Speaker 1: At a.
Speaker 2: Book.
Speaker 3: If you'd like to be able to listen to the
show without ads and have full access to bonus content,
that's an option. To find out how, please go to
Dogmanencounters dot com forward slash podcast. One of Tonight's guests,
Kyle Roth, was featured on episode six thirty last week,
where he came on and talked about a dogman he
had some encounters with in South Africa that he calls
white Man. Well, he agreed to come back and do
a Q and A because we didn't have nearly enough
time for me to ask all the questions I had
for him on that show. Well, it's add a surprise.
I found out in the process of scheduling this Q
and A that Marcus had an interest in joining us.
Marcus Smith. So for tonight's show, I want to welcome
both Kyle Roth and Marcus Smitt back on. Gentlemen, thanks
so much for joining.
Speaker 1: Us, Thank you for having us pick. Thank you, it's
a big pleasure to be here.
Speaker 3: Well, it's great half in you Kai. For the people
who missed episode six point thirty, please give us a
brief bio on yourself.
Speaker 2: Yeah, my name is Kay Ross. I'm nineteen years old.
I've been born and raised in capt On my whole life,
moved around quite a bit here and there, and right now,
I currently live in a small holiday village called Pringle Bay,
where I've had my sightings with white Man. Yeah, I mean,
I'm a very outdoors person. I love nature, always have
always loved animals my whole life. And yeah, I'd love
being in the ocean. I've got a good group of mates.
I can't complain about that. And yeah, I'm out of school.
I'm matriculated two years ago and I'm currently working. And yeah,
that's pretty much about.
Speaker 1: Me, all right.
Speaker 3: How about you, Marcus?
Speaker 1: Yeah, my name is Marcus. I met Kai here in
this little town. I moved in about two years before
him and me and my family also moved around in
South Africa a lot, and we spent almost every end
of the year camping out at a campsite that we're
also a very outdoors family. The friend group that me
and Kyle pot of we love going on camps as well.
At one point we did a few regular scheduled camps
which was very fun. Like Kai also love animals and nature,
and he's been get me into the thing and bodyboarding
that we do.
Speaker 3: Yet both of you guys sound so nice. It sounds
to me like you're awfully lucky to have each other
as friends. And the fact that you live in such
a beautiful place. I mean, it doesn't get any better
than that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would agree, I would agree strongly.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it sure doesn't. Ky, Can you give us a
brief flyover of those encounters you told us about with
white Man on episode six thirty for the people who
might have missed that episode.
Speaker 1: Yeah, of course, Rick.
Speaker 2: So, in summary, what happened was, well about a week
I had a very old feeling that something was watching
me at night. It was specifically strong at nights, and
I would be very on edge. I'd have my eyes
darting around, ears would be tuned in, and the hay
on my body would be raised. And then shortly after
I had a sighting with a dog man we believed
to be a dog man, which we later called white Men.
And in summary, what happened was my dog was barking
at night, and I went out with my sister to
go get the dog, and I noticed there was something
very off with the dog, her aggression level and the
hair on her back. And then I saw what I
first I thought was an old neighbor walking in the road,
and when I greeted them, the said person dropped down
to all fours and me and this dog man were
kind of in a stalemate position for about five to
ten minutes whilst my sister got my dad and my
dad came out, and then my dad switched on the
car and a dog man booked it down the empty
plot across our road. And yeah, I went to bed
that night, and at about eleven o'clock it came back
and was tapping on our outside window. And after about
an hour of it, I got full of what was
happening and looked outside and I saw it silhouette, standing
literally to two panes of glass away. And then I
got my parents. I got my dad and we went
outside and didn't find anything and nothing else for the
rest of that night. And then, yeah, I mean, that's
the only sightings I've ever had. I obviously ran through
some of my friends sightings and encounters in the last episode,
and then yeah, pretty much just me feeling off for
a few weeks and months after that. But that's pretty
much what I experienced. Yeah, and I told about in
the last episode.
Speaker 3: Did a great job sharing those experiences to Marcus on
episode six thirty. Of course, Kai told us about dream Counter,
But it's a lot different to have someone share your
experience than to share it yourself. So now I want
you to please tell us in your own words, what
happened when you had that experience?
Speaker 1: Absolutely so about one or two months, maybe a few
weeks more than that. Off the Kai sighting of the
dog Man, I was an overcast weather with a bit
of a drizzle coming down. I decided that I was
going to go on walk. It's one of my favorite
types of weather to go for a walk in. And
I decided I'm going to head off into our local forest,
and so I took my skateboard with me, and the
entrance of the forest, I hid it under a bush
and I walked in. Now, as I'm walking in, usually
in this type of when the area gets wet, you
have lots of these little frogs croaking, but in their
hundreds croaking, So there's constantly this noise going on, and
I hear some birds up being around. And so to
get to the specific area I was planning on going
off or going to, you have to walk through this
almost tunnel of these long, sticky thieves. And so I'm
making my way through the tunnel, and for some other reason,
the heads on my next start to raise. And so
at the time I didn't think much of it. I
think I told myself it's probably just the redess of
it all. And it pushed through. So I walk through
the tunnel and I get up on this sand dune,
and so this is now the sort of open plane
where the fame was growing at about your knees length,
and it's just a fast open plane with the road
about a few hundred meters off, and so there's a
little foot party follow and then you break off. I
broke off from the path, still just pushing through whatever
I was feeling at the time, and I you round
this one. So I'm planning on going to this river valley.
There's the Lagoon River that comes all the way down
from the mountains, and this place I'm going to has
a lovely rock that I was planning on sitting by
and just carving sticks and whatnot. To to get there,
you have to round this bush and then there's a
drop down maybe about two meters that you then just
slide down, and then you end up on the rock.
So as I then round bush, I noticed that everything
just went then, all the frogs, all the birds, there
was nothing. And that immediately put me off because I
know that if there's something, if there's a predator animal around,
usually the animals go the other animals go quiet, and
so I immediately jumped to there's a lepard in the area.
We have baboons, but they don't really cause such a
reaction in the other animals, so I immediately thought there
was a leopard in nearby, and so leopards you can scare
away quite easy if you know how. It's very You
just act very intimidating, don't lose your ground, and the
old runoff and they're very shy in as well. So
I just decided to keep on going. And as I
stepped then there's again there's this little bowl behind this
bush that leads to the entrance of the rock beach.
I look over across the river and I see this
white object hidden behind lots of foliage, and my first
thought was that it's just some of the foam. When
the lagoon want to get stale, it produces this white foam.
So my first thought was it's probably just a big
keeper foam behind all the foliage. As I take maybe
three steps into that little bowl, I see this mat,
this white mass rise up. Take a few steps, and
I'm immediately frozen. It takes a few steps away from me,
stops and then keeps walking upstream. And once I lose
sight of it, I just immediately I crunk, crouch down,
I hunk it up. I take out my pocket knife
for what it was worth, and I just very slowly
and very quietly backed out all the way that entire route.
I was walking backwards, just keeping my eye on the
area from which I came, and I remember I got
to the exit of the forest, grew up my skateboard,
and I bolted down, and maybe five hundred meters past
the forest, I started hearing the front again, and I
remember they're seeing that thing, because the hairs everywhere lays
very similar to what I described. All of my body
is raising. I remember feeling a strange dread. But I remember,
I'm just like, I'm just gonna touchdown. I'm just going
to hide. Seeing it walk away from me, I saw
it obviously didn't want anything with me, and I remember,
it's just stay quiet. I'm just going to leave, not
going to look for trouble. Whatever this thing is, it
just looks like it wants to mind it. And that's
about as much as I can remember. I remember just
after the entire encounter. I remember I stayed boarded back
home when I brought myself in the room and I
just sat for a bit, maybe an hour. Would you
just the process the entire thing, and afterwards I told
Kai and the rest of the of what happened.
Speaker 3: That's a lot to take in. Did you ever have
any other experiences, Marcus that you could attribute to White
main were maybe you think he might have been tormenting
you after that first sighting, just the same way that
he did with Kai, after Kai had his first encounter
with him.
Speaker 1: So off the top of my head, I don't really
remember any significant sight things like that one after that.
I do remember a few nights after that. The dogs
were very we have at the time, we had two dogs.
They were extremely on edge the whole night long. I
remember my dad made a point of it the next
morning to tell me that he just couldn't get any
sleep letting the dogs in and then they want to
come out, and then they want to go. They're just
in and out the house the entire night long, and
I remember as well that night just hearing the dogs
barking and howling. But that's as close as I can
think to a direct connection to white men.
Speaker 3: Oh good, I'm glad he didn't force the issue and
torment me. Then hate the fact that he did that
to Kai though. If you've had a Dogman encounter that
you need help dealing with, or if you'd like to
be a guest on the show, please go to Dogmanencounters
dot com and submit a report. If you've had a
bigfoot sighting 'll like to be a guest on one
of my two big foot podcasts, please go to my
Bigfoot Sighting dot com. I know you too are good friends,
very good friends. But before he actually laid eyes on
white men, how sure were you that Kai actually had
experienced what he told you he had. Did you believe
one hundred percent or was there a little bit of
doubt there.
Speaker 1: When Kai first told me. I remember me and my
friends kind of made a joke about it, but he
just never caved in, Like you didn't go, oh, it's
all the joke. He literally he just kept pressing us
and telling us that what he saw was real. And
I think for the whole day long, he's just telling
us the same thing over and over and over, and
I realized that, Okay, he probably did something. My first
thought it was that it was maybe someone dressed up
as something, or maybe someone who painted themselves white, or
maybe it's just someone playing a prank. And I sort
of that was one of the doubts I had until
I went and had and saw the thing at the lagoon,
And it was at that point that I just realized
whatever Kai told me described to what he saw. That's
probably isolating.
Speaker 3: This might be hard to admit, but in a way,
were you hoping maybe that Kai had just mistook something
like you just laid out for us, and hadn't actually
seen what he said he saw. Because Pringle Bay sounds
like a beautiful place, and it's obvious that you two
have an amazing time running around doing all the things
you do together. Well, when you have a dog man
running around paradise, that tends to change things. That takes
some of the shine off of a very pretty thing
like Pringle Bay? Deep down, were you hoping that maybe
he had mistakenly identified something else as being the dog man?
Speaker 1: So at first I was more scared that would be
with someone who's lost their mind, who has just gone insane,
because if a person is acting like that, then then
there's really something going on. But after my encounter with it,
I don't really feel threatened by it. I feel the
way that I managed to react to it and how
it just went off on it. I feel like it
might just be another animal that wants to be left alone.
I've had this thought come up that it does make
walking around alone, which is something I love to do,
It makes that a bit more difficult for me. But
like I said, I haven't had any other horrible encounters
with it, or any other encounters in matter fact at
all with it, and so I feel like I almost
see it as just part of the wildlife.
Speaker 3: Well that's a really good thing. I'm glad you're you
able to deal with this in such a healthy way.
That sure does be feel alternative, KI, why mean tormented you?
Like I said earlier, after he had that first encounter
with him, do you see that as an indication that
he is an evil being? Or do you think that's
just how this particular dog man is. He was just
trying to get some jollies by tormenting you the way
he did.
Speaker 2: To be completely honest with you, Vic, in my mind,
after thinking about it for quite a while, I feel
like that tormenting afterwards was in my mind a bit
more of curiosity. From its side, I think it was
just trying to chaste me, and some part of it
may have been trying to scare me for the fun
of it. But in my mind, I've always viewed it
as it just being like curious about me. But to
be honest with you again, I don't live in fear
of it every day, and I to be honest with you,
I'm on the same boat as Marcus.
Speaker 1: I feel as.
Speaker 2: Though it is just a part of the wildlife, and
unfortunately that's that is how, that is what the situation
is at the moment.
Speaker 1: Whether we like it or not, it lives here.
Speaker 2: And as I said in the last episode, I do
believe that it is a flesh and blood creature.
Speaker 1: So I mean, whether we like it.
Speaker 2: Or not, it's in my in my eyes and in
my opinion, I view it as a part of the
wildlife on the ecosystem here.
Speaker 3: I really do like the outlook that both of you
guys have. That's really good. Ki when you're in that
standoff with him, the first time you saw him, could
you see any expression on his face?
Speaker 2: And so, to be honest with you, I couldn't see
any like human expressions on its face, if that's what
you're asking. So it didn't give me a smile or
a frown or anything like that. It more just look
shocked because it had these perfectly circular eyes, and it
looked like it had them open as wide as possible,
and its ears were facing me, but they didn't twitch once. So,
if I'm being honest with you, the only feeling I
got off of orf of white men when I had
my first stand off with it was that it was
defensive and it was a bit surprised. So it was
kind of stood there just waiting to see what I
was doing or what I was going to do. So
to answer a question, I would say, shocked is the
only thing I can really the only word I can
really give you. But it didn't, it didn't like physically
give me a human emotion or like a like a
gesture on its face.
Speaker 3: Due to his positioning or mannerisms, he said, he clearly
seemed to be shocked, but did he ever do anything?
They give you the impression might have been afraid.
Speaker 2: I don't think it was afraid at any point. I
think it was just defensive. Like it how I saw
it is it knew its power, it knew what it
was capable of, and it knew it had the upper hand.
It was just waiting to see what my play was. Obviously,
I'm thankful that I didn't do anything else, but say,
for example, maybe I moved forward and it knew it
had the upper hand and it felt defense and it
could have either come at me or ran away. So
I wouldn't say it was scared at any points. I
think it was just testing me in a way. I
obviously think again my dog was going, and probably it
noticed the dog but didn't give much notice to it.
And then when I came, maybe scared it a boat
to gave it a bit of fright, and so it
immediately jumped into defensive and then was just over time
watching to see what I would do. So that would
be my answer to you. I don't think it was scared.
I think it was more just assessing me and seeing
what I was lacking what I'll do.
Speaker 3: Well, it's good you noticed all that, and you're probably
spot on. That's probably what was going on, Marcus. When
you saw white Man that day the Lagoon River. It
sounds to me like you might have been hiding from
you before he eventually arose, making it very easy for
you to see him. Do you think he actually was
hiding from you at first?
Speaker 1: I'm not really sure about that. My impression was that
it was almost like certain animals they grades. I feel
like white Man at that point was really just minding
its own business. It wasn't laying down or hiding. I
know that was definitely it was definitely upright, but I
think it was on all fours. And it was when
I went closer and saw that it rose and walked off.
So the way I took it was that I sort
of intruded on this animal's maybe territory or maybe its
personal space, and it just didn't like the feel of that,
and it just and it walking off to me was
sort of that was the chance I took to just
leave it alone. I'm not going to mess with this creature.
But back to your question, I think I don't think
it was hiding. I think it was just minding its
own business.
Speaker 3: If you think he was put off by you being
there that day. As far as his pasture will go,
how would you describe it? Was he more hunched forward
or more upright?
Speaker 1: So when I first saw it, thinking about its physiology, now,
it was most likely crouched down on all foods, and
it was only that I got close to it that
it then reared up. But it definitely had forward arching
back with very long, lanky legs, and I I would
assume by the way it was walking that it had
a backward bending meat that you'd see and dogs.
Speaker 3: Those are good descriptions, Kile. Baboons don't come down to
the ground at night. Do you go on your night
walks instead of day walks to avoid the ones that
run around your village or for some other reason.
Speaker 2: To be honest with you, Vick, we probably walk around
more during the day than we do at night. And
the baboons that don't bother you un this if you
have food on you.
Speaker 1: So I mean we walk.
Speaker 2: Around during the day more than we do at night.
The main reason why we guard at nights is purely
because it's more quiet. There's no cars going around, there's
not people talking, and it really gives you an opportunity
to just accept the peace of the place of this
town that we live in. And I suppose it's just
always that that thing of being out at night like it,
I don't know, just it kind of lifts our mood
a bit, and it it helps everyone to interact with
each other, but then to have a better time than
if we were to do something during the day. And yeah,
I guess we all just enjoy exploring at night. It's
just because then we have the cover of docks, so
we can go into these empty, abandoned housings or lots
and go explore these places without having some grumpy old
lady on our rear ends calling someone because they want
to make a complaint. So yeah, I reckon we walk
at nights a lot less than what we do during
the day. But the reason we go at night is
just to have a bit of a better experience.
Speaker 3: That makes sense, Okay. Yeah, if I didn't ask you
that question, it'd be pretty easy to jump to conclusions
on why you did that. But I'm glad we got
it straight from the horse's mouth. KI, when you first
saw white Man, what kind of substrate was he standing on?
You said he was about twenty meters away from you.
Was it grass? Or something else.
Speaker 2: So it was a gravel road, so it's hard grounding
underneath with a bunch of loose rock, and then it
ran away onto grass which is probably like half a
meter and then jumped into this marsh like reeds, and
it's muddy and it's wet, and he pretty much booked
it along there. But those are pretty much the only
the only terrains I would say it really went across.
It was standing on the gravel when I had the
stand up with it, and then it ran across the marshland.
But the problem with that marshland is a lot of
it is sewage and oil and this and that from
neighboring houses that have their irrigations flow out in there.
Speaker 3: Listening to describe how things were laid out, obviously on
that hard, gravelly ground across the road, you're not going
to find any prints. But if he did move off
into softer ground the way you said he did, did
you ever go over the looking for prince.
Speaker 1: No, we did not go looking for prints.
Speaker 2: The one thing that we were mainly focused on myself
and Marcus was calculating its speed, because I remember we
went back about a few days after I had my sighting,
and we took an estimate of how long the plot was,
and I gave a time, and we calculated it. And
I won't say the exact speed because I can't recall it,
but we we came to a conclusion that it was
something unbelievably fast, and something much faster than any animal
we have in our in our biosphere. But to answer
your question, Vic, no, we didn't look for tracks purely
because it is unbelievably difficult to move in. And it
just that that marshland stinks of of who and oil.
It's just really not a place you want to go
in unless you really have to.
Speaker 3: That's totally understandable. When he went into what seemed to
be that defensive mode across the road from you, was
he looking right at you the whole time? Or was
he looking in a different direction.
Speaker 2: Oh no, his eyes were locked with mind you were
just he didn't He didn't move his eyes once. When
I was looking at him and assessing the other details
of his body, I didn't break eye contact with him.
I was more using the perimeter of my vision to
assess that. But I never My eyes always stayed on
his and his stayed on And we didn't break eye
contact up until the point and my dad turned on
the edge and he ran down the plot.
Speaker 3: When he boarded into that marsh after your dad started
his car. Did he do so on two legs or
four legs?
Speaker 1: He ran on four legs.
Speaker 2: But from what I saw, it looked like a very
weird run. It looked like almost he was grabbing the
ground and then throwing himself forward.
Speaker 1: It didn't look like a normal dog's run.
Speaker 2: And that's another thing that caught me was it looked
like he would grab with one hand pull and then
grab the next and pull and just almost ran like that.
It didn't look looked like a dog. I physically saw
the elbow's bend and still hold the ground up until
he fully extended his arm again. And so yeah, that's
pretty much how I would describe that he moved.
Speaker 3: Your head must have been spinning at the time, and
understandably so, so if you don't know the answer to this,
it's totally understandable. But by chance, did you ever notice
if he put his back legs between his front legs
when he would run and pull back like that, or
if it weren't outside of his front.
Speaker 2: Leg Yeah, if for a core correctly. His front legs
came for it was almost like he was hovering, so
it was like his front legs would come in between
and then he would it would play not like barely
very lightly place his back legs and then almost throw
his front arm his front legs over again and then
grab because the movement was I would see it speed
up and then slow down, and speed up and slow down,
but it did so unbelievably fast. It was literally like
a fraction of a second that.
Speaker 1: He paused and then.
Speaker 2: He'd like speed up again in a fraction of a
second that he paused and speed up again.
Speaker 3: If I'm understanding you, it sounds like what you witnessed
was him pulling himself for it to propel himself, and
his back legs were almost like an afterthought kind of
just supporting his weight. Is that accurate?
Speaker 2: Yes, That's how I would describe it. And my guess
behind the reasoning for that was purely because of the
terrain that he was running in. My my guess would
be that it was like he was grabbing onto the
roots or the stems of the reeds and pulling himself
forward because the water on that in that marshland is
unbelievably thick, and then it falls into like different layers
of mud, and it's as I said before, it is
extremely hard to move in. I've tried it once and
it is just you try to pull your foot up
and you just get like it's a vacuum, seals your
foot into the mud. So I personally think he was
trying to put as little pressure on the on the
mud as possible, and it was trying to use the
surroundings to move.
Speaker 3: The reason why I asked about that is quadripads, they
almost always use their back legs for propulsion in their
front legs catch their weight. Their front legs do prove
I had some propulsion, but mostly the front legs are
just to catch their weight when they're in full run.
For him to do the opposite that is really strange.
But then again, do all of me do a lot
of things that just fly in the face of what's normal.
So that's just one of those things. But yeah, that's
why I was asking you about that. Marcus. Have you
ever heard about someone besides Kai and your other friends
having an experience with something that just might have been
white man.
Speaker 1: No, I haven't really heard anything specifically about white maing
that me and my friends have, But I have heard
other people mentioned that they hear strange sounds outside the house,
that some people it sounded like someone was an animal,
a quadruped animal specifically, was prowling around the house, But
nothing that can tell me it was White Man.
Speaker 3: Well, I'm glad you're not jump into conclusions. That's good, Marcus.
Is there any novelty to the fact that at any
time when you go out you might bump into him again?
Or would you be totally fine if he disappeared from
the face of the earth and never came back and
that was never even a possibility.
Speaker 1: No, I'm quite excited about the fact that I could
see him again. Like I said, it wasn't a negative
experience that I had. Sometimes I sort of hope when
I'm walking around that night, specifically because I hope I
sometimes just maybe catch a glimpse of something, maybe just
bump into him, well not physically, but just see him
across the road walking back into the mountains and something.
I really do it would be a cool experience for
me to see. Obviously, I'd be a bit frozen and
she very cautious on my way home. But if he's gone.
I would be just a little bit bummed out about that.
Speaker 3: Well, it's good to hear you say those things, because
if you have that desire to see him again some time,
then you can't be that bad off after having that
encounter at the Lagoon River, and speaking of that place
at the Lagoon River, how far is that from your home?
Speaker 1: Shoot, I'd say maybe five kilometers I would if I guess,
it's about maybe four kilometers on dirt roads and bar roads,
and then another kilometer into the theness.
Speaker 3: It's not that far. Then is there much at all
in the way of infrastructure between that place and your home, houses,
other buildings, businesses or you talked about the dirt roads
and everything. Is it nothing but bush?
Speaker 1: No? So between the forest and my residence there is
roads and houses and some shops. It's quite I live
in very central Pringle Bay.
Speaker 3: Well, if you didn't want to have any visits late
at night, I guess that might help. But as I'm
sure you know, these things do come into towns, so
it definitely doesn't preclude the chance. Kai when you were
laying in bed that night and heard that tapping on
your bedroom window, it doesn't seem like the tapping sounded
light claws on glass. Considering how you described it, did
it sound like it might have been knuckles instead.
Speaker 2: To be one hundred percent honest with you, Vic, I
haven't the slightest clue. I don't know if it was
knocking on my window. I don't know if it was tapping.
All I know is that when I opened up my curtain,
I saw the handout with the index finger extended and
the thumb slightly out of the hand. Now again, whether
it had its left hand and had it backwards or
it had its right hand facing forwards, I really don't know.
Speaker 3: But yeah, I'm sure you're so frightened that you're doing
good to know your own name, so you can't be
faulted for not knowing exactly what it sounded like when
you heard that tapping. So I understand.
Speaker 1: Kai.
Speaker 3: After your dad pulled his car around to point his
headlights where white Men was when you first saw him,
you told your dad that you had seen a dog man.
How did your dad know back then what a dog
man was?
Speaker 2: To be honest with you, Vic, I'm pretty sure he
just made a guess of the two words together and
probably assumed that it was some sort of mix of
a creature mixed with a man and a dog. I
don't think he had the full rundown or idea of
what it was. My dad's never really been into that
kind of stuff. He's a very religious and so, I mean,
to be honest with you, he never asked me what
a dog man was. I didn't tell him it was
a dog man. I just described to him what i'd seen,
purely because I was still in shock and I didn't
know what I didn't want to put a name on
it yet, so I just described to him what I saw,
this white creature with a tale that I thought was
unable walking at first, and then dropped down and it
had these pointy years with his black, sunken eyes. And
he pretty much just told me, like, don't talk about it,
purely for the sake of my younger sisters.
Speaker 3: I'm glad you brought that up. Let's talk more about that.
When you had that experience, Like you said, he told
you not to bring it up with your sister any
other family members for that point down the road. Did
you ever tell that sister who was with you that night,
what it was that you saw, what happened, or have
you to this day kept that from her.
Speaker 1: So funny, and I never told her personally.
Speaker 2: I mean, she asked me questions when I got inside,
and I said, I don't know. That's literally the only
response I had at the time. She was asking what
was what do you think it is? And I was
just saying I don't know, I don't know. And then
when you released the last episode last week, my family
actually listened to it, and my elder sister who's turning
sixteen this year, the one who was with me for
that encounter, listened, and then the two youngest state, well,
they went to bed. So now she knows of my
encounter in detail.
Speaker 3: Oh good, it's good that she knows. But if she
does know in detail about what happened to you and
about white Man being out there, have you noticed any
changes in her behavior?
Speaker 1: To be honest with you know? Vix So she.
Speaker 2: Lives with her mom about hours outside of Pringle Bay
towards Cape Soun, so we only get to see her
every second weekend. But I mean I got home on
Saturday from Johannesburg and she was quite eager, and she
was asking, like, can we go for the night walk tonight?
Can you ask that if we can go for a
night walk. So I don't think it's I don't think
it's I suppose you could say caused any hesitation on
her side. I do think and hope that she believes me,
but I don't think she lives in fear of it.
Speaker 3: Well, that's really good. That is good to hear, Marcus.
When you go on your walks, do you take any
weapons with you?
Speaker 1: No? Not really. When I plan to go out to
the wilderness, I'll take maybe a pocket night with me,
But if I'm just walking around at night, or maybe
walking through someone at night, it's usually just my phone
in my pocket. Sometimes I'll carry a satchel that has
depending on where I'm going again, and maybe has some
drawing supplies and some books. But that's about all that
I carry with me on a regular.
Speaker 3: Well, that just reinforces the point that mentally you're in
a good place when it comes to your encounter with
him and the possibility of bumping into him again. That's
really good to hear. Are you as close to Dale
as kay is?
Speaker 1: Oh? Yes, yes, we're very good friends.
Speaker 3: If that's a case. After he had his encounter, do
you know if he became interested in them. Maybe you're
not happy about the possibility of bumping into one, because
it sounds like that encounter really shook him up. But
do you know if he started researching them at a
distance or did he seem to avoid the topic at
all costs.
Speaker 1: I know that since the beginning of our friendship, he's
been pretty into the supernatural, but especially the creatures, the
cryptids like Bigfoot, even some of the aquatic creatures like
NeSSI from the Loch ness he mentioned once, so he
since the beginning, he's been researching them in depth. And
I remember after Kai's encounter when me and Dale went
to Kai's house and me and him stopped outside just
to quickly look around to see if we could spot anything,
and we saw some some of the grass was kicked up,
but we didn't bring it up to Kai because we
didn't know how he reacted to it and we didn't
want to make him paranoid. And after Dale's encounter with it,
I remember he was also not really shooken by it,
and me and him and Kai dove into the research together.
Speaker 3: Oh, I mistook how he handled that encounter then, Yeah,
I got the impression that he had a lot of
trouble coming to terms with it.
Speaker 1: Yes, so early on he was very much shaken by it,
like Kai was, unlike I was. The first few days
he was he like I said, he was regularly telling
me about cool creatures that he discovered online or that
he read about. And I remember after that encounter he
was pretty shaken up. It was only after a few
weeks that we got back into it again and he
seemed to gain some interest. So long term he's still well,
I'm not sure now. We haven't had contact with him recently,
but over the long term he was still in He
seemed to have a similar reaction to me and Ki.
Speaker 3: Oh good, yes, good news to hear that he is
dealing with this well now. It's totally understandable that he'd
be taken aback at first by the experience, but he
had to hear that he's come to terms with it.
That's great, that really is Ki. You told us why
you and your friends gave Skinwalker Forrest that name. Had
you been to Skinwalker Forrest before you had your first encounter,
and if you had, did the place give you the
creeps back then?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Vic, the place always gave us creeps from the start.
I mean, it started off one day we were just
randomly walking and we saw the plots and we thought, okay,
let's go for a walk in there. And one of
the things that stood out for us was the off feeling.
And I mean that was months before I had my
first encounter, and so as long as we've known the place,
it's always had a very very off feeling about.
Speaker 3: Sounds like a really scary place. Sounds like a great
name for it. When you took Angus and Marcus's little
brother Colub there with you, he joked about how Calb
was going to be the sacrifice. How old was he
at the time.
Speaker 2: This was last year and he was I think fifteen.
Speaker 3: He was fifteen. Did you have any concerns about him
being able to hold his own being too young to
deal with an experience if you wind up having one,
or did that concern never cross your mind?
Speaker 2: Initially it was just going to be myself and Angus,
And then when we went to Marcus's house to ask
him to join us, karlib bumped his head around the
corner and said, I want to come with, And so
there was we didn't invite him. He more invites himself.
And then the whole sacrifice thing is more more of
a joke, because, to be honest with you, he's faster
than I am. So, in all honesty, if something had happened,
I probably would have been the first to have gone anywhere,
considering I was the slowest out of the three of us.
Speaker 3: Well, you might have been the slowest, but you would
have tripped someone, wouldn't you, Vic?
Speaker 1: I would like to say that I would.
Speaker 2: But with me, I have a very blank mind whenever
it comes to a a flight situation. So if I'm
in a flight mode, I run and I don't think
about anything else. I don't think about any strategies. I
just go as fast as what I can, even if
it means running for me.
Speaker 3: No, that's understandable. I understand. When the three of you
heard that ground impact sound, have you considered the possibility
you that it might have been caused by something heavy
jumping out of a tree?
Speaker 2: Vic, So, to be honest with you, there weren't any
trees big enough that this thing could have been in.
Speaker 1: I would say within thirty to.
Speaker 2: Forty meter circumference of where we heard the sound. To
be honest with you, I think it's either one of
two things. I think first either physically hit the ground
or stomped, or I reckon it might have thrown a
large stone, and and we only heard the first impact
and we were gone.
Speaker 3: If you didn't have any trees big enough to climb,
that does change things. When I sat there and listened
to you talk about hearing that impact, I thought, Okay, yeah,
it must have been white Man jumping out of a tree.
But if you didn't have any trees like that around,
that changes things. It really does. Have either of you
two ever gone out for the sole purpose of trying
to have another encounter with white.
Speaker 1: Man, Yes, absolutely, we've gone into Skinwalker Forest ever since
after those encounters. Most of the time we go into
Skinwalker forests to try and find White Main. And we've
had late nights bumbling around in the bush looking for
any clues. We even consulted tracking books, and I remember
I did research on how to find tracks, like identify
smells and all those things. I remember we did. We explored,
We covered a lot of ground looking for any clue,
but it's just it's pretty wild out there. So there's
always leaves falling, this rain, there's mud, there's there's so
many features that I just don't have the the expertise
to discern what could be just natural and what could
possibly be something that passed through the area.
Speaker 3: Considering how you've laid out your encounters with white Man,
I wouldn't be surprised if you have another encounter down
the road. But for some reason, I'm of the mindset
that if it happens, it's going to be on his terms,
not yours. I could be wrong about that, but I'm
pretty sure that's how it's going to be. Well, gentlemen,
I think we're about out of time, but before we
get out of here, Ki, do you have any closing
comments you want to put out there for us.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I would just like to say thank you very much,
Nick for this opportunity. As I said in the last episode,
I've been listening to your podcast for years now, and
I never thought I'd be able to come on you
and tell my encounter and be able to answer all
these questions. So I just want to say thank you
for the opportunity, and to be honest with you, it
has already started to help me with getting over my
fears at night. I mean, I've got my own room
upstairs here at night and had it had I'd not
spoken to you about this encounter, I probably would have
gone to sleep every night facing the window, defensive and
probably ready for something to show up. But after talking
to you, it's just it's almost helped get a load
off my shoulders, and it's actually helped a lot.
Speaker 3: Well, that's great to hear. That's what this whole show
is about, and that's what I'm here for. So that's
music to my ears. How about you, Marcus? Do you
have any closing comments for us?
Speaker 1: Yeah? I also just want to say thank you. It's
really nice knowing that we finally got our story out there.
I think it's really cool that we get featured on
your podcast. Kai has told me for a very since
a while ago, told me about this guy's podcast is
so cool and he deals with all these cool things,
and I was, yeah, I could see it was very
enthusiastic about this, and I'm also I was also very
excited to be on here.
Speaker 3: Well, it's great having both of you on. So I'm
so glad that you decided to come on and do this.
I really am. But having said that, I can't thank
you too enough for coming on to sure these experiences
with us and to answer these questions for us. I
really do appreciate it.
Speaker 1: Thank you again, Vic. Yeah, thanks, it was a big pleasure.
Speaker 3: Well you're welcome. The pleasure is all mine. Well, thanks
again so much for your time, and have a great night.
Speaker 2: English