WEBVTT 1 00:00:02.439 --> 00:00:08.519 Hello, and welcome to book two of our Star Wars 2 00:00:08.560 --> 00:00:13.080 book Club with of course our series The New Jedi Order. 3 00:00:14.199 --> 00:00:21.920 Book two is of course dark Tied one on Slot so. 4 00:00:22.920 --> 00:00:27.559 Written by Michael Stackpole, who's one of my favorites in Legends. 5 00:00:27.719 --> 00:00:33.200 Michael A. Stackpole, this is, like I said, book number 6 00:00:33.240 --> 00:00:37.439 two of how many total? Again it's I believe we 7 00:00:37.479 --> 00:00:40.200 said it was nineteen nineteen. Yeah, I was gonna say that, 8 00:00:40.200 --> 00:00:42.960 but I didn't want to be wrong. So nineteen books 9 00:00:43.079 --> 00:00:47.560 in this series, guys, as a reminder, these are not 10 00:00:47.600 --> 00:00:49.960 going to be very big. They're not going to be 11 00:00:51.000 --> 00:00:55.039 super detail oriented. We're only going to hit some of 12 00:00:55.079 --> 00:00:58.759 course favorite character moments. We're going to be talking about 13 00:01:00.079 --> 00:01:04.840 and in connections, whether some things that we see as 14 00:01:04.840 --> 00:01:08.840 far as those connections currently or something that we would 15 00:01:08.879 --> 00:01:12.319 like to see come to canon. And then, of course 16 00:01:12.680 --> 00:01:19.959 the main antagonists of this story so far is the 17 00:01:20.040 --> 00:01:24.319 Yujen Vong, so we were going to be talking about 18 00:01:24.560 --> 00:01:29.040 them some things that we have learned more so in 19 00:01:29.120 --> 00:01:36.079 this book moving forward. So with that, Katie, I really 20 00:01:36.079 --> 00:01:40.400 hate that you said that you liked Michael A. Stackpole. 21 00:01:41.799 --> 00:01:42.959 Did you hate this book? 22 00:01:43.519 --> 00:01:49.200 I didn't hate. It is a very strong word. I think, 23 00:01:49.560 --> 00:01:51.439 and we always talk about this, We talk about this 24 00:01:51.599 --> 00:01:58.959 in most Star Wars books, perspectives. This one had a lot, 25 00:01:59.799 --> 00:02:04.000 a lot. 26 00:02:02.400 --> 00:02:07.480 I can kind of see that, but I also kind 27 00:02:07.560 --> 00:02:11.319 of disagree because it's stuck to the same perspectives. Like 28 00:02:11.360 --> 00:02:15.319 we didn't get Ganner's perspective with Quorn, true true, true, 29 00:02:15.639 --> 00:02:19.319 but we got Kryn, Jason, Jana Anakin. 30 00:02:20.280 --> 00:02:24.400 I think, okay, so not necessarily, I think the only 31 00:02:24.560 --> 00:02:28.560 new one is Corn Yes, Kuren. 32 00:02:28.639 --> 00:02:31.639 Actually I say Luke's perspective. We really didn't even get 33 00:02:31.680 --> 00:02:34.479 Luke's perspective. We got Jason's perspective. 34 00:02:34.960 --> 00:02:39.879 Yes, yes, and I and you are correct. I think 35 00:02:40.039 --> 00:02:45.280 more so. I I think the easy target was to 36 00:02:45.319 --> 00:02:50.560 say perspectives. I think more so a lot is happening 37 00:02:50.560 --> 00:02:56.840 in this book, and I don't necessarily think it is 38 00:02:57.159 --> 00:03:01.919 Michael's fault. I think because of this being a series 39 00:03:01.960 --> 00:03:06.759 and initiative, he had to go somewhere from where we 40 00:03:06.879 --> 00:03:14.680 left off and of course vector Prime. So again, not 41 00:03:14.759 --> 00:03:20.680 gonna go over specific long form story arcs in this book, 42 00:03:22.080 --> 00:03:30.080 but I will say some ten Pole character moments here, 43 00:03:33.000 --> 00:03:38.319 things that stood out to me. Three characters specifically stood 44 00:03:38.360 --> 00:03:46.280 out to me that I really really enjoyed Anakin Jason Jana. 45 00:03:46.520 --> 00:03:51.800 I think and from what I am getting from already 46 00:03:51.840 --> 00:03:58.840 two books in, I think this is the closest thing 47 00:03:58.919 --> 00:04:03.759 that we could have gotten to what and that's literally 48 00:04:03.759 --> 00:04:05.759 what the title is, the New Jedi Order. I think 49 00:04:05.879 --> 00:04:11.240 this is Star Wars Legends way of saying, hey, we're 50 00:04:11.280 --> 00:04:12.120 passing the baton. 51 00:04:13.159 --> 00:04:17.240 Yeah, next generation kind of thing, like you still get Leya, 52 00:04:17.399 --> 00:04:22.199 you still get Luke, but it's from the outside character's 53 00:04:22.279 --> 00:04:28.160 perspective really, like Leya does have focused chapters, but it's 54 00:04:28.199 --> 00:04:34.439 all kind of exposition, expositioning the New Republic's attitude towards it. 55 00:04:34.759 --> 00:04:38.079 I did forget. You do get Gavin Dark later, which 56 00:04:38.240 --> 00:04:41.040 is kind of like your regular people persona in this 57 00:04:41.480 --> 00:04:44.959 he's not a Jedi. But it's good to get a 58 00:04:45.120 --> 00:04:49.079 regular person's perspective of the yuz On Vong in this 59 00:04:49.560 --> 00:04:54.720 book too, because they're so terrifying yea, and this book 60 00:04:54.759 --> 00:04:57.959 really expounds on it because you see the yuz On 61 00:04:58.079 --> 00:05:02.279 Vong like for but they really are. You start to 62 00:05:02.360 --> 00:05:06.519 at least because you find Jason ends up in bonds 63 00:05:06.560 --> 00:05:11.000 where he's not being tortured, but he's he's just in pain, 64 00:05:11.680 --> 00:05:14.439 Like that's all there's no use on vong around him. 65 00:05:14.759 --> 00:05:18.800 There's a similar case with Korin and Ganner rescuing a 66 00:05:18.800 --> 00:05:21.800 pair of students and they're just sitting in a pair 67 00:05:21.839 --> 00:05:27.560 of bonds in pain. Like yeah, and it's going to 68 00:05:27.639 --> 00:05:33.000 continue to lead up to the core philosophy of the Yuzonvong, 69 00:05:33.079 --> 00:05:36.839 which is a worshiping of the pain process. 70 00:05:37.519 --> 00:05:44.639 Yeah, you know, it's really like, we're gonna talk more 71 00:05:44.680 --> 00:05:51.399 about the Yuzong Vong, but when I read the Yuzong Vong, 72 00:05:52.279 --> 00:05:57.040 I'm about to show you a picture of what I 73 00:05:57.399 --> 00:06:04.720 legitimately believe this book really entails as far as like 74 00:06:05.720 --> 00:06:09.040 when I have a picture in my head of the 75 00:06:09.120 --> 00:06:15.000 Yu Gen Vong and like this Star Wars Galaxy of Legends, 76 00:06:16.360 --> 00:06:21.839 it is literally this. It is literally Star Wars versus 77 00:06:22.279 --> 00:06:28.439 the Xenomorphs, because this is how I like, that is 78 00:06:28.519 --> 00:06:33.000 basically how I see the U Gen Vong, with how 79 00:06:33.199 --> 00:06:39.240 crazy they are, with the venoms that they use, the poisons, 80 00:06:40.079 --> 00:06:53.439 their agileness, they're kind of predatory attack tactician like mind. 81 00:06:55.399 --> 00:06:57.399 That's what I see like and and it's it's so 82 00:06:57.439 --> 00:07:02.199 funny because currently at the time of recording, This Alien 83 00:07:02.319 --> 00:07:06.639 Earth is coming out on FX and of course Hulu 84 00:07:06.639 --> 00:07:11.160 and Disney Plus, and as somebody who has always wanted 85 00:07:11.199 --> 00:07:16.120 to get into that universe, I am literally watching Alien 86 00:07:16.199 --> 00:07:19.160 Earth right now. I still need to watch the fourth 87 00:07:19.199 --> 00:07:23.959 episode and I am still lost three episodes in I 88 00:07:24.639 --> 00:07:28.160 like I almost wanted to message the the the group 89 00:07:28.240 --> 00:07:30.360 chat and be like, hey, can somebody explain this? Like 90 00:07:30.360 --> 00:07:34.879 I'm four years old, but like when I but I 91 00:07:34.959 --> 00:07:37.040 know who they are. I know the Xeno Morphs, I 92 00:07:37.120 --> 00:07:41.480 know Aliens, I know the franchise. And because of that, 93 00:07:41.800 --> 00:07:46.439 whenever I read this, and because of the way, even 94 00:07:46.920 --> 00:07:52.480 like the way Luke Jason Leah Mara like these people 95 00:07:52.519 --> 00:07:59.839 are describing the fear and the like in all sens 96 00:07:59.839 --> 00:08:04.360 and purposes of the word, how alien the yu Jan 97 00:08:04.480 --> 00:08:13.439 Vong really are? Like, it is so interesting as a concept, 98 00:08:13.720 --> 00:08:17.000 the fact that I still need to wrap my mind 99 00:08:17.199 --> 00:08:21.600 around the fact that these individual beings are from a 100 00:08:21.680 --> 00:08:28.439 completely different galaxy. It's not something that we have really 101 00:08:28.480 --> 00:08:31.399 gotten to really explore in the Star Wars universe up 102 00:08:31.480 --> 00:08:36.440 until now with the Soka right and even then, like 103 00:08:37.759 --> 00:08:43.720 there isn't really much in that that we've got to 104 00:08:43.759 --> 00:08:48.759 explore because there was no crazy alien that was attacking them. 105 00:08:48.799 --> 00:08:53.639 There was no weird obstruction of the force in that, 106 00:08:54.200 --> 00:09:00.480 whereas in here we I do like the the kind 107 00:09:00.519 --> 00:09:04.320 of aha moment that our heroes have in this book, 108 00:09:04.799 --> 00:09:08.279 it's like, oh, well, I can't sense them with the Force. 109 00:09:09.399 --> 00:09:13.080 So whenever there is literally a blank space in my 110 00:09:14.440 --> 00:09:19.320 force projection of reaching out, I know that the Yujon 111 00:09:19.440 --> 00:09:22.720 vonga right there when I feel nothing, when I when 112 00:09:22.799 --> 00:09:25.519 I when I see no fear, when I feel no fear, 113 00:09:26.000 --> 00:09:28.759 like that is where I know the Yujon vongar. And 114 00:09:28.799 --> 00:09:31.039 I think that is very clever. I think that's very fun. 115 00:09:34.039 --> 00:09:36.639 And this is all kind of what the early books 116 00:09:36.639 --> 00:09:39.279 in this series are about, is the Jedi kind of 117 00:09:39.759 --> 00:09:43.399 exploring what it means to still be a Jedi and 118 00:09:43.480 --> 00:09:48.039 not have access to something that does inherently make you 119 00:09:48.120 --> 00:09:55.320 more powerful than your enemy in most cases. I also 120 00:09:55.440 --> 00:09:59.720 really like how this book approaches the Force, and I 121 00:09:59.720 --> 00:10:05.519 think Michael A. Stackpole writing this works because he's known 122 00:10:05.600 --> 00:10:08.960 for his x Wing books. I think this and the 123 00:10:09.120 --> 00:10:12.080 x Wing Rogue Squadron books are the only books that 124 00:10:12.120 --> 00:10:17.159 he truly wrote for Star Wars, and I think it 125 00:10:17.320 --> 00:10:20.279 shows because he approaches the Force in a much different 126 00:10:20.360 --> 00:10:23.960 way than other people do. Oh he did write Eejedi two, 127 00:10:24.120 --> 00:10:27.440 I take that back his corn hard character of course. 128 00:10:27.320 --> 00:10:31.159 He's oh wait, that was him. Yeah, I loved Eye 129 00:10:31.240 --> 00:10:33.279 Jedi though was the That's the weird thing is that 130 00:10:33.399 --> 00:10:35.559 I love Eye Jedi and this I kind of feel 131 00:10:35.559 --> 00:10:38.159 like was all over the place. But again, like I said, 132 00:10:38.200 --> 00:10:40.039 I don't think it's really his fault. I think it's 133 00:10:40.120 --> 00:10:46.240 the amalgamation of where the story needed to go, a 134 00:10:46.279 --> 00:10:50.960 lot of like you were saying, exposition to what we 135 00:10:50.960 --> 00:10:53.480 were being introduced to, because this is still a new concept. 136 00:10:53.840 --> 00:10:57.759 Book two is still new, right, So I don't think 137 00:10:57.759 --> 00:11:02.360 it's it's a lot of him doing the legwork for 138 00:11:02.519 --> 00:11:06.480 the complicated. Hey, this is what's going on. Like I 139 00:11:06.519 --> 00:11:09.159 would have I at this point, it's so funny that 140 00:11:09.200 --> 00:11:11.919 I'm saying this only book two. But I would have 141 00:11:12.240 --> 00:11:17.279 really enjoyed if there was some sort of like interview 142 00:11:17.320 --> 00:11:22.159 on YouTube that like had like the first five people 143 00:11:22.759 --> 00:11:25.200 in the in the initiative of the New Jedi ordered 144 00:11:25.279 --> 00:11:26.879 to be like, hey, this is how we kind of 145 00:11:27.360 --> 00:11:30.639 wrote down like where this book was going. You know. 146 00:11:31.919 --> 00:11:33.759 I think that would be a lot of fun to 147 00:11:33.759 --> 00:11:34.559 to kind of get into. 148 00:11:35.000 --> 00:11:43.039 Yeah, that would be interesting, No, because I know there's 149 00:11:43.120 --> 00:11:45.960 like some interviews, so we'll have to go back and 150 00:11:45.960 --> 00:11:51.840 find them. I think, okay, okay, But I like how 151 00:11:51.879 --> 00:11:55.320 Michael A. Stackpole did it because I think you see 152 00:11:55.360 --> 00:11:57.720 a lot of cool stuff with the Force and this 153 00:11:57.799 --> 00:12:03.000 you also see Luke and Mara's journey kind of expound 154 00:12:03.200 --> 00:12:06.440 as a couple. They're not together a whole lot, but 155 00:12:06.480 --> 00:12:09.200 the scenes where they are together are super important to 156 00:12:09.240 --> 00:12:09.799 their relationship. 157 00:12:09.799 --> 00:12:11.559 It's a very strong relationship. 158 00:12:11.639 --> 00:12:16.919 Yeah. Stackpole apparently also did rate a Star Wars Union, 159 00:12:17.000 --> 00:12:21.240 which was their wedding comic for Quara and Luke, so 160 00:12:21.279 --> 00:12:27.320 there's that too. But there it's chapter twelve in this 161 00:12:27.360 --> 00:12:31.279 book where Anakin has taken Mara to Dantuyene at the 162 00:12:31.320 --> 00:12:34.639 request of Luke because dantuine is a very fo centric planet, 163 00:12:34.720 --> 00:12:40.200 very nature hoping to heal Maa, and Mara helps Anakin 164 00:12:40.440 --> 00:12:43.919 expound his relationship with the Force in a way that 165 00:12:44.039 --> 00:12:47.799 I think a lot of Legends fanboys forget was the 166 00:12:47.840 --> 00:12:53.080 whole purpose of Legends is, Hey, you do have access 167 00:12:53.080 --> 00:12:56.399 to the Force, but you are also human and you 168 00:12:56.600 --> 00:13:02.000 have limits. And she takes this conversation and it's so beautiful, 169 00:13:02.039 --> 00:13:05.600 like that, if I got a tattoo there's one quote 170 00:13:05.679 --> 00:13:07.879 in that chapter you can't hear a whisper if you're 171 00:13:07.879 --> 00:13:11.240 constantly shouting. That would be probably the tattoo that I 172 00:13:11.279 --> 00:13:16.440 would get is because it's such a powerful quote that 173 00:13:16.600 --> 00:13:20.600 people forget to listen, and you see it a lot nowadays, 174 00:13:20.879 --> 00:13:26.919 like is so powerful. And I love how Stackpole transitions 175 00:13:27.000 --> 00:13:33.200 this to the fights that Luke has where he uses 176 00:13:33.360 --> 00:13:38.120 exponential amounts of the force, where he rescues Jason from 177 00:13:38.200 --> 00:13:42.200 the usual Bank because Jason has a vision. He thinks 178 00:13:42.360 --> 00:13:45.320 he has a dream where he's supposed to go rescue 179 00:13:45.919 --> 00:13:48.360 the slaves that they have found on Belkadon. What did 180 00:13:48.399 --> 00:13:49.080 you think about that? 181 00:13:49.639 --> 00:13:52.320 Well, I was just about to ask I I and 182 00:13:52.360 --> 00:13:54.720 it's not really an ask. I think it's so fun. 183 00:13:54.799 --> 00:13:58.840 I think a lot of these Star Wars fanboys could 184 00:13:58.879 --> 00:14:00.000 not read this book. 185 00:14:02.200 --> 00:14:04.120 And the reason why because they claim to. 186 00:14:04.759 --> 00:14:09.519 Well, and that's the thing, like they're like, oh, legends, legend, legends, guys. 187 00:14:10.440 --> 00:14:16.840 This literally did exactly what the last Jedi did. They 188 00:14:16.919 --> 00:14:20.399 made look Luke looked like a badass. And then immediately 189 00:14:20.440 --> 00:14:23.600 after they made look Luke looked like a badass, they 190 00:14:23.639 --> 00:14:27.960 made him look that made him look is kind of 191 00:14:28.080 --> 00:14:30.559 pushing it for uh, the last Jedi. 192 00:14:30.600 --> 00:14:32.159 But he is show age. 193 00:14:32.559 --> 00:14:36.679 They show his age, They show that he has limits. 194 00:14:37.039 --> 00:14:43.639 He is not this you know, uh, unlimited bad ass 195 00:14:43.759 --> 00:14:48.519 that can do any and all things, you know. Uh. 196 00:14:49.080 --> 00:14:58.919 And it's so interesting because Michael puts emphasis on these moments. 197 00:14:59.759 --> 00:15:05.799 They're there is a pause in the entire setting to 198 00:15:06.000 --> 00:15:09.480 give this moment to Luke of Okay, hold on, I'm 199 00:15:09.480 --> 00:15:14.720 gonna breathe, okay. And I love how he even phrases 200 00:15:14.759 --> 00:15:18.080 it in his in his writing, there's a lot of oh, 201 00:15:18.120 --> 00:15:21.559 I need to catch my breath. He even like stutters 202 00:15:21.559 --> 00:15:24.519 and stammers whenever he's talking in these moments, Like he 203 00:15:24.919 --> 00:15:27.679 talks to I forget who it is at the very end, 204 00:15:27.720 --> 00:15:31.720 and he's like, you know what you do, you whatever 205 00:15:31.759 --> 00:15:32.399 you think is good? 206 00:15:32.440 --> 00:15:34.000 You dotor. 207 00:15:34.559 --> 00:15:34.759 Yeah. 208 00:15:35.039 --> 00:15:38.000 That's the other moment is he he does what you 209 00:15:38.039 --> 00:15:41.200 were talking about in the beginning, where he finds the 210 00:15:41.320 --> 00:15:46.279 space around this yujuon bomb creature and like helps guide 211 00:15:46.320 --> 00:15:49.559 it basically to where he can get torpedoes in it 212 00:15:49.559 --> 00:15:54.519 inn that'll explode. It's such a big pull of the 213 00:15:54.559 --> 00:15:57.120 force that he legitimately passes out. 214 00:15:57.720 --> 00:15:57.960 Yeah. 215 00:15:58.000 --> 00:16:01.679 Afterwards, he's talking to the senators yeah, whatever you want 216 00:16:01.679 --> 00:16:04.080 to do, I'm just gonna lie here like and then 217 00:16:04.120 --> 00:16:09.039 passes out. He is a badass and he knows how 218 00:16:09.039 --> 00:16:14.200 to use the force appropriately, but he's also human and 219 00:16:14.399 --> 00:16:14.759 do you know. 220 00:16:14.720 --> 00:16:18.960 It's even wilder and again this you can correct me 221 00:16:19.039 --> 00:16:22.679 if I'm wrong, because at this point, at this point 222 00:16:22.720 --> 00:16:27.639 in time, and like it is so interesting as somebody 223 00:16:27.720 --> 00:16:33.440 who has only read like a very small handful of 224 00:16:33.519 --> 00:16:39.559 legends so far, like from the timeline of where we're 225 00:16:39.559 --> 00:16:45.679 reading right now, because like I only know when our 226 00:16:45.720 --> 00:16:48.879 heroes are young, and they're like, you know, very they're 227 00:16:49.039 --> 00:16:53.399 very very young in their hero age. You know, here 228 00:16:54.840 --> 00:16:59.360 he is showing his age. He hasn't had kids yet though, 229 00:17:00.080 --> 00:17:04.039 and I note that they have kids, like the one kid. 230 00:17:04.400 --> 00:17:08.279 He has one kid. But the thing is, I know 231 00:17:08.400 --> 00:17:11.400 that he eventually has a kid, and in my mind, 232 00:17:11.440 --> 00:17:14.960 I'm like, dude, you could barely keep up with your nephews, 233 00:17:15.599 --> 00:17:17.680 Like I could only imagine how it's gonna be like 234 00:17:17.680 --> 00:17:22.480 when you have a kid. Man, But I oh, I 235 00:17:25.599 --> 00:17:31.839 the the character moments that I wanted to talk about was, uh, 236 00:17:32.759 --> 00:17:39.480 this moment with Jason when he is fighting the gen 237 00:17:39.599 --> 00:17:44.640 Vong because of it was a Jason or was Anakin? 238 00:17:47.839 --> 00:17:51.319 Where because we has to rescue who WU has to rescue? 239 00:17:51.920 --> 00:17:55.880 Yes, that's Anakin, right, he goes with. 240 00:17:55.960 --> 00:18:00.000 Jason t Belkadon Anakin goes with Mara to Dantuine. 241 00:18:00.480 --> 00:18:03.119 That's right, that's right. So so it is it is Jason. 242 00:18:04.559 --> 00:18:09.480 I really enjoyed this moment because and call me a 243 00:18:09.559 --> 00:18:14.160 sucker for kind of loving the undergo the underdog and 244 00:18:14.240 --> 00:18:19.279 kind of like the losers of our stories. But again, 245 00:18:19.400 --> 00:18:25.359 like you said, Jason gets this false sense of knowing 246 00:18:25.440 --> 00:18:30.279 the future because of his teachings, and it's Jason is 247 00:18:30.359 --> 00:18:36.839 such a prick, But I I love this very teachable moment. 248 00:18:38.359 --> 00:18:43.839 You guys have to remember, Luke only knows so much. 249 00:18:44.799 --> 00:18:47.920 He did not He was not raised in the time 250 00:18:48.680 --> 00:18:53.559 of the Jedi with an extensive amount of archives, with 251 00:18:54.079 --> 00:18:57.000 so many other people to talk to about these things, right. 252 00:18:58.799 --> 00:18:58.960 And. 253 00:19:00.440 --> 00:19:05.720 From what my understanding is as far as legends, Luke 254 00:19:06.880 --> 00:19:12.440 probably only had a very small handful of like less 255 00:19:12.480 --> 00:19:16.440 than five people to really lean on when it came 256 00:19:16.519 --> 00:19:20.799 to creating his academy, you know, bringing up the New 257 00:19:20.880 --> 00:19:26.839 Age of Jedi and everything else. So like he's not 258 00:19:26.880 --> 00:19:29.519 going to know everything the people that he kind of 259 00:19:29.599 --> 00:19:33.319 leaned on. Are not going to know everything, but they 260 00:19:33.359 --> 00:19:38.119 know of things. So this thing of oh visions, oh 261 00:19:38.200 --> 00:19:41.160 what visions? Oh well, visions can kind of show you 262 00:19:41.200 --> 00:19:43.920 the future. Okay, well what does that mean? Oh well 263 00:19:43.960 --> 00:19:46.759 that it means that it could happen or it couldn't happen. 264 00:19:46.759 --> 00:19:48.880 And you know, it's really the interpretation of how you 265 00:19:48.920 --> 00:19:51.440 see the force and blah blah blah. And so like 266 00:19:52.359 --> 00:19:55.400 the way that Jason is so confident. And I love 267 00:19:55.480 --> 00:20:00.000 that dynamic between Jason and Anakin because there's two life 268 00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:04.720 life lessons that we're learning here through them because again, 269 00:20:04.799 --> 00:20:08.920 like you had said, with Anakin and Mara, he's learning, hey, 270 00:20:09.000 --> 00:20:15.240 you have limits, you're human, right, whereas Jason is learning 271 00:20:15.359 --> 00:20:22.039 the same thing but through a completely different mean, right, 272 00:20:23.960 --> 00:20:29.160 And so being so confident, and like, I like how 273 00:20:29.359 --> 00:20:34.920 Jason was trying to, you know, have this philosophical talk 274 00:20:35.079 --> 00:20:40.000 with Luke with like like stop it, no, but he's like, 275 00:20:40.400 --> 00:20:44.759 we're Jedi. We're Jedi, which means that we're the good guys. 276 00:20:44.880 --> 00:20:48.839 We're the people who save people, and so we have 277 00:20:48.920 --> 00:20:55.279 to go do this. And Luke is like, no, you're 278 00:20:55.559 --> 00:21:00.400 only how old is he sixteen? And and that's what 279 00:21:00.640 --> 00:21:06.319 He's like, you're only sixteen. You only have the experience 280 00:21:06.319 --> 00:21:09.640 of a sixteen year old. You have many years ahead 281 00:21:09.680 --> 00:21:12.319 of you, so you'll have a lot more time to 282 00:21:12.400 --> 00:21:15.119 learn these things. But let me teach you something real quick. 283 00:21:16.039 --> 00:21:19.200 Just because you can do something does not mean you 284 00:21:19.240 --> 00:21:20.480 should do something. 285 00:21:21.200 --> 00:21:25.960 Is yeah, and he expounds on like, hey, like we 286 00:21:26.119 --> 00:21:30.480 have to work for the entire galaxy, not just people. 287 00:21:31.240 --> 00:21:36.839 And like it. I like seeing the parallels between Ganner 288 00:21:37.559 --> 00:21:40.559 and Jason because they kind of have the same ideals 289 00:21:40.559 --> 00:21:43.279 because Ganner wants to go save the slaves too, and 290 00:21:43.319 --> 00:21:45.519 it's like, well, we're their only hope and Chorn's like, 291 00:21:46.000 --> 00:21:49.720 hang on, if you actually listen, you will know that 292 00:21:49.759 --> 00:21:50.839 they're basically dead. 293 00:21:51.720 --> 00:21:53.880 Yeah, Like there's no. 294 00:21:53.960 --> 00:21:59.559 Point like in trying. Where's like, if we can rescue 295 00:21:59.559 --> 00:22:02.960 the people that we do know are safe, that we 296 00:22:03.000 --> 00:22:06.079 can get out with this information and save the next people. 297 00:22:06.640 --> 00:22:10.759 Like I do enjoy seeing that parallel. Do you I 298 00:22:10.799 --> 00:22:14.400 have a question for you? Do you know where Jason 299 00:22:14.519 --> 00:22:17.480 ends up? We have talked about this, but do you remember? 300 00:22:20.680 --> 00:22:23.400 Uh? I don't think so. I don't think I remember. 301 00:22:23.720 --> 00:22:25.880 Okay, I am going to spoil this for you, but 302 00:22:25.920 --> 00:22:30.480 it's like twenty something. You're is not twenty it's probably 303 00:22:30.480 --> 00:22:34.279 fifteen years after this, so it's down in the process 304 00:22:34.640 --> 00:22:35.960 he turns into a sith word. 305 00:22:37.359 --> 00:22:40.880 Okay, yeah, yeah, okay, yeah, I remember you saying this. Yeah. 306 00:22:40.920 --> 00:22:45.559 So with this conversation and knowing that, can you see 307 00:22:45.559 --> 00:22:46.480 this transition? 308 00:22:46.759 --> 00:22:50.319 I can totally see it. And the really funny thing 309 00:22:50.559 --> 00:22:57.880 is is now being reminded of that the crumbs are there, 310 00:22:58.519 --> 00:23:01.920 The crumbs are This is setting the groundwork for sure, 311 00:23:02.559 --> 00:23:09.519 and I really like how like I think it was, 312 00:23:09.519 --> 00:23:13.880 was it correct me if I'm wrong? It was Jason 313 00:23:14.559 --> 00:23:21.440 that was kind of like hitting on Danny. Yep, see again, 314 00:23:22.400 --> 00:23:28.000 laying down the groundwork for Okay. So, so the the 315 00:23:28.039 --> 00:23:31.759 way that he had his interactions with Luke, you know, 316 00:23:32.039 --> 00:23:38.640 uh selfishness pass to the dark side with Danny. Okay, 317 00:23:39.319 --> 00:23:44.279 Danny his his his selfishness with uh, with love and 318 00:23:44.480 --> 00:23:47.519 and and the fear of losing and and and all 319 00:23:47.559 --> 00:23:50.119 of these things right past to the dark side. Like 320 00:23:50.400 --> 00:23:53.960 they're setting all of this up. And I really like 321 00:23:54.039 --> 00:23:56.359 that now now that that is kind of like in 322 00:23:56.440 --> 00:23:58.799 my head, I'm like, okay, I can I can see 323 00:23:58.799 --> 00:24:03.079 where this is going. But I kind of like, how 324 00:24:04.960 --> 00:24:09.039 if this was legitimately something brand new that I was reading. 325 00:24:11.319 --> 00:24:15.000 I could probably come up with that guess, But you 326 00:24:15.079 --> 00:24:21.920 can almost say the same thing about Anakin almost. And 327 00:24:21.960 --> 00:24:27.599 the reason why I say this is every character can 328 00:24:27.640 --> 00:24:32.119 have a redeeming moment, right you. So Jason has those 329 00:24:32.119 --> 00:24:37.839 redeeming moments here. Anakin has those redeeming moments here. But 330 00:24:37.880 --> 00:24:41.960 Anakin has it just as hard. Look at the conversations 331 00:24:41.960 --> 00:24:45.440 that he had to have about Han Solo, about his 332 00:24:45.559 --> 00:24:49.960 father hating him for the fact that Chewbacca is dead 333 00:24:50.640 --> 00:24:54.480 and all of that. There's so much weight on Anakin. 334 00:24:55.720 --> 00:25:00.960 I can see one more toothpick on the pile completely 335 00:25:01.000 --> 00:25:05.359 breaking him, so like I could see it going either way. 336 00:25:06.519 --> 00:25:09.920 And even like in all of that too, I really 337 00:25:10.519 --> 00:25:16.160 Han Solo had very minimal parts in this book. 338 00:25:16.319 --> 00:25:17.680 Yeah, he literally one. 339 00:25:19.039 --> 00:25:24.960 He literally only had the one conversation about, oh, you know, 340 00:25:25.160 --> 00:25:29.079 you don't know how Chewbacca felt I was his best friend. 341 00:25:29.440 --> 00:25:32.440 You don't know that he was proud of me. Blah 342 00:25:32.440 --> 00:25:34.920 blah blah. He hated me, he hates me, he hated 343 00:25:34.920 --> 00:25:37.200 me in his last moments, blah blah blah. Like there 344 00:25:37.279 --> 00:25:43.559 was all that, but like Anakin wasn't even there in 345 00:25:43.599 --> 00:25:47.559 that conversation and Anakin was saying the exact same things 346 00:25:47.720 --> 00:25:53.599 about his father towards him. Yeah, like that was, uh, 347 00:25:54.200 --> 00:25:59.519 it broke my heart. It broke my heart. 348 00:26:00.920 --> 00:26:09.000 Yeah, it's It's super intense. And the book after Ruin, 349 00:26:09.119 --> 00:26:11.160 which is the next book that we're gonna be talking about, 350 00:26:11.480 --> 00:26:16.000 there's a there's another duology by James Lucino and it 351 00:26:16.079 --> 00:26:19.240 goes into Hansilla. Like Han is the main character in 352 00:26:19.279 --> 00:26:21.680 that one, so we will get to Han's part of 353 00:26:21.720 --> 00:26:27.759 the story. But yeah, just seeing how the twins and 354 00:26:27.799 --> 00:26:33.839 then Ana can handle everything, it's super interesting, especially like 355 00:26:34.279 --> 00:26:38.960 me knowing where they all end up. I'm not gonna 356 00:26:38.960 --> 00:26:41.079 spoil like too much. I wanted to bring up Jason, 357 00:26:41.640 --> 00:26:48.359 but like, ah it, it's super powerful, and I'm kind 358 00:26:48.359 --> 00:26:50.559 of remembering the next bits of. 359 00:26:52.079 --> 00:26:59.119 Ruin, so to to veer away from that and instead 360 00:26:59.119 --> 00:27:04.880 of trying to spoil me, let's kind of go down 361 00:27:04.920 --> 00:27:08.680 the same path with our next topic. And this will 362 00:27:08.680 --> 00:27:10.759 probably be the last topic because we already talked about 363 00:27:10.759 --> 00:27:14.559 the Jean Vong, But one of the topics that we 364 00:27:14.599 --> 00:27:19.599 wanted to talk about is canon. What are some of 365 00:27:19.599 --> 00:27:22.799 the things that we saw in this book that could 366 00:27:22.920 --> 00:27:28.000 very easily fall into canon. And what are the things 367 00:27:29.039 --> 00:27:35.559 that we see? Oh, this clearly influenced what is now canon. 368 00:27:36.960 --> 00:27:41.119 We already mentioned one. I think the story of Luke Skywalker. 369 00:27:41.880 --> 00:27:45.319 I think that is very much there is some influence here. 370 00:27:45.720 --> 00:27:53.720 Now do I know that? Oh my gosh, Johnson, do 371 00:27:53.839 --> 00:27:56.839 I know that he read New Jedi Order? No, I 372 00:27:56.880 --> 00:28:04.279 have no idea if you. But coincidentally, boom, we've made 373 00:28:04.279 --> 00:28:09.079 it into canon. Luke Skywalker's an old man. He's dead now. 374 00:28:09.160 --> 00:28:13.400 But you know, we got to see there was some 375 00:28:13.519 --> 00:28:17.400 evolution there. There was a show and age, and I 376 00:28:17.440 --> 00:28:21.039 think again, like we said, also, it's kind of the 377 00:28:21.079 --> 00:28:24.759 only path to take because you are, like we're saying, 378 00:28:24.799 --> 00:28:28.279 with the New Jedi Order, we are passing the baton, 379 00:28:28.359 --> 00:28:31.839 We're moving to a new generation. And so the only 380 00:28:31.880 --> 00:28:35.079 way to do that without killing off your characters is, oh, 381 00:28:35.200 --> 00:28:38.480 let's make them a little older to where they can't 382 00:28:38.559 --> 00:28:45.759 be the hero all the time. So, Katie, what are 383 00:28:45.799 --> 00:28:52.519 some things in this book that besides like the obvious, like, oh, 384 00:28:52.559 --> 00:28:54.839 it would be so cool if they adapted the yu 385 00:28:54.920 --> 00:28:59.799 Joan Vong into Cannon. What are some things here that 386 00:28:59.880 --> 00:29:05.920 you could very well see be implemented into Cannon. 387 00:29:06.799 --> 00:29:12.680 I would love to see Gavin come in. I I 388 00:29:12.759 --> 00:29:16.480 really think Gabon is such a cool character, and going 389 00:29:16.519 --> 00:29:21.119 back to Rogue Squadron and everything, I think he fits 390 00:29:21.359 --> 00:29:25.200 very well in the story that's being told. And instead 391 00:29:25.240 --> 00:29:28.759 of Wedge Antilles and Tycho Kelchu recreating Rogue Squadron, you 392 00:29:28.799 --> 00:29:32.000 could potentially introduce him at Mando Vers and go, hey, 393 00:29:32.039 --> 00:29:35.680 I'm rebuilding Rogue Squadron in the name of my brother, Bigs, 394 00:29:35.960 --> 00:29:41.079 Luke Skywalker, Wedge Antilia's all these people like and I 395 00:29:41.119 --> 00:29:45.240 think that could be such a cool moment that's a 396 00:29:45.240 --> 00:29:48.400 gig fan service sye, but also works with the story 397 00:29:48.440 --> 00:29:54.480 that's being told. The other one I was gonna say 398 00:29:54.519 --> 00:29:56.839 was the Force stuff, which you already brought up. I 399 00:29:58.079 --> 00:30:00.960 think the Force is such a big thing in this book. 400 00:30:00.880 --> 00:30:05.319 Well, and and we have kind of talked about this 401 00:30:05.839 --> 00:30:11.519