Speaker 1: Meaning a live man like this man letting butterfly flapping
his wing.
Speaker 2: Dig down in the forest.
Speaker 3: Man, it gonna cause a tree fall, letting five thousand
miles away.
Speaker 4: Man, nobody's seen nobody.
Speaker 5: You see.
Speaker 3: You don't need no man's luck.
Speaker 2: You call a little story and you got racked for
like that. I'll win. Man, don't like a dang on
the panel.
Speaker 1: Man, Man, you don't don't matter.
Speaker 6: Man all right, more goth Welcome back to Jay Burtonshaw.
Speaker 7: How you doing man, Hellotle getting jit nice to see again.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm glad to have you. I uh, I think
this is roughly the pattern that has been going on
for two or three years, which is that I assume
that I have talked to you more recently. I check
our DMS and see it has been exactly a year
since we spoke last. So I'm really glad to have
you on. I was recently watching something you put on
on substack, just sort of your your year in review
right for twenty twenty five. And as I said, you know,
before we went live, I'm not able to, you know,
consume as much media on what happens in the UK,
just because it's not where I live. I don't have
the context, but I rely on a few sources you
included to understand what's going on. And you mentioned, you know,
several kind of themes, right, what's going on in your country?
And I guess I'll throw it to you. You know,
we were talking to this before. You know what is
going on? What are kind of the main themes of
twenty twenty five because to be perfectly blunt man from
the outside looking in, it's it's incredibly grim.
Speaker 2: Yes, I think.
Speaker 7: I've did like a year room review where I went
through the articles of the air just to sort of
recop of everything that had happened and things that I
wrote about and to sort of see if those any
kind of through lane.
Speaker 2: And it was there, really was.
Speaker 7: You can see the right at the beginning of the
year when Elon Musk and Rupert Low and Hammer and
tongues on the grooming gangs and things. But to get
a real which sort of you know, annoyse the British
establishment a lot because they take a dirty little secret.
And I did an article that it's our I mean,
I've been seeing for a long time and I've been
comparing our situation to sort of the Soviet Union and
the the the grooming gang issues is kind of like
the reactor five of Chernobyl. It's it's this sort of
massive disaster, catastrophic that that, and you see all the
different layers of what's gone wrong is kind of encapsulated
with that with that one scandal from top to bottom.
You see like as if like the term mats have
just Hollywood out of woodn't been all of it. What's
wrong with Britain is encapsulated that. And then I did
another one which is about the Borrows Wave and the
effects of the Borrows Wave on the country, and I
think a lot of the panic and the trauma was
the way people when people discuss mass immigration in Britain
on the right, you often hear that a quote from
a Tony Blair speechwriter called Andrew Neila who he said
that they and was to rub the right nose and
diversity and what he meant was to change the demographics,
to change so the politics would have to change it
to do it deliberately. And I think what happened with
Boris Johnson and the millions that he led in where
you get this famous graph where the line just screams up,
was it's it's insane. And I think what actually happened
was that the center right Tory Party rubbed the left
knows and diversity. And what I mean is their sort
of view, their values and their principles beforehand had been
in the abstract because there's so many places in Britain
still hadn't been touched by diversity. And after the Borrows
wave that's they have, especially in England. You can go
to some far from places in Scotland or Wales, Northern Ireland,
but basically it's everywhere now and all of a sudden
this year in particular, you began to see more and
more not just the grooming gangs which flared up again
and the issues around that, but sort of random violence
and especially from the illegal immigrants who's been housed in hotels,
and sort of girls and.
Speaker 2: Women being raped and actually abused and.
Speaker 7: Casual random violence. And I think what this en In particular,
we saw the rise of this meme which it began
on Twitter by Crumbler Grouply or whatever he's called, where
they call it the UK and they mean like why ok, why,
which I can get into that because it is interesting
and so something was clearly happening and there was a
sense that were it's of de territorialization and the aesthetics
of it. That's what that amounts to, really, and all
of a sudden you saw that what the UK reflects
and is a reality of twenty twenty five. Of course
it's been coming for a while, which is squalid and
unpleasant and far far away from the kind of pr
multicultural propaganda that we used to get. This is why
I say it's almost like the left's face got rubed
in diversity, because it's like, well, we're in it now.
I mean, it's important to say as well, like in
the two thousands before Brexit, most of our immigration was
coming from the European Union, so they were just other
Europeans recent Europeans polls, but also people from France or Holland,
and so they had that kind of cushion. But after
and especially after the Boris with they just came in
from everywhere on Earth like we've never seen before. And
so for the first time those values and principles are
manifested in the real world. And then alongside that, compounding
that kind of feeling of just everything being decredit everything
being a bit shit, is the economic issues, which are
facing and shops closing, boarded up shops, and so you
get this strange thing with this UK aesthetics they call it,
where you'll have late's here a Muslim woman standing in
like a sort of fishing village in well Wheels, talking
about how well she is. All of this kind of thing.
You'll get like a car crashed into a vape shop
with a Turkish barbers next door, and all of this,
and it alls. It all seems weird and alien and
and it's as if like the country has just been
transformed into something else with which it which it largely has,
and the normal people recognize this as well. And this
is what we were talking about just before we went live, where.
Speaker 2: You get this.
Speaker 7: On top of all of that, you've got this kind
of suffocating surveillance state and the bureaucracy that goes with it.
Speaker 2: So it's just it just could.
Speaker 7: Sort of ticks so many boxes of this state of dystopia.
And one of the things about the sort of the
mode that we're in is there's a denial of it.
You know, in the past, and I've written some things
about this to the Myra Hindley sort of murders and
things on substack and how that relates today. But if
you go in the past, for example, if you go
into a different era of Britain, British history to take
for example, when Thatcher was closing heavy industry down like
the coal mines in the nineteen eighties, you had protests,
you had unrest. There was at least some kind of
highbrow commentary on that. There was a discussion and people
could sort of philosophize over it and get sort of
fury cell takes in about what was happening to the country.
But because of the nature of they say political correctness
and where we are now, it's almost taboo for that.
So you'll find people writing about it on substock or twila.
But the conversation that we should be having, we can't.
And of course everybody's scared that they're going to get fired.
Or on top of all of that, it's now legendary
the hate speech laws and people going to jail for
tweets and things in Britain, and all of this comes
from a place I think of profound insecurity of the
managerial state itself.
Speaker 6: Well, I'm glad you you mentioned the kind of analogy
to the late Soviet Union because there's there's recently been
a case where a man has been jailed for I
don't remem exactly how long, a truly ludicrous amount of time, regardless,
for sending anti immigration tweets. And you dig a layer
down and you find out that these tweets were viewed
by thirty people. You don't have to be criminally online
to realize criminally terminally online to realize that thirty views
on Twitter is basically nothing. That's not even likes, it's
just someone scrolled past it. And he's been sentenced for
these anti immigration sentiments. And we find out, you know,
as the Daily Mail called him right a deranged loaner.
We find out that he was basically turned in by
his brother in law who didn't like it. So we
really have to escalate it to the point of East Germany,
where effectively you're turning people in to avenge your sort
of personal slights based on these laws. And the complete
and total denial around this issue I think is interesting
as well, because it's almost as if they've they've given
up on any sort of attempt at legitimacy. They're simply
going to freeze out the conversation. We're not going to
address it. We're not going to talk about it. It
just vacated that space, and seemingly in addition to vacating it,
they're determined to salt the earth make it illegal to
discuss it at all. And in my mind, that's almost unprecedented, right,
the idea that simply this apparent fact, at these horrific crimes,
this sort of replacement level migration is unassailable. You cannot
talk about it. You mentioned your substack. This is sort
of how I became aware of it, because you'd posted
something there that basically said that your profile on subsack
was blocked within your own nation. You needed to verify
your account, right, send the government a photo of your
face or send a third party. But we all know
what's happening there. Enter into this sort of like biometric
security apparatus in order to read things, and we all understand,
of course, what has done with that information. It is
there to prosecute you, It is there to enforce these
sort of draconian laws.
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Speaker 6: So I'm curious what do you make of that crisis
of legitimacy, the fact that they're simply not contesting the field.
Even they're just saying it's off limits. There's not even
really a counter argument anymore.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I think there's there's a genuine crisis for the
Something strange happened with the layback government.
Speaker 2: And it does it.
Speaker 7: I think it kind of goes to the Borrow's way
as well. But there's a there is a crisis of legitimacy,
and it's not entirely the labor Government's fault. It's it's
the fault of the Conservative Party for what they did.
I mean, so much of the legislation.
Speaker 2: I know, it's it's.
Speaker 7: Popular, it's popular on the British right, it's popular American right,
where they think of Kostarma as being this particularly kind
of brutal communist and he is like that, he's utterly humorous.
But you know, all the laws on the legislation was
already was already baked into the system. The thing which
I've got to now put my sort of show my
face that's going to come in everywhere. I think that's
the Online Harms Bill, And originally it's all part of
this surveillance state which is getting ruled.
Speaker 2: Really quickly now.
Speaker 7: I mean, I remember back five years ago, four years ago,
I was doing visy video essays on all of this
stuff and it didn't seem to go anywhere. But now
it's actually coming in. We're getting digital ds. I mean,
on the legitimacy thing, Labor got into power on there
was nothing said about digital ds anywhere, and they just
sprang so it wasn't nobody voted for it, it wasn't
in their manifesto, and they've just rammed it through. You
get half a million people or whatever it was, saying
a petition saying we want to have this gone over
our again.
Speaker 2: But not just they'll just ram it through.
Speaker 7: And this combined with masses and masses of facial recognition technology,
and then on top of that you've got the online harms.
But and all of this is going to link up.
I mean, when I try to describe this, I say,
it's a bit like the end of and Or where
you see them building the death Star and all of
the rivets. It's just mis missing that kind of central
thing that slots into the middle, that dish thing. And
that's what the digital ID will be. Everything is being
made deliberately awkward and troublesome to create the problems that
the digital ID can solve. So in the future I
will probably just link up my digital ID to my
online persona and then I'll bypass that issue on substack.
But it it is like a third party. So the
state will I mean in a way, because the state
kind of a quango called Who Not Hate sort of
carried out a surveillance operation on me earlier this year
and they got me. They found out who I was
after all these years they did this terrible hit piece
on me. So this in a way for me, it's
too late. The state knows who I am. It's But
what it means is that in the future everybody will
be docs. I just already am and all of this
is where there's you're not going to have online anonymity.
It's it's dead. It's a dead duck. And so you
just come across this stuff in your face all of
the time. You know it's and you know, you don't
know where it's going to go on the.
Speaker 2: Back end or anything.
Speaker 7: But to get back to the just the issue with
the labor government, I do really like the fact that
the Americans, because like Trump and jd. Vance and these
people have been launching broadside against the British government because
I know, like it's it's all the rage now for
people to say, well, you know, criticized Donald Trump, or
he's not getting this, he's not getting that, doing that,
that that's for you you fellas in America. That that's
like a sort of internal American thing just in terms
of having that kind of voice put pressure on the
on the British government and shine a torch on them
and say what the hell are you doing what is
going on here that I'm not going to be such
a kind of spurg We we don't have the luxury
of of snubbing on us.
Speaker 2: Is that that kind of thing?
Speaker 7: We need all the help we can get here. But
the issue with what labor have inherited was sort of
baked in, and I think they came in wanted to
be just a leftist standard of course, sort of sent
a left party. But the state of the country is
a tinder box. It's in such a bad state that
they've actually had to do all kinds of schizophrenic moves.
So the immigration this year is coming down quite drastically.
Speaker 2: Actually, it's they're not.
Speaker 7: The last figures have thought saw was they're on track
for like six hundred thousand fewer immigrants than what we
got last year. That they're talking tough on all kinds
of things. Now this is people will say this is
because we form with Nigel Farage are coming in from
the right and putting pressure on them, and it is.
It is part of that.
Speaker 2: But I think the deeper issue is that you have
to rule. You can't just be.
Speaker 7: A sadistic sort of a bunch of gangstars who torment
and sort of persecute people and rub them up the
wrong way for nothing. There comes that gets you get
those certain point where the legitimacy of the state is
becoming a real problem. We've had hundreds of thousands of
people leaving the country, this kind of thing, and so
you get this kind of thing where labor have to
lurch quite far right just because of the basic infrastructure
of the country, just because the country. I mean, I
did a video on this a while ago on the
demographics that it's possible we are a failed state and
with the white British are still the majority, because people
didn't seem to factor that in when when you get
these get these numbers will be a minority by twenty
fifty or twenty sixty or whatever. It was never the
social factors of that along the way weren't factored in
at all.
Speaker 6: Yeah, several several things there to your point about you know,
different takes on on Trump. This is something that always
frustrates me. Uh, you're talking with nationalists or right wingers,
which is there's sort of this kind of pie in
the sky version of of nationalism, which is that you know,
nationalism all goes one direction, and I understand it right.
You know, all of us are sort of fighting against
this sort of you know, globalist block. I get that,
but there are many cases in which you know, your
natural or national interest in mind might be at opposite ends.
And look, I'm not even saying Trump is a perfect
example of that. You know, Ukraine is perhaps an even
better one. You know, I understand why the you know,
the the Nordic guys are all you know, very much
pro you know, fighting Russia. It makes good sense, whereas
in my position it's like, well, to be honest, man,
I don't want to be involved in it. Uh just
a brief aside there, but uh yeah, I think that
the the problem of you know, ruling of simply you know,
the state continuing to function. It's crazy to see the decline.
So I've been on kind of a crusade against the
you know, the center right in America. You know, they're
they're attacking what they call either the woke right or
the new right. And there are two lines of attack.
One which is pretty easy to dismiss is you are
all actually Marxists. You are woke, you are the woke right.
You can sort of dismiss that one out of hand.
But another one. And you see this in kind of
the legacy press and people like David French. Is this
idea that oh, you're simply blinded by sort of artificial
nostalgia for a world that never existed. Things have always
been like this. You know, it's not really bad, things
aren't really in crisis. And obviously it's a completely disingenuous
argument because you know, you look to a country like yours,
which you're sure there were problems in the nineties, there
were problems in the eighties. We mentioned in the industrialization.
You know, all of these are very real crises. But
you mentioned earlier and I can't remember her name that
you know, the sort of prominent murderers, you know, this
woman who sort of became the you know, the talk
of the town right for killing, and it almost seems
quine in comparison with you know, modern violence. Right Axel
Rubacabana is one example, but you know there are dozens more.
And you see that and you're like, well, okay, like that,
we've lost several things there. One, we've lost a little
bit like an absolute amount of immediate security. How likely
are you to be killed? But also you've lost a
culture where people could be unified in opposition to some
sort of savage attack, right, that that was seen universally
as something that was notable enough to talk about and
also to morally condemn. There's sort of a cultural unity
there that has been lost. It's the idea that this
is simply you know, disingenuous complaints from the new right,
whatever you want to call it, is absurd, right. Similarly,
in our case, I think that the Charlie Kirk assassination
is one of the biggest stories of the last year
because obviously the event is significant. A man was murdered graphically,
you know, for the whole world to see, but the
reaction to it, both the failure to capitalize or to
address this issue from the center right and also effectively
the laughing scorn from the left that oh, you know,
that violence was was ultimately legitimate. They're like, okay, well,
America is perhaps not a failed state, you know, it's
not Venezuela or South Africa, but something very definitely has
been lost there, some sort of cultural cohesion that in
the previous era most people would feel as if this
sort of event is life altering, right. It was something
that you know, the Kennedy assassination. Obviously that's a president,
but that was a where were you moment? You know,
the other political assassinations as well well, And to see
that sort of pulled into you know, kind of the
culture where it's like, okay, well we've lost a unified
culture in any way, and look like a large part
of that is migration. New arrivals simply do not have
the same kind of cultural attitudes that you or I do.
But another part of it is that, like the realm
of politics has expanded to such a degree that, you know,
things that were previously off limits in a more homogeneous
culture are now simply part of you know, the daily grind.
And in much the same way, I see the same
thing happening to these you know, horrific migrant crimes.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean, I've did quite a lengthy article on
I call it the Evil Past and Present. And it
began because I saw like a shit live on Twitter
put how a picture of Maira Hindley. Now, I'll just
explain a little bit. In the nineteen sixties, there was
a couple called Ian Brady and Myra Hindley who murdered
and abused children and buried them in the Yorkshire was
and they took those videos that were it was. It
was really grotesque and horrible and the woman. Now people
can kind of absorb and understand that Ian Brady, he
was the motivating factor behind it. And what's really got
people was that there was a woman involved. And there's
a famous smoke shot of the two of them together.
It's in black and white and she's got this so
blonde peroxide hair. The Wars murders. If you want to
see it, I've got on the article as well. And
one of that image of Meira Hindley became a kind
of something in British folklore, almost as an object of evil.
She became this demonic presence within the collective psychology of
the culture and so to how and then there was
this person said, basically, you've always had these murderers, and
I thought that was very interesting because the mug shot.
It always comes down to the mug shot, and the
mug shots that the famous ones. Now you'll see of
these grooming gang sort of perpetrate as where you'll have
sort of five or six Pakistani faces all lined up together,
but you'll also have the actual rule of Kabana one
where he just looks wild and feral, and what interested
in me was that it doesn't have the same effect,
It doesn't embed itself in the culture the way that
Maira Hindley did. And it took me down a bit
of a rabbit hole and I discovered.
Speaker 3: That in.
Speaker 7: I mean, even when she was alive. She died in
two thousand and two or two thousand and three, but
even when she was alive, that image was called iconic,
which but it was an icon of evil, and we
all understood it wasn't political in any way, and we
didn't have the degree of managerial state where they kind
of said, well, she had a rough childhood or this
or that the other, and so you had this element
where almost like in a village where a woman was
accused of being a witch and she was kind of
lashed out of town and she became this kind of
she's evil, get her out to be spiritually purged from
the inn group, and there was really an element of that,
and that image of her was just regurgitated in British
culture forever. And in the nineteen nineties somebody cottoned onto
this and this modern artist put together like a big
montage of Meira Hindley's the image of her the mug
shot you using the hands of small children, and people
were absolutely outraged, and he the image got damaged when
it was in an art gallery, but it was this
kind of what he was actually getting at was this
sort of borderardium, sort of commentary on images replicating images,
because the actual real woman of Maira Hindley by this time,
she was just this kind of frail, elderly depressive in
a jail cell, but her image kind of lingered on
in the cultural psyche and she became something more, and
he was trying to sort of touch on that the
meaning of signs and symbols and kind of hyper realism.
And what's fascinating is that the mog shots that we
get now, the actual banner or the Pakistani grooming gangs
or whatever, they just don't have any of that, because
when you go to say the nineteen sixties, Britain was
still ninety eight percent Native and when you look at
my Raindley, you've got one of your own staring back
at you. That's why it became this kind of symbolic
act of purging the witch, get this sick demon out,
get her out of the group. But when you've got
this sort of when actually Lucabana staring back at you,
it isn't even part of your in group, you will
you kind of it becomes political in a way. It's
more of a political act because you think, well, he's
here because of political decisions, and he isn't of the
in group, And so instead of having almost like this
metaphysical evil all of a sudden, it's it's something close
that to sort of inter ethnic warfare. But of course,
because of the lies that the society's built on, you
can't even acknowledge that. You can't have that conversation, so
you're just left with this sort of barrenness, this kind
of abyss where it's just this squalid, depressing.
Speaker 2: Reality that you inhabit. Now you don't even.
Speaker 7: Get that catharsis of lashing the witch out of the village,
or looking back at part of your group gone horribly
horribly wrong and become sick and poison because they were
never you in the first place. It's the same with
the Pakistani mok shots.
Speaker 2: It's just the other.
Speaker 7: It's just this wall of otherness looking back at you.
And this is kind of baked in across the UK
now and it gives this kind of gloom over everything,
this acknowledgment of it, but also the fact that you
aren't even allowed to sort of intellectually investigated.
Speaker 2: We're all create a.
Speaker 7: Cultural sort of movement around it and discuss it honestly,
as we have done with these things in the past.
I mean the fact that he made that postmodern kind
of badly advised I would say artwork of Maira Hindley's face.
He was at least trying to comment on her place
and that image in British culture. But you couldn't do
that with actually Rukbana because it would be seen as
I mean, they prefer that you just don't see any
of it. I mean just there. So there was a
nine year old girl stabbed to death in Somerset somewhere,
which is quite a nice part of England.
Speaker 2: It's the Shias.
Speaker 7: And it was a fifteen year old boy who did it,
but we don't have any other details. So here you
come here here it is well, so now the BBC
will close the replies. You're not given anything more to
go on because of legal reasons, and everybody suspects what
they don't know, and probably in a few years we
will get to know and this is this is just
the misery of it, and the misery of where we
are culturally spiritually. It's it's rotten, and it's it's it's
hollowed out and it's it's it kind of consumes everything.
It's difficult to step outside of it. It's why I
just focus almost entirely on on Britain these days.
Speaker 6: I recently rewatched uh, the original Blade Runner film, uh,
and I was really struck by several things about it,
which is one, the Blade Runner is sort of the
future that came to pass. Obviously, you have the look
of it, right, this kind of sort of dystopian, you know,
blend of all cultures, kind of peat like layered on
top of this pre existing, previously existing world. Right you
have you know the kind of old you know, Victorian era,
you know, apartment buildings, you know, run down, you know,
covered in neon signs for you know, companies, you know,
kind of broadcasting vice everywhere, which you know you see
obviously in America in places like you know, any urban center,
but you know, in kind of an echo of that
in the UK aesthetic. But also to me, I think
it's interesting because you know, the whole idea of the replicants, right,
these these sort of artificial people created as slaves, rights,
as cheap labor, wreaking havoc. You know, it has very
much been you know, the story of you know, the
twenty first century in both our countries. One of the
biggest stories in America over the last year, and I've
got a trucker on to talk about this has been
obviously in a proliferation of migrant truckers. You know, this
incredibly dangerous job. You know, you're driving something that's sixty
thousand pounds on a highway with normal cars, which you know,
previously was the realm of be honest, working class white guys.
It was a good way to make money. You know,
you could with a relatively small amount of capital, you know,
put yourself in a position where you're making good money.
And that needed to be done away with, that needed
to be replaced. We needed to do it cheaper, and
so we imported these sort of fake citizens in many cases, right,
these sort of like replicants, if you can imagine, and
it's unleashed havoc. Right, there have been a number of,
you know, horrific videos of these you know, death machines,
you know, just running through people, you know, blowing away,
you know, a family in a sedan. And the most
iconic one, I think is that you know that crash
from Florida where these two Indian guys are in the
you know, the front seat and they just you know,
whip into a little access point which you know, cars
aren't supposed to go in let alone. You know, a
semi truck across the lane of traffic and you kill
a family of four, and in much the same way, right,
you see these this is something that's always happened. There
always been accidents. These are dangerous things. You know. You
might have a guy from West Virginia, you know, high
on meth and he you know, does the same thing.
But it is different when it is someone who has
basically been brought here in the last six months, right,
and in order to you know, grease the wheels of
this managerial system. Those four people. There are many other examples,
you know, I'm sure you don't need me to remind
you have been sacrificed on that altar. And again, right,
it's that same sort of thing like this, We've always
had violence, and look, America has always been a violent country,
there's no two ways about it. But this new, this
new sort of crime, and we've seen with these truckers,
let alone the kind of you know, massive fraud that
we've seen in places like Minnesota. It's like all of
these war choices, this did not have to happen. And
what we've seen, and this is I think an origin
a lot of the you know, a lot of the
annoyance with the Trump administration in the US is that
you know, he's he's very comfortable talking about, you know,
the illegal immigration. It's something that's effectively ceased to be
a problem. You know, these mass deportations are to some
degree occurring, and that's something to be thankful for. But
that need for the for the system to you know,
have cheap labor, that need for the system to keep
expanding forever, well, that comes first, and so we'll replace
you another way, will replace you legally. You know, we've
seen that with you know, these sort of high skill
visas quote unquote, you know, all of these that comes
before anything else, and these casualties seemingly are completely and
totally acceptable, you know, to to serve that end.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean, our I think our version of that
beside the the the ulder stuff like the grooming gangs,
which is still going on. Well, the thing for this, yeah,
has been the the like the asylum seeker things, particularly
men from Afghanistan or I think there was like four
cases last week where they were raved. And you see
these stories, I know, I realized that this is like
a thoroughly sort of depressed and subject all of what
we're talking about. That that's just the way it is
in in Britain. That's that's the you know it, this
is sadly and I lament that as well. I like,
I don't want that you get this strange thing like
the girl that I saw today on X this story
where the girl was a nine year old girl was
stabbed as death. And it gets back to what I
was saying earlier, where this once upon a time that
would have been a big thing, and now it just
sort of drifts down your your news feed.
Speaker 2: It's people will.
Speaker 7: Swipe past it on their phones and I thought, I thought,
I thought, is this is this just how it gets normalized?
Speaker 9: Now?
Speaker 2: Is this? Is this not enough? When is it?
Speaker 7: Does it have to be more than one?
Speaker 2: Does it?
Speaker 7: And it just seems to is this is this just
like the collapse. Now is this because there's no signs
of this getting any better, and the state just is
a completely blindsided by all of this. I mean, I
try to order for for the garden and some pruners
on eb to to prune a planet a color of
raspberry bushes, and so I thought, I haven't got any
prune as I'm gonna at the end of the season,
and I found out that I couldn't actually, I couldn't
actually order them online. And you get these things now
where you get knaves are coming out now in London
and they've got rounded tips on them, and so people
can't eat basically because it's a weapon, but for some reason,
like a set of gardening like prunas, handheld prunas for
you to clip branches, it's it's sharp and you could
I mean, it's it's so basically the state has decided
that you just can't buy them online anymore, in the
same way that you have to show your face to
access the messages on substack. And so you see these
pathetic and stupid attempts to hold the hold the line
against the tide, rather than addressing the core issues and
the stuff of the asylum seekers. There was a story
this year where they've been putting them up in hotels,
which is bad enough. They crossed the channel on boats
and they put them up in hotels and in Epping
this year they protested against the establishment of such a
hotel and they was brushed down. They were called for right,
they were called extremists, and then a local girl was
sexually abused. Now I'm not sure if you I'm not
sure the extent of that, then I have to be
careful what I say about these things because not allowed. Again,
you just walk around eggshells all of the time, so
I could be construed as spreading misinformation. There's a whole
other thing to do with, like where how we exist
in England now where everybody has to speak like a lawyer,
because you've always got to have a get out, you've
always got to have applausible deniability, or you can't put
in all groups. You'll have to say it mainly or
instead of just talking about a group and this kind
of thing. But anyway, they then covered that up the
newspaper and the government put like a block on that
where it was covered up and so the people have
already protested against it. They were proven to be correct,
and then that was the whole what they were scared
of happened that was covered up. They then launched an
appeal and it was to say that the hotel would
in fact be closed down. The government in London then
intervened and said no, this the Supreme Court I think
it was, which is just this blair right nonsense, said no,
actually it will stay open. And then the person who
actually was another person was touched the girl did something
wrong like that, he actually wandered away, if you remember,
it was everywhere he escaped. He escaped and he was
just wondering. He was Ethiopian and he was just wandering
around for days on end.
Speaker 3: And.
Speaker 7: You just think it's it's there's this kind of thing
that we talk about, whether it's incompetence or malice. Is
this kind of meme that goes around in Britain. And
because the argument will be somebody like my dad, for example,
on friends would say the government are useless. They are
absolutely useless. They just don't know what they're doing. And
you think, after a certain amount of time you can't
just say it's useless anymore. It gets to a point
where you have to say world on a second. This
is when it's always I mean, one of the things
that I say is that if it was just incompetence,
it would going out of way, it would favor us
sometimes even if just by random chance. But that never happens,
and so the only conclusion you can draw is that
they are malicious. They are actually malicious. Now, having said that,
you do also have total incompetence baked into this, this
system of orders and magnitudes that would have just been
maind boggling to British people thirty or forty years.
Speaker 2: They would not comprehend it.
Speaker 6: I mean, to that point, Morgreth, We're three or four
days into the investigation of this shooting it Brown which
which is a large university in the middle of you know,
a progressive city, and seemingly there was some sort of
political motive that this girl killed. One of two was,
you know, the leader of a conservative group who was
devoutly religious, seems and despite all of this state surveillance apparatus,
we have a photo of a person of interest, but
no arrest has been made seemingly. You know, when when
the state is is truly angered, right, when they're actually
interested in bringing someone to justice as we saw, you know,
post jan six. Well, they can make arrests almost immediately.
You know, they can fence your phone and find you
no matter where you run or even you know, as
we saw under Biden, right, this eighty some year old
woman who is you know, protesting in front of an
abortion clinic, right holding up a sign that says you
don't kill your baby, and she goes to jail. We
can find her, of course, But again to your point,
you'd assume, you know, if this wasn't competence, there'd be
sort of a random walk and you know, maybe not
half the time, but at least some of the time
it would go your way. And when that is not
the case, the next logical question is, well, why it
seemingly when you want to you can get things done
very quickly. You can bring down this sort of harsh
violence as we saw, you know, to the protesters and
epic right, people can be thrown in jail, We can
have courts running around the clock to make sure these people,
you know, receive the state's idea of justice. But this,
this really comes down to the question, and this is
something that's come up in you know, American discourse as well,
which is to be honest, like, what is the point
of the country here? Why does this exist? And you know,
you or I I have the idea that, well, it
is a place for a people. You know, there's a
you know, a catchy term I probably can't say in
YouTube for that sort of idea. But if simply it
is this sort of like economic zone, if it simply
is this sort of you know, support team where you
need to you know, maximize your talent pool, that's not
really a country anymore. And you know, this was something
that many right wingers were comfortable saying during the Biden years,
right when he was letting in millions of people stream
across the border every year, like do we even have
a country anymore? But you know that's changed, right, we
swapped the guy out, and seemingly still that question of
are we a real country or not remains unanswered. And again, right,
like the purpose of someone being in charge is for
there to be a ruler. And I think one of
the terrifying things that's emerged in you know, American politics
is this realization that effectively the system is unassailable. You
can do everything you're supposed to do right, You can
create a government apparatus for you know, purging the bloat,
you know, for attacking the sort of patronage network of
the left, you attacking the deep state, as it said,
But it's almost like the blob is too big, it's
gotten past the point of containment, and those interests right
of sort of continuing the managerial system for see a
pace no matter what, seemingly there's nothing to be done.
And again I'm not trying to you know, monopolize this
conversation talking about the you know, the American circumstance, but
it is kind of bizarre that in both we are
seeing this sort of crisis of legitimacy, Like what is
the point of participation in this system if quite simply,
you know, you're you're you're using a wheel that isn't
connected to anything. In the US, we have these you know,
shopping carts for children. We're just like you know, painted
like a race car with a little fake steering wheel
in it so your kid can amuse themselves while you
go shopping.
Speaker 2: Like is that what this is?
Speaker 6: Is effectively this whole thing just designed to you know,
do what it was going to anyway and just make
you feel you know, Alternately, better or worse about it.
I mean, I have an answer to that, but that's
a dangerous place for regime to be.
Speaker 10: It.
Speaker 6: We need some sort of buy in here.
Speaker 7: Yeah, And this is this is why I think the
British government. It's unpopular to say, but I think the
British government is panicking about this, just just in straightforward,
even just from a Machiavellian point of view. I was
thinking the other day, I mean, though, I think I
might write something about this. There was some kind of
atrocity happened last week. It's always the same, It's always
the same thing. And I was I was thinking, I'd
rather have a weak king than this.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 7: I'm not talking about Alfred the Great or Charlemagne or
an Oliver Cromwell figure. What I mean is even like
a weak pathetic king, like what Charles is now or
what William will be in the future, even that would
be better than what we've got now.
Speaker 2: And I realized that, you.
Speaker 7: Know, my, my misters, she watches all of the royal
gossip rubbish. And I remember I wrote something. I watched
that series that Crown last year, and you saw the
because of the royal family, what they are obsessed with
in all of this. If you think like Prince Andrew,
because he was connected to Epstein, they immediately just stripped
him of everything and booted him. I mean to be honest,
it took. It took longer suld have done. But they
realized there was more information going to come out in
America and they were like, okay, get rid of them,
get get rhythm, strip them everything, get rid of them.
And the reason for it all And it's the whole
all of the storylines, all of the plots, all of
the drama in that TV show of the Crown is
all about pr The royal family are absolutely desperate to
be loved by the people, to be respected by the people.
Speaker 2: They it's all they want.
Speaker 7: And I was thinking, it's really strange because if you
had a weak king and they had that same mindset,
even if they were squishy and they didn't want to
do things, They've got this this sort of sort of
obsessed that people like them, that people like the Royals,
and whereas when you look at the state, the bureaucracy,
they don't care because as who do you hete everybody
hates Kirstalma, but he doesn't care. He really he's on
like ten percent approval rating, and he'll just carry on pushing.
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Speaker 1: This is the sound of a superpower we all have
sending Christmas cards to our family and friends and making
them feel loved. Who will you send magic to your auntie,
your brother, You're bestie living abroad. You can buy Christmas
stamp booklets in your local post office or online with
free next day delibery. Send Christmas love from the heart today,
unpost send.
Speaker 7: Love like terrible things that nobody wants. I mean, that's
a whole different subject we'll get to know. But what
I mean is when you take the daily, the daily
atrocity that we get now, nobody really knows who's responsible.
Whereas even if you had a because you've got this
just just interlinking spaghetti of a system. But I don't know,
it's a kind of old fashioned reactionary talking point. This
But even when you put it in like even a
weakling like William would have to be sitting there, who
would be sitting on top of this system? Even then
you would say, well, ultimately you are in charge, why
is it that the place is being flooded with these
sex pests? Like, ultimately, this is your country.
Speaker 2: You have to deal with it.
Speaker 7: But you can't really do that with If you try
and pin that on the Labor Party, they'll just blame
the Tory Party, or they'll blame this or that quango
or the European Court of Human Rights or the Supreme Court.
It just goes on and on and on. There's no accountability.
And it was fascinating to think that, you know, you
go back in the day when was Diana having an
affair and what would the public think of this? What,
oh god, we have to we have to clean this
mess up or people will not like us. And I thought, yeah,
I'd like to have that. I'd like to have a
bit more of that in the country.
Speaker 2: Even if it was like a total weakling, they would
at least in some way have to be responsive to
what people want.
Speaker 6: Well and similarly as well. And this is a point
that you know that Happa makes talking about monarchy, where
it's like, well, you've you've also you know, established an
interest in the nation. These these rulers that will they
own it and they're going to pass it on to
their family. Obviously there are still bad kings. Meristotle wrote
about this quite a bit, but clearly are our elites
do not see themselves as being connected to a place
in any way. You know, what matters is not the
actual nation, how it continues, but the sort of like
aggregate propositional nation, right that the territory called America, and
how much it can enrich me, you know, how much
it can benefit my life. And this is the point
that Land makes in Dark Enlightenment, I believe, where you know,
he talks about how you know, the spendthrift politician is
an evolutionary dead end because you have a very definite
amount of time and power. You have shorter in hours
than ors, of course, and so you know, the incentive
is to create this sort of smash and grap and
you sort of have this for them, this sort of
wonderful situation where you know, once you're in, you're in
and enrich yourself as much as you like. And then
when questioned, you know, responsibility is so dispersed. It's really
it's nobody's fault. You know, there's no one you can
really blame. You've seen this, and I mentioned it before
with this sort of massive welfare scandal coming out of Minnesota,
right where these Somalis have you know, defrauded billion billion
dollars plus or minus of you know, welfare money. And
you know, when when looking for responsibility, sure you can
look at the governor and it seems as if he's complicit,
but you know, he's got more than enough people between
him and anything actually said that he will never be
forced to pay any consequences, for nobody will be forced
to pay political consequences. The only people who might be
are effectively, it seems like Donald Trump is family in
immediate circle, you know, because they have particularly angered you know,
the life left. And that's I think Another thing that
I find to be particularly galling in all of this
is that I feel like, I can't be the only
one looking at this and saying like, well, you know,
mister president, do you not realize what they're going to
do to you him? His family has already been debanked,
even down to his nineteen year old son can't get
a bank account, you know, simply through association. And so
when you look at him or even you know, many
others in the nominal kind of conservative movement after the
death of Charlie Kirk, it's like, well, like, where do
you think this goes? Do you think that they're suddenly
going to stop being violent? Because the sad lesson of
that case is, effectively, no political violence works. You're sure
that kid is going to go to jail for the
rest of his life. But for everyone else they they want,
they paid effectively no consequence and got one of their
enemies removed. And so to me, I think that's a
very worrisome trend that I've identified going forward. It seems
as if the taboo around political violence has been well
and truly broken. You know. Sure, obviously the individual people
were either killed in the act or you know, put
in jail, So there's that, right, there's still some semblance
of justice, although in this case in Brown that may
be falling apart for you know, again incompetence, ormalice. Who knows.
But again, do you are we still a real country anymore?
Or are we this sort of banana republic where you know,
effectively the political class persecutes who they will and uses
this sort of paramilitary violence to go after their enemies.
I thought the whole point of a society was to
have a monopoly on violence.
Speaker 2: Has that gone?
Speaker 6: Are we still, as you've said, like a functional country
or is this becoming a sort of failed state? And obviously,
you know, not literally, you know, I can still press
a button and get whatever I want delivered to my house.
It's not you know, it's not Zimbabwe. But you start
to look at this and say, like, all right, we're
identifying trend lines here, like where does this go and
where is where is the urgency you would expect from
you know, a ruling class faced with these sort of problems.
Like one of the other things that I've been thinking
about quite a lot is you know, how many of
these sort of political assassins fit the same profile?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 6: Ironically enough, you know, young men radicalized on the internet,
but you know, towards this kind of like combination of
you know, bizarre sexual perversion and extreme left wing politics,
and it's like, well, you know, both of these kids
are not from you know, liberal families, They're not from
these kind of stereotypical progressives. They're sort of you know,
sleeper cells that have been left in every you know,
cul de sac in the country. And especially when you
consider the fact that fewer and fewer young men are
able to do the things that traditionally connected people to
a society, able to you know, find a woman, you know,
find property that is a tinder box. You know that
not necessarily for some sort of war, but to say,
like you were, you have this incredible population of young
men with nothing to lose, and they have been given
moral license to do something drastic. I can't be the
only one seeing where this goes. And it seems like
there are so many of these issues which are you know,
if not you know, boiling over you. They're starting to bubble,
and there seems to be no reaction. And I don't
know if that's because it serves the ends of those
in power, or they're simply too lazy or incompetent to
address it. Sorry, more as a bit of a rant
for me, but something I've been thinking about.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean, it's that's quite specific to America. We
don't because we don't have the guns. I mean, I
think the criminals. If people I want to do they
probably get them, but by and large they that's I
think all of that's a specific problem to America. When
I saw the picture of Tyler Robinson and the court
hearing or whatever it was, and the look on his face,
I thought that this is this is what like a
leftists in America, like a white man in America, this
is what he has to do for approval from his
peers on the left. What he's saying is that I
can give you a degree. I mean, I don't know
anything about guns, but I can imagine he's singing one
of it's in my skill set to be a pull off,
a shot like that, and you know, this is what
I can bring to the table.
Speaker 2: Love me, love me, you know.
Speaker 7: And I thought, this is this is just completely twisted.
This is this that my view on it was, this
is how what you have to do to be a
white man and get social approval on the left. In Britain,
it's it's a bit different. All this summer the violence
that the concerns the government, because I know they don't
seem to be very concerned about the daily sort of atrocity.
But all summer there was this worry that we were
going to have riots, and that would be the need
of men against against the rapes, against the endless sort
of just misery, but particularly against these hotels and these asylums.
Speaker 2: He guys.
Speaker 7: And it was strange going into the summer when these
things tend to happen. And I wrote an article on
substack they called it the Summer of Kindling, and all
the newspapers and everybody, everybody was on tender hooks, and
there was this sense that if some sort of atrocity happens,
I mean, they did happen, but if one like in
Southport last year, really catches on, really, then we've got major,
major problems. And I think this goes back to the
government recognizing that at the end of the day, we
do have a country. We can't just sort of presade
over this anarchy because our own sort of legitimacy, our
own position long term is being eroded by this. I mean,
the latest thing that's going on is that they're they're
banging the war drums for Russia. The nation has to
prepare its sons and daughters for war with Russia. And
I'm not even I'm not even like a Russia symp
I get accused of it, but I'm perfectly fine that.
I'm fine if if I think NATO, if we've got NATO,
if a country in NATO is attacked, then it deserves
a joint response, fair enough.
Speaker 2: Like that's about it.
Speaker 7: I'm kind of boring and normally in in that regard,
but that isn't really what we're getting. We're getting as
if there's going to be this, an attack is imminent,
And I asked, well, where's the troop build up, where's this,
Where's this going to happen? And I'm never given any answers.
But the flip side of that, of course, is that
now you're asking the demographic which has been made per
eye as the exact demographic you need to go and
fight these wars are working class white lads from Teeside
and Sunderland and Middlesbrough and these these areas which have
just been left to rot. And you see the sentiment
of no, we're not going to do it anymore. And
I did a little sort of grock Google thing, and
I was asking it, like, what what are the what
what instances and history have there been where a population
was so demoralized by its its rulers that they just
flatly refused to war on their behalf any more. And
one of the one of the results that came up
was caligular caligulars caligular plan and invasion of the British
Isles and as armies just refused because you're insane, you're
a lunatic, and we're done with it. And I think,
I just thought, is this whether British state is now
where the historical comparisons are like Caligula And one of
the other ones is like Russian the under the Zah
and Russian and things, But the one of like where
you've got the British states, the Kisama and the British
government is now comparable to Caligula in how demoralized and
kind of incensed people that it's it says it all,
It really says all.
Speaker 6: No, one hundred percent. I think that his faded drug,
you said, Marta Valila, I couldn't shoul their father's staffer
to two to month.
Speaker 2: His fader Lrene thrugy two will you rudder organ will
blow along?
Speaker 6: When you knowed the two boat couldn't rusta conto Marvine
twig to month passionary Augustini.
Speaker 11: Not to.
Speaker 2: To a court at Rsa pon kai.
Speaker 9: Another square story from Toblerone, work Christmas do time for
the gifts you got your boss, Tina bath bombs shaped
like mince pies, but added tobler own diamond truffles just
in case she unwraps the bath bombs silence. Then the
Toblerone truffles, velvety diamond shaped chocolates with a crunchy new
golf filling. Oh big smiles from Tina. Whatever you gift,
added diamonds just in case. Tobalone never square.
Speaker 6: That's what's so, I guess worrisome about these kind of
you know, calls for foreign adventure. We're kind of spinning
up for one with Venezuela, and you know, hopefully that
will be much less of a cluster then you know
what happened in Afghanistan. But you know, I wonder if
that is the danger of you know, a Nigel Faraja
esque figure, right, someone who makes the average man feels
if his complaints are being heard and just in time
for you know, a big war. You know this is
you know what you see from from you know, guys
like aa we're talking about, you know, the desire to
get white boys to die in foreign wars. Right, that
is the reason that you know, certain social attitudes are
being relaxed. And you know, you're you're starting to see
as we you know, have noticed in both your country
and mind uh you know, military ads featuring white guys again,
you start to get a little nervous. You're like, okay,
like why why are you letting up? Why are you
doing something obviously that hasn't happened in your country, But
you know the fact that you know, Farage may be
making a good run of it, who knows, but I think.
Speaker 7: We are getting those military adds. We were specifically targeting
people like me, people like people from the north, are
the industrialized North in particular, which is what traditionally the
pool that we've It's kind of like the north of
England is a bit like the American South o semiogogue.
Speaker 2: It is there is something too that.
Speaker 6: All right, it's the same, it's the same genetics, let's
be honest, right, Yeah, Like this is sort of a
funny thing. But you know, our are Scots Irish, you know,
which is you know, a combination of you know, Orderers
and you know a little bit of Irish mixed in.
Have basically fought every American war in history. We were
The whole reason they're ain't even in the South is
that Quakers were getting killed by Indians, and so they
sort of cast about and said, well, you know who
can fight, we will not, And it's who they selected.
And it is one of those things where it's what
I worry about more in in my country than yours,
is that I almost wonder if you know here where
we're you know, in this in the second Trump era,
you know, where the right is seen to be sort
of culturally ascended, you see a lot more buy in
right because it feels like your country again. But in
your case, I don't understan that seems like too much whiplash,
you know, to go from very quickly. You know, you
can't tweet about anything. You know, everyone is British. You
know the Irish were actually black, which you know, if
you're a Ben Franklin guy, I guess you could make
the argument for but how do you this is an
open question. I do not know the answer. How do
you so quickly tone shift on that? Because I can't
see how you can convince people to sign up for
a state that you know so recently hated them and
still does you can't.
Speaker 7: I mean, it's one of the somebody sort of one
thing that I saw was that they would weigh like
four thousand pounds a month in their faces, which you
may get a bit of an up particle of that
until the shooting starts, until the dying starts, and then
that won't be enough anymore. But it goes back to
what I was saying at the start, that you know,
it gets to a point where the kind of the
problems that could arise when when I began talking about
this so long ago, for most people, it was just
something purely abstract. But now it's there. It's there now
in the real world. They're they're rubbing shoulders with it
in the real world, and this is so now it's
like really there. It's it's in their face. It's in
their face every time they go to the shopping center,
it's it's when they go to work, but it's it's
everywhere now, And so there's a sense that you know,
the rabbits has bolted, and then they're looking around and thinking, well,
this this they kind of have asked for this, and
you get into this kind of like why is this happening?
Why do I feel like a stranger and your own homeland?
And so you're going to have to have some really
drastic policies to undo that. And this is why it's
it's I realized it's an unpopular opinion, but it's it's
quite shocking, how like how far to the right labor
are willing to lurch on some of these things. One
of the things that was mentioned last week, which I
think is this is one of the things they mentioned
was the asylum seekers who were coming in, We're going
to have all of their money and jewelry taking off
them to pay for their So so you get this,
you get this, and it's like, I don't I don't
want to rob the illegal immigrants. I just don't want
them in the country, Like I don't want to do
this performance.
Speaker 6: There's a simpler solution.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I don't want to I don't want to rob them,
I don't want to mug them when they step off
the board. I just want the board turned around and
they can step back. I don't want this kind of
performance of cruelty that they that's miss under. But you
can see what where they're what they're trying.
Speaker 2: To go for there.
Speaker 7: And another thing is the numbers coming down and down
and down, which they are. It's too late, it's the
damage is done now.
Speaker 2: And so in terms of I.
Speaker 7: Mean, I do think this is part of the reason
why the American government is blast, putting European countries on
blast for being too woke and do you know you
don't have freedom of speech and all of that. I
think they actually genuinely worry that this is this is
compromising the empire itself, where the core the basics now
are beginning to unravel. If you want to have if
you want to have this sort of American empire, then
you've got this sort of major chunk of it in Europe,
and with Britain as always being America as.
Speaker 2: Point man, in Europe begin to look quite unhinged.
Speaker 7: And you can think, even purely sort of from cymically, yeah, okay,
it's it's walk, it's lefty. They know they don't have
free speech, but is does that actually create war fighting potential?
What happens if they go so far on this that
it becomes compromises the entire kind of structure of the
American Empire. And that's why I think that's something to that.
But as you are saying, even within America, they're not
doing that much to change it. It's just I think
there's so much space. Maybe maybe not everybody. It's not
in their face as it is in European countries like
England in particular, is pretty bad at the moment, and
it hasn't created the conditions where lots of men want
to go off and fight like Russia. Because fundamentally it's
a trite point to make. That like what everybody will make.
But it is true that whether they like it or not,
more people see Kyo storm On the Labor Party as
their enemy than they do Vladimir Putin and Russia. And
that's just that's just the reality of it.
Speaker 6: Well, especially when you know, if if the argument you know,
is made in sort of you know, blood and soil terms, right,
the idea that you like defend the homeland, it's like, well, one,
you haven't done that, you know, they are foreigners. And
also it's not as if you know Russia's you know,
dumping boats into the English Channel. You know they're they're
dropping bombs over London. You know it's for again this
kind of you know, outer or outpost of someone else's empire.
But why would anyone get involved, you know, particularly when
they're very clean or very clearly being sold out at home?
I think one of the other open questions. Uh, and
this is you know, sort of different on opposite ends
of the Atlantic. But there is a financial element to
this as well, right, like how long can you keep
paying for all of this because and you know it's
slightly different here because you know, the empire that controls
most of the world's, right, you get to sort of
violate the rules. But and I realized, you know, you're
not a you don't cover finance, and I be honest,
don't know anything about it either. But the signs you're
seeing are sort of worrying. You know, you have this
this giant, you know, argument about the budget, right that
a massive hole suddenly discovered. You know, it's just missing,
you know, the problems with the government securing debt. And
it's like, well, okay, how does the system of paying
people off work when you can't make the payments, you know,
when it suddenly you have to make difficult decisions. And
it seems as if this is just a question that
is not being answered at all. And again, look, I
realize people have been predicting the collapse of the global
financial market for longer that I've been alive. I'm not,
you know, saying that's what's gonna happen. But again, what
do you do when you face a genuine crisis? I
don't know. These people don't seem to be acting seriously
about it.
Speaker 7: Yeah, and it just keeps limping on, and it may
we need we end up be facing like some giant crush,
but we are facing this kind of steady. There's a
word like and shittification. In this case, everything is getting
I noticed there's these biscuits. I don't know if you
have them in America, but we call them penguin biscuits,
these little chocolate biscuits, and they're basically just a little
chocolate biscuit that you have with like a cup of tea.
And they've changed it now because chocolate has become really expensive.
For apparently they get coca beans.
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Speaker 7: Sensibly, if it's climate change or whatever it is, for
whatever reason, it's becoming extremely expensive, and so they changed
it so that now it's chocolate flavored or chocolate or
the chocolate compound chocolate tasting compound is now what this
is the kind of played a sort of fait every
everything's fake, so you know, you'll you'll sit in the
in the UK with the daily atrocity and you're not
even eating real chocolate anymore. It's like chocolate tasting compound.
But it's just enough to get through the regulations and
all of this kind of thing, and yeah, it's it's all.
It's all just sort of squaliz. I wish I could,
I wish I wasn't such a duma, but I do.
Speaker 3: I do.
Speaker 7: One of the things, you know, is one of the
reasons why I focus on this stuff is because it's real.
And when I look at like social media and I
look at sort of the sort of Candice Owns versus
Tim Poole, versus Nick Fans versus Carlson who killed Charlie,
this this whole kind of You've basically got all these
millionaires like ship talking each other and everybody is like
clapping it along, and that there's something there's this kind
of hard realism about life in the UK, which I
find is grounding. I find it kind of keeps you
keeps your feet on the on the ground it's it's
not really a part of the discourse of the online right.
I mean the little touches where you're not even in
real chocolate anymore, and and and the streets where it's
like Afghan immigrants and what they call them roadman and
all of this that there's a there's a kind of
hardness and glottliness to it, which I feel is real.
I'm not part of this hype, a real Internet sort
of garbage, to be honest.
Speaker 6: Well, and this is something that they call it like
the affordability crisis here where, And I think this is
a much bigger problem, especially for sort of the narrative
of America and also for the kind of Whig history
we see across the progressive world, which is at a
certain point it becomes painfully obvious that things are getting worse,
that the system is is fumbling. And you know, I
think about conversations I've had with my my grandfather, who's
you know, he worked his entire life in the trades,
and he's a body man, right, repairing cars, And you know,
he got out of the military. He was a homeless orphan.
He was not a wealthy man by any means. You know,
worked in a McDonald's. You ended up in the trades.
And the whole time you know, his he supported his
children is you know, they lived in homes that they owned,
you know, palaces by any means, but still property, and
were able to buy new cars. You know, it was
just seen as kind of expected for someone in the
you know, the broad working class even and you know,
now every one of those things has become a luxury
to the point where you know, housing is ludicrously expensive.
Groceries have become incredibly expensive, as you mentioned, you know,
they're more and more of these sort of ersatz products.
And I mean, look, I'm not going to complain about it,
but I've never owned a car that came out after
I got my driver's license, right at any point, even
to this day, I drive a vehicle that's twenty years old,
and that's just seen as as normal for people who
are middle class. Effectively, the whole society is downwardly mobile.
Everyone is getting poorer, and you know, look, it's one
thing if that's just hard times right there. This has
happened before. Nations go through these periods, you know, but
when you're being told, you know, know, everything is getting better,
everything has to get better because the past was evil
and horrible and racist, and now you know, in this
new world, right, this new liberated existence, isn't it grand?
And you look around and you're like, well, for who,
right do I live in a country that's just a
retirement home, you know, designed to ensure that, you know,
a certain generation is you know, maximally comfortable. And then
they're they're imported servants?
Speaker 7: Right?
Speaker 3: Is that?
Speaker 2: Is that what we have here?
Speaker 6: And so it's again like this is another aspect of
that legitimacy crisis, like what are we doing here? What
is the point of this?
Speaker 2: I don't know? It is?
Speaker 6: Sorry, what's that?
Speaker 2: Well?
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean And this gets to something which because
nobody wants to hear it.
Speaker 2: Part one.
Speaker 7: To take Boris Johnson for example, The reason that he
flooded the place with millions of people within just a
couple of years for the Borrows Wave was that after COVID,
they needed all of these bodies. The Bank of England
I think it was just basically just demanded that he
flood the place, take off, take off the breaks, take
off all the safeguards and just flood the place for
financial reasons to soak up the money so we didn't
get hype oer inflation and to get people working and
all of this kind of thing. And now the justification
which we hear increasingly now there's an article in The
Guardian this week that everybody was talking about is basically,
there's there's the birth rate is too low and you
need to sort of you need bodies, you need these
endless bodies coming in to keep this thing chugging along.
And I know and I know that many people on
the right look for ways to sort of brush that aside,
and I think it's that it's a nettle that should
be grabbed and you should just accept that. Yeah, we're
gonna we still we will just have to do it,
like we will just have to watch things collapse. We
will just have to go downwards in our quality of
life because as it is now, that's gonna happen anyway,
just it'll take longer, but when it does actually happen,
we're going to be like total minorities in our own country.
And I'm I've actually sort of fought this through towards
logical conclusion that for example, you're gonna have to deal
with the fact that there.
Speaker 2: Will be two few children and too many old.
Speaker 7: People, and that's just the way it's going to be,
and it's going to be tough. But if we've still
got our own country, and we've still got our own
people and a sense of where we are in the world,
it could be choked up as another kind of hard
time that let's say the English went through. So we've
been through hard times before and we're going through another
one again. If you've got like a circular view of history,
which I tend to, then you kind of you know
that winter is coming, and if you can just be
honest about where you are on the cycle, you can
hunker down and you can get ready for it. Now
a strange but what that will mean will be telling
the markets and telling the bankers to go to hell.
And in a geopolitical sense, it's gonna be a little
bit like if you're in a playing strategy game, it
would be like turtling. You're just gonna kind of take
some time out from world history because you're not in
a good state right now. You're going to defend your borders,
You're gonna have minimal You're going to be like actually
so many other countries around the world, to just mind
their own business we did. You know, it's a particular
Western and are definitely a particularly English mindset.
Speaker 2: You see it even now, even now, at.
Speaker 7: This stage, we're warmongering and pretend to be a great power.
And if we could just say, look, time out, time out,
we need one hundred years of getting We need to
deport all the foreigners, and we need to get a
house and order because we're dying here and we need
to go on the defensive now very quickly, you would
have curious things happening in that Materially things would go
downhill quite a lot, but other things will happen where
everybody would be able to have a house, so there
wouldn't be a housing shortage. You would free up all
of these properties and you would have you know, when
when you when you we got through the plague, for example,
you got this booon to after the plague, it was horrible,
the worst thing we've ever been through. And afterwards it
was this boon time. And slowly but surely you can
breathe yourself back to life, and you can heal the scars,
and we can eat potatoes and onions and it's not
going to be nice. But the problem is this is
not what anybody wants to hear this is this is
just not and this is this is this is the tragedy.
This is the great tragedy of it all. The solution
of this is to just take some time out and
be ourselves for a long time.
Speaker 2: But it's not. It's this kind of drive and of madness.
Speaker 6: Right, And that's that you're the thing that I mentioned right,
that that wig history right, things are always getting better
all the time, and that's almost like this sacred myth
that needs to be preserved no matter what. And so
certainly on the narrative level, but also on the economic level,
it's like, whatever we need to do so that that
that fiction stays a live right, anything will be sacrificed.
And I think that your point about, you know, quality
of living is I agree with that, right. And the
complaints I'm making are not to say, you know, a
decline in quality of living is the you know, the
the worst thing that can befall either an individual or
a nation. But there's a difference, as you've said, when
you were getting you know, both, when you're getting both
replacement and the decline, and it's like, well that seems
to be losing twice right, this, this decline and quality
of living, you know, this decline in you know, international
prominence seems to be an efft seems to be the
way of the world. And you can either fight against that,
you know, tooth and nail and destroy yourself in the process,
or say, you know what, I would rather live to
play another game anyway more goth over time. I've got
another interview after this, and my guest is no doubt
wondering where I am. But thank you so much, man,
It's it's always great to talk to you. I really
appreciate your time.
Speaker 2: All right.
Speaker 7: I hope it wasn't too miserable, but that's the way
things are.
Speaker 2: At the moment.
Speaker 7: So yeah, maybe I'll see you again next year.
Speaker 2: I have a merry Christmas.
Speaker 6: Likewise, Mort, I'll be sure to link to all of
your stuff. It's great speaking to you. I appreciate it,
all right.
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