Speaker 1: This seven twenty nine on a Wednesday, and a happy
Speaker 1: one to you. It's time we could talk to Donovan
Speaker 1: Andeil Americans for Prosperities donov An Aneil, Welcome back, Donovan.
Speaker 1: It's always a pleasure speaking with you on the fifty
Speaker 1: five Case Morning Show.
Speaker 2: Brian.
Speaker 1: Always good to start my morning with you. Let's talk
Speaker 1: veto overrides. They didn't override all of the ones related
Speaker 1: to property taxes, but we did get something accomplished the
Speaker 1: other day. I know AFP was behind the effort to
Speaker 1: restore those provisions in the budget that allowed for a
Speaker 1: small measure a potential property tax relief. Got to qualify
Speaker 1: all of it because it wasn't going to immediately result
Speaker 1: in our property taxes drafting, but it would have provided
Speaker 1: some measure of flexibility going in that direction. For whatever reason,
Speaker 1: Governor de Wines struck those provisions from the tax bill,
Speaker 1: claiming that they needed to be looked into more, which
Speaker 1: is crazy considering our elected officials have been looking at
Speaker 1: this for a solid year and that's how they came
Speaker 1: up with a list of potential property tax relief provisions,
Speaker 1: some of which were ultimately incorporated into the incorporated into
Speaker 1: the budget. So where are we on this right now,
Speaker 1: Donovan and Neil?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I think I think folks are a
Speaker 3: little deflated after that result. But you know, the reality
Speaker 3: is we we've over in one of those four provisions,
Speaker 3: and it's an important one. It's the Truth and Taxation provisions.
Speaker 3: And so what that's what that'll do when that goes
Speaker 3: into effect after the Senate passes it, the senateslots to
Speaker 3: vote on it, it'll allow it'll remove some of these
Speaker 3: inflamed language like emergency levees, and it'll remove some of
Speaker 3: the confusing language like replacement levees.
Speaker 2: And so it's an.
Speaker 3: Important piece in the transparency side of the equation. But
Speaker 3: on the relief side of the equation, we still need
Speaker 3: things to get done. Their studies have been completed, the
Speaker 3: testimonies all filed and delivered, but the governor, as you
Speaker 3: pointed out, had vetoed some of the other provisions that
Speaker 3: would resolve this. And now I think we're sort of
Speaker 3: in a bit of a limbo over the next few
Speaker 3: weeks till we.
Speaker 2: Come back in the the fall.
Speaker 1: Have you seen any further statement from Governor de Wyne's
Speaker 1: office about his reasons for getting rid of the all
Speaker 1: three of those property tax proposals again because they had
Speaker 1: been what I understand is thoroughly discussed and thoroughly studied
Speaker 1: in advance, and out he comes striking those provisions and saying,
Speaker 1: when you to look at him further, it just doesn't
Speaker 1: seem to make sense or add up. Donovan.
Speaker 3: Yeah, No, I mean the you know, the committee, the
Speaker 3: select working group of eleven members has been named. They're
Speaker 3: going to meet for the first time tomorrow afternoon at
Speaker 3: two o'clock, and they've got a charge to come up
Speaker 3: with a list of working solutions, workable solutions by September thirtieth,
Speaker 3: you know. But the thing is, I think what it
Speaker 3: ultimately is is because this working group has made up
Speaker 3: of these folks, the thirty nine hundred political subdivisions across the.
Speaker 2: State of Ohio.
Speaker 3: The schools, the libraries, the cities, the townships, the villages,
Speaker 3: the counties don't want to have to make tough decisions
Speaker 3: with their funding, with their spending. They don't want to
Speaker 3: have to go back to the voters when they need
Speaker 3: money and make the case for why they need money
Speaker 3: and how they're spending it. And so they ask the
Speaker 3: governor to veto these things, he vetoed them on their behalf,
Speaker 3: and now they have an opportunity, you know, to kill
Speaker 3: more time without any relief insight for homeowners.
Speaker 1: And so they didn't want to do their own damn job,
Speaker 1: A miss I think so.
Speaker 3: I honestly, looking back at testimony, looking at comments that
Speaker 3: they've made, and the composition of this work of this
Speaker 3: governor's working group, I think they just don't want to
Speaker 3: have to actually do their job. They're afraid they have
Speaker 3: to go back to the voters. They are sitting on
Speaker 3: large cash balances because they keep taking money from the
Speaker 3: taxpayer without providing any relief or having any mechanism of accountability.
Speaker 3: And their solution, their solution is to shift that tax burden.
Speaker 2: By expanding the homestead exemption.
Speaker 3: Is the solution that the Democrats and many of the
Speaker 3: local government officials have put forward. We're just we want
Speaker 3: to take it out of the state General Revenue Fund
Speaker 3: and we want to use that to provide relief. It's
Speaker 3: masking the problem, it's not solving the spikes that occur,
Speaker 3: and it's squeezing the middle class working families here in
Speaker 3: the state of Ohio when we could actually deliver some
Speaker 3: real solutions that smooth the problem out, begin to address
Speaker 3: the issue in the long run, and give people some
Speaker 3: immediate relief.
Speaker 1: Well, I suppose what of this working group that Governor
Speaker 1: de Wint's putting together. I mean, isn't it certainly plausible
Speaker 1: that they come up with the same answers and same
Speaker 1: suggestions as the working group that led to these three
Speaker 1: provisions being in the budget in the first place. In
Speaker 1: other words, the securitest route to back to where we
Speaker 1: were before.
Speaker 3: Given So if I laughed, because that's what I actually
Speaker 3: pointed that out to a reporter I was speaking with
Speaker 3: yesterday on this issue. I said, look, you know, this
Speaker 3: is an issue that has been discussed and debated and
Speaker 3: evaluated for the last two and hos half years. Right,
Speaker 3: we have to select working group of legislators folks who
Speaker 3: can actually do something on it. Right, compared to this
Speaker 3: working grip that can just issue recommendations. They identified twenty
Speaker 3: one recommendations, an eight hundred page report, hundreds of hours
Speaker 3: of public testimony from everybody around the state who has
Speaker 3: an opinion on it. We've shown a light like every
Speaker 3: corner of this issue has been identified, every possible solution
Speaker 3: I think has really been vetted and identified. Now, maybe
Speaker 3: these folks have something that hasn't been brought to the table.
Speaker 3: But many of these folks, Brian, have been in the
Speaker 3: ways and means committee rooms testifying or providing opinions on this,
Speaker 3: and most of their opinions, Brian, have been they don't
Speaker 3: like the ideas that the legislature is saying they need
Speaker 3: to do that would actually solve the.
Speaker 1: Problem, well, not liking them, and coming up with an
Speaker 1: alternative that accomplishes what we are looking for, which is
Speaker 1: some sort of property tax relief. I mean, I mean,
Speaker 1: it's one thing to say I reject that because here's
Speaker 1: the reasons why that won't work out. But here's a
Speaker 1: better idea. We're missing that sort of ladder component in
Speaker 1: this discussion.
Speaker 3: Well they have there. So their better idea is the
Speaker 3: state should pay for this the state. We should shift
Speaker 3: the money that the state collects and income and sales
Speaker 3: tax and gross receipts tax, and the state should cover
Speaker 3: that for the school districts who keep raising their taxes.
Speaker 4: All right.
Speaker 1: That the devil on that one is in the details.
Speaker 1: When the money goes out of Columbus out into the world, though,
Speaker 1: isn't it.
Speaker 3: It is, well, and again, it's just shifting that burden. Right,
Speaker 3: We're not actually addressing the spending problem. We're not actually
Speaker 3: addressing the unvoted tax increased problem that these local governments
Speaker 3: are able to impose upon their citizens without a vote
Speaker 3: of the people. We're just saying, hey, we're going to
Speaker 3: actually take Columbus's money and we're gonna we're gonna redistribute
Speaker 3: it out to inefficient governments around the state of Ohio.
Speaker 2: That's lunoicrous.
Speaker 3: We you know, I shouldn't be paying for poor decision
Speaker 3: making in Cincinnati, right, I agree. If the Democrats and
Speaker 3: the Blues of Cincinnati and Hamilton County aren't able to
Speaker 3: get it done, why should me here in Richland.
Speaker 2: County have to pay for that? Oh?
Speaker 3: That's and that's what this That's what their proposal essentially
Speaker 3: is is we're gonna shift that burden. We're gonna have
Speaker 3: the state carryer water, and we'll just keep going along
Speaker 3: until the next crisis.
Speaker 2: Pops.
Speaker 3: Should solve the crisis now and solve it for the
Speaker 3: next fifty to one hundred years.
Speaker 1: All right, Well, I know America's prosperity always has action plans,
Speaker 1: and plans. I'm moving forward, so the couple of provisions
Speaker 1: are remaining. Excuse me, remain vetoed and bring it back
Speaker 1: and we'll walk through the next step of the analysis,
Speaker 1: which is, I know there's that revoke property taxes in
Speaker 1: the state of Aha proposed legislation that's floating around out there.
Speaker 1: We get an update on maybe where that is. But
Speaker 1: it seems to me as we pause for a moment
Speaker 1: and bring it back, that this is only going to
Speaker 1: exacerbate the christ to just eliminate property tax, which I
Speaker 1: think takes us to probably a more complicated reality. But
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Speaker 1: If you have KCD talk station right, Thomas was don
Speaker 1: on and of for Americans were prosperity talking about the
Speaker 1: veto override singular two of them did not get over
Speaker 1: ridden related to the property taxes and the budget bill.
Speaker 1: Were the votes even close on the two that didn't
Speaker 1: get over ridden? Donovan, Well, so it's a bit of
Speaker 1: a procedural thing. They didn't even bring those two of vote.
Speaker 3: They tabled them because if they had brought them for
Speaker 3: a vote and they failed, they would not be able
Speaker 3: to go at it again. So you only kind of
Speaker 3: get one bite out of veto override Apple. So there's
Speaker 3: they're working still to come back. They'll be They always
Speaker 3: come back for session days in September October, I think
Speaker 3: that's when they planned to bring those up and address them.
Speaker 3: There you had members who were out of town, members
Speaker 3: who chose not to come back into town, and I
Speaker 3: think just still some more discussion with members about what
Speaker 3: we're trying to do here in the state of Ohio
Speaker 3: to resolve this property tax crisis.
Speaker 1: All right now, as for this working group that Dwine's
Speaker 1: putting together, that presumably will result in some legislative changes,
Speaker 1: I mean, this was all in the budget bills they
Speaker 1: had to pass that like any legislation. So if they
Speaker 1: come up with some different proposals or even the same ones,
Speaker 1: that's going to have to be incorporated into legislation that'll
Speaker 1: have to be voted on in the normal process right well, And.
Speaker 3: Unlike the General Assembly, they don't they don't have the
Speaker 3: ability so this working group can can make recommendations till
Speaker 3: they're blue in the face. Ultimately, it takes the legislature
Speaker 3: introducing that as legislation. So you're right, it would have
Speaker 3: to go through that whole process, multiple hearings, which is fine,
Speaker 3: you can move those things along fairly fast. But the
Speaker 3: reality is that working group won't have you know, isn't
Speaker 3: charged to bring recommendations back until September thirtieth.
Speaker 1: Okay, so we're not done with veto override votes that
Speaker 1: you've established. We know that they can come back, and
Speaker 1: they just chose three property ones to go for this time,
Speaker 1: only one got voted on five. Doesn't this present a
Speaker 1: problem if there's a movement out there to have what
Speaker 1: a constitutional amendment here in the state of Ohio circulating
Speaker 1: petitions to get this on the ballot that will let
Speaker 1: us vote whether to eradicate them across the board, this
Speaker 1: might fuel that effort. This delay and this working group
Speaker 1: and this idea of going through the legislative process with
Speaker 1: whatever future fixes they come up with. I mean, that's
Speaker 1: still a woman in the background, though, isn't it thought
Speaker 1: of it?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 2: Absolutely?
Speaker 3: And I mean you're talking to the guy in the
Speaker 3: organization right, that's working every day to eliminate Ohio's income tax.
Speaker 2: So yeah, you'll find you don't going to find me
Speaker 2: defending keeping.
Speaker 3: Taxes on the books, especially taxes that can kick people
Speaker 3: out of their homes if they're failed to be if
Speaker 3: they fail to pay them, right, which is what happens
Speaker 3: if you fail to pay your property taxes even after
Speaker 3: paying off your mortgage. And their ballot initiative is there.
Speaker 3: It's a very it's very simple language. It's not like
Speaker 3: what was that one from last year that was all
Speaker 3: the last couple of years that's been all convoluted. It's
Speaker 3: four lines, Brian, It's four lines that says in a
Speaker 3: constitution property tax essentially you can't put a property tax
Speaker 3: on any homeowner property owner in the.
Speaker 2: State of Ohio.
Speaker 3: And so it's not a complicated ballot initiative. It's a
Speaker 3: very simple message. And those folks are doing great work.
Speaker 2: They're chugging along, they're getting signatures.
Speaker 3: We've you know, we we've seen many of them at
Speaker 3: the events that will do and I think you know,
Speaker 3: if you're a local, if you're a political subdivision, right,
Speaker 3: who's trying to wait up the clock and just slow
Speaker 3: walk a process.
Speaker 2: Or reform that is long overdue.
Speaker 3: This is the sort of damocles hanging over the head,
Speaker 3: and it's the nuclear option that I think a lot
Speaker 3: of citizens here in the state of Ohio are eager
Speaker 3: to push the red button on.
Speaker 1: If you will well, and I mean, I guess one's
Speaker 1: left with the perplexing question, the complex question of what
Speaker 1: reaction will there be if that actually passes. I mean,
Speaker 1: they're going to have a huge load of work on
Speaker 1: their plates and Columbus trying to figure out how they're
Speaker 1: going to cover the missing now missing property taxes since
Speaker 1: so much of how you know, various entities are funded
Speaker 1: are predicated on property taxes, and these levies, I mean,
Speaker 1: you're going have to start from scratch with the taxation system.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, because you know most I think, what is it,
Speaker 2: twenty eight billion dollars.
Speaker 3: I believe I might be off a little bit there,
Speaker 3: but is what is collected I believe in property taxes
Speaker 3: across the state of Ohio. Between income and sales tax
Speaker 3: here in the state of Ohio, I think that that
Speaker 3: number comes in at about twenty three twenty four billion
Speaker 3: and some change and so, and these property taxes don't
Speaker 3: ever go through Columbus.
Speaker 2: Right, That's something important here. None of this money is
Speaker 2: actually managed by Columbus.
Speaker 3: It is all levied and authorized by the local political
Speaker 3: subdivisions across the state of Ohio. And so when you
Speaker 3: end that, you're ending I mean fifty to at least
Speaker 3: fifty or more percent of.
Speaker 2: Funding to local public schools.
Speaker 3: You're ending significant amount of money that go to your
Speaker 3: townships where most ohiglands live, to pay for police and
Speaker 3: fire services. Our roads will be fine because Governor Dwinjai
Speaker 3: up our gas taxes in his first tournament office.
Speaker 2: But you know the other kinds.
Speaker 3: Of services that you that most people have come to
Speaker 3: expect and depend on, those are in jeopardy. And I
Speaker 3: think this game of chicken that's being played by political subdivisions,
Speaker 3: where we could provide people with some relief is ultimately
Speaker 3: could result in just an outright elimination of it. And
Speaker 3: what we do, because again, we won't just stop having
Speaker 3: police and fire in schools, right, Brian, because those are
Speaker 3: things most people to civilized society count on. We're just
Speaker 3: going to put that burden on somebody else. That tax
Speaker 3: shifts somewhere else. I think the real solution is Sorry.
Speaker 3: The real solution I think here is we have too
Speaker 3: gang much government here in the state of Ohio. We
Speaker 3: really needed to start to contract, consolidate, and that would begin,
Speaker 3: I think, to solve many, many, many of the problems,
Speaker 3: not just on the property tax issue, but the problems
Speaker 3: that put our state in the bottom half of the
Speaker 3: rankings across the country.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I just them to think the confounding mess that
Speaker 1: would have to come about as after the elimination of
Speaker 1: party tacks, because your local political subdivision is the one
Speaker 1: that lives at the local schools and parks and everybody
Speaker 1: are then going to have to go to Columbus and
Speaker 1: lobby the elected officials there for their slice of whatever
Speaker 1: allocation is coming out of Columbus under whatever formula they
Speaker 1: come up with, maybe the raise sales tax to cover
Speaker 1: the missing twenty eight billion dollars we're talking about. I
Speaker 1: don't know, but they're gonna have to justify themselves to
Speaker 1: people in Columbus, as opposed to justifying themselves the local
Speaker 1: community members in the form of lobbying for or against
Speaker 1: a levee. You think local control would better manage the
Speaker 1: finances and people in the community would say no, no, no,
Speaker 1: you've got too much money school district. We're not going
Speaker 1: to renew your levee or or you know, vote for
Speaker 1: this emergency levee or whatever. But I just I just
Speaker 1: can't imagine how complicated it would be if the money
Speaker 1: just resides in Columbus then has to be doled out.
Speaker 3: Well, and that's the ironic thing here, rights those and
Speaker 3: you think the folks in Columbus, the legislators in Columbus,
Speaker 3: are going to want to do any favors for the
Speaker 3: very people who been lobbying against the dozens of solutions they've.
Speaker 2: Been putting forward.
Speaker 3: This is the thing, right, this is this is where
Speaker 3: being you know, looking at this every day, both working
Speaker 3: when in the grassroots or at events around the state
Speaker 3: with our team at AFP, and being at the State
Speaker 3: House and seeing the lobbyists and legislators engaging on this issue.
Speaker 3: The solutions here, the solutions have been presented. The legislatures
Speaker 3: put forward some very common sense ones that both provide
Speaker 3: immediate relief and resolve the spikes and triggers that cause
Speaker 3: crises like we've been experiencing for the last few years.
Speaker 3: The problem is the local government lobbyists and it's this
Speaker 3: township trustees, the school board officials, the superintendents, the teachers'
Speaker 3: unions and the rest of them have been lobbying against
Speaker 3: any common sense solution for the last two and a
Speaker 3: half years.
Speaker 2: And maybe they're going to get every.
Speaker 3: Little bit they deserve if the property taxes elimined out
Speaker 3: right in the state of Ohio.
Speaker 1: Certainly is possible. Donovan and Neil, Americans for prosperity. Any
Speaker 1: call to action for my listeners you typically do, I
Speaker 1: mean maybe that one small step kind of thing.
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I always go to Buckeye Blueprint dot com.
Speaker 3: Buckeye blueprint dot com. You see and get plugged in,
Speaker 3: check out all. We don't just work on this issue.
Speaker 3: We work on a lot of different issues. Learn our message,
Speaker 3: learn our mission, and if you want to get involved
Speaker 3: in it, sign up and we'll reach out and bring
Speaker 3: into the fold.
Speaker 1: I can't encourage my listeners enough to do just that.
Speaker 1: Donald van Neil, thanks for all the work that you
Speaker 1: and AFP do throughout the week and the year, and
Speaker 1: I'll look forward to another discussion with.
Speaker 2: You next week.
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