Speaker 1: Welcome back in today, guys. I've got Zach Pandel coming
Speaker 1: in from Grayscale. We are going to break down the
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Speaker 1: few taps. Zach, how are you.
Speaker 2: I'm awesome, Paul, great to be on with you. Again
Speaker 2: looking forward to this conversation.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so we've got a lot happening in the markets
Speaker 1: right now. If you consider one thing, and that is
Speaker 1: just the simple thing of bitcoin price. We are now
Speaker 1: at sixty nine thousand, so we're seeing the sixes again.
Speaker 1: You look at a couple of points right now, and
Speaker 1: one of the things I want to focus in on
Speaker 1: is why so you've got a little bit of a
Speaker 1: market pushback. There's been some selling across some of the
Speaker 1: major exchanges. Right there, I'm showing finance coinbas bybit. They're
Speaker 1: all offloading some large amounts right now. Do you think
Speaker 1: this is something to do with the broader risk market
Speaker 1: or is this simply a rotation of capital into what's
Speaker 1: happening over on the S and P five hundred.
Speaker 2: I think the bitcoin has a flow problem from a
Speaker 2: number of large sellers, particularly Strategy formerly micro Strategy, and
Speaker 2: the other large digital asset treasuries. I think we have
Speaker 2: an overhang of supply from the dats at the moment,
Speaker 2: and we're still working through that a supply. We have
Speaker 2: confirmation now that Strategy sold. We know that Maha or Marathon,
Speaker 2: the bitcoin minor, which also operates sort of as a
Speaker 2: Quasi dat had sold some assets, and some of the
Speaker 2: smaller players also selling. So look, I think that unfortunately,
Speaker 2: this is a bitcoin specific problem clearly not something that's
Speaker 2: weighing on the S and P five hundred, and I
Speaker 2: think it's largely a supply overhang from the dats. I
Speaker 2: think we're going to get through this in the coming
Speaker 2: weeks and find a durable bottom.
Speaker 1: Well that's the key right now, is finding the durable bottom.
Speaker 1: If we continue to see the S and P five
Speaker 1: hundred skyrocket, and if this does I mean because I've
Speaker 1: talked to a couple of analysts that I've got one
Speaker 1: analyst O here telling you this is a supercycle. This
Speaker 1: is not like the bomb era. We are going to
Speaker 1: continue to see this kind of train moving and we
Speaker 1: haven't seen anything like this in all of the finance
Speaker 1: sector's history. Do you think that continues to put pressure
Speaker 1: on risk in terms of just liquidity where the cash
Speaker 1: is moving.
Speaker 2: As long as risky assets like the stock market continue
Speaker 2: to go up, I think ultimately that's a positive for crypto,
Speaker 2: and I would see a setback in equities as something
Speaker 2: that could weigh on crypto short term. It's true that
Speaker 2: there is maybe some rotation, you know, speculative investors taking
Speaker 2: capital out of crypto deploying it into some of the
Speaker 2: high flying AI stocks has been that been part of
Speaker 2: the story. Yes, I think absolutely, But it'd be pretty
Speaker 2: unusual situation if the equity market continue to make new
Speaker 2: highs driven by AI and this other part of the market,
Speaker 2: digital assets, which is complementary to AI, didn't ultimately participate
Speaker 2: in that a trade. So look, I think that crypto
Speaker 2: is going to catch up to the move inequities here
Speaker 2: over the coming months. It may take a few catalysts,
Speaker 2: some of the things that we'll talk about, clarity, maybe
Speaker 2: getting through this supply overhang, but rather than crypto staying
Speaker 2: depressed while equities take off, I ultimately think that there's
Speaker 2: a pretty good chance we catch up to the boom
Speaker 2: that we see in stocks.
Speaker 1: You look at Tom Lee's a narrative here, and we've
Speaker 1: talked about it before. He has this three phase idea,
Speaker 1: but he's also referencing the tailwinds that he thinks are sustainable,
Speaker 1: which is what has happened to drive us to seventy
Speaker 1: six hundred. He's also talking about us GDP growth is accelerating.
Speaker 1: So this economy is not slowing down. And then the
Speaker 1: timing is he's saying leads into a raging bull in
Speaker 1: twenty twenty seven and beyond. Do you think that is?
Speaker 1: Would you put that timeline as the same as what
Speaker 1: Lee is pointing to or do you see a different
Speaker 1: frame work here.
Speaker 2: Look, I love Tom Lee's work, and I agree with
Speaker 2: a lot a lot of that. I could see crypto
Speaker 2: recovering sooner than twenty twenty seven. I'm more optimistic, I
Speaker 2: think on the shorter term outlook. The only thing I
Speaker 2: would add to that frame where is I think both
Speaker 2: crypto and the equity market has some fed risk over
Speaker 2: the shorter term. Inflation is still running relatively high. We
Speaker 2: don't have a resolution in the Iran conflict, so it's
Speaker 2: hard to be confident that oil prices will come down.
Speaker 2: So there is some risk that the Federal Reserve needs
Speaker 2: to at least talk about higher rates. That could be
Speaker 2: the one thing that's a speed bump to risky assets
Speaker 2: over the coming months, and something I'm a little nervous about,
Speaker 2: to be.
Speaker 1: Honest, Yeah, and I'm nervous, but I just saw some
Speaker 1: big data. Obviously, we're down here in Florida. I tweeted
Speaker 1: about this this morning, is that this is almost recessionary
Speaker 1: price action that's happening in the real estate market here
Speaker 1: in Florida. And what I mean by that is that
Speaker 1: right now, it's almost twelve percent of homes in Florida
Speaker 1: have either lowered their price or actively lowering their price
Speaker 1: right now, which is very indicative of a risk on market,
Speaker 1: which is our risk off market, which is what we're
Speaker 1: seeing now in real estate in Florida, which has been
Speaker 1: mostly bulletproof against these kind of things. If a rate
Speaker 1: hike were to come in come on, that would just
Speaker 1: absolutely put a bombshell in the middle of the real
Speaker 1: estate market, wouldn't you think.
Speaker 2: I do think it would be a major headwind for
Speaker 2: real estate. And we have this sort of bifurcated economy
Speaker 2: at the moment to Paul, where you know, AI AI
Speaker 2: cap X related things really taking off and other parts
Speaker 2: of the economy looking a little bit soft. You know,
Speaker 2: what are you supposed to do as the Federal Reserve?
Speaker 2: You know, these are difficult decisions that are they're going
Speaker 2: to have to make, But ultimately, if inflation is still
Speaker 2: running around three percent or higher, they're probably going to
Speaker 2: need to take action on it, and that will be
Speaker 2: a surprise for President Trump to nominate a candidate President
Speaker 2: Trump obviously interested.
Speaker 3: In low rates.
Speaker 2: To nominate a candidate that ultimately raises rates pretty quick
Speaker 2: would be a surprise, But I don't think we can
Speaker 2: rule it out given what we're seeing on the inflation
Speaker 2: side of the ledger.
Speaker 1: What do you make of Charles Schwab saying they're going
Speaker 1: to roll out direct spot crypto trading to advisors next year.
Speaker 2: Well, it's great to see, and another and a long
Speaker 2: line of steps unlocking digital assets for every type of investor.
Speaker 2: Of course, greyscale has played a central role in that
Speaker 2: story for more than a decade, providing more efficient access
Speaker 2: to investors to the digital assets space. And we want
Speaker 2: to see all these types of access opened up. The
Speaker 2: ETF products that we specialize in our a great solution
Speaker 2: for many investor types owning tokens directly on chain or
Speaker 2: through a wallet infrastructure. Is it going to be an
Speaker 2: increasing part of the future story as well. We're thrilled
Speaker 2: to see this. I think it will be the first
Speaker 2: of many platforms opening up of true access to token trading.
Speaker 1: Well. Timing is interesting too, because that of course next
Speaker 1: year would mean that hopefully we're post clarity. By then,
Speaker 1: rias are going to be getting much more active in
Speaker 1: the digital space, I think by then, and much more
Speaker 1: educated as well. Speaking of ETFs, I was looking at
Speaker 1: this right here, which is the chains by app revenue
Speaker 1: in May, Solana leading the way. I know you guys
Speaker 1: have ETFs around a lot of these. Hyper Liquid comes
Speaker 1: at number two, but Solana was up ninety one million,
Speaker 1: almost double hyper liquid. That blew me away when you
Speaker 1: saw the app revenue just in May. Ethereum came in
Speaker 1: a little soft at fifty two, and then you have
Speaker 1: Polygon and Base. When you look at these chains right
Speaker 1: now and you consider the opportunity, is it Solana that
Speaker 1: you think might end up leading this somewhat bear market.
Speaker 1: Out of this bear market, what do you think.
Speaker 2: Well, you have a couple of chains that are running
Speaker 2: ahead of the others over the short term. Some people
Speaker 2: are calling it the three headed dragon of hyper liquid,
Speaker 2: z cash, and niear. I would say those are the
Speaker 2: things that really have stood out since the end of March,
Speaker 2: since we've seen some movement in the ald coin space.
Speaker 2: I think those can continue to be leaders. That being said,
Speaker 2: I think that's a great chart that highlights really the
Speaker 2: strength of the Salana ecosystem. Incredible diversity projects that make
Speaker 2: real revenue and have lots of users. It's a very sound, durable,
Speaker 2: diverse ecosystem.
Speaker 3: Solana.
Speaker 2: It should be a key part in anybody's crypto portfolio,
Speaker 2: and I think entry points to that asset are very good.
Speaker 3: At the moment. Solana is not going anywhere.
Speaker 2: You're getting, as a longer term investor, a great access
Speaker 2: point in the ecosystem at current prices.
Speaker 1: I saw this right here, which was a topic on gold,
Speaker 1: and the question was I think a lot of people
Speaker 1: at least in our chat was talking this very issue,
Speaker 1: and that is gold starting to take over for treasuries.
Speaker 1: The ECB comes in it says, yeah, the gold has
Speaker 1: replaced treasuries as the worldtop preserve. I don't see how
Speaker 1: there's enough gold to do that. What do you make of.
Speaker 3: This, well, Paul, this is a topic near and dear
Speaker 3: to my heart. Definitely.
Speaker 2: The reason that I started to get so interested in
Speaker 2: bitcoin back in the day was thinking about exactly the
Speaker 2: challenges of fiat currencies. Debt and deficits are fracturing global
Speaker 2: monetary system, and some of the things that have driven
Speaker 2: central banks to look at gold. Your listeners will remember
Speaker 2: that really the thing that I think was the starting
Speaker 2: gun on this diversification process was actually Russia's invasion of
Speaker 2: Ukraine and the sanctions that the US and European governments
Speaker 2: imposed on the Russian Central Bank really motivated a rethinking
Speaker 2: about the security of treasury bonds as reserves and a
Speaker 2: need for major central banks to start accumulating gold again.
Speaker 2: And that's been a huge run. Look, my own personal
Speaker 2: view is that this continues for a long time, and
Speaker 2: ultimately it also incorporates digital assets. I think bitcoin and
Speaker 2: some other digital assets have features like a goal that
Speaker 2: have a role to play in central bank up portfolios
Speaker 2: and will compete with treasury bonds with other types of
Speaker 2: Fiat currency risk, and they belong there in those portfolios
Speaker 2: for the long run.
Speaker 1: Could we ever see an ETF that is multi asset
Speaker 1: with multi markets.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, I think watch this space.
Speaker 2: I think you will see portfolios that blend both equities
Speaker 2: and eat crypto exposures for different themes. I don't want
Speaker 2: to overshare here at this moment. I think you will
Speaker 2: see more of that and also sort of acid allocation
Speaker 2: type products that look across the spectrum and incorporate digital assets.
Speaker 2: I think that absolutely will be part of the next
Speaker 2: phase of product innovation for digital assets.
Speaker 1: Well, a lot of that is going to be critical
Speaker 1: in terms of what's going on with Clarity, because the
Speaker 1: Clarity Act is entering a very very important four week
Speaker 1: window right now. The Senate returns back to DC and
Speaker 1: they're expected to resume on Clarity right now. The question
Speaker 1: really because we had that and I'll show you the
Speaker 1: poly market actually, let me bring it up real quick
Speaker 1: because this was a little bit surprising on where poly
Speaker 1: market was on Clarity. And I'll show the week on
Speaker 1: this for you guys that might be listening in the audio.
Speaker 1: It started right around sixty one. We had kind of
Speaker 1: peaked around right there on May. Yeah, so you're looking
Speaker 1: at around May thirty first, around sixty one percent, and
Speaker 1: then it dove over the weekend and we saw a
Speaker 1: very low point right here just yesterday, which was holding
Speaker 1: it at a forty nine percent chance, and it is
Speaker 1: bounced back today and it's holding it fifty five. So
Speaker 1: why do you think the erratic nature first? And do
Speaker 1: you think that Congress is going to get this on
Speaker 1: the floor before the midterms.
Speaker 2: I think clarity is coming, and I think that we're
Speaker 2: going to see rapid progress over the next month or two.
Speaker 2: It's not a done deal, and there are obviously people
Speaker 2: opposing the legislation. As we've talked about in the past, Paul,
Speaker 2: the banking lobby is not thrilled about this piece of legislation.
Speaker 2: But that's one good sign that it is making real
Speaker 2: inroads and has a real shot to pass. Look, my
Speaker 2: personal odds are higher and more stable than the polymarket contract.
Speaker 3: I think.
Speaker 2: As much as I love poly market, I look at
Speaker 2: these charts myself, so you know, the liquidity on some
Speaker 2: of these contracts are a bit low, and so we
Speaker 2: just need to be careful not to overinterpret them. I
Speaker 2: think maybe the gyrations reflect just you know, people are
Speaker 2: a little unsure and it's a it's a thin market.
Speaker 2: But you know, we're gonna see big steps over the
Speaker 2: coming weeks, you know. To me, the biggest piece of
Speaker 2: news recently was Jamie Diamond and some of the other
Speaker 2: key constituents in the bank lobby really coming out so
Speaker 2: forcedly against Clarity is a sign that they need to
Speaker 2: spend their time, their effort, their lobbying dollars on this
Speaker 2: tobby because it's very important and it's probably likely going
Speaker 2: to pass, so you know, we will see how the
Speaker 2: next couple of months shakeout.
Speaker 3: I hope that this passes. I think this will pass.
Speaker 2: I think it will be very positive for ensuring that
Speaker 2: crypto can continue to be built effectively in the United States.
Speaker 1: This was an odd video that came in from the
Speaker 1: chief policy officer with Coinbasin, and what he was talking
Speaker 1: about was that it was almost because, I mean, we
Speaker 1: all heard the words come out of Jamie Diamond's mouth
Speaker 1: about Coinbase. Brian Armstrong wasn't nice. But at the same time,
Speaker 1: it's as if Coinbase is trying to play kind of
Speaker 1: nice with the banks, saying, hey, every big bank is
Speaker 1: going to get into this crypto sector. This is after
Speaker 1: those statements. So I'm getting mixed signals here as to
Speaker 1: what's actually going on up there. Is this all theater?
Speaker 1: I'm beginning to wonder if this is all theater going forward?
Speaker 2: So well, I think you can assume that things that
Speaker 2: happen in Washington are mostly theater. Uh And you know my,
Speaker 2: I'll leave that to the professionals and the lobbyist. You
Speaker 2: know my, my judgment as a market analyst is to
Speaker 2: try to get my best guess odds on this thing
Speaker 2: happening or not. And I feel pretty good about it.
Speaker 2: That's my that's my judgment.
Speaker 1: I like it, Yeah, I like it. Listen, we've got
Speaker 1: to talk about XRP ETFs continuing to be on the
Speaker 1: move here right now, we've got some big winners right now.
Speaker 1: Bit Wise leads out with the largest position at least
Speaker 1: in XRP, Franklin templand holding number two. Canary, you guys
Speaker 1: coming in at number four. So growth is still coming
Speaker 1: in pretty aggressively. And this right here was pretty interesting
Speaker 1: because we've talked about this before with some other analysts
Speaker 1: and it was trying to predict where xrp's total assets
Speaker 1: net assets would be crossing now one point one billion
Speaker 1: coming in hot. So where do you think this ends up?
Speaker 1: All ETFs by end of year holding XRPH, where do
Speaker 1: you think this ends up?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Good, good question. I think it's a good highlight
Speaker 3: of Paul.
Speaker 2: The XRP ETFs have been popular with investors lately, and
Speaker 2: I have seen inflows while some of the other products
Speaker 2: have seen outflows. I think one of the advantages here
Speaker 2: is is diversification in a in a crypto portfolio. You know,
Speaker 2: bitcoin and ethereum ETFs have seen similar behavior and similar
Speaker 2: price action. XRP uh, you know, sort of zigging while
Speaker 2: the others are are zagging. Makes it a good diversifier
Speaker 2: in the mix. In terms of where this is going, look,
Speaker 2: I think some rough benchmarks can be the percent of
Speaker 2: assets that are held in the bitcoin and ethereum ETFs
Speaker 2: that are a little bit further along, you know, that's
Speaker 2: in the zone of you know, five six percent or
Speaker 2: so any given a month. I think probably that's the
Speaker 2: shorter term direction of travel for XRP other ult coins
Speaker 2: is heading in that the direction of total asset and
Speaker 2: then probably more growth over time. But I would expect
Speaker 2: to get you know, to five six percent of the
Speaker 2: outstanding circulating supply and then we'll see, you know, we'll
Speaker 2: see what investor appetite looks like.
Speaker 1: When you say to five to six percent of outstanding
Speaker 1: supply of both assets accumulative or each individual asset.
Speaker 2: Meaning the XRP ETFs collectively hold you know, five to
Speaker 2: six percent of the circulating supply of the XORP token
Speaker 2: something like that with a big round number. Guess as
Speaker 2: a starting point. I think we're heading in that direction.
Speaker 2: I think XORP has seen, as you said, lot lots
Speaker 2: of demand. I think there's a good chance that that
Speaker 2: or certainly higher number in the ETFA structure as possible.
Speaker 1: SEEMI Group is officially live with twenty four to seven
Speaker 1: crypto futures now, so that's all rolling Ripple Prime, their
Speaker 1: day one clearing and financing partner is underway. XRP futures also,
Speaker 1: as you know, kind of just as a note, they
Speaker 1: were the fastest ever to cross the one billion in
Speaker 1: open interest on CIMI, so that in itself probably opens
Speaker 1: up a large market. How big of an impact is
Speaker 1: this on the markets in generally what's going on right
Speaker 1: now with just crypto futures and options.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, futures are a huge part of the ecosystem,
Speaker 2: and I think are a big part of the broader
Speaker 2: adoption story of the technology.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: Futures of course a critical element of virtually every developed
Speaker 2: financial asset, and an important part in crypto. They're used
Speaker 2: for hedgers, speculators for basis trade activity, and certainly for
Speaker 2: institutional investors like hedge funds that want to capture leverage
Speaker 2: through a regulated product. Of futures are still the right
Speaker 2: place to go. And then of course there's the bigger
Speaker 2: story Paul, that we've talked about as well, but.
Speaker 3: Of perpetual futures.
Speaker 2: Perpetual futures are a crypto native that is being exported
Speaker 2: to traditional finance. We saw the CFDC on Friday grant
Speaker 2: the first perpetual futures product to Calshi. We're going to
Speaker 2: see a bunch more of that. That'll be a tailwind
Speaker 2: for hyper liquid and other kind of platforms associated with
Speaker 2: a perpetual futures maybe Salona ecosystem and other things, and
Speaker 2: I think places like the CME will ultimately list these
Speaker 2: products as well. So futures have been an important part
Speaker 2: of crypto to date. I think our way in which
Speaker 2: crypto is beginning to reshape traditional finance as well.
Speaker 1: We saw and had a chance to talk with a
Speaker 1: founder that is building an AI tool for AI enhanced trading,
Speaker 1: and I asked him very specifically if that tool is
Speaker 1: going to be available for ETFs for basically it to
Speaker 1: manage and fund in and out of ETFs as well
Speaker 1: as vaults. His answer was yes, So it's likely that
Speaker 1: we're going to see a lot more of these tools
Speaker 1: out there. What do you make of that? If we
Speaker 1: do see AI trading occur and it starts to go
Speaker 1: out and find us the best deals, whether it's vault
Speaker 1: best deals for yield, or it's the best ETFs for
Speaker 1: lowest rates, best activity to liquidity, all that, what do
Speaker 1: you think?
Speaker 2: Well, I think it's incredibly exciting vision, and I think
Speaker 2: something that will drive liquidity and volume and transaction activity
Speaker 2: for blockchain, so kind of fundamentally and important growth driver
Speaker 2: potentially of crypto and blockchain adoption. I'm curious to see
Speaker 2: what risk parameters we put around you as well, because
Speaker 2: you know, you put a bazooka in the hands of
Speaker 2: a novice, you know you better watch out what's going
Speaker 2: to happen. So are these sort of things have been
Speaker 2: a part of like the hedge fund and quantitative trading
Speaker 2: ecosystem for a long time. Black professional investors, they put
Speaker 2: a risk framework around it. I think we're going to
Speaker 2: need if AI agents are deploying capital for the every
Speaker 2: man like myself. I hope that's the case, but I
Speaker 2: want to make sure I have a fullsome risk framework
Speaker 2: around it.
Speaker 1: Listen, I did. I did a full test on it.
Speaker 1: Last week in paper mode, which is you know where
Speaker 1: it's basically trading you know, fictitious portfolios. I got absolutely demolished.
Speaker 1: So I'm not totally in on it just yet. But
Speaker 1: there were some wins within it, but not enough to
Speaker 1: be able to make that like a successful test. I
Speaker 1: think you're right. I think the key is it's going
Speaker 1: to be one. It's going to have to learn and
Speaker 1: understand the market dynamics are so fluid right now, and
Speaker 1: to be able to keep up with that, I don't know.
Speaker 1: I'm still on the fence as to how it's going
Speaker 1: to be super efficient now. Tactical measurements like hey, go
Speaker 1: out and buy this asset and find me the best rate.
Speaker 1: That's just you know, a skill that I'm assigning to
Speaker 1: the AI to do rather than asking it to get,
Speaker 1: you know, go out and make the purchase for me.
Speaker 1: So I think you're right, it's going to be an
Speaker 1: intriguing next step forward. What is new for gray Scale?
Speaker 1: Do you guys have anything coming out that you can
Speaker 1: talk about today?
Speaker 2: Well, I should not hesitate to highlight our hyper liquid
Speaker 2: etf that will launch momentarily. We are thrilled about the
Speaker 2: hyper liquid ecosystem. I think really the breakout success story
Speaker 2: of this cycle in digital assets showing the power of
Speaker 2: blockchain technology to do something great with a financial derivative,
Speaker 2: perpetual futures, a place where customers are really cutthroat and
Speaker 2: very focused on best execution, best price, etc. Hyper Liquid
Speaker 2: is showing you can do that with a blockchain. I
Speaker 2: think that's why it's making big waves in a traditional
Speaker 2: finance on Wall Street. We think investors are going to
Speaker 2: be very interested in our hyper liquid ETF launching momentarily.
Speaker 1: Well. I think the trad fi gets it, you know because,
Speaker 1: like you mentioned earlier, as they've already been down the
Speaker 1: track of quant trading, so they understand, you know, kind
Speaker 1: of the model of what is being done right now,
Speaker 1: not only with hyper liquid, but what we're going to
Speaker 1: see in purpose here very quickly, I think in the
Speaker 1: US market. So this could get a little crazy pretty
Speaker 1: quickly for sure. Where do you see this in say
Speaker 1: six months?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Great, great question.
Speaker 2: So the hyper liquid product, I'll just mention the ticker,
Speaker 2: it's hype G. hYP G launching very shortly. Please take
Speaker 2: a look out for it. I think the key thing, Paul,
Speaker 2: is the kind of regulatory unlocks that will happen for
Speaker 2: this ecosystem and related ecosystems. Hyper Liquid, as your listeners know,
Speaker 2: specializes in perpetual futures and it's a decentralized exchange, two
Speaker 2: areas where there's regulatory ambiguity in the US market. We
Speaker 2: are unlocking the first door for perpetual futures right now.
Speaker 2: That's what the CFT announcement last Friday was all about,
Speaker 2: and we're going to we think, unlock that second door
Speaker 2: access to decentralized exchanges for US investors over the coming
Speaker 2: quarters as well. So I think that's where we're heading.
Speaker 2: It's kind of regulatory change facilitating professional access to platforms
Speaker 2: like hyper liquid over the coming year or so, exactly
Speaker 2: what we want to see, you know, That's that's the
Speaker 2: whole goal, is it build great technology, bring those benefits
Speaker 2: to users in a way that's safe and regulated. I
Speaker 2: think that's what we're going to see over the coming months.
Speaker 2: Hyper Liquid an important part of that story. We're delighted
Speaker 2: to be along for the ride.
Speaker 1: Man. I'm getting so much input from investment advisors that
Speaker 1: are in our community and they are telling me that
Speaker 1: the demand right now from investors. I'm talking about whether
Speaker 1: it's family offices, high out with individuals, or just you know,
Speaker 1: people that are looking to trade. Has really accelerated in
Speaker 1: terms of digital assets, even though the market is coming down.
Speaker 2: So I couldn't agree more with that, Paul. You know
Speaker 2: my day to day is so different than what I
Speaker 2: read on crypto Twitter.
Speaker 1: No, it's crazy.
Speaker 2: You know, professional investors are looking at regulatory clarity, they're
Speaker 2: looking at the adoption metrics, they're looking at there clear
Speaker 2: use cases like stable coins and token iszed assets, and
Speaker 2: they're saying, now is the time, Now is the time
Speaker 2: that I make the leap into crypto. I'm having that
Speaker 2: conversation literally every single day. Uh Here, it's hard to
Speaker 2: be downbeat about the outlook for this asset class. Doing
Speaker 2: my role at grey Scale.
Speaker 1: Hey listen, we're gonna be watching this and a whole
Speaker 1: lot more this week because there is a busy week
Speaker 1: ahead of us, knowing obviously what is happening DC. This
Speaker 1: of course gets into all these new financial tools coming in. Zach,
Speaker 1: thanks for coming in and chatting about it. We appreciate it.
Speaker 3: My pleasure is always Paul.
Speaker 2: Great to see you one