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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Mike Carry from much I had sheet Porta,

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I play at the link, sit point and beach. This

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is GOP smurdering number nine nine zero. And I think

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this is a big part because of podcasting. Now we

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get wisdom talked about a little bit more that we

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maybe have over the last ten twenty thirty years, you know,

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the last twenty years. It's all about where you have lessons.

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You do this, you hit these numbers, you do this

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on track, man, you hit this line on a video screen.

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To be honest, for some people, it works. For most

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they don't have time to really change anything fundamentally, and

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so you can have this great lesson, but you know,

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after you've hit your bucket of balls, you're probably not

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going to hit another bucket of balls correctly until you

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see the next lesson. And so people, I think, get

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frustrated and they're paying all this money for a swing lesson.

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And yeah, my numbers look better and this line looks

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better on the screen. But I keep shooting the same score,

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and I keep hitting the same shots, and I keep

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making the same mistakes. There's a lot more podcasts involved

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with wisdom and experience and filling fives into fours. A

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different approach to be able to help you score better.

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Speaker 2: Meet the course, not yourself. Written by one of the

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PGA tours older rookies, Gary Christian. This is Golf Smarter,

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sharing stories, tips and insights from great golf minds to

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help you lower your score and raise your golf IQ.

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There's your host, Fred Green. Welcome to the Golf Smarter podcast.

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Speaker 1: Gary Well, thank you so much. Fred, great to be

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with you. Look forward to having a nice chat.

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Speaker 2: I'm looking forward to as well, because I truly enjoyed

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the book, but we'll talk about that later. I want

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to talk about your fascinating history in the golf world.

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You've done so many different things, but what's got to

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start the conversation is that you were the oldest rookie

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ever in the PGA Tour.

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Speaker 1: Well, I think I was one of the oldest, let's

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say true rookies, never having played a PGA Tour until

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I was forty years old. So you'll see a lot

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of people you know sneak in and make a US

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open every now and again. That counts that you played

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appreciator event or Monday qualified And yes I was on

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the not overly accelerated path to the PGA Tour. So

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it was it was quite the journey to have a

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lot of you know, dead ends and going backwards, to

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go forwards and go sideways, and we finally made it.

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So great journey. A lot of the time, the journeys,

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I think more fun than the actual destination.

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Speaker 2: Sometimes it is you learn a lot more from the

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journey than you do from the destination, I think, especially

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in golf exactly.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think it makes you the person that

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you are. It forms your character. So the ability to

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have the tenas the and the perseverance and the resilience

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that you showed in your golf career then translates to

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life as well. So I think that's the great thing

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about golf. I had so many parallels to life, and

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it is in many respects a metaphor for life.

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Speaker 2: Right right, So you must have hit so many roadblocks

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along the way. What was that your drive kept going

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that you just knew that you had the ability to

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get there?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, I mean, you know, the roadblocks I had,

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you know, just always had was not being a particularly

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imposing physical specimen, you know, maybe not having the finances

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that could help me to do whatever I needed to

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do when I needed to do it, and you know,

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a talent level that was obviously a very high talent level.

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But when you threw me in against some other players

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and some other college players and many tour players there,

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you know there was only one person that was going

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to make the two and it wasn't me. And so

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you always of battling and and it just I always

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had the ability to win. I think just because I

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was just naturally a tough personality. I always say I

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hated losing more than I enjoyed winning, and you learn

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a lot from that, and but you know, it takes

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a lot out of you. So you know, it's funny

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now that I don't really enjoy competing that much in

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many respects. I think I used up my reserves of

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energy and emotional and energy to be able to get

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where I got to. So you know, now when my

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son beats me a ping pong, I don't solve for

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half an hour like I used to. So that's kind

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of nice. It makes you a little bit better human

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being as well, which is even better. But yeah, I

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always had the belief in myself that I had something

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of what it would take to get to the highest level,

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and we just were trying to put our finger on

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what was that little bit of glue that would put

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the final pieces together that would allow everything to work.

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You know, you can be you know, maybe undersized, maybe

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under talented, maybe under financed, maybe under coached, but if

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you have one thing that kind of puts everything together

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to give you what it is you do have, but

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has everything working together at the same time, like everyone's

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put in the same direction, you can achieve great things.

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And that's what I think I did with the mental

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side of the game to dedicate myself to that to

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be able to push me over the edge. You see

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a lot of incredibly talented players with amazing swings, amazing

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you know, coaching, but they don't have that thing that

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allows it to happen when they need it to happen.

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And you know, it's almost like it's almost like the

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game's too easy for them, and they kind of overlook

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certain other things that I would never have overlooked, and

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you know, I would just be jealous of kind of

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I could just have that talent or that swing or

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that bank balance to be able to go and see

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who I want when I want and try and improve constantly.

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You know, I could have done some really great things

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with that, and I would have been a rookie at

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thirty or not forty.

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Speaker 2: So in that journey you must have played a lot.

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Let me ask you this first. What year was it

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when you were forty that you made it onto the tour?

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What were we talking?

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Speaker 1: That was twenty eleven. So I'm on myland Classic on

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the Cornferry to and I've had a good year up

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to that stage, and that win put me comfortably inside

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the top twenty five on the points list or the

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moneylist back back then. But it was special because it

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was in Pittsburgh. Arnold Palmer was the honorary tournament chairman,

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and so there was just something. I'm a student of

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the game, a student of history, and to have that

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connection with what I had just achieved. And someone took

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a photo of me making my six inch part to

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get my PGA Tour card and win the tournament, and

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they sent it to me. I sent it to mister

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Palmer and he signed it like he does. He did,

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you know, for so many people. So it's just that special,

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special memento that They've got a lot of special things,

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but that's certainly one of the more important ones.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, absolutely, so when we're talking about twenty eleven, there

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were probably a lot in those years that you were

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competing at that level before you made it to the

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PGA Tour. There must have been a lot of young

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players coming up that were just walking right by you

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and getting onto the tour. Were there players that you're going,

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I'm better than him? Why am I not going there?

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Speaker 1: Well, I mean there's been nine here. There were plenty

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of players that you know, you knew were very good players.

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We were obviously to make you live in at the game.

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You're all very good players, and it's just a fine

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it's such a fine line. You know, for that person

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that finished hundredth on the one hundred and first on

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the corn free to have lost their card, they were

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just as good of a player as the guy that

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finished in the top twenty five and got their card.

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That's the final line of the nature of professional golf.

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And you know, you look at it, it may come

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down to you know, one nine holes and might come

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down to one hole, but you know, you've just got

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to just got to maintain that belief. And you know,

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I didn't really worry too much about that the young

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guns coming through and taking taking my spots on the

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PGA Tour because I knew I was going to get

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there eventually, and I just, you know, as as I

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played the years on the corn Free Tourt, I got

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more comfortable with the courses. I got more comfortable being

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in contention. And you just have to use prior experience

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to be able to perform better when you get an

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opportunity the next time. And that was always my goal.

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Whatever happened, I always learned something from the experience, whether

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it was good or bad, and then applied that the

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next time. You know, I'd vow to not make that mistake.

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The next time, I would I would sit back after that.

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I was very good about looking at things objectively. I

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didn't take things emotionally. So, you know, you may go

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into the tournament in the final group or two with

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a chance to win a Corn Forrery Tour event, which

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may may or may not get a PGA Tour card,

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and you end up not playing great. You know, a

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lot of people it will crush them. Because of the

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resilience I had, I was just able to kind of

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sit back, say, hey, you know, I try my best.

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You know, things didn't work out that day. Now let's

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go over that round. Let's see what I could have

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done better. You know, maybe in course management, maybe in

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decision making, you know, but usually the most of the

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most of the answers were in you know, maybe deviating

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from my routine, getting distracted, get in a little bit

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taken by the situation, and then you kind of say, okay,

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next time. You know, My goal was to try and play,

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you know, in effect, play a little bit like an

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emotionless robot, even though I'm an outgoing, friendly guy in

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between shots, That's what I am. But when I get

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when I was getting into the shots, my job was

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to take everything out of play, every distraction, every thought

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of score, every thought of position, every thought of what if,

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and say, I'm going to dedicate myself to giving myself

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the best chance to make the best decision on this shot,

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to visualize this shot as clearly as possible, to feel

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exactly what it is I'm trying to do with this swing,

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and then to get set up and then connect to

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the target and let it go, and then whatever happens happens.

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But what I could do is I could look myself

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in the mirror after that shot and say, hey, I

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did anything I could do. I cannot do anything more

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than this, and sometimes go it's a hard game. And

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sometimes sometimes is a degree out and that past two

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degrees out and the ball goes twenty yards offline. That's

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just part of the game. And I worked really hard

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on that, and I would grade myself on how I

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perform my routine, and I would try and get seventy

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five percent of shots hit, whether they were drives, iron shots,

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chips or puts as an a as grade in it

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as an ad man, I did everything right there. It's

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impossible to do for one hundred percent of the shots,

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but seventy five percent was kind of my checklist. And

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I'll go through my yardage book at the end on

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my pin sheet and our grade every shot, and at

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the end, I was saying, man, that was a good

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round of golf today. I got seventy eight percent of

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routines done to my liking.

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Speaker 2: You mentioned being emotionless when you're playing, even though you're

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an outgoing guy. At what stage of your development as

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a golfer from I'm sure you started as a very

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young age, started playing through the time that you finally

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made it to the Tour and beyond that, what was

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the point in that development that you realized how or

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learned how to be emotionless while you're playing golf.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's when I dedicated myself to the

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mental side of the game. In twenty oh four, I'd

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failed again at second stage of qualifying school and I

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had a five drive back home, and you know, I'm

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looking forward to blawing on the Mini Tours. But yet

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another year, at thirty four years old or thirty three

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years old or whatever, I had a wife and a

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newborn son, and you know, obviously what I was doing

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wasn't working. Because it was working well enough to make

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money on the Mini Tours, which is almost impossible, and

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to win events every single year, but it just wasn't

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enough to get over that hump of getting through second

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stage of qualifying school. So when I dedicated myself to that,

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I was able to see a different path, see a

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path where to be in control of one's mental makeup,

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one's emotional makeup, the ability to react positivetively not negatively,

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to talk kindly to yourself, all of these things that

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we see in every gold psychology book we read. But

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what brought life to it was reading the Eight Traits

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of Champion Golfers by Graham and John Stabler, and I

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just kind of just threw myself into it. And the

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more I read of that, the more of these little

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vignettes would come out to help me on the golf course.

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And it wasn't theory. It was it was practical, practical advice.

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You do this, this will happen. You do this differently,

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this will happen differently. And that's what I wanted. I

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just wanted a roadmap. And to that point I didn't

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have a roadmap. I was kind of a little bit

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lost in exactly what it is I needed to do.

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And this helped just focus me a little bit more

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to instead of, you know, trying lots of different things

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and wasting energy kind of as I said, going forwards

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and then saying, well that doesn't work, let's back out

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this space and go to another another tunnel and see

256
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if that works. This now was was what it is

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that I needed, and that was that gave me the

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ability to be way more efficient in the time spent

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with preparation to play golf at the highest levels. As

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I said, I had family commitments where I didn't need

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to be out of the house for eight hours a day,

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and so I cut back on my physical practice and

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spend more time at home. But I would go to

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a quiet spot and really work hard in developing the

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skills necessary to be able to translate that on the

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golf course of visualization and relaxation and just awareness, awareness

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of how it is you're thinking. You know, we are

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not very mindful of what's going on. We're not mindful

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of what we're eating. I eat too quickly, I don't

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maybe listen the way I should do. I don't open

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my senses, and all of a sudden, when you become mindful,

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you're suddenly aware of God tell you what my body

273
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is extremely tight here, or I'm now very aware of

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these very poor messages I'm telling myself. And I used

275
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to do that. You know, I would get frustrated playing

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go if I wouldn't show out and break clubs or

277
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throw clubs or custs or anything. But there was that inward,

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in a conversation between me and myself about how unacceptable

279
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that was and how poor that was and how much

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I sucked. And you can't be doing that to yourself,

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and you flip it around and if your parents had

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said the same thing to you that you were saying

283
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to yourself, it wouldn't be a very healthy relationship. So,

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you know, I've always been a positive guy, but I

285
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could just you know, I was seventy five percent positive.

286
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I had to get one hundred percent positive. So everything

287
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that I did, every situation that I faced, I framed

288
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it as positively as possible. I could go on top one,

289
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but I could say to myself, you know what, man,

290
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your routine felt pretty good there, or you had the

291
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right club, or can't wait to hit this next shot

292
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and see if we can hit a great shot and

293
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then another great shot and make part on this whole.

294
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I did that in a PGA two event in Memphis.

295
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It was just a shot out of the blue, like

296
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a pool top that went about one hundred yards. I

297
00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:02,320
hit three with thirty forty yard short of the green,

298
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pitched onto two feet and made part. But if I'd

299
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have got in my own way of telling myself how

300
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bad that was, and you know, telling myself, I'm a

301
00:16:12,159 --> 00:16:15,120
PGA tour plan, I've just topped a ball and look

302
00:16:15,159 --> 00:16:17,960
at all those people watching. How embarrassing is that? I

303
00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:21,240
can't believe I'm a pros just done that. My mind

304
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just went immediately to let's frame this as positive as possible.

305
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Let's get onto the next shot. They said a great

306
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shot here, and they said another great shot. And that's

307
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what I did.

308
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Speaker 2: What a great lesson. And many of those are in

309
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the book. And again we are going to get to

310
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the book. I'm just more fascinated about your development right now.

311
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Speaker 1: I think I think that's why the book is so powerful,

312
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is because it is actually based in a realistic, actual

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things that happen. And you know, I like to think

314
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that things are taught better or easier or people understand

315
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things when it's based in things that happen everyday life.

316
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And I think that's a powerful way. You know, when

317
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you had teachers at school who could turn a very

318
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boring history lesson into something that came alive, where you

319
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put yourself in that battle or in that courtroom drama

320
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or whatever it was in that you know, you know,

321
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congressional meeting, whatever it was. When I heard those kinds

322
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of stories, I just lived at I was there. I imagined,

323
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I could you know, vividly imagine being you know, somewhere

324
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two hundred years ago. And I think that's the secret

325
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to good teaching, good write, in, good broadcast, in whatever

326
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it is. You've got to allow that person to experience

327
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what it is they experience and then help them change

328
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that experience.

329
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Speaker 2: Are you self taught in all of all your development

330
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or did you have a variety of instructors from the

331
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beginning all the way through.

332
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Speaker 1: Well, I was self taught until I was twenty six.

333
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With a golf swing. My dad was a genius without

334
00:18:01,880 --> 00:18:05,759
knowing it. He he as a kid, would have me

335
00:18:06,079 --> 00:18:08,759
I was a six and we would hit balls and

336
00:18:08,799 --> 00:18:10,960
he would put a stick on the other side of

337
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the ball and would tell me just to make the

338
00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:17,000
divot after the stick, you know, And as a six

339
00:18:17,119 --> 00:18:19,720
year old kid, you don't ask why, You just say, okay,

340
00:18:19,799 --> 00:18:22,240
I'll do that then, because my dad told me to

341
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do it, so it must be right. And that gave

342
00:18:24,599 --> 00:18:26,759
me a hundred lessons without him knowing it. It gave

343
00:18:26,839 --> 00:18:28,960
me a steady head, It gave me a good pivot,

344
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It gave me a flat left wrist to impact. He

345
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gave me weight transition. It did everything that you needed

346
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to do to hit the ball consistently. So I've never

347
00:18:37,839 --> 00:18:40,440
ever worried about making good contact with the ball because

348
00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:42,720
of that lesson when I was six. But you know

349
00:18:42,759 --> 00:18:47,200
I got through you know, junior golfert whatever level I

350
00:18:47,240 --> 00:18:50,839
played in England, I earned a scholarship to Auburn. Being

351
00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:55,240
self taught, which in many respects was, you know, maybe

352
00:18:55,279 --> 00:18:57,839
put me a little bit behind other people. But I

353
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think what I gained from it was I own my swing.

354
00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:03,519
I owned the DNA of my swing, so I was

355
00:19:03,559 --> 00:19:06,799
able to correct things way quicker than other people because

356
00:19:06,799 --> 00:19:09,480
I could correct things on the course because in effect,

357
00:19:09,559 --> 00:19:13,039
I was my own coach, whereas other players with way

358
00:19:13,039 --> 00:19:14,839
better swings than me, as soon as they hit one

359
00:19:14,920 --> 00:19:18,160
bad shot, you know, if mister coach isn't there, they

360
00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:20,480
don't know how to go to Plan B or how

361
00:19:20,519 --> 00:19:23,640
to correct when things go wrong. And so I knew

362
00:19:23,640 --> 00:19:26,920
that obviously I had to finally get a coach, and

363
00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:29,680
so when I was twenty six, I started working with

364
00:19:30,519 --> 00:19:32,880
a great coach called Wayne Flint, top one hundred instruct

365
00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:36,240
who lived close to where I lived in Birmingham, and

366
00:19:36,519 --> 00:19:39,960
that helped refine what it was I did already, but

367
00:19:40,039 --> 00:19:43,279
it didn't change the DNA of the swing. So I

368
00:19:43,319 --> 00:19:47,519
still had the belief and the feel and the understanding

369
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of the swing, but we just in effect knocked off

370
00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:54,119
the rough edges and with the golf psychology. I read

371
00:19:54,119 --> 00:19:56,200
a load of books, they didn't really speak to me,

372
00:19:56,359 --> 00:19:59,480
you know, Bob Rotello. I enjoyed those books, but it

373
00:19:59,519 --> 00:20:01,480
didn't feel like it was tailored to me. It was,

374
00:20:01,599 --> 00:20:05,000
you know, some lovely little anecdotes that I could get

375
00:20:05,039 --> 00:20:08,960
stuff from, but I needed something that was more for me,

376
00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:12,440
a personalized touch, and that's where Deborah Graham and John

377
00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:15,240
Stables book spoke to me. So then I started working

378
00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:18,200
with them on a one to one basis and that

379
00:20:18,319 --> 00:20:21,039
just helped solidify what I knew already. So it was

380
00:20:21,119 --> 00:20:23,279
kind of the same kind of thing with the swing

381
00:20:23,359 --> 00:20:25,000
and the mental side of the game. I was basically

382
00:20:25,039 --> 00:20:27,880
self taught and then had the experts come in and

383
00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:30,119
just knocked the rough edges off and just help the

384
00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:31,359
understanding a little further.

385
00:20:32,799 --> 00:20:37,319
Speaker 2: Excellent. So what was harder getting to the tour or

386
00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:38,480
staying on the tour?

387
00:20:39,319 --> 00:20:42,519
Speaker 1: Well, in many respects, I feel a bit like Jim Brown.

388
00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:45,640
Injury took my career before I really got a chance

389
00:20:45,680 --> 00:20:49,079
to enjoy it. So you certainly get into the tour

390
00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:52,599
was the hardest thing. Yeah, when I was playing it

391
00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:55,319
was top one twenty five would keep their card. I'll

392
00:20:55,319 --> 00:20:57,640
be honest, I don't think I had to play that

393
00:20:57,640 --> 00:21:00,880
well to keep my card. I earned my card on

394
00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:03,039
the corn for it to a play at a level

395
00:21:03,039 --> 00:21:04,920
I would call an A or an A minors to

396
00:21:05,079 --> 00:21:09,079
finish in the top twenty five, I finished ninth. And

397
00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:11,920
I played my rookie year on the PGA Tour. I

398
00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:17,640
made the FedEx Cup playoffs. I had six or seven

399
00:21:17,720 --> 00:21:21,119
top twenties, top ten, So I played, you know, had

400
00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:23,920
some good results, and I mean I would grade myself

401
00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:28,519
a B minors, maybe even a C plus. And I finished,

402
00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:30,240
you know, and got on the FedEx Cup playoffs. If

403
00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:32,119
I'd have played the way I'd played the previous year,

404
00:21:32,759 --> 00:21:35,640
I would have finished top seventy, I think pretty comfortably. So,

405
00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:38,839
you know, on the tour, you just it suited my

406
00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:44,440
game because it was about minimizing mistakes, and I tended

407
00:21:44,440 --> 00:21:46,240
to keep the ball in play. I tended to hit

408
00:21:46,240 --> 00:21:50,079
a lot of greens, and I tended not to beat myself,

409
00:21:51,599 --> 00:21:53,519
which would be a good name for a bookouldn't it.

410
00:21:54,240 --> 00:21:56,880
So that was the kind of the secret of playing

411
00:21:56,920 --> 00:21:58,920
on the on the PGA Tour, you just you know,

412
00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:01,079
everyone thinks you got to go super low out there.

413
00:22:01,079 --> 00:22:03,559
You don't. You just go, you shoot four rounds on

414
00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:05,440
the par You're going to make a fortune every year.

415
00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:10,519
And it was just I was unfortunate in that my game.

416
00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:13,799
You know, Yes, the course is a little bit harder,

417
00:22:14,279 --> 00:22:16,880
and it maybe highlighted a few of my weaknesses a

418
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:18,319
little bit more than it did on the corn for

419
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:20,200
a tour, But on the corn for a too, I

420
00:22:20,279 --> 00:22:22,039
was top twenty and part in on the tour, I

421
00:22:22,079 --> 00:22:23,920
was outside the top one hundred. And that was basically

422
00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:28,160
the difference between playing four good rounds five weeks in

423
00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:32,000
that year to play in three good rounds five weeks

424
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:34,799
a year. And if you had played four good rounds,

425
00:22:34,799 --> 00:22:37,440
I would have had five top tens and finished in

426
00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:39,559
the top seventy pretty comfortably.

427
00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:49,799
Speaker 2: You mentioned that I think this is a lesson for

428
00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:53,559
every golfer at every level, from beginner all the way through.

429
00:22:54,319 --> 00:22:57,799
But you know, everyone when you ask someone are you

430
00:22:58,400 --> 00:23:01,079
are you pretty good golfer? Andy? And I'll tell you no, no, no,

431
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:04,519
I suck. I'm terrible. But everyone is going to say that.

432
00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:06,759
And here we have somebody who made it to the

433
00:23:06,759 --> 00:23:10,720
PGA Tour saying, yeah, I was a C plus B minus. Right.

434
00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:14,400
Even the best in the world will tell you no,

435
00:23:14,960 --> 00:23:19,920
you know. I mean, I've been telling people I'm not good,

436
00:23:20,079 --> 00:23:21,000
but I'm not that bad.

437
00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:26,119
Speaker 1: It goes back to those fine lines. You know. The

438
00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:28,799
difference between a B minus year and an A minus

439
00:23:28,880 --> 00:23:33,319
year is tiny, It's minuscule, but that's the difference between

440
00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:37,720
finishing barely inside the FedEx Cup playoff spots and finishing

441
00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:41,799
well inside or finishing well outside. It is just it's

442
00:23:41,839 --> 00:23:46,200
so competitive out there, and you just you can't have weaknesses.

443
00:23:46,319 --> 00:23:48,319
That's that's the thing that kind of stands out to

444
00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:51,480
me the most. On the PGA too. Any weaknesses is

445
00:23:51,799 --> 00:23:58,160
magnified there because the penalty for a lack of skill

446
00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:00,799
and a department is just a little bit higher than

447
00:24:00,839 --> 00:24:02,680
it is anywhere else, and you get found out. And

448
00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:05,160
when you're playing against the top one hundred and fifty

449
00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:09,640
in the world, that basically, you know, that's a recipe

450
00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:13,759
for getting run over. So I was glad that what

451
00:24:13,839 --> 00:24:17,279
I was so glad I never had that overarching dream

452
00:24:17,519 --> 00:24:20,440
and goal of I have to play on the PGA Tour.

453
00:24:21,279 --> 00:24:24,359
My goal was to improve, to see how good I

454
00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:28,880
could get and wherever that took me, I would be delighted. So,

455
00:24:29,599 --> 00:24:31,680
you know, to go from being a part time player

456
00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:33,680
because I had a full time job in England. I'm

457
00:24:33,759 --> 00:24:35,720
one of the few PGA Tour players who's ever had

458
00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:38,680
a job as well. So I left school at eighteen

459
00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:42,759
and worked full time in the pensions field for two

460
00:24:42,839 --> 00:24:45,440
years just outside London, and I was playing twice a

461
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:47,359
week and everyone was playing seven days a week. So

462
00:24:48,839 --> 00:24:51,680
you know it is to go from there to playing

463
00:24:51,839 --> 00:24:55,160
college goal for Auburn. What a massive jump that was,

464
00:24:55,200 --> 00:24:57,440
What an amazing journey that was. And if I'd have

465
00:24:57,440 --> 00:25:00,000
finished there and that was the limit to how good

466
00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:02,480
I could get, then I could have probably laid my

467
00:25:02,519 --> 00:25:05,319
head on the pillow and been fine about it. But

468
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:07,559
then to go from there and be able to play

469
00:25:07,599 --> 00:25:10,640
on the mini tours and win thirty times, that's a

470
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:13,839
pretty good career right there for someone who started where

471
00:25:13,839 --> 00:25:16,519
I started from. And then to go to the corn

472
00:25:16,559 --> 00:25:20,240
Free Tour and win two times there, that's an amazing story.

473
00:25:20,319 --> 00:25:22,960
To go from working as a pensions administrator to win

474
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:25,480
in twice on the corn Free Tour and then to

475
00:25:25,559 --> 00:25:28,880
be a rookie make the Fedexcat Playoffs as a forty

476
00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:31,160
year old and play with tiger woods at the Barclays.

477
00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:33,359
That kind of puts the cherry on the top to

478
00:25:33,799 --> 00:25:35,920
know where you went from and where you finished that.

479
00:25:36,519 --> 00:25:39,200
But again, it was always just that I just want

480
00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:40,720
to see how good I can get, and I was

481
00:25:40,839 --> 00:25:44,160
glad to see that that was a PGA Tour level

482
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:45,799
and to be one of the best players in the world.

483
00:25:46,839 --> 00:25:53,359
Speaker 2: Man, congratulations on that. I'm fascinated. Do you think that

484
00:25:54,920 --> 00:25:57,680
it could ever happen again that a forty year old

485
00:25:58,000 --> 00:25:59,799
could make it to the tour as a rookie.

486
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:05,519
Speaker 1: I find it highly highly unlikely. It's just the standard

487
00:26:05,519 --> 00:26:07,599
of golf is so high. I was very lucky that

488
00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:11,359
I got right at the end of the PGA Tour,

489
00:26:11,559 --> 00:26:15,599
being obviously the best tour of the world, obviously incredible

490
00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:21,640
selection of players, but it was you know, there was

491
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:25,279
that pathway through the corn free tour where you could

492
00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:28,559
use experience and you could, you know, kind of pay

493
00:26:28,599 --> 00:26:31,160
your dues, kind of like the old fashioned way of things,

494
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:33,000
how things used to be. You would kind of learn

495
00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:35,599
how to fail for many many years on the on

496
00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:37,799
the mini tours and whatever, and then all of a

497
00:26:37,839 --> 00:26:41,039
sudden you would hit it just right and get through

498
00:26:41,079 --> 00:26:43,079
qualifying school and get on the PGA two and may

499
00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:46,200
or may not have a career, long term career, but

500
00:26:46,279 --> 00:26:49,240
it was possible to do. Now you got PGA two

501
00:26:49,400 --> 00:26:57,480
university where these university college students graduates the accelerated program.

502
00:26:57,759 --> 00:27:01,400
These guys are, they're in their teens or their early twenties,

503
00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:03,920
and they're the equivalent of thirty year old players that

504
00:27:04,079 --> 00:27:07,480
the the tools they have behind them. You know, they

505
00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:09,559
when you think of what I did, I was self

506
00:27:09,599 --> 00:27:11,720
taught to I was twenty six. Not one player is

507
00:27:11,759 --> 00:27:15,680
self taught. I didn't get into goal psychology till I

508
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:20,359
was thirty three. Basically every single top college player will

509
00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:23,599
have a psychologist. Basically every top college player has a

510
00:27:23,599 --> 00:27:27,200
PGA to a team behind them as a teenager. And

511
00:27:27,799 --> 00:27:30,559
that's the difference. So they are they are so far

512
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:34,559
and above what people from the previous generation were at

513
00:27:34,559 --> 00:27:38,599
their age that they are. You know, they're they're just incredible,

514
00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:43,480
incredible athletes and incredible players that have this amazing talent,

515
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:47,279
but with that maturity added in. You throw that in

516
00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:50,880
with you know, players in how bigger, stronger, more powerful

517
00:27:52,079 --> 00:27:54,799
at you know, twenty five years old players they hit

518
00:27:54,839 --> 00:27:56,519
in it three hundred and forty yards and they're just

519
00:27:56,680 --> 00:27:59,000
playing pitch and park golf courses all the way, all

520
00:27:59,079 --> 00:28:02,759
year long. You know, forty year olds tend to hit

521
00:28:02,799 --> 00:28:05,000
it a little bit shorter than a twenty five year old.

522
00:28:05,079 --> 00:28:07,000
So you know, the way I look at the best

523
00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:11,119
way to explain it is through my experience of playing

524
00:28:11,119 --> 00:28:13,799
at the highest levels. I hit the ball, let's say

525
00:28:13,799 --> 00:28:16,720
two hundred and eighty five yards, I get paired with

526
00:28:16,839 --> 00:28:19,960
Rory McElroy, I get I have to give him forty

527
00:28:20,039 --> 00:28:23,920
yards on every single hole where we hit driver. Now,

528
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:27,079
over one round, I might have one of those days

529
00:28:27,079 --> 00:28:29,920
with my seven irons where I just have that incredible

530
00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:31,839
ball striking round and they have a load of birdie

531
00:28:31,880 --> 00:28:35,759
chances with the seven nine, maybe two rounds, I might

532
00:28:35,799 --> 00:28:38,200
be able to stay in hang in there by doing

533
00:28:38,599 --> 00:28:41,559
having some incredible ball striking. But over the course of

534
00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:45,039
four rounds, a forty yard head start is gonna catch

535
00:28:45,119 --> 00:28:47,480
up with you, and you get no chance to compete

536
00:28:49,039 --> 00:28:51,960
without just having basically playing a perfect four days of

537
00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:55,759
golf ever free. And that's the difference. And that's where

538
00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:59,880
it's not just Rory who does that. It's one hundred players.

539
00:29:00,039 --> 00:29:04,200
The PGA tour and so that's that's the hardest thing

540
00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:06,960
to compete again. So you know, I'm very proud that

541
00:29:07,519 --> 00:29:12,000
I think I will be certainly, if not the last,

542
00:29:12,119 --> 00:29:14,839
very close to the last kind of story that that

543
00:29:15,759 --> 00:29:18,440
I think we can we can relate to. You know,

544
00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:22,200
I'm in every man we call a guy that did

545
00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:24,640
the best with what he had and didn't have the

546
00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:27,720
resources to do it any more than I was capable

547
00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:30,640
of doing. And I made it to live a dream.

548
00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:33,359
And you know, we will strive for that, don't we.

549
00:29:33,359 --> 00:29:35,599
We go through college and we we we try and

550
00:29:35,599 --> 00:29:38,200
get a job that will allow us to fulfill a dream.

551
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:41,359
Some people start their own business because they have a dream.

552
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:44,680
A lot of people fail, there's a few that succeed.

553
00:29:45,519 --> 00:29:47,839
And that's kind of kind of how I feel in

554
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:55,119
that my dream, you know, came came to fruition. There's

555
00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:59,079
a hundred others whose dream just got was the roadkill

556
00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:02,519
on on mini tours where they invested a ton of

557
00:30:02,519 --> 00:30:05,400
money and time and effort and sweat equity, and at

558
00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:08,000
the end of it, they lost a load of money.

559
00:30:08,119 --> 00:30:11,319
And you know they didn't They're thirty years old and

560
00:30:11,400 --> 00:30:14,319
they're still driving a car. Put together with duct tape.

561
00:30:14,319 --> 00:30:17,720
And that's kind of how I was until I figured

562
00:30:17,759 --> 00:30:20,960
out how to be successful. It was such a fine

563
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:22,039
line once again.

564
00:30:23,119 --> 00:30:26,640
Speaker 2: And you were saying that you pretty much stopped had

565
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,039
to stop playing because your body rebelled against you.

566
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:32,559
Speaker 1: Well, I just had a freak injury. Yeah. I always

567
00:30:32,599 --> 00:30:35,960
say I do some public speaking about my journey, and

568
00:30:36,559 --> 00:30:39,920
you know, using the life lessons and lessons in business.

569
00:30:40,400 --> 00:30:43,759
It's a very close parallel. But I always always get

570
00:30:43,799 --> 00:30:45,480
to kick. They always get a kick when I say

571
00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:48,759
the TV show The Bachelor ended my PGA tour career.

572
00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:51,319
Now I wasn't on it and got divorced or anything,

573
00:30:51,359 --> 00:30:54,640
but my wife and I would watch The Bachelor religiously

574
00:30:55,799 --> 00:30:59,319
because we all love a train wreck. And so playing

575
00:30:59,359 --> 00:31:02,480
in the Canadian Open, I just started playing really well

576
00:31:02,519 --> 00:31:05,039
on the tour my next my second year, my sophomore year.

577
00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:09,519
And I don't like the heat, and this was one

578
00:31:09,559 --> 00:31:11,839
of those perfect weeks in Canada. It was seventy degrees

579
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:14,319
and you know, I just wanted to just get some

580
00:31:14,359 --> 00:31:17,640
fresh air in my body. And so I had dinner

581
00:31:17,799 --> 00:31:19,400
and I was going to go back to the hotel

582
00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:21,759
and watch The Bachelor, and I guess text backs and

583
00:31:21,759 --> 00:31:24,960
falls with my wife, and I said, you know what,

584
00:31:25,039 --> 00:31:27,680
I think I'm gonna I'll watch it on DVR when

585
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:30,000
I get home. I'm going to go for a walk,

586
00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:33,960
and so I had an ice cream. I walked to

587
00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:37,279
a place called Bronte Harbor, which is on Lake Ontario,

588
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:41,240
and I was just walking around through the woods and

589
00:31:41,480 --> 00:31:43,480
I walked over these rocks that were kind of like

590
00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:46,559
an embankment around the lake, and I slipped off the

591
00:31:46,599 --> 00:31:51,599
last rock and I paw my ACL mcl maniscus all

592
00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:54,960
at the same time. So my knee kneecap was jiggling

593
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:57,720
at the spot that it shouldn't have jiggled, and that

594
00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:01,759
was basically I had had it repaired, and I tore

595
00:32:01,799 --> 00:32:05,960
it again in the corn Free Tour playoffs at that time,

596
00:32:06,039 --> 00:32:09,359
trying to get my tour car back, which you trying

597
00:32:09,400 --> 00:32:12,200
to get back, Yeah, so I was. I was around

598
00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:14,680
and four holes away from getting it back. I played

599
00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:17,079
really well for two rounds and then I got I

600
00:32:17,079 --> 00:32:19,279
got in a bunk with a massive steep face and

601
00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:23,000
hit it and I couldn't hold my balance and as

602
00:32:23,400 --> 00:32:25,680
I started falling back, I just heard it snap and

603
00:32:26,759 --> 00:32:29,680
swelled up like a grapefruit. And I I tried to

604
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:31,440
gut it out the next day, and I think if

605
00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:34,559
I could have shot seventy one the last round, I

606
00:32:34,559 --> 00:32:35,960
could have got my tour I would have got my

607
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:38,279
tour card back. And I think I shot seventy seven,

608
00:32:38,319 --> 00:32:41,680
but hobbled around on a tour in acl and you

609
00:32:41,799 --> 00:32:43,759
do what you have to do. And I had it

610
00:32:43,799 --> 00:32:45,960
repaired again and tore it again, and then I had

611
00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:48,920
it repaired again. So there was actually a special moment.

612
00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:54,359
This last year, I covered the PGA Tour event, the

613
00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:59,480
Canadian Open for PGA two Alive, and it was at

614
00:33:00,119 --> 00:33:02,920
Hamilton Golf and Country Club where I actually had my

615
00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:04,920
my loan top ten on the tour. So it was

616
00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:07,240
a special moment for me anyway to do that. But

617
00:33:07,279 --> 00:33:09,519
on the way back to the airport, I drove back

618
00:33:09,599 --> 00:33:12,119
to Bronte Harbor and I wanted to just go back

619
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:15,279
to see if I could remember where it happened. And

620
00:33:15,319 --> 00:33:17,240
it was a it was a cathartic moment, but it

621
00:33:17,359 --> 00:33:20,079
was one that just just gave me goosebumps, just to

622
00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:23,160
you know, to be there and see the rock and

623
00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:26,960
remember being enough heat a crumpled heap on the floor

624
00:33:28,319 --> 00:33:31,000
and just right there sitting there saying, well, that's the

625
00:33:31,119 --> 00:33:33,279
dream over, and what do I do next? I remember

626
00:33:33,359 --> 00:33:35,440
vividly saying that, well, I'm not going to be playing

627
00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:38,880
golf anymore? What do I do now? And so it

628
00:33:38,920 --> 00:33:42,319
was it was special to see that. And then funnily enough,

629
00:33:42,359 --> 00:33:43,960
I flew over it on the way back home as well,

630
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:45,960
so I saw it from a different angle. So it

631
00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:50,480
just it was almost like, you know, it's almost like

632
00:33:50,519 --> 00:33:53,359
a it's sort of like almost like the Hollywood ending

633
00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:56,519
the wrong way, but still something that you got something

634
00:33:56,559 --> 00:33:58,400
out of and you framed it the right way and

635
00:33:58,759 --> 00:34:00,720
you said, Okay, well here's the next challenge. What do

636
00:34:00,759 --> 00:34:03,559
I do now? And I've always been good about kind

637
00:34:03,559 --> 00:34:04,039
of moving on.

638
00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:15,199
Speaker 2: Well, were you emotionless about what do I have to

639
00:34:15,239 --> 00:34:18,480
do next now that I know that my competitive play

640
00:34:18,639 --> 00:34:21,559
is over? Or did it take you a while to

641
00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:24,079
pick yourself up and figure something out?

642
00:34:25,039 --> 00:34:28,480
Speaker 1: Yeah? It was surprisingly quick. As I said, I move

643
00:34:28,559 --> 00:34:32,039
on quickly. And I've talked to other players who were pissed.

644
00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:35,000
They were pissed at life that thinks, yeah, where they

645
00:34:35,039 --> 00:34:40,000
couldn't play anymore. And I guess one of the reasons

646
00:34:40,039 --> 00:34:41,840
was I just knew I couldn't play to the level

647
00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:43,840
that I was capable of playing that, So why get

648
00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:46,880
upset about it? You know, now move on and throw

649
00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:50,639
all of that energy that you threw into playing on

650
00:34:50,679 --> 00:34:53,119
the PGA two and get into the PGA two and

651
00:34:53,199 --> 00:34:56,880
having a fifteen year journey to get there. Well, now

652
00:34:57,239 --> 00:34:59,480
let's throw some energy into the next stage of things.

653
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:02,440
And I wanted to get into broadcast and in my fifties,

654
00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:05,119
not in my forties, and I always felt like I

655
00:35:05,159 --> 00:35:06,719
was going to be good at it. I always enjoy

656
00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:11,199
talking to the media. I always enjoyed giving thoughtful answers,

657
00:35:11,360 --> 00:35:14,199
and so it was it was fortunately was able to

658
00:35:14,199 --> 00:35:16,760
make that transition through Sky Sports in the UK where

659
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:19,639
they needed a British voice that had actually played the

660
00:35:19,639 --> 00:35:22,559
PGA Tour or their talent played on the dp World Tour,

661
00:35:23,079 --> 00:35:26,239
so I could add a different angle because I'd actually

662
00:35:26,239 --> 00:35:28,719
played the golf courses. So that was that was very,

663
00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:30,639
very fortunate to have been able to do that. I

664
00:35:30,679 --> 00:35:32,599
got to go home, I got to spend time with

665
00:35:32,679 --> 00:35:34,400
my mom and dad and my brother and my friends,

666
00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:37,920
and it was almost like, you know, I got a

667
00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:41,960
spiritual side to matters when you know, I thought, this

668
00:35:42,039 --> 00:35:45,079
is this was my next path. This is the I

669
00:35:45,079 --> 00:35:48,639
couldn't do anything about it. And I remember a lot

670
00:35:48,679 --> 00:35:53,159
of that was from I had, you know, I played

671
00:35:53,199 --> 00:35:56,440
a few weeks before that, The Travelers, and I played

672
00:35:56,559 --> 00:35:58,679
Ricky Founder, who that time was one of the top

673
00:35:58,719 --> 00:36:01,119
ten in the world, and I matched him shot for shot.

674
00:36:01,159 --> 00:36:03,639
I played unbelievable. I think he shot sixty six. I

675
00:36:03,639 --> 00:36:05,639
shot sixty seven in the last round. We were one

676
00:36:05,679 --> 00:36:09,840
of the PGA two a Live ats feature groups, one

677
00:36:09,840 --> 00:36:12,719
of the first ones they ever did, and so it

678
00:36:12,719 --> 00:36:15,239
was a pretty special day. But I remember I told

679
00:36:15,519 --> 00:36:19,840
about two three footers on seventeen and eighteen. They went in,

680
00:36:20,559 --> 00:36:24,280
but it didn't feel real comfortable. And I remember, you know,

681
00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:26,639
I finished top twenty. I think top twenty five had

682
00:36:26,639 --> 00:36:29,760
a nice check and I got a flight that night

683
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:32,440
and I was sitting on the tarmac and my part

684
00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:35,159
rate was still one hundred and twenty or so. And

685
00:36:35,199 --> 00:36:38,119
this was three hours after i'd hold those parts, and

686
00:36:38,159 --> 00:36:40,840
I said to myself, Man, I don't know, I don't

687
00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:42,760
know if I want to do this anymore. I don't

688
00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:45,880
like the way it makes me feel physically. And then

689
00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:48,320
there you go. Two three weeks later, that was the

690
00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:50,239
end of that. That matters would take it out in

691
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:54,360
my hand. So when you understand that you could, I

692
00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:57,679
think you can move on quicker in your next path.

693
00:36:57,880 --> 00:37:00,960
Your next part of the journey is I wouldn't know,

694
00:37:01,239 --> 00:37:03,960
maybe it's not pre ordained, but you're now guided to

695
00:37:04,079 --> 00:37:06,000
the next step of the journey.

696
00:37:07,199 --> 00:37:09,360
Speaker 2: And part of the next step of your journey was

697
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:12,280
writing a book, which I would love to talk about

698
00:37:12,320 --> 00:37:15,079
for a while now. First of all, you got me

699
00:37:15,119 --> 00:37:20,119
on the title was beat the Courus, not yourself. And

700
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:23,000
what I really enjoyed about this book, and I just

701
00:37:23,039 --> 00:37:25,519
finished it the other night. I definitely made it all

702
00:37:25,559 --> 00:37:27,639
the way through and took lots of notes throughout the

703
00:37:27,679 --> 00:37:32,920
book is that many times when you that I've listened.

704
00:37:32,920 --> 00:37:35,679
I've read so many golf books over the years of

705
00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:40,000
doing this podcast and talking to various authors, especially books

706
00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:45,039
about the mental game. There you mentioned earlier anecdotal, they're

707
00:37:45,079 --> 00:37:50,559
you know, telling you how to how you know, they're

708
00:37:50,599 --> 00:37:53,440
really how to books on how to work your mental game,

709
00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:56,159
how to prepare yourself, how to work your pre shot

710
00:37:56,199 --> 00:38:00,800
routine and your post shot routine, how to get yourself

711
00:38:00,920 --> 00:38:05,480
out of a death spiral in your head. What I

712
00:38:05,559 --> 00:38:08,559
really enjoyed about this book and made it so relatable,

713
00:38:08,599 --> 00:38:11,360
and is why I was compelled to finish it is

714
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:17,119
that it's a story. It's a novel, I guess, about

715
00:38:17,159 --> 00:38:21,760
a player who is a very good young player but

716
00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:30,679
struggling with his head and finally gets some coaching, and

717
00:38:30,719 --> 00:38:34,360
as he's going through it, you're going through it with him,

718
00:38:34,639 --> 00:38:38,679
so you feel what he's feeling, as opposed to being

719
00:38:38,679 --> 00:38:42,760
told what to feel. I really enjoyed that approach on

720
00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:45,760
the book, and I highly recommend it for anybody who

721
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:48,400
likes reading about the Metal game, who likes discussing the

722
00:38:48,440 --> 00:38:52,039
Metal game. I think the book is really good and

723
00:38:52,159 --> 00:38:53,880
it's not a hard read and it's not really long.

724
00:38:54,440 --> 00:38:56,599
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, it's very kind of you, as I said

725
00:38:56,880 --> 00:38:59,679
it just I've read, you know, obviously throwing myself into

726
00:38:59,679 --> 00:39:01,679
the mental side of the game. I read, you know,

727
00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:05,400
dozens of books, and you know, with someone like me

728
00:39:05,519 --> 00:39:09,199
who is preordained to want to get information out of

729
00:39:09,199 --> 00:39:11,639
the book, there was a lot of books that I

730
00:39:11,679 --> 00:39:14,239
read that were just not very good. I would just

731
00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:15,800
read and say, when am I going to get to

732
00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:17,440
something that's going to help me? Because I know a

733
00:39:17,519 --> 00:39:20,280
lot of this anyway, but I need something. I need

734
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:23,840
something to justify this twenty dollars and you know you

735
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:26,519
can finally find, you know, a chapter or something. They

736
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:28,599
would say, Okay, I can take something from that. But

737
00:39:28,679 --> 00:39:32,840
that's someone who is one hundred percent all in on

738
00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:34,920
the mental side of the game. If you're someone who's

739
00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:37,440
being pushed, dragging and screaming to the mental side of

740
00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:39,119
the games, you don't want to do it anyway, because

741
00:39:39,159 --> 00:39:41,159
you'd rather hit balls, and you'd rather get a new driver,

742
00:39:41,199 --> 00:39:43,159
and you'd rather get a new partter and more coaching.

743
00:39:45,199 --> 00:39:47,400
You know, you want to give them a reason to

744
00:39:47,559 --> 00:39:49,800
want to read and get something out of it and

745
00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:54,599
want to keep going beyond the first page and the

746
00:39:54,639 --> 00:39:57,320
second page and the third page. And so I think

747
00:39:57,320 --> 00:39:59,559
a story helps to do that because you know, as

748
00:39:59,679 --> 00:40:05,000
human we can we gravitate to emotion, and we gravitate

749
00:40:05,119 --> 00:40:08,360
to experiences, and we gravitate to putting ourselves in the

750
00:40:08,400 --> 00:40:13,320
position of a character. And so I wrote this originally

751
00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:18,039
for teenage competitive golfers to help them because they the

752
00:40:18,079 --> 00:40:21,239
tendency is the last thing they go to try and

753
00:40:21,280 --> 00:40:22,760
get better at. It is the mental side of the game,

754
00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:26,119
and most of them don't bother with it. And so

755
00:40:26,199 --> 00:40:28,760
it actually it kind of dovetails nicely and with the

756
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:31,679
PGA coaching man or the ADM, which says about fifteen

757
00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:35,000
sixteen kids, you know, if they want to be competitive,

758
00:40:35,159 --> 00:40:37,679
should get a foundation in the mental side of the game.

759
00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:42,920
And so the character, the main character, Jack, obviously reflected that. So,

760
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:45,199
you know, I thought originally it was kind of a

761
00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:50,639
niche book because teenage golfers and golf psychology. I can

762
00:40:50,679 --> 00:40:52,360
search all day and I'm not going to find too

763
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:54,599
many books about that, or certainly not too many books

764
00:40:54,599 --> 00:40:59,239
that are worth a read. And so then I started thinking, well,

765
00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:03,480
I've taught a number of junior golfers, and you know,

766
00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:06,039
they're tough to teach because they are you know, they're

767
00:41:06,079 --> 00:41:09,079
finding out about themselves, and they're emotional, and you know,

768
00:41:09,199 --> 00:41:11,920
maybe they don't listen very well.

769
00:41:11,719 --> 00:41:15,159
Speaker 2: And they know they know anything exactly.

770
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:17,719
Speaker 1: They travel all these tournaments, their parents take them, Their

771
00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:21,679
parents spend a ton of money, and their parents desperately

772
00:41:21,679 --> 00:41:23,800
want to see them do well. Their parents put pressure

773
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:28,639
on them, and as a result, sometimes there's a little

774
00:41:28,639 --> 00:41:33,039
bit of friction between teenage athletes and parents. And so

775
00:41:33,119 --> 00:41:37,719
I thought, well, parents should read this book because parents

776
00:41:37,800 --> 00:41:40,840
will actually now understand what their kids are going through.

777
00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:43,360
These kids aren't trying to make a double bogie with

778
00:41:43,400 --> 00:41:46,599
a wedge to piss you off. They're trying their hardest.

779
00:41:46,840 --> 00:41:51,000
But when they're not mentally and emotionally focused and in

780
00:41:51,039 --> 00:41:54,679
the right spot and understand any kind of plan of

781
00:41:54,679 --> 00:41:56,559
what it is they're trying to do, they're going to

782
00:41:56,559 --> 00:41:59,559
make mistake after mistake after mistake. And so I would

783
00:41:59,559 --> 00:42:02,239
talk to and they would be pissed at their kids

784
00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:04,599
by they would say, hey, look, I'm spend all this

785
00:42:04,679 --> 00:42:07,599
money on lessons. Why is it he keeps making these

786
00:42:07,679 --> 00:42:10,719
dumb double bogies? And I said, well, you know, I've

787
00:42:10,719 --> 00:42:12,199
been trying to help him with the mental side of

788
00:42:12,239 --> 00:42:13,559
the game, or I've been trying to help him with

789
00:42:13,559 --> 00:42:16,320
the preparation side of the game, and he doesn't want

790
00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:20,000
to listen and he doesn't apply it. I try my hardest,

791
00:42:20,400 --> 00:42:22,159
but if he can hear it from you as well

792
00:42:22,159 --> 00:42:26,360
as me, that may help him or her be a

793
00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:29,239
little bit more focused on how they go about the game.

794
00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:34,159
And more importantly, it gives the parent a little bit

795
00:42:34,199 --> 00:42:37,119
more empathy of what their kid is going through, because,

796
00:42:37,159 --> 00:42:40,079
as I said, the kid wants desperately to please their parents.

797
00:42:41,519 --> 00:42:44,840
And you know, when things go wrong and they don't

798
00:42:44,880 --> 00:42:48,440
know why things are going wrong, it can get so frustrated.

799
00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:50,400
And when the hormones are raging and you're trying to

800
00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:52,679
get through school and you maybe got a boyfriend or

801
00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:55,480
a girlfriend, you know, there's a lot of stuff going

802
00:42:55,480 --> 00:42:59,039
on up there. And so I think this really helps

803
00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:02,440
that relationship as well. And so you know, there was

804
00:43:02,440 --> 00:43:06,960
a chapter in the book with a you know, as juniors,

805
00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:10,480
they've all experienced this, they've played badly. They've got to

806
00:43:10,519 --> 00:43:12,679
get in the car and their dad's driving or their

807
00:43:12,760 --> 00:43:17,199
mum's driving, and you get that horrible, uncomfortable, silent journey

808
00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:20,440
back home because the kids in the back simmering about

809
00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:23,159
he shot eighty five again, the parents in the front

810
00:43:23,280 --> 00:43:25,280
thinking I've just given up another half a day to

811
00:43:25,519 --> 00:43:27,800
watch this and I've spent all this money on lessons,

812
00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:31,119
and the two kind of talk, and you know, the

813
00:43:31,599 --> 00:43:35,360
kid Jack gets everything off his chest. The parent shows

814
00:43:35,400 --> 00:43:38,760
some empathy and shows and says, why don't we try

815
00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:43,360
this path with this wise older pro that I think

816
00:43:43,360 --> 00:43:47,159
can help you. And so now you've got teenagers, now

817
00:43:47,159 --> 00:43:50,719
you've got their parents. But these lessons also pertain to

818
00:43:51,119 --> 00:43:52,880
anyone with a pencil in the hand, whether it's a

819
00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:55,079
dog fight at the weekend once a month, whether it's

820
00:43:55,119 --> 00:43:58,000
a club championship, whether it's playing in the little corporate

821
00:43:58,079 --> 00:44:00,719
day or a scramb or whatever it is. We can

822
00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:02,760
do better when we go out and play with a

823
00:44:02,800 --> 00:44:05,000
pencil on our hand. And you know, we work really

824
00:44:05,079 --> 00:44:07,719
hard during the week and we want to desperately do

825
00:44:07,880 --> 00:44:09,880
well and perform well. We're r on the golf course.

826
00:44:09,920 --> 00:44:13,440
But when we beat ourselves at all times, it makes

827
00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:16,599
it so hard. And so a lot of people I teach.

828
00:44:16,639 --> 00:44:20,199
I teach a lot of successful businessmen and business women,

829
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:22,760
and I say, look, if you run your business the

830
00:44:22,760 --> 00:44:24,719
way you run your golf game, you go bankrupt. You

831
00:44:24,719 --> 00:44:27,400
have no plan. You've got to have a business plan

832
00:44:28,199 --> 00:44:32,719
in whatever limited time that you have. We understand you

833
00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:36,039
don't have time to practice hundreds and hundreds of balls

834
00:44:36,039 --> 00:44:39,000
a week. So we've got to use the game that

835
00:44:39,039 --> 00:44:42,360
you have and set yourself up for the most successful

836
00:44:43,119 --> 00:44:45,920
the most success you can possibly have. And it basically

837
00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:49,119
all starts from before you ever moved the golf club.

838
00:44:49,239 --> 00:44:51,880
If you can give yourself that great business plan before

839
00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:53,760
you move the golf club, you've got a chance for

840
00:44:53,840 --> 00:44:56,440
success based on whatever level of talent that you have.

841
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:07,480
Speaker 2: So this character, this older character that's in the book,

842
00:45:07,639 --> 00:45:15,480
Charlie Right, he's got wisdom beyond his years, and you're

843
00:45:15,559 --> 00:45:18,079
able to bring it through in the book in so

844
00:45:18,159 --> 00:45:21,880
many different ways. Who is he patterned after?

845
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:24,880
Speaker 1: Well, there may or may not be a handsome young

846
00:45:24,920 --> 00:45:27,599
englishman at the end of it with an American actions book.

847
00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:31,599
It was what I really enjoyed was I got to

848
00:45:31,599 --> 00:45:34,159
play every character. I was a junior golf for once.

849
00:45:34,639 --> 00:45:37,960
I was a parent dealing with disappointments from my kids

850
00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:41,679
playing soccer and basketball. I was a or I am

851
00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:45,719
a coach who has thirty years of experience around golf.

852
00:45:46,320 --> 00:45:50,039
I volunteered to be a college coach for three months

853
00:45:50,079 --> 00:45:52,039
just to learn a little bit more about how to

854
00:45:52,199 --> 00:45:55,280
deal with kids and what they go through and what

855
00:45:56,119 --> 00:45:59,000
they experienced. So I got to experience every single character.

856
00:45:59,000 --> 00:46:03,400
The only character I wasn't was the nick, the antagonist,

857
00:46:03,559 --> 00:46:05,800
the one that was a little bit too for his boot.

858
00:46:05,920 --> 00:46:11,079
So exactly, yeah, I was even you know, Matt, He's

859
00:46:11,119 --> 00:46:13,440
best friend. You know, you've just got to have those

860
00:46:13,639 --> 00:46:18,480
those relationships, those close relationships with people. But I think

861
00:46:18,559 --> 00:46:21,760
there's I want to say there is. And I think

862
00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:26,719
this is a big part because of podcasting, where now

863
00:46:27,199 --> 00:46:29,440
we get wisdom talked about a little bit more than

864
00:46:29,480 --> 00:46:32,079
we that we maybe have over the last ten twenty

865
00:46:32,159 --> 00:46:35,360
thirty years, you know, to get better, you know, the

866
00:46:35,440 --> 00:46:38,119
last twenty years. It's all about where you have lessons.

867
00:46:38,119 --> 00:46:41,280
You do this, you hit these numbers, you do this

868
00:46:41,360 --> 00:46:44,360
on track, man, you hit this line on a video screen,

869
00:46:45,760 --> 00:46:50,239
and you know, to be honest, for some people it works.

870
00:46:50,760 --> 00:46:54,239
For most they don't have time to really change anything fundamentally,

871
00:46:55,360 --> 00:46:58,360
and so you can have this great lesson, but you know,

872
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:01,800
after you've hit your bucket of ball, you're probably not

873
00:47:01,840 --> 00:47:04,440
going to hit another bucket of balls correctly until you

874
00:47:04,440 --> 00:47:08,000
see the next lesson. And so people, I think get

875
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:10,920
frustrated and they're paying always money for a swing lesson.

876
00:47:11,400 --> 00:47:15,079
And you know, yeah, my numbers look better and this

877
00:47:15,199 --> 00:47:17,440
line looks better on the screen, But I keep shooting

878
00:47:17,480 --> 00:47:19,400
the same score, and I keep hitting the same shots,

879
00:47:19,440 --> 00:47:23,320
and I keep making the same mistakes. And so now

880
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:28,079
there's a lot more podcast involved with wisdom and an

881
00:47:28,119 --> 00:47:33,400
experience and turning fives into fours and a different approach

882
00:47:34,280 --> 00:47:37,679
to be able to help you score better. You know,

883
00:47:37,760 --> 00:47:40,880
the short game, the chipping, the put in. If you

884
00:47:40,920 --> 00:47:43,559
want low hanging fruit and you want a swing lesson,

885
00:47:43,760 --> 00:47:45,800
you want a lesson that's the lowest hanging fruit you

886
00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:49,000
can possibly have. You just get good fundamentals chipping, you're

887
00:47:49,039 --> 00:47:51,480
going to shave a tonne straps of your twenty handicapper.

888
00:47:52,880 --> 00:47:55,239
I find it really hard to get someone to commit

889
00:47:55,280 --> 00:47:58,760
to that. They want swing lessons, so they hit seven

890
00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:01,000
fairways with their driver, hit two in the trees, and

891
00:48:01,039 --> 00:48:04,000
they want to hit none in the trees. Well, you know,

892
00:48:04,000 --> 00:48:06,280
if there are a fifteen handicapper and they hit none

893
00:48:06,280 --> 00:48:08,760
in the trees instead of two in the trees in

894
00:48:08,800 --> 00:48:10,519
the big scheme of things, they're probably going to screw

895
00:48:10,599 --> 00:48:12,199
up the next shot and the chip in the part

896
00:48:12,239 --> 00:48:15,519
and they're going to shoot the same And so why

897
00:48:15,639 --> 00:48:18,280
not if you're going to miss fifteen greens, learn how

898
00:48:18,320 --> 00:48:21,840
to chip and part and so, ye know, just by

899
00:48:21,960 --> 00:48:25,519
using just common sense. And you know, we call it analytics,

900
00:48:25,519 --> 00:48:28,559
but it's just common sense of if you miss a

901
00:48:28,559 --> 00:48:30,679
load of greens and you don't chip very well, or

902
00:48:30,719 --> 00:48:32,559
you're leaving a lot of you're leaving a lot on

903
00:48:32,639 --> 00:48:37,599
the table. You if you have forty parts every round

904
00:48:37,599 --> 00:48:39,960
and you only hit four greens, you're leaving a lot

905
00:48:39,960 --> 00:48:42,320
on the table there. And so we can look at

906
00:48:42,320 --> 00:48:44,840
things differently that you know, we can I like to

907
00:48:44,840 --> 00:48:48,119
do playing lessons where I like to see someone on

908
00:48:48,159 --> 00:48:49,920
the golf course and you know, most.

909
00:48:49,719 --> 00:48:51,320
Speaker 2: Swing decision making.

910
00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:54,559
Speaker 1: Exactly, Yeah, most coaches spent swing coaches spend an hour

911
00:48:54,599 --> 00:48:57,280
on the on the range and they see the student

912
00:48:57,360 --> 00:49:00,360
hit it great, and then it's almost like, well, there

913
00:49:00,360 --> 00:49:02,760
you go. I've done my job. It's all up to you.

914
00:49:02,840 --> 00:49:05,360
Now you've got to get on golf course. You've got

915
00:49:05,360 --> 00:49:05,599
to have.

916
00:49:05,719 --> 00:49:09,320
Speaker 2: Right because if you're giving a playing lesson at the range,

917
00:49:09,320 --> 00:49:11,400
you're either hitting off of a mat or off of grass.

918
00:49:11,559 --> 00:49:14,280
But there's no uneven lies you're doing. You're not you know,

919
00:49:14,559 --> 00:49:16,280
you don't have any trees in your way. You're just

920
00:49:16,280 --> 00:49:19,880
looking at flags. So there's so many more elements. I mean,

921
00:49:20,760 --> 00:49:24,280
part of a major part of what I've been trying

922
00:49:24,320 --> 00:49:28,000
to do with golf smarter is to become a smarter

923
00:49:28,519 --> 00:49:32,079
golfer in the mental game. And we talked to a

924
00:49:32,079 --> 00:49:36,159
lot of mental coaches in a wide variety of you know,

925
00:49:36,280 --> 00:49:44,599
from mindfulness to brain functionality, right, and it seems to

926
00:49:44,599 --> 00:49:48,519
be our wheelhouse, although I do like to cover, you know,

927
00:49:48,679 --> 00:49:53,079
an eclectic mix of golf stories and golf people, but

928
00:49:53,239 --> 00:49:57,199
it really we really have focused on on the mental

929
00:49:57,239 --> 00:50:00,239
side of the game. And one of the lines is

930
00:50:00,280 --> 00:50:03,639
that you have in your book that really jumped at

931
00:50:03,639 --> 00:50:06,840
me because I've not read it anywhere else, but we've

932
00:50:06,840 --> 00:50:10,880
been saying it on the podcast forever, and my audience

933
00:50:10,960 --> 00:50:12,599
right now, if they've been listening a while, they know

934
00:50:12,639 --> 00:50:14,840
where I'm headed with this because I learned it from

935
00:50:14,840 --> 00:50:17,719
a listener and been saying it. Not only do I

936
00:50:17,760 --> 00:50:19,840
say it for every round I play, but I've been

937
00:50:19,880 --> 00:50:22,760
saying it on the show hundreds of times. We say,

938
00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:26,480
never follow a bad shot with a stupid shot, but

939
00:50:26,760 --> 00:50:29,320
you enhanced that for me in a way I never

940
00:50:29,440 --> 00:50:33,360
really realized. And on page fifty six, at least off

941
00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:35,920
the pdf that I was reading, the worst thing you

942
00:50:35,960 --> 00:50:38,960
can do is follow up a poor shot with a

943
00:50:39,039 --> 00:50:43,360
dumb shot, trying to make up for the previous one.

944
00:50:44,239 --> 00:50:46,840
That was in AHA moment for me.

945
00:50:48,119 --> 00:50:51,519
Speaker 1: Well, what again, It's that common sense, isn't it It is?

946
00:50:52,320 --> 00:50:55,840
You know, we just we try and do too much.

947
00:50:56,000 --> 00:50:58,800
We try and do more than maybe our talent levels

948
00:50:58,840 --> 00:51:00,920
are capable of, I think is the worst thing you

949
00:51:00,960 --> 00:51:03,920
can look at on a scorecard. If you're fifteen par

950
00:51:04,119 --> 00:51:08,119
isn't part pars bogie. And so you know, I like

951
00:51:08,199 --> 00:51:10,920
to I like to talk to players, and I say,

952
00:51:10,960 --> 00:51:13,679
I think dogfight points are the greatest way of playing

953
00:51:13,719 --> 00:51:17,760
golf because you see the value of a point. So

954
00:51:18,079 --> 00:51:19,920
if you're a fifteen handicap and you don't have a

955
00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:24,519
very high quota, you know you can maybe finding three

956
00:51:24,599 --> 00:51:26,639
or four holes where in the past you would have

957
00:51:26,719 --> 00:51:28,760
played a dumb shot with a three would out of

958
00:51:28,760 --> 00:51:31,199
the rough trying to get it on the green, and

959
00:51:31,280 --> 00:51:33,679
you learn that, you know, maybe a five iron and

960
00:51:33,719 --> 00:51:36,880
then pitching on from forty yards maybe an easy way

961
00:51:36,920 --> 00:51:40,079
to make a point. What happens is we get in

962
00:51:40,119 --> 00:51:42,320
a cycle of and that's what I'm talking about in

963
00:51:42,360 --> 00:51:46,639
the book of is just the cycle of you know,

964
00:51:46,679 --> 00:51:49,519
the way a round of golf unfolds or shots unfolds.

965
00:51:49,599 --> 00:51:52,679
So you have a shot, you know, I want you

966
00:51:52,760 --> 00:51:57,679
to have a nice, productive athletic routine. So if you

967
00:51:57,880 --> 00:52:00,599
do that athletic routine, the chance says, ah, you're going

968
00:52:00,599 --> 00:52:03,440
to hit a decent shot. And then after you've hit

969
00:52:03,480 --> 00:52:05,199
that shot, you can kind of pack yourself in the back,

970
00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:08,159
or you can say, oh, that wasn't very good, and

971
00:52:08,199 --> 00:52:10,760
then you can objectively look at it and say, what

972
00:52:10,800 --> 00:52:12,920
could I have done better? You know, maybe I didn't

973
00:52:12,960 --> 00:52:14,519
have the right club there, and I really should have

974
00:52:14,599 --> 00:52:17,920
hit the seven instead of the eight. Okay, well, there's

975
00:52:17,920 --> 00:52:20,159
a little reminder for the next time I'm in that situation.

976
00:52:20,280 --> 00:52:22,239
And then you spend the next four minutes walking to

977
00:52:22,320 --> 00:52:24,880
the next shot, and you're in a good mental space,

978
00:52:25,159 --> 00:52:28,679
and you know, you enjoy talking with your playing partner.

979
00:52:28,760 --> 00:52:30,880
You're looking at the trees and the houses and the

980
00:52:30,880 --> 00:52:34,159
birds and then whatever else. And then as a result,

981
00:52:34,159 --> 00:52:36,320
you're in a good headspace for the next shot. You

982
00:52:36,360 --> 00:52:38,599
produce a good routine, you hit a decent shot, and

983
00:52:38,639 --> 00:52:42,559
so the cycle continues. The cycle also continues the wrong way,

984
00:52:42,599 --> 00:52:44,599
where you don't have a routine, or if you have

985
00:52:44,639 --> 00:52:46,239
a routine, you don't do it very well. You hit

986
00:52:46,280 --> 00:52:48,840
an awful shot, you tell yourself how much you suck.

987
00:52:49,360 --> 00:52:51,679
Then you stew about it for that five minutes to

988
00:52:51,719 --> 00:52:53,920
the next shot. You're trying to figure out all these

989
00:52:53,960 --> 00:52:56,719
swing thoughts and all these things that one coach told

990
00:52:56,800 --> 00:52:59,599
you five years ago. Another coach told you last week.

991
00:53:00,039 --> 00:53:02,000
Speaker 2: And then a video that you saw this morning.

992
00:53:02,519 --> 00:53:05,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, that YouTube thing you'd pulled up, you know,

993
00:53:06,039 --> 00:53:08,039
all of those things, and then you get to the

994
00:53:08,079 --> 00:53:09,880
next shot, Well, your mind is in you know, is

995
00:53:10,159 --> 00:53:12,960
complete disarray. It's like fireworks going off up there, all

996
00:53:13,000 --> 00:53:15,920
the distractions, which means then you can't focus on the

997
00:53:15,960 --> 00:53:18,760
next shot. You then hit another bad shot, and then

998
00:53:18,760 --> 00:53:21,480
that cycle continues as well. So what I'm trying to

999
00:53:21,519 --> 00:53:25,800
do is, in as practical simple terms as possible, is

1000
00:53:25,920 --> 00:53:28,599
help that player with those steps. And number one, it

1001
00:53:28,639 --> 00:53:31,159
comes from how do you practice? If you have time

1002
00:53:31,199 --> 00:53:35,039
to practice, you know, learn from what it is you practice,

1003
00:53:35,039 --> 00:53:36,480
and learn from what it is you can do on

1004
00:53:36,519 --> 00:53:39,800
the practice range, because if you if you if you

1005
00:53:39,880 --> 00:53:41,800
try and hit a shot that you don't try on

1006
00:53:41,840 --> 00:53:44,199
the practice range, you shouldn't be hitting that shot because

1007
00:53:44,199 --> 00:53:45,360
you don't know if you hit it or not.

1008
00:53:45,840 --> 00:53:47,840
Speaker 2: Just because you say it on TV doesn't mean you

1009
00:53:47,840 --> 00:53:48,320
can't do it.

1010
00:53:48,719 --> 00:53:51,320
Speaker 1: And again, you know, you might have seen Rory McElroy

1011
00:53:51,440 --> 00:53:54,280
hit a punch cut with a seven nine into a

1012
00:53:54,320 --> 00:53:57,280
thirty mile hour wind in the Irish Open, but you're

1013
00:53:57,280 --> 00:53:59,440
a fifteen handicap who's never tried to hit a punch

1014
00:53:59,440 --> 00:54:01,199
cut and they're like, and you might lay the st

1015
00:54:01,239 --> 00:54:03,400
over it instead of just hitting the shot and then

1016
00:54:04,000 --> 00:54:05,679
you know, chipping it on from short with the green.

1017
00:54:07,239 --> 00:54:10,079
What was what really brought that to my mind, to

1018
00:54:10,119 --> 00:54:11,800
the forefront of my mind when I when I did

1019
00:54:11,800 --> 00:54:16,280
that volunteer coaching for a local college, I had a

1020
00:54:16,360 --> 00:54:18,199
kid that was was showing a bit of promise, was

1021
00:54:18,480 --> 00:54:21,360
paying attention, and he got to a tooment, was playing

1022
00:54:21,400 --> 00:54:24,840
really well, and he got to the seventeenth I think,

1023
00:54:24,880 --> 00:54:27,199
a part three, and I was following it on golfstat

1024
00:54:27,239 --> 00:54:29,119
and he was two or three under power I think,

1025
00:54:29,840 --> 00:54:32,280
and he makes a six on the path three. And

1026
00:54:32,320 --> 00:54:35,079
I called him after I said, man, what a great

1027
00:54:35,159 --> 00:54:38,199
round of golf. What happened on that path three? He'said, oh, man,

1028
00:54:38,280 --> 00:54:41,400
it was you know, you know, it was a thirty

1029
00:54:41,440 --> 00:54:43,639
mile hour wind into me and it was a path three,

1030
00:54:43,760 --> 00:54:46,079
and you know I had to hit that punch drawer

1031
00:54:46,079 --> 00:54:48,519
in there because you know, the wind was coming you know,

1032
00:54:48,599 --> 00:54:51,960
into left or right really hard. And I said, you know,

1033
00:54:53,480 --> 00:54:55,639
you've never tried to hit that shot before, have you?

1034
00:54:56,159 --> 00:54:58,320
He said, no, no, but but it was the shot

1035
00:54:58,360 --> 00:55:01,440
that it called for. I remember distinctly said that was

1036
00:55:01,480 --> 00:55:05,199
the shot that it called for. But if you don't

1037
00:55:05,360 --> 00:55:08,920
know how even the start of how to hit that shot,

1038
00:55:08,960 --> 00:55:10,559
and you pull that out in the talent when you're

1039
00:55:10,559 --> 00:55:13,559
playing great man, it's not a good it's not a

1040
00:55:13,559 --> 00:55:15,559
good idea. So we pulled it straight out of bounds

1041
00:55:15,559 --> 00:55:18,679
and made a triple and it just we're in an

1042
00:55:18,760 --> 00:55:23,960
unbelievable round with one poor decision. And so we got

1043
00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:27,280
on the range that next week and I just said, look,

1044
00:55:27,360 --> 00:55:30,559
you hit this beautiful, solid drawer every single time you

1045
00:55:30,639 --> 00:55:33,039
hit this great shot. It's a strong shot. You know

1046
00:55:33,480 --> 00:55:35,360
you have you can take the spin off because you

1047
00:55:35,400 --> 00:55:37,199
hit it so strongly through the wind. You didn't need

1048
00:55:37,239 --> 00:55:40,079
to try and hit that shot. And then the next

1049
00:55:40,079 --> 00:55:42,199
time we had a big wind, we went on the

1050
00:55:42,199 --> 00:55:44,000
practice range, went straight into the wind. I said, just

1051
00:55:44,039 --> 00:55:46,440
hit your shot and it was amazing, went through the wind.

1052
00:55:46,440 --> 00:55:48,679
And he said, yeah, and I see the validity now.

1053
00:55:48,840 --> 00:55:51,760
I think you were right. But there's so many just

1054
00:55:51,760 --> 00:55:56,400
simple lessons there that you know, if you read it,

1055
00:55:56,519 --> 00:55:59,800
you will put yourself in the positions that Jack faces,

1056
00:56:00,360 --> 00:56:02,679
and you will see yourself and you will see the

1057
00:56:02,719 --> 00:56:05,960
decisions you make, and you will see the decisions he makes.

1058
00:56:06,000 --> 00:56:10,519
And say, ah, yes, I know exactly what he's going through.

1059
00:56:10,800 --> 00:56:12,400
I can't wait to read the rest of this book

1060
00:56:12,400 --> 00:56:14,119
because I know we're going to get the secret to

1061
00:56:14,280 --> 00:56:16,599
what to do next. And you get that, and then

1062
00:56:16,639 --> 00:56:19,159
you see him put it into practice in the big

1063
00:56:19,199 --> 00:56:20,760
tournament at the end of the book, and then a

1064
00:56:20,960 --> 00:56:24,239
college coach comes up to him, congratulates him and tells

1065
00:56:24,320 --> 00:56:26,480
him that's exactly the kind of things he's looking for

1066
00:56:26,519 --> 00:56:28,639
when he's recruiting. So it kind of puts a nice

1067
00:56:28,679 --> 00:56:29,760
bow in it at the end.

1068
00:56:30,199 --> 00:56:32,679
Speaker 2: YEP, it does. I'm going to read off a couple

1069
00:56:32,760 --> 00:56:35,599
of the lines that jumped out to me and I'll

1070
00:56:35,639 --> 00:56:40,239
just it's just to reinforce to somebody that they should

1071
00:56:40,280 --> 00:56:42,159
go out and buy this book, that this is the

1072
00:56:42,280 --> 00:56:44,960
kind of topics that you cover that we've been covering

1073
00:56:45,000 --> 00:56:47,039
for years on the podcast. And I just felt so

1074
00:56:47,079 --> 00:56:51,840
supported on this this one. Play the course, not the competition,

1075
00:56:53,000 --> 00:56:57,199
really important note message, right because we're like so worried

1076
00:56:57,239 --> 00:56:59,000
about oh my god, they just birdied the hole and

1077
00:56:59,320 --> 00:57:01,239
I boge, you, what am I going to do now?

1078
00:57:01,360 --> 00:57:01,519
Speaker 1: Right?

1079
00:57:03,239 --> 00:57:06,519
Speaker 2: Stay in the moment and just win this shot. Don't

1080
00:57:06,559 --> 00:57:09,199
worry about the score. Don't worry that you need to

1081
00:57:09,199 --> 00:57:11,440
get a part in this whole just win this shot.

1082
00:57:11,880 --> 00:57:12,480
I love that.

1083
00:57:12,880 --> 00:57:15,039
Speaker 1: We were actually originally going to call the book win

1084
00:57:15,159 --> 00:57:18,920
the next shot. Wow, Okay, I mean that that was

1085
00:57:19,119 --> 00:57:21,920
a great lesson in that. But again it goes back

1086
00:57:21,960 --> 00:57:25,639
to if you've got a productive routine, what it does.

1087
00:57:25,679 --> 00:57:28,280
It focuses the mind on exactly what it is you're

1088
00:57:28,280 --> 00:57:31,000
trying to do. And it also kind of acts as

1089
00:57:31,039 --> 00:57:34,119
a bit of a force field around your mind and

1090
00:57:34,159 --> 00:57:36,800
you from all those distractions of score and what else

1091
00:57:37,000 --> 00:57:39,239
other people are doing. And you know what it would

1092
00:57:39,239 --> 00:57:40,960
mean if I had a good result here all of

1093
00:57:41,000 --> 00:57:45,760
those things we're always facing, and if we're a fifteen handicapper,

1094
00:57:45,840 --> 00:57:49,199
we're facing you know, my buddy's laughing at me because

1095
00:57:49,199 --> 00:57:51,519
I've just top one. You know, we want to get

1096
00:57:51,920 --> 00:57:54,039
our mind one hundred percent focus on the next shot

1097
00:57:54,079 --> 00:57:55,480
as well as we possibly can.

1098
00:57:56,880 --> 00:58:01,840
Speaker 2: Well, it's a high recommendation my part for this book.

1099
00:58:01,880 --> 00:58:05,400
I really enjoyed it. Again. It's called Beat the Course,

1100
00:58:05,800 --> 00:58:09,960
Not Yourself by Gary Christian and you can also go

1101
00:58:10,000 --> 00:58:13,960
to Gary's website which is Gary christiangolf dot com. Gary,

1102
00:58:14,119 --> 00:58:16,719
this is a blast. Thanks so much for your time.

1103
00:58:16,639 --> 00:58:19,000
Speaker 1: Man, I really enjoyed it, and yeah, the book self published,

1104
00:58:19,000 --> 00:58:23,199
so it's on Amazon. So if you search, I can't

1105
00:58:23,199 --> 00:58:26,000
believe I said Amazon, Amazon, I would call it in England.

1106
00:58:26,079 --> 00:58:30,559
So the course not yourself on Amazon for the price

1107
00:58:30,559 --> 00:58:33,679
of a sleeve of golf balls. It will be it

1108
00:58:33,679 --> 00:58:35,719
will certainly last longer than the sleeve of golf balls,

1109
00:58:35,719 --> 00:58:37,639
and it will give you that game plan. It will

1110
00:58:37,639 --> 00:58:40,239
give you a game plan of practice, how to talk

1111
00:58:40,280 --> 00:58:43,960
to yourself, how to have a routine, how to put

1112
00:58:43,960 --> 00:58:46,480
it into practice. And that's ultimately what we want. We

1113
00:58:46,559 --> 00:58:48,880
want to take it from the practice range or the

1114
00:58:48,920 --> 00:58:52,599
indoor hidden map to the golf course. That's why we practice,

1115
00:58:52,719 --> 00:58:54,840
that's why we hit balls indoors, because we want it

1116
00:58:54,920 --> 00:58:55,800
to work on the course.