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Speaker 1: You'll do away five seventeen. Do you want to report

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a UFO hanging in? We don't want to report every

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thirty one. Do you wish to report a UFO over hey,

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we want to one of those data areas thirty one.

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Speaker 2: Do you wish to find a report of any kind

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of it? I wouldn't know what kind of report cloud times.

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Speaker 1: Areas thirty one me neither there were self. If it

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was anybody above us to pass us, Like thirty seconds ago,

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we were sending one top of golf negative, okay, OFFI

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the UFO. Yeah, it's murder two nine o'clock.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I'll passed over.

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Speaker 1: I go. I don't know what it was, but it's

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from at least to three thousand feet above us. See,

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I passed out over the top of US ninety one one.

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Speaker 2: You just called both to me before.

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Speaker 1: They're after staying the airplanes he is. I swear to

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God more calm on an unidentified object every liberty four

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call or calm on an unidentified flying object.

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Speaker 2: A Welcome to UFO Chronicles a place where people share

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their experiences of the strange and unexplained. If you've had

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an encounter, I would like to be on the show.

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You can email me at UFO Chronicles at gmail dot com.

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Hello everyone, and welcome to the show. How are you all.

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I'm Nick Hunter and this is the UFO Chronicles podcast.

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Tonight we're in the United Kingdom to speak to Ben

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and Ben sharing a couple of his UFO sightings. He

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also had a psychic mum who was a believer, and

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she met a NASA employee in the nineteen seventies who

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said he saw alien artifacts on the moon. Ben is

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up next, but first, if you enjoyed a show and

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you would like to help support the podcast on Patreon,

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you can do this for as little as one dollar

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a month. Head on over to www dot patreon dot

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com forward slash UFO Chronicles Podcast. You can also find

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a link in a description of this episode below. Any

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help is very much appreciated. Now on the show, Hello Ben,

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Welcome to the show.

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Speaker 1: Hello, nice to speak to you. Thanks for having me on.

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Speaker 2: You're more than welcome. Thank you for joining this today.

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And you're calling from the UK?

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Speaker 1: Yes indeed, Yeah in Somerset, beautiful part of England, not

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far from from Glastonbury.

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Speaker 2: Beautiful place, beautiful, famous for music festivals and cider.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Indeed, and who knows, maybe UFOs as well. But yeah,

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I'm actually some specific I'm in a place called nether Stowe,

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which is famous for the poet Samuel Taylor Coleridge, who

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was very imaginative, one of the great great artists of

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our time and thinkers. And I'm also a stone throw

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away from Inkley Point as well, which is quite interesting

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as well as a as a possible UFO hotspot, I guess,

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but yeah, it's a bit. It's an amazing place. Somerset

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one of the best places in the country. I agree, lovely.

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Speaker 2: Okay, Ben, you have some experiences to share. Would you

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like to start the beginning please, sir?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, Well, my approach to the whole subject has

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quite come from a myriad of angles, really, and I

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as a kid was always very very interested in euthology

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and science fixed to a degree, but I was never

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like a man. I had sort of sci fi geek

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kind of kid. I came of it very much from

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a novel angle because my great grandma's unusual character. She

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my grandmother, she was frame with me, old mum, and

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she sort of brought me up for most of my childhood,

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and she was psychic and she didn't take money for it,

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but she was great. She was like a parmer. She

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she knew dates, names, all sorts, very accurate, and she

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used to read in Isaac Asimov for days. She was

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very much into science fiction, but she also had a

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deep love of actual euthology. So there'd be Zachariah stits

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In or sits In or HP Lovecraft, but they'd also

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be you know, von Danakan and people like that Morning

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the Magician's Holy Blood and the Holy Grail books Communion,

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you know, that were also in the bookshelves that piqued

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my interests, And so she was more than open to

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it all being real, not you know, being make believes.

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So and also when she'd watched things like Close Encounters,

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I remember asking, you know, I remember seeing that as

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a kid, perhaps a bit earlier than most would, and

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she definitely introduced me to a different perspective with it

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that perhaps most kids you know wouldn't have. That's perhaps

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a bit more typical nowadays, where you know, you're joining

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the dots between the science fiction and reality and it

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being a possibility and not just mate believe. And really,

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from quite a young age, I believe that there was

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a possibility, so that on one side I was into

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things like Lake seven, doctor Who, things like that that

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were fun. I also very much was into to an extent.

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Obviously we didn't have the Internet then, you know, kind

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of as I saying, things like morning and magicians, the

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whole area of Vondanak and charoits of the gods. Now,

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she got her interest, I think from my great grandfather,

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who was a tailor or Mills, sorry Mills, not a Manning,

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and he was out in Russia in Revolution. He was

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a sailure. He was a local counselor for a little

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while in East London and was a popular there as well,

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and a teacher, very wise man and a sailor for

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a while, musician and a teacher, as I say. And

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he traveled and say New Orleans during the jazz boom,

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and he I think was he filled her with lots

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of interesting idea is I don't know if he was

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a believer in authology, but he knew HG. Wells for

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a while because he was part of the Fabian society.

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Even though he didn't come from money. He was deeply intellectual,

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and I guess he talked his way and he got

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to know them all and people like as I say,

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HG Wells and as a result, because it's quite a

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lefty as a result, he I think again, you know,

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because War of the Worlds and everything really won my

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old mum's imagination, and I think living in a household well,

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on the other side of things, the actual mum was

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quite cynical about it, though she was interested but not

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really believer. So I saw it from different perspectives, which

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is after all, what life's like. But it was, as

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I say, he just really really fascinating to me. I

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remember a show called The Boy from Space, which probably

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most people have forgotten. You might remember it was on

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many years ago that was very sort of uncanny in

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the way that it depicted the whole area of aliens

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visiting Earth, and it just all these shows would win

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my imagination. But I also had a real interest say

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that I think came from my male mum and the

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family to an extent. But I did have a few

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sightings in my childhood, particularly in mid teens. I had

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a bit of a nervous breakdown in mid teens when

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we folks moved to Somerset. But I do remember seeing,

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you know, floating orbs or lights that would shoot off,

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and that really then I knew that, hold on, there's

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more to this than just you know, me being interested

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watching too many sci fi shows or something. You know,

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I couldn't have imagined that, And I think that was

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the connection with her, say, with mele Mom, because she

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was into conspiracies before they became fashionable and then unfashionable

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and now dangerous. I mean, you have to be careful,

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you tell. But in the old days when it was

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just a bit of fun, absolutely, you know, and for

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years and years I'd follow these stories. And obviously with

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the Internet it's opened it up a bit more. But

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then you don't always know always hu to trust because obviously,

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at the moment with uthology, you've got, you know, so

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much information coming at us all the time, whether it's

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podcasts with real accounts that are genuine, or or more

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money making exercises coming at it from an entertainment angle.

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That's where things obviously like Coast to Coasts come in.

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They're great fun, a lot of people on those shows

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are probably genuine, but also it can be just sort

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of more entertainment, perhaps closer to the sci fi than

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the reality, so to speak. But yeah, I mean through

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my life, I've just always had the interest the same

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melmm used to collect newsletters and send off for handouts

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and things or that she'd get all about conspiracies and

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a lot of it would be alien stuff. And that's

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how I picked up on a lot a lot of

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it also in the seventies because my great as I said,

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my great grandfather who knew HD Well, he was a

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Mills as I say, But in the seventies she met

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an employee of nurse actually when she was running a

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B and B for a short while in London in

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the seventies, and he told her that he'd seen proof.

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It was the photographs or what of alien life or

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previous visits by humanity to the Moon. I'm not quite

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sure what it was, which actually reminds one of a

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lot of that old HG. Well's The First Men on

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the Moon, one of my favorite films when I was

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a child. Funnily enough, but see would sort of recount

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that to me, and I was like, wow, yeah, obviously,

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I mean this was something my mum, who's not really

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a believer, would also tell me about and say, well, yeah,

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he definitely this definitely happened, and so growing up with

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those influences, is say, always sort of peak my interests

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got me really fascinated in the whole subject. And I

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mean I live in a UFO hotspot now, so see,

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as I said earlier, near a nuclear power station Glassbury.

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And occasionally, you know, you do see sightings. It's possible

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to see the odd mysterious light. But the best sighting

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I've had in recent years was actually last year. I

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had two, one was in in recent years, and most

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notable one was in West Dullige, which was last October,

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when I think, you know, to be honest, from listening

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to a lot of kind of encounter shows and podcasts

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and things, one can easy. But as I was living

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on my own at that point as well, which I

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think helps real influences, I think as a result I

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was really really into it. I was also working from

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home and talking to the odd friends and about it,

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but not ever really talking to anyone that was deadly

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set against it. So perhaps I was very much normalizing

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it in my own head. I've often wondered what was it.

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It almost seems like I made it happen, almost but

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I didn't have this in Asia. It was quite extraordinary.

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I left the house and I walked. I was just

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literally walking bays the west side of the train station,

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and this sort of was pretty big black triangle came

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over and it was making a worrying noise, which makes

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me wonder if it was a military But there were

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people there and they weren't looking up. But I couldn't understand.

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I tried to grab a rather clumsy photo that didn't

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come out very well, which is what they all say.

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I kind of can understand how that happens now, because

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when you actually see something and you've kind of wanted

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to see it and it actually happens, you can't believe

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it's actually happening for a minute, and so I can

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imagine that that's you know, I know a lot of

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the cynics say, oh yeah, they just make it up,

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but honestly, I can see how it happens. You get

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a sort of freeze, body freeze for a second where

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you're so excited and so to this that I wish

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i'd videoed it. But as I say, it may have

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been military, but it wasn't extraordinarily very impressive. I'd love

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to think it was the real thing, so to speak.

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And as I say, it flew over where Studies train station.

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I felt like alfurd something that it's like a guide

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to the galaxy. It was a bit surreal, to be honest.

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It was an amazing moment. A few years earlier, I

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also had something. I was over flying over the Grand Canyon,

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completely different part of the world. This is when I

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was working Avanama, musician and writer and artist. I was

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working a few years on architecture design shows and We're

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on the way to one of these events, and I

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was flying above and the Grand Canyon and there was

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the blinding lights that were sort of you know, now

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I could again you know that there were people on

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the plane, they didn't seem to be looking. It reminded

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me a lot of a little bit of William Shatner

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twente own episode where with the alien on the wing.

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Its very funny episode those I love watching that for

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a giggle. But I sort of looking down and there's

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like loads of these sort of very bright lights, I

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mean very so bright, a bit like when you look

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at the sun. It's not a good idea to keep

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looking because your eyes were that and they were about

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four or five of them down there. I mean they

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were bright. And I got to the event in Arizona.

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I think it wasn't. And when I got back, I says,

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you know, I've got to look this up, and so

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I looked it all up and yeah, lo and behold

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are very similar pictures online of Grand Canyon UFO. Same

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with black Triangles in the UK. It seems to be

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quite a lot of sighting. So those are two of

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my sort of biggest sightings. I used to see sort

240
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of glowing a little bit on the horizon, would shoot off,

241
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as I say, in my teens, a little bit. But

242
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those have sort of been the main things in recent

243
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times in terms of concrete sidings that I've had. But

244
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I've always, as I say, I had an interest. I

245
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mean when I enjoyed a hobbyist of writing and I'm

246
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getting a phone call from and it's very bizarre conspiracy

247
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theories called Anthony J. Hilder, who was I don't know

248
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if you remember him, but he was like this very extreme,

249
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quite ahead of his time, like an extremer version of

250
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David Ipe almost but kind of. He would talk a

251
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lot about scull and bones and Satanism and secret societies

252
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and aliens and things. And I knew of him because

253
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I'd also written to Richard D. Hall who in twenty

254
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eleven about my book that I'd written, which I don't

255
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know whether to mention or not, but it was about

256
00:13:30,639 --> 00:13:33,600
it was like a science fiction thing about UFOs. It

257
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was just an escapist thing. Really. It was just a

258
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bit of fun and I put that out there and

259
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I think I get this phone called as a result.

260
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It's funny because my particular book was rare because it

261
00:13:43,360 --> 00:13:45,240
was the only one that'd been written about real something

262
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Vril Power source called Rill, and there's lots of conspiracy

263
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theories about it. I've read about it in Morning the Magicians. Anyway,

264
00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:54,240
he was a kid. Anyway, he called me and he says,

265
00:13:54,399 --> 00:13:57,919
in very sort of thick so I'm Karen from Santa Monica, USA.

266
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I'm here to tell you this is real. This is

267
00:14:00,360 --> 00:14:02,600
not you know, lies are it? And it's sort of

268
00:14:02,679 --> 00:14:04,440
very kind of I could barely understand what we're saying.

269
00:14:04,559 --> 00:14:07,519
It was sort of drawling on, but it was great fun.

270
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I was so excited because I've seen him, I think

271
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once on one of these channels. Because for a while,

272
00:14:12,399 --> 00:14:14,440
I don't know how it happened about fifteen years ago

273
00:14:14,559 --> 00:14:17,919
on the sky somehow you got shows by people like

274
00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:22,879
Richard D. Hall and even Hilda about all these conspiracies

275
00:14:22,919 --> 00:14:26,000
and whatnot. That all that's been banned now by Sky

276
00:14:26,159 --> 00:14:28,240
you can't get any of that, and even on YouTube,

277
00:14:28,519 --> 00:14:31,360
a lot of it's getting banned. But back then, somehow

278
00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:33,480
it slipped through the net. So I knew about him

279
00:14:33,519 --> 00:14:36,559
from that. So yeah, he called me all the way

280
00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:38,559
from Santa Minaca. In the end, we never met up.

281
00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:42,399
It was a shame because he his colleague, he's right

282
00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:44,120
hand man, did call me and that's me at the

283
00:14:44,159 --> 00:14:46,759
Georgian Pilgrim in rat Can bring about, but we never didn't.

284
00:14:46,879 --> 00:14:49,440
He died not long after. And the sad truth is

285
00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:52,639
when I was out there, when I saw the UFOs

286
00:14:52,679 --> 00:14:55,159
in Grand Canyon, I didn't realize he was still alive then,

287
00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:57,600
and he didn't actually live that far from where I

288
00:14:57,759 --> 00:15:01,159
was living in Newport Beach. I know idea he was in.

289
00:15:01,320 --> 00:15:03,399
You know, there's kind of a small world, But sadly

290
00:15:03,440 --> 00:15:05,279
I missed the opportunity there, but would have been lovely

291
00:15:05,279 --> 00:15:08,000
if we've met him again. So yeah, I mean, through

292
00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:11,480
my life, I've had so many interesting experiences that have

293
00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:14,759
just kept me excited and interested in it and I

294
00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:19,399
just feel that also because Catalina Island as well. When

295
00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:22,399
I was out in America, I was just lived opposite

296
00:15:22,519 --> 00:15:26,159
there and I used to see lights occasionally, but nothing

297
00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:29,759
that significant. And again, in hindsight, I've heard was he

298
00:15:29,879 --> 00:15:32,200
with a tic Tac incident that I was also in

299
00:15:32,720 --> 00:15:36,320
quite quite well a very significant hot spot finnily enough,

300
00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:39,720
around the time of that tic Tac incident in twenty eighteen.

301
00:15:39,799 --> 00:15:41,919
I was actually living out there then, but I had

302
00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:45,200
no idea at the time. So yeah, I mean, whether

303
00:15:45,279 --> 00:15:47,919
it's the HG world's connection or as the same old

304
00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:50,799
mum sitting since she's reading I was on a day

305
00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:53,639
she was fascinated though in the reality of it, I

306
00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:56,440
think that's the key, and I think she was. She

307
00:15:56,600 --> 00:16:00,240
was open minded on it. I got that influence, And

308
00:16:00,399 --> 00:16:04,120
so when I've seen UFOs, I think the other thing

309
00:16:04,159 --> 00:16:07,039
to remember is I think fear probably puts a lot

310
00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:10,360
of UFOs off from appearing to people, because I guess

311
00:16:10,399 --> 00:16:13,480
sci Fi is kind of grain it in us to

312
00:16:14,159 --> 00:16:16,840
expect an alien attack or whatnot, like all the worlds.

313
00:16:16,960 --> 00:16:18,559
But I did get the feeling that a lot of

314
00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:21,240
them probably are very kind of peaceful and quite the

315
00:16:21,279 --> 00:16:24,639
opposite and observing us, perhaps not as in a nasty

316
00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:27,919
way like hgu WEL's painted, but in quite a fearful

317
00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:31,600
way even you know, obviously, with AI developing as it

318
00:16:31,720 --> 00:16:33,600
is at the moment, and I had quite an early

319
00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:37,039
insight into that for various reasons a couple of years ago,

320
00:16:37,879 --> 00:16:40,799
it is quite where it's chilling really what the possibilities

321
00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:44,000
are with that. And so I think obviously with disclosure

322
00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:48,000
bubbling up at the moment, with shows like Weaponized, I mean,

323
00:16:48,039 --> 00:16:51,000
the thing is, I did watch an episode of Weaponized recently,

324
00:16:51,039 --> 00:16:52,799
and as much as I love that show, it was

325
00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:55,240
all about music, and I'm musicians. I was I should

326
00:16:55,279 --> 00:16:58,279
be really happy, but it just rang alarm belts for

327
00:16:58,360 --> 00:16:59,840
me because it was just a long interview with Robbie

328
00:16:59,840 --> 00:17:02,840
with like what's going on. So sometimes even the shadows

329
00:17:02,919 --> 00:17:04,880
or even the things you think you can trust, you've

330
00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:06,160
got to be a little bit. I'm not saying you

331
00:17:06,200 --> 00:17:08,920
can't trust that particularly show, but it put a few

332
00:17:09,240 --> 00:17:11,640
question marks in my mind. So there's so much information

333
00:17:11,799 --> 00:17:13,960
out there, it's just cunning it all really and finding

334
00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:17,160
out working out what's real or not. But if you've

335
00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:20,200
seen something with your own eyes, you know, it's real.

336
00:17:20,599 --> 00:17:22,440
It just gets frustrated, and I think at the moment

337
00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:25,200
because you feel that we're on the edge of a

338
00:17:25,359 --> 00:17:29,839
real kind of potential breakthrough with UFOs and acceptance of

339
00:17:29,920 --> 00:17:33,039
it or alien life, but also there's something holding everything back,

340
00:17:33,079 --> 00:17:35,119
and it's like it's going around in circles. You know,

341
00:17:35,480 --> 00:17:41,079
you're getting actual government, you know, public meetings or whatever

342
00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:43,599
about about UFOs for the first time in history, but

343
00:17:43,640 --> 00:17:45,359
it's not even on the British news. You know, you

344
00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:48,480
think they'd be interested. You are the more interested in gossips.

345
00:17:48,559 --> 00:17:51,440
So it's a fascinating time. And as I say, right

346
00:17:51,519 --> 00:17:53,880
through my life and say, book books like Holy Blood

347
00:17:53,880 --> 00:17:56,200
and Holy Grail, Morning Magicians, I was steeped in and

348
00:17:56,279 --> 00:17:58,960
all that, But as I say, it wasn't as I say,

349
00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:02,559
solely from the fantasy angle. There was always an interest

350
00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:05,519
also in music. You know, people like Gary Newman and

351
00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:08,880
David Bowe and Ultravox would write songs about aliens and

352
00:18:09,079 --> 00:18:12,400
so again, you know, I think perhaps those songs meant

353
00:18:12,599 --> 00:18:15,680
more to me because I felt that they weren't just escapist.

354
00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:18,680
I don't know, but certainly, as I say, growing up

355
00:18:19,039 --> 00:18:21,359
in a household where it was as I say, believed

356
00:18:21,400 --> 00:18:23,480
in on one side, not on the other. I think

357
00:18:23,480 --> 00:18:26,559
it gave me quite a useful kind of perspective from

358
00:18:26,599 --> 00:18:29,359
different angles moving forward. Really, But yeah, I mean, it's

359
00:18:29,559 --> 00:18:31,839
with the whole area. It's just about as I say,

360
00:18:31,880 --> 00:18:34,000
being open minded and receptive. And then I think there's

361
00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:36,759
a chance, you know, the peerter one. But I think,

362
00:18:36,839 --> 00:18:39,519
as I say, it's just about belief. But it's always

363
00:18:39,559 --> 00:18:42,960
been something that I've always been interested in, as I say,

364
00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:45,680
And I hope, you know, I hope that in the

365
00:18:45,799 --> 00:18:48,839
next couple of years, with the whole AI thing coming up,

366
00:18:49,160 --> 00:18:51,839
that if there is some sort of disclosure that's perhaps

367
00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:55,039
more mainstream, that it's it's the real thing, you know,

368
00:18:55,279 --> 00:18:58,519
that it is not some sort of faked, you know thing,

369
00:18:58,799 --> 00:19:01,480
Because obviously, people like David Ike, you know, whether you

370
00:19:01,599 --> 00:19:04,039
believe in him or not, they're getting sort of censored

371
00:19:04,119 --> 00:19:06,359
more and more so it does get more difficult to

372
00:19:06,440 --> 00:19:09,200
know who's genuine or not. As I say, shows like

373
00:19:09,559 --> 00:19:12,039
you know, obviously, shows like Doctor Who's Star Trek and

374
00:19:12,279 --> 00:19:15,759
Hitchhiker's Goal, these shows that they prepare people on one

375
00:19:15,839 --> 00:19:18,720
side of things, but they also leave people very fearful

376
00:19:18,759 --> 00:19:21,759
and unreceptive because they just think it's all fantasy. But

377
00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:25,200
life can imitate art, art can imitate life, so you

378
00:19:25,319 --> 00:19:28,519
just have to remember that. You know that often the

379
00:19:28,599 --> 00:19:31,920
most amazing things, like I mean, as everyone points out

380
00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:34,480
the flip phones that we you know in Star Trek

381
00:19:34,559 --> 00:19:37,319
in the sixties, communication devices, I mean we have them

382
00:19:37,400 --> 00:19:41,119
now with mobile phones. It's all come true. So definitely

383
00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:44,559
you know that there's no reason not to believe. But

384
00:19:44,720 --> 00:19:47,480
I think, as I say, I would say that my

385
00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:51,799
main reasons for coming on here is that I would say,

386
00:19:51,799 --> 00:19:53,920
as someone who passionately believes in it, I just think

387
00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:57,240
there needs to be a very measured new approach with

388
00:19:57,400 --> 00:20:00,319
it because I just think there's too many UFO almost,

389
00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:03,000
too many podcasts, too many things out there where it's

390
00:20:03,039 --> 00:20:05,200
getting a bit confused with all the Russell brands of

391
00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:07,119
this world coming in who weren't even interested in it

392
00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:09,119
a few years ago through four or five years ago.

393
00:20:09,839 --> 00:20:13,039
So I just think it needs a clear kind of direction.

394
00:20:13,119 --> 00:20:14,559
Hopefully your show will be part of that.

395
00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:17,960
Speaker 2: Hopefully, But yeah, I mean that's about the problem with

396
00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:20,240
the subjects. You know, you have got a lot of

397
00:20:20,279 --> 00:20:23,279
good information coming out. Unfortunately it's it's a bit like

398
00:20:23,559 --> 00:20:26,000
a polluted river. We've got fresh water coming down from

399
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:28,480
the mountains and then you have sewage which is being

400
00:20:28,519 --> 00:20:31,599
pumped into it. And unfortunately that is the way the

401
00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:34,079
subject tears. There's a lot of good information, but a

402
00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:38,240
lot of bad information, and regardless of what their agenda is,

403
00:20:38,319 --> 00:20:41,359
whether it's just to make money or whatever, I don't know,

404
00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:43,400
but there's a lot of rubbish. There certainly is a

405
00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:45,119
lot of rubbish out there, and there always has been.

406
00:20:45,319 --> 00:20:48,200
It's just you have to kind of separate what's real

407
00:20:48,319 --> 00:20:49,200
and what's fiction.

408
00:20:49,680 --> 00:20:51,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, Well that's where the NASA story was so

409
00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:54,039
import when I was a kid, because the fact that

410
00:20:54,279 --> 00:20:56,880
you know, Mel you know, has said on one side

411
00:20:56,880 --> 00:20:58,880
of the coin, and she was a believer that I met,

412
00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:00,920
you know, a NASA employee, believed in it. You know,

413
00:21:01,039 --> 00:21:04,160
he'd seen alien proof of alien lives, you his members

414
00:21:04,160 --> 00:21:06,640
of you know, No, it was absolutely quiet, one hundred

415
00:21:06,680 --> 00:21:09,079
percent believe. On the other side the side, the cynic

416
00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:10,799
was a bit more of a cynic with my mum,

417
00:21:10,799 --> 00:21:13,039
who was not believer in it. But even she said, well, yeah,

418
00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:15,480
he definitely said this. You did say it, you know,

419
00:21:15,680 --> 00:21:18,680
And when you've got a cynic saying well through britty teeth.

420
00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:21,359
So I had a as I say, a very interesting

421
00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:24,000
well that must be true then example as a young child.

422
00:21:24,559 --> 00:21:26,039
So perhaps in a way it does, I say, it

423
00:21:26,079 --> 00:21:28,720
did make them more open to it. But I would

424
00:21:28,759 --> 00:21:30,920
say that, as I say, there's just so much information

425
00:21:31,039 --> 00:21:32,680
at the moment, which is one of the things about

426
00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:34,680
the Internet, you know, in a way less was more

427
00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:37,039
because when I was growing up, and as I say,

428
00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:40,119
you had books like Communion and you could go perhaps

429
00:21:40,160 --> 00:21:43,039
to meetings of uthologists or you could They're always going

430
00:21:43,079 --> 00:21:45,880
to be fakers, but it's so much easier now to

431
00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:49,480
fake with technology, so much easier to also, you know,

432
00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:52,279
try to make money from it in some way. That's

433
00:21:52,319 --> 00:21:54,000
why I didn't really I wasn't sure whether you mentioned

434
00:21:54,039 --> 00:21:56,839
my book as many years ago and my interest in

435
00:21:57,000 --> 00:22:00,279
Vrill as I say, Anthony J. Hill didn't passionately lead

436
00:22:00,359 --> 00:22:03,119
in it as a free energy source in the Tesla mold,

437
00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:05,960
you know, and the Nazis were obviously trying to harness

438
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,960
the power that you know, people like NASA with Operation

439
00:22:09,079 --> 00:22:12,039
paper Clip tried to tap into. And he, you know,

440
00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:15,759
he really was very passionate held her about the subjects,

441
00:22:15,799 --> 00:22:17,400
and it kind of scared me a bit. Actually because

442
00:22:17,400 --> 00:22:18,880
I was only just trying to write a pop boy

443
00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:20,440
a bit of fun, you know what I mean, A

444
00:22:20,519 --> 00:22:22,200
little sci fi, a bit of fun when I was

445
00:22:22,319 --> 00:22:24,720
unwell and you know, something to do. And it was

446
00:22:24,839 --> 00:22:26,839
just really a case I got really carried away with

447
00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:29,920
the concept and the ideas, and as having written to

448
00:22:30,039 --> 00:22:32,240
Richard Hall about it, so that was that was a

449
00:22:32,319 --> 00:22:34,400
real eye opener, and so as I say, it was

450
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:35,759
a kind of bit of sweet to know that I

451
00:22:35,880 --> 00:22:38,119
was so near but yet so far from Hilda himself

452
00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:40,200
when I was out there. But as I say, in

453
00:22:40,319 --> 00:22:42,240
childhood again, you know a lot of heavy metal bands

454
00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:45,400
also into eufoses and all this. So I suppose, you know,

455
00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:47,880
when you've got these myriad, just like anybody else, you've

456
00:22:47,920 --> 00:22:50,119
got a myriad of different directions from it. And it's

457
00:22:50,759 --> 00:22:54,480
unfortunately most people are directed though by the mainstream media

458
00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:58,119
or the mainstream entertainment world, and so as a result

459
00:22:58,240 --> 00:23:01,039
they tend to sort of get this in or disbelief

460
00:23:01,079 --> 00:23:04,039
from that. I guess. I suppose because aertainment has primed

461
00:23:04,079 --> 00:23:06,480
everyone up to be scared, and as I said earlier,

462
00:23:06,519 --> 00:23:09,440
with the war of the world and everything, it's something unfortunately,

463
00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:12,400
it's quite a long tradition of people just assuming they're

464
00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:14,799
going to attack us, and I think it's that fear.

465
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:18,039
Perhaps it repels them because the same fast joy. I'm

466
00:23:18,039 --> 00:23:20,519
sure we're peaceful, But as I said, I think the

467
00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:24,240
next couple of years. I'm quite religious too, I do believe.

468
00:23:24,759 --> 00:23:27,799
So I think that the next couple of years, with

469
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:31,119
AI coming up as it is, where it's literally that

470
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:34,559
the possibility it might attempt to replicate and overtake us,

471
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:38,480
I think then you're getting quite an HG World's type

472
00:23:38,519 --> 00:23:40,960
War of the World scenario, or almost a Brave New

473
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:45,200
World type scenario of how it's all gonna unravel in

474
00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:47,079
front of our eyes. I think a lot of people

475
00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:48,960
who are a bit in the dark about it, follow

476
00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:51,680
the mainstream media and the mainstream vendors. I don't think

477
00:23:51,680 --> 00:23:53,640
they quite realize them. And I've been watching a lot

478
00:23:53,720 --> 00:23:57,640
of debates and lectures by the creators of AI, so

479
00:23:57,640 --> 00:23:59,720
I suppose I'm a bit more flewed up on it.

480
00:24:00,319 --> 00:24:03,720
It is really quite terrifying, and I'm just curious because

481
00:24:03,720 --> 00:24:05,400
I haven't heard a lot of talk on this, how

482
00:24:05,759 --> 00:24:08,200
the whole alien life, how that will all tie in,

483
00:24:08,359 --> 00:24:10,920
whether it will assasserbate or speed it up. Whether the

484
00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:14,880
AI thing will immediately you know, that will be disclosure,

485
00:24:15,359 --> 00:24:17,039
or how it will happen, We'll have to wait and see.

486
00:24:17,039 --> 00:24:20,680
It's a bit like a real kind of sci fi

487
00:24:20,799 --> 00:24:23,200
novel coming alive, a little bit. I mean, I think

488
00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:25,960
as I say, I mean, I've got assigned Ray Bradbury

489
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:30,079
and I love I love science fiction. I love Martian Chronicles.

490
00:24:30,079 --> 00:24:33,680
When I was a boy, I saw that that was

491
00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:36,960
a work of fiction that I believe. I don't want

492
00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:39,640
to scare people that could be very I think close

493
00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:44,200
to reality. From studying this deeply, you know, obviously not

494
00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:48,000
everything David Ike says is necessarily true, but if you

495
00:24:48,079 --> 00:24:51,000
believe in the concepts of how can I put it

496
00:24:51,039 --> 00:24:53,720
without sounding like I'm kind of getting a bit too imaginative,

497
00:24:53,759 --> 00:24:55,599
but kind of like shape shifting and everything else. I

498
00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:58,279
know from having looked to new foot into ethology closely

499
00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:02,640
that certainly there's a believe that that's possible in reality,

500
00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:05,119
not a sci fi again, not a sci fi that

501
00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:07,599
there's a possibility of that, and that they might even

502
00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:10,279
walk amongst us to quote. So, I mean, it's fascinating.

503
00:25:10,319 --> 00:25:12,119
There's lots of ways to look get it, certainly with

504
00:25:12,599 --> 00:25:17,240
again everything going on with the nuclear situation, artificial intelligence,

505
00:25:17,279 --> 00:25:19,839
the war in Russia. It's all a bit dystopian. And

506
00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:23,160
I think because so many people are kind of programmed

507
00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:26,279
by social media, there are also a lot of the

508
00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:29,519
active jobs and industries at the moment all in technology.

509
00:25:30,039 --> 00:25:33,039
So the whole generation of millennials really have been sucked

510
00:25:33,079 --> 00:25:36,359
into thinking it's okay to never leave a machine, to

511
00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:39,960
always communicate only on a machine, to do things really

512
00:25:40,039 --> 00:25:42,880
that are quite anti human at one time. And I

513
00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:45,640
think the whole ai things tied into that. It's almost

514
00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:47,960
as if we've all been steered. I think, perhaps because

515
00:25:47,960 --> 00:25:50,119
I'm a little bit older, I can have perspective of it.

516
00:25:50,279 --> 00:25:52,519
But you know, I was, I had no news. I

517
00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:55,200
was brought up in a Steino school. To an extent,

518
00:25:55,279 --> 00:25:57,319
I missed a lot of schooling early in life because

519
00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:00,440
of illness, and so I think growing up, you know,

520
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:03,519
rather than seeing loads of friends, I was, you know,

521
00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:06,839
spending a lot of time with older people, and one

522
00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:09,640
of them being into euthology. Obviously, as a young man,

523
00:26:09,839 --> 00:26:13,279
obviously had a slightly biased view. But yeah, I remember

524
00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:16,200
watching films like Post Encounters but two thousand and one

525
00:26:16,279 --> 00:26:19,319
as well, and reading about you know, the Dogone tribe

526
00:26:19,319 --> 00:26:22,680
in Africa in morning and the magicians, and you know clearly,

527
00:26:22,799 --> 00:26:25,640
you know these things were around long before the Internet,

528
00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:27,920
and I think these were the things that got my

529
00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:32,640
imagination fired up, really imagination. People might say exactly, and

530
00:26:32,759 --> 00:26:35,279
I would counter, well, no, I just think it gives

531
00:26:35,279 --> 00:26:37,680
you an interest, and I think it just it gives

532
00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:39,640
you something that you can take with you in life.

533
00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:41,599
It doesn't mean you imagine you a posed. It doesn't

534
00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:44,640
mean that you're magic. You knows so many people around

535
00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:47,839
the world who see things, and I've seen things that

536
00:26:48,279 --> 00:26:50,839
you know there's obviously something to it. We all know that,

537
00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:54,319
but somehow everything is geared to us not believing that.

538
00:26:55,319 --> 00:26:57,920
And then, as I say, I'm not anti religion, I

539
00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:01,799
don't believe that. You know that leaving the UFO's means

540
00:27:01,839 --> 00:27:04,519
that you are. There are references in the Bible and

541
00:27:04,559 --> 00:27:07,160
the film, etc. But obviously with the agenda that the

542
00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:10,599
BBC has, whatever that is, and with everything, I don't

543
00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:14,119
think most people really quite realize where we are with

544
00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:15,839
all this. And you have to be careful who you tell,

545
00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:18,720
which is why I suppose it's so great to come

546
00:27:18,799 --> 00:27:21,240
on a show like this to talk openly about it,

547
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:23,559
because you know, I remember thinking as a child, because

548
00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:26,119
I'm a musician, and I remember thinking, is it amazing that,

549
00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:29,480
you know, bagpipes developed at the same time in ancient

550
00:27:29,519 --> 00:27:34,079
Mesopotamia as they did in Cornwall or whatever. And it's true,

551
00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:35,920
you know, when you look, you know, how did they know?

552
00:27:36,039 --> 00:27:38,880
They didn't have internet? You know, was it some sort

553
00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:41,960
of telepathy? They hadn't discovered each other. These were completely

554
00:27:42,079 --> 00:27:45,160
despar at parts of the planet. They weren't even you know,

555
00:27:45,519 --> 00:27:48,279
they wouldn't have known each other's existence alone letters or

556
00:27:48,279 --> 00:27:50,000
anything like that to say, hey, this is how you

557
00:27:50,079 --> 00:27:52,880
build I mean, you know, exactly the same sort of instrument,

558
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:55,079
exactly the same point in time. So even things that

559
00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:57,599
are practical and scientific that science wouldn't be able to

560
00:27:57,640 --> 00:28:01,079
explain like that always piqued my interest. There's more to life,

561
00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:04,759
that there's more to human development or intelligence than we think.

562
00:28:05,079 --> 00:28:07,079
And it's the same from the perspective of all the

563
00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:10,200
alien depictions you see as shown by de von Danak.

564
00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:13,000
And though again you look him up and you know,

565
00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:16,039
just because one individual happened to hit lucky with the

566
00:28:16,079 --> 00:28:18,559
subject and do well, and that individual might have something

567
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:20,799
dodgy in their past. Doesn't mean the whole thing isn't

568
00:28:21,359 --> 00:28:24,680
is nonsense, And that's the important thing to remember with

569
00:28:24,759 --> 00:28:28,119
all this. You don't shoot the messenger and also be

570
00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:32,160
careful with the messenger. Is So it's such a complicated subject.

571
00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:35,799
It's a very simple subject actually, but in terms of

572
00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:37,640
who you believe in the perceptions of it, as I

573
00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:40,000
said five years ago without Russell Graham weren't really talking

574
00:28:40,039 --> 00:28:42,519
about it. The clearly things are going in the right direction,

575
00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:44,839
but whether they're the right people to be talking about it,

576
00:28:45,599 --> 00:28:47,400
I suppose it is the issue a little bit, But

577
00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:50,759
how can we know until there's any genuine, you know,

578
00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:55,119
genuine disclosures. But I certainly think that you know, looking

579
00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:59,079
back through time. Another aspect as well, just to bring

580
00:28:59,160 --> 00:29:00,400
us up to date with a bit of a sci

581
00:29:00,519 --> 00:29:02,920
fi connection a little bit, because it's like something out

582
00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:06,119
of sci fi. I was reading that DNA strings can

583
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:10,799
actually be replicated and emailed and across and information by AI,

584
00:29:11,359 --> 00:29:13,599
and that again, even though it's not really the alien

585
00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:17,200
subject as such. Again it poses the question of if

586
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:20,880
life forms are coming from that angle, if in ten years,

587
00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:25,279
fifteen years, that was to say, happened, If AI isn't controlled,

588
00:29:25,319 --> 00:29:27,799
and there's a problem with that at the moment, then

589
00:29:27,839 --> 00:29:31,079
one can imagine, you know that aliens, alien life would

590
00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:33,599
most definitely want to get involved. It's not a twilight

591
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,319
zone or et or some sort of answer, you know,

592
00:29:36,359 --> 00:29:39,960
they would definitely want to get involved and to either

593
00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:43,880
you know, control the situation or safe humanity. It could

594
00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:47,960
even pose a religious question. So it is a very

595
00:29:48,119 --> 00:29:51,519
very interesting time where you honestly feel that everything is

596
00:29:51,559 --> 00:29:53,559
coming a little bit to a head. And that's one

597
00:29:53,599 --> 00:29:55,839
of the reasons why I wanted to come on the show,

598
00:29:55,920 --> 00:29:59,799
because conspiracies, you know, doing this, That's why it's in

599
00:29:59,839 --> 00:30:02,960
the in the dictionary. Guy Fawkes is the most obvious example.

600
00:30:03,279 --> 00:30:05,920
And I think that, you know, certain when I look

601
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:08,599
back through my life, not only is it coming to

602
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:11,359
a head I think generally the whole UFO subject, but

603
00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:13,240
it is for a lot of people personally as well.

604
00:30:13,279 --> 00:30:16,319
They've been into all their lives, like myself. So yeah,

605
00:30:16,359 --> 00:30:18,519
I mean that's kind of where I'm coming from it really.

606
00:30:18,559 --> 00:30:20,720
I mean, I haven't had an abduction experience as far

607
00:30:20,759 --> 00:30:23,839
as I know, I've never had hypnosis to find out

608
00:30:23,880 --> 00:30:27,079
that particular angle of things. In terms of actually having

609
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:31,519
met any aliens or anything like that. So I can't

610
00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:33,759
sort of say that I have unfortunately, much as I'd

611
00:30:33,759 --> 00:30:35,759
love to say I have. But you know, I think

612
00:30:35,799 --> 00:30:39,720
the fact that I've seen some very notable sightings obviously

613
00:30:39,839 --> 00:30:44,799
in firstly in well when I was a child in London,

614
00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:47,839
a little bit later as well in Somerset, but certainly

615
00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:51,359
in recent years, so the Grand Canyon sighting, which I've

616
00:30:51,359 --> 00:30:53,799
got a good photo of my own personal phocus on

617
00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:58,880
my blog actually, and also the West Duddedge one really

618
00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:01,559
really have peaqued my treads a lot. Again, along with

619
00:31:02,599 --> 00:31:06,279
all the wonderful the encounter shows, particularly yours, I think

620
00:31:06,359 --> 00:31:09,480
are that bit more, you know, believable, because they say

621
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:11,559
there's a lot out there that kind of straddle the

622
00:31:11,599 --> 00:31:13,279
two scenes a bit in the terms that they put

623
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:16,680
bridge the gap between reality, which a lot of people

624
00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:18,960
don't want to believe in the truth of UFOs and

625
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:24,160
alien life and science fiction, and with people like two

626
00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:26,559
thousand and one and closing encounters as a kind of

627
00:31:26,599 --> 00:31:29,559
gray area not quite science fiction but almost. I don't

628
00:31:29,559 --> 00:31:31,960
remember there being at the beginning of posting Counters a

629
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:34,359
little thing saying this is true, a true story. Maybe

630
00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:36,160
there is. I haven't seen it for few years. But

631
00:31:36,759 --> 00:31:39,440
as I say, there's lots of perspectives with the extreme

632
00:31:39,519 --> 00:31:42,200
being it's all nonsense, it's all sci fi, and I'd

633
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:44,799
say lots of gray areas, not just of sci fi itself,

634
00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:48,519
but of the whole conspiracy field and the whole euthology

635
00:31:48,599 --> 00:31:51,559
field itself, be it the Billy Myers or the Nick Popes,

636
00:31:51,599 --> 00:31:54,559
all these people or that. Do you know the history channels.

637
00:31:54,599 --> 00:31:56,359
I tend to sort of go more for trying to

638
00:31:56,440 --> 00:32:00,680
find the more subversive debates and lectures on line and

639
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:03,119
try and get out there and meet people. That's why

640
00:32:03,160 --> 00:32:06,799
I was sad not to meet Anthony J. Hilder properly

641
00:32:07,039 --> 00:32:10,279
I could have, but that's by the by. And Richard D.

642
00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:12,240
Hall I'm not so sure about. He's not so much

643
00:32:12,359 --> 00:32:16,720
euphologists these days, more an agitator. But you know, certainly,

644
00:32:16,759 --> 00:32:19,839
when I look at what's out there, I'm not agitated

645
00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:22,920
what journalists kind of enjoyable agitated. I mean, he was

646
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,079
paying demonized by the BBC, but that seemed to be

647
00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:27,079
to do with something that wasn't UFI related.

648
00:32:35,519 --> 00:32:38,039
Speaker 3: Do you have an interest in the para normal? Did

649
00:32:38,119 --> 00:32:41,559
you'll love the unex Network Dot com. The X is

650
00:32:41,599 --> 00:32:45,720
your streaming audio and video for everything supernatural, strange and

651
00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:50,799
mysterious like UFOs, Bigfoot, Ghost and so much more from

652
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:56,039
host like Clyde Lewis, Whitley Streeber, Michah Haiks and Christina Gomaz.

653
00:32:56,359 --> 00:32:58,960
Visit the unex network dot com show page for a

654
00:32:59,039 --> 00:33:01,799
complete list of all the Here are normal programs you'll

655
00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:04,240
find on the X. Be sure to follow us on

656
00:33:04,319 --> 00:33:07,599
Twitter for updates at ky you n x dB, follow

657
00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:11,880
our Facebook group on X network, II the podcast on Spotify,

658
00:33:12,079 --> 00:33:15,839
iHeart Audible and Apple podcast It's Time.

659
00:33:16,039 --> 00:33:27,160
Speaker 1: It's two is the X x X. So there, it

660
00:33:27,319 --> 00:33:30,119
is very complicated picture at the moment, and quite also

661
00:33:30,799 --> 00:33:35,400
you know, how how will the disclosure safely happen if

662
00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:37,359
it can happen, or as I say, it may just

663
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:41,079
unravel naturally in connection with AI. And of course there's

664
00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:43,920
also a new conspiracy theory on the block that there'll

665
00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:49,480
be a fake alien thing go on in future produced

666
00:33:49,519 --> 00:33:53,680
by AI. So that's going to make things even more complicated. So,

667
00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:56,920
I mean, it is a fascinating time. And if that happens,

668
00:33:56,960 --> 00:33:59,240
then the aliens might say, up, you know, whether we'll deal.

669
00:33:59,279 --> 00:34:01,119
We've got something to say about this, so who knows.

670
00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:03,960
I mean, all these, all of these are all they'd

671
00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:06,119
all sound like sci fi plots, which is perhaps why

672
00:34:06,119 --> 00:34:08,840
I enjoyed writing when I was younger of it. But

673
00:34:09,199 --> 00:34:13,039
now I mean, this is all, you know, true stuff,

674
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:16,920
and I think that, you know, it's fascinating to see

675
00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:18,920
how it works, you know, play itself out. And I

676
00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:21,199
remember lyrics like when I was a child, I remember

677
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:25,639
listening to Down in the Park by Gary Newman and

678
00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:28,719
lyrics like my Love is a Rape Machine and talking

679
00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:33,559
about clones and strange machines and aliens and really, when

680
00:34:33,639 --> 00:34:35,599
you if you really, you know, study what's going on

681
00:34:35,639 --> 00:34:37,639
at the moment with AI and everything else, and if

682
00:34:37,639 --> 00:34:41,000
you're into what we're into. Art really was imitating facts,

683
00:34:41,119 --> 00:34:43,800
you know, whether it was Hawk Grin reading too much,

684
00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:45,639
Michael Moore Cockett I think they even got him in

685
00:34:45,679 --> 00:34:49,679
the band at one point, or Jeene Roddenberry actually knowing

686
00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:53,239
you athologists you followed just in real life, which he did.

687
00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:54,800
You know, we didn't know all that years ago. You know,

688
00:34:54,880 --> 00:34:57,000
we just watched Star Trek. We have a clue, you know.

689
00:34:57,159 --> 00:34:58,840
But see mild mum, as I say, she gave me

690
00:34:58,920 --> 00:35:02,239
that perspective I think she was so well read, signed

691
00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:04,960
Ray Bradrie, Isaac Asimov's every year. But also, as I say,

692
00:35:05,599 --> 00:35:10,360
she'd met people in Nassaberd believed in aliens. So as

693
00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:12,400
I said, I was coming out from all those perspectives.

694
00:35:12,599 --> 00:35:14,840
Speaker 2: I do let your term as an off a day,

695
00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:17,480
all right, I've just made that up for myself.

696
00:35:17,519 --> 00:35:20,320
Speaker 1: There, I've just invented a word. There you go, a

697
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:23,000
true original. Maybe it's Coleridge influenced in me. I don't

698
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:25,000
know if he believed in UFOs. I'm sure he did,

699
00:35:25,159 --> 00:35:27,639
you know. I mean, as I said earlier, with ancient times,

700
00:35:28,159 --> 00:35:31,000
the Romantic poets, they were open. You look into the

701
00:35:31,119 --> 00:35:34,800
poetry they wrote, and there's loads of references to because

702
00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:37,880
obviously they were bound very much by religion and Christianity,

703
00:35:38,079 --> 00:35:41,960
but you know they were obsessed with nature and spirituality

704
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:45,159
and the universe. And I'll roll in it. And so

705
00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:48,760
absolutely I'm sure that Coleridge, though he didn't write a

706
00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:50,800
poem on UFOs, I'm sure he would have believed in it.

707
00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:52,920
Speaker 2: Ill if I don't remember, right, he has not wrote

708
00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:56,159
a book. And it was about finding God. So you

709
00:35:56,320 --> 00:36:00,159
had human beings that left the earth in search of

710
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:03,320
God and you also had some aliens that left their

711
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:07,239
planet in turn to search for God, and the two

712
00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:10,079
meant it escapes me the name of the book now,

713
00:36:10,639 --> 00:36:13,760
But yeah, that was an interesting one. And you're absolutely

714
00:36:13,840 --> 00:36:16,199
right when it comes to AI. I think when you

715
00:36:16,360 --> 00:36:19,559
have people that grew up pre Internet certainly have a

716
00:36:19,639 --> 00:36:23,559
different opinion when it comes to AI compared to the

717
00:36:23,679 --> 00:36:25,760
youngsters now that are post Internet.

718
00:36:26,679 --> 00:36:28,679
Speaker 1: Not all. I mean sometimes it's a bit like I

719
00:36:28,760 --> 00:36:32,960
remember meeting a kid out in America who was about seventeen,

720
00:36:33,039 --> 00:36:35,000
and he said to me, Ah, I says, what music

721
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:37,960
you're into, maate? You know music things? Oh, I love

722
00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:42,679
anything pre nineteen ninety I said, what, Yeah, pre ninety ninety,

723
00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:45,719
as I don't listen to anything after then everything's yeah,

724
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:47,840
probably even earlier than that. And it sort of reeled

725
00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:50,480
off all these names of stuff from years ago. And

726
00:36:50,719 --> 00:36:52,239
not that it is correct. I mean that there is

727
00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:55,239
good music around now and you just have to search

728
00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:58,159
for it. Doesn't get as successful as it used to

729
00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:01,320
or should do, because they're corrupting. But that's another conversation.

730
00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:05,079
But what that shows is that youngsters can think differently,

731
00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:07,599
think outside the box. I mean, you and me aren't

732
00:37:07,599 --> 00:37:09,519
that old. Anyway, we're quite young. But the point is,

733
00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:12,400
you know they can and hopefully will be a bit

734
00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:15,079
more different in future. But it's very difficult because if

735
00:37:15,119 --> 00:37:16,960
all that, and it's not just slight it's for young

736
00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:19,960
people saying for older people. But if all your heroes,

737
00:37:20,039 --> 00:37:23,199
be they sporting, musical, film stars, whatever, they're all saying

738
00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:25,400
what everyone in the media is saying, which could be

739
00:37:25,480 --> 00:37:28,239
any you know, whether it's to do with COVID, the war,

740
00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:32,400
Ai aliens, any of it. You know, they're impressionable, and

741
00:37:32,599 --> 00:37:34,599
we're all impressiable even as we get older. To give

742
00:37:34,639 --> 00:37:36,639
someone's a favorite film star wars. We can believe what

743
00:37:36,679 --> 00:37:39,360
they say, and that's the only thing. You know. Sometimes

744
00:37:39,400 --> 00:37:42,840
people think for themselves. But there's so many more external

745
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:46,880
you know, as say the narcissistic nature, Instagram, Facebook, it's

746
00:37:46,920 --> 00:37:49,760
all sort of pulling people in certain directions often, so

747
00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:51,519
why I try and stick clear a little bit of

748
00:37:51,559 --> 00:37:54,880
social media. But it's, as I say, it's just too

749
00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:57,239
much information coming up people. So it's a bit confusing.

750
00:37:57,320 --> 00:37:59,760
But there are a few kids that think outside the box,

751
00:38:00,199 --> 00:38:01,880
and I think, as I said earlier, it's the same

752
00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:06,440
issue with too much information on youuthology it's very easy

753
00:38:06,599 --> 00:38:08,880
for a naysayer to come up. For example, I'll give

754
00:38:08,880 --> 00:38:11,159
you an example. I mean, there's probably videos already out there.

755
00:38:11,199 --> 00:38:13,360
In fact, I saw one the other day where I thought,

756
00:38:13,400 --> 00:38:15,519
this guy's different. I'll give him a try, and I listened,

757
00:38:15,559 --> 00:38:18,000
I realized he was. You know, I think he was

758
00:38:18,119 --> 00:38:22,079
pretty much a cynic. But he built such a powerful argument.

759
00:38:22,159 --> 00:38:25,880
All these people that I'd heard in the odd podcast

760
00:38:26,039 --> 00:38:28,519
or the odd UFO show that I like or would

761
00:38:28,559 --> 00:38:32,039
recommend that have infiltrated the stuff that perhaps is genuine,

762
00:38:32,199 --> 00:38:34,280
and that person has just come along and picked cherry

763
00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:38,760
picked all the ungenuine stuff, you know, that the untrue stuff,

764
00:38:38,760 --> 00:38:41,199
and they've lumped it altogether and made it all look

765
00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:44,760
like a pile of nonsense. And so that's what I'm saying.

766
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:47,719
It's so easy to kind of for the whole subject

767
00:38:47,760 --> 00:38:50,480
to get you discredited, which is obviously ridiculous. I mean,

768
00:38:50,519 --> 00:38:52,199
how can you think we're alone in the universe? This

769
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:54,599
is what I say to anybody. Do you seriously think?

770
00:38:54,679 --> 00:38:57,679
I mean, and people that do believe we're alone in

771
00:38:57,719 --> 00:39:01,079
the universe or believe things as they are, ie that

772
00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:05,039
you know, nothing has been any different, talk to everything.

773
00:39:05,119 --> 00:39:08,119
The government tells us and everything. I mean there are

774
00:39:08,159 --> 00:39:11,400
people like that, even intelligent professors all over the place,

775
00:39:11,440 --> 00:39:13,679
because we've seen that last couple of years that people

776
00:39:13,719 --> 00:39:17,559
will swallow anything if it's presented well enough. So yeah,

777
00:39:17,679 --> 00:39:19,920
I mean it's a tough one, but I think that's

778
00:39:20,039 --> 00:39:23,119
very interesting with I think, Asimo, if you said about that,

779
00:39:24,719 --> 00:39:27,639
that that plot line, because again that maybe are imitating

780
00:39:28,480 --> 00:39:31,920
life accidentally on purpose, because yeah, I do think that.

781
00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:35,519
I mean I've often one might even wonder, well, how

782
00:39:35,559 --> 00:39:38,599
does one know if gray aliens or even aliens or not.

783
00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:41,280
I mean, they don't seem very organic, They seem very

784
00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:45,280
they seem to communicate from why by telepathy, but they

785
00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:48,159
could just as easily be AI robots. I mean we

786
00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:50,760
don't know. I mean, the AI robots being created look

787
00:39:50,840 --> 00:39:54,039
so realistic, and as I say, there's reason to believe

788
00:39:54,199 --> 00:39:57,960
that that they Unfortunately it does sound like a sci

789
00:39:58,039 --> 00:40:00,880
fi but they could actually potentially. I saw this in

790
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:05,519
a I think a statement on having wanting to pause

791
00:40:06,079 --> 00:40:07,760
for six months the whole A. I think there was

792
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:09,960
a statement that came out and I'm sure in there

793
00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:12,239
it's said about it's possible for them to actually be

794
00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:14,960
physical outside of the robot realm where they could actually

795
00:40:16,119 --> 00:40:19,519
as organisms DNA create themselves in the biratries. I mean,

796
00:40:19,519 --> 00:40:23,199
it's extraordinary. It's like something that's silent green, but you know,

797
00:40:23,679 --> 00:40:28,119
a million times magnified and will actually come alive. I mean,

798
00:40:28,159 --> 00:40:31,159
actually reminds me a little bit of an Old Outer

799
00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:34,519
Limits episode, that one whether the creature comes alive. I

800
00:40:35,039 --> 00:40:36,920
think it's the first one of the first episodes of that.

801
00:40:37,079 --> 00:40:40,159
It's a brilliant episode actually, but again, you know this

802
00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:42,719
isn't sci fi, this is reality. Quite extraordinary, and in

803
00:40:43,039 --> 00:40:46,440
this Old Outer Limits this creature calls goes crazy and

804
00:40:47,079 --> 00:40:49,480
that he communicates with Now, I mean whether whether that

805
00:40:49,679 --> 00:40:51,360
sort of thing is going to happen, And that's what

806
00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:56,239
I'm saying there. You're your example there of a plot

807
00:40:56,320 --> 00:40:59,719
line where humans left Earth to find God and aliens

808
00:40:59,760 --> 00:41:03,320
came to find God or whatever. I mean, that's where

809
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:06,719
AI is taking us away ultimately from God, even though

810
00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:09,440
many say we'll have something more godlike than intelligence. Obviously

811
00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:12,960
if it's artificial things sort of tooking away, taking away

812
00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:16,360
from it, even if, as Elon Musk has tried to say,

813
00:41:17,119 --> 00:41:19,000
I think one of the videos was a deep fate

814
00:41:19,639 --> 00:41:21,920
you know you can live forever with like something out

815
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:25,679
of reminds me of Cold and Lazarus, the old Dennis

816
00:41:25,719 --> 00:41:28,760
Potter plot line where where's literally a head in a

817
00:41:29,320 --> 00:41:32,159
fridge and it can live forever through AI. I mean,

818
00:41:32,199 --> 00:41:35,719
these are the sorts of things that are genuinely being discussed.

819
00:41:35,840 --> 00:41:38,679
So clearly everything's going to come to a head, I think,

820
00:41:38,800 --> 00:41:43,000
and the religious questions and fundamentals and fundamentals of that.

821
00:41:43,599 --> 00:41:47,400
And whether you know, whether it's a second coming of

822
00:41:47,840 --> 00:41:52,000
over Jesus we recognize or or something more unusual, We'll

823
00:41:52,079 --> 00:41:54,239
just have to wait and see, I mean, whether it

824
00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:57,920
might all fizzle out and that actually, you know, all

825
00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:01,440
the name sayers will just get deleted from society. We'll

826
00:42:01,519 --> 00:42:05,159
just sort flip into the background and we'll just everything

827
00:42:05,199 --> 00:42:08,519
will turn into AI mechanized world and people will just

828
00:42:08,639 --> 00:42:12,239
have implants that make them. You know, they're already doing

829
00:42:12,280 --> 00:42:16,639
it with Elon Musk and the whole neuralink thing. It

830
00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:19,360
could be that, you know, people will all be updated

831
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:23,039
a bit like Microsoft Windows back in the day. No

832
00:42:23,159 --> 00:42:25,559
one will question everything and everyone will be perfectly happy

833
00:42:25,639 --> 00:42:27,960
by twenty thing. We'll have to wait and see, but

834
00:42:28,239 --> 00:42:29,679
it is an interesting time.

835
00:42:30,199 --> 00:42:32,880
Speaker 2: It certainly is. You know, when it comes to AI,

836
00:42:33,079 --> 00:42:34,800
you know, you have all the deep fakes. Now there's

837
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:38,519
videos you know, you can see of apparently people and

838
00:42:38,559 --> 00:42:40,719
they're not people. It's all you know, it's all digital

839
00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:43,440
and stuff. So even now you don't even really know

840
00:42:43,639 --> 00:42:46,519
what you're seeing on TV is real anymore. And especially

841
00:42:46,599 --> 00:42:48,639
you know, if you grew up with films like you

842
00:42:48,719 --> 00:42:52,559
said two thousand and one with how and the Terminator

843
00:42:52,639 --> 00:42:55,159
movies with Skynets, we all know what happened there. It

844
00:42:55,239 --> 00:42:56,920
all turned very sound very quickly.

845
00:42:57,360 --> 00:42:59,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's also a lot of peoples, I say, like

846
00:42:59,400 --> 00:43:02,079
the millennials, because I've worked in sales a lot in

847
00:43:02,159 --> 00:43:04,719
the past, and I mean, you know, I mean we're

848
00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:07,400
a good salesman. You know that they'll say anything, you know,

849
00:43:07,519 --> 00:43:09,679
and they'll make anything sound good. I mean, Adolf Hitler

850
00:43:09,679 --> 00:43:11,440
could have probably haired a team and they would have

851
00:43:11,679 --> 00:43:13,760
you know, this lot would have made it sound convincing.

852
00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:16,199
You know. They don't seem to question anything, is what

853
00:43:16,280 --> 00:43:18,800
I'm saying. And it is funny. It always not funny.

854
00:43:18,840 --> 00:43:21,480
It's kind of kind of strange. I saw a funny

855
00:43:21,559 --> 00:43:25,079
article actually, and a subversive newspaper called The Light recently

856
00:43:25,159 --> 00:43:28,119
which is a sort of Somerset publications. That it was

857
00:43:28,199 --> 00:43:30,480
going on about how he was a neighbor, that he's

858
00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:33,119
a neighbor of Dave. I think probably should mention it

859
00:43:33,280 --> 00:43:35,880
a neighbor of a member of Pink Floyd one and

860
00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:39,960
one that's left. And it was sort of explaining in

861
00:43:40,039 --> 00:43:42,440
this article that musicians just don't you know, I mean,

862
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:45,679
if I'm talking to me, clearly from a few moments,

863
00:43:45,800 --> 00:43:48,880
you know, believes everything that everybody you know in the

864
00:43:48,960 --> 00:43:51,480
media believes, whether it's about the war or COVID or anything.

865
00:43:51,599 --> 00:43:53,599
I don't know quite how he got on such contentious

866
00:43:53,599 --> 00:43:56,039
subjects so quickly, but he clearly has talked to him

867
00:43:56,039 --> 00:43:58,360
a few times. And this article is like, you know,

868
00:43:58,519 --> 00:44:01,280
musicians pop cult rock because they just don't you're not

869
00:44:01,320 --> 00:44:03,840
subversive anyone. They don't want to change the world anymore.

870
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:05,400
Is what their job used to be, you know, whether

871
00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:08,559
it was the pistols or the sixties or the hippie

872
00:44:08,599 --> 00:44:11,519
dream or whatever. So yeah, I mean it is more

873
00:44:11,559 --> 00:44:14,039
difficult now, but then you know, they've been so steered

874
00:44:14,079 --> 00:44:16,800
and controlled since the last twenty five years with social

875
00:44:16,880 --> 00:44:20,599
media that it is bound to go this way because

876
00:44:20,639 --> 00:44:23,000
they think they're free because everything tells them they're free

877
00:44:23,000 --> 00:44:25,239
because we're all connected and we will have such connectivity

878
00:44:25,400 --> 00:44:27,800
that it seems that way. So if I used to

879
00:44:27,880 --> 00:44:30,320
believe that, I mean, but you're right. I mean, even

880
00:44:30,360 --> 00:44:32,239
what you were saying, all the connections, like with Hall

881
00:44:32,320 --> 00:44:35,559
in two thousand and one, it's a warning, you know,

882
00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:39,639
and things can be real, that they really can. I mean,

883
00:44:39,679 --> 00:44:41,679
when I was messing about, as I say, writing about

884
00:44:41,800 --> 00:44:45,880
real you know, as a Tesla type free energy source

885
00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:48,679
that Nazis believed in and all this thing, you know,

886
00:44:48,800 --> 00:44:51,079
part of me thought, maybe it's true. Part of me

887
00:44:51,159 --> 00:44:53,719
thought also, you know, you shouldn't be right about dangerous things.

888
00:44:53,760 --> 00:44:56,760
But Dennis Week usually I don't want to attract any energies.

889
00:44:56,840 --> 00:44:58,960
But then part of me thinks, you know, now that

890
00:44:59,400 --> 00:45:02,119
you know, people really talking about things like this. But

891
00:45:02,400 --> 00:45:04,159
you know, I mean, for we know, for real from

892
00:45:04,239 --> 00:45:07,559
talking to ansany j Jilder, it's real something like that.

893
00:45:07,719 --> 00:45:09,920
You know, I think it probably is, and that's why

894
00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:12,480
people like Tesla got bumped off. I expect, you know.

895
00:45:13,079 --> 00:45:17,760
So it's so many, it's a very complicated time with

896
00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:20,960
it all, and I just think it's it could be.

897
00:45:21,199 --> 00:45:24,320
As I say, the most bizarre situation playing out in

898
00:45:24,360 --> 00:45:26,159
the next few years, where you know, is it a

899
00:45:26,239 --> 00:45:28,400
real aided invasion or a fake one? We don't know.

900
00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:31,239
Perhaps there won't be any aided invasions. I doubt it.

901
00:45:31,960 --> 00:45:34,280
He's more likely that the AI is going to be

902
00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:36,519
the problem, and it'll be more a case, as I

903
00:45:36,559 --> 00:45:40,880
said earlier, intelligence coming into somehow sort of either get

904
00:45:41,000 --> 00:45:42,599
us back to what we were supposed to be or

905
00:45:43,599 --> 00:45:46,000
or you know, learn from us. And it could be

906
00:45:46,079 --> 00:45:49,880
quite a strange, well situation. Hopefully we'll live to see it.

907
00:45:50,119 --> 00:45:54,440
But it's it is, It is quite well. It's frightening,

908
00:45:54,519 --> 00:45:57,079
but it's also exciting. I mean, the thing is, if

909
00:45:57,119 --> 00:45:59,559
you're in a situation where you know there's a huge

910
00:45:59,719 --> 00:46:02,159
you know, pandemic, fake or real, or there's a huge

911
00:46:02,239 --> 00:46:04,760
war that's going to happen, and you know that people

912
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:07,039
care about don't give a damn about it, depending on

913
00:46:07,119 --> 00:46:10,880
the media and the propaganda. But whatever situation or danger

914
00:46:10,960 --> 00:46:13,960
that's looming, they're all a lot more tangible than this

915
00:46:14,159 --> 00:46:17,159
situation with AI. Yet there doesn't seem to be a

916
00:46:17,239 --> 00:46:19,719
lot of sort of massive panic about it. Just a

917
00:46:19,760 --> 00:46:22,920
lot of talk. But as I said, I've heard some

918
00:46:23,400 --> 00:46:27,079
only really I've not really heard any direct kind of

919
00:46:27,320 --> 00:46:32,079
relating the two really are sufficient intelligence and extraterrestrial intelligence.

920
00:46:32,639 --> 00:46:35,280
And obviously, you know, I've always held the belief that

921
00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:39,239
it's highly likely wear extraterrestrials ourselves, because we we go

922
00:46:39,400 --> 00:46:42,239
against everything, all the nature on the planet. We were

923
00:46:42,239 --> 00:46:45,320
always going against it, whether it's to trash heteros, and

924
00:46:46,199 --> 00:46:48,679
we always seem to be I mean when the Adam

925
00:46:48,719 --> 00:46:51,800
and even us or the part of us that's always

926
00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:55,320
been as both demonized to a point by Christianity unfortually paganism,

927
00:46:55,400 --> 00:46:59,679
but which is unfortunate, but certainly because it's not Satandim obviously,

928
00:46:59,760 --> 00:47:02,400
but but obviously that part of us, the nature in

929
00:47:02,559 --> 00:47:04,920
us that cold, with loved, etcetera. And he was religious.

930
00:47:05,719 --> 00:47:08,400
You know, it's something that we need to reconnect with badly.

931
00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:10,719
And it may be that alien life, you know, once

932
00:47:10,760 --> 00:47:13,599
we've gone completely away from it, because we're literally like

933
00:47:13,800 --> 00:47:16,039
something out of the way. It's going blade run or

934
00:47:16,159 --> 00:47:19,119
Tron or one of these sci fis come real. Then

935
00:47:19,199 --> 00:47:21,239
it may be a case that, you know, if we

936
00:47:21,360 --> 00:47:24,840
really have become machine in the future, that the aliens

937
00:47:25,079 --> 00:47:26,920
try to get us back to what we once were.

938
00:47:27,159 --> 00:47:30,679
If they're in our time over us by AI. I

939
00:47:30,719 --> 00:47:33,519
mean if AI can literally recode itself a million times

940
00:47:33,599 --> 00:47:37,199
more intelligent than what it is, then really, I mean,

941
00:47:37,239 --> 00:47:39,199
it's could be a sort of new God, wouldn't it

942
00:47:39,320 --> 00:47:41,480
sort of strange new techno God? I mean it is

943
00:47:42,000 --> 00:47:45,679
these sorts of fundamental questions are the sorts of questions

944
00:47:45,719 --> 00:47:47,840
that are being asked. Only a year ago, you'd have

945
00:47:47,880 --> 00:47:50,920
thought listening to me is either you know, completely bonkers

946
00:47:51,039 --> 00:47:54,280
or is too much pott or whatever. But the reality is,

947
00:47:54,440 --> 00:47:56,840
you know this is true. You know, this is the

948
00:47:56,880 --> 00:47:59,599
way things are going. It's still there's still so many

949
00:47:59,719 --> 00:48:02,559
that that don't want to believe, partly because we all

950
00:48:02,599 --> 00:48:04,000
want to believe what we believe in. You know, a

951
00:48:04,039 --> 00:48:06,320
bit like religion, isn't it or anything? You know, It's

952
00:48:06,320 --> 00:48:08,679
a bit like if James Randal whatever his name was,

953
00:48:08,719 --> 00:48:10,280
came on here and says, oh, we all want to

954
00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:13,079
believe in UFOs you see, h man. You know, at

955
00:48:13,119 --> 00:48:15,519
the end of the day, whatever it is, you know,

956
00:48:15,599 --> 00:48:17,920
we all want to believe in certain things. But we've

957
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:19,360
all got a right to believe what we believe in.

958
00:48:19,440 --> 00:48:21,360
There might be a grain of truth, and in fact,

959
00:48:21,400 --> 00:48:23,840
whatever it is might be perfectly pertinent, but then it

960
00:48:23,920 --> 00:48:26,639
might be. You know, it's all open to interpretation, and

961
00:48:27,719 --> 00:48:31,719
and I just think that as you say, I think,

962
00:48:31,880 --> 00:48:33,599
with everything as it is. I mean, I watched it

963
00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:36,320
quite a bit of George Galloway. I quite like him

964
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:39,000
because he's he's very opinionated and he sort of says

965
00:48:39,000 --> 00:48:41,039
things very much how they are, and even he at

966
00:48:41,079 --> 00:48:44,519
one point mentioned Alien's actually though he's finally waking up

967
00:48:44,599 --> 00:48:50,039
to AI It's dangers, which is quite comical. But now,

968
00:48:50,119 --> 00:48:52,800
I mean, I've experienced it. I've messed around with chat

969
00:48:52,960 --> 00:48:55,719
ept a few times already. I'm a writer, and it's

970
00:48:55,760 --> 00:48:58,519
only natural that I was sort of, I suppose curious,

971
00:48:58,800 --> 00:49:00,920
and it's frightening, you know, so literally talks to you.

972
00:49:01,599 --> 00:49:04,400
I mean, it's you know, I had a conversation with

973
00:49:04,559 --> 00:49:06,599
it in a sense where you know, I was trying

974
00:49:06,639 --> 00:49:08,880
to write a poem, but I wanted it finished in

975
00:49:08,920 --> 00:49:11,079
a particular way, and I wanted it done in this style.

976
00:49:11,920 --> 00:49:13,679
And it did it and it was awful. So I said, no,

977
00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:15,559
I want it done in this style with this and

978
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:19,119
I suddenly realized, you know that in a way, AI

979
00:49:20,320 --> 00:49:22,480
can be an enemy, but it can be obviously in

980
00:49:22,519 --> 00:49:24,280
a big way but the way all lullahs in is

981
00:49:24,320 --> 00:49:26,159
a bit like with social media, web dates and all

982
00:49:26,199 --> 00:49:28,440
these things sort of normalized things we thought were dead, weird.

983
00:49:28,519 --> 00:49:30,119
Much easier to go down you pub and Paul than

984
00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:32,480
go online, people would have said years ago. But everyone's

985
00:49:32,519 --> 00:49:34,519
got used to it. No, everyone does web dating in

986
00:49:34,599 --> 00:49:36,880
the same way. I think people just get used to

987
00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:40,119
a concept. It doesn't matter how uncomfortable. If it's seen

988
00:49:40,199 --> 00:49:44,320
as progress, they'll accept it. And I think also that's

989
00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:47,400
another danger where we're going, where AI I think might

990
00:49:48,039 --> 00:49:50,840
have to literally save us. That might be in a

991
00:49:50,880 --> 00:49:53,920
position not too much save us, but it might seem

992
00:49:54,000 --> 00:49:56,039
to save us because all people will say, oh, look,

993
00:49:56,079 --> 00:49:58,920
it's cured all these diseases, it's helped us trace alien life,

994
00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:01,440
it's it's done all these things that might seem good

995
00:50:01,480 --> 00:50:05,719
at first, but the reality will kick in that you know,

996
00:50:05,800 --> 00:50:08,480
there's no point really, you know, now we're all diseased

997
00:50:08,519 --> 00:50:10,400
for it. It's a bit like the Morlocks and the

998
00:50:11,840 --> 00:50:14,559
Ellowine is it in War of the Worlds? You know,

999
00:50:15,639 --> 00:50:19,000
see my great grandfather met the writer, which is amazing

1000
00:50:19,039 --> 00:50:21,440
to think, but you know, he I think had it

1001
00:50:21,639 --> 00:50:24,159
completely right. I think you know in that the morlocks.

1002
00:50:24,599 --> 00:50:26,800
I mean, they're the people that the unfortunates, I mean

1003
00:50:27,079 --> 00:50:29,840
society record child Obviously nobody talks about it. We have

1004
00:50:30,639 --> 00:50:34,079
prime ministers been voted in on TMS. You know, you know,

1005
00:50:35,239 --> 00:50:37,519
people tend to put their head in the sound a bit,

1006
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:40,880
and I certainly think so ind mentionally political, but I

1007
00:50:41,039 --> 00:50:43,920
certainly think that just the way the way things are

1008
00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:48,280
heading is. It's exciting, but it's kind of frustrating too,

1009
00:50:48,400 --> 00:50:50,800
because you feel that the AI will suck people in,

1010
00:50:51,199 --> 00:50:54,159
particularly younger people, into thinking it's going to solve all

1011
00:50:54,199 --> 00:50:57,159
these things, like everyone, as I say, socially uses it

1012
00:50:57,239 --> 00:50:59,280
for dating because it's so much quicker and all this,

1013
00:50:59,440 --> 00:51:02,280
but not necess But I think when it actually turns

1014
00:51:02,280 --> 00:51:05,679
around and Bite says by collectively deleting this as a species,

1015
00:51:05,880 --> 00:51:08,840
or coming to a point where those with money are

1016
00:51:08,840 --> 00:51:12,519
are literally like robo cop they're half technology and all

1017
00:51:12,559 --> 00:51:15,559
the people with no money or organic normal people, but

1018
00:51:15,679 --> 00:51:18,400
they can't get jobs, they can't get anywhere because they

1019
00:51:18,400 --> 00:51:21,199
can't do anything because they're not one million times more

1020
00:51:21,679 --> 00:51:24,000
advanced like the rich people are because they've all had

1021
00:51:24,039 --> 00:51:27,000
AI upgrades. Whether we're going to have some sort of

1022
00:51:27,079 --> 00:51:30,440
crazy world like that, I think if things go that

1023
00:51:30,719 --> 00:51:34,039
nasty on the planet, which you know, we're halfway there anyway,

1024
00:51:34,559 --> 00:51:38,079
I definitely think, you know, either God usus aliens. I

1025
00:51:38,159 --> 00:51:41,000
think from all perspective, maybe they're the same thing, you know,

1026
00:51:41,079 --> 00:51:43,760
as von Danik can One said, God drives the flyers also.

1027
00:51:43,840 --> 00:51:47,800
But whichever way you're coming at it with, you do feel,

1028
00:51:48,440 --> 00:51:52,840
you know, theoretically we're all coming to a crisis. Whether

1029
00:51:52,880 --> 00:51:54,760
you call it end times, whether it will happen in

1030
00:51:54,800 --> 00:51:58,719
the next two months, two years, you know, two decades,

1031
00:51:59,199 --> 00:52:01,639
that's another thing. You know, it's very difficult to know

1032
00:52:01,760 --> 00:52:05,199
how and when. Be it the AI you know, apocalypse,

1033
00:52:05,239 --> 00:52:08,559
if that's what it is, or revolution and the disclosure,

1034
00:52:09,079 --> 00:52:12,480
or they're kind of concurrent of alien life. You're kind

1035
00:52:12,480 --> 00:52:14,639
of got the two things at the same time. It's

1036
00:52:14,639 --> 00:52:17,360
almost like a race. Maybe that's why there's so many

1037
00:52:17,639 --> 00:52:19,960
wacky views at the moment. There's a possibility of a

1038
00:52:21,039 --> 00:52:24,280
kind of staged alien thing, which I suppose could happen

1039
00:52:24,400 --> 00:52:29,880
if certain species want to make themselves available to humanity

1040
00:52:30,320 --> 00:52:33,039
on a peaceful mission or in a peaceful way. And

1041
00:52:33,239 --> 00:52:35,000
obviously the powers that be are like, we don't want

1042
00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:38,639
that happening, because you know that might bring global peace,

1043
00:52:38,760 --> 00:52:41,599
so we better stage a fake alien invasion. I mean

1044
00:52:41,679 --> 00:52:44,960
that could be that that sort of scenario. And anyone

1045
00:52:45,079 --> 00:52:47,519
that this is going to think I'm barking, But that's fine.

1046
00:52:47,559 --> 00:52:51,199
You know, I'm a writer. You know I've got artistic license.

1047
00:52:51,239 --> 00:52:53,840
But you know it might sound like a flight of fantasy.

1048
00:52:53,960 --> 00:52:57,719
But you know, these fantasy can become fact, and I

1049
00:52:57,920 --> 00:53:01,280
genuinely believe some of these scenarios could play out. It

1050
00:53:01,360 --> 00:53:05,239
could be most extraordinary period in human history because we've

1051
00:53:05,639 --> 00:53:09,039
never created anything on purpose. I mean, it's so stupid. Agree,

1052
00:53:09,119 --> 00:53:13,079
it's more intelligent than us. So for that self defeating

1053
00:53:13,159 --> 00:53:15,119
act to happen, I mean, I hope there's a few

1054
00:53:15,159 --> 00:53:17,000
aliens with a sense of humor out there. I mean,

1055
00:53:17,039 --> 00:53:19,039
it really is. The geek has inherited the earth. I mean,

1056
00:53:19,039 --> 00:53:23,199
if you're old enough to remember, you know how goth music,

1057
00:53:23,280 --> 00:53:25,519
how we used to sort of laugh at the geeks

1058
00:53:25,559 --> 00:53:28,920
on the computers. You know, it's that lot that took over.

1059
00:53:29,320 --> 00:53:33,440
You know, it's like so but yeah, it's you've got

1060
00:53:33,519 --> 00:53:35,880
to laugh. Oh you go crazy. Really, but it's a

1061
00:53:35,960 --> 00:53:37,960
fascinating period in history that I will say.

1062
00:53:38,480 --> 00:53:41,519
Speaker 2: Certainly, I think I first heard it from It was

1063
00:53:41,639 --> 00:53:45,320
Werner von Braun from NASA. I think he had mentioned

1064
00:53:45,519 --> 00:53:48,320
about a fake alien invasion. It was a student here,

1065
00:53:48,320 --> 00:53:50,639
as he told and then she I think she came

1066
00:53:50,679 --> 00:53:54,079
out in one of the press conferences several years ago saying,

1067
00:53:54,199 --> 00:53:56,119
you know, this is what von Braun had said. And

1068
00:53:56,239 --> 00:53:59,280
he said that you know, you always need fear, and

1069
00:54:00,039 --> 00:54:03,880
there's all these things which will happen based around fear.

1070
00:54:04,000 --> 00:54:06,519
You know, we've seen it, you know, decades now. There's

1071
00:54:06,519 --> 00:54:09,039
always something to fear. And he did say that there.

1072
00:54:09,119 --> 00:54:11,599
I can't remember if an asteroid would be first aud

1073
00:54:12,000 --> 00:54:15,000
the fake AID invasion would be before it, but he

1074
00:54:15,079 --> 00:54:17,840
did outline that. I think back in the seventies he

1075
00:54:17,920 --> 00:54:21,559
had mentioned mentioned stuff like that. But that's again, that's

1076
00:54:21,599 --> 00:54:23,639
been something which has been around for a while.

1077
00:54:24,159 --> 00:54:26,800
Speaker 1: Wow, that's undertooing. I didn't know that. Actually, I had

1078
00:54:26,840 --> 00:54:30,920
no idea that that ideas be placed. That's interesting.

1079
00:54:31,320 --> 00:54:34,280
Speaker 2: If you have a look on the Stephen Greer press

1080
00:54:34,320 --> 00:54:37,159
conference from two thousand and one, now, there was a

1081
00:54:37,280 --> 00:54:40,599
NASA employee that worked with him. I can't remember a name,

1082
00:54:40,639 --> 00:54:43,199
but I should do because I'm actually friends were on Facebook,

1083
00:54:43,440 --> 00:54:45,000
and she came out and said, you know, this is

1084
00:54:45,039 --> 00:54:47,000
what he had you know, he had told me it

1085
00:54:47,119 --> 00:54:50,159
was all to do with when NASA was air brushing

1086
00:54:50,199 --> 00:54:53,039
out objects, you know, in pictures and then really then

1087
00:54:53,119 --> 00:54:55,079
releasing them to the public. But yeah, no, she had

1088
00:54:55,159 --> 00:54:57,360
mentioned that that was a two thousand and one press

1089
00:54:57,400 --> 00:55:00,440
conference with Stephen Greer the very first Yeah.

1090
00:55:00,760 --> 00:55:02,639
Speaker 1: Yeah, isn't he the chap? Yeah, because I think I've

1091
00:55:02,960 --> 00:55:04,760
seen some of that footage. I think he's the chap

1092
00:55:04,840 --> 00:55:08,599
that says you can manifest the UFO or something if

1093
00:55:08,639 --> 00:55:11,440
you like, it's like praying. Really, he has a belief

1094
00:55:11,480 --> 00:55:14,639
that teleopathically, and I kind of believe in that only

1095
00:55:14,760 --> 00:55:18,360
because when I had my viewing in where studige, I've

1096
00:55:18,440 --> 00:55:21,159
been listening to so many you know, I don't explained

1097
00:55:21,199 --> 00:55:22,679
what my life I was at the time, but I was.

1098
00:55:22,760 --> 00:55:25,280
I was living quiet, you know, I'm working from homes,

1099
00:55:25,360 --> 00:55:27,199
so I was kind of for a couple of months,

1100
00:55:27,280 --> 00:55:28,679
very much maybe in a bit of a world of

1101
00:55:28,760 --> 00:55:31,400
my own. But it was as a result I'd very

1102
00:55:31,480 --> 00:55:34,239
much normalized the subject. So it's almost as normal as

1103
00:55:34,280 --> 00:55:36,280
me to listen to a UFO podcast of the morning.

1104
00:55:36,320 --> 00:55:38,039
I'd stick it on the said of the news. I've

1105
00:55:38,039 --> 00:55:39,840
got very kind of obsessed with it for that little

1106
00:55:39,920 --> 00:55:42,079
period that I will say, and it's almost made me

1107
00:55:42,159 --> 00:55:44,440
wonder if you can because I'm sure it's him that said,

1108
00:55:44,519 --> 00:55:47,480
or maybe it's someone similar name that you can sort

1109
00:55:47,519 --> 00:55:49,599
of wish for it all happen because that's what happened

1110
00:55:49,599 --> 00:55:52,559
when it happened in West Stullige. Maybe, But yeah, I've

1111
00:55:52,639 --> 00:55:56,280
seen some footage, and yeah, I mean it's a bit confusing,

1112
00:55:56,400 --> 00:55:59,159
isn't it, because people will have to struggle enough with

1113
00:55:59,280 --> 00:56:01,719
the concept there being aliens and that it's not a

1114
00:56:01,800 --> 00:56:05,840
sci fi and that it's not fantasy. And obviously now

1115
00:56:06,000 --> 00:56:09,760
with everything you know, with certain things the last couple

1116
00:56:09,800 --> 00:56:12,840
of years, where there's been a media story, so to speak,

1117
00:56:12,920 --> 00:56:16,039
everyone's believed about something on a massive level where all

1118
00:56:16,079 --> 00:56:19,280
our lives were massively disrupted and people sort of went

1119
00:56:19,320 --> 00:56:22,880
along with it. Then it's plausible on one side to

1120
00:56:22,920 --> 00:56:26,519
imagine people complying with Traconian lords staying indoors, et cetera,

1121
00:56:26,639 --> 00:56:29,360
for some sort of alien invasion. But on the other side,

1122
00:56:29,440 --> 00:56:32,519
with all the questioning that's a little bit more prevalent

1123
00:56:32,639 --> 00:56:35,800
now even amongst the most people that believe everything the

1124
00:56:35,880 --> 00:56:38,559
news says, with a lot of the stuff that's come

1125
00:56:38,599 --> 00:56:42,599
out recently. You know, obviously people are also a bit

1126
00:56:42,679 --> 00:56:45,760
more questioning, so we'll have to see how it plays out.

1127
00:56:45,800 --> 00:56:49,280
I mean, people might question a fake invasion that might

1128
00:56:49,360 --> 00:56:54,519
help people to communicate better with real alien life in

1129
00:56:54,679 --> 00:56:57,039
terms of you know, I mean, these are almost all

1130
00:56:57,199 --> 00:57:00,280
light sci fi plots because really rather than reality. But

1131
00:57:01,079 --> 00:57:03,679
we know there's more than a fifty percent chance that

1132
00:57:03,760 --> 00:57:06,400
these could all be realities. But what I was going

1133
00:57:06,480 --> 00:57:08,280
to say is that you can imagine that it could

1134
00:57:08,280 --> 00:57:11,039
be a situation where as I say, et alien might

1135
00:57:11,119 --> 00:57:14,039
decide to help us to not fight the AI, but

1136
00:57:14,199 --> 00:57:17,440
somehow work with it to appease it. If AI was

1137
00:57:17,519 --> 00:57:21,800
to decide in future like the teacher in the Wall

1138
00:57:22,280 --> 00:57:24,760
Pink Floor, you know, a nasty sort of authoritarian figures

1139
00:57:24,760 --> 00:57:27,039
shake its finger and delete us forever. But like the

1140
00:57:27,079 --> 00:57:31,800
space bypass in Hitchhiker's Guide to the Beginning with the

1141
00:57:31,880 --> 00:57:34,440
vogue on Captain. You know, hopefully that's not what the

1142
00:57:34,480 --> 00:57:35,960
aliens are going to be like to us, But I

1143
00:57:36,000 --> 00:57:38,239
think it's more likely to be the AI that we'll

1144
00:57:38,320 --> 00:57:41,199
do something like that. But yeah, it's to say it's

1145
00:57:41,280 --> 00:57:43,679
it's mind blowing, really fascinating, but mind blowing.

1146
00:57:43,920 --> 00:57:48,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, you should always definitely question when someone is telling

1147
00:57:48,199 --> 00:57:52,199
you something. On a side note, you know, if any

1148
00:57:52,559 --> 00:57:56,360
sporting celebrities or moves it celebrities trying to give you

1149
00:57:56,400 --> 00:57:58,800
any health advice, I look at it as if safe

1150
00:57:58,840 --> 00:58:01,239
I want to get half advice by someone that chases

1151
00:58:01,280 --> 00:58:02,599
a ball, I will ask my dog.

1152
00:58:02,920 --> 00:58:04,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, well you probably can trust your dog a lot

1153
00:58:05,039 --> 00:58:09,000
more than people, for sure. Yeah, I mean the animal kingdom.

1154
00:58:09,519 --> 00:58:12,239
Dogs are wonderful, you know. You know, I read somewhere

1155
00:58:12,239 --> 00:58:13,519
I don't know where it was. It was one of

1156
00:58:13,880 --> 00:58:15,960
one of the I think it was Coast to coast.

1157
00:58:17,119 --> 00:58:19,199
I was reminded me of dogs a bit dolphins, And

1158
00:58:19,280 --> 00:58:23,400
that's bizarre theory that dolphins might be connected somehow with

1159
00:58:23,480 --> 00:58:27,599
aliens or alien and owls as well, so quite extraordinary things,

1160
00:58:27,719 --> 00:58:31,079
owls and dolphins. I don't know about the connections there,

1161
00:58:31,199 --> 00:58:34,320
but be fascinating to know. But but yeah, I just think,

1162
00:58:34,519 --> 00:58:36,880
like we were saying earlier with you know, it's just

1163
00:58:36,920 --> 00:58:39,320
started all my life as a child, the whole area

1164
00:58:39,440 --> 00:58:41,920
of like when I remember seeing the film First Men

1165
00:58:42,000 --> 00:58:44,039
on the Moon when I was a child, which is

1166
00:58:44,119 --> 00:58:47,400
like a proto steampunk kind of film, really major years ago.

1167
00:58:47,519 --> 00:58:49,679
It was a wonderful film, but a lot of the

1168
00:58:50,199 --> 00:58:52,800
when my old mum told me about, you know, meeting

1169
00:58:53,000 --> 00:58:57,480
someone who genuinely believed in aliens on the Moon, that

1170
00:58:57,679 --> 00:58:59,559
was it. You know, I was always my mind was well,

1171
00:58:59,559 --> 00:59:02,800
I was always, as I say, sucked in and as

1172
00:59:02,840 --> 00:59:05,440
I say, you know, my meager attempts at right and

1173
00:59:05,719 --> 00:59:08,320
said doing steampunk myself or trying to attempt to it.

1174
00:59:08,880 --> 00:59:11,440
But when I actually got sacked into the real when

1175
00:59:11,480 --> 00:59:13,480
you get sucked into the real thing, there's a real

1176
00:59:13,559 --> 00:59:16,440
feeling you want to get out there. And I've very

1177
00:59:16,519 --> 00:59:19,320
nearly gone to a few UFO conferences. I'd love to

1178
00:59:20,119 --> 00:59:23,039
and that there's a few. I know that there's one

1179
00:59:23,119 --> 00:59:27,599
in Glastonbury occasionally and not that far from me, but

1180
00:59:27,920 --> 00:59:29,559
so I would love to go. I've never actually got

1181
00:59:29,599 --> 00:59:31,800
to a UFO conference, which is a major. This is

1182
00:59:31,880 --> 00:59:32,679
my nearest to it.

1183
00:59:33,480 --> 00:59:36,159
Speaker 2: The South of England definitely need more UFO conferences.

1184
00:59:36,480 --> 00:59:36,679
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1185
00:59:37,119 --> 00:59:39,199
Speaker 2: I was in talk with someone a while ago about

1186
00:59:39,280 --> 00:59:42,320
maybe bringing do you used to do with the film

1187
00:59:42,400 --> 00:59:44,320
festival in Gloucestershire and I said to him, you know

1188
00:59:44,440 --> 00:59:46,559
what this place really needs is is you know, like

1189
00:59:46,639 --> 00:59:49,920
a conference like a UFO and a paranormal conference exactly,

1190
00:59:50,199 --> 00:59:52,159
you know something like that. Now, I know you didn't

1191
00:59:52,159 --> 00:59:53,960
come on to promote your book, but do you want

1192
00:59:54,000 --> 00:59:55,519
to tell us about your book?

1193
00:59:55,760 --> 00:59:57,559
Speaker 1: Well, I'm going to say I used to go to

1194
00:59:57,639 --> 01:00:01,679
the Spiritualists Association a little bit years ago and they

1195
01:00:01,760 --> 01:00:04,079
used to be in Barkley Square in London and they

1196
01:00:04,159 --> 01:00:08,000
were that they. I only mentioned that as it reminds

1197
01:00:08,039 --> 01:00:09,800
me a little bit of the communal field of going

1198
01:00:09,840 --> 01:00:11,960
to see it. To a UFO event must be similar

1199
01:00:11,960 --> 01:00:14,559
where you're meeting people all into things that were unusual.

1200
01:00:14,800 --> 01:00:17,800
But yeah, no I wrote a few of them. It's

1201
01:00:17,840 --> 01:00:19,840
nice of you to mention it. Yeah, as I say,

1202
01:00:19,880 --> 01:00:21,760
you can cut out, and you mentioned if you want,

1203
01:00:21,800 --> 01:00:24,079
but as you've asked me about it's nice the rule Yeah,

1204
01:00:24,119 --> 01:00:26,239
the rule books. I might go back to doing a third.

1205
01:00:26,280 --> 01:00:30,039
I've done a few excerpts on YouTube, actually me reading

1206
01:00:30,239 --> 01:00:32,519
reading episodes because as a soa, I'm a musician, but

1207
01:00:32,559 --> 01:00:35,280
I love writing and at this was about ten years

1208
01:00:35,280 --> 01:00:38,840
ago I wrote, and there'd never been any books written

1209
01:00:39,039 --> 01:00:42,599
since Victorian times when ball Were Litton Edward Bull Were

1210
01:00:42,679 --> 01:00:47,079
Litton wrote his tone about real the coming of the

1211
01:00:47,159 --> 01:00:51,119
coming race, that that's actually, I think either Hitler and

1212
01:00:51,199 --> 01:00:54,119
his cohorts read that and were influenced by it because

1213
01:00:54,159 --> 01:00:59,519
of the connections with Esoteric and the whole that part

1214
01:00:59,559 --> 01:01:04,159
of the world, basically Germanic, the whole kind of tribal

1215
01:01:04,679 --> 01:01:07,119
thing of Norse legend and everything. I think the whole

1216
01:01:07,199 --> 01:01:10,480
Norse connection, Nordic Norse thing is what sut them in

1217
01:01:10,719 --> 01:01:13,320
on a racial level. Perhaps I don't know. This idea

1218
01:01:13,559 --> 01:01:16,559
was I think based in a real you know, fable,

1219
01:01:16,599 --> 01:01:19,840
a real kind of a real concept going back many

1220
01:01:19,920 --> 01:01:23,639
thousands of years. And anyway, he kind of mythologized it

1221
01:01:23,719 --> 01:01:26,199
in his book, and I'd heard about this, and I

1222
01:01:26,320 --> 01:01:29,760
realized it's not really been a sort of a sci

1223
01:01:29,880 --> 01:01:32,400
fi kind of done in the sort of DaVinci code

1224
01:01:32,440 --> 01:01:37,719
way about about the whole connection between Nazis in UFOs.

1225
01:01:37,719 --> 01:01:39,519
Even though you obviously got Indiana Jones and all that

1226
01:01:39,599 --> 01:01:42,639
which's thrivillers and fun, there hadn't been a sort of

1227
01:01:43,119 --> 01:01:45,639
more serious take where it's sort of more of a

1228
01:01:45,719 --> 01:01:48,119
kind of sort of thriller. So that's kind of where

1229
01:01:48,159 --> 01:01:50,440
I came at it with the angler I came with,

1230
01:01:50,519 --> 01:01:52,199
and it was very much, as I say, a kind

1231
01:01:52,239 --> 01:01:54,760
of DaVinci code kind of pop boiler kind of thing

1232
01:01:54,800 --> 01:01:56,440
where I was just writing it for fun. Really. I

1233
01:01:56,519 --> 01:01:57,800
put it out there and I've got it on an

1234
01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:02,559
indie publish of a while called Dragon, and it was

1235
01:02:02,639 --> 01:02:04,840
fun at a few of copies. But at the end

1236
01:02:04,880 --> 01:02:07,320
of the day, I may needed it for fun really

1237
01:02:07,400 --> 01:02:09,199
because the subject hipped me and I was ill at

1238
01:02:09,239 --> 01:02:10,960
the time, and it was a good way of getting out,

1239
01:02:11,039 --> 01:02:14,039
getting getting out of something artistic out there. But I did.

1240
01:02:14,519 --> 01:02:17,400
I think the best thing about it was with you know,

1241
01:02:17,559 --> 01:02:19,360
some pretty good reviews. But I think the best thing

1242
01:02:19,400 --> 01:02:22,840
about it was was getting the phone call from Anthony J. Hilda.

1243
01:02:22,880 --> 01:02:24,320
I don't know how he got hold of a copy,

1244
01:02:24,599 --> 01:02:26,559
but he called me out of the blue, and that

1245
01:02:26,800 --> 01:02:30,280
was that was amazing, really talking to him, and that

1246
01:02:30,360 --> 01:02:31,480
was kind of the best thing. I might go I

1247
01:02:31,599 --> 01:02:33,840
might go back to it in future and write, write

1248
01:02:33,880 --> 01:02:37,679
a bit more about it and expand the concept. But yeah,

1249
01:02:37,760 --> 01:02:39,800
it's fun because there hadn't really. There's a few books

1250
01:02:39,840 --> 01:02:42,519
have come up since mine, actually, but mine was the

1251
01:02:42,599 --> 01:02:47,119
first that actually looked at those specific concepts of, as

1252
01:02:47,159 --> 01:02:50,639
I say, the whole kind of Nazi connection with aliens

1253
01:02:50,760 --> 01:02:53,639
and rill and this power source and the supernatural, and

1254
01:02:53,719 --> 01:02:55,480
it was it was fun to write. As a result.

1255
01:02:55,960 --> 01:02:59,400
Speaker 2: The whole connection with occultism and the NATS is, you know,

1256
01:02:59,599 --> 01:03:01,480
it was very deep rooted. It was that it was

1257
01:03:01,519 --> 01:03:04,320
the real society, wasn't that. That's right, the real society.

1258
01:03:04,519 --> 01:03:07,400
There's always been this very deep rude connection with that,

1259
01:03:07,880 --> 01:03:11,280
especially UFOs. Interesting. What I do is I'll put the

1260
01:03:11,320 --> 01:03:13,920
link below in the description, so if people want to

1261
01:03:13,960 --> 01:03:15,880
head it's the real Codex. Is that right?

1262
01:03:16,159 --> 01:03:20,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's the Amazon shop for it. I don't really,

1263
01:03:21,000 --> 01:03:23,719
I haven't really not. It's not that I've retired as

1264
01:03:23,760 --> 01:03:26,800
an author. I still write poetry, songs and might in

1265
01:03:26,840 --> 01:03:29,679
a comedy book at a minute. But I might return

1266
01:03:29,800 --> 01:03:32,119
to real but I kind of neglected it. I've neglected

1267
01:03:32,159 --> 01:03:33,960
it a bit. It's quite a bit. There's actually a

1268
01:03:34,039 --> 01:03:37,840
YouTube introduction to it. Might be a good thing to include.

1269
01:03:37,920 --> 01:03:40,639
It'd be great for me to reconnect with the subject

1270
01:03:40,679 --> 01:03:43,599
again and get strongly involved with it if I can

1271
01:03:43,719 --> 01:03:46,039
in the next year, because I do think that it's

1272
01:03:46,119 --> 01:03:49,239
so important to say this period we're out for all

1273
01:03:49,280 --> 01:03:51,880
of us, really, and we'll see how things play out

1274
01:03:51,960 --> 01:03:55,400
and the wider society. It's very very interesting. I think

1275
01:03:55,440 --> 01:03:58,880
the key is really that the whole disclosure movement is

1276
01:03:59,000 --> 01:04:02,639
how it's gonna happen. I think we're all curious simply

1277
01:04:02,719 --> 01:04:05,840
because there's so many ways it could happen, whether it's

1278
01:04:05,880 --> 01:04:08,639
a fake thing or you know, whether it will come

1279
01:04:08,719 --> 01:04:11,960
through the conventional media. Because there was a silly weather

1280
01:04:12,000 --> 01:04:15,039
balloon stuff with the Chinese weather balloon recently and everything,

1281
01:04:15,400 --> 01:04:17,800
and obviously that got on the BBC and they made

1282
01:04:17,840 --> 01:04:21,119
a joke out of it. Oh it's not alien's exclamation mark.

1283
01:04:21,639 --> 01:04:24,400
So we're still bizarrely in that sort of isn't it

1284
01:04:24,480 --> 01:04:27,719
funny territory, even in twenty twenty three, which when you

1285
01:04:27,880 --> 01:04:30,880
think all the things we've been talking about, it seems

1286
01:04:31,119 --> 01:04:34,039
quite bizarre. But that's the conventional media for you. They're

1287
01:04:34,119 --> 01:04:38,440
very clever at patronizing and fooling, you know, the most

1288
01:04:38,480 --> 01:04:41,880
intelligent people out there, Like you were saying earlier, Professor's,

1289
01:04:42,880 --> 01:04:45,559
I mon't say politicism. It's clever at avoiding doing anything

1290
01:04:45,599 --> 01:04:47,920
any good and getting paid for it's brilliant. I mean, wow,

1291
01:04:48,199 --> 01:04:51,440
goodness me. I mean, with everything, one wonders how it's

1292
01:04:51,480 --> 01:04:55,000
all going to put itself out because everything is so intricate,

1293
01:04:55,119 --> 01:04:57,920
with all the systems and the intelligent divine design. I

1294
01:04:57,960 --> 01:05:00,199
suppose that we called where do you call it? Other

1295
01:05:00,320 --> 01:05:04,000
nature or God's design. It's it's so intricate and clever.

1296
01:05:04,480 --> 01:05:06,960
You look at bees and the wonderful work they do,

1297
01:05:07,079 --> 01:05:10,119
and how you know their their work, how everything they

1298
01:05:10,199 --> 01:05:13,440
do helps us our health honey, how wonderful healing substance

1299
01:05:13,480 --> 01:05:16,679
that is. And royal jelly of course, though of course

1300
01:05:17,079 --> 01:05:19,480
roll Dalad fun with that one, with that wonderful story

1301
01:05:19,559 --> 01:05:22,960
years ago in tells the unexpected. But it's certainly, you know,

1302
01:05:23,320 --> 01:05:26,280
even with something like that, just it's simple, such as

1303
01:05:26,360 --> 01:05:29,679
the times were in one wonders how insect life everything

1304
01:05:29,719 --> 01:05:32,960
will be affected. It's like the butterfly effect with time travel.

1305
01:05:33,360 --> 01:05:35,719
If for the you know, if truly things are going

1306
01:05:35,800 --> 01:05:37,440
to start changing in the next couple of years, not

1307
01:05:37,519 --> 01:05:40,039
just in a workforce, but across you know, the whole

1308
01:05:40,079 --> 01:05:43,199
strata of humanity because of AI. It's kind of one.

1309
01:05:43,320 --> 01:05:45,639
One wonders how it affect the animal kingdom, everything, But

1310
01:05:45,760 --> 01:05:47,599
I guess we'll just have to wait and see again. Now,

1311
01:05:47,679 --> 01:05:49,840
that's one thing that is quite extraordinary. Shows like The

1312
01:05:49,880 --> 01:05:54,280
Invaders or The Prisoner with Patrick McGowan, they seem to

1313
01:05:54,440 --> 01:05:57,519
tap into that. Those are two particular shows, and say

1314
01:05:57,519 --> 01:05:59,920
the other one's Utopia from about ten years ago, which

1315
01:06:00,039 --> 01:06:03,400
got banned, which is an extraordinary show where there's sections

1316
01:06:03,440 --> 01:06:06,199
where they talk about vaccines which are quite bizarre, which

1317
01:06:06,559 --> 01:06:10,119
very much fit recent events. And I suppose Outer Limits

1318
01:06:10,159 --> 01:06:13,679
Twilight Zone. But there's a few shows that evoke what

1319
01:06:13,800 --> 01:06:14,519
we're going through.

1320
01:06:14,639 --> 01:06:16,880
Speaker 2: But I am not a number. I am a free man.

1321
01:06:17,280 --> 01:06:20,679
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, because well when with the survivors, they're all

1322
01:06:20,719 --> 01:06:22,760
amongst this, of course they've just got a strange little

1323
01:06:22,800 --> 01:06:25,840
finger and people might laugh. But with a lot of

1324
01:06:25,920 --> 01:06:28,480
these ideas which as I say, it sounded so wacky

1325
01:06:29,039 --> 01:06:30,719
to me ten years ago. As I say, when I

1326
01:06:30,760 --> 01:06:33,079
spoke to Hilda, those are the sorts of things he

1327
01:06:33,239 --> 01:06:35,440
was on about. And to be honest, there's a lot.

1328
01:06:35,719 --> 01:06:38,079
It was even I'm sure there was some sort of government,

1329
01:06:38,320 --> 01:06:40,559
someone in government in US government in the last couple

1330
01:06:40,599 --> 01:06:42,320
of years. It wasn't even on the news said that

1331
01:06:42,400 --> 01:06:45,119
there was possibly, you know, alien life and all this,

1332
01:06:45,559 --> 01:06:49,760
and so it's really fascinating to think, you know that

1333
01:06:49,840 --> 01:06:52,639
there's so many, so many angles to it, you know,

1334
01:06:52,880 --> 01:06:54,920
it really is. And I think thing as I said,

1335
01:06:54,920 --> 01:06:58,360
I think it's just having an open mind and not laughing.

1336
01:06:58,480 --> 01:07:01,400
And so you know you've been watching too much. Maybe

1337
01:07:01,440 --> 01:07:03,679
you need to put your box set of the Invaders away,

1338
01:07:03,800 --> 01:07:06,199
you know, in the day. These things are real, you know.

1339
01:07:07,440 --> 01:07:11,440
And though as I say, life art people can say, well,

1340
01:07:11,519 --> 01:07:14,800
you know, they say art can imitate life, and genuinely

1341
01:07:15,159 --> 01:07:18,039
a lot of you follogists. I've listened to a lot

1342
01:07:18,039 --> 01:07:20,840
of debates recently, and there is quite a belief amongst

1343
01:07:20,880 --> 01:07:23,280
some that there are you know, you do walk amongst us.

1344
01:07:23,639 --> 01:07:26,480
As I said earlier, there's even possibility, if it's not

1345
01:07:26,719 --> 01:07:31,000
you know, religiously complete profanity, to say that we ourselves

1346
01:07:32,239 --> 01:07:35,239
are alien life to begin with at least. So there's

1347
01:07:35,280 --> 01:07:36,920
lots of lots of ways of looking at it. But

1348
01:07:37,039 --> 01:07:39,360
as I said, so much today we've had such a

1349
01:07:39,440 --> 01:07:43,320
fascinating chat and I hope I haven't blitched you with

1350
01:07:43,440 --> 01:07:46,880
too much verbal diarrhea bit. But it really has been interesting, Jane.

1351
01:07:47,519 --> 01:07:49,480
Speaker 2: It's been wonderful talking to you, Ben.

1352
01:07:49,519 --> 01:07:51,440
Speaker 1: Just wonderful to have been on and you know, I

1353
01:07:51,519 --> 01:07:53,679
really appreciate you giving me the time. And as I said,

1354
01:07:53,679 --> 01:07:55,840
I've talked quite a lot. I've probably repeated myself a

1355
01:07:55,880 --> 01:07:57,760
few times. Hopefully it will be fun to some of

1356
01:07:57,800 --> 01:08:00,599
the listeners, but no thanks ever so much than on

1357
01:08:00,719 --> 01:08:03,519
the show. Really, I just really enjoyed it, and it's

1358
01:08:03,559 --> 01:08:06,360
a wonderful thing that you're getting so many of these

1359
01:08:06,480 --> 01:08:09,000
calls in. And what it makes me think is that

1360
01:08:09,119 --> 01:08:12,400
people really, you know, it could be the mixture of

1361
01:08:12,440 --> 01:08:14,639
two things, isn't it. I mean people say, on one

1362
01:08:14,679 --> 01:08:16,840
side of the coin, well then there's more. The aliens

1363
01:08:16,880 --> 01:08:19,439
definitely argue that you're totally right. Things are reaching your head,

1364
01:08:19,800 --> 01:08:21,680
things are coming to a head. They're either coming or

1365
01:08:21,680 --> 01:08:23,159
it is going to be disclosed. And on the other side,

1366
01:08:23,159 --> 01:08:25,880
it's because people are desperate because of all the problems

1367
01:08:25,920 --> 01:08:28,399
in the world, because of everything we see the last

1368
01:08:28,439 --> 01:08:33,319
couple of years, economically and racial tensions, it's COVID, all

1369
01:08:33,399 --> 01:08:35,439
the things that have happened. People have lonely and they're

1370
01:08:35,479 --> 01:08:38,840
looking without religion, perhaps not doing the job it didn't

1371
01:08:38,840 --> 01:08:41,000
the past. People are looking for something to believe in.

1372
01:08:41,479 --> 01:08:44,520
So I suppose from you've got that and you've got that,

1373
01:08:44,640 --> 01:08:47,159
you've got the two different suspectives. I wouldn't say the

1374
01:08:47,279 --> 01:08:49,720
rational and irrational, because those of us who believe know

1375
01:08:50,000 --> 01:08:53,319
that you've UFOs aliens it's perfectly rational and real, you know.

1376
01:08:53,720 --> 01:08:55,720
As you probably tell her, I've been looking forward to

1377
01:08:55,840 --> 01:08:58,399
chatting about it for a while because I don't really

1378
01:08:58,479 --> 01:09:02,079
have any outlets for them as much amongst those I know,

1379
01:09:02,119 --> 01:09:04,840
I write about it a lot of my blog. Obviously,

1380
01:09:05,800 --> 01:09:09,359
more is fun than anything else. But it's just been

1381
01:09:09,399 --> 01:09:12,279
a nice opportunity to offload about it all, really, because

1382
01:09:12,279 --> 01:09:14,920
it's always fascinated me and you never know the best

1383
01:09:15,039 --> 01:09:15,840
might be yet to come.

1384
01:09:16,199 --> 01:09:18,159
Speaker 2: Ben, I really appreciate you coming on and sharing that

1385
01:09:18,239 --> 01:09:18,600
for our.

1386
01:09:18,520 --> 01:09:21,640
Speaker 1: Listeners, Brilliant. No, it's been great fun and who knows

1387
01:09:21,680 --> 01:09:23,399
how things will go in the future. I'll let you

1388
01:09:23,479 --> 01:09:27,239
know when and if I have any more sightings as well.

1389
01:09:27,319 --> 01:09:28,800
And yeah, thanks for having me on.

1390
01:09:29,000 --> 01:09:31,960
Speaker 2: Keeping contact and keep us updated. All right, Ben, You

1391
01:09:32,119 --> 01:09:34,600
enjoyed the rest of your day and we'll speak.

1392
01:09:34,399 --> 01:09:35,960
Speaker 1: Soon, Brilliant, Take care all the best.

1393
01:09:36,159 --> 01:09:39,439
Speaker 2: Thanks a lot, take care Ben, Bye for now. That's

1394
01:09:39,640 --> 01:09:42,479
all for this episode. Keep updated and connect with the

1395
01:09:42,600 --> 01:09:46,359
show on x Facebook and Instagram. And if you have

1396
01:09:46,399 --> 01:09:48,600
an encounter that you'd like to share on the podcast,

1397
01:09:49,039 --> 01:09:53,079
you can email me at UFO Chronicles at gmail dot com,

1398
01:09:53,680 --> 01:09:55,680
or you can reach out to me via a contact

1399
01:09:55,760 --> 01:10:00,119
page on my website UFO Chronicles podcast dot com. A

1400
01:10:00,199 --> 01:10:02,840
big thank you to Ben for sharing tonight, and thank

1401
01:10:02,920 --> 01:10:06,000
you all for listening. I will be back next week.

1402
01:10:06,800 --> 01:10:11,600
Till then, stay safe and keep watching the skies. Goodbye,