Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to the show. This is the Cult
Speaker 1: of Conspiracy, and my name's Jonathan, I'm Jacob and today
Speaker 1: we have a very special guest, somebody who I've been
Speaker 1: looking forward to for a very long time. Welcome to
Speaker 1: the show, Karen Wilkinson.
Speaker 2: Thank you guys, Thanks so much for having me Jonathan
Speaker 2: and Jacob. I'm so grateful to be here with you
Speaker 2: guys today. We've already had a great conversation, looking forward
Speaker 2: to the rest of it.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, yes, yes, And so you are kind of just
Speaker 1: becoming a very well known especially within the conspiracy crowd,
Speaker 1: because you know, as far as conspiracies go, there's a
Speaker 1: lot of connectedness. It connects two conspiracies, whether it be
Speaker 1: UFO or religion or government or I mean really it's
Speaker 1: it's kind of a big old catch all net. And
Speaker 1: so you talking about aliens and how they could be
Speaker 1: connected to demons, that's right up our alley, baby. So
Speaker 1: if you would, I mean, maybe tell a little bit
Speaker 1: about your books.
Speaker 3: I know you did. You wrote two books, right.
Speaker 2: Just one, just one right now, working on the.
Speaker 1: Second, working on the second. Maybe that's why I got
Speaker 1: it confused. Maybe it was like a little telekinetic thing
Speaker 1: that I was picking up on.
Speaker 3: Who knows, but.
Speaker 1: If you would, can you can you tell us a
Speaker 1: little bit about yourself and about you know, your experiences
Speaker 1: whatever led you to write this book.
Speaker 2: Sure. Yeah. The name of the book is Stolen Seed,
Speaker 2: Evil Harvest, and it is published through Ellie Marzuoli's publishing company,
Speaker 2: Spiral of Life. Right now, it's available exclusively at Elliemarzuli
Speaker 2: dot net, So you can't go looking forward on Amazon
Speaker 2: right now. It's just through his publishing company. And the
Speaker 2: inspiration to write the book really came from I had
Speaker 2: a near death experience, which I write about in the
Speaker 2: book and ended up doing a lot of PTSD therapy
Speaker 2: after that, which allowed me to deal with this lifetime
Speaker 2: of memories and all of this that had happened to me.
Speaker 2: I never had any hypnosis or regression or anything like that.
Speaker 2: These are just memories that I've always had. So this
Speaker 2: is just something that's happened to me throughout my lifetime.
Speaker 2: I have a lifetime of abduction experiences by non human
Speaker 2: what people call alien entities, and once I was able
Speaker 2: to start dealing with them, I really felt led to
Speaker 2: reach out to La Marzuli. Not had really didn't know
Speaker 2: much about him at the time, and we were put
Speaker 2: in contact that we did an interview. It became the
Speaker 2: centerpoint for his fourth movie in his UFOs series on
Speaker 2: the abduction phenomenon, and once that was completed, people started
Speaker 2: wanting to talk about it, and I realized that they're
Speaker 2: having someone to talk about these things, who you had
Speaker 2: this in common with was really important to people. And
Speaker 2: it was important to me because I suddenly had people
Speaker 2: that I could share with and it was so amazing
Speaker 2: and helpful to me, and I was just it was
Speaker 2: such a blessing to have, you know, finally to have
Speaker 2: conversations so absolute. Yeah, it just you.
Speaker 3: Know, I people who go a lot of traumatic things
Speaker 3: to find networks and people who have gone through similar
Speaker 3: things they could find support, they could find because I mean,
Speaker 3: that's a very ostracizing feeling, and it's terrifying to feel
Speaker 3: like you're the only one doing this because you're halfway
Speaker 3: thinking if you're crazy or not right, how can you
Speaker 3: go a bit like yeah, by the way, I've been
Speaker 3: abducted by aliens multiple times my entire life. You know
Speaker 3: that people are going to write you off as a
Speaker 3: psycho immediately, But if you find people who are who
Speaker 3: aren't like internet clout chasers, who like genuinely have real
Speaker 3: trauma and real deep seated issues based off of these experiences.
Speaker 3: It's kind of like, and per my faith Christian, it's
Speaker 3: like sharing your testimony with somebody who is suffering or
Speaker 3: dealing with similar stuff. There's power in that, and there's
Speaker 3: empowerment in that as well, especially for something in this regard.
Speaker 2: Oh absolutely, yeah, you said that so well, that is true.
Speaker 2: And I call it my testimony because that's what it is.
Speaker 2: Because it's been a lifetime of something that I was
Speaker 2: so difficult and so ugly, but then really allowed me
Speaker 2: to do something good with it. And yeah, it wasn't
Speaker 2: out there. You know, I had nothing to gain by
Speaker 2: sharing my story, you know, nothing to gain by talking
Speaker 2: about what happened to me. I spent my whole life
Speaker 2: being told by them that I cannot talk about this,
Speaker 2: and then being ostracized by the public perception, so I
Speaker 2: never spoke about it. You know, the powers that be,
Speaker 2: the governments and the agencies and all the other people
Speaker 2: who are in charge of what we think and what's
Speaker 2: put out to us have created this environment where, like
Speaker 2: you said, you're considered crazy or delusional or what have you.
Speaker 2: But I'm like, but these things happened to me my
Speaker 2: whole life. These are real things. You know. This isn't
Speaker 2: just something made up. I mean a physical proof, and
Speaker 2: so it just, yeah, it became something. There's so much
Speaker 2: more to it that I felt like if I could
Speaker 2: write it down and share it, maybe I could help
Speaker 2: get in touch with more people. And so I wrote it,
Speaker 2: and Ela loved it and agreed to publish it and
Speaker 2: took a chance on me. You know, I was writing
Speaker 2: for his newsletter at the time, so getting to know
Speaker 2: him better, and so I do write for his newsletter
Speaker 2: monthly now, which is amazing. But that just opened doors
Speaker 2: for me to just be able to reach out to
Speaker 2: more people and reach more people and talk to more people,
Speaker 2: because I want to create an environment where it's okay
Speaker 2: to talk about these things. And you know, as this
Speaker 2: started happening, then you get we had all this government
Speaker 2: stuff start coming up over the last six years, between
Speaker 2: the twenty seventeen New York Times article and all these
Speaker 2: other admissions and whistleblowers and things coming out. So the
Speaker 2: timing was really crazy because it just all kind of
Speaker 2: coalesced at the same time we were doing this project,
Speaker 2: And yeah, I just want to make it okay for
Speaker 2: people to have these conversations and not feel crazy, because
Speaker 2: this stuff affects people's lives in really incredible ways and
Speaker 2: it's devastating. Some people, you know, just never are able
Speaker 2: to get past it. And I was really blessed that
Speaker 2: I was able to have that PTSD therapy so that
Speaker 2: I could learn how to function better with it. That
Speaker 2: was a huge part.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that is amazing that you were able to come
Speaker 1: out on the other side of that, not exactly unscathed,
Speaker 1: but at least, you know, healthy enough in the mind
Speaker 1: to be able to talk about it and not have
Speaker 1: to worry about, you know, somebody chasing you down. I
Speaker 1: want to get to a couple of the minor details
Speaker 1: that you brought up here, because that really strikes your fancy. So,
Speaker 1: first of all, you have a near death experience, and
Speaker 1: I love that I finally get to speak somebody who
Speaker 1: has had one. And it's funny because I actually just
Speaker 1: restarted watching this this Netflix show called The OA.
Speaker 3: Have you ever seen that?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Oh my god, so good. But anyway, it's all about
Speaker 1: near death experiences and stuff like that.
Speaker 2: And uh.
Speaker 1: Also, I'm I'm a past life aggressionist, so I do
Speaker 1: I do hypnotherapy to go past lives and and and
Speaker 1: stuff like that. Doesn't necessarily have to be past lives,
Speaker 1: but it's hypnotherapy, right, And I would love to hear
Speaker 1: a little bit more about maybe what did you experience
Speaker 1: as a result of your NDE. Did you see something
Speaker 1: on the other side, like what was after the did
Speaker 1: it did it all go dark? Is there another world?
Speaker 1: I mean, what was your experience with that?
Speaker 2: Right? Did you have a question too, Jacob Before I
Speaker 2: start talking about.
Speaker 3: That, it was. It was kind of the two parter.
Speaker 3: But I also really want you to answer Johnson's question too.
Speaker 3: That's I was like, come on, I really want to
Speaker 3: hear this one. But I was going to ask if
Speaker 3: you and you talk about it in your book. I
Speaker 3: was gonna say, if you could kind of go into
Speaker 3: a little bit of detail about what led to your
Speaker 3: near death experience. If you can't, I understand a lot
Speaker 3: of traumatic things.
Speaker 2: No, it's good because I think it is important in
Speaker 2: it and it kind of ties into everything else because
Speaker 2: of a strange way that it happened. I was going
Speaker 2: in for a surgery another back surgery. I've had eight
Speaker 2: of those in the last eight years, probably major ones.
Speaker 2: All kinds of crazy stuff goes on with my body.
Speaker 2: They just can't explain. And you know, I could explain it,
Speaker 2: but they wouldn't believe me, probably right. But anyway, So
Speaker 2: this was the third, I think, surgery with this particular surgeon.
Speaker 2: They took me into the operating room and I had
Speaker 2: IV ports in but I wasn't hooked up to any
Speaker 2: machines or anything yet, and he wasn't quite ready, which
Speaker 2: is unusual to go in to the operating room before
Speaker 2: the doctor is ready, but he wasn't in the room yet.
Speaker 2: It was just they took me in and there were
Speaker 2: two nurses in the room and an anesthesiologist or nurse anesthesist.
Speaker 2: I don't know what it was, what her title was,
Speaker 2: but it was a woman with short, dark hair and
Speaker 2: a white lab coat. Came in and leaned over me.
Speaker 2: She had a pocket full of syringes and took one out,
Speaker 2: and I assumed it was a sedative. She pushed it
Speaker 2: in my IV port and turned and walked away. Didn't
Speaker 2: ask if I was okay, how that felt, nothing, just
Speaker 2: turned and walked away really quickly.
Speaker 3: That's scary.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And it was the last time I ever saw
Speaker 2: this woman too.
Speaker 3: Her name was I have now entered the realm of
Speaker 3: absolutely what the hell.
Speaker 2: Just happened exactly, and instantly my body started to feel
Speaker 2: like cement. I couldn't breathe, I couldn't move, I couldn't
Speaker 2: gesture for help. And for me, having had this lifetime
Speaker 2: of abduction experiences, it was terrifying because I was immobilized
Speaker 2: so many times before, but this time I couldn't breathe,
Speaker 2: I couldn't do anything, and I lay there dying. I
Speaker 2: just I remember thinking God helped me, and I heard
Speaker 2: an audible voice in my head that said, it's okay,
Speaker 2: you can let go now. And it didn't sound like
Speaker 2: my voice. You know sometimes when you're kind of having
Speaker 2: a conversation with God, it kind of sounds like you're own,
Speaker 2: you know. There's really no description for that voice. This
Speaker 2: voice had an audible sound, and it was just the
Speaker 2: most pure voice. It was like crystal clear water. It
Speaker 2: was so hard to describe. And instantly I was out
Speaker 2: of my body, but I was very close to my
Speaker 2: body and I just instinctively, instinctively knew to stay close
Speaker 2: and I could see everything happening in the room and
Speaker 2: in the adjoining rooms too. I could see without eyes. Here,
Speaker 2: without ears, I could see what was going on through
Speaker 2: the walls. I didn't nothing obstructed my vision. I could
Speaker 2: see the walls, but I also could see through them,
Speaker 2: which I know it doesn't make sense, but I'm was
Speaker 2: not in a physical body.
Speaker 3: Let's go.
Speaker 2: One of the things that struck me so interesting was
Speaker 2: that I was still me. I still had my personality,
Speaker 2: and I don't know why, but I was just like,
Speaker 2: I'm still me. God, I'm still me. I'm just like.
Speaker 2: And all I felt was peace and love, the most
Speaker 2: unbelievable incredible peace and love, no fear. I wasn't worried
Speaker 2: about anyone or anything. I just felt this all encompassing,
Speaker 2: like being wrapped in a warm blanket. Just peace, love,
Speaker 2: just beyond comprehension.
Speaker 3: Random medical staff looking person. We don't even know this
Speaker 3: bitch had a name, be.
Speaker 2: Honest, I don't even remember she had a name.
Speaker 3: Tag on right inject's random syringe, one of twenty that
Speaker 3: she happens to have in her lab coat pocket. Doesn't
Speaker 3: say a word and just dips. You immediately feel your
Speaker 3: entire body start to slowly shut down, and then you
Speaker 3: have a literal outer out of body experience where you
Speaker 3: sounds like possibly might have met not necessarily the Creator,
Speaker 3: but at least went to the other side.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I felt like it was the voice of my creator.
Speaker 2: I really did. It's like I knew that voice and
Speaker 2: immediately he said you can let go now, like he
Speaker 2: released me from this physical body. It was just it
Speaker 2: was just all understood. I had no questions, you know
Speaker 2: what I mean.
Speaker 3: They didn't like to see God. You didn't like come
Speaker 3: face to face with their creator. But you did hear
Speaker 3: the voice.
Speaker 2: But I heard the voice and I knew I was
Speaker 2: with in his presence that because the love and the
Speaker 2: peace was just undeniable. I mean it was I had
Speaker 2: no I just knew, you know. I didn't have to
Speaker 2: be told. I just knew, you know. Everything was just
Speaker 2: given to me. It was like an instant download in
Speaker 2: that second. And there was no time passing. Although I
Speaker 2: knew time was passing, I didn't feel any time passed.
Speaker 2: I could hear what everyone was saying and see what
Speaker 2: they were doing. And then you know, the nurses were
Speaker 2: putting around with tables and things like that, and one
Speaker 2: of them, looks over my way and she's like and
Speaker 2: I could see the look on her face, and she
Speaker 2: looks at the other nurse and she's like hey, and
Speaker 2: she comes up. Is she had an allergic reaction to something?
Speaker 2: And she comes running over and looks at me, and
Speaker 2: the other one's like, oh my god, she's not breathing
Speaker 2: and starts to panic. So the nurse that's not panicking
Speaker 2: runs in the other room, grabs the doctor says, hey,
Speaker 2: something's wrong, she's not breathing. He comes running in yelling
Speaker 2: bagger bagger, and they put that bag thing and start
Speaker 2: you know, trying to get air, and nothing happens, and
Speaker 2: more people start coming in the room and alarms are
Speaker 2: you know, they're pushing buttons and things, and now I'm
Speaker 2: not hooked up to anything, so no one knew, you know,
Speaker 2: what my bibles were anything. They start hooking me up
Speaker 2: to things and wires going everywhere and pieces everywhere, and
Speaker 2: I'm just, you know, watching all this happen, listening to him,
Speaker 2: watching what they're doing.
Speaker 3: And so that was my next question. You were present,
Speaker 3: quote unquote ish you heard these things happen. You heard
Speaker 3: the doctor come in and say, bag her, bag her
Speaker 3: and like, so you were at least partially still present
Speaker 3: in this realm.
Speaker 2: I was, yeah. I mean I was out of the body,
Speaker 2: but I was, Yeah. I could see what was happening
Speaker 2: in the other rooms, you know what I mean, and
Speaker 2: hear what was happening in the other rooms, but I
Speaker 2: was not, you know, inn been. And afterwards, when I
Speaker 2: recounted those things to the doctor and my daughter in
Speaker 2: law was with me when I was doing that, He's like,
Speaker 2: there's no way you could have known that, you know,
Speaker 2: because there's no direct connection for those two rooms for
Speaker 2: me to have known what happened between the rooms.
Speaker 1: And things like that, Then how do I know it?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 1: Like it's like, I, yeah, how.
Speaker 2: Do I know? That? He was blown away? And after Yeah,
Speaker 2: I think that that changed him and changed something about him.
Speaker 2: I you know, I have some theories on that that
Speaker 2: I won't get into here because I don't know. I
Speaker 2: just think he might have been involved in some of that,
Speaker 2: and afterwards, I think his understanding of the of the
Speaker 2: supernatural and God and hereafter probably changed quite a bit.
Speaker 2: And I need to say he's no longer my doctor.
Speaker 3: But that's fair. So all right, this was your first
Speaker 3: This was a near death experience. But you say you
Speaker 3: had abduction history prior to this was you said, what
Speaker 3: nine years ago? Eight years ago?
Speaker 2: This was about eight years ago.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so eight years ago you have your near death
Speaker 3: experience and you had your I don't want to say revelation,
Speaker 3: but basically you got whatever kind of confirmation was ever questioned.
Speaker 3: You now know that there is another side. It is
Speaker 3: the good place of all good and all love. At
Speaker 3: least that was the place that you were destined to go.
Speaker 3: All these things wonderful. However, I feel like I need
Speaker 3: to hear a little bit more about your the backstory
Speaker 3: that led up to you so calmly and nonchalantly being like, well,
Speaker 3: I guess today is my day. All these ducts, like,
Speaker 3: I'm sorry, those are about those abductions.
Speaker 2: Right right. Let me cap that off to say that
Speaker 2: they finally they intubated me, and all of a sudden,
Speaker 2: when they're intubating me, I can taste the metal in
Speaker 2: my mouth and I'm back in my body.
Speaker 3: Okay, Now here's my next question. Because you said metallic taste,
Speaker 3: did they do any kind of toxicology, blood work, anything
Speaker 3: to see what was injected into you? What you were
Speaker 3: having reaction because of nothing.
Speaker 2: Oh no, their biggest, their number one thing was to
Speaker 2: cover this up for sure, that they did everything in
Speaker 2: their power to cover up. They had me so drugged
Speaker 2: up it wasn't funny, and kept me on combinations of
Speaker 2: drugs that I probably should have sued him for. Afterwards,
Speaker 2: we tried to get lawyers because I didn't want to
Speaker 2: you know, I wasn't looking to get anything from anyone
Speaker 2: to ruin anyone's life. I wanted someone to pay for
Speaker 2: my therapy because it was going to take me a
Speaker 2: lot of therapy to get through the PTSD part, because
Speaker 2: it triggered a lifetime of similar issues. Yeah, and every
Speaker 2: lawyer that was considering taking our case would then shortly
Speaker 2: thereafter you go, nope, won't touch it.
Speaker 3: So happened it was fentanyl that they got that caused
Speaker 3: a crazy reaction, like the same thing. Hospital covered it
Speaker 3: up all this because if there's anything showing fentanyl to
Speaker 3: be a negative thing in the medical field, Oh, we
Speaker 3: can't talk about that. Oh no, no, no, no, we we
Speaker 3: got to wash our hands of any of that. So
Speaker 3: who knows what concoction was in that vial that she
Speaker 3: injected into your IV line? So I.
Speaker 2: Oh, sorry, go ahead, I'm sorry.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I really want to know, because you hear like
Speaker 1: we've done near death experience shows where we've only talked
Speaker 1: about people's experiences with their near death experience. It's documented
Speaker 1: on you know, certain websites nderf dot com or something
Speaker 1: along those lines, and they're all pretty different. I mean
Speaker 1: not you're never going to get two that are exactly
Speaker 1: the same. But I mean, hey, that's our lives, and
Speaker 1: there's no two lives that are exactly the same, so
Speaker 1: I wouldn't expect it. But that being said, I am
Speaker 1: very curious if you were given an option to stay
Speaker 1: where you were or to go back into your body,
Speaker 1: or was it just automatically like I'm going back in
Speaker 1: because they brought me back to life, they got all
Speaker 1: that shit out of my system. Was it was the
Speaker 1: decision made for you or did you make a decision?
Speaker 2: You know, I felt like the decision was made for
Speaker 2: me immediately, because from the second I was out of
Speaker 2: my body, I just I knew that I was supposed
Speaker 2: to stay really close to my body and not wonder anywhere. Okay,
Speaker 2: just stay right here, just stay close to your body.
Speaker 2: This is just for a little while. I just knew
Speaker 2: that so has never given that option. Do you want
Speaker 2: to you know, stay or go, which I've heard of
Speaker 2: the people talk about no, and and like I said,
Speaker 2: as soon as they intimated me, everything went black. And
Speaker 2: I did have a small stroke from not small stroke,
Speaker 2: I had a stroke from it, which is why this
Speaker 2: side of my face doesn't move so much. You'll see me,
Speaker 2: you know. But it took me a long time to
Speaker 2: learn to walk again, to talk again. You know, I'm
Speaker 2: now ambidexterous because I had you do everything with my
Speaker 2: left hand for so long, you know, crazy stuff, and
Speaker 2: you know, people, it's just I it was such a
Speaker 2: strange way that everything happened, and it but like I said,
Speaker 2: I'm grateful for it because A I know that God
Speaker 2: loves me. I know that we go on. I know
Speaker 2: that we go on as ourselves like this, who you
Speaker 2: are is what continues on. I mean outside of the
Speaker 2: physical you know, body that we have, you keep going
Speaker 2: and it's as amazing and it just love and peace.
Speaker 2: So I am excited for that when that time comes,
Speaker 2: because I know that, you know, we have so much
Speaker 2: more than that to look forward to. But I just
Speaker 2: have a little, tiny glimpse into just the love and
Speaker 2: the beauty of what was there.
Speaker 3: I love this way too. You got a glimpse because,
Speaker 3: as the Bible says, no I have seen, nor ear
Speaker 3: has heard what God's got going on for us when
Speaker 3: we get there. You saw a little snippet of what
Speaker 3: you call the most profound love and peace and all
Speaker 3: these things. That was just a taste.
Speaker 2: Yeah, can you imagine. I mean, it makes it worth it.
Speaker 2: So I'm just like, Wow, I'm not afraid. I'm not
Speaker 2: afraid to die anymore. I'm not afraid of any of that.
Speaker 2: And I've had a lot of close calls since then too,
Speaker 2: So you know, whatever is going on, God's keeping me
Speaker 2: around for a reason, and I'm going to try to
Speaker 2: make the most of it and do the best I
Speaker 2: can with what He's blessing with.
Speaker 1: So that's amazing my.
Speaker 2: Choice now, And that's why I'm coming forward with all
Speaker 2: of this, because it's not something most people would ever
Speaker 2: choose to come forward with. I never thought I would
Speaker 2: talk about this with anyone, let alone in a public setting,
Speaker 2: in the public form. This was never never on my radar,
Speaker 2: you know. But when I feel like when God throws
Speaker 2: you into something that's what you do, you know, and
Speaker 2: and so I'm grateful that I get to do to
Speaker 2: do this.
Speaker 1: But this question sound like this might sound like a
Speaker 1: ridiculous question, but only because I'm just so fascinated with NDEs.
Speaker 1: I just want to kind of go off a little
Speaker 1: checklist of whatever is just going on in my mind
Speaker 1: with this. After your NDE, did you pick up any
Speaker 1: like talents ever had before?
Speaker 2: That's a good question. Well, I definitely can use my
Speaker 2: left hand definitely now.
Speaker 3: It was kind of an actual superpower, let's be real.
Speaker 2: So yeah, that happened. I know I was I was
Speaker 2: wishing that I would kind of come out being able
Speaker 2: to play like a concert pianist or something. But no,
Speaker 2: I didn't get that. But what I did get it
Speaker 2: was coming out of it in recovery. I've been in
Speaker 2: recovery many times after surgery. That's usually a bunch of
Speaker 2: people in a room with one or two nurses barely
Speaker 2: paying attention to you, you know, your robes hanging out
Speaker 2: and you're like, can someone please come, you know over
Speaker 2: here waiting for your ice chips, that kind of thing.
Speaker 2: This time, I woke up and they were like six
Speaker 2: doctors and nurses standing around me. Every time they tried
Speaker 2: to bring me out of anesthesia. I was screaming in
Speaker 2: pain so loud that and just in so much pain
Speaker 2: that they kept having to put me back under so
Speaker 2: I wouldn't stroke out or have a heart attack. They
Speaker 2: did that for about four hours, and I remember so finally,
Speaker 2: after about four hours of this, I remember praying, going, God,
Speaker 2: why did you send me back into this body? I
Speaker 2: can't do this? Help me. And I look up and
Speaker 2: there's these two young, orderly males at the foot of
Speaker 2: my bed, and I look at them and they I'm like,
Speaker 2: oh my gosh, you look like you could be my kids,
Speaker 2: you know, because I had a lot of kids and
Speaker 2: a lot of kids that call me mom. And they
Speaker 2: were just young, handsome. They looked similar to one another
Speaker 2: in scrubs, and they just comforted me, and all of
Speaker 2: a sudden, I wasn't worried about the pain. They helped
Speaker 2: me just you know, within thirty minutes, I'm on my
Speaker 2: way back up to the room. They go all the
Speaker 2: way up to the room with me, and I'm just
Speaker 2: chatting to them, you know, and they're not really talking
Speaker 2: to me, but I'm talking to them a lot and
Speaker 2: We get to the room and my husband and my
Speaker 2: daughter in law, who are always there for me after surgery,
Speaker 2: were right there waiting and we're in the kind of
Speaker 2: ICU area and I grabbed their hands and I was like,
Speaker 2: you have to meet the boys. They remind me of
Speaker 2: our kids so much. Oh my gosh. And they're like, okay, yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, we're and I'm like, they're right here, and
Speaker 2: they're like where, And I'm like I looked at the
Speaker 2: nurse and the other orderly who was on either side
Speaker 2: of me, and I said, oh, what happened to the
Speaker 2: boys that I was talking to? And she's like, honey,
Speaker 2: what boys. I'm like, the ones that are with us.
Speaker 2: They were in the elevator, they were down the hall
Speaker 2: and she's like, honey, I don't know who you're talking about.
Speaker 2: I'm like, they were right here with us. I was
Speaker 2: talking to him the whole way up. She's like, oh,
Speaker 2: we wondered too, you were talking to honey. It's just
Speaker 2: us and.
Speaker 3: Your third eye, your pineal glam was a little more
Speaker 3: open than it usually is.
Speaker 1: These you were things.
Speaker 3: That were absolutely there that they comforted me.
Speaker 2: They talked me through it. I you know, I believe
Speaker 2: these were angels. They came and helped me, they comforted me.
Speaker 2: I went from them spending four hours trying to get
Speaker 2: me out of anesthesia to just like that, everything was better.
Speaker 2: I was still in pain, but it it was okay.
Speaker 2: All of a sudden, and I searched that hospital high
Speaker 2: and low with my little walker in my wheelchair, trying
Speaker 2: to find these guys nobody was talking about. No one
Speaker 2: else had seen them, and I realized, well, they were
Speaker 2: wearing scrubs, but I remember, they didn't have any badges
Speaker 2: or anything on, you know, the millionyards or anything. And
Speaker 2: they they were just there to help me. And as
Speaker 2: soon as I had everything I needed, they were gone.
Speaker 2: You know, they didn't interfere with me, they didn't hurt
Speaker 2: me in any way, they didn't nothing. They just helped
Speaker 2: me and they were kind and comforting. And then they
Speaker 2: were gone when they weren't no longer needed. And I
Speaker 2: was like, wow, so there are good angelic beings out there, wonderful, benevolent.
Speaker 2: And I had had a lifetime of these horrible encounters
Speaker 2: with non human entities. Finally yours two that are just
Speaker 2: wonderful and lovely. So I was so grateful for that
Speaker 2: so no, I didn't get any special powers, Jonathan, but
Speaker 2: I did get a visit from two amazing entities whatever,
Speaker 2: whoever they were.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, that is so cool. I knew I
Speaker 1: kind of felt like you were going there whenever you
Speaker 1: first started saying it, and then you're like, oh, well,
Speaker 1: nobody knew who they were, and uh, that is so crazy.
Speaker 1: I love to hear that. See you were, You said
Speaker 1: that they were there to like comfort you. Right, Did
Speaker 1: they put hands on you? Was there any kind of touch?
Speaker 1: Did you feel that at all?
Speaker 2: Yeah, they had their hands on my half of my
Speaker 2: legs on either side, one on either side. That's the
Speaker 2: only contact I had. And I was under the sheet
Speaker 2: the blanket, you know those awful hospital cotton blankets the US.
Speaker 2: So it wasn't direct contact. But yeah, they had their
Speaker 2: hands on my halfs.
Speaker 3: Oh, that's interesting too. Biblically speaking, the armor that God
Speaker 3: tells us to wear, it would be the shoes of
Speaker 3: peace and these two entities who again, he says that
Speaker 3: he will send you a comforter If I'm not mistaken.
Speaker 3: This all checks out to me. Not gonna lie, and
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna lie. Also, when you said you had
Speaker 3: these two gentlemen that were standing at the foot of
Speaker 3: your bed when you woke up. I have my former
Speaker 3: father in law. Long story short, was on his deathbed.
Speaker 3: They had like one more treatment they were gonna try,
Speaker 3: and if this didn't take it was it the whole
Speaker 3: nine horrible, horrible situation. When he came out and he
Speaker 3: woke up, he says he had two gentlemen in suits
Speaker 3: and ties around him that weren't actually there, but he
Speaker 3: saw them, and he is saying that these entities were
Speaker 3: not of the good type, and they were tormenting him
Speaker 3: for a couple of days until the third third eye
Speaker 3: pineal gland started to calcify back over naturally. But uh yeah,
Speaker 3: he says that what he saw in recovery was horrible.
Speaker 3: So many different experiences.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's amazing. No, I you know, I had no
Speaker 2: reason to There's nothing of benefit for me to make
Speaker 2: those guys up, you know what I mean, there's there
Speaker 2: just isn't. There's no reason for me to make something
Speaker 2: like that up. You know, It's it's just what happened,
Speaker 2: you know. And yeah, I mean if they were actual humans,
Speaker 2: no one could ever find them in the hospital. So
Speaker 2: I don't know, I I really do.
Speaker 1: Let's hear a little bit about you know, what happens
Speaker 1: as maybe maybe the before story that Jacob was kind
Speaker 1: of asking about or alluding to their as far as
Speaker 1: demonic presences or aliens or maybe you know, aliens cloaking
Speaker 1: themselves as demons or vice versa.
Speaker 3: Let's say this, let's say other than human entity abductions.
Speaker 3: And before we even hear the story, let's leave it.
Speaker 3: You and I Johnathan are going to hear this from
Speaker 3: very neutral playing fields. Right, We're not saying these are
Speaker 3: good aliens, bad aliens, angels, demons. Nothing. She said and
Speaker 3: that she was abducted by non human creatures, and let's
Speaker 3: hear the experiences and we will decide what we think
Speaker 3: as far as all of these things are concerned with,
Speaker 3: especially with all the things we've heard, stories, we've heard,
Speaker 3: guess we've had on She is saying that she believes
Speaker 3: that these were demonic entities, and again she has experience
Speaker 3: with these things. I am I got to know what
Speaker 3: happened to where I was like, no, that is absolutely
Speaker 3: what this is, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Also as a as a little pre or sort of
Speaker 1: this and this is you know, kind of just something
Speaker 1: that I feel like is necessary to ask, have you
Speaker 1: been a Christian your entire life?
Speaker 2: No?
Speaker 1: But you became a Christian as a result of this.
Speaker 2: Well, I wouldn't say as a result of this. No.
Speaker 2: I had a experience with my roommates when we were
Speaker 2: about eighteen or nineteen years old, and one of them
Speaker 2: had a background with family members who are Christian, and
Speaker 2: we were listening to a particular song by Duran Duran
Speaker 2: and looking into the lyrics and she's like, I know
Speaker 2: what that means. She started explaining to us. Before you know,
Speaker 2: we've got a Bible out, we're all giving our lives God,
Speaker 2: we're all born again. You know, we start going down
Speaker 2: and going to church and doing all you know, getting.
Speaker 3: Led to you finding Jesus. Yeah, Lord uses so many tools,
Speaker 3: am I right?
Speaker 2: I know? Right? It was crazy? Was that song? Election Day?
Speaker 2: I think, yeah, She's like, that's about well not going
Speaker 2: in the rapture, and we're like, what's the rapture? You know,
Speaker 2: we had no idea I went. I grew up in
Speaker 2: like a presratory in church. It was just about getting
Speaker 2: dressed up, going being quiet, going home. You know. We
Speaker 2: learned some stories about Noah and some giraffes and things
Speaker 2: like that, but not much else. So then I fell
Speaker 2: away from that, you know, because I didn't really have
Speaker 2: a good foundation and I didn't have a good support
Speaker 2: system around me to continue that, and I fell away
Speaker 2: from it. And so I still I've always known God
Speaker 2: was there since I was a little, tiny kid, because
Speaker 2: I went to church and I knew who God was
Speaker 2: and Jesus was and all that, and I and I
Speaker 2: even you know, there were times when I was little
Speaker 2: where there would be these commercials on TV and God
Speaker 2: would just put that in my head, in my heart,
Speaker 2: and I know that that protected me. Sometimes. It's so
Speaker 2: weird now to think back on how even when I
Speaker 2: wasn't aware, God was still helping me. But so and
Speaker 2: I always, you know, I prayed, and I kind of
Speaker 2: had these different times in my life where I get
Speaker 2: back into my beliefs a little bit and then just
Speaker 2: fall away. I went down a very new age path
Speaker 2: and different tried out different religions, Buddhism, all kinds of
Speaker 2: different things, you know, just searching, and yeah, and God
Speaker 2: never left me. He just stayed there, and he just
Speaker 2: kept knocking and he kept waiting for me to see
Speaker 2: and to find my way like a prodigal son, and
Speaker 2: you know, and all the things that I did that
Speaker 2: I am not proud of, But as far down as
Speaker 2: I fell, he never walked away, and that's you know.
Speaker 2: So what led me back was just his love for
Speaker 2: me always being there. And when I looked up and
Speaker 2: he was still there, I came back in and he
Speaker 2: invited me back in with open arms. And that was
Speaker 2: again after my near death experience. So you know, it's
Speaker 2: funny because even then he didn't leave me or forsake me,
Speaker 2: because I had already given my life and my heart
Speaker 2: to him. Even though I fell away, he's still there.
Speaker 3: So that's how it works. You can't get unadopted from
Speaker 3: a family. That's literally not how it works, you know, right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I didn't think I was worthy to ever
Speaker 2: be back in his presence and I'm still not a yeah,
Speaker 2: and exactly, and now I realize I'll never be worthy.
Speaker 2: That's the whole point, yep. And that's the coolness of
Speaker 2: it is that you know, I'm not out there trying
Speaker 2: to do bad things. I'm trying my best to do
Speaker 2: my best, but I know I'll never be good enough.
Speaker 2: And that's okay. But I'm just going to do what
Speaker 2: I can because I just want to please him, because
Speaker 2: bless me so much and I am so grateful for that.
Speaker 2: And people are like, how can you be so happy
Speaker 2: when you've had such a horrific life. I'm like, because
Speaker 2: what I have now is so much greater than the
Speaker 2: pain that I've had in my past and all suffered,
Speaker 2: is so much greater than what I suffered. It just
Speaker 2: he can heal anything, and healed my heart. He can
Speaker 2: heal anyone's heart. So sorry, that makes me a little bit.
Speaker 3: No, no, no, no, no, Look, I'm getting emotional here
Speaker 3: to hear you say these things because I'm telling you
Speaker 3: this is this is words from my heart that you
Speaker 3: are saying right now. I feel like I've said these
Speaker 3: words on this program multiple times. I could not agree more.
Speaker 3: And like, that's the point. You're supposed to do the
Speaker 3: best you can. Is it ever going to be good enough? No,
Speaker 3: You're human. You were born into sin and imperfect and
Speaker 3: that's okay. God made you that way. It's a part
Speaker 3: of the plan. I promise. She ain't mad at you,
Speaker 3: He doesn't hate you. He just wants you to come home.
Speaker 3: That's it, and it's hard for people to grasp that and.
Speaker 2: Accept you where you are and for who you are,
Speaker 2: period and the story, and that's that's the amazing part
Speaker 2: of it. So I hope that answers your question, Jonathan.
Speaker 2: I know I went down a really long road there,
Speaker 2: but but yeah, I was not always a Christian. But
Speaker 2: to get back to the abduction stuff, they started from
Speaker 2: as early as I can remember. If you want me
Speaker 2: to kind of talk about that a little.
Speaker 3: Bit again, yeah, I was gonna say that happened around
Speaker 3: like teenage years that started. First memory was in a spaceship, like,
Speaker 3: what were we talking about here?
Speaker 2: Yeah, these these abductions happened from my very earliest memories
Speaker 2: when I was a little kid. I remember I was
Speaker 2: only about maybe three or four years old, maybe two.
Speaker 2: One of my nieces or nephews graduated from high school.
Speaker 2: Not nieces, uncles, sorry answer uncles. I can't remember my
Speaker 2: dad's niece nephew. And they took us to the high
Speaker 2: school and I was so little, and they tried to
Speaker 2: hand me off to one of my other aunts and
Speaker 2: uncles that was sitting behind them, and I screamed, bloody murder.
Speaker 2: I will never it is ingrained in my head because
Speaker 2: I looked at their faces and they looked so similar
Speaker 2: to these Nordic entities that I was so used to
Speaker 2: already seeing all the time. I was terrified of that
Speaker 2: side of the family. Just you know, I'm a little kid,
Speaker 2: so I can't make those distinctions. But and they they
Speaker 2: were very human. Don't get me wrong, My family members
Speaker 2: were not aliens. They were human, but they had their
Speaker 2: eyes were big and blue, and they're very fair and
Speaker 2: very tall and very thin, and just they were so
Speaker 2: similar that I couldn't go to it. And they couldn't
Speaker 2: understand why I wouldn't ever go to anyone on that
Speaker 2: side of the family. And you know, at that young age,
Speaker 2: you can't communicate that. And when I start having concrete
Speaker 2: memories around five or six years old, as most children do,
Speaker 2: that's when your memories kind of start to are solidified, right.
Speaker 2: I remember it would happen at night. They would come
Speaker 2: and it didn't matter where I was. Quite often at
Speaker 2: my grandparents' farm house it would happen, or at our
Speaker 2: home didn't matter, and it would just be the middle
Speaker 2: of the night. If I was sharing a room with
Speaker 2: a sibling, that sibling would just be in a state
Speaker 2: of knocked out. Can't wake them up, can't rouse them sleep.
Speaker 2: Just like you know, if I screamed or hit, no
Speaker 2: one in the house would hear me, even if I
Speaker 2: did try to to do something. A lot of times
Speaker 2: there the crickets and cicadas outside would just get quiet.
Speaker 2: Sometimes the cows make cows on the farm. They would
Speaker 2: get really quiet. Sometimes they would get really loud, which
Speaker 2: is weird. Sometimes there be a light that would come
Speaker 2: in the window or the far window from the bedroom
Speaker 2: that I could see from down the hall, and there
Speaker 2: would I could feel it. I could feel the change
Speaker 2: in the room. To this day, if they are around,
Speaker 2: I get that same feeling and it is like another
Speaker 2: sense and I can't describe it except that it's a
Speaker 2: feeling and it's very clear. It's always that same feeling
Speaker 2: when they're around. They know when they're around. I know
Speaker 2: when they're out Yeah, there's definitely I know when they're
Speaker 2: out there, I know when they're close by. I know
Speaker 2: that sounds crazy, but I always feel them. I always
Speaker 2: know when they're around. It's like a cold breeze, but
Speaker 2: doesn't feel like that, you know, but it is something
Speaker 2: that is tangible that I can tell that they're there,
Speaker 2: and there would be at least two of the what
Speaker 2: people call typical gray alien in the bedroom. They were,
Speaker 2: you know, the kind of three foot round, three feet tall,
Speaker 2: with the big oversized bulbous heads, the big black screen
Speaker 2: eyes that didn't move. They were just stationary, thin, really thin,
Speaker 2: almost brittle bodies. Some of them smelled really bad. Some
Speaker 2: of them had a putrid smell like a cross between
Speaker 2: dead animal sulfur urine feces kind of, you know, just
Speaker 2: some didn't smell that bad at all, and some smelled
Speaker 2: really bad. I don't you know, I don't know why.
Speaker 2: I think some of them might have been older skin suits, whatever.
Speaker 2: But from that point I would be put in a
Speaker 2: state of waking paralysis. People talk about sleep. For me,
Speaker 2: this was a wide awake. And then as soon as
Speaker 2: I noticed them, I would get immediately put into a
Speaker 2: state of paralysis. Usually at that point I had as
Speaker 2: soon as I'd see them, I would like wet the
Speaker 2: bed or something like that, because I was terrified in them,
Speaker 2: and they would love tate me off the bed and
Speaker 2: take me up through a ceiling or out through a
Speaker 2: closed window. And I would get right up to a
Speaker 2: ceiling and see crazy little details like paint marks or
Speaker 2: you know, wallpaper curling and being really brown because my
Speaker 2: Grandma's house had wallpaper on the ceiling, or the bugs
Speaker 2: that were in the light, or every little detail on
Speaker 2: this etched light that was on the ceiling of one
Speaker 2: of the rooms, or you know, getting right up to
Speaker 2: the window that you see like every little square on
Speaker 2: the screen and some of them aren't bent and some
Speaker 2: are broken, but they're not really square after all, you know,
Speaker 2: just or smudges, and when just things that you know,
Speaker 2: I remember, just why is this so close up? And
Speaker 2: then seeing things get further away, like picks on the
Speaker 2: walls and in the rooms and the doorways, and everything's
Speaker 2: getting further and further away. As I would approach the
Speaker 2: window or the ceiling, I it was like this base
Speaker 2: almost like a low hum, like a really low low vibration.
Speaker 2: It was like holding onto a big base speaker almost
Speaker 2: at a concert, like a really loud concert, only without
Speaker 2: the noise. And I felt like my body was just
Speaker 2: going into a bazillion little pieces, and I would just
Speaker 2: go through a window or through a ceiling, and at
Speaker 2: that point, I don't know if it was because of
Speaker 2: how it was done. But I feel like that that's
Speaker 2: the point where I'd always blackout, would be put to
Speaker 2: sleep whatever. Not always, but usually because I do have
Speaker 2: memories of seeing the outside and seeing things good bye,
Speaker 2: and seeing things, seeing things get smaller and further away.
Speaker 1: Now, is this your body or is this your consciousness that's.
Speaker 2: Happening to my physical body, my physical person being being.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so you're saying that they were using I don't
Speaker 3: want to say sound wave energy because we don't know
Speaker 3: what this energy would have been, but something akin to
Speaker 3: it to make you be able to go through hearts, surfaces, walls, ceilings, windows,
Speaker 3: all of this. Basically, they would turn on this device
Speaker 3: to in some way shape or form, make the wall
Speaker 3: soft or you soft or both to be able to
Speaker 3: pass through each other, and then turn it off when
Speaker 3: you got on the other side. But that was around
Speaker 3: the time when you would black out.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. And you know, they can manipulate space, time, energy,
Speaker 2: and matter of ways that we don't understand. They're so
Speaker 2: advanced of us, they advice been so far ahead of us,
Speaker 2: and some of the things that they utilized when I
Speaker 2: was little makes sense now, but I couldn't have explained
Speaker 2: then because it was like virtual reality, you know, when
Speaker 2: you put on br goggles and everything scenes and feels
Speaker 2: so real, but it's not really there. I was experiencing
Speaker 2: that from a really young age. Or these walls in
Speaker 2: these rooms that were just means like video screens. But
Speaker 2: you know, all we had was a little tiny TV
Speaker 2: with four six ten thirteen in the U channel, and
Speaker 2: I don't know what the you did, but sometimes something
Speaker 2: would come to the static, you know, you know, I mean,
Speaker 2: that's how old I am, but so, you know, it's
Speaker 2: just so none of these things made sense, you know,
Speaker 2: And I didn't have vocabulary to talk about them either,
Speaker 2: because there weren't shows on TV or podcasts or books
Speaker 2: or magazines or things that I had access to anyway
Speaker 2: that talked about these things. So I didn't have the
Speaker 2: vocabulary for gray alien or spaceship or any of that
Speaker 2: other stuff. You know. All I knew was that, you know,
Speaker 2: they were the ones that came to get me and
Speaker 2: one of my sisters. I remember, I would always try
Speaker 2: to hide at night. I thought if I could find
Speaker 2: like a big enough suitcase, get in it, zip it
Speaker 2: up under the bed, they wouldn't be able to find me.
Speaker 2: I remember, her saying, it doesn't matter where you go.
Speaker 2: They can see us through thee through the roofs, you know,
Speaker 2: they can see through the house. This is like a
Speaker 2: five and an eight year old having a conversation like that.
Speaker 2: You talk about them the ones who come to get
Speaker 2: is there are the ones that can get I won't
Speaker 2: speak for that other person, so, but you know, having
Speaker 2: these conversations when we're that little, I mean, but we
Speaker 2: didn't have any vocabulary to put behind it. So if
Speaker 2: you tried to tell somebody, I mean, I remember being
Speaker 2: about six years old, six years seven, I think it
Speaker 2: was about six at the school and they had to
Speaker 2: call and have my mom come and get me because
Speaker 2: I was in a cuddled up, huddled up in a
Speaker 2: ball in the corner of a bathroom stall, just holding
Speaker 2: onto my knees and rocking and I wouldn't get up,
Speaker 2: and I wouldn't talk and I wouldn't move, and they
Speaker 2: had to have her come get me because I had
Speaker 2: finally had my just I broke down. You know, I
Speaker 2: was only like six years old, but I couldn't take
Speaker 2: it anymore. And because at that point I had been
Speaker 2: warned and I can back up to talk about that
Speaker 2: they was trying to talk about it. You know, they
Speaker 2: come get me, they do this, you know, and I
Speaker 2: was telling kids to school, you know. Yeah, they did
Speaker 2: this needle in my neck or my chest, you know,
Speaker 2: just things like that. And the one night they took
Speaker 2: me and walked me into the backyard of my house
Speaker 2: and it did a screen memory thing. It's called like
Speaker 2: a screen memory when you think you're seeing something but
Speaker 2: you're not. It's really like VR is for virtual reality
Speaker 2: is for us today.
Speaker 3: You mean scrying.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, you mean scrying screen memory?
Speaker 3: Okay, I might be thinking of someone else.
Speaker 2: What's crying. I don't know.
Speaker 3: When you when you write something down, you're getting from
Speaker 3: the other side. I might be making things.
Speaker 2: They had these things called that are referred to as
Speaker 2: screen memories when people have them, and it's you know,
Speaker 2: it's kind of an old term, but it's like a
Speaker 2: virtual reality thing being shown to you, but you're you're there,
Speaker 2: You're you're there, and they're it feels like everything else
Speaker 2: is there too. And they showed my family being walked
Speaker 2: out into the backyard. There was a clothesline going down
Speaker 2: the middle of the yard at my grandma's house, and
Speaker 2: the family was on the other side of the clothes line.
Speaker 2: And then they're like, you can't talk to people about this.
Speaker 2: You have to stop talking. You have to be good.
Speaker 2: You have to be good. And they sprayed something on
Speaker 2: their backs, of their necks and then beheaded them all
Speaker 2: in front of me. And I was just a little kid,
Speaker 2: you know, I'm like six years old, and I just
Speaker 2: that's what led to me. You know, then when you
Speaker 2: go back to school, and I just I couldn't do
Speaker 2: it anymore. You know. I realized at that point I
Speaker 2: didn't have anyone who was going to save me. I
Speaker 2: didn't have any options. I couldn't stop them without hurting
Speaker 2: my family. And I kind of made that choice at
Speaker 2: that point because of a little kid. You know, kids
Speaker 2: don't we don't have those tools. That's when I made
Speaker 2: the choice to just put that over here and my
Speaker 2: life over here and never bring them back together and
Speaker 2: for as much as possible, and I just at that
Speaker 2: point just did a lot of dissociation from it. Sure,
Speaker 2: and you know, it became something I never spoke about after.
Speaker 3: That, but it was something that was still regularly happening though, correct.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, it happened constantly all the time. I mean,
Speaker 2: I couldn't say with how what with what frequency, because
Speaker 2: I don't remember every time I was taken. Sometimes i'd
Speaker 2: be taken and the memory would be just of them
Speaker 2: showing up, and then I have no other memory of
Speaker 2: what happened the rest of that time. Sometimes I would
Speaker 2: wake up and not really remember the actual abduction part,
Speaker 2: but I would be at the elevators. So there were
Speaker 2: these banks of elevators, and most often it would be
Speaker 2: we would go into these elevators and they just went
Speaker 2: down and down and down, and then I would get
Speaker 2: on what I called the sideways elevators. Because I was little,
Speaker 2: I never had any frame of reference for vehicles that
Speaker 2: were silent, So these elevators went side to side or
Speaker 2: up at an angle or down an angle. I just
Speaker 2: thought of them as elevators in my head, but they
Speaker 2: were more likely like a high speed transit system of
Speaker 2: some sort. But back then cars made noise, Trains made noise.
Speaker 2: You know, everything we traveled in was loud back then.
Speaker 2: So then that would just take me to wherever we
Speaker 2: were going that particular time. Whatever they were going to
Speaker 2: do just you know, examinations or I don't know what
Speaker 2: they were doing because they didn't tell me what they
Speaker 2: were doing. It wasn't pleasant, it was invasive. You know,
Speaker 2: I have a burn on my back that mark. It
Speaker 2: felt like a burn. I can't say it's a burn,
Speaker 2: but it hurt like a burn. It's in the shape
Speaker 2: of like a triangle. I put a picture of it
Speaker 2: in the book that you know, I came back with
Speaker 2: once with you know, i'd come back with rashes or
Speaker 2: burns or different things than marks. You know, when my
Speaker 2: mom picked me up from the school that time, she
Speaker 2: took me to the doctor because I had marks on me,
Speaker 2: and I did say they just you know, it's from
Speaker 2: the ones that get me, the ones that are touching me,
Speaker 2: that are bothering me, and because I know how to
Speaker 2: describe what they were doing either, right, I mean, I
Speaker 2: couldn't say, oh, it's from the ali introductions and the
Speaker 2: grades that show it. Yeah, it's that's not even anywhere
Speaker 2: close to something I could have vocalized. And he says, well,
Speaker 2: something has clearly happened to her. Maybe somebody's you know,
Speaker 2: bugging her, bothered her at school, or done something to her,
Speaker 2: but yeah, she's been definitely been abused in some way. However,
Speaker 2: he says she's young, she'll forget and wow, that was
Speaker 2: the end of that. Now, this is in the sixties
Speaker 2: and seventies, so you know there was.
Speaker 3: No victims' advocates.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, it was usually if an adult says something,
Speaker 2: you believe the adult. If a child, you know, we
Speaker 2: were meant to be seen and not heard.
Speaker 3: So yeah, you weren't.
Speaker 1: You weren't like abused like in any kind of sexual way.
Speaker 3: Was it?
Speaker 2: Oh, by them by the aliens? Yes? But later not
Speaker 2: as No, I don't have any memories of being little,
Speaker 2: but yes.
Speaker 1: I don't need to jump ahead that And I'm sorry.
Speaker 2: No, no, that's all right, that's all right. I mean
Speaker 2: there's a progression to it, you know. I mean I
Speaker 2: was as a child, and I wasn't the only human there.
Speaker 2: I was the only child there, and you know, having
Speaker 2: just you know, I have a lot of opinions about
Speaker 2: these things because I've been around them my whole life,
Speaker 2: and I've had this happen in my whole life, and
Speaker 2: it's gone through different iterations. I had a hand I
Speaker 2: call him a handler. Sometimes I would call him Toby
Speaker 2: when I was little, but he didn't have a name.
Speaker 2: We had it like an imprint knowing, I knew who
Speaker 2: he was. He was, I always knew where to go
Speaker 2: when I was taken. Sometimes when I was taken, there's
Speaker 2: these underground facilities are where I was taken, and they're huge.
Speaker 2: They're massive. They're bigger than football stadiums and airports and
Speaker 2: everything you can think of put together. It's just I
Speaker 2: have no idea how big they are. All I can
Speaker 2: say is a just it's an unbelievably massive amount of
Speaker 2: stuff going on under our feet. There was one area
Speaker 2: quite often I would be taken, and it's a huge
Speaker 2: area and there's lots of people showing up there that
Speaker 2: have been taken. Everyone's in kind of like a dumbfounded state,
Speaker 2: like this brain fog kind of thing where no one's
Speaker 2: no one's even everyone's glassy eyed, and everyone's the you know,
Speaker 2: and you just kind of notice everyone. I mean, it's
Speaker 2: just no one talks to anyone, no one's everyone's just
Speaker 2: out of it. And I would always know. I would
Speaker 2: just feel where he was and nowhere to go. And
Speaker 2: this handler was a man. He appeared as a man.
Speaker 2: He was very tall, very big build, very square face,
Speaker 2: and looked military, you know, like looked like my friend
Speaker 2: Chad's gi Jo doll, you know, kind of growing up.
Speaker 2: Maybe he appeared that way because that's, you know, something
Speaker 2: that I have my Barbie dolls name Chad has g
Speaker 2: I Joe dolls and we play with those. So maybe
Speaker 2: that's where they came from. I don't know, but he
Speaker 2: was very He was always there with me. He was
Speaker 2: kind of it was like a little kid being groomed.
Speaker 2: He was always there too. I always felt safe knowing
Speaker 2: he was there because he's going to show you where
Speaker 2: I was to go. He's going to be there with me.
Speaker 2: There were other humans all over the place, there were
Speaker 2: other non humans all over the place, so I knew,
Speaker 2: and I was with him that these other entities weren't
Speaker 2: going to bother me or hurt me because he was
Speaker 2: going to protect me.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 2: It's like that abusive situation where you know they give you,
Speaker 2: they do something nice to kind of keep you on
Speaker 2: the hook, even though the whole thing is really disgusting.
Speaker 2: It's kind of like that, and you know when you're
Speaker 2: taken from a young age. And I've spoken with so
Speaker 2: many people now who whose stories are just the same
Speaker 2: as mine. You know, I think different is our names
Speaker 2: and where we grew up and who we were with
Speaker 2: when we were taken or where we were taken from.
Speaker 1: People have identical stories to you.
Speaker 2: Wow, I mean as identical as you can you know,
Speaker 2: not the same, but as yeah, identical circum circumstances. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: circumstance parallel lots and lots and lots, and it's and
Speaker 2: they have no reason to do that, you know, They're like,
Speaker 2: I don't want to share my name, but I want
Speaker 2: you to know. I just read your book, and I
Speaker 2: just read my whole life and I hear that over
Speaker 2: and over and over again. Wow, and especially from women,
Speaker 2: because we have a lot of similarities that happened later
Speaker 2: in my life I talk about in the book that
Speaker 2: are right about. But so this guy was always with me,
Speaker 2: and you know, so it was definitely a grooming thing
Speaker 2: where it was you taught how to act, you're taught
Speaker 2: where to go, you're taught not to talk about it,
Speaker 2: and you start to just get used to these entities
Speaker 2: being everywhere. You know that there were Nordic entities, there
Speaker 2: were Reptilian entities. There were the grays and not the
Speaker 2: grays that come and pick people up like the ones
Speaker 2: I experienced that would show up in my room. But
Speaker 2: the other grays that I think those little grays were
Speaker 2: modeled after, and the grays, the other grays, and all
Speaker 2: of them are like people in that they don't all
Speaker 2: look the same. I think people think, oh, you're abducted
Speaker 2: and there's like these six identical cookie cutter entities, and
Speaker 2: you know, they're all Retellian or they're all Nordic, or
Speaker 2: they're all gray, or they're all insectlin or whatever. That's
Speaker 2: not the case. They all look different, but you can
Speaker 2: tell that this is clearly this kind of like these
Speaker 2: are all kinds of grays, but they have you know,
Speaker 2: the ones that were there in those facilities that weren't
Speaker 2: these little worker be ones. Which I have a lot
Speaker 2: of opinions and thoughts on those based on my personal
Speaker 2: experience that I can share that later or another time,
Speaker 2: because that probably will get us off off topic.
Speaker 1: Hey is your show today? Girlfriend?
Speaker 3: You you.
Speaker 2: Okay? And tell me yeah, just tell me to stop
Speaker 2: if you want me to stop, because sometimes I get
Speaker 2: on a roll and I forget we love it. Well,
Speaker 2: So back to the grays, then I'll talk about that
Speaker 2: a little bit. They all, you know, they're all different,
Speaker 2: like people are so they had the regular grays, not
Speaker 2: the ones that came to get me, But they had
Speaker 2: facial expressions, you know, their faces wrinkled and moved, and
Speaker 2: you could tell, you know, how they felt by the
Speaker 2: way they looked at you. You their eyes moved like
Speaker 2: those grays that picked up they're just like their eyes
Speaker 2: were like a screen. They weren't like a real eye.
Speaker 2: But the ones that were there when I was taken,
Speaker 2: their eyes moved like they were almost full on black.
Speaker 2: You could see some difference and some movement in there,
Speaker 2: but it was like black on black kind of And
Speaker 2: but they were big, still really big, and their faces
Speaker 2: had expressions, and some of them looked more male than female.
Speaker 2: Not that I think that they were particularly male or female,
Speaker 2: because I never they never really explained any of that
Speaker 2: to me, So I'm just based on what I saw.
Speaker 2: Some were taller and really big, and some were small
Speaker 2: and more frail and that kind of thing. So, you know,
Speaker 2: just like people, they were all different, and the same
Speaker 2: with the reptilians too. And my handler was who eventually
Speaker 2: later I knew that he wasn't human because he would
Speaker 2: sometimes look like he would phase in and out of
Speaker 2: how he looked you know, i'd see it. It was
Speaker 2: like seeing a what's it called a hologram? Thank you? Yeah,
Speaker 2: it was almost like sometimes it would I could see
Speaker 2: something else behind him, like do you look different? I
Speaker 2: want to see what you really look like. I'm not
Speaker 2: afraid of you. I'm fine with it. I want to
Speaker 2: see what you really look like. And he was a
Speaker 2: reptilian and not like some gross looking lizard. And I
Speaker 2: like little lizards and frogs that I find in the backyard.
Speaker 2: It's Texas, we have a lot of them. I've always
Speaker 2: been fine with that. No, he you know, he was
Speaker 2: beautiful in a way, and.
Speaker 3: I reptilian looked beautiful.
Speaker 2: Now he was. His skin was like opalescent, almost shimmery,
Speaker 2: like jeweled almost. It was just so pretty. It was
Speaker 2: colors like it's just so hard to describe. And from
Speaker 2: what I've.
Speaker 1: Heard is that, you know, not all reptilians, I mean,
Speaker 1: in this this is something that's gonna get you know, convoluted.
Speaker 1: So I'm not going to spend too much time saying this,
Speaker 1: but you know a lot of people they have certain
Speaker 1: reptilian experiences. And the stories that I hear is that
Speaker 1: you know, like these races or different entities are not
Speaker 1: necessarily all good or all bad, just like humans in
Speaker 1: that way that maybe there could be like good reptilians
Speaker 1: or or good I'm not going to go as far
Speaker 1: as to say good demons, but you know what I.
Speaker 2: Mean, right, Yeah, different shades of gray, right, but ye are.
Speaker 3: But I think the whole thing about aliens being this
Speaker 3: cookie cutter thing.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 3: If I'm not mistaken me, if I'm wrong, people in
Speaker 3: the chat, whatever, do your thing. But I believe the
Speaker 3: first time that a quote unquote Martian was ever actually
Speaker 3: shown on screen was by with Marvin Martian and Bugs
Speaker 3: Bunny and if you remember what that was, the clone,
Speaker 3: the little bird alien creature that he kept popping out
Speaker 3: and he just kept pumping out more. I think that
Speaker 3: most people just kind of assumed that that's just how
Speaker 3: aliens go. They just have this one type, and that's
Speaker 3: just what the story ran, right. We hear about these
Speaker 3: little blue and little green men, little gray men, and
Speaker 3: they just kind of get these features tattooed onto them
Speaker 3: by society, by media, by whatever. The first image that
Speaker 3: people saw growing up whatever, and boom, that is like
Speaker 3: what we have locked in to be an alien. And
Speaker 3: maybe there's antenna's maybe there's not, maybe there's three eyes,
Speaker 3: slight differences here and there, but we all have the
Speaker 3: general idea of what a quote unquote alien looks like.
Speaker 1: Well, most people are not. Yeah, most people are never
Speaker 1: going to come in contact with an alien, though, like
Speaker 1: that's I would say, it's like the people who could
Speaker 1: ever come in contact with an alien or a demon
Speaker 1: or anything like that. I would say that we are
Speaker 1: of the minority for sure.
Speaker 3: For now, for now, for now, Allegedly, according to Fox
Speaker 3: News and Seeing In and all these other big dogs,
Speaker 3: there could be an alien mothership off of one of
Speaker 3: Saturn's rings. Right now, we don't even know about it,
Speaker 3: and we could spend five full days of mainstream media
Speaker 3: talking about this thing, and then at the very end
Speaker 3: till everybody, by the way, there's no evidence of this.
Speaker 3: We just think it's possible. Who knows man.
Speaker 2: Exactly. And that's what bothers me. I think the most
Speaker 2: about it is that there's so much there's so many
Speaker 2: assumptions out there, and there's so many people going, well,
Speaker 2: we think possibly, blah blah, you know, But then there
Speaker 2: are a lot of us who actually have had experience,
Speaker 2: who've been in the presence of these things for a lifetime.
Speaker 2: And there's nothing special about me. I'm just talking about it.
Speaker 2: But there are a lot of us. I mean, more
Speaker 2: than you think, probably, you know, if I had hazard,
Speaker 2: A guess, I'd say about fifty percent of the populations
Speaker 2: had some kind of if not at least contact, then
Speaker 2: have seen something probably more honestly, but a huge percentage,
Speaker 2: especially based on what I'm finding out as the deeper
Speaker 2: I go into this and the more research that I'm doing,
Speaker 2: because you've also have to remember, I've spent a lifetime
Speaker 2: with not being able to look at anything about this,
Speaker 2: not being able to research this stuff, not being able
Speaker 2: to watch any shows or read any books, not even
Speaker 2: being able to look out the windows at night because
Speaker 2: the terror and the fear of accidentally bringing them in
Speaker 2: is too deep, and accidentally looking at something and then
Speaker 2: having nightmares, you know, when I can keep them, when
Speaker 2: I could keep them out of my head. I wanted
Speaker 2: to stay that way because it was so much a
Speaker 2: part of my life, and so I never you know,
Speaker 2: I never read any of the books or watch the
Speaker 2: shows or wanted to do any of that stuff because
Speaker 2: it was too triggering and it was too hard so
Speaker 2: I'm just now, you know, now that I've been doing this,
Speaker 2: of course, I'm doing more research and I'm learning more
Speaker 2: and I'm talking to more people and to be well
Speaker 2: enough educated as to what else is out there aside
Speaker 2: from my own experience. But yeah, going back to what
Speaker 2: I was saying, it just there's all these supposed experts
Speaker 2: out there on all these new shows talking about all
Speaker 2: this stuff, and I'm like, where are you getting your
Speaker 2: information from?
Speaker 3: That guy, David Grush, He's getting off his info from
Speaker 3: third party sources and then gets the DoD approval to
Speaker 3: talk about it. You know, yeah, that's totally real.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm actually more on the side of believing
Speaker 1: some of the things that he said. I've actually gone
Speaker 1: through and I've sifted through some of the things he says. Dude,
Speaker 1: he doesn't believe that these are like off planet entities.
Speaker 1: He believes that they're their inner dimensional and that's way
Speaker 1: more believable to me.
Speaker 3: Everything everything he said, I'm saying, he is not a source.
Speaker 3: He was told this information from other people, and he
Speaker 3: didn't say anything that was like earth shattering. By the way,
Speaker 3: there's aliens. Yeah, bro, we know they're right there. They've
Speaker 3: been here forever. Yeah, once again, homeboy, we've been knowing this.
Speaker 3: Thank you, Welcome to the party.
Speaker 1: You know what I mean, Well, some people need to
Speaker 1: hear that, you know, no government, Like like if we
Speaker 1: say that there's one hundred percent aliens and we talk
Speaker 1: about electro nick calling it out in the sky, or
Speaker 1: we talk about my mushroom trips or your your experiences
Speaker 1: as a child and seeing demons like that's one thing.
Speaker 1: But if you hear like a government representative coming out
Speaker 1: and saying it like a lot of people tend to
Speaker 1: believe that a bit more. And that's really why I
Speaker 1: like what Stephen Greer is doing so much. I don't
Speaker 1: know if you're familiar with him, Karen, I am, but
Speaker 1: he's been he's been kind of trying to at least like, uh,
Speaker 1: get the government to like open up more about it
Speaker 1: and not be so secretive. Could he be a controlled opposition?
Speaker 1: Anybody could at this point, I'm just going to be
Speaker 1: real with you. I don't know, but from what I've
Speaker 1: read and the things that I've seen, he seems like, uh,
Speaker 1: I don't know, maybe he's he's trying to get it
Speaker 1: to be like more well known that these things are
Speaker 1: actually happening, and he's trying to get the government to
Speaker 1: like kind of loosen the noose on the whole conversation.
Speaker 3: And I like that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Now I think you're right. I think people like Rush.
Speaker 2: He's he seems credible. To me. I don't see any
Speaker 2: reason not to believe him, because I'm not seeing any
Speaker 2: personal gain for him in doing what he's doing. I
Speaker 2: think he has just enough information to share credible facts
Speaker 2: that he himself has verified, whether he first hand was
Speaker 2: party two things, or whether he was getting it secondhand
Speaker 2: but was able to verify it. And and I think
Speaker 2: that that makes it more credible for the rest of us.
Speaker 2: I think we need more of that, because they're just
Speaker 2: we haven't had anything that brought it into the mainstream
Speaker 2: light the way it has since the twenty seventeen York
Speaker 2: Times article and then up to today with David Grush
Speaker 2: bringing things to congressional committees and saying, yes, but I
Speaker 2: can't talk to you about that here, but I can
Speaker 2: talk to you about it in a skiff, or I
Speaker 2: can talk to you about it, you know, behind closed doors.
Speaker 2: It lends a certain amount of possible credibility, but it
Speaker 2: then also lends a huge amount of space for people
Speaker 2: to make assumptions. And it's like, you know, when you
Speaker 2: say biological material non human, do you mean that you
Speaker 2: found cats or do you mean that you found non
Speaker 2: human alien entities? What are you talking about your.
Speaker 3: Plant organic non human matter?
Speaker 2: Exactly an in front of record.
Speaker 3: I'm not saying that I hate Grush and I don't.
Speaker 3: I'm not over here just shitting on him, like no, no, no, no.
Speaker 3: I think that he is a spokesperson. Yeah, okay, I don't.
Speaker 3: You don't shit all over a news reporter for reporting
Speaker 3: what's on their teleprompter. Now, if they go off key
Speaker 3: and they give their own two cents about it, I
Speaker 3: might dislike them as a person after that. Fine, Fine,
Speaker 3: I can form my own opinion. I'm not saying that
Speaker 3: Grush is, you know, in on it and he's he's
Speaker 3: totally evil, like no, no, no, Look, he's probably just a
Speaker 3: low level government agent that has a good speaking voice
Speaker 3: that people naturally would tend to trust and they're like, hey, buddy,
Speaker 3: you're gonna become really famous. Here's a lot of things
Speaker 3: that we want you to read off and go for it.
Speaker 3: And he's not saying that he's not lying, he is
Speaker 3: relaying the information that he was given to relay. I'm
Speaker 3: not shitting on it. But again, like you said, it
Speaker 3: lead the fact that it's the government, and Jonathan, you're right.
Speaker 3: To certain people, the government saying dot dot dot makes
Speaker 3: them have a warm and fuzzy feeling inside. They're like, oh, oh,
Speaker 3: what the government came out. It's got to be real. Meanwhile,
Speaker 3: the other half of the country, and I actually do
Speaker 3: believe it's half and not conspiracy, not truth, or just
Speaker 3: the half with brainstems that are connected, right, they're like, oh, wait,
Speaker 3: the government said it. Oh we need to do the opposite.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's a horrible idea. My point is
Speaker 3: there's either way you go. There's gonna be people trying
Speaker 3: to disprove you either side of the aisle you're on.
Speaker 3: So I see him as what he is and not
Speaker 3: what he's what people are making him out to be.
Speaker 3: You see what I'm saying, absolutely able to look.
Speaker 1: At like anybody's accounts of aliens or UFOs or anything
Speaker 1: like that with a healthy amount of skepticism, and I
Speaker 1: think that's all you're doing.
Speaker 3: Put it like this, I trust Bob Lazar's word over
Speaker 3: David Grush, oh for sure. Now some people will say, oh, well,
Speaker 3: Lazarre he blah blah blah blah, it's not real, you
Speaker 3: know what. That's firsthand, that's first hand account. Grushes is
Speaker 3: at best second or third. So I'm sorry, Bob, Lazar's
Speaker 3: got more of my attention, man.
Speaker 2: And the thing with any of them is if they didn't,
Speaker 2: if the powers to be, the governments and the agencies
Speaker 2: and the three Letter Agencies or whoever is in of
Speaker 2: this topic right now didn't want them to speak, they
Speaker 2: wouldn't be speaking about it. They're only speaking because there
Speaker 2: is a very specific permission given for this information to
Speaker 2: be out there, because trust me, if they don't want
Speaker 2: it out there, they will stop it. The only reason
Speaker 2: I'm allowed to be speaking about this right now is
Speaker 2: because so much of this is already out there, and
Speaker 2: there is so much you know, there's so much negativity
Speaker 2: towards someone who releases information like I have, who shares
Speaker 2: information like I have. You know, I'm not looked at
Speaker 2: as a you know, as Yeah, I'm not looked at
Speaker 2: as someone who's with respect that it should be given.
Speaker 2: Let's put it that way. I'm trying to find a
Speaker 2: nice way to put it, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: And all I'm doing is telling the truth, and all
Speaker 2: I'm doing is taking is being brave enough to share
Speaker 2: what so many other people you know want to share
Speaker 2: but are comfortable. And I understand that, I understand not
Speaker 2: wanting to share it. Trust me. We're trained from a
Speaker 2: young age. I was try from a young age not
Speaker 2: to talk about this, but like I said, that near
Speaker 2: death experience changed everything for me, and I am not
Speaker 2: going to spend what time I have left on this
Speaker 2: earth not sharing the truth about what I know about
Speaker 2: these entities and about what happened to me, because I
Speaker 2: don't want any more. I don't want the truth to
Speaker 2: be obfuscated. If I can help it, you know, if
Speaker 2: I can be a part of the clarity, then then
Speaker 2: that's what I want to do. And I'm not afraid anymore.
Speaker 2: I mean, I am very protective of my family, and
Speaker 2: if I didn't have my faith that I have right now,
Speaker 2: I definitely wouldn't be able to do this, that's for sure.
Speaker 1: So your experience, and you say that you're kind of
Speaker 1: going in these like kind of underground tunnels, underground areas, cities,
Speaker 1: whatever you want to call them, I mean, is that
Speaker 1: does that kind of line up with like what hell
Speaker 1: might be.
Speaker 2: Oh gosh, that's a good question. I don't know, because
Speaker 2: I don't really think I was in any kind of
Speaker 2: a hell and it you know, for me, I think
Speaker 2: the biblical hell is not being able to spend eternity
Speaker 2: with the love and the peace and the grace that
Speaker 2: I had, you know, when I had my experience with
Speaker 2: our Creator, with our Savior. So when you look at
Speaker 2: hell as an absence of love, an absence of peace,
Speaker 2: I was never without love and peace. Even though I
Speaker 2: was tortured, even though I was tormented, even though it
Speaker 2: wasn't a pleasant thing that was happening to me, even
Speaker 2: though I was kidnapped and raped and had children ripped
Speaker 2: from my womb, It's still God was still with me,
Speaker 2: you know, and I still there was always still that
Speaker 2: shred of knowing that I wasn't damned or I wasn't
Speaker 2: going to have a lifetime of this. Whatever was happening
Speaker 2: was happening in the moment. Because we live in a
Speaker 2: fallen world. We live in a simple world. We live
Speaker 2: in a world that I can't control what other people
Speaker 2: are doing, and I was being taken advantage of by
Speaker 2: entities who were fallen and who were not still with God,
Speaker 2: who were not still We're not doing good.
Speaker 1: Right, I'm sorry there children ripped from your womb.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so that was a little rough to say, Jesus.
Speaker 2: Sometimes it's easier to say it that way than to
Speaker 2: actually go down the road of that. We can go
Speaker 2: down that path. It's fine, No, I mean, this is
Speaker 2: this is really important because I have, since I've shared
Speaker 2: my information spoken then with so many women who who
Speaker 2: have gone through this exact same scenario that I have
Speaker 2: with the pregnancies in two thousand and twenty I think
Speaker 2: it was twenty two. I haven't in the book, and
Speaker 2: I can look it up, but I don't want to
Speaker 2: go searching for it. A report was released by the
Speaker 2: government about acute and sub acute anomalist side effects basically
Speaker 2: of people who I've been exposed to alien entities, non
Speaker 2: human entities for lack of a better word. They put
Speaker 2: a really long, complicated title on it. It's a huge
Speaker 2: report and no one's going to take the time to
Speaker 2: go through it. But Tecker Carl said did and he
Speaker 2: needed a report. Says it sounds like the stuff of
Speaker 2: sci fi and you know, and missing pregnancies, and the government,
Speaker 2: the government actually confirmed the things that I wrote about.
Speaker 2: I'd already written about this, I'd already talked about this
Speaker 2: with La Marzuli, and now you know, at this point
Speaker 2: I was able to add it into the book, thank goodness.
Speaker 2: But they I've had missing pregnancies happened since I was
Speaker 2: able to have children. The first time it happened, I
Speaker 2: was married. It was my first pregnancy. I was very excited.
Speaker 2: I went to the doctor, confirmed pregnancy, got my prescription
Speaker 2: or vitamins. They confirmed everything. Back then, it was blood
Speaker 2: tests and you know, you get to hear at some
Speaker 2: point a heartbeat. Not the first visit, obviously, but you
Speaker 2: had to get prescriptions for your vitamins back then too,
Speaker 2: and everything. I'm dating myself a little more here, but
Speaker 2: that's all right. And about the beginning of the second trimester,
Speaker 2: I woke up at night and I was my stomach
Speaker 2: hurt really bad, but I was not bleeding. I was
Speaker 2: spotting a tiny bit, but nothing came out of me.
Speaker 2: So my husband at the time took me to the
Speaker 2: emergency room. You know back then that doctors weren't all connected.
Speaker 2: We didn't have computers, and everybody's office. Everything was still
Speaker 2: on paper. I go into the er and they you know,
Speaker 2: did a doppler thing and there was no heartbeat. And
Speaker 2: they did an ultrasound and there was no baby. And
Speaker 2: they did a test and I still had pregnancy hormones
Speaker 2: in my system, and they did a d n C
Speaker 2: and there was no fetal tissue at all in my
Speaker 2: none whoa zero? And that you know, that's where they Sorry,
Speaker 2: someone walked in the room. Okay, good timing.
Speaker 3: So many follow up questions to this, Oh my god, and.
Speaker 2: It's not Yeah, And some of my friends who've talked
Speaker 2: to me about their similar experiences, would they still have
Speaker 2: like the placenta would still be or the amniotic sack
Speaker 2: or different things, random things that would never be left behind, right,
Speaker 2: but not the baby anyway. But go ahead, okay, okay, okay,
Speaker 2: this is a really hard one we talk about. So
Speaker 2: I'm glad that you have questions because it gives me
Speaker 2: a second.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, No, I'm sorry, I'm sorry for you. Take
Speaker 3: a minute. It's all good. No, No, you asked, so
Speaker 3: you were you said, how far along in your pregnancy
Speaker 3: at this time before, like when everything was still going good?
Speaker 3: Last doctor visit was all normal, good? How far were you.
Speaker 2: End of the first trimester? Started the second trimester, so
Speaker 2: in the third to fourth month, you know, okay, that's
Speaker 2: it's a forty weeks, so you're looking at you know,
Speaker 2: kind of twelve to thirteen weeks is the end of
Speaker 2: the first trimester.
Speaker 3: Okay, And so when you went and how long was
Speaker 3: it between these two doctors the last time you saw
Speaker 3: that everything was good and then you came in because
Speaker 3: of the spotting correct net.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so the first visit would be the one where
Speaker 2: I realized I was pregnant, which was very early on,
Speaker 2: probably you know, my four to six weeks at that point,
Speaker 2: and we didn't have these easy to get over the
Speaker 2: counter piano stick things, you know. Yeah, I mean they
Speaker 2: came out I think around that time, and they were
Speaker 2: I think they were pretty expensive, I remember, right. I
Speaker 2: know by the end of this I would buy like
Speaker 2: ten of those at a time because I never believed
Speaker 2: I was pregnant even when I was, you know. And anyway,
Speaker 2: so yeah, so into a doctor's pointment sometimes would have
Speaker 2: two because usually there's the first one and then the second
Speaker 2: one is right at the end of the first trimester.
Speaker 2: Usually It just depends on your doctor. It's not always
Speaker 2: the same. It's not the same with every doctor. So
Speaker 2: usually there would be at least two appointments by that
Speaker 2: point in time.
Speaker 3: Okay, so multiple appointments, at least at least a couple
Speaker 3: and you go in because the spotting and there is
Speaker 3: not only.
Speaker 2: It was really the pain. Honestly, with the limited the
Speaker 2: little bit of spotting ahead, I would not have been concerned, okay,
Speaker 2: because that's normal to have a little bit sometimes it's
Speaker 2: just things that happen. The pain, the pain intense.
Speaker 3: Okay, So I know people are no women, excuse me,
Speaker 3: I want to say people, because not all people have
Speaker 3: ovaries no matter what, quote unquote matter.
Speaker 1: No matter what there are, they're called vagina owners.
Speaker 3: Now, okay, look, I'm sorry. Men can't have periods, and
Speaker 3: I will stand by that. Sorry. Anyway, women that I
Speaker 3: know who have dealt with ovari insists in the past,
Speaker 3: and they have said about how much pain they are
Speaker 3: in when these things rupture, all these things. I know
Speaker 3: multiple women who have had natural childbirth all the stuff.
Speaker 3: So this was this level of pain.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I've had this strupture. I mean I've had
Speaker 2: natural childbirth I've had, you know, three children and and
Speaker 2: done it all the different ways. And the big proponent
Speaker 2: of the drugs, I'm just saying, not drugs in general, people,
Speaker 2: I'm talking about the the ones you get to help
Speaker 2: you through childbirth, right.
Speaker 1: Epidurals and.
Speaker 3: Of natural childbirth. I think that's amazing when the women
Speaker 3: who do it are incredible.
Speaker 2: I think also.
Speaker 3: As a man, realize that I will never be in
Speaker 3: a position to get an epidural or not, so I
Speaker 3: also recognize that my opinion is null and void on
Speaker 3: this entire talk.
Speaker 2: For that, I appreciate that women.
Speaker 3: Don't.
Speaker 1: They say it's like equivalent to being kicked in the
Speaker 1: nuts like a thousand times.
Speaker 3: It's like taking your bottom lip and ripping it over
Speaker 3: the back of your skull and then having someone tell
Speaker 3: you smile for the fucking camera Jesus coming through the
Speaker 3: front end of you. As a man, from what I
Speaker 3: have been explained, that's like the best way to describe
Speaker 3: the pain and all, like what it's like for us,
Speaker 3: you and I, it's that's unimaginable, that's that's unfathomable things.
Speaker 3: But for women it's like, oh, y'all don't even know,
Speaker 3: and it's like, you know what, You're right, and I'm.
Speaker 1: Just happy we live in a day and age where
Speaker 1: we don't have to get the Q tips up our
Speaker 1: p hole for STD checks, you know what I mean. Like,
Speaker 1: I hear that that used to be pretty brutal back
Speaker 1: in the day, thank god, you know, in the day.
Speaker 3: Early two thousands. Yeah, look, thank god met modern medicine
Speaker 3: has come as far as it's come. But in another regard,
Speaker 3: I'm really upset the modern midicine has come as far
Speaker 3: as it's come, you know, I mean different fields, different
Speaker 3: areas of discipline. But yeah, all right, So anyway back
Speaker 3: to the whole you having a child ripped from your womb.
Speaker 3: Let's let's stay on topics.
Speaker 2: We've gone around, and that was me being a little
Speaker 2: dramatic about it. But you know, I get upset because
Speaker 2: people think, oh, these are benevolent space brothers. I'm like, really,
Speaker 2: and what's your basis for comparison because mine's pretty specific.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So okay, let me ask you know, there was
Speaker 3: no scarring, there was no nerve damage, there was no
Speaker 3: markings on your body whatsoever. After this abduction, after this
Speaker 3: whole situation, when you go back in to say, hey,
Speaker 3: I need to check in on my baby, and they're like,
Speaker 3: what baby.
Speaker 2: Oh wow. And one time they were just like they
Speaker 2: were so confused. They're like they were convinced it had
Speaker 2: to be a tubal pregnancy, and so they're like, in
Speaker 2: looking in my fallopian tubes. One, there's got to be
Speaker 2: a baby here somewhere, I mean, you know. And then
Speaker 2: they're always, you know, theyre always have the well, we
Speaker 2: don't know what happened explanation, but clearly there's an explanation.
Speaker 2: I just don't know what that is. So it was
Speaker 2: always absorbed the baby or my favorite is you lost
Speaker 2: the baby, you just didn't realize it. And every woman
Speaker 2: I've talked to him like, do you think that's possible? No,
Speaker 2: it's not. You're going to know. I'm sorry, And you know,
Speaker 2: the biggest no offense to you guys are the biggest
Speaker 2: issues I get from people when I have these conversations,
Speaker 2: and I'll get like negative comments. Will be men going
Speaker 2: there's no you just lost a baby. Didn't know. I'm like,
Speaker 2: how can you? How do you know? What's your basis
Speaker 2: for comparison? You know? So anyway, because it is so
Speaker 2: you know, it is such a as a parent as
Speaker 2: a man or a woman. To lose a child is
Speaker 2: one of the most emotionally got wrenching things you can
Speaker 2: ever go through. And not to be able to memorialize
Speaker 2: that child, not to know what happened to that child,
Speaker 2: not to be able to bury that child, not to
Speaker 2: be able to you know, I know what happened to
Speaker 2: that child is it was just the emotion that goes
Speaker 2: along with that, the pain.
Speaker 1: Yeah, is incredible, heart break I can.
Speaker 2: And now I just now. I talk so many women
Speaker 2: I have reached out to me with who have had
Speaker 2: these experiences like this, and they're like, and they're so
Speaker 2: relieved that there's someone else who has is talking about
Speaker 2: it because they're like, I was always afraid to talk
Speaker 2: about it because everyone say something crazy when I try
Speaker 2: to talk about this, But this happened to me too,
Speaker 2: and it's just like, you're not crazy. It happened.
Speaker 3: Now, was this your first pregnancy?
Speaker 2: That one? Yes, okay, but then it happened again.
Speaker 3: You know, this happened multiple times?
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, three of them that I had confirmed, and
Speaker 2: beyond that, it would get to the point where I
Speaker 2: wouldn't even go into the doctor until I get to
Speaker 2: a certain point because it was too hard, and it
Speaker 2: was easier to pretend I wasn't pregnant until it got
Speaker 2: to a certain point and then I go in and
Speaker 2: because if it got past a certain point, then I
Speaker 2: knew that that was it was going to be, okay,
Speaker 2: I wasn't going to lose that baby or whatever, so
Speaker 2: you know, or it was going to go missing or whatever.
Speaker 2: So it definitely definitely was. I even't got my tubes
Speaker 2: tied after my second child because I thought that would
Speaker 2: stop it, but it didn't stop it.
Speaker 3: So even after your tubes getting tied, you still were
Speaker 3: able to conceive, and you still were losing them due
Speaker 3: to these entities. Now, let me ask you this follow
Speaker 3: up to the follow ups here. Okay, you're saying that
Speaker 3: this first experience was in the transition between first trimester
Speaker 3: and second trimester. I'm with you. These other ones that
Speaker 3: you had, when were they in the in vitro process?
Speaker 2: Yeah, all same. I mean it's so hard to pinpoint
Speaker 2: the date because I would never know what data got pregnant,
Speaker 2: and especially because what was happening is my eggs were
Speaker 2: being harvested. However, these embryos are being created, was then
Speaker 2: being put back into me so for me to know
Speaker 2: that from the time I found out it would be
Speaker 2: around the end of the first trimester. Yeah, and it
Speaker 2: was always about the same time. And interestingly enough, that's
Speaker 2: the point at which the human body is designed to
Speaker 2: reject an embryo if there's something wrong with it. So
Speaker 2: they clearly knew that. I'm obviously they're very intelligent that
Speaker 2: if they didn't take it by that point in time,
Speaker 2: that the body would just reject it anyway and it
Speaker 2: would end up, you know, and you can't tell when
Speaker 2: it's that small what it is. I mean, really, you know,
Speaker 2: if there was something, if there was a slight difference,
Speaker 2: if it was a hybrid or a human, it would
Speaker 2: be very hard to tell for just a normal lay person,
Speaker 2: not for a doctor, I'm sure, but so and then
Speaker 2: it was you think that.
Speaker 3: They were using you as a host to try to
Speaker 3: give birth to hybrid children.
Speaker 2: I know they were because I held one of those.
Speaker 2: I have very vivid memory of holding one. I don't
Speaker 2: know how often this might have happened, but I have
Speaker 2: a vivid memory of one time when they took me,
Speaker 2: and then I also saw three of them much later.
Speaker 1: So okay, I'm going to get really weird here, and
Speaker 1: I'm sure maybe I don't.
Speaker 2: Think so, but is the progeny of human and an
Speaker 2: angel and I believe these are angelic beings because they're
Speaker 2: just not human, and the other entities that we know
Speaker 2: that God created we call them angels. It's a misnomer.
Speaker 2: They're just the other beings, right, And so you're not
Speaker 2: supposed to cross the two. It's like crossing the streams.
Speaker 2: You don't do it, right. So, yeah, to your point, yes,
Speaker 2: that's modern day nepheline.
Speaker 1: Where I was going Yeah, where I was going at
Speaker 1: is that there there There are obviously a lot of
Speaker 1: stories of aliens, but one of the most common ones
Speaker 1: that I hear, especially that has been around for decades,
Speaker 1: is that the Grays are the and it's interesting you
Speaker 1: mentioned the grays here too, is that the grays are
Speaker 1: are essentially just older versions of us that like grew
Speaker 1: through you know, technology and mechanics and stuff like that,
Speaker 1: and they and their bodies essentially just like kind of
Speaker 1: withered away because they just got so into the technology
Speaker 1: or something like that. And so the story goes is
Speaker 1: that eventually they stop being able to reproduce, and so
Speaker 1: to keep their race going they would they would like
Speaker 1: kind of come out here or where, you know, with
Speaker 1: with human women. I guess, very similar to the Nefflin story.
Speaker 1: But uh in that sense they would come to the
Speaker 1: human women and that this is where you'd hear about
Speaker 1: all this like astral sex or astral rapist. I guess
Speaker 1: it's not really you know, you're not wanting it, so
Speaker 1: it's you know, you hear those kind of stories and
Speaker 1: it's like, all right, well now we finally have a
Speaker 1: first hand account of what is going on. And I mean,
Speaker 1: is was this all by the Grays or was it
Speaker 1: multiple different kind of alien in quotes beings?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know what particular entity provided the other
Speaker 2: half of the equation for the fetus that I was posting.
Speaker 2: I have no idea, and they never shared that with me.
Speaker 2: What I can say was for the time frame that
Speaker 2: I was used, when my body was viable, and for
Speaker 2: the and for the children that were pretty much grown.
Speaker 2: When I saw them, they looked like what people describe
Speaker 2: as the black eyed kids. They were stocky, they had
Speaker 2: very dark eyes. They were wearing hooded like sweatshirt type
Speaker 2: things when when I saw them, and there appears to
Speaker 2: me based on what I've seen and what I've encountered
Speaker 2: with them to be an evolution of while they're working
Speaker 2: with this program getting different results, you know, more human looking,
Speaker 2: more able to learn and adapt and be a part
Speaker 2: of our society. I think the black Eyed kids were
Speaker 2: probably like the first step into entities that could actually
Speaker 2: be here around us, in our airspace, in our you know,
Speaker 2: in our I don't think in the sunlight.
Speaker 1: Yeah, merboreal beings instead of just inter dimensional.
Speaker 2: And then you get to someone like what doctor David
Speaker 2: Jacobs his work were walking among us when he talks
Speaker 2: about the thousands and thousands of people that he interviewed
Speaker 2: who have reports of hybrid entities who were as human
Speaker 2: looking as you and I practically. So it's just, you know,
Speaker 2: it seems to be and this is you know, only
Speaker 2: based on my portion of it, knowing that these kids
Speaker 2: were looking more like black Eyed kids, and that seems
Speaker 2: to have gone away. Nobody has had those kinds of
Speaker 2: sightings the way they were. It seemed to happen in
Speaker 2: a very specific period of time where they were in
Speaker 2: that kind of same era when I was having my kids.
Speaker 2: It makes sense, whereas now there seems to be more
Speaker 2: and more less and less hybrid type sightings, because I
Speaker 2: think they're more and more easily integrated into our society
Speaker 2: if they are here with us at all. So that's
Speaker 2: my thought process on it.
Speaker 3: So you say, if they're here, do you possibly believe
Speaker 3: I'm not saying do you have this confirmed or not? Yeah,
Speaker 3: but I'm assuming you were not the only one. You've
Speaker 3: had so many other women say so many similar stories.
Speaker 3: Do you believe at this time that some of them
Speaker 3: were viable, were born or are even let me ask
Speaker 3: you this, do you believe that they are possibly in
Speaker 3: positions of power today or do you think that these
Speaker 3: hybrid beings somehow are born into out from a human
Speaker 3: mother and has just accepted that they're human and they're
Speaker 3: just bebopping along working a little nine to five somewhere.
Speaker 3: Think Clark Kent before he realized he was Superman.
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, I think that's anything I say on that
Speaker 2: would be speculation. But my experience, I do one hundred
Speaker 2: percent believe that at this point they are passing for human.
Speaker 2: You wouldn't know, and because they've gotten so much better
Speaker 2: with it, and you know, are there there are things
Speaker 2: I think that had to happen in our society and
Speaker 2: our medical society in order for this to happen, because
Speaker 2: otherwise it would stand out like a sore thumb. But
Speaker 2: as our society has progressed, and our medical fields have progressed,
Speaker 2: and our understanding of things have progressed, it has allowed
Speaker 2: burst to happen that never would have made it full
Speaker 2: term or to be pre termed. But they're still in
Speaker 2: or you know. Yeah, I think for someone to even
Speaker 2: have a baby like that to go full term could
Speaker 2: absolutely happen now, but it wouldn't have been able to
Speaker 2: happen before without everyone noticing, do you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: without there being some sort of something that was showing
Speaker 2: up his odd So it's hard to say, but I
Speaker 2: do think that they are around. There are too many
Speaker 2: reports of them, and too many reports of people hosting
Speaker 2: hybrid entities and running into them. My friend Al Matthews,
Speaker 2: who was in the fourth movie of LA's with Me,
Speaker 2: he has had a really wild encounter with one with
Speaker 2: a female hybrid entity. And Al has no reason to
Speaker 2: lie to me, you know, but these are just conversations
Speaker 2: that he would have a conversation with you if you
Speaker 2: were ever interested. But these are just conversations I've had
Speaker 2: with him, you know, and he's had with La and
Speaker 2: that he's shared with us. But he's got no reason
Speaker 2: to lie about that. It's just this crazy thing that happened.
Speaker 2: And it's not just him. There's so many other people
Speaker 2: who have had those So one hundred percent think that
Speaker 2: could they be in positions of power? Oh definitely. I
Speaker 2: mean you're looking at you look at books like tim
Speaker 2: Alrena's Birthright where he really gets into how we as
Speaker 2: humans were given the birthright to the earth, and then
Speaker 2: you know that's being tried to take away from us.
Speaker 2: At what point, you know, are they just human enough
Speaker 2: to inherit that birthright? At what point are they human
Speaker 2: enough to take over positions of power, wealth and authority
Speaker 2: where they can be making these choices and these decisions
Speaker 2: that affect the humans and that are taking you know,
Speaker 2: power and authority from us. You know, who is the
Speaker 2: prince of the power of the air, you know. And
Speaker 2: then it all goes back to Genesis three, p. Fifteen
Speaker 2: to the Sea War, because that's when it says and
Speaker 2: he will breuge your head and you'll crush his heel,
Speaker 2: or you crush his head and he will bruise your heel. Sorry,
Speaker 2: that backwards, and that's that sets up a sea war
Speaker 2: that never ended. You know, they couldn't stop Jesus from
Speaker 2: being born, but what they could do was stop as
Speaker 2: many people from believing as possible.
Speaker 3: I think that step further. They couldn't stop the temple
Speaker 3: being rebuilt, but they could try to kill all the
Speaker 3: Jews in a holocaust.
Speaker 2: Exactly Why have the Jewish people always been so oppressed?
Speaker 2: You know what I mean? And you know, people are
Speaker 2: all over on this subject right now, and I'm like,
Speaker 2: you have to boil it down to the simplest no,
Speaker 2: I mean, come.
Speaker 3: On, I never thought that I would live to see
Speaker 3: so much vehement anti Semitism in this country like I
Speaker 3: do right now, Like I neither. It's not even anti
Speaker 3: Israel or anti who's the president, he's been president, you know,
Speaker 3: it's not even anti him. It is people being anti
Speaker 3: like anti semi truefull blood, just hating the Jews. And
Speaker 3: I'm like, what come from?
Speaker 2: Yeah? And then anywhere where there's hate, you know, And
Speaker 2: I don't understand that because hate doesn't do us any good,
Speaker 2: It doesn't help anyone. I mean, we don't have to agree.
Speaker 2: I don't have to agree with y'all. You don't have
Speaker 2: to agree with me. And you've been so kind to
Speaker 2: me tonight. And I know that I'm bringing some pretty
Speaker 2: controversial stuff up, but you've been so kind to me
Speaker 2: because you guys don't have that kind of You don't
Speaker 2: come at people with hate. It doesn't do us any
Speaker 2: good to do that, you know. I mean, I respect
Speaker 2: your beliefs, you respect mine. I think that's amazing. We
Speaker 2: need to be that way if we're gonna survive. Ever,
Speaker 2: you know, I mean, there just isn't any reason for it.
Speaker 2: It just breaks my heart. I mean, there's enough pain
Speaker 2: in this world. I can attest to personally to that.
Speaker 2: There is more than enough pain in this world to
Speaker 2: go around. We need to not to get on a
Speaker 2: weird soapbox, but you know, we need to bring that
Speaker 2: down a notch and do our part to make it better,
Speaker 2: to make it agree.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's I mean, it's definitely needed. And you know
Speaker 1: I know that definitely riding like riding around in these
Speaker 1: conspiracy realms, it can get a little heated, it can
Speaker 1: get a little conflicted. I mean, how me and Jacob
Speaker 1: have almost chewed each other's heads off. A couple of times.
Speaker 1: But you know, that's just differing belief and that's all right,
Speaker 1: you know, like there's no way of confirming a lot
Speaker 1: of these things, but we can speculate, we can theorize,
Speaker 1: we can put our brains together and try and come
Speaker 1: up with some kind of solution or some kind of
Speaker 1: answer to the questions that we seek. I don't think
Speaker 1: there's anything wrong with that. And and you know, just
Speaker 1: because y'all are are are Christians, and you know, it
Speaker 1: doesn't mean that like I think, I think that's a
Speaker 1: great thing. I I'm happy that, you know, we have
Speaker 1: guests and even Jacob, I'm I'm happy that we don't
Speaker 1: think the same way because it allows us to look
Speaker 1: through all these different lines of vision and all these
Speaker 1: different perspectives that you know, like if I can't figure
Speaker 1: something out, Jacob probably can. If Jacob can't figure something out,
Speaker 1: I probably can. And if we can't figure up mount,
Speaker 1: we bring Karen Wilkinson on the show. Maybe she can
Speaker 1: figure it out.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: Like that's the beautiful thing about these, uh, these open
Speaker 1: ended like conversations. And I mean, I mean, I'm I'm
Speaker 1: so sorry to hear about what you've had to go
Speaker 1: through in your life. But I'm I'm very thankful that
Speaker 1: you're you're actually telling the story, because that is just
Speaker 1: it's just insane. I mean, most people they go through
Speaker 1: one of those things, they're scarred for life.
Speaker 3: And here you are.
Speaker 1: You're like, oh, yeah, I got visited by demons or
Speaker 1: aliens multiple times and I'm just around to tell talked.
Speaker 3: About talk to people about it.
Speaker 1: And it's like, oh my god, the cohon is on you.
Speaker 3: It's crazy. I'm jealous. You're you're you're how can I
Speaker 3: put this gone?
Speaker 2: Yourumption? Thanks. It hasn't been easy, trust me. And I
Speaker 2: have broken down more often than not, and I have
Speaker 2: had my moments where I really wanted to leave this earth.
Speaker 2: And that's where I know that God is with me
Speaker 2: because he stopped me every time. And I don't know how,
Speaker 2: you know, it's just it's a lot. And yeah, I
Speaker 2: still break down all the time, so you know, it's
Speaker 2: easy to put forward sometimes a brief face with people,
Speaker 2: and then later I go down and you know, I
Speaker 2: have my moments. But yeah, it was a lot. It
Speaker 2: was and it affected every part of my life, and
Speaker 2: it left up every part of my life. Trust me,
Speaker 2: you know, I didn't have good relationships. I didn't, you know,
Speaker 2: I Yeah, it messed up everything. But in the end,
Speaker 2: everything came back together in the end, you know, the
Speaker 2: blessings abound in the end. You know, I have beautiful, happy,
Speaker 2: healthy children whom I love more than life itself, you know,
Speaker 2: than anything, and and so that there there's a lot
Speaker 2: to be grateful for too. But yeah, it's a lot,
Speaker 2: and it's been hard, and probably more than we can
Speaker 2: even discussed in two or three hours. But that's okay,
Speaker 2: because we can we can bring more of it back.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I hate to see people argue and fuss
Speaker 2: over differences of opinion on things when I know that
Speaker 2: I do not know everything. I know what I know
Speaker 2: and the rest of it. I'm never gonna sit here
Speaker 2: and say I'm right and you're wrong, because I can't
Speaker 2: do that. That's not it works. We have to learn
Speaker 2: from each other.
Speaker 3: And I don't even mind people disagreeing, and I don't
Speaker 3: even mind people getting passionate about their beliefs. And maybe
Speaker 3: tempers do get flaired sometimes and people do get serious
Speaker 3: about what it fine, fine, fine, But as long as
Speaker 3: there is a level of respect, right and a level
Speaker 3: of even if we just we get screaming at each other, like, yeah,
Speaker 3: we're gonna go have a beer after this and be cool.
Speaker 3: This is a conversation, and once the conversation ends, its ending,
Speaker 3: it's all good. But also in another light, I can
Speaker 3: relate to very small fragments of your entire store. But
Speaker 3: a few of the things you experienced, I experienced. But
Speaker 3: this was in no way, shape or form. Did I
Speaker 3: think this was an alien, not even once this was
Speaker 3: confirmed a demon from the word go. But again, this didn't.
Speaker 3: This didn't have the same effect on me as it
Speaker 3: did on you. It wasn't as frequent, it wasn't as
Speaker 3: violent it was there was not near the level. I
Speaker 3: think my experiences was more of a very very small
Speaker 3: scratch of the surface of what could have been. Don't
Speaker 3: get me wrong, but and the times of that happened,
Speaker 3: an angel was sent or something along those lines, and
Speaker 3: looking at what the demon looked like and everything, like,
Speaker 3: I feel you one thousand percent.
Speaker 1: What was that angel's name again, by the.
Speaker 3: Way, the angel's name, Yeah, Jonathan, you dick. I'm not
Speaker 3: happy about that, all right. I know you're just grinning
Speaker 3: ear to ear, shithead, but you know whatever, I can't
Speaker 3: change my angel's name. I would if I could, you bastard,
Speaker 3: if I could.
Speaker 1: But anyway, I mean, it literally means God's gifts, so
Speaker 1: you're welcome.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: That's the other thing too. It just fits anyway. Anyway,
Speaker 3: But I was talking about the waking paralysis. I had
Speaker 3: one experience like that, and I used to have scars
Speaker 3: on it on me from what happened in that experience,
Speaker 3: but it was they have long since passed, and it
Speaker 3: was a as far as the entirety of my life goes,
Speaker 3: a one off, and I saw that as a massively
Speaker 3: traumatic experience and something that I didn't want to talk
Speaker 3: about with people. I didn't talk about with my church
Speaker 3: group because again that's fucking weird. I told my mom
Speaker 3: about it once upon a time, and like she was
Speaker 3: aware of some things, but didn't know the whole scope,
Speaker 3: because again I didn't exactly know how to explain this.
Speaker 3: It wasn't until much later in my life when I
Speaker 3: finally grasped everything, did research into everything, and then eventually
Speaker 3: felt comfortable enough to be like, you know what, I
Speaker 3: we need to talk about this on the show. And
Speaker 3: it was. It was cathartic in a lot of ways
Speaker 3: to come forward and like talk about this thing that
Speaker 3: like had been weighing on me. Not that it was
Speaker 3: weighing on me to get it out, it was weighing
Speaker 3: on me because like that sucked, Like why would I
Speaker 3: want to retell these stories? You know what I mean?
Speaker 3: But just like you said, there's power in that, and
Speaker 3: there is there's truth in that. And I cannot tell
Speaker 3: you how many people have messaged us DMed me, found
Speaker 3: me in some way, shape or form and told me like, look, bro,
Speaker 3: you sharing your story helped me in so many ways
Speaker 3: I had stories just like that. This validated so many things.
Speaker 3: Oh my god. I'm like, look, I'm happy, Like I
Speaker 3: want these people to share these stories and like we
Speaker 3: get these things out, we can collectively figure out we
Speaker 3: all regardless of whatever religious dogma, whatever god you worship,
Speaker 3: whatever book you banging, whatever, you believe that there is
Speaker 3: a good force and a bad force. There is a
Speaker 3: light and a dark, a positive, a negative. Either way
Speaker 3: you want to say, there's good shit at work and
Speaker 3: there's bad shit at work, okay, fair enough. If enough
Speaker 3: people are collectively having these bad work experiences, and the
Speaker 3: forces and entities look the same, act the same smell
Speaker 3: the same, talk the same. Now, look, I'm no mathematician,
Speaker 3: but if it looked like a duck and walk like
Speaker 3: a duck, guess what half flat? You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3: That's it. So if all of us are coming together
Speaker 3: with these stories and these similar experiences and some very dissimilar,
Speaker 3: but like I said, there was a few comparisons that
Speaker 3: I could at least draw, I believe that all of
Speaker 3: this is in the same realm, and I kind of
Speaker 3: think we're talking about the same same entities in a degree,
Speaker 3: if not maybe creatures influenced and corrupted by other entities.
Speaker 3: Even I don't know how many levels to this five
Speaker 3: D chess we got going on here. God's way more
Speaker 3: intelligent than I'll ever grasp, you know exactly.
Speaker 2: Now. I love how you put all that, and that's
Speaker 2: so true, and yeah, I love that we don't all
Speaker 2: have to agree on it. But you're right, we don't
Speaker 2: have all the answers. We don't know how many different
Speaker 2: types of these entities there are and which ones are
Speaker 2: influenced by what. But what I will tell you is this.
Speaker 2: You know, if I'm standing speaking in front of a
Speaker 2: crowd of people and I ask who here thinks it's
Speaker 2: okay to kidnap a five year old child. Who here
Speaker 2: thinks it's okay to rape a woman or a man,
Speaker 2: And here thinks it's okay to steal a child from
Speaker 2: a fetus from a woman's womb. You know who here
Speaker 2: thinks it's okay to mutilate animals and humans. It's not
Speaker 2: just cattle mutilations. Humans are mutilated to and other animals.
Speaker 2: I don't ever get anyone standing up or raising their
Speaker 2: hand so in that respect, without being dismissive of anyone
Speaker 2: else's beliefs, it kind of proves my point that these
Speaker 2: are not the ones that I have encountered, are not
Speaker 2: our benevolent space brothers. And I am not decrying what
Speaker 2: anyone else's stories are, what anyone else is saying, because
Speaker 2: those are their experiences and their stories, and I would
Speaker 2: not take that from anyone, and I would I one
Speaker 2: hundred percent respect what other people have to say and
Speaker 2: the fact that they're willing to share their experiences as well.
Speaker 2: It takes a lot of guts to do it, I
Speaker 2: know for sure, But my experiences were not benevolent space
Speaker 2: brothers from ZEA reticulate. They were very malevolent beings. They
Speaker 2: are falling angelic beings. When I call on Jesus, they
Speaker 2: backed the heck up and they leave and they know
Speaker 2: they can't be around me when I do that. And
Speaker 2: they have absolutely confirmed to me who and what they are.
Speaker 3: And I told you just here's what's up.
Speaker 2: Well, they haven't said said I'm this and such version
Speaker 2: of this and such entity that God created, but they
Speaker 2: have absolutely confirmed to me that, yes, God is their
Speaker 2: creator as well. Yes they have to obey if I
Speaker 2: call on his name. Yes there's nothing that they can
Speaker 2: do about it. Yes, they know that I'm protect did
Speaker 2: and they still are trying to convince me to come
Speaker 2: back and get involved with them. And I'm like, no,
Speaker 2: oh no, you know but absolutely so. You know, that
Speaker 2: doesn't mean that anyone else is why. It doesn't mean
Speaker 2: that anyone else is wrong. It means that this is
Speaker 2: what I am talking about, and that these are the
Speaker 2: entities that I have encountered. But I will tell you this,
Speaker 2: there were a lot of people there, a lot of
Speaker 2: other people being taken with me. When I was taken.
Speaker 2: There were humans working alongside these entities, and I listened
Speaker 2: to them be threatened not to talk and you know,
Speaker 2: you can understand. And someone gets this super fun high clearance. Hey,
Speaker 2: you're doing so great at this job. We're going to
Speaker 2: give you this new high high security clearance. But you
Speaker 2: got to sign an NDA and now you're here, and
Speaker 2: now if you say a word or this is what
Speaker 2: we're going to do, your wife, your daughter, your friend,
Speaker 2: your neighbor, your children, and then these people like me
Speaker 2: to show them what would happen to their families and
Speaker 2: their friends. And that was sick, and I wrote about that.
Speaker 2: I'm not going to go into a lot of detail,
Speaker 2: but you know, I understand why these people didn't help me.
Speaker 2: I understand why they didn't talk to me. But you know,
Speaker 2: I can't understand why someone would call this benevolent behavior
Speaker 2: because it's not.
Speaker 1: So You're down there in this like this underground factory
Speaker 1: for a better term, I mean, for a lack of
Speaker 1: a better term. Did you did you notice anybody down
Speaker 1: there that maybe looked familiar at all?
Speaker 2: Now, you know, part of the problem when you're taking
Speaker 2: is that you get this kind of sometimes not every time,
Speaker 2: but this kind of brain foggy thing, you know, so
Speaker 2: and everyone is always off going to hear going to
Speaker 2: their doing what they're doing. So when I would be
Speaker 2: in a room with like all the screen on the
Speaker 2: wall and to watching like whatever movie type thing they
Speaker 2: wanted me to watch that day. Sometimes it was like
Speaker 2: these massive floods and things like that and what have you.
Speaker 2: There would be other humans, but it was never the
Speaker 2: same ones. I don't ever remember seeing the same. The
Speaker 2: only ones I saw that were the same were my
Speaker 2: handler and some of the entities like the insect insect
Speaker 2: ones that looked like the praying man see kind of faces.
Speaker 2: They had the really big long arms that they went like, up,
Speaker 2: I can't do it with my arms to show you
Speaker 2: a bit like and then the weird hands or whatever
Speaker 2: they were appanages. They it always seemed like there was
Speaker 2: the same one in certain rooms, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: They looked never looked different. But as far as the humans,
Speaker 2: I've never necessarily run into anyone outside of there, but
Speaker 2: there are there are always people where you're like, oh,
Speaker 2: I feel like I know you. You know what I mean,
Speaker 2: when you meet someone and you're just like, I know that,
Speaker 2: I know you. I know I feel the same way.
Speaker 2: I know that I've had so many of those types
Speaker 2: of weird encounters sure, it's like why do we know
Speaker 2: each other? And it's like, you know you've spent time
Speaker 2: with someone, but you can't figure out how how you
Speaker 2: feel why you feel that way, Maybe somebody you.
Speaker 3: Knew from a past life or something like that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like exactly and except for for me, you know,
Speaker 2: I knew it wasn't that. It's just like I really
Speaker 2: know that I've spent time with this person. I'm like,
Speaker 2: how do we know each other? And we're trying to
Speaker 2: figure out how we know each other? Did we go
Speaker 2: to the same high school?
Speaker 3: No?
Speaker 2: Did we grow up in this noow. I've lived in
Speaker 2: a lot of places and I can't never find that connection.
Speaker 2: How do we know each other? You know what I mean?
Speaker 2: I've had that happen too many times for me to
Speaker 2: think it's a coincidence where we can't figure out why
Speaker 2: we know that we know each other, but we do.
Speaker 2: So I've had that kind of thing happen.
Speaker 1: From down there is what you're saying, You, Yeah, I
Speaker 1: know them from wherever?
Speaker 3: That?
Speaker 1: I mean, do you have a name for what you
Speaker 1: call down there?
Speaker 3: How was my next question or do you know where
Speaker 3: it was?
Speaker 2: This?
Speaker 3: Like contineal us? Was this like they had transported you
Speaker 3: to Africa and they went underground, Like do you even
Speaker 3: know where in the world you were? Could have been.
Speaker 2: Okay, right, Well, I know that. I mean physically, we're
Speaker 2: always just physically there with other physical people. And I
Speaker 2: know people were coming and going and speaking English. So
Speaker 2: I'm assuming it was here in America or in this
Speaker 2: continent only because and that doesn't mean it was, but
Speaker 2: just there was a lot of English speaking people, but
Speaker 2: there were also people speaking languages I didn't understand, but
Speaker 2: it seemed like there were a lot of English speaking people. Also,
Speaker 2: though I know that there was one place by the
Speaker 2: Ohio River where there were bricks, and I just remember
Speaker 2: going into that place and then somehow that leading to
Speaker 2: and I won't go back there. I won't even look
Speaker 2: for it because I can't. But so I feel like
Speaker 2: that was an entry point somewhere there. I have memories
Speaker 2: of being somewhere sandy, and then there's an entry point
Speaker 2: weird memories of different geological things. However, having said that,
Speaker 2: I don't have any specific location information except that it
Speaker 2: was just there. It was underground, it was just where
Speaker 2: I went. It was just it was just there. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I haven't called it anything really honestly, because it was
Speaker 2: where where are we going today? Well, we're going this way,
Speaker 2: or we're going to that part, or we're going to
Speaker 2: you know, the exam area, or we're going to this
Speaker 2: waiting room, where we're going to this viewing room. Where
Speaker 2: we're going to you know, there was the one that.
Speaker 3: The reason why I asked is because there is confirmed
Speaker 3: at least five hundred underground bases that the governments that
Speaker 3: are used strictly to store and house blocks of cheese. Right,
Speaker 3: there's hundreds, if not thousands of missile silos and domes
Speaker 3: deep underground military bunkers. We know about Mount Shasta and
Speaker 3: all these things. So that's why I brought up if
Speaker 3: you knew anything about the location. But it also it
Speaker 3: can be underwater. Reason why in the transportation process some
Speaker 3: of those details are a little fussy. This makes sense
Speaker 3: to me as well.
Speaker 2: It does. And the thing is too, they're so big
Speaker 2: and so much connected, and the way it was traveling
Speaker 2: when it was taken, when I would get to the elevators,
Speaker 2: when they would take me there but didn't want me
Speaker 2: to see, you know, they don't want you to know
Speaker 2: where you're going to a certain point and then because
Speaker 2: that would just there would not be good obviously, But
Speaker 2: it's so huge, I mean it could cover I don't know.
Speaker 2: I mean it literally could cover from underground to underwater,
Speaker 2: underground to another continent. You know, I hadn't because there
Speaker 2: were these the trains that I would get on, you know,
Speaker 2: if these high speed rails, I had no idea how
Speaker 2: far they went or where they went. But you know
Speaker 2: there are the sky's limit as far as the underground selimit.
Speaker 2: I guess as far as it was going. But you
Speaker 2: know they're huge. I mean the just mazes of hallways
Speaker 2: and stuff. If I didn't have a handler and someone
Speaker 2: just let me go, I mean, who knows how lost
Speaker 2: I could have gotten.
Speaker 1: Now, how old were you the last time you were
Speaker 1: taken to one of these places? Or how long ago
Speaker 1: was it?
Speaker 2: Yeah, it wasn't very long ago. The last time was
Speaker 2: only about was after my near death experience. But after
Speaker 2: that then I or was it yeah, it was right after.
Speaker 2: It wasn't long after that. I was about a year
Speaker 2: after that maybe.
Speaker 3: If that so seven years ago?
Speaker 2: Yeah, about seven years ago, and and then that's when
Speaker 2: I I, you know, I just I won't go into
Speaker 2: how that all happened. But that's when I did find
Speaker 2: my way back and to my faith, and all of
Speaker 2: a sudden, God just it's like turned on all these
Speaker 2: lights for me, and it was just like I get it.
Speaker 2: I know what it is, I know what to do.
Speaker 2: And the first time I stood up to them, it
Speaker 2: was so amazing and incredible and I was free. I
Speaker 2: was free. And I had last attacks after that where
Speaker 2: they've tried to come back and they have not not tried.
Speaker 2: They have tried to come back over and over again.
Speaker 2: They can't cross my threshold. I've broken all threshold covenant.
Speaker 2: I've learned a lot about that stuff from my friend
Speaker 2: Vicki joy Anderson, who you guys should talk to you sometimes.
Speaker 2: She's amazing, but she helped me a lot with that,
Speaker 2: with agreements I made that I didn't know I made,
Speaker 2: with covenants I made I didn't know I made. And
Speaker 2: then there were astral as well, where my handler came back.
Speaker 2: It was about a year ago. It was an astral
Speaker 2: and we went back into an area of the underground
Speaker 2: where it's very like carved out of stone, and it's
Speaker 2: an area been familiar with. It's been there. I don't
Speaker 2: know how many maybe hundreds of times, who knows, but
Speaker 2: as an area I was really familiar with, but it
Speaker 2: was there an astral So it was really weird because
Speaker 2: I've always been there physically, and I knew I wasn't
Speaker 2: physically there but I was okay, and I knew God
Speaker 2: was letting it happen for a reason. I just didn't
Speaker 2: know what it was, and because I have since learned that. Anyway,
Speaker 2: So we're there and he is has some of me.
Speaker 2: He wanted me to be there and he wanted he
Speaker 2: was begging me to come back, and he looked terrible.
Speaker 2: He looked sick. He looked like he was dying. He
Speaker 2: looked like this flat met almost brownish green color. He
Speaker 2: was so I've never seen the detail on his face
Speaker 2: before because he was always almost shining, and I saw
Speaker 2: every crease line down the middle and across his forehead
Speaker 2: and just every weird detail that I had never noticed before.
Speaker 2: And maybe I was seeing him through different eyes as well.
Speaker 2: There is also that possibility. But he really tried to
Speaker 2: pull on my sense of wanting to save everything, Like
Speaker 2: if there's an animal that needs to be saved, I'm
Speaker 2: going to save it if it needs a home, I'm
Speaker 2: going to take care of it, same with a child
Speaker 2: or an adult or anybody. I'm just one of those rescuers.
Speaker 2: And he was really trying to take advantage of that
Speaker 2: and utilize that on me to try to get me
Speaker 2: too and I and try to trick me into doing
Speaker 2: something that would have been detrimental to me. And so
Speaker 2: I just went back to my faith and I said, look,
Speaker 2: you know, if you can admit that Jesus is, you know,
Speaker 2: God here on earth in the flesh, and came to
Speaker 2: do this and then you know, and went through my
Speaker 2: and that was it.
Speaker 3: So have you done any research as to why this
Speaker 3: creature looked different this last go round?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 3: So I'm not saying this for sure because I don't
Speaker 3: know all the ins and outs of your story and
Speaker 3: of your life. That being said, I know from personal
Speaker 3: experience and also research that I have done into demonic entities,
Speaker 3: the what's the name of the book, the Big Grimoire
Speaker 3: that's like the basically demonic Bible and you name it.
Speaker 3: I've delved into it, just not to dive into because
Speaker 3: I was into it to dive into it for research,
Speaker 3: Like strictly the reason why he looked so old and frail,
Speaker 3: and all of that was because he was weak and
Speaker 3: starving and dying. Uh, not physically dying, because we know
Speaker 3: these creatures don't do that, more like his connection to
Speaker 3: you was dying. These entities, from what I have found,
Speaker 3: they feed off of fear for a lot of people.
Speaker 3: That's why children always see these shadow creatures or whatever
Speaker 3: that terrify them. And these entities feed off of fear
Speaker 3: literally like its food. Some of them go for a
Speaker 3: different approach. Yeah, there's demons do demonic shit, demonic ways,
Speaker 3: that's how they get down. But from the research that
Speaker 3: I've done, Also random question, but also very curious, did
Speaker 3: you notice a change in eye color for Mere Handler
Speaker 3: at any given point in your exposure to him?
Speaker 2: Oh? Definitely.
Speaker 3: What color eyes did they have? Give me the whole rundown.
Speaker 2: It go from these almost icy blue eyes to a
Speaker 2: golden to brown, and then the black would go this
Speaker 2: way or this way. It was so weird. I mean,
Speaker 2: the eyes were what freaked me out the most. But
Speaker 2: the last time they were almost this like a dirty
Speaker 2: gold color like flex in there, like flexi brown and gold.
Speaker 2: It was just it's just and he said he needed
Speaker 2: to be physically with me to heal him, because I'm like,
Speaker 2: I'm not your savior. I'm not the person who can
Speaker 2: heal you. You know, That's not how I'm doing this. It's
Speaker 2: not how I'm living my life anymore, you know. So
Speaker 2: I didn't have to be afraid, which was really wild
Speaker 2: because I finally had myself put to that test where
Speaker 2: we were face to face again. Because it had been
Speaker 2: a long time, and I've had them outside my window,
Speaker 2: I've had them out there somewhere and in the skies
Speaker 2: and stuff, and I always feel them when they're around
Speaker 2: the entities in general. But this is the first time
Speaker 2: he ever, Yeah, this closed face to face, and I
Speaker 2: wasn't scared.
Speaker 1: So whenever you're whenever you know you're you're talking to
Speaker 1: this demon or reptilian or handle or whatever he is,
Speaker 1: and you're saying like, I'm not your savior, I'm not
Speaker 1: going to be the one to save you, like you
Speaker 1: think you need me, and you're you're telling them about,
Speaker 1: you know, whatever your faith is, whether it's Jesus God, whatever,
Speaker 1: And at any point in time, do you think that
Speaker 1: he kind of got a little bit more curious and
Speaker 1: wanted to know a little bit more, or do you think.
Speaker 1: Do you think that these demons they just laugh at
Speaker 1: the whole idea about being saved by God? Is it
Speaker 1: like a joke to them?
Speaker 2: They know more about our Christian Bible than anyone I've
Speaker 2: ever met. They know it forwards and backwards literally, because
Speaker 2: they know how the story ends front to back. They
Speaker 2: know everything we're thinking. They know everything that's in that
Speaker 2: book and more. They are so much more well versed
Speaker 2: in it. There's nothing I can could say that would
Speaker 2: shed any light on anything for them. And there it's
Speaker 2: unbelievable how much they know. But don't get in a
Speaker 2: quote in contest with them. I'll tell you that.
Speaker 3: Well, I mean they were there, you know what I mean,
Speaker 3: when the book was being written and when the events
Speaker 3: were actually taking place. They were like, you know, physically there.
Speaker 2: So and the only you know, yeah, I mean it's
Speaker 2: just you know, we have all these different interpretations and
Speaker 2: versions and stuff like that, and they're all just like, no,
Speaker 2: they they know they know better than we do.
Speaker 3: So I'm gonna be honest with you talking about the
Speaker 3: eye color thing for a minute. So the research that
Speaker 3: I did, my demonic entity had gold eyes for the
Speaker 3: majority of my life. Now that was. I'm not saying
Speaker 3: he was some sort of a general in the Demonic
Speaker 3: Army by any means, but at least somebody with a
Speaker 3: little bit of stroke. He had a little bit of
Speaker 3: power behind him and could actually do some things. The
Speaker 3: last time that he presented himself to me, he had
Speaker 3: red eyes, but they weren't like a bright red. They
Speaker 3: were like a very dark I don't want to say maroon,
Speaker 3: but very a dark, dark red, very muted tone. The
Speaker 3: research that I did basically meant that that at that time, anyway,
Speaker 3: that demon had dropped a level. Now I don't know
Speaker 3: if that's like a rank. I don't know if that's
Speaker 3: a power level. I don't know to what degree that meant,
Speaker 3: but he had taken he had been brought down a
Speaker 3: Pegger two. And again I don't even know if that's
Speaker 3: because of me or because he was doing a lot
Speaker 3: of shit to other people and collectively he had lost
Speaker 3: his loss himself. I don't know. I don't know. But
Speaker 3: blue eyes, now that's interesting. I don't know much about
Speaker 3: blue eyed demons what I and I know if you
Speaker 3: look any of this up on Google, you're gonna find
Speaker 3: anything about the Ice King game of thrones, all the shit.
Speaker 3: If I'm not mistaken, and I could be, I'm going
Speaker 3: to do research when we wrap this episode, I promise you,
Speaker 3: because this is interesting. If I'm not mistaken, a blue
Speaker 3: eyed demon is some how could I put this because
Speaker 3: it's not the only terms I could use, their human terms.
Speaker 3: So it's very difficult to explain what I'm trying to explain.
Speaker 2: Well careful too, because he wasn't a demon, he was
Speaker 2: a fallen angelic being demons angels?
Speaker 3: Is that not literally the same thing?
Speaker 2: Well not according to well not according to what I've experienced,
Speaker 2: it not according to our biblical no, because.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we've had people on that's come on and said
Speaker 1: that same thing, that demons and fallen angels are not
Speaker 1: the same thing.
Speaker 2: They're angels are demonic, and you can call them demons.
Speaker 2: That's fine, but it's a misnomer because demons are the
Speaker 2: disembodied spirits of the nepheline because when they died, when
Speaker 2: they were first taken out in the flood, and then
Speaker 2: after that, God said, you're neither of heaven or of earth.
Speaker 2: There is no to go. So these are the ones
Speaker 2: that inhabit the little grays, the ones that tried inhabit
Speaker 2: people that Jesus cast out of the guys and went
Speaker 2: into the pigs. So yeah, I mean demons, and if
Speaker 2: they're in a body, then the eye color can change
Speaker 2: for sure. I was just asking for clarity more for myself.
Speaker 3: No, no, I'm with you, and I think I kind
Speaker 3: of group them all into the demon or demonic realm,
Speaker 3: because yes, the nephileine, the disembodied souls of what was
Speaker 3: once a walking Nephileine, Yes, they can't go up or down.
Speaker 3: But I think because their parentage is of those fallen angels,
Speaker 3: I just kind of lump them all in under the
Speaker 3: same term. So my apologies for the misnumber.
Speaker 2: Oh no, I was just trying to con for myself
Speaker 2: clarify what if we're talking about the same thing or not?
Speaker 1: Okay, okay, so the whole same idea behind like the devil, Lucifer,
Speaker 1: and Satan. Are they all three different entities? Are they
Speaker 1: all the same thing? Well, we maybe they all kind
Speaker 1: of act the same, so we group them in the
Speaker 1: same thing.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of opinions on that as well well.
Speaker 2: But then as a different terminology. So I'm just trying
Speaker 2: to clarify for myself too, So please don't think I was.
Speaker 2: I hope that I'm sorry.
Speaker 3: But then there's also different there's different literature on that
Speaker 3: topic as well, different ones that are been verified in
Speaker 3: fact checks and all the things, and experts in these
Speaker 3: fields cannot stop agreeing with X or Y, even though
Speaker 3: they're conflicting and like all the things, all the things.
Speaker 3: But it depends on what source you're looking at. Okay.
Speaker 3: So a lot of people believe that, yes, Satan was
Speaker 3: cast out, a third of the angelic body was cast
Speaker 3: out with him. All of these creatures fell to earth.
Speaker 3: All of these creatures became demons, tried to come to
Speaker 3: Earth corrupt God's creation. We got the nephil from it,
Speaker 3: all these things. Yes, yes, yes, and they just kind
Speaker 3: of throw it in. Other people believe something more along
Speaker 3: the lines of a Paradise Lost. Have you ever heard
Speaker 3: or read that book?
Speaker 2: Milton?
Speaker 3: Yeah, Milton, you know it. Okay, So, yes, they were
Speaker 3: all cast but only like you know, Satan and nine
Speaker 3: of his top dogs were like actually like among the
Speaker 3: it's so, and then you got the whole Dante Allegary's
Speaker 3: version of everything. So it's like you have so many
Speaker 3: different opinions of things. So again, just to my knowledge
Speaker 3: and background, you're saying that this was not a demon
Speaker 3: that was attached to you. You're saying that it was
Speaker 3: the disembodied soul of a once nepheline.
Speaker 2: No, I'm.
Speaker 3: Okay, I'm sorry, I'm sorry I misunderstood.
Speaker 2: So, and that is for them as angels, yeah, whatever
Speaker 2: you want to call them. But it was just it
Speaker 2: wasn't disembodied. It was fully in its body that it
Speaker 2: had always had, and it was a fallen entitate whatever
Speaker 2: you want to call it.
Speaker 1: So, quite literally a sexy beast.
Speaker 3: Dare I say there, didn't you?
Speaker 2: Because yes, quite literally, I did, unfortunately have a Stockholm
Speaker 2: syndrome type attachment to him for a very long time. Wow.
Speaker 1: And that I have one more question for you, and
Speaker 1: I'm and it's something that like you know, because you
Speaker 1: say that you're you're being taken physically, right, okay. So,
Speaker 1: and that's another reason why I asked, when was the
Speaker 1: most recent time now in all of these events that
Speaker 1: you're being taken? Did you have anybody else sleeping in
Speaker 1: the bed with you? Was your husband there with you?
Speaker 1: Were your kids ever there with you? Did they ever
Speaker 1: realize that you ever left the room.
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh yeah, there were other people there and they
Speaker 2: would be in this crazy sleep state where nothing I
Speaker 2: did would rouse them. There was one time when I
Speaker 2: was driving in a car with a friend of mine
Speaker 2: and it was like this horrible, out of nowhere lightning
Speaker 2: storm comes up, all the lights in the cargo out
Speaker 2: car goes, you know, off to the side of the road,
Speaker 2: and we're like power outage. I write about this in
Speaker 2: the book because it was so weird. You know, we
Speaker 2: made a funny comment that made no sense whatsoever. Next thing,
Speaker 2: you know, we're driving down the road on our way home.
Speaker 2: I don't even know how much time passed. We never
Speaker 2: spoke of it. So in that occasion, I'm you know,
Speaker 2: guessing that he was taken us with me. But when
Speaker 2: I had my husband or someone in the bed with me,
Speaker 2: they would just be how cold, like just dead to
Speaker 2: the world, no way to rouse them when and on
Speaker 2: occasion I would just make my current husband he wakes
Speaker 2: up for anything. I would just you know, try to
Speaker 2: get him to nothing, no response whatsoever.
Speaker 1: Do you ever think about like putting a camera in
Speaker 1: the room.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I just don't like the idea fall asleep with
Speaker 2: a camera on me. Yeah no, but yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: I guess that would have been a good idea in retrospect,
Speaker 2: but I never really thought about doing that.
Speaker 1: Now, Well, these things are few and far between, aren't they?
Speaker 1: Like how often are these happening? Like every six months
Speaker 1: or a year, every couple of years.
Speaker 2: When I was little, it seemed like it was happening
Speaker 2: all the time, But really looking back on it, it's
Speaker 2: not as frequent as that, because you know, you're thinking
Speaker 2: back on a lifetime and you know, maybe it's once
Speaker 2: a month, maybe it's twice a month, you know, as
Speaker 2: an adult, certainly, yeah, not. It just depended like if
Speaker 2: they were doing a insemination type thing and there was
Speaker 2: going to be a series of events, and it did
Speaker 2: seem very cyclical, Like, yeah, there were definitely seasons of
Speaker 2: my life or times in my life where it was
Speaker 2: happening a lot more often. So then it would get
Speaker 2: to a point where it just when you give yourself
Speaker 2: the permission to separate this part of your life from
Speaker 2: that part, the thought of putting a video camera or
Speaker 2: something to capture them doesn't really cross your mind because
Speaker 2: you've already separated your day to day life from what's happening,
Speaker 2: and so for me, when I just split from that,
Speaker 2: for lack of a better word, I really did. I mean,
Speaker 2: knowing it was happening, knowing they were there, and knowing
Speaker 2: it was coming, being frightened all the time, that's one thing.
Speaker 2: But then allowing myself to think logically about what to
Speaker 2: do about it, But that's bringing it in.
Speaker 1: And I was in a different world at that point.
Speaker 2: It is, and I wasn't willing to bring it in
Speaker 2: to my life anymore. It's too hard, you know, as
Speaker 2: too hard as it was. But then to have to
Speaker 2: think logically about it meant meant that I really would
Speaker 2: be forced to look at it, and I didn't want to.
Speaker 1: So I want to ask you this, and I wish
Speaker 1: that we can go longer. We have another show coming
Speaker 1: up here in like a half an hour or else
Speaker 1: we would extend this bad Boy four hours, but that
Speaker 1: only opens the door for another show.
Speaker 2: I only last for so long anyway, So yes, we
Speaker 2: can definitely continue this another time.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, Okay, great, But one last question I have for
Speaker 1: you so and you might not even remember this, this
Speaker 1: is I get it. Whenever you would have these let's
Speaker 1: just call them sessions where you're going to another place
Speaker 1: and being abducted by these entities. Do you recall the
Speaker 1: the state of mind that you were in. Were you
Speaker 1: in a fearful state of mind before you went to bed?
Speaker 1: Was it a shitty day leading up to this? Were
Speaker 1: there bad things that were going on in your life
Speaker 1: that would essentially open the door for something like this
Speaker 1: to happen.
Speaker 3: Good question.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there were a lot of things that opened doorways
Speaker 2: for this in my life. There were Masons in my family.
Speaker 2: I myself was inducted into the Rainbow Girls, which is
Speaker 2: the young young girl version.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's the kid version of the Eastern Star, very
Speaker 3: similar being the kid version of the Masons.
Speaker 2: Yeah, my mom and dad were Eastern Star in d Malay.
Speaker 2: My grandfather was a very high level Mason. They were
Speaker 2: members of my family who dabbled in some of the
Speaker 2: darker arts and things like that. You know, there'd be
Speaker 2: a Weegi board. My dad was completely against those things,
Speaker 2: let me tell you right now, but they still find
Speaker 2: their way in and so they were all all kinds
Speaker 2: of things. I could read cards from the day I
Speaker 2: could pick up a deck of cards. I could read
Speaker 2: minds from the day. I could look at somebody I
Speaker 2: could tell you what was going to happen. Premonitions abounded
Speaker 2: on me. I mean just all kinds of stuff like that,
Speaker 2: you know, sleepovers, when you'd have slumber parties and everyone
Speaker 2: would do seances, things I could put my fingers under someone, and.
Speaker 3: That seemed to be a whole thing with girl slumber parties.
Speaker 3: I feel like it's like a rite of pass. It's
Speaker 3: kind of like the whole Bloody Mary and the Mirror thing,
Speaker 3: like that's the thing the kids do. Apparently, little girl
Speaker 3: sleepover is like, why is a feather stiff as a
Speaker 3: board just happens?
Speaker 2: Yeah, it must have come with a manual. I don't know,
Speaker 2: because that was like every single one. Yeah, And then
Speaker 2: I got to the point where I wouldn't even go
Speaker 2: near it because when one little girl actually gets lifted
Speaker 2: up the floor, everyone starts screaming and crying and everyone
Speaker 2: goes home, and it's not the slumber party you want
Speaker 2: to have with your girlfriends when you're seven years old.
Speaker 2: So you she was just saying, so you know, and
Speaker 2: every actually expects it to happen. I will say that
Speaker 2: as well.
Speaker 3: Right, everybody thinks secretly that it's a joke. And nothing's
Speaker 3: going to happen until they make a kid levitate, and it's.
Speaker 2: Like, okay, someone levitates and she starts crying, and then
Speaker 2: everyone gets in trouble.
Speaker 3: And then you got called the moms and they're wondering
Speaker 3: what kind of demonic house they let their daughters sleep.
Speaker 3: It's a whole thing, especially in the Bible building.
Speaker 2: All right, Oh yeah, and then it's do you way
Speaker 2: more than a duck or rocks or whatever? Three small
Speaker 2: rocks or whatever.
Speaker 3: So it's.
Speaker 1: So you were you were basically kind of raised around dark, crazy,
Speaker 1: wild things. I mean, growing up as in the Rainbow
Speaker 1: Grills and your parents being involved in the Masons and
Speaker 1: stuff like that, and seances and tarot cards and psychic
Speaker 1: readings and whenever you look back. I hate that I'm
Speaker 1: even the person that has to ask this question, but
Speaker 1: I mean, are those all kind of powers of the devil?
Speaker 3: In your opinion?
Speaker 2: Well, there are certainly things that are forbidden because you know,
Speaker 2: because they are you're going back into. It's not that
Speaker 2: they're forbidden because we can't do them. It's not that
Speaker 2: we're there forbidden because they're not possible. They're forbidden because
Speaker 2: when we start opening these doorways and interacting with these
Speaker 2: entities that are stronger and more intelligent and more aware
Speaker 2: and have the ability to manipulate space, time, matter, energy
Speaker 2: and see and understand things that we can't. It's like
Speaker 2: putting a puppy and alliance Dan, we're defenseless. There's a
Speaker 2: reason we're told not to do it. Not because God
Speaker 2: doesn't want us to have any fun or win the
Speaker 2: lottery or whatever people might do with it. It's because
Speaker 2: it's dangerous for us and we're not equipped for that,
Speaker 2: and we're dealing with entities that He knows how much
Speaker 2: stronger they are than we are and how much more capable.
Speaker 3: So it also kills them that people acknowledge that power corrupts.
Speaker 3: But then they want to go fuck with entities that
Speaker 3: are far more powerful than they can even comprehend. And
Speaker 3: that's like a positive thing, oh, because they're good guys.
Speaker 3: Like hmm.
Speaker 2: People enjoy scaring themselves with things like content houses and
Speaker 2: all these other things where they're encountering these these entities
Speaker 2: that are clearly scary, you know, and watching scary movies
Speaker 2: and doing these other things because they know it exists,
Speaker 2: but they don't really want to admit it. Or admit
Speaker 2: that the power that it possesses or the danger that
Speaker 2: it can put a person in. So yeah, I was
Speaker 2: definitely opening portals left and right. Others were opening those
Speaker 2: portals for me. Somewhere along the line, someone gave permission
Speaker 2: for me to be taken. And whether it was something
Speaker 2: as simple as the creata treaty, or whether it was
Speaker 2: something as complex as my grandfather putting me up as
Speaker 2: his sacrificial thing or whatever, you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: who knows. I have no idea who gave what permissions,
Speaker 2: but quite a few of them. I quite likely just
Speaker 2: gave myself right and unknowingly or knowingly but not realizing
Speaker 2: how dangerous it was, just thinking it was fun. Yeah,
Speaker 2: the same, It's just the Oigi board. It's just fun.
Speaker 2: And no, playing with the Wigi board doesn't mean you're
Speaker 2: automatically opening yourself up to being abducted or taken or
Speaker 2: opening a portal. No, but you don't want to take
Speaker 2: the chances, especially if you've got friends and family and
Speaker 2: loved ones. If you got children, you got your dog,
Speaker 2: anyone you love that's also vulnerable, you're going to put
Speaker 2: them in harm's way too. And we have to think
Speaker 2: about others, not just ourselves. And that's not something I realized,
Speaker 2: but it's something I've since learned. You know that regardless
Speaker 2: of who opened those portals, open those doorways, gave those permissions,
Speaker 2: I was able to ask for those things to be closed,
Speaker 2: to be negated, to be ended on my behalf and
Speaker 2: I had but I had to do that, you know,
Speaker 2: and because it's me and it's affecting me, and it
Speaker 2: can affect others. So that was my responsibility and that's
Speaker 2: how I was able to stop it and to free
Speaker 2: myself from this lifetime of of just terrifying abduction experiences.
Speaker 1: Well, Aaron, we we appreciate all the time that you've
Speaker 1: come to spend here with us very insightful information. I mean,
Speaker 1: the the experiences that you have on multiple occasions. And
Speaker 1: I'm sure we barely even graze the surface, to be
Speaker 1: honest with you, because there's certain things that you just
Speaker 1: said in that last sentence. I was like, well, what what?
Speaker 1: What I need to know more? But we'll we'll make
Speaker 1: this a whole series. It'll it'll definitely we'll cover as
Speaker 1: much as we possibly could. I don't I don't care
Speaker 1: how many episodes it takes we love having you, we
Speaker 1: love talking to you, and anybody that wants to be
Speaker 1: able to find any of your information or reach out
Speaker 1: to you look into your book. Where where would they
Speaker 1: be able to find that information?
Speaker 2: Okay, well thanks? First of all, I love you guys too.
Speaker 2: Just sit and talk with you, guys. Has been so
Speaker 2: easy this time flew by and yes there's we just
Speaker 2: scratched the surface. But I will come back anytime because
Speaker 2: it is so fun and easy to talk to you guys.
Speaker 2: I feel like I've actually laughed more tonight than I
Speaker 2: have ever in another interview, so that is great because
Speaker 2: this is not easy subject material to talk about, so
Speaker 2: thank you for that. You can find me. My website
Speaker 2: is Karen Wilkinson author dot com. I'll give you all
Speaker 2: this for the show notes or you should have it,
Speaker 2: and from there you can find links to everything. But
Speaker 2: the book is available exclusively at Lamarzuli dot dot net.
Speaker 2: That's l A m A r z U l l
Speaker 2: i dot net. Links to that are also on my
Speaker 2: website and on my social media Facebook and Instagram. It's
Speaker 2: just under my name. On Facebook It's Karen Wilkinson and
Speaker 2: on Instagram it's Karen Wilkinson author. I don't know why
Speaker 2: I couldn't get the same and all of those have
Speaker 2: links to each other. So if you want to reach
Speaker 2: out to me, please don't hesitate. There's a contact page
Speaker 2: on my website. I will get back to you, not
Speaker 2: always right away. I get a lot of messages and
Speaker 2: I do take the time to go through each one
Speaker 2: myself and respond myself, so it does take time, but
Speaker 2: I will get back to your promin it's just really busy.
Speaker 2: I will be at the I'll be in Orlando at
Speaker 2: the Prophecy Watchers conference end of I don't know when
Speaker 2: this is coming out, so that'll be the end of
Speaker 2: February beginning of March, and then I'll have more events
Speaker 2: on my website very soon as soon as I have
Speaker 2: everything else confirmed. There's a bunch of events coming up
Speaker 2: this year that I will be at. I love to
Speaker 2: meet people at events. Just sign copies of the book,
Speaker 2: talk to people, meet people, talk about what their experiences are,
Speaker 2: and just you know, share with each other and just
Speaker 2: have an opportunity to talk and meet people is probably
Speaker 2: the best part of this. So please reach out to
Speaker 2: me if you're looking to just share your story or
Speaker 2: want to just have someone with something in common don't hesitate.
Speaker 1: Absolutely well, look, we appreciate it so much. This was
Speaker 1: so much fun and like I said, can't wait to
Speaker 1: do it again, but until next time, this was another
Speaker 1: beautiful episode of the Cult of Conspiracy. And my name's
Speaker 1: Jonathan Drake and there's one very important, extremely vital piece
Speaker 1: of information we need you to learn just as soon
Speaker 1: as humanly possible. Open up that third