Speaker 1: Big Food and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo. These guys
are your favorites, so light share, subscribe and rade it
five story short and merges on es Today and listening
watching always keep its.
Speaker 2: Watching And now you're hosts Cliff Berkman and James Bubo Fay.
Speaker 1: Greetings, Bobo, love Cliff. What's happening man? Anything good?
Speaker 3: Not a whole lot.
Speaker 4: I got break coming up, I got a spring break
coming up, and created just left about five minutes ago.
Speaker 3: So I'm a bachelor for the next four days.
Speaker 1: Which means what really like, what are the differences?
Speaker 4: Uh, watch tiver you want whatever, like volume you want,
or don't worry about being home for dinner. Just come
home whenever I feel like it. Just that kind of stuff,
you know, just just total freedom.
Speaker 1: Okay, very good. So it doesn't sound like it's a
big functional difference honestly, because you'll probably still wander home
when the streetlights come on, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, pretty much?
Speaker 1: Yeah, Well that's cool. Enjoy your quote unquote freedom.
Speaker 3: HMP sire for a little barbecue.
Speaker 1: So how does Creedle like HMP heavy metal?
Speaker 3: Path?
Speaker 1: Oh? Really good? Good, because that would be a contention.
You know, she probably wouldn't made it this far if
if there was an issue, yeah, well you got gone.
Another sighting report came in, so that made two sightings
in the month of March in the local area. I'll
fill you in on that on the members side here
because it's kind of a longer story, but the short
version is four young men saw a well two of
them saw it. The other two guys were just there.
But four dudes were camping and a sasquatch came into
camp and two of the people saw it, and one
of the guys saw it twice over over like an
hour period of time up between Capoos and Vernonia over
there in the coast range. So that was kind of cool.
Other than that, I got all sorts of interesting things
going on. Looks like we now have permission from the
Willow Creek Museum down in you know, Willow Creek. We're
going to start selling some of the Tipmas casts and
giving them commissions on it, basically, you know, giving them
really decent chunk of the profit that we make. But
it'll be so cool just to be able to do that,
especially since we have historical items from the Tipmus collection
on display in the museum. So looking forward to that.
Just started producing some casts last week, and that includes
the footprint cast or some of the footprint casts from
Tipmas's visit to the Patterson Gimlan film site. So I've
been unleashed on that now, so that's kind of cool.
I have a documentary film crew in town for the
next couple of weeks. I'm gonna be working with them.
They want to do something on what real sasquatch research
looks like nowadays, and so I'll be helping them out
with that, stearing them towards witnesses, taking them to the woods,
that kind of thing. Been out to the woods. I
found an interesting track or two out there about a
week and a half ago. So just, you know, just
a ton of stuff. As always, it's just there's always
stuff going on in my life with bigfoot.
Speaker 3: So yeah, cool, Well.
Speaker 1: You have something interesting to share, don't you.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I was hoping that this person would be among our listenership,
because you know, a lot of witnesses end up following
the subject obviously. So Emily and I were at a
national park recently and we were having dinner in the
lodge and the lodge was like packed. There was a
family sitting next to us, like husband and wife and
two young kids, and the kids were asking questions of
the dad like.
Speaker 3: Oh, do you think we'll see hawks? What do hawks
look like?
Speaker 1: What do they do?
Speaker 2: Do you think we'll see falcons?
Speaker 3: What do falcons look like? What do falcons do? And
then they said do you think we'll see bigfoot?
Speaker 1: What is bigfoot like? And so he was like, well, they're.
Speaker 2: They're humanoid, but they're not really human. And you know,
people do see them around here. They say they see
them in California and in the Northwest. And then I
think his wife is sort of prodding like, well, do
you want to tell him? And he was like, well,
the one I saw was in Colorado. I was in
survival training and me and a few guys that I
was in training with saw one and he was porn
some things in the restaurant. He was like, well, it's
about as far away as that thing here. It was
about as tall as this thing here. So I was
overhearing this story looking at Italy like, oh, man, should
I say something like I didn't want to be rude
and like eavesdrop, but you know how it is man
like if you say sasquatch or bigfoot around me like
I'm going to hear it, you know, I'm going to
start listening. So I thought, well, if I see this
guy around the park, you know, maybe I'll stop and
say hey. You know, I didn't mean the eavesdrop, but
introduce myself. But I didn't get the chance. So if
that person's listening, if you were to National Park recently
in the lodge telling your kids about the Sasquad siding
you had, we'd love to hear about it, shoot us
an email.
Speaker 3: But other than that, I know.
Speaker 2: We've got a guest on the line. We don't want
to keep him waiting, but as always want to toss
out once again. The upcoming appearances, I know you are
going to be at the Ohio Bigfoot Conference on May
the second. I think that's sold out already, Yeah, definitely is.
You can check or beg for tickets if you like
that same we can. I'll be speaking at the Smoky
Mountain Bigfoot Festival in Townshend, Tennessee, and so that's Saturday,
May the second. So there's a link to that in
the show notes. Nick Cliffe, You'll be in o Caalla,
Florida on June thirteenth, right, I think so theoretically, yep,
that's the Great Florida Bigfoot Conference by our friends over
there gather up events, and then I do have tickets
and info a link in the show notes here for
gather up events Alaska Bigfoot Cruise that will be September
eleventh to the eighteenth. So I'll be speaking there with
Jonathan Dover, Adam Davis, and RPG your buddy Ryan Colmbeski.
So that'll be a lot of fun. So now that
all those are announced and available, you can click the
link in the show notes if you're close to or
want to attend to any of those. Well enough of that,
I think we go straight out of our guests. Now
you know, everybody's best friend in the world and everybody's
favorite author, lovely and talented Lyle Blackburn.
Speaker 3: I didn't realize.
Speaker 5: Oh was that lovely? I appreciate that.
Speaker 1: Oh you have no idea, your loveliness.
Speaker 3: Sectionalist Bigfoot are alive. Besides prove it, baby, I.
Speaker 1: Deferd to Lyle of that one. I'll take second or third.
I literally have a sticker of Lyle now on my
water bottle.
Speaker 3: There you go.
Speaker 5: Yes, I do have my own stickers, so.
Speaker 3: And coozies yeah, I gotta have some of that website.
Speaker 5: The stickers are the koozies are for special gifts, so
I would have to send you in special but I
can do that.
Speaker 3: Oh great, I see in person.
Speaker 1: They came in a box when I ordered stock for
Lyle's brand new book, Terrifying Encounters for the North American
Bigfoot Center, And of course he was being the lovely
man he is. He autographed every single one for us,
you know. But I still recommend anybody listening to buy
it directly from Lyle because frankly, he's doing it cheaper.
I think he's sawing these for thirteen bucks or something,
and I got to sell him for fourteen because of
shipping and issues like that. But yeah, Lyle's brand new
book true, is it true Terrifying Encounters or no, it's
just Terrifying Encounters. True is just an exclamation point, I guess,
right above the title. But Lyle, this is a great book, man.
I haven't had a chance to get all the way
through it, but I did start going through it. And
first of all, you know all of us here, you know,
Bobo and I and you and I think Matt. And
Matt's a little younger than us. But we grew up
in the seventies and eighties and stuff, and we had
these paperback classics like the John Green books. Everybody knows
that they're published in like maybe eight and a half
by eleven format, a little bit bigger than that. But
later on they were condensed down to paperbacks like these
pocket paperback books. And that was the thing back in
the day. Just like when a television show or whatever,
it gets popular enough and does enough episodes, they eventually
go to syndication. That that's kind of a different way
of thinking about this, but when a book was popular
enough back in the seventies and eighties, it eventually went
to paperback and therefore to the mass market with the
wider distribution and the author can make more money and
whatever else. And a lot of our favorite big Foot
books were published in that format eventually, like Renee de
Hinden's book was published like that, Peter Burns book was
published like that, John Green stuff was published like that,
And I'll just skip the first step and went straight
to the cool pocket paperback book. It was just fantastic.
And even just like classic guitars and whatnot, you can
buy brand new guitars that look like they're aged. These
books look like they're age. There's cracks in the cover
even though it's brand new. These are so cool, They're adorable.
Speaker 3: I read the whole thing as a good book. I
enjoyed it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Lyle tell us about how this book came into existence. Man,
I'm just loving it so far.
Speaker 5: Well, thank you that those are the things that, you know,
kind of inspired me to do it in this format.
You know, first off, just pocket paperback size, which is
a certain It's probably was like as market and stuff
of these, you know, they probably calculated the perfect size
that people wanted to hold and that you know, those
classic books.
Speaker 3: So I don't know, I've had.
Speaker 1: This idea for a while.
Speaker 5: It's like, you know what, you know, books have gotten
bigger and stuff, but I like to carry them around,
you know, and get them out and read them. And
I just thought, what if I did a retro style
where it was literally the same size as those pocket
paperback which is what they call it, and also make
it look like that, like that's the old fonts and everything,
so that it would just sort of be like a
modern day companion to your collection if you have some
of those. Yeah, like mysterious monsters and some of the
old classics of paranormal books, and so, you know, I
just set about, you know, kind of designing it with
that in mind. So and what I wanted to do
is have stories in here or reports and encounters that
I had nowhere else to put them, because over the
years I've gotten you know, whole manner of stuff. But
usually my books are focused, you know, on a certain
area or a certain case like Boggy Creek, Lake Worth,
the Missouri Monster, that sort of stuff. So I'd had
all these really great and super credible encounters and I thought, well,
this is the perfect way to do it. Is you know,
it just doesn't matter where it took place or when
it took place. It's just a collection of what I
consider some of the best encounters I've researched. So this book,
you know, allowed me to do that. And it's and
actually this is volume one, so it's going to be
a series. And if you look on the spine, you know,
it says one and then so you you know, collect
them all and the others. So this is this contains Bigfoot,
dog man, devil monkeys and you know, goat men and
other sort of like that category of cryptids, and then
you know, of course I'll cover other ones like lizard
Man and Mothman, and so as the volumes go forward,
it's sort of a collection of similarly grouped cryptids, if
you will. So that's sort of the the you know,
the master plan going forward. And it's super fun to
do because, like I said, I've had some of these
encounters just here and I've never been able to write
about them. So now I'm like, yes, I can finally
document these and share them with the world.
Speaker 3: Have you ever counted how many cryptids you have reports over?
Speaker 1: Like?
Speaker 3: Have you and Ken Garhar and I guess like that
ever got together?
Speaker 4: So like I've got goat Man and bat Boy and
pig Man, and like they've ever counted how many like
cryptids there are?
Speaker 5: You guys have a track of No, I've never actually
you know, tallied it up, but I certainly if you
look at the mostly digital files at this point, if
you look at the folders in my computer under cryptid reports,
there's more and more folders of just all stuff like
lake Monsters and yeah, pig Man, goat Man. Because you
you know, over the years, I've gotten all these stray
things that don't I don't really fit into anywhere, and
I had no, you know, real platform to share them.
So yeah, it's a lot and then ones that we
don't have. If we're covering that particular cryptid you know,
well a lot of us will ask, hey, do you
have anything on this, and you know, kind of build
up the files so that we, you know, have all
of it together.
Speaker 1: When you set out to do this sort of retro
format for your book, do you think it affected your
writing style at all? Because you're an excellent writer. That's
I think everybody knows that about you. You're an excellent,
excellent writer. It's engaging to read any of your books.
But when I when I was going through this book,
it read like those old pocket paper books as well,
And I'm wondering if that was intentional or am I
just reading into your writing.
Speaker 5: No, it was kind of intentional in a way, because
once I sat down and said, okay, you know, I'm
writing up these encounters for this particular book format, I
did kind of think about that and kind of I
was like, you know what, you know that there was
a certain storytelling style that is sort of a mash
up between like John Keel and John Green and Lauren Coleman.
Where you know, John Green's very detailed and very interview style,
but John Keel would just he wrote up a lot
of crazy encounters that had exciting details. So I really
wanted to while all of these, in my opinion, are
I mean, they're certainly from real people, and they're they're
credible as far as I can tell, I wanted to
write them up in a way that if somebody just
picked this up, you know, mass market, maybe they are
not a cryptid fan, or if they just picked it up,
it would be engaging and the encounter would sound terrifying
and bringing out the you know, the aspects of these
reports so that they're interesting. And again like the way
it's written up, you know, there's I do a little
premise before the encounter and that kind of I was
just going to you know, there's the encounters, but the
way I write books, I usually inject my own sort
of connection to it or a little bit about you know,
I did investigate this, I interviewed the person or whatever,
so I have a little setup. But then it's just
there's the counter and you can almost pick up the
book and just flip through and just read an encounter
and it doesn't matter if it's in the middle of
the book or the end. It's you know, self contained.
So that's kind of what I was thinking, is like,
anybody that picks this up and just reads one of
them goes, wow, that's amazing.
Speaker 1: You know, stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with
Cliff and Bogo. We'll be right back after these messages.
I love the way this entire book reads because it
reminds me so much of those seventies and eighties documentaries
or the schlockumentaries as I call them, where it's largely
reenactments basically, you know, And that's the way your book
reads like a TV show, which I think is so
cool because you have a subtitle within a chapter, and
all the subtitles grab you. They grab your imagination and
paint some sort of level of expectation for you before
you jump into the story, you know, like I've just
flipped the one Run for Your Life is a subtitle,
Like how cool is that? That tells you something about
the story. It gives you a little bit of a
foreshadowing or lonely back road. Here's another one, See a
Thing on the Hill, there's something on the hill.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So, and then you go into the narration, just like
you would in it in one of these old TV
shows where the guy sets it up, sets up the
story and the scene and the characters, and then you
go into the retelling of it. It's just genius. Man.
I'm just couldn't be happier for you that you you
dug up this old this old format and are now
you know, rolling around in it. It's just so cool.
Converse Werewolf. I love all this stuff.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and that that's exactly what I was going for,
is just you know, I love to making the titles
for the section, and it does it's you know, it
sets it up.
Speaker 3: You want it.
Speaker 5: You want people to go, you know, run for your life.
You go, oh my gosh, what could this be? You
know it it kind of gets gets you primed, prime
the pump there, and then yeah, my little narration kind
of grounds it in. You know, this is a real
report that what you're about to read. What you're about
to read is not fiction. This is a actual person
said this. And you know I include the names of people.
You know, I don't some people if they wish not,
you know, their names not to be public. Fine, I
honor that, but you know, I mean these are things
that if a person stands behind what they saw, usually
they don't mind sharing.
Speaker 1: So but yeah, it's just like it.
Speaker 3: It's just that thing.
Speaker 5: And what I'm most happy about is people seem to
love it. Like it's like everything I like about these
kind of books and all that retro stuff. Everybody has
really responded to. And I've seen people post pictures of
my book with other books, those pocket paperbacks from their
own collection. I'm like, what an honor you know, if
there's like a you know, John Green book or something,
I'm like, wow, this is like for me, is a
right or it's it's really gratifying, and I'm glad people
have responded in the way they have and love it.
It's a small book, you know, people like it's different,
but people get out. I love that, love the feel,
I love the look, and so you know, I'm like, Okay,
I'm working on volume two as fast as I can
because I know people are ready to collect them all.
Speaker 4: You know, that's a genius format. I mean I just
looked it up online as the book covering that whole Uh.
For some reason, the second I saw a pictured Clinton
Tarantino reading it going like this is great, you know,
like he does that kind of retro style.
Speaker 1: Yeah, gosh, it's send you bore when you're reading through
the book, you know, after you get to the title
and then I guess the narrator is setting up the
context and everything like that. I totally picture your your sexy,
smooth voice reading it to me. And I'm lucky enough
to know you, of course, but anybody who has heard
you or your podcasts, I think would probably hear your
voice reading it because you'd be the perfect setup for this,
which brings about my question. Have you featured any of
these stories on your podcast? Because you're your podcast unlike ours,
ours is just you know, shooting the poop with friends basically,
but yours is a storytelling format in your in your podcast,
and it takes a long time to produce these things,
and they're they're just exquisite, you know, they're they're they're
pieces of art basically, you know, where we throw these
things together every single every week. Have you done any
of these stories for your podcast?
Speaker 5: I actually have the there's a few of them that
have been on there, you know, sort of in relation
to the topic of that podcast. For example, I did
a two part on skunk apes, and I include this one,
the Creature of Cedar Key, which is one of the
all time best cryptid reports I've come across ever. And
you know, I'm sort of a writer first and every
the narrator and all that other stuff second. And I've
never been able to write this one up, even though
I've had the report for like nine years. But I
was in a monster mart in Falk, Arkansas, and I
just know go there frequently, and I was in there
one day and two women were in there with their
mother and they'd come to town and the owner of
the monster mart had said, well, Lyle Blackburn's on its
way up here, like oh wow. So they hung around
because they wanted to talk to me. And anyway, these
these two sisters said, we've never told anybody about this,
but we were in Florida. We had gone on a
cruise and they were headed back, driving back home, and
they were driving through an area where there had been
a hurricane and they had a sighting of a large,
upright bipedal thing walk across the road in broad daylight
in front of them, and it, you know, it freaked
them out that these are not ladies that were into
bigfoot or anything. And unlike a lot of reports, I
had two witnesses there. They were sisters, but I was
able to talk to them both, and I mean just
I was like, wow, now there is no question about
what you saw. I mean, you know, you had two
eyes on it. It was daylight, clear visibility in an
area that had, you know, a history of skunkap reports
which they did not know about. So there's ones like
that that it just I had interviewed people and sort
of had on the files and I did cover that
in one of my podcasts. So this is sort of
a companion piece where now I'm writing up the narrative
of the whole encounter. But it's gratifying to me again
to be able to document this in print as I would,
you know, as I've done with other things like Boggy
Creek encounters and so forth. And yeah, it was really
nice to include it here because I didn't have any
there's no constraints, you know, it didn't matter where it
occurred or what year it occurred. I'm able to put
it in the book because well, there's a chapter on bigfoot.
These are the best you know.
Speaker 1: Of these stories in here, I see some of the
classic Beast of Brave Road, for example, I've seen I've
been flipping through. I've been seeing some stuff. I see
you mentioned Fahrenbachn here. Are there any stories for you,
or perhaps individuals for you in the book that really
stand out in one way or another, like either the
strong personality or extraordinarily a convincing or anything like that.
Speaker 5: Yeah, certainly, you know, because some of these, you know,
are are gleaned from other sources where I felt that
they had been well documented and they, you know, serve
the purpose of the book. I mean, the accounter needs
to be lengthy enough to you know, have substance, and
it needs to be something that kind of had an effect,
you know, on the witness, you know, usually fearful or
you know, this was something that affected them as they
saw it. But yeah, there's there is several. There was
one it's speaking of dog Man. You know, I don't
I've got dog Man reports, and I'm you know, I'm
skeptical about Man. But there have been some that I've
gotten or people I've interviewed where I said, you know
what I don't. I don't know how to explain that
but there's There was a guy who had contacted me
and he had come out to the Texas Bigfoot Conference
and saw me there and he said, you know, I've
never told anybody this, but when I was younger, I
was a hunter, and I went out with my father
in Louisiana and he said, I saw something that sounds
like a dog man. He says, I don't know what
it was, but he proceeded to tell me about And
he was about twelve at the time, and he had
just his father had just started letting him hunt by himself,
you know, go off and have his own stand, and
they went out. He went out there one morning and
got in this ground blind and just as you know,
the son was coming up. He said he saw what
he first took to be a coyote coming in about
seventy five yards away, and it got closer. And as
he looked at this thing, he's like, that doesn't quite
look like a coyote.
Speaker 3: It's bigger. It it just looks odd.
Speaker 5: And you know, more light is coming in as the
sun's going up, and this thing goes to where they
had some corn laid out on the ground, and they
had they'd actually mixed this corn with peanut butter. I
guess they found that that would draw in the deer.
And he had also hung up some dough that was
hanging in the tree, so you know, they had it
all there, and this thing kind of came up and
it kind of went to the corn, and he said,
then it kind of sniffed around. He said, it stood
up on two legs and then walked over there to
the tree where the doe you'reine was hanging and inspected that,
and he said, turned around and on two legs walk back,
and then I guess it was eating on the corn
or the peanut butter. It did this a couple of times,
and of course in the process of this, this kid
is just you know, thinking what am I looking at?
And you know, he just got down on the bottom
of that stand and the thing eventually walked off and
disappeared into the woods. But it really struck me as
like I identified with it because when I was young,
you know, my father was an avid hunter, so I
was in the exact same situations where just as I
started getting old enough, you know, I had a gun
and my dad would then say, okay, you're you can
you stay in this stand and then I'm going to
go off to mine and I'll come back after son
up and get you. And you know you felt real
brave and and you know, mature. But I'm just thinking, man,
I know if I would have seen that thing back
when I was young, sitting out there by myself in
the woods, it would have freaked me out, just like
it did this guy. And I could tell this guy
was not making this up. And you know, he wasn't
claiming it was a dog man. He didn't know what
it was. He just said it was very scary. And
and so those are the ones where the witness you
kind of would identify with him, and I connected with him,
and I said, man, if you don't mind, I'd love
to put that in this book because that that's exactly
what I want to put in here. You know, this
is a real life encounter and it sounds scary.
Speaker 3: It's just scary. I read that with my hair up
like I was.
Speaker 1: I was like, like, this is like I could just
the way you wrote it.
Speaker 4: I was there and I was like a fourteen year
old kid seeing this, and it was just like, you know,
I was surprised when I said, I asked about this
while was like the thing never noticeding like and I
noticed a few of these.
Speaker 3: Like where it's the big foots. It's almost never like you're.
Speaker 4: Hidden and observing a big foot where they don't like
just turn around and look at you, like like just
zap in on you instantly, like you know, you always
hear like people like I was. I was, you know,
like in my you know, I was all like a
gilly suit turkey turkey hunting, you know, and I was
completely camouflaged and holding still and it was one hundred
yards with it.
Speaker 3: It's snap head back and looked right at me.
Speaker 4: Like these other cryptids like dog Man and the goat Man,
it seems like they they aren't as like they don't
they're not like like picking up on people as much
as well. It seems like dog Mandy, but the goat Man,
like that was either creepy. One that really set out
to me was the one the guy I think it
was Minnesota Missiere or something. The guy was up in
a deer stand in that satyr I guess it was.
Goat Man came mumble and bidles with sins. It was
mumbling and cursing and a trespassers and.
Speaker 3: Like that one really freaked me out too.
Speaker 5: Right, Yeah, And that's a compliment because I do I
write these up to make it as I try to
put the person there.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 5: It's like, because that's the way I feel about a
lot of crypto encounters. We feel like, oh, you know, hey,
I saw this or whatever. But if you're really out
there by yourself in the woods and you see a
seven foot tall, powerful looking whether it's a bigfoot or
you see something even weirder like a goat man or whatever,
these are life changing experiences. So I really want to
put the reader there and front and and try to
you know, ride it in that way to where you
can you can kind of envision yourself just like you did,
like being in that stand watching that if you were
a hunter.
Speaker 3: So yeah, that's that's exactly what I try to do.
Speaker 4: I was on the goat man thing I could I
wasn't sure, like when that guy was up with the
tree stand and stuff and that one went by.
Speaker 3: Are they are these? Sometimes when you say goat man,
is that does that mean on four legs? Like a
goat lower body?
Speaker 4: And then sometimes it's like a human upper body and
a goat below the waist or whatever.
Speaker 3: But is there sometimes they two legs and sometimes are
they four legs.
Speaker 5: Typically, you know the goat men ones are you know,
the legs or the lower body of a goat and
they're walking on two legs though, but they don't have
four legs. I mean their upper torso is more you know, humanoid.
And of course when it comes to goat man, you know,
it's like it's it's a far stretch. So you know,
I really have to search around to even find enough
to fill up that chapter that I feel are credible enough,
and even at that, there's not many. And of course,
but you know, there's some classics like the Lakeworth Monster
incident where the classic nineteen sixty nine attack where I
was able to interview the son of that guy. And
in this case the one you're talking about. My colleague
Nate Couch, he's done a lot of research on goat man,
and I reached out to him and said, you have
any really credible ones where people actually supposedly saw, you know,
something walking on two legs that you know fell into
the category of goat man, And that's one of those.
So yeah, it's mostly just their upright, it's not the
opposite where it's like it's a four legged goat with
a human head or something weird like pig man or something.
You go, well, is it that face of a pig
or the body of a pig and the head of
a man? You know what are we talking about here, folks?
Speaker 1: Or just the demeanor up a pig?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 4: But have you noticed that though, Like I mean, because
you've done plenty of bigfoot investigations, does it seem like
it seems like the bigfoots are like, you know, locked
in on people, like right like they they'll spie, like
they they can feel you looking at them. They they
look right where they'll turn and look and snap their
head and like staring right at you. Like it seems
like the other cryptis aren't aren't as aware as ever?
Speaker 3: Have you know something? I just making that up?
Speaker 5: No, one hundred percent, I know what you're talking about.
And yeah, now that you point that out, because you know,
there's one in the book about a hunter Mike Wooley,
who was a friend of mine who had an encounter
and he was in a deer stand and it was
it was like that the bigfoot walked into you know,
and his line aside, and after a few moments it
just looked right up at him as if, yeah, I
know you're here, and you get that a lot. I
think with Bigfoot, and yeah, like you say, with these others,
they just tend to be going about their business in
the woods and usually don't even and look at you
most of the time, not always, but I don't know.
I think Bigfoot naturally, I would speculate that they're probably
a little more intelligent and a little more aware of
what's going on around them than say, some of these
more errant animal like cryptids.
Speaker 1: Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and
Bobo will be right back after these messages. So the
first three chunks of your book Beastly, Bigfoots, devil Monkeys,
and anomalous apes, they all seem to describe unknown primates
of some sorts. And I did read in the Double
Monkeys and preamble, if you want to call it that,
that some of these descriptions of the double monkeys, at
least in particular, show tales. So beyond the tail thing,
the presence of tales in some of these observations of
these creatures, is there anything to suggest that there's more
than one species It's like, could these all just be
sasquatches in different circumstances, or do you think there's actually
other things, that's something else going on.
Speaker 5: I think there there would have to be something else
going on. Now, the different, the beastly bigfoots, those are
just pretty much straight up what I would consider classic
bigfoot descriptions, the anomalous apes. And I broke that off
into its own chapter because I've gotten these reports that
seem just a little off, like the bigfoot would be
described is really thin or in some ways not what
we typically think of as you know, the anatomy of
a bigfoot, and so I kind of broke those off.
And people describing things as monkey men, you know, it's
splitting hairs here. But those I think can generally fall
into bigfoot and perhaps, you know, I mean just like
humans not you know, we all weigh, we're different sizes,
we way different with different heights. You know, that certainly
can apply to bigfoots. Devil monkeys, however, definitely seems like
something else. And those descriptions, well, you know, lack of
a better comparison, is more like baboon like and either
it has a tail or it doesn't and there's definitely
more few and far between. And I wanted to include
devil monkeys just simply because I've heard a lot about it,
and you see, like, supposedly there's this category of cryptids
devil monkeys. So I'm like, you know what, I'm going
to look into that. I'm going to find what credible
encounters there are, and it just seems like something to
put in terrifying encounters. So, but I think the descriptions
there are one of two things. Either it's it is
simply a mistaken identity perhaps. I mean, if you saw
a baboon jumping by in the woods, it would be freaky.
Or there's a cryptid, you know, ape that more closely
fits that, which would have to be a different species
because now we're talking about different anatomy traits. If it
did have a tail or, if it's usually its snout
is more elongated.
Speaker 1: I see that they aren't exactly the devil monkey sightings
aren't exactly grouped where I would expect them to be,
which is you know, Florida, Louisiana, you know, the South
basically where it's generally warmer all year round. There's actually
the first two chapter, first two sub chapters are from Virginia,
for example, and then it goes on the Illinois I think, So,
what do you think the chances of the devil monkeys
being some sort of you know, illegal pet set loose
or something to that effect.
Speaker 5: Yeah, definitely, you know, more skeptical about those. And while
you know, the witnesses truly surely believe they saw something
that they couldn't quite identify, it doesn't mean that it
wasn't It wasn't you know, an exotic path that got loose.
Because again, if you depending on the angle and the lighting,
and if it's at night and you're driving a car
or whatever, you know, if you saw something that was
baboon like and it jumped out and jumped at your car,
and you know, you may not be expecting to see
a baboon or a mandrel or something. So I think,
you know, there is room for interpretation over what these
people actually saw, but they they do seem committed to
I saw something that did not fit in anything I've seen,
you know, at a zoo or in.
Speaker 1: A book, or any known animal.
Speaker 5: You know, most people know what a baboon looks like
and so forth. So yeah, and like you say, they
don't seem to be in an environment like Virginia. It's like,
you know, if these things were living indigenously, it doesn't
seem like a place where it would be hospitable because
you know, most primates live in more of a subtropical environment,
so you know that would that would be its you know,
normal habitat. So yeah, definitely anomalies and you know, could
be escaped pets and other things, but you know, nonetheless
a terrifying encounter, I suppose.
Speaker 1: And they would be terrifying. I mean having and I
think Bobo can agree with this as well. Is that
being around monkeys out in the world. You know, whether
it's in the Paul and the temples and the paul
are all sorts of monkeys are just hanging out stealing
stuff from tourists and whatever else. Or the golden snubnosed
monkeys we had the opportunity to hang out with in China.
Monkeys are horrifying and terrifying, even like the friendly, rather
docile ones that with their fifteen pound Oh I think
a fifteen pounder can rip your stuff up, man, Just horrifying,
horrifying little critters. Man, the worst pets in the world.
You know, you think you think your children are bad,
wait till you get one of these.
Speaker 5: Man my grandmother used to own. I believe it was
a spider monkey. Now that was when she was younger.
I never saw the thing, but apparently it was. It
only liked her. Anybody that came around it showed its
teeth and it was unpleasant. They finally had to get
rid of it because it was, you know, just protective
of my grandmother. And I was like, how in the
world does one get a monkey? Or Dad would always
bring home bizarre stuff and he's like, here, I got
you this monkey. So but yeah, they ain't keep it long.
But you're right, I mean monkeys of any size, you know,
they're they're oh, it's cute. Well if it you know,
when it gets aggressive, it is it is not cute.
And those things are are scary, even at any size.
So surely, you know, if you imagine a bigger version
of that or something that we're going to call a
devil monkey, it's like, I don't want to encounter that
in the woods.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, probablymates make terrible pets, which is part of the
reason I don't have children.
Speaker 5: Right, and not to mention they tend to fling things
that we would think are unsanitary. It's not it would
not be pleasant in your house.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was just not verbally right.
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, So but anyway, it was it was fun
to kind of look into the double monkey thing, just
the because you know, oftentimes, you you know, say you're
on a cryptied website, they have all you know, here's
all the types of cryptids, and you know, that's double
monkeys is a type. But I'm never really you know,
investigating now what now, what reports are there of this
and what witnesses have claimed to see? And again there
one it's one where there's just not a lot. I mean,
it may have its own classifications as a cryptid, but
like goat man, when you start really delving into it,
that those categories are based on very few reports, and
you know, it's not as prevalent as say Bigfoot. You know,
I could do one of these on Bigfoot alone. I
could do five volumes, no problem, you know, because you
could just more than you can. There's just more encounters.
But these and then they're fun to research and to
kind of get my mind around, because again, if something
I've heard of over the years but never really spend
any time or how to you know, had a reason
to kind of look into it. Now, I'm sort of like,
you know, I know about deble monkeys, and I can
you know, somebody asked me about that, Now I can
you know, impart what I know about it.
Speaker 1: It could spit a little truth at them, right, but
their own experience. So these other you know, goat man
and you know that sort of stuff that like, I
don't think goat men are a thing, but they do
pop up every once in a while, but they pop
up with such infrequency that I just can't imagine that
there is a physical reality behind them. So there must
be something else. And I kind of put dog man
in the same category. I don't think it's a physical thing,
but I know a couple of good witnesses and I
don't think they're lying. So what do you think is
behind this? Is this some sort of like arc type
sort of thing, or some sort of psychological phenomenon or
something truly paranormal, or what are your thoughts on these
extraordinarily rare cryptids that just the data isn't there for
you know, like like in a sasquatch situation, and where
there's tons of data, it's probably a real animal. These
other ones, who knows, what do you think is going on?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 5: I think, you know, in the case of these other
ones they say goat man, I think it's a combination
of several things.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 5: Again, you have witnesses that I've I believe they saw
something that you know there they categorized as a goat
man for lack of any other thing to describe it as.
And so I think, you know, it can be a
combination of misidentification. I mean, certainly a lot of these
things are in you know, the dark woods, or it
happened briefly and they believe they saw horns. It was
some kind of upright hairy looking thing. They believed believed
it had horns, like in lake Worth close to where
I live, and I had, you know, did my book
on the Lakeworth Monster that we discussed. You know, the
first witness is the first witness who basically had a
fight with it, described it as a goat man. He
said he thinks it had horns, it had thinks it
had hoofs. And then you had all these subsequent witnesses
who saw something that they felt was unusual, but they
described it as it. Yes, it had white colored fur,
but it looked more like a bigfoot. So you're like, well,
did the first guy, you know, because of the panic situation,
did he see things that maybe he felt were there
but weren't there, and maybe it was just simply a
white sasquatch. And that's kind of the argument I pretty
much make in my Lakeworth Monster book. But you know,
at the end of the day, it's propagated on the internet.
This is a goat man encounter and that's what the
witness believed he saw.
Speaker 3: So well, what was the time that was in those
sightings of the goat man than the white thing?
Speaker 5: Very not much time at all. So that was he
had the encounter on July tenth, nineteen sixty nine, and
there was some There was a sighting the very next day,
and then for about several months there was a lot
of sightings and then it kind of got fewer and fewer,
But the next couple of years you still had encounters.
So they were all kind of right there in the
late in nineteen sixty nine and through the fall, in
which people describe seeing pretty much a white looking ape.
So it was all in one time period.
Speaker 3: Yeah, what doesn't make sense to me?
Speaker 4: Is that because the one that the one that was
like throwing the tire down there and all that when
there was the big foot that when people are saying
it was like a big foot that that, I mean
that thing was seven foot tall and was capable of
throwing a tire like where no human could, like you know,
like super strong, and like there's no way if a
seven foot big foot dropped out of a tree on
top of a car.
Speaker 3: Roof, I mean, you'd see some real damage.
Speaker 4: And then I don't see any dude like knocking it
down like a foot big foot and like you know,
able to you know, get it off the you know,
his wife's door and then you know, get back into
the car.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: It's just it doesn't some like it could be a
big foot to me or how to be like not
the same one that the you know, like they're you know,
the same time frame. It's just like to be like
maybe an offspring, like a young, smaller white big foot.
I don't know, It's it's just I never I just
could never see that part about anyone be able to
take the advantage on on something like that. You know,
these humans are just two I mean because you take
a one hundred and fifty pounds chimpanzee and some guys
try to tackle like that would just rip the guy's
arm off.
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, no doubt.
Speaker 5: I mean it's that's why I think that it's sort
of a combination of things. Like you know that the
tire throwing, there's there's pretty much that's believed to be
probably somebody rolling the tire down the hill and it
just took a lucky hop, you know, and that may
not be actually connected because people just went crazy when
those sightings got in the paper. And so now you
got all these people down there, now it's hard to
discern between what was a sighting, what was people messing
around And yeah, with the guy getting attacked, now while
he steadfastly said I was I had, you know, confronted
this thing and it was trying to get inside the
car to get my wife, I mean, it's this is
is adrenaline's pumping. He's in the moonlit woods out there.
His description, you know, could be somewhat inaccurate. It could
have been smaller than what he thought it was, because yeah,
if you're going to confront something that's the size of
a bigfoot and you're going to get nowhere, it'll.
Speaker 3: Just crush you.
Speaker 5: And you know, if you think about if you if
you ran into just a gorilla in the woods, I
mean that thing had just throw you, you know, across
one hundred yards and take you down, and there's nothing
you can do about it if that's what it wants
to do. So you know, I I I think when
it comes to these other cryptids, I find that these
people are witnesses who believed what they saw and they
described it in the best way they could. But it
doesn't lead me to just say, Okay, definitely there's there's
goat men running amok, same thing with a Maryland goat man.
There's all those stories, you know, but if you get
up there and you start looking into the actual reports,
there's not that many where the people said it was
I saw a goat man. It was always like we
heard the sound, are we this and that? And you
know that gets sort of thrown into the data. But
those are not very well documented encounters and don't describe.
What I would say, is I need I want you
to you should see this thing, not just surmise that
you heard a stick crack in the woods and well
I'm in goat man area, it must be the goat man.
So yeah, it just boils it down to just a
few encounters in which people actually describe these things, and
that's not very much to go on. But you know, again, nonetheless,
they're unusual things that people experienced that we don't have
a real good explanation. So I mean, I'm I'm one
that you know, I like to keep my mind open.
I can't prove these things anymore than the next person,
So I don't know if they're paranormal or what we
would call paranormal, or just simply experiences that people were
under duress and described things that were you know, could
could be explained possibly, but under the circumstances, this is
the way they interpreted it. So they saw what they saw,
and I don't claim to know all the answers. I
just present them as you know, here's the facts behind
this encounter.
Speaker 1: Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo.
Will be right back after these messages. Have you been
going to the woods at all lately?
Speaker 3: Somewhat?
Speaker 5: I've been up to Fouc more often than other places lately,
so and that tends to be my main home base
regardless of what else I do, because there's been some
pretty good sightings in the last couple of years. So
I've kind of just kept on that, and the more
my scope has become, the more I'm like, you know,
I'm overwhelmed with options and places to go, and I'm like,
you know what, Buggy Creek has always seems to be
the place where this mystery could certainly exist, and that's
within my you know, it's only three and a half hours.
So I've been going up there as frequently as I
possibly can and just continued to I don't know, enjoy
enjoy the swamps, but as well keep my eyes open
and get out there with game cameras and other things
to where I can possibly you know, document some evidence.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think last time you were on you were telling
us about the sighting you personally had in that area.
Has there been any follow up on either your situation
that you encountered there or other people seeing perhaps even
the same animal in the same general area.
Speaker 5: Right, Yeah, you know, and that's another reason obviously I've
been back up there. I did go back up there
and took a couple of guys with me and we
went back to the site, and I was able to
kind of re envision and reconstruct that so I could
get some better estimates of the distance and things, you know,
kind of the old finding Bigfoot where Bobo would stand
in for the Sasquatch and we you know, kind of
I was like, yeah, that's about where it was, and
I got a better idea of you know, how tall
it could have been and how how far away. And
actually on my YouTube channel, I actually.
Speaker 3: Show all that I went up.
Speaker 5: I filmed it as I did it and sort of
gave everybody the story and literally show the exact spot
where it happened. So I've done that, and of course
we didn't see anything while we were out there in
that area, as it usually goes. But there hasn't been
really any sightings or any sighting reports that I've come
across in that very area since, or any ones that
I would consider Okay, they you know, they were there
and they saw the exact same thing. Though there's been
a few other sidings, but they've kind of been further
away down I guess more south on the Bayou, you know.
But the way it goes with that usually it's kind
of nothing, nothing, nothing, and then all of a sudden
you'll get two or three really good reports, and oftentimes
from one specific area to suggest that one of these
things was, you know, spending a little time in a
specific area.
Speaker 1: So when you'd go to the woods, what is your
mo like, what do you actually do out there? Because
everybody has their own style of based on what they
enjoy doing. If you go to the woods, say you
have a weekend or something like that, what do you do, like,
what's your research technique for lack of better term, Well.
Speaker 5: For me, I'm kind of less of a gadget person
than I am, just kind of old school boots on
the ground observation, So though I do you know, I'll
usually put a game camera in a strategic location once
I get to the area, and we try to camp
at least as much off the grid as possible. And
there are places in fout that I'm able to go
that you know, are not public campgrounds and so forth,
and so you know, we get there and we will
set up camp, put the tents out, and then usually
go put up a few game cameras, and then I
like to do a lot of hiking back as far
as I can, and I'll do it. I'll go along
the cree and places where there's a lot of muddy
area and just look for tracks, you know, as far
back in there as we can possibly go, which is
unfortunately that's become harder over the years because there's more
and more feral hogs that just tear everything up. And
I've seen that where it's like, oh my god, there
could you know, this thing could have walked to here
with the best you know, trackway ever and it would
just be destroyed later that night by these these hogs.
But nonetheless, we do a lot of hiking back in
there and usually try to go deep into areas where
either we haven't gone before or the areas where we
feel like most people are not going, and just kind
of observe. And then a lot of times at night
we will put some audio recorders out and listen, because
you will get unexplained howls, and you'll get wood knocks
and things like that, of course, and you know, of
course you get those on tape, and you know, I
don't know if they know what they prove other than
to yourself. Is like, if you're confident that you're listening
to one of these creatures, then you're like, Okay, we're
in the right area.
Speaker 3: So do you have red wolves there?
Speaker 5: No, there's not really any wolves. There's cougars, you know,
mountain lions, and there's been a couple of bear reports
and sightings, and actually I see what I believe it.
So the last time I was there, I was hearing something.
I swear it was a bear making kind of a
distinctive vocalization, and that was odd because I've never heard
that up there, but not completely out of the ram
of possibility, because there literally have been bear sightings. I've
never seen a bear track up there, though, And I've
asked a lot of hunters how many times have you
come across a bear track? And a few of them
will say, you know, twenty years ago I saw one.
But there's a little more population of black bears coming
into East Texas and Louisiana in southern Arkansas, so they're
out there. So you know, we just spend a lot
of time just going in the woods and if we
a lot of times, if we have a boat, which
is either a canoe or just a swamp boat, we'll
take those deep back in there in the Bayous, like
total old school legend of Boggie Creek and we'll get
out and you know, look for tracks on those banks
and sometimes just go down there and sit at night
and just kind of listen to the sounds. And then
we've gotten some go pros on the like on the dash,
so when we drive back and forth through there, A
lot of times we'd drive at night. You know, Hey,
you never know something's going to run across.
Speaker 3: So that's kind of what we do.
Speaker 5: And just even if, you know, even if nothing happens,
it's always enjoyable because you're out there and you know,
the home of the legend of Boggie Creek, and it's
just that beautiful countryside and spooky swamps and I just
I feel right at home there.
Speaker 1: So what's coming up for you? A lyhile? I mean
between I know you have a new book coming out.
It's gonna I guess volume two of Terrifying Encounters. I
know you're on at least a couple appearances because I'm
doing something with you, I think in Florida in June
here coming up and Google Town. Your band, of course
is probably playing like anything that our listeners might want
to attend or check out.
Speaker 5: Yeah, So a lot of it's been a busy year already,
so yeah, I'm hoping Terrifying Encounters Too will come out
around first of July. It's actually already written, so I'm
just kind of got to go through the editing process
and production trying to get those out as frequently as
I possibly can, because they're obviously they're smaller books, and
you know, you take five months to write it, and
some guy says, hey, it was really great, I read
it one day.
Speaker 3: Get it Okay, I'll hurry up.
Speaker 5: But yeah, we got the fount Monster Festival coming up
April twenty fourth and twenty fifth, which you know, obviously
that's one of my favorite festivals. And I've got some
other appearances coming up in Kentucky, and I'll be at
the Great Florida Bigfoot Conference. You know, there's a couple
of a couple of encounters that I'm going to follow
up on in my journeys where I'm going to veer
off and investigate some areas and talk to witnesses that
I've kind of got on the list there as as possible.
And then Ghule Town is actually in the studio right
now recording a new album, so I have to balance
the day job or the night job, because you know,
it's a band, so one or the other. But we're
working on a new album and talking to a kind
of a pretty big label that's kind of become interested
in putting out our stuff. So who knows, but I
just I keep doing it all. It's it's always fun.
And I'm just really happy that people responded so well
to the to the retro Terrifying Encounters book that that
really fires me up because I really do want to
make like a whole collection of these and so, yeah,
lots of cool stuff.
Speaker 1: To work on. Well, your book just ticks so many
boxes for us, you know, especially people like my age
or you know, because it has that nostalgia thing built
into it. It reads like you're watching in search of
the story. You know. I'm not a story guy, but
you're such a good writer that you wrote me in.
When I start reading this and I can hear your
voice reading it to me like a bedtime story from
Lyle Blackburn, I just love the thing. I just absolutely
love it, and I think it's going to be a
huge hit. So Lyle, thank you so much for popping
by and hanging out with us for this hour. I
really really appreciate it.
Speaker 3: You are.
Speaker 1: I think you have the most appearances on Bigfoot and
beyond of all the guests, I think, what's a bit
Matt prot to ver fact check me on that one.
And what if anybody is interested in what Lyle's up to,
of course you can go to Lyle Blackburn dot com
and check out everything from Gooldtown to new books, to
appearances to everything else this guy's into. He's all over
the place. So Lyyle, thank you very much.
Speaker 3: For coming on.
Speaker 1: Man, I appreciate you.
Speaker 5: I'm quite honored to you know, have appeared on the
show this many times, so you know, you guys were
there when I first started doing this stuff, and I've
been influential, and it's just just an honor, and you know,
just to be continue our friendship and explore these fun
topics together.
Speaker 4: I just love that stuff, all right, Well cool, Lyle, Yeah, man,
it's honor for us to have you on. There's a
reason you're our most returned guests and everyone knows why.
And you're also are one of our top favorite cryptian writers.
So yeah, thanks so much for coming on. And I
know your book's going to be a success. I really
enjoyed it yeah, and we'll be talking to you soon
and Volume twer comes out.
Speaker 3: Sounds awesome, all right?
Speaker 4: Okay, folks, thanks for joining us on big Footing Beyond
with Clipping Bobo and our guest Lyle Blackburn. And until
next week, y'all keep it squatchy.
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Bigfoot End Beyond.
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