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Speaker 1: He was addressing issues of who was superior in the

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church Jews Gentiles, who was grafted in, who was grafted out,

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and after discussing the relationship between the two and basically

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saying that either of you can be grafted in or

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grafted out based on your faith. There's only one tree,

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there's only one sheepfold, only one branch, only one vine,

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and that is the covenant the Church. There's not two covenants.

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There's not separate covenants. All the covenants are one in

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the person of Christ. And they come to their telos

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at the First Advent, that is the inauguration of the

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end of the age. The last days began the First Advent.

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As the New Testament says over and over and over again,

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there is a end of the world, a resurrection, and

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so forth. But that is not the Kingdom. The kingdom

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is identified as the Church, the New Testament Church. The

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New Testament Church is not anybody who just believes. It

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is a historic institutional reality that was set up in

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the first century. It has a historical lineage based on

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the type of lineage that the Israelites had in the

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Old Testament. If you read numbers, for example, numbers twelve

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or numbers eleven. We'll see this in a minute. There's

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a succession and laying on of hands. That laying on

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of hands with the promised blessing that you see in Genesis,

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that you see with the Moses and the elders. That's

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a type of the way that the New Israel would

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be set up instructed, where Jesus breathes on the apostles,

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commissions them at Pentecost, and then they lay hands on

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their successors, as we see from Timothy's from Paul's letters

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to Timothy, that passes on. Paul says, the gift to

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the Holy Spirit, which is that succession, which is that episcopacy,

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which is that priesthood after the Order of Melchis. Today

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doesn't mean that every person in the church isn't also

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a kind of priest, but there is a ministerial priesthood

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that mirrors the three tier priesthood of the Old Testament,

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the high priest, the priest, and the levite corresponding to

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Christ and the church or corresponding to bishop, priest deacon

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in the historic Church. And you'll notice that when Paul

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talks about the Covenant promises, he says, receive one another

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whether you're due or gentile. He's saying, receive you both

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as Christ received us. Jesus has become a servant to

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the circumcision, that is, to the Jews for the truth

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of God. To confirm the covenant promise is made to

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the fathers, all of those old covenant promises, the Fathers

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and the Mosaic Covenant and the Ibramic Covenant. And we

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know it's a brainment, especially because of circumcision, because Christ

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was circumcised. When Jesus was circumcised in the Book of Luke,

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that fulfills circumcision. Thus it is said, when he confirms

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these promises, they're all confirmed. So there's not dual promises,

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separate promises to gentiles, separate promises to some atheist socialist

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nation state from nineteen forty eight. No, no, no, there's only

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one covenant fulfilled in the one prophet, priest king of Israel,

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who is the person of Christ. Thus, Paul says, the

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gentiles would also glorify God. I will confess your name

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amongst the gentiles and sing to your name. Rejoice, So

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gentiles with his people. This is not an aschaeological reality.

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Paul is saying in the Roman Church. In the Church

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at Rome, Gentiles and Jews together worshiping the One Father

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through the Son Christ in the Spirit. So you understand

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that Romans fifteen is showing you clear as day that

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his people is the Church, who does the root of

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Jesse rule over the Gentiles, where in his kingdom the Church.

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Paul is interpreting the passage in Isaiah to be a

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present reality. This refutes all of you evangelical dispensational heretics,

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because you put that at the end of the world

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and you don't believe that Christ is the king of

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the New Testament, Israel the Church. There is no separate

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Israel that He's also king of. That's why Peter says

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the first Peter two, the whold I lay in Zion

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a chief, cornerstone, elect and precious. He says, you are

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the living stones. You are the Holy Priesthood. The gentile

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believers are the Holy priests. The gentile believers are Zion.

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The gentile believers are the chosen people, the Holy Nation.

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That's Israel. Israel alone has the priesthood. Now it is

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the Gentiles that have the priesthood and the Jews that believe,

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clear as day, there is no other Israel. That's the

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only one. Paul says in Galatians six sixteen. As many

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as you of you walk according to my rule, Peace

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and mercy be upon them some about what He's taught

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in the letter to the Galatians, and upon the Israel

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of God. Who's the Israel of God? The church? How

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do I know that? Well, if I go to Galatians three.

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The promise of Abraham is to those who are in Christ.

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There's no promise to Abraham. That's a separate fulfillment at

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the end of history in a thousand year kingdom in Palestine,

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or in Tel Aviv or Jerusalem or wherever. Right there.

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It's telling you that everybody in Galatia, in the Church

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of Galatian in the first century, that has faith and

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is baptized, you are Abraham's seed. That's the only seed

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that matters, the divine seed of divine sonship through baptism.

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And I want anybody who disagrees, I want you to

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call in. I see a lot of people that are

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new Joel. I want you to call in if you

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disagree Celestial no, that's orthodox, justin. Anybody who disagrees that

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none of them will actually come and argue their points.

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So it's so bizarre. Carson, call in if you disagree.

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We got a lot of people in here. Mixon, call

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in now, By a Cow, you talked a bunch of smack.

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Are you going to call in? I'm and invite you

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to speak. I want you to explain how I'm wrong

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in interpreting these passages, because when I go to Galatians four,

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Paul is even more forceful than three. Paul says that

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the Israel on earth is actually like Hagar. The heavenly

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Jerusalem is the Church which is the real mother of

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those who believe in our Abraham seat. This is the

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same heavenly city of Hebrews eleven, which includes all the

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Old Testament saints like Moses and Isaiah, as well as

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post Crucifixion resurrection saints like Paul, the Apostles, and all

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the Orthodox Church fathers. There's only one city, only one covenant.

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They're all in Christ, as we just saw in Romans fifteen.

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So how am I wrong in this? By a Cow?

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Speaker 2: I actually agree with you that the church is Israel.

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My only issue was that it's not the Catholic Church.

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Speaker 1: It's the Orthodox Catholic Church. There is no other church.

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Speaker 2: No, there is no church period. There's the body of Christ.

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Speaker 1: Was my point. How could there be no church when

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the ecclasia is the body of Christ according to Paul?

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Speaker 2: Right, but what does ecclasia mean?

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Speaker 1: That means a gathering?

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Speaker 2: Well, doesn't mean a building or an institution or a

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corporal body.

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Speaker 1: Well, Paul talks about one body of people at Corinth

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and an Ephicis. Does he not does he not write

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letters to churches at cities?

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, one hundred percent? I agree with you.

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Speaker 1: Okay, how are they not an institution?

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Speaker 3: Well, considering they gave everything away and you know it

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was more of a community.

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Speaker 1: Where is your evidence that Corinth and Ephesis gave everything away?

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Speaker 2: Well, if you read an Axe, what it talks about Corinth.

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Speaker 1: And Ephesis, that's not what happens in Corinth and Ephesis.

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You're talking about a different situation and acts. Where is

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your evidence that at Corinth and Ephesis Paul told them

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to do that? I never said that, Okay, So there

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is no So there is no evidence. So you're just

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you're just asserting that. No, you're just a jackass, Okay,

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I say, no arguments and just dumb heresies. So no

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idea about church history, no idea what you're talking about,

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can't actually debate, and he runs away glad. What's up?

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This is what we get with these evangelicals is just

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the most extreme arrogance that is equivalent to what we

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get with the Muslims. They're actually of the same I'm

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now convinced they're of the same spirit. They're all essentially Judaizers.

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The Muslims are because the yep less relious waste of

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my time. Who's next, It's open for him. We're going

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to talk about the actual passagesm Now we get this

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other sort of weird line of argumentation that Jesus didn't

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establish a church, he didn't establish an institution. Well, first

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of all, he called a college of apostles. Surely, he says,

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you will sit on twelve thrones judging the twelve tribes

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of Israel, which is the church. And we know that

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because in the Book of Revelation the Church has on

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its foundation stone the names of the twelve apostles. According

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to Galatians four, that heavenly Jerusalem is the Church. It

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is not a only future reality. According to these goofballs

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and goobers that postpone everything to the end the world.

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It's a present reality. Hagar represents Mount Sinai and corresponds

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to earthly Jerusalem, which now is that religion is in bondage.

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It's a false religion. It's a dead religion. And we

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are of the heavenly Jerusalem, which is the Mother of us.

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All that is the Church, a present reality. Exactly what

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he had said in chapter three. How do I join

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this present reality? Baptism, faith in Christ. That's how that

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makes you Abraham seed. There is no other seed. That's

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why Paul says in Galatians three, the genetic lineage doesn't

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save you. All it does is give you a first offer,

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privileged position to hear the message first. As John the

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Baptist says, God can raise up children to Abraham from

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rocks and stones. He doesn't need the Jews in the Pharisees. Now,

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there's so many passages in the New Testament that make

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this abundantly clear that I want to again go to

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the parable of the Wicked vine Dressers, which is about

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the contemporary Jewish leaders of Jesus day, the Pharisees, and

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that they rejected the son right, they rejected the one

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who surely they will hear my son, and they say

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he is the heir. Let's kill him. Jesus predicting his

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own murder by the rabbinic authorities, and he asked them

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when the vine when the vineyard owner returns, what will

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he do? These people, well, they said he will destroy him,

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and they perceive that he was speaking of them. The

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Jesus says, have you not read the scripture? Is the

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stone that the builders reject. It is the cornerstone. Therefore,

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the Kingdom of God will be taken from you Jews

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and given to a nation the Gentiles spoken under the

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title of nation producing the fruits thereof all the heretics

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who think that there's still some separate nation state of Israel,

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that is somehow part of all of the covenantal promises.

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All Romans eleven tells you is that they can still

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come into the one tree they have to be grafted in.

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There's not two trees, there's only one tree. That fact

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right there refutes all of these evangelical liars and heretics

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who go to Romans eleven to try to prove that

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there's a dual covenant going on. No, there's not. The Jews,

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he says, because of unbelief are cast away. How do

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you get a dual covenant out of cast away? It's insane.

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The only way is that they can be grafted back in,

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and if they believe, and if they repent, they can

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be grafted back in. And Paul predicts a future conversion.

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I believe of the Jews at some point, but there's

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nothing at all about some separate promise. In fact, he

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says their enemies of the Gospel in verse twenty eight.

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Are they still the Jews? Correct, they are, but they

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have forsaken their calling. They are enemies of the Gospel,

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and so until they repent, they cannot be saved. But

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Paul's arguing they can still be saved. God still loves

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all people, and especially he still loves Jews. Sure they

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can be saved, but not in some dual covenant, separate pathway,

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or separate covenant. It's just completely non existence, can totally

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made up. As we just saw. Remember remember how powerful

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Romans fifteen is in this argumentation. Jesus came to fulfill

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the promises to the Jews and to the gentiles. What

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do we mean to the gentiles? All throughout the Old Testament,

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we've done podcasts on this. There's dozens and dozens of

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passages in the Psalms, in Isaiah and the minor Prophets

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that predicts that the Gentiles will come into the covenant,

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into the kingdom and worship the God of Israel. Well,

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guess what that's been happening for two thousand years. That's

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the fulfillment of this and those passages. Paul is not

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saying this is an end times reality. It's a present reality.

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And only the most abtuse of just idiotic people would

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act like, no, this is the end of the world.

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That's when that happens. He says, Jesus came, he has become,

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not he will at the end of the world. He

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is the fulfillment of the promises made to the fathers.

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That's Noah. Actually, Adam is a covenant too, a damnic covenant,

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noeic covenant, mosaic, dividic. All come to their telos, their telos,

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their purpose in the First Advent, in the establishment of

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the Kingdom. That's why Jesus, throughout the Gospels, which I

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guess these people are just ignorant of, constantly refers to

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the Kingdom as a present reality. In Luke, he says,

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the Kingdom of God doesn't come with signs and omens.

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It will at the end of the world and it's

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fullest sense. But he says, the King of God is

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within you. It's the presence of the Holy Spirit in

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your heart. Through Baltism. The King of God is the

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presence of love, joy, peace, patience, kind of senterless and

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thoughtult of self control, the fruits of this. That's the

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presence of the Kingdom of God. And that exists in

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the life of the Church that Jesus set up, which

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is a historical reality. It's not this amorphous, invisible thing

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that makes you a gnostic. It's an actual, historical body,

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just as real and just as physical as His body.

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That's why in First Corinthians, Paul says, you are the

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body of Christ. In corinth you are his eyes, his arms,

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his legs, et cetera, because you are that baptized physical embodiment.

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Protestants and Evangelicals are gnostics because they have a Nestorian church.

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There is a bunch of sects, and then there is

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that invisible group that's the real church. There's one visible

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body of people. At for example, corinth Paul doesn't have

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a thousand different sects at Corinth that are all the church.

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But he's only writing his legs to the invisible Christians.

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There are these secret church. No, there's one church at Ephesus,

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the one that he told Timothy to be the bishop

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of because he laid hands on Timothy and said, you

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have authority in Ephesus because I laid hands on you.

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Therefore you don't lay hands on anybody else hastily. Because

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there's the transferring of the gift to the Holy Spirit.

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That's not charismatic Protestant gibberish and rolling around embarking and

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acting like a retard. That's apostolic succession. That's exactly what

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happens in the Book of Numbers when Moses passes on

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the Holy Spirit. Gather to me, to the seventy elders,

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consecrate yourselves to the Lord, and Moses lays hands on them,

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and the spirit is upon them. Upon the elders, the

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Holy Spirit. It's not Moses' spirit, you see the typology

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of moses Dolic succession. What Moses is doing is a

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type a pattern of what will happen when the true

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Moses comes Christ, who institutes his church, and then the

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apostles do exactly what Moses does.

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Speaker 3: Here, Timothy has his hands laid on him by Paul.

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Paul established Timothy to be in charge at Ephesus. I

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charge you, Timothy, to wage this warfare.

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Speaker 1: He says. There's people who have already taught that the

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resurrection has happened at Ephesus, named Hymeneus and Alexander. They

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are satanic blasphemers. They did not get the charge from Paul.

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Paul did not lay his hands on Hymoneus and Alexander.

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They are heretics. They are called out as heretics. And

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he tells Timothy to boyd those two heretics because I

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charged you, He says, I laid hands on you, and

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the gift of the Holy Spirit was given to you.

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In the Protestant view, there is no such thing as

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apostolic succession. There is a succession of ideas. That's their

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succession of the supposed Gospel, which was of course lost

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immediately after the death of the apostles, because the church

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fell into having an episcopacy and having the Eucharist, having

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Baptist regeneration, having liturgy, all of these things that ignorant

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and foolish Protestants don't even realize is what the apostles

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themselves set up. Mendo, what's up, Mando? What's up? I mean,

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hey day, thanks for hosting man this.

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Speaker 4: I don't know if you're taking general questions about the topic,

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and I don't have like a debate to offer, but

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I was just wondering.

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Speaker 1: I was wondering, Uh, if the.

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Speaker 4: Early Church bothers, if they saw that, you know, the

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destruction of the Temple and the diaspora of the Jews

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to almost corroborate, or did they comment on that in.

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Speaker 1: Like of course, yes, most of the Eastern Fathers are

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partial preteros absolutely. John christostem and his homilies on Matthew

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twenty four, Saint Anthonasius when he talks about Daniel nine,

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that's fulfilled at the first avant and the destruction of

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the Temple. It's so obvious too when you read Daniel nine.

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Where do these idiot evangelicals split the split this week

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in this giant time frame, and it's all the Prince

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there is actually the anti Christ. No, it's Messiah the Prince.

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He's called Messiah the Prince or the Prince in the

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Book of Ezekiel too. So why would we think that

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the Prince of Daniel nine. Oh, that's a separate Antichrist prince.

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It's the same prince that's anointed. Who's the anointed? I

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wonder what I wonder who the massa.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and even Jews think it's talking about the Messiah.

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Speaker 1: The Messiah will be cut off and the people of

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the prince who is to come will destroy the sanctuary

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that's talking about. It depends on whether you're reding the

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septuagen or whether reading the Mazaretic text this is masaatic,

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but here the Masoretic reads it like the Prince is Titus.

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But either way, if it's the Messiah, it's of course

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what Luke twenty one is saying that Jesus says, I

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will send the King, will send his armies and destroy

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the city talking about Jerusalem. So it doesn't really matter

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how you say prince. But the reason that evangelicals need

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prince to be the Antichrist there is because they have

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to split the final week of Daniel nine to the

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end of the world. But you'll notice the reason that

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it's the Messiah is that at the end of this

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abomination of desolation, what happens is that there's an end

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to sacrifice an offering. When Jesus destroyed the temple in

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seventy a d. He put an end to sacrifice an offering,

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and when he made reconciliation, he sealed up vision and prophecy.

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So after seventy eight D, that's the finality of big

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scale revelations. We don't need, I mean until the end

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of the world. But there's no new, ongoing revelations. It's

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another passage that tells us that we don't have ongoing

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new public revelations. So any cults that come along and

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teach new revelations Mohammad, Joseph Smith, Montanus Ellen White, they're

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de facto heretics because there are no new prophets. The

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role of a prophet ceased when the Gospel revelation was complete,

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and that was said by Jude and Jude three to

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be once for all committed to the Saints. Well, it

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was once for all committed, and the New Testant revelation

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is complete, and the last apostle died. There's no more

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oral or written word of God. It's complete. And yes,

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the apostles many times over referred to their oral teaching

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as the word of God. Which Protestants don't even know. Bird?

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What's that? Bird? Welcome everybody. We are trying to get

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the evangelical dispensations to come, but I don't think any

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of them will ever ever show up. What's up?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, just from the standpoint of that are understanding. Sometimes

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you see like news articles of an entire congregation converting

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to Orthodoxy. So I'm wondering, like it was, say an

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Anglican church, like the whole congregation wanted to become part

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of Yah.

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Speaker 2: They have.

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Speaker 1: I helped an entire Anglican church convert in twenty seventeen,

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So what.

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Speaker 2: Does what does that look like?

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Speaker 6: What does that entail?

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Speaker 1: How do you like, how do you cross that barrier? Why?

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I don't cross it. I mean they are received under

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one of the bishops, So it depends on which bishopric

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receives them. So what I don't understand what you mean?

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Speaker 5: Like, so obviously the liturgy changes like everything.

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Speaker 2: You know. You listen, you have a building with a

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bunch of.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean they're not immediate, They're not necessarily

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immediately going to make that person a priest. I mean

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they may, it depends on the situation. So it's a

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case by case basis, So there's not going to be.

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But I mean usually there's a you know, canonical times

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between how long you can be converted and then how

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long before you can become a deacon of a priest.

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You can't just typically that's not like overnight.

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Speaker 5: Because yeah, because you'd have to phase the whole community

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into a different you know, aspect and style of literagy,

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change the music, change the Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I mean it's not going to happen over the weekend. Yeah, okay,

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thanks ye Jeff, what's up, Jeff? What's on your mind? Jeff?

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Rather you have to unmute man. I'd also like to

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ask the evangelical dispensationless what are these passages talking about divorce,

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the divorce of Israel, right, because there's quite a few

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of these, I mean not tons, but at least a handful. Okay,

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what is the divorce in Jeremiah three? Here? What's up?

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H Browsey, it's up, Jake.

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Speaker 7: I don't even have anything to add. I just thought

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you would think this is funny. You know, you've been

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posting about how much you've you know, been trying to

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get somebody.

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Speaker 1: More dispensation listening to a debate and obviously.

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Speaker 7: I've been tagging you in dozens and maybe even a

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hundred over one hundred like separate posts, or like I'll

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retweet somebody's stuff and I'll tag you in it, or

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even just like type your name. So my page got

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flagged yesterday for spam because of how much I did it.

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Speaker 1: Like I thought, well, don't do that, don't get flagged,

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but you know I did, like all, so a.

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Speaker 7: Couple of days ago, I realized I've been like commenting

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on so much of James Lindsay stuff that I was like, yeah,

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I might this might be a problem.

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Speaker 1: And it was, like I.

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Speaker 7: Said, I couldn't post for like an hour yesterday while

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they did while they did a little review of my

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my page.

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Speaker 1: But I'm good now.

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Speaker 7: So yeah, that was pretty much it and like nobody, nobody,

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no matter how many times I did it, I replied

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or retweeted. Then that then that's just stuff. Maybe like

404
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a dozen times past the red block, I hit him

405
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James Lindsay over and over again. I could go on

406
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and on with the names, not a single one. And

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I know they saw it. I know for a fact

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they've seen it because they will reply to somebody else's

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stuff right after.

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Speaker 1: Me, Yeah, and I knew they weren't ever going to respond,

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So I.

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Speaker 2: Did have one more question. Do you remember that you

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remember that.

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Speaker 1: Polist that called in like two years ago? What the polist?

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Speaker 7: You know, people that actually like worshiped Paul that It

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was a guy he might have been trolling, but there

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was a guy that called in.

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Speaker 1: On a stream like two or three years ago. I

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don't remember.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, I had somebody, I had somebody asked me about

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that a few days ago, and I wanted to find

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that stream because you were after he got off, like

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you said.

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Speaker 1: Something about it. But I'm gonna really have to look.

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Speaker 7: You know, far back for that stream because that's the

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only person that you know, they ascribed to that I've

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ever even heard of. So yeah, all I appreciate you

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how to do it? Sure, yeah, good good riddance. Not

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to you, BROSI, but to the guy talking smack in

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the chat. Yeah, don't we don't need you, hear He's like,

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I am unsubscribing at this very Yeah, I don't care.

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Speaker 1: If you can't call in and defend your stupid positions,

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then you're welcome to leave. Dudomie twenty four talks about

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the relationship between a husband and a wife, and the

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bill of divorce that's given. And so God says, you know,

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if there's uncleanness, she's unfaithful, you hand her a bill

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of divorce, et cetera. And God's own relationship, as everybody knows,

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I think to Israel is characterized as a marriage. But

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Israel consistently throughout the Old Testament, as everybody knows who's

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familiar with it, was an unfaithful spouse. And by the

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time that Jeremiah, God says, I've had enough, I am

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going to divorce her. She has played the harlot. Therefore,

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I'm giving her a certificate of divorce, just like what

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he talked about and did Roe twenty four.

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Speaker 3: He says the same thing in Hoseiah. Now when was

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this and how does this happen? Well, but God's promises

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here forever he could ever divorcel close.

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Speaker 1: He said it was eternal. Yeah, So the way that

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that's reconciled is that flesh Israel is given a bill

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of divorce when the culmination of their sins come to

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its full fruition and the crucifixion of the Messiah, and

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thus they are divorced as Paul says they are the

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bond Woman's children. And Jesus can say Matthew twenty three,

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that all of the things written in the prophets, including

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the divorce of Israel, will come upon this generation, the

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generation that he sees and he's talking to, because of

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the culmination of their sins in crucifying the Messiah. Just

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like in Genesis when it talks about when Egypt's sins

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come to their full measure, such and such will happen.

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The same thing happens to spiritual sodom in Egypt, according

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to the Book of Revelation, which is Israel, the flesh Israel,

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their sins come to a culmination in the crucifixion of

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the Messiah. There Messiah, and so all the things written

464
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:22,200
in the prophets, including the promise of the bill of divorce.

465
00:31:24,319 --> 00:31:27,440
That's why the Book of Revelation is the pouring out

466
00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:33,480
of the Covenant sanctions, the penalties the Covenant penal sanctions

467
00:31:33,599 --> 00:31:38,440
upon Israel written in Deuteronomy and Leviticus for unfaithfulness to

468
00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:43,559
the Covenant. And this is the fulfillment of ultimate unfaithfulness. Thus,

469
00:31:43,839 --> 00:31:48,319
the Book of Revelation is God's bill of divorce to

470
00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:53,839
flesh Israel, and instead he's married the Church, the true Israel,

471
00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:57,279
those who love him and have the law written on

472
00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:02,599
their hearts, which was always how you were saved. Damien,

473
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:19,920
what's up, Damien? What's up? I'm mute, Damien, unmute.

474
00:32:20,079 --> 00:32:38,599
Speaker 8: If you want to talk, Daniel, I'm mute, Daniel.

475
00:32:39,319 --> 00:32:41,440
Speaker 1: Hey, what's up? Man? How you doing good?

476
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:42,039
Speaker 3: Uh?

477
00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:46,119
Speaker 9: First time listener. I've listened to the Sam Hi show before.

478
00:32:46,119 --> 00:32:46,799
Speaker 1: I love the guy.

479
00:32:46,839 --> 00:32:50,119
Speaker 9: I think the show is amazing. So I see your writer,

480
00:32:50,559 --> 00:32:55,240
so I popped in. Nice to meet you. Hey, yeah, man,

481
00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:57,680
I'm picking up what you're putting down.

482
00:32:57,720 --> 00:32:57,920
Speaker 10: Man.

483
00:32:58,079 --> 00:33:01,839
Speaker 9: I grew up in an evangelical church and have been

484
00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:05,559
sort of radicalized since I wouldn't say radicalize. Actually that's

485
00:33:05,559 --> 00:33:10,079
what they say I am. But I've totally changed my

486
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:13,559
views since October seventh, like probably millions and millions and

487
00:33:13,559 --> 00:33:16,960
millions of Americans. So I'm like a baby in the

488
00:33:17,039 --> 00:33:20,279
whole Israel thing. But I've learned a lot in a

489
00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:23,920
very short period of time. And there's once you notice

490
00:33:24,319 --> 00:33:31,640
things you can unnotice. It's impossible. So yeah, the we've

491
00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:41,039
been doing spaces lately entitled is Zionism Retardation or supremacy

492
00:33:41,400 --> 00:33:45,279
or racism or all three. And then we invite Zionists

493
00:33:45,400 --> 00:33:48,839
up on the stage and ask them to define Zionism

494
00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:52,640
and what it is to be a Jew. And what

495
00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:58,680
we're discovering is that they cannot define either or and

496
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:02,039
without surprise to see retardation or.

497
00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:04,000
Speaker 1: Racism.

498
00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:06,559
Speaker 9: And it's pretty incredible.

499
00:34:06,599 --> 00:34:06,799
Speaker 1: Man.

500
00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:09,440
Speaker 9: We give them an opportunity, and when you ask them

501
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:12,679
what is a Jew, nine times out of ten they

502
00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:16,920
define what a Jew is by the same word by

503
00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:20,360
saying someone who's born whose mother is a Jew, which

504
00:34:20,559 --> 00:34:24,719
is antithetical, like you cannot define a word with the

505
00:34:24,760 --> 00:34:25,320
same word.

506
00:34:25,599 --> 00:34:27,039
Speaker 1: It's a circular argument.

507
00:34:27,199 --> 00:34:32,519
Speaker 9: So basically we are going to be holding these spaces.

508
00:34:32,519 --> 00:34:33,599
Speaker 1: We'd love to have you one day.

509
00:34:33,639 --> 00:34:35,239
Speaker 9: That wasn't the purpose of me coming in, but I

510
00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:40,679
wanted to just say that Judeo Christian its actual meaning

511
00:34:41,039 --> 00:34:45,239
is a Jew who converts to Christianity. And it's been

512
00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:47,960
I'd love to know your thoughts on how it's been

513
00:34:49,119 --> 00:34:52,559
sort of captured by the Zionist movement since I would

514
00:34:52,599 --> 00:34:57,840
say eighteen early eighteen hundreds. Early the Mormons started this,

515
00:34:59,199 --> 00:35:02,039
they were like the old g triple Og Zionists. Before

516
00:35:02,039 --> 00:35:05,159
it was even a thing, and that's acurately. They're actually

517
00:35:05,199 --> 00:35:08,800
literal Jews. They believe they're descendants of the Twelve Tribes

518
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:08,920
of this.

519
00:35:09,079 --> 00:35:10,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, we've had a lot of Mormons come in debate.

520
00:35:11,239 --> 00:35:16,079
Speaker 9: Yeah great. So I just think that, like, uh, the Antichrist,

521
00:35:16,079 --> 00:35:18,840
in my opinion, is a spirit and it resides within

522
00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:25,280
the Church. It resides in religious ideologies, mainly mainly the

523
00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:28,559
one that if you are a Christian and you don't

524
00:35:28,559 --> 00:35:31,280
support the nation state of Israel, you will not be

525
00:35:31,360 --> 00:35:32,239
blessed by God.

526
00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:37,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, just to just to let you let you know, like, yeah,

527
00:35:37,159 --> 00:35:40,000
we did two podcasts this week on that on my channel.

528
00:35:40,079 --> 00:35:45,360
So we did a whole debunking of Christian Zionism a

529
00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:49,000
few days ago called Christian Zionism Dispensations and refuted from

530
00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:53,559
the Bible. And then we did another podcast, part two

531
00:35:53,920 --> 00:35:57,360
going into the history of it, and we talked about Schofield,

532
00:35:57,480 --> 00:36:04,800
Plymouth Brethren, rothschildst for that study Bible, Samuel Untermeyer in

533
00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:07,159
the US. So yeah, I'd be happy to come on

534
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:13,559
a space anytime. Just yeah, you could just tag me

535
00:36:13,639 --> 00:36:15,239
or message me anytime you want me to come up.

536
00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:18,960
But I appreciate that. Daniel, did you want to say

537
00:36:18,960 --> 00:36:21,079
something else. Come back. I thought you were done. Go ahead,

538
00:36:22,639 --> 00:36:28,840
we want to say something else, go ahead? Yeah, yeah,

539
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:29,159
I was.

540
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:32,639
Speaker 9: I appreciate that, man, and I was just wanted to

541
00:36:32,719 --> 00:36:36,320
ask you. Can I find those podcasts on your page.

542
00:36:35,960 --> 00:36:38,599
Speaker 1: Here on No No on my YouTube channel. So we

543
00:36:38,639 --> 00:36:42,360
livestream everything through YouTube. So if you go to jay

544
00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:45,639
di or YouTube, you'll see that past live streams. If

545
00:36:45,639 --> 00:36:49,719
you go back about five of them, the fourth and

546
00:36:49,760 --> 00:36:52,639
fifth one are the two podcasts that would be right

547
00:36:52,719 --> 00:36:57,039
up your alley. Great, thank you, yeah, thank you. Manuel.

548
00:36:57,960 --> 00:37:00,159
That's it's funny. I don't know how you got How

549
00:37:00,159 --> 00:37:02,199
do you guys get these people actually come? They won't

550
00:37:02,199 --> 00:37:04,440
actually come and debate with me, So like I'm trying

551
00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:05,880
to figure out how to get them to actually come

552
00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:08,639
in here, Like none of them will actually come. What's

553
00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:14,239
up man? We have one evangelical come in here. He's like,

554
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:21,559
you're at jagas, I'm madies, I'm mad a damien. If

555
00:37:21,599 --> 00:37:25,920
you want to call back in go ahead, Chris, what's

556
00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:31,199
up man? What's on your mind?

557
00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:33,000
Speaker 2: So?

558
00:37:33,159 --> 00:37:35,039
Speaker 6: What do we say to these people that believe that

559
00:37:35,159 --> 00:37:38,239
Jews are Israel When Jesus Christ, God in the flesh,

560
00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:41,400
says that they are of a different bloodline entirely, and

561
00:37:41,440 --> 00:37:43,159
that they're actually up their father through the devil.

562
00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:48,320
Speaker 1: Well, the are you a Christian identity person, because that's

563
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:55,119
an opposite, that's actually a that's a cabalistic heresy itself.

564
00:37:55,519 --> 00:37:59,840
So they're not a different bloodline, there is spiritual descendant

565
00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:03,320
of the devil. Wow.

566
00:38:03,599 --> 00:38:06,440
Speaker 6: So when people say that Jews or Israel, how do

567
00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:07,320
we refute.

568
00:38:06,960 --> 00:38:11,159
Speaker 1: That as Christians? That's literally the first thirty minutes of

569
00:38:11,159 --> 00:38:16,039
this podcast was going through all the texts that refute that. Okay,

570
00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:22,079
I mean fifteen huh, yeah, I just helped in here.

571
00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:24,519
That's all good. I mean, are sorry? Do you believe

572
00:38:24,519 --> 00:38:28,159
in the serpentcyed theory? No?

573
00:38:28,199 --> 00:38:30,719
Speaker 6: But I think it's interesting that the King James Bible

574
00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:34,039
says that I can't remember which book it is, but

575
00:38:34,159 --> 00:38:37,440
Jesus is literally telling them, you're not even remotely related.

576
00:38:37,159 --> 00:38:42,840
Speaker 1: To us to who use? What do you mean? The

577
00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:43,840
children of Israel?

578
00:38:44,000 --> 00:38:46,800
Speaker 6: To the modern Jews today are not even remotely related

579
00:38:46,840 --> 00:38:47,639
to the Jews.

580
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:50,199
Speaker 1: Of the Bible. Well, that's a different topic than the

581
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:52,639
Jews Jesus is talking to. So in Matthew twenty three,

582
00:38:52,719 --> 00:38:56,400
he says that the Scribes and the Pharisees are actual Jews.

583
00:38:56,440 --> 00:38:58,639
And John fourth to the Woman of the Well. He says,

584
00:38:58,960 --> 00:39:02,119
salvation is of the Jews. So he's not calling them

585
00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:07,199
all a different bloodline. That's a totally different topic from

586
00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:10,679
Jesus calling them and John, you know, eight and whatever,

587
00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:13,199
sons of the devil. It doesn't mean that their genetic

588
00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:14,280
lineage is of Satan.

589
00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:20,679
Speaker 6: Okay, So is it Paul who says that when the

590
00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:24,400
Jews of today say that we're Israel, Paul says.

591
00:39:24,119 --> 00:39:29,519
Speaker 1: That they are lying. Yeah, they're not the true Israel.

592
00:39:29,559 --> 00:39:32,760
We just we just cover Galatians three and four. Uh,

593
00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:36,920
you know, in Thessalonians, he says that they are enemies

594
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:40,559
of God, enemies the Gospel revelation says synagogue or Satan. Sure,

595
00:39:41,400 --> 00:39:42,760
but it's not talking about it. It's not talking about

596
00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:44,599
their genetics.

597
00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:49,000
Speaker 6: So like, what would you label the Jews of today

598
00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:50,360
that have the Israeli flag?

599
00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:53,639
Speaker 1: What would be the Orthodox Christian description of them? They

600
00:39:53,679 --> 00:39:56,280
are still Jews. And that's why all the Church fathers

601
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:59,000
after the first, second, third, fourth, fifth, sixth centuries, they

602
00:39:59,039 --> 00:40:02,119
never stopped calling the people Jews. They just say that

603
00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:04,679
their enemies of the Gospel and they're outside of the church.

604
00:40:06,679 --> 00:40:09,480
Speaker 2: Okay, thanks, sure.

605
00:40:09,960 --> 00:40:12,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's why Paul talks about in Romans eleven a

606
00:40:13,039 --> 00:40:15,840
future conversion of the Jews. But when how that will happen?

607
00:40:15,880 --> 00:40:19,119
We don't know, k bird, what's something. But it's not

608
00:40:19,199 --> 00:40:23,280
a separate covenant, and it's not a genetic problem like

609
00:40:23,559 --> 00:40:26,920
Jews are not the serpent seed or something like that.

610
00:40:27,039 --> 00:40:27,519
What's up?

611
00:40:30,480 --> 00:40:30,719
Speaker 2: No?

612
00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:33,559
Speaker 3: Are you there?

613
00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:36,639
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, I'm there.

614
00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:37,679
Speaker 1: What's on your mind?

615
00:40:39,519 --> 00:40:39,679
Speaker 7: Hi?

616
00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:46,119
Speaker 11: My question is Okay, I came from Romania and I

617
00:40:46,159 --> 00:40:46,679
grew up.

618
00:40:47,679 --> 00:40:50,000
Speaker 2: I was born in Romania.

619
00:40:49,559 --> 00:40:55,519
Speaker 11: And in a Christian family pentecost and I never judge

620
00:40:55,559 --> 00:41:04,079
about different other religion in day if they believe in God,

621
00:41:04,360 --> 00:41:06,440
Jesus as a son and the.

622
00:41:06,400 --> 00:41:07,679
Speaker 2: Holy Spirit, and.

623
00:41:09,199 --> 00:41:10,400
Speaker 1: We have a Romania.

624
00:41:10,559 --> 00:41:12,079
Speaker 2: Well, I live in US.

625
00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:16,679
Speaker 11: Now, but for four years already Romania it was a

626
00:41:16,719 --> 00:41:18,800
lot of prosecution with Christians.

627
00:41:18,800 --> 00:41:19,960
Speaker 2: It was the commonist.

628
00:41:21,280 --> 00:41:22,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, we know.

629
00:41:23,639 --> 00:41:30,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, so that's why I I was nineteen and I want.

630
00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:34,599
Speaker 11: To get out of there to to taste the freedom

631
00:41:34,760 --> 00:41:39,079
and America and all that. I never judge religion as

632
00:41:39,119 --> 00:41:40,519
long as the way I.

633
00:41:40,480 --> 00:41:45,719
Speaker 2: Said, what do you think about the pope? The symbol

634
00:41:45,760 --> 00:41:46,079
of the.

635
00:41:46,079 --> 00:41:50,480
Speaker 11: Pope and his job like he's on top two, like

636
00:41:50,719 --> 00:41:52,920
ruling the Catholics and all that.

637
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:56,440
Speaker 2: What do you think his placed in a Bible?

638
00:41:56,760 --> 00:42:01,199
Speaker 3: I think the pope is a street gooy, Bope is

639
00:42:01,320 --> 00:42:04,079
three boy, Jeff?

640
00:42:04,119 --> 00:42:04,599
Speaker 1: What's up?

641
00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:07,119
Speaker 2: Pope?

642
00:42:07,599 --> 00:42:14,079
Speaker 1: Count vampire? He So I lived next to uh.

643
00:42:16,079 --> 00:42:19,280
Speaker 2: Christian High School and this school.

644
00:42:20,480 --> 00:42:25,239
Speaker 12: Has basically banned Orthodox, Like a lot of teachers from

645
00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:28,000
there used to be Orthodox, or they became Orthodox and

646
00:42:28,039 --> 00:42:34,679
they started converting too many people to Orthodoxy where they

647
00:42:34,880 --> 00:42:38,039
changed their declaration of faith where.

648
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:41,639
Speaker 2: You can basically be a heretic. You can be.

649
00:42:43,280 --> 00:42:47,039
Speaker 12: Different beliefs, but you can't be Orthodox. But they teach

650
00:42:47,079 --> 00:42:50,559
classes like Judeo Christianity.

651
00:42:49,920 --> 00:42:51,679
Speaker 2: Uh, my neighbor is.

652
00:42:53,039 --> 00:42:54,840
Speaker 12: My neighbor is a teacher there and he has an

653
00:42:54,920 --> 00:42:56,079
Israeli flag.

654
00:42:55,760 --> 00:42:56,400
Speaker 1: Out in front.

655
00:42:57,519 --> 00:43:00,000
Speaker 12: Super pro Jewish, but yeah, they will. You can be

656
00:43:00,079 --> 00:43:01,199
a heretic and teach there.

657
00:43:01,239 --> 00:43:05,960
Speaker 1: You can ever Yeah, yeah, Well that's because they deep

658
00:43:06,039 --> 00:43:12,239
down ignorantly are persecuting and opposing the real thing. And

659
00:43:12,320 --> 00:43:15,440
that's really what today is about. I mean, I got

660
00:43:15,480 --> 00:43:20,960
on Twitter, and I rarely do this, but I did

661
00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:25,440
it the past few weeks because I've figured out that

662
00:43:25,920 --> 00:43:27,760
maybe that's how I can get these people to come

663
00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:31,199
and discuss, and I went to the dreaded for you.

664
00:43:31,920 --> 00:43:34,639
As you guys know, I have for years avoided the

665
00:43:34,719 --> 00:43:36,159
for you because it is just.

666
00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:40,159
Speaker 7: Who who I.

667
00:43:40,079 --> 00:43:42,760
Speaker 1: Mean, I'm full Rick Flair over here when it comes

668
00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:48,880
to just the idiocy, dude, it is just like only

669
00:43:48,960 --> 00:43:52,639
topped by TikTok. The only thing dumber than the idiocy

670
00:43:52,639 --> 00:43:55,639
of the for you is TikTok. TikTok is the total

671
00:43:55,679 --> 00:43:57,960
bottom of the barrel. It is the dumbest of the dumb.

672
00:43:58,840 --> 00:44:03,639
It is just chirping, barking dogs and monkeys on Twitter.

673
00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:09,440
I mean on X, I mean TikTok. Excuse me. You

674
00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:13,000
can't even hardly have a conversation. And the last time

675
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:15,360
I went on there, as you guys know, Agent and

676
00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:21,360
all his goblins got the stream pulled down. So that's

677
00:44:21,400 --> 00:44:23,559
what they'll do. If you go on TikTok and have

678
00:44:23,559 --> 00:44:28,360
a live stream, they will report your live stream. That's

679
00:44:28,400 --> 00:44:34,800
how That's how dishonest and pathetic the Oriental goblins are.

680
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:38,400
But that's all they have. They can't actually argue their case,

681
00:44:40,079 --> 00:44:44,760
and every time they put forward some loser, he gets

682
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:47,360
demolished and then three years later they waited for some

683
00:44:47,440 --> 00:44:49,519
other loser to pop up. So it was sever and

684
00:44:49,599 --> 00:44:52,920
Zelat four years ago. In four years it'll be some

685
00:44:53,000 --> 00:44:57,079
other Zelot. And they were so dishonest about my statement

686
00:44:57,119 --> 00:45:00,719
of Brown cult because they know that my point was

687
00:45:00,760 --> 00:45:03,960
to say that when you leave the Gospel, you become

688
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:08,920
an ethnic tribal cult. So they became the ethnic tribal cult,

689
00:45:08,960 --> 00:45:13,199
which is I'm criticizing their ethnophilitism, but they say I'm

690
00:45:13,239 --> 00:45:15,920
the racist. So they act just like all the social

691
00:45:16,039 --> 00:45:20,960
justice warriors, screaming that I'm racist for calling out them

692
00:45:21,039 --> 00:45:25,599
putting their tribe above the Orthodox faith, and that's exactly

693
00:45:25,599 --> 00:45:30,960
what they did. Nick con what's up anyway? So it's

694
00:45:31,039 --> 00:45:35,239
the same attitude and the same energy from all of

695
00:45:35,239 --> 00:45:40,840
these insane zio freaks across X. So if I go

696
00:45:40,920 --> 00:45:42,800
to X and if I click on the for you,

697
00:45:42,920 --> 00:45:46,960
where's this dreaded for you? Watch this? It's going to

698
00:45:47,039 --> 00:45:52,440
be nothing but just insanity. Watch this. Now, I know

699
00:45:52,519 --> 00:45:55,920
that the for you is intended to this awful, awful,

700
00:45:56,280 --> 00:46:01,320
worst of the worst Protestant profiles of chat, whom I've

701
00:46:01,320 --> 00:46:04,719
asked to debate like twenty times, and you just post

702
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:11,800
like the worst a AI slop images NonStop. I've tried

703
00:46:11,840 --> 00:46:16,760
to get this Lizzy girl to come chat. What's up man?

704
00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:24,199
What's on your mind? Nick On? This is a Mormon

705
00:46:24,239 --> 00:46:28,800
goofball who won't come debate. What's up? Nick On? I'm you, yo,

706
00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:29,239
what's up?

707
00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:29,519
Speaker 2: Jay?

708
00:46:30,719 --> 00:46:34,119
Speaker 1: I'm just looking at nothing but Ben Shapiro promotion in

709
00:46:34,159 --> 00:46:38,119
my feed everywhere. It's like Ben Shapiro, Candace Bad Tucker.

710
00:46:38,360 --> 00:46:43,519
In fact, Den Desuzo was going off today and he's like,

711
00:46:43,559 --> 00:46:47,880
I'm finally looking into the Trolie Kirk assassination. I'm like, oh,

712
00:46:47,960 --> 00:46:50,119
let me guess Tucker and Candace did it right, because

713
00:46:50,119 --> 00:46:52,360
we know where he's going with it. But what's on

714
00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:54,760
your mind? You know, it would be really.

715
00:46:54,559 --> 00:46:59,280
Speaker 13: Funny sketch sketch comedy idea, as if you were to go, well,

716
00:46:59,320 --> 00:47:01,920
there's a couple of here, so one somebody needs to

717
00:47:02,039 --> 00:47:06,599
troll the Benny Hinn style Protestant megachurches and go in

718
00:47:06,599 --> 00:47:09,760
there and pretend like they need some kind of healing

719
00:47:10,360 --> 00:47:13,480
and then just like freak out.

720
00:47:13,360 --> 00:47:16,400
Speaker 10: As as as soon as it gets slain in the spirit, just.

721
00:47:16,440 --> 00:47:20,519
Speaker 1: Do something really wild or sketch comedy idea.

722
00:47:22,480 --> 00:47:24,360
Speaker 2: You know you have like the TBN.

723
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:27,079
Speaker 10: Pat Robertson types who are like, somebody in this room

724
00:47:27,519 --> 00:47:28,079
is struggling.

725
00:47:28,239 --> 00:47:31,639
Speaker 1: Somebody's got gout. I can sense it. You've got a

726
00:47:31,679 --> 00:47:35,320
little bit of gout right around your toenails and right

727
00:47:35,360 --> 00:47:36,480
here on your throat.

728
00:47:36,679 --> 00:47:42,400
Speaker 10: Yeah yeah, But like I'm sensing in this room somebody

729
00:47:42,440 --> 00:47:46,400
who hasn't had a bowel movement in forty days, somebody

730
00:47:46,400 --> 00:47:49,639
who hasn't had a battle movement, and then just slain

731
00:47:49,679 --> 00:47:50,239
in the spirit.

732
00:47:50,360 --> 00:47:55,239
Speaker 1: Tons of diarrhea everywhere. I like it. By the way,

733
00:47:55,440 --> 00:47:58,400
look at this, this Mormon goofball actually trying to defend

734
00:47:58,559 --> 00:48:07,119
this laughable, made up thing from Joseph Smith. Yeah. So yeah,

735
00:48:07,159 --> 00:48:16,360
it's like all Zio freaks talking about evangelical nonsense. Well,

736
00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:18,480
there's a couple of atheists popped up in here. I

737
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:25,199
haven't seen any atheists in a while, So Mormons, and uh,

738
00:48:25,239 --> 00:48:27,480
that's all that's all the for you is. So maybe

739
00:48:27,480 --> 00:48:33,039
we'll get something to come in here. Oh, here we go. No, wait,

740
00:48:34,239 --> 00:48:49,920
I hate Zionism. What's up? I'm mute? All right, he's

741
00:48:49,920 --> 00:49:03,679
not gonna mute. C R. What's up? C R? What's up?

742
00:49:04,079 --> 00:49:10,559
I'm mute? Hey, Jay, how are you doing getting me? Yeah?

743
00:49:10,679 --> 00:49:14,559
Speaker 14: Okay, Yeah, sorry, first time, first time ever trying to

744
00:49:15,239 --> 00:49:17,119
get a question in and ad a couple of things.

745
00:49:17,159 --> 00:49:20,639
So I really respect everything you've been doing, and I

746
00:49:20,639 --> 00:49:24,000
really appreciate the information, and uh definitely looked over a

747
00:49:24,039 --> 00:49:27,239
lot of the the videos and stuff they'll put together.

748
00:49:27,239 --> 00:49:30,360
I haven't got to everything, but I've been debating with

749
00:49:31,679 --> 00:49:35,039
Protestants that I know, et cetera. I come from a

750
00:49:35,119 --> 00:49:38,760
very loose like hippie ish that southern California Protestant sort

751
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:40,960
of Methodist family. I mean, you're talking about that last week,

752
00:49:41,639 --> 00:49:43,920
and it's been very difficult for me to like find

753
00:49:43,920 --> 00:49:46,599
the right path. And I've been appreciative of the talks

754
00:49:46,599 --> 00:49:48,920
and orthodoxy and I've been coming to that on a

755
00:49:48,960 --> 00:49:51,599
couple of things. But one of the challenges I've had

756
00:49:51,639 --> 00:49:55,880
is the historicity and knowing the information, and uh, one

757
00:49:55,920 --> 00:49:57,280
of one of the things I haven't been able to

758
00:49:58,159 --> 00:50:02,719
fully get to grips with is what potential there is

759
00:50:02,760 --> 00:50:05,920
for corruption with the early Church versus say, like the

760
00:50:05,920 --> 00:50:06,920
Byzantine Empire and.

761
00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:07,480
Speaker 1: Things like that.

762
00:50:07,880 --> 00:50:09,360
Speaker 6: And so that was one of the things I'd gone.

763
00:50:09,239 --> 00:50:13,000
Speaker 14: Over your book listings already for things like theology and

764
00:50:13,360 --> 00:50:17,519
ecclesiarchy and things like this. But I'm curious if I

765
00:50:17,719 --> 00:50:22,559
missed a good recommendation on things like the Byzantine emperors

766
00:50:22,599 --> 00:50:25,320
and any corruption that potentially might have gone on with

767
00:50:25,360 --> 00:50:27,679
the church there that I could learn from maybe have

768
00:50:27,760 --> 00:50:29,239
a good recommendation.

769
00:50:31,199 --> 00:50:35,000
Speaker 1: I mean, there is the I don't know about a

770
00:50:35,000 --> 00:50:39,719
specific book on the corruption. I mean there's a book.

771
00:50:39,760 --> 00:50:43,920
There's a famous book on Byzantine intrigues in corruption by

772
00:50:45,199 --> 00:50:50,760
it's not what's the guy's name not, it's not proclus

773
00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:55,440
it's pro Copious. I think is that's like the famous

774
00:50:56,039 --> 00:51:01,360
book by the guy who didn't like Byzantium. But there

775
00:51:01,440 --> 00:51:04,480
is also and he was a guy who wrote against

776
00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:07,599
Saint Justinian and all that. But I mean there's also

777
00:51:08,880 --> 00:51:14,440
the three volume set by the Byzantine famous businessing historian

778
00:51:16,880 --> 00:51:21,280
Julian Gwen Blank. I had to get up early for church,

779
00:51:21,320 --> 00:51:25,800
so I'm like, oh, yeah, there's a good introduction book

780
00:51:25,920 --> 00:51:30,880
by Steven Runson and the historian, which I read a

781
00:51:30,880 --> 00:51:44,400
long time ago. But John Julian Norwich, uh his uh,

782
00:51:44,800 --> 00:51:49,599
there's a bridge version John Julius Norwich, excuse me. His

783
00:51:49,679 --> 00:51:53,519
abridge version is a readable history and it would talk

784
00:51:53,559 --> 00:51:57,599
about some of the corruption there, but more specifically in

785
00:51:57,679 --> 00:52:03,519
terms of ideological different is the Synicia Glue book Radical

786
00:52:03,559 --> 00:52:07,039
Platonism in Byzantium that would deal more with like the

787
00:52:07,039 --> 00:52:22,159
theological struggles in Byzantium Vrangian. What's up, Clue? Yeah, what's up? Man?

788
00:52:23,239 --> 00:52:25,400
Speaker 2: Hey, longtime listener.

789
00:52:26,480 --> 00:52:30,239
Speaker 15: I'm actually friends with Daniel who came up earlier, and

790
00:52:31,159 --> 00:52:33,960
I became an inquirer back in twenty sixteen, and I

791
00:52:34,000 --> 00:52:37,239
was recently baptized this year into the Greek Orthodox Church

792
00:52:37,280 --> 00:52:39,880
and just wanted to say before I go, you're you're

793
00:52:39,880 --> 00:52:40,639
a big part of that.

794
00:52:40,679 --> 00:52:41,840
Speaker 1: So thank you for everything you do.

795
00:52:43,719 --> 00:52:46,079
Speaker 15: But I guess my question when it pertains to like

796
00:52:46,119 --> 00:52:51,599
Protestantism and Tinian Desigonism, it just seems like even in

797
00:52:51,639 --> 00:52:55,320
the in the past few years, like these megachurches, you know,

798
00:52:55,400 --> 00:52:58,079
like the Kennis Copelands and the Franklin Jensens of the world,

799
00:52:58,559 --> 00:53:00,960
like they're finally kind of starting to exposed. And I

800
00:53:01,000 --> 00:53:02,840
know you've talked about like a lot of their ties

801
00:53:02,880 --> 00:53:07,760
to like the CIA and in government institutions, but even

802
00:53:07,800 --> 00:53:10,519
more so now it's just coming out not just that,

803
00:53:10,760 --> 00:53:13,840
but just how kind of money hungry and fraudulent a

804
00:53:13,840 --> 00:53:16,840
lot of these churches are. Yes, and my question is

805
00:53:17,440 --> 00:53:20,159
what's it going to take for like those parishioners and

806
00:53:20,239 --> 00:53:24,880
just Americans in general to finally like realize what's actually

807
00:53:24,920 --> 00:53:28,079
going on with those churches. Like it just blows my

808
00:53:28,159 --> 00:53:32,000
mind that they continue to function and grow and continue

809
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:34,079
to feed off of people like that. I just don't

810
00:53:34,159 --> 00:53:37,679
understand how they can't see what's going on. So I

811
00:53:37,800 --> 00:53:39,360
just kind of wanted to get your thoughts on that.

812
00:53:41,079 --> 00:53:45,159
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's a combination of things spiritual delusion

813
00:53:45,199 --> 00:53:50,119
and blindness. It's low IQ stupidity. Americans are very uneducated,

814
00:53:50,320 --> 00:53:53,199
very dumb. I mean, it's all of that. We're also

815
00:53:54,760 --> 00:53:57,800
slaves to our vices. I mean, there's a lot going on.

816
00:53:58,360 --> 00:54:01,599
But speaking of that, I forgot there's I think just

817
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:04,679
two megachurches busting the last couple of weeks for all

818
00:54:04,760 --> 00:54:06,440
kinds of insanity. Here's one look at this.

819
00:54:07,000 --> 00:54:10,199
Speaker 16: Two church leaders with ties to Tampa are facing federal

820
00:54:10,320 --> 00:54:13,599
charges tonight. They're at the center of what investigators are

821
00:54:13,599 --> 00:54:18,400
calling a multi million dollar conspiracy involving money laundering, forced labor,

822
00:54:18,440 --> 00:54:19,039
and abuse.

823
00:54:19,519 --> 00:54:20,519
Speaker 7: This follow what I say.

824
00:54:20,559 --> 00:54:22,119
Speaker 1: These churches are money laundering.

825
00:54:21,960 --> 00:54:23,039
Speaker 16: Including at a home.

826
00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:26,960
Speaker 1: Look at that pastor's home, dude, or the church's home.

827
00:54:27,960 --> 00:54:32,039
That's the damn church right ere. That's time for the church, son.

828
00:54:32,119 --> 00:54:34,679
Speaker 3: We're about to have an eyes watch shut church party

829
00:54:34,679 --> 00:54:38,239
in the basement too. That's what That's what they call

830
00:54:38,320 --> 00:54:41,480
an after party. You know what I'm saying, y'all ever.

831
00:54:41,320 --> 00:54:42,719
Speaker 1: Heard of the after party?

832
00:54:43,679 --> 00:54:46,480
Speaker 3: I put my key incognition high and fresh out of

833
00:54:46,480 --> 00:54:48,960
that kitchen, Ma Morola, and now by they got every

834
00:54:49,119 --> 00:54:51,199
man inhuition sipping on cocaine.

835
00:54:51,199 --> 00:54:51,480
Speaker 1: Wrong.

836
00:54:51,719 --> 00:54:54,360
Speaker 3: I'm like, so what I'm drawing. It's a freaking weekend, baby,

837
00:54:54,360 --> 00:54:55,960
were about to have some some church.

838
00:54:56,119 --> 00:54:59,719
Speaker 16: In the affluent Avalane neighborhood in Hillsboro County. This was

839
00:54:59,719 --> 00:55:03,679
part the nationwide takedown. Fox thirteen is covering this investigation

840
00:55:03,760 --> 00:55:06,920
from multiple angles. Are Kylie Jones is at the Federal

841
00:55:06,960 --> 00:55:10,039
Courthouse in Tampa, diving deeper into the church and its leaders.

842
00:55:10,199 --> 00:55:12,719
But we begin with Aaron Mesmer live in Avala with

843
00:55:12,880 --> 00:55:15,239
more on the raid and reaction from neighbors.

844
00:55:15,360 --> 00:55:19,960
Speaker 17: Aaron, Yeah, Heley and these neighbors were absolutely stunned by

845
00:55:20,039 --> 00:55:20,960
what went on this morning.

846
00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:22,199
Speaker 1: Neighbors in this community, they.

847
00:55:22,079 --> 00:55:26,559
Speaker 17: Woke up to helicopters and FBI agents raiding a home

848
00:55:26,920 --> 00:55:29,960
in Novela and once they found out why those agery

849
00:55:30,000 --> 00:55:31,639
are there, it was even more surprising.

850
00:55:32,639 --> 00:55:34,519
Speaker 18: Some of you say, I don't have one hundred thousand,

851
00:55:34,599 --> 00:55:37,559
but you have twenty thousand, You have fifty thousand.

852
00:55:37,559 --> 00:55:38,920
Speaker 1: Here, you have ten thousand.

853
00:55:39,239 --> 00:55:41,920
Speaker 19: That's video of David Taylor asking viewers to send money

854
00:55:41,920 --> 00:55:42,079
to me.

855
00:55:42,159 --> 00:55:45,519
Speaker 1: I need to adopt the model of David Taylor. All

856
00:55:45,519 --> 00:55:46,400
of y'all right.

857
00:55:46,239 --> 00:55:52,199
Speaker 3: Now, at y'all home, Deacons, wives, moms, close the dough,

858
00:55:52,599 --> 00:55:55,159
close the dough. You ain't getting out until I see

859
00:55:55,239 --> 00:55:58,480
twenty thousand dollars in the super Chit ain't nobody getting

860
00:55:58,519 --> 00:55:59,119
out that house.

861
00:55:59,480 --> 00:56:01,840
Speaker 1: You sitting on the toilet, You staying on the pot

862
00:56:01,920 --> 00:56:02,239
right now.

863
00:56:02,880 --> 00:56:05,199
Speaker 3: You set your ass down and keep shitting until I

864
00:56:05,280 --> 00:56:07,559
see twenty thousand dollars in the super chat.

865
00:56:07,679 --> 00:56:09,920
Speaker 1: Right now, y'all ain't leaving this room.

866
00:56:10,079 --> 00:56:14,960
Speaker 3: Y'all ain't leaving this here ex Twitter space until I

867
00:56:15,039 --> 00:56:19,679
see seeds of faith put right here into the super

868
00:56:19,960 --> 00:56:26,079
a Chat. Huh haight man, twenty thousand dollars, super Chat.

869
00:56:26,320 --> 00:56:28,599
That's our goal today. And ain't none of y'all leaving

870
00:56:28,679 --> 00:56:31,360
until I see twenty thousand right now. I want to

871
00:56:31,400 --> 00:56:35,719
see each one of you reaching into your Grandmama's purse.

872
00:56:36,039 --> 00:56:39,679
Reaching into your aunt is a person, reaching into your

873
00:56:39,760 --> 00:56:43,199
sisters a person and somehow figure out how to put

874
00:56:43,199 --> 00:56:45,519
it into the Internet and send it to the super chat.

875
00:56:45,599 --> 00:56:48,039
Right though, That's what I'm talking about right now.

876
00:56:48,440 --> 00:56:52,119
Speaker 19: Authorities now say Taylor used donations to fund an extravagant

877
00:56:52,119 --> 00:56:56,679
lifestyle that included this massive mansion in Tampa's affluent OVLA community.

878
00:56:57,199 --> 00:56:59,519
FBI agents rated the home Wednesday morning.

879
00:56:59,639 --> 00:57:00,800
Speaker 9: It's very surprising, team.

880
00:57:00,880 --> 00:57:04,639
Speaker 1: I like how the FBI agents can bust this obvious

881
00:57:04,719 --> 00:57:07,880
fake ass church, which everybody in Tampa probably knew was

882
00:57:07,880 --> 00:57:10,800
a fake ass church. But they can't bust nobody else.

883
00:57:10,840 --> 00:57:13,840
They can't find the human traffickers, but they can bust

884
00:57:13,880 --> 00:57:18,400
this dumb ass fake church. And then on top of that,

885
00:57:18,599 --> 00:57:23,079
there was a whole other one. Remember this was a

886
00:57:23,119 --> 00:57:26,760
couple of weeks ago. Here we go, this lovely man.

887
00:57:26,599 --> 00:57:30,000
Speaker 20: Here, the man who once led one of the largest

888
00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:35,559
congregations in America, today walking into an Oklahoma courthouse pleading

889
00:57:35,559 --> 00:57:38,400
guilty to sexually abusing an underage girl.

890
00:57:38,800 --> 00:57:41,440
Speaker 9: This has taken my entire lifetime to get here.

891
00:57:41,760 --> 00:57:44,880
Speaker 20: That girl was Cindy Klemishire, now fifty five.

892
00:57:46,119 --> 00:57:52,440
Speaker 3: Now there was another megachurch, not just this black dude's church.

893
00:57:52,480 --> 00:57:54,320
There was a whole other one somewhere. And see where

894
00:57:54,400 --> 00:57:58,840
that one is. Oh this, this might be it human trafficking.

895
00:58:00,039 --> 00:58:00,880
Oh that's the same one.

896
00:58:00,920 --> 00:58:01,199
Speaker 1: I think.

897
00:58:01,239 --> 00:58:02,920
Speaker 2: Let's see, really.

898
00:58:02,679 --> 00:58:06,079
Speaker 20: Scared to be honest, because we never suspected something like

899
00:58:06,119 --> 00:58:09,079
that from him when he said he was a pastor.

900
00:58:09,239 --> 00:58:12,000
Speaker 21: And well, you mean the pastor was like totally like

901
00:58:12,159 --> 00:58:13,440
stealing people or whatever?

902
00:58:13,559 --> 00:58:15,400
Speaker 1: Bro, how can a pastor steal people?

903
00:58:15,800 --> 00:58:16,119
Speaker 22: Stuff?

904
00:58:16,239 --> 00:58:21,440
Speaker 23: That a joint FBI operation stretch from Michigan to Texas

905
00:58:21,480 --> 00:58:23,960
to Florida and then right in the heart of North Carolina.

906
00:58:24,079 --> 00:58:27,800
That's the same self professed religious leaders has been taken

907
00:58:27,800 --> 00:58:29,880
into custody in Durham after.

908
00:58:30,360 --> 00:58:32,760
Speaker 1: All, Right, there's another one that happened, and I've shared

909
00:58:32,800 --> 00:58:36,320
it on YouTube, but I can't remember. Let's see Texas megachurch,

910
00:58:37,840 --> 00:58:40,679
FBI mansion And that's not it. There's another one. Where's

911
00:58:40,679 --> 00:58:43,079
the other one? But you know what, this happens like

912
00:58:43,119 --> 00:58:46,360
every few weeks almost, so you could just put in

913
00:58:46,400 --> 00:58:50,719
a Google update for every few weeks one of these

914
00:58:50,840 --> 00:58:51,840
fake ass churches.

915
00:58:52,760 --> 00:58:56,119
Speaker 3: Mexican megachurch. Oh, here's one Mexico.

916
00:58:57,039 --> 00:59:01,920
Speaker 21: A dude all you've got to do Bro, like barely,

917
00:59:02,079 --> 00:59:04,119
you just got a barely super chat or whatever.

918
00:59:04,599 --> 00:59:05,920
Speaker 1: There's like a little bitty see.

919
00:59:05,800 --> 00:59:09,679
Speaker 21: The faith, Bro, And like probably probably I could probably

920
00:59:09,719 --> 00:59:11,639
I could do something with that, but like probably it

921
00:59:11,679 --> 00:59:13,920
needs to be like at least like five hundred dollars

922
00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:14,480
or something.

923
00:59:15,199 --> 00:59:18,639
Speaker 1: Barely. What if it's like barely like four hundred or whatever.

924
00:59:18,719 --> 00:59:22,480
I mean, Okay, that's cool, that's right. Michael.

925
00:59:22,519 --> 00:59:25,679
Speaker 24: The church leader's attorney just gave us a savement a

926
00:59:25,719 --> 00:59:26,320
short time ago.

927
00:59:26,360 --> 00:59:27,800
Speaker 2: You'll hear that in just a short bit.

928
00:59:28,159 --> 00:59:30,760
Speaker 24: He's already serving it right now, state time in state

929
00:59:30,840 --> 00:59:33,960
prison for crimes he committed guilty too. He's been transferred over.

930
00:59:34,199 --> 00:59:36,679
Speaker 1: Bro. They just started the persecute people. Man, It's just

931
00:59:36,880 --> 00:59:37,719
it's just a state.

932
00:59:37,800 --> 00:59:40,000
Speaker 2: The persecuting bro or custody.

933
00:59:40,079 --> 00:59:43,760
Speaker 1: Now a federal agents searches a system. Bro, it's the system. Ro,

934
00:59:45,480 --> 00:59:46,519
that's a freaking system.

935
00:59:46,840 --> 00:59:49,199
Speaker 24: The mass agents swarmed this houncil block away from the

936
00:59:49,280 --> 00:59:52,320
Laalusta Mundo church here in East La Our cameras caught

937
00:59:52,360 --> 00:59:56,440
them carrying out large boxes and the prosecutors believe could

938
00:59:56,440 --> 00:59:59,920
be kind to a massive international racketeering and child export

939
01:00:00,079 --> 01:00:02,840
tation and a problem in this you Federal indictment prosecutors

940
01:00:02,840 --> 01:00:06,119
say Garcia and five others abuse their power, doctrine, and

941
01:00:06,199 --> 01:00:09,239
structure of the La Luce de Mundo church to threaten.

942
01:00:09,079 --> 01:00:09,719
Speaker 14: L lul.

943
01:00:14,159 --> 01:00:22,559
Speaker 21: Labuta, le boa la Mundo, l Moon l Mundo.

944
01:00:25,719 --> 01:00:29,320
Speaker 1: You know, la bota. It's like the most famous Mexican song.

945
01:00:29,280 --> 01:00:33,880
Speaker 21: Lea boa lata lebou.

946
01:00:38,199 --> 01:00:43,079
Speaker 1: We're just having church. What's y'all's problem. Listen, this preacher

947
01:00:43,119 --> 01:00:45,679
game works, y'all. Just send me a ship ton of

948
01:00:45,679 --> 01:00:48,639
super chats. I'm starting to think this preacher game is

949
01:00:48,639 --> 01:00:52,320
where it's at. That's why I should have been a preacher, dude,

950
01:00:52,320 --> 01:00:53,280
to start my own church.

951
01:00:55,760 --> 01:01:01,199
Speaker 3: Get a damn palace, Get a bunch of dang hump slaves,

952
01:01:02,000 --> 01:01:06,639
get a bunch of dang What else do you get? Everything?

953
01:01:08,079 --> 01:01:10,360
Arms gotta go ahead? What else do we get?

954
01:01:10,880 --> 01:01:12,920
Speaker 1: I was gonna say, Private Jetic.

955
01:01:13,400 --> 01:01:15,840
Speaker 15: Tucker actually talked about He interviewed it, dude.

956
01:01:15,880 --> 01:01:17,480
Speaker 2: He talked about that Tampa pastor.

957
01:01:17,639 --> 01:01:20,679
Speaker 15: But he also went after Kenneth Copeland.

958
01:01:20,880 --> 01:01:22,519
Speaker 1: He's got a whole freaking oil.

959
01:01:22,320 --> 01:01:27,039
Speaker 15: Operation going on on the on the what's the name

960
01:01:27,079 --> 01:01:29,079
of it? What do they call the land that's owned

961
01:01:29,079 --> 01:01:31,599
by the parishioners supposedly by that lake.

962
01:01:31,800 --> 01:01:34,840
Speaker 1: Are you talking about? I know you're talking about Pastor

963
01:01:34,920 --> 01:01:36,039
Randy Balls' church.

964
01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:40,000
Speaker 15: Oh okay, I thought it was Kenneth Copeland as well.

965
01:01:40,320 --> 01:01:42,480
Speaker 1: No, no, have you have you looked into Randy Balls.

966
01:01:44,280 --> 01:01:46,719
Speaker 15: I haven't looked into him the rectory, That's what I'm saying.

967
01:01:46,760 --> 01:01:48,960
Speaker 1: No, no, no, no, no, I know I know what you're talking about.

968
01:01:49,039 --> 01:01:53,559
I'm talking about Randy Balls, the internet's most famous mega

969
01:01:53,639 --> 01:01:57,199
church pastor. Go look up, go to go to YouTube

970
01:01:57,239 --> 01:02:00,559
and type in Randy Balls and you're gonna see two videos.

971
01:02:01,320 --> 01:02:05,280
And in the second video, it's providential you said that

972
01:02:05,519 --> 01:02:09,079
because in the second video, Pastor Randy Balls talks about

973
01:02:09,079 --> 01:02:15,280
his Middle Eastern oil deal. I'm joking, bro, that's me.

974
01:02:15,719 --> 01:02:18,320
I'm Randy Balls. Oh okay.

975
01:02:18,360 --> 01:02:19,719
Speaker 15: I was like, I can't say it.

976
01:02:20,440 --> 01:02:22,920
Speaker 1: But you know what, what's funny is this in the skit,

977
01:02:23,039 --> 01:02:25,280
I put a Middle Eastern oil deal in there. I didn't.

978
01:02:25,400 --> 01:02:29,199
I never actually conceived of a megachurch pastor actually having

979
01:02:29,239 --> 01:02:29,960
an oil deal.

980
01:02:30,599 --> 01:02:31,519
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, no.

981
01:02:31,599 --> 01:02:34,400
Speaker 15: He So this dude went on to, uh, he went

982
01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:36,960
on a Kenneth Copeland's property where, like you know, he

983
01:02:37,039 --> 01:02:41,719
went past the hangar and apparently the rectory which he

984
01:02:41,840 --> 01:02:44,280
has like a ten thousand square foot house and it's

985
01:02:44,280 --> 01:02:48,400
file lake and like apparently he's got an oil.

986
01:02:48,159 --> 01:02:51,840
Speaker 1: Where he got Oh you know who do you remember

987
01:02:53,000 --> 01:02:58,280
Pat Robertson? Oh? Yeah, you know what he did. One

988
01:02:58,280 --> 01:03:00,679
of the first things he did when he got a

989
01:03:00,679 --> 01:03:02,840
bunch of money, he bought a bunch of diamond mines.

990
01:03:04,599 --> 01:03:06,760
Is that crazy? He took the church, he took all

991
01:03:06,800 --> 01:03:08,519
the church money and bought diamond mines.

992
01:03:09,880 --> 01:03:11,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, the Lord put it on his heart.

993
01:03:11,280 --> 01:03:16,960
Speaker 1: Yet right exactly, the Lord's put it on my heart.

994
01:03:17,079 --> 01:03:20,360
I've gotta get some of these some of this drip and.

995
01:03:20,679 --> 01:03:25,599
Speaker 3: Blame and ice. The lords told me, I gotta be

996
01:03:25,960 --> 01:03:26,440
iced out.

997
01:03:31,119 --> 01:03:33,440
Speaker 15: Oh man, I appreciate you having me up.

998
01:03:33,519 --> 01:03:35,800
Speaker 1: Man, I'll drop down the well. Just be sure and

999
01:03:35,840 --> 01:03:39,119
go check into uh Randy Balls and get some b

1000
01:03:39,199 --> 01:03:43,000
A W l Z and get some spiritual enlightenment. What's up, man,

1001
01:03:50,280 --> 01:03:52,159
cole chat the night Stalk or what's up?

1002
01:03:56,920 --> 01:04:04,559
Speaker 2: I'm mute, I'm here as we do, say very good uh.

1003
01:04:07,400 --> 01:04:13,559
Speaker 1: Space, Thank you much, man. I appreciate that. Sounds like

1004
01:04:13,599 --> 01:04:15,400
it was hard to get that out, but I appreciate

1005
01:04:15,440 --> 01:04:24,000
you trying. What's up nikon, Yeah, the money laundering remix exactly.

1006
01:04:25,559 --> 01:04:31,480
What's up there? I'm mute barely.

1007
01:04:33,679 --> 01:04:37,039
Speaker 3: Dude's calling me from Zack Morris's phone from nineteen ninety three.

1008
01:04:38,760 --> 01:04:46,000
Speaker 1: One second through my blue blue Dude, I said, Zach

1009
01:04:46,079 --> 01:05:00,320
Morris Nokia right there. No, not at all. This is

1010
01:05:00,320 --> 01:05:03,400
that dude right now, He's like he's dud. Dude's trying

1011
01:05:03,440 --> 01:05:08,559
to call a C slater. I'm not screeched, dog, I'm

1012
01:05:08,559 --> 01:05:12,039
not ac slater. Bro. You can't reach me with that mess.

1013
01:05:16,320 --> 01:05:18,440
That's a good idea, dude, And call me on a

1014
01:05:18,480 --> 01:05:26,000
modern smartphone, not a zacphone. All right, what's up? Everybody?

1015
01:05:26,480 --> 01:05:32,079
Looking forward to any more discussions about Saved by the Bell?

1016
01:05:32,840 --> 01:05:36,599
I want to get deep into now. See here we

1017
01:05:36,639 --> 01:05:41,079
go with with somebody sent me five hundred n z's okay.

1018
01:05:41,159 --> 01:05:43,639
Now that's gonna trip me out because you think.

1019
01:05:43,480 --> 01:05:46,599
Speaker 3: Oh shit, you're rich. Now, dude, you just got four hundred,

1020
01:05:48,039 --> 01:05:51,840
you got four hundred. Well, let's see what the conversion

1021
01:05:51,920 --> 01:05:59,119
rate for in this is. Did he actually give us money?

1022
01:05:59,159 --> 01:06:03,599
Speaker 1: Let's find out what's a nizz like three cents probably,

1023
01:06:03,800 --> 01:06:10,880
let's see, so half maybe he actually did let's say

1024
01:06:10,880 --> 01:06:14,800
four hundred nine nine niz. Well, thank you for the niz.

1025
01:06:14,880 --> 01:06:15,199
Speaker 15: Dude.

1026
01:06:15,960 --> 01:06:20,159
Speaker 1: He said five hundred niz, which comes to two hundred eight.

1027
01:06:20,199 --> 01:06:23,639
So he's winning the super chests. Shout out to my

1028
01:06:23,679 --> 01:06:27,719
New Zealand bros. All the nizzes. I don't know where

1029
01:06:27,719 --> 01:06:31,039
I'm gonna spend all these niz but thank you so

1030
01:06:31,199 --> 01:06:35,480
much to what was his name? Noos? Where'd it go?

1031
01:06:36,519 --> 01:06:41,840
Speaker 3: News company? See that, man understands. You take a religious

1032
01:06:41,840 --> 01:06:44,320
thing and you turn it into a brand.

1033
01:06:44,960 --> 01:06:50,039
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying. You create El Mundo church,

1034
01:06:50,880 --> 01:06:56,880
Lebota church, you create I forget what Randy Balls's church was,

1035
01:06:56,920 --> 01:06:58,679
but thank you so much, man, I appreciate that. That's

1036
01:06:58,679 --> 01:07:01,760
a very generous super chantes. He's pretty much paid the bills.

1037
01:07:01,800 --> 01:07:04,199
We could just call it a day if we want. Greg.

1038
01:07:04,239 --> 01:07:10,440
What's up man? See? I like that because I thought

1039
01:07:10,480 --> 01:07:11,719
it was yeah, like I thought it was gonna be

1040
01:07:11,760 --> 01:07:14,159
like Zimbabwe dollars, which is like you get a billion

1041
01:07:14,199 --> 01:07:15,840
of them and you think you're about to retire and

1042
01:07:15,880 --> 01:07:19,360
that comes out to like a subway sandwich or something.

1043
01:07:19,360 --> 01:07:20,760
What's up, man, I'm mute.

1044
01:07:22,840 --> 01:07:23,679
Speaker 2: Hey, what's going on?

1045
01:07:23,719 --> 01:07:28,559
Speaker 1: Man? What's on your mind?

1046
01:07:29,440 --> 01:07:31,519
Speaker 2: Then I saw this space. I just wanted to pop

1047
01:07:31,559 --> 01:07:37,599
in and talking about the Church is Israel. Yes, so

1048
01:07:38,199 --> 01:07:40,480
can you elaborate on that, because there's many ways you

1049
01:07:40,519 --> 01:07:43,559
could take that statement.

1050
01:07:45,679 --> 01:07:50,239
Speaker 1: In the sense of the traditional Orthodox Catholic Church is

1051
01:07:50,519 --> 01:07:53,360
the Israel of God of Galatians six sixteen.

1052
01:07:54,880 --> 01:07:58,519
Speaker 2: Oh, Okay, So you're basically saying it's like, is that

1053
01:07:58,559 --> 01:08:02,719
like super sessionism where the church is like the new Israel,

1054
01:08:02,760 --> 01:08:05,719
it's like replacing the nation of Israel.

1055
01:08:07,360 --> 01:08:11,039
Speaker 1: I think fulfillment is a better term than replacement, because

1056
01:08:11,239 --> 01:08:15,519
it's one faith all the way back to Noah, prior

1057
01:08:15,599 --> 01:08:19,479
to even Abraham. It's that same faith all the way

1058
01:08:19,560 --> 01:08:22,720
up into Romans fifteen, where Paul says that all the covenants,

1059
01:08:23,319 --> 01:08:27,399
whether the Mosaic or whether the Noaic, Thevidic, they're all

1060
01:08:27,439 --> 01:08:29,079
fulfilled in the person of Christ.

1061
01:08:31,079 --> 01:08:35,000
Speaker 2: Okay, that makes sense for me. I have a lot

1062
01:08:35,000 --> 01:08:38,800
of questions about Paul. I've always had questions about Paul,

1063
01:08:38,840 --> 01:08:43,239
and I know Protestants, they starting with Martin Luther, they

1064
01:08:43,359 --> 01:08:47,079
really venerate what Paul said. Most of the New Testaments

1065
01:08:47,279 --> 01:08:51,279
written by Paul and Luke. But for me, the person

1066
01:08:51,319 --> 01:08:55,840
of Jesus seems to be central right to Christianity, not Paul.

1067
01:08:57,199 --> 01:08:58,039
So the questions.

1068
01:08:58,119 --> 01:09:00,880
Speaker 1: But Paul preaches Jesus. So I don't see a conflict there.

1069
01:09:00,920 --> 01:09:03,199
What what specifically do you see as a conflict.

1070
01:09:04,079 --> 01:09:06,399
Speaker 2: I see a lot of conflicts between Paul and Jesus

1071
01:09:06,439 --> 01:09:07,319
myself personally.

1072
01:09:07,399 --> 01:09:09,119
Speaker 1: Okay, Like, what's an example.

1073
01:09:09,840 --> 01:09:13,159
Speaker 2: I'll give you many. I'll give you one example. Jesus said,

1074
01:09:13,439 --> 01:09:16,680
do not give care for tomorrow, for tomorrow will take

1075
01:09:16,720 --> 01:09:18,840
care of itself. Look at the lilies of the field.

1076
01:09:19,359 --> 01:09:22,199
Paul said, he who does not work does not eat.

1077
01:09:22,760 --> 01:09:26,760
And basically, you know, Jesus said letting men, no man

1078
01:09:27,039 --> 01:09:31,199
call himself father. Uh, And Paul says, I am your father.

1079
01:09:32,319 --> 01:09:33,640
Darth Vader also said.

1080
01:09:33,439 --> 01:09:36,880
Speaker 1: That, Okay, but I mean, doesn't you know does the

1081
01:09:36,880 --> 01:09:39,119
Ten Commandments say honor your father and your mother?

1082
01:09:40,319 --> 01:09:41,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, your biological father.

1083
01:09:41,840 --> 01:09:46,720
Speaker 1: Sure, Okay, So there's qualifications to it.

1084
01:09:47,840 --> 01:09:53,479
Speaker 2: Well, Jesus was talking about the iglesia the church, right, ecclesias. Uh.

1085
01:09:53,640 --> 01:09:56,359
He's talking about when you are all brothers in the

1086
01:09:56,479 --> 01:10:00,239
Church of Jesus and you all come together, when two

1087
01:10:00,279 --> 01:10:02,960
or more with you, I am among you. But he's

1088
01:10:03,000 --> 01:10:05,119
saying you all are equal.

1089
01:10:05,479 --> 01:10:07,479
Speaker 1: If someone was where did he say where? Did he

1090
01:10:07,520 --> 01:10:09,399
say where? Did he say you all are equal. You're

1091
01:10:09,439 --> 01:10:11,039
you're just saying that. Where did he say that?

1092
01:10:11,079 --> 01:10:12,880
Speaker 2: Well, he says, like this, if any one of you.

1093
01:10:13,479 --> 01:10:15,800
He said three things. First, he said, let no man

1094
01:10:15,840 --> 01:10:19,079
call himself father. Secondly, he said, if you want to

1095
01:10:19,119 --> 01:10:21,000
be the leader, you actually have to be the servant

1096
01:10:21,079 --> 01:10:24,880
of all. He's always talking about how to be the first.

1097
01:10:24,920 --> 01:10:28,560
You got to be the last. Right to find your life,

1098
01:10:28,640 --> 01:10:31,680
you have to deny your life. So like this idea

1099
01:10:31,760 --> 01:10:35,880
that I can. I can tell you many things where,

1100
01:10:36,840 --> 01:10:41,359
but essentially this is the big one. Jesus says. When

1101
01:10:41,359 --> 01:10:44,039
a young ruler asked him, how do I enter life?

1102
01:10:44,520 --> 01:10:48,079
Jesus said, follow the commandments. Follow the law. He said,

1103
01:10:48,119 --> 01:10:53,399
which law? Jesus says, you know, the one honor? You know.

1104
01:10:53,840 --> 01:10:56,079
He started to list the commandments. Do not kill, do

1105
01:10:56,159 --> 01:10:57,319
not steal your honor.

1106
01:10:58,079 --> 01:11:01,560
Speaker 1: He says, well, if you keep the first commandment, then

1107
01:11:01,600 --> 01:11:04,039
you will buy necessity to keep all of them. Right,

1108
01:11:04,119 --> 01:11:08,279
So love God first, right, let me find the words

1109
01:11:08,319 --> 01:11:08,760
of Jesus.

1110
01:11:08,840 --> 01:11:09,399
Speaker 2: One second.

1111
01:11:10,079 --> 01:11:12,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, but Paul says the same thing Paul says in

1112
01:11:12,079 --> 01:11:13,920
Galatians that you have to keep the law too.

1113
01:11:15,359 --> 01:11:19,399
Speaker 2: This is the interesting thing Paul see Paul taught from

1114
01:11:19,439 --> 01:11:22,880
his own visions. Paul was converted on the road to Damascus.

1115
01:11:22,880 --> 01:11:26,199
He had a personal vision. I put him in the

1116
01:11:26,199 --> 01:11:28,920
same category myself personally. I put him in the same

1117
01:11:28,920 --> 01:11:32,119
category as Muhammad, in the sense that he had personal

1118
01:11:32,199 --> 01:11:35,960
visions that he interpreted were from God. And then he

1119
01:11:36,039 --> 01:11:38,880
went into the inner rooms, into the jail.

1120
01:11:38,720 --> 01:11:41,640
Speaker 1: Or the jailer. I understand that, right, I understand you

1121
01:11:41,720 --> 01:11:45,319
think that. In Galatians five six, he says the only

1122
01:11:45,359 --> 01:11:47,720
faith that counts as the one that works through love,

1123
01:11:48,279 --> 01:11:51,239
and he identifies the works are the works of the law.

1124
01:11:51,319 --> 01:11:53,239
So Paul doesn't say that you don't teach the law

1125
01:11:53,640 --> 01:11:55,279
or you keep the law. He says exact same thing

1126
01:11:55,319 --> 01:11:56,039
that Jesus says.

1127
01:11:56,840 --> 01:11:59,279
Speaker 2: Oh, I agree. So Paul wanted the Jews to keep

1128
01:11:59,319 --> 01:12:01,600
the law, continued to keep the law.

1129
01:12:02,199 --> 01:12:04,439
Speaker 1: Paul's writing to the church at Galatia, He's not writing

1130
01:12:04,479 --> 01:12:05,239
to the Jews there.

1131
01:12:06,279 --> 01:12:10,159
Speaker 2: So this is to unpack everything. So Jesus came only

1132
01:12:10,279 --> 01:12:13,800
to the lost sheep of Israel. When Jesus was approached

1133
01:12:13,840 --> 01:12:16,720
by a non Jewish woman, a gentile woman, as it

1134
01:12:16,720 --> 01:12:21,319
says in the New Testament, she said, please heal my daughter,

1135
01:12:21,600 --> 01:12:24,079
Jesus said, I was sent only to the last sheep

1136
01:12:24,119 --> 01:12:29,399
of Israel. She keeps telling him, Master, you know, I

1137
01:12:29,520 --> 01:12:31,680
please heal my daughter. He says, it is not.

1138
01:12:31,880 --> 01:12:34,159
Speaker 1: I'm aware he offered the Gospel was offered to the

1139
01:12:34,239 --> 01:12:36,600
Jews first, and Paul says the same thing to the

1140
01:12:36,680 --> 01:12:39,760
jew first, to the Greek. How is that? None of

1141
01:12:39,840 --> 01:12:42,000
that's a contradiction, Well.

1142
01:12:41,840 --> 01:12:45,079
Speaker 2: The first of all. Besides the contradictions, which I'll get

1143
01:12:45,119 --> 01:12:49,079
into more contradictions, but look at Paul. Paul comes after Jesus,

1144
01:12:49,079 --> 01:12:53,119
many years after Jesus. He was persecuting the students of Jesus.

1145
01:12:53,119 --> 01:12:55,720
Do you agree at that point he was persecuting them

1146
01:12:56,439 --> 01:12:57,319
before diverted in.

1147
01:12:58,119 --> 01:12:58,399
Speaker 19: Yeah.

1148
01:12:58,479 --> 01:13:00,880
Speaker 2: Then he went on the road and the desert. You know,

1149
01:13:00,920 --> 01:13:02,960
he might have got a sunstroke. Who knows, he might

1150
01:13:02,960 --> 01:13:03,800
have had epilepsy.

1151
01:13:03,920 --> 01:13:04,439
Speaker 1: We don't know.

1152
01:13:04,760 --> 01:13:07,039
Speaker 2: But what we do know is that he was struck

1153
01:13:07,119 --> 01:13:10,399
down on the road to Damascus. His companions didn't see

1154
01:13:10,399 --> 01:13:14,560
anything he did. And then he describes it as being

1155
01:13:14,600 --> 01:13:17,720
caught up to the seventh heaven. He says, here's what

1156
01:13:17,800 --> 01:13:20,199
he says. Paul, in his own words of the Galician, says,

1157
01:13:20,560 --> 01:13:23,479
I did not go to study with the students of Jesus.

1158
01:13:23,520 --> 01:13:27,199
I went to Arabia for three years for my own visions.

1159
01:13:27,239 --> 01:13:31,640
I taught for my own visions. He says himself. This

1160
01:13:31,680 --> 01:13:34,840
is what I have a problem with. If you believe

1161
01:13:34,840 --> 01:13:37,239
that Jesus appeared to why wouldn't you go study in

1162
01:13:37,319 --> 01:13:38,600
his church that he set up.

1163
01:13:42,199 --> 01:13:46,199
Speaker 1: Because the church isn't only located in Jerusalem. He was

1164
01:13:46,279 --> 01:13:48,199
received into the church if you read the Book of

1165
01:13:48,239 --> 01:13:50,279
Acts by people from the church, So you don't have

1166
01:13:50,319 --> 01:13:52,800
to go to Jerusalem to be received into the church.

1167
01:13:53,800 --> 01:13:55,279
Speaker 2: Well, in the Book of Acts, if you go to

1168
01:13:55,279 --> 01:13:58,479
Acts fifteen, he does go. Finally, after three years, he

1169
01:13:58,520 --> 01:13:59,800
goes and sees what he calls.

1170
01:13:59,600 --> 01:14:02,760
Speaker 1: A pillar, the inga. He says, I went after that

1171
01:14:02,800 --> 01:14:03,560
to go see Peter.

1172
01:14:04,600 --> 01:14:08,399
Speaker 2: Yeah, he writes Galatians afterwards. But Luke is who writes

1173
01:14:08,439 --> 01:14:12,840
Acts fifteen, and he faithfully records that Paul gets chastised

1174
01:14:13,239 --> 01:14:15,640
by the pillars of the church. First he argues with them,

1175
01:14:16,000 --> 01:14:19,079
and then he gets told, if you read Acts twenty

1176
01:14:19,079 --> 01:14:22,159
one and Acts fifteen, he gets told, there's rumors about

1177
01:14:22,199 --> 01:14:25,399
you that you have been spreading. There's rumors people say

1178
01:14:25,439 --> 01:14:27,319
about you that you have been teaching the Jews not

1179
01:14:27,399 --> 01:14:31,520
to follow the law. So let show people there's no

1180
01:14:31,600 --> 01:14:35,880
truth in these rumors. Pay for these purification rights of

1181
01:14:36,000 --> 01:14:40,680
these you know Nazarenes, these sort of monks, right to

1182
01:14:40,720 --> 01:14:43,960
get their heads pure shape. And he does it. He

1183
01:14:44,039 --> 01:14:46,119
shows there is no truth in these rumors. So what

1184
01:14:46,159 --> 01:14:48,880
does that mean. He means he wasn't teaching Jews to

1185
01:14:49,399 --> 01:14:54,119
abandon the law. So you're right, Paul wasn't teaching Jews. Now,

1186
01:14:54,359 --> 01:14:57,760
Gentiles were never under the law, but Jews were. So

1187
01:14:57,880 --> 01:15:00,399
I don't think Paul was this radical guy I was

1188
01:15:00,439 --> 01:15:01,159
telling the Jews.

1189
01:15:01,199 --> 01:15:03,920
Speaker 1: Now, oh, so, I mean this refutes what you said

1190
01:15:03,920 --> 01:15:05,800
a minute ago that he you have a problem with Paul,

1191
01:15:05,840 --> 01:15:08,000
because now you're saying that he's saying what you say.

1192
01:15:08,880 --> 01:15:10,880
Speaker 2: Well, this is what I'm saying. What I'm saying is

1193
01:15:10,960 --> 01:15:15,079
Luke recorded Paul being chastised and Paul going along with

1194
01:15:15,880 --> 01:15:19,279
disproving these rumors. But then they give him a letter

1195
01:15:19,680 --> 01:15:22,359
which is in Acts fifteen, and they give him a

1196
01:15:22,439 --> 01:15:25,840
letter that basically invokes the Holy Spirit. It invokes the

1197
01:15:26,000 --> 01:15:28,439
entire authority of the Holy Spirit and says there's only

1198
01:15:28,479 --> 01:15:31,079
a few things we need you to do, Gentiles, and

1199
01:15:31,079 --> 01:15:32,399
that is abstained from meat.

1200
01:15:32,680 --> 01:15:34,800
Speaker 1: Yes, this is from the NOA Covenant so it's referring

1201
01:15:34,800 --> 01:15:37,159
back to the Noa Covenant because the argument exactly, the

1202
01:15:37,239 --> 01:15:40,680
argument is exact. If gentiles could be made righteous at

1203
01:15:40,680 --> 01:15:44,000
the time of Noah through those minimal requirements, we ought

1204
01:15:44,000 --> 01:15:48,159
to not expect more from them than was expected, then beautiful.

1205
01:15:48,239 --> 01:15:51,840
Speaker 2: Yes, I agree that that's probably the Noaka Covenant. There

1206
01:15:52,039 --> 01:15:54,359
here's what I have a problem with. They told Paul

1207
01:15:54,479 --> 01:15:57,920
to spread these things, but when he goes to and

1208
01:15:57,960 --> 01:15:59,640
they give it to him and Barnabas, and then he

1209
01:15:59,720 --> 01:16:02,880
all argues with Barnabas also and then they part ways whatever.

1210
01:16:02,960 --> 01:16:05,039
Speaker 1: Fine, But then Paul when.

1211
01:16:04,920 --> 01:16:07,039
Speaker 2: He writes to the Galatians, he says, they did not

1212
01:16:07,159 --> 01:16:10,560
add anything to my message save that I remember the poor,

1213
01:16:10,600 --> 01:16:13,159
which I was anyway going to do all along. It's

1214
01:16:13,199 --> 01:16:16,239
like he never even tells the Galicians what they're he's

1215
01:16:16,239 --> 01:16:20,000
supposed to, which is that they're not supposed to meet sacrifice,

1216
01:16:20,039 --> 01:16:23,119
titles and all that stuff. He never delivers the message

1217
01:16:23,159 --> 01:16:26,319
of the pillars of the Church. This is what I

1218
01:16:26,359 --> 01:16:27,000
have a problem with.

1219
01:16:27,119 --> 01:16:30,680
Speaker 1: Well, hold on, hold on, we don't know that the

1220
01:16:30,720 --> 01:16:33,640
only thing that Paul taught or said to the Galatians,

1221
01:16:33,640 --> 01:16:36,399
which is what's in Galatia, right, he might have taught

1222
01:16:36,439 --> 01:16:40,239
other things. The apostles taught all kinds of things. For example,

1223
01:16:40,279 --> 01:16:42,680
Paul taught for three years, day and night at Ephesus,

1224
01:16:43,359 --> 01:16:46,159
and most of that was oral and not recorded, so

1225
01:16:46,199 --> 01:16:49,279
we only know what he told Timothy in a written form,

1226
01:16:49,319 --> 01:16:50,159
what's in the letters.

1227
01:16:50,439 --> 01:16:52,960
Speaker 2: So now look, he may have told him something outside

1228
01:16:52,960 --> 01:16:55,479
of these letters. But when he talks to the Corinthians

1229
01:16:55,479 --> 01:16:58,079
and others, he says, who are these super apostles. I'm

1230
01:16:58,159 --> 01:17:00,720
just as much of an apostle as these guys, And like,

1231
01:17:01,079 --> 01:17:02,760
the problem I have with this is, first of all,

1232
01:17:02,800 --> 01:17:05,600
Peter was supposed to be the apostle to the Gentiles

1233
01:17:05,600 --> 01:17:08,279
according to the Great Commission. He was supposed to go

1234
01:17:08,359 --> 01:17:11,479
to the Gentiles, and suddenly it's Paul. It's like the

1235
01:17:11,520 --> 01:17:12,720
whole thing was a switcheroo.

1236
01:17:13,039 --> 01:17:17,560
Speaker 1: Well Peter if yeah, Initially Peter speaks to the Gentiles,

1237
01:17:17,560 --> 01:17:20,239
but Peter then has an issue in Acts ten with

1238
01:17:20,920 --> 01:17:24,760
the ceremonial law and the food right, the unclean food.

1239
01:17:25,359 --> 01:17:28,960
So in that sense, Paul might be a better fit

1240
01:17:29,399 --> 01:17:32,840
providentially than Peter, because that's why Paul rebukes Peter at

1241
01:17:32,880 --> 01:17:33,920
the beginning of Galatians.

1242
01:17:34,720 --> 01:17:38,000
Speaker 2: Do you believe Jesus had prophecy and foresight, and he

1243
01:17:38,079 --> 01:17:40,760
appointed Peter to be.

1244
01:17:41,279 --> 01:17:46,199
Speaker 1: The Jesus is the son of God, so he has omniscions.

1245
01:17:46,239 --> 01:17:48,840
He's not a human person, he's a divine person with

1246
01:17:48,920 --> 01:17:49,640
the human nature.

1247
01:17:49,760 --> 01:17:52,800
Speaker 2: So well, even more so so then he would would

1248
01:17:52,840 --> 01:17:54,439
you say, Jesus made a mistake and it.

1249
01:17:54,439 --> 01:17:57,000
Speaker 1: Should have been Paul. No, but we have free will,

1250
01:17:57,039 --> 01:17:59,960
and even apostles have free will, so they're not control

1251
01:18:00,239 --> 01:18:02,319
like some kind of demonic possession or something. When they

1252
01:18:02,319 --> 01:18:05,159
write things, they have the ability to also make mistakes.

1253
01:18:05,159 --> 01:18:08,920
So Peter, even in the Gospels, makes mistakes and hence

1254
01:18:08,960 --> 01:18:11,800
he gets rebuked by Jesus when he's you know, Jesus says,

1255
01:18:12,800 --> 01:18:16,119
you know, you get behind me, Peter. He says later on,

1256
01:18:16,640 --> 01:18:19,960
you know, feed my sheep. Because that's a threefold response

1257
01:18:20,039 --> 01:18:25,439
to Peter's threefold denial. So there's no idea that apostles

1258
01:18:25,479 --> 01:18:29,760
aren't or like, morally impeccable, even though their theology might

1259
01:18:29,760 --> 01:18:30,479
be infallible.

1260
01:18:31,439 --> 01:18:35,359
Speaker 2: Well, listen, here's the thing. Yes, we all have free

1261
01:18:36,239 --> 01:18:42,520
freedom of choice. Absolutely. Sometimes God coerces prophet like Jonah.

1262
01:18:42,840 --> 01:18:45,079
You know, he wasn't going to go to Tarshesh and

1263
01:18:45,119 --> 01:18:48,920
then the fish ate him anyway, he was going to

1264
01:18:49,000 --> 01:18:52,079
go there, and he did finally prophesy how God wanted.

1265
01:18:53,000 --> 01:18:55,920
But you're right, a lot of times God uses people

1266
01:18:56,000 --> 01:19:00,520
like Joseph's brothers to fulfill something much greater, even though

1267
01:19:00,560 --> 01:19:02,760
they rebel. But what I am saying to you is

1268
01:19:03,279 --> 01:19:06,920
Jesus specifically chose Peter to be the rock upon which

1269
01:19:07,159 --> 01:19:09,840
his church was built. And the reason I have a

1270
01:19:09,880 --> 01:19:14,520
big problem with modern Christianity is this is based around Rome.

1271
01:19:15,199 --> 01:19:17,520
While they do claim that the seed of Peter is

1272
01:19:17,560 --> 01:19:21,520
in Rome, Jesus set up the church in Jerusalem. Jesus

1273
01:19:21,560 --> 01:19:23,159
set up his church so that.

1274
01:19:23,520 --> 01:19:27,199
Speaker 1: Yeah, but we're Orthodox, so we would agree with the

1275
01:19:27,359 --> 01:19:29,840
error of thinking that everything is centered around Rome. So

1276
01:19:31,239 --> 01:19:35,239
I oppose Roman Catholicism. And in fact, in Matthew sixteen,

1277
01:19:35,279 --> 01:19:38,079
when he says that to Peter, two chapters later, he

1278
01:19:38,159 --> 01:19:40,600
says the exact same thing to the entire collogy of

1279
01:19:40,600 --> 01:19:44,159
the apostles. So we don't think that Peter has anything

1280
01:19:44,199 --> 01:19:46,920
more than a kind of mouthpiece role of the apostles.

1281
01:19:47,319 --> 01:19:50,319
He's not the super apostle, He's not above any of

1282
01:19:50,319 --> 01:19:54,079
the others in any sense beyond just being honored and

1283
01:19:54,119 --> 01:19:57,640
being given a kind of a gift, you could say,

1284
01:19:57,640 --> 01:20:00,600
by Christ here, but that same gift tw given to

1285
01:20:00,640 --> 01:20:01,640
all of them.

1286
01:20:02,039 --> 01:20:04,680
Speaker 2: Oh I like that. I like that. But basically, what

1287
01:20:04,720 --> 01:20:07,840
I'm basically saying is to you is this, even if

1288
01:20:08,000 --> 01:20:12,399
Jesus rose from the dead and appeared to everybody, even

1289
01:20:12,439 --> 01:20:16,520
if that happened, that in no way proves that Paul

1290
01:20:17,119 --> 01:20:20,880
a guy who lived decades later, never met the students

1291
01:20:20,880 --> 01:20:23,399
of Jesus for three years, studied from his own vision,

1292
01:20:23,479 --> 01:20:27,600
started his own churches, and then argued with you know,

1293
01:20:27,680 --> 01:20:28,560
his own students.

1294
01:20:29,279 --> 01:20:31,159
Speaker 1: You know what I mean? Well, how about I make

1295
01:20:31,159 --> 01:20:34,199
the argument this way, Like, in a roundabout way, I

1296
01:20:34,239 --> 01:20:37,119
could just simply say that the only way we even

1297
01:20:37,239 --> 01:20:40,560
know who wrote Matthew or any of these gospels is

1298
01:20:40,640 --> 01:20:43,560
by the tradition of the church, and the church historically

1299
01:20:43,920 --> 01:20:46,640
has received the Pauline epistles. So that tells me that's

1300
01:20:46,640 --> 01:20:47,239
all I need to know.

1301
01:20:48,479 --> 01:20:51,199
Speaker 2: Wait, you're saying just because the guys, So Muhammad also

1302
01:20:51,319 --> 01:20:52,560
was very successful.

1303
01:20:52,119 --> 01:20:54,560
Speaker 1: In stunning stuff. Right, It's a total false analogy. It's

1304
01:20:54,600 --> 01:20:57,520
nothing like Muhammed an't saying about success. I said the

1305
01:20:57,600 --> 01:21:01,159
actual source for how you would even know that Matthew

1306
01:21:01,199 --> 01:21:04,560
the Apostle wrote the Book of Matthew is the Church's tradition.

1307
01:21:04,680 --> 01:21:07,000
So you can't actually have knowledge of things like aposto

1308
01:21:07,399 --> 01:21:10,760
authorship or the canon of Scripture without the tradition and

1309
01:21:10,840 --> 01:21:13,279
history of the Church. So that's why it's not really

1310
01:21:13,319 --> 01:21:17,760
possible to pit Paul against everybody else, because the Church,

1311
01:21:18,000 --> 01:21:20,079
which is where we get all of these texts from,

1312
01:21:20,479 --> 01:21:22,640
has already accepted and received Paul.

1313
01:21:23,640 --> 01:21:25,560
Speaker 2: I hear what you're saying, But take a step back

1314
01:21:25,600 --> 01:21:28,359
for a second. Right, your starting point is the Church.

1315
01:21:28,840 --> 01:21:31,079
You're looking backwards through the lens of the.

1316
01:21:31,119 --> 01:21:33,439
Speaker 1: Church, right, Yeah, But you're doing the same thing though.

1317
01:21:33,479 --> 01:21:36,840
If you say that you're going to cite Matthew or

1318
01:21:36,880 --> 01:21:40,800
you're going to cite Paul's epistles, to even know that

1319
01:21:40,960 --> 01:21:44,920
those are Pauline texts or Matthew and texts, it assumes

1320
01:21:44,960 --> 01:21:47,239
the tradition of the church. I hear you.

1321
01:21:47,479 --> 01:21:50,079
Speaker 2: First of all, I never said that Matthew was written

1322
01:21:50,119 --> 01:21:53,000
by Matthew, or we don't know who wrote some of

1323
01:21:53,039 --> 01:21:53,640
these other things.

1324
01:21:53,680 --> 01:21:55,640
Speaker 1: Were okay, Well, then if we don't know the authorship,

1325
01:21:55,680 --> 01:21:58,600
then your arguments setting them against would also fail because

1326
01:21:58,600 --> 01:22:01,399
we don't know who wrote them. Your argument is premised

1327
01:22:01,600 --> 01:22:04,199
Your argument was premised on Luke writing acts, Luke writing

1328
01:22:04,279 --> 01:22:05,840
Luke Paul writing to the Galatians.

1329
01:22:06,680 --> 01:22:09,000
Speaker 2: No, no, we know that Luke wrote acts much better

1330
01:22:09,079 --> 01:22:13,039
than the anonymous authors of the Gospels, much better because

1331
01:22:13,359 --> 01:22:16,800
the Gospels were anonymous, whereas these these books call out

1332
01:22:16,840 --> 01:22:19,039
who they're written by. Luke wrote them.

1333
01:22:19,199 --> 01:22:21,319
Speaker 1: How do you know what Luke that is? That's begging

1334
01:22:21,319 --> 01:22:25,159
the question. Matthew says Matthew. But Matthew who There's only

1335
01:22:25,239 --> 01:22:26,920
one dude named Matthew in the first century.

1336
01:22:27,760 --> 01:22:30,000
Speaker 2: That's fair, But Luke says, I am a student of Paul,

1337
01:22:30,039 --> 01:22:31,319
I'm companion of Paul.

1338
01:22:31,439 --> 01:22:36,079
Speaker 1: Okay, But Gospel the Gnostic texts, say Thomas, Apostle of Christ.

1339
01:22:37,000 --> 01:22:40,319
You know so that there are you aware of the

1340
01:22:40,359 --> 01:22:42,079
pseudonymous writings?

1341
01:22:42,119 --> 01:22:42,560
Speaker 19: Yeah, I was.

1342
01:22:42,560 --> 01:22:45,640
Speaker 2: Gonna say, if you pull in all these pseudopigraphical stuff,

1343
01:22:45,720 --> 01:22:49,079
you're gonna have to talk about Marcian and the heretics

1344
01:22:49,119 --> 01:22:51,920
of you know, Sinepe. You're gonna have to talk about

1345
01:22:52,239 --> 01:22:55,279
Ireneus and the four Gospels. He argued that there has

1346
01:22:55,319 --> 01:22:57,600
to be exactly four Gospels because there are four wins.

1347
01:22:57,840 --> 01:23:00,119
Do you understand how flimsy the argument did?

1348
01:23:00,199 --> 01:23:02,960
Speaker 1: I make an argument that the canon is known from Ireneus.

1349
01:23:03,000 --> 01:23:04,840
I never said that. So you're going all over the

1350
01:23:04,840 --> 01:23:06,840
place to get away from that argument.

1351
01:23:07,079 --> 01:23:08,560
Speaker 2: Was formed, It was formed.

1352
01:23:08,880 --> 01:23:11,920
Speaker 1: No, it wasn't. No, it wasn't. There was no a

1353
01:23:11,960 --> 01:23:17,000
canon explicitly universally at the time of IRUs Iraineus thought

1354
01:23:17,079 --> 01:23:19,479
that that might work, and he made various arguments. He

1355
01:23:19,520 --> 01:23:22,880
didn't dis argue from weird things. But the fact that

1356
01:23:22,920 --> 01:23:25,359
he made a weird argument, that's what is. How does

1357
01:23:25,359 --> 01:23:27,439
that disprove anything that I said about.

1358
01:23:28,680 --> 01:23:31,439
Speaker 2: What you're saying. I'm asking a question and my only

1359
01:23:31,920 --> 01:23:34,479
so I have two main questions. One of them is

1360
01:23:35,600 --> 01:23:38,479
even if Jesus rose from the dead, and the christological

1361
01:23:38,640 --> 01:23:42,359
argument that let's say William Lane Craig puts forth right,

1362
01:23:42,960 --> 01:23:46,640
you let's say give a hundred percent to that. Okay,

1363
01:23:46,840 --> 01:23:50,000
let's say proven that Jesus the Son of God raised

1364
01:23:50,000 --> 01:23:53,439
by God from the dead. Okay, what does that have

1365
01:23:53,520 --> 01:23:54,720
to do with Paul at all?

1366
01:23:58,479 --> 01:24:01,800
Speaker 1: Well? I would argue that the worldview is a holistic thing.

1367
01:24:02,079 --> 01:24:04,520
It's not a piecemeal thing. So you could go with

1368
01:24:04,600 --> 01:24:07,039
this piecemeal approach. But if you're going to go with

1369
01:24:07,039 --> 01:24:10,800
the piecemeal approach, then we would evolve into the arguments

1370
01:24:10,800 --> 01:24:12,600
that I was making about how you couldn't even know

1371
01:24:12,640 --> 01:24:15,800
who wrote what text. So you can't even argue that

1372
01:24:15,920 --> 01:24:19,760
Luke wrote Luke without arguing that the church preserved the

1373
01:24:19,800 --> 01:24:24,079
text that Luke wrote. Nobody has autographa right, Let's say.

1374
01:24:23,920 --> 01:24:26,600
Speaker 2: I agree with your argument. So that means we're in

1375
01:24:26,600 --> 01:24:28,840
a world where we are lost and we don't know

1376
01:24:28,880 --> 01:24:31,720
who wrote what, so but that we have to be okay.

1377
01:24:31,760 --> 01:24:34,560
Speaker 1: Well, then all of your arguments against Paul fall apart

1378
01:24:34,680 --> 01:24:36,640
because you don't know any of the authorship.

1379
01:24:37,880 --> 01:24:41,079
Speaker 2: No, my argument against Paul is there is not a

1380
01:24:41,119 --> 01:24:44,000
single place outside of his own writings and those of

1381
01:24:44,039 --> 01:24:45,000
his buddy Luke.

1382
01:24:45,119 --> 01:24:49,720
Speaker 1: But your argument was premised on Luke being the author

1383
01:24:49,880 --> 01:24:51,720
of Luke an Axe.

1384
01:24:51,760 --> 01:24:52,600
Speaker 3: No, let's say he wasn't.

1385
01:24:52,640 --> 01:24:54,079
Speaker 2: Let's say he wasn't. Let's say it was.

1386
01:24:54,319 --> 01:24:54,760
Speaker 1: We don't know.

1387
01:24:54,840 --> 01:24:57,720
Speaker 2: Let's say we don't know. I'm saying, if you if

1388
01:24:57,720 --> 01:25:01,880
you remove for a moment everything written by Paul according

1389
01:25:01,920 --> 01:25:05,600
to Paul himself, which is his letters, and everything written

1390
01:25:05,600 --> 01:25:08,920
by Luke according to what it says there you remove,

1391
01:25:09,079 --> 01:25:11,600
that's most of the New Testament. What you're left with

1392
01:25:12,520 --> 01:25:16,560
doesn't mention Paul or Luke at all except in one place,

1393
01:25:17,039 --> 01:25:18,880
so at all at all and.

1394
01:25:18,840 --> 01:25:20,880
Speaker 1: The one So this is just presupposing your position.

1395
01:25:21,159 --> 01:25:25,880
Speaker 2: So what No, I'm bringing evidence for what I'm saying.

1396
01:25:26,199 --> 01:25:29,640
I'm saying that it's circular authority that he gives to himself.

1397
01:25:30,720 --> 01:25:33,479
Every time he writes a letter, he's saying, I am

1398
01:25:33,880 --> 01:25:37,399
equal to the superpostles. They add nothing to my message.

1399
01:25:37,760 --> 01:25:40,560
Listen to me. And then he says, these other men

1400
01:25:40,640 --> 01:25:44,119
came to lead you astray. Don't listen to those guys.

1401
01:25:44,439 --> 01:25:46,239
Listen to me. I am your father.

1402
01:25:46,720 --> 01:25:48,680
Speaker 1: But in none of this have I ever actually heard

1403
01:25:48,680 --> 01:25:51,079
a real clear, coherent reason as to why Paul is

1404
01:25:51,159 --> 01:25:53,720
wrong or not an apostle. I just heard some gripes

1405
01:25:53,800 --> 01:25:56,000
with I didn't like the fact that he said. But

1406
01:25:56,000 --> 01:25:57,760
then when we actually got in the Galatians, he was like, yeah,

1407
01:25:57,760 --> 01:26:00,000
I'm a problem with that. So it's like, what exactly

1408
01:26:00,199 --> 01:26:01,399
is the problem I don't understand?

1409
01:26:02,640 --> 01:26:05,720
Speaker 2: Well, I have several. I'll start with the first one.

1410
01:26:05,840 --> 01:26:08,479
The first one is I don't like circular authority. Someone

1411
01:26:08,479 --> 01:26:12,079
gives him self authority and then later, thousands of years later,

1412
01:26:12,119 --> 01:26:15,520
you go, well, what's what's the problem. The problem is

1413
01:26:15,600 --> 01:26:19,560
you're supposed to give me properly rooted authority in a guy,

1414
01:26:19,720 --> 01:26:22,680
Why should I just accept it because he said it?

1415
01:26:23,159 --> 01:26:26,199
Speaker 1: Well, we don't accept Paul's authority just because Paul said it.

1416
01:26:26,520 --> 01:26:28,880
I argued that it's all part of a package deal.

1417
01:26:28,880 --> 01:26:33,560
It's an entire worldview. So if Paul's false Christianity is false,

1418
01:26:33,600 --> 01:26:35,720
the whole thing falls apart. There is no Christianity, only

1419
01:26:35,760 --> 01:26:39,680
Pauline Christianity. Only Pauline Christianity is what other one is there?

1420
01:26:40,600 --> 01:26:40,800
Speaker 9: Oh?

1421
01:26:40,800 --> 01:26:43,920
Speaker 2: My goodness, there are many studies of the life of Jesus.

1422
01:26:43,920 --> 01:26:46,239
For example, I'll give you one that I find.

1423
01:26:46,279 --> 01:26:49,840
Speaker 1: You see, this is all academic. I'm saying Christianity is

1424
01:26:49,680 --> 01:26:52,039
a religion with a liturgy and a history and a

1425
01:26:52,880 --> 01:26:58,039
lived community. What other Christianity? Not some scholars theory? What

1426
01:26:58,079 --> 01:26:59,920
other Christianity is there other than this? Though?

1427
01:27:00,800 --> 01:27:02,760
Speaker 2: Well that's what orthodox Jews say that they're the only

1428
01:27:02,800 --> 01:27:05,640
ones left, you know, and the Samaritans are gone, so

1429
01:27:05,680 --> 01:27:08,199
therefore they must be correct because they're the only link

1430
01:27:08,279 --> 01:27:10,680
to the past. Right, So you're saying the same thing kind.

1431
01:27:10,479 --> 01:27:17,800
Speaker 1: Of Oh, I see, we're saying yeah, no, yeah, I

1432
01:27:17,800 --> 01:27:20,680
would as an orthodox Christian, I would say yes, not

1433
01:27:20,840 --> 01:27:23,079
argument holes not for Orthodox Jews, but for us.

1434
01:27:24,119 --> 01:27:26,880
Speaker 2: Well, why the same Orthodox Jew said, don't listen to

1435
01:27:27,039 --> 01:27:31,560
those sects that you know faded away, listen to the

1436
01:27:31,560 --> 01:27:32,920
ones that are still around.

1437
01:27:32,800 --> 01:27:36,319
Speaker 1: Right right, Okay, Well, because we have predictions and prophecies

1438
01:27:36,359 --> 01:27:39,199
that the Church can't die. So if the Church died out,

1439
01:27:39,239 --> 01:27:41,960
if the true Church was some group of say Nazarenes

1440
01:27:42,000 --> 01:27:44,640
in the early early centuries, and then it died out

1441
01:27:44,680 --> 01:27:46,840
and then we're going to resurrect it from some scholar,

1442
01:27:47,399 --> 01:27:51,960
then the prophecies and predictions of the nations being converted

1443
01:27:52,000 --> 01:27:55,039
to Christ, to worship the God of Israel, et cetera.

1444
01:27:55,119 --> 01:27:57,920
All these you know, Isaiah prophecies and prophecies, and the

1445
01:27:57,920 --> 01:28:01,239
psalms about the Gentiles, Gus talking about you know, the

1446
01:28:01,239 --> 01:28:03,039
gates of Hell not prevailing against the Church. All of

1447
01:28:03,079 --> 01:28:06,199
those things would fail if the true Church was some

1448
01:28:06,439 --> 01:28:09,680
you know, third century Nazarite cult or something.

1449
01:28:11,079 --> 01:28:14,640
Speaker 2: Okay, interesting, because then that brings that brings up two

1450
01:28:14,720 --> 01:28:19,000
major things. One is Jeremiah thirty one. Jeremiah thirty one

1451
01:28:19,079 --> 01:28:22,520
says I I love to read the end of it verbatim,

1452
01:28:22,560 --> 01:28:26,159
but it basically says until the sun and the moon

1453
01:28:26,239 --> 01:28:29,000
and the ocean and the earth vanish from my sight.

1454
01:28:29,359 --> 01:28:33,439
My decrees will never vanish. Right, and God says Israel

1455
01:28:33,720 --> 01:28:35,840
the nation of Israel. At that time it was the

1456
01:28:35,920 --> 01:28:39,479
nation of Israel, not the Church, it says, will it

1457
01:28:39,600 --> 01:28:42,119
will always be a nation before me? Hold on, let

1458
01:28:42,119 --> 01:28:43,960
me let me read it directly. I just want to.

1459
01:28:44,159 --> 01:28:46,720
I don't want to say the wrong thing. Hold on

1460
01:28:47,199 --> 01:28:49,600
Jeremiah thirty one.

1461
01:28:49,920 --> 01:28:52,079
Speaker 1: Now, I know, yeah, we just we just read this

1462
01:28:52,159 --> 01:28:54,640
on a couple of days ago. I'm not saying if

1463
01:28:54,640 --> 01:28:57,560
I read verse sure.

1464
01:28:57,399 --> 01:29:00,800
Speaker 2: Okay, thank you, all right. This is I'm reading thirty

1465
01:29:00,800 --> 01:29:03,640
five of verse thirty five onwards to the end. This

1466
01:29:03,720 --> 01:29:06,560
is what the Lord says, He who appoints the sun

1467
01:29:06,600 --> 01:29:09,039
to shine by day, who decrees the moon and starts

1468
01:29:09,039 --> 01:29:10,800
to shine by night, who stirs up the sea so

1469
01:29:10,840 --> 01:29:13,359
that its waves roar, The Lord Almighty is his name.

1470
01:29:13,960 --> 01:29:16,760
Only of these decrees vanished from my sight, declares the Lord.

1471
01:29:16,800 --> 01:29:20,279
Will Israel ever cease to be cease being a nation

1472
01:29:20,399 --> 01:29:23,239
before me? This is what the Lord says. Only of

1473
01:29:23,279 --> 01:29:25,720
the heavens above can be measured, and the foundations of

1474
01:29:25,720 --> 01:29:28,800
the earth below searched out. Will I reject the descendants

1475
01:29:29,239 --> 01:29:31,359
of Israel? Because of all they have done, declares the Lord.

1476
01:29:31,399 --> 01:29:34,359
And this is the last few verses. The days are coming,

1477
01:29:34,399 --> 01:29:38,760
declares the Lord. When this city will be rebuilt for me,

1478
01:29:39,079 --> 01:29:42,039
meaning the city of Jerusalem, from the tower of Hananel

1479
01:29:42,159 --> 01:29:45,159
to the corner gate. The measuring line will stretch from

1480
01:29:45,199 --> 01:29:48,560
there straight to the Kail of Goap. It's very specific,

1481
01:29:49,119 --> 01:29:51,560
and turned to Goah. The whole valley where the dead

1482
01:29:51,560 --> 01:29:53,760
bodies and ashes are thrown, and the terraces out to

1483
01:29:53,760 --> 01:29:55,840
the Kidrun valley in the east, which is by the

1484
01:29:55,880 --> 01:29:59,039
way in Jerusalem east. As far as the corner of

1485
01:29:59,039 --> 01:30:01,359
the horse gate will be hould to the Lord. And

1486
01:30:01,439 --> 01:30:03,960
this is the most important part. The city will never

1487
01:30:04,079 --> 01:30:08,359
again be appruded or demolished. So by your logic, if

1488
01:30:08,359 --> 01:30:11,560
the profits are correct, Israel will be rebuilt, and there

1489
01:30:11,560 --> 01:30:14,359
will be a city there will Jerusalem. It will never

1490
01:30:14,439 --> 01:30:17,560
be appruded or demolished, and the nation of Israel will

1491
01:30:17,560 --> 01:30:20,399
never cease to be a nation. So before the.

1492
01:30:20,359 --> 01:30:24,000
Speaker 1: Lord, Jeremiah is talking about in the immediate context the

1493
01:30:24,079 --> 01:30:28,119
return from captivity and the rebuilding that occurred. If you

1494
01:30:28,159 --> 01:30:32,439
go to Jeremiah thirty three, go a couple chapters over, but.

1495
01:30:32,479 --> 01:30:33,760
Speaker 2: It says the city will never again.

1496
01:30:33,840 --> 01:30:39,079
Speaker 1: I'm gonna explain that. Go to Jeremiah thirty three. Okay,

1497
01:30:41,119 --> 01:30:44,039
the days are coming, he says, when this is verse fourteen,

1498
01:30:44,159 --> 01:30:46,079
I will perform the good thing which I promised to

1499
01:30:46,119 --> 01:30:49,359
Israel and to Judah in those days. At that time

1500
01:30:49,399 --> 01:30:51,960
I will cause to grow up to David a branch

1501
01:30:52,000 --> 01:30:55,239
of righteousness. He will execute judgment and righteouness in the earth.

1502
01:30:55,760 --> 01:30:57,640
In those days you will be saved, and Jerusalm will

1503
01:30:57,680 --> 01:31:00,640
dwell safely. This is the name that she will be called,

1504
01:31:00,880 --> 01:31:04,520
the Lord our righteousness. For thus says the Lord, David,

1505
01:31:04,600 --> 01:31:07,279
will never lack a man to sit on the throne

1506
01:31:07,319 --> 01:31:10,079
of the House of Israel, nor the priest, nor the levites,

1507
01:31:10,079 --> 01:31:14,199
nor anyone to lack norther levice, lack a man to

1508
01:31:14,279 --> 01:31:17,239
offer burnt offering before me, or kindle the green offerings

1509
01:31:17,520 --> 01:31:21,039
and the sacrifice continually. This is the work of the Lord.

1510
01:31:21,159 --> 01:31:22,760
This is the word Lord, the King. To Jeremiah, says,

1511
01:31:22,760 --> 01:31:24,000
if you can break my covenant with day and night.

1512
01:31:24,119 --> 01:31:27,359
So it's parallel with the reference to the promises of

1513
01:31:27,399 --> 01:31:30,319
providence and the noea covenant in thirty three, that we

1514
01:31:30,479 --> 01:31:35,399
just continue, Yeah, that you just don't what you just

1515
01:31:35,399 --> 01:31:38,680
read in thirty one is also referencing the NOEA covenant, right,

1516
01:31:38,720 --> 01:31:41,640
So both of these statements are making a promise about

1517
01:31:42,199 --> 01:31:45,840
when this will occur and when this will never be forgotten.

1518
01:31:45,880 --> 01:31:49,079
There will never cease to be what descendants of David

1519
01:31:49,199 --> 01:31:53,199
sitting on the throne from the time of Jeremiah after

1520
01:31:53,319 --> 01:31:57,119
seventy a d have there been a lack of descendants

1521
01:31:57,159 --> 01:31:58,640
on David's.

1522
01:31:58,239 --> 01:32:01,479
Speaker 2: Throne, of course, And this is why I'm saying so.

1523
01:32:03,199 --> 01:32:09,359
Speaker 1: The fulfillment is the resurrection of Christ. Psalm one, the

1524
01:32:09,399 --> 01:32:11,760
Lord said to my Lord, sit at my right hand

1525
01:32:12,239 --> 01:32:15,119
until I make your enemies your footstool. The Lord will

1526
01:32:15,159 --> 01:32:17,880
send the rod of your strength out of Zion rule

1527
01:32:17,880 --> 01:32:20,840
in the midst of your enemies. The predictions in both

1528
01:32:20,840 --> 01:32:24,520
of these passages are to the church that Jesus established,

1529
01:32:24,680 --> 01:32:27,399
and that's why when he ascended an Acts and the

1530
01:32:27,439 --> 01:32:30,319
New Testament, every time it cites one ten, it cites

1531
01:32:30,399 --> 01:32:33,520
Palm one ten about his ascension as the beginning of

1532
01:32:33,560 --> 01:32:35,920
his reign in Zion. Zion is the Church.

1533
01:32:37,800 --> 01:32:40,680
Speaker 2: So I just want to understand your position first and

1534
01:32:40,720 --> 01:32:44,079
steal man your position right before I respond. So you're

1535
01:32:44,119 --> 01:32:49,720
saying that Jesus is sort of a substitution for these prophecies.

1536
01:32:49,159 --> 01:32:51,000
Speaker 1: Meaning He is the prophecy.

1537
01:32:51,520 --> 01:32:53,640
Speaker 2: He is the prophecy. So when it says that you

1538
01:32:53,680 --> 01:32:56,520
know the reason I read the measuring line and the

1539
01:32:56,560 --> 01:33:01,159
gate and the valley, the Kidron valley, these are very specific.

1540
01:33:01,960 --> 01:33:05,720
Speaker 1: God is the specifics, right, the specifics referred to when

1541
01:33:06,000 --> 01:33:11,279
the Jews return from Babylonian captivity. That's the historical immediate context, right.

1542
01:33:11,880 --> 01:33:17,119
The fulfillment is the Messianic fulfillment. Disagree, Okay, I got it.

1543
01:33:17,159 --> 01:33:19,079
I know you don't believe it. But the Messianic fulfillment

1544
01:33:19,359 --> 01:33:22,439
is just like when Jesus is arguing with the Pharisees

1545
01:33:22,600 --> 01:33:25,600
and Jesus says, then who is David talking to when

1546
01:33:25,640 --> 01:33:27,479
he says, my Lord said the Lord said to my

1547
01:33:27,520 --> 01:33:29,560
Lord in some one ten. I'm saying, it's the same

1548
01:33:29,600 --> 01:33:33,359
principle in Jeremiah thirty three that David will never lack

1549
01:33:33,439 --> 01:33:36,159
a man to sit on the throne. How is that

1550
01:33:36,199 --> 01:33:39,600
fulfilled if after seventy a d there's no dividic throne. Well,

1551
01:33:39,680 --> 01:33:42,439
turns out Jesus has been on the throne. He's the

1552
01:33:42,439 --> 01:33:45,279
son of David, and he's been reigning since his ascension

1553
01:33:45,279 --> 01:33:47,199
and he will always reign. That's how he will never

1554
01:33:47,279 --> 01:33:47,920
lack him in it.

1555
01:33:48,600 --> 01:33:52,119
Speaker 2: I understand your interpretation, and it has a few things

1556
01:33:52,159 --> 01:33:54,680
going for it, right, like the fact that Jews don't

1557
01:33:54,720 --> 01:33:57,520
have sacrifices for the last two thousand years either.

1558
01:33:57,640 --> 01:34:00,600
Speaker 1: Well, it's also Genesis. It's also Genesis forty nine, which

1559
01:34:00,640 --> 01:34:05,640
says that right until Shiloh comes, right there will not

1560
01:34:05,760 --> 01:34:12,000
be the scepter will not depart from Judah until the

1561
01:34:12,079 --> 01:34:13,199
lawgiver comes.

1562
01:34:13,720 --> 01:34:17,279
Speaker 2: All right, but let me tell you what an alternative

1563
01:34:17,479 --> 01:34:21,520
interpretation that fits everything. And in fact Christians believe this

1564
01:34:21,560 --> 01:34:25,359
one also, and that is in the future, maybe the

1565
01:34:25,399 --> 01:34:28,439
near future, who knows, because Israel has been sort of

1566
01:34:28,479 --> 01:34:31,960
constituted now and nobody could have believed it two hundred

1567
01:34:32,039 --> 01:34:37,600
years ago. That there will be everything will be rebuilt,

1568
01:34:37,840 --> 01:34:40,920
as it says in Jeremiah thirty one, and the third

1569
01:34:40,960 --> 01:34:44,640
Temple will be there and the sacrifices will come, and

1570
01:34:44,760 --> 01:34:48,119
from that point on it will never be approuded or

1571
01:34:48,479 --> 01:34:52,119
meaning it hasn't happened yet obviously, because until now it

1572
01:34:52,199 --> 01:34:56,560
has been approuded demolished, And you're right, there hasn't been

1573
01:34:56,720 --> 01:35:00,359
people sitting on the throne. What the prophecy may be about,

1574
01:35:00,720 --> 01:35:02,960
and a lot of these prophecies have been could have

1575
01:35:03,000 --> 01:35:05,880
been in the far future, which hasn't even happened yet,

1576
01:35:06,079 --> 01:35:09,600
just like Jesus prophecies as well well.

1577
01:35:09,640 --> 01:35:12,520
Speaker 1: But if you look at Luke twenty one, Jesus is

1578
01:35:12,520 --> 01:35:15,359
talking about the destruction of the Temple. It's very clear

1579
01:35:15,359 --> 01:35:18,399
because that was written to Gentiles. It's not talking about

1580
01:35:18,560 --> 01:35:20,600
primarily the end of the world. I think the Temple

1581
01:35:20,680 --> 01:35:22,760
is a type of the whole universe. So there's a

1582
01:35:22,800 --> 01:35:26,359
three tier structure to the Temple, and that's why Hebrews

1583
01:35:26,399 --> 01:35:29,520
says that when the high priest goes into the Holy

1584
01:35:29,560 --> 01:35:31,640
of Holies on the day of Atonement, that's a type,

1585
01:35:32,000 --> 01:35:34,680
according to the author of Hebrews, of Christ ascending into

1586
01:35:34,720 --> 01:35:37,359
the third heavens, the Holy of Holies, God's throne. So

1587
01:35:37,399 --> 01:35:39,800
in that sense, the destruction of the Temple in seventy

1588
01:35:39,800 --> 01:35:43,319
eighty is a foreshadowing of the destruction of the universe.

1589
01:35:43,359 --> 01:35:48,479
I would say, but why does Genesis to go along

1590
01:35:48,520 --> 01:35:52,439
with this theme of fulfillment at the First Advent. Why

1591
01:35:52,479 --> 01:35:56,079
does Genesis say that the scepter will not depart from

1592
01:35:56,159 --> 01:35:59,800
Judah until the Lawgiver comes, until Shiloh comes.

1593
01:36:00,319 --> 01:36:05,079
Speaker 2: Because I'll tell you, first of all, Shiloh was already

1594
01:36:05,880 --> 01:36:08,159
it was an earlier time than Jesus. It was about

1595
01:36:08,159 --> 01:36:11,560
a thousand years before Shiloh was a city, and the

1596
01:36:11,720 --> 01:36:16,800
ark was in Shiloh. But before that Judah was. Remember,

1597
01:36:16,880 --> 01:36:20,800
each of the tribes got a place, got a piece

1598
01:36:20,800 --> 01:36:24,319
of land, right, okay, And so the Ark of the

1599
01:36:24,359 --> 01:36:29,399
Covenant would travel. Each of the brothers got something. So

1600
01:36:29,760 --> 01:36:33,159
when it says that the scepter wouldn't depart from Judah,

1601
01:36:33,239 --> 01:36:35,680
it can mean one of two things. It can mean

1602
01:36:35,720 --> 01:36:39,600
that no other tribe or a descendant could be a king.

1603
01:36:40,479 --> 01:36:42,880
So it couldn't be that suddenly, you know, some other

1604
01:36:43,119 --> 01:36:46,680
lineage would become king. In fact, Jesus the biographers had

1605
01:36:46,720 --> 01:36:49,119
to go and find the lineage for him exactly for

1606
01:36:49,199 --> 01:36:53,199
that reason, because we know that every king of Israel

1607
01:36:53,319 --> 01:36:55,760
has to go from David. Now, are there gonna be

1608
01:36:55,960 --> 01:36:59,279
periods where there won't be anyone on the throne, of course,

1609
01:36:59,560 --> 01:37:02,800
but there will be someone on the throne. It has

1610
01:37:02,840 --> 01:37:05,319
to be a descendant, and that's what it means.

1611
01:37:06,039 --> 01:37:08,840
Speaker 1: Well, But isn't it interesting that, like Daniel nine says

1612
01:37:08,920 --> 01:37:12,239
that when he came, there's an end, he's cut off.

1613
01:37:12,279 --> 01:37:17,119
There's an end to sacrifice, just like in Genesis forty nine,

1614
01:37:17,720 --> 01:37:21,359
the lawgiver, the dividic kingdom ends.

1615
01:37:21,159 --> 01:37:25,199
Speaker 2: There's no more dividing anything that is in the first

1616
01:37:25,199 --> 01:37:30,199
five books, which is the Torah you got the Sadducees. Sorry,

1617
01:37:30,359 --> 01:37:33,880
this is the Samaritans have a Pentateuch, which they only

1618
01:37:33,920 --> 01:37:37,520
believe those five books. They don't believe the prophet right,

1619
01:37:37,560 --> 01:37:39,119
and this is the time of Jesus. By the way,

1620
01:37:39,119 --> 01:37:41,239
I'm just telling the listeners who might not be aware

1621
01:37:41,239 --> 01:37:45,039
of this. During the time of Jesus, the Northern Kingdom

1622
01:37:45,439 --> 01:37:49,039
was filled with Samaritans. Even today it's called Samaria, Judah

1623
01:37:49,039 --> 01:37:52,000
and Samaria by the Jews, which is interesting because the

1624
01:37:52,000 --> 01:37:56,319
Samaritans were like numbering maybe a million people, and so

1625
01:37:57,319 --> 01:37:59,520
these people did not believe in the prophets or the

1626
01:37:59,560 --> 01:38:01,359
other book, so they just believed in the five books.

1627
01:38:01,359 --> 01:38:05,239
My point is this, those five books they say that

1628
01:38:05,319 --> 01:38:08,359
there will be a king, but they're also leave it

1629
01:38:08,399 --> 01:38:11,439
open like there might not be a king because Samuel

1630
01:38:11,640 --> 01:38:14,520
told Israel that, you know, guys, maybe you shouldn't have.

1631
01:38:14,439 --> 01:38:18,000
Speaker 1: A king at all. So I mean, look, it is

1632
01:38:18,279 --> 01:38:21,960
do you do you think like as far as I'm aware.

1633
01:38:22,159 --> 01:38:24,720
I mean, I have rabbinic commentaries and you know, Jewish

1634
01:38:24,720 --> 01:38:26,880
study Bible, this kind of stuff, Like, do you think

1635
01:38:26,920 --> 01:38:29,960
that Genesis forty nine ten is a Messianic prophecy?

1636
01:38:30,840 --> 01:38:35,239
Speaker 2: Let me look at it, Genesis forty nine to ten. Sorry,

1637
01:38:35,279 --> 01:38:40,520
I'm not familiar with everything that passage. Yeah, okay, that

1638
01:38:40,720 --> 01:38:45,079
the rulers staff between his feet. Okay, so this is

1639
01:38:45,079 --> 01:38:48,680
where Israel? Who is Jacob?

1640
01:38:48,920 --> 01:38:51,199
Speaker 1: I'm just saying, like, classic Judaism saw this as a

1641
01:38:51,239 --> 01:38:53,720
messian prophecy, right, It's in the targems, this is scena

1642
01:38:53,840 --> 01:38:54,399
maybe yeah.

1643
01:38:54,319 --> 01:38:58,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, but remember that all these later generations, including the Talmud,

1644
01:38:58,800 --> 01:39:01,760
they look at this and the genres of sort of

1645
01:39:01,800 --> 01:39:03,600
like one hundred years of this genre. On hundred years

1646
01:39:03,640 --> 01:39:07,960
of that genre. It's had a genre called Yeah, it's

1647
01:39:08,000 --> 01:39:10,439
like ex of Jesus. Everyone's got their ex Jesus, right,

1648
01:39:10,800 --> 01:39:14,159
And so these are men, these are men, and you

1649
01:39:14,159 --> 01:39:16,520
you as Christians, agree that these are men trying to

1650
01:39:16,680 --> 01:39:19,079
understand these scriptures correct.

1651
01:39:19,439 --> 01:39:22,119
Speaker 1: Well and argue it's Jesus that is the god of

1652
01:39:22,159 --> 01:39:25,039
the Old Testament and he's the one that's inspiring these

1653
01:39:25,079 --> 01:39:28,560
people to write this stuff. So no, I don't I mean, yeah,

1654
01:39:28,600 --> 01:39:30,880
men are writing these things. I don't think that it's

1655
01:39:30,920 --> 01:39:33,720
that there's no human synergy or anything going on, but

1656
01:39:34,319 --> 01:39:36,560
it's ultimately I think a divine inspiration.

1657
01:39:37,800 --> 01:39:40,119
Speaker 2: Well, it's hard to say because there were so many

1658
01:39:40,119 --> 01:39:41,079
different sects.

1659
01:39:40,760 --> 01:39:42,920
Speaker 1: At the time of Jesus. Okay, well, look, I mean

1660
01:39:43,560 --> 01:39:46,800
all right, so basically in this view, then we can

1661
01:39:46,920 --> 01:39:49,000
make this into anything. This is where it gets into

1662
01:39:49,079 --> 01:39:51,760
like a This is almost like the way Muslims do

1663
01:39:51,920 --> 01:39:54,199
or Jews do with the Talmud, to the Muslims with

1664
01:39:54,239 --> 01:39:56,960
the Hadids, Like we can really craft this into anything.

1665
01:39:57,039 --> 01:39:59,600
Speaker 2: Right, I don't want to craft No, I don't even

1666
01:39:59,600 --> 01:40:02,640
go by evidence. Right, And remember what I said in

1667
01:40:02,680 --> 01:40:04,560
the beginning how we got into this. I said, I

1668
01:40:04,600 --> 01:40:09,840
have two problems. One is, you said, according to the prophecies,

1669
01:40:10,079 --> 01:40:13,479
we have to take it seriously. I brought up Jeremiah

1670
01:40:13,520 --> 01:40:16,520
thirty one to show that he predicts stuff that hasn't

1671
01:40:16,560 --> 01:40:19,880
happened yet. It couldn't have happened yet because the physical Yeah.

1672
01:40:19,880 --> 01:40:21,399
Speaker 1: And then when I well, hold on, but then when

1673
01:40:21,399 --> 01:40:23,840
I show you the same wording two chapters later that

1674
01:40:23,920 --> 01:40:26,199
David will never lack a man, you say, oh, well,

1675
01:40:26,199 --> 01:40:28,479
but then we can have situations where that doesn't really

1676
01:40:28,560 --> 01:40:30,800
mean David never lacks a man. So in other words,

1677
01:40:31,479 --> 01:40:32,640
you can interpret it well.

1678
01:40:32,960 --> 01:40:34,439
Speaker 2: I just want to be clear from that point on,

1679
01:40:34,600 --> 01:40:36,880
David will not lack a man. From the point where

1680
01:40:36,920 --> 01:40:40,079
the third Temple is rebuilt and the city is rebuilt,

1681
01:40:40,119 --> 01:40:43,199
from that point it will never be approveded. So logically

1682
01:40:43,279 --> 01:40:46,720
it hasn't happened yet because it has been approveded, so

1683
01:40:46,880 --> 01:40:47,680
there must.

1684
01:40:47,399 --> 01:40:50,680
Speaker 1: It must be in the future or or the fulfillment

1685
01:40:50,760 --> 01:40:53,960
is the ascension of Christ. And that's how God kept

1686
01:40:54,000 --> 01:40:57,239
the covenant and never denied the covenant. Even though he

1687
01:40:57,319 --> 01:40:59,960
said in Jeremiah three and in Joseiah two that he

1688
01:41:00,039 --> 01:41:03,840
would divorce Israel. When was the divorce? So when was

1689
01:41:03,880 --> 01:41:04,399
the divorce?

1690
01:41:05,319 --> 01:41:07,560
Speaker 2: First of all, he never he never said I will

1691
01:41:07,640 --> 01:41:08,319
reject Israel.

1692
01:41:08,359 --> 01:41:14,600
Speaker 1: No, no divorce, you said, you said, He never said that. No.

1693
01:41:14,600 --> 01:41:16,600
Speaker 2: No. God says over and over that he will gather

1694
01:41:16,720 --> 01:41:18,920
Israel back from the furthest parts of the euroe.

1695
01:41:18,960 --> 01:41:21,439
Speaker 1: I'm not talking I know the promises of return. I'm

1696
01:41:21,439 --> 01:41:24,279
talking about the statements of divorce. What are the How

1697
01:41:24,279 --> 01:41:25,119
do you interpret those?

1698
01:41:26,680 --> 01:41:29,279
Speaker 2: Can you give me the exact versus reject.

1699
01:41:29,079 --> 01:41:31,359
Speaker 1: Jeremy the first one is Jeremiah three to eight.

1700
01:41:33,359 --> 01:41:36,439
Speaker 2: Okay, Jeremiah was made to marry a prostitute.

1701
01:41:36,479 --> 01:41:38,640
Speaker 1: And so now Jeremiah, don't.

1702
01:41:39,840 --> 01:41:44,439
Speaker 2: No, but I'm saying, I'm giving you the context. Jeremiah

1703
01:41:44,479 --> 01:41:47,159
was even told by the Lord to marry a prostitute,

1704
01:41:47,159 --> 01:41:47,880
if I remember correct.

1705
01:41:47,920 --> 01:41:51,520
Speaker 1: Now, Jeremiah's Hoseiah jose Oh, I'm so sorry. All right,

1706
01:41:51,560 --> 01:41:55,239
But Hoseiah is the other text that says that God

1707
01:41:55,279 --> 01:41:57,560
will divorce Israel. There's two passages there.

1708
01:41:57,560 --> 01:42:00,520
Speaker 2: You go, look, it's an imagery, just like Jesus was

1709
01:42:00,560 --> 01:42:03,600
giving imagery about plucking an eye out for having your

1710
01:42:03,600 --> 01:42:04,000
old body.

1711
01:42:04,039 --> 01:42:06,960
Speaker 1: Okay, but what I'm saying is that your interpretation says, well,

1712
01:42:06,960 --> 01:42:10,319
it's just imagery. My interpretation actually explains how there was

1713
01:42:10,359 --> 01:42:13,680
a divorce, but also God kept faithful because the real

1714
01:42:13,800 --> 01:42:16,800
Israel is those who have faith in Christ. That fulfills

1715
01:42:16,800 --> 01:42:20,119
Genesis twelve that all the nations are blessed in abraham seed.

1716
01:42:20,159 --> 01:42:23,880
If Abraham's seed ultimately is those who have faith in Yahweh,

1717
01:42:24,000 --> 01:42:29,039
not just biological descent, then that fulfills both the passages

1718
01:42:29,079 --> 01:42:32,119
of Jeremiah thirty three and Jeremiah three and Joseiah two

1719
01:42:32,279 --> 01:42:33,800
of a divorce for.

1720
01:42:33,880 --> 01:42:36,520
Speaker 2: While, I'm happy for more people to have faith in

1721
01:42:36,600 --> 01:42:40,359
God and to follow his commandments, even if said no

1722
01:42:40,520 --> 01:42:43,159
hide commandments, I'm very happy about that. So that's a

1723
01:42:43,199 --> 01:42:46,920
good thing. All I'm saying is that you got to

1724
01:42:47,000 --> 01:42:49,439
understand in the time of Jeremiah what was happening. There

1725
01:42:49,479 --> 01:42:52,319
was an exile, the Jews were worried that they might

1726
01:42:52,359 --> 01:42:56,600
not return, and in Jeremiah saying, hey, God is currently

1727
01:42:56,680 --> 01:42:59,920
mad at you. He's faithful to you, so you are

1728
01:43:00,119 --> 01:43:04,079
the one who has broken the covenant. So in his time,

1729
01:43:04,119 --> 01:43:07,439
he's not thinking about Jesus. It could be later you

1730
01:43:07,439 --> 01:43:10,039
could say maybe it's a prototype.

1731
01:43:09,439 --> 01:43:12,439
Speaker 1: Of Jesus war. I'm saying, okay, but I'm not saying

1732
01:43:12,439 --> 01:43:15,479
that Jeremi is immediately thinking of Jesus when he says

1733
01:43:16,199 --> 01:43:20,560
that you will be divorced. It's You're correct that during

1734
01:43:20,600 --> 01:43:23,680
the period of exile in the babylon in captivity, there

1735
01:43:23,720 --> 01:43:27,239
is this concern have we been forsaken? And Jeremi is

1736
01:43:27,319 --> 01:43:29,840
using the language of Deuteronomy twenty four of the Bill

1737
01:43:29,880 --> 01:43:33,199
of Divorce when God says that a man who wants

1738
01:43:33,239 --> 01:43:35,760
to find that his wife is unfaithful, he can give

1739
01:43:35,760 --> 01:43:37,680
her a bill of divorce. And so forth. So the

1740
01:43:37,760 --> 01:43:41,239
language of Deuteronomi twenty four is being used in Jeremiah

1741
01:43:41,640 --> 01:43:46,319
three to say you've been unfaithful, You're going to be divorced.

1742
01:43:46,399 --> 01:43:48,720
Now they're brought back to the land, so they're not

1743
01:43:49,199 --> 01:43:52,159
at this stage divorced. What I'm saying is that in

1744
01:43:52,199 --> 01:43:55,800
the Christian interpretation, in the passage, like Matthew twenty three,

1745
01:43:55,960 --> 01:44:00,279
Jesus says that because Israel is rejecting her living horror

1746
01:44:00,319 --> 01:44:02,960
of the Messiah, and let's say for the sake of argument,

1747
01:44:03,000 --> 01:44:06,359
that Jesus is the Messiah, then the fullness of the

1748
01:44:06,439 --> 01:44:10,000
sins from all of these passages, including not just the

1749
01:44:10,039 --> 01:44:15,039
predictions of salvation and restoration, but also the Covenant sanctions,

1750
01:44:15,399 --> 01:44:18,600
the Bill of Divorce, the warnings come to their full fruition.

1751
01:44:19,199 --> 01:44:22,800
That's why seventy eighty leads to the destruction of Jerusalem, which,

1752
01:44:23,119 --> 01:44:26,239
if you're consistent and you believe in the Covenant curses

1753
01:44:26,239 --> 01:44:31,079
of Deuteronomy and Leviticus, then clearly, whatever you think of Jesus,

1754
01:44:31,079 --> 01:44:34,239
there had to have also been a cursing in diaspora

1755
01:44:34,279 --> 01:44:37,359
in seventy eighty, which is Covenant curses. So it would

1756
01:44:37,359 --> 01:44:42,199
be yet another statement of Jeremiah three Bill of Divorce. Right,

1757
01:44:42,239 --> 01:44:44,239
So if at the battle I see where you're.

1758
01:44:44,359 --> 01:44:46,880
Speaker 2: I see where you're coming from. And I agree about

1759
01:44:46,960 --> 01:44:51,880
the junomy predictions of expulsion and then later gathering when

1760
01:44:51,920 --> 01:44:55,760
the Jews return spiritually to God right in their distant lands.

1761
01:44:55,920 --> 01:44:59,039
But again, I want to ask you when when Jeremiah

1762
01:44:59,039 --> 01:45:03,199
says thirty one, verse thirty seven, he says, this is

1763
01:45:03,199 --> 01:45:05,560
what the Lord says. Only if the heavens above can

1764
01:45:05,600 --> 01:45:08,239
be measured in the foundations of the earth below searched out,

1765
01:45:08,520 --> 01:45:11,119
will I ever reject the descendance of Israel because of

1766
01:45:11,159 --> 01:45:12,920
all they have done the Lord?

1767
01:45:13,199 --> 01:45:16,279
Speaker 1: And I'm saying that that I'm saying that that promise

1768
01:45:17,039 --> 01:45:21,199
was always to those that had the true faith and

1769
01:45:21,279 --> 01:45:24,520
not merely the biological descent. So you're saying that ultimately

1770
01:45:24,560 --> 01:45:28,600
that's to the biological descent. I'm saying no, No, it's ultimately

1771
01:45:28,640 --> 01:45:31,840
to those who have the faith of God and love Him.

1772
01:45:31,840 --> 01:45:36,640
And that's not just Jewish people, because it's also before Abraham.

1773
01:45:36,640 --> 01:45:39,079
It's people like Noah. So they're all part of that

1774
01:45:39,119 --> 01:45:41,039
heavenly city. They're all part of the same faith.

1775
01:45:43,199 --> 01:45:45,840
Speaker 2: This is I think we should get into this topic

1776
01:45:45,880 --> 01:45:48,800
because this was your original topic, like the super sessionism, right,

1777
01:45:49,119 --> 01:45:49,720
the truth.

1778
01:45:49,800 --> 01:45:52,520
Speaker 1: It's a fulfillment. It's not a superseding. It's literally like

1779
01:45:52,600 --> 01:45:55,199
it's it's more like a te lo ort, a purpose,

1780
01:45:55,359 --> 01:46:01,720
like you know, culmination, more so than like fulfillment. Fulfillment

1781
01:46:01,840 --> 01:46:02,399
is a good word.

1782
01:46:03,039 --> 01:46:06,119
Speaker 2: I'll get to that word fulfillment because it's used when

1783
01:46:06,199 --> 01:46:09,720
Jesus talks about I'll read the read letter Bible of

1784
01:46:09,840 --> 01:46:13,079
Jesus next. But I just want to get onto this

1785
01:46:13,119 --> 01:46:13,520
for a second.

1786
01:46:13,720 --> 01:46:16,119
Speaker 1: Let's let's make it. Let's we got let's We've got

1787
01:46:16,119 --> 01:46:18,439
a lot of people, so let's do this one. No,

1788
01:46:18,560 --> 01:46:20,439
you can make this last argument. Go ahead and make

1789
01:46:20,439 --> 01:46:22,560
your last argument. I'll give you the final word here

1790
01:46:22,600 --> 01:46:24,720
and then we'll take the next scholars. But it was

1791
01:46:24,760 --> 01:46:26,520
a really great discussion, discussion. I want you to call

1792
01:46:26,560 --> 01:46:28,560
back in if you want to sometime, but we're going

1793
01:46:28,600 --> 01:46:31,520
to move on to the other one. What's that? Thank you?

1794
01:46:32,039 --> 01:46:33,119
Speaker 2: Thank you? Okay, follow me?

1795
01:46:33,199 --> 01:46:34,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love this.

1796
01:46:35,119 --> 01:46:38,119
Speaker 2: I'm a Jewish person, but I do believe in Jesus

1797
01:46:38,199 --> 01:46:42,119
being the Messiah. I you know, I'm a monotheist, so

1798
01:46:42,239 --> 01:46:45,279
I don't think that Jesus is God. But I don't

1799
01:46:45,319 --> 01:46:47,600
think Jesus claimed to be God. But anyways, give me

1800
01:46:48,560 --> 01:46:49,920
sixty seconds, I'll try to.

1801
01:46:50,039 --> 01:46:50,600
Speaker 1: Get my point.

1802
01:46:51,399 --> 01:46:55,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, if you look at all the Torah, the five

1803
01:46:55,680 --> 01:46:58,039
Books of Moses, or you know, the first five books,

1804
01:46:58,479 --> 01:47:00,479
it always talks about biological sentence.

1805
01:47:00,720 --> 01:47:02,680
Speaker 1: The word door means generation.

1806
01:47:03,359 --> 01:47:07,680
Speaker 2: This is a statute for all generations means biological generations.

1807
01:47:07,680 --> 01:47:12,159
Obviously when it talks about you know, the generations after Noah,

1808
01:47:12,199 --> 01:47:13,840
and it counts a number of years, So this is

1809
01:47:13,840 --> 01:47:18,319
talking about physical biological generations. Jeremiah thirty one talks about

1810
01:47:18,359 --> 01:47:21,600
physical places like the value the kidrun valley and how

1811
01:47:21,640 --> 01:47:24,319
this will be rebuilt to this you know, over here,

1812
01:47:24,479 --> 01:47:24,920
and it will.

1813
01:47:24,840 --> 01:47:25,720
Speaker 1: Never be appruded.

1814
01:47:25,760 --> 01:47:28,359
Speaker 2: So to me, I mean I read this literally. I

1815
01:47:28,399 --> 01:47:31,520
think that it hasn't happened yet because it has been uprooted,

1816
01:47:31,800 --> 01:47:34,880
but in the future it hasn't. Now. Christians believe that

1817
01:47:35,000 --> 01:47:37,840
Jesus came on a donkey, and he will come on

1818
01:47:37,880 --> 01:47:41,039
the clouds of glory in the future. Jews also believe

1819
01:47:41,199 --> 01:47:43,439
that the Messiah will come either on a donkey or

1820
01:47:43,520 --> 01:47:45,520
on the clouds of glory, and I like to tell

1821
01:47:45,560 --> 01:47:48,119
them he's going to come on both. He came once

1822
01:47:48,159 --> 01:47:49,680
on a donkey. Next time he's going to come on

1823
01:47:49,720 --> 01:47:53,039
the clouds of glory. Here's where I have an issue

1824
01:47:53,359 --> 01:47:56,880
with the whole Christianity. When I said Christianity, I mean

1825
01:47:57,279 --> 01:48:01,760
the church that came up later. Here's including Orthox Church.

1826
01:48:01,840 --> 01:48:02,840
Speaker 1: Here's what I have a problem with.

1827
01:48:04,399 --> 01:48:07,680
Speaker 2: The church that Jesus himself set up in Jerusalem was

1828
01:48:07,720 --> 01:48:12,640
also unfortunately destroyed when the Romans destroyed Jerusalem and they

1829
01:48:12,640 --> 01:48:15,960
fade into history. So in other words, James the brother

1830
01:48:16,039 --> 01:48:21,000
of Jesus Jacobosen Greek. You know, yeah, his children are

1831
01:48:21,079 --> 01:48:21,600
kind of ruling.

1832
01:48:21,560 --> 01:48:24,079
Speaker 1: All right, Well, this is moving on to other arguments.

1833
01:48:24,079 --> 01:48:27,319
So I got your point about the biological descendants, and

1834
01:48:27,399 --> 01:48:30,920
I agree that the immediate contexts at the time of

1835
01:48:31,159 --> 01:48:33,640
you know, the promise to Abraham, God is really saying

1836
01:48:33,680 --> 01:48:38,279
that your descendants, through you know, Isaac, you know, et cetera,

1837
01:48:38,479 --> 01:48:41,279
not through Ishmael, that will be the covenant. Just like

1838
01:48:41,359 --> 01:48:43,520
if you go back prior to it being a tribe,

1839
01:48:43,560 --> 01:48:46,640
it was a family. So with Noah it was his household.

1840
01:48:47,000 --> 01:48:49,720
Prior to that it was Adam and Eve and their children.

1841
01:48:49,800 --> 01:48:55,039
So I'm not denying the actual literal, historical biological element,

1842
01:48:55,159 --> 01:48:59,359
but I'm saying that even amongst the biological elements. It

1843
01:48:59,399 --> 01:49:02,199
is not all Israel that is Israel, as Paul says,

1844
01:49:02,560 --> 01:49:04,800
so it would still be even in the time of

1845
01:49:04,840 --> 01:49:09,600
Jeremiah when he rebukes the Jews, he says, circumcise your hearts. Right,

1846
01:49:09,720 --> 01:49:11,840
That's the same point that Paul makes when he talks

1847
01:49:11,880 --> 01:49:14,920
about the purpose of baptism is to show that you

1848
01:49:15,039 --> 01:49:18,279
have actually circumcised your heart. So it was always the

1849
01:49:18,359 --> 01:49:21,600
case that you needed to circumcise your heart. That was

1850
01:49:21,640 --> 01:49:25,600
the only thing that that's what really saved you, so

1851
01:49:25,640 --> 01:49:28,800
to speak. Even though yes, of course it is the

1852
01:49:28,840 --> 01:49:32,920
flesh descendants of Abraham that make up the nation of Israel.

1853
01:49:32,920 --> 01:49:36,520
Who is the covenant when it goes from family or

1854
01:49:36,560 --> 01:49:40,119
from household to tribe to nation, right, And we have

1855
01:49:40,159 --> 01:49:42,720
a national covenant, you could say with Moses. I don't

1856
01:49:42,760 --> 01:49:46,479
deny that. But it's not just the nation state that

1857
01:49:46,560 --> 01:49:49,560
saves you. The nation state is the preparation for the

1858
01:49:49,600 --> 01:49:52,039
next phase, which is the opening of that up to

1859
01:49:52,079 --> 01:49:54,119
the Gentiles. And I think that let me let me

1860
01:49:54,199 --> 01:49:54,680
leave you with.

1861
01:49:54,640 --> 01:49:57,159
Speaker 2: This one question. Let me just set it up. It'll

1862
01:49:57,159 --> 01:49:58,760
take me last sixty seconds.

1863
01:49:58,840 --> 01:49:59,960
Speaker 1: Okay, it's very important.

1864
01:50:00,560 --> 01:50:04,000
Speaker 2: I believe that the Jewish Mosaic Covenant was given to

1865
01:50:04,039 --> 01:50:06,680
the Jews for all generations. Many of the laws. It says,

1866
01:50:06,720 --> 01:50:10,439
you must do this for all generations, physical generations. Now,

1867
01:50:10,800 --> 01:50:12,960
Jesus said, I came to the law sheep of Israel.

1868
01:50:13,760 --> 01:50:16,840
And in Matthew five, this is the key. He says,

1869
01:50:16,880 --> 01:50:19,319
do not think I have come to abolish the law

1870
01:50:19,399 --> 01:50:21,680
or the prophets. I have come not to abolish, but

1871
01:50:21,720 --> 01:50:23,479
to fulfill them. And the key to me is the

1872
01:50:23,520 --> 01:50:26,600
original Greek word fulfill, because it's not the same word

1873
01:50:26,880 --> 01:50:29,199
as when Jesus dies on a cross and says everything

1874
01:50:29,439 --> 01:50:33,760
tell us to lie. Everything is accomplished, everything is fulfilled.

1875
01:50:33,920 --> 01:50:37,439
So it's translated in English as saying, but it's actually

1876
01:50:37,479 --> 01:50:40,279
a different word. So here's my point. Jesus says, for

1877
01:50:40,399 --> 01:50:43,399
I truly tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not

1878
01:50:43,479 --> 01:50:45,880
the smallest letter, not this least stroke of a pen,

1879
01:50:46,119 --> 01:50:49,560
but by any means, disappear from the law, until everything

1880
01:50:49,640 --> 01:50:52,840
is accomplished. Therefore, anyone who sets aside the least of

1881
01:50:52,880 --> 01:50:56,279
these commands, it teaches others accordingly, like Paul said, the

1882
01:50:56,359 --> 01:50:59,560
law is obsoletes et cetera, will be called the least,

1883
01:50:59,600 --> 01:51:01,720
and they can them of heaven, meaning they'll get into heaven,

1884
01:51:01,760 --> 01:51:04,439
but they will be the least there. And whoever practices

1885
01:51:04,479 --> 01:51:06,239
and teaches these commands will be called great in the

1886
01:51:06,319 --> 01:51:06,960
Kingdom of Heaven.

1887
01:51:07,319 --> 01:51:07,680
Speaker 1: Understand.

1888
01:51:07,760 --> 01:51:09,319
Speaker 2: And so the last thing I want to say is this,

1889
01:51:09,840 --> 01:51:12,880
I think that the Gentiles were never supposed to do

1890
01:51:13,159 --> 01:51:15,680
everything that the Jews were supposed to do, right. I

1891
01:51:15,680 --> 01:51:18,800
think the Jews were taught by Jesus to basically be

1892
01:51:18,920 --> 01:51:22,359
more merciful, be more thankful for all the mercies of

1893
01:51:22,760 --> 01:51:27,159
their God that they don't deserve. But Jesus never said that,

1894
01:51:27,520 --> 01:51:30,439
you know, just believe solo fete, just believe in me

1895
01:51:31,880 --> 01:51:35,880
he saved. He said, you've got to follow the law anyway, right.

1896
01:51:35,800 --> 01:51:39,039
Speaker 1: And yeah, and we agree with that. Where we disagree

1897
01:51:39,039 --> 01:51:41,479
on that point, I thank you for your call. Is

1898
01:51:41,880 --> 01:51:44,880
the way that the law is kept is what changes,

1899
01:51:45,119 --> 01:51:48,760
not that the law is useless or worthless. For example,

1900
01:51:49,680 --> 01:51:51,840
when Paul writes his epistles I'm just using this as

1901
01:51:51,880 --> 01:51:57,279
an example, he goes to the uh, you know law,

1902
01:51:57,359 --> 01:52:00,159
the ceremonial laws that deal with like not sowing too

1903
01:52:00,399 --> 01:52:03,239
patches of garments, not sowing two seeds in a field,

1904
01:52:03,640 --> 01:52:06,880
and he says those are pedagogical things that even the

1905
01:52:06,920 --> 01:52:10,399
gentile church can learn from in terms of morals and

1906
01:52:10,439 --> 01:52:14,680
not being unequally yoked. So politics, even the ceremonial commands

1907
01:52:15,119 --> 01:52:19,920
and applies them even to the gentiles in a spiritual way.

1908
01:52:20,159 --> 01:52:22,960
And that's what we would say as Orthodox Christians, is that, yes,

1909
01:52:23,000 --> 01:52:27,960
you're correct, that you cannot say Leviticus doesn't matter, Deuterami

1910
01:52:28,000 --> 01:52:30,840
doesn't matter. In fact, if you look at Revelation two

1911
01:52:30,840 --> 01:52:35,680
and three, the Covenant curse language and blessing language is

1912
01:52:35,720 --> 01:52:38,159
applied to the seven churches of Asia Minor. So when

1913
01:52:38,199 --> 01:52:40,880
Jesus talks to the seven churches, he says, if you

1914
01:52:40,920 --> 01:52:43,079
do this, you will be blessed. If you do this,

1915
01:52:43,199 --> 01:52:45,680
I will come quickly bring a cursing in judgment, just

1916
01:52:45,760 --> 01:52:49,079
like what you read in Deuteronomy and Leviticus. So the

1917
01:52:49,119 --> 01:52:52,520
Covenant cursing and the Covenant blessings. So I would disagree

1918
01:52:52,560 --> 01:52:56,279
though that the Orthodox Church is some later invention if

1919
01:52:56,359 --> 01:52:59,039
you watch this documentary that we made. Actually, I think

1920
01:52:59,039 --> 01:53:02,840
that the real messy Judaism is actually Orthodox Christianity. And

1921
01:53:02,840 --> 01:53:05,399
that's the purpose of this documentary. It's called Christian worship.

1922
01:53:05,399 --> 01:53:08,520
In the Old Testament. Everything that the Church does is

1923
01:53:08,640 --> 01:53:12,760
literally crafted, we believe, by the apostles from the Temple

1924
01:53:12,960 --> 01:53:16,720
liturgy and the Synagogue liturgy service. It's combined into an

1925
01:53:16,840 --> 01:53:20,800
Orthodox Christian worship service, the Divine Liturgy. That's the pattern

1926
01:53:20,840 --> 01:53:23,600
of worship that you see when you read Cyprian or

1927
01:53:23,720 --> 01:53:26,279
Justin Martyr or Irenaeus or any of these church fallows

1928
01:53:26,319 --> 01:53:29,279
when they discuss the pattern of worship and the liturgy.

1929
01:53:29,279 --> 01:53:32,680
So everybody should, if you're interested in this question, watch

1930
01:53:32,760 --> 01:53:36,800
that documentary. But the last point on the heaven and

1931
01:53:36,840 --> 01:53:41,119
earth passing away, ultimately the law is fulfilled in the

1932
01:53:41,159 --> 01:53:43,640
person of Christ. We think he is the living Torah.

1933
01:53:43,720 --> 01:53:47,600
But when he says to not think of it as

1934
01:53:48,399 --> 01:53:50,840
going away until having earth go away, there was a

1935
01:53:50,880 --> 01:53:52,800
sense in which heaven and earth went away when the

1936
01:53:52,800 --> 01:53:55,119
Temple was destroyed. So in our view in seventy a d.

1937
01:53:55,720 --> 01:53:57,359
When he talks about the destruction of the Temple in

1938
01:53:57,439 --> 01:54:01,880
Luke twenty one, which happens years later, there is a

1939
01:54:02,000 --> 01:54:03,960
sense in which if you read Hebrews, and I know

1940
01:54:04,000 --> 01:54:06,760
that guy's not going to like Hebrews. But Paul, assuming

1941
01:54:06,800 --> 01:54:11,399
he wrote Hebrews, discusses the temple again like a miniature

1942
01:54:11,520 --> 01:54:14,640
of the universe. So when the Temple was destroyed, it

1943
01:54:14,760 --> 01:54:17,359
is like the heavens and the earth being rolled up

1944
01:54:17,399 --> 01:54:20,479
like a stroll and being done away with. Doesn't mean

1945
01:54:20,520 --> 01:54:23,920
that we don't look to Leviticus or whatever to find

1946
01:54:23,960 --> 01:54:26,800
spiritual principles. We do, and that's what Paul does in

1947
01:54:26,840 --> 01:54:32,439
his epistles. But as he pointed out correctly, the expectation

1948
01:54:32,720 --> 01:54:35,199
was never that the Gentiles were supposed to follow the

1949
01:54:35,239 --> 01:54:38,439
Jewish ceremonial laws per se as at least as they're

1950
01:54:38,680 --> 01:54:41,880
done by the Jews. Like you can't keep the Jubilee

1951
01:54:41,920 --> 01:54:45,840
laws if you're in Mexico, right, because the laws pertain

1952
01:54:45,920 --> 01:54:48,239
to the land, so the laws for the land of Israel.

1953
01:54:50,239 --> 01:54:54,159
That's why the Church in Acts fifteen chose the basic

1954
01:54:54,239 --> 01:54:57,560
Noea covenant principles for the reception of gentiles into the Church.

1955
01:54:58,079 --> 01:55:01,279
But that church didn't die out, it wasn't destroyed. It

1956
01:55:01,439 --> 01:55:04,119
becomes some weird Nazarene sect. It is the Church of

1957
01:55:04,119 --> 01:55:07,039
the first, second, and third century, and the Orthodox Church

1958
01:55:07,039 --> 01:55:08,960
teaches the exact same thing as that church. Now in

1959
01:55:09,039 --> 01:55:12,680
terms of whether Jesus was divine and whether he's the

1960
01:55:12,680 --> 01:55:16,359
God of the Old Testament, you can look at all

1961
01:55:16,399 --> 01:55:21,000
of the trinitarian discussions and lectures that we have right here,

1962
01:55:21,039 --> 01:55:25,079
for example, is this is part one. This is the

1963
01:55:25,119 --> 01:55:29,680
Trinity in the Torah. So there's that one. Then I

1964
01:55:29,720 --> 01:55:43,880
have another one, which is three hour talk on Theophanes.

1965
01:55:49,960 --> 01:55:59,159
That's not it. I can never remember what I titled

1966
01:55:59,159 --> 01:56:04,960
these videos. By the way, this is also a good one.

1967
01:56:05,159 --> 01:56:07,359
The Jewish Trinity. This would be a good one. This

1968
01:56:07,479 --> 01:56:10,880
was the opening statement for the Daniel Hookee get you debate.

1969
01:56:15,920 --> 01:56:29,079
Let me see. Oh I know what it is. Yeah,

1970
01:56:29,079 --> 01:56:31,119
it's this one right here from seven years ago. Is

1971
01:56:31,199 --> 01:56:34,479
Jesus God is God Triune. This goes through many of

1972
01:56:34,520 --> 01:56:38,640
the other Theophany passages and Angel of the Lord passages

1973
01:56:38,680 --> 01:56:42,000
in the Old Testament. So there's that one. Anyway, it

1974
01:56:42,079 --> 01:56:46,359
was a great discussion there. Enjoyed that back and forth.

1975
01:56:48,560 --> 01:56:51,319
We got. Let me see, we got quite a few

1976
01:56:51,359 --> 01:56:52,960
super chests. Let me catch up on that because we've

1977
01:56:52,960 --> 01:57:00,560
got so many of those. Cody five dollars.

1978
01:57:00,640 --> 01:57:03,159
Speaker 3: I started watching it in the wait wait, wait bird

1979
01:57:03,199 --> 01:57:07,880
ten dollars. Awesome congresation conversation with Greg. For those that

1980
01:57:07,920 --> 01:57:10,720
say that you're mean, BASI realize that when smart people

1981
01:57:10,720 --> 01:57:12,880
actually have something to say, you will listen.

1982
01:57:13,279 --> 01:57:16,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think so. I mean that was a good discussion,

1983
01:57:19,000 --> 01:57:20,920
even though I disagree with the arguments, Like we had

1984
01:57:20,920 --> 01:57:24,119
a good discussion bird the Storm of the cat ten dollars.

1985
01:57:24,159 --> 01:57:28,279
Anthony Westgate run an article about the Messianic so called

1986
01:57:28,319 --> 01:57:31,640
Messianic Jews. They don't worship a real Christ, although on

1987
01:57:31,720 --> 01:57:34,439
a surface level they sound like they do. There is

1988
01:57:34,760 --> 01:57:37,319
lots of Kabbala in it. Yeah. Well, the thing with

1989
01:57:37,359 --> 01:57:39,439
the Messianic Judaism is that it's all over the place.

1990
01:57:39,520 --> 01:57:42,880
You can have like Trinitarian Messianic Jews. You know, we

1991
01:57:42,920 --> 01:57:48,000
have our friend ken Ami is a Trinitarian Messianic Jew

1992
01:57:48,119 --> 01:57:53,720
who's written several books, Is Usus the Messiah. That's that's

1993
01:57:53,720 --> 01:57:57,720
a great one by ken Amy, and that, by the way,

1994
01:57:57,760 --> 01:57:59,680
would be good for this discussion that we just had,

1995
01:57:59,760 --> 01:58:10,279
right is his book because he actually goes to a

1996
01:58:10,279 --> 01:58:14,119
lot of the early Rabbinic sources which most of us

1997
01:58:14,159 --> 01:58:18,000
don't know about. Is Jesus the Messiah a Judaism versus

1998
01:58:18,079 --> 01:58:21,880
Judaism debate. This is a good book for the topics

1999
01:58:22,119 --> 01:58:27,079
that we just covered today. If you don't have especially

2000
01:58:27,159 --> 01:58:30,960
for a lot of us who don't know, you know,

2001
01:58:31,680 --> 01:58:34,640
the specifics of Jewish texts.

2002
01:58:35,439 --> 01:58:37,279
Speaker 3: He does, and he's good at that. So that's a

2003
01:58:37,279 --> 01:58:37,920
good book for this.

2004
01:58:44,159 --> 01:58:47,159
Speaker 1: But then, like you said, yeah, you've got Messianic groups

2005
01:58:47,159 --> 01:58:51,520
that are anti Trinitarian. It's all over the place. There's

2006
01:58:51,560 --> 01:58:57,239
not really a single Messianic movement per se Sanjoya Savage

2007
01:58:57,279 --> 01:58:59,479
five dollars. By the way, the one of the founders

2008
01:58:59,479 --> 01:59:03,640
of it became Orthodox, remember that, one of the founders

2009
01:59:03,720 --> 01:59:09,119
of and he just passed away, but he was always

2010
01:59:09,159 --> 01:59:11,720
nice to me, by the way, He's sent some very

2011
01:59:11,760 --> 01:59:14,319
kind messages my way. Father Bernstein, if you don't know

2012
01:59:14,399 --> 01:59:16,960
Father James Bernstein, who passed away, I think last year,

2013
01:59:20,159 --> 01:59:24,520
and he was I think in the Antiochian Church. But yeah,

2014
01:59:24,560 --> 01:59:30,359
he passed away in twenty twenty four. But I think

2015
01:59:30,399 --> 01:59:34,119
he was one of the co founders of Jews for Jesus.

2016
01:59:34,319 --> 01:59:38,079
I think something like that. Am I right about that?

2017
01:59:38,119 --> 01:59:40,600
I can't remember. I have his book, but I haven't

2018
01:59:40,600 --> 01:59:58,319
gotten around. I didn't read it yet. Says he was. Yes,

2019
02:00:00,079 --> 02:00:08,680
he helped found Jews for Jesus in San Francisco, was

2020
02:00:08,760 --> 02:00:14,239
received in the Orthodox Church in the nineteen eighties. He

2021
02:00:14,319 --> 02:00:18,640
got his ENDIV and he was a.

2022
02:00:18,600 --> 02:00:21,279
Speaker 3: Contributor by the way, to the Orthodox Study Bible, So

2023
02:00:21,479 --> 02:00:23,039
I don't even know he was one of the contributors,

2024
02:00:23,079 --> 02:00:24,279
but the notes are really good.

2025
02:00:24,159 --> 02:00:31,880
Speaker 1: By the way. So that's real Messianic Judaism. It's like, right,

2026
02:00:31,880 --> 02:00:34,680
he became Orthodox exactly. That's that's what I was arguing.

2027
02:00:34,720 --> 02:00:41,039
But anyway, Daniel would be too. Oh yeah. Also if

2028
02:00:41,039 --> 02:00:45,279
you didn't if you don't remember the opening argument against

2029
02:00:45,359 --> 02:00:49,800
Daniel Hoikikachu in the Muslim debate, there's that right there.

2030
02:00:49,800 --> 02:00:58,960
What's up, Jr? What's on your mind?

2031
02:01:00,960 --> 02:01:05,399
Speaker 25: So many Protestants would be it would be good for

2032
02:01:05,439 --> 02:01:08,560
them to pick up a copy of the book. We

2033
02:01:08,600 --> 02:01:13,600
always mention Yarislav Pelicans the emergence of the Catholic tradition

2034
02:01:16,079 --> 02:01:20,880
because on page one eighteen and one nineteen he.

2035
02:01:20,880 --> 02:01:22,199
Speaker 1: Specifically talks about it.

2036
02:01:22,239 --> 02:01:26,439
Speaker 25: Now, remember he's a Lutheran at the time of writing this,

2037
02:01:28,039 --> 02:01:33,800
but even he realizes and points out that scripture and

2038
02:01:33,880 --> 02:01:39,239
tradition are hand in hand with each other. It says

2039
02:01:39,359 --> 02:01:44,840
here that the church fathers denied Heretics any legitimate claim

2040
02:01:44,960 --> 02:01:50,119
to the criterion of the Scripture because Tertullian demanded that

2041
02:01:50,199 --> 02:01:54,840
Marcion produce a Marciani church that could trace its descendants

2042
02:01:54,840 --> 02:01:56,520
from the apostles and a.

2043
02:01:56,399 --> 02:01:59,079
Speaker 1: List of bishops.

2044
02:01:57,560 --> 02:02:04,680
Speaker 25: Yes, it also says that when Cyprian is quoting Matthew

2045
02:02:04,720 --> 02:02:11,720
sixteen eighteen, he also adds the caveat It means that

2046
02:02:11,800 --> 02:02:15,800
the church was built on Peter, but also gave a

2047
02:02:15,840 --> 02:02:24,079
similar power that was entrusted to other apostles. Eusebius writes

2048
02:02:24,079 --> 02:02:30,279
an ecclesiastical history, the succession of the Church is from

2049
02:02:30,359 --> 02:02:34,239
the Holy Apostles.

2050
02:02:33,960 --> 02:02:37,479
Speaker 1: So there's early episode of succession admitted by a Lutheran

2051
02:02:37,520 --> 02:02:40,199
who ended up Orthodox exactly.

2052
02:02:40,319 --> 02:02:46,399
Speaker 25: So that whole section right there of that book is

2053
02:02:46,399 --> 02:02:52,439
probably about page one sixteen to about page one does

2054
02:02:52,439 --> 02:02:56,720
away with any idea of any early church, low Church, yes,

2055
02:02:57,800 --> 02:03:01,479
and Protestantism. It's it's all right there in that book.

2056
02:03:03,119 --> 02:03:06,319
Speaker 1: To pick that book up. Yeah, this is a classic,

2057
02:03:06,439 --> 02:03:09,000
of course. I mean it's even here at the SA

2058
02:03:09,159 --> 02:03:13,600
Vladimir's website. I mean, pretty much anybody in seminary, whether

2059
02:03:13,640 --> 02:03:18,600
you're Reformed, Orthodox, and even Roman Catholics, Lutherans, this is

2060
02:03:18,600 --> 02:03:22,359
pretty much the universally used, you know, history of Christian

2061
02:03:22,359 --> 02:03:26,960
theology set. I've read the first four volumes of it.

2062
02:03:27,239 --> 02:03:30,439
The last one I don't really care about modern Carl

2063
02:03:30,520 --> 02:03:32,720
Bart and all these kinds of people. So really the

2064
02:03:32,760 --> 02:03:36,479
first four of the most relevant. It is a really

2065
02:03:36,520 --> 02:03:40,079
great series. I've also I've read also his book on

2066
02:03:40,199 --> 02:03:44,159
natural theology and the Cappadocians as a classic metamorphosis of

2067
02:03:44,239 --> 02:03:48,600
natural theology. Also his book Whose Bible which tradition is

2068
02:03:48,640 --> 02:03:50,279
really good on the history of the Canon.

2069
02:03:50,640 --> 02:03:54,399
Speaker 25: That's the book that the Jews should read. Whose Bible

2070
02:03:54,520 --> 02:03:56,039
is it? Anyway?

2071
02:03:56,640 --> 02:03:59,720
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, And by the way, if you don't have

2072
02:03:59,800 --> 02:04:04,199
that says to the Pelicon book, I did a talk

2073
02:04:04,359 --> 02:04:09,119
on volume one, so if you go to I think

2074
02:04:09,159 --> 02:04:20,880
I called it. What did I call this? There's a

2075
02:04:20,880 --> 02:04:25,880
full lecture here. It is gnostics charismatics in early Christian heresies.

2076
02:04:26,119 --> 02:04:29,800
This talk I did six years ago is on volume

2077
02:04:29,840 --> 02:04:33,680
one that John is talking about from Pelicon. If you

2078
02:04:34,520 --> 02:04:37,439
are not able to get the book, I recommend definitely

2079
02:04:37,479 --> 02:04:39,000
getting in reading it. But if you're not able to,

2080
02:04:39,800 --> 02:04:43,479
there is my talk on it. Let's see, we got

2081
02:04:43,479 --> 02:04:55,319
a lot of super jest so joya savage, Sam joya savage,

2082
02:04:55,359 --> 02:04:57,479
Lizzy will not debate. Well, I wasn't trying to debate

2083
02:04:57,479 --> 02:04:59,960
Lizzie because she DMed me and said that or the

2084
02:05:00,319 --> 02:05:01,560
are mean to her, and I was like, well, I

2085
02:05:01,560 --> 02:05:04,279
won't be mean. You can just have a conversation. And

2086
02:05:04,319 --> 02:05:08,039
she said, okay, I'll come converse sometimes. So I don't

2087
02:05:08,720 --> 02:05:10,840
see her in here, but maybe one time, one day

2088
02:05:10,880 --> 02:05:14,920
she'll come converse. I don't know. She decided she thinks

2089
02:05:15,039 --> 02:05:20,479
Orthodoxy's pagan. Andrew and Rachel debated her. She lost everyone

2090
02:05:20,600 --> 02:05:24,439
in the sewing circles acts the same. I cono class

2091
02:05:24,800 --> 02:05:27,840
five dollars. I interacted with an evangelical dude. He said,

2092
02:05:27,920 --> 02:05:30,760
says Orthodoxy could not be right because I couldn't explain

2093
02:05:31,720 --> 02:05:35,239
the invisible Church and how it contradicts I don't understand.

2094
02:05:35,319 --> 02:05:37,840
Then he got oh, he couldn't explain that. Yeah, because

2095
02:05:37,840 --> 02:05:40,439
there's like thirty thousand different sects which are the church.

2096
02:05:40,680 --> 02:05:45,720
Then he got upset, said orthodox doesn't validate that. Seems

2097
02:05:45,800 --> 02:05:49,640
like everyone is part of the church. Well, I mean

2098
02:05:50,039 --> 02:05:52,199
we just saw in Timothy, right, remember at the beginning

2099
02:05:52,239 --> 02:05:54,760
of the stream, we looked at the first Timothy, and

2100
02:05:54,800 --> 02:05:59,600
Paul says, Hymenaeus and Phelidus, who say that the resurrection

2101
02:05:59,680 --> 02:06:03,560
is already happened, they're not part of the church. So

2102
02:06:03,560 --> 02:06:06,159
so no, not everybody is part of the church. Right,

2103
02:06:06,199 --> 02:06:09,439
because Paul specifically, it tells Timbothy in chapter one, those

2104
02:06:09,439 --> 02:06:12,920
guys claiming to be Christians there in emphasis, who says

2105
02:06:12,920 --> 02:06:15,239
the resurrections already happened. They're not part of the church.

2106
02:06:16,319 --> 02:06:21,159
So there's one example. But like when Paul writes to Ephesus,

2107
02:06:21,560 --> 02:06:24,439
he only writes to that church. He doesn't write to

2108
02:06:25,640 --> 02:06:28,479
the all the sects in Ephesus. He only writes to

2109
02:06:28,960 --> 02:06:34,239
the church in Ephesus. Orthozowski five dollars. This is good

2110
02:06:34,239 --> 02:06:37,920
and all. But we was kings or where we Israelites

2111
02:06:38,000 --> 02:06:40,560
or where we star seeds? All the above? Dude? Did

2112
02:06:40,560 --> 02:06:45,279
you not see my live streams where we watched the moonbeaver? Dude,

2113
02:06:45,800 --> 02:06:48,920
it's all the above. Bro, you're trying to set up

2114
02:06:48,960 --> 02:06:58,720
false dialectics. This is all the above. Julio, Marita, Jay debate,

2115
02:06:58,840 --> 02:07:02,079
Ken Wheeler. I don't every day you guys, I'm not

2116
02:07:02,159 --> 02:07:06,520
mad because I think it's funny. Every day debate this dude,

2117
02:07:06,520 --> 02:07:09,000
debate this dude. Wait this dude, Wait this dude. I'm

2118
02:07:09,039 --> 02:07:10,720
not mad. I think it's funny, So don't get your

2119
02:07:10,720 --> 02:07:16,079
feelings hurt. Oh this guy the theorya APPA faces this guy,

2120
02:07:16,520 --> 02:07:20,399
Uh yeah, he's like a neo platonic Buddhist guy. I mean,

2121
02:07:21,760 --> 02:07:29,119
I don't usually these kinds of sort of eccentric philosophy people,

2122
02:07:30,479 --> 02:07:33,479
they don't usually do debates. I've never seen that guy

2123
02:07:33,520 --> 02:07:36,239
do a debate. I mean, he's he's an intelligent dude.

2124
02:07:36,279 --> 02:07:39,920
He's all into like camera optics and studying light and stuff,

2125
02:07:39,960 --> 02:07:43,600
which is which is cool. But I don't really think

2126
02:07:43,600 --> 02:07:49,039
he does debates, or at least if he does, I

2127
02:07:49,039 --> 02:07:54,840
haven't seen any. He has his own community. They say,

2128
02:07:54,880 --> 02:07:57,520
you'll have to reach out to him. This would be

2129
02:07:57,560 --> 02:08:00,560
the debate of the century. Well, I mean, I appreciate

2130
02:08:00,600 --> 02:08:03,760
you thinking of me, but nobody is going to watch that.

2131
02:08:04,039 --> 02:08:08,640
There's like, there's like probably five thousand spergs out there

2132
02:08:08,640 --> 02:08:10,800
that will actually watch and care about.

2133
02:08:10,560 --> 02:08:16,880
Speaker 25: That because of the suffragette and radical feminist movement had

2134
02:08:17,800 --> 02:08:20,520
See That's that's another weird thing at that time period,

2135
02:08:20,720 --> 02:08:25,600
is that what you would consider, you know, quasi right

2136
02:08:25,640 --> 02:08:32,399
wing Christian conservatism at the time was actually connected to

2137
02:08:32,720 --> 02:08:36,039
feminism and suffragette movement, even so much that some of

2138
02:08:36,079 --> 02:08:37,800
them were eugenics proponents.

2139
02:08:39,680 --> 02:08:41,079
Speaker 1: Interesting so so.

2140
02:08:41,119 --> 02:08:47,720
Speaker 25: Early early Protestant movements were pro eugenics because obviously, you know,

2141
02:08:49,600 --> 02:08:52,840
bad people who do bad stuff needed to you know.

2142
02:08:53,000 --> 02:08:53,920
Speaker 1: Be sterilized.

2143
02:08:54,159 --> 02:08:58,720
Speaker 25: Yeah, so a lot of that is connected with early

2144
02:08:58,760 --> 02:09:00,600
Protestant It is him as well.

2145
02:09:00,920 --> 02:09:02,560
Speaker 2: But another thing too is.

2146
02:09:04,399 --> 02:09:10,439
Speaker 25: Aaron As in the time of Marcian I heresy or.

2147
02:09:10,880 --> 02:09:12,000
Speaker 2: I mean prior to it.

2148
02:09:12,840 --> 02:09:21,920
Speaker 1: He's actually talking about he's what well, aaron As talks.

2149
02:09:21,760 --> 02:09:28,479
Speaker 25: About second of bishops prior to Marcian, and.

2150
02:09:30,520 --> 02:09:31,560
Speaker 1: It's referring to.

2151
02:09:33,760 --> 02:09:37,600
Speaker 25: Like easy. Aaron As is even saying something like you

2152
02:09:38,079 --> 02:09:41,920
that it's not even really scripture, it's a more apostolic

2153
02:09:42,039 --> 02:09:44,560
foundation that is the proponent of the church.

2154
02:09:45,159 --> 02:09:45,520
Speaker 1: Mm hm.

2155
02:09:48,520 --> 02:09:51,000
Speaker 25: And I'm just reading out of the Pelicon book I

2156
02:09:51,039 --> 02:09:56,520
have right here, and so so there were even i mean,

2157
02:09:56,600 --> 02:09:59,560
what what whatever is debated later, but in the early

2158
02:09:59,640 --> 02:10:04,319
Church there was even a more emphasis on apostolic succession

2159
02:10:04,359 --> 02:10:06,359
than there was on quote unquote scripture.

2160
02:10:08,079 --> 02:10:10,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, exactly. I mean that's you know, when aaron

2161
02:10:10,920 --> 02:10:14,119
As begins book three or four, that's the first thing

2162
02:10:14,159 --> 02:10:17,000
he says is, well, we don't even have to listen

2163
02:10:17,000 --> 02:10:19,800
to these heretics because they don't even have the succession.

2164
02:10:20,159 --> 02:10:24,640
So it's like an immediate disqualifier for him, before even

2165
02:10:24,680 --> 02:10:28,560
trying to argue like the Biblical text with him.

2166
02:10:28,720 --> 02:10:31,199
Speaker 25: Yeah, why would you argue the big Biblical text with

2167
02:10:31,279 --> 02:10:34,800
somebody who didn't have the Apostolic succession exactly?

2168
02:10:35,079 --> 02:10:37,640
Speaker 1: Yeah. And notice here when you go to these weird

2169
02:10:37,640 --> 02:10:41,039
websites like whatever, this is some sort of Protestant thing,

2170
02:10:41,039 --> 02:10:46,199
and it's like they're even citing Montanous and his women

2171
02:10:46,760 --> 02:10:49,399
as like he was so ahead of the head of

2172
02:10:49,399 --> 02:10:53,319
the of the curve with like his women pastors. It

2173
02:10:53,399 --> 02:10:58,720
was so sweet, dude. It was so sick, so sick, dude.

2174
02:10:58,760 --> 02:11:01,039
If we just had some more womens or whatever, like

2175
02:11:01,079 --> 02:11:04,359
then we could have like like really equality in the churches.

2176
02:11:04,479 --> 02:11:07,279
We would have so much like massaging or whatever. If

2177
02:11:07,279 --> 02:11:09,399
you just had like just had like.

2178
02:11:09,399 --> 02:11:13,359
Speaker 3: Some sick prophetesss or like Instagram girls or whatever.

2179
02:11:13,560 --> 02:11:15,119
Speaker 1: Like I bet, I bet.

2180
02:11:14,960 --> 02:11:18,560
Speaker 25: They said exactly what you just said like that. That's

2181
02:11:18,880 --> 02:11:20,039
that's what they said back then.

2182
02:11:21,319 --> 02:11:28,399
Speaker 1: That be so sick right now, Ja kwan or j'all

2183
02:11:28,439 --> 02:11:32,239
woken sends a lot of money, Dang, y'all are being generous.

2184
02:11:33,079 --> 02:11:36,000
My little seeds of faith. Black preacher bit brought in

2185
02:11:36,039 --> 02:11:39,319
about five hundred dollars, so he says for one hundred

2186
02:11:39,359 --> 02:11:42,560
and sixty nine new Zealand Bucks. Put y'all hand on

2187
02:11:42,600 --> 02:11:48,159
the screen and pray with me. Laptop five dollars. Would God,

2188
02:11:48,319 --> 02:11:53,199
the Triune God, be physical and non physical? God proper

2189
02:11:53,319 --> 02:11:55,880
is no, is not physical. I mean usually that refers

2190
02:11:55,920 --> 02:11:58,520
to in our view, the person of the Father, right,

2191
02:11:59,079 --> 02:12:02,479
and then God can also refer to the divine nature

2192
02:12:02,520 --> 02:12:06,199
which is shared by the Son of the Spirit. But

2193
02:12:07,199 --> 02:12:12,000
God is not physical. The Son took on a human nature.

2194
02:12:12,680 --> 02:12:16,479
But we wouldn't say that God is physical, at least

2195
02:12:16,560 --> 02:12:21,119
not the way that your question is framed. The Son

2196
02:12:21,239 --> 02:12:25,119
is uncreated, and the Spirit is the mind of the Father.

2197
02:12:25,840 --> 02:12:29,199
The Son, the Spirit, and the mind are immaterial. I

2198
02:12:29,239 --> 02:12:32,319
mean there's just Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and all

2199
02:12:32,359 --> 02:12:37,640
three we would say have the same divine mind, and

2200
02:12:38,800 --> 02:12:43,000
all three are immaterial in their person and their nature.

2201
02:12:43,479 --> 02:12:47,199
Except that the Son became material. That doesn't mean that

2202
02:12:47,279 --> 02:12:50,680
he changed or transformed into matter. It means that he

2203
02:12:50,840 --> 02:12:55,520
added a physical human nature to the divine nature that

2204
02:12:55,560 --> 02:13:01,039
he possesses. Judy Steyer, what's up? I thank you if

2205
02:13:01,039 --> 02:13:03,319
you can remember, Amy twenty dollars. Thank you for keeping

2206
02:13:03,359 --> 02:13:05,920
all this real. I enjoy your channel. I like Jamie's

2207
02:13:05,960 --> 02:13:08,680
channel as well. Thank you. Appreciate that. Amy much love

2208
02:13:08,720 --> 02:13:11,119
from Tennessee. We'll shout out to all of our fellow

2209
02:13:11,199 --> 02:13:11,920
Tennessee people.

2210
02:13:15,920 --> 02:13:20,359
Speaker 3: Pastor jayde this will cove of my indulgence. He's twenty dollars.

2211
02:13:20,399 --> 02:13:23,920
Put this towards that twenty one thousand. We're doing a

2212
02:13:23,960 --> 02:13:27,720
little bit of a fundraiser. Nobody leaves the bathroom or

2213
02:13:27,720 --> 02:13:30,439
the party, or the shit of until I see twenty

2214
02:13:30,560 --> 02:13:34,119
thousand dollars worth of super chats. I want everybody to

2215
02:13:34,439 --> 02:13:38,359
lock themselves in the bathroom, lock themselves in the bedroom

2216
02:13:38,399 --> 02:13:41,239
wherever you are. And this is an act of faith.

2217
02:13:41,760 --> 02:13:44,960
You don't leave that bathroom with that bedroom son until

2218
02:13:45,000 --> 02:13:47,239
I see twenty thousand dollars.

2219
02:13:46,880 --> 02:13:51,079
Speaker 1: With the super chats. You'll see the faith offering. Friends.

2220
02:13:51,479 --> 02:13:56,079
It's only twenty thousand dollars that I'm expecting tonight. Well,

2221
02:13:56,279 --> 02:13:58,159
for those that don't know, there was that black preacher

2222
02:13:58,159 --> 02:14:02,399
that I actually said closing doors. Ain't nobody getting out

2223
02:14:02,439 --> 02:14:11,239
un till I see forty thousand, yea, remember that. Let's

2224
02:14:11,239 --> 02:14:13,960
go see if I can find that man. These black

2225
02:14:14,000 --> 02:14:17,800
preachers are off the hook, They're unchained off the hook.

2226
02:14:17,920 --> 02:14:21,079
Black preachers are going wild. We just had a giant

2227
02:14:21,479 --> 02:14:24,720
black preacher, Mega Church busted by the FBI involved in

2228
02:14:24,800 --> 02:14:30,800
everything in Florida. Tristan, you missed that. Shout out to Tristanah.

2229
02:14:30,920 --> 02:14:37,760
Let's see black preacher. No one leaves. Wasn't it like

2230
02:14:37,800 --> 02:14:43,960
forty thousand? Yeah, here it is Marvin Sap. Now, this

2231
02:14:44,039 --> 02:14:46,840
man right here knows how to do church. Okay. This

2232
02:14:46,920 --> 02:14:50,479
is how you do church, right lost that is involved.

2233
02:14:51,680 --> 02:14:54,760
This is how you do church. I said close them doors.

2234
02:14:56,800 --> 02:14:59,159
I said close them doors. Close the doors.

2235
02:15:00,199 --> 02:15:02,880
Speaker 3: Close that bathroom door right now. Lock that man, because

2236
02:15:02,920 --> 02:15:06,279
a lot of y'all. Right now, y'all watching and listening

2237
02:15:06,520 --> 02:15:09,520
on the shitter, you on the pot on the can. Okay,

2238
02:15:09,520 --> 02:15:12,560
I know what you're doing. You listening to me while

2239
02:15:12,560 --> 02:15:15,359
you go and doodo. Okay. I want you to lock

2240
02:15:15,439 --> 02:15:17,399
that door. I want people outside to lock you in

2241
02:15:17,520 --> 02:15:21,000
that door. You don't get out until I see forty thousand. Okay,

2242
02:15:21,880 --> 02:15:23,720
close the doors.

2243
02:15:24,960 --> 02:15:26,039
Speaker 1: We all gonna lead together.

2244
02:15:27,079 --> 02:15:29,000
Speaker 22: Y'all ain't going no place but to the restaurant.

2245
02:15:30,680 --> 02:15:33,239
Speaker 1: We know where you're going. You're gonna eat this.

2246
02:15:33,439 --> 02:15:36,560
Speaker 22: One thousand of you tonight, and those that are watching.

2247
02:15:37,640 --> 02:15:40,279
It's a thousand that's watching online.

2248
02:15:40,439 --> 02:15:43,680
Speaker 3: I want a thousand of y'all right now to send

2249
02:15:43,800 --> 02:15:47,800
me forty thousand dollars. Okay, we're gonna beat Pastor Marvin

2250
02:15:47,840 --> 02:15:51,439
over here, Bishop Marvin, because if every one of y'all

2251
02:15:51,439 --> 02:15:54,880
in this audience sent me forty thousand dollars right now,

2252
02:15:54,880 --> 02:16:09,680
I could retire and I could get so much more done.

2253
02:16:10,439 --> 02:16:14,079
Speaker 22: I'm challenging each of you all down here to give

2254
02:16:14,119 --> 02:16:15,119
a twenty dollars seed.

2255
02:16:16,319 --> 02:16:19,520
Speaker 1: I'm challenging just Tristan right now to give me.

2256
02:16:21,119 --> 02:16:24,079
Speaker 3: Forty coconuts because he's down there in the Ecuador where

2257
02:16:24,079 --> 02:16:27,079
they got them islands. Okay, he living on an Ecuadorian island,

2258
02:16:27,119 --> 02:16:31,520
he got coconuts. He basically built a house out of coconuts.

2259
02:16:32,000 --> 02:16:36,239
I want forty thousand coconut from Tristan right now. We

2260
02:16:36,239 --> 02:16:39,520
ain't leaving this hut. We ain't leaving this hut until

2261
02:16:39,559 --> 02:16:44,200
I see forty thousand coconuts in the super chat right now. Okay,

2262
02:16:46,479 --> 02:16:48,799
by the way, did you know that it is possible

2263
02:16:48,879 --> 02:16:51,280
to be a bishop and a pimp at the same

2264
02:16:51,319 --> 02:16:55,239
time we had a whole dispute, We had a whole schism.

2265
02:16:55,239 --> 02:16:59,559
Do you know that there was pimp schisms? I'm not joking,

2266
02:17:00,200 --> 02:17:07,440
Bishop don Juan, uh reverend and pimp. Okay, see this

2267
02:17:07,520 --> 02:17:15,479
man right here, Bishop don Juan, that's my boy right up.

2268
02:17:15,520 --> 02:17:16,079
Speaker 1: Let's listen.

2269
02:17:16,120 --> 02:17:20,600
Speaker 3: He had a schism with another pill Okay, this pempo

2270
02:17:20,639 --> 02:17:26,200
stalic succession over here. Now is you with Bishop don

2271
02:17:26,319 --> 02:17:31,719
Juan or is you with Bishop what was that other

2272
02:17:31,760 --> 02:17:36,840
guy's name, Seamen, seamaster, Minister Seymour, that's him.

2273
02:17:37,200 --> 02:17:41,239
Speaker 1: So we basically got a pimp schism right now. And

2274
02:17:41,280 --> 02:17:43,159
you gotta choose. You gotta choose.

2275
02:17:43,159 --> 02:17:46,040
Speaker 3: You're gonna be on the side of Minister Seymour? Are

2276
02:17:46,040 --> 02:17:48,159
you going to be on the side of the true

2277
02:17:49,680 --> 02:17:54,200
pempostalic succession Bishop don Juan. Now we all know deep

2278
02:17:54,239 --> 02:18:00,719
down minister Seymour is a schismatic okay, now me Now.

2279
02:18:03,680 --> 02:18:05,200
Speaker 1: You see that he said I'm in the church.

2280
02:18:06,000 --> 02:18:08,879
Speaker 3: Okay, only a man lifted up in him pride would

2281
02:18:08,879 --> 02:18:13,520
say I'm the church. Now listen to the to the

2282
02:18:13,559 --> 02:18:17,200
real humility of Bishop don Juan, who don't speak that way.

2283
02:18:18,120 --> 02:18:20,879
This right here, to this a proof right here, this proof,

2284
02:18:20,920 --> 02:18:23,840
This is the real authentic succession right here. Or is

2285
02:18:23,840 --> 02:18:27,319
this just something that you did, you know, to sort

2286
02:18:27,360 --> 02:18:29,520
of keep the women in line, or how would you

2287
02:18:29,559 --> 02:18:30,239
really describe that.

2288
02:18:30,280 --> 02:18:32,319
Speaker 18: Well, one thing about me is, let me get it

2289
02:18:32,440 --> 02:18:35,719
understood that I never had to beat the girls for

2290
02:18:36,000 --> 02:18:39,079
money or anything like that, because they wanted to do

2291
02:18:39,200 --> 02:18:40,319
everything they could.

2292
02:18:40,399 --> 02:18:44,479
Speaker 1: Man, I see that. Listen, Bishop don Juan, don't gotta

2293
02:18:44,520 --> 02:18:47,760
beat women. I didn't hear nothing like that out of

2294
02:18:47,799 --> 02:18:51,840
Minister Seymour and his schism. What's I tell you right there?

2295
02:18:52,399 --> 02:18:55,559
That's how you that's how you know. That's how you

2296
02:18:55,600 --> 02:19:05,440
know who's got true pepper solid succession. I'm making sure

2297
02:19:05,479 --> 02:19:09,040
they're miss any super jests storm the cat.

2298
02:19:09,159 --> 02:19:13,760
Speaker 3: Do you like Brian Eno? Uh, be honest with you, man,

2299
02:19:13,879 --> 02:19:15,719
I only know one Brian Eno song.

2300
02:19:15,920 --> 02:19:16,719
Speaker 1: Be honest with you.

2301
02:19:19,159 --> 02:19:23,360
Speaker 3: I mean, as a full identified black man, I gotta

2302
02:19:23,399 --> 02:19:24,120
be honest with you.

2303
02:19:24,159 --> 02:19:27,639
Speaker 1: I don't know a lot of these weird white people's songs. Okay,

2304
02:19:27,879 --> 02:19:30,280
this is some kind of that weird whitem. This is

2305
02:19:30,319 --> 02:19:32,879
what a weird white boy listened to. Okay, I don't

2306
02:19:32,879 --> 02:19:35,319
know nothing about that. I ain't an arcle. Okay, you

2307
02:19:35,399 --> 02:19:37,520
might have a few articles that listen or something like this,

2308
02:19:37,600 --> 02:19:40,000
but this ain't me. Man. Now, listen, we got some

2309
02:19:40,000 --> 02:19:42,399
black people in the audience, Ash Brosey, I want you

2310
02:19:42,440 --> 02:19:46,399
to be honest. Have you ever heard a white man

2311
02:19:46,760 --> 02:19:49,920
do that good of a black man voice. I honestly

2312
02:19:49,959 --> 02:19:52,600
think I have the best black man voice. Now, there

2313
02:19:52,680 --> 02:19:57,479
is that one unk, the wigger unk, who has probably

2314
02:19:57,479 --> 02:20:02,399
the best wigger voice dude on Instagram. I mean, I

2315
02:20:02,440 --> 02:20:05,120
cannot even do a wiged voice anywhere near as good

2316
02:20:05,120 --> 02:20:08,239
as that dude. But I do feel like my actual

2317
02:20:08,360 --> 02:20:12,639
black dude is pretty damn good. I mean, I've called

2318
02:20:12,680 --> 02:20:16,399
people before doing my black voice and people don't know it.

2319
02:20:16,559 --> 02:20:20,520
They think it's a black dude. Literally, I've called my

2320
02:20:20,639 --> 02:20:23,159
family talking like a black dude and they think they're

2321
02:20:23,159 --> 02:20:25,440
getting they're getting, they get start getting scared, thinking a

2322
02:20:25,520 --> 02:20:28,040
black we got black people calling us. I don't know

2323
02:20:28,040 --> 02:20:28,440
who they are.

2324
02:20:28,520 --> 02:20:35,639
Speaker 2: I was like, that was me, what, hey, you know

2325
02:20:35,639 --> 02:20:36,479
what's funny about that?

2326
02:20:36,680 --> 02:20:37,719
Speaker 1: Well, what's funny?

2327
02:20:38,000 --> 02:20:42,079
Speaker 7: That's when the Cat Williams thing was blowing up last

2328
02:20:42,399 --> 02:20:44,479
last year, maybe a year and a half ago, And

2329
02:20:44,600 --> 02:20:48,959
you did your impression of Cat. I've been watching I was.

2330
02:20:49,159 --> 02:20:50,079
Speaker 2: I started sending that.

2331
02:20:50,559 --> 02:20:51,799
Speaker 6: Well, I sent it to my wife.

2332
02:20:52,159 --> 02:20:55,079
Speaker 2: She thought it was like, and It's like I've.

2333
02:20:54,920 --> 02:20:58,120
Speaker 7: Been I've been hearing like impressions a cat my entire life. Obviously,

2334
02:20:58,479 --> 02:21:01,879
my family I'll I'll try on myself. If I'm listening

2335
02:21:01,879 --> 02:21:04,760
to him, you have the best Cat Williams.

2336
02:21:05,000 --> 02:21:07,680
Speaker 1: Thank you appreciate that. It's insane.

2337
02:21:07,760 --> 02:21:11,479
Speaker 7: No, you sound exactly like him, so like that was

2338
02:21:11,559 --> 02:21:13,680
that was pretty funny. I mean, yeah, I know, I

2339
02:21:13,719 --> 02:21:16,479
know the wigger on here talking about he he's like

2340
02:21:16,600 --> 02:21:17,280
peak wigger.

2341
02:21:18,120 --> 02:21:20,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, he'd like like a chubby white guy, right.

2342
02:21:21,000 --> 02:21:23,879
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like he looks like a gen x uh

2343
02:21:24,399 --> 02:21:27,040
you know, with he's got a white beard.

2344
02:21:27,319 --> 02:21:29,120
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, I know, yeah, we're talking about the same.

2345
02:21:29,479 --> 02:21:32,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm trying to find that profile. I think Tristan,

2346
02:21:32,559 --> 02:21:35,600
I think Tristan sent me the clip. But I mean

2347
02:21:35,639 --> 02:21:38,159
I can I can't do a wigger voice. There's a

2348
02:21:38,200 --> 02:21:43,440
little bit of a a a fun ass that's different

2349
02:21:44,319 --> 02:21:46,959
for the wigger voice versus a regular black dude voice.

2350
02:21:47,440 --> 02:21:49,600
Speaker 7: Yeah, but I mean I'll be boring for him. He

2351
02:21:49,719 --> 02:21:52,680
straight up just sounds like a nigga though, like he

2352
02:21:52,719 --> 02:21:53,440
doesn't really.

2353
02:21:53,239 --> 02:21:57,920
Speaker 1: Have any like he's so he's so wiggered. He sounds authentic, okay,

2354
02:21:59,600 --> 02:22:00,399
because I think.

2355
02:22:00,239 --> 02:22:02,280
Speaker 7: I think the key for him or for like some

2356
02:22:02,360 --> 02:22:04,959
of the wiggers that sound more like just straight up blocks.

2357
02:22:05,280 --> 02:22:07,639
Speaker 2: You have to be from the South and oh really,

2358
02:22:07,639 --> 02:22:09,079
every yeah, every for everyone.

2359
02:22:09,159 --> 02:22:11,280
Speaker 7: I've heard they're all from the South with it because

2360
02:22:11,319 --> 02:22:13,559
I think that guy grew up in Baton Rouge.

2361
02:22:13,719 --> 02:22:15,959
Speaker 2: Okay, some of some of them are from Florida.

2362
02:22:16,000 --> 02:22:18,120
Speaker 7: He might maybe he's from Florida even uh yeah, but

2363
02:22:18,120 --> 02:22:21,399
a lot of them are from like anywhere in the

2364
02:22:21,440 --> 02:22:25,879
Miami Dade County. Everybody from down there, like the white,

2365
02:22:25,879 --> 02:22:27,879
black or whatever. You're gonna sound like a gonna sound

2366
02:22:27,879 --> 02:22:28,319
like a nigga.

2367
02:22:28,360 --> 02:22:30,600
Speaker 1: So all right, let let's let's hear it. Here's the

2368
02:22:30,639 --> 02:22:32,000
here's the uncle I'm talking about right here.

2369
02:22:33,159 --> 02:22:35,959
Speaker 26: Stop stop stop asking. I'm in the mall right now,

2370
02:22:36,040 --> 02:22:38,920
stop asking. Sent them to see you a good man, man.

2371
02:22:39,040 --> 02:22:41,159
I've been snatched out six times out yet.

2372
02:22:42,920 --> 02:22:43,760
Speaker 1: Thank you. I appreciate it.

2373
02:22:43,799 --> 02:22:46,840
Speaker 7: I love him, you love the energy.

2374
02:22:47,440 --> 02:22:53,479
Speaker 26: It's black underscoring label, underscoring services sold. Joe y'all start

2375
02:22:53,520 --> 02:22:56,319
asking center for a good man. Bro God damn, I

2376
02:22:56,440 --> 02:22:58,360
kid gets snatched up in the mall. Man, ain't no

2377
02:22:58,600 --> 02:22:59,840
man he's spoken for.

2378
02:23:03,360 --> 02:23:03,799
Speaker 1: Anyway.

2379
02:23:04,239 --> 02:23:08,040
Speaker 7: Okay, Well, I'd corrected. He actually does have a ten

2380
02:23:08,120 --> 02:23:10,000
of whites for him. Because he said he pronounced the

2381
02:23:10,120 --> 02:23:13,200
s and asking. He didn't say accent. So it's not

2382
02:23:13,319 --> 02:23:15,680
he's no longer a genuine black lad.

2383
02:23:16,600 --> 02:23:19,319
Speaker 1: Okay, hold on home, let's give him. Let's see if

2384
02:23:19,319 --> 02:23:21,760
we can find another clip of him, because he always

2385
02:23:21,760 --> 02:23:25,840
comes up. Do we know what his name is?

2386
02:23:29,280 --> 02:23:32,479
Speaker 26: Ladies, ladies, lady, listen to be a favorable Stop stop

2387
02:23:32,799 --> 02:23:33,600
stop asking.

2388
02:23:33,680 --> 02:23:36,520
Speaker 1: I'm in the mall right now, stop, all right. I

2389
02:23:36,719 --> 02:23:39,559
don't know what his profile is. He pops up every

2390
02:23:39,600 --> 02:23:43,079
now and then. But anyway, Uh, to answer the question,

2391
02:23:43,879 --> 02:23:46,719
I only remember didn't Brian you know? Do she blinded

2392
02:23:46,719 --> 02:23:48,879
me with science? Or is that somebody else? I mean

2393
02:23:48,879 --> 02:23:54,319
that's the only song I know? Or no, that's not

2394
02:23:54,680 --> 02:23:59,200
Briani knows that I can't remember. No, I'm sorry, I'm

2395
02:23:59,200 --> 02:24:04,239
thinking of Thomas. I don't remember what. I'm sure John

2396
02:24:04,239 --> 02:24:07,520
Adams knows the Brian Eno songs. I don't remember. Man,

2397
02:24:07,680 --> 02:24:13,559
I don't know, though, But thank you for that super chat.

2398
02:24:13,719 --> 02:24:18,840
Brenda Turner, three dollars. You used to watch Pope Rap

2399
02:24:19,760 --> 02:24:20,719
by Trevor Moore.

2400
02:24:21,040 --> 02:24:21,159
Speaker 2: Uh?

2401
02:24:21,840 --> 02:24:26,079
Speaker 1: Yeah, well Trevor's funny. So let's see, but I don't

2402
02:24:26,120 --> 02:24:31,120
know what. I don't remember the Pope Rap. Oh okay,

2403
02:24:31,159 --> 02:24:35,559
this was a Comedy Central thing, not from not from

2404
02:24:35,760 --> 02:24:46,200
whitest kid you know, all right, Yeah, Comedy Central won't

2405
02:24:46,239 --> 02:24:48,079
let you play any of this stuff because they'll immediately

2406
02:24:49,680 --> 02:24:51,719
copyright it. So I'll have to watch that later. But

2407
02:24:51,760 --> 02:24:55,920
I'll put in the chat since you recommended it. Andrews saying,

2408
02:24:56,120 --> 02:24:58,399
did you watch Destiny debate? Or are you gonna watch

2409
02:24:58,479 --> 02:25:04,920
Need God and What debate? I don't, oh Destiny versus

2410
02:25:04,920 --> 02:25:07,680
a job to be honest with you? May be honest

2411
02:25:07,680 --> 02:25:11,120
with you. May. I don't watch no debates man, for real, y'all,

2412
02:25:11,120 --> 02:25:12,600
I've been here trying to as me about a bath.

2413
02:25:12,799 --> 02:25:14,399
I don't watch noh of base man. I don't watch

2414
02:25:14,479 --> 02:25:17,680
none of these debates. I'm out here doing my own thing, okay,

2415
02:25:17,920 --> 02:25:19,399
y'all trying to get me up here a bunch of

2416
02:25:19,440 --> 02:25:21,520
other people business now, Man, I'm trying to do my

2417
02:25:21,600 --> 02:25:24,520
own thing. By the way, if I actually get a

2418
02:25:24,559 --> 02:25:29,000
cold and talk like a black dude, I scare people

2419
02:25:29,079 --> 02:25:33,520
because they think that's like the most real black voice

2420
02:25:33,760 --> 02:25:35,479
because I get a little bit of a crackle and

2421
02:25:35,520 --> 02:25:39,799
it doesn't sound like me at all. But I'm not

2422
02:25:39,799 --> 02:25:43,719
trying to be dismissive. But bro, I don't I literally

2423
02:25:43,719 --> 02:25:47,280
don't watch anybody else's debates. Ever, the last debate I

2424
02:25:47,360 --> 02:25:49,959
did watch, though, was Jim Bob. So I watched Jim

2425
02:25:49,959 --> 02:25:55,159
Bob debate that Mormon idiot. I have watched Andrew debates

2426
02:25:55,159 --> 02:26:02,040
some maybe in the last year. Uh, but I don't

2427
02:26:02,079 --> 02:26:05,680
remember the last I just don't have time to watch

2428
02:26:05,680 --> 02:26:10,879
a bunch of other people's debates. I watched some clips

2429
02:26:10,959 --> 02:26:14,840
of Nick flintest debating Danesh de Suza. Obviously, Donsha Susa

2430
02:26:14,920 --> 02:26:19,440
is awful, and of course he's never gonna do debate me.

2431
02:26:19,559 --> 02:26:25,520
But last debate I watched was me and Tim Gordon.

2432
02:26:27,159 --> 02:26:28,879
Would it be cool if you had a conversation with

2433
02:26:29,000 --> 02:26:31,319
David Bentley Hart? No, dude, I ain't gonna have a

2434
02:26:31,399 --> 02:26:35,360
talk with that lunatic. Are you serious? That dude's crazy?

2435
02:26:35,920 --> 02:26:40,319
He's an open perennialist member of the Democratic Socialist of America.

2436
02:26:40,639 --> 02:26:42,799
Like that, dude's awful. No, I'm not gonna have to

2437
02:26:42,799 --> 02:26:44,360
talk with him. By the way, he would never talk

2438
02:26:44,399 --> 02:26:48,680
to me anyway. Don Will ten dollars, Thank you so much, Zaane.

2439
02:26:49,280 --> 02:26:53,840
What's up? Don Will? What about guns in church? How

2440
02:26:53,879 --> 02:26:57,360
does that work? Are you trying to quote? I feel

2441
02:26:57,360 --> 02:27:10,399
like you're quoting the insane clown magnets. How does that work? Uh? Magic, yo, miracles?

2442
02:27:11,360 --> 02:27:17,959
Speaker 3: Remember this, we got a theory you see, Mike, then

2443
02:27:17,959 --> 02:27:20,319
it's a missed what really goes on?

2444
02:27:20,520 --> 02:27:26,120
Speaker 1: But I've seen what happened to. Uh what's their cult called?

2445
02:27:27,719 --> 02:27:30,799
I just went blank? What's the I c P cult

2446
02:27:31,120 --> 02:27:39,200
people called? They have a name? Not wiggers, Juggalos? Our

2447
02:27:39,280 --> 02:27:42,639
juggalos died out? What's where's that call? I haven't seen

2448
02:27:42,639 --> 02:27:44,879
a lot of juggalos. I want to debate a juggalo.

2449
02:27:46,399 --> 02:27:50,079
How's that? Next debate is me versus insane clown posse?

2450
02:27:50,559 --> 02:27:54,879
And we're going to debate, uh magic and science? Which

2451
02:27:54,920 --> 02:27:58,879
one is real and which one is fake? And y'all

2452
02:27:58,920 --> 02:28:04,239
are gonna be surprised. What's I don't know, Bobby C. Jay,

2453
02:28:04,239 --> 02:28:09,520
I appreciate work, but on my mom, you need to

2454
02:28:09,520 --> 02:28:13,040
put some respect on that. Put some respect on Bishop

2455
02:28:13,079 --> 02:28:17,159
don Juan. He got real pepper style that secession listen man.

2456
02:28:17,799 --> 02:28:20,639
I said he was the legit one, Okay, I said

2457
02:28:20,639 --> 02:28:24,159
Minister Seymour was the schismatic. You need to get your

2458
02:28:24,239 --> 02:28:28,079
fact straight. You need to check yourself for your radio self.

2459
02:28:28,280 --> 02:28:30,319
Haley's in the chat. Ten dollars, Thank you so much,

2460
02:28:30,360 --> 02:28:34,559
Flint Westwood. That's a name. Five dollars J I went

2461
02:28:34,719 --> 02:28:38,319
to liturgy Investments. Is the first time I was able

2462
02:28:38,360 --> 02:28:42,440
to find an Orthodox church in Wisconsin. I'm glad you were,

2463
02:28:42,520 --> 02:28:46,680
but Wisconsin sounds terrible. I'm sure the people are good,

2464
02:28:47,120 --> 02:28:53,319
I'm sure your cheese is good. But I just those

2465
02:28:53,760 --> 02:28:56,399
Yankee towns just so scary to me. I don't know

2466
02:28:59,760 --> 02:29:04,000
new five hundred dollars for the jet baby, I think

2467
02:29:04,040 --> 02:29:05,799
I missed. I never did read your I was so

2468
02:29:05,840 --> 02:29:08,399
surprised you sent five hundred News New Zealand bucks and

2469
02:29:08,440 --> 02:29:12,159
I didn't even read it. Thank you so much so,

2470
02:29:12,280 --> 02:29:17,799
Man Dean Limb ten dollars Randy Balls the remix to

2471
02:29:17,840 --> 02:29:26,719
Ignition money laundering remix. I like that. I like that. Kyle,

2472
02:29:26,840 --> 02:29:32,319
can you break down Revelation two five to six? I mean, honestly,

2473
02:29:32,360 --> 02:29:34,159
off the top of my head, I know there's a

2474
02:29:34,159 --> 02:29:37,479
lot of debate about what the Nicolaason's taught. I don't,

2475
02:29:37,600 --> 02:29:42,040
off the top of my head, have like any insights.

2476
02:29:42,479 --> 02:29:44,200
I mean, I would just probably go to the notes

2477
02:29:44,200 --> 02:29:46,879
in the Orthodox Study Bible, or I mean, I've got

2478
02:29:46,879 --> 02:29:48,639
a bunch of commentaries on Revelation, but I don't have

2479
02:29:48,680 --> 02:29:59,079
them with me. My godfather has published a four volume,

2480
02:30:00,319 --> 02:30:01,680
so I would say, if you really want to get

2481
02:30:01,799 --> 02:30:06,920
deep into the Book of Revelation, my godfather wrote one

2482
02:30:07,000 --> 02:30:11,120
volume and then published the three volumes of James Jordan's

2483
02:30:11,959 --> 02:30:16,200
Commentary in Revelation, So I would say, you know, check

2484
02:30:16,280 --> 02:30:19,280
something like that out. You can get this at Dean

2485
02:30:19,399 --> 02:30:23,159
Arnold dot com and I'll put that in the chat

2486
02:30:23,159 --> 02:30:27,120
for there. Jordan's are probably one of the best of

2487
02:30:27,159 --> 02:30:35,760
the Protestant biblical exegetes. To be honest, not promoting Protestants.

2488
02:30:35,760 --> 02:30:38,360
I'm just saying like this, this his commentary is actually

2489
02:30:38,440 --> 02:30:44,799
lead a lot of people to Orthodoxy. So zaying this

2490
02:30:44,879 --> 02:30:47,639
is a weird question. Were you twoing tobacco? What was it?

2491
02:30:48,719 --> 02:30:54,959
ALP which is the non cucked brand of Zen. So

2492
02:30:55,000 --> 02:30:57,079
we went hung out with Hesher and spor when when

2493
02:30:57,079 --> 02:31:01,239
I was on Alex and they got me doing nicotines again,

2494
02:31:01,360 --> 02:31:04,680
so I was I was had an ALP pack in

2495
02:31:08,799 --> 02:31:13,079
you know, like Tucker's Zen's. This was ALP, same stuff,

2496
02:31:13,079 --> 02:31:18,079
different brand, all right? Is that the last of the

2497
02:31:18,120 --> 02:31:18,600
super jests.

2498
02:31:18,639 --> 02:31:20,319
Speaker 3: Guys remember how to or to chalk dot com use

2499
02:31:20,399 --> 02:31:22,200
promo coach J forty JYF was alre to get forty

2500
02:31:22,239 --> 02:31:23,680
percent off all those great products.

2501
02:31:23,319 --> 02:31:26,280
Speaker 1: At chalk c h o q dot com. Link is

2502
02:31:26,280 --> 02:31:28,840
in the show description. Get ahold of that performance stack.

2503
02:31:29,319 --> 02:31:31,000
Use the promo cod jif was are to get forty

2504
02:31:31,000 --> 02:31:33,120
percent off, or use the promo coach J forty four

2505
02:31:33,159 --> 02:31:35,079
Life this Jay four four l a f E to

2506
02:31:35,079 --> 02:31:37,280
get forty four percent off all those great products, including

2507
02:31:37,719 --> 02:31:39,879
the Action two point Z, the Chadmo pre Workout, and

2508
02:31:39,920 --> 02:31:40,760
the tonkat Ali.

2509
02:31:41,959 --> 02:31:42,120
Speaker 9: Uh.

2510
02:31:42,159 --> 02:31:44,399
Speaker 1: I think Jamie and I might go see tron Arees.

2511
02:31:44,479 --> 02:31:47,200
I don't know. Uh, There's there's been actually three or

2512
02:31:47,200 --> 02:31:49,159
two or three movies that were pretty good lately that

2513
02:31:49,200 --> 02:31:55,040
I want to do an analysis of, and most movies sucks.

2514
02:31:55,079 --> 02:31:56,520
So if I see a movie that I think was

2515
02:31:56,559 --> 02:31:59,120
actually pretty interesting and at least had some symbolism in it,

2516
02:32:00,040 --> 02:32:03,600
I'm a little bit excited, you know what I mean. Now,

2517
02:32:03,639 --> 02:32:08,120
I know tron ares doesn't have the greatest reviews. However,

2518
02:32:09,559 --> 02:32:13,719
I did do an analysis of the previous Trons, so

2519
02:32:13,920 --> 02:32:15,440
I feel like I need to kind of fill out

2520
02:32:15,479 --> 02:32:19,159
the trilogy or whatever or part four whatever this is.

2521
02:32:20,000 --> 02:32:24,280
The previous tron was not very good, but I'm willing

2522
02:32:24,360 --> 02:32:27,239
to give this one a chance. It looks visually interesting.

2523
02:32:28,239 --> 02:32:30,840
But I did like Eden and I did like Bogonia.

2524
02:32:30,879 --> 02:32:35,200
Bogunia was pretty funny, I have to say, and I'm

2525
02:32:35,200 --> 02:32:38,520
not a huge what was that guys, Your ghosts Lanthromos

2526
02:32:38,559 --> 02:32:46,760
whatever that crazy Greek name is, your ghosts lanthemosh. The

2527
02:32:46,760 --> 02:32:50,360
The Lobster was okay, So I did see Lobster when

2528
02:32:50,360 --> 02:32:53,559
it came out. It was an okay dystopia. I feel

2529
02:32:53,600 --> 02:32:54,840
like it could have been better. It's kind of a

2530
02:32:54,840 --> 02:33:00,600
little boring. Poor Things was terrible. It would I recommend

2531
02:33:00,639 --> 02:33:01,920
Poor Things, And I thought it was going to be

2532
02:33:02,000 --> 02:33:08,840
like a I don't know, like a you know, I

2533
02:33:08,879 --> 02:33:11,760
don't know, something like twelve Monkeys type of you know,

2534
02:33:13,120 --> 02:33:16,479
I mean, not like twelve Monkeys, but like I'm going

2535
02:33:16,600 --> 02:33:28,639
blank on them Terry Gilliam. I expected that Poor Things

2536
02:33:28,639 --> 02:33:33,040
are going to be like a Terry Gilliam movie, and

2537
02:33:33,159 --> 02:33:36,479
usually Emma Stone's pretty good in whatever movie she's in.

2538
02:33:36,520 --> 02:33:41,159
But it was gross, dude. It it was like gross

2539
02:33:41,239 --> 02:33:47,879
Krollian stuff. And so I didn't actually have very high

2540
02:33:47,959 --> 02:33:51,719
expectations for Bogonia at all, and turns out it was

2541
02:33:51,920 --> 02:33:57,440
really funny and pretty interesting, So I do recommend it

2542
02:33:57,520 --> 02:34:02,600
a little bit of feminism little bit, but also it's

2543
02:34:02,639 --> 02:34:05,479
so goofy and satirical that I didn't even really mind

2544
02:34:05,680 --> 02:34:08,520
a little bit of feminism in it, because it's just preposterous.

2545
02:34:08,719 --> 02:34:12,440
But it's funny preposterous. So much better than all of

2546
02:34:12,440 --> 02:34:14,920
his previous outings, I'll have to say. And I'd thought

2547
02:34:15,040 --> 02:34:17,440
Eden was actually pretty good. It was better than I expected.

2548
02:34:18,719 --> 02:34:22,600
You have Jude Law basically kind of setting up a

2549
02:34:22,600 --> 02:34:27,040
atheist nature cult, you could say, although he doesn't really

2550
02:34:27,040 --> 02:34:28,639
want to be a cult because he wants to be alone.

2551
02:34:28,680 --> 02:34:31,000
So he's trying to kind of set up a m

2552
02:34:31,079 --> 02:34:34,079
night Shamalin village situation right out in the middle of nowhere.

2553
02:34:34,079 --> 02:34:37,920
It's based on a true story supposedly of these disillusioned

2554
02:34:37,920 --> 02:34:40,479
Germans that try to set up some community on an

2555
02:34:40,479 --> 02:34:44,760
island and it just turns into a nightmare. But it

2556
02:34:44,840 --> 02:34:49,479
ends up being a symbol for quote civilization and the idea,

2557
02:34:49,559 --> 02:34:52,399
oh can I set up, you know, a community that

2558
02:34:52,440 --> 02:34:54,120
will be free from the troubles.

2559
02:34:53,719 --> 02:34:54,280
Speaker 2: Of the world.

2560
02:34:54,840 --> 02:34:57,280
Speaker 1: And then what you find is that well, because humans

2561
02:34:57,280 --> 02:35:01,520
are fallen, humans bring the troubles. You can't really get

2562
02:35:01,520 --> 02:35:05,559
away from it. You can't really escape greed and envy

2563
02:35:05,639 --> 02:35:08,840
and lying and all this kind of stuff, even when

2564
02:35:08,920 --> 02:35:11,600
you have ten people trying to survive on an island.

2565
02:35:13,760 --> 02:35:16,399
So it made for a good allegory for civilization. So

2566
02:35:16,520 --> 02:35:20,079
it was kind of like Lord of the Flies or

2567
02:35:20,200 --> 02:35:25,840
Mosquito Coast with Harrison Ford, or Lost in the Vein

2568
02:35:25,920 --> 02:35:28,440
of those if you like that kind of stuff, So

2569
02:35:28,639 --> 02:35:32,239
I might what am I doing a movie stream in

2570
02:35:32,280 --> 02:35:34,719
the next few days on these anyway, Thank you guys

2571
02:35:34,760 --> 02:35:36,840
so much. A lot of fun tonight, and I will

2572
02:35:36,840 --> 02:35:38,200
talk to you soon. Be sure, and head over to

2573
02:35:38,360 --> 02:35:41,079
Jason Elsons dot com in the shop get ahold of

2574
02:35:41,159 --> 02:35:43,719
the books Star Hollywood one in too. And by the way,

2575
02:35:43,719 --> 02:35:46,399
I also bought a bunch of stock of The Red Book,

2576
02:35:47,319 --> 02:35:49,280
so there's quite a few copies of the Red Book

2577
02:35:51,200 --> 02:35:52,719
if you headn't over to the shop and you can

2578
02:35:52,760 --> 02:35:55,559
get Estar Hollywood one, two, and three sign copies of