Speaker 1: I'm back with Corey Hughes Bloody History. Corey, thanks for
Speaker 1: being with me.
Speaker 2: Thank you for having me. You're one of my You're
Speaker 2: one of my favorite Kennedy researchers of the day. Like
Speaker 2: your work is stellar, and I think that more people
Speaker 2: should be exposed to your work. And you really blew
Speaker 2: me away with your video on the Israeli war bonds.
Speaker 2: That is so that is like such upper level research
Speaker 2: that most people just breeze over that and never even
Speaker 2: look at it. I was very very stoked on that video.
Speaker 2: So yes, thank you for having me here again.
Speaker 1: Thanks, Corey. We're here to discuss Corey's a new book,
Speaker 1: relatively new book came out in July. We're in November.
Speaker 1: Right now here. It is right here, Lee Harvey Oswald
Speaker 1: in Black and White, Volume one. Now, Corey, what's now? Corey?
Speaker 1: This is your Is this your second published book? Yes? Okay,
Speaker 1: Warning from History was your first book that you've ever written? Yes? Wow, okay,
Speaker 1: So the book, now, the Housewall book has been out,
Speaker 1: like I said, for a few months. How would you
Speaker 1: summarize the reaction so far? From that? The maybe the
Speaker 1: JFK community specifically has well.
Speaker 2: I don't think I don't think most of them know
Speaker 2: it exists yet. So my first book we did, so
Speaker 2: it's really wild. I look back at some of the
Speaker 2: stuff that I did and the techniques I did to
Speaker 2: sell books and whatnot, and like, I did a pre
Speaker 2: sale on my first book for like a year, which
Speaker 2: is crazy because if I were to try that today,
Speaker 2: it would never work. I know it would never work,
Speaker 2: and I don't know how it worked the first time.
Speaker 2: But I sold a ton of pre sales and that
Speaker 2: got the word out. So then when my book actually
Speaker 2: came out, it did really good. Right from the start,
Speaker 2: this one, like nobody knew was coming. I had no promotion,
Speaker 2: no nothing, and it just popped up one day, right.
Speaker 2: So I've probably sold about one hundred copies, which is,
Speaker 2: you know, for an independent publisher with no PR marketing
Speaker 2: or you know, that's it's not bad. So but as
Speaker 2: far as the content goes, everyone who reads it is shocked.
Speaker 2: They don't really know what to think. I wrote the
Speaker 2: damn book, and I don't know what to think. So
Speaker 2: I anticipate a lot of people will read it and
Speaker 2: get confused because it kind of jumps right into the
Speaker 2: too Oswald stuff I tried to take a little bit
Speaker 2: of time in the beginning, if you notice the first
Speaker 2: like fifty pages or so, I don't really address that
Speaker 2: until we get into like forty five and forty six,
Speaker 2: when we get like the mastoidectomy and the tonsilectomy and
Speaker 2: all the stuff that seems to disappear later on in life. Right,
Speaker 2: So I don't really bring that the two oswalding into
Speaker 2: it until then because you have to kind of see
Speaker 2: that Oswald's background is tumultuous, I guess is a word
Speaker 2: that you could use. It's kind of all over the place,
Speaker 2: not very well documented, and there's a lot of contradiction
Speaker 2: and weird stuff. Like some of the things that really
Speaker 2: capt my attention are Marguerite Oswald. When Robert Oswald Senior died,
Speaker 2: she tried to have him buried the same day and
Speaker 2: didn't even notice notify the family. This is crazy to me.
Speaker 2: This is this is like to me. Character development is
Speaker 2: very important in the Kennedy story and obviously in the
Speaker 2: life of Oswald. And what does that tell you about
Speaker 2: her character? Like that is some crazy stuff right there.
Speaker 2: And the weird thing is when you read about Marguerite Oswald,
Speaker 2: you'll come to understand that she had made it very
Speaker 2: clear to everyone, and everyone could see this that the
Speaker 2: happiest time she had in her life was when she
Speaker 2: was Ruth Robert Oswald, and so she truly loved the guy.
Speaker 2: And so for her to be able to just he died,
Speaker 2: let's bury him right away, like that's that's psychopathic behavior.
Speaker 2: If he asked me, so one example, Yeah, this is
Speaker 2: one example. All kinds of stuff that pops up in
Speaker 2: the early life of Oswald, and then you get into
Speaker 2: Oswald's family that's like crazy stuff like Oswald. I think
Speaker 2: it would be a great uncle. Paul Polo Voitier was
Speaker 2: one of Hughey Long's bodyguards, clearly one of the two
Speaker 2: men who shot him, right, So this is incredibly insane
Speaker 2: and I can't believe no one's ever made this conclusion,
Speaker 2: draw this conclusion before that information has been out there forever,
Speaker 2: Like Paul Pole of Voitier was one of Huelung's bodyguards.
Speaker 2: He's in all the books, he's in all the newspaper articles.
Speaker 2: All the speculation about his murder brings up Paul Pole
Speaker 2: of Voitier, and it's Oswald's uncle Jesus Christ, two of
Speaker 2: the most important assassinations in American history, and you got
Speaker 2: the Oswald family tied into it.
Speaker 1: It's it's.
Speaker 2: There's something more there that we are unaware of, a
Speaker 2: familial intelligence link through the votiers that will probably never
Speaker 2: have answers to I Literally one day, I'm probably gonna
Speaker 2: have to go to New Orleans and go to the
Speaker 2: archives and pull physical documents because none of the stuff
Speaker 2: is online as far as the Voittier background, you know,
Speaker 2: and then that will tie into the duplicates, the dupal
Speaker 2: get Marguerite Oswald's stuff, you know, as Oswald's life progresses.
Speaker 1: So we're gonna get into all that, Hopefully, I'm going
Speaker 1: to approach some of these questions as if if I'm
Speaker 1: my audience is my mother who was fifteen when JFK
Speaker 1: was shot, And boy, that was strange. What Jack Ruby?
Speaker 1: Did you know that kind of stuff? She might be
Speaker 1: open to a conspiracy and all that, but it's just odd,
Speaker 1: lu she don't we just let the man rest, you know,
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff. So, and I think that's a
Speaker 1: lot of people because Corey, wait what before we get
Speaker 1: into the specifics, what I wanted to mention and get
Speaker 1: you talking about was even from a warning from history
Speaker 1: and this book you demolish conventional understanding of the case
Speaker 1: as it was presented to us officially, I mean even
Speaker 1: within the Warren Commission, or you're calling out actual testimony
Speaker 1: as fabrication.
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, So, so I wanted the very thesis is
Speaker 2: about the idea that there were two Oswald's going back
Speaker 2: to the time he was a child, and that this
Speaker 2: was some part of some greater intelligence operation known as
Speaker 2: an identity transfer, where somebody acts as an identity donor
Speaker 2: and you have somebody who uses that identity. In this
Speaker 2: case for most of Oswald's life, I believe you have
Speaker 2: two people using the same identity, and at times a
Speaker 2: third person using the identity, and even possibly more that
Speaker 2: we haven't even discovered yet. But it becomes very clear
Speaker 2: that Oswald was engaged in something going back to a
Speaker 2: time before there was a CIA, before there was even
Speaker 2: an OSS, to when Oswald's name and his history start
Speaker 2: to appear in two different places. Ultimately, when you create
Speaker 2: a timeline of Oswald's life, you get two timelines. And
Speaker 2: so the person who really brought this to the forefront,
Speaker 2: if you can say that, was John Armstrong, whose work
Speaker 2: today is marginal mostly marginalized. And the reason the work
Speaker 2: is mostly marginalized is because the conclusions that he drew
Speaker 2: as far as the assassination go, and the conclusions that
Speaker 2: he drew as far as the two Oswald's go, he
Speaker 2: couldn't tell when one story ended and another began, and
Speaker 2: he melded them all together into one big story. So
Speaker 2: all of the duplicate Oswald stuff that occurs during the
Speaker 2: assassination that I attribute to William Seymour and Carrie Thornley,
Speaker 2: primarily with a couple extras, he attributed to this duplicate
Speaker 2: Oswald who was present the whole time that Lee Harvey
Speaker 2: Oswald was growing up. And so that's where he went
Speaker 2: off the deep end and he basically lost everybody because
Speaker 2: understanding the difference between these operations is paramount, and it's
Speaker 2: wild that Oswald was part of multiple identity transfer operations,
Speaker 2: one as a child up through him getting out of
Speaker 2: the Marines and going to Russia, and another one post
Speaker 2: you know, basically January of sixty one with the bolton
Speaker 2: Ford incident starts off the long line of impersonations of
Speaker 2: Oswald while he's still in the so Union. But then
Speaker 2: once he gets back in June sixty two, they really
Speaker 2: start to ramp up, and Oswald is seen all over
Speaker 2: the place with a shady group of characters. And yes,
Speaker 2: it's a very, very fascinating tale. And so even people
Speaker 2: who are on board with the impersonations of Oswald in
Speaker 2: the assassination story, a lot of them fall off the
Speaker 2: wagon when I get to the duplic at Oswald going
Speaker 2: back to the time when he was like two years old.
Speaker 1: And that's what this book's about, folks. I mean, this
Speaker 1: is basically the beginning from nineteen thirty nine to basically
Speaker 1: fifty six or so. There, Corey, this.
Speaker 2: Is yeah, October twenty fourth, fifty six.
Speaker 1: And so it was nice, a nice gesture. You dedicated
Speaker 1: the book to John Armstrong, which I thought was good.
Speaker 1: But you make a point at some point in your
Speaker 1: videos or something where you say, look, here's some newspaper articles,
Speaker 1: here's some magazine articles that have been put out throughout
Speaker 1: the years talking about a kind of dual identity going on.
Speaker 1: And it's so this has been out there. You're trying
Speaker 1: to tell people like, this isn't some kind of theory
Speaker 1: plucked out of obscurity by some of the by someone
Speaker 1: on an education for.
Speaker 2: Him correct, and the first observations of the possibility of
Speaker 2: there having been two Oswald's throughout his childhood. That goes
Speaker 2: back way before John Armstrong. I don't remember which book
Speaker 2: it was, but there was a book that came out,
Speaker 2: I believe in the late nineteen sixties after Garrison's investigation,
Speaker 2: that talked about the possibility that Oswald was replaced by
Speaker 2: the Soviets, like the Soviets sent somebody back. That's definitely
Speaker 2: not true. I mean, the photographic record, there's so much
Speaker 2: evidence that the person who went to the Soviet Union
Speaker 2: and who came back was in fact one of the
Speaker 2: Oswalds who and we'll call him Harvey Oswald. And the
Speaker 2: reason we call Harvey Oswald it's not because we're making
Speaker 2: it up and we're trying to play a game with
Speaker 2: the name Lee Harvey Oswald, is because this person identified
Speaker 2: themselves to people they knew all throughout their growing up
Speaker 2: and even as an adult as Harvey Oswald.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: We even have documentation, there's upwards of seventy five to
Speaker 2: one hundred documents that show the name Harvey Lee Oswald
Speaker 2: many many years after the assassination, going on into the seventies.
Speaker 2: A Defense Intelligence Agency document with the handwritten scribble Harvey
Speaker 2: Lee Oswald came out in seventy eight. Now I'm sorry,
Speaker 2: but sixteen years after the assassination, the name Lee Harvey
Speaker 2: Oswald is ingrained in everyone's head. Everyone knows Lee Harvey Oswald.
Speaker 2: Why is it that all these years later the intelligence
Speaker 2: community is still passing around documents that says Harvey Lee Oswald?
Speaker 2: Because Harvey Lee Oswald was a different person from Lee
Speaker 2: Harvey Oswald. And for me, the evidence of this begins
Speaker 2: in nineteen forty one, but technically that doesn't come out
Speaker 2: until Oswald submits his application to the Marines in fifty six,
Speaker 2: because when he does his basic brief biography, where did
Speaker 2: you live? He puts that he lived in Fort Worth
Speaker 2: starting in nineteen forty one, when we know that Lee
Speaker 2: Harvey Oswald lived in New Orleans, basically bouncing back and
Speaker 2: forth between Lillian Moretz and the Bethlehem Orphanage all the
Speaker 2: way up until basically January of forty four, when he's
Speaker 2: taken out of the orphanage, and then in April of
Speaker 2: forty four they move into the Victor Street address in Dallas,
Speaker 2: where they'll be for the next year year and a
Speaker 2: half or so. So we have that major conflict. And
Speaker 2: that's just the first one. That was one of the
Speaker 2: most recent contradictions that I found in the record. But
Speaker 2: really you start to run into problems in the fall
Speaker 2: of nineteen forty five. Fall in nineteen forty five, they're
Speaker 2: supposed to be at the Victor Street address in Dallas.
Speaker 2: But what you have is you have Robert Oswald testify
Speaker 2: to the Warrant Commission that Lee Harvey Oswald edwin at
Speaker 2: Dahl and Marguerite went up to Boston and spent approximately
Speaker 2: six months in Boston, and during that time they did
Speaker 2: some traveling cross country. They're photographed in Arizona during this time. Well,
Speaker 2: at the exact same time, starting in October of nineteen
Speaker 2: forty five, you've got Lee Harvey Oswald enrolled at the
Speaker 2: Benbrook Common School in Benbrook, Texas. And this opens up
Speaker 2: a real can of worms here, because after they leave
Speaker 2: the Victor Street address in Dallas, they go to Covington, Louisiana,
Speaker 2: or they go back to Louisiana. We go to Covington,
Speaker 2: and this is where Oswald goes to the Covington Grammar School. Well,
Speaker 2: you have a researcher and a lawyer for the Warrant
Speaker 2: Commission named John hart Eli, who basically was the guy
Speaker 2: tasked with the background of Oswald. And this guy, when
Speaker 2: you go through all of his notes and he was
Speaker 2: prolific in his notes, he couldn't figure out a damn thing.
Speaker 2: He couldn't figure out when anybody was ware because the
Speaker 2: testimony of Robert Oswald and Marguerite Oswald contradicted with school
Speaker 2: records and all this other stuff. So in this nineteen
Speaker 2: forty six ish time period, when Oswald goes to the
Speaker 2: ben to the grammar school in Covington, you have John
Speaker 2: hart Eli concluding that he obviously could have only lived
Speaker 2: there for like three or four months over the summer,
Speaker 2: and that was his final conclusion. But we have the
Speaker 2: school record showing that he finished out that semester there
Speaker 2: before they returned to Fort Worth. However, Robert Oswald testifies
Speaker 2: that all through forty six and through Christmas forty six
Speaker 2: they were living in Benbrook at an address that nobody
Speaker 2: knows because it was just out a po box because
Speaker 2: it was nothing really built up out there. So the
Speaker 2: heavy duty contradictions really start with the trip to Boston
Speaker 2: while he's going to Benbrook, and then all the stuff
Speaker 2: that goes on at Covington in Louisiana that's all contradicted
Speaker 2: and when So who the hell knows what's the real story?
Speaker 2: We don't know, but we have a photograph of Oswald there,
Speaker 2: and Oswald did finish this semester through the end of
Speaker 2: the year, or not the school year, but the end
Speaker 2: of the actual year in forty six. And then in
Speaker 2: forty seven he's back at Ridge Lee West Elementary School, right,
Speaker 2: And so yeah, it's a whole big cluster. And it's
Speaker 2: funny because I read, I try to read some books
Speaker 2: about Oswald's past, and people try to like come up
Speaker 2: with a timeline, and they end up having to ignore
Speaker 2: half the data in order to construct the timeline, because
Speaker 2: everybody discounts the fact that there were two Lee Harvey
Speaker 2: Oswald's and that this was an intentional plot going back,
Speaker 2: you know, to before the time of the modern intelligence agencies.
Speaker 1: So, folks, if you're thinking this is just another kind
Speaker 1: of rundown biography of Lee Harvey Oswald's life, it's anything.
Speaker 1: But what Corey is doing is he's kind of actually
Speaker 1: revising the traditional accepted narrative of who this man was,
Speaker 1: and more importantly, Corey, who these families are, right, because
Speaker 1: this is not a story about a kind of loaner
Speaker 1: who was drifting through life and decided to take his
Speaker 1: revenge on.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 1: Right, You make a point that this is really about
Speaker 1: a deep deception going on. And I wanted to ask,
Speaker 1: and you call it an identity transfer program, why did
Speaker 1: you come up with Where did you come up with
Speaker 1: the idea that it's out of naval intelligence?
Speaker 2: Well, just because the origins pre date CIA and OSS. Right,
Speaker 2: so in nineteen forty five when the Benbrook stuff is
Speaker 2: going on, but he's actually up in Boston going around
Speaker 2: and we have the school records from ben Brook and
Speaker 2: Robert Os when all that's going on, there's no CIA
Speaker 2: at that time, and the OSS was pretty goddamn busy,
Speaker 2: they were. I'm pretty sure the OSS was not running
Speaker 2: domestic identity transfer operations. So who does that leave us with?
Speaker 2: Naval intelligence? Nobody else? And that would correspond with Oswald
Speaker 2: being in the Marines, because Marine and all that Marine
Speaker 2: intelligence fell into the Navy, And so to me, it
Speaker 2: just it made a whole lot of sense. And then
Speaker 2: when you have the little tidbits of information about Marguerite Oswald.
Speaker 2: And so this is something we need to talk about,
Speaker 2: is Marguerite Oswald's lies about forty one to forty four.
Speaker 2: Because Marguerite Oswald joined the navy. This is a fact.
Speaker 2: She wrote it in the book with Gene Stafford, a
Speaker 2: mother in History, that she worked as a switchboard operator
Speaker 2: for the naval base at Algier's Louisiana in nineteen forty two. Okay,
Speaker 2: stop the presses. This is the most blockbuster statement that's
Speaker 2: been in the zeitgeist for fifty years. Since nineteen sixty
Speaker 2: six when that book was written, this information has been
Speaker 2: out there. It's blockbuster because when you study the Navy
Speaker 2: in nineteen forty two, and how is it that Marguerite
Speaker 2: Oswald who didn't have any jobs, and then all of
Speaker 2: a sudden she's working for the navy when she's supposed
Speaker 2: to be working at retail, like at department stores. How
Speaker 2: does this come about? Well, when you dig into the
Speaker 2: navy and what they were doing in forty two, well,
Speaker 2: everyone left to go to the war, so were the
Speaker 2: whole navy was like, oh my god, we got nobody here.
Speaker 2: So the creator was called the Navy Waves program, which
Speaker 2: is the Women in the Navy program, which technically they
Speaker 2: were civilians, but a lot of the women who were
Speaker 2: in this civilian program ended up transitioning to be in
Speaker 2: the actual Navy. A couple of years after the war
Speaker 2: when they started to let women in. I think was
Speaker 2: like forty seven, forty eight something like that they let
Speaker 2: women into the Navy, and the first batch came from
Speaker 2: this program. But this program was designed to fill the
Speaker 2: slots that they needed. And it wasn't just secretarial work.
Speaker 2: It was everything. They taught women, cryptography and all the
Speaker 2: stuff that the men did. They taught women intelligence, you know, firearms,
Speaker 2: like the whole nine yards. They were actual soldiers, I
Speaker 2: guess you could say. And so so Marguerite Oswald kind
Speaker 2: of disappears off the radar in late forty one. At
Speaker 2: this time, we know that Lillian Mourette took in Marguerite
Speaker 2: took in league for eight or nine months before he
Speaker 2: ends up going to the Betham Orphanage. Then he's in
Speaker 2: the Bethham Orphanage for I guess about a year or so,
Speaker 2: but they would come frequently and take him out, and
Speaker 2: this I don't know how it didn't cause resentment amongst
Speaker 2: him and his two other brothers, because the two other
Speaker 2: brothers in the bethl hedmorphanage also. But Lee was taken
Speaker 2: out on a fairly regular basis to go do things.
Speaker 2: I don't know how that didn't cause some family resentment,
Speaker 2: but it obviously didn't. But Marguerite Oswald will tell different
Speaker 2: people she's working at a shoe store, or she's working
Speaker 2: at retail, or she's working for the Pittsburgh plate Glass Company,
Speaker 2: which is what she told Myrtle Evans. And then so
Speaker 2: we don't really know what she's doing this entire time.
Speaker 2: The only indication we have are some addresses that she
Speaker 2: gave allegedly in New Orleans and Algiers in nineteen forty two.
Speaker 2: So she gives two addresses, twenty one to thirty six
Speaker 2: Broadway and two two seven Atlantic Avenue. Okay, I grew
Speaker 2: up in Brooklyn. The split second I heard those addresses,
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, that's New York. That was my very
Speaker 2: first instinct. And then I went and I start going
Speaker 2: through the documents, and they're supposed to be in New
Speaker 2: Orleans and Algiers, but they go and they interview people
Speaker 2: who live there. They're like, yeah, nobody ever lived here
Speaker 2: by that name, like it's just a bad address. She
Speaker 2: gave bad addresses, and she gave this address on like
Speaker 2: credit forms, she gave it to her doctor. She gave
Speaker 2: these bad addresses as her official addresses everywhere. But those
Speaker 2: addresses don't make sense until you put them in New York.
Speaker 2: And once you put those addresses in New York, you
Speaker 2: realize that twenty one to thirty six Broadway is the
Speaker 2: Hotel Belvedere I believe it's called, and it was only
Speaker 2: nine miles from the Waves training facility in the Bronx, Okay.
Speaker 2: Plus add to the fact Marguerite Oswald is only lived
Speaker 2: at that address for three weeks, and it's like, duh,
Speaker 2: of course that's where she was. She was up there
Speaker 2: in forty one forty two training at the Navy Waves facility.
Speaker 2: Then by summer forty two she's obviously back down in
Speaker 2: Algiers working as the phone operator. So to me, filling
Speaker 2: in the gap of her being in New York for
Speaker 2: that time is ultra important. And why else is it
Speaker 2: ultra important? Because during nineteen forty two is when she
Speaker 2: allegedly met edwin Ekdahl. But she supposedly met him, well,
Speaker 2: nobody never really knows where she met him. It's only
Speaker 2: you know, hearsay as to how they met. But to me,
Speaker 2: it's pretty damn clear. They met up in New York.
Speaker 2: He was only twenty miles from her address in New York,
Speaker 2: and that's the year they met, and both of them
Speaker 2: happened to be there at the same time. And then
Speaker 2: we don't have a real story on how they actually met. Yeah, bs,
Speaker 2: they met and there's some intelligence guys in New York.
Speaker 2: I have no doubts. And so it's not until April
Speaker 2: of forty four that they move into Victor Street. So
Speaker 2: you have this huge gap of like three years that
Speaker 2: really we don't know what the hell Marguerite's doing. This
Speaker 2: is why the tax records are so important, because we
Speaker 2: don't have any. Why not Corey, because you're know, well,
Speaker 2: they fall back on this privacy thing. Well, everyone's fucking dead,
Speaker 2: so what do you care about privacy? Okay, so they
Speaker 2: say it's a privacy issue and it's federal law. But
Speaker 2: that's just like, guy, they're hiding behind that. Because if
Speaker 2: we get some tax records and it shows Marguerite Oswald
Speaker 2: was on the payroll navel of the Navy for like
Speaker 2: four or five years, you know. And it's another thing
Speaker 2: about Margerit Oswell. She claimed that she was broke like
Speaker 2: her whole life. She wasn't broke her whole life. When
Speaker 2: Robert Oswald died, she got either five or ten thousand dollars.
Speaker 2: We haven't really been able to determine, but it's one
Speaker 2: of those two. She had enough money to live all
Speaker 2: the way into nineteen forty one. And she's also getting
Speaker 2: money from ed pick As. She's getting alimony like twenty
Speaker 2: dollars a month, which is a decent amount back then.
Speaker 2: And she held onto the Alvar Street property where Oswald
Speaker 2: lived that when he was born and where Robert Oswald died.
Speaker 2: She held onto that place for like four or five years,
Speaker 2: you know, before it was sold to I forget the
Speaker 2: guy's name off hand. But she ends up having so
Speaker 2: she has rental income property, she has alimony coming in.
Speaker 2: She obviously has this job at the Navy doing whatever right.
Speaker 2: She had this money left over from when Robert Oswell died.
Speaker 2: She's lived in the high life. But she's crying, poor me,
Speaker 2: I don't have any money to take care of my children,
Speaker 2: so I got to put him in the orphanage and
Speaker 2: let my sister take care of him. Whatever. You're a psychopath, Okay,
Speaker 2: the real Margaret's a psychopath, and so.
Speaker 1: Let's stick with her for a minute. Tell me what
Speaker 1: is a what is the definition of a legend? And
Speaker 1: would you classify Marguerite Oswald as a legend?
Speaker 2: A legend is a false background that's created for intelligence purposes.
Speaker 2: And that's a lot of time where identity transfer comes in,
Speaker 2: because you can just identity transfer into someone's complete background
Speaker 2: without having to create a legend, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: So the legend system and the identity transfer system are
Speaker 2: kind of like they're connected in that way because you
Speaker 2: can either build a legend over time or you can
Speaker 2: just swap out a person and get an instant background. So,
Speaker 2: but I don't know. I kind of feel to some
Speaker 2: degree that this was experimentation on their part because they
Speaker 2: were real sloppy and when we look at their records
Speaker 2: now and the contradictions, when I see contradictions, to me,
Speaker 2: that's them being sloppy. They didn't have a tight lid
Speaker 2: on this thing. And other than them funneling her money,
Speaker 2: which I'm sure they did in some way, which I
Speaker 2: can't detect maybe through these fake rental properties that she had,
Speaker 2: because she had rental properties for like the whole time,
Speaker 2: her whole life, she had rental properties that she never
Speaker 2: had any money from. So I don't know what they
Speaker 2: were really doing in as far as this is the
Speaker 2: thing I'm this is the thing that really drives me
Speaker 2: to understand the mechanisms of how this would have worked
Speaker 2: on a operational level. Right, So, research with Diana Thomas
Speaker 2: kind of she determined that when you look at all
Speaker 2: of Oswald's addresses growing up, he lived in extremely close
Speaker 2: proximity to either a lunatic asylum or an orphanage and
Speaker 2: all of those that are involved with the state and
Speaker 2: the church, right the state and the church are running
Speaker 2: those And she thought it was an extremely weird coincidence.
Speaker 2: And I do too, and I think it needs to
Speaker 2: be needs some major investigation because somehow they were giving
Speaker 2: her some kind of support. They had to give her
Speaker 2: some sort of support or direction or something, because you're
Speaker 2: not going to raise two children under the same name,
Speaker 2: under two different Margueritie Oswald's and not have some kind
Speaker 2: of standard operating procedures that you're going to try to implement, right,
Speaker 2: there's got to be protocols and and all that stuff,
Speaker 2: but we don't have any of that stuff, and so
Speaker 2: a lot of it feels like they were winging it.
Speaker 2: But another problem is that, in hindsight, we have a
Speaker 2: ton of documents from all this time, but we have
Speaker 2: a ton missing. So a lot of this story we
Speaker 2: only know about because they were bad at filtering out
Speaker 2: the documents that indicate that there were two Oswald's, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean. So, but then again, you have
Speaker 2: people coming into the story twenty thirty years after the fact,
Speaker 2: after Kennedy's assassination, having to go through this stuff, and
Speaker 2: do you think everybody's in on the two oswald scheme? No,
Speaker 2: that was a need to know only. So I think
Speaker 2: people who were going through documents to release stuff didn't
Speaker 2: know what they could release and what they couldn't release,
Speaker 2: And that's how we get a lot of the contradictory information.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: There's some documents out there that are mind blowing that
Speaker 2: they should never have given to us, but they did,
Speaker 2: like the Frank choloona document, like the Kerry Thornley AFFI David.
Speaker 2: There's so many things that we shouldn't have because they
Speaker 2: spill the beans, but yet we have them, which tells
Speaker 2: me that people releasing documents don't know what they have, right,
Speaker 2: And so that's a big problem with putting together the
Speaker 2: life of Oswald and his mother. Well, I've kind of
Speaker 2: got I think, I think I have a pretty good
Speaker 2: idea of like the two paths that went that, But
Speaker 2: there's still some major gaps, major gaps.
Speaker 1: Why is January nineteen forty five so important in the
Speaker 1: life of Lee Oswald? Now, Lee Oswald would have been
Speaker 1: just about not yet two and a half years old,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, not yet not yet six and a half.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so in forty five, six forty five is when
Speaker 2: he had the ton selectomy from doctor Philbin. And that's
Speaker 2: important because later on in the Marines, Oswald will have
Speaker 2: his tonsils inflamed twice, maybe even three times. He has
Speaker 2: to go in because his tonsils are inflamed. Now, I
Speaker 2: did see some rebuttal to this that one of the
Speaker 2: ways that they did ton selectomies back in the day
Speaker 2: didn't involve the removal of the tonsils completely. But I've
Speaker 2: read all of the rebuttal stuff on this, and there's
Speaker 2: just no evidence of that whatsoever. As far as Oswald
Speaker 2: goes the paperwork very clearly shows he how tonsilectomy, and
Speaker 2: then we have swollen tonsils. Those two things are incongruent,
Speaker 2: and we have no evidence to the contrary that he
Speaker 2: had some sort of problematic operation. There's no notes or
Speaker 2: anything to indicate that surgery was incomplete or problematic or
Speaker 2: anything like that. So we just don't know. But this
Speaker 2: always seems to be a rebuttal to everything. This time
Speaker 2: period is important also because in forty six we'll get
Speaker 2: to his he had a mastoid ectomy on his left ear,
Speaker 2: which left a big star right here behind the left ear,
Speaker 2: and this I believe is one of the most important
Speaker 2: events in Oswald's life because this appears to have shaped
Speaker 2: his behavior and personality. And so this oftentimes, even when
Speaker 2: there were kids around, Oswald didn't want to go outside
Speaker 2: and play with other kids. Why would you do that?
Speaker 2: Why would you rather stay at home? Why would you
Speaker 2: feel inadequate to go play with them? Because obviously, to me,
Speaker 2: it's pretty obvious this all started after forty six, and
Speaker 2: this is all part of the mastoid ectomy, and this
Speaker 2: becomes more apparent that it was more of a problem
Speaker 2: than we know of when he gets up to the
Speaker 2: school in New York and stuff. Hang on on my
Speaker 2: dogout real quick.
Speaker 1: All right, that's okay. We'll get into the New York
Speaker 1: stuff in a little bit.
Speaker 2: But the masthoid ectomy I believe shaped his personality, created
Speaker 2: the withdrawn Oswald that we've all heard about in Oswald's youth,
Speaker 2: because it's not withdrawn when we of Oswald that we
Speaker 2: know is Oswald, right, but we keep hearing these stories.
Speaker 2: He's withdrawn, doesn't have any friends. And I think a
Speaker 2: huge part of that is because of the mastoid ectomy
Speaker 2: and the fact that he couldn't hear, he had trouble
Speaker 2: hearing in the left ear, and this kind I believe
Speaker 2: that would shape anyone's personality.
Speaker 1: Let me let me push back on this. And so, Mom,
Speaker 1: if you're watching, we're talking about an Oswald who was
Speaker 1: not the Oswald that we know who has arrested the
Speaker 1: weekend of the assassination. Is that correct, Corey, that's correct.
Speaker 2: The Oswald who was arrested that weekend is missing numerous
Speaker 2: scars that he would have.
Speaker 1: But I will say, just you know, put it out there.
Speaker 1: Do you remember that midnight press conference and he has
Speaker 1: to he has to go to the guy, sir to repeat,
Speaker 1: but you have been charged with that, and it just
Speaker 1: makes me think like, oh, maybe that's his left ear,
Speaker 1: like he can't hear and he has to lean in
Speaker 1: and said, sir, I mean it's it's a straw man's argument.
Speaker 2: That Well, I would say that is not the case
Speaker 2: because that man who was autopsy didn't have the masterodectomy scar.
Speaker 2: So according to Diana Thomas, she found that Robert Oswald
Speaker 2: had the messed outdectomy scar also, which is very weird
Speaker 2: and definitely needs some further follow up.
Speaker 1: Wow, and we'll touch more on Robert Oswald in a
Speaker 1: little bit. So who do you think is uh? Who
Speaker 1: do you think is the puppet man? This is a speculation,
Speaker 1: I guess, but maybe not because there is a name
Speaker 1: that you and I both talked about. Who do you
Speaker 1: think is the puppet master here? Let's say it is
Speaker 1: naval intelligence. Let's say it is the navy. Is there
Speaker 1: a gentleman who comes to mind that maybe having something
Speaker 1: to do with pulling these strings?
Speaker 2: One hundred percent Fred Corth. So, Fred Corth is one
Speaker 2: hundred percent clearly in on this deception, because, first of all,
Speaker 2: Fred Corth is I forget his position before he was
Speaker 2: Secretary of Navy, but it had something to do with
Speaker 2: he was some sort of liaison to the army. And
Speaker 2: after that he will go on to be the Secretary
Speaker 2: of the Navy. What is that prior to John Connolly?
Speaker 2: I think it's prior to John Connolly, and then after
Speaker 2: John Connolly, I forget who's after that. But he's a
Speaker 2: big shot and he's a major player, and he's tied
Speaker 2: into all the upper level stuff. And in nineteen what
Speaker 2: was it forty eight, he is the lawyer for Edwin
Speaker 2: ek Dahl, who Edwin Ekdahll. So he marries Marguerite. This
Speaker 2: is the whole Edwin Ecdall thing. Is kind of interesting
Speaker 2: because he was an older guy. He'd had a heart attack,
Speaker 2: he was kind of lonely. He met Marguerite. She wasn't
Speaker 2: really into it, but she met with Edwin Ekdahl's sister
Speaker 2: and she kind of convinced her to marry him, kind
Speaker 2: of like, oh, he's probably not got much time left.
Speaker 2: Just make an old man happy kind of thing. He
Speaker 2: was like twenty years older than she was, and so,
Speaker 2: but he worked for a company called Ebasco, which was
Speaker 2: an electric company, and they had been they had built
Speaker 2: electric power plants in the Soviet Union during the Cold War.
Speaker 2: What does that tell you? And that's an intelligence connection.
Speaker 2: You're not You're not going to Soviet Union to build
Speaker 2: power plants without the without the go ahead of the CIA. Right,
Speaker 2: So clearly there's an intelligence connection to Ebasco. After he died,
Speaker 2: the FBI attempted to get documents on him from EBASCO,
Speaker 2: and IBASCO straight up said no, sorry, not happening, which
Speaker 2: means that there's a something there which is higher authority
Speaker 2: than the FBI in its entirety, you know, protecting Edwin Ekdahl.
Speaker 2: So they end up getting married and it's never really
Speaker 2: it doesn't seem like it's a real marriage. They don't
Speaker 2: really live, they don't live together. They don't really like
Speaker 2: each She doesn't seem like they like each other. He
Speaker 2: is living in at the Ewing Street address. This is
Speaker 2: another place where it gets weird. He's living at Ewing
Speaker 2: Street and he's got some other roommate while she's living
Speaker 2: at another address. And despite the fact that they're having
Speaker 2: like some sort of marital trouble, she believes she caught
Speaker 2: him having an affair. She ends up living with Edwin
Speaker 2: et Dahl and John Pick and Robert Oswald and Lee
Speaker 2: Oswald at Ewing Street until March of nineteen forty eight,
Speaker 2: and then from there they'll go to the thirty three
Speaker 2: hundred Willing Street, which was like a really it was
Speaker 2: kind of slummy. John Pick said that when they got there,
Speaker 2: he said that we were back down in the lower
Speaker 2: class again. It was a really it was a very
Speaker 2: hard emotional thing for all of them to deal with.
Speaker 2: It was very hard for them to move back into
Speaker 2: the ghetto. And for Lee Oswald, Edwin Ekdahl was the
Speaker 2: only father figure he really ever knew, and so it
Speaker 2: was very hard on Oswald the divorce because he was
Speaker 2: very young and they were all together like two or
Speaker 2: three years, but it was the only time that he
Speaker 2: had a father figure, right, So that was a whole
Speaker 2: a very very rough time for Oswald and the whole family. Now,
Speaker 2: the problem that we have here is that the divorce
Speaker 2: happened in July forty eight, and that the official story
Speaker 2: says that Marguerite Oswald and the family she will buy
Speaker 2: a property at one oh one San Saba in Benbrook
Speaker 2: in like a brand new development. It's the only house
Speaker 2: built in the area, and then they'll move and they'll
Speaker 2: live at this property in Benbrook for about two or
Speaker 2: three months, only two or three months until school started
Speaker 2: again in September of forty eight, and then they moved
Speaker 2: out of there again when Robert and John Pick went
Speaker 2: back to school. So that's the official story, and we
Speaker 2: have testimony to that from John Pick, we have testimony
Speaker 2: to that from Robert Oswald, from testimony to that from
Speaker 2: Marguerite Oswald. But the problem is when you John Armstrong
Speaker 2: did a phenomenal job pulling all the history on that
Speaker 2: address at one on one San Saba, and he found
Speaker 2: that Marguerite Ekdahl, the name on the records, actually had
Speaker 2: purchased that property in July of nineteen forty seven, not
Speaker 2: forty eight forty seven. So that's very problematic for the
Speaker 2: official story, which says that she didn't buy it for
Speaker 2: a year later. And so John Armstrong goes and this
Speaker 2: is where John Armstrong really shines. This is where he
Speaker 2: did his absolute for most phenomenal work. He went and
Speaker 2: he talked to Georgia Bell and Otis Carlton, who were
Speaker 2: allegedly neighbors of the Oswalds out at Benbrook and so
Speaker 2: when you read their statements, it's clear the FBI altered
Speaker 2: their statements. And John Armstrong when he spoke to them,
Speaker 2: basically he got the same story from Otis Carlton and
Speaker 2: Georgia Bell, and that was that the Oswalds, and it
Speaker 2: was just Marguerite and Lee. It was no John Pick
Speaker 2: or no other kids. Moved in there around May of
Speaker 2: nineteen forty seven and lived there until Thanksgiving of nineteen
Speaker 2: forty seven. She also said that the Marguerite Oswald who
Speaker 2: lived in that house in nineteen forty seven did not
Speaker 2: have a car, and she did not work at a
Speaker 2: retail store, which is what the official story is. And
Speaker 2: we have we can prove that she worked for retail
Speaker 2: in forty eight. We can prove this. But in nineteen
Speaker 2: forty seven, according to Georgia Bell, this woman was a
Speaker 2: nurse and at another time she had to have a
Speaker 2: neighbor drive her over to a house next to Stripling
Speaker 2: Junior High School where she had to pick up her
Speaker 2: nurse's uniform. Okay, this is nineteen forty seven, This is
Speaker 2: one year before the Oswalds actually officially lived there. Right,
Speaker 2: So what do we have. We have a Marguerite Oswald,
Speaker 2: who doesn't drive, doesn't have a car, is a nurse,
Speaker 2: is short and fat, right and so, and then she
Speaker 2: moved out by Thanksgiving. The issue is, we don't have
Speaker 2: any contacts between Georgia Bell and Otis Carlton with the
Speaker 2: real Marguerite Oswald and her kids in the two or
Speaker 2: three months that they lived there from July, you know,
Speaker 2: to September of nineteen forty eight. When you look at
Speaker 2: the testimony of Georgia Bell and Otis Carlton, they didn't
Speaker 2: know anybody else living there in that house because Otis
Speaker 2: Carlton ended up buying that house, and so they are
Speaker 2: unaware of another set of people ever having lived in
Speaker 2: that damn house. So what does that tell me? That
Speaker 2: tells me that when the Oswalds went back to Benbrook
Speaker 2: in July of forty eight, number one, it was the
Speaker 2: real Marguerite, the real Lee and his brothers. It was
Speaker 2: not the Marguerite and Lee who were living there in
Speaker 2: forty seven. And they didn't go to one O one
Speaker 2: San Saba. They went to some other address in the area.
Speaker 2: Because even when John Picked testified and they asked him
Speaker 2: to talk about that time, and he's talking about it
Speaker 2: Albert Jenner says, was that one O one San Saba
Speaker 2: and John Pickos. I don't know nothing about one on
Speaker 2: one San Saba, Right, So what are we yelling here?
Speaker 2: What is happening here? We've got more of this overlap
Speaker 2: with witnesses, solid testimony on both sides. We can firmly
Speaker 2: establish what everyone is saying here. And the only answer
Speaker 2: is that there were two sets of Marguerite and Lee.
Speaker 2: That's it. It's the only solution. And this is one
Speaker 2: of literally one hundred incidents when you follow the life
Speaker 2: of Oswald like, it's not like the pattern is different
Speaker 2: and changing and indicating different types of things. No, the
Speaker 2: pattern is always Oswald in two places at once, always,
Speaker 2: and then sometimes three places at once. When we get
Speaker 2: to like fifty five to fifty eight, So people might.
Speaker 1: Be saying, geez, Corey, so many addresses, come on, relax,
Speaker 1: I mean, give me a break already, but we're going
Speaker 1: to double down. Tell me about to to zero Thomas Place.
Speaker 2: Right, so tujuous THEREA Thomas Place is the place where
Speaker 2: the Marguerite Oswald that we know who. I'll get to
Speaker 2: her real identity later on. I believe I know who
Speaker 2: that is. Well, she was living at tou Chi Cho
Speaker 2: zero Thomas Place at the time of the assassination. Okay,
Speaker 2: it is also like, I can't imagine can you imagine
Speaker 2: another scenario where Marguerite Oswald was driven to get her
Speaker 2: nurse's uniform at a house next to Stripling Junior High,
Speaker 2: But it's a different house. I don't think so. So
Speaker 2: odds are any cop in the world would would deduce
Speaker 2: that the house that they were driven to she was
Speaker 2: driven to in forty seven to get her nurse's uniform
Speaker 2: when she was living at one on one San Saba
Speaker 2: is to to Choo zero Thomas Place, and that would
Speaker 2: indicate that there's a connection to this house from nineteen
Speaker 2: forty seven at the earliest, all the way to nineteen
Speaker 2: sixty three under two different owners. Edna Pendleton and Mary
Speaker 2: McCarthy are the two owners. So Mary McCarthy turns out
Speaker 2: close personal friend of Fred Korth, the man who handled
Speaker 2: the divorce from Edwin Necdahl from Marguerite Oswald. This is
Speaker 2: fascinating because it's the real Marguerite Oswald who got the
Speaker 2: divorce from Edwin neck Doahll. So Fred Corth knew every
Speaker 2: intimate detail about the family, about Oswald and his brothers,
Speaker 2: the living situation, the money situation, like he had to,
Speaker 2: because that's what you do in divorce proceedings. You get
Speaker 2: to know everything. And then we have Then we have
Speaker 2: the other Marguerite, the false Marguerite who was acting as
Speaker 2: a caretaker for Harvey Oswald.
Speaker 1: We have.
Speaker 2: Her popping up at that address sometime in nineteen fifty four.
Speaker 2: And that's a whole nother story we'll have to seg into.
Speaker 2: But what we do is we have Marguerite Oswald, the
Speaker 2: real Marguerite Oswald divorce from Edwin Acdall. Fred corth is
Speaker 2: the lawyer. But also this house will be rented to
Speaker 2: the false Marguerite in the future, in nineteen fifty four
Speaker 2: and again in nineteen sixty three. And it's the false
Speaker 2: Margarite who's conected to this residence in nineteen forty seven,
Speaker 2: a year before Marguerite got divorced from Edwin Acdahll. So
Speaker 2: what was fred Court's in this house in nineteen forty seven,
Speaker 2: if there was one, right, we don't know. We don't
Speaker 2: know the relationship between Edna Pendleton and anybody else. So
Speaker 2: I did, trust me, we did a full genealogy and
Speaker 2: background on her. We got nothing, So it's very interest.
Speaker 2: We don't know, we don't know, but it's very strange
Speaker 2: that one address nobody rents up. Nobody rents a house
Speaker 2: from like two different owners, unless it's like the owner
Speaker 2: transferred it back to back while you're living there, right,
Speaker 2: then that's But if you rent a house and then
Speaker 2: you go back ten years later to rent a house
Speaker 2: and it's a different owner, why are you get in
Speaker 2: the same place in the first place, right, None of
Speaker 2: the story makes any sense, And why would you be
Speaker 2: attached to it for se for like fifteen years plus,
Speaker 2: you know. So, yeah, there's something going on with that
Speaker 2: residence and Fred Korth, And that brings me back to
Speaker 2: this idea that there has to be some sort of
Speaker 2: covert real estate network at play here, which would also
Speaker 2: connect to the house that Robert Oswald lived at on Davenport,
Speaker 2: which actually appears in the story years before Oswald. Robert
Speaker 2: Oswald ever buys the damn thing, right, So that gets
Speaker 2: us into like the whole nineteen fifty four to nineteen
Speaker 2: fifty six couple of years, which is the craziest couple
Speaker 2: of years as far as the two Oswald stuff goes
Speaker 2: because none of it makes any sense at all. Everyone's lying,
Speaker 2: And if there was nothing to it, why is everybody lying? Right,
Speaker 2: if there's nothing to any of this, why is everyone lying?
Speaker 1: We'll get to that, just to close the circle on
Speaker 1: Fred Corth. Now, Marguerite claims that Oswald's discharge I believe
Speaker 1: was handled by Fred Corth number one and number two.
Speaker 1: Marguerite names Fred Corth as involved in the framing of
Speaker 1: Oswalt and the assassination well of the president. And I
Speaker 1: would even say of Oswalt, you know, couples a few
Speaker 1: assassinations that we can who which Marguerite is claiming that.
Speaker 2: That's the false Marguerite, because the real Marguerite. This is
Speaker 2: the thing, like when you go over the records, you've
Speaker 2: come to realize that all of Oswald's official story addresses
Speaker 2: are the are the real Oswald and the real Marguerite.
Speaker 2: But that changes in nineteen fifty six, which tells me
Speaker 2: in nineteen fifty six, when Oswald goes off to the Marines,
Speaker 2: that's when they're supposed to do the official swapperou with
Speaker 2: the families, and Marguerite Oswald should be off doing something
Speaker 2: else with a different name or something, but that's not
Speaker 2: what ends up happening. So Oswald, the real Lee Oswald,
Speaker 2: will end up going to Hawaii on his way to Atsugi,
Speaker 2: Japan August nineteen fifty seven, he will send a postcard
Speaker 2: to He sends it to thirty thirty eight West sixth
Speaker 2: but I think it's actually just a thirty eight thirty.
Speaker 2: But it ended up making it through because the post
Speaker 2: office is kind of smart sometimes, and so we're not
Speaker 2: supposed to have that address period. That address is not
Speaker 2: supposed to be the official address of Marguerite Oswald at all.
Speaker 2: She's living. God, I forget what you addressed you was
Speaker 2: at Again, from this time period in fifty six through
Speaker 2: the end of fifty seven we have more obfuscation because
Speaker 2: we have the real Marguerite purchasing a house at two
Speaker 2: thousand and six what is it Birchwood or Birchman or
Speaker 2: something like that, which doesn't appear in the record. You
Speaker 2: shouldn't appear in the record anywhere. And then so it
Speaker 2: gets really complicated when you get into fifty six because
Speaker 2: in fifty six you have Oswald's working in all right, well, actually,
Speaker 2: if we're gonna start this, we're gonna talk about this,
Speaker 2: we have to start at fifty four, So we're gonna
Speaker 2: start at fifty four. We kind of have to start it.
Speaker 2: We have to go through all the New York stuff too,
Speaker 2: so let's back up a little bit.
Speaker 1: So my next question then would be how much did
Speaker 1: oswd how much did Oswalt's Oswalds in New York blow
Speaker 1: your mind?
Speaker 2: That's when stuff really starts to go off the deep
Speaker 2: end in the fall of forty two. So you have
Speaker 2: Marguerite Oswald sells the Birchman property in late August of
Speaker 2: fifty two, and then she goes to New York with
Speaker 2: Lee and they live at John Picks off a ninety
Speaker 2: second Street. But we have some contradiction here already, because
Speaker 2: we have some people saying that she stayed with John
Speaker 2: Pick for a month. John Pick's mother in law said
Speaker 2: that they stayed there for closer to a year, which
Speaker 2: I can't fit into any timeframe at all. Well, maybe
Speaker 2: I could, but then that mean everyone's lying, including John Pick,
Speaker 2: and I don't buy the John Picks a lie at all. Yeah,
Speaker 2: So allegedly they get up there and it's late nineteen
Speaker 2: fifty two, and then we run into some problems with
Speaker 2: when Oswald left there where he actually went after there,
Speaker 2: because we have both John Pick and Robert Oswald saying
Speaker 2: that they went to school. He went, they got another
Speaker 2: place in Manhattan and went to school in Manhattan at
Speaker 2: PS forty four. Well, I could never find a PS
Speaker 2: forty four in Manhattan at all. It's three of them.
Speaker 2: None of them were in Manhattan, So I don't even
Speaker 2: know what that's about. But everyone was pretty sure that
Speaker 2: Oswald went and lived in Manhattan. But the official story
Speaker 2: says they went up in the off at Sheridan for
Speaker 2: a couple of weeks fourteen fifty five Sheridan, and then
Speaker 2: they went to the one hundred and seventy ninth Street
Speaker 2: address in the Bronx, right, and so this is the
Speaker 2: one hundred and seventy ninth Street. The Bronx address would
Speaker 2: correspond with the time that Oswald went to the Trinity School,
Speaker 2: the Lutheran school, and so okay, So Margareton, she claims
Speaker 2: the family's all Lutherans, but they never went to church.
Speaker 2: So what's the deal with the Lutherans? Why are they
Speaker 2: all Lutheran if nobody ever goes to church. I don't
Speaker 2: get it. There's something there. But as it turns out,
Speaker 2: and thank you to Diana Thomas again for discovering this,
Speaker 2: that Oswald never actually went to Trinity. Everyone thinks he did.
Speaker 2: The FBI has records it said he did, but he
Speaker 2: never showed up. John Hannah, who was a pastor there,
Speaker 2: years later he knew Lawrence Wench, who was the principal
Speaker 2: at the time, and he told him the full story.
Speaker 2: He's like, look, Oswald, his mother came and showed up,
Speaker 2: paid the twenty five cent registration, and then Oswald never
Speaker 2: showed up at the school. Right, So here we have
Speaker 2: this big gap in August, late August, September through early
Speaker 2: October ish at the Trinity where we where John Picks
Speaker 2: said that Oswald was going to school in Manhattan. Okay,
Speaker 2: so we possibly have that explanation there that he was
Speaker 2: actually in Manhattan, not at the Trinity school because he
Speaker 2: never went to Trinity. Then after Trinity, he allegedly goes
Speaker 2: to PS one seventeen. But at PS one seventeen that's
Speaker 2: where and we know this is Harvey Oswald. He starts
Speaker 2: to be a truant and he never goes to school.
Speaker 2: And right, so the weird thing is he misses most
Speaker 2: of the damn year, but he still somehow passes the year.
Speaker 2: I don't understand this, Like this doesn't make any sense.
Speaker 2: Then we start to run into some major, major problems
Speaker 2: because of Oswald's truancy. So now picture this in my head.
Speaker 2: You have Lee Oswald going to school somewhere in Manhattan,
Speaker 2: and he's going to school, he's a positive attendance record.
Speaker 2: You have Harvey Oswald up in the Bronx at one
Speaker 2: hundred and seventy ninth, allegedly going to PS one seventeen,
Speaker 2: but he never goes, gets in trouble, ends up getting
Speaker 2: picked up. So Oswald's arrest is all over the place.
Speaker 2: The official story says he was arrested from his apartment
Speaker 2: on the sixteenth of April. However, we have the documents
Speaker 2: from the court record showing Magistrate Delaney sent him to
Speaker 2: youth house on April fifteenth, the day before. We have
Speaker 2: no explanation to this whatsoever. Then, when you get into
Speaker 2: the statements made by it wasn't Realnada's Heartogs, it was
Speaker 2: the other guy I can't recall his name offhand, The
Speaker 2: first counselor that Oswald allegedly saw when he went to
Speaker 2: youth house. He swears that Oswald was there March twenty seventh,
Speaker 2: the last Saturday in March, because and he was positive,
Speaker 2: because he was packing up all his stuff and moving
Speaker 2: because he had quit working for the State of New York.
Speaker 2: That was his last week and that was the last
Speaker 2: day that he was there. So he's confident the date
Speaker 2: was March twenty seventh. So we have three contradictory records,
Speaker 2: and we have Marguerite Oswald said in A Woman in
Speaker 2: History that she was in the court she had brought
Speaker 2: Oswald to the courtroom, and then Oswald was taken from
Speaker 2: the courtroom, right he was arrested there and taken from
Speaker 2: the courtroom. Well, how does that jive with Oswald being
Speaker 2: arrested at his apartment on April sixteenth, which we have
Speaker 2: the arrest card. The arrest card is in my book.
Speaker 2: There were newspaper articles published about policewoman Felicia Spritzer, who
Speaker 2: was allegedly some famous policewoman who went and was part
Speaker 2: of the unit that made that arrest. I have the
Speaker 2: newspaper article in there. None of that jives with the
Speaker 2: statements of Marguerite Oswald who said Oswald was taken from
Speaker 2: her in court, and none of that jives with anyone
Speaker 2: having ever met with Oh it is Milton Currion was
Speaker 2: the psychologist. None of that jives with Milton Curion statement
Speaker 2: that he met with Oswald on the twenty seventh. This
Speaker 2: is all kinds of jacked up. And then when you
Speaker 2: get into actual of the records of like where Oswald
Speaker 2: was during the period of time that he was supposed
Speaker 2: to be at youth House and whatnot, there's all kinds
Speaker 2: of contradictions. There's like memos about him doing well at
Speaker 2: PS six eleven, which PS six eleven was a school
Speaker 2: for the hearing impaired, which is weird. And then you
Speaker 2: see other mentions in the school record that Oswald had
Speaker 2: the mascuoidectom me in forty six and that he had
Speaker 2: a loss of hearing. It's the only document in the
Speaker 2: world you'll ever find anything about Oswald having a loss
Speaker 2: of hearing. And so, yeah, so the whole entire New
Speaker 2: York thing is crazy. And so then this is one
Speaker 2: thing I think is great. Marguerite will get a lawyer
Speaker 2: because she's like, this is on this is the Waltz. Margerite,
Speaker 2: she gets a lawyer, his name is Edward Budle, and
Speaker 2: she basically tells him, look, I got something's going on.
Speaker 2: What do we do here? He looks at the record
Speaker 2: and he goes, look, they're trying to lock your kid up.
Speaker 2: You better get him out of town as quick as possible. Okay.
Speaker 2: And I think that's exactly what they did. And this
Speaker 2: is where the entire controversy over South Dakota comes into
Speaker 2: the story. And I one hundred percent believe Oswald went
Speaker 2: to South Dakota. But there are some interesting anomalies in
Speaker 2: this story. So Oswald he will tell Aileen when he's
Speaker 2: in the Soviet Union that he discovered dust copy tell
Speaker 2: the book in the library in South Dakota. Okay. We
Speaker 2: have the statements of al McCole and her son, Oh
Speaker 2: what was his name, I don't recall his name offhand,
Speaker 2: but they basically she sent a letter to Lyndon Johnson said, hey,
Speaker 2: my son knew Oswald back here in nineteen fifty three
Speaker 2: during the summer. And so there's multiple data points that
Speaker 2: would indicate one hundred percent Oswald went to South Dakota.
Speaker 1: William Henry Timmer Timmer, Yes.
Speaker 2: Timmer, and so Timmer Timmer's story is interesting because Timmer
Speaker 2: will end up saying to the FBI that Oswald told
Speaker 2: him he came from New York and that he was
Speaker 2: in gangs in New York and he fought in street
Speaker 2: fights in New York and that I don't remember if
Speaker 2: you told him that he drove or he told me
Speaker 2: something he had a car or something along those lines.
Speaker 2: And that's when he starts to talk about communism and
Speaker 2: dust Capital. And this is in the summer of fifty three.
Speaker 2: This is an anomalous event because we don't have any
Speaker 2: other references to Oswald and communism until fifty eight, when
Speaker 2: you get into the Palmer McBride stuff, and then really
Speaker 2: you don't get any any inkling whatsoever that Oswald has
Speaker 2: any interest in the Soviet Union or speaking Russian until
Speaker 2: March of nineteen fifty nine. So we have an event
Speaker 2: here almost six years prior to the first confirmable you know,
Speaker 2: I say confirmable, because the Palmer McBride stuff is more hearsay.
Speaker 2: But the first confirmable times that Oswald's trying to speak
Speaker 2: Russian is in March of fifty nine. And so I've
Speaker 2: had a lot of revelations lately over Oswald and is
Speaker 2: speaking Russian, and the possibility that he did go to
Speaker 2: the Monterey Institute for Language, which I'm honestly starting to
Speaker 2: become more and moral believer of one hundred percent, I'm
Speaker 2: at ninety percent, i'd say, because I've been trying to
Speaker 2: figure out for Oswald spoke Russian at all, And it
Speaker 2: seems like when he went to the Soviet Union he
Speaker 2: didn't speak an Russian when he went there, well, not
Speaker 2: publicly to his friends. He spoke English to people who
Speaker 2: we don't know who he spoke English to. Right, something's
Speaker 2: up with Russia. And I'm gonna get to Russia when
Speaker 2: I finished this book. But he from what I hear,
Speaker 2: he didn't speak Russian when he gets over there. And
Speaker 2: we have some contradictory information about a woman who went
Speaker 2: out Rosalie I forget her name, Roslin Quinn roslind Quinn
Speaker 2: goes out on a date with Oswald while he's in
Speaker 2: the Marines, and she tells this is funny because she
Speaker 2: tells the FBI that he spoke fluent Russian like he
Speaker 2: was good. But she had also gone on a date
Speaker 2: with a guy named John Donovan who was Oswald's like supervisor,
Speaker 2: and she told Donovan that he barely spoke Russian at all. Okay,
Speaker 2: then you get into Rosalind Quinn. Turns out she was
Speaker 2: a flight stewardess, just like Marilyn Mourette was, you know,
Speaker 2: flying all these weird countries. So so Rosalind Quinn most
Speaker 2: likely a spook, right, and so you really can't trust
Speaker 2: her word in the official story. So we have all
Speaker 2: this contradiction over when Oswald actually spoke Russian, and from
Speaker 2: going through those statements of other marines, I'm starting to
Speaker 2: come to the conclusion that he didn't speak any Russian
Speaker 2: at all until March of fifty nine, when he's then
Speaker 2: seen with a Russian he's listening to Russian records like
Speaker 2: how to speak Russian records, and he's going through a
Speaker 2: Russian dictionary and the Russian newspapers he's getting he's looking
Speaker 2: up how to read them by looking up words in
Speaker 2: the Russian dictionary. So what is my current working thesis.
Speaker 2: There's this weird period between January and mid March of
Speaker 2: fifty nine when he gets back from Matsugi, he goes
Speaker 2: home for a little bit on break, comes back, and
Speaker 2: then he's doing this weird stuff that we're really not
Speaker 2: sure what he was doing. He went to San Francisco
Speaker 2: for something where the Monterey Institute is okay, but he
Speaker 2: allegedly it was from some sort of large scale drills.
Speaker 2: He also goes to Yuma, Arizona, and he spends about
Speaker 2: three weeks in Yuma, Arizona. So we don't really know
Speaker 2: what's going on here. But this is when he takes
Speaker 2: the Russian tests, so to me, and what is he
Speaker 2: barely passed it. He only got two words more right
Speaker 2: than wrong or something like that. Right, So he wasn't
Speaker 2: that good at Russian speaker when he took the test.
Speaker 2: What does that tell me? They probably did send him
Speaker 2: to Monterey Russian class at that time at the Speaking Institute.
Speaker 2: Immediately after that is when he's seen translating the Russian
Speaker 2: from the records with the dictionary right. Then he goes
Speaker 2: on the date with Rosalind Quinn where she tells Donovan
Speaker 2: that he doesn't speak good Russian at all. Then he
Speaker 2: goes to Russia where he doesn't speak Russian, and he
Speaker 2: probably learned the Russian that he did know in the
Speaker 2: Soviet Union working with Marina. That's probably where he actually
Speaker 2: did so I'm feeling much better about the fact that
Speaker 2: he actually did do a shotgun course, learned basic Russian,
Speaker 2: and then the rest of it came when he was
Speaker 2: over there. That's what I'm kind of putting together now,
Speaker 2: And so Corey, forget what we're going with that, but
Speaker 2: go ahead.
Speaker 1: But I have to question the Dakota story because the
Speaker 1: documents say he didn't go to Dakota. He went to
Speaker 1: New Orleans.
Speaker 2: Right, That's an interesting one because the documents Rosalin not
Speaker 2: Roslin Quinn. Aileen Mosby turns over her notes from the
Speaker 2: Oswald meeting to the FBI, and despite the fact that
Speaker 2: she published in the newspaper that it said that he
Speaker 2: went to North Dakota or South Dakota or was it
Speaker 2: North Dakota, it was one of the dakotas Stanley, North Dakota,
Speaker 2: North Dakota, Okay, So even though she printed that, when
Speaker 2: the FBI turned the notes over to the Warrant Commission,
Speaker 2: her notes now said when he went back to New Orleans,
Speaker 2: the same quote, but they changed North Dakota to New Orleans.
Speaker 2: So yeah, it's why would they do that? Well, obviously
Speaker 2: they're trying to hide the fact he went to North Dakota.
Speaker 2: And why would they hide the fact that they went
Speaker 2: to North Dakota. Well, because we have school records showing
Speaker 2: he was still in New York where he ended up.
Speaker 2: He ends up leaving New York January ninth or tenth,
Speaker 2: fifty four. And from there this brings us to the
Speaker 2: next chapter, which if I had a million dollars, I'd
Speaker 2: put a million dollar reward out right now for any
Speaker 2: person on planet Earth who can tell me where Lee
Speaker 2: Harvey Oswald was living between January and May of nineteen
Speaker 2: fifty four. Nobody can tell me because the story that
Speaker 2: we have is contradictory. Okay, So this is where it
Speaker 2: really gets for me. This is where I lost my marbles.
Speaker 2: This is where it really gets good as far as
Speaker 2: this was a good opportunity for further investigative research, right,
Speaker 2: especially when we get to like when Oswald goes back
Speaker 2: to Fort Worth. So January of fifty four, Oswald leaves
Speaker 2: New York, goes to New Orleans and is attending Borgard
Speaker 2: Junior High School. We have the records showing he attended
Speaker 2: classes from January all the way onward. We don't know
Speaker 2: where Oswald's living, and I'll tell you why because Oswald
Speaker 2: and his mother will not move into fourteen fifty four
Speaker 2: Saint Mary until May the end of May of nineteen
Speaker 2: fifty four. It is also at the end of May
Speaker 2: nineteen fifty four that a letter is sent from Marguerite
Speaker 2: Oswald to John Pick, where she says, Hey, we just
Speaker 2: got back to New Orleans. Really, I thought you were
Speaker 2: supposed to be there since January. But it's May and
Speaker 2: you're just now writing to John Pick. Myrtle Evans, who's
Speaker 2: a longtime friend of hers, completely in on this scheme,
Speaker 2: gives testimony and says that she thought that when Marguerite
Speaker 2: came back to New Orleans, she had come from either
Speaker 2: San Antonio or Fort Worth. Okay, I one hundred percent
Speaker 2: believe this. I don't think it's Fort Worth. I think
Speaker 2: it is San Antonio because I've seen two or three
Speaker 2: other references miscellaneous references to San Antonio that I can't
Speaker 2: fit into any narrative whatsoever. Something was going on in
Speaker 2: San Antonio. John Pick was not living there at that time.
Speaker 2: It was years later he would live in San Antonio.
Speaker 2: So I don't know what to deal with San Antonio is.
Speaker 2: But nonetheless, we don't know where Oswald and his mother
Speaker 2: are until they move into fourteen fifty four Saint Mary
Speaker 2: at the end of May. Now here's the problem with this.
Speaker 2: The school record showing Oswald starts in January. Hebrew friends
Speaker 2: a woman at Borguard Junior High School named Myra drus LaRue.
Speaker 2: She is a woman's pe teacher, but she is has
Speaker 2: a homeroom, and that homeroom is in the basement of
Speaker 2: the school on the stage right, and so homeroom you
Speaker 2: go and you check in and they make sure you're
Speaker 2: there for the day, and then you go off to
Speaker 2: your first class. Starting in that semester in January, she
Speaker 2: had a student in her homeroom named Lee Harvey Oswald
Speaker 2: who she would see hanging around the library after class,
Speaker 2: and she just happened to befriend him, and he made
Speaker 2: it a very specific point that he wanted to be
Speaker 2: called Harvey Oswald. He didn't go by Lee, he went
Speaker 2: by Harvey, and so everyone knew him as Harvey Oswald.
Speaker 2: She tells a story about how one day a piano
Speaker 2: fell on Harvey and Edvi Bell is a student at Boredguard.
Speaker 2: Edvi Bell is the one who came and got her
Speaker 2: and then they helped Harvey yep, and she ended up
Speaker 2: driving him home from school that day. And this member
Speaker 2: this is early nineteen fifty four. This is in that
Speaker 2: first semester of fifty four. She drives him home to
Speaker 2: one twenty six Exchange Place. She called it Exchange Alley,
Speaker 2: which is what it had been. But this is absolutely
Speaker 2: unbelievably important because Oswald and his mother are not supposed
Speaker 2: to have moved into one twenty six Exchange Place until
Speaker 2: June of nineteen fifty five, more than a year later.
Speaker 2: They're not supposed to be at one twenty six Exchange Place.
Speaker 2: So this is where you get some really really crazy overlap.
Speaker 2: And I think, and it's in the book, I kind
Speaker 2: of deduced where everybody was at what time. So you
Speaker 2: have Marguerite and his mother, I'm sorry, Margaret Elle and
Speaker 2: his mother are living at fourteen fifty four Saint Mary,
Speaker 2: allegedly right until June or July of fifty five. But
Speaker 2: we start to get letters from Margaree to John Pick
Speaker 2: in October of fifty four with the address one twenty
Speaker 2: six Exchange Place. Okay, everybody and their mother testified that
Speaker 2: they didn't move into one twenty six Exchange Place. Until
Speaker 2: summer fifty five. But we start to have letters sent
Speaker 2: to John Pick from his real mother, the real Marguerite
Speaker 2: in October, and we have a letter in October, and
Speaker 2: we have a letter in November from exchange place. But
Speaker 2: the official story says that they're at one four five
Speaker 2: four Saint Mary until the summer. Okay, this is when
Speaker 2: we start to have the appearances of It took me
Speaker 2: a long time to figure this out, and even John
Speaker 2: Armstrong didn't figure this out. And John Armstrong actually did
Speaker 2: some incredible investigative work that he ended up discarding that
Speaker 2: he shouldn't have discarded. So you have Oswald now suddenly
Speaker 2: appears in Fort Worth at Stripling Junior High School in October,
Speaker 2: ish October, November of nineteen fifty four. Okay, this is
Speaker 2: at a time when Oswald is clearly registered and going
Speaker 2: to school in Boreguard. So what do we have. Harvey
Speaker 2: Oswald is going to Beauregard January for that first semester.
Speaker 2: End that semester close to October, he ends up leaving
Speaker 2: and going to Fort Worth, and the real Lee Harvey
Speaker 2: Oswald ends up taking his place at Bouregard. This is
Speaker 2: crazy to me. Did people just not notice. Oh my god,
Speaker 2: Oswald looked so much different. Maybe they banked on like
Speaker 2: over the summer, how kids grow. Maybe they thought that
Speaker 2: would be enough change for them to be able to
Speaker 2: swap them out. Well they did, and the one person
Speaker 2: who remained friends with Lee Oswald is Edva Bell. Edva
Speaker 2: Bell was there when Oswald got into the fight with
Speaker 2: Johnny Nwmeyer and had his front tooth knocked out, testified
Speaker 2: to Warren Commission. Oswald had his tooth knocked out, you
Speaker 2: know Oswald when he had the autopsy done and they
Speaker 2: dug him up. He didn't have a false tooth. Okay,
Speaker 2: So we have some shenanigans there. But Edva Bell, I
Speaker 2: think clearly obviously knew both Harvey and Lee. And then
Speaker 2: Edva Bell will join the Civil Air Patrol. He will
Speaker 2: bring the real Lee Oswald into the Civil l Patrol
Speaker 2: of July twenty seventh of what is that what years
Speaker 2: fifty five? Fifty five, yeah, fifty five, right after he
Speaker 2: graduates from Bourreguard. So we have all this stuff going
Speaker 2: on in New Orleans. However, simultaneously after Oswald is seen
Speaker 2: and confirmed by Frank Goodlady, who's the assistant principal who
Speaker 2: met with John Armstrong confirmed Oswald was at Stripling in
Speaker 2: that fifty four to fifty five school year for approximately
Speaker 2: six weeks. So now we have another Oswald in two
Speaker 2: places at once, this time one in Fort Worth, the
Speaker 2: other one in New Orleans. It is around this time
Speaker 2: we will run into a problem. We will run into
Speaker 2: an issue where we have a Lee Harvey Oswald and
Speaker 2: his mother, Marguerite Oswald, are now working at Dolly Shoe store, okay,
Speaker 2: for Mary Goodman. The problem is that Oswald can't be
Speaker 2: working at Dolly Shoe and going to Borgar at the
Speaker 2: same time. It's too much of a problem there, okay.
Speaker 2: And so we also have the testimony of Tommy Brown
Speaker 2: and Randall Reeves and a couple other guys in Fort
Speaker 2: Worth who will tell John Armstrong that they knew and
Speaker 2: went to school with Lee Harvey Oswald at Moniggue Junior
Speaker 2: High School where they all graduated that June of fifty five. Okay, Now,
Speaker 2: this is kind of out of left field, and even
Speaker 2: John Armstrong disregarded this information. The reason he shouldn't have
Speaker 2: disregarded this information is because I one hundred percent believe it.
Speaker 2: And the reason I believe it is because Tommy Brown,
Speaker 2: who was one of the guys who knew Oswald at Monig,
Speaker 2: he gave a very explicit description on where Oswald was
Speaker 2: living on Davenport, a bunch of streets over from I
Speaker 2: think it was Exeter, a bunch of houses over from Exeter.
Speaker 2: And so the issue with this is that Tommy Brown
Speaker 2: should never have known about that house because that house,
Speaker 2: dollars to donuts, will be the house that Robert Oswald
Speaker 2: will move into on Davenport. What is it seventy thirty
Speaker 2: seven seventeen or seventy three thirteen Davenport, one of those.
Speaker 2: But the problem is that this is we're talking June
Speaker 2: of fifty five. Robert Oswald will not buy or move
Speaker 2: into that house for two more years. Okay, this brought
Speaker 2: this in my research, brought me back to the whole
Speaker 2: covert real estate network when I dug into the documents
Speaker 2: from Armstrong. Turns out the guy who owned the house
Speaker 2: at the time was a guy named Joseph Summerfeld who
Speaker 2: was like a lifelong high level freemason involved with the
Speaker 2: Scottish Right and all that stuff, which made my bells
Speaker 2: go off back to guy Banister and all this stuff,
Speaker 2: and how many other unexplained things do we have? You know,
Speaker 2: loving enterprises who owned one twenty six exchange place. They
Speaker 2: were obviously in on some shenanigans. I couldn't link any
Speaker 2: of them to any of these other people. But to me,
Speaker 2: to see the Scottish right pop up a second time
Speaker 2: in the life of Oswald was too creepy. And that's
Speaker 2: kind of what spawned all my freemason research that I'm doing.
Speaker 2: But we have major contradictions in where Oswald was again
Speaker 2: for this entire period January fifty four all the way
Speaker 2: through here June of fifty five, clearly in two places
Speaker 2: at once, and so it's it's it's go ahead.
Speaker 1: Did John Armstrong ever track down.
Speaker 2: Edva Bell, No, he was dead. He died at thirty one.
Speaker 2: So Edward Bill died of a pulmonary embolism. His father
Speaker 2: told John Armstrong that he was healthy one day and
Speaker 2: dead the next, and his father was adamant that it
Speaker 2: had something to do with the Oswald case.
Speaker 1: So whose duplicity keeps you up at night? You write
Speaker 1: that in the book you remember you need me to
Speaker 1: you will be.
Speaker 2: Heah, give me a hint. I probably said that a
Speaker 2: bunch of people.
Speaker 1: How deep into the deception was Robert Oswald?
Speaker 2: So Robert Oswald. The thing about Robert Oswald is he
Speaker 2: is he was clearly in on this from a very
Speaker 2: young age, because, like I said, he said that they
Speaker 2: were out in Benbrook, Exus and forty six, you know,
Speaker 2: and we have the statements going back to forty five
Speaker 2: of them up in Boston. To me, it's a parent
Speaker 2: that he knew what was going on all the way
Speaker 2: back then. He didn't have much of a choice. If
Speaker 2: he's at Benbrook, but the real Oswald is in Covington,
Speaker 2: then we can say with certainty he was with the
Speaker 2: false Marguerie. Well, honestly, I think this guy's a brother.
Speaker 2: And I'll say why I think this guy is a brother?
Speaker 2: Why this Harvey Oswald? Which Harvey Oswald and Harvey Oswald? Okay,
Speaker 2: I think instead of there being four, instead of there
Speaker 2: being three brothers, John Pick, Robert Oswald and Lee Harvey Oswald,
Speaker 2: I think there's four brothers. And I think that and
Speaker 2: I believe this because of what was said to Milton
Speaker 2: Curian by Harvey Oswald. So March twenty seventh, when Oswald
Speaker 2: is not supposed to be at youth house. Yet Milton
Speaker 2: Curian meets with him. During this meeting, he will tell
Speaker 2: him he oh, and he describes Oswald as having been
Speaker 2: about four foot eight, gaunt, skinny little kid, whereas we
Speaker 2: have the school records of the really Oswald said he
Speaker 2: was five at four one hundred and thirty pounds, you know,
Speaker 2: so a totally different, you know, sized build of a person.
Speaker 2: Harvey Oswald identified himself to Milton Curion as Harvey Oswald.
Speaker 2: He said, my name is Harvey. This is like the
Speaker 2: third or fourth what I call real time usage of
Speaker 2: the name. And so what he tells Milton Currian is
Speaker 2: that when they would get into a new area, a
Speaker 2: new community, and this is a quote, knowing that he
Speaker 2: Harvey would ditch school and not go to school, his
Speaker 2: brother would go in his stead, which made it increasingly
Speaker 2: difficult for him to attend school. Okay, what brother are
Speaker 2: we talking about? Robert Oswald's five and a half years
Speaker 2: older than Oswald. No possibility at all a sixteen year
Speaker 2: old could go to school for an eleven year old
Speaker 2: and get away with it. Ever, so what brother is
Speaker 2: he talking about? Obviously he's talking about the brother that
Speaker 2: could get away with it Lee Oswald. Right. John Armstrong
Speaker 2: had a theory that Harvey Oswald kept going to school
Speaker 2: and then dropping out because he couldn't get the records
Speaker 2: transferred like Lee Harvey like the Really Oswald had a
Speaker 2: steady stream of the same records going from school to school.
Speaker 2: But Harvey Oswald had to keep dropping out of school
Speaker 2: because he would go for a time, the records would
Speaker 2: never show up. They'd say, hey, your record's never showed up,
Speaker 2: and you'd have to leave and go to another school,
Speaker 2: and he would repeat that process. But that's why I
Speaker 2: think they're brothers, because of what he said to Milton Curion,
Speaker 2: combined with the fact that that would explain the overwhelming
Speaker 2: similarities in appearance, including the little flat crook of the ear,
Speaker 2: the hairline, a whole lot of stuff. Right, So that's
Speaker 2: why I'm convinced that their brothers. But where were we
Speaker 2: taking that?
Speaker 1: And yet and yet it's Robert who has the dual
Speaker 1: scar on the back of the year.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm convinced that Robert Oswald impersonatedly at some point
Speaker 2: in his life. This is another thing I think is
Speaker 2: kind of weird. So it's apparent that Robert Oswald, Robert
Speaker 2: Oswald Senior. Nobody knew him as Robert. Everyone called him Lee.
Speaker 2: When you reach the Warreant Commission, this is Lee's father,
Speaker 2: we're talking, yeah, right, So everyone's testimony and Warren Commission
Speaker 2: they are Lillian. Everyone who knew him they called him Lee.
Speaker 2: Robert Oswald is born, same exact name. From what I gather,
Speaker 2: he was called Lee also all the way up until
Speaker 2: the time that Lee Harvey Oswald was born. So here's
Speaker 2: an interesting story at the Bethlehem Orphanage. One of the teachers.
Speaker 2: I don't know if I included this in the book
Speaker 2: or not. One of the teachers at the Bethlehem Orphanage,
Speaker 2: when the FBI spoke to him, he told them that
Speaker 2: he very clearly remembered Lee, and he remembered John Pick,
Speaker 2: but he had no recollection of Robert at all. And
Speaker 2: I think the reason for that is because Robert was
Speaker 2: going by the name Lee, and I think that that
Speaker 2: ended up changing at some point in time. There is
Speaker 2: much later after the assassinate there's I forget. This is
Speaker 2: a story that was related to me. A reporter was
Speaker 2: with Robert Oswald in his house and was flipping through
Speaker 2: some books that he had on his bookshelf, and she
Speaker 2: opened one up and it was inscribed to Lee in
Speaker 2: the book, and she asked him about it, and Robert
Speaker 2: Oswald told her, Oh, he must have lent it to
Speaker 2: Lee at some point in time. But I don't believe
Speaker 2: that at all. I believe he went by Lee for
Speaker 2: a period of time in his life, and that book
Speaker 2: was given to him when he was went by Lee,
Speaker 2: and that makes more sense than anything. What doesn't. What
Speaker 2: I don't get is that, to me, would cause some
Speaker 2: sort of existential friction. If my dad's name is Joe,
Speaker 2: and I'm Joe Junior my whole life, and then all
Speaker 2: of a sudden I have a brother and now he's
Speaker 2: Joe and I got to go back to my other name,
Speaker 2: I would think there's some kind of resentment there, right
Speaker 2: when that calls some kind of family friction. If all
Speaker 2: of a sudden your name is stripped from you and
Speaker 2: given your little brother like that would be a major problem.
Speaker 2: I don't understand how that fits into the g Greater story,
Speaker 2: but to me, it feels like there's some major significance there.
Speaker 1: You know, So Roberts is blatantly off skating line his.
Speaker 2: Warrant testimony, right Yeah, So he gets out of the
Speaker 2: Marines in July fifty five. In fifty three, he'll go
Speaker 2: to Korea. No, in fifty three, he goes down to
Speaker 2: Miami and then he comes. Yeah, he goes to Miami first,
Speaker 2: and then he goes to Korea after Miami. In January
Speaker 2: of nineteen fifty four, and this is in the book,
Speaker 2: he starts to testify to the Warrant Commission that he
Speaker 2: visited his family in New Orleans in January fifty four
Speaker 2: and that he stayed with them at their place. They're
Speaker 2: not supposed to have a place in New Orleans and
Speaker 2: January fifty four, because it's not until like the tenth
Speaker 2: or that second or third week they get to New Orleans.
Speaker 2: Then they stay allegedly with Lillian Mourett for a couple
Speaker 2: of weeks, and then then the story goes haywire. But
Speaker 2: we don't know where le Oswald and his mother are
Speaker 2: in January fifty four. And then right as Robert is
Speaker 2: about to be asked about that, Dulles cuts him off
Speaker 2: and says, let's take a five minute break before he
Speaker 2: can say, because where did he stay with him? Where
Speaker 2: did he stay? Tell us where did he stay? Then
Speaker 2: when they asked the same question to Lillian Morett, she
Speaker 2: gives a story about Robert coming and taking them all
Speaker 2: over to exchange place. But that's not until July of
Speaker 2: fifty five, when Robert gets out of the Marines. So
Speaker 2: what was going on here? Where did they stay in
Speaker 2: January fifty four? Why is everyone lying about it? How
Speaker 2: does Dulles even know about it? To cut them off?
Speaker 2: You see what I'm saying, Like, this is a cluster.
Speaker 2: This is a cluster, And I'm telling you the reality
Speaker 2: is we don't know where Lee and his mother were
Speaker 2: from January to May at all. Million dollar reward if
Speaker 2: anyone can tell me, I don't have a million bucks.
Speaker 2: But you know what I'm saying. Do you think do
Speaker 2: you think?
Speaker 1: So? Tell me about why Robert Oswald was in Miami.
Speaker 2: He was stationed at the secret CIA base at Opa Laca,
Speaker 2: the base that they overthrew Our Bends and guatem Mala,
Speaker 2: and the base that they ended up launching and running
Speaker 2: Operation Mongoose out of. Now this is in fifty three,
Speaker 2: This is long before any of that stuff. But at
Speaker 2: the time, Howard Howard Hunt was stationed out there, and
Speaker 2: like this is the beginning of the way I see
Speaker 2: at that time period was kind of the beginning of
Speaker 2: them starting to focus on on the Caribbean in the
Speaker 2: Middle and like the Central America. Like this is when
Speaker 2: that stuff was kind of building up.
Speaker 1: Dulles certainly would have known Pbe's success and Oswald and
Speaker 1: what was.
Speaker 2: Going on in Miami when oh yeah.
Speaker 1: He was getting speaking about that in his testimony.
Speaker 2: Right, So I don't. I see. That's another thing. I
Speaker 2: really want to more understand the role of Robert Oswald
Speaker 2: in this thing. How old was he when he got
Speaker 2: pulled into this. I just some of these questions I
Speaker 2: don't have answers to, and they and they're really I mean,
Speaker 2: I think we need to know what Robert Oswald was
Speaker 2: up to. I mean, I'm hoping that maybe one of
Speaker 2: his kids will spill the beans and like maybe they
Speaker 2: told him. I don't know, See, I don't. It's really
Speaker 2: frustrating when you see people who are obviously in on it,
Speaker 2: obviously lying, and now they're dead. What are we supposed
Speaker 2: to do with that?
Speaker 1: You know? Yeah, I know. And clock sticking, I mean,
Speaker 1: you know this, You're you're kind of watching this whole
Speaker 1: era fade away as you're trying to get a sense
Speaker 1: of it, and it's just correct through your fingers.
Speaker 2: Correct. Correct. So Robert Oswald, fortunately I pulled up I
Speaker 2: got a subscription to search military records, and I verified
Speaker 2: his military history. There's nothing out of place. Everywhere they
Speaker 2: said he was, he was, you know, he was in Memphis,
Speaker 2: he was in all the places that he was supposed
Speaker 2: to be. He went to Korea, like I checked his
Speaker 2: I checked the diaries, and there's nothing unusual about his
Speaker 2: time in the Marines unless they did some of that
Speaker 2: you know, obfuscation stuff, because like anyone who did any
Speaker 2: radar operator stuff, whether it was working on their machines
Speaker 2: or running them or plotting board, any of that stuff,
Speaker 2: that was all classified. And so everyone who did the
Speaker 2: radar stuff at Biloxi it doesn't say Biloxi on their
Speaker 2: on their paperwork, it says they were usually like mc Castco.
Speaker 2: Which is casual company, which is like at the station headquarters.
Speaker 2: They have ways of putting you on paper to where
Speaker 2: you can go do something else, you know, and that's
Speaker 2: what they did for everyone involved in the radar stuff.
Speaker 2: So unless Robert Oswald has some of that stuff tied
Speaker 2: into with his record, it seems pretty above board. How
Speaker 2: he got to be picked to go to Opa Laca
Speaker 2: is I don't know. But there's another guy in the
Speaker 2: Oswald story who ends up at Opa Laca, a guy
Speaker 2: who's in the Marines with Oswald named Well. His name
Speaker 2: is Alan Robert Feld. And this is a crazy, crazy
Speaker 2: story about Alan Feld. So the two Oswald things is
Speaker 2: going on. Oswald ends up going to the Marines October
Speaker 2: twenty fourth, fifty six. This is where my second book
Speaker 2: on Oswald starts. He will go to San Diego for
Speaker 2: basic training and then he goes to Camp Pendleton for
Speaker 2: individual combat training. While he is at Camp Pendleton, he's
Speaker 2: there with a guy named Alan Robert Feld. I can
Speaker 2: prove Alan Arfeld was there because I have his picture
Speaker 2: in the in the in the the yearbook. But on
Speaker 2: all the initial paperwork he's listed as Alexander Alexander d Feld.
Speaker 2: He's not on there as Alan Arfeld. He's in there
Speaker 2: as Alexander Defeld. Well, he had come forward and told
Speaker 2: the FBI after the assassination that he was with Oswald
Speaker 2: at Camp Pendleton and then they went to Jacksonville, and
Speaker 2: then from Jacksonville they both went to Memphis, okay, and
Speaker 2: that after Memphis he ends up going to the CIA
Speaker 2: base at Opa Laca. This contradicts the official story which
Speaker 2: says that Oswald went from Camp Pendleton to Jacksonville, to
Speaker 2: Biloxi and then to El Toro and then to Atsugi. Right,
Speaker 2: So we have this contradiction here. I have pulled all
Speaker 2: of the Marine diaries for all this stuff. Alexander Feld
Speaker 2: once he he's on the roster as Alexander D. Feld
Speaker 2: all the way until he gets to Memphis. Then once
Speaker 2: he gets to Memphis, he's back as Alan Robert Feld.
Speaker 2: This directly the Marine diaries completely contradict the Marine yearbook,
Speaker 2: which has Alan Arfeld's picture and it says his name
Speaker 2: Alan Rfeld. So, this being a crazy story, what does
Speaker 2: John Armstrong do? John Armstrong tries to track this guy down.
Speaker 2: The Alan r Feld that the FBI tracked down and
Speaker 2: interviewed is actually not Alan Rfeld. It's Robert allen Feld.
Speaker 2: And he denied knowing anybody. Why they wasted their time,
Speaker 2: I don't even know. So John Armstrong tracks this guy
Speaker 2: down and he finds Alan r Feld had changed his
Speaker 2: Social Security number but continued to live in the same
Speaker 2: exact house that was on the official documentation for where
Speaker 2: Alan Arfeld lived, and when he met him in person,
Speaker 2: Alan r Feld denied the whole thing and said, I
Speaker 2: don't know what you're talking about. Refused to talk to Armstrong. Crazy.
Speaker 2: Huh crazy. He's not the only person on the Marine
Speaker 2: rosters with a different name. I found a couple other
Speaker 2: people with different names on the roster from what they
Speaker 2: should be. So I don't know what's going on there.
Speaker 2: I don't know if they group certain people together because
Speaker 2: they were involved in intelligence. I'm starting to think that
Speaker 2: a bunch of these guys get recruited into intelligence and
Speaker 2: then they're told you have to go join the Marines,
Speaker 2: like Kerrie Thornley. I'm convinced Kerry Thornley got recruited in
Speaker 2: high school from the Voice of Democracy contest out in Whittier, California,
Speaker 2: and then from there he joins the Marines his junior
Speaker 2: year of high school, goes to basic training between his
Speaker 2: junior and senior year.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: And so I'm pretty convinced that they'll recruit these kids
Speaker 2: from families or from whatever. They recruit them, and then
Speaker 2: going into the Marines is the step one of their
Speaker 2: official training, you know.
Speaker 1: So all right, how deep into the deception was the
Speaker 1: other brother, John Pick? And can you tie into We've
Speaker 1: all had our share of bizarre Thanksgivings, But tell me
Speaker 1: about Thanksgiving nineteen sixty two.
Speaker 2: Okay, so I'll get that Thanksgiving sixty two, but it
Speaker 2: needs to be prefaced because John Pick and Oswald were
Speaker 2: as close as brothers. They were never they never they
Speaker 2: were half brothers. But that was never a thing in
Speaker 2: the family that was never. It was never like, hey,
Speaker 2: this is my half brother. It was like this is
Speaker 2: my brother. It was just how they grew up together.
Speaker 2: It was just how it was. The last time that
Speaker 2: John Pick will see Lee Harvey Oswald, the real Oswald,
Speaker 2: will be around August, September, maybe October at the latest,
Speaker 2: of nineteen fifty three. Okay, right after he moves out
Speaker 2: of his place in Manhattan, moves to the Bronx, John Pick,
Speaker 2: when this is another thing I'll get to you here
Speaker 2: in a second, John Pick will go and visit Oswald
Speaker 2: in the apartment in the Bronx, and that's the last
Speaker 2: time he will see Oswald until Thanksgiving of sixty two.
Speaker 2: Something I need to point out here. Robert Oswald claims
Speaker 2: he didn't go to New York to visit them until
Speaker 2: July of nineteen three, and this is when he will
Speaker 2: take the picture of Harvey Oswald at the Bronx Zoo.
Speaker 2: So this is the slam dunk proof that we know
Speaker 2: he was involved with both Oswald families because he took
Speaker 2: the real Oswald is his brother. But yet he's the
Speaker 2: one who took the picture of the Bronx Zoo and
Speaker 2: the one at the Bronx Zoo was clearly Harvey Oswald.
Speaker 2: So the problem that we have is that John Pick
Speaker 2: testified to the Warrant Commission that Robert Oswald actually visited
Speaker 2: New York very shortly after Oswald had moved out of
Speaker 2: the apartment to go to the Bronx. He said, within
Speaker 2: a month. So he put Robert Oswald's first visit to
Speaker 2: New York in October or November of fifty three, because
Speaker 2: all of them together went up to visit Oswald at
Speaker 2: the apartment and building in the Bronx, including Robert Oswald.
Speaker 2: Robert Oswald swears that his visit wasn't until July. Why
Speaker 2: is Robert Oswald involved in more lies? Why is it
Speaker 2: important when he visited New York? I don't understand why
Speaker 2: there's more lying here, but there is. And so John
Speaker 2: Pick cannot be in on this identity transfer skis. He
Speaker 2: can't be. He calls out every single every single time
Speaker 2: there's a contradiction, he calls out the contradiction. So he
Speaker 2: has shown the picture when he's testifying of Oswald at
Speaker 2: the Bronx Zoo. He looked at the photograph and he says, Sir,
Speaker 2: from this picture, I cannot tell you that this is
Speaker 2: Lee Harvey Oswald. Well, guess who was able to identify
Speaker 2: that picture. Milton Curion, the psychologist who only met Oswald
Speaker 2: one time for a couple hours. He was able to
Speaker 2: identify that picture at the Bronx Zoo as the kid
Speaker 2: that he had met with as Lee Harvey Oswald as
Speaker 2: Harvey Oswald. Actually, he was able to identify that like
Speaker 2: thirty years later to John Armstrong. So Milton Curion, a
Speaker 2: guy who met this kid one time, could identify him,
Speaker 2: but his own brother could not identify him as being
Speaker 2: his brother. The photo at the Bronx Zoo is the
Speaker 2: slam dunk to me proof. And I don't like the
Speaker 2: word proof because even proof is only ninety nine point
Speaker 2: nine nine nine is never one hundred percent right. You
Speaker 2: can have a video of somebody shooting somebody that's not
Speaker 2: one hundred percent. There's always something there, right, So as
Speaker 2: close to proof as you can get is this photograph
Speaker 2: of the Oswald or Harvey Oswald at the Bronx Zoo
Speaker 2: that prefaces all the stuff that happened down in New
Speaker 2: Orleans leading up to the Marines and just kind of
Speaker 2: emphasizes and kicks off the fact that there were two
Speaker 2: boys here that were both using the same identity. The
Speaker 2: one thing that really bothers me about the whole thing,
Speaker 2: It doesn't seem like this was managed very well at
Speaker 2: the time. Why did they use the same freaking name?
Speaker 2: You know, that had to be operational. If they had
Speaker 2: just given one of the kids, if they had had
Speaker 2: given Harvey Oswald a totally fake name until until he
Speaker 2: was ready to, you know, defect, we wouldn't be having
Speaker 2: this conversation because there wouldn't be contradictions in the record,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. So just the fact that
Speaker 2: they used the same name screwed them, Like they were
Speaker 2: so sloppy in everything, is this is the intelligence community
Speaker 2: always sloppy? Is this how they operate? I mean, are
Speaker 2: they just leaven slop everywhere for people to find. I
Speaker 2: don't know, but it seems to be the case all
Speaker 2: the way back then. This thing doesn't seem like it
Speaker 2: was managed as professionally as it should have been, not
Speaker 2: nearly as well thought out.
Speaker 1: And you make a point that as a law enforcement officer,
Speaker 1: if you were to make an air, that air doesn't
Speaker 1: stay in your report. And we're seeing this all over right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so from my experience, and I'm pretty sure this
Speaker 2: is how it is everywhere. When you write a report,
Speaker 2: it's your report. You send it to a supervisor. He
Speaker 2: doesn't have the authority legally to correct your report, even
Speaker 2: if it's just a missing comma or a period. And
Speaker 2: I work for an agency that was really really big
Speaker 2: on grammar. You screwed up your grammar, you got your
Speaker 2: report kicked back to you every time. And so yeah,
Speaker 2: if I put in a wrong name, you know, part
Speaker 2: of the supervisor's job is to verify the names in
Speaker 2: the name section against what you put in the report,
Speaker 2: and if there's even just a spelling error, it gets
Speaker 2: kicked back to you. We got about close to one
Speaker 2: hundred documents that say Harvey the Oswald even in handwriting,
Speaker 2: right years after the assassination, and when I when I
Speaker 2: found all these documents from Defense Intelligence Agency, Marine G
Speaker 2: two NI customs, you name it, it became brutally obvious.
Speaker 2: Everybody knows. Everybody knew. Everybody who's anybody, including the Warrant Commission,
Speaker 2: knew that there were two Oswald's. They knew it because
Speaker 2: that's what they were protecting. When they're going in there interviewing,
Speaker 2: why do you think they called in what was their name,
Speaker 2: Lilian Bootaree? Lillian Bootaree was the daughter of mister and
Speaker 2: missus Thomas Roach, who lived with Oswald allegedly in forty
Speaker 2: two at the Congress address. What does that have to
Speaker 2: do with the assassination? Absolutely nothing. When they called them in,
Speaker 2: they called them in to clarify timelines. And why would
Speaker 2: they could do that because in forty one and forty
Speaker 2: two is when we're dealing with those major conflicts in
Speaker 2: Marguerite Oswald's timeline. So they're calling people in and they're
Speaker 2: asking them about stuff that's got nothing to do with
Speaker 2: the assassination, because they know all this stuff that I'm
Speaker 2: telling you, and they're trying to make sure who knows
Speaker 2: what and when that's what they're doing, Hey, was Oswald
Speaker 2: right handed or was he left handed? Why are you
Speaker 2: asking that? Right? Like, when you finally come to understand
Speaker 2: that they were well aware of the two Oswald and
Speaker 2: you go back and you read the testimony, particularly people
Speaker 2: like Merle and Julian Evans and the woman who lived
Speaker 2: above them at one twenty six exchange place, it's obvious
Speaker 2: they knew what the deal was and they're formulating their
Speaker 2: questions to verify to themselves who knew which Oswald. That's clear.
Speaker 2: Like when you start to read some of this stuff,
Speaker 2: you're like, oh my god, that's exactly what they're doing.
Speaker 2: They're feeling out who knew which one?
Speaker 1: Paul, you're talking about the actual Warren Commission.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Albert Jenner, Yes, what tells me? Here's what I
Speaker 2: I'm promising you. There is a secret Warrant Commission report somewhere.
Speaker 2: We have the official story. I promise you, somewhere there
Speaker 2: is an unofficial story that talks about all this and
Speaker 2: how they need to navigate around it. This is how
Speaker 2: bureaucracy works. When you're dealing with a team of people
Speaker 2: who have to keep this thing under wraps. They have
Speaker 2: to have communications that are beyond top secret, and then
Speaker 2: they had to Eventually all that stuff needed to be
Speaker 2: compiled into some sort of preliminary report to let us know, Hey,
Speaker 2: this is how we're going to shape the narrative based
Speaker 2: on this, right, So somewhere is a report where they
Speaker 2: talk about this stuff has to be, has to be
Speaker 2: because that is how bureaucracy works. So but yeah, all
Speaker 2: the everyone knew about it. Maybe Dallas police didn't know,
Speaker 2: you know, maybe certain people at the FBI didn't know,
Speaker 2: But when it came down to it, the people at
Speaker 2: the core of the analysis of this thing, they all knew.
Speaker 2: I mean, how else are you going to get two
Speaker 2: different guys with the same name running through the Marines
Speaker 2: the same time without Marine G two coordination, You're not gonna.
Speaker 1: So the work that the Warrant Commission did, then, you conclude,
Speaker 1: is less interested in the actual mechanics of the assassination
Speaker 1: than it is put it getting the timeline right about Oswald.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, for sure. Now do I think that the
Speaker 2: do I think the Warren Commission knew who pulled the
Speaker 2: triggers and stuff? Well, they had a lot of the
Speaker 2: David Ferry stuff. They knew all about David Ferry, and
Speaker 2: I'm sure they had a lot of the documents of
Speaker 2: the New Orleans stuff and that all got squashed. Right,
Speaker 2: they have to be exposed to the information to know
Speaker 2: what to squash. And so just like the nine to
Speaker 2: eleven Commission, just like the Nuremberg trials, just like every
Speaker 2: other you know, we haven't had the COVID Commission yet.
Speaker 2: I'm still hoping that comes. But these things are all
Speaker 2: like they have their answer before they start, and they
Speaker 2: just have it's about formulating how to get to the
Speaker 2: where they you know, how do they want to get
Speaker 2: to their answer?
Speaker 1: Right? So right, it always had to be that guy
Speaker 1: that window, that building, that rifle, and yeah, that was
Speaker 1: the objective, right formulate. So when you see the famous
Speaker 1: photograph of David Ferry and Lee Oswald having a barbecue together, Wow,
Speaker 1: that who is that?
Speaker 2: That's interesting? That's the really Oswald. And this is kind
Speaker 2: of fascinating because at this point, and you know, it's
Speaker 2: the really Oswald. How do we know this? Because Harvey
Speaker 2: Oswald and his mother, we have the clear path of
Speaker 2: them leaving one twenty six exchange place in October, going
Speaker 2: to Tu Serah Thomas Place in Fort Worth, him going
Speaker 2: to Strippling, and then all the testimony of people who
Speaker 2: knew him at Monig So this entire time, Harvey Oswald,
Speaker 2: he's over in Fort Worth. So it's the really Harvey
Speaker 2: Oswald who's dealing with David Ferry and ed Via Bell
Speaker 2: and probably Barry Seal who was in David Ferry's caap
Speaker 2: in fifty six. So my boy, my boy Jim thinks
Speaker 2: that Barry Seal might be in that photo. We just
Speaker 2: don't know which one it is. It's possible because Barry
Speaker 2: Seal confirmed he was in that group. So but yeah,
Speaker 2: it's definitely the real Oswald there. And so then what
Speaker 2: happens after that we get into let me see, we're
Speaker 2: in the summer. Then we get into like fall of
Speaker 2: fifty five, and here we have even more contradiction with
Speaker 2: the school record because we have Okay, so the official
Speaker 2: story says that Lee Harvey Oswald will attend Warren east
Speaker 2: In High School in New Orleans, but he'll only go
Speaker 2: for like a couple of weeks and then he'll drop out,
Speaker 2: and then allegedly he's out of school for the rest
Speaker 2: of that year. But then he starts school again in
Speaker 2: whereas in Arlington High School in fifty six for like
Speaker 2: two months until he goes to the Marines. Well, that
Speaker 2: doesn't seem right to me at all, doesn't seem right
Speaker 2: at all. I don't recall what the school records say.
Speaker 2: But Oswald himself, when he was on the Latin American
Speaker 2: radio show in WDSU, he says himself he went to
Speaker 2: Warren Easton High School for over a year. Okay, So,
Speaker 2: which is funny because the person who said that most
Speaker 2: certainly didn't go to Warren Easton High School at all,
Speaker 2: because that's Harvey Oswald and he's over in Fort Worth.
Speaker 2: But then when John Armstrong went and talked to guys
Speaker 2: like Frank de Benedetto at Two Jaigues, he said that
Speaker 2: Oswald lived in New Orleans and worked for him at
Speaker 2: two Jagues all the way up until the time he
Speaker 2: left for the Marines, which we have to assume is
Speaker 2: in October of fifty six. But we've got Oswald at
Speaker 2: Arlington High School in Fort Worth this whole time, right,
Speaker 2: and so, and then you get the weird statement about
Speaker 2: him having gone to Warren Easton for over a year,
Speaker 2: which would makes sense, but it would have been the
Speaker 2: other Oswald who was there for over a year, which
Speaker 2: means there is a coordination of stories going on. There's
Speaker 2: most certainly a coordination of story is going on at
Speaker 2: some point. But again, Oswald, on his handwritten biography that
Speaker 2: he did in the Soviet Union, he said that he
Speaker 2: was in Fort Worth from fifty four to fifty six.
Speaker 2: Where does that fall into the story? That negates everything
Speaker 2: that happens in New Orleans? Right? So what is going
Speaker 2: on here?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 2: The evidence of two people is just overwhelming. It's just NonStop.
Speaker 2: It never goes away. If you look at an angle
Speaker 2: you think is going to be kosher turns out not
Speaker 2: to be kosher at all. There's something else more to
Speaker 2: the story. And then when you get to the Marines,
Speaker 2: there's even some information that might show that Oswald could
Speaker 2: have possibly joined the Marines and left the Marines in
Speaker 2: July not October, which that I'm going to cover in
Speaker 2: the second book. I need to do some more digging.
Speaker 2: But yeah, the official story of Oswald and the two Oswald's,
Speaker 2: it never ends. It never ends. And I don't know
Speaker 2: what happens in Russia, but it doesn't end all the
Speaker 2: way throughout his time in the Marine Corps up until
Speaker 2: September fifty nine, and to me, the most stunning piece
Speaker 2: of the most stunning piece of the puzzle is the
Speaker 2: photograph taken at the passport office September tenth, fifty nine
Speaker 2: in Los Angeles.
Speaker 1: Let me ask, because that's my last question, and then
Speaker 1: we're gon we're gonna have a few kind of fun
Speaker 1: questions at the end of here. My last question about
Speaker 1: this is, so, why was the photograph of Osweald entering
Speaker 1: the Marines kept secret?
Speaker 2: That's a good question that photograph. When you look at
Speaker 2: the photograph of Oswald when he joined the Marines, it
Speaker 2: was taken December of fifty six. I forget the exact
Speaker 2: day it was December of fifty six, Maybe it's twenty eighth.
Speaker 2: That is most certainly not the guy arrested on November
Speaker 2: twenty second, And I think it's obvious from that picture
Speaker 2: it's not the same guy. There are some pictures where
Speaker 2: they look very much alike, and there's some pictures where
Speaker 2: they look very much different. Yeah, that doesn't look anything
Speaker 2: like the guy arrested on November twenty second, But you
Speaker 2: know who it does look like. It looks exactly like
Speaker 2: the guy who was on the passport photo. And it
Speaker 2: looks exactly like the guy that Robert Oswald photographed on
Speaker 2: the Mercer farm when they went squirrel hunting or whatever.
Speaker 2: So it's clearly two people the photographic evidence alone, it's
Speaker 2: all in the chin, like the really Oswald has a
Speaker 2: very strong, solid, like almost a ball chin, and then
Speaker 2: the other one has like a wider chin. I mean,
Speaker 2: it's all over the pictures of Oswald, especially once he's arrested.
Speaker 2: All the pictures of Oswald once he's arrested and November
Speaker 2: twenty second, you compare those to those early pictures of Oswald,
Speaker 2: it is not the same guy. And then well, why
Speaker 2: are they doing all this? Why are there two Oswalt
Speaker 2: in the first place? And I would call this a
Speaker 2: pre Cold War plot to get a spy in the Soviet.
Speaker 1: Union, pre Cold war plot.
Speaker 2: Yeah, forty one is pre Cold War. Well, I mean,
Speaker 2: if you want to get super technical, you could start
Speaker 2: to say that the Cold War began with World War Two.
Speaker 2: You could start to say that because we were really
Speaker 2: plotting against the Russians while we're working with them. Of
Speaker 2: what a bunch of scumbags we are. So but yeah,
Speaker 2: this is a pre Cold War experimental plot. That's why
Speaker 2: there's so many holes in it. That's why there's so
Speaker 2: many contradictions in the documents. This is a ways and
Speaker 2: means kind of thing. This is a tradecraft thing that
Speaker 2: they would go to any length to hide. Everyone knows
Speaker 2: they do body doubles and stuff, but nobody knows the details,
Speaker 2: and they don't want the details ever getting out because
Speaker 2: I have no doubts. Look at half the pictures of
Speaker 2: Osama bin Laden. That ain't Osama bin Laden, right, Okay,
Speaker 2: They've used body doubles forever, and I feel like if
Speaker 2: this were to come out, it would come out on
Speaker 2: a large scale, and then everyone would draw everything into question.
Speaker 2: You know, once you prove the government's using body double stuff,
Speaker 2: like all of the all the pictures of politicians we
Speaker 2: look at and go, hey, that's a body double, would
Speaker 2: suddenly become quite realistic, Like didn't Johnson have a body double?
Speaker 2: J bird Peck? Didn't he have his cousin sit in
Speaker 2: for him in a bunch of places?
Speaker 1: Like? You know? And man, that's interesting because there's when
Speaker 1: Milk here is on the voice recording that Willie Somerset
Speaker 1: recorded about the you know, there's gonna be a high
Speaker 1: rise building shot from a high rise building. He mentions
Speaker 1: how the president has all these body doubles, believe it
Speaker 1: or not, you know, which is fascinating. And you have
Speaker 1: a body double that you claim in Ruby's scenario. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and so an honest investigation would have would have exposed
Speaker 1: these incredible holes in this experimental plot. Yeah, yeah, did Garrison?
Speaker 1: Was he in a was he barking up this tree? Oh?
Speaker 2: Yeah, So Garrison was, yes, because Garrison was going through
Speaker 2: the documents and he's finding out that everyone's saying Oswald's
Speaker 2: a different height, like the Oswald that came back from
Speaker 2: the Soviet Union on the PaperWorks that he was five
Speaker 2: ft six, which is weird because there's a photo of
Speaker 2: Marina and Oswald standing on a bridge in the Soviet
Speaker 2: Union where Oswald is not towering over her like you
Speaker 2: should be. If Oswald was five foot nine and she's
Speaker 2: five foot one, there should be a huge gap there
Speaker 2: and there isn't, which draws into question what the hell
Speaker 2: was going on in Russia. I'm anxious to get to
Speaker 2: Russia because there's Shenanigan's a foot but he was he
Speaker 2: was convinced that well, he believed the impersonations began in
Speaker 2: the Marines, and.
Speaker 1: So Rickson believed that.
Speaker 2: Garrison believed that. Yeah, and so this is the most
Speaker 2: this is the most damning thing. The photograph that you
Speaker 2: just showed that's Oswald joining the Marines, and that's in December.
Speaker 2: He's five foot nine inches tall, which is obvious because
Speaker 2: the ball behind him says five foot nine inches tall. Okay, yeah,
Speaker 2: exactly exactly five foot nine. When he leaves the Marines
Speaker 2: in September, his paperwork will say that he's seventy one
Speaker 2: inches tall, which is five foot eleven. Okay, five foot eleven.
Speaker 2: I'm assuming there's another picture like that that they get
Speaker 2: on the way out the door that we've never seen.
Speaker 2: Every document of Oswald post has returned from the Soviet Union,
Speaker 2: and the photographs in everywhere show that he's five foot
Speaker 2: nine inches tall. What did the guy shrink two inches?
Speaker 2: I don't think. So this is more evidence of the
Speaker 2: dual Oswald plot for sure. And this is what Garrison
Speaker 2: picked up on. And yeah, so there's a there's a
Speaker 2: specific document from Garrison. It's titled Heights of the Oswalds,
Speaker 2: and that's.
Speaker 1: That's in the back in the Yeah, document section of.
Speaker 2: The book Heights of the Oswald's and it's got statements
Speaker 2: from all kinds of different people who knew Oswald at
Speaker 2: a different height. So I'm going to say it right now,
Speaker 2: I will be extremely surprised if the really Harvey Oswald,
Speaker 2: who's five foot eleven inches tall, I will be very
Speaker 2: surprised if he appears in Russia at all. Although Eileen
Speaker 2: Mosby said the Oswald she met with was five foot eleven,
Speaker 2: which doesn't make sense because the Oswald she met with
Speaker 2: clearly five foot nine, So why would you say five
Speaker 2: foot eleven. I don't know, But.
Speaker 1: What I did see.
Speaker 2: I did see a picture recently of Oswald and the
Speaker 2: Soviet Union that just struck me as the real Oswald,
Speaker 2: like the body, the gate, the height, the facial features,
Speaker 2: the hairline. So I would be shocked if the really
Speaker 2: Oswald is there. But it seems like if the really
Speaker 2: Oswald is there and Harvey Oswald is there, we have
Speaker 2: some major government shenanigans going on, including the Russians.
Speaker 1: If he wasn't there, Lee Oswald, the true Oswald born
Speaker 1: of that. This is get on right here that we're
Speaker 1: talking about, right what happened to him?
Speaker 2: The last we know of him in September tenth, nineteen
Speaker 2: fifty nine. Although this is where we get some more contradiction.
Speaker 2: There are at least two indicators that Oswald left the
Speaker 2: Marines in July, not Aber, which doesn't make any sense
Speaker 2: to me because he would have had to flown back
Speaker 2: to la to get his photograph taken September tenth at
Speaker 2: the passport office. But Robert Oswald initially his initial statements
Speaker 2: of the FBI, he told them that when Lee got
Speaker 2: out of the Marines, he came to Fort Worth and
Speaker 2: stayed with him for four months before he left for
Speaker 2: Europe and the Soviet Union. Four months. I have that,
Speaker 2: I have the document, so what is And then we
Speaker 2: have a document from the guy who handled records at
Speaker 2: the Marines. When the FBI went to go pull documents,
Speaker 2: he pulled a document that said that Oswald had left
Speaker 2: the Marines in July. So the statement from the guy
Speaker 2: in the Marine, the sergeant in the Marines who handled
Speaker 2: the staffing, his statement kind of corresponds with Robert Oswald's
Speaker 2: initial statement that Oswald had been there for four months
Speaker 2: before leaving to the Soviet Union. But we how do
Speaker 2: we account for the September tenth photograph on the passport
Speaker 2: can't account for that if the July statements are true.
Speaker 2: So I don't know. All I know is there's obfuscation.
Speaker 2: And if you were to make a map of all
Speaker 2: the obfuscation over Oswald's time in the Marines, it would
Speaker 2: be NonStop.
Speaker 1: So well, you make the point that the research requires a.
Speaker 2: Timeline, requires so many times you'll be trying to figure
Speaker 2: something out in a split second. You put it into
Speaker 2: an actual chronology, things will start to make a whole
Speaker 2: lot more sense.
Speaker 1: So I hope people if they've stuck with us, and
Speaker 1: if you haven't, then I have some Easter egg questions
Speaker 1: for Corey. But if you've stuck with us, then you
Speaker 1: would know that Corey isn't interested in Mexico City or
Speaker 1: the typical Oswald material that distracts from what's going on
Speaker 1: the whole life leading that before we you know, as
Speaker 1: a child from from the cradle is essential.
Speaker 2: Well, there's some there's some interesting stuff. I'm interested in
Speaker 2: a couple of things, not obviously not involving Oswald. But
Speaker 2: to me it's pretty obvious Carrie only was the one
Speaker 2: who went down to Mexico City and when you start
Speaker 2: to dig into, like I guess among Oswald's possessions were
Speaker 2: like flyers for like bullfighting or something like that in Mexico.
Speaker 2: God years ago. I dug into the bullfighters down there,
Speaker 2: and there's like that's all connected to some spy ring
Speaker 2: to stuff, like the bull ring stuff was and the
Speaker 2: highlight the bull the bull stuff and the highlight stuff
Speaker 2: was somehow connected to this this spying industrial complex. I
Speaker 2: just remember reading it and like it just it just
Speaker 2: kept coming up, the bullfighting and the highlight and an
Speaker 2: unrelated subject studying in Mexico City. So I'm convinced that
Speaker 2: they're involved in some kind of thing. You know, when
Speaker 2: you're a spy and you go out of town on
Speaker 2: the thing, you're not going to do any recreation. You're
Speaker 2: doing spy stuff. So I don't see them taking the
Speaker 2: time to go to some highlight match just for the
Speaker 2: hell of it, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, So you know, when do we expect volume two? Then?
Speaker 2: January February tops. I was trying to get it out
Speaker 2: by the end of this year. I just keep getting
Speaker 2: distracted because I'm working on so many different things right now.
Speaker 1: What has you know, we spoke a few months ago,
Speaker 1: pretty well received video on a Warning from History. Is
Speaker 1: there anything that you want to share about about that
Speaker 1: book since we've last talked. I'm just curious about, as
Speaker 1: have you? Has the community been responsive to what you've
Speaker 1: been putting out there, Corey or I'm just going to
Speaker 1: say this, Do they mock you in person? Or is
Speaker 1: it just behind your back?
Speaker 2: Probably just behind my back, But so I often feel
Speaker 2: like I'm just screaming into the wind and not really
Speaker 2: getting anywhere. I've been doing this for almost I mean,
Speaker 2: I've been a historian for almost eleven years. I've been
Speaker 2: doing Kennedy for seven plus. You know, at some point
Speaker 2: in time, here's what's gonna happen. I'm gonna be dead
Speaker 2: for like twenty years, and someone's gonna discover my book,
Speaker 2: and then the whole thing's gonna pop long after I'm gone.
Speaker 2: But it's really difficult, man, because I see people come
Speaker 2: up into Kennedy world who have like done nothing, which
Speaker 2: is crazy to me. I don't understand what makes I
Speaker 2: don't understand what makes people make it or not make
Speaker 2: it because I watch people's videos that just straight suck
Speaker 2: and they got thirty thousand views on it. I'm like,
Speaker 2: what the fuck is this about? You know what I mean,
Speaker 2: It's like, this doesn't make any sense to me. I'm
Speaker 2: a little abrasive, and I can be a little abrasive,
Speaker 2: but that shouldn't matter if you care about the truth.
Speaker 2: And but I don't know. I've said I send my
Speaker 2: books out to all kinds of people. Recently, I said,
Speaker 2: I've been talking to Matt Crumpton, who does that solving JFK.
Speaker 2: He's a little more open to my work, but he
Speaker 2: hangs out with like Jefferson Morley in that crowd, So
Speaker 2: I don't know what to expect from that. Jefferson Morley
Speaker 2: is a gatekeeper one hundred percent. I ain't skulling bones
Speaker 2: and Cia I'll kiss his ass in Macy's front window,
Speaker 2: you know. So, Uh, the Kennedy Research space doesn't seem
Speaker 2: like it's full of people who care about Kennedy. It
Speaker 2: seems like it's full of people who care about getting clicks.
Speaker 2: And that's frustrating to me.
Speaker 1: What would it take? What would you? I mean, what
Speaker 1: do you want to see? I mean, do you really
Speaker 1: expect I know you were trying to get this to Luna?
Speaker 1: I mean, can the tie turn on this case. Well,
Speaker 1: here's the thing.
Speaker 2: The reason I don't think we're ever gonna get anything
Speaker 2: from the government, because even though it's a long dead government,
Speaker 2: like we're sixty years past your government that was in
Speaker 2: place at the time, there should be no connections and
Speaker 2: we're never going to get anything because ultimately, when it
Speaker 2: comes out that the United States murdered its own president
Speaker 2: with the help of a foreign nation, that will impugne
Speaker 2: American prestige. Right, they still have plausible deniability. They still do.
Speaker 2: They can still say Lee, Harvey Oswald did it. We
Speaker 2: don't know what you're talking about. They can't ever let
Speaker 2: anything out that will say otherwise, because like I said,
Speaker 2: American prestige is everything. So you know, it doesn't matter
Speaker 2: if it was another government. It doesn't matter if it
Speaker 2: was another government sixty years ago, because it's still America
Speaker 2: and we just they'll never let it out no matter,
Speaker 2: no matter what. And then it'll obviously lead to all
Speaker 2: the spycraft stuff and they definitely can't have that get out.
Speaker 2: That's national security issue stuff.
Speaker 1: Correct me if I'm wrong. I mean, there's an there's
Speaker 1: a maybe an under fifty age group our generation and
Speaker 1: up and coming who are more receptive to what you're
Speaker 1: arguing what you found.
Speaker 2: Right, correct. But and I look at people like Dan
Speaker 2: Bongino and Cash Pattel who were like, gung ho, we're
Speaker 2: going to tell you the truth people, and then they
Speaker 2: get in the government and it's like Epstein killed himself, right,
Speaker 2: Like something happens when you get there, and I don't
Speaker 2: know what that is. I think they're brought into the scope.
Speaker 2: They don't have to be brought into specific details on
Speaker 2: the assassination. They just have to be let in on
Speaker 2: the overarching implications and what that'll do for American prestige
Speaker 2: moving forward. And I think that's all it takes.
Speaker 1: You're also chipping away at a kind of legacy mentality.
Speaker 1: For instance, when you go to Dallas, there's the trolley
Speaker 1: tour and it's going to take you over to the highlights,
Speaker 1: which is always have to do with Oswald.
Speaker 2: Right, I did it. I loved it. It was fun.
Speaker 1: But that's what you're tipping. You're reading. You're reading where
Speaker 1: Tippett was shot, right, and you got the the plaque there,
Speaker 1: and it's telling future generations what the official story is.
Speaker 1: That's right, that's all of that needs to you know.
Speaker 1: I don't know, do someone have to buy the rooming
Speaker 1: house and and then have to and then you know,
Speaker 1: someone who knows what's going on there and has to
Speaker 1: read orient people's mind because you're really you know how
Speaker 1: hard that is to shift perspective. Yeah, that's what you're
Speaker 1: going up against.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you know, yeah, And so I don't think
Speaker 2: I don't think that it'll ever be accepted what really happened,
Speaker 2: no matter what to point out, like to me, the most,
Speaker 2: to me, the single biggest piece of absolute proof of
Speaker 2: conspiracy is McIntire photo number two, which in my opinion,
Speaker 2: clearly shows, beyond all doubt, David Morales and Jack Valenti
Speaker 2: on the side of the Secret Service car heading to
Speaker 2: Parkland Hospital. That is the entire assassination in a single photograph.
Speaker 2: I don't see how there's anybody. Do you know the
Speaker 2: photo I'm talking about.
Speaker 1: I do. It's kind of it's a why it's a
Speaker 1: long shot. I mean, it's these gentlemen are pretty far away.
Speaker 1: You need to really well.
Speaker 2: You you're talking about MacIntire one. I'm talking a McIntire two.
Speaker 2: McIntire two is the close up of the Secret Service car,
Speaker 2: and that photograph clearly is not Landis and READI on
Speaker 2: the side out of the Secret Service car. I once
Speaker 2: you acknowledge, and I got Matt Crumpton from solving JFK
Speaker 2: the other day to acknowledge that is not ready on
Speaker 2: the side of the car. It is not reading in
Speaker 2: landis on the side of the car. The split second
Speaker 2: you acknowledge it's not reading in landis, you have to
Speaker 2: acknowledge everyone in the Secret Service car lied everyone, including
Speaker 2: Kenny O'Donnell, including Dave Powers, Kennedy's alleged best friend who
Speaker 2: drank himself to death in nineteen seventy seven. He sat
Speaker 2: there in the car while they picked up the damn
Speaker 2: shooter on the noll and drove to Parkland Hospital. And
Speaker 2: then Jack Vilnni gets to park On Hospital and plants
Speaker 2: the original magic bullet from an infield three oh three,
Speaker 2: which will then be later swapped out by the FBI
Speaker 2: for what we now know is the magic bullet.
Speaker 1: So what was your reaction two years ago or in
Speaker 1: November of twenty five from the sixtieth anniversary there was
Speaker 1: a book that came out last witnessed by Paul Landis Yeah,
Speaker 1: good service agent. What was your take Corey.
Speaker 2: That guy's a fucking he's alive. He's a fraud. He
Speaker 2: could be tried tomorrow for conspiracy, conspiracy to commit murder
Speaker 2: because he was definitely involved in the assassination plot. The
Speaker 2: fact that he would come out of the woodwork like
Speaker 2: now after all these years and say that he planted
Speaker 2: the magic bullet is the dumbest story of all time.
Speaker 2: It's totally unplausible. We know the real history of the
Speaker 2: magic bullet. The official story of the magic bullet is
Speaker 2: that it was this carcano round that hit all these
Speaker 2: bones and didn't leave a damn dent. No reading Josiah
Speaker 2: Thompson six seconds in Dallas, you'll learn that Opi Wright
Speaker 2: and Darryl Thomlinson found the original magic bullet and that
Speaker 2: it had a pointed tip. It had a pointed tip.
Speaker 2: Opi Wright told Josiah Thompson that it was had a
Speaker 2: pointed tip just like this, and he had one in
Speaker 2: his desk drawer because he was a hunter, and he
Speaker 2: pulled one out and he showed it to him. He said,
Speaker 2: this is the bullet, exactly the same bullet. And so
Speaker 2: the bullet ended up going from Richard Johnson Secret Service
Speaker 2: to the head of the Secret Service over to the FBI,
Speaker 2: and then the FBI did the swap, and then the
Speaker 2: FBI fabricated reports about the magic Bullet saying that Tomlinson
Speaker 2: and Wright confirmed the bullet they had was the magic bullet,
Speaker 2: that they found totally false statement. They fabricated reports. God,
Speaker 2: I forget the name of the FBI agent who went
Speaker 2: down to do the follow up interviews, but when he
Speaker 2: was interviewed about his follow up interviews, he's like, I
Speaker 2: never did any follow up interviews. I never handled any bullet.
Speaker 2: I don't know what you're talking about, right, So the
Speaker 2: FBI is guilty in swapping the bullet and fabricating all
Speaker 2: the stories surrounding it.
Speaker 1: You know, I think it's just probably a coincidence. But
Speaker 1: Landis is a northeast Ohio guy out of Cleveland, and
Speaker 1: I think he's still there on the east side of
Speaker 1: Cleveland Sugar Heights and be interesting in Crumpton, who went
Speaker 1: to the rival High School of Ferry and myself might
Speaker 1: might have an insight on that. But you know, so
Speaker 1: you yeah, you just completely just debunk debunk Landis.
Speaker 2: And it's clearly when you look at the photograph of
Speaker 2: McIntyre one you can clearly see where landis. Is landis
Speaker 2: is in the middle of O'Donnell and Dave Powers in
Speaker 2: the second row, and you can tell us he's he
Speaker 2: like just got there because his back is facing he's
Speaker 2: facing totally sideways, which means he probably just hopped in
Speaker 2: and was still in the process of getting settled when
Speaker 2: that photograph got snapped.
Speaker 1: So well, you know, we'll wrap it up here with
Speaker 1: you mentioned the foreign power and a gentleman. After you
Speaker 1: mentioned thank you. By the way, the Israel Ponds video,
Speaker 1: I got a comment from an individual that said, very interesting,
Speaker 1: opened my eyes to what you're saying. I will continue
Speaker 1: though too. I will remain convinced that Israel is yet
Speaker 1: another foreign military camp essentially for the US, so he
Speaker 1: can't came down on the CONCLUSI and that it's just working.
Speaker 1: It's just another arm of American military, whereas the argument
Speaker 1: that we're saying is it's coming the other way around.
Speaker 1: And Corey, I think you know with work that's being
Speaker 1: done about even how the Epstein case can tie back
Speaker 1: to the assassination Robert Maxwell, for one, who was in
Speaker 1: Czechoslovakia on Hagan always illegally running arms. By the way,
Speaker 1: against the US. This could still this still has some legs,
Speaker 1: so there's a movement there, but potentially that at least
Speaker 1: a ground swell might be able to a pro Palestinian
Speaker 1: contingent as well.
Speaker 2: Did you and the guys ever, determine who Irwin Hayman's
Speaker 2: Texas contact who trained the Haganah was. That's the connection
Speaker 2: to clay Shaw in Dallas. That so I have on
Speaker 2: good authority clay Shaw was in Dallas with Irwin Hayman.
Speaker 2: Then once you put Hayman in the US, my contact
Speaker 2: who knows about this won't tell me anything. Basically said,
Speaker 2: good job. Now find his Texas friend who trained the Haganah.
Speaker 2: That person who trained the Haganah is the connection from
Speaker 2: Irwin Hayman to clay Shaw and the person that clay
Speaker 2: Shaw was in Dallas with. Dr We're trying to figure
Speaker 2: it out.
Speaker 1: Was, but we've spoken of this. I want to get
Speaker 1: this out on the record. Though clay Shaw was on
Speaker 1: the West coast.
Speaker 2: Corey, Oh, he doesn't show up on the West coast
Speaker 2: till the twenty fifth. He has no alibi for nothing.
Speaker 2: He was on that he was allegedly on that train. No,
Speaker 2: uh huh. So the controversy was because he allegedly showed up.
Speaker 2: The story had always been he showed up like the
Speaker 2: day or over the day before the assassination, but no,
Speaker 2: I determined he showed up on the twenty fifth. So
Speaker 2: he doesn't have any alibi. And so I don't how
Speaker 2: do I say this? On the David Ferry trip to
Speaker 2: alleged trip to the Winterland and all that stuff, there's
Speaker 2: a phone call made and I can't remember if on
Speaker 2: that trip they said that they went to Alexandria. I
Speaker 2: think they did so boboof could see his parents or
Speaker 2: something like that, because they lived in Alexandria Louisiana. There's
Speaker 2: a there's an airport in Louisiana in Alexandria. And also
Speaker 2: if you dig far enough, you'll find there's a hotel
Speaker 2: in Alexandria that the FBI did a ton of digging
Speaker 2: into reference to the assassination, and only about one page
Speaker 2: of this turned up in Garrison's files. But somewhere is
Speaker 2: a deep dive into this hotel in Alexandria that the
Speaker 2: FBI did in reference to David Ferry's trip. I believe
Speaker 2: that Alexandria is somehow tied to Clay Shaw and his alibi.
Speaker 2: I can't figure out what, but my gut instinct is
Speaker 2: telling me that Alexandria stuff has to do with Shaw,
Speaker 2: and he has his parents live there also, so there's
Speaker 2: something there. I don't know what. And I'm still having
Speaker 2: some issues piecing together some of the Galveston trip, like
Speaker 2: what did they do on telephone Road? They did something
Speaker 2: on telephone Road according to bo Booth they went to
Speaker 2: some restaurant there. But no, because there's a whole other
Speaker 2: aspect of the Galveston trip that I can't seem to
Speaker 2: stumble across, involving Sid Toarante and a guy named Monte
Speaker 2: de Monte. Monte de Monti does a big article on Monty.
Speaker 2: You know who Montey Demonty is if you start any
Speaker 2: of that stuff. Monte de Monti was like some sort
Speaker 2: of mobster slash card shark slash hustler that somehow gained
Speaker 2: some kind of notoriety in Hollywood. And he was dating
Speaker 2: this stripper who did the Jack Ruby circuit named god
Speaker 2: I can't even remember her name. But he ends up
Speaker 2: getting He's living in Oak Cliff and he ends up
Speaker 2: getting a job to go down to Galveston to help
Speaker 2: Jack Ruby. And this is all during David Ferry's alleged
Speaker 2: Galveston trip. But it's never any clarification of what Monty
Speaker 2: Demnte did. And you have the reference to the to
Speaker 2: the restaurant on Telephone Road. But then I determined that
Speaker 2: there was one of these strip clubs that Monte de
Speaker 2: Monte's girl was dancing at on Telephone Road. So I
Speaker 2: don't know if that's involved. There's a lot of little, tiny,
Speaker 2: minuscule nuggets of data surrounding stuff that happened in Houston
Speaker 2: and Galveston that Saturday that I'm dying to get to
Speaker 2: the bottom of that I can't. I don't know how
Speaker 2: much it impacts the story. I think it more has
Speaker 2: to do it getting people moved around. But yeah, there's
Speaker 2: this little tidbits man that just ooh, I'm dying to know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we'll meet up again, Corey and chat Moore
Speaker 1: stay on the line. Okay, Thanks love for being with me,
Speaker 1: Thanks for having me