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<v Speaker 1>You are listening to the IFAH podcast Network. For more

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<v Speaker 1>amazing filmmaking and screenwriting podcasts, just go to ifagpodcastnetwork dot com.

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome to the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, Episode number three eighty seven.

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<v Speaker 2>The pictures are there and you just take them.

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<v Speaker 1>Robert Kappa broadcasting from a dark, windowless room in Hollywood.

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<v Speaker 2>When we really should be working on that next draft.

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<v Speaker 1>It's the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, showing you the craft and

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<v Speaker 1>business of screenwriting while teaching you how to make your

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<v Speaker 1>screenplay bulletproof.

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<v Speaker 2>And here's your host, Alex Ferrari. Welcome, Welcome to another

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<v Speaker 2>episode of the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast. I am your humble

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<v Speaker 2>host Alex Ferrari. Now, today's show is sponsored by Bulletproof

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<v Speaker 2>script Coverage. Now. Unlike other script coverage services, Bulletproof Script

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<v Speaker 2>Coverage actually focuses on the kind of project you are

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<v Speaker 2>and the goals of the project you are, so we

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<v Speaker 2>actually break it down by three categories, micro budget, indie film,

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<v Speaker 2>market and studio film. There's no reason to get coverage

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<v Speaker 2>from a reader that's used to reading tempole movies when

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<v Speaker 2>your movie is gonna be done for one hundred thousand

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<v Speaker 2>dollars and we wanted to focus on that. At Bulletproof

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<v Speaker 2>Script Coverage, our readers have worked with Marvel Studios, CIA, WME, NBC, HBO, Disney,

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<v Speaker 2>Scott Free, Warner Brothers, The Blacklist, and many many more.

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<v Speaker 2>So if you need your screenplay or TV script covered

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<v Speaker 2>by professional readers, head on over to covermiscreenplay dot com.

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<v Speaker 2>Let's start the episode today with the story. Guys, when

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<v Speaker 2>I put out my second film on the corner of

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<v Speaker 2>ego and desire within I'm going to say eight to

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<v Speaker 2>ten hours somewhere along there's those lines. It was already

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<v Speaker 2>pirated and put up illegally on these sites tour in

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<v Speaker 2>sits where you can download and watch my movie for

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<v Speaker 2>free without giving me, the filmmaker, or my producers any

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<v Speaker 2>revenue from I was a little independent film. Seriously, I

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<v Speaker 2>don't think it gets much more little than as far

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<v Speaker 2>as budget is concerned for ego and desire. But I

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<v Speaker 2>was shocked about it. I was like, man, I can't

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<v Speaker 2>believe they went after me. Someone's so small. I'm not

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<v Speaker 2>the Avengers, I'm not a big studio movie. But it's

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<v Speaker 2>pretty remarkable how the ecosystem works, of how these websites

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<v Speaker 2>are making money why they do what they do, how

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<v Speaker 2>they do it, and so on. I wrote a whole

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<v Speaker 2>article about about how that happened, where I found them,

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<v Speaker 2>kind of the ecosystem things like that, and I'll put

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<v Speaker 2>a link to that in the show notes as well.

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<v Speaker 2>But today I wanted to bring a copyright expert on

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<v Speaker 2>the show, and his name is Evan Zeisel, who is

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<v Speaker 2>the owner and operator of an amazing website and service

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<v Speaker 2>called Copyright Slap. Now, what copyright Slap does is allows filmmakers,

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<v Speaker 2>for twenty bucks a month to come in and send

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<v Speaker 2>out as many sees and the cyst orders as they

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<v Speaker 2>want in that thirty day period to as many different

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<v Speaker 2>websites links anywhere they find their movies. They send a

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<v Speaker 2>ceason assist order, and Copyright Slap not only sends them

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<v Speaker 2>the first letter, but if they don't reply, then they

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<v Speaker 2>send it to their website provider and gets their website

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<v Speaker 2>completely taken down. So their rate of takedowns is pretty

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<v Speaker 2>remarkable and easily the most affordable and effective service doing

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<v Speaker 2>this online today. And Evan and I get into the

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<v Speaker 2>weeds of what these pirates are doing, why they're doing it,

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<v Speaker 2>how they make their money, what kind of ecosystem is

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<v Speaker 2>set up for this world and how we as independent

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<v Speaker 2>filmmakers can fight back against the pirates and take back

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<v Speaker 2>the ip the copyrighted material that we own and we

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<v Speaker 2>deserve to make money with. So, without any further ado,

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<v Speaker 2>please enjoy my conversation with Evan Zeiseel. I like to

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<v Speaker 2>welcome to the show, Evan zeisel Man.

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<v Speaker 3>How you doing, Evan, I'm doing great. I'm doing great.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you for having me.

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<v Speaker 2>Thanks for coming on the show. Man. We're going to

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<v Speaker 2>talk about piracy and copyright infringement and all sorts of sexy, beautiful,

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<v Speaker 2>cool stuff that filmmakers love to talk about.

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<v Speaker 3>But yeah, Johnny Depp being on the internet pretty much right,

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<v Speaker 3>that's what we're talking.

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<v Speaker 2>About, exactly. It's the really, I mean, it's it's it's

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<v Speaker 2>one step above financial breakdowns for future films. No, but

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<v Speaker 2>it all but it's so much fun. But the bottom

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<v Speaker 2>line is it is something that is affecting so many filmmakers,

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<v Speaker 2>not just the Avengers and Game of Thrones.

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<v Speaker 3>But also a lot of money and can afford can

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<v Speaker 3>afford it? Right exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>But then the indies like myself, like I had my

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<v Speaker 2>film Pirate, I think eleven hours after I got put

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<v Speaker 2>up on online. It was already on the pirated boards.

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<v Speaker 3>I was like, that's that's pretty fast. I Mine just

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<v Speaker 3>took under a week.

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<v Speaker 2>My first yeah, mis was eleven hours. I counted. I

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<v Speaker 2>was like, holy cow. So I did a whole episode

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<v Speaker 2>like this is what happened to my film?

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<v Speaker 3>And and there are fake ones too, They're amazing. There

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<v Speaker 3>are fake ones that pop up on films that are

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<v Speaker 3>in festivals that are just up on IMDb, and they

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<v Speaker 3>pull from IMDb the the name and the description and everything,

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<v Speaker 3>and then they say, you know, click to watch, and

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<v Speaker 3>then you have to get a description. And but it's

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<v Speaker 3>all about it's all about the traffic for them. They

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<v Speaker 3>don't care about the actual watching of the film. They

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<v Speaker 3>just want either the ads or the person to show

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<v Speaker 3>up to the site so they can add malware to

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<v Speaker 3>their system and then you know, sell that. Or they've

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<v Speaker 3>got these weird click through things. I mean, it's so many,

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<v Speaker 3>Well we'll get it. They make their money. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>I want to get.

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<v Speaker 2>Into the whole piracy business as well. But first of all,

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<v Speaker 2>how did you a mild mannered filmmaker? You know, the

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<v Speaker 2>Clark Kent of filmmakers, So how did you get into

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<v Speaker 2>the copyright you know, piracy game, like how to protect

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<v Speaker 2>filmmakers from up from copyright piracy.

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<v Speaker 3>I feel like I feel like we all as filmmakers

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<v Speaker 3>start off as I would say, instead of Clark camp

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<v Speaker 3>will go young Bruce Wayne even then somebody comes in

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<v Speaker 3>and murders our parents in front of us, and then

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<v Speaker 3>guess what, Batman shows up, and then Batman's never gonna lead,

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<v Speaker 3>and Batman gets angry and Batman tracks people down right. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>I'm sort of the story of every indie filmmaker. I

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<v Speaker 3>did my first feature film about ten years ago now,

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<v Speaker 3>and we you know, went to festivals, got a distributor,

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<v Speaker 3>and then within a week of going online, I think

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<v Speaker 3>we started on back in the day when Apple TV

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<v Speaker 3>was the big thing. We started on Apple TV, but

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<v Speaker 3>then went to all the other ones. But yeah, within

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<v Speaker 3>a week of being on our first subscription video on

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<v Speaker 3>demand or at whatever I guess it did, it's a

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<v Speaker 3>VOD site. I started popping up on all of these

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<v Speaker 3>piracy sites and they had the film. And with modern technology,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, people just record the Somebody rented it once

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<v Speaker 3>and then recorded the whole thing, so it's pristine quality.

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<v Speaker 3>And instead of people going to our site or even

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<v Speaker 3>when it's on Amazon Prime it's free to watch, so

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<v Speaker 3>but we get money when people watch it. But when

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<v Speaker 3>they go to other sites, it's there. And so I

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<v Speaker 3>I was like, well, I'm going to stop this. So

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<v Speaker 3>I did my research and sort of the positives and

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<v Speaker 3>negatives of the copyright world, especially online, as it all

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<v Speaker 3>goes through this this law, this US law called the DMCA,

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<v Speaker 3>which stands for the Digital Millennial Copyright Act, which is

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<v Speaker 3>an act in nineteen ninety eight. To give you a

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<v Speaker 3>reference for how old it is, back back when people

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<v Speaker 3>were on al aols right copies copyer, Yes, yes exactly,

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<v Speaker 3>so you know it's created then, and it's got this

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<v Speaker 3>sort of double sided blade. So on one side it

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<v Speaker 3>is meant to protect copyright holders from their works being stolen.

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<v Speaker 3>On the other side, it is meant to respect the

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<v Speaker 3>First Amendment and to protect people who don't realize what

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<v Speaker 3>they're doing. Unfortunately, that opens up the door for people

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<v Speaker 3>to essentially run amok. And what the what the DMCA

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<v Speaker 3>says is, UH, if you put somebody's copyright items online

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<v Speaker 3>and you don't know it's copyrighted, uh, and it is

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<v Speaker 3>not illegal until the copyright holder contacts you and says, hey,

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<v Speaker 3>that's mine. That's illegal. If you use it for commercial purposes,

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<v Speaker 3>then they can say, you know, okay, you've you've used it,

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<v Speaker 3>so now you owe me for that benefit. But until

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<v Speaker 3>you're contacted by the copyright holder, it is not illegal.

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<v Speaker 3>And so what happens is these piracy sites put them

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<v Speaker 3>online and then you, as a copyright holder, have to

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<v Speaker 3>track them down and then figure out how to contact

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<v Speaker 3>them and then send a very specifically worded document that

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<v Speaker 3>matches what it says in the Digital Millennial Copyright Act

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<v Speaker 3>to them, and then when they receive it, they have

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<v Speaker 3>to quote the DMCA a reasonable amount of time, which

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<v Speaker 3>the court has deemed I think between forty eight and

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<v Speaker 3>seventy two hours to comply and if they don't take

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<v Speaker 3>it down, then they are in violation law. But essentially,

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<v Speaker 3>when I was spending I don't know, two hours a

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<v Speaker 3>day finding sites, looking and finding the contact info, filling

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<v Speaker 3>out this form, emailing it to them, and then you know,

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<v Speaker 3>usually they take it down because they don't care about

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<v Speaker 3>my film. They just care about people coming.

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<v Speaker 2>We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,

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<v Speaker 2>and now back to the show.

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<v Speaker 3>And we got to but I was doing two hours

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<v Speaker 3>a day and I burned out. I mean, as you know,

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<v Speaker 3>us indie filmmakers are not we don't have the Warner

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<v Speaker 3>Brothers army of attorneys. We don't We're often small, if

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<v Speaker 3>not individual kind of productions. And it's just overwhelming. And

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<v Speaker 3>I think that's one of the things that sort of

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<v Speaker 3>the pirates bank on. And so I, with no coding knowledge,

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<v Speaker 3>contacted a college friend of mine who's in it, and

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<v Speaker 3>I was like, Hey, I got this idea. Let's let's

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<v Speaker 3>help indie filmmakers like fight this thing that screws them

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<v Speaker 3>that's mainly focused on these you know, the avengers, the

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<v Speaker 3>big budget films that make all their money in the

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<v Speaker 3>theaters or make them on you know, their HBO, Max's

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<v Speaker 3>or whatever, and it doesn't hurt their bottom line. But

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<v Speaker 3>you know, I remember calculating at one point, if I

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<v Speaker 3>got a ninety nine sense actually I think I calculated

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<v Speaker 3>if I got like fifty cents for every view, I

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<v Speaker 3>would have made back the entire budget easily in the

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<v Speaker 3>first year if and had access. But you know, you

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<v Speaker 3>go to these sites and people like, oh, I don't

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<v Speaker 3>want to pay, and they just and they watch and

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<v Speaker 3>they've got more and more advanced, so they look like

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<v Speaker 3>a Netflix. They look like a professional site until you

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<v Speaker 3>sort of delve into them. But the normal user isn't

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<v Speaker 3>going to delve into them, and they go, oh, this

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<v Speaker 3>looks awesome, Oh I can watch this for free, and

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<v Speaker 3>so yeah, So so my friend and I we created

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<v Speaker 3>copyright slap dot Com that essentially automates the process so

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<v Speaker 3>that it's so much faster to do, so that we

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<v Speaker 3>can send, you know, hundreds of these takedowns and seconds

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<v Speaker 3>so that producers don't get overwhelmed first don't.

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<v Speaker 2>So okay, So the when you're when you're doing copyright infringement,

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<v Speaker 2>so like there's the we're it's a gray area, and

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<v Speaker 2>it seems like the the the pressure is on the

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<v Speaker 2>copyright holder, not the pirate or the person who just

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<v Speaker 2>doesn't know any better. Yeah, because there's there's people who

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<v Speaker 2>upload to YouTube, you know, the Avengers, the entire movie because.

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<v Speaker 3>Well yeah, and well you run into and so one

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<v Speaker 3>of the things that balances out is this idea of

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<v Speaker 3>fair use versus copyright infringement, which I also think fair Yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>and so fair use is if you use a piece

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<v Speaker 3>of uh a copyright material, but it's either a bleep

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<v Speaker 3>transformative or it's used for commentary, uh yeah, or for

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<v Speaker 3>kind of reporting.

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<v Speaker 2>Reported I think is educational even then there.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I think educational. I think educational. Yeah, is is

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<v Speaker 3>one of the big ones in there. And uh that

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<v Speaker 3>allows you to use it, but you can't upload an

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<v Speaker 3>entire film because you just.

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<v Speaker 2>Put a commentary on it.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, like that's not but you know, you know the

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<v Speaker 3>ones that the YouTube channels that do the breakdown of

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<v Speaker 3>the films and sort of like, well, this was wrong,

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<v Speaker 3>this was wrong, this was wrong. They're not using the

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<v Speaker 3>whole film. They're using clips and they're talking specifically about it.

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<v Speaker 3>And it's not people are watching that video not to

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<v Speaker 3>watch the film. They're watching it to watch that video

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<v Speaker 3>that is the commentary.

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<v Speaker 2>Right, and they actually and YouTube has become very ridiculous

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<v Speaker 2>about it now where now these copyright holders like Warner

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<v Speaker 2>Brothers and stuff like that, they'll just start they just

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<v Speaker 2>blanket it to go after anybody that even has a

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<v Speaker 2>second of Avengers and one of these talking points that's

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<v Speaker 2>no one's talking over because I've gotten hit with that.

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<v Speaker 2>We have a series on an indie film Hustle that

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<v Speaker 2>it's called the Director Series, which is is a commentary

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<v Speaker 2>series about breaking down famous directors and their work, and

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<v Speaker 2>I've been hit with that's constantly. I'm like, dude, it's

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<v Speaker 2>completely fair use. But then the big boys will start

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<v Speaker 2>pushing back on you and just like, well, we don't

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<v Speaker 2>care if you want.

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<v Speaker 3>To, well, but you have technically you have the law

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<v Speaker 3>on your side there. I'm so. I am a big

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<v Speaker 3>supporter of uh protecting those who have the copyright and

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<v Speaker 3>them not getting screwed out of earnings. But I also

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<v Speaker 3>believe fair use is fair use, and there are times

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<v Speaker 3>and places for that that are appropriate. And one of

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<v Speaker 3>the things that we we sort of say to our

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<v Speaker 3>our users is know the difference between copyright infringement and

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<v Speaker 3>fair use. If somebody is doing a commentary on your film,

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<v Speaker 3>people are gonna watch that and then watch your film

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<v Speaker 3>like you want that. That's a positive thing. It's it's

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<v Speaker 3>kind of goes to the uh, you know, the Disney

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<v Speaker 3>copyright thing related to cosplay, where they used to I

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<v Speaker 3>don't know if they still do, but they they don't

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<v Speaker 3>allow people to dress up because they don't want the name,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, injured or whatever. And at the same time,

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<v Speaker 3>if you think about it, everybody watching these cosplay people

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<v Speaker 3>are like, oh, yeah, I love that film. I'm gonna

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<v Speaker 3>go rewatch it. It's free advertising, and it's yeah, it's

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<v Speaker 3>and YouTube is only started doing that because they've been

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<v Speaker 3>losing lawsuits. They would they don't do it on their

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<v Speaker 3>own until they're pushed. It's it's all about the money.

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<v Speaker 2>It's always it seems to be always about the money.

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<v Speaker 2>But that's just as they say, a tale is old

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<v Speaker 2>as time.

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<v Speaker 3>Uh well, I mean that's both sides. Both. The piracy

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<v Speaker 3>is not about them actually caring about your film. It's

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<v Speaker 3>them making money. And YouTube they make their ad sales

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<v Speaker 3>regardless of if it's a copyright infringement or not, until

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<v Speaker 3>some giant copyright holders start suing them.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, and then that's the thing was that before, before

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<v Speaker 2>the Internet, it was just DVDs and people would just

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<v Speaker 2>burn out DVDs or burnout VHS's or copy and then

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<v Speaker 2>sell them on the street. And it was a lot

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<v Speaker 2>harder to kind of break that down, but there also

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<v Speaker 2>was a very limited amount like if you were losing

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<v Speaker 2>it's not like well in China they do that still,

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<v Speaker 2>and you know, it's it's insane. But ever since the

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<v Speaker 2>Internet showed up, now it's like a few hours later

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<v Speaker 2>it's around the world and you're done. It's a second

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<v Speaker 2>it hits. So that's why like all these big movies

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<v Speaker 2>are hitting HBO Max right now, you know, and god

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<v Speaker 2>Zilla versus Kiing Kong, which is a quote unquote theatrical release,

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<v Speaker 2>that's that's been pirated. Moment it hit the online.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh yeah, it's gone. It's like I mean, I mean,

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<v Speaker 3>I remember, I remember back in the day. Well remember

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<v Speaker 3>back in the day the handheld videos in the theater.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh my god.

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<v Speaker 2>There was like there was like a signful episode where

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<v Speaker 2>Jerry accidentally became like the ultimate bootlegg A tour and

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<v Speaker 2>he would just like you know, and it's like how

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<v Speaker 2>he shot it and everything. Yeah, and those are yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>you would just see it, dude. You see people get

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00:16:38.799 --> 00:16:41.240
<v Speaker 2>up in the scene and walk around. But those are

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<v Speaker 2>still those are still available, those are still being done

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<v Speaker 2>in in other countries. And then yeah, I.

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<v Speaker 3>Mean but now unfortunately, with with modern technology and computer

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<v Speaker 3>a lot easier, you can just screen record and it's

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<v Speaker 3>a perfect copy. Unfortunately, I'm not I'm not telling anybody

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<v Speaker 3>anything they don't know. Sure, not telling pirates how to

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00:17:01.360 --> 00:17:04.640
<v Speaker 3>do their job. But it's it's easy and really annoying

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<v Speaker 3>because at least when there's somebody standing in the way,

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00:17:08.039 --> 00:17:11.599
<v Speaker 3>the viewers like, Okay, maybe this isn't legit, or maybe

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<v Speaker 3>maybe I'll buy the real thing.

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<v Speaker 2>But the thing is too I think one of the

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<v Speaker 2>things that I found that piracy what the studios have done,

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<v Speaker 2>and I think indiaan and filmmakers need to do as well,

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<v Speaker 2>is they've made it so easy to consume the content

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<v Speaker 2>that it's harder now to go out and bootleg something

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<v Speaker 2>for the most part, like go and go, find the file,

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<v Speaker 2>download the file, get that file to play either on

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<v Speaker 2>your computer or try to figure out a way to

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<v Speaker 2>play it out on your TV. There's a technical process there.

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<v Speaker 2>Most every day people aren't going to do. This is

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<v Speaker 2>just my opinion is to do.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I'm biting my tongue on this one. What do

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<v Speaker 3>you think I think on certain things, And I don't

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<v Speaker 3>want to tell people how to pirate of course movies. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>I mean you're sort of talking about torrants, which are

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00:18:03.680 --> 00:18:06.319
<v Speaker 3>one of the aspects of it. But these days, unfortunately

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<v Speaker 3>the streaming websites.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, I saw my movie. Oh yeah, I saw

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00:18:10.319 --> 00:18:10.680
<v Speaker 2>my movie.

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<v Speaker 3>There's my partner will kill me? So when I or

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<v Speaker 3>when I sort of say this, so I'm going to

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00:18:16.759 --> 00:18:18.640
<v Speaker 3>be very careful of how I say it. There are

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<v Speaker 3>three levels to piracy. The first one is streaming content,

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<v Speaker 3>which is the most easily accessible. The second level is torrance,

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<v Speaker 3>which is the second level of accessibility. And then there's

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<v Speaker 3>a third one which I'm not allowed to talk about

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<v Speaker 3>because it is very hard to access. But many hackers

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00:18:36.759 --> 00:18:38.960
<v Speaker 3>are the ones to access it, and so if I

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00:18:39.000 --> 00:18:40.440
<v Speaker 3>bring that up, I get in trouble.

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<v Speaker 2>So that's fair enough.

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<v Speaker 3>But well, so there's nothing returns. I think the torrents,

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00:18:47.839 --> 00:18:50.359
<v Speaker 3>you know, it takes a little bit of know how

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00:18:50.400 --> 00:18:52.920
<v Speaker 3>to do, but to go online and just search for

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00:18:53.000 --> 00:18:56.640
<v Speaker 3>a movie, unfortunately, is really easy and it'll pop up

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<v Speaker 3>a lot of sites. I know, Google just recently, because

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00:18:59.359 --> 00:19:02.880
<v Speaker 3>of a lawsuit, change their search engine, so they should

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<v Speaker 3>the illegal sites show up less because.

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<v Speaker 2>Before you could literally just Google and you know, you

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00:19:11.039 --> 00:19:13.400
<v Speaker 2>google my name of my movie and boom does some

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<v Speaker 2>site and in Malaysia pops up and it's like with

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<v Speaker 2>my poster with all my IMDb information in there, and

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<v Speaker 2>then I press play. I'm like, are you kidding me?

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<v Speaker 2>Like it's there. I'm like, if I'm honored that you

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00:19:28.319 --> 00:19:31.039
<v Speaker 2>thought of my little film. But it's it was just

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<v Speaker 2>pretty eye opening. It was like wow, like I get Avengers,

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00:19:34.240 --> 00:19:37.400
<v Speaker 2>I get Game of Thrones, I get that. That's there's big.

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<v Speaker 2>There's big numbers. Big people are interested in them, but

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<v Speaker 2>like to go after the indies like it's yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>So the thing is the the streaming slash online piracy

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<v Speaker 3>industry is a multi billion dollar industry. It's not a

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<v Speaker 3>multi hundred thousand dollars, it's not a couple of million.

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<v Speaker 3>It's a multi billion dollar industry.

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<v Speaker 2>Will be right back after a word from our sponsor,

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<v Speaker 2>and now back to the show.

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<v Speaker 3>Because they've got so many different ways to make money

359
00:20:12.880 --> 00:20:15.440
<v Speaker 3>when people show up, so that all they care about

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<v Speaker 3>is traffic.

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<v Speaker 2>So how so how do you make how what's the business?

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<v Speaker 2>The piracy business model?

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00:20:21.039 --> 00:20:25.400
<v Speaker 3>Piracy business? So there's there's a bunch of different approaches.

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00:20:25.480 --> 00:20:31.960
<v Speaker 3>So one there's the subscription model. They they what is me?

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<v Speaker 3>But it's you know, the thing they say is like

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<v Speaker 3>pay ten dollars and you get every movie ever right

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<v Speaker 3>per month?

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<v Speaker 2>And so's I legally, but obviously those servers are not

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<v Speaker 2>here in the US there, yeah, oh.

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<v Speaker 3>They're yeah, they're not. It's not legal at all yeah, yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>like people don't, but they set them up so it

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<v Speaker 3>looks like a Netflix, it looks like a Hulu. So

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<v Speaker 3>it's so professional. The average you know, person who's searching

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<v Speaker 3>online for movies doesn't know. So so one route is

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<v Speaker 3>a subscription, second route is Google Ads. Right, the more traffic,

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<v Speaker 3>the more ads are worth on sites. So if they

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<v Speaker 3>can get millions of people to come by their web

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<v Speaker 3>website every day, then the ads that they are making

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<v Speaker 3>money that are posting on their site are worth more.

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<v Speaker 2>So how is Google allowing us? How's Google and allowing this?

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<v Speaker 3>Because Google doesn't have a no fly list for websites.

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<v Speaker 2>And even then if even if you close one, fifteen

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<v Speaker 2>pop up in its place.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Yeah. And then there's a tangent on the Google

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<v Speaker 3>Ads one which I find really interesting and I only

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00:21:45.079 --> 00:21:48.799
<v Speaker 3>know about because I had sort of a tutorial shown

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00:21:48.839 --> 00:21:53.279
<v Speaker 3>to me by one of the sort of copyright alliances

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00:21:53.319 --> 00:21:57.400
<v Speaker 3>that's also helping fight this. And what happens is you

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<v Speaker 3>go to a website and in the background, another window

390
00:22:01.880 --> 00:22:04.839
<v Speaker 3>automatically is open up without you knowing it. Andy, it

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00:22:04.920 --> 00:22:09.599
<v Speaker 3>scrolls up and down, and then a little pointer comes

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<v Speaker 3>and clicks on an AD and so it looks like

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<v Speaker 3>you're browsing a site and clicking through an ad, which

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00:22:16.680 --> 00:22:20.880
<v Speaker 3>is higher dollar pay to the web. Click throughs are

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<v Speaker 3>much more than just traffic, so they have that. And

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<v Speaker 3>then there is the sort of last route, which a

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<v Speaker 3>lot of people unless you have virus software on your system,

398
00:22:32.640 --> 00:22:35.680
<v Speaker 3>that's pretty good. Then you go to any of these

399
00:22:35.720 --> 00:22:39.440
<v Speaker 3>piracy sites. The last one is malware, so these sites

400
00:22:39.519 --> 00:22:43.559
<v Speaker 3>also try and put malware on your system while you're watching.

401
00:22:43.640 --> 00:22:45.880
<v Speaker 3>When you go oh, click to view, yes, you click,

402
00:22:45.920 --> 00:22:49.759
<v Speaker 3>which is also an acceptance of whatever permissions, they add

403
00:22:49.799 --> 00:22:52.319
<v Speaker 3>a little trojan horse, you know, backdoor thing on your

404
00:22:52.319 --> 00:22:57.279
<v Speaker 3>computer and then they sell in bulk bundles of essentially

405
00:22:57.400 --> 00:23:02.119
<v Speaker 3>zombie computers to nefarious people who want to use them.

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00:23:02.359 --> 00:23:04.720
<v Speaker 3>And that's one way that you know, these people can

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<v Speaker 3>do U what is it a d uh D d

408
00:23:08.359 --> 00:23:14.079
<v Speaker 3>o s the when you brute force attack a website

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00:23:14.119 --> 00:23:17.240
<v Speaker 3>with a lot of different computers at once. Essentially they're

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00:23:17.279 --> 00:23:21.400
<v Speaker 3>buying these packages of all these computers that people don't

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00:23:21.440 --> 00:23:24.720
<v Speaker 3>know and it's very small, that's you know, that's happening

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00:23:24.799 --> 00:23:26.519
<v Speaker 3>in the background, so that people don't even know their

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00:23:26.519 --> 00:23:30.079
<v Speaker 3>computers are being used, and they can make money off

414
00:23:30.119 --> 00:23:34.319
<v Speaker 3>of that, yeah and so and so if you look

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00:23:34.400 --> 00:23:38.559
<v Speaker 3>at how they make their money, the actual content doesn't matter.

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<v Speaker 3>People to the site, so they go, they go, oh,

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<v Speaker 3>I've created a bot that can scrape all of IMDb

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<v Speaker 3>and then it finds if they find one thing, one

419
00:23:49.720 --> 00:23:54.240
<v Speaker 3>version of the movie, quote it up and boom done done.

420
00:23:54.440 --> 00:23:57.640
<v Speaker 2>And this in the same system goes with any kind

421
00:23:57.720 --> 00:24:01.759
<v Speaker 2>of content, whether it's piracy of software, piracy of music,

422
00:24:01.920 --> 00:24:06.920
<v Speaker 2>piracy of porn, and any anything that people are interested

423
00:24:07.000 --> 00:24:11.000
<v Speaker 2>in to download or watch. It's just so movies are

424
00:24:11.039 --> 00:24:14.240
<v Speaker 2>just one of many forms of media that are being

425
00:24:15.079 --> 00:24:16.400
<v Speaker 2>being used for this business model.

426
00:24:16.839 --> 00:24:18.559
<v Speaker 3>Just I just like to say, if anybody is in

427
00:24:18.599 --> 00:24:21.640
<v Speaker 3>the porn industry listening, porn is also a movie. So

428
00:24:21.680 --> 00:24:24.880
<v Speaker 3>that is not a separate category. You are a filmmaker too,

429
00:24:27.119 --> 00:24:28.839
<v Speaker 3>just a very particular subgenre.

430
00:24:29.119 --> 00:24:33.200
<v Speaker 2>It's a it's a very particular subgenre, so so much of.

431
00:24:33.119 --> 00:24:35.519
<v Speaker 3>A subgenre that in a deeper voice for this, we

432
00:24:35.559 --> 00:24:36.799
<v Speaker 3>should be talking in particular.

433
00:24:37.119 --> 00:24:40.880
<v Speaker 2>There should be it's a very particular subgenre. But oh oh,

434
00:24:40.920 --> 00:24:42.759
<v Speaker 2>I think a pizza A pizza man just knocked on my.

435
00:24:42.759 --> 00:24:49.920
<v Speaker 3>Door, give me a second, no joke, but actually, uh,

436
00:24:50.119 --> 00:24:53.160
<v Speaker 3>piracy online piracy is a big issue for the porn industry,

437
00:24:53.200 --> 00:24:55.920
<v Speaker 3>Oh she goes. You know again, they make a lot

438
00:24:55.960 --> 00:24:59.319
<v Speaker 3>of their money on either I believe subscription services for

439
00:24:59.599 --> 00:25:02.480
<v Speaker 3>like a porn in start or their particular production company,

440
00:25:03.559 --> 00:25:06.799
<v Speaker 3>or coming to their specific site, and they make the

441
00:25:06.839 --> 00:25:08.599
<v Speaker 3>content for their site, right. I mean it's kind of

442
00:25:08.640 --> 00:25:14.119
<v Speaker 3>like a social media influencer you gain by people coming

443
00:25:14.160 --> 00:25:18.160
<v Speaker 3>to your site and you or your your page, your handle, whatever.

444
00:25:19.200 --> 00:25:21.680
<v Speaker 3>I think a lot of porn sites it's going to

445
00:25:21.839 --> 00:25:24.920
<v Speaker 3>those sites and viewing the content because they make their

446
00:25:24.920 --> 00:25:31.319
<v Speaker 3>money quote unquote legitimately via Google ad sales or things

447
00:25:31.319 --> 00:25:35.359
<v Speaker 3>like that, but they you know, probably particularize their content

448
00:25:35.680 --> 00:25:39.079
<v Speaker 3>for their the niche group that is going to those sites.

449
00:25:39.279 --> 00:25:41.720
<v Speaker 3>But when it's when it's pulled away, there's just another

450
00:25:41.759 --> 00:25:42.880
<v Speaker 3>piracy to site.

451
00:25:43.000 --> 00:25:44.799
<v Speaker 2>So let me ask you a question, what is the

452
00:25:44.880 --> 00:25:48.319
<v Speaker 2>actual effect of online piracy to an independent filmmaker? Like,

453
00:25:48.599 --> 00:25:50.960
<v Speaker 2>I mean, look, were the people that were watching it

454
00:25:51.000 --> 00:25:54.440
<v Speaker 2>on a pirated site actually ever like were they really

455
00:25:54.480 --> 00:25:55.759
<v Speaker 2>ever going to be a customer?

456
00:25:56.079 --> 00:25:59.759
<v Speaker 3>Is the question I'm asking. That is a very good

457
00:25:59.799 --> 00:26:01.960
<v Speaker 3>quest question And when I've thought about a lot, and

458
00:26:02.000 --> 00:26:07.720
<v Speaker 3>I think is always asked, and I think there are tiers. Right, Uh,

459
00:26:07.759 --> 00:26:11.000
<v Speaker 3>there's the people who will never pay for anything, and

460
00:26:11.839 --> 00:26:16.599
<v Speaker 3>those people might not go to watch content. However, if

461
00:26:16.599 --> 00:26:20.759
<v Speaker 3>that content is on YouTube with ads, if that content

462
00:26:20.880 --> 00:26:27.759
<v Speaker 3>is on Amazon Prime, uh, on tube yeah, two b TV. Uh,

463
00:26:27.960 --> 00:26:31.359
<v Speaker 3>you know a Roku channel that IMDb TV is coming

464
00:26:31.359 --> 00:26:34.240
<v Speaker 3>out and it has you know, ad based content that's

465
00:26:34.279 --> 00:26:37.759
<v Speaker 3>free to watch. Uh, So would they go to those

466
00:26:38.119 --> 00:26:42.200
<v Speaker 3>which are also free? The then there are those that

467
00:26:42.759 --> 00:26:46.079
<v Speaker 3>it's easy to find. They search online if it if

468
00:26:46.119 --> 00:26:49.359
<v Speaker 3>the first one was a two b tv, uh, you

469
00:26:49.359 --> 00:26:52.640
<v Speaker 3>know Amazon Prime, they click it, but it's not. So

470
00:26:52.720 --> 00:26:56.400
<v Speaker 3>The idea essentially is if you can whack a mole

471
00:26:56.680 --> 00:26:59.960
<v Speaker 3>enough of these sites so that your your main content

472
00:27:00.079 --> 00:27:01.839
<v Speaker 3>that you want people to go to is on that

473
00:27:01.880 --> 00:27:04.279
<v Speaker 3>first search page or the first or second search page,

474
00:27:04.920 --> 00:27:07.799
<v Speaker 3>the chance is that somebody's going to click one of those,

475
00:27:07.920 --> 00:27:11.599
<v Speaker 3>you know, AVOD ad based video on demand streaming sites,

476
00:27:11.799 --> 00:27:13.880
<v Speaker 3>which they don't have to pay for, but you do

477
00:27:13.960 --> 00:27:17.160
<v Speaker 3>make money off of the percentage chance of them clicking

478
00:27:17.160 --> 00:27:21.920
<v Speaker 3>on that goes up dramatically. I mean, yeah, how much.

479
00:27:22.519 --> 00:27:25.319
<v Speaker 3>That is a good question. So I think the number

480
00:27:25.319 --> 00:27:30.880
<v Speaker 3>of people who watch online is an insane number. I

481
00:27:30.920 --> 00:27:31.880
<v Speaker 3>had some statistics.

482
00:27:31.960 --> 00:27:34.039
<v Speaker 2>I think, well, I remember what I'm going to cut

483
00:27:34.079 --> 00:27:35.960
<v Speaker 2>you off. But I remember when Game of Thrones was,

484
00:27:36.000 --> 00:27:39.640
<v Speaker 2>which was the number one pirated show I think in history,

485
00:27:39.640 --> 00:27:41.480
<v Speaker 2>I think ever something like that, but it was one

486
00:27:41.519 --> 00:27:46.000
<v Speaker 2>year specifically that it just dominated, and the producers of

487
00:27:46.039 --> 00:27:51.359
<v Speaker 2>the show said publicly that they're very thankful for the

488
00:27:51.400 --> 00:27:55.440
<v Speaker 2>piracy because it wouldn't have been as popular of a

489
00:27:55.519 --> 00:27:59.160
<v Speaker 2>show without the piracy, and so many people would either

490
00:27:59.240 --> 00:28:03.400
<v Speaker 2>pirate seize or two and then to get the latest thing.

491
00:28:03.440 --> 00:28:06.480
<v Speaker 2>Instead of pirates fired in each episode, they just went

492
00:28:06.519 --> 00:28:09.880
<v Speaker 2>ahead and got a subscription to HBO go or whatever

493
00:28:09.920 --> 00:28:12.559
<v Speaker 2>it was at the time. They said it was extremely

494
00:28:12.720 --> 00:28:15.880
<v Speaker 2>it was extremely helpful to building the brand because so

495
00:28:16.119 --> 00:28:19.599
<v Speaker 2>many people bootlegged it and so many people watched it

496
00:28:19.680 --> 00:28:22.799
<v Speaker 2>that at the end of the day, it actually helped them. Now,

497
00:28:22.839 --> 00:28:26.839
<v Speaker 2>again that's a very specific case. I'm not saying copy

498
00:28:26.960 --> 00:28:30.640
<v Speaker 2>you know pirates. Here's here's my my my asterisk. If

499
00:28:30.640 --> 00:28:33.680
<v Speaker 2>we're gonna have Ferry bonds it, yeah, very much.

500
00:28:35.000 --> 00:28:38.839
<v Speaker 3>My asteris is HBO makes a lot of money on merchandise,

501
00:28:39.480 --> 00:28:42.000
<v Speaker 3>that Kama Thrones makes a lot of money on merchandise.

502
00:28:42.319 --> 00:28:45.839
<v Speaker 3>That their bottom line is the more people they get

503
00:28:45.880 --> 00:28:50.039
<v Speaker 3>to watch, the more people are gonna buy the dragon

504
00:28:50.240 --> 00:28:55.000
<v Speaker 3>egg mug or the you know whatever that they make

505
00:28:55.039 --> 00:28:58.319
<v Speaker 3>a lot of money on that. So part of their

506
00:28:58.400 --> 00:29:03.839
<v Speaker 3>pitch is the most number of eyes and hbos and

507
00:29:04.000 --> 00:29:07.079
<v Speaker 3>HBO's model has very often been and they've sort of

508
00:29:07.079 --> 00:29:08.799
<v Speaker 3>figured it out in a nice, in a smart way.

509
00:29:09.559 --> 00:29:12.599
<v Speaker 3>It's not about the greater audience. It's about a niche audience.

510
00:29:12.599 --> 00:29:14.680
<v Speaker 3>And if we can get a viewer, he says, Oh,

511
00:29:14.680 --> 00:29:18.000
<v Speaker 3>I got to see this show and it's nowhere else

512
00:29:18.079 --> 00:29:20.680
<v Speaker 3>really other than I mean, I guess on piracy. But

513
00:29:20.720 --> 00:29:24.160
<v Speaker 3>they want to see it in the moment, then they

514
00:29:24.200 --> 00:29:26.519
<v Speaker 3>can do it and they'll get subspidify. But I've also

515
00:29:26.559 --> 00:29:28.759
<v Speaker 3>I mean back in the day, I remember talking to

516
00:29:29.359 --> 00:29:32.599
<v Speaker 3>a friend and I think I was watching Game of

517
00:29:32.680 --> 00:29:36.960
<v Speaker 3>Thrones and you know, they were in another country and

518
00:29:38.359 --> 00:29:41.400
<v Speaker 3>it wasn't as easily accessible, and I was like, oh,

519
00:29:41.480 --> 00:29:43.039
<v Speaker 3>did you see that episode of Like oh, well, we're

520
00:29:43.200 --> 00:29:44.880
<v Speaker 3>you know, we're ten minutes behind because we got to

521
00:29:44.880 --> 00:29:47.400
<v Speaker 3>watch it on a piracy site. I was like, you

522
00:29:47.440 --> 00:29:49.480
<v Speaker 3>know they're recording. They're like, oh no, was lying and

523
00:29:49.519 --> 00:29:53.119
<v Speaker 3>putting it online pretty much immediately.

524
00:29:53.319 --> 00:29:55.799
<v Speaker 2>We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor

525
00:29:59.440 --> 00:30:03.279
<v Speaker 2>and now back to the show. Yeah, And that's and

526
00:30:03.319 --> 00:30:06.039
<v Speaker 2>that's another thing as well that I've I've mentioned. I

527
00:30:06.160 --> 00:30:08.599
<v Speaker 2>mentioned that in my book and I mentioned it elsewhere,

528
00:30:08.640 --> 00:30:12.680
<v Speaker 2>that if you can use your movie as a lead

529
00:30:12.759 --> 00:30:16.839
<v Speaker 2>generator for other revenue streams, the actual exploitation of the

530
00:30:16.839 --> 00:30:19.839
<v Speaker 2>film is not the business. That's not the main business.

531
00:30:20.000 --> 00:30:23.599
<v Speaker 2>Because all the studios have done that. Disney's main business

532
00:30:23.680 --> 00:30:27.240
<v Speaker 2>is not making movies. It's everything else that they have

533
00:30:27.319 --> 00:30:30.599
<v Speaker 2>in their ecosystem. It's now HBO and Warner Brothers is

534
00:30:30.720 --> 00:30:32.640
<v Speaker 2>kind of picking up on that. Disney is still the

535
00:30:32.720 --> 00:30:35.799
<v Speaker 2>king of that. And their system is so instant, their

536
00:30:36.160 --> 00:30:39.279
<v Speaker 2>foundation and infrastructure is so well put together that I

537
00:30:39.279 --> 00:30:42.720
<v Speaker 2>think I think it's Disney, Warner Brothers, and maybe Universal,

538
00:30:42.720 --> 00:30:44.440
<v Speaker 2>and I think that's pretty much it. Then the other

539
00:30:44.480 --> 00:30:46.440
<v Speaker 2>guys are still trying to catch up. Paramount still trying

540
00:30:46.480 --> 00:30:48.359
<v Speaker 2>to catch up. They don't they don't have the infrastructure

541
00:30:48.720 --> 00:30:52.240
<v Speaker 2>that Disney does. But you know, sure they make everyone say, oh,

542
00:30:52.279 --> 00:30:54.519
<v Speaker 2>you made a billion dollars off or two billion dollars

543
00:30:54.559 --> 00:30:57.480
<v Speaker 2>off of Avengers or whatever the hell it was. That's

544
00:30:57.680 --> 00:31:01.200
<v Speaker 2>nice money, but it's nothing compared to what they sell

545
00:31:01.240 --> 00:31:03.880
<v Speaker 2>and merch it's nothing to compare. It's nothing compared to

546
00:31:03.920 --> 00:31:07.880
<v Speaker 2>the parks, rides and all the million of other things

547
00:31:07.920 --> 00:31:11.240
<v Speaker 2>that they sell. My buddy worked at Disney as an animator,

548
00:31:11.480 --> 00:31:14.079
<v Speaker 2>and they brought him in, brought the whole team in

549
00:31:14.119 --> 00:31:18.039
<v Speaker 2>to tell them how they made their money. And they said,

550
00:31:18.240 --> 00:31:22.640
<v Speaker 2>Frozen okay, which made a billion dollars at the box office.

551
00:31:23.440 --> 00:31:28.680
<v Speaker 2>A billion dollars at the box office. The dresses, the

552
00:31:28.759 --> 00:31:31.720
<v Speaker 2>Anna and what's her name is what I forgot her name?

553
00:31:31.759 --> 00:31:32.039
<v Speaker 3>Elsa?

554
00:31:32.319 --> 00:31:33.680
<v Speaker 2>Thank you, Elsa?

555
00:31:33.799 --> 00:31:34.480
<v Speaker 3>How dare you?

556
00:31:34.480 --> 00:31:37.319
<v Speaker 2>How dare me? I know? I'm sorry Elsa. And Anna's

557
00:31:37.440 --> 00:31:41.319
<v Speaker 2>dresses alone, the ones that my daughter bought. My daughter's

558
00:31:41.319 --> 00:31:44.039
<v Speaker 2>brought like seven times because they kept growing and breaking

559
00:31:44.039 --> 00:31:45.599
<v Speaker 2>and ripping them off because the wouldn't take them off.

560
00:31:45.880 --> 00:31:49.880
<v Speaker 2>A billion on the dresses alone, Oh I bet, I.

561
00:31:49.839 --> 00:31:53.160
<v Speaker 3>Bet there's some some digital dress that you can buy

562
00:31:53.720 --> 00:31:57.200
<v Speaker 3>on some game that is an a dress or an

563
00:31:57.200 --> 00:31:59.480
<v Speaker 3>else address that they've also made a billion dollars off

564
00:31:59.519 --> 00:32:02.000
<v Speaker 3>of that. It costs just the coding. I mean to

565
00:32:02.799 --> 00:32:07.480
<v Speaker 3>make a nod to that little guy over your shoulder, Yes,

566
00:32:07.880 --> 00:32:10.559
<v Speaker 3>I mean Star Wars and Lucas were the first to

567
00:32:10.640 --> 00:32:12.559
<v Speaker 3>do it. It was he said, you know, it's not

568
00:32:12.640 --> 00:32:15.519
<v Speaker 3>about it's not about the movie. Pouts of merchandising.

569
00:32:15.519 --> 00:32:16.920
<v Speaker 2>It's about the lunchpots as idiots.

570
00:32:17.119 --> 00:32:21.039
<v Speaker 3>That's I mean, that's what mel Brooks in Spaceball write,

571
00:32:21.039 --> 00:32:22.880
<v Speaker 3>Oh you got to come to the you know, the

572
00:32:22.960 --> 00:32:25.039
<v Speaker 3>whole thing. And it's because that's the truth.

573
00:32:25.160 --> 00:32:27.960
<v Speaker 2>Spaceballs a flamethrower. I still want that. I still want flame.

574
00:32:28.279 --> 00:32:30.640
<v Speaker 2>I still want Spaceball's a flamethrower. It's with the kids.

575
00:32:30.640 --> 00:32:34.440
<v Speaker 2>They love it. You know the deal? Do you know

576
00:32:34.440 --> 00:32:36.880
<v Speaker 2>what the deal was with the Spaceballs? How George Lucas

577
00:32:36.880 --> 00:32:39.200
<v Speaker 2>gave him rights to do it because he asked, do

578
00:32:39.240 --> 00:32:42.200
<v Speaker 2>you know the whole star? I'mious on a side note, everybody,

579
00:32:42.359 --> 00:32:44.720
<v Speaker 2>so Spaceballs. If you haven't seen Spaceball, go watch Spaceballs

580
00:32:44.720 --> 00:32:48.240
<v Speaker 2>because it's amazing. But he called George Lucas, I'm gonna

581
00:32:48.240 --> 00:32:50.359
<v Speaker 2>make this parody film on on Star Wars and I

582
00:32:50.359 --> 00:32:53.559
<v Speaker 2>don't want to get sued. So what do we need

583
00:32:53.599 --> 00:32:55.759
<v Speaker 2>to do here? Because he could arguably make it. But

584
00:32:55.880 --> 00:32:58.000
<v Speaker 2>he goes, you can make it, but you can't sell

585
00:32:58.000 --> 00:33:01.480
<v Speaker 2>any merchandise. That's why you can't. You never see Spaceball's

586
00:33:01.519 --> 00:33:05.279
<v Speaker 2>merchandise anywhere. And that's that was the deal. So that's

587
00:33:05.319 --> 00:33:07.319
<v Speaker 2>why you and that that he completely made a joke

588
00:33:07.359 --> 00:33:09.839
<v Speaker 2>of it because all those cool things that you saw

589
00:33:09.920 --> 00:33:12.400
<v Speaker 2>in the movie, all that merch I would have who

590
00:33:12.440 --> 00:33:14.799
<v Speaker 2>wouldn't have killed against? I think there's some stuff now

591
00:33:14.799 --> 00:33:16.000
<v Speaker 2>that comes out everyone. I'm sure.

592
00:33:16.039 --> 00:33:18.359
<v Speaker 3>I'm sure if I look on Etsy, I could find that.

593
00:33:18.519 --> 00:33:21.599
<v Speaker 2>Oh you can find something, but no mass. No mass at.

594
00:33:21.480 --> 00:33:25.920
<v Speaker 3>The time of the release, searching Etsy for flamethrowers exactly.

595
00:33:26.319 --> 00:33:29.640
<v Speaker 2>Oh, I'm sure somebody has made this make small flamethrower.

596
00:33:30.759 --> 00:33:32.920
<v Speaker 3>I can only get it if it's attached to a drone.

597
00:33:33.119 --> 00:33:35.759
<v Speaker 2>Obviously, you know how that goes, all right, So with

598
00:33:36.039 --> 00:33:38.240
<v Speaker 2>so we've we've obviously told everybody the world is coming

599
00:33:38.279 --> 00:33:40.680
<v Speaker 2>to an end. Well, we'll never make any money online anymore.

600
00:33:40.799 --> 00:33:41.480
<v Speaker 2>I get all the way.

601
00:33:41.519 --> 00:33:43.039
<v Speaker 3>So no, but I do, I do agree way I

602
00:33:43.039 --> 00:33:44.640
<v Speaker 3>want to just I just want to pause and just

603
00:33:44.720 --> 00:33:47.240
<v Speaker 3>jump back to something that you said, which you was

604
00:33:47.279 --> 00:33:50.000
<v Speaker 3>talking about the bigger industry. But I also think it

605
00:33:50.039 --> 00:33:54.079
<v Speaker 3>applies to indie filmmakers, where the easier you make it

606
00:33:54.279 --> 00:33:58.559
<v Speaker 3>for UH users or audience to view your content, yes,

607
00:33:59.000 --> 00:34:02.599
<v Speaker 3>the more audience are going to get yes. And so

608
00:34:04.039 --> 00:34:06.759
<v Speaker 3>you know, I initially was not the biggest fan of

609
00:34:07.359 --> 00:34:10.400
<v Speaker 3>sort of ad based video on demand because you get

610
00:34:10.400 --> 00:34:14.719
<v Speaker 3>paid pennies. However, the amount of people who watch that

611
00:34:14.760 --> 00:34:17.519
<v Speaker 3>because they don't want to spend you know, five dollars

612
00:34:17.559 --> 00:34:21.880
<v Speaker 3>ten dollars two ninety nine for something that if you

613
00:34:21.920 --> 00:34:25.800
<v Speaker 3>can get them to those free sites, that's how the

614
00:34:25.840 --> 00:34:28.199
<v Speaker 3>indie filmmakers I think are going to make the money.

615
00:34:28.239 --> 00:34:32.079
<v Speaker 3>And as you said, sort of leveraging, right, leveraging one

616
00:34:32.159 --> 00:34:36.719
<v Speaker 3>film to make the next one, and so in that

617
00:34:36.719 --> 00:34:38.920
<v Speaker 3>that's that's one of the things. The goal of copyright

618
00:34:38.960 --> 00:34:42.239
<v Speaker 3>slap was is to sort of play whack a mole

619
00:34:42.280 --> 00:34:45.480
<v Speaker 3>and make it much easier to whack that mole if

620
00:34:45.559 --> 00:34:48.199
<v Speaker 3>everybody knows that game. If not, then I'm just making

621
00:34:48.280 --> 00:34:53.840
<v Speaker 3>really weird references. But to sort of send out as

622
00:34:53.880 --> 00:34:59.400
<v Speaker 3>many DMCA violation notices as easy as possible to get

623
00:34:59.440 --> 00:35:01.440
<v Speaker 3>these things take and down work.

624
00:35:01.480 --> 00:35:04.000
<v Speaker 2>So this is the counter This is how you counter

625
00:35:04.079 --> 00:35:06.360
<v Speaker 2>online piracy. It's just sending out these notices. But do

626
00:35:06.400 --> 00:35:07.519
<v Speaker 2>they actually take them down?

627
00:35:08.079 --> 00:35:12.760
<v Speaker 3>So there's we are running statistics, but we'd say about

628
00:35:13.039 --> 00:35:15.760
<v Speaker 3>sixty percent, if not a little bit more, take them

629
00:35:15.800 --> 00:35:19.440
<v Speaker 3>down as soon as they get it. Now, will they

630
00:35:19.440 --> 00:35:22.079
<v Speaker 3>put it up the next week? We don't have the

631
00:35:22.159 --> 00:35:24.760
<v Speaker 3>numbers on that, but they will take it down pretty

632
00:35:24.800 --> 00:35:27.920
<v Speaker 3>easily because they don't care. Literally, it's more hassle to

633
00:35:27.960 --> 00:35:33.000
<v Speaker 3>them to potentially deal with somebody bothering them than to

634
00:35:33.079 --> 00:35:35.880
<v Speaker 3>just comply. And they know they got to get If

635
00:35:35.880 --> 00:35:37.360
<v Speaker 3>they put it up again a week or two weeks

636
00:35:37.400 --> 00:35:39.280
<v Speaker 3>or a month later, then that has to be found

637
00:35:39.280 --> 00:35:40.599
<v Speaker 3>and it has to happen, but then they can take

638
00:35:40.599 --> 00:35:44.559
<v Speaker 3>it down again. And so how it works is, yeah,

639
00:35:44.880 --> 00:35:48.440
<v Speaker 3>you get the DMCA violation notice. Now, as you sort

640
00:35:48.440 --> 00:35:50.400
<v Speaker 3>of said at the beginning of this podcast, depends where

641
00:35:50.440 --> 00:35:56.559
<v Speaker 3>the server is though, because the DMCA is a US law. However,

642
00:35:56.599 --> 00:36:02.320
<v Speaker 3>there are many international treaty that then relate to copyright

643
00:36:02.400 --> 00:36:05.400
<v Speaker 3>and so a lot of countries respect it. Some don't,

644
00:36:05.519 --> 00:36:08.039
<v Speaker 3>and they're super annoying. I won't name those countries, but

645
00:36:08.079 --> 00:36:12.239
<v Speaker 3>they're like, if you have uh, you know, two signatures

646
00:36:12.320 --> 00:36:15.079
<v Speaker 3>by a notary and you have a court document and I,

647
00:36:15.119 --> 00:36:18.679
<v Speaker 3>then we'll consider taking it down. And I was like, ah, well,

648
00:36:18.840 --> 00:36:21.559
<v Speaker 3>don't worry because covers app also sends all these sites

649
00:36:21.639 --> 00:36:27.599
<v Speaker 3>to the Intellectual Property Division of uh the United States

650
00:36:27.639 --> 00:36:31.800
<v Speaker 3>of Defense. So yeah, well you just talked to them exactly,

651
00:36:31.840 --> 00:36:35.639
<v Speaker 3>but yeah, so you have that if they do take

652
00:36:35.639 --> 00:36:39.559
<v Speaker 3>it down, great, If they don't take it down. Then technically,

653
00:36:39.880 --> 00:36:42.840
<v Speaker 3>if you, as a copyright holder, have a copyright uh

654
00:36:43.119 --> 00:36:45.960
<v Speaker 3>for the for the beeast. So this is this is

655
00:36:46.000 --> 00:36:48.599
<v Speaker 3>one sort of aspect of the of the law. You

656
00:36:48.639 --> 00:36:52.719
<v Speaker 3>cannot sue for copyright infringement unless you have a copyright

657
00:36:53.079 --> 00:36:57.440
<v Speaker 3>on the the item that you are you want to

658
00:36:57.519 --> 00:36:59.480
<v Speaker 3>you want to take legal action off. Now you do

659
00:36:59.639 --> 00:37:02.840
<v Speaker 3>own the copyright, but to take legal action, it needs

660
00:37:02.840 --> 00:37:05.320
<v Speaker 3>to be copyright registered. Wait you do the read registered? Yeah,

661
00:37:05.519 --> 00:37:07.960
<v Speaker 3>which is you know it's what twenty dollars? It needed

662
00:37:08.480 --> 00:37:11.639
<v Speaker 3>thirty five now, yeah, okay, it's gone up. Back in

663
00:37:11.719 --> 00:37:12.239
<v Speaker 3>my day.

664
00:37:12.440 --> 00:37:14.519
<v Speaker 2>Back in my day, it was twenty dollars. Yeah. And

665
00:37:16.280 --> 00:37:18.760
<v Speaker 2>by the way, just so everybody knows, in regards to copyrighting,

666
00:37:19.079 --> 00:37:23.400
<v Speaker 2>you when you apply for the copyright, you're protected from

667
00:37:23.440 --> 00:37:26.119
<v Speaker 2>the moment you've submitted and paid for the thing, because

668
00:37:26.159 --> 00:37:28.719
<v Speaker 2>it will take six to eight months to actually get

669
00:37:28.800 --> 00:37:31.960
<v Speaker 2>if you're lucky, the actual copyright certificate back.

670
00:37:32.599 --> 00:37:36.599
<v Speaker 3>And on top of it, I believe it's ninety days.

671
00:37:37.320 --> 00:37:40.760
<v Speaker 3>I have to verify that. But if you have copyright infringement,

672
00:37:41.519 --> 00:37:45.599
<v Speaker 3>if you register the copyright within ninety days of the infringement,

673
00:37:45.639 --> 00:37:48.039
<v Speaker 3>you can still take legal action from something that happened

674
00:37:48.119 --> 00:37:52.760
<v Speaker 3>ninety days ago. No photographers do that because photography is

675
00:37:53.159 --> 00:37:54.760
<v Speaker 3>got huge piracy online.

676
00:37:54.880 --> 00:37:59.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and you know, I've as far as piracy photography

677
00:37:59.440 --> 00:38:03.000
<v Speaker 2>is concerned, like, if you have a DMCA notice and like,

678
00:38:03.039 --> 00:38:05.880
<v Speaker 2>hey man, you're using a photo of mine on your website,

679
00:38:05.920 --> 00:38:08.599
<v Speaker 2>take it down, that's pretty much the end of the conversation.

680
00:38:08.760 --> 00:38:10.760
<v Speaker 2>Right they can get can they assue you?

681
00:38:11.519 --> 00:38:16.239
<v Speaker 3>So well, here's here's where it gets interesting with photographers.

682
00:38:16.800 --> 00:38:20.639
<v Speaker 3>If a website is using it specifically for commercial value,

683
00:38:20.880 --> 00:38:26.400
<v Speaker 3>then you have so essentially some company, one of the

684
00:38:26.400 --> 00:38:30.800
<v Speaker 3>famous ones company is selling skateboards and a photographer took

685
00:38:30.880 --> 00:38:37.079
<v Speaker 3>a picture of a skateboarder, and the company used the photo,

686
00:38:37.079 --> 00:38:41.280
<v Speaker 3>took the photo from Instagram from that professional photographer, and

687
00:38:41.320 --> 00:38:43.920
<v Speaker 3>then essentially made an ad and posted it to Instagram.

688
00:38:43.960 --> 00:38:45.480
<v Speaker 3>It was like, yeah, blah blah blah, look at our

689
00:38:45.840 --> 00:38:48.199
<v Speaker 3>our you know, our skates. And just because it had

690
00:38:49.000 --> 00:38:52.599
<v Speaker 3>their you know, skateboarding wheels or board or whatever in

691
00:38:52.639 --> 00:38:55.480
<v Speaker 3>it doesn't mean that they have the right to use

692
00:38:55.519 --> 00:38:58.519
<v Speaker 3>somebody's photograph. So this person contacted them is like, hey,

693
00:38:59.199 --> 00:39:03.000
<v Speaker 3>you're using my com in an ad, So either this

694
00:39:03.039 --> 00:39:05.039
<v Speaker 3>is a reasonable amount that you should pay me for

695
00:39:05.079 --> 00:39:08.679
<v Speaker 3>that use or I'm going to assue you. And even

696
00:39:08.679 --> 00:39:10.280
<v Speaker 3>if they take it down, they already use it in

697
00:39:10.320 --> 00:39:14.280
<v Speaker 3>an ad. They are generating income for a company, right,

698
00:39:14.400 --> 00:39:16.480
<v Speaker 3>so you get so that gives a photographers get a

699
00:39:16.519 --> 00:39:18.920
<v Speaker 3>little bit more leverage. It's a little bit harder for

700
00:39:19.280 --> 00:39:22.599
<v Speaker 3>in the filmmaking world because it's not really an ad.

701
00:39:22.679 --> 00:39:24.960
<v Speaker 3>It's content that they're reposting.

702
00:39:25.239 --> 00:39:27.360
<v Speaker 2>Right except but yeah, but like if you have but

703
00:39:27.480 --> 00:39:30.639
<v Speaker 2>like a lot of news organizations use you know, blogs

704
00:39:30.719 --> 00:39:34.400
<v Speaker 2>use images constantly from anywhere anywhere.

705
00:39:33.960 --> 00:39:36.400
<v Speaker 3>And yeah, and so then you can, you know, DMCA,

706
00:39:36.679 --> 00:39:40.400
<v Speaker 3>or you can sort of DMCA slash have you know,

707
00:39:40.440 --> 00:39:43.320
<v Speaker 3>an attorney friend write a note saying, hey, you use this,

708
00:39:43.519 --> 00:39:44.719
<v Speaker 3>we would like to be compensated.

709
00:39:45.519 --> 00:39:47.519
<v Speaker 2>And then that so it becomes a question like is

710
00:39:47.559 --> 00:39:48.920
<v Speaker 2>this going to be worth going to court for?

711
00:39:49.320 --> 00:39:51.719
<v Speaker 3>Yeah? Yeah, And so usually you ask for a little

712
00:39:51.800 --> 00:39:54.320
<v Speaker 3>less than you might get a settlement, and therefore you

713
00:39:54.360 --> 00:39:57.800
<v Speaker 3>have an advantage. So the DMCA says, if somebody is

714
00:39:57.840 --> 00:40:02.280
<v Speaker 3>violating your copyright, you can for up to thirty thousand

715
00:40:02.320 --> 00:40:03.440
<v Speaker 3>dollars per occurrence.

716
00:40:05.880 --> 00:40:08.400
<v Speaker 2>We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,

717
00:40:12.000 --> 00:40:13.280
<v Speaker 2>and now back to the show.

718
00:40:16.079 --> 00:40:20.119
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, and One of the great things of the COVID

719
00:40:20.239 --> 00:40:23.840
<v Speaker 3>nineteen relief bill that was passed this past December is

720
00:40:24.119 --> 00:40:29.000
<v Speaker 3>something called the Case Act, and that initiated for the

721
00:40:29.039 --> 00:40:33.360
<v Speaker 3>first time in the United States a Small Claims Copyright Court.

722
00:40:33.920 --> 00:40:35.880
<v Speaker 3>Now it's it's in the process of being set up

723
00:40:35.920 --> 00:40:41.639
<v Speaker 3>right now, but it essentially allows smaller kind of indie

724
00:40:42.440 --> 00:40:47.760
<v Speaker 3>copyright holders to go put forth a claim to I

725
00:40:47.760 --> 00:40:52.800
<v Speaker 3>believe it's three not judge, I guess judges, three judges

726
00:40:52.840 --> 00:40:56.960
<v Speaker 3>who are you know, people who judiciate this copyright content,

727
00:40:58.039 --> 00:41:02.480
<v Speaker 3>and then the defend and can send in documents and

728
00:41:02.559 --> 00:41:07.920
<v Speaker 3>this three in judges make a decision and they can

729
00:41:07.960 --> 00:41:11.360
<v Speaker 3>then find in favor of the copyright in front the

730
00:41:11.400 --> 00:41:14.320
<v Speaker 3>person whose copyright was infringed, and it can be up

731
00:41:14.320 --> 00:41:17.840
<v Speaker 3>to fifteen thousand dollars. So one of the biggest hurdles

732
00:41:17.920 --> 00:41:21.960
<v Speaker 3>usually for copyright holders in going beyond just a simple

733
00:41:22.039 --> 00:41:26.960
<v Speaker 3>DMCA violation notice is you have to pay for an attorney,

734
00:41:27.000 --> 00:41:31.079
<v Speaker 3>you have to pay a lot of court fees, and

735
00:41:31.119 --> 00:41:33.199
<v Speaker 3>so that was hard. So this small Claims Court sort

736
00:41:33.199 --> 00:41:37.039
<v Speaker 3>of opens the door and allows the smaller guy to

737
00:41:37.599 --> 00:41:41.159
<v Speaker 3>be able to fight against these Now, the heart the

738
00:41:41.239 --> 00:41:45.719
<v Speaker 3>other ASTERIXL throne there is. Finding who is behind these

739
00:41:45.760 --> 00:41:48.880
<v Speaker 3>streaming sites is hard, right because you've got to figure

740
00:41:48.880 --> 00:41:53.079
<v Speaker 3>out who you're suing right now if it's you know,

741
00:41:54.079 --> 00:41:57.960
<v Speaker 3>sometimes if you if you dig into the who is

742
00:41:58.119 --> 00:42:02.280
<v Speaker 3>information on a site, somebody is not smart enough to

743
00:42:02.360 --> 00:42:05.599
<v Speaker 3>hide the fact that their email address and their and

744
00:42:05.639 --> 00:42:09.280
<v Speaker 3>their name and address are the admin email address kind

745
00:42:09.280 --> 00:42:12.159
<v Speaker 3>of buried in there. You can you know, screenshot, keep

746
00:42:12.199 --> 00:42:15.599
<v Speaker 3>that and then maybe use it as an attack m

747
00:42:16.800 --> 00:42:20.599
<v Speaker 3>But it's hard because you have to have a lawsuit

748
00:42:20.599 --> 00:42:23.760
<v Speaker 3>against somebody to be able to get money, right, you

749
00:42:23.800 --> 00:42:25.760
<v Speaker 3>have to figure out where those assets are, and they

750
00:42:25.840 --> 00:42:29.440
<v Speaker 3>hide a lot so one of the other So that

751
00:42:29.519 --> 00:42:31.840
<v Speaker 3>is the hard side of it. One of the other things, though,

752
00:42:31.880 --> 00:42:36.199
<v Speaker 3>that we try to do is different is since we

753
00:42:36.280 --> 00:42:41.599
<v Speaker 3>care more about Batman's style revenge on these pirates than

754
00:42:42.039 --> 00:42:45.400
<v Speaker 3>necessarily making a lot of money. Beyond the fat fact

755
00:42:45.440 --> 00:42:49.360
<v Speaker 3>that we we I guess sell our service for very inexpensive.

756
00:42:49.599 --> 00:42:53.599
<v Speaker 3>We also compile a blacklist of piracy sites that we

757
00:42:53.719 --> 00:42:59.440
<v Speaker 3>find from our users interactions anonymously sort of figuring out

758
00:42:59.480 --> 00:43:03.039
<v Speaker 3>which one are just pure piracy sites, and then we

759
00:43:03.079 --> 00:43:05.559
<v Speaker 3>take that list in once a month we send to

760
00:43:06.039 --> 00:43:09.599
<v Speaker 3>essentially the Internet Crimes Division of the United States and

761
00:43:09.639 --> 00:43:14.960
<v Speaker 3>say here is a list of the sites that we

762
00:43:15.039 --> 00:43:20.039
<v Speaker 3>know are illegal, please take action. And they've been open

763
00:43:20.079 --> 00:43:23.719
<v Speaker 3>to that. It's hard to keep track of like if

764
00:43:23.719 --> 00:43:27.519
<v Speaker 3>they do anything, but they are open to us sending

765
00:43:27.920 --> 00:43:30.440
<v Speaker 3>a file and we give it into format so they

766
00:43:30.440 --> 00:43:33.320
<v Speaker 3>can integrate it into their system very easily. So we

767
00:43:33.480 --> 00:43:36.280
<v Speaker 3>sort of are pushing to do things like that because

768
00:43:36.320 --> 00:43:38.519
<v Speaker 3>that'll have more of an impact if we can just

769
00:43:38.559 --> 00:43:39.519
<v Speaker 3>take down a whole site.

770
00:43:40.199 --> 00:43:42.639
<v Speaker 2>Well, of course, because if there thinks out tens of thousands,

771
00:43:42.679 --> 00:43:45.000
<v Speaker 2>if not more films that have been put up there,

772
00:43:45.639 --> 00:43:51.039
<v Speaker 2>it's fascinating. And so so copyright slap dot com, what's

773
00:43:51.079 --> 00:43:53.360
<v Speaker 2>the process, What does filmmakers have to do to use

774
00:43:53.400 --> 00:43:55.079
<v Speaker 2>your service? And how does it work?

775
00:43:56.280 --> 00:43:59.320
<v Speaker 3>So it's as simple as we possibly could make it.

776
00:44:00.280 --> 00:44:04.159
<v Speaker 3>So yeah, copyright slap dot com and you just go

777
00:44:04.199 --> 00:44:07.519
<v Speaker 3>and you register as a user, and then once you've registered,

778
00:44:07.639 --> 00:44:11.239
<v Speaker 3>you can initiate a new project or start a new project.

779
00:44:11.280 --> 00:44:14.000
<v Speaker 3>Project essentially is your film or we were expanding into

780
00:44:14.079 --> 00:44:18.239
<v Speaker 3>books because online literary piracy is a big thing. We're

781
00:44:18.280 --> 00:44:20.079
<v Speaker 3>slowly sort of expanding as much as we can to

782
00:44:20.119 --> 00:44:23.480
<v Speaker 3>protect different copyright holders. So you register a project and you.

783
00:44:23.599 --> 00:44:27.559
<v Speaker 3>Essentially we ask you for the specific information needed to

784
00:44:27.639 --> 00:44:30.639
<v Speaker 3>fill out a DMCA violation form, as you know the

785
00:44:30.679 --> 00:44:33.280
<v Speaker 3>title of the film, when it was published, the original

786
00:44:33.960 --> 00:44:36.000
<v Speaker 3>location of where the film can be found, be it

787
00:44:36.039 --> 00:44:40.559
<v Speaker 3>the film's website or the Amazon Prime link or something

788
00:44:40.639 --> 00:44:45.440
<v Speaker 3>like that, and then you submit that it saves and

789
00:44:45.480 --> 00:44:48.079
<v Speaker 3>you started this new project, and then we run in

790
00:44:48.400 --> 00:44:52.960
<v Speaker 3>thirty day cycles. They can click and activate the project.

791
00:44:54.280 --> 00:44:57.559
<v Speaker 3>Our normal thirty day cycle is twenty dollars for unlimited

792
00:44:58.119 --> 00:45:01.800
<v Speaker 3>number of takedowns. To put that in perspective, one of

793
00:45:01.800 --> 00:45:04.039
<v Speaker 3>the reasons when I was starting out didn't go to

794
00:45:04.360 --> 00:45:09.039
<v Speaker 3>a site like this is it was essentially our competitors

795
00:45:09.079 --> 00:45:11.360
<v Speaker 3>charge just under two hundred dollars. I believe it's one

796
00:45:11.400 --> 00:45:15.440
<v Speaker 3>hundred and ninety nine dollars per single takedown of Jesus

797
00:45:15.519 --> 00:45:18.760
<v Speaker 3>Christ's particular. There are some that are a little bit

798
00:45:18.880 --> 00:45:20.920
<v Speaker 3>less expensive, but then you have to enter all of

799
00:45:20.960 --> 00:45:23.800
<v Speaker 3>the information that we ask for once every time, and

800
00:45:23.880 --> 00:45:26.599
<v Speaker 3>you have to do like jump through a number of hoops.

801
00:45:26.760 --> 00:45:28.760
<v Speaker 3>So our goal is like make it as simple as possible,

802
00:45:28.800 --> 00:45:31.960
<v Speaker 3>So for us, it's twenty dollars and then whatever you

803
00:45:32.000 --> 00:45:35.800
<v Speaker 3>find online as a URL, that's an infringement. You can

804
00:45:35.840 --> 00:45:38.280
<v Speaker 3>just copy and paste that into a form we have

805
00:45:38.400 --> 00:45:40.559
<v Speaker 3>you hit enter and we take care of everything, and

806
00:45:40.599 --> 00:45:43.280
<v Speaker 3>then we also keep track of it. And essentially we

807
00:45:43.320 --> 00:45:46.199
<v Speaker 3>have a system where if there's a contact info directly

808
00:45:46.239 --> 00:45:49.360
<v Speaker 3>for the website owner, they get a DMCA violation of this.

809
00:45:49.880 --> 00:45:54.280
<v Speaker 3>If they don't comply, then we escalate it, allow the

810
00:45:54.320 --> 00:45:57.239
<v Speaker 3>user to escalate it, and that goes to the online

811
00:45:57.320 --> 00:46:01.119
<v Speaker 3>service provider, the person hosting the website. And one of

812
00:46:01.119 --> 00:46:04.960
<v Speaker 3>our goals is if the website owner may ignore it,

813
00:46:05.239 --> 00:46:08.519
<v Speaker 3>but the online service provider doesn't want to legal content

814
00:46:08.639 --> 00:46:11.639
<v Speaker 3>on their server. And there are certain laws that say

815
00:46:11.679 --> 00:46:16.119
<v Speaker 3>if you're a winger that somebody is hosting illegal activity,

816
00:46:16.239 --> 00:46:17.719
<v Speaker 3>you are not allowed to host.

817
00:46:17.519 --> 00:46:22.000
<v Speaker 2>Them, or you're going to get you're liable.

818
00:46:23.440 --> 00:46:28.039
<v Speaker 3>And there's so I'm going to add to it. There

819
00:46:28.199 --> 00:46:31.920
<v Speaker 3>is a bill sort of coming out or a up

820
00:46:31.960 --> 00:46:36.280
<v Speaker 3>for discussion, an update to the Digital Millennial Copyright Act.

821
00:46:36.599 --> 00:46:41.719
<v Speaker 3>So Senator Tom Tillis from North Carolina have put forth

822
00:46:41.760 --> 00:46:43.039
<v Speaker 3>at the beginning of this year, at the end of

823
00:46:43.119 --> 00:46:46.119
<v Speaker 3>last year, the Digital Copyright Act of twenty twenty one,

824
00:46:46.719 --> 00:46:51.039
<v Speaker 3>and that is aiming to update the DMCA so that

825
00:46:51.599 --> 00:46:55.360
<v Speaker 3>these online service providers can't hide from when they know

826
00:46:56.119 --> 00:46:59.800
<v Speaker 3>there's a legal activity that the loopholes that a lot

827
00:46:59.840 --> 00:47:05.559
<v Speaker 3>of places get away with because the copyright the MCA

828
00:47:05.679 --> 00:47:08.960
<v Speaker 3>was written in nineteen ninety eight sort of closing those

829
00:47:09.119 --> 00:47:13.199
<v Speaker 3>so it's not as easy for them to hide without

830
00:47:13.280 --> 00:47:19.000
<v Speaker 3>being illegal immediately. And yeah, so we sent Yeah, so

831
00:47:19.039 --> 00:47:23.639
<v Speaker 3>we send to the website owners. Then we send to

832
00:47:23.000 --> 00:47:31.119
<v Speaker 3>the online service providers. Sometimes they're multiple and if there's

833
00:47:31.119 --> 00:47:34.239
<v Speaker 3>sort of two levels there. The website owners sometimes they

834
00:47:34.239 --> 00:47:35.880
<v Speaker 3>reply back and they're like, we took care of but

835
00:47:35.960 --> 00:47:39.079
<v Speaker 3>it's gone, stop bugging us. And then if they don't,

836
00:47:39.360 --> 00:47:42.280
<v Speaker 3>sometimes the service providers go, well, we've removed that account,

837
00:47:42.800 --> 00:47:44.920
<v Speaker 3>and so then that actually ends up taking down the

838
00:47:44.920 --> 00:47:52.599
<v Speaker 3>website or taking down the page at least, but not

839
00:47:52.639 --> 00:47:55.039
<v Speaker 3>even the website doing it, just these the online service

840
00:47:55.039 --> 00:47:57.000
<v Speaker 3>providers like, we're going to we're going to remove this

841
00:47:57.199 --> 00:47:59.719
<v Speaker 3>entire website if you don't comply with this. So then

842
00:47:59.760 --> 00:48:02.760
<v Speaker 3>they can apply. And one of the features that we

843
00:48:02.800 --> 00:48:05.639
<v Speaker 3>are in the works of adding right now so this

844
00:48:05.639 --> 00:48:09.760
<v Speaker 3>will be dated hopefully in within the next couple to

845
00:48:09.840 --> 00:48:13.360
<v Speaker 3>few weeks, is the ability for if the online service

846
00:48:13.360 --> 00:48:17.400
<v Speaker 3>providers don't respond and help get it taken down, that

847
00:48:17.559 --> 00:48:21.599
<v Speaker 3>users will be able to send every thirty days violation

848
00:48:21.719 --> 00:48:25.280
<v Speaker 3>notices to everybody associated with the website. And the goal

849
00:48:25.280 --> 00:48:27.559
<v Speaker 3>of that one is if every thirty if we can

850
00:48:27.559 --> 00:48:33.760
<v Speaker 3>be annoying enough that they get enough notices saying they're

851
00:48:33.760 --> 00:48:36.360
<v Speaker 3>in violation, that they will just take it down so

852
00:48:36.400 --> 00:48:38.400
<v Speaker 3>that they don't have to deal with the users.

853
00:48:39.639 --> 00:48:42.880
<v Speaker 4>Interesting, well, you're you are you are the batman of

854
00:48:42.920 --> 00:48:45.400
<v Speaker 4>cop No no man, I mean, you are a vicious

855
00:48:46.039 --> 00:48:48.880
<v Speaker 4>It makes me angry, I'm And the more ways that

856
00:48:48.960 --> 00:48:51.360
<v Speaker 4>we can, we can, you know, go and help get

857
00:48:51.360 --> 00:48:52.039
<v Speaker 4>them taken down.

858
00:48:52.440 --> 00:48:58.119
<v Speaker 3>I just I you know, it's it's when when you

859
00:48:58.159 --> 00:49:00.559
<v Speaker 3>see how it impacts your film, right, mean, these indie

860
00:49:00.559 --> 00:49:02.480
<v Speaker 3>well a lot of these indie films go straight to

861
00:49:02.760 --> 00:49:05.880
<v Speaker 3>straight to video on demand, and it's like you put

862
00:49:05.880 --> 00:49:08.840
<v Speaker 3>your sweat and blood into this and this is your

863
00:49:08.880 --> 00:49:11.360
<v Speaker 3>passion and you care so much, and then somebody's gonna

864
00:49:11.400 --> 00:49:14.039
<v Speaker 3>come and steal it and then they get it for

865
00:49:14.079 --> 00:49:16.239
<v Speaker 3>free and you already are making it free for people,

866
00:49:16.360 --> 00:49:17.559
<v Speaker 3>like come on.

867
00:49:17.920 --> 00:49:20.519
<v Speaker 2>It's enough, you know, yeah, well listen.

868
00:49:20.360 --> 00:49:22.159
<v Speaker 3>And they don't need to make their billions of dollars.

869
00:49:22.239 --> 00:49:23.960
<v Speaker 3>You just need to be able to make you know,

870
00:49:24.360 --> 00:49:26.599
<v Speaker 3>make your money back and make sure you've paid all

871
00:49:26.639 --> 00:49:29.480
<v Speaker 3>of your cast and crew and that they've been happy,

872
00:49:29.639 --> 00:49:34.000
<v Speaker 3>and that maybe you make a potentially I mean, fingers crossed.

873
00:49:34.079 --> 00:49:36.239
<v Speaker 3>This is not the thing that always happens. Fingers cross

874
00:49:36.239 --> 00:49:37.920
<v Speaker 3>you make a profit, so that you could then put

875
00:49:37.920 --> 00:49:41.679
<v Speaker 3>that towards the next film. Stop it stops.

876
00:49:41.840 --> 00:49:45.039
<v Speaker 2>You're talking. Just you talk, crazy talk. It's crazy talk,

877
00:49:45.280 --> 00:49:50.119
<v Speaker 2>crazy talk. It's all the same. Look Tebra per am,

878
00:49:50.119 --> 00:49:52.119
<v Speaker 2>I the only one I aveted the piano. Okay, you

879
00:49:52.199 --> 00:49:52.480
<v Speaker 2>had to.

880
00:49:54.440 --> 00:49:58.760
<v Speaker 3>Time. Now is there a you mentioned they might be

881
00:49:59.280 --> 00:50:01.159
<v Speaker 3>because I was read friend sing it per commentary.

882
00:50:02.719 --> 00:50:05.199
<v Speaker 2>We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor

883
00:50:08.840 --> 00:50:14.239
<v Speaker 2>and now back to the show. Yes, exactly. Wow, Wow,

884
00:50:14.440 --> 00:50:16.000
<v Speaker 2>let's all sing the Happy Birthday song.

885
00:50:17.159 --> 00:50:20.679
<v Speaker 3>So that's now legal though that's not legal? Oh yeah.

886
00:50:20.840 --> 00:50:23.760
<v Speaker 3>A couple of years ago it turned out that they

887
00:50:23.840 --> 00:50:28.119
<v Speaker 3>the author of it, had released it publicly like hundreds

888
00:50:28.159 --> 00:50:30.800
<v Speaker 3>of like one hundred years ago, and they were illegally

889
00:50:30.840 --> 00:50:32.960
<v Speaker 3>collecting copyright for it.

890
00:50:33.280 --> 00:50:35.960
<v Speaker 2>Oh wow, So now you can use the Happy Birthday

891
00:50:35.960 --> 00:50:37.119
<v Speaker 2>again and you can.

892
00:50:37.039 --> 00:50:39.599
<v Speaker 3>Sing Happy Birthday without owing anybody money.

893
00:50:39.760 --> 00:50:44.960
<v Speaker 2>Jesus Christ. Now you said earlier off air that you

894
00:50:45.000 --> 00:50:47.400
<v Speaker 2>have a promo code for any Indie Film Huszle tribe

895
00:50:47.440 --> 00:50:51.760
<v Speaker 2>members if they want to get their film uh you know,

896
00:50:51.800 --> 00:50:56.119
<v Speaker 2>work copyrights, use copyright slap to help protect their films online.

897
00:50:56.800 --> 00:50:59.760
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. So, as I said, we made very inexpensive, so

898
00:51:00.119 --> 00:51:03.119
<v Speaker 3>twenty dollars a month, but we created a special Indie

899
00:51:03.119 --> 00:51:05.719
<v Speaker 3>Film Hustle promo code. So I'm going to tell you

900
00:51:05.760 --> 00:51:08.679
<v Speaker 3>that code should be pretty easy for everybody. It is

901
00:51:08.920 --> 00:51:13.039
<v Speaker 3>Indie Film Hustle all one word, all lowercase. Yes, that

902
00:51:13.159 --> 00:51:16.360
<v Speaker 3>is the proper code, and that's entered when they activate

903
00:51:16.360 --> 00:51:19.440
<v Speaker 3>a project, and that will give them three months at

904
00:51:19.440 --> 00:51:23.400
<v Speaker 3>fifty percent of the actually, so ten dollars a month

905
00:51:23.559 --> 00:51:26.320
<v Speaker 3>for three months and they'll use all three months. You

906
00:51:26.320 --> 00:51:30.880
<v Speaker 3>could use it one month and you know stop and truthfully,

907
00:51:31.000 --> 00:51:33.119
<v Speaker 3>if you if you use it for even a single day,

908
00:51:33.519 --> 00:51:37.159
<v Speaker 3>you can you can enter and send DMCA violation notices

909
00:51:37.199 --> 00:51:42.280
<v Speaker 3>to every single person infringing on your your site or

910
00:51:42.280 --> 00:51:46.199
<v Speaker 3>your content in that day because there's no limit and

911
00:51:46.280 --> 00:51:49.159
<v Speaker 3>it's no extra cost, you know, per one. We have

912
00:51:49.239 --> 00:51:51.559
<v Speaker 3>we have a number of users who they use it

913
00:51:51.639 --> 00:51:54.280
<v Speaker 3>every three months. They sign in for one month, they

914
00:51:54.840 --> 00:51:58.280
<v Speaker 3>spend a few days and they enter every single illegal

915
00:51:58.320 --> 00:52:01.039
<v Speaker 3>thing and they update, you know, things that haven't been

916
00:52:01.599 --> 00:52:05.280
<v Speaker 3>complied with, they escalate and then they you know, they

917
00:52:05.320 --> 00:52:06.679
<v Speaker 3>stop using it for a couple of months and then

918
00:52:06.760 --> 00:52:09.039
<v Speaker 3>come back, you know, three months later and say, Okay,

919
00:52:09.199 --> 00:52:11.199
<v Speaker 3>I'm gonna use it again. And here's another story.

920
00:52:11.239 --> 00:52:12.239
<v Speaker 2>Bucks less rock and roll.

921
00:52:12.320 --> 00:52:16.199
<v Speaker 3>Yes, yeah, and it has had an impact with my

922
00:52:16.320 --> 00:52:20.719
<v Speaker 3>films in getting them off of streaming sites. And it's

923
00:52:20.760 --> 00:52:23.199
<v Speaker 3>you know, I think it also it depends on the

924
00:52:23.320 --> 00:52:27.960
<v Speaker 3>genre of film and and also the length of time

925
00:52:28.000 --> 00:52:30.159
<v Speaker 3>it's been online, you know, the logger it's been online.

926
00:52:30.639 --> 00:52:34.039
<v Speaker 3>If you've been able to squash these sites from adding

927
00:52:34.239 --> 00:52:37.239
<v Speaker 3>the content and they've taken it down, then they're less

928
00:52:37.320 --> 00:52:40.360
<v Speaker 3>likely to put it back up. But if it's you know,

929
00:52:40.400 --> 00:52:43.159
<v Speaker 3>if it's newer and been there for the last number

930
00:52:43.199 --> 00:52:47.079
<v Speaker 3>of years, you know, it's probably already been up and

931
00:52:47.119 --> 00:52:50.320
<v Speaker 3>people keep adding it. One thing we have seen is

932
00:52:50.440 --> 00:52:52.639
<v Speaker 3>because of the pandemic and people are at home more,

933
00:52:53.960 --> 00:52:57.159
<v Speaker 3>it's not just it's not just the action or horror

934
00:52:57.199 --> 00:53:01.400
<v Speaker 3>films that are gaining the content. It is it's sort

935
00:53:01.400 --> 00:53:06.119
<v Speaker 3>of everything everything is up in getting pirated. I mean,

936
00:53:06.119 --> 00:53:09.920
<v Speaker 3>we had one person who it's uh it was, yeah,

937
00:53:09.960 --> 00:53:12.679
<v Speaker 3>a documentary and they were like, we are seeing so

938
00:53:12.880 --> 00:53:15.559
<v Speaker 3>much piracy. I mean, you know, I won't tooot our

939
00:53:15.559 --> 00:53:17.760
<v Speaker 3>own horns, but it was, you know, we love your

940
00:53:17.800 --> 00:53:20.280
<v Speaker 3>site because we can put in so many you know,

941
00:53:20.360 --> 00:53:24.280
<v Speaker 3>takedowns every single day, but like, is this normal to

942
00:53:24.400 --> 00:53:27.840
<v Speaker 3>have this much piracy? And unfortunately, because of the pandemic

943
00:53:28.440 --> 00:53:32.119
<v Speaker 3>and sort of the switch over to two people watching

944
00:53:32.159 --> 00:53:35.400
<v Speaker 3>a lot, you know, at home, it's up so much.

945
00:53:36.000 --> 00:53:38.280
<v Speaker 3>It's it's I mean, it's also it's also up more

946
00:53:38.400 --> 00:53:41.760
<v Speaker 3>on the on the Amazon Primes, on the two BtVS

947
00:53:41.840 --> 00:53:44.599
<v Speaker 3>as well, which is good for filmmakers. It's just frustrating

948
00:53:44.599 --> 00:53:46.960
<v Speaker 3>because it's like, just give me one penny, Just give

949
00:53:47.000 --> 00:53:51.320
<v Speaker 3>me one penny for every hour you watch and it'll help.

950
00:53:51.440 --> 00:53:53.800
<v Speaker 2>Which is essentially which is essentially what Amazon Prime is

951
00:53:53.840 --> 00:53:55.199
<v Speaker 2>paying you if you could either get your film on

952
00:53:55.239 --> 00:53:56.280
<v Speaker 2>Amazon Prime anymore.

953
00:53:56.920 --> 00:53:58.320
<v Speaker 3>And that's a whole other conversation.

954
00:53:59.119 --> 00:54:00.559
<v Speaker 2>But there is a lot of there's a lot of

955
00:54:00.559 --> 00:54:04.199
<v Speaker 2>ways you can still make money with your film, especially

956
00:54:04.280 --> 00:54:06.320
<v Speaker 2>avad is the future. I think that is where a

957
00:54:06.360 --> 00:54:07.920
<v Speaker 2>lot of money is being made right now. It's the

958
00:54:07.920 --> 00:54:13.400
<v Speaker 2>strongest sector for independent filmmakers doing or trying to make

959
00:54:13.400 --> 00:54:16.760
<v Speaker 2>money in vod because s VOD if you can get

960
00:54:16.800 --> 00:54:20.719
<v Speaker 2>a deal. Great, but that's rare. H. T VOT is dead,

961
00:54:21.280 --> 00:54:26.639
<v Speaker 2>it's essentially almost dead. But TVA exactly transactional like paying

962
00:54:26.639 --> 00:54:28.599
<v Speaker 2>two ninety nine. I've always stold people. I'm like, ti

963
00:54:28.719 --> 00:54:31.559
<v Speaker 2>vot is just a holdover from the Blockbuster video store days.

964
00:54:31.599 --> 00:54:33.840
<v Speaker 2>That's all it is. It's just you're holding it over.

965
00:54:33.880 --> 00:54:38.440
<v Speaker 2>It's an older concept. And I don't know, I mean,

966
00:54:38.519 --> 00:54:41.800
<v Speaker 2>how did you have any numbers on how these these

967
00:54:41.840 --> 00:54:44.639
<v Speaker 2>Disney Because I know Disney's like releasing the premium for

968
00:54:44.679 --> 00:54:46.960
<v Speaker 2>like twenty bucks a pop or something like that, Like

969
00:54:47.000 --> 00:54:49.400
<v Speaker 2>they're gonna do that with Black Widow. Like Black Widow

970
00:54:49.440 --> 00:54:53.360
<v Speaker 2>I think might actually get some money. Like a good

971
00:54:53.360 --> 00:54:56.320
<v Speaker 2>amount of people might might pay to see Black Widow

972
00:54:56.320 --> 00:54:58.199
<v Speaker 2>because it's a Marvel movie. So it's a it's the

973
00:54:58.239 --> 00:55:01.559
<v Speaker 2>first real test because they did it with you know,

974
00:55:01.599 --> 00:55:02.239
<v Speaker 2>a couple.

975
00:55:01.960 --> 00:55:03.639
<v Speaker 3>Of Wonder Woman nineteen eighty four.

976
00:55:03.719 --> 00:55:05.440
<v Speaker 2>But that wasn't a paid a Bousan paid now. No, No,

977
00:55:05.599 --> 00:55:07.360
<v Speaker 2>that was free, Max, Yeah, that was free. Now I'm

978
00:55:07.360 --> 00:55:11.320
<v Speaker 2>talking about like paying twenty bones up front right away,

979
00:55:11.480 --> 00:55:13.239
<v Speaker 2>and the only place you can get it is by

980
00:55:13.239 --> 00:55:15.599
<v Speaker 2>paying the twenty bucks for that thirty or sixty day

981
00:55:15.639 --> 00:55:18.519
<v Speaker 2>window I think the Marvel movie will pro and we're

982
00:55:18.559 --> 00:55:21.079
<v Speaker 2>so hot, like we're hungry for Marvel.

983
00:55:21.679 --> 00:55:24.199
<v Speaker 3>I think I think all the people with their home theaters,

984
00:55:24.519 --> 00:55:26.880
<v Speaker 3>it's in there. I do think it's I do think

985
00:55:27.239 --> 00:55:29.920
<v Speaker 3>that will be more popular once the once we get

986
00:55:29.960 --> 00:55:32.760
<v Speaker 3>over this hurdle of the pandemic where you can actually

987
00:55:32.880 --> 00:55:35.800
<v Speaker 3>watch things as groups, you know, like, oh, I'm gonna

988
00:55:35.800 --> 00:55:38.760
<v Speaker 3>pay forty dollars, but we got you know, seven friends

989
00:55:38.760 --> 00:55:41.559
<v Speaker 3>over and we're chilling. That works a lot easier than

990
00:55:41.599 --> 00:55:44.159
<v Speaker 3>I'm gonna pay forty dollars and it's me by myself

991
00:55:44.239 --> 00:55:47.280
<v Speaker 3>or like, you know, me and my significant other right

992
00:55:47.400 --> 00:55:50.440
<v Speaker 3>that it's it's a little bit harder. Yeah, I mean,

993
00:55:50.440 --> 00:55:53.239
<v Speaker 3>I think I don't have any specific numbers, but I

994
00:55:53.280 --> 00:55:56.559
<v Speaker 3>know for the HBO Max is, they've been pretty happy, oh,

995
00:55:56.559 --> 00:56:00.480
<v Speaker 3>on their individual releases because it gets people to join

996
00:56:00.519 --> 00:56:04.480
<v Speaker 3>the subscription, and usually it's it's all about getting people

997
00:56:04.519 --> 00:56:06.960
<v Speaker 3>to join because maybe their retention rate is forty percent,

998
00:56:07.039 --> 00:56:10.599
<v Speaker 3>but they got supporting that more than they normally would have.

999
00:56:10.800 --> 00:56:12.960
<v Speaker 3>You know, no, what is BO Max.

1000
00:56:13.000 --> 00:56:15.519
<v Speaker 2>What HBO Max has done, man is is I mean

1001
00:56:15.559 --> 00:56:18.440
<v Speaker 2>it's pissed off a lot of filmmakers, a lot of

1002
00:56:18.440 --> 00:56:21.199
<v Speaker 2>big time filmmakers and and and actors and stuff because

1003
00:56:21.199 --> 00:56:29.239
<v Speaker 2>they're not getting their normal paydays. But i've off off

1004
00:56:29.519 --> 00:56:33.519
<v Speaker 2>off record, but I can't say who, but the payments

1005
00:56:33.559 --> 00:56:37.199
<v Speaker 2>that I've heard from people on the inside of these

1006
00:56:37.199 --> 00:56:40.800
<v Speaker 2>actors because they all get bonuses based on box office

1007
00:56:41.159 --> 00:56:43.079
<v Speaker 2>when that was taken off, They're like, look, we're just

1008
00:56:43.119 --> 00:56:46.719
<v Speaker 2>going to give you a X dollar to just be happy.

1009
00:56:46.880 --> 00:56:47.599
<v Speaker 2>You good with that?

1010
00:56:47.639 --> 00:56:50.000
<v Speaker 3>Well, well, I mean so yeah, there's well, there's a

1011
00:56:50.119 --> 00:56:53.199
<v Speaker 3>number of things. I'm I'm pretty active in the SAG

1012
00:56:53.239 --> 00:56:57.320
<v Speaker 3>after the film and TV radio union, and one of

1013
00:56:57.360 --> 00:57:00.239
<v Speaker 3>the big gains that they gained in their last TV

1014
00:57:00.400 --> 00:57:05.800
<v Speaker 3>theatrical negotiations was they had the foresight to say, Okay, yeah.

1015
00:57:05.639 --> 00:57:08.199
<v Speaker 2>We're cool with you know, theatrical and.

1016
00:57:08.119 --> 00:57:11.280
<v Speaker 3>We and releases and we you know that's important, but

1017
00:57:11.800 --> 00:57:15.280
<v Speaker 3>we want to talk about streaming and online usage. And

1018
00:57:15.320 --> 00:57:17.400
<v Speaker 3>that was their big focus and I think it is

1019
00:57:17.400 --> 00:57:19.639
<v Speaker 3>going to is paying off a lot better because that

1020
00:57:19.760 --> 00:57:22.360
<v Speaker 3>was their shift in Okay, we got to make sure

1021
00:57:22.440 --> 00:57:25.199
<v Speaker 3>that actors are covered here. And that was before the pandemic,

1022
00:57:26.760 --> 00:57:28.559
<v Speaker 3>and it was just you know, that's the trend that

1023
00:57:28.599 --> 00:57:31.599
<v Speaker 3>things are going. I think I think the movies that

1024
00:57:31.679 --> 00:57:37.519
<v Speaker 3>will be big for you know, the releases directly online

1025
00:57:38.079 --> 00:57:39.960
<v Speaker 3>like The Black Widow are going to be the same

1026
00:57:40.000 --> 00:57:42.400
<v Speaker 3>movies that will do well in theaters that you know

1027
00:57:42.480 --> 00:57:45.719
<v Speaker 3>you want to see with a you know, a big

1028
00:57:45.760 --> 00:57:49.480
<v Speaker 3>screen and surround sound. That I mean I went last

1029
00:57:49.480 --> 00:57:53.679
<v Speaker 3>I saw. I remember seeing Captain Marvel in the theaters

1030
00:57:54.159 --> 00:57:56.719
<v Speaker 3>and in the last ten minutes somebody let their kid

1031
00:57:56.800 --> 00:57:58.519
<v Speaker 3>run up but now in the aisle screaming, and I

1032
00:57:58.519 --> 00:58:01.480
<v Speaker 3>was like, are you kidding me? Like, I'm here, this

1033
00:58:01.519 --> 00:58:03.480
<v Speaker 3>is my movie experience.

1034
00:58:03.159 --> 00:58:05.079
<v Speaker 2>And I paid, I paid good money to be here.

1035
00:58:05.280 --> 00:58:06.719
<v Speaker 2>Oh no, dude, don't even get me start.

1036
00:58:06.880 --> 00:58:09.119
<v Speaker 3>I mean, I'm like an Alamo draft House. This is

1037
00:58:09.119 --> 00:58:10.960
<v Speaker 3>not an ad for Alama draft House. I have no

1038
00:58:11.159 --> 00:58:13.599
<v Speaker 3>association with them. But the fact that day at the

1039
00:58:13.599 --> 00:58:16.079
<v Speaker 3>beginning are like, if you answer a cell phone call,

1040
00:58:16.119 --> 00:58:18.440
<v Speaker 3>we will kick you out. If you open your cell

1041
00:58:18.480 --> 00:58:20.440
<v Speaker 3>phone and we see the screen on, we'll give you

1042
00:58:20.480 --> 00:58:21.920
<v Speaker 3>a warning and then we'll kick you out and you

1043
00:58:21.920 --> 00:58:25.639
<v Speaker 3>don't get your money back. I'm like, yes, because it's

1044
00:58:25.639 --> 00:58:27.480
<v Speaker 3>like I'm paid, I paid me here, and I think,

1045
00:58:28.079 --> 00:58:31.480
<v Speaker 3>you know it's it's changing the types of movies do

1046
00:58:31.559 --> 00:58:35.079
<v Speaker 3>you need to see, you know, a comedy in a

1047
00:58:35.079 --> 00:58:39.559
<v Speaker 3>big screen. Huh. But like you know endgame, Oh, I.

1048
00:58:39.440 --> 00:58:41.639
<v Speaker 2>Mean can you oh God, of course.

1049
00:58:41.320 --> 00:58:44.000
<v Speaker 3>Like Alatar back you know, back in the day when

1050
00:58:44.000 --> 00:58:46.320
<v Speaker 3>that came out, Like I saw Avatar in three D twice,

1051
00:58:46.440 --> 00:58:49.039
<v Speaker 3>just because there's it's an experience.

1052
00:58:48.880 --> 00:58:51.039
<v Speaker 2>You know, it's it's a ry at that. Yeah, you

1053
00:58:51.079 --> 00:58:54.079
<v Speaker 2>can't get that at home, no matter how insane. I mean,

1054
00:58:54.159 --> 00:58:56.039
<v Speaker 2>unless you have literally an IMAX at your house. It

1055
00:58:56.360 --> 00:58:56.840
<v Speaker 2>really is not.

1056
00:58:57.760 --> 00:58:59.960
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I mean, I'm not gonna lie. I've got a

1057
00:59:00.159 --> 00:59:03.360
<v Speaker 3>I've got a projector and it's it's probably set up

1058
00:59:03.400 --> 00:59:07.840
<v Speaker 3>for a fifteen foot diagonal screen, and I've got five

1059
00:59:07.840 --> 00:59:10.599
<v Speaker 3>point one surround sound, well five point zero because I

1060
00:59:10.679 --> 00:59:15.960
<v Speaker 3>removed my soubble for because of neighbors. But you know,

1061
00:59:16.079 --> 00:59:19.039
<v Speaker 3>I've got like it's you know, if I'm watching a movie,

1062
00:59:19.239 --> 00:59:21.719
<v Speaker 3>I make my own popcorn. We can we can, you know,

1063
00:59:21.760 --> 00:59:26.679
<v Speaker 3>we can, we can chill. There's nobody screaming, and compared

1064
00:59:26.719 --> 00:59:29.079
<v Speaker 3>to some of the smaller theaters in New York. Actually

1065
00:59:29.159 --> 00:59:31.239
<v Speaker 3>the screen size might be comparable.

1066
00:59:30.960 --> 00:59:33.280
<v Speaker 2>Compare and the sound experience might be comparable. Look, at

1067
00:59:33.280 --> 00:59:35.119
<v Speaker 2>the end of the day, I don't think theatricals ever

1068
00:59:35.199 --> 00:59:36.880
<v Speaker 2>going to go away completely I think they'll always go

1069
00:59:37.000 --> 00:59:39.599
<v Speaker 2>some way, just like like Broadway. Still Broadway. People still

1070
00:59:39.599 --> 00:59:42.320
<v Speaker 2>paying amount of money. But I think it's because the

1071
00:59:42.320 --> 00:59:44.039
<v Speaker 2>price of those tickets are going to go up. It's

1072
00:59:44.079 --> 00:59:45.519
<v Speaker 2>going to be much more of an experience in the

1073
00:59:45.639 --> 00:59:48.719
<v Speaker 2>days of going to go see, you know, a comedy

1074
00:59:48.880 --> 00:59:51.920
<v Speaker 2>of like Dumb and Dumber at the theater and spending

1075
00:59:52.039 --> 00:59:56.039
<v Speaker 2>twenty five bucks to go see a comedy or even

1076
00:59:56.039 --> 01:00:01.400
<v Speaker 2>a drama at the theater unless you're hardcore cinophile. We'll

1077
01:00:01.400 --> 01:00:07.400
<v Speaker 2>be right back after a word from our sponsor, and

1078
01:00:07.480 --> 01:00:11.199
<v Speaker 2>now back to the show. Most people are being like,

1079
01:00:11.280 --> 01:00:12.440
<v Speaker 2>know what, I'm good. I'm good at.

1080
01:00:12.360 --> 01:00:16.199
<v Speaker 3>Home, unless the theater industry pivots, if they pivot and

1081
01:00:16.320 --> 01:00:19.679
<v Speaker 3>everything becomes like the Alamo Draft Horse have Alamo Draft

1082
01:00:19.679 --> 01:00:22.920
<v Speaker 3>House where there's you know, a restaurant link to it

1083
01:00:23.079 --> 01:00:25.440
<v Speaker 3>or a bar, and you can bring your food and

1084
01:00:25.480 --> 01:00:27.239
<v Speaker 3>you can bring your drinks, and they make money off

1085
01:00:27.280 --> 01:00:29.599
<v Speaker 3>of the food sales like they do now except for

1086
01:00:30.199 --> 01:00:33.039
<v Speaker 3>the you know, the theaters that make money off their food.

1087
01:00:33.079 --> 01:00:36.320
<v Speaker 3>Now it's popcorn and candy that's not necessarily for everybody

1088
01:00:36.320 --> 01:00:39.119
<v Speaker 3>and way over priced, but if it's reasonably priced and

1089
01:00:39.159 --> 01:00:41.039
<v Speaker 3>they're making their money because people want to come and

1090
01:00:41.079 --> 01:00:44.440
<v Speaker 3>they want the experience. It's that's a way to keep

1091
01:00:44.440 --> 01:00:44.760
<v Speaker 3>it going.

1092
01:00:45.119 --> 01:00:47.079
<v Speaker 2>It's gonna keep going, It's gonna ge qu Anyway, we

1093
01:00:47.079 --> 01:00:50.000
<v Speaker 2>have veered off the copyright path a bit. It's just

1094
01:00:50.079 --> 01:00:52.440
<v Speaker 2>now two film geeks talking about the business. But anyway,

1095
01:00:52.599 --> 01:00:55.400
<v Speaker 2>Evan man, thank you so much for you know, being

1096
01:00:55.519 --> 01:00:59.119
<v Speaker 2>that night avenger for copyrights. You are. You are the

1097
01:00:59.199 --> 01:01:02.639
<v Speaker 2>dark Knight. I appreciate what you're doing man, and helping

1098
01:01:02.639 --> 01:01:06.280
<v Speaker 2>filmmakers out when you reached out to me a while ago.

1099
01:01:06.320 --> 01:01:08.639
<v Speaker 2>Now we've been trying to see this interview for a minute,

1100
01:01:09.239 --> 01:01:11.719
<v Speaker 2>but when I saw it, I was like, man, this

1101
01:01:11.840 --> 01:01:14.800
<v Speaker 2>is so desperately needed and I want to get the

1102
01:01:14.800 --> 01:01:16.719
<v Speaker 2>word out on this. So thank you so much for

1103
01:01:16.760 --> 01:01:18.719
<v Speaker 2>what you do, brother, and keep up the good fight,

1104
01:01:18.800 --> 01:01:19.199
<v Speaker 2>my friend.

1105
01:01:19.519 --> 01:01:23.119
<v Speaker 3>Now, keep and keep making films. Anybody listening, keep making films.

1106
01:01:23.119 --> 01:01:25.840
<v Speaker 3>Don't let them keep you down. Thanks man, Thank you.

1107
01:01:26.440 --> 01:01:28.239
<v Speaker 2>I want to thank Evan for coming on the show

1108
01:01:28.280 --> 01:01:32.000
<v Speaker 2>and dropping his copyright knowledge bombs on the Tribe today.

1109
01:01:32.039 --> 01:01:34.599
<v Speaker 2>Thank you so much, Evan for not only being on

1110
01:01:34.639 --> 01:01:39.320
<v Speaker 2>the show, but being that avenger of the independent filmmaker

1111
01:01:39.360 --> 01:01:43.559
<v Speaker 2>and helping us fight these pirates online. Thank you so much, Evan.

1112
01:01:43.599 --> 01:01:45.000
<v Speaker 2>If you want to get links to anything we spoke

1113
01:01:45.039 --> 01:01:47.800
<v Speaker 2>about in this episode, including how to sign up for

1114
01:01:47.920 --> 01:01:50.920
<v Speaker 2>copyright slap, head over to the show notes at Bulletproof

1115
01:01:50.920 --> 01:01:54.559
<v Speaker 2>Screenwriting dot tv. Forward slash three eighty seven. Thank you

1116
01:01:54.559 --> 01:01:57.199
<v Speaker 2>so much for listening, guys, As always, keep on writing

1117
01:01:57.360 --> 01:01:59.199
<v Speaker 2>no matter what. I'll talk to you soon.

1118
01:01:59.639 --> 01:02:03.599
<v Speaker 1>Thanks are listening to the Bulletproof Screenwriting podcast at Bulletproof

1119
01:02:03.679 --> 01:02:05.039
<v Speaker 1>Screenwriting dot tv.