WEBVTT

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<v Speaker 1>Ahway, it's that guy who asked to pet your dog

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<v Speaker 1>but doesn't realize how much you want to talk to

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<v Speaker 1>him about your dog's likes and dislikes and hopes and dreams.

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<v Speaker 1>Alley Ward back with another spooky episode of ologies. So

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<v Speaker 1>I've been justshed up a whole month of darkish, pumpkiny topics.

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<v Speaker 1>And if you've missed out this October, y'all, there are

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<v Speaker 1>episodes on skeletons, we talk about body farms, we got

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<v Speaker 1>one on spiderwebs, one on pumpkins that'll warm your whole heart,

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<v Speaker 1>and now this one is just right on the nose. Demons,

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<v Speaker 1>evil spirits, creepy mean beings. Let's get into it, but

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<v Speaker 1>before we do, a few business items up top. Number one.

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<v Speaker 1>If you're in LA and you're hearing this before Friday,

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<v Speaker 1>October twenty fifth, come you hang out in a park

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<v Speaker 1>and learn about squids with me and Sarah McNaulty, who

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<v Speaker 1>is our squid expert touthologist, Silverlike Meadow, six point thirty pm, Friday,

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<v Speaker 1>October twenty fifth, Free. We're just gonna be hang out

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<v Speaker 1>in a park talking about science. There's an event bright

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<v Speaker 1>link in the show notes with more info. Also pay

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<v Speaker 1>birthday to Fancy Nancy aka my mom, who taught you

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<v Speaker 1>how to fall asleep better. We all love you, Fancy Nancy.

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<v Speaker 1>Also thank you to everyone supporting the podcast on patreon

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<v Speaker 1>dot com, slash ologies and submitting your questions. Thank you

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<v Speaker 1>to everyone wearing Ologies merch and tagging your photos with

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<v Speaker 1>oligi'es merch. Thanks to everyone making sure that you're subscribed

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<v Speaker 1>and reading the podcast and telling friends, and of course

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<v Speaker 1>the folks leaving reviews. You know that I read them

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<v Speaker 1>so that I can pick afresheet every week, such as

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<v Speaker 1>for example, Eggs ten eighty nine, who says crushed Nana's

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<v Speaker 1>dinner Convo, says, today I wowed my fam with so

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<v Speaker 1>much Spiderweb knowledge and pitched the podcast so hard. I

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<v Speaker 1>told them they can all expect Ologies Merch for Christmas.

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<v Speaker 1>Thank you for inspiring me to slow my life down

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<v Speaker 1>and take genuine interest in things I never thought I would.

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<v Speaker 1>This podcast is pure gold. Eggs ten eighty nine, Thank you,

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<v Speaker 1>Thank you Nana for me. Okay, let's descend into the

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<v Speaker 1>bowels of human culture and consciousness, around the darkest corners

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<v Speaker 1>of fear and trickery, and delve into demons which come

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<v Speaker 1>by the way from a root meaning a lesser spirit,

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<v Speaker 1>which comes from an earlier route meaning to divide. And yes,

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<v Speaker 1>demonology is a thing. So this ologist and I agreed

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<v Speaker 1>to meet remotely at an ungodly hour of seven am.

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<v Speaker 1>We hopped on the phone. We each recorded our audio.

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<v Speaker 1>So the sound might be just a wee bit different

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<v Speaker 1>than usual, just attributed to a demon. It's fine. So

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<v Speaker 1>this all. Just got a bachelor's in religious studies, a

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<v Speaker 1>master's in theology and religion, and a PhD in religion

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<v Speaker 1>with a thesis about the neo pagan Internet community, and

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<v Speaker 1>is now an assistant professor in religious studies at West

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<v Speaker 1>Virginia University. She teaches courses on the history of witches

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<v Speaker 1>and demon hunts and fear and historical heresy. So we

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<v Speaker 1>hopped on the phone. We gap about ghosts and gargoyles

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<v Speaker 1>and possessions and myths and horror films and psychology and

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<v Speaker 1>Halloween costumes and cross cultural spookiness and dear old demons

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<v Speaker 1>and devils. So light a candle and watcherback for the

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<v Speaker 1>historical wisdom of religious studies. Professor and demonologist, doctor Alissa Biel,

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<v Speaker 1>So you are a demonologist, Yes, I.

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<v Speaker 2>Guess sort of, I study people who study demons. Haws

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<v Speaker 2>that I don't study the demons themselves.

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<v Speaker 1>I think it explains why it's hard to find an

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<v Speaker 1>actual demonologist who is perhaps incredible in their field, right,

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<v Speaker 1>I think.

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<v Speaker 2>Like a practicing demonologist might be difficult. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there's like one out there in her Twitter account

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<v Speaker 1>was suspended for unknown reasons, and I was like, oh, dear,

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<v Speaker 1>there's a lot of them. But how long have you

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<v Speaker 1>studied people who study demons?

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<v Speaker 2>About twenty years now. I guess it started when I

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<v Speaker 2>was in grad school. I got very interested in just

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<v Speaker 2>concept of magic and witchcraft historically a lot of Inquisition

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<v Speaker 2>era stuff, and it sort of went from there. I

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<v Speaker 2>started teaching a class on magic and witchcraft, which people

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<v Speaker 2>also thought was sort of a practicum. They thought they

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<v Speaker 2>were going to learn spells. They were very disappointed when

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<v Speaker 2>they found out they weren't. So yeah, about twenty years

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<v Speaker 2>back at Syracuse, I started studying it.

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<v Speaker 1>What got you into it before it became academic? Like,

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<v Speaker 1>what kind of a kid were you?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh? Crazy? Absolutely? I tell a story all the time.

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<v Speaker 2>One of my friends remembers this. I got in trouble

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<v Speaker 2>on the playground because I told some of the other

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<v Speaker 2>kids in grade school that I was talking to Athena

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<v Speaker 2>and I wasn't. It wasn't, let's make that clear, but

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<v Speaker 2>I was pretending that I was, and they got a

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<v Speaker 2>little nervous about that.

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<v Speaker 1>So Alyssa's parents were avid traveler and she developed an

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<v Speaker 1>appetite for world history and religion pretty early. So, well,

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<v Speaker 1>your thing is a kid may have been like micro

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<v Speaker 1>machines are hopping a skippet in the driveway. Doctor Beale's

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<v Speaker 1>thing was ancient Greece, and apparently her school administrators did

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<v Speaker 1>not appreciate her tall tales about talking to ancient deities.

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<v Speaker 1>So what happened when you got called them to the

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<v Speaker 1>principal's office for this?

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<v Speaker 2>I think at first they were just trying to make

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<v Speaker 2>sure that I didn't need medical advice. Yeah, but they

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<v Speaker 2>just basically told me to stop scaring the other kids

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<v Speaker 2>and stop telling them that I was having conversations with

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<v Speaker 2>ancient gods. So I did mine.

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<v Speaker 1>What did your parents think of it? Were they like,

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<v Speaker 1>she's our kid?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, yeah, They weren't terribly upset about it. They

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<v Speaker 2>thought it was pretty funny actually at the time. So, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>I was the kid who started playing D and D

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<v Speaker 2>when she was like ten or so. So that gives

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<v Speaker 2>you some idea of my personality as a child, I think. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>So when it came to getting on an academic path,

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<v Speaker 1>did you realize that you could do this as a

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<v Speaker 1>job or what was your first intro into it academically?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh gosh, I would say I had no idea of

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<v Speaker 2>what I was going to do. I actually started out

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<v Speaker 2>in polysci and journalism. That was what I was going

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<v Speaker 2>to college for, and I ended up taking a really

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<v Speaker 2>horrible anthropology class on magic, and I just sort of

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<v Speaker 2>fell in love with the topic and it was just

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<v Speaker 2>one of those things where you find something out of

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<v Speaker 2>the blue that you really really enjoy and it sort

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<v Speaker 2>of brings together all of the different things that you love.

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<v Speaker 2>So I YEA had no clue I would end up here.

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<v Speaker 1>What exactly is a demon versus like a goblin versus

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<v Speaker 1>bad ju ju?

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<v Speaker 2>Like?

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<v Speaker 1>Do youon even define?

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<v Speaker 2>If you go all the way back, like into ancient Greece?

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<v Speaker 2>They are not necessarily evil. You might just think of

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<v Speaker 2>them more like they're not spirits because they have form,

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<v Speaker 2>but they're not necessarily evil creatures. So have you ever

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<v Speaker 2>read The Golden compass. No, oh, okay, it's this great fiction,

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<v Speaker 2>great book. It's sort of a kid's book, but it's

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit higher end than that.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's about demons.

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<v Speaker 2>It's about demons, yes, and they're good for their people.

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<v Speaker 2>They're sort of attached to people and they're very very

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<v Speaker 2>good creatures as long as the people are good. And

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<v Speaker 2>demons are originally kind of like that. But when you

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<v Speaker 2>get into monotheism, all of those kinds of creatures get

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<v Speaker 2>turned into bad things.

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<v Speaker 1>So how far back do you think the notion of

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<v Speaker 1>a spirit who was like mischievous, who had form? How

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<v Speaker 1>far back does that go? What are the first instances

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<v Speaker 1>of that in writing or in drawing?

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<v Speaker 2>Wow, that's a big question. Yeah, sorry, Yeah, no, I'm

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<v Speaker 2>sort of flipping three things in my head. Definitely ancient

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<v Speaker 2>Greece and I would think in some forms ancient Egypt

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<v Speaker 2>as well. So that's about as far back as we

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<v Speaker 2>can really get in some ways textually, at least.

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<v Speaker 1>So even before written history, demon idols were in effect, y'all.

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<v Speaker 1>Like they found an eleven thousand year old mouth, a

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<v Speaker 1>gape human face carved in a plank of wood. A

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<v Speaker 1>few gold prospectors discovered it in a Siberian peak bog.

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<v Speaker 1>They thought it was a lot younger than it was,

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<v Speaker 1>didn't really realize what a big deal it was, and

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<v Speaker 1>that it was worth more than its weight in the

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<v Speaker 1>gold they were looking for. Oops, that's just a demon

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<v Speaker 1>screwing with your values. So what kind of demons are

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<v Speaker 1>we talking about? In ancient myths, you may have heard

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<v Speaker 1>of Hades, for example. Now, how cute is it that

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<v Speaker 1>the underworld was just called Hades after the guy whose

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<v Speaker 1>house it was like Maybe once he had a cute

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<v Speaker 1>neon bar sign that said MS, but the top half

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<v Speaker 1>shorted out and no whatever bothered to fix it, so

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<v Speaker 1>they just called it Hades. Hades places. Hades wasn't a

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<v Speaker 1>purely evil figure though, just kind of a dickish step

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<v Speaker 1>dead that no one liked. But Alyssa explains that those

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<v Speaker 1>kind of demons are in gods, and they're not sequestered

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<v Speaker 1>in hell. Mythological demons were whole separate bag, and they

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<v Speaker 1>were considered to be up here among us, just kicking

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<v Speaker 1>it anywhere. And as a person whose shoe fell behind

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<v Speaker 1>the X ray machine at TSA this morning, so she

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<v Speaker 1>just left it and ran in socks to her gate

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<v Speaker 1>through lax as her plane was boarding hot Damn, I'm

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<v Speaker 1>starting to believe in demons.

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<v Speaker 2>No, I mean, I think it's more of an idea

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<v Speaker 2>of beings in the normal world that are not quite

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<v Speaker 2>gods and goddesses. So some kind of I have air

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<v Speaker 2>quotes going on here, spiritual beings just sort of creatures

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<v Speaker 2>in the normal world.

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<v Speaker 1>But they're not a person either, right, and they have

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<v Speaker 1>some kinds of powers. Why do you think that, as

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<v Speaker 1>human beings we need to come up with stories to

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<v Speaker 1>explain good and evil? Do you think that demons are

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<v Speaker 1>essentially just a product of trying to understand that we're

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<v Speaker 1>shitty people or understand but Freudian super ego or an ego?

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<v Speaker 2>I think they vary depending on sort of where you're at,

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<v Speaker 2>and obviously the time period as well. So demons today, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>they're probably oh gosh, manifestations of our issues and that

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<v Speaker 2>kind of thing. So we try to create these figures

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<v Speaker 2>that embody the things that we're scared of, dang alone.

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<v Speaker 2>But since they're not always evil historically, you know, that

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<v Speaker 2>question is sort of up in the air. It's it's

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<v Speaker 2>really I guess they could be manifestations of what people

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<v Speaker 2>were afraid of or what people wanted or desired, but

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<v Speaker 2>it's hard to tell because people in the past don't

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<v Speaker 2>really talk about things like that. So it's our best

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<v Speaker 2>guess in many ways, why a lot of society seem

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<v Speaker 2>to create these these things and still today not all

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<v Speaker 2>of them are bad. So if you go over to

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<v Speaker 2>for example, Thailand, they have these absolutely gorgeous what we

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<v Speaker 2>would think of as demons. They have scary faces and

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<v Speaker 2>they're very mean looking, but they're actually creatures that protect temples.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, side note, I look this up and I believe

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<v Speaker 1>she's talking about yaksha, which are nature spirits with demon faces.

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<v Speaker 1>They kind of look like if a professional wrestler and

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<v Speaker 1>a dragon had a love baby who dressed up as

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<v Speaker 1>a circus clown for Halloween, like fierce, snarling, just exploding

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<v Speaker 1>with bright colors and makeup, but also bearing kind of

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<v Speaker 1>surprise expressions like holy shit, what are you doing here?

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<v Speaker 1>That's kind of what their faces look like. So yaksha

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<v Speaker 1>can be beautiful though, and they can guard or they

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<v Speaker 1>can haunt places, so they might protect you or they

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<v Speaker 1>might devour you. So I guess be nice to them,

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<v Speaker 1>and I want them to know that the wrestler clown

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<v Speaker 1>baby thing was like very much a compliment.

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<v Speaker 2>They're not bad, but they look like it.

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<v Speaker 1>And can you walk me through. I know this is

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<v Speaker 1>essentially distealing all of your work into like five or

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<v Speaker 1>ten minutes, but just a tiptoe through the tulips of demons, Like,

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<v Speaker 1>what are some of your favorites in history? When did

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<v Speaker 1>they rise and fall in popularity?

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<v Speaker 2>Because my period is so sort of medieval, I guess

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<v Speaker 2>those are kind of my favorite. And medieval demons are

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<v Speaker 2>so classically what we would think of as demons, right,

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<v Speaker 2>They've got big horns, and they're all muscly, and a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of times they've got like six penises and that

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<v Speaker 2>kind of stuff. So they're just so classically demonic that

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<v Speaker 2>you really have to love them. Yeah six. But I

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<v Speaker 2>also do I have a kind of affinity for the

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<v Speaker 2>ones that I was just talking about in Thailand, because again,

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<v Speaker 2>they're so over the top and they are really really beautiful.

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<v Speaker 2>So I'm sort of equally drawn to the super super

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<v Speaker 2>scary ones in medieval fieldlogy and they really really pretty

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<v Speaker 2>ones in sort of Thai religion as well.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so quick aside, demons like people and lamps and

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<v Speaker 1>probably butt plugs come in all shapes and sizes. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>they might not be called demons though us human persons.

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<v Speaker 1>We've got a lot of names for them, like pre

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<v Speaker 1>Babylonians call them shadow and in Islamic folklore they're called

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<v Speaker 1>gins or ephrits or sheatin, and the Japanese have these ogrioni.

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<v Speaker 1>Jewish mythologies got sheddim Christianity has demons, fallen angels called nephelim,

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<v Speaker 1>Russian has shorts, and in Algonquin there's this tall, antlered,

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<v Speaker 1>blood hungry spirit called a wind to go. So you

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<v Speaker 1>got a culture, you got demons. Now what about demons

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<v Speaker 1>with the AE Demons can be nice or they can

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<v Speaker 1>be the name of a computer program. That's just a

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<v Speaker 1>little Techi factoid for you. Now, what about Damien? Does

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<v Speaker 1>that name mean that you're evil? No, the name damien

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<v Speaker 1>means to tame or to subdue. Also, for a little context,

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<v Speaker 1>what was the inquisition you inquire? Well, there were a

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<v Speaker 1>few inquisition periods, one in the mid twelve hundreds, and

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<v Speaker 1>they used to torture people to try to find out who

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<v Speaker 1>was talking about the pope or later in the fifteen hundreds,

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<v Speaker 1>everyone was poking everyone else to see who was a

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<v Speaker 1>demon or a witch to combat the rise of Protestantism.

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<v Speaker 1>So a lot of side eye and suspicion in those days.

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<v Speaker 1>And now historically, was the Inquisition period, was that like

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<v Speaker 1>the hot time for demons? Did demons have a kind

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<v Speaker 1>of a boom?

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<v Speaker 2>Then in the end period of it, it doesn't start

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<v Speaker 2>out that way. That's what's sort of interesting to sort

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<v Speaker 2>of summarize it briefly, it seems more like, at first

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<v Speaker 2>you're not supposed to believe in them as a practicing

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<v Speaker 2>Christian at the time, it sort of goes against the

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<v Speaker 2>power of God to believe that demons have power. And

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<v Speaker 2>the same thing with witches. You're really not supposed to

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<v Speaker 2>believe that witches are real. In the beginning of the Inquisition,

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<v Speaker 2>and then as it develops, it seems like they're almost

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<v Speaker 2>trying to prove that God is real. It's this sort

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<v Speaker 2>of period of skepticism that everybody starts getting very nervous

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<v Speaker 2>about proving whether or not God exists. Yeah, and to

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<v Speaker 2>do that they have to sort of prove the supernatural,

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<v Speaker 2>So they end up trying to prove that demons exist.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, so if demons exist, then God exists and

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<v Speaker 2>everything's okay, We're all good here.

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<v Speaker 1>So that is not what I expected at all.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's fascinating to see it really is how it develops,

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<v Speaker 2>because when the inquisition period starts, they're not going after witches.

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<v Speaker 2>They're really going after what they would call heretics, people

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<v Speaker 2>who believe differently from them, and it evolves into this

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<v Speaker 2>whole actual witch hunt, but it doesn't start out that way.

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<v Speaker 2>So demons come in relatively sort of light on the scene,

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<v Speaker 2>so to speak.

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<v Speaker 1>And when, in terms of a timeline, when did Monotheism

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<v Speaker 1>really take root? When did we as a culture, When

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<v Speaker 1>did certain cultures tea on this idea that demons were

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<v Speaker 1>the enemy of the One True God?

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<v Speaker 2>Probably around the time that Christianity really gains a hold

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<v Speaker 2>in Rome, so you know, around the three hundreds.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, quick virtual field trip. Alyssa told me that underneath

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<v Speaker 1>the Vatican there's a huge necropolis where they used to

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<v Speaker 1>store a whole army of dead people, and there's a

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<v Speaker 1>stucco painting of Lucifer down there under the Vatican. Lucifer,

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<v Speaker 1>of course, draws his name from a bringer of light

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<v Speaker 1>or the sun of morning, named after a star falling

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<v Speaker 1>from heaven because Satan's origin story was that of an

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<v Speaker 1>angel who rebelled and turned into that friend who's always

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<v Speaker 1>trying to get you to have another drink or order

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<v Speaker 1>the chili cheese fries, or just delighting in the misery

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<v Speaker 1>of others.

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<v Speaker 2>So it really is around. It starts developing, I would

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<v Speaker 2>guess early on like one hundred two hundred, when they're

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<v Speaker 2>trying to sort of beat you know, they're trying to

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<v Speaker 2>sort of win the battle of whose religion is going

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<v Speaker 2>to take over this particular area, and so they really

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<v Speaker 2>turn against the representations of those earlier gods and goddesses.

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<v Speaker 1>And so in order to prove their faith to one

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<v Speaker 1>god in the sky. It's like all these other jabbronis,

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<v Speaker 1>we don't believe in them anymore. That's yesterday's news.

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<v Speaker 2>Or they have to be bad, so instead of them

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<v Speaker 2>being powerful and possibly good, they can sort of be powerful,

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<v Speaker 2>but they have to be less powerful than God. So

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<v Speaker 2>then you get this whole demonic world.

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<v Speaker 1>And what properties does a demon usually have? What kind

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<v Speaker 1>of mischief are we talking do they? Like do they

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<v Speaker 1>give you cancer or do they just drop something in

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<v Speaker 1>your food that sucks?

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<v Speaker 2>You know what I mean?

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<v Speaker 1>Like, how bad are we talking.

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<v Speaker 2>I guess it could be that though. Yeah, they could

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<v Speaker 2>cause illness, that's for sure. Okay, there's one story that

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<v Speaker 2>I read in one text that was something as simple

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<v Speaker 2>as this priest blamed a demon for tripping him as

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<v Speaker 2>he fell down the stairs, and that was his proof

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<v Speaker 2>that he had tripped and fallen down the stairs, and

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<v Speaker 2>that was proof of demonic activity. So it can be

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<v Speaker 2>anything from really really horrible like killing babies, did you know,

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<v Speaker 2>making them into stews that's really popular during the medieval period,

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<v Speaker 2>Or it can be something something as simple as tripping

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<v Speaker 2>and falling down the stairs. So they can have a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of power, but they also can do really really

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<v Speaker 2>stupid stuff.

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<v Speaker 1>So a few things a demon might do to you

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<v Speaker 1>sign your name on an insulting letter to someone you respect,

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<v Speaker 1>perhaps deposit their own giant bowel movement in your cat litterbox,

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<v Speaker 1>causing you to take your pet to the veterinarian. Maybe

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<v Speaker 1>a fix a fuck Cops sticker to your cars bumper.

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<v Speaker 1>Just kidding, that's not the work of a demon. All

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<v Speaker 1>three of those are just things that notorious prankster and

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<v Speaker 1>low key comedic maniac George Clooney has done to his friends.

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<v Speaker 2>They weren't necessarily accusing the people of being demonic. They

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<v Speaker 2>were accusing them of having interactions with demons. And that's

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<v Speaker 2>where witches were supposed to get their power from.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm doing one now that I can't tell you about,

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<v Speaker 1>but in a year you're going to hear that I've

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<v Speaker 1>been arrested.

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<v Speaker 2>So witches were not powerful in and of themselves. They

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<v Speaker 2>were powerful through the help of a demon. They often

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<v Speaker 2>can't even be seen the demons, so the priests are

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<v Speaker 2>trying to prove that they exist through the witches.

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<v Speaker 1>You know what they say, behind every great witch is

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<v Speaker 1>a supportive, inspiring demon. And do you think that there

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<v Speaker 1>was You know, back then there were a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>kind of fables and demons that were made up to

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<v Speaker 1>explain science that they just didn't get.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like even things like crops failing the harvest doesn't

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<v Speaker 2>come in right, so you have to blame something. I

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<v Speaker 2>think that's definitely an aspect of it. Sure, or again,

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<v Speaker 2>like I just said, with the whole connection to babies, Obviously,

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<v Speaker 2>there were a lot of really early infant deaths during

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<v Speaker 2>the medieval period, and so people wanted to blame something

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<v Speaker 2>for that happening. It's better than not knowing what's going on,

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<v Speaker 2>or it's better than thinking that you did something wrong. Right,

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<v Speaker 2>So I do think in a lot of ways it

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<v Speaker 2>was manifestations of people's fears. You can take them and

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<v Speaker 2>use it yourself to blame those bad creatures for the

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<v Speaker 2>bad stuff that's going on.

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<v Speaker 1>Do you think that still happens today?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, definitely, yes, Yes, it seems that we create these

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<v Speaker 2>sorts of things, sure, even if it's in pop culture,

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<v Speaker 2>which is a lot of what I also study. I'm

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<v Speaker 2>really into horror movies, even though I'm terrified of horror

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<v Speaker 2>movies too. It takes me forever to get up the

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<v Speaker 2>nerve to watch one, but I love them. So I

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<v Speaker 2>think we still create these sorts of things in order

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<v Speaker 2>to express those fears. Even today in the US, we

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<v Speaker 2>sort of turn towards certain types of creatures when we're

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<v Speaker 2>afraid of certain things, so we sort of get you know,

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<v Speaker 2>vampires are popular for like five years, and then zombies

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<v Speaker 2>are popular for five years, and then we switch over

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<v Speaker 2>to witches for a while, and they all are expressions

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<v Speaker 2>of different things that we're scared of.

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<v Speaker 1>I think, are they all a type of demon? Like

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<v Speaker 1>when it comes to defining a demon, are there parameters

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<v Speaker 1>in terms of what's a demon and what's not.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, we would think of them today very differently.

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<v Speaker 2>So I assume that if somebody was going to define

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<v Speaker 2>demonic activity, especially if you're within the church, it would

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<v Speaker 2>have to have something to do with the figure of Satan,

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<v Speaker 2>I would think. So it's not anymore just some kind

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<v Speaker 2>of evil creature. With the influx of Christianity, we really

388
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<v Speaker 2>do have to have that kind of opposition to the

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<v Speaker 2>One True God. If you think about things like exorcism movies,

390
00:22:19.000 --> 00:22:24.400
<v Speaker 2>they definitely have to be able today to take control

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<v Speaker 2>of a person. There's that whole possession aspect to it,

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<v Speaker 2>and I would think that today that would be one

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<v Speaker 2>of the main sort of markers of what is demonic

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<v Speaker 2>and what's not possession the lawyers. So we've got things

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<v Speaker 2>like ghosts and witches and that sort of stuff still

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<v Speaker 2>in popular culture, but the demonic is something that can

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<v Speaker 2>like literally take over your body and not give it back.

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<v Speaker 2>I think that's what people are so scared of. Excellent.

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<v Speaker 1>Did you ever watch The Exorcist oh as a child?

400
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<v Speaker 2>Yeah? Yes?

401
00:23:00.799 --> 00:23:02.759
<v Speaker 1>And is that the scariest movie?

402
00:23:02.799 --> 00:23:02.880
<v Speaker 2>Like?

403
00:23:02.880 --> 00:23:05.240
<v Speaker 1>Why is that in the omen? Like why are those

404
00:23:05.359 --> 00:23:06.200
<v Speaker 1>so terrifying.

405
00:23:06.279 --> 00:23:16.240
<v Speaker 2>Oh god, the omens scared me even more. Actually, yeah, yeah,

406
00:23:16.400 --> 00:23:20.200
<v Speaker 2>it still does. It's still the Exorcist isn't so scary

407
00:23:20.200 --> 00:23:22.599
<v Speaker 2>when I show it to students now, though I showed

408
00:23:22.599 --> 00:23:26.160
<v Speaker 2>them Exorcism of Emily Rose the other day and a

409
00:23:26.200 --> 00:23:28.920
<v Speaker 2>lot of them were really freaked out by that one.

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<v Speaker 1>And I.

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<v Speaker 2>The devil. I do think that even if people aren't

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<v Speaker 2>scared by other stuff, possession in particular still scares people

413
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<v Speaker 2>a lot. So I can talk through with my students,

414
00:23:46.480 --> 00:23:48.759
<v Speaker 2>and we do. We talk about all of these things

415
00:23:48.799 --> 00:23:52.039
<v Speaker 2>that people have feared in the past, because at some

416
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<v Speaker 2>point vampires were considered to be absolutely real and people

417
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<v Speaker 2>were really really scared of them.

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<v Speaker 1>Side note also scary. The plague, just infectious flea bites

419
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<v Speaker 1>and wet coughs killed up to two hundred million people

420
00:24:07.640 --> 00:24:11.279
<v Speaker 1>in the mid thirteen hundreds. And what happens when everyone

421
00:24:11.400 --> 00:24:15.599
<v Speaker 1>is dying and barfing blood and has bleeding mouth sorece

422
00:24:16.000 --> 00:24:19.359
<v Speaker 1>Folks start thinking, well, shit, vampires are real. What is

423
00:24:19.359 --> 00:24:23.160
<v Speaker 1>a bacteria? Never heard of it? But vampires? That's just science.

424
00:24:23.440 --> 00:24:27.279
<v Speaker 2>But now that sounds silly to most people. Whereas you

425
00:24:27.319 --> 00:24:30.799
<v Speaker 2>show them the Exorcist and they're really freaked out. So

426
00:24:31.319 --> 00:24:33.400
<v Speaker 2>I think it's that idea of loss of control of

427
00:24:33.440 --> 00:24:37.079
<v Speaker 2>the body, loss of control of your mental facilities. All

428
00:24:37.160 --> 00:24:39.839
<v Speaker 2>of that stuff is terrifying to people.

429
00:24:40.359 --> 00:24:44.160
<v Speaker 1>How do you feel when you see like news items

430
00:24:44.240 --> 00:24:50.160
<v Speaker 1>about current day exorcisms. How do you process that in

431
00:24:50.279 --> 00:24:53.799
<v Speaker 1>terms of your your skeptical brain and your science brain

432
00:24:53.839 --> 00:24:54.960
<v Speaker 1>and your historical brain.

433
00:24:55.559 --> 00:25:00.519
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I guess for me, anytime I'm studying, really, I

434
00:25:00.519 --> 00:25:03.759
<v Speaker 2>do sort of go into this dual mode. Right, So

435
00:25:04.119 --> 00:25:08.920
<v Speaker 2>I'm very much a skeptic, and I'm very much into science.

436
00:25:09.000 --> 00:25:12.079
<v Speaker 2>I mean, my brothers in aeronautics and aerospace, and you

437
00:25:12.079 --> 00:25:15.839
<v Speaker 2>know it's my family is really scientific and not religious

438
00:25:15.839 --> 00:25:20.400
<v Speaker 2>at all. But I'm really interested in why these things

439
00:25:20.640 --> 00:25:24.559
<v Speaker 2>come up in religions too. So you know, whereas my

440
00:25:24.720 --> 00:25:28.720
<v Speaker 2>scientific brain is saying that can't possibly happen, my other

441
00:25:28.839 --> 00:25:32.240
<v Speaker 2>side of my brain is saying, well, let's see what

442
00:25:32.240 --> 00:25:35.319
<v Speaker 2>it looks like. So I'm really interested when I hear

443
00:25:35.440 --> 00:25:38.319
<v Speaker 2>those types of things, and obviously all over the world,

444
00:25:38.799 --> 00:25:41.799
<v Speaker 2>whether it's a monotheistic culture or not, you get these

445
00:25:42.039 --> 00:25:46.640
<v Speaker 2>concepts of possession. Sometimes they're good, Like in voodoo, possession

446
00:25:46.680 --> 00:25:49.759
<v Speaker 2>is often a really positive thing. It's because it's the

447
00:25:49.799 --> 00:25:54.519
<v Speaker 2>way of communicating with the spirit world. So I'm interested

448
00:25:54.599 --> 00:25:57.680
<v Speaker 2>in how that gets carried out in a culture. So

449
00:25:58.000 --> 00:26:01.200
<v Speaker 2>why being possessed might be good for somebody, but in

450
00:26:01.279 --> 00:26:04.359
<v Speaker 2>our culture it's seen as the absolute worst thing that

451
00:26:04.440 --> 00:26:07.359
<v Speaker 2>could possibly happen, at least in a Christian context.

452
00:26:08.319 --> 00:26:13.960
<v Speaker 1>I wonder too, how Christianity regards getting possessed by a

453
00:26:14.000 --> 00:26:18.359
<v Speaker 1>good spirit. Like Christianity seems a okay with getting knocked

454
00:26:18.440 --> 00:26:21.680
<v Speaker 1>up by God, right exactly, But at the same time,

455
00:26:21.759 --> 00:26:25.480
<v Speaker 1>like demon get how dare you make me dance around

456
00:26:25.519 --> 00:26:26.519
<v Speaker 1>and speak in gibberish?

457
00:26:27.400 --> 00:26:32.000
<v Speaker 2>Except when people speak in tongues, that's okay. So the

458
00:26:32.039 --> 00:26:35.599
<v Speaker 2>whole descent of the Holy Spirit and Pentecostal Christian traditions,

459
00:26:36.240 --> 00:26:40.799
<v Speaker 2>it is the influx of the Holy Spirit, and it

460
00:26:40.880 --> 00:26:43.319
<v Speaker 2>can make you do things that you don't usually do.

461
00:26:43.640 --> 00:26:49.319
<v Speaker 2>So in some cases, in some denominations of Christianity, it's

462
00:26:49.359 --> 00:26:57.400
<v Speaker 2>a positive thing to speak in tongues, speaking in tongues

463
00:26:57.480 --> 00:27:01.160
<v Speaker 2>what Greek can't. But then it's of the flip side

464
00:27:01.160 --> 00:27:05.039
<v Speaker 2>of demonic possession that can make you speak languages that

465
00:27:05.160 --> 00:27:08.680
<v Speaker 2>you're that you don't know. Then I think that's still

466
00:27:08.680 --> 00:27:12.559
<v Speaker 2>one of the proofs of possession is that you speak

467
00:27:12.559 --> 00:27:15.720
<v Speaker 2>in a language that you have never learned. So it

468
00:27:15.799 --> 00:27:18.240
<v Speaker 2>can go either way. Even in Christianity.

469
00:27:18.599 --> 00:27:21.119
<v Speaker 1>I looked into this, and it's true some folks put

470
00:27:21.160 --> 00:27:23.319
<v Speaker 1>a lot of pressure on themselves to speak in tongues.

471
00:27:23.519 --> 00:27:26.240
<v Speaker 1>There was one ministry's website I read. I found an

472
00:27:26.319 --> 00:27:29.079
<v Speaker 1>article that said, quote, I felt like it was my fault,

473
00:27:29.359 --> 00:27:31.640
<v Speaker 1>that I was doing something wrong, that something in me

474
00:27:31.880 --> 00:27:34.559
<v Speaker 1>was broken. Finally, I just shut myself in my room

475
00:27:34.599 --> 00:27:37.119
<v Speaker 1>and said, I'm not leaving this room until I speak

476
00:27:37.160 --> 00:27:39.920
<v Speaker 1>in tongues. I'm not letting one word of English leave

477
00:27:39.920 --> 00:27:43.039
<v Speaker 1>my mouth. And I think that was my breakthrough. So

478
00:27:43.160 --> 00:27:46.440
<v Speaker 1>Rosetta Stone can help you here. Friends, have you ever

479
00:27:46.599 --> 00:27:50.000
<v Speaker 1>looked into those studies and tried to figure out, okay,

480
00:27:50.079 --> 00:27:52.480
<v Speaker 1>were these people just speaking gibberish or did they all

481
00:27:52.519 --> 00:27:55.039
<v Speaker 1>of a sudden were they fluent in Portuguese? If anyone

482
00:27:55.079 --> 00:27:55.839
<v Speaker 1>can explain it.

483
00:27:55.960 --> 00:27:59.880
<v Speaker 2>Do you get the stories that yeah, it's fluency and

484
00:28:00.079 --> 00:28:04.000
<v Speaker 2>stuff like Latin or ancient Greek or something like that

485
00:28:04.079 --> 00:28:08.319
<v Speaker 2>most people never are even exposed to. But you know, again,

486
00:28:08.359 --> 00:28:11.759
<v Speaker 2>the skeptical side of me says, well, who's telling a story?

487
00:28:12.480 --> 00:28:15.759
<v Speaker 2>You know, what do they have to gain? By having

488
00:28:15.799 --> 00:28:19.079
<v Speaker 2>this out there two sides of the coin, right, does

489
00:28:19.119 --> 00:28:22.920
<v Speaker 2>it actually happen or is there a compelling reason for

490
00:28:22.960 --> 00:28:25.880
<v Speaker 2>somebody to be sharing this sort of story? And I

491
00:28:25.880 --> 00:28:30.759
<v Speaker 2>don't know if I've ever seen scientifically convincing evidence of

492
00:28:30.799 --> 00:28:33.720
<v Speaker 2>somebody talking a language that they have not learned.

493
00:28:34.160 --> 00:28:36.759
<v Speaker 1>Why do you think we need to be scared? Especially

494
00:28:36.839 --> 00:28:39.480
<v Speaker 1>like we're coming up on Halloween here? Why do we

495
00:28:39.720 --> 00:28:42.359
<v Speaker 1>descend into like a month of like let's be terrified,

496
00:28:42.519 --> 00:28:47.200
<v Speaker 1>like goblins, ghosts, spooks, spiders, Like why do we need that?

497
00:28:47.519 --> 00:28:50.079
<v Speaker 2>It's really an outlet, isn't it. I mean, this is

498
00:28:50.119 --> 00:28:52.400
<v Speaker 2>the same reason I watch horror movies, even though I

499
00:28:52.640 --> 00:28:55.279
<v Speaker 2>get totally scared and I hate the feeling. And I'm

500
00:28:55.279 --> 00:28:57.799
<v Speaker 2>one of those people that actually watches it from behind

501
00:28:57.839 --> 00:29:02.720
<v Speaker 2>my fingers half the time. Oh got me? Yeah, So

502
00:29:02.960 --> 00:29:07.119
<v Speaker 2>I don't know when I'm done watching a horror movie,

503
00:29:07.359 --> 00:29:10.240
<v Speaker 2>have I had some sort of emotional release or something. Maybe?

504
00:29:10.640 --> 00:29:13.000
<v Speaker 2>Then again, often I can't go to sleep the night

505
00:29:13.039 --> 00:29:15.440
<v Speaker 2>that I watch a horror movie either, So that's kind

506
00:29:15.440 --> 00:29:20.039
<v Speaker 2>of silly, But I think it is. It's some kind

507
00:29:20.039 --> 00:29:23.279
<v Speaker 2>of emotional feeling that we get out of it that

508
00:29:23.400 --> 00:29:28.480
<v Speaker 2>we really want. So we want to be terrified because

509
00:29:28.519 --> 00:29:33.759
<v Speaker 2>in some ways it actually feels good, I guess, and

510
00:29:33.839 --> 00:29:36.319
<v Speaker 2>it actually I think it also engages a part of

511
00:29:36.359 --> 00:29:40.119
<v Speaker 2>our brain that we might turn off a lot. So

512
00:29:40.480 --> 00:29:42.759
<v Speaker 2>as I've been saying this whole thing about me being

513
00:29:42.799 --> 00:29:46.759
<v Speaker 2>skeptical and I don't believe in ghosts, But at the

514
00:29:46.799 --> 00:29:50.400
<v Speaker 2>same time, then why do I get absolutely terrified when

515
00:29:50.440 --> 00:29:53.839
<v Speaker 2>I watch something like Hanning of hill House? I, you know,

516
00:29:54.000 --> 00:29:57.480
<v Speaker 2>I do. I get really really scared. But if I

517
00:29:57.480 --> 00:29:59.519
<v Speaker 2>don't believe the ghosts, why am I getting that scared

518
00:29:59.559 --> 00:30:05.519
<v Speaker 2>when I want? It doesn't actually make sense, So I

519
00:30:05.559 --> 00:30:08.680
<v Speaker 2>think it just it gives us some kind of emotional

520
00:30:08.759 --> 00:30:10.440
<v Speaker 2>release that we might be looking for.

521
00:30:10.960 --> 00:30:13.640
<v Speaker 1>There's more on this in the Ferology episode, but most

522
00:30:13.759 --> 00:30:18.160
<v Speaker 1>experts echo that scary entertainment and horror hijacks or fight

523
00:30:18.279 --> 00:30:21.960
<v Speaker 1>or flight response and pokes at our screaming almond of

524
00:30:22.079 --> 00:30:25.119
<v Speaker 1>terror the amygdala, which is deep in the brain. So

525
00:30:25.240 --> 00:30:27.920
<v Speaker 1>the rush of adrenaline that we would be using to

526
00:30:28.039 --> 00:30:31.720
<v Speaker 1>run away from a bloodthirsty moose or a demon in

527
00:30:31.720 --> 00:30:35.960
<v Speaker 1>a nightgown instead gives some people an opioid like rush,

528
00:30:36.240 --> 00:30:38.839
<v Speaker 1>And then everything that goes bump in the night is

529
00:30:38.920 --> 00:30:42.279
<v Speaker 1>kind of a little bump of brain chemicals when you're working,

530
00:30:42.319 --> 00:30:45.559
<v Speaker 1>are you pouring over old manuscripts? Like what kinds of

531
00:30:45.559 --> 00:30:47.880
<v Speaker 1>writing are you looking at? And do you ever get

532
00:30:47.920 --> 00:30:49.200
<v Speaker 1>freaked out while you're studying.

533
00:30:49.799 --> 00:30:53.200
<v Speaker 2>I do actually get a little bit freaked out by that.

534
00:30:53.799 --> 00:30:56.960
<v Speaker 2>I just was writing on Haunting of Hillhouse and I

535
00:30:57.039 --> 00:31:01.400
<v Speaker 2>had to watch the whole series again on Netflix, and

536
00:31:01.480 --> 00:31:03.920
<v Speaker 2>I had to do it like during the day while

537
00:31:04.000 --> 00:31:06.680
<v Speaker 2>my husband was home with all the lights on. So

538
00:31:06.799 --> 00:31:10.440
<v Speaker 2>that stuff still does freak me out. The ancient texts

539
00:31:10.480 --> 00:31:16.880
<v Speaker 2>and the wood cuttings, they're really interesting and they're really elaborate,

540
00:31:16.960 --> 00:31:20.119
<v Speaker 2>especially when you get into depictions of demons and things

541
00:31:20.200 --> 00:31:23.039
<v Speaker 2>like that. So it's fascinating to see what the medieval

542
00:31:23.119 --> 00:31:24.519
<v Speaker 2>brain was coming up with.

543
00:31:25.400 --> 00:31:29.279
<v Speaker 1>What was our thing with goats? Why goats and demons?

544
00:31:29.519 --> 00:31:31.799
<v Speaker 1>Why is there such a crossover? Stylistically?

545
00:31:32.200 --> 00:31:34.440
<v Speaker 2>I think it's the horns. I think it goes back

546
00:31:34.480 --> 00:31:38.440
<v Speaker 2>again to pan in ancient Greece, the sort of depiction

547
00:31:38.680 --> 00:31:41.799
<v Speaker 2>of the half human half goat, or at least the

548
00:31:41.880 --> 00:31:45.960
<v Speaker 2>horned beings. I do think that comes in from a

549
00:31:45.960 --> 00:31:48.920
<v Speaker 2>lot of the ancient Greco Roman stuff. Again, there was

550
00:31:49.000 --> 00:31:51.079
<v Speaker 2>just an exhibit that we saw we were in study

551
00:31:51.079 --> 00:31:54.440
<v Speaker 2>abroad with students last summer and we took them to

552
00:31:55.200 --> 00:31:58.119
<v Speaker 2>It was in the Israel Museum and they were doing

553
00:31:58.160 --> 00:32:02.079
<v Speaker 2>an exhibit on Peter Pan, which sounds strange maybe, but

554
00:32:02.160 --> 00:32:04.599
<v Speaker 2>they were actually tracing it all the way back to

555
00:32:05.240 --> 00:32:10.079
<v Speaker 2>the ancient Greco Roman god Pan and then how that

556
00:32:10.160 --> 00:32:13.319
<v Speaker 2>came forward. So all of these fairy tales and all

557
00:32:13.359 --> 00:32:17.240
<v Speaker 2>of these depictions have their roots in that mythology still,

558
00:32:17.799 --> 00:32:22.160
<v Speaker 2>so we're constantly re using the Greeks as everybody has

559
00:32:22.200 --> 00:32:24.960
<v Speaker 2>for thousands of years. So now we're using them for

560
00:32:25.200 --> 00:32:29.559
<v Speaker 2>these depictions of demons, still using their gods and goddesses.

561
00:32:30.039 --> 00:32:33.079
<v Speaker 1>So for more on this, see the Mythology episode with

562
00:32:33.200 --> 00:32:36.599
<v Speaker 1>John Bousche. It's just chock full of gossip about gods

563
00:32:36.920 --> 00:32:41.839
<v Speaker 1>and what about how demonology is used in a way

564
00:32:41.880 --> 00:32:46.839
<v Speaker 1>to alienate different groups of people, different religions. How has

565
00:32:46.880 --> 00:32:49.000
<v Speaker 1>that been in the past and how does that continue now?

566
00:32:50.200 --> 00:32:55.200
<v Speaker 2>Oh gosh, you mean like accusing people of literal I

567
00:32:55.279 --> 00:32:58.319
<v Speaker 2>mean sometimes it's actually accusing people of having sex with them.

568
00:32:58.359 --> 00:33:01.519
<v Speaker 2>That's one of the major things that the inquisitors do is.

569
00:33:01.440 --> 00:33:04.720
<v Speaker 1>That really Oh yeah, they're Wyman was six dicks.

570
00:33:04.799 --> 00:33:09.279
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's not supposed to be fun, right, the inquisitors,

571
00:33:09.319 --> 00:33:13.079
<v Speaker 2>the stuff that they write, it's very, very detailed, which

572
00:33:13.119 --> 00:33:14.440
<v Speaker 2>is one of the interesting things.

573
00:33:15.759 --> 00:33:17.960
<v Speaker 1>And it's porn. It's demon porn.

574
00:33:17.799 --> 00:33:22.359
<v Speaker 2>It is actually and they talk a lot about demon penises.

575
00:33:22.480 --> 00:33:26.160
<v Speaker 2>It's a fascination with the inquisitors. So you know, it's

576
00:33:26.200 --> 00:33:29.880
<v Speaker 2>supposed to be often, as I said, lots of lots

577
00:33:29.880 --> 00:33:36.720
<v Speaker 2>of dicks, but also like spiked. Yeah, so not like

578
00:33:36.880 --> 00:33:39.519
<v Speaker 2>barbed with yeah yeah oouch.

579
00:33:39.839 --> 00:33:44.680
<v Speaker 1>Demons not only horned but also horned. I asked Alyssa

580
00:33:44.720 --> 00:33:50.319
<v Speaker 1>about horns and the intersection of religious fear and anti Semitism.

581
00:33:50.559 --> 00:33:54.039
<v Speaker 1>Moses is famously depicted by Michaelangelo as having horns. So

582
00:33:54.079 --> 00:33:57.839
<v Speaker 1>what in the fiery depths of shee Hades hell is

583
00:33:57.880 --> 00:33:58.519
<v Speaker 1>that all about?

584
00:33:58.799 --> 00:34:02.559
<v Speaker 2>And the whole Moses thing, Moses being depicted with horns

585
00:34:02.559 --> 00:34:06.480
<v Speaker 2>particularly all of that. It's so weird how this happens.

586
00:34:06.839 --> 00:34:12.039
<v Speaker 2>That in particular is a mistranslation of words. So I

587
00:34:12.119 --> 00:34:16.079
<v Speaker 2>think it's when what does it say about Moses. It's

588
00:34:16.079 --> 00:34:18.800
<v Speaker 2>that he's got rays of light coming out of his

589
00:34:18.920 --> 00:34:24.000
<v Speaker 2>head in one particular biblical verse, and somewhere it might

590
00:34:24.039 --> 00:34:26.079
<v Speaker 2>be King James version. I'm not sure when it gets

591
00:34:26.159 --> 00:34:31.159
<v Speaker 2>translated that gets translated into horns coming out of his head. Yeah,

592
00:34:31.239 --> 00:34:34.880
<v Speaker 2>oh boy. So you do get a lot of those overlaps,

593
00:34:34.960 --> 00:34:39.400
<v Speaker 2>but usually it's down to some horribly mistranslated something or

594
00:34:39.400 --> 00:34:43.639
<v Speaker 2>another that people then run with. Oh god, yeah, that

595
00:34:43.760 --> 00:34:45.199
<v Speaker 2>is awful.

596
00:34:45.400 --> 00:34:48.960
<v Speaker 1>It is one job, right, No one was proofing.

597
00:34:48.639 --> 00:34:52.400
<v Speaker 2>That, No, I know, right, it happens over and over again.

598
00:34:53.119 --> 00:34:53.920
<v Speaker 2>Oh man.

599
00:34:54.159 --> 00:35:00.559
<v Speaker 1>So anyone who's who has like a religious based political leanings,

600
00:35:00.840 --> 00:35:04.440
<v Speaker 1>who knows you might be working from like a smeared manuscript?

601
00:35:04.480 --> 00:35:08.719
<v Speaker 2>Oh exactly, yes, yeah, yeah, that's terrifying. It is. Well,

602
00:35:08.719 --> 00:35:10.679
<v Speaker 2>I'm thinking about how boring it must have been to

603
00:35:10.800 --> 00:35:15.440
<v Speaker 2>be like recopying all of these texts. So the people

604
00:35:15.440 --> 00:35:18.199
<v Speaker 2>who had to do that, sometimes I wonder if they

605
00:35:18.599 --> 00:35:21.360
<v Speaker 2>really just decided to screw around with stuff because they.

606
00:35:21.239 --> 00:35:26.159
<v Speaker 1>Were bored, bored horny monks. Exactly who's the demon now, bitches?

607
00:35:26.519 --> 00:35:31.000
<v Speaker 1>And you see this mistranslated something exactly well, persist for eons.

608
00:35:30.840 --> 00:35:33.320
<v Speaker 2>And they make all these little drawings in the margins

609
00:35:33.360 --> 00:35:35.679
<v Speaker 2>that are really crazy. So I think a lot of

610
00:35:35.719 --> 00:35:39.440
<v Speaker 2>it maybe came in from just bored medieval lunks.

611
00:35:39.960 --> 00:35:43.039
<v Speaker 1>Also, I wondered if some of those celibate religious folks

612
00:35:43.199 --> 00:35:45.559
<v Speaker 1>ever wish they could just make out with someone, and

613
00:35:45.599 --> 00:35:48.039
<v Speaker 1>if that ever came out in their work, because they

614
00:35:48.039 --> 00:35:49.880
<v Speaker 1>get real detailed.

615
00:35:49.800 --> 00:35:52.280
<v Speaker 2>That One of the big proofs they're looking for with

616
00:35:52.400 --> 00:35:56.079
<v Speaker 2>both male and female witches is that they're having sex

617
00:35:56.119 --> 00:36:00.840
<v Speaker 2>with demons, not just that they're you know, talking to them,

618
00:36:00.039 --> 00:36:05.440
<v Speaker 2>they're actually having some sort of physical interaction with them.

619
00:36:05.519 --> 00:36:11.440
<v Speaker 2>And it's essentially the most physical you can get with something, right. Yeah, So,

620
00:36:11.599 --> 00:36:15.800
<v Speaker 2>especially if you're talking about multiple penetrations, that's pretty intimate

621
00:36:15.960 --> 00:36:16.599
<v Speaker 2>with the demon.

622
00:36:16.880 --> 00:36:19.039
<v Speaker 1>How do they explain that there aren't a bunch of

623
00:36:19.079 --> 00:36:20.199
<v Speaker 1>demon babies around?

624
00:36:20.760 --> 00:36:24.039
<v Speaker 2>Oh? There are sort of Okay, So this is how

625
00:36:24.079 --> 00:36:28.440
<v Speaker 2>it works. Are there's male demons and there's female demons,

626
00:36:28.719 --> 00:36:31.920
<v Speaker 2>at least in the Inquisition period, and the way that

627
00:36:32.000 --> 00:36:38.280
<v Speaker 2>they breed is that essentially the female demons, this is

628
00:36:38.280 --> 00:36:40.199
<v Speaker 2>one of the ways that it works. The female demons

629
00:36:40.239 --> 00:36:44.039
<v Speaker 2>have sex with men. Usually the female demons are on top,

630
00:36:44.280 --> 00:36:47.599
<v Speaker 2>that's how it works, and they take the sperm into

631
00:36:47.880 --> 00:36:53.159
<v Speaker 2>their bodies and then they transmit it to the male demons,

632
00:36:53.280 --> 00:36:56.880
<v Speaker 2>and the male demons can impregnate women. But it's actually

633
00:36:57.079 --> 00:37:00.159
<v Speaker 2>with human sperm and not demonic sperm.

634
00:37:00.559 --> 00:37:03.639
<v Speaker 1>I mean, that's just science Emma, right, Oh my god.

635
00:37:03.719 --> 00:37:06.800
<v Speaker 1>So it's kind of gets passed around like a baton

636
00:37:07.159 --> 00:37:08.159
<v Speaker 1>in a race.

637
00:37:08.119 --> 00:37:11.679
<v Speaker 2>Yes, exactly, yes, racing sperm.

638
00:37:11.960 --> 00:37:15.239
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and then and then a human female has it,

639
00:37:15.320 --> 00:37:19.039
<v Speaker 1>and then she has a demon baby because it's human

640
00:37:19.119 --> 00:37:21.400
<v Speaker 1>sperm that's passed through to at least two demons.

641
00:37:21.440 --> 00:37:25.400
<v Speaker 2>Exactly. Yeah, so it's not really physically a demon baby,

642
00:37:25.559 --> 00:37:28.320
<v Speaker 2>but it was caused by a.

643
00:37:28.199 --> 00:37:32.559
<v Speaker 1>Demon cursed and haunted zygotes guaranteed to pass through at

644
00:37:32.639 --> 00:37:37.159
<v Speaker 1>least two organic demons before implantation. Did you ever see

645
00:37:37.239 --> 00:37:38.559
<v Speaker 1>Rosemary's baby?

646
00:37:38.159 --> 00:37:39.440
<v Speaker 2>And yes?

647
00:37:40.079 --> 00:37:43.679
<v Speaker 1>Is that how medieval demon babies were described or was

648
00:37:43.679 --> 00:37:44.119
<v Speaker 1>it different?

649
00:37:44.400 --> 00:37:47.719
<v Speaker 2>In the end once she has it, it's actually like scary,

650
00:37:47.840 --> 00:37:49.960
<v Speaker 2>demonic looking, right, I think?

651
00:37:50.000 --> 00:37:53.480
<v Speaker 1>So yeaheah, what have you done to its eyes?

652
00:37:54.119 --> 00:38:03.000
<v Speaker 2>He has his father's eyes. Are you talking about guys

653
00:38:03.079 --> 00:38:08.599
<v Speaker 2>as are normal? What have you done your many satan

654
00:38:08.719 --> 00:38:09.480
<v Speaker 2>missus father?

655
00:38:09.679 --> 00:38:13.280
<v Speaker 1>That guy he came up from hell and beget a

656
00:38:13.360 --> 00:38:18.159
<v Speaker 1>son a mortal woman, Pale Satan Alyssa says, medieval demon

657
00:38:18.199 --> 00:38:20.079
<v Speaker 1>babies we're just more run of the mill looking.

658
00:38:20.639 --> 00:38:24.119
<v Speaker 2>These end up just looking like normal babies. And that's

659
00:38:24.199 --> 00:38:27.519
<v Speaker 2>also part of the fear, is that you never really know,

660
00:38:28.760 --> 00:38:33.760
<v Speaker 2>because it just looks like a normal human anyone could

661
00:38:33.760 --> 00:38:38.280
<v Speaker 2>have been the product of this kind of bizarre multiple union.

662
00:38:38.840 --> 00:38:42.800
<v Speaker 2>You can't tell the offspring of this kind of union

663
00:38:42.920 --> 00:38:49.119
<v Speaker 2>just by looking at him. So jerks, demons, demon babies. Oh,

664
00:38:49.880 --> 00:38:51.519
<v Speaker 2>I was gonna say, all babies.

665
00:38:54.880 --> 00:38:56.519
<v Speaker 1>Did you cry and they shit on you?

666
00:38:56.719 --> 00:38:57.320
<v Speaker 2>Yes? Yeah?

667
00:38:57.360 --> 00:38:58.480
<v Speaker 1>If they bite your boobs?

668
00:38:58.639 --> 00:39:01.679
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So I don't think any more than than normal babies.

669
00:39:03.519 --> 00:39:09.519
<v Speaker 1>Colic demon baby doesn't sleep to the night babbling in tongues.

670
00:39:11.199 --> 00:39:14.760
<v Speaker 1>What it's the biggest demon flim flam that you want

671
00:39:14.800 --> 00:39:18.280
<v Speaker 1>to debunk? What's some real bullshit horsepuckey that you're like,

672
00:39:18.360 --> 00:39:20.280
<v Speaker 1>this is? That's not what demonology is about.

673
00:39:21.320 --> 00:39:25.519
<v Speaker 2>I think it's probably the idea that and this might

674
00:39:25.599 --> 00:39:31.400
<v Speaker 2>just go for religious studies in general, since that's my field. A.

675
00:39:32.039 --> 00:39:37.679
<v Speaker 2>We're not all sitting around like practicing whatever we're teaching, right,

676
00:39:38.039 --> 00:39:41.239
<v Speaker 2>you have no idea. How many times, especially with students

677
00:39:41.280 --> 00:39:45.559
<v Speaker 2>who take our classes, people think that they're going to

678
00:39:45.639 --> 00:39:50.280
<v Speaker 2>be indoctrinated into something. And it's said because in some

679
00:39:50.320 --> 00:39:53.639
<v Speaker 2>ways it really stops people from taking those sorts of courses.

680
00:39:54.039 --> 00:39:57.239
<v Speaker 2>And I think they're really useful just for understanding different cultures.

681
00:39:57.760 --> 00:40:00.519
<v Speaker 2>So I guess that would be my major thing.

682
00:40:01.920 --> 00:40:03.320
<v Speaker 1>Is that you're not going to walk out of here

683
00:40:03.360 --> 00:40:04.960
<v Speaker 1>with demonic powers or.

684
00:40:05.159 --> 00:40:08.199
<v Speaker 2>Yes, I'm not. I'm not going to teach you spells, right,

685
00:40:08.639 --> 00:40:11.199
<v Speaker 2>We're not going to have the goat sacrifice practicum at

686
00:40:11.239 --> 00:40:13.679
<v Speaker 2>the end of the class. Yeah, that would be my

687
00:40:13.840 --> 00:40:14.360
<v Speaker 2>major thing.

688
00:40:15.039 --> 00:40:17.079
<v Speaker 1>Can I ask you questions from listeners? There's so many

689
00:40:17.159 --> 00:40:20.719
<v Speaker 1>of course. Yeah, okay, so before we ask questions from patreons,

690
00:40:20.920 --> 00:40:23.159
<v Speaker 1>and there are so many a quick break to tell

691
00:40:23.159 --> 00:40:25.000
<v Speaker 1>you about the sponsors of the show, who make it

692
00:40:25.039 --> 00:40:27.920
<v Speaker 1>possible for us to donate to a charity of the ologists,

693
00:40:28.000 --> 00:40:30.880
<v Speaker 1>choosing each week, and this week, Alyssa wanted her donation

694
00:40:30.920 --> 00:40:34.519
<v Speaker 1>to be split between Doctors Without Borders, that facilitates global

695
00:40:34.599 --> 00:40:39.639
<v Speaker 1>first responders to emergencies, epidemics, and natural disasters and provides

696
00:40:39.800 --> 00:40:42.880
<v Speaker 1>medical relief in conflict zones, and the other donation went

697
00:40:42.880 --> 00:40:46.119
<v Speaker 1>to Planned Pairenthood, which is a nonprofit organization that provides

698
00:40:46.239 --> 00:40:49.440
<v Speaker 1>sexual healthcare in the United States and globally. So links

699
00:40:49.480 --> 00:40:52.000
<v Speaker 1>to both of those and to these sponsors will be

700
00:40:52.119 --> 00:40:52.960
<v Speaker 1>in the show notes.

701
00:40:53.639 --> 00:40:55.320
<v Speaker 2>Okay, well that's get two questions.

702
00:40:55.639 --> 00:40:58.239
<v Speaker 1>Okay, we can just do this like a lightning round.

703
00:40:58.559 --> 00:41:00.599
<v Speaker 1>We'll get through as many as we can, all right,

704
00:41:01.400 --> 00:41:05.920
<v Speaker 1>so many good questions. Mary Roseby says. Pumped for this,

705
00:41:06.400 --> 00:41:10.480
<v Speaker 1>she says, what famous demon cases do you think are true?

706
00:41:10.559 --> 00:41:15.599
<v Speaker 2>If any ooh like actual possession. That's that's that split

707
00:41:15.639 --> 00:41:19.039
<v Speaker 2>brain thing again. Yeah, yeah, I mean I want to

708
00:41:19.079 --> 00:41:21.679
<v Speaker 2>take people at their word when they say that they're possessed.

709
00:41:21.800 --> 00:41:24.960
<v Speaker 2>I believe, And then my scientific brain is back here

710
00:41:25.000 --> 00:41:28.599
<v Speaker 2>going no, no, I don't believe you. So I'm not

711
00:41:28.639 --> 00:41:30.679
<v Speaker 2>sure about that one. Actually, I don't know how I

712
00:41:30.719 --> 00:41:34.159
<v Speaker 2>would answer that. I think extorm of Emily Rose is

713
00:41:34.159 --> 00:41:36.159
<v Speaker 2>supposed to be based on a true story, and I

714
00:41:36.199 --> 00:41:39.239
<v Speaker 2>would love to sort of dive more into that actual story.

715
00:41:39.800 --> 00:41:42.599
<v Speaker 2>But then again, based on true story, we never know

716
00:41:42.679 --> 00:41:45.480
<v Speaker 2>what that means in movies, right exactly? Yea.

717
00:41:46.000 --> 00:41:50.079
<v Speaker 1>Ps. I was unfamiliar with this tale and the Exorcism

718
00:41:50.159 --> 00:41:53.559
<v Speaker 1>of Emily Rose was based on the story of Annalise Michelle,

719
00:41:53.639 --> 00:41:57.800
<v Speaker 1>who was a woman who had epilepsy and psychiatric illnesses

720
00:41:57.800 --> 00:42:00.280
<v Speaker 1>that just didn't respond to treatment, and so she and

721
00:42:00.320 --> 00:42:03.880
<v Speaker 1>her family became convinced it was a possession. So she

722
00:42:04.119 --> 00:42:07.679
<v Speaker 1>endured a year of exorcism rights in the mid nineteen

723
00:42:07.760 --> 00:42:10.360
<v Speaker 1>seventies and in the process, she stopped eating and she

724
00:42:10.519 --> 00:42:14.039
<v Speaker 1>died of starvation, and she had shattered kneecaps from kneeling

725
00:42:14.119 --> 00:42:17.800
<v Speaker 1>so much. There's just nothing not awful about what she

726
00:42:17.920 --> 00:42:20.519
<v Speaker 1>and her family went through. And her parents and a

727
00:42:20.559 --> 00:42:24.039
<v Speaker 1>priest were found guilty of negligent homicide because of what

728
00:42:24.159 --> 00:42:26.000
<v Speaker 1>she went through. And I just want to say big

729
00:42:26.000 --> 00:42:29.480
<v Speaker 1>thanks to anyone studying how the brain works. That would

730
00:42:29.480 --> 00:42:32.880
<v Speaker 1>have saved a lot of people a lot of demonic suspicions.

731
00:42:33.079 --> 00:42:35.320
<v Speaker 1>The more we know about how our brain meets work,

732
00:42:35.760 --> 00:42:38.800
<v Speaker 1>the better off we all are. So this next question

733
00:42:39.000 --> 00:42:42.079
<v Speaker 1>was also asked, by the way, by Kathleen Sachs Chris

734
00:42:42.119 --> 00:42:45.679
<v Speaker 1>Paul's wants to know how many names does Satan Lucifer

735
00:42:45.840 --> 00:42:48.679
<v Speaker 1>Metastopheles have throughout history.

736
00:42:48.280 --> 00:42:51.599
<v Speaker 2>So much branding there is, but a lot of it

737
00:42:51.639 --> 00:42:55.360
<v Speaker 2>is also mistranslation. So yeah, there are a lot of

738
00:42:55.360 --> 00:42:59.559
<v Speaker 2>different names that come from these various sources. So Lucifer

739
00:43:00.239 --> 00:43:03.480
<v Speaker 2>back to that idea of light right in the Greco

740
00:43:03.559 --> 00:43:06.920
<v Speaker 2>Roman pantheon, So there are a lot of different names

741
00:43:07.000 --> 00:43:11.400
<v Speaker 2>that come out of different authors. Lucifer doesn't get popular,

742
00:43:11.480 --> 00:43:15.000
<v Speaker 2>I think until like Milton or Dante, one or the other.

743
00:43:15.079 --> 00:43:16.400
<v Speaker 2>I can never remember.

744
00:43:16.000 --> 00:43:19.880
<v Speaker 1>Which ps Milton is the poet John Milton who penned

745
00:43:20.280 --> 00:43:24.119
<v Speaker 1>an epically long poem called Paradise Lost, and it was

746
00:43:24.159 --> 00:43:27.719
<v Speaker 1>about Adam and Eve and the fallen angel Satan. It

747
00:43:27.760 --> 00:43:35.239
<v Speaker 1>was published in sixteen sixty seven. Haah, so close, so close,

748
00:43:35.559 --> 00:43:38.440
<v Speaker 1>you know his publicist must have been so bist, like

749
00:43:38.760 --> 00:43:41.920
<v Speaker 1>one year earlier. Man, what I mean, good marketing. But yes,

750
00:43:42.119 --> 00:43:45.119
<v Speaker 1>some folks wrap up all the names for Satan into

751
00:43:45.159 --> 00:43:47.280
<v Speaker 1>one guy, kind of like how I call my dog

752
00:43:47.639 --> 00:43:51.280
<v Speaker 1>Gramlin or Grammy Land or Graham's or Grammy or monkey

753
00:43:51.280 --> 00:43:54.880
<v Speaker 1>Butt or monkey face or meat beast or Pouci or Rumpel, Snuggles,

754
00:43:55.039 --> 00:43:58.800
<v Speaker 1>et cetera. Satan I feel like, probably loves nicknames. Now.

755
00:43:58.920 --> 00:44:03.159
<v Speaker 1>Some authors think, though, that there are seven distinct princes

756
00:44:03.159 --> 00:44:06.639
<v Speaker 1>of Hell, like in the late fifteen hundreds, Peter Binsfield

757
00:44:06.840 --> 00:44:10.920
<v Speaker 1>thought each prince of Hell represented their own sin. Lucifer

758
00:44:11.159 --> 00:44:17.440
<v Speaker 1>was pride, Mammon was greed, as Mudeos lust, Leviathan envy,

759
00:44:17.719 --> 00:44:22.239
<v Speaker 1>Diezo Bub was gluttony, Satan was wrath, and Belle fegor

760
00:44:22.679 --> 00:44:25.519
<v Speaker 1>good old bell Fegre was sloth. So you have in

761
00:44:25.559 --> 00:44:27.920
<v Speaker 1>a real lazy day Belle fi Gore made you do

762
00:44:28.000 --> 00:44:32.039
<v Speaker 1>it now? Who asked about the show Supernatural, Quite a

763
00:44:32.079 --> 00:44:34.840
<v Speaker 1>few of you have been watching it, including Samantha J. Gunther,

764
00:44:35.159 --> 00:44:40.239
<v Speaker 1>Lauren Harder, Caitlyn Fitzgerald, and Gianna Ruwick. Okay, a lot

765
00:44:40.280 --> 00:44:44.360
<v Speaker 1>of people, including Lauren Harder, Samantha Riley mcinness asked about

766
00:44:44.440 --> 00:44:49.159
<v Speaker 1>the Supernatural show, and Lauren says, I watch more seasons

767
00:44:49.199 --> 00:44:51.480
<v Speaker 1>of Supernatural than I want to admit, and I'd love

768
00:44:51.519 --> 00:44:53.840
<v Speaker 1>to know how they did it with all the various

769
00:44:53.840 --> 00:44:57.960
<v Speaker 1>and sundry demons and monsters from different cultures. So how

770
00:44:58.159 --> 00:45:00.840
<v Speaker 1>where are they getting all of the demons for Supernatural?

771
00:45:01.039 --> 00:45:04.039
<v Speaker 2>Okay, I have a confession to make, which is that

772
00:45:04.199 --> 00:45:09.280
<v Speaker 2>I have not watched Supernatural. I know everybody asks me this.

773
00:45:10.559 --> 00:45:12.840
<v Speaker 2>I don't know why I never got into it. I

774
00:45:12.920 --> 00:45:17.199
<v Speaker 2>watched like the first episode and just said, eh, okay,

775
00:45:17.280 --> 00:45:19.719
<v Speaker 2>I know, I know. I feel really bad about that.

776
00:45:19.800 --> 00:45:22.400
<v Speaker 2>So I'm sorry to all of the readers who wanted

777
00:45:22.440 --> 00:45:27.679
<v Speaker 2>to listeners who wanted to know that. Yeah, I think

778
00:45:27.719 --> 00:45:33.239
<v Speaker 2>I stopped with Buffy and then they just me so yes, yeah.

779
00:45:32.679 --> 00:45:33.880
<v Speaker 1>Some people asked about Buffy.

780
00:45:33.920 --> 00:45:35.880
<v Speaker 2>Actually, oh that's good, Yay Buffy.

781
00:45:36.039 --> 00:45:39.159
<v Speaker 1>Laura Durgovich says, everything I know about demons. I learned

782
00:45:39.159 --> 00:45:42.679
<v Speaker 1>from Buffy Angel which demons in the Wheden verse are

783
00:45:42.880 --> 00:45:46.639
<v Speaker 1>recognizably drawn from known sources and which ones are totally original.

784
00:45:47.679 --> 00:45:52.559
<v Speaker 2>Oh. I think he's really good at doing his research. Actually, yeah, yeah,

785
00:45:52.599 --> 00:45:55.559
<v Speaker 2>So I would say that most of the demons in

786
00:45:55.599 --> 00:46:00.119
<v Speaker 2>Buffy the Vampire s Layer have some source historically. I

787
00:46:00.159 --> 00:46:04.440
<v Speaker 2>mean he gets creative with them, right, He certainly you know,

788
00:46:04.519 --> 00:46:07.239
<v Speaker 2>turned them into lounge singers and things like that. First

789
00:46:07.400 --> 00:46:13.559
<v Speaker 2>I was afraid. I was petrified. But I think he's

790
00:46:13.599 --> 00:46:17.039
<v Speaker 2>done his research. I really do. And I think when

791
00:46:17.039 --> 00:46:20.119
<v Speaker 2>it comes down to the shows like Buffy and Angel,

792
00:46:20.360 --> 00:46:22.440
<v Speaker 2>he's done his research. So I would say most of

793
00:46:22.480 --> 00:46:23.320
<v Speaker 2>them are historical.

794
00:46:23.920 --> 00:46:27.000
<v Speaker 1>Oh nice, I mean it's I feel like it's in

795
00:46:27.039 --> 00:46:30.199
<v Speaker 1>some ways, it gives you more cred if they're historical,

796
00:46:30.199 --> 00:46:33.320
<v Speaker 1>and also you probably have to do less work, so bonus.

797
00:46:33.440 --> 00:46:33.679
<v Speaker 2>Yes.

798
00:46:34.360 --> 00:46:36.519
<v Speaker 1>Also I had to stop and ask myself, is Joss

799
00:46:36.559 --> 00:46:39.360
<v Speaker 1>Whedon a demon? I have bad feelings about him? And yes,

800
00:46:39.519 --> 00:46:42.199
<v Speaker 1>I googled it and in an open letter in twenty seventeen,

801
00:46:42.519 --> 00:46:46.000
<v Speaker 1>his former wife laid bare quite a bit of deceit

802
00:46:46.400 --> 00:46:50.159
<v Speaker 1>and infidelity on his part. So what's his excuse? Was

803
00:46:50.159 --> 00:46:53.360
<v Speaker 1>he possessed. We're just a successful dude in Hollywood being

804
00:46:53.400 --> 00:46:57.239
<v Speaker 1>gross thinking it's the latter. Now, speaking of possession, the

805
00:46:57.280 --> 00:47:00.760
<v Speaker 1>following folks wanted to know more about it, including first

806
00:47:00.760 --> 00:47:05.639
<v Speaker 1>time question asker Rachel Hartley, Evan Monroe, Lacy net Ducks, Float,

807
00:47:05.920 --> 00:47:09.960
<v Speaker 1>Ryan and Jasmine. First time question asker Megan Borossa, Jennifer Downey,

808
00:47:09.960 --> 00:47:14.960
<v Speaker 1>Amanda Lango, Lexi Bonafate, Michael Sherman, Celes Lewis, Alexander Remarkinova,

809
00:47:15.280 --> 00:47:19.239
<v Speaker 1>Joe Portifido, Emily Deck and Sarah so Erica wants to

810
00:47:19.239 --> 00:47:21.639
<v Speaker 1>know what the heck is actually going on in reported

811
00:47:21.840 --> 00:47:23.679
<v Speaker 1>instances of demon possession.

812
00:47:26.800 --> 00:47:36.119
<v Speaker 2>Okay, scientific brain first, something ugh, something psychologically unresolved. Maybe

813
00:47:36.320 --> 00:47:42.079
<v Speaker 2>my religious studies brain wants to say, whatever demon or

814
00:47:42.119 --> 00:47:44.800
<v Speaker 2>God they think is possessing them, I don't want to

815
00:47:44.880 --> 00:47:48.679
<v Speaker 2>necessarily write it off as being fake, at least from

816
00:47:48.719 --> 00:47:53.320
<v Speaker 2>the perspective of how that person is interacting with their

817
00:47:53.400 --> 00:47:57.119
<v Speaker 2>own world. You know, again, the religious studies side of

818
00:47:57.199 --> 00:48:00.079
<v Speaker 2>me says, whatever that person tells you is going on

819
00:48:00.360 --> 00:48:02.800
<v Speaker 2>is what is actually going on. You know that we

820
00:48:02.880 --> 00:48:05.840
<v Speaker 2>have to take them seriously about it. And then yeah,

821
00:48:05.920 --> 00:48:11.119
<v Speaker 2>scientific bran in the back is saying they're not really possessed, but.

822
00:48:11.840 --> 00:48:14.840
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, okay. Side note, there are scientific papers

823
00:48:14.840 --> 00:48:20.360
<v Speaker 1>of plenty describing medical conditions like Tourette syndrome, epilepsy, encephalitis

824
00:48:20.400 --> 00:48:25.480
<v Speaker 1>or brain inflammation, dissociative identity disorder, schizophrenia, and psychosis that

825
00:48:25.599 --> 00:48:29.559
<v Speaker 1>would to some look like demonic possession. And a twenty

826
00:48:29.599 --> 00:48:33.159
<v Speaker 1>fourteen article that ran in Culture, Medicine and Psychiatry titled

827
00:48:33.199 --> 00:48:37.000
<v Speaker 1>quote a Village Possessed by Witches a mixed method, case

828
00:48:37.039 --> 00:48:40.360
<v Speaker 1>controlled study of possession and common mental disorders in rural Nepal.

829
00:48:41.079 --> 00:48:45.559
<v Speaker 1>Researchers in this found that quote possessed women reported higher

830
00:48:45.639 --> 00:48:48.960
<v Speaker 1>rates of traumatic events and higher levels of symptoms of

831
00:48:49.000 --> 00:48:54.039
<v Speaker 1>mental disorder compared to non possessed women, so more anxiety, depression,

832
00:48:54.199 --> 00:48:58.239
<v Speaker 1>and PTSD. So some researchers think that the process of

833
00:48:58.320 --> 00:49:02.119
<v Speaker 1>letting a spirit or a demon act out through you

834
00:49:02.639 --> 00:49:05.920
<v Speaker 1>gives an outlet for distress, so a way to express

835
00:49:05.960 --> 00:49:10.440
<v Speaker 1>the pain of mental illness or socio political violence, or

836
00:49:10.639 --> 00:49:15.159
<v Speaker 1>past trauma or oppression. So not unlike our sloth being

837
00:49:15.239 --> 00:49:18.519
<v Speaker 1>blamed on belth the gore, a demon can throw things

838
00:49:18.599 --> 00:49:21.159
<v Speaker 1>and express anger and pain in a way that the

839
00:49:21.320 --> 00:49:24.599
<v Speaker 1>possessed aren't usually allowed to in their regular life, So

840
00:49:24.920 --> 00:49:27.480
<v Speaker 1>of course we're still learning how the brain works and

841
00:49:27.519 --> 00:49:31.119
<v Speaker 1>who the actual hell knows what the future will unfold

842
00:49:31.159 --> 00:49:34.920
<v Speaker 1>about like vaping or staring at cell phones. Who knows

843
00:49:34.920 --> 00:49:37.920
<v Speaker 1>what our brains are going through. Several people asked, what's

844
00:49:38.000 --> 00:49:42.239
<v Speaker 1>up with pentagrams? That has something to do with demons?

845
00:49:42.280 --> 00:49:46.679
<v Speaker 2>Right, it does. Pentagram It has a lot of different

846
00:49:46.760 --> 00:49:50.519
<v Speaker 2>symbolic uses again throughout history, so you can see them

847
00:49:50.559 --> 00:49:53.840
<v Speaker 2>all over in Greco Roman art, and they're not evil,

848
00:49:53.920 --> 00:49:57.280
<v Speaker 2>they're not associated with anything Satanic. Well, because you know

849
00:49:57.360 --> 00:50:00.800
<v Speaker 2>Greco Romans don't believe in the idea of Satan. Greco

850
00:50:00.880 --> 00:50:04.239
<v Speaker 2>Romans is that that's a group Greeks and Romans didn't

851
00:50:04.280 --> 00:50:07.199
<v Speaker 2>believe in that sort of concept. You start to see

852
00:50:07.239 --> 00:50:11.159
<v Speaker 2>it as a kind of reversed symbol. So sort of

853
00:50:11.199 --> 00:50:14.920
<v Speaker 2>like when you flip a cross upside down, it becomes

854
00:50:14.920 --> 00:50:17.880
<v Speaker 2>a symbol of evil, right, the same thing sort of

855
00:50:17.920 --> 00:50:22.320
<v Speaker 2>happens with the idea of the pentagram. It's usually with

856
00:50:22.559 --> 00:50:26.159
<v Speaker 2>point down if you see it in like films about

857
00:50:26.239 --> 00:50:30.239
<v Speaker 2>Satanic cults and things like that. Traditionally, the right side

858
00:50:30.280 --> 00:50:34.199
<v Speaker 2>up pentagram wouldn't have been a negative symbol it's only

859
00:50:34.239 --> 00:50:38.280
<v Speaker 2>when it's reversed that it becomes satanic. It's usually good luck,

860
00:50:38.599 --> 00:50:40.960
<v Speaker 2>sort of the right side up one. And modern day

861
00:50:40.960 --> 00:50:44.559
<v Speaker 2>Wicca obviously uses the pentagram as a symbol as well,

862
00:50:44.719 --> 00:50:48.119
<v Speaker 2>and certainly not satanic and certainly not evil. So maybe

863
00:50:48.119 --> 00:50:50.280
<v Speaker 2>that's one of the misconceptions that I should be clearing

864
00:50:50.360 --> 00:50:53.719
<v Speaker 2>up right now, is that witches don't worship Satan. Wickens

865
00:50:53.719 --> 00:50:56.199
<v Speaker 2>aren't into that at all. Do you see the same

866
00:50:56.320 --> 00:51:00.280
<v Speaker 2>thing with the swastika. The swastika in ancient India is

867
00:51:00.320 --> 00:51:04.679
<v Speaker 2>an extraordinarily positive symbol, good luck symbol, and what you

868
00:51:04.719 --> 00:51:09.079
<v Speaker 2>see in Nazi Germany is the reversal of that symbol

869
00:51:09.280 --> 00:51:14.920
<v Speaker 2>into the swastika, and it obviously takes on completely different connotations.

870
00:51:15.840 --> 00:51:18.960
<v Speaker 1>And do you think that also plays into this psychological

871
00:51:19.679 --> 00:51:22.800
<v Speaker 1>binary that we used to cope with what is good

872
00:51:22.840 --> 00:51:24.719
<v Speaker 1>and what is evil? Like, do we need to take

873
00:51:24.760 --> 00:51:28.079
<v Speaker 1>something and flip it completely on its head, take some

874
00:51:28.199 --> 00:51:30.519
<v Speaker 1>idea of a loving god and then switch it into

875
00:51:30.559 --> 00:51:34.400
<v Speaker 1>some guy who lives in the steps of hell that

876
00:51:34.440 --> 00:51:36.119
<v Speaker 1>wants to boil our balls and stuff.

877
00:51:36.280 --> 00:51:39.159
<v Speaker 2>Oh for sure, yes, yes. And if you have an

878
00:51:39.159 --> 00:51:44.199
<v Speaker 2>all powerful god, that gets super scary too, because if

879
00:51:44.239 --> 00:51:46.119
<v Speaker 2>you have an all powerful God, and this is kind

880
00:51:46.119 --> 00:51:50.000
<v Speaker 2>of a classic theological question. Why are bad things still

881
00:51:50.039 --> 00:51:53.719
<v Speaker 2>happening to us? So we have to come up with

882
00:51:53.760 --> 00:51:58.360
<v Speaker 2>some sort of powerful evil to explain that. Otherwise it

883
00:51:58.360 --> 00:52:01.320
<v Speaker 2>all has to be God. And nobody is really good

884
00:52:01.360 --> 00:52:03.880
<v Speaker 2>with that, Like, nobody wants to think that God is

885
00:52:03.880 --> 00:52:07.079
<v Speaker 2>doing all of this bad stuff. So we have to

886
00:52:07.079 --> 00:52:10.639
<v Speaker 2>come up with some kind of reversal of powers there,

887
00:52:10.880 --> 00:52:12.320
<v Speaker 2>and then you reverse the symbols.

888
00:52:12.599 --> 00:52:15.880
<v Speaker 1>Right, It's like God wouldn't let me trip, but obviously

889
00:52:16.360 --> 00:52:17.840
<v Speaker 1>I've been done by a trickster.

890
00:52:18.280 --> 00:52:18.760
<v Speaker 2>Exactly.

891
00:52:19.639 --> 00:52:23.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, A lot of people Laura Stacey, Nikki Finger, and

892
00:52:24.000 --> 00:52:27.400
<v Speaker 1>Nadav Leventov asked about sixty six to six being the

893
00:52:27.519 --> 00:52:31.119
<v Speaker 1>number of the beast and why I.

894
00:52:31.119 --> 00:52:31.920
<v Speaker 2>Should know that.

895
00:52:32.519 --> 00:52:34.440
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, right, No, I don't know.

896
00:52:35.039 --> 00:52:37.199
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I should know that, and I do not know that.

897
00:52:38.079 --> 00:52:40.440
<v Speaker 1>We'll look it up. Yeah, And let me just think

898
00:52:40.480 --> 00:52:45.880
<v Speaker 1>of how many properties are undervalued because they have six

899
00:52:45.960 --> 00:52:48.440
<v Speaker 1>six six in the address? You know, likely as long

900
00:52:48.440 --> 00:52:52.159
<v Speaker 1>as we're just tossing numbers around, how about Revelation thirteen

901
00:52:52.320 --> 00:52:55.880
<v Speaker 1>fifteen through eighteen, which reads, here is wisdom. Let him

902
00:52:55.920 --> 00:52:58.760
<v Speaker 1>that hath understand and count the number of the Beast,

903
00:52:59.119 --> 00:53:01.039
<v Speaker 1>for it is the number of a man, and his

904
00:53:01.199 --> 00:53:05.239
<v Speaker 1>number is six hundred three score and six. Other scholars

905
00:53:05.280 --> 00:53:08.119
<v Speaker 1>are like, hmmm, I think that translation is off. Maybe

906
00:53:08.119 --> 00:53:09.599
<v Speaker 1>your math is wrong and it is supposed to be

907
00:53:09.719 --> 00:53:14.039
<v Speaker 1>six one six. Oops, everyone in Grand Rapids, you just

908
00:53:14.159 --> 00:53:17.199
<v Speaker 1>skirted maybe having the area coat of the beast. But

909
00:53:17.239 --> 00:53:19.119
<v Speaker 1>no one scared of six one six like they are

910
00:53:19.159 --> 00:53:21.599
<v Speaker 1>of six six six. No one with six one six

911
00:53:21.639 --> 00:53:25.719
<v Speaker 1>addresses is scrambling with the county to change their mailbox numbers,

912
00:53:25.960 --> 00:53:29.199
<v Speaker 1>like one couple in spring Lake Park, Minnesota, who recently

913
00:53:29.400 --> 00:53:31.920
<v Speaker 1>had to fork over about one hundred dollars in fees

914
00:53:31.960 --> 00:53:35.440
<v Speaker 1>to change their address, saying they weren't superstitious, but it

915
00:53:35.480 --> 00:53:38.480
<v Speaker 1>was just hard to get plumbers and electricians out. And

916
00:53:38.679 --> 00:53:42.760
<v Speaker 1>the perhaps accursed six sixty six Fifth Avenue in Manhattan,

917
00:53:43.000 --> 00:53:46.000
<v Speaker 1>which was purchased in what ended up being a terrible

918
00:53:46.039 --> 00:53:48.920
<v Speaker 1>decision by Trump and law Jared Kushner, is about to

919
00:53:48.920 --> 00:53:53.119
<v Speaker 1>get a makeover that includes new windows and an address change,

920
00:53:53.239 --> 00:53:56.719
<v Speaker 1>while still remaining neatly wedged at fifty second and fifty

921
00:53:56.760 --> 00:54:00.960
<v Speaker 1>third between a church and a victorious secret. Oh, perhaps

922
00:54:01.000 --> 00:54:04.159
<v Speaker 1>that might inspire someone to write a sequel to Rosemary's Baby.

923
00:54:04.400 --> 00:54:06.840
<v Speaker 1>Joshua Harton wants to know where does this Where does

924
00:54:06.840 --> 00:54:08.880
<v Speaker 1>the legend that you should sell your soul to a

925
00:54:08.920 --> 00:54:11.519
<v Speaker 1>demon at a crossroads come from?

926
00:54:11.960 --> 00:54:17.960
<v Speaker 2>Oh, crossroads again if you sink back into Greco Roman mythology.

927
00:54:18.000 --> 00:54:19.360
<v Speaker 2>I know, I keep bringing that up.

928
00:54:19.920 --> 00:54:21.639
<v Speaker 1>No, it has a huge place.

929
00:54:21.840 --> 00:54:26.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's definitely the site of power, crossroads of all kinds,

930
00:54:26.679 --> 00:54:30.360
<v Speaker 2>the site of power. So I assume again it's one

931
00:54:30.400 --> 00:54:35.559
<v Speaker 2>of those a fear of particular sites of power and

932
00:54:35.599 --> 00:54:39.599
<v Speaker 2>not they're not necessarily evil, but it's sort of like

933
00:54:39.719 --> 00:54:44.480
<v Speaker 2>the liminal space between worlds, almost at the crossroads.

934
00:54:44.159 --> 00:54:46.599
<v Speaker 1>What you're afraid of you might encounter.

935
00:54:47.039 --> 00:54:53.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, it's not necessarily evil power. It's power period. Right.

936
00:54:54.000 --> 00:54:57.960
<v Speaker 2>If people see something like a crossroads or that type

937
00:54:57.960 --> 00:55:01.880
<v Speaker 2>of space as being just innately power powerful, it could

938
00:55:02.000 --> 00:55:05.239
<v Speaker 2>end up being something scary. So we're going to develop

939
00:55:05.320 --> 00:55:08.199
<v Speaker 2>stories out of that being the place in the world

940
00:55:08.320 --> 00:55:12.480
<v Speaker 2>where to put it. Sort of strangely, the veil is thin,

941
00:55:13.199 --> 00:55:16.800
<v Speaker 2>so to speak, sort of like on Halloween, right, the

942
00:55:16.880 --> 00:55:18.360
<v Speaker 2>veil between worlds is thin.

943
00:55:18.679 --> 00:55:22.400
<v Speaker 1>And do you feel like in your work Halloween is

944
00:55:23.039 --> 00:55:26.280
<v Speaker 1>kind of a busier time for you because we're all

945
00:55:26.320 --> 00:55:28.199
<v Speaker 1>in that spirit if you will.

946
00:55:28.800 --> 00:55:32.599
<v Speaker 2>Oh. Yeah, it's always fun, especially in the religion classes

947
00:55:32.599 --> 00:55:35.960
<v Speaker 2>when Halloween rolls around, and I always want to dress

948
00:55:36.039 --> 00:55:39.000
<v Speaker 2>up and go into class and I never do so

949
00:55:39.559 --> 00:55:42.960
<v Speaker 2>I really should. It's definitely a fun time of the year.

950
00:55:43.280 --> 00:55:45.639
<v Speaker 2>It's probably my favorite holiday. Still.

951
00:55:47.079 --> 00:55:49.679
<v Speaker 1>Do you give extra credit for people who dress as

952
00:55:49.760 --> 00:55:50.599
<v Speaker 1>historical demons?

953
00:55:50.840 --> 00:55:54.800
<v Speaker 2>I should. I want to tell my students that you suggested.

954
00:55:54.199 --> 00:55:59.199
<v Speaker 1>That if you had to dress as a demon in history,

955
00:56:00.079 --> 00:56:00.440
<v Speaker 1>did you go?

956
00:56:00.639 --> 00:56:04.199
<v Speaker 2>And then I dress us? Uh, the only the only

957
00:56:04.280 --> 00:56:07.000
<v Speaker 2>one I've ever dressed as, and it's not really demonic.

958
00:56:07.079 --> 00:56:10.239
<v Speaker 2>I did the classic devil with the blue dress one Halloween.

959
00:56:10.599 --> 00:56:12.159
<v Speaker 1>Oh that's amazing.

960
00:56:12.360 --> 00:56:14.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it was a really easy costume though. I was

961
00:56:14.400 --> 00:56:15.480
<v Speaker 2>just being super lazy.

962
00:56:17.800 --> 00:56:21.239
<v Speaker 1>So many people asked about demons across various cultures, and

963
00:56:21.320 --> 00:56:24.199
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to say your name's with my mouth so fast.

964
00:56:24.320 --> 00:56:27.559
<v Speaker 1>Matt and Crane, Dalton, Becky Woodruff, Hadley, Sarah Jeane Horwitz,

965
00:56:27.679 --> 00:56:31.199
<v Speaker 1>Rosie Crockett, Casey Flint, Hennah and Tay Allen, Andy Schuster,

966
00:56:31.280 --> 00:56:34.920
<v Speaker 1>Anna Thompson, Julia Sculligan, Liz Johansson, jeffre Kat, Sidney Brown,

967
00:56:34.960 --> 00:56:39.199
<v Speaker 1>Donald McLeod rot, Lanny Bauer, Leonna Schuster, Megan Jessica Tuba Sing,

968
00:56:39.360 --> 00:56:44.199
<v Speaker 1>Jesse Cole, Meghan Emmanuel Shanchez, Maya Ramon, Josie Gombas, David M. Williams,

969
00:56:44.239 --> 00:56:47.679
<v Speaker 1>Clark Bennett, Maria Delcatto, Gomaz, Shay good Ard, Kathleen Sachs,

970
00:56:47.760 --> 00:56:52.199
<v Speaker 1>Katie Nole, Enrique Sarmiento, Ryan Clark, Leon Schuster, Katherine Finney,

971
00:56:52.360 --> 00:56:57.239
<v Speaker 1>Alex Ellison, Marissa Nole, Who and Canon Perdy who asked

972
00:56:57.719 --> 00:57:01.119
<v Speaker 1>what are some differences between demons across cultures? As in

973
00:57:01.320 --> 00:57:05.159
<v Speaker 1>Japanese demons and devils versus Christian demons versus pagan Right,

974
00:57:05.280 --> 00:57:07.480
<v Speaker 1>So how do we see those across a lot of

975
00:57:07.480 --> 00:57:08.239
<v Speaker 1>different cultures?

976
00:57:08.400 --> 00:57:12.559
<v Speaker 2>Some of them are positive, And I think that's the

977
00:57:12.599 --> 00:57:16.000
<v Speaker 2>main distinction, that some of them are really positive creatures,

978
00:57:16.480 --> 00:57:19.280
<v Speaker 2>even though they might still get called demons. We have

979
00:57:19.400 --> 00:57:22.400
<v Speaker 2>such a negative association with that word in the English language,

980
00:57:22.760 --> 00:57:25.360
<v Speaker 2>much like we do with the term possession. But in

981
00:57:25.440 --> 00:57:31.199
<v Speaker 2>other cultures, again, their spirit beings, and they can be scary.

982
00:57:31.400 --> 00:57:33.880
<v Speaker 2>I mean, they can be scary as all hell, but

983
00:57:34.519 --> 00:57:38.920
<v Speaker 2>they're only scary towards evil people. So they're much more

984
00:57:39.000 --> 00:57:44.599
<v Speaker 2>protective than they are attacking good people. So I think

985
00:57:44.719 --> 00:57:49.079
<v Speaker 2>that's the major distinction still across cultures is that demons

986
00:57:49.119 --> 00:57:52.440
<v Speaker 2>aren't always bad. Like Thailand you get and in Japan

987
00:57:52.719 --> 00:57:56.920
<v Speaker 2>you get these protective figures that we would really perceive

988
00:57:57.000 --> 00:58:00.280
<v Speaker 2>as being demons because of how they look, and they

989
00:58:00.400 --> 00:58:03.119
<v Speaker 2>almost would look like our classic idea of what a

990
00:58:03.199 --> 00:58:07.400
<v Speaker 2>demonic presence would be, but they are protective.

991
00:58:07.679 --> 00:58:10.880
<v Speaker 1>So it's like a cool goat bitch having your back. Also,

992
00:58:10.960 --> 00:58:14.079
<v Speaker 1>a few of you had sleep paralysis questions, and we

993
00:58:14.159 --> 00:58:16.400
<v Speaker 1>do talk about this in a Smnology episode with doctor

994
00:58:16.440 --> 00:58:20.000
<v Speaker 1>Chris Winter, but for this one, E Kristin Anderson, Bruce r. Cordell,

995
00:58:20.280 --> 00:58:23.679
<v Speaker 1>Rachel Weiss, Katie Nole, and Skull again all asked asked

996
00:58:23.760 --> 00:58:28.480
<v Speaker 1>about sleep paralysis and about how that was considered to

997
00:58:28.519 --> 00:58:32.000
<v Speaker 1>be a demon sitting on your chest. But yeah, you know,

998
00:58:32.199 --> 00:58:34.079
<v Speaker 1>we know a little bit better now. Are there other

999
00:58:34.119 --> 00:58:37.360
<v Speaker 1>ways in which demons have been implicated in ancient or

1000
00:58:37.480 --> 00:58:38.599
<v Speaker 1>medieval medicine?

1001
00:58:38.800 --> 00:58:44.480
<v Speaker 2>Folks want to know, Yes, So crib death for sure. Again,

1002
00:58:44.599 --> 00:58:47.679
<v Speaker 2>going back to babies, it was often if you had

1003
00:58:47.719 --> 00:58:52.840
<v Speaker 2>somebody dying unexpectedly, and particularly if children died unexpectedly, that

1004
00:58:52.880 --> 00:58:56.880
<v Speaker 2>would get attributed to demons in some cases what we

1005
00:58:56.920 --> 00:59:00.400
<v Speaker 2>would think of today as sexually transmitted diseases. You could

1006
00:59:00.440 --> 00:59:05.880
<v Speaker 2>link those to demons as well. Infertility for sure, and

1007
00:59:06.639 --> 00:59:12.360
<v Speaker 2>male impotency. Yeah, always blame male impotency on demons. Right,

1008
00:59:12.840 --> 00:59:15.639
<v Speaker 2>It's not my fault. It's that demon over there that

1009
00:59:15.679 --> 00:59:16.199
<v Speaker 2>did it to me.

1010
00:59:16.719 --> 00:59:21.960
<v Speaker 1>The old demon makes alcoholic dick trickery. I e. Probably

1011
00:59:21.960 --> 00:59:22.960
<v Speaker 1>just drank too much meat.

1012
00:59:23.400 --> 00:59:26.639
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, a lot of medical stuff got sort of

1013
00:59:26.639 --> 00:59:29.360
<v Speaker 2>put on the shoulders of demons so that people didn't

1014
00:59:29.400 --> 00:59:32.000
<v Speaker 2>have to deal with it themselves. Yeah.

1015
00:59:32.079 --> 00:59:37.199
<v Speaker 1>I have to say, viagra does sound like a Greek goddess.

1016
00:59:36.639 --> 00:59:40.079
<v Speaker 2>Does, doesn't it. Yeah, you wonder why the inquisitors were

1017
00:59:40.079 --> 00:59:43.400
<v Speaker 2>so interested in writing about this stuff too. I guess

1018
00:59:43.400 --> 00:59:46.719
<v Speaker 2>we don't have to wonder that much, but yeah, they

1019
00:59:46.760 --> 00:59:48.719
<v Speaker 2>were very concerned with sexuality.

1020
00:59:49.000 --> 00:59:54.039
<v Speaker 1>So well, I understand that that Fifty Shades of Grace

1021
00:59:54.079 --> 01:00:01.119
<v Speaker 1>started out as Twilight. I know it's all related. Yeah,

1022
01:00:01.239 --> 01:00:04.000
<v Speaker 1>let's see. Jillian's mom sixteen asked is there a certain

1023
01:00:04.079 --> 01:00:07.079
<v Speaker 1>kind of person or emotional state that demons prey on?

1024
01:00:09.920 --> 01:00:14.320
<v Speaker 2>If demons are real, then I would feel like they

1025
01:00:14.360 --> 01:00:19.000
<v Speaker 2>would pray on Oh my gosh, I guess people who

1026
01:00:19.000 --> 01:00:21.880
<v Speaker 2>are having a really difficult time in their lives that

1027
01:00:21.920 --> 01:00:24.559
<v Speaker 2>would make sense. I would think that would open them

1028
01:00:24.639 --> 01:00:28.880
<v Speaker 2>up to some kind of demonic presence. If people are

1029
01:00:28.920 --> 01:00:32.079
<v Speaker 2>looking for some kind of power in their.

1030
01:00:31.920 --> 01:00:35.880
<v Speaker 1>Lives, maybe something like depression is almost a thinning of

1031
01:00:35.920 --> 01:00:40.199
<v Speaker 1>the veil keen darkness and light. So I don't know.

1032
01:00:40.239 --> 01:00:42.519
<v Speaker 1>Maybe demons are like, he's bummed out, I'm going to

1033
01:00:42.559 --> 01:00:46.440
<v Speaker 1>go fuck with him exactly. Yes, interesting, what an asshole.

1034
01:00:47.599 --> 01:00:50.800
<v Speaker 1>A few people, including Raymond J. Deutsche, asked where did

1035
01:00:50.840 --> 01:00:54.360
<v Speaker 1>God Bless You actually originate? What is the flim flam

1036
01:00:54.519 --> 01:00:55.960
<v Speaker 1>about the devil and sneezing?

1037
01:00:56.960 --> 01:00:59.679
<v Speaker 2>It would be there was a fear in a lot

1038
01:00:59.719 --> 01:01:05.440
<v Speaker 2>of cltures that sneezing sort of opened yours, allowed your

1039
01:01:05.480 --> 01:01:08.159
<v Speaker 2>soul to get out of your body, so that all

1040
01:01:08.199 --> 01:01:10.360
<v Speaker 2>of the different sort of God Bless You and kazoom

1041
01:01:10.400 --> 01:01:13.000
<v Speaker 2>Tite and all of that sort of thing was supposed

1042
01:01:13.039 --> 01:01:14.800
<v Speaker 2>to be almost a countermeasure to.

1043
01:01:14.800 --> 01:01:18.639
<v Speaker 1>That protection, like keep it in there exactly. It's not

1044
01:01:18.800 --> 01:01:23.079
<v Speaker 1>off of minute. A few people had questions about famous

1045
01:01:23.079 --> 01:01:27.519
<v Speaker 1>demonologists Ed and Lorraine Warren, including one Pager Martinez and

1046
01:01:28.239 --> 01:01:30.280
<v Speaker 1>Aaron Elizabeth Becker wants to know how you feel about

1047
01:01:30.400 --> 01:01:35.719
<v Speaker 1>Ed and Lorraine Warren, who were kind of famed demonologists.

1048
01:01:36.159 --> 01:01:41.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I don't know. It's sort of like watching ancient aliens, right,

1049
01:01:41.920 --> 01:01:48.159
<v Speaker 2>It's fun for a while, But I don't know. I

1050
01:01:48.159 --> 01:01:52.599
<v Speaker 2>don't really have much of an opinion on professional demonologists.

1051
01:01:52.960 --> 01:01:56.039
<v Speaker 2>I don't know. I want to study them, I guess.

1052
01:01:56.400 --> 01:01:58.800
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, sure, I mean you study the people who study demons,

1053
01:01:58.800 --> 01:01:59.880
<v Speaker 1>which makes sense exactly.

1054
01:02:00.119 --> 01:02:00.679
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

1055
01:02:00.800 --> 01:02:03.599
<v Speaker 1>Greg Wallach has a great question our personal demons the

1056
01:02:03.639 --> 01:02:04.760
<v Speaker 1>scariest of all.

1057
01:02:05.119 --> 01:02:09.440
<v Speaker 2>Of course, right, Yeah, And I think it has a

1058
01:02:09.480 --> 01:02:11.639
<v Speaker 2>lot to do with how we depict these sorts of

1059
01:02:11.679 --> 01:02:15.920
<v Speaker 2>things cross culturally. It really does come down to we're

1060
01:02:15.960 --> 01:02:19.000
<v Speaker 2>trying to make our fears things that we can deal

1061
01:02:19.039 --> 01:02:21.960
<v Speaker 2>with a lot of the time, and even putting that

1062
01:02:22.079 --> 01:02:25.559
<v Speaker 2>into a super scary form, you know, with horns and big,

1063
01:02:25.639 --> 01:02:29.719
<v Speaker 2>rest red, musty bodies and all of that, it allows

1064
01:02:29.800 --> 01:02:32.400
<v Speaker 2>us to sort of confront it in a way that

1065
01:02:32.440 --> 01:02:35.360
<v Speaker 2>we can't when we just keep it internal. So it's

1066
01:02:35.440 --> 01:02:39.519
<v Speaker 2>like demons therapy maybe, Yeah.

1067
01:02:39.039 --> 01:02:42.119
<v Speaker 1>That makes sense. Yeah. Danielle Vaughn says, I've read that

1068
01:02:42.159 --> 01:02:45.159
<v Speaker 1>the Vatican has an exorcism division and that the legit

1069
01:02:45.280 --> 01:02:47.800
<v Speaker 1>have trouble with people willing to do this job. Is

1070
01:02:47.840 --> 01:02:48.480
<v Speaker 1>that a real thing?

1071
01:02:48.920 --> 01:02:52.400
<v Speaker 2>I believe it came back in about a decade ago. Yes,

1072
01:02:52.840 --> 01:02:57.039
<v Speaker 2>so for a while I think the church had sort

1073
01:02:57.079 --> 01:03:01.559
<v Speaker 2>of debunked the whole idea of exorcism and possession. But

1074
01:03:01.760 --> 01:03:04.800
<v Speaker 2>I think it's actually there is now a division, but

1075
01:03:04.880 --> 01:03:08.599
<v Speaker 2>it's relatively recent that it's come back into vogue, so

1076
01:03:08.679 --> 01:03:09.159
<v Speaker 2>to speak.

1077
01:03:09.639 --> 01:03:11.559
<v Speaker 1>I guess now that the Pope is on Twitter, you

1078
01:03:11.559 --> 01:03:14.360
<v Speaker 1>could always just ask him about it. Jessica Lee wants

1079
01:03:14.400 --> 01:03:16.679
<v Speaker 1>to know what is the worst demon horror movie you

1080
01:03:16.719 --> 01:03:17.400
<v Speaker 1>have ever seen?

1081
01:03:18.239 --> 01:03:21.800
<v Speaker 2>Oh gosh, I was just thinking of this the other day.

1082
01:03:22.159 --> 01:03:27.000
<v Speaker 2>The Prince of Darkness. Okay, it's really old, well, not

1083
01:03:27.119 --> 01:03:31.239
<v Speaker 2>really old. It's like the eighties, late eighties horror movie.

1084
01:03:31.639 --> 01:03:35.559
<v Speaker 2>It's wonderful and horrible at the same time. It's all

1085
01:03:35.760 --> 01:03:40.840
<v Speaker 2>around this concept of a corrupt priesthood surprise surprise calling

1086
01:03:40.920 --> 01:03:46.039
<v Speaker 2>the Brotherhood of Sleep, and they're they're keeping Satan in

1087
01:03:46.159 --> 01:03:50.440
<v Speaker 2>this sort of tupperware jar kind of thing anyway, and

1088
01:03:50.480 --> 01:03:52.639
<v Speaker 2>it obviously finally breaks free.

1089
01:03:53.320 --> 01:03:55.519
<v Speaker 1>I look this up and it's a lot of gooey

1090
01:03:55.599 --> 01:03:59.480
<v Speaker 1>special effects makeup and people vomiting garden hoses of water

1091
01:03:59.559 --> 01:04:01.079
<v Speaker 1>on each other. Oh oh.

1092
01:04:01.119 --> 01:04:04.760
<v Speaker 2>In the cameos, famously, Alice Cooper has a role in it.

1093
01:04:05.239 --> 01:04:08.840
<v Speaker 2>Oh God, wonderful. So yeah, Prince of Darkness. If you

1094
01:04:08.880 --> 01:04:11.199
<v Speaker 2>haven't seen that one, watch that one.

1095
01:04:11.480 --> 01:04:12.079
<v Speaker 1>Okay.

1096
01:04:12.239 --> 01:04:12.719
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

1097
01:04:12.840 --> 01:04:15.719
<v Speaker 1>A few people had questions about D and D. This

1098
01:04:15.840 --> 01:04:19.599
<v Speaker 1>dungeony dragony question was also asked by Baron and Dion Damlo.

1099
01:04:19.840 --> 01:04:22.039
<v Speaker 1>James Hales wants to know how accurate are the D

1100
01:04:22.079 --> 01:04:24.480
<v Speaker 1>and D Monster Manuals in regard to demons.

1101
01:04:24.599 --> 01:04:27.119
<v Speaker 2>I still have one sitting behind me right now. Yeah,

1102
01:04:27.159 --> 01:04:29.920
<v Speaker 2>I do. They're great, No, they really are. There's another

1103
01:04:30.119 --> 01:04:32.719
<v Speaker 2>sort of people who did their research really well. A

1104
01:04:32.719 --> 01:04:35.920
<v Speaker 2>lot of them are based on either demigods or all

1105
01:04:35.960 --> 01:04:40.400
<v Speaker 2>sorts of things from other mythologies. So Monster Manual is

1106
01:04:40.400 --> 01:04:42.440
<v Speaker 2>a good way to go, especially if you are trying

1107
01:04:42.440 --> 01:04:45.440
<v Speaker 2>to write a story or write a film. And I

1108
01:04:45.519 --> 01:04:48.920
<v Speaker 2>love I mean, just the different powers that they all get.

1109
01:04:49.000 --> 01:04:53.400
<v Speaker 2>It's so great. The minds that created those things are wonderful.

1110
01:04:53.559 --> 01:04:56.400
<v Speaker 1>On the topic of books, Mandy Smith has a question,

1111
01:04:56.480 --> 01:04:58.159
<v Speaker 1>are there any good books where I can learn about

1112
01:04:58.159 --> 01:05:03.159
<v Speaker 1>different demon, witchy, etc. Symbols? Mandy says, I've been watching

1113
01:05:03.159 --> 01:05:05.039
<v Speaker 1>a lot of supernatural just don't really want to learn

1114
01:05:05.039 --> 01:05:07.719
<v Speaker 1>about them. But other than taking your course, I mean,

1115
01:05:07.920 --> 01:05:09.559
<v Speaker 1>people could always just go to school.

1116
01:05:09.760 --> 01:05:12.400
<v Speaker 2>Yes, there are a lot. I mean it depends on

1117
01:05:12.440 --> 01:05:15.400
<v Speaker 2>the period that you're interested in. Obviously, I love the

1118
01:05:15.440 --> 01:05:18.960
<v Speaker 2>medieval period for this stuff. There is a fantastic book

1119
01:05:19.000 --> 01:05:21.679
<v Speaker 2>if you're really interested in how it went down. It's

1120
01:05:21.719 --> 01:05:23.559
<v Speaker 2>is sort of like, you know how you have like

1121
01:05:23.679 --> 01:05:29.719
<v Speaker 2>academic crushes sometimes on particular authors. All of this started

1122
01:05:29.719 --> 01:05:33.400
<v Speaker 2>when I read one particular book called Demon Lovers, a

1123
01:05:33.440 --> 01:05:37.400
<v Speaker 2>guy named Walter Stevens. It's just a brilliant book and

1124
01:05:37.440 --> 01:05:40.719
<v Speaker 2>it's really detailed, and his research is fantastic, but he

1125
01:05:40.840 --> 01:05:45.559
<v Speaker 2>writes so well, so that would be one of my suggestions.

1126
01:05:45.599 --> 01:05:50.000
<v Speaker 2>It's not like overly academic. I mean, it's very academic,

1127
01:05:50.039 --> 01:05:52.239
<v Speaker 2>but it's so well written that you don't really notice it.

1128
01:05:52.719 --> 01:05:54.679
<v Speaker 2>So Demon Lovers excellent.

1129
01:05:55.559 --> 01:05:58.480
<v Speaker 1>Vince Alasha and a few others wanted to know what

1130
01:05:58.559 --> 01:06:02.280
<v Speaker 1>your opinion is on ghost and demon hunting reality shows.

1131
01:06:02.480 --> 01:06:04.400
<v Speaker 1>I love Can You Trust Them?

1132
01:06:04.480 --> 01:06:07.320
<v Speaker 2>I love them? Yeah, I love watching them, and my

1133
01:06:07.400 --> 01:06:10.719
<v Speaker 2>husband mocks me for it because again I don't believe

1134
01:06:10.760 --> 01:06:14.360
<v Speaker 2>in ghosts. But then I sit there watching ghost Hunters, right,

1135
01:06:14.920 --> 01:06:18.719
<v Speaker 2>makes no sense. I've never seen them show anything that

1136
01:06:19.559 --> 01:06:23.239
<v Speaker 2>proves it to me. I, for some reason, obviously still

1137
01:06:23.320 --> 01:06:24.360
<v Speaker 2>enjoy the shows.

1138
01:06:25.159 --> 01:06:28.079
<v Speaker 1>I mean it's because they structure it to where you

1139
01:06:28.159 --> 01:06:30.880
<v Speaker 1>have to watch after the commercial break. That's how they

1140
01:06:30.920 --> 01:06:31.840
<v Speaker 1>get you you of course.

1141
01:06:31.960 --> 01:06:35.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's going on.

1142
01:06:37.199 --> 01:06:42.119
<v Speaker 1>What is your least favorite thing about studying demonology? What sucks?

1143
01:06:42.320 --> 01:06:45.840
<v Speaker 1>Is it? Grading papers? Is it? Is it a manuscript?

1144
01:06:45.920 --> 01:06:49.159
<v Speaker 1>Mike graffiche what's something that just sucks about the field

1145
01:06:49.239 --> 01:06:50.000
<v Speaker 1>or about demons?

1146
01:06:51.519 --> 01:06:54.400
<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, nobody likes grading papers. I've never met a

1147
01:06:54.400 --> 01:06:57.920
<v Speaker 2>professor who enjoys grading papers, that's for sure. I think

1148
01:06:58.360 --> 01:07:01.920
<v Speaker 2>probably some of the miss understandings, Like I said, about

1149
01:07:01.920 --> 01:07:05.920
<v Speaker 2>the field, that's a problem. I've had students end up

1150
01:07:06.000 --> 01:07:11.760
<v Speaker 2>on prayer circles because they were taking my classes. I've

1151
01:07:11.800 --> 01:07:17.840
<v Speaker 2>had students get threatening emails because they were taking my classes. Yeah,

1152
01:07:18.079 --> 01:07:22.199
<v Speaker 2>so there's a lot of misunderstanding out there about that.

1153
01:07:22.960 --> 01:07:27.760
<v Speaker 2>So probably one grading papers too. You are never going

1154
01:07:27.800 --> 01:07:33.760
<v Speaker 2>to make money being in religious studies ever, But the

1155
01:07:33.800 --> 01:07:36.119
<v Speaker 2>misunderstandings probably the big thing.

1156
01:07:36.760 --> 01:07:41.079
<v Speaker 1>And what is your favorite thing about your study of demons?

1157
01:07:42.000 --> 01:07:42.800
<v Speaker 1>What do you love the most?

1158
01:07:45.360 --> 01:07:48.719
<v Speaker 2>It's how it can tie into so much other stuff.

1159
01:07:48.880 --> 01:07:52.880
<v Speaker 2>So I love traveling, Like I have a real problem

1160
01:07:53.079 --> 01:07:57.840
<v Speaker 2>with travel. I want to constantly be traveling and this

1161
01:07:58.000 --> 01:08:01.320
<v Speaker 2>ties into it perfectly because, like I said, you look

1162
01:08:01.320 --> 01:08:04.599
<v Speaker 2>at the Taie demons and they're so completely different from

1163
01:08:04.639 --> 01:08:08.880
<v Speaker 2>the Japanese stuff, from the ancient Greco Roman things. So

1164
01:08:09.039 --> 01:08:12.599
<v Speaker 2>every culture you go into you can find something about this.

1165
01:08:13.119 --> 01:08:15.880
<v Speaker 2>And so that's really what's fun for me is that

1166
01:08:15.920 --> 01:08:19.159
<v Speaker 2>I can tie all of this together and have a

1167
01:08:19.159 --> 01:08:20.119
<v Speaker 2>good time doing it.

1168
01:08:20.479 --> 01:08:22.680
<v Speaker 1>When you're traveling, do you ever have to worry about

1169
01:08:23.239 --> 01:08:28.039
<v Speaker 1>demons trying to hide your passport even diarrhea?

1170
01:08:28.119 --> 01:08:31.239
<v Speaker 2>Yes, I'm such a freak about my passport. I always

1171
01:08:31.279 --> 01:08:34.399
<v Speaker 2>know exactly where it is, and it's usually in my

1172
01:08:34.479 --> 01:08:37.119
<v Speaker 2>purse just in case I need to sort of make

1173
01:08:37.119 --> 01:08:40.279
<v Speaker 2>a break for it. Yeah, constant joke that every time

1174
01:08:40.279 --> 01:08:42.680
<v Speaker 2>we drive past an airport, I'm sort of nudging my

1175
01:08:42.800 --> 01:08:45.319
<v Speaker 2>husband like let's just go, we don't have to go

1176
01:08:45.399 --> 01:08:48.000
<v Speaker 2>to Thanksgiving dinner, let's just go do something else.

1177
01:08:48.600 --> 01:08:50.359
<v Speaker 1>So I love it you just like you're ready to

1178
01:08:50.479 --> 01:08:52.000
<v Speaker 1>jam in it totally.

1179
01:08:52.239 --> 01:08:55.720
<v Speaker 2>Yes. In fact, I usually keep a little backpack of

1180
01:08:56.199 --> 01:08:58.640
<v Speaker 2>a change of clothes and stuff in the car just

1181
01:08:58.720 --> 01:09:00.720
<v Speaker 2>in case I get to take off somewhere.

1182
01:09:01.800 --> 01:09:02.840
<v Speaker 1>The travel demon.

1183
01:09:03.079 --> 01:09:05.680
<v Speaker 2>I know that's it has it has.

1184
01:09:06.640 --> 01:09:09.359
<v Speaker 1>Thank you so much for doing this I'm less afraid

1185
01:09:09.399 --> 01:09:12.000
<v Speaker 1>of demons. Actually, not that I was really scared, but

1186
01:09:12.600 --> 01:09:14.680
<v Speaker 1>now I just feel like they're just they just want

1187
01:09:14.720 --> 01:09:16.920
<v Speaker 1>to watch me trip and fall, and they do also

1188
01:09:16.960 --> 01:09:17.680
<v Speaker 1>in my own head.

1189
01:09:18.000 --> 01:09:20.199
<v Speaker 2>Yes, yes, and you can just you know, go get

1190
01:09:20.239 --> 01:09:23.079
<v Speaker 2>a little statue of one of the cute Thai rainbow

1191
01:09:23.079 --> 01:09:25.119
<v Speaker 2>demons and keep that and it'll protect you.

1192
01:09:26.359 --> 01:09:29.479
<v Speaker 1>I love them. Yeah, thank you so much for doing this.

1193
01:09:29.520 --> 01:09:30.439
<v Speaker 1>Have a safe Halloween.

1194
01:09:30.520 --> 01:09:31.520
<v Speaker 2>Thank you, Elie, you too.

1195
01:09:32.520 --> 01:09:36.479
<v Speaker 1>This has been awesome. So ask smart scholars stupid spooky

1196
01:09:36.560 --> 01:09:40.560
<v Speaker 1>questions because they are just treasure troves of lore. Now.

1197
01:09:40.560 --> 01:09:43.079
<v Speaker 1>There are tons of links in the show notes and

1198
01:09:43.399 --> 01:09:47.520
<v Speaker 1>up at aliward dot com, slash ologies, slash Demonology, and

1199
01:09:47.640 --> 01:09:52.279
<v Speaker 1>to follow doctor Elisabeel. She's at Alysa dot beale on Instagram.

1200
01:09:52.479 --> 01:09:56.159
<v Speaker 1>We are Ologies on Twitter and Instagram. I'm Ali Ward

1201
01:09:56.239 --> 01:09:58.800
<v Speaker 1>with one L on both, so do follow along there.

1202
01:09:59.079 --> 01:10:02.439
<v Speaker 1>Ologies Merch is available at ologiesmerch dot com. Thank you

1203
01:10:02.520 --> 01:10:05.279
<v Speaker 1>Shannon Feltis and Bonnie Dutch of the podcast You are

1204
01:10:05.319 --> 01:10:07.640
<v Speaker 1>That for managing that, and thank you Eron Talbert and

1205
01:10:07.680 --> 01:10:11.079
<v Speaker 1>Hannah Lippo for admitting the Facebook Ologies podcast group. Thank

1206
01:10:11.119 --> 01:10:14.319
<v Speaker 1>you to Emily White and all of the Ologies transcribers

1207
01:10:14.359 --> 01:10:17.760
<v Speaker 1>who are making transcripts available. You can go to aliward

1208
01:10:17.760 --> 01:10:21.800
<v Speaker 1>dot com slash ologies, dash extras for those I'll pop

1209
01:10:21.840 --> 01:10:24.199
<v Speaker 1>that link in the show notes, and you can join

1210
01:10:24.239 --> 01:10:26.359
<v Speaker 1>that Facebook group of transcribers if you want to help

1211
01:10:26.399 --> 01:10:29.439
<v Speaker 1>make transcripts available. You can also search the transcripts on

1212
01:10:29.479 --> 01:10:31.760
<v Speaker 1>the site if you're looking for particular passages you want

1213
01:10:31.760 --> 01:10:35.600
<v Speaker 1>to remember. Thank you also to devilishly handsome assistant editor

1214
01:10:35.680 --> 01:10:38.880
<v Speaker 1>Jared Sleeper for helping me with some spooky research and

1215
01:10:39.000 --> 01:10:41.960
<v Speaker 1>driving like fifteen of the sixteen hours on this weekend's

1216
01:10:42.000 --> 01:10:44.840
<v Speaker 1>road trip to see my family. You're the best. Thank

1217
01:10:44.840 --> 01:10:47.720
<v Speaker 1>you to the always wonderful Stephen Ray Morris for pulling

1218
01:10:47.760 --> 01:10:51.079
<v Speaker 1>all the pieces together each week, and to Nick Thorburn

1219
01:10:51.079 --> 01:10:53.720
<v Speaker 1>who wrote and performed the theme music. And if you

1220
01:10:53.840 --> 01:10:55.359
<v Speaker 1>listen all the way to the end, you know I

1221
01:10:55.359 --> 01:10:57.960
<v Speaker 1>tell you a secret each week, and this week is

1222
01:10:58.000 --> 01:11:03.199
<v Speaker 1>that I've never seen The Omen or The Exorcist, and

1223
01:11:03.239 --> 01:11:06.479
<v Speaker 1>they were both so terrifying, But honestly, it's the barfing

1224
01:11:06.960 --> 01:11:09.520
<v Speaker 1>in the Exorcist that I'm like most afraid of that

1225
01:11:09.600 --> 01:11:11.600
<v Speaker 1>seems like it would just really stick with you, man.

1226
01:11:11.800 --> 01:11:14.079
<v Speaker 1>I feel like I saw just a millisecond of a clip,

1227
01:11:14.159 --> 01:11:17.039
<v Speaker 1>and I'm like, well that's enough. That's enough of that. Also,

1228
01:11:17.159 --> 01:11:20.680
<v Speaker 1>I'm just gonna be very honest, I'm hella happy to

1229
01:11:20.720 --> 01:11:23.760
<v Speaker 1>be finishing this episode because after working on it late

1230
01:11:23.840 --> 01:11:27.720
<v Speaker 1>last night, getting asked deep and demon trivia, I had

1231
01:11:27.840 --> 01:11:31.159
<v Speaker 1>nothing but a horror show of LA traffic. Getting to

1232
01:11:31.239 --> 01:11:33.880
<v Speaker 1>the airport this morning at like five in the morning,

1233
01:11:34.119 --> 01:11:37.000
<v Speaker 1>there was tons of traffic. My lift driver got lost.

1234
01:11:37.279 --> 01:11:40.319
<v Speaker 1>I had to run through TSA my shoes alarmed. I

1235
01:11:40.359 --> 01:11:42.600
<v Speaker 1>had to throw my shoe on the belt. It fell

1236
01:11:42.640 --> 01:11:45.680
<v Speaker 1>behind the x Roym machine and all the TSA people

1237
01:11:45.720 --> 01:11:48.199
<v Speaker 1>were like, sucks to be you man. So then I

1238
01:11:48.239 --> 01:11:52.840
<v Speaker 1>had to run through LAX with no shoes. I just

1239
01:11:53.000 --> 01:11:57.880
<v Speaker 1>ditched that shoe like a very haggard, bleary eyed, sad Cinderella.

1240
01:11:58.000 --> 01:12:00.000
<v Speaker 1>I just left a shoe. I didn't have any other

1241
01:12:00.199 --> 01:12:02.800
<v Speaker 1>shoes in my luggage, so then I just ran in

1242
01:12:03.000 --> 01:12:06.159
<v Speaker 1>socks all the way through the American terminal. I finally

1243
01:12:06.159 --> 01:12:07.920
<v Speaker 1>got to my gate and they're like, we can't let

1244
01:12:07.960 --> 01:12:09.880
<v Speaker 1>you on a plane without shoes, you freak. And I

1245
01:12:09.920 --> 01:12:11.960
<v Speaker 1>was like, whatever, I'll buy shoes and I get to Boston.

1246
01:12:12.279 --> 01:12:15.439
<v Speaker 1>So then my producer luckily had tossed an extra pair

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01:12:15.439 --> 01:12:17.680
<v Speaker 1>of shoes in her bag. I put on her shoes.

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<v Speaker 1>Thank you, Stephanie, thank you Carly. You're both the best.

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01:12:20.720 --> 01:12:23.239
<v Speaker 1>I made it on the flight, but I'm still hoarse

1250
01:12:23.279 --> 01:12:25.760
<v Speaker 1>from panting, and I'm just saying I'm over this demon shit.

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01:12:26.039 --> 01:12:29.439
<v Speaker 1>You guys. I'm sorry, demons. I hope we're all good now.

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01:12:29.800 --> 01:12:32.520
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to burn a cinnamon stick or something. And

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01:12:32.600 --> 01:12:35.319
<v Speaker 1>I really just hope that George Clooney doesn't try to

1254
01:12:35.319 --> 01:12:38.039
<v Speaker 1>pull any shit on me either, for that mat or two. Okay, buddy,

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<v Speaker 1>all right. Pacaderman College Mambiology or doo Zoology, lithology, technology, meteorology, bonology, anthology, zereology, elinology.

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<v Speaker 1>Demons demons, Demons drink them mountain dew.