Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, welcome to Pink Shade.
Speaker 2: It's Thursday. That means it's Pop and Bravo Thursday. I've
Speaker 2: got my friend here. It's the beautiful Kate Casey Hillory. Hey,
Speaker 2: we're doing this episode a day before, but it's going
Speaker 2: to come out on September eleventh. And yeah, September eleventh.
Speaker 2: I lived in DC at the time. Yeah, i'd been
Speaker 2: married less than a year. No, I lived I lived
Speaker 2: in Virginia Beach, but I just moved from there. But
Speaker 2: I had several friends that were there. One that was
Speaker 2: a first responder at the Pentagon, and then my sister
Speaker 2: was in World Trade Center seven, which is the Umbrella building,
Speaker 2: so that one was partly destroyed. So and then I
Speaker 2: was married at the time to somebody in the military
Speaker 2: who was on deployment in a military town.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I have many connections to nine to eleven. It's
Speaker 3: a subject i'm deeply still fascinated by.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, me too, just because you know my story is
Speaker 2: I was maybe if you've been listening for a long time,
Speaker 2: you've heard it. I just was driving to work and
Speaker 2: went right by the Pentagon, maybe less than twenty minutes,
Speaker 2: right where it got hit. So when I to the
Speaker 2: city or I was going, well, I was going from
Speaker 2: Alexandria to Arlington. So I was still just like on
Speaker 2: the roundabouts of Virginia there and like heading towards the
Speaker 2: fourteenth Street bridge right got it, yea by the Pentagon
Speaker 2: that you have to veer off, and then you go
Speaker 2: into Arlington that way. The office was right there on
Speaker 2: the water right by the Key Bridge going over into Georgetown,
Speaker 2: That's where the office was. And so I'm just driving.
Speaker 2: And then I was listening to Elliott in the morning.
Speaker 2: It was just still a show on DC whe I won,
Speaker 2: and he had been.
Speaker 1: Folds ben Folds five.
Speaker 3: Oh I love that band.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love ben Folds, And so he was on
Speaker 2: and he was literally singing a song and Elliott interrupted him,
Speaker 2: was like, hey, I don't want to interrupt you, man,
Speaker 2: but like some terrible news just happened. And it was
Speaker 2: the whole the World Trade Center, you know, those buildings
Speaker 2: have been hit. Oh, it's so crazy, And the interrupted
Speaker 2: been Folds while he was singing. I remember thinking like, whoa,
Speaker 2: We're not going to do that. I remember thinking like wow,
Speaker 2: I get to my office park in the garage, go
Speaker 2: up and all the TVs you know, of course, are
Speaker 2: all on CNBC and blah blah.
Speaker 1: Blah, and it's.
Speaker 2: The ball starts rolling now maybe within twenty thirty minutes.
Speaker 1: The head of the firm came on on.
Speaker 2: The last speakers. Everybody, get out, get only your personal belongings.
Speaker 2: Don't worry about your computers. Everybody, just get out of
Speaker 2: the building. Because we were I mean, you could see
Speaker 2: the Pentagon on fire from our building. So of course
Speaker 2: where our building was right there on the water across
Speaker 2: you know, from Georgetown, we're right there on that on
Speaker 2: the flight path, So I mean, helicopters would fly by
Speaker 2: the window and you'd be like, holy shit, like you
Speaker 2: always saw they were going to come right in. So
Speaker 2: we all just left. And but then I couldn't go
Speaker 2: home the correct way that I normally go home, and
Speaker 2: I'm so bad with directions. There's no GPS or anything then,
Speaker 2: so I ended up routing myself back into DC. Couldn't
Speaker 2: get like I was like, I just need to get
Speaker 2: to like three ninety five, four ninety five, the GW
Speaker 2: Parkway is something to get back to Alexandria. And I
Speaker 2: couldn't figure it out, and you couldn't call anybody. I mean,
Speaker 2: it was the only call that got through was my
Speaker 2: boss to be like hey, Like I was on the
Speaker 2: metro and like I heard that, like the you know,
Speaker 2: but I've got an appointment and so you and I go,
Speaker 2: you're not going to your appointment, like something terrible has happened.
Speaker 2: He's like, well, you need to call over to you know,
Speaker 2: uh Sterling Brown and Rubble to tell them I'm not coming.
Speaker 2: I'm like, I'm not doing that.
Speaker 1: I remember. I was like I'm not no.
Speaker 2: And then I couldn't get another call cut, you know,
Speaker 2: from anybody, for hours, and got home and like did
Speaker 2: my computer and like emailed my family. Dave's mom. Her
Speaker 2: story was that she she was in Oklahoma. She was
Speaker 2: working in the yard, and she just left the house
Speaker 2: and went to get her haircut. And when she was
Speaker 2: getting your haircut, somebody said, oh my god, your son
Speaker 2: lives in DC. Is he okay? And she goes, yeah,
Speaker 2: why it had been hours. She didn't know anything. Oh wow,
Speaker 2: because she'd just been in the yard and they'd got
Speaker 2: in her car and like she never it's just not
Speaker 2: the twenty four hour news cycle. I mean, it was
Speaker 2: a twenty four hour news cycle then but we weren't
Speaker 2: so attuned to it now then as we are now.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So for everybody out there, you know, whether you're
Speaker 2: personally infected by or not, you know, all of us
Speaker 2: have stories.
Speaker 1: Even if you're like in the.
Speaker 2: Middle of the country and nothing. You know, everybody has
Speaker 2: a story. Everybody knows somebody.
Speaker 3: It was such a.
Speaker 2: Such a terrible thing, such a terrible thing. I remember
Speaker 2: Dave when I I started washing the cars. Once we
Speaker 2: both got home, What are you doing? He's like, what
Speaker 2: else am I going to do? Sit here and watch TV.
Speaker 2: I was like, yeah, that's what I'm doing.
Speaker 3: It was just like in a fog. At my house.
Speaker 3: Ever since my kids were born, we go to the
Speaker 3: fire and the police station and we bring them donuts
Speaker 3: or bagels with cars.
Speaker 1: You can do that. You're you gonna do that?
Speaker 3: Yeah, we always do that. And I'm rerunning tomorrow in
Speaker 3: my episode in interview with Alison Crother, she's the mother
Speaker 3: of Wells Brother, and I tell the story of Wells Brother,
Speaker 3: who was a young guy actually just a few years
Speaker 3: out of college. You went to Boston College. He was
Speaker 3: a little cross team and he took a job in
Speaker 3: finance and he worked in one of the one of
Speaker 3: the firms in the South Tower, and so long story short,
Speaker 3: Alison Crother's son does not come home after September eleventh,
Speaker 3: works in one of the buildings, and she tells the story.
Speaker 3: About six months later, she's reading the newspaper of an
Speaker 3: account of the South Tower, and she screams out to
Speaker 3: her husband, I found Wells. Well Wells's father had been
Speaker 3: a fireman, and he had taught him since he was
Speaker 3: a young boy to carry two handkerchiefs in his back pocket,
Speaker 3: a red one and a white one. And after the attacks,
Speaker 3: he had put a red bandana around his mouth and
Speaker 3: had been going up and down the South Tower to
Speaker 3: get people like out, and he was They found his
Speaker 3: body months months later when he was with all the
Speaker 3: firemen at the bottom of the building. And so in
Speaker 3: the when she's reading the article, it's all these people
Speaker 3: that have this recollection of this man with a red bandana,
Speaker 3: And so they made a documentary about it, and there's
Speaker 3: a children's book that people come buy to. It's like
Speaker 3: a must have a few of kids. It's a great
Speaker 3: story of heroism. And anyway, so I interviewed her a
Speaker 3: couple of twenty twenty, and what I found what was
Speaker 3: interesting was her going through how in a few days
Speaker 3: before September eleventh, Wills was feeling very melancholy and she
Speaker 3: found him in the living room and he was looking
Speaker 3: at his old photo of like his I guess his
Speaker 3: college picture or high school picture, and he was kind
Speaker 3: of looking at it, and she's like, what are you doing?
Speaker 3: And he said, I just don't think I want to
Speaker 3: work in finance anymore. I think I want to be
Speaker 3: a firefighter. And then he would just sort of pause,
Speaker 3: and I'm forgetting the exact phrasing, but something along the
Speaker 3: lines of I just feel like something's going to happen
Speaker 3: in my life and it's going to be really big,
Speaker 3: and I'm going to find my purpose or something along
Speaker 3: those lines.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 3: And then September eleventh happens. She keeps calling, she can't
Speaker 3: get through, and I think it was after she read
Speaker 3: that article. Maybe she says she talks about going into
Speaker 3: the bathroom and there was like a gold plate thing
Speaker 3: over the toilet paper, and she just sits in the
Speaker 3: bathroom and for whatever is she starts counting, for whatever reason,
Speaker 3: just to kind of calm herself. And when she got
Speaker 3: to this specific number, which happened to be the same
Speaker 3: number his lacrosse jersey. The gold thing on top of
Speaker 3: the toilet paper popped off, and she was like, that
Speaker 3: has to be him. Also, h she felt a sense
Speaker 3: of doom. It was like that morning or maybe the
Speaker 3: day before, she just had this horrible feeling of doom.
Speaker 3: So it's just like just going through all the premonitions
Speaker 3: and the things in retrospect and also his legacy. So
Speaker 3: at Boston College they have a special event for him
Speaker 3: every year, and he's just become this like mythical figure
Speaker 3: almost but a young man who had realized that maybe
Speaker 3: he hadn't been in the right vocation.
Speaker 1: Yeah and.
Speaker 3: Yeah, anyway, that straight really stays with me. So I
Speaker 3: like found his mom and I interviewed her and it
Speaker 3: was very meaningful. So I replayed that one.
Speaker 1: Okay, so that'll be out on.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but if somebody is listening to this and they're like,
Speaker 3: I just want to kind of take a moment and
Speaker 3: go back and kind of think about those victims. One
Speaker 3: thing I can recommend is I ended up interviewing the author.
Speaker 3: It's an excellent book. It's called but the Only Plane
Speaker 3: in the Sky, The Oral History of nine to eleven.
Speaker 3: It's by Gareth Graf Grff and the book goes through
Speaker 3: beginning from the beginning of the day, and it's just
Speaker 3: an oral history of people that were involved in nine
Speaker 3: to eleven, everybody from investigations to family members. And they
Speaker 3: include a lot of the transcripts of the people that
Speaker 3: called from the planes or on voicemails. And so I
Speaker 3: think for younger people they're kind of like, why is
Speaker 3: this such a big deal. It's a big deal because
Speaker 3: a couple of things. The way that we saw ourselves
Speaker 3: and our own safety totally changed totally. And another thing
Speaker 3: is like the rest of the world was completely on
Speaker 3: our side, like with us standing in grief. You saw
Speaker 3: memorials all across the entire globe. And it was this
Speaker 3: weird moment in time where for a couple of days
Speaker 3: is everyone was quiet and and and thoughtful about their
Speaker 3: neighbor and we were all coming together for a collective movement.
Speaker 3: And I just I can't imagine young people now even
Speaker 3: imagining that because of the way that we are all
Speaker 3: now in this very divisive spot in our in our world,
Speaker 3: in our time. But that was really and like a
Speaker 3: moment in time where everyone was just so shocked and
Speaker 3: saddened and felt unmoored.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's right.
Speaker 3: It was.
Speaker 2: It was the whole country and in other countries as well.
Speaker 1: You just felt unity.
Speaker 2: I mean, you know where we lived, right in Old Town, right,
Speaker 2: not too far from the airport at all. At the time.
Speaker 2: You know, there were no planes for months. Our neighborhood
Speaker 2: was so quiet and there was no boats and there
Speaker 2: was no We lived right about the train would it
Speaker 2: go right through Old Town?
Speaker 1: No sounds? It was so quiet.
Speaker 2: It was so quiet, and so that's it was eerie. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it was eerie for a long time. But but you're right,
Speaker 2: our sense of just walking through the airport or whatnot,
Speaker 2: all of that changed. And it's interesting you're saying all this,
Speaker 2: because I'm like, no, I'll never read that book, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean, Like, I just I don't need to.
Speaker 1: I lived it, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: I think you'd be surprised how much you would really
Speaker 3: enjoy it.
Speaker 2: No, Okay, I know myself well enough, like when I
Speaker 2: stopped really watching the news after Sadie Hook, you know,
Speaker 2: because I had a kid that age. I just know
Speaker 2: myself enough to know that I get and because of
Speaker 2: the nine to eleven stuff, because I you know, like
Speaker 2: a lot of us lived it. I don't I don't
Speaker 2: want to read a book about it because I just
Speaker 2: know that it's not.
Speaker 3: You know what I mean. Right. My sister who was
Speaker 3: in World Trade Center seven, she can't handle anything, and
Speaker 3: she's only talked to I think maybe two or three
Speaker 3: of us in her time since then about what she
Speaker 3: saw that day, yeah, and what she went through. She
Speaker 3: can't go back there. She also lives in a town
Speaker 3: now when you she lived in the city at the
Speaker 3: time where there were a lot of families that I
Speaker 3: loved ones in fact, so weird. My niece is working
Speaker 3: at Fox Sports and she's got a coworker and she said, oh,
Speaker 3: you know, his step father died on nine to eleven.
Speaker 3: Of course my heart broke and he never met him
Speaker 3: because his mom found out she was pregnant a week
Speaker 3: after he died.
Speaker 2: A lot of stories like that, yeah, a lot of
Speaker 2: stories like that. And so I think that for me,
Speaker 2: I can't.
Speaker 1: Read this book.
Speaker 2: I think it's very interesting what you're saying about younger
Speaker 2: people not getting it, and you're right, like they.
Speaker 3: Don't really know the details of it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they don't know the details, and they don't and
Speaker 2: they a lot of kids, and I'm just speaking for
Speaker 2: the ones I know are all about the conspiracy theory
Speaker 2: about it didn't happen or you know, I'm like, well,
Speaker 2: I watched it on the news for weeks and weeks
Speaker 2: and weeks, and it sure shit happened. And I surely
Speaker 2: knew people that walked by and saw dead bodies on
Speaker 2: the street, so it definitely happened.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 3: I think it was what our parents felt about case
Speaker 3: assassination in Martin Luther King's assassination. It's it is. It's
Speaker 3: a moment in time where you you're terrified that hope
Speaker 3: is lost.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and uh yeah it was.
Speaker 3: It was.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: It's so interesting because you don't think about how my
Speaker 2: kids don't know that you just be You've been able
Speaker 2: to walk into the airport just go on your plane,
Speaker 2: do you know what I mean? Like you just check
Speaker 2: in and get your ticket and walk to your gate.
Speaker 2: There was none of this metal detectors and take your
Speaker 2: shoes off and that, you know all that.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I actually follow two different nine to eleven accounts, and
Speaker 3: every day I it's like someone who died's birthday. Yeah,
Speaker 3: And they do a wonderful job of kind of giving
Speaker 3: the history of that person. And then sometimes I find
Speaker 3: myself because I'm myself chasing who that person was, like
Speaker 3: I want to find out more. And there have been
Speaker 3: people that my sister has said, oh, so and so
Speaker 3: from town and they lost someone in nine to eleven.
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, I know who that person is because
Speaker 3: I I read about them once.
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Speaker 2: support our show and say Pink Shade sent you, Kate,
Speaker 2: do you have a photographic memory?
Speaker 3: How do yeah?
Speaker 1: You actually do?
Speaker 2: I do yeah, Because some of the things that you
Speaker 2: come up with, I'm like, how on earth do you
Speaker 2: pull that out? Like it's something that you remember from
Speaker 2: like ten years ago, and do you remember sovividly? I'm like,
Speaker 2: how would you remember that so vividly?
Speaker 3: I know. My friend Gina always laughs because she's like,
Speaker 3: we hadn't talked for a little while, and you were like,
Speaker 3: remember when you were when you were in elementary school
Speaker 3: and you can never listen to the sound of music
Speaker 3: to the part of adel Weis because that was the
Speaker 3: song your grandmother used to sing to you when you
Speaker 3: were a baby. She's like, you are so weird, and
Speaker 3: I just can't. I can't turn it. I just cannot
Speaker 3: turn it off. I can't turn it off, and I don't.
Speaker 3: But I've said this before. I don't know if I've
Speaker 3: said this to you, but it memory, my specific one
Speaker 3: is called superior recall. And I was told by a
Speaker 3: professor who works at the Memory Center at a University
Speaker 3: of California orr VIE that it's often hereditary. There's no
Speaker 3: correlation to intellect. It's just sort of sort of like
Speaker 3: there's this area of your brain which is like there's
Speaker 3: a bigger space, but it's yeah, hereditary, and it shows
Speaker 3: up in different generations in a different way. So my grandmother,
Speaker 3: my dad's mother, was a musician and she could see
Speaker 3: a sheet of music and then remember it forever. And
Speaker 3: then my dad can remember stuff about history, like if
Speaker 3: you could ask him like when did Mary, Queen of
Speaker 3: Scott's die or what he and he can tell you
Speaker 3: the exact date. Mine is like specific details about people.
Speaker 3: Trust me, I wish it was like for numbers or something.
Speaker 3: It's just like details about people, and so I'm always
Speaker 3: kind of paying attention. I think two of my kids
Speaker 3: have good memories, but I don't know if they have it.
Speaker 3: But my mom also has. On my other side, my
Speaker 3: mom is a really good memory too, But it's just
Speaker 3: something you have or you don't.
Speaker 1: Like.
Speaker 3: People often will say like you're like Mary Lou Henter,
Speaker 3: she has she can remember every single day of her life. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I can't. I don't have that. I think they are
Speaker 3: only I thought that I read somewhere figure maybe like
Speaker 3: forty five people in the country that have that specific thing.
Speaker 2: It's crazy. My my friend Mary has a crazy memory
Speaker 2: of dates, and you can. I will ask her sometimes,
Speaker 2: I'm like, how old is my nephew Thompson?
Speaker 1: Like, is he thirty? Is he thirty two? She'll well, okay, well.
Speaker 2: Sanford was born in nineteen ninety one, and so that
Speaker 2: was two years later. So he was born in ninety three,
Speaker 2: and so he was born on like what June fifth?
Speaker 2: And I'm like, so, like, she will know the birthdays
Speaker 2: of all my nieces and nephews, like having heard it once.
Speaker 1: Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: So she have kids? Do her kids have that too?
Speaker 3: Do you not? Probably in a different way, I'll ask.
Speaker 2: Her her one daughter got her master's recently at UVA,
Speaker 2: and then her other daughter plays lacrosse at Dennison.
Speaker 1: Oh that's great, so I'll have to ask her. She's
Speaker 1: coming here tomorrow. I'm at the beach again. Everybody, and.
Speaker 2: Well, that's really interesting. Every time I talk to you,
Speaker 2: I'm like, how do you remember? I think the same
Speaker 2: about Mary. She'll say, no, no, no, no, that didn't
Speaker 2: happen because in nineteen seventy four this happened, and you
Speaker 2: were born in sixty eight, so you definitely done, Dada.
Speaker 2: You will only six, and I'm like, no, I remember it.
Speaker 2: I watched that movie shows there's no way you watched
Speaker 2: that movie because blah blah.
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, you don't know. My parents will watch anything.
Speaker 3: They didn't care I think even know you. And then
Speaker 3: you say that way, it's probably why I there's some
Speaker 3: like docs that I really like find my like a vichy.
Speaker 3: I'm not a music person. I don't really care about it,
Speaker 3: but I feel like he had. I refer to it
Speaker 3: as like a little like a mad genius. It's like
Speaker 3: it doesn't make any sense, but it's someone's specific thing. Yeah,
Speaker 3: And I feel like he had that, like anybody that
Speaker 3: has like something that's just so bizarre, but it's like different.
Speaker 3: I kind of feel like I I'm really into.
Speaker 1: Well, it's sort of like.
Speaker 2: Eddie Vedder, Billie Eilish, John Mayer all have that synesthesia.
Speaker 1: Or whatever it is. Yeah, they hear.
Speaker 2: Music as John Mayer hears music as shapes and colors,
Speaker 2: and Eddie Vedder has said mostly his shapes, and Billie
Speaker 2: Eilish says she really like when she sees a person,
Speaker 2: she'll be like.
Speaker 1: Oh, brown square, you know, but her dad has it too.
Speaker 2: But it's a little bit different, but I remember her.
Speaker 2: I mean I've heard her talk about it a lot.
Speaker 2: But one time she said on Jimmy Kimmel and he goes, well,
Speaker 2: what am I?
Speaker 1: And no, sorry, Jimmy Fallon. He goes what.
Speaker 2: She goes, No, you're you know you're yellow circle and
Speaker 2: he goes why she goes, I don't know. That's when
Speaker 2: I think of you. I think yellow circle. My dad
Speaker 2: said brown square. So I don't know, you know, but
Speaker 2: it's when they hear music. So John Mayer always looks
Speaker 2: so orgasmic all the time because he closes his eyes
Speaker 2: and all he sees his colors and shapes.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think he has an album called Shapes
Speaker 1: and Colors, Colors and Shapes.
Speaker 2: But anyway, he realized it when he was young, and
Speaker 2: Eddie Vedder has said he has that too. He closed
Speaker 2: his eyes and the music all just appears to him
Speaker 2: in shapes in his brain.
Speaker 3: Well, like Jonathan Mark is like really close to me,
Speaker 3: and he's a medium. It's like that's another thing. It's
Speaker 3: like it's just the it is what it is, like,
Speaker 3: that's he grew.
Speaker 2: Up with that, he has that he has a Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's icy dead people that's a good movie. If nobody
Speaker 2: ever saw that, it's a great movie.
Speaker 3: You know. He also made The Village. That was a
Speaker 3: good one too.
Speaker 2: I saw The Village m Night Shamalan and he made
Speaker 2: another movie that scared the shit out of me. I
Speaker 2: can't remember what it was then that was. That was
Speaker 2: back when I probably watched scary movies. I don't watch
Speaker 2: them anymore.
Speaker 3: I know it's hard to watch scary movies. All of
Speaker 3: his movies are made in the Philadelphia area. God bless God, Buss.
Speaker 2: Oh thank you, shout out Philly. Well, we're not here
Speaker 2: to talk about any of that now. First of all,
Speaker 2: we have to announce everybody. Kate and I have a
Speaker 2: side project. I'm gonna make a little note here. We
Speaker 2: have a side project coming out together, and it's gonna
Speaker 2: be we've semi fleshed it out, but it is coming
Speaker 2: out next month.
Speaker 1: So when Ingery is back in town, we'll have it
Speaker 1: fully done.
Speaker 2: But it's gonna be called tell Me Everything with Kate
Speaker 2: and Mary Payne, because I'll call Kate and I'll go,
Speaker 2: let me tell you this.
Speaker 1: She'll go tell me everything.
Speaker 2: Or she called me yesterday and she said, oh my god,
Speaker 2: let me tell you about this thing in my neighborhood.
Speaker 2: I'm like, tell me, tell me, tell me everything.
Speaker 3: So, oh, that was the mom, the mom that got arrested.
Speaker 1: Your that was your story. That was good.
Speaker 2: So when my sister was recently in town and my
Speaker 2: other friend we sat around and kind of talked about
Speaker 2: a lot of these stories. I was like, oh my god,
Speaker 2: I've got like six stories I could tell Kate already.
Speaker 2: The first one I've been fleshing out because I am
Speaker 2: changing the names and the places and you know, and
Speaker 2: nobody's going to go and look these people up or anything.
Speaker 2: But I wouldn't want anybody to get their feelings hurt.
Speaker 2: But some of the stories and that you haven't heard them,
Speaker 2: that's the point. I'm going to tell you a story
Speaker 2: that you don't know, and you're going to tell me
Speaker 2: a story I don't know. And it could be from
Speaker 2: the news and the way I came up.
Speaker 1: With this idea.
Speaker 2: Kate did a show on her Patreon where she just
Speaker 2: talked about, No, you haven't told me that one. No,
Speaker 2: this was about the r Gina guy who owned the bowling.
Speaker 3: Oh that's right, so written here and.
Speaker 2: I heard you tell that story on your Patreon, and
Speaker 2: I go, oh my god, I just want Kate to
Speaker 2: tell me stories I don't know, and I also don't
Speaker 2: want to have to research it and read a twenty
Speaker 2: page Vanity far artle.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because there are crazy people, and you're a crazy
Speaker 3: person at times too, where you just like rabbit hole
Speaker 3: it and I you have somebny that's done the rabbit
Speaker 3: hole for me.
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, And so this is going to be on
Speaker 2: both of our Patreon feeds, whatever, Patrions, super gass, Apple,
Speaker 2: you know all the places. It's going to be on
Speaker 2: the ten dollars level for me. You're going to add
Speaker 2: a ten dollars level for you, so it will be equal.
Speaker 2: But guys, it'll be every other week. So it'll be
Speaker 2: the first week will be on Kate show because it's
Speaker 2: going to be me telling her a story. The next
Speaker 2: week will be Kate on my show. She's going to
Speaker 2: tell me a story. So if you want to hear
Speaker 2: all of it, you've got to subscribe to both. That's
Speaker 2: how we get you. But it's going to be worth it.
Speaker 3: I think the first one I'm going to tell you
Speaker 3: about it is my cousin story about my cousin.
Speaker 2: Okay, Okay, are you, But do you have to pretend
Speaker 2: that it's not your cousin or you're going to say
Speaker 2: it's your cousin.
Speaker 3: No, I'm going to say it. Yeah, I have nothing
Speaker 3: to hide.
Speaker 2: Some of my stories I am going to have to
Speaker 2: change the names to protect that guilty and innocent.
Speaker 1: And I could tell you also the detailed story of
Speaker 1: my family murder.
Speaker 2: That's a good Yeah, that's a good one. But I
Speaker 2: think but I think you already know it. So I
Speaker 2: want to tell you a story that you don't know
Speaker 2: so that you have a questions. So that's the premise guys,
Speaker 2: when Inger gets back and really gonna flesh out. Look,
Speaker 2: all we have is a title and a logo, and
Speaker 2: I've written out a few notes. But it is going
Speaker 2: to happen in October, so be on the lookout for that.
Speaker 3: Somebody should start a podcast and call it Stories for Days. Okay, well,
Speaker 3: it's not gonna I have another idea. Brian Howie and I.
Speaker 3: You know my friend Brian who's going through cancer treatments.
Speaker 3: He is owns a podcast company. We with his help, like,
Speaker 3: we've come up with the concept of a podcast. We
Speaker 3: just need the two people who would be willing to
Speaker 3: be the host of it, okay. So it so it's
Speaker 3: basically off of an idea that he did where he
Speaker 3: was going to make a podcast where he gave parenting
Speaker 3: advice although he does not have any children okay. And
Speaker 3: he took a picture for the for the you know,
Speaker 3: the the art art thank you, and it was him
Speaker 3: with all my five kids on a couch okay. And
Speaker 3: I was like, you know what would be really funny
Speaker 3: if you had a person who has zero children giving
Speaker 3: parent advice co hosting a show with a person who
Speaker 3: like is a CEO with the and okay. So it's
Speaker 3: like this, there's a person who's a CEO who doesn't
Speaker 3: have any children okay, and they're giving somebody who has
Speaker 3: children advice on parenting okay. And the parent who is
Speaker 3: not a working person is giving the CEO business advice.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 3: So each episod So they come up with a scenario
Speaker 3: in each of their pockets of lives. But the person
Speaker 3: who is not with children or without like a company
Speaker 3: that they're in charge of, has to give the other
Speaker 3: person advice because I have to believe that there's some
Speaker 3: nugget in the madness of someone who doesn't have your
Speaker 3: same life experience that you can take away. Yeah. Absolutely,
Speaker 3: we need to find the people who would be the
Speaker 3: perfect host for that.
Speaker 2: Okay, nobody steal this idea. It's Kate Casey's idea. It's
Speaker 2: TM patented and trademark. Do not steal this idea. If
Speaker 2: you do, we have this weak back on. Yeah, it's
Speaker 2: a great idea.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 3: Got to find the right people though, So it has
Speaker 3: to the CEO without children and then a parent who
Speaker 3: has children who does not work.
Speaker 2: I was just gonna say it could be that CEO
Speaker 2: that got called at the Coldplay concert, but he's out
Speaker 2: of a job and he does have kids, and he
Speaker 2: does have children, and also he makes bad choices.
Speaker 3: He makes terrible choices. But that's kind of the funny
Speaker 3: thing is like some of the You're Gonna go you
Speaker 3: were an absolute moron, because Brian and we came up
Speaker 3: with him and he would like, try to give me
Speaker 3: advice on something, and I'd like, you have no fucking
Speaker 3: idea what you're talking about. Yeah, yeah, and you're laughing
Speaker 3: because you're like, that is pretty funny. Yeah, what they
Speaker 3: think parenting might be like. But then sometimes you're like well,
Speaker 3: because you're not in the thick of it. That actually
Speaker 3: kind of is a genius idea.
Speaker 1: To step back and be like, oh, actually maybe that
Speaker 1: might work.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because children, they've got high organizational skills, they deal
Speaker 3: with stress all the time. They might actually have some
Speaker 3: really great insight for a situation in a company.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they've got people management skills for sure, especially if
Speaker 2: they've got you know, five kids like you do.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and you know, I don't know how you
Speaker 1: do it all, But that's day.
Speaker 3: The funniest thing is when people ask me for parenting advice.
Speaker 3: I'm like, why would you ask me? I mean, I
Speaker 3: five is but I'm halfway halfway okay with my own kids,
Speaker 3: you know what I mean. So your kids are your
Speaker 3: own and they have their own personalities. I remember I
Speaker 3: interviewed the super nanny and I was so annoyed before
Speaker 3: this whole thing. I was like, she doesn't even have kids,
Speaker 3: what does she know? And then she said something like, well,
Speaker 3: you know your kids, but you don't know other people's kids.
Speaker 3: I thought, you know what, You're right, I don't know,
Speaker 3: right I give advice to another parent when I don't
Speaker 3: know their I don't know the ins and outs of
Speaker 3: their kids and how they work and everything.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, that's a lot of times when you have
Speaker 2: to go to your close friend to be like, okay,
Speaker 2: you know how I get operates, you know what this
Speaker 2: is like in my house? Like what do you think
Speaker 2: you know? Yeah, ook, that's a great idea. Okay, well
Speaker 2: you know TM, nobody steal it. Okay, you guys, let's
Speaker 2: talk about Real Housewives of Miami. Are you enjoying this season?
Speaker 3: I always love that show. I think the thing that
Speaker 3: really stands out to me. And I asked Matt about this,
Speaker 3: Why does your show look so much better aesthetically than
Speaker 3: other shows? And he said it's because they spend so
Speaker 3: much time I'm in post edit with the colors on
Speaker 3: the screen, like to make it pop, because Miami is
Speaker 3: such like a colorful it has its own specific look. Yeah,
Speaker 3: and he said they just it's really important to them
Speaker 3: the way the colors pop on screen, and it's such
Speaker 3: like a specific small thing that really does make a difference.
Speaker 1: I think, I love I just love Marisol. I want
Speaker 1: her to be my friend.
Speaker 3: No, and she's the best clothes she and Kiki, I
Speaker 3: think at the best clothes of all housewives.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I loved.
Speaker 2: I loved the episode this week with Kiki talking to
Speaker 2: her dad and saying, like, you kicked me out when
Speaker 2: I was fifteen. He's like, oh, well, you know that's
Speaker 2: what happened. She's like, uh fifteen mm.
Speaker 3: She's like, well, I remember, that's yeah, that's what it
Speaker 3: was is I remember I interviewed her about that. She
Speaker 3: said the wife didn't like her awful and by the way,
Speaker 3: she where did she go? She didn't have any money.
Speaker 3: She got to Miami and they were like, you're like,
Speaker 3: you're out of here, and she had to figure out
Speaker 3: a way to like eat, like have food. I mean,
Speaker 3: just really out on her own.
Speaker 2: That's awful. Well, anyway, I loved that. Seeing with her dad.
Speaker 2: I have to assume he's not with that woman anymore.
Speaker 3: But oh he's like a lithario, Like he bounces. He's
Speaker 3: got kids from a couple of different women, and he
Speaker 3: gets bored easily. Okay, well, all right, y'all.
Speaker 2: What's the hardest thing about hitting your protein goals? For me,
Speaker 2: it's breakfast. I'm always trying to figure out a protein
Speaker 2: packed breakfast because there's so many days when I know
Speaker 2: I'm not going to be able to grab lunch. So
Speaker 2: let me tell you, Tropical Smoothie Cafe helps me hit
Speaker 2: that protein goal every morning while staying on Tropic time.
Speaker 2: At Tropical Smoothie Cafe, it's super easy, breezy to get
Speaker 2: your morning protein. My favorite part is you can order
Speaker 2: a head in the app and you can do it
Speaker 2: online and you grab your high protein SIPs and bites
Speaker 2: even faster, you guys, I love the app. You could
Speaker 2: go get my husband's favorite, which is the Peanut Paradise
Speaker 2: Smoothie with twenty two grams of protein, and you could
Speaker 2: add more good vibes to your smoothie. You can do almonds, spinach,
Speaker 2: kalechi issy, ginger, or supplements like Energizer. My personal favorite
Speaker 2: is the Sausage, egg and Cheese Dia, but there are
Speaker 2: also amazing choices like Peebee Protein crunch Bowl, the mixed
Speaker 2: berry Greek yogurt bowl, or the All American rap You guys,
Speaker 2: on the way home from the beach, we stopped at
Speaker 2: Tropical Smoothie in North Carolina and I got two of
Speaker 2: those sausage, egg and Cheese I dias for me and
Speaker 2: my son.
Speaker 1: We love them. It's just so good, so make.
Speaker 2: Every day I get away with the bold flavors and
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Speaker 1: Order ahead, take the.
Speaker 2: Scenic rout and earn rewards with a Tropical Smoothie Cafe app.
Speaker 2: Download it to day Tropical Smoothie Cafe.
Speaker 1: You're on Tropic Time.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 2: I loved this week being on the Virgin Vote. Now
Speaker 2: I'm going to tell you something interesting. And I hope
Speaker 2: that you cannot hear my messages dinging, because I talked
Speaker 2: about this all the time on the show. I have
Speaker 2: it on Do not Disturb. But what I've discovered a
Speaker 2: monkey told me if somebody's in your emergency content, even
Speaker 2: if it's a do not disturb, it will still come through.
Speaker 2: And that really bothers me.
Speaker 3: Oh, who is it? Anna?
Speaker 2: You know, it's all three, it's everybody in my family.
Speaker 2: They're talking about the guy that Charlie Kirk shooting.
Speaker 1: That's what they're talking about.
Speaker 2: So now they're just going back and forth about violence.
Speaker 2: It's not the answer, and I'm like, yeah, quit texting.
Speaker 2: So and then a message I got from another from
Speaker 2: Dave while we've been sitting.
Speaker 1: Here is what is violence? Birthday the dog.
Speaker 3: But he's BRILLIANTO. Those dogs, it's really astounding.
Speaker 1: Loves the dogs.
Speaker 3: He really loves your dogs.
Speaker 1: Really. Yeah, we had a landscape or come here, he's
Speaker 1: a house today to get.
Speaker 3: Very concerned about them all the time.
Speaker 1: To get a place. Yeah, so they have a good
Speaker 1: place to go potty.
Speaker 2: Okay, sure, anyway, okay, I forgot Marisol, and now forgot
Speaker 2: what I was saying.
Speaker 1: Oh, the Virgin the Virgin boat. So here's something interesting.
Speaker 2: I since I don't cover any housewived shows turn by turn,
Speaker 2: I love to listen to our friends Ben and Ronnie.
Speaker 2: Yeah right, so they're coming uh, they're coming on together
Speaker 2: in a couple.
Speaker 1: Of weeks here. So I was listening to their show
Speaker 1: before I came on with you.
Speaker 2: And at the beginning, and I listened on Wondery Boo Wondery,
Speaker 2: I listened mad at Wondering. I listened to Wondery the
Speaker 2: app and it's supposed to be add free, but it
Speaker 2: was a full three minutes and them talking about the
Speaker 2: Virgin Cruise and how great the Virgin Cruise was. And
Speaker 2: this show is sponsored by Virgin Cruises. Oh so Ben
Speaker 2: and Ronnie got an ad for Virgin.
Speaker 1: Cruises to go with that. Episode.
Speaker 3: Interesting.
Speaker 1: Interesting.
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh my god, can you imagine Ben and
Speaker 2: Ronnie in that rock star suite?
Speaker 3: You know? Can I tell you my Richard Branson story?
Speaker 3: Of course, my husband went to his island on a
Speaker 3: trip with like a business trip with and I rich.
Speaker 1: Was he there was Richard Branson there.
Speaker 3: Yeah. They played tennis together every morning. And Dan, my
Speaker 3: husband's a really good tennis player, like, yeah, we have
Speaker 3: tennis channel on in my house. So like he's obsessed.
Speaker 3: And he was like kind of not putting his health.
Speaker 3: Physical health is a priority at this time that he
Speaker 3: went to visit. It was not too long ago. You
Speaker 3: mean your husband or your husband? Okay, yeah, so wait
Speaker 3: I should tell you, like no for that. He the
Speaker 3: guy works seven days a week. Like he works, he
Speaker 3: comes home. He doesn't like, he doesn't have a lot
Speaker 3: of time for other stuff. He does play tennis, that's it.
Speaker 3: So Richard says to him, He's like, what's going on, Dan,
Speaker 3: And so like they sit at the tennis court and
Speaker 3: he's like, you know, I'm really overwhelmed with work. And
Speaker 3: Richard Branson was like, your health has to pre a
Speaker 3: priority and this is what you have to do. And
Speaker 3: he came back from that trip and he went to
Speaker 3: every he got a colin oscoby, he went here, he
Speaker 3: went here, he went to all the kinds of doctors
Speaker 3: that one needs to make sure and like it was
Speaker 3: a couple of weeks ago. Dan said, I really got
Speaker 3: handed to him, Like he made a huge difference in
Speaker 3: my life. Like I really like he It was like,
Speaker 3: your children need you to be at your peak health. Wow.
Speaker 3: Look at Richard Branson and he said, he is totally
Speaker 3: devoted to his wife and kids. They have a property there.
Speaker 3: He spends a lot of his time there, but like
Speaker 3: crazy about his wife. And if you watch the documentary
Speaker 3: The Disruptors, if anybody in your life has ADHD as
Speaker 3: as I do, he's he's in it and he talks
Speaker 3: about how he had eight well he has ADHD and
Speaker 3: dyslexia and his experience in school and he's like a
Speaker 3: really good example of someone who on paper would not
Speaker 3: have done well in school. However, has used his focused
Speaker 3: disorder to kind of create his own lane and has
Speaker 3: become massively successful. But is also very charitable.
Speaker 1: Yes, that is one thing to hear about him, that
Speaker 1: he's charitable.
Speaker 2: Well, he was charitable enough to give Vin and Ronnie
Speaker 2: some money for their show and not us, and God
Speaker 2: bless and let these ladies onto the boat. And I listen,
Speaker 2: I've thought a lot. I love every so often just
Speaker 2: hop on a little cruise, I.
Speaker 3: Do, and never going on a cruise ever again.
Speaker 1: Well, I'm telling you, Disney Cruise way to go. You know,
Speaker 1: I don't even like Disney. Nope, it was the best
Speaker 1: thing we ever did.
Speaker 3: So anyway, cases really ruined the cruise industry.
Speaker 1: Sorry, oh okay, well okay, So the Virgin Cruise, you know,
Speaker 1: it's adults.
Speaker 2: Only, and so in my mind, I'm like, oh my god,
Speaker 2: it's going to be like going to hedonism or something like.
Speaker 1: It's going to be gross.
Speaker 2: But people, you know, like it's just going to be
Speaker 2: like necking people in the hot tub swingers part.
Speaker 1: But people that have been on those cruises.
Speaker 2: Virgin Cruises, SAD is very different and very nice, and
Speaker 2: it's not super expensive. It does literally go like Miami
Speaker 2: to Biminy and then like back. It only has like
Speaker 2: three stops, so it really is like if you're just
Speaker 2: trying to like go for four days with some girlfriends,
Speaker 2: I don't. They may have some boats now that do
Speaker 2: other things, but it's interesting in the cruise industry that
Speaker 2: somebody could put out like new boats, a new brand
Speaker 2: and have it be successful. Yeah, definitely, and it looks
Speaker 2: nice and what do you okay the arguments that we
Speaker 2: have now, I can't quite remember who's mad at who,
Speaker 2: because but I did like all sitting down with Stephanie
Speaker 2: and saying, you don't need to talk about how much
Speaker 2: everything costs all the time.
Speaker 3: I mean, well, that's an archetype. Usually of the tropes
Speaker 3: of the Housewives, the newcomer tends to be so insecure
Speaker 3: they overdo it and they like get over the top
Speaker 3: closed or they have to talk about their money all
Speaker 3: the time. That's definitely like a first season kind of mistake.
Speaker 3: I'm sure she'll chill out. I also have some concerns
Speaker 3: because she's so chatty about income. That's to me like karmic.
Speaker 3: The karmic reality is you're probably going to be involved
Speaker 3: in some sort of financial fallout.
Speaker 2: Well, a listener wrote me and said that the house
Speaker 2: that she showed that they were you know where she
Speaker 2: showed lars of the closet with this walls for the
Speaker 2: Burkins and all that was already in foreclosure, and that
Speaker 2: hadn't even moved in.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a problem.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So anytime somebody talks about like their wealth and
Speaker 3: their things, I'm always win sying. I'm like, this is
Speaker 3: going to come back and don't haunt you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well I did, like a Marasol set her down.
Speaker 2: I love every time they show Marasol's cute, little tiny
Speaker 2: perfect I love that.
Speaker 3: That's probably one of my favorite houses and all of
Speaker 3: us wives. It's like so adorable and clean and clean
Speaker 3: lines and just the spacial landscaping. I love it. I
Speaker 3: also asked Matt Anderson, the executive producer, about each of
Speaker 3: the women and what's something when we don't know, we
Speaker 3: don't get okay, And he said Marisol's step kids adore her. Yeah,
Speaker 3: like I love love hanging out with her, And I
Speaker 3: thought that was cool.
Speaker 1: What did you have to say about Adriana because she
Speaker 1: just bugs.
Speaker 3: She's really really smart. She's like very cultured art history, piano.
Speaker 3: She's very cultured, and it's like a really fun person
Speaker 3: to talk to because she knows a lot of different things.
Speaker 2: What did he say that would be interested to know
Speaker 2: about Gerdy Because I feel like we know everything about Gerty.
Speaker 3: That her husband is. I don't know. It wasn't really
Speaker 3: about Gerty, but it was about her. Her husband's like
Speaker 3: a huge star wars nerd and that they're like the
Speaker 3: whole family's really close. Like I mean, you kind of
Speaker 3: get a sense of that, but he's just reiterating like
Speaker 3: they're very, very close.
Speaker 1: Gerty Is.
Speaker 3: I've got a soft spot for her because I think
Speaker 3: that she's probably somebody who's got like a focused disorder.
Speaker 3: She's like super super creative, and when she's in a
Speaker 3: zone for work, it's like magic. But then outside of
Speaker 3: work she's sign of like in a couple different places,
Speaker 3: and I don't know, I never get the sense for
Speaker 3: her that she wants that she's cunning or manipulative. I
Speaker 3: think she's like, at her heart, like a girl, a
Speaker 3: girl's girl, and like a good person.
Speaker 2: So speaking to tennis, you know us opened was just
Speaker 2: on and so we watched a lot of it, and
Speaker 2: we watched the final match with Alcoraz and.
Speaker 1: Cinner. I always want to say Skinner but at center and.
Speaker 3: Dan went there by the way, Oh he did, Yeah,
Speaker 3: he thought for a day so he could go. I'm
Speaker 3: telling you he's like a dork.
Speaker 2: Okay, but that's great. I love it so we I
Speaker 2: would love to do that too. So we were watching
Speaker 2: it and something they showed a clip of something, you know,
Speaker 2: something from the past and Martina Navatrola and they were
Speaker 2: talking about, oh, Yvonne Lindall is here when he was
Speaker 2: presenting the thing, and got my husband and I talking
Speaker 2: and I said, oh, you know earlier they showed Martina
Speaker 2: and Naviatrola. I said, you know, she's on the Real
Speaker 2: Housewise in Miami. He's like what, He's still so upset
Speaker 2: about Charles Oakley being on Real Housewives of Atlanta.
Speaker 1: Oh, He's like what.
Speaker 2: I said, Yeah, she's married to this woman, Julia, and
Speaker 2: they actually just had their anniversary because she posted about
Speaker 2: the US Open is so special dust, It's where we
Speaker 2: got engaged. And Dave's like, god, I mean to him,
Speaker 2: that is like the lowest of the love of the
Speaker 2: trashiest of the trash.
Speaker 1: You know, not Miami, not, but just to be on
Speaker 1: a real housewive show.
Speaker 3: There was a clip too where there was a couple
Speaker 3: that got engaged to the US Open, and they showed
Speaker 3: a clip of it and Martina was on the panel.
Speaker 3: It was like four people. Yeah, and this gulp this
Speaker 3: stranger is getting engaged, and the one woman on the
Speaker 3: panel goes, that is the definition of like like cheesiness,
Speaker 3: like the fact that something she's like that is an
Speaker 3: absolute cheese move or whatever she said, I forget the
Speaker 3: exact freezing. And then Martina goes, well, you know, I
Speaker 3: proposed to Julia like eleven years ago and she was like,
Speaker 3: my bad. And I was like everyone has had that
Speaker 3: moment in life where you're like, oh please, blah blah blah,
Speaker 3: and then you're like, oh, I'm horrible.
Speaker 2: But this way they were calling her Marty. I was like, Oh,
Speaker 2: now she's like, what are we doing? Are we trying
Speaker 2: to lighten up Martina to feel like she's fun and light.
Speaker 2: I don't find her fun and light. I find her
Speaker 2: to be like stunned at the position she's found herself.
Speaker 3: I've always wanted to interview her though, because I like
Speaker 3: her escape out of Checkolslovakia. I feel I've very interesting.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well I think that's interesting.
Speaker 2: But I think she is like, how do you think
Speaker 2: Martina and Abertilova is getting paid by this show?
Speaker 3: Uh? No, I think she really loves Julia and wants
Speaker 3: her to have something for herself.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because I mean, like you can't imagine that, like
Speaker 2: Lenny was getting paid when he was with Lisa, like
Speaker 2: the spouse is don't get paid. He wanted her to
Speaker 2: be on the show because it helped him get away
Speaker 2: from her. No, I helped his business, surgery business. But
Speaker 2: I think so he had an agenda, and I think
Speaker 2: Terry Dubrow had an agenda. I think the Heather being
Speaker 2: on the show helped his business immensely.
Speaker 3: I'm sure. I think she has said it too, like
Speaker 3: I didn't want to be on the show, but he
Speaker 3: wanted to be on the show.
Speaker 2: Did you like on the the episode with the light
Speaker 2: detector where she admitted she'd rather be on the Rouse Beverly.
Speaker 3: Well, I think it was like, okay, yeah, we all
Speaker 3: know that she doesn't live here. She lives she does
Speaker 3: not own a home in the County of Orange.
Speaker 1: So crazy, it's hilarious. And she goes, what I live
Speaker 1: closer to them Sti's just let her do it. Just
Speaker 1: let her go over there, just do it.
Speaker 3: Also, let her go her you know, it's really hard
Speaker 3: when you have like a bunch of kids, when you
Speaker 3: kind of are in the mindset or in the social
Speaker 3: groups of your older kids. And as your kids get older,
Speaker 3: I mean I find this with like my my kids
Speaker 3: range from junior in high school to first grade. So
Speaker 3: the first grade parents like they're this is these that
Speaker 3: child is their oldest. They've got little kids at home,
Speaker 3: and there is like this, yes, disconnect and you're kind
Speaker 3: of I feel like going through life with your oldest
Speaker 3: kids like tribe. And so I think a lot of
Speaker 3: what Heather and Terry face is like their tribe of friends.
Speaker 3: Their kids are off in college. There's don't even come
Speaker 3: back to it. So they're physically and mentally not in
Speaker 3: Orange County anymore. Right, even though they have their youngest
Speaker 3: one is in the eighth grade, so they do have
Speaker 3: and ones going off clubs or the youngest one still
Speaker 3: has you know five you know, five more years here.
Speaker 3: But they're in their heads, they're they're not there.
Speaker 1: Their youngest one is the youngest one ace yes.
Speaker 3: Eighth grader, okay, eighth and keighth grade ye in l A.
Speaker 3: No wait, maybe they're in seventh. They're not, you know what,
Speaker 3: I think they're in seventh.
Speaker 1: But in the OC are in la in l A, Okay.
Speaker 3: So now their kids still and and Katerina. She went
Speaker 3: to high school senior year in l A too, So
Speaker 3: they don't go to I'm telling you, they don't have
Speaker 3: a property year. There's no reason to be here. Their
Speaker 3: kids go to school in lad Well.
Speaker 2: Okay's speaking of oz. Okay, let's try to let's try
Speaker 2: to figure out if we can break this down. Okay,
Speaker 2: because I have heard lots of you know, podcasters and
Speaker 2: stuff explain it, which is helpful because even though I
Speaker 2: watch every episode, I'm still like, wait, huh so, and
Speaker 2: I don't even understand how Kiki Monique, who we both
Speaker 2: know and it's a completely normal, nice person, how she
Speaker 2: got dragged into this?
Speaker 3: Okay, So all you need to know is Kiki went
Speaker 3: out with Katie. Katie like met with a bunch of
Speaker 3: different people in the off season, like, oh, you know
Speaker 3: you're you're a blogger, You're like just I think to
Speaker 3: kind of No, No, I think she went out to
Speaker 3: kind of meet people in the space, kind of the
Speaker 3: way somebody who starts a job you're gonna meet the
Speaker 3: vendors you're gonna meet, Like, I don't think that's that unusual.
Speaker 2: Okay, but can I ask you a question? Yeah, we
Speaker 2: can cut this out if you.
Speaker 1: Don't want it.
Speaker 2: Are you gonna ever say that you went out to
Speaker 2: lunch with Katie? I, well, okay, you can talk, you
Speaker 2: can talk about it, Okay, go ahead.
Speaker 3: So it's not that unusual. I am a year ago
Speaker 3: I met with her. I want to lunch. I was like, oh,
Speaker 3: you know you live. You live in a neighborhood or by.
Speaker 3: So went out to lunch. And I saw her several
Speaker 3: times over a weekend and I had scheduled to interview her,
Speaker 3: and then it was delayed for some reason, and I
Speaker 3: tried to follow up with it to schedule it, and
Speaker 3: it was like crickets. I never got a text back,
Speaker 3: and I was just nothing. And then I look on
Speaker 3: Instagram and she's unfollowed me, and I was like okay, Now,
Speaker 3: for those of us that have schedule podcast interviews, you
Speaker 3: can imagine how annoying that is.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because you're like, okay, next week, I'm gonna slot
Speaker 2: this in. Let me just nail the time down. Yeah,
Speaker 2: And now I'm like what. So I go back to
Speaker 2: Bravo and I'm like, so, I guess you know. I
Speaker 2: was like, well, well, I'm not doing the interview with
Speaker 2: her because so can I have Emily and they were like, wait,
Speaker 2: are you sure don't you still want to do Katie?
Speaker 2: And I went, well, no, like I've moved on. I'm annoying,
Speaker 2: Like I like, I'm not going to wait around for
Speaker 2: weeks for so it is cod But do you think.
Speaker 1: This was this?
Speaker 2: Was this the same time they were filming, she was
Speaker 2: getting in trouble.
Speaker 1: For all this stuff.
Speaker 3: Okay, so I met her as last weekend of August
Speaker 3: of last year, and that this probably went on several
Speaker 3: weeks where we were trying to coordinate. So maybe, but
Speaker 3: I've had other people ask me when you got to
Speaker 3: because what people are saying is that when Katie met
Speaker 3: with other people, she was just like talking about each
Speaker 3: cast member like this is what they have alleged, like, oh,
Speaker 3: like I met with her and she's like, here's why
Speaker 3: this person's horrible, this is their deep a secret. I
Speaker 3: did not have that experience at all. I feel like
Speaker 3: we talked a lot about her life. So that's why
Speaker 3: I have said the whole season, like why are we
Speaker 3: not getting to her story? Which I think if you
Speaker 3: know the origin story, some of this kind of makes sense.
Speaker 3: We never get to it. But of course you know
Speaker 3: me I'm prone to ask people lots of questions, so
Speaker 3: maybe that's why that didn't happen. But I did not
Speaker 3: have that experience with her. I thought her story was
Speaker 3: very interesting, and again I don't know why it doesn't
Speaker 3: come up. I think that So do I think it's
Speaker 3: normal that she met with people? Yeah?
Speaker 1: What's abnormal?
Speaker 3: I think in the whole equation, if true, would be
Speaker 3: sharing a story that someone told you that blurs the
Speaker 3: line of legality. So if you were in your normal
Speaker 3: life and we're together and you say to me, so
Speaker 3: someone that we know, Sarah, make up a name, Sarah
Speaker 3: was at a party at John's house, and she says
Speaker 3: she got drug while she was there. And then I
Speaker 3: go and I tell somebody who has a public platform
Speaker 3: and says, Mary Paine told me that when Sarah was
Speaker 3: at John's house that he drugged her. Now, in the
Speaker 3: regular world that we live, and we'd be like, wait,
Speaker 3: what like this is and then Sarah and John would
Speaker 3: be like why would you spread that rumor? Like there's
Speaker 3: no proof of it. That could totally harm my business,
Speaker 3: my job, my life. That's where it's a problem. So
Speaker 3: I do believe Gretchen probably said something because I don't
Speaker 3: think Katie totally pulled that out of nowhere. To what degree,
Speaker 3: I don't know. But it begins there the planting the seed,
Speaker 3: and then then it seed.
Speaker 1: But then we saw Gretchen say it on camera. She said,
Speaker 1: go to the hospital. She whispered it. She said, I was.
Speaker 3: So so she said something that planted the seed.
Speaker 1: Right, She's probably said something.
Speaker 3: But then because now then she says, well, I misspoke.
Speaker 3: So it's just like what So she clearly planted the seed.
Speaker 3: That's a problem. And the second problem is carrying that
Speaker 3: seed to somebody who has access to a public platform.
Speaker 3: And because of that, Kiki then goes to two other
Speaker 3: people and says, hey, I went out with Katie and
Speaker 3: she says this thing that's like deeply troubling and blurs
Speaker 3: the line of legality. Have you heard this too? Now?
Speaker 3: That person then calls Tamra. Now tamar is about the
Speaker 3: film or is starting a film, and then she brings
Speaker 3: it on camera. The shocker to me is that they
Speaker 3: would actually include this in filming because to me, I'm
Speaker 3: going back to this is a legal issue, right right,
Speaker 3: I think everybody's involved in this to some degree. There's
Speaker 3: all culpability and the other problem is, you know everyone
Speaker 3: is lying in some way about some part of the story.
Speaker 3: You just can't pinpoint to what degree. And that sucks
Speaker 3: because you want to feel like there's at least one
Speaker 3: narrator in this thing that we're watching, and I know one.
Speaker 3: I can't. You don't know what anyone's truth is.
Speaker 2: Well, how does Sheiina get involved? Because people are like, oh,
Speaker 2: so Kiki said it.
Speaker 1: To Shina and she knows, like, don't bring my own.
Speaker 3: Teddy interviewed Katie and Teddy Okay Okay on her podcast,
Speaker 3: and Teddy said, I was asking her about this and
Speaker 3: she's like, well, I heard this rumor, so again, it's
Speaker 3: the game of telephone. I don't know. Somebody somewhere along
Speaker 3: the lines goes, well, probably they were probably like, well,
Speaker 3: Gretchen is friends with Kiki and Sheena, so maybe there's
Speaker 3: some connection, not based on any proof or anything. So
Speaker 3: Teddy says that in Katie's reaction is sort of like
Speaker 3: not denying that, and then Sheena and Kiki they record
Speaker 3: together and they're like, this is absolutely not true. So
Speaker 3: I think it's just it's we're all sort of lost
Speaker 3: in all of us, like passing the seed. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: that it's just it's really frustrating.
Speaker 2: Well, it's so interesting because I was trying to figure out, like,
Speaker 2: at this time when Katie was meeting with various people,
Speaker 2: which is in her right to do whatever, and you
Speaker 2: have lunch with her, and I was like, and ghost
Speaker 2: did you?
Speaker 1: Is what happened?
Speaker 3: She goes to me. I found her to be lovely
Speaker 3: and yeah, you in your story. I sent it everybody.
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, I think she's really interesting. Then I
Speaker 3: got mad when I got ghosted, of course, because I
Speaker 3: was like, I got to schedule my show. Yeah.
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Speaker 2: Wayfair dot com. That's Wayfair dot com, way fai r
Speaker 2: dot com, Wayfair, every style, every home. Yes, I remember
Speaker 2: all of it, but now that we're seeing it on TV,
Speaker 2: I'm wondering if around the same time which she goes
Speaker 2: at you completely, she was like, oh, I can't talk
Speaker 2: to anybody anymore.
Speaker 3: I think it was before that.
Speaker 1: Because then after, because then she did. She did.
Speaker 2: She did refollow you and swing back around like six
Speaker 2: months later, and you were like, girls, get out of here.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I don't remember if she did. I know her
Speaker 3: husband did. Did she I don't remember. I don't remember anymore.
Speaker 3: Was like, listen, I just told you I have a
Speaker 3: photographic memory, but I don't that part. I don't remember.
Speaker 3: Maybe she did. I remember being very annoyed, though.
Speaker 2: You were very annoyed, okay, but she reached back out,
Speaker 2: but it was like months after she had un followed you,
Speaker 2: and you're like no.
Speaker 3: I was like that because once someone has like screwed
Speaker 3: you over, you're like fuck off, We're I think everybody
Speaker 3: can kind of understand that. I was like, I don't
Speaker 3: you know what what? And then also, you when you
Speaker 3: spend time trying to get to know someone and you
Speaker 3: feel like your time was not valued. It annoys, well,
Speaker 3: it annoys me, like, yes, I spent a lot of
Speaker 3: time getting to know her and and really was a
Speaker 3: great listener, and then felt like I was sort of
Speaker 3: like disposable and I didn't like that feeling. That's how
Speaker 3: I felt. If that was her intention, I don't know,
Speaker 3: but I but at the time that's how I felt.
Speaker 3: And I remember I called you and I was like,
Speaker 3: I am so annoyed.
Speaker 1: Yeah, very annoyed.
Speaker 2: And also it has like you know, in our world,
Speaker 2: it's always annoying when you count on somebody and they
Speaker 2: cancel that day the day before. I've definitely had people chancel,
Speaker 2: which is even hard.
Speaker 3: For people to get. They it's hard. If you're not
Speaker 3: a podcaster, you're not going to get it and you're
Speaker 3: going to go, well, this is but it is a
Speaker 3: massively stressful thing, especially when you have five children and
Speaker 3: you're trying to coordinate around their schedules. And then I'm like, Okay,
Speaker 3: now I have to come up with another plan, and.
Speaker 1: I have advertisers and the episode has to go out.
Speaker 2: At midnight and it's four PM, and I got no show,
Speaker 2: and I've got a two hour window to do it because.
Speaker 1: I've got a babysitter, I've got a dead I've got
Speaker 1: the whatever, you know.
Speaker 2: So yeah, I remember all of that, but I was
Speaker 2: just trying to put it together in my brain if
Speaker 2: they were filming or if something happened in that time
Speaker 2: where she not just goested you k.
Speaker 1: Casey because she's like, fuck that bitch.
Speaker 2: It was more like I gotta I can't speak to
Speaker 2: anybody that's in the podcasting, the news, the blogger business
Speaker 2: because I don't want to get in trouble because I
Speaker 2: did something and now I'm in trouble.
Speaker 3: So I think it was I think it was before
Speaker 3: because I think all of this stuff was happening in March.
Speaker 2: They filmed all this in March, I think, so of
Speaker 2: twenty twenty five, No.
Speaker 3: No, I think, so, yeah, look it up.
Speaker 1: Don't they filmed me year? But I don't know when
Speaker 1: they filmed.
Speaker 3: I don't know. No, Well, we're already in September, So
Speaker 3: I think it was back then because so that's when
Speaker 3: I think they went to New Orleans, was like February
Speaker 3: March or something.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because I remember that in Tamer being like everybody's
Speaker 2: Tamer quit again, Like okayl Well that is an interesting story,
Speaker 2: and we'll see what happens. And you know, I've heard
Speaker 2: the rumors as you have of there's gonna be this big,
Speaker 2: terrible thing that happens at the end of the season
Speaker 2: regarding Gretchen, and.
Speaker 3: You know, I do know, I do know what happens at.
Speaker 2: The end, and and homophobia and of course Heather.
Speaker 3: I just think three, if you were already feeling totally
Speaker 3: yucky for lack of a better term, ick, if you've
Speaker 3: been feeling ick about this season, it's gonna get worse.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's my thought. That's my thought.
Speaker 2: And you know, sort of like at the end of
Speaker 2: New Jersey where you're just like that one, we were
Speaker 2: already feeling so bad and now it's made it worse
Speaker 2: at the end, Like why can't everybody.
Speaker 3: Just get I do feel like the New Jersey and
Speaker 3: the OC is just like it's very similar.
Speaker 1: The toxicity.
Speaker 3: It's not fun to watch. There's no fun in that
Speaker 3: show at all.
Speaker 2: Well, it's sort of like people said about The Valley
Speaker 2: that they really like hated how toxic it was, and
Speaker 2: I was like, I loved every minute of it. Something
Speaker 2: wrong with me or what what? Somebody sent me a
Speaker 2: reel the other day and listener, and it was Jax
Speaker 2: like being crazy. It's like, you know, him with his
Speaker 2: nose bandage and him with this blood and the punching
Speaker 2: and all, you know, all like the scared Jax memes
Speaker 2: in that. And it ended with when he like threw
Speaker 2: that chunky sweater off and went to beat up that
Speaker 2: guy in the parking lot that Oussi he was dating
Speaker 2: or whatever, and I was like, God, he was hot.
Speaker 3: That was my first Oh my god, wait did you
Speaker 3: watch You didn't watch it? It just came out today. First, Trap,
Speaker 3: the documentary on William White.
Speaker 1: No, tell me who's William White?
Speaker 3: Okay that your listeners are going to be fired up
Speaker 3: about this one. I got my pen.
Speaker 1: I'm writing it down.
Speaker 3: There are two episodes came out today, Paramount Plus. Okay, okay,
Speaker 3: but wait first, wait how many episodes will then? Because
Speaker 3: you know I've got all my diffriend's coming this weekend. Oh,
Speaker 3: you're gonna watch this is the one you're gonna watch
Speaker 3: with them? You're gonna yeah? Okay, that and Charlie Sheen documentary.
Speaker 2: I was going to get them to watch if they
Speaker 2: hadn't seen Unknown Caller and tell them nothing about it
Speaker 2: and have them watch that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a good one too. But okay, let me
Speaker 3: explain thirstrap because you may have different opinions. But okay,
Speaker 3: so imagine and Heather interviewed him during COVID twenty one
Speaker 3: year old landscaper from Canada makes these TikTok videos where
Speaker 3: he's lip syncing to bearing.
Speaker 2: Okay, I remember when Heather interviewed him. Okay, yeah, this way,
Speaker 2: he's just dim dumber than a box of rocks. Yeah yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: as my mother would say, criminally stupid. Oh and big
Speaker 2: blue eyes, wide smile, dimous, gorgeous.
Speaker 3: You would kind of look like like like a young
Speaker 3: version of like John Mellencamp and the Jack and Diane
Speaker 3: video kind of like a like a just like a
Speaker 3: Indiana Canada, kind of like Canada, you know, like like
Speaker 3: not a city guy.
Speaker 1: Right, Okay, I got it.
Speaker 3: Makes these videos and surprisingly the women that made him
Speaker 3: go viral the audience was like women over fifty, and
Speaker 3: it was, you know, strategic on his part. He's choosing
Speaker 3: songs that were right up their alley. They were going
Speaker 3: back to the roller skating days of their lives. I
Speaker 3: don't know, and they're like, he is so hot, and
Speaker 3: that's when you could start sending people money on TikTok.
Speaker 3: Yeah and yeah, Like one woman's on there, she's probably
Speaker 3: in her sixties now, and she's like, I've sent I
Speaker 3: sent him like two hundred thousand dollars. They are all
Speaker 3: dying over him, and he would do TikTok lives and
Speaker 3: they would some of them were like I would wake
Speaker 3: up at five o'clock just to see him during his live.
Speaker 3: Then they started going to Canada to his hometown and
Speaker 3: hopes to see him. Like so really harkens back to
Speaker 3: like the teen bop days, right, but in this case
Speaker 3: it's a twenty one year old and the women and
Speaker 3: the people that love him are in their.
Speaker 1: Fifties and sixties, okay.
Speaker 3: And it was like he would go on TikTok Live
Speaker 3: and be like, I'm going to go to Kelsey's restaurant,
Speaker 3: which is like their local state or burger place, and
Speaker 3: then he'd go to pay and then be like, somebody's
Speaker 3: already taken care of it. He like he was. So
Speaker 3: he's at first seems kind of sweet and dopey, and
Speaker 3: then you see he's getting money and he's like these
Speaker 3: broad these idiots and he's like, they're giving me what
Speaker 3: I want, right, and then they start getting possessive of him.
Speaker 3: And when one of those groups went to visit him,
Speaker 3: this one woman they called the Disney Mom. I don't know,
Speaker 3: she was like because of her like Instagram handle or something.
Speaker 3: They go up into her room and they get it
Speaker 3: on William White and the woman and she's like talking
Speaker 3: about the experience and how all of these women went
Speaker 3: insane on her. Afterward, they were like bitter and angry.
Speaker 1: Now I see a single guy or I live with
Speaker 1: his mother, Like yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, he lives with his mother. Same. Yeah, she's
Speaker 3: the same age as these women, okay. And they're all
Speaker 3: trying to be friends with the mom, and then the
Speaker 3: mom gets upset because then she starts getting things sent
Speaker 3: to her house and she's like, now we've crossed the line.
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh wait, now we've crossed the line. Okay.
Speaker 3: So there are women who are like they're duets, you know.
Speaker 3: And TikTok were side by side videos where they're like
Speaker 3: lustfully looking look after the sky's like joy and then
Speaker 3: he was like get a girlfriend or something, and then
Speaker 3: they would be angry. It was like parasocial behavior on
Speaker 3: crack Yeah okay, and then it kind of ends with
Speaker 3: like the fallout where he starts like resenting these people
Speaker 3: and like talking smack to them, and then they hate him,
Speaker 3: and they're two factions. There's like a positive group that
Speaker 3: love everything he does, and then there's the negative group
Speaker 3: that like trolls the positive people.
Speaker 1: Yeah okay.
Speaker 3: And then like his relationship with the internet, like wanting
Speaker 3: to be on it but wanting to be off it,
Speaker 3: and the amount of money people were sending him is insane.
Speaker 3: And so I made Heather McDonald watch it last night.
Speaker 3: She watched it with Drake, and she texts me she's like,
Speaker 3: I'm embarrassed right now to be a woman or something
Speaker 3: because she's like it's like Drake's age person. She's like
Speaker 3: of the fan group, and she's like, this is so
Speaker 3: crazy that these women like went crazy for him. And
Speaker 3: she's like, he's not as hot as he was in
Speaker 3: the video. I'm like, yeah, because he was getting older,
Speaker 3: and like I don't I feel like, well, he had
Speaker 3: some addiction issues, and I feel like the addiction issues
Speaker 3: went strach was face. Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, it's funny that you say this, So Anna
Speaker 2: had a friend that was a high school friend and
Speaker 2: maybe it was no, it must have been high school
Speaker 2: was before she went to the other school. And she
Speaker 2: had this guy and he dated her friend Fiona, and
Speaker 2: he came to our house. He was I mean, like
Speaker 2: the guy that played Elvis.
Speaker 3: In the movie. Was his name, Oh, Austin Austin Smith.
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, I'm talking like look like that.
Speaker 2: Okay, Like just as an adult woman, You're like, that's
Speaker 2: a good looking kid, Like, whoa, he should be a
Speaker 2: model like that, you know, just like, okay, dated her
Speaker 2: friend Fiona. Good for you, Fiona, whatever, he's hot. But
Speaker 2: then Anna tells me, oh, you know, he's got this
Speaker 2: viral tiktoka and.
Speaker 1: I go, no, I don't know about it. Why would
Speaker 1: I know? It doesn't come up.
Speaker 2: I'm looking for like Amazon fndes and like what to
Speaker 2: buy from Target, you know, and sometimes cute dog memes
Speaker 2: is what comes up for me. And she goes, oh
Speaker 2: my god, no, he's got like two million I mean,
Speaker 2: something crazy on tikto. This was way back and it
Speaker 2: popped off during COVID, same thing, same idea, and he
Speaker 2: was singing like Elvis songs.
Speaker 3: Oh god, oh yeah. So it was like the same idea,
Speaker 3: you're in the sixty year old ye because.
Speaker 2: Somebody said you kind of look like a young Elvis
Speaker 2: or whatever. And I said, and I go, why is
Speaker 2: he's always in like these mom jeans?
Speaker 1: Like why you know? And that's why I'm not this.
Speaker 1: It's not relating to me that people will be like, whoa,
Speaker 1: we's so hot because it is like such.
Speaker 2: A nerd, you know, and she goes, mom, I don't know.
Speaker 2: People just love him. But he just went to college
Speaker 2: and lived his life. But I remember talking to him
Speaker 2: one time. Whatever his name was, it'll never come back
Speaker 2: to me. I'll have to ask hnma. But I remember
Speaker 2: asking him one time like, how do you make money
Speaker 2: on TikTok? If you like have such a I don't like,
Speaker 2: I don't know. And he goes, oh, well, people like
Speaker 2: buy you things or they send.
Speaker 1: You roses or whatever. And I go and then you
Speaker 1: cash it out.
Speaker 2: Like it goes into an account, and he goes, yeah,
Speaker 2: you have like a TikTok account and you're going to
Speaker 2: cash it out like if you sell purses on po
Speaker 2: or something.
Speaker 3: I was like, what, yeah, a lot of money. Some
Speaker 3: of those women basically said that watching his videos gave
Speaker 3: them this sexual awakening like it had been dormant, you know,
Speaker 3: maybe because of a divorce or raising kids, and then
Speaker 3: suddenly they were like having the feelings. And then for
Speaker 3: somebody their child's age, yes, and then they were having
Speaker 3: these feelings of like maybe we could be together. It's
Speaker 3: like delusion.
Speaker 2: Okay, I'm writing this down thirst Trap, and I'm going
Speaker 2: to ask my friends because when we was.
Speaker 3: Weird because someone were like, oh, I just think of
Speaker 3: him as my friend. I'm like, why would you have
Speaker 3: a friend who's a twenty one year old landscaper from Canada?
Speaker 2: You should be like speaking of at a landscape or
Speaker 2: come over here today. The one that I talked about,
Speaker 2: like it's got to do something for the dogs.
Speaker 1: Dogs. She's really cute, real cute.
Speaker 3: I got real nervous, you know, like, hey, I knew
Speaker 3: someone who had an affair with the landscaper.
Speaker 2: No, it's not happening here. But I'll tell you that
Speaker 2: a lot of people that work here. This is in
Speaker 2: North Carolina, and that's the word area.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, but the people.
Speaker 2: Come from the tiny towns that do all the work
Speaker 2: on nobody lives here. They all, you know, come over
Speaker 2: on the ferry and I guess this guy does too,
Speaker 2: but they have work trucks that that stay here or whatever.
Speaker 2: But a lot of people are just like local, small
Speaker 2: town North Carolina, just real, like real salt of the earth. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, missing some teeth, gonna drink a Budweiser and
Speaker 2: go fishing on the weekend.
Speaker 1: Like just just nice, good for the regular regular folk.
Speaker 3: Yeah, this guy shows up and I was like, whoaah, Yeah,
Speaker 3: good for.
Speaker 2: You, Good for you, hot landscaper. Yeah, anyway, that's just
Speaker 2: a sidebar.
Speaker 3: One time I had an Uber driver and I said,
Speaker 3: you look like I don't know, I like, why is this?
Speaker 3: I said, you look like you could be a professional
Speaker 3: soccer player from Dubai. And he goes, looks like me
Speaker 3: crazy and I was like, oh sorry, and then he goes,
Speaker 3: my brother is a professional soccer player in Dubai.
Speaker 1: No way.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he showed me on his phone. I was like, wow,
Speaker 3: I don't know. Well it was weird.
Speaker 2: Last story, and this is what we do and this
Speaker 2: is why you're going to enjoy our new side quest
Speaker 2: is I had the driver yesterday. So you when you
Speaker 2: land to come to the beach, you land at the
Speaker 2: Willington airport and you have to have an Uber. But
Speaker 2: if you call an Uber, it's literally going to be
Speaker 2: the same guy that you hire as the driver, and
Speaker 2: it's going to be the same price. There's like four
Speaker 2: Uber drivers and then they also do like private car
Speaker 2: service in their van or whatever. So this is this
Speaker 2: guy that I know, so he you know, you text him,
Speaker 2: here's when I'm landing, and he drives you, drives you
Speaker 2: over to the ferry, and then you take the ferry.
Speaker 2: It's plane trains and automobiles. So anyway, I was in
Speaker 2: the car with him and he started talking about something
Speaker 2: about true crime.
Speaker 1: I was like ooh.
Speaker 2: I was like, well, I love a true crime story
Speaker 2: or something, and he goes, yeah, I kind of got
Speaker 2: into that. He goes something about tell me about that
Speaker 2: that story about the Murdos.
Speaker 1: Can you tell me about that?
Speaker 2: I go, well, it's only a forty five minute ride, Like,
Speaker 2: I mean, how much time do you? So I went
Speaker 2: through kind of what I can even remember, you know,
Speaker 2: specifically about it. And so then I said, but let
Speaker 2: me tell you what you do need to be following
Speaker 2: as the Donna Adelson situation, because.
Speaker 3: You're like, oh good, oh yeah, I have something to this, okay.
Speaker 2: I gave him the whole story, and then I kept
Speaker 2: going and then and I kept like remembering shit, you know,
Speaker 2: I was like, and then he sampled the money, and
Speaker 2: then you know, I kept remembering like so many things,
Speaker 2: and I completely have forgotten the part about them going
Speaker 2: to Vietnam. And then halfway through he goes next, I go,
Speaker 2: oh my god, I totally forgot. They were trying to
Speaker 2: go one way to Vietnam.
Speaker 3: He goes, well, that's a red flag.
Speaker 1: I go, well, exactly.
Speaker 2: I go, well, they've been to Vietnam before and their
Speaker 2: friend came over and told him to buy one way
Speaker 2: because it was cheaper.
Speaker 3: He's like, oh, well, no, bullshit, yeah totally.
Speaker 1: I was trying to give him both sides. So anyway,
Speaker 1: I was like, what to watch for is.
Speaker 2: What's going to happen with, you know, Wendy and Harvey.
Speaker 2: So he's like, okay, Wendy's the wife, Harvey's the dad.
Speaker 2: So he wrote me last night and said, okay, great,
Speaker 2: now I've gone down a rabbit hole. I wrote me this,
Speaker 2: He wrote me this morning. The driver wrote me this
Speaker 2: morning and goes thanks again. I literally stayed up till
Speaker 2: midnight and I've got more research to do today.
Speaker 3: I was like, okay, I appreciate that. I was talking
Speaker 3: to a consultant that I hadn't talked to and like
Speaker 3: we haven't worked together in maybe six years or something.
Speaker 3: And I was like, oh, I was thinking about you
Speaker 3: and all the true crime stuff that you're working on.
Speaker 3: He goes, are you following the Adolson case? I go, am,
Speaker 3: I following the Adolesen case. I just interviewed an attorney
Speaker 3: from Tallahassee about it. And he goes, Wendy Adelson was
Speaker 3: my old girlfriend when uh huh school or something, no,
Speaker 3: in college. I go, what before she married? Does it
Speaker 3: tell me everything?
Speaker 1: What is going on?
Speaker 3: And he said she was the person that I dated
Speaker 3: before I met my wife that I ended up marrying.
Speaker 3: And he said, I go, was the family weird? And
Speaker 3: he said, oh no, I go, well, what do you
Speaker 3: think happened? He goes, absolutely, she knew about the whole plan.
Speaker 3: There's no doubt about it. That family, it was totally weird.
Speaker 3: And he said they she talked to her mom constantly,
Speaker 3: like all day long. And he said I never met
Speaker 3: the older brother because he seemingly, even then like wanted
Speaker 3: nothing to do with the family. I mean he's been
Speaker 3: married to his wife for like this guy, he's been
Speaker 3: married for like nineteen years or something, but he said
Speaker 3: he remembered this one Thanksgiving she canceled. She was like, remember, yeah,
Speaker 3: how I wanted you to come. Like, we're not gonna
Speaker 3: do that anymore. We're just gonna keep it just the
Speaker 3: family cold and told the boyfriend, I know you were
Speaker 3: going to come visit me for Thanksgiving to spend it
Speaker 3: with your family, but now because we just wanted to
Speaker 3: be family. He's like, of course they all knew the plan,
Speaker 3: all of them.
Speaker 1: I they're so amastring.
Speaker 2: When I was talking to the driver last night, I
Speaker 2: was like, there's so many things that point that she
Speaker 2: did know, and then there's so many things that are
Speaker 2: like ran that's just circumstantially. You have to look at
Speaker 2: it from what a jury has to look at it. Circumstantially,
Speaker 2: like there's no concrete email or anything that she knew.
Speaker 2: It's just so I was like, I don't know until
Speaker 2: they get something concrete on her. But they said stay tuned,
Speaker 2: So we're staying tuned, Stay tuned, stay tuned. So just
Speaker 2: I mean the dad Markell, the dad when he got
Speaker 2: up and he listed all the people that now don't
Speaker 2: have parents, and all the people that are affected, don't
Speaker 2: have a sister, don't have a mother, don't have these
Speaker 2: people don't have any parents, these people don't have grandparents
Speaker 2: because of what you've done, Like anyone.
Speaker 3: Wasn't worth it.
Speaker 2: That was so powerful when he listed out you know,
Speaker 2: Katherine mcmanawa's children have no parents. Now, you know, all
Speaker 2: these these Lincoln in whatever the other one's name is,
Speaker 2: don't have probably eventually won't have parents either, And then
Speaker 2: what's in place?
Speaker 1: Who's going to take care of them?
Speaker 3: You know, did you bro the way watch any of
Speaker 3: the Chrislies stuff. No, Kate's getting better. I just have
Speaker 3: such a hard time with it, I know, but it's
Speaker 3: getting better and better. The family is so honest about
Speaker 3: how messed up they are. I just I like them
Speaker 3: even more. I mean I would watch it back in
Speaker 3: the day, like early earlier, and I was like, yeah,
Speaker 3: they seems funny, And then I just took a long,
Speaker 3: long break.
Speaker 2: Because it was so like, here comes Grandma. Isn't she
Speaker 2: crazy in the kitchen? Like it was so fake scripted.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So the opposite now where Chase is clearly still
Speaker 3: on drugs. He's engaged to a girl, and Julie wants
Speaker 3: nothing to do with this girl. She's like, I'm not
Speaker 3: going to meet her. I don't want anything to do
Speaker 3: with her. And she's got a mom who is definitely
Speaker 3: invested in this relationship so she can be like a
Speaker 3: TikTok star. Then you have Grace and the youngest one,
Speaker 3: he's the voice of reason. And oh the grandparents Julie's parents.
Speaker 3: The father I think his name's Harvey two. He and
Speaker 3: Savannah despise each other and they have this like bolt
Speaker 3: like rip each other apart conversation on camera where you're like,
Speaker 3: you're like holding your head. You're like, oh my god,
Speaker 3: I can't believe they went through with this on camera.
Speaker 3: It is like the most complicated family and it is
Speaker 3: nothing that you thought from the original version of the show.
Speaker 3: That one was like package with a nice bow, yeah,
Speaker 3: and this one you're like, oh my god. Julie's parents
Speaker 3: hate Todd, and then Julie's parents crossed a son, and
Speaker 3: now they basically have transferred their feelings about their deceased
Speaker 3: son onto Chase. So Chase gets away with everything, but
Speaker 3: it's actually probably led him into a deeper addiction.
Speaker 1: I didn't know Chase had addiction problems.
Speaker 3: No, I didn't either, And it's heartbreaking because he's like
Speaker 3: sitting on the couch and he's such a he's got
Speaker 3: funny he's like his dad. He's got like funny one liners.
Speaker 3: But he's got the sensitivity of his mom. But his
Speaker 3: arms or I don't know anything about that much about
Speaker 3: like certain addictions, but like you know, when like he
Speaker 3: has no muscle on his body, it's just like these
Speaker 3: thin arms where it just looks like he never exercises
Speaker 3: or eats healthier. And You're like, I'm worried about him,
Speaker 3: and I'm worried about Julie. I'm worried about Julie. I'm
Speaker 3: getting better about it because I've been like listening to
Speaker 3: that podcast to just check in on her. I would
Speaker 3: love to interview her. I think she's getting When she
Speaker 3: first came out of prison, I was really worried about her.
Speaker 3: But then and the last episode, someone who was in
Speaker 3: prison with her, this really cool lady, I think her
Speaker 3: name is Sharita. She came on and talked to Savannah.
Speaker 3: They were in prison together, and she reads this letter
Speaker 3: that Julie wrote to Sharita and basically said, I prayed
Speaker 3: that God would send me a strong black woman who
Speaker 3: could be a great influence for my granddaughter Chloe. And
Speaker 3: he gave me. He gave you to me, and we
Speaker 3: were going to be we're gonna be friends for the
Speaker 3: rest of our lives. And you're I don't know. I like,
Speaker 3: there's so many layers to it. I find endlessly fascinating.
Speaker 3: It is not what people would think it is. Right.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm just just you know, Oh God at that
Speaker 2: other show just irritated me to no end.
Speaker 1: Kate, Yeah, and he irritates me to no end. But
Speaker 1: I do feel for Julie.
Speaker 3: He doesn't bother me as much anymore because on the
Speaker 3: podcast he said, I absolutely hated doing my show. It
Speaker 3: was like so over it. I didn't really want to
Speaker 3: do it. I was doing it for the kids. That
Speaker 3: level of transparency I really appreciate because we talked to
Speaker 3: these reality stars. That's why I like to interview people
Speaker 3: that are off the show for a while, because then
Speaker 3: you get the real authenticity. When they're in it, they
Speaker 3: will will say and do anything to keep their job. Yes,
Speaker 3: and there's a level of transparency that's happening even with
Speaker 3: the parents that I'm like, Okay, now this is really
Speaker 3: what was going on.
Speaker 2: Speaking of that, next week, I'm talking to Olivia Plath again.
Speaker 3: Oh see, that's that's another one. I think she's really
Speaker 3: pretty transparent.
Speaker 2: It's great because she really she either did or has
Speaker 2: broken her contract with the TLC. She didn't give a
Speaker 2: shit before, and she really doesn't.
Speaker 1: Give a shit.
Speaker 3: She don't give a shit now she didn't give a shit,
Speaker 3: then save a shit now.
Speaker 2: Like I've had actual you know, speaking of like having
Speaker 2: lets the way, I've had actual lunch with Olivia. And
Speaker 2: she couldn't be more easy to talk to, a normal
Speaker 2: and so beyond wise for her years, you know.
Speaker 3: Especially coming from that family system where it's like you
Speaker 3: have all those kids.
Speaker 1: And yeah, her own family and then that family.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Anyway, they talk about her a lot and welcome to
Speaker 2: Pathhil and I'm like, she is a not bothered, she's out.
Speaker 2: She was like in France and she was in Croatia,
Speaker 2: she was in Italy.
Speaker 1: She's like, oh.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Sometimes sometimes I use the crayon box to explain things,
Speaker 3: situations and people. The Plath family are a box of
Speaker 3: eight thick dollar store crayons. She is a box of
Speaker 3: one sixty four, one sixty fours. Can't hang out with
Speaker 3: boxes of eight, you know what I mean, that's so weird.
Speaker 1: But yes, that's where you came up with that. That's
Speaker 1: actually your brain.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Some people are just so basic. They don't see
Speaker 3: beyond that, and they're you know, and they and theirs
Speaker 3: are thick because they're they're troubled and they have not
Speaker 3: read a book in fourteen years, so they don't really
Speaker 3: know basic things. And you know, she's been to Croatia
Speaker 3: in France, but her life is much more full of
Speaker 3: different colors. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And Michael almost escaped, but he suck got sucked again.
Speaker 3: Because he's a He's as my mother I would say,
Speaker 3: criminally stupid.
Speaker 1: Bless him, bless his heart. It's so cute. Listen, everybody,
Speaker 1: you know where to find k Casey.
Speaker 3: You know what, though, I would love for people to
Speaker 3: go and do two things for me. The Bonus podcasts
Speaker 3: on Patreon but also on Apple podcasts. And also to
Speaker 3: follow or to subscribe to my what to watch list.
Speaker 3: You have substack dot com because I want you guys
Speaker 3: to get the list of what to watch each week,
Speaker 3: because you would have missed thirst trap if I had
Speaker 3: not even mentioned that, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: And then I constantly constantly look at your Oh that's awesome.
Speaker 1: Yeah it's Kksey dot substack dot com and that's what
Speaker 1: to watch and that's free.
Speaker 3: Free comes right to your email box. God bless, and
Speaker 3: you look at it, you go, ah, shit, you might
Speaker 3: not know God, God bless from Chris Farah used to
Speaker 3: say God Bless, and I got that from her.
Speaker 1: I feel like she says it.
Speaker 3: She says it all the time hers, but she says
Speaker 3: it like fifteen more times than we do. But it
Speaker 3: definitely Wade weighs on me and I enjoy it. It's
Speaker 3: a good way to She.
Speaker 2: Says it in a frantic way like I don't know. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's like I mean, you know, like who's who amonks?
Speaker 1: But God bless.
Speaker 3: You know what she is like if you go to
Speaker 3: lunch with her or dinner with her, she'll talk to
Speaker 3: the waiter and she'll find out everything about the waiter,
Speaker 3: and then the waiter will mess up something and then
Speaker 3: she'll apologize to the waiter as if she was the waiter,
Speaker 3: and then talk to the manager about how the waiter
Speaker 3: should not be fired.
Speaker 2: Does that make Yeah, I'm gonna tell you that going
Speaker 2: out to a meal with Chris and Matt is rough
Speaker 2: because Matt also.
Speaker 1: I love your tattoos. That's color looks so good to you.
Speaker 1: I'm like, we don't know her. We are here to
Speaker 1: talk to each other.
Speaker 3: Yea, yeah, Matt and be like how's your mom? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Oh you're so pretty. I bet you have Italian background.
Speaker 1: We don't care.
Speaker 3: Just tell me about your first boyfriend. You know he
Speaker 3: did that to you. Get out of here. God.
Speaker 2: The two of them just went to dinner or something
Speaker 2: the other day and he wrote me. He's like, oh
Speaker 2: I just saw Chris. I was like, oh god, y'all
Speaker 2: even have a conversation. Did you only just talk to
Speaker 2: the people around you?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: He was like, yeah, we do do that.
Speaker 3: Well. I have the opposite problem. I was leaving a
Speaker 3: restaurant on Sunday and I saw Shannon Badoor sitting with
Speaker 3: her dad and I said hi to her, and then
Speaker 3: my husband came over and was like, the car is
Speaker 3: pulled up or leaving you? Like he has to rip
Speaker 3: me away because then I would just because I want
Speaker 3: to ask her everything about OC. But like she used
Speaker 3: to talk to her dad. You know what I mean,
Speaker 3: what's the same da same Jean Jean. She said to Dan,
Speaker 3: you know, my dad is ninety six years old, and
Speaker 3: Dan said, you look really good for ninety six. Yeah,
Speaker 3: but you could tell the dad was like, I really
Speaker 3: just want to sit with my daughter. And that's when
Speaker 3: and I'm glad Dance said that's me. I got in
Speaker 3: the car and I was like, you're right. He was
Speaker 3: just sort of like, I, you know what, that's all fun,
Speaker 3: great show, blah blah blah, like I want to be
Speaker 3: with my daughter.
Speaker 2: Did you get any information out of her before your
Speaker 2: husband pulled you away?
Speaker 3: Uh, not too much, but she just was like, you know,
Speaker 3: it's been it's been a it's a been a heck
Speaker 3: of a week or two or three or four. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Luckily she's not in the middle of it, so
Speaker 1: that's good for her.
Speaker 3: I did say, was I like that part of the
Speaker 3: last episode where her daughter was back on camera. She
Speaker 3: looks super happy her daughter. And you know what, you
Speaker 3: could say whatever you want about these women, but I
Speaker 3: do think when they have kids, you kind of get
Speaker 3: a sense of like their parenting when you see the
Speaker 3: adult kids, and it seems like her kids really enjoy
Speaker 3: nice relationship with her, and they're all kind of independent
Speaker 3: and happy people.
Speaker 1: I agree, not because the David Badoura will just say
Speaker 1: that allegedly.
Speaker 3: I would not think so. Okay, kay, I'll love I've
Speaker 3: always heard that though with Shannon's kids, because I live
Speaker 3: in the same town. The people have always said her
Speaker 3: kids are really nice kids. Okay, listen, this is not
Speaker 3: a shann Badoura podcast. Okay, I'll talk to you later,
Speaker 3: but