions of the Nazi rallies with Hitler in attendance and
Speaker 2: young women screaming, you know. And again, so it's not
Speaker 2: just culture and the presentation of rock stars and so forth.
Speaker 2: In the tradition of screaming. I wonder if when Caesar
Speaker 2: went down the streets of Rome whether there was screaming
Speaker 2: as well. But again it was the women who screamed
Speaker 2: at Hitler for Hitler. I don't you know, it's a
Speaker 2: really interesting phenomenon, something that would be challenging to test
Speaker 2: or to explore in a more formal scientific way, But
Speaker 2: just as an observation, I think it's really quite quite
Speaker 2: strikingly interesting.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, it's funny. My mom and her sister
Speaker 1: saw the Beatles in the sixties and somehow their picture
Speaker 1: got on the front page of the chronicle, just in
Speaker 1: a picture of screaming girls and my mom. My mom
Speaker 1: and her sister still assert that they each made eye
Speaker 1: contact with a different Beatle that night. And I think
Speaker 1: it's interesting the thing, if I scream loud enough, maybe
Speaker 1: they'll look my direction.
Speaker 2: Indeed, well, you know, I think it's an interesting hypothesis.
Speaker 2: There was a student, of course, my student I two
Speaker 2: channel will be here. You're here at Emory, and that
Speaker 2: most of them know that I'm also interested in screams
Speaker 2: and human screams. And one of the students came up
Speaker 2: to me after class one day and said, I've got
Speaker 2: a story for you, doctor Cazula's, and I think you
Speaker 2: might find it interesting, she said. A year or so ago,
Speaker 2: my parents asked me no. They told me that I
Speaker 2: would have to go to a Justin Bieber concert with
Speaker 2: my younger sister, and she said, I hate Justin Bieber.
Speaker 2: I'm not a fan. I did not want to go.
Speaker 2: I knew I would be embarrassed, but as a good
Speaker 2: older sister, she went to the concert. But here's the
Speaker 2: funny part, she said, despite my best efforts, I found
Speaker 2: myself screaming. Oh no, yeah, it was hilarious. But it
Speaker 2: again suggests that there's something infectious, emotional contagion, if you will.
Speaker 2: And so many on a questions, especially in that arena.
Speaker 1: What about the catharsis of a scream? Why does screaming
Speaker 1: sometimes feel so good or relieve pain or feel like
Speaker 1: an outlet?
Speaker 2: It does?
Speaker 4: You know?
Speaker 2: Years ago and I think it was in the sixties
Speaker 2: and it's now discredited and no longer talked about, but
Speaker 2: there was something called the primal scream. I don't know
Speaker 2: if you've heard yeah, yeah, And the idea was you
Speaker 2: could feel better if you just let it all hang
Speaker 2: out through screaming. Now again not just yelling, but screaming
Speaker 2: in particular.
Speaker 1: And so screaming is remember, a nonverbal vocal expression, and
Speaker 1: to shout generally means saying something at the top of
Speaker 1: your volume, and yelling is supposed to mean unarticulated wailing,
Speaker 1: no words, just sound. But I feel like we use
Speaker 1: yelling to mean shouting. Like let's say that you broke
Speaker 1: curfew right and your mom yelled at you, but it
Speaker 1: was actual yelling, just like gibberish shrieking. You would probably
Speaker 1: get home earlier next time. Although Harold makes the point
Speaker 1: that sometimes when we know what we're getting into, the
Speaker 1: spike of an alarm can feel good. So we toss
Speaker 1: money towards roller coaster terror and pay to get chased
Speaker 1: around Knotsberry Farm by actors carrying chain sauce.
Speaker 2: And why is it that we do that? Why do
Speaker 2: we like to be scared? Again? Does we can speculate?
Speaker 2: I think that screaming has been so important in the
Speaker 2: evolutionary past that in essence, practicing is something that is advantageous,
Speaker 2: and our brains treat it as rewarding. So you could
Speaker 2: look on YouTube and search for scream contests.
Speaker 1: They say, everyone's good at something.
Speaker 2: For these people at screaming.
Speaker 1: We like to pit themselves against each other to win.
Speaker 2: A screaming contaste, and they involve people, often a pair
Speaker 2: of people. Young girls tend to do this more often again,
Speaker 2: but they'll scream, and they scream in a competitive way.
Speaker 2: One screams, the other screams, who screams louder, who screams longer.
Speaker 2: Little kids will do that. It's something that is done socially,
Speaker 2: and I think what it does is expose the people
Speaker 2: that you're close to, your friends, your relatives to the
Speaker 2: particular renditions of a scream that an individual produces. In
Speaker 2: terms of a vocalization for permitting individual recognition, screams are
Speaker 2: not ideal, and that's because the air is forcefully projected
Speaker 2: through the larynx and through the vocal folds in a
Speaker 2: way that produces chaotic vibrations. Chaotic in the sense that
Speaker 2: they're not as predictable as normal speeches. So very quickly.
Speaker 2: We can get familiar with someone's voice and recognize it
Speaker 2: when we pick up the phone. But the theoretical literature
Speaker 2: would suggest that for screams that's not the case, because
Speaker 2: there's that lack of predictability quote I like from Jurassic
Speaker 2: part nature finds a way. So from the origin of
Speaker 2: screams again, to deal with the imminent death due to
Speaker 2: a predator, you have to, in essence expose your friends
Speaker 2: and relatives to the kind of scream that you produce.
Speaker 2: That's maybe why kids scream as much as they do,
Speaker 2: you know, in essence they're driving their parents' nuts and
Speaker 2: the neighbor's nuts. But through that effort, again evolutionarily, it's
Speaker 2: nothing conscious needless to say, but that that exposure to
Speaker 2: screams allows for more ready identification. Oh that's my kid,
Speaker 2: you know. And so maybe that's one of the reasons
Speaker 2: that we tend to scream and enjoy screaming and actually
Speaker 2: seek out experiences that prompt us to scream.
Speaker 1: Okay, but what if you're on the other side of
Speaker 1: the chainsaw and you've been paid to scream? Does a
Speaker 1: scream have to be an utterance that is kind of unintentional?
Speaker 1: Like it just has to come out of you or
Speaker 1: does it still count as a scream if you are
Speaker 1: consciously going ah, is that a scream or not?
Speaker 2: Sure? And of course actors, good actors do that all
Speaker 2: the time, and they convey an emotion through a scream
Speaker 2: and presumably and they not experiencing that precise emotion. I'm
Speaker 2: not an expert in acting techniques, but I understand that
Speaker 2: sometimes they will try to generate, you know, or create
Speaker 2: the internal state, the emotional state that would allow for
Speaker 2: the production of a scream or other kinds of emotional expression.
Speaker 2: But some people are really good at producing, let's say,
Speaker 2: convincing screams. And that's one of the studies that we did.
Speaker 2: We presented participants with real screams and active screams and
Speaker 2: asked them to judge which were acted and which were real.
Speaker 2: They were terrible, They couldn't do.
Speaker 1: It, really really, Yeah, where what kind of movies did
Speaker 1: you pull from? Was this Meryl Streep or was this
Speaker 1: horror movie on the homework channel?
Speaker 2: Arrange? Dating all the way back to one of my
Speaker 2: favorites because I'm a primatologist and interested in screams, The
Speaker 2: original King Kong nineteen thirty three with Wow fay Ray
Speaker 2: And as you probably know, they coined the term scream
Speaker 2: queen back then. And so these are people like fay Ray,
Speaker 2: Jamie Lee Curtis, Kate Capshaw, Kim Basinger, Phyllis Coates. Not
Speaker 2: probably not a name that you would recognize or many people,
Speaker 2: but she was the She played Lois Slane in the
Speaker 2: nineteen fifties Superman TV show. Had a very distinctive scream.
Speaker 2: I'd recognize it anywhere. Hello, Hello miss Lane. Of course
Speaker 2: she was always screaming for Superman to come at her.
Speaker 2: I'm so familiar with people who scream and movies, actors
Speaker 2: and actresses and so forth. And I had a subscription
Speaker 2: to Netflix for a while where I was getting DVDs,
Speaker 2: and I'm sure the algorithm pegged me is just the
Speaker 2: biggest horror film fan out there. But actually I was
Speaker 2: again harvesting for screams for the research related that's right.
Speaker 1: Can I ask you questions from patrons listeners?
Speaker 2: Oh of course, okay, good.
Speaker 1: I told them you're coming on. I sent them a
Speaker 1: link to your research gate and they have a bunch
Speaker 1: of questions. So let's just lightning around. Let's see how
Speaker 1: many we can answer.
Speaker 2: Okay, where we dive in.
Speaker 1: Let's take some cash. We're going to toss it at
Speaker 1: a cause, and doctor Gazillis would like to point that
Speaker 1: money toward the American Diabetes Association, which educates the public
Speaker 1: about diabetes and helps those affected by it through funding
Speaker 1: research to manage, cure, and prevent diabetes. So that is
Speaker 1: the American Diabetes Association. So ch ching Team Pancreas. So
Speaker 1: that money toss was made possible by sponsors of the show,
Speaker 1: whom I like.
Speaker 5: Mum, Why did they call it Scottish cheese?
Speaker 1: It's cottage cheese, honey, And I'm not sure.
Speaker 5: Did dogs in other countries speak different languages?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 3: I think so.
Speaker 4: When when we get there, well, we've got to fix
Speaker 4: the car first, but there's someone coming to help us.
Speaker 5: Is it the man from Geneva?
Speaker 1: Not Geneva, he's from Aviva. Oh there's a van now.
Speaker 4: For car insurance with breakdown rescue, it takes a Viva
Speaker 4: visit a Viva dotta eat to say fifteen percent.
Speaker 3: Acceptance criteria terms and conditions apply. Minimum premium of three
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Speaker 3: new policies bott online. See Aviva dot i E for details.
Speaker 3: Car Insurance is underwritten by Aviva Insurance Ireland DAK Aviva
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Speaker 1: Okay, let's get to your blood curdling curiosities. A bunch
Speaker 1: of you, I believe Sanchez, Jodi Pire, Teryld Thompson, Laura Smith,
Speaker 1: Page McLachlin and Alicia ray Bell asked Harold to simply
Speaker 1: play favorites. Nathan Andrew Leeflight, You're gonna like this. I
Speaker 1: read your question. Madison Stewart and a bunch of other
Speaker 1: listeners want to know who has the best movie scream?
Speaker 2: Well, I would just, out of sentimentality go for Fayray, okay,
Speaker 2: And that is because it combines primatology and screaming. So
Speaker 2: I would say Fayray.
Speaker 1: Fayray a classic starlet in an era full of helpless heroines.
Speaker 1: She shrieked her way into forever fame via King Kong.
Speaker 1: And if you're thinking, wow, a classic nineteen thirty three
Speaker 1: Hollywood picture show for me to watch, Well, some undertones
Speaker 1: of the film can be pretty socially jarring nowadays, how so. Well,
Speaker 1: for more on that, you can see the work of
Speaker 1: Argentinian sociologist of culture and the arts, someone named Juan
Speaker 1: Antonio roche Carsel, who wrote whole paper about the intersection
Speaker 1: of the nineteen twenty nine financial collapse and the Great
Speaker 1: Depression and then the subsequent xenophobia that started to appear
Speaker 1: in horror films and essentially the fear of the other.
Speaker 1: We could do a whole side episode just on this side,
Speaker 1: but I'm going to link his work at my website.
Speaker 1: But did the angenou Feyray? Did she gasp and scream
Speaker 1: in her final breaths? Nope? No, lucky lucky for her.
Speaker 1: She lived a long ninety six years and she just
Speaker 1: died peacefully in her sleep. But what scream queens took
Speaker 1: over for her?
Speaker 2: But I'm trying to think which of the Harrison Ford
Speaker 2: movies Kate Capshaw.
Speaker 4: Was in, Oh, Indiana Jones India is one of the
Speaker 4: Indiana Jones and it's the one with Kate Capshaw, and
Speaker 4: she just gives up just a stellar performance.
Speaker 2: In terms of screams in different contexts. It's it's really
Speaker 2: quite amazing. And another example is Kim Basinker in the
Speaker 2: original Batman with Jack Nicholson. She produces screams in a
Speaker 2: wide range of contexts, and she's great too, So I've
Speaker 2: got a number of favorites. There's no such thing as
Speaker 2: a scream king.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was gonna say who screamed? What men scream?
Speaker 1: So yeah, there's gonna be some right.
Speaker 2: Do you know that the TV show New Girl? It
Speaker 2: was on a few yeah, five six years. I'm blanking
Speaker 2: on the Nick who played Nick the.
Speaker 1: Act oh ah, he has it starts with a J.
Speaker 2: But yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm blanking on it. It'll come
Speaker 2: to me in a bit.
Speaker 1: But if you watch New Girl, you've been screaming. Jake Johnson.
Speaker 1: His name is Jake Johnson. He played Nick Miller on
Speaker 1: New Girl. And my ex boyfriend Michael used to wait
Speaker 1: tables at a vietname he's placed in La and said
Speaker 1: when Jake came in, he was really nice. So I
Speaker 1: just wanted to tell people that a few other scream kings,
Speaker 1: just to name check them. They deserve it. The film
Speaker 1: critic Rachel Roth says that their rise is really the
Speaker 1: result of female characters being more than just monster bait,
Speaker 1: so that people who identify as males could start to
Speaker 1: be the screamers. And Roth says that Bruce Campbell of
Speaker 1: the Evil Dead Movies is a total scream king, so
Speaker 1: is Evan Peters an American horror story and Daniel Kluja
Speaker 1: of Get Out is also worthy of this scream king scepter.
Speaker 1: But yes, Jake Johnson a certified top notch man of Hollers,
Speaker 1: as deemed by this professional screamologist.
Speaker 2: He's got an interesting scream and he uses it to
Speaker 2: great effect in that show on multiple occasions. Startle screams,
Speaker 2: I mean, he gets startled.
Speaker 1: I think what about Homer Simpson. I think he's a
Speaker 1: scream king, thank you.
Speaker 2: You know, I'm not a huge fan of the Simpsons.
Speaker 2: Have to admit something, and I don't think I've ever
Speaker 2: watched an entire episode of The Simpsons.
Speaker 1: If you just look up Homer screams as a very
Speaker 1: iconic a little bit like this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, oh no, I've heard that. I've heard that,
Speaker 2: And of course there's the classic Willhelm scream.
Speaker 1: Yes, how do you feel about that?
Speaker 2: Well, it is something that obviously we've been aware of.
Speaker 2: I've been aware of from the start of our human
Speaker 2: scream research, and it's something that you have to take
Speaker 2: in consideration when you use screams from movies and TV.
Speaker 2: You know, I recognize it all the time.
Speaker 1: So the Willhelm scream just a little background. It's a
Speaker 1: stock sound effect that was originally recorded in the nineteen
Speaker 1: fifties for a swamp scene and it was labeled on
Speaker 1: an old real man being eaten by alligator and the
Speaker 1: man being actor SHEB Woolley. And decades later, the sound
Speaker 1: designer for Star Wars tucked this scream into a scene
Speaker 1: of Luke Skywalker shooting a stormtrooper off a ledge, and
Speaker 1: folks are like nice, So then they kept using it.
Speaker 1: And once you know the scream, you'll hear it over
Speaker 1: and over again in movies. It's kind of like a
Speaker 1: little sonic treasure embedded just for you. It's been in
Speaker 1: Transformers and Lord of the Rings and Toy Story. Wonder
Speaker 1: Woman nineteen eighty four also used it, so did Tron.
Speaker 1: Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs popped it in there
Speaker 1: and it sounds like this.
Speaker 2: Of course, there's super imposition of a scream for some individuals,
Speaker 2: but they tend to be not the main stars. So
Speaker 2: the way I describe it, remember the original Star Trek
Speaker 2: and the people that always got bumped off in the
Speaker 2: first few minutes where what I referred to as the
Speaker 2: red and I think that that that's actually a term
Speaker 2: that is used by the fans of the show, that
Speaker 2: they're just the crew members that get pumped off by
Speaker 2: the alien or the you know, whatever evil is out there,
Speaker 2: and you know they're not going to be producing screams.
Speaker 2: If they scream, it's going to be a Wilhelm scream.
Speaker 2: Like but you look at somebody like Kim Basenker over
Speaker 2: her career in the different movies, and you get screams
Speaker 2: from different movies, you know, is she who's screaming? There's
Speaker 2: just no doubt about that. So again, it is something.
Speaker 2: It's a fascinating question. And the classic Wilhelm scream is
Speaker 2: so recognizable and inserted by Spielberg and George Lucas and
Speaker 2: other you know, it's just an in joke for them
Speaker 2: to sneak it in again in the a lot of
Speaker 2: the Harrison Ford movies, and.
Speaker 1: It's become a meme almost.
Speaker 2: It is.
Speaker 1: It is absolutely and correct me. But did your research
Speaker 1: find that actors tended to scream longer or the less
Speaker 1: believables were the ones that were longer.
Speaker 2: If they extend again in that domain close approximating three seconds,
Speaker 2: Then that tends to be deemed less believable.
Speaker 1: Yes, that makes sense. For more on this, you can
Speaker 1: feel free to cozy up in your little reading book
Speaker 1: with Harold's twenty twenty one paper The Emotional Canvas of
Speaker 1: Human Screams, Patterns and Acoustic cues and the Perceptual Categorization
Speaker 1: of a basic call type. And that research was conducted
Speaker 1: at Emory's Bioacoustics Lab, and they used screams collected for
Speaker 1: movies and TV and ads and YouTube videos and some
Speaker 1: commercial sound banks. And I read the details of the
Speaker 1: study and it said that, you know, for experiments like
Speaker 1: this where they're hooking volunteers up to what sounds like
Speaker 1: people dying, there is an institutional review board that has
Speaker 1: to sign off on it. But the volunteers gave informed
Speaker 1: written consent. They got class credit for completing the study.
Speaker 1: No word on what happens if they bounced after two
Speaker 1: point one two seconds, which is the average duration of
Speaker 1: an angry scream. Those are the longest. The study also
Speaker 1: showed that happy screams clock in around one and a
Speaker 1: half seconds, fear and pain screams both about one point
Speaker 1: three seconds. In length, and the shortest type of scream
Speaker 1: quick and easy ones frustration and surprise, So gasps and
Speaker 1: grunts each at about a third of a second, just
Speaker 1: in case you have to fake it for anything. Now
Speaker 1: you know. Now the loudest of all of those also anger,
Speaker 1: which was the longest. So take some deep breaths, maybe
Speaker 1: go lock yourself in your car, go rip out. A
Speaker 1: few more on that in a minute. But while we're here,
Speaker 1: some patrons, including very quiet first time question asker Brixton Moss,
Speaker 1: as well as Breckenheart and Boreal Becca had volume inquiries.
Speaker 1: First time question asker Tony Vessels and a ton of
Speaker 1: other listeners want to know how far can a scream
Speaker 1: travel and still be heard and essentially how loud can
Speaker 1: a human scream?
Speaker 2: Right, that's a great question. We first noticed in studying
Speaker 2: monkeys that you could be hundreds of yards away and
Speaker 2: hear screams, and that's certainly true with the screams from
Speaker 2: children at the swimming pool next near our house. I'm
Speaker 2: just amazed. Always you can't hear the conversations, you can't,
Speaker 2: but you can hear the screams, So I would say,
Speaker 2: and of course it would depend upon the acoustic features
Speaker 2: of the particular environment. If you're in a concrete canyon,
Speaker 2: the sound will be transmitted further than in a forest,
Speaker 2: for example, but hundreds of yards at the very least.
Speaker 1: I would say so, given that screams are defense against predation,
Speaker 1: this brings to mind one of the most chilling opens
Speaker 1: to a book I've ever read, the book Helter Skelter,
Speaker 1: and I think it may have been the only page
Speaker 1: of the book I read, having picked it up in
Speaker 1: middle school because my future crime reporter sister, Celeste, was
Speaker 1: reading it. But it starts it was so quiet, one
Speaker 1: of the killers would later say, you could almost hear
Speaker 1: the sound of ice rattling in cocktail shakers in the
Speaker 1: homes way down the canyon. The canyons above Hollywood and
Speaker 1: Beverly Hills play tricks with sounds, a noise clearly audible
Speaker 1: a mile away, maybe indistinguishable at a few hundred feet,
Speaker 1: And that imagery always stuck with me. And as an Angelino,
Speaker 1: I could say, it is not comforting. But let's say
Speaker 1: that your life isn't in peril, and maybe you're just
Speaker 1: screaming for clout. If you're a middle aged blonde woman
Speaker 1: named Jill Drake, you could set the world record for
Speaker 1: the loudness of a human scream. She practically blisters paint
Speaker 1: at one hundred and twenty nine decibels, somewhere between a
Speaker 1: chainsaw and a nearby gunshot. But what if you can't
Speaker 1: do it? Asked patrons Rhala, Daniel Burr's, Rachel Kendrick, Nina
Speaker 1: eves Z, Jessica Kleist, Leah Alliam Myers, m B Felix Wolf,
Speaker 1: Robin Coohan, Janelle McIntyre, and first time Questions subminners August Seafrit,
Speaker 1: Lissa Mercier, Frank Kendricks, and Kim Hamlin. And as someone
Speaker 1: who has had strangers point kitchen knives toward her throat,
Speaker 1: not on a movie set, but just on Beverly Boulevard
Speaker 1: in LA, I can tell you that screaming loud is
Speaker 1: harder than it looks or sounds. Okay, I am a
Speaker 1: person who has been mugged. I survived, But for myself
Speaker 1: and for a lot of other listeners, including Sunny Brisbee,
Speaker 1: Maren Ellis and Bridget Lawrence, Francesca Huggins, a lot of
Speaker 1: people wanted to know. In maren Ellis's words, why can't
Speaker 1: my screams come out loud. When I'm distressed yelling for
Speaker 1: one of my munchkins who's in danger. My scream comes
Speaker 1: out hoarse and almost muffled when I need it to
Speaker 1: be loud and alarming. And Sonny wants to know why
Speaker 1: is it sometimes when someone goes to scream, nothing comes out.
Speaker 2: I had somebody contact me and was a a young
Speaker 2: woman in Australia, and she emailed me and said, you know,
Speaker 2: have you ever heard of this situation? I cannot scream?
Speaker 2: She said, I've never screamed in my life, and so
Speaker 2: it wasn't restricted to, you know, a particular dangerous situation
Speaker 2: or an attack or anything. She said, she was incapable
Speaker 2: of screaming. And I had never heard of this, and
Speaker 2: I don't know that it has been defined or characterized
Speaker 2: in the psychological literature. And again she said, it's not
Speaker 2: that I don't feel emotions, and it's not that I
Speaker 2: can't express emotions in other contexts, but I can't scream.
Speaker 2: So people vary just a lot. Some people are more
Speaker 2: expressive and have more control over the vocalizations and so
Speaker 2: can consciously produce a scream, whereas other people can't. I
Speaker 2: don't think I could scream. I think some people's thought process,
Speaker 2: especially in the context of imminent danger, might proceed rapidly
Speaker 2: enough that they assess whether or not the screaming will
Speaker 2: make the situation worse. But you know, I don't know.
Speaker 2: I'll be thinking about that some more.
Speaker 1: Yeah, good good. Let me know if you ever need
Speaker 1: to do some research on someone who couldn't scream when
Speaker 1: she was in grave danger, because I'm one of those people.
Speaker 1: If you're like, what if a demon tries to kill
Speaker 1: me in my sleep and I can't scream, it seems
Speaker 1: like the perfect time for a demon to kill you.
Speaker 1: But I looked into it, and the reason you can't
Speaker 1: scream in a dream is because of a fancy little
Speaker 1: feature you have called rem sleep muscle paralysis or muscle antonia,
Speaker 1: which is your brain's way of keeping you in bed
Speaker 1: and not really swinging at a T ball with the
Speaker 1: guy from Maroon five or whatever you're dreaming about. So
Speaker 1: your motor neurons are like gone fish and bitch, and
Speaker 1: they are not going to do your bidding or your
Speaker 1: pharynx screaming, even if you're doing it in a dream.
Speaker 1: So that one's for you. Patrons Taylor, Hanavon, Alisiha, Penny,
Speaker 1: Lily Honey, Kelly Shaver, Catherine pg, Ariana Mass and Jade Pollard. However,
Speaker 1: bonus round in my I drank coffee too late, problems
Speaker 1: I had this week. I did find myself pouring through
Speaker 1: a vintage nineteen ninety eight study out of Japan, and
Speaker 1: it was translated to screaming during sleep in patients with
Speaker 1: Parkinson's disease, and it analyzed the really high rates of
Speaker 1: sleep shouting and screaming in Parkinson's patients who, because of
Speaker 1: lesions in the mid and lower brainstem, don't have that
Speaker 1: muscle suppression during rem sleep, so they do scream in
Speaker 1: their sleep, but in the hardest part of the day,
Speaker 1: the waking hours. Jacky, I'm fine. Why does screaming seem
Speaker 1: to be the BFF of anger and stress? Asked vulnerable
Speaker 1: but relatable patrons Sophie Trenacti, b Stephanie, and Kay who
Speaker 1: drives around alone shrieking to blow off steam and is
Speaker 1: one of us, all of us? Is there something cathartic
Speaker 1: about raising your voice in a situation where you're angry
Speaker 1: or you feel like you need to be aggressive to
Speaker 1: be listened to.
Speaker 2: Uh, yeah, there's I don't know how cathartic it is,
Speaker 2: but it certainly is more effective. I don't think parents
Speaker 2: want to scream or should scream in front of their kids,
Speaker 2: And I don't mean just raise your voice. That's that's
Speaker 2: again there's a distinction. When we say I scream to him,
Speaker 2: stop it. You know, Well, that's language. And we can
Speaker 2: talk about screaming meaning raising the voice loud, maybe harsh sounding,
Speaker 2: but that's still language. When we talk about screams, we're
Speaker 2: talking about that non vocal utterances that rabbits and goats
Speaker 2: and monkeys and apes and we are capable of producing.
Speaker 1: Oh that's a good distinction to make. And just a
Speaker 1: backtrack to the catharsis of it. Scream So many of you, honestly,
Speaker 1: like fifty of you, you know who you are, I
Speaker 1: love you, wanted to know why screaming feels good. And
Speaker 1: the short answer may lie in the long answer beta
Speaker 1: endorphined neuropeptides. There you go. So that's some wonderful juice
Speaker 1: that your hypothelmis and pituitary glands squirt out in response
Speaker 1: to food and sex and apparently screaming. But let's say
Speaker 1: that the gelato's gone. No one will become naked with
Speaker 1: you anytime soon. And your walls are very thin, so
Speaker 1: you can't scream. You can milk those endorphins by exercising
Speaker 1: for thirty minutes. So do you want to do that
Speaker 1: when you're stressed or angry? Of course not. But your
Speaker 1: brain's like, please make me so happy, though, and you're like,
Speaker 1: oh no, Screaming can be cathartic. That is what one
Speaker 1: headline said about David Arquette, who said filming Screen five
Speaker 1: with Courtney Cox, his ex wife, was cathartic. I guess
Speaker 1: they met during Scream one. And yesterday I emailed Harold
Speaker 1: to see if he's seen Scream five yet, and he said,
Speaker 1: I have not seen Screen five. I have not been
Speaker 1: to a movie or a sit down restaurant for that matter,
Speaker 1: since the pandemic hit dreadful, he wrote. But despite the
Speaker 1: last few years being its own kind of horror show,
Speaker 1: doctor Gazulas is still doing his amazing work as an
Speaker 1: Emory professor. And someone a listener wrote and said about you,
Speaker 1: no way. I took an animal behavior class with him
Speaker 1: and it changed my life all caps. Olivia Milloway, Oh,
Speaker 1: I know that name, Yes, thank you well, Olivia.
Speaker 2: That's that's such a sweet and kind thing to say.
Speaker 1: Really enjoyed your class and had a question, how can
Speaker 1: babies tell the difference between happy and angry screams or
Speaker 1: can they? Like when? Is this something that we do
Speaker 1: figure out?
Speaker 2: I don't think babies could, I think now, And this
Speaker 2: is an interesting question. We haven't talked about this much,
Speaker 2: but why is it that humans have screams in these
Speaker 2: different contexts pain, fear, aggression, frustration, and excitement startle when
Speaker 2: other species don't. Yeah, and I think, and again, this
Speaker 2: is speculation, but I think it's fun speculation that and
Speaker 2: it's kind of ironic that language gives us the capacity
Speaker 2: to use nonverbal communication in more elaborate ways than animals can. Cognitively,
Speaker 2: the brain and cognitive underpinnings for language, I suspect give
Speaker 2: us greater capacity to use nonverbal communication in more elaborate
Speaker 2: ways than other species. And I think supporting that contention
Speaker 2: is laughter, an entirely different category of vocalization. So you
Speaker 2: can tick a the chimpanzee, which is a fun thing
Speaker 2: to do, by the way, or an orang and when
Speaker 2: they're young, and they will produce a laugh and It's
Speaker 2: a not a very sophisticated laugh, it's kind of and
Speaker 2: there's a playface associated with it, and the production of
Speaker 2: that vocalization is limited to that tickle and play context,
Speaker 2: whereas humans, again, we use laughter in a variety of
Speaker 2: sometimes pretty nuanced situations. We've got genuine laughter, we've got
Speaker 2: fake laughter, we've got derisive laughter. And I think that too,
Speaker 2: is probably a reflection of our capacity for language and
Speaker 2: how our brains work to draw inferences.
Speaker 1: That's so interesting to think that we are doing that
Speaker 1: subconsciously without even recognizing it. So is laughter the best medicine?
Speaker 1: I want to know if a screamologist can take a
Speaker 1: prescription pad and write down go yell your fucking guts out.
Speaker 1: Yuka Ioa wants to know what's up with colleges having
Speaker 1: primal scream sessions before finals. I'm wondering if emery does that.
Speaker 1: And Justin So wants to know just screaming into a
Speaker 1: pillow have the same effect? Is screaming?
Speaker 2: Those are great questions. As I mentioned earlier, the primal
Speaker 2: scream phenomenon in psychology as something that would be recommended
Speaker 2: and prescribed fell out of favor in the nineteen sixties
Speaker 2: or early nineteen seventies, so I don't think there's been
Speaker 2: much empirical support for that contention now that despite the
Speaker 2: fact that we sometimes feel good after screaming, there is
Speaker 2: something pleasurable about screaming in particular contexts like roller coasters
Speaker 2: and haunted houses. So to my knowledge, there is no
Speaker 2: strong scientific support for this primal scream therapy approach to
Speaker 2: mental health.
Speaker 1: And screaming can release some endorphins, but most psychologists say
Speaker 1: it's as good a release as exercise or just laughing,
Speaker 1: the latter of which is probably the most convenient of
Speaker 1: the three. But the real work is actually just untangling
Speaker 1: what clot of trauma you have that's bottling up all
Speaker 1: of your feelings in the first place. And Harold says
Speaker 1: that no, they don't gather on the Emery quad for
Speaker 1: any scream days, but during finals they do have therapy
Speaker 1: dogs on campus, and hearing that was the most comfort
Speaker 1: I have felt for the youth in quite some time.
Speaker 2: The social context is something that's really important in all
Speaker 2: of this. Really, again, it wouldn't be fun to be
Speaker 2: on a roller coaster by yourself. Would you even scream?
Speaker 1: Probably not. I probably wouldn't I would probably just experience it.
Speaker 1: But it does feel like I am definitely allowed to
Speaker 1: make very loud vocalizations on this roller coaster and no
Speaker 1: one will accuse me of crying wolf or trying to attention.
Speaker 1: Does feel like very cathartic.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and who would go to a haunted house by themselves? Yeah?
Speaker 2: You always would go with somebody and experience the fear
Speaker 2: and the startle experiences and the screaming. Again, is a
Speaker 2: social interactive phenomenon.
Speaker 1: You know. By the Bye is a listener who wrote
Speaker 1: in and asked, am I stronger when I scream? I
Speaker 1: also want you to know that I told people that
Speaker 1: when they submitted questions they could do so in all caps,
Speaker 1: just because it's a screaming episode. So by the Bye asked,
Speaker 1: am I stronger? Would I scream?
Speaker 2: There are weightlifters who scream when they are making the
Speaker 2: effort to lift their weights, and competitive weight lifters, So
Speaker 2: maybe for some people. I don't know that it would
Speaker 2: be universally true, but I suspect some people do get
Speaker 2: some strength out of vocal production like that, right.
Speaker 1: You know a lot of people wanted to know, in
Speaker 1: Kelsey Story's words, is it possible for metal vocalists to
Speaker 1: damage their anatomy by screaming improperly or is that a MYS.
Speaker 2: No, it definitely you can damage your vocal cords. And
Speaker 2: we haven't talked about screaming and rock and roll. I mean, yes,
Speaker 2: I'm sure some of your listeners at least know the
Speaker 2: who's won't get fooled again. What would the end of
Speaker 2: that song be without Drew Daltrey's in a classic scream?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah, So many people asked about that. Looking at You Patrons,
Speaker 1: Kelsey Story, Spencer Parks, Chelsea Rabble, Jeffrey Bradshaw, Dane Schuckman,
Speaker 1: Rachel that, Ryland, Guy, Nixia Vail, Ashley, Sarah de Rivas,
Speaker 1: Samantha Barnes, Mary Leeby, Eric Pahanka, Bruce Wayne, Jordan, Waynwright,
Speaker 1: Evan Davis, Carol Wolf From, Maria, Jurel Weva, and first
Speaker 1: time askers Heaven Klinger, Thomas Wallace, Zoe, deathcore music fan
Speaker 1: Elena and Catherine Peg, who wrote in is there a
Speaker 1: safe way to scream for music? Looking at You black metal?
Speaker 1: They say, so, I'm so glad you're mentioning this. And
Speaker 1: my brother in law is in a death metal band
Speaker 1: and seeing them live it is really I'm like, so
Speaker 1: worried about the vocalist.
Speaker 2: Well, there are less you can search on YouTube, and
Speaker 2: there are lessons for vocalists in these kinds of bands.
Speaker 2: How to scream without damaging your vocal chords?
Speaker 1: Wow, how are what do you find when you listen
Speaker 1: to that kind of screaming? Like Alna? First time question
Speaker 1: asker says, deathcore music fan here, how do the vocalists
Speaker 1: do it? They go to one concert and sing my
Speaker 1: heart out, but they'll lose their voice the next two days,
Speaker 1: So explain this sorcery. But are they doing a completely
Speaker 1: performative type of vocalization or do you think that they also,
Speaker 1: like an actor, have to get into the emotion for
Speaker 1: it to have an effect on the audience.
Speaker 2: I think they have to acquire that ability and scream
Speaker 2: in a particular way that doesn't damage their vocal cords.
Speaker 2: But again, if you go to some of those YouTube videos,
Speaker 2: they're clearly techniques that are advocated to minimize and reduce
Speaker 2: the possibility the likelihood of damage.
Speaker 1: Of course, I researched this for too long with absolutely
Speaker 1: no intention of joining my brother in law's thrash metal band, which,
Speaker 1: by the way, Exodus, Heathen, shout out, scream out. But
Speaker 1: some guy named David on YouTube uploads via a channel
Speaker 1: called rift shop, and he seems to have you covered
Speaker 1: for your death metal brutal guttural vocals. Or you can
Speaker 1: also just search about false chord screaming, which is where
Speaker 1: you keep your vocal cords open, but you learn to
Speaker 1: flap the skin above them to spare the wear and
Speaker 1: tear on the actual chords. False chord screams. Just don't
Speaker 1: call it cookie monster screaming. Import the death ground community
Speaker 1: not into that. Speaking of death, Lisa Muschinsky wants to know,
Speaker 1: can you die from screaming?
Speaker 2: Can kill you? Well? I don't think so. Okay, I'm
Speaker 2: sure some people have died screaming. Lots of people have
Speaker 2: died screaming, right, but I don't think screaming would be
Speaker 2: the cause of death.
Speaker 1: You literally scream from the cradle to the grave, perhaps
Speaker 1: depending on the way that you go out, you.
Speaker 2: Know, I think, I think well again again, it's it's
Speaker 2: just one of these extremely important and interesting vocalizations so
Speaker 2: prominent in popular culture, you know again, the horror movies,
Speaker 2: the rock and roll and even art.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: Munk's famous painting. It's just iconic, and you know it's
Speaker 2: as I understand it, it's the second most readily recognized
Speaker 2: paintings in the world, second only to the Mona Lisa.
Speaker 2: And why is that? You know, I have thought about this.
Speaker 2: If we could hear that scream, if we could hear
Speaker 2: the scream of that, it probably wouldn't be as interesting.
Speaker 1: Oh but such a good point.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but we but instead were left to come to
Speaker 2: our own conclusions. And that's that's the essence of good art,
Speaker 2: isn't it. I mean, does it portray internal psychological disarray, fear, angst, alienation,
Speaker 2: personal dread or is it more a general common about
Speaker 2: the state of the world. You know, who knows. But
Speaker 2: that's what makes it really interesting.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I guess I always ask two questions at
Speaker 1: the end. But really quick, before that, you mentioned that
Speaker 1: there were so many questions still unanswered. And I saw
Speaker 1: on your website that you might be looking for a
Speaker 1: graduate student. Are you still I am people apply.
Speaker 2: Sure, that'd be great, absolutely, And you know, I never
Speaker 2: have trouble recruiting participants for the research. They always have
Speaker 2: to provide a description of course of the study, and
Speaker 2: people are interested that they just they're curious, you know,
Speaker 2: they want to be able to be challenged. Can they
Speaker 2: tell one scream from another? And there's so many unanswered questions.
Speaker 2: And eventually we'd like to do some brain imaging studies,
Speaker 2: you know, exactly how does this does the brain process
Speaker 2: these different kinds of screams. There's been some preliminary exploration
Speaker 2: in a lab in Europe, research by the name of Fruhols,
Speaker 2: who has begun to explore that set of questions. But
Speaker 2: we'd like to jump in with that as well.
Speaker 1: So there might be some future screamologists out there. They
Speaker 1: should reach out.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so, that's great, It'll be great.
Speaker 1: And in all of this last questions, I always ask
Speaker 1: there must be something difficult about being a screamologist. Is
Speaker 1: it listening to screams all day? Or is it paperwork?
Speaker 1: Or is it recruiting people for studies?
Speaker 2: I think it's the It just translates to being a
Speaker 2: faculty member doing research. You're faced with the kinds of challenges.
Speaker 2: There are so many interesting questions that in a different
Speaker 2: world or in a different era you might be able
Speaker 2: to pursue. But there are constraints. They're financial constraints. There
Speaker 2: are ethical constraints as to what one can do, and
Speaker 2: so again it's not unique to this kind of research,
Speaker 2: but there are always limitations to the scientific method and
Speaker 2: how we can apply it to understand questions. So to
Speaker 2: have the curiosity and to wonder about the answers to
Speaker 2: these questions is what is rewarding and reinforcing about doing
Speaker 2: the research. But they're always the frustrations, you know. I'd
Speaker 2: like to answer this particular question, I just can't get
Speaker 2: there at this point.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm. Yeah, So I can imagine how frustrated that
Speaker 1: must be, because there's so much exciting research to do. But
Speaker 1: what is your favorite part about being the world's most
Speaker 1: recognized screamologist.
Speaker 2: Having to accept the term schreamology? I suppose.
Speaker 1: I'm so glad someone someone coined you that, But yeah,
Speaker 1: is there a part of your work that just really
Speaker 1: gets you out of bed in the morning.
Speaker 2: I love to teach students about animal behavior, and I
Speaker 2: also teach a seminar on animal communication, and I take
Speaker 2: great pleasure in that as well, revealing and discussing the
Speaker 2: literature with them and having them explore new ideas, and
Speaker 2: like Olivia, some of them just say, wow, you know,
Speaker 2: I look at the world differently as a result of
Speaker 2: understanding animal behavior and evolutionary principles and how they might
Speaker 2: apply to us and other living creatures. And that's just
Speaker 2: enormously rewarding to invite people to think about things in
Speaker 2: ways that they perhaps haven't done so before.
Speaker 1: I love how you are changing what we know about ourselves,
Speaker 1: things that we don't even think we can study. It's
Speaker 1: great to know that there's someone out there when it
Speaker 1: comes to human communication and screams and vocalizations, there's someone
Speaker 1: out there who was on it, and that's amazing.
Speaker 2: I'm on the job.
Speaker 1: You're on the job. Oh my god, thank you so
Speaker 1: so much for being on this.
Speaker 2: It was my great pleasure, my great pleasure.
Speaker 1: So ask smart people loud questions if you want, because
Speaker 1: it'll help you understand yourself and the world a lot better.
Speaker 1: Doctor Harold Gazoulis is out there and looking for researchers,
Speaker 1: so hit him up. Future screamologists, here's the world's just
Speaker 1: screaming opportunities are you. You can find more links to
Speaker 1: everything we talked about at Aliward dot com slash ologies
Speaker 1: slash Screamology. We are on Twitter and Instagram at ologies.
Speaker 1: I'm at ali Ward with one l on both smologies
Speaker 1: are the shorter, condensed and kid friendly episodes that come
Speaker 1: out about every two weeks. You can find more of
Speaker 1: those to download for your children or just yourselves at
Speaker 1: aliward dot com slash smologies. Thank you Ze Rodriguez Thomas
Speaker 1: of mind jam Media for editing those and Stephen Ray
Speaker 1: Morris for the assist on that. Thank you Aaron Talbert
Speaker 1: for admitting the Facebook group and Shannon and Bonnie for
Speaker 1: helping with that. Thank you to Noel Dilworth for all
Speaker 1: the scheduling, Susan Hale for so much behind the scenes stuff.
Speaker 1: Emily White of the Wordery makes the professional transcripts. Caleb
Speaker 1: Patten bleeps them and those are available for free at
Speaker 1: aliwar dot com slash ologies extras. And Nick Thorburn made
Speaker 1: the theme song He's in a very good band called Islands.
Speaker 1: The lead editor is Mindjem media stared Sleeper, who, as
Speaker 1: part of his job, is forced to sleep into bed
Speaker 1: with me and tell me that I'm pretty from time
Speaker 1: to time, and when I'm tired and crying and worried,
Speaker 1: everyone is going to be mad at me if this
Speaker 1: is up on a Wednesday, because I couldn't stop researching.
Speaker 1: He reminds me, it's not the end of the world.
Speaker 1: So thank you, sleeper, And if you listen to the
Speaker 1: end of the podcast, I do tell you a secret,
Speaker 1: so you know, here's another one. The last few weeks
Speaker 1: they've been really bad with anxiety around work, and maybe
Speaker 1: that's just my bruised brain's way of trying to incapacitate me.
Speaker 1: But I don't like it. Zero stars on that. But
Speaker 1: I'm going to end us on an up note, and
Speaker 1: that is this really wonderful review of someone Left this week.
Speaker 1: I'm going to read it to you because it deserves it.
Speaker 1: They wrote. When I discovered this podcast, I was working
Speaker 1: a dead end job that I hated. I imagined what
Speaker 1: life might one day be like if I was half
Speaker 1: as interested in my work as I was in Ali
Speaker 1: Word's take on the Natural History Museum and that particular
Speaker 1: episode where she mentions volunteering to scoot closer to meaningful work.
Speaker 1: And it squarely in my lap when I needed it
Speaker 1: and inspired me to imagine in a new future for myself.
Speaker 1: I began to volunteer for a youth empowerment organization and
Speaker 1: finally acknowledge how much I loved working with students. Three
Speaker 1: years later, after a few new roles and lots of luck,
Speaker 1: I landed my dream job, directing a college STEM scholarship
Speaker 1: program funded by the National Science Foundation. Yes, I help
Speaker 1: baby scientists hatch, they say, and it is indeed as
Speaker 1: incredible as it sounds. I've been waiting all these years,
Speaker 1: oh Man, to post this review in hopes that this
Speaker 1: one may be read aloud so that other listeners can
Speaker 1: hear the change is possible. Thank you for reminding us
Speaker 1: all how important it is to celebrate buffoonery, to spend
Speaker 1: each day learning, and to ask smart people not always
Speaker 1: smart questions. Signed your sc advisor, So thanks for that review.
Speaker 1: I'm glad I left it at the end. That would
Speaker 1: have been weird to start the episode crying and then
Speaker 1: go into screaming. But so everyone who leaves reviews it
Speaker 1: helps the show stay up in the charts. But it
Speaker 1: really it always helps me on the days that are
Speaker 1: more tough. So thank you for letting you know that
Speaker 1: it's always worth it to keep going. Also, one more secret.
Speaker 1: That review actually said to ask smart people stupid questions,
Speaker 1: but I always get a tweet or two whenever I
Speaker 1: say stupid questions, even if it's an ironic reclaiming of
Speaker 1: the term, but just covering bases there. Okay, next week,
Speaker 1: plant stuff. Plants are very quiet last I checked, so
Speaker 1: that one should be more mellow. So everyone go get
Speaker 1: some rest. And thank you for all the PEP talks
Speaker 1: and the reviews and for listening. It really matters to
Speaker 1: me a lot. All Right, we got this far. Bye,
Speaker 1: ice s creamer, you screamer, your screamer for ice cream.