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Speaker 1: Good morning, Terry. How are you doing today?

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Speaker 2: Hi, I'm good.

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Speaker 1: How are you fantastic? Looking forward to sharing a conversation

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with you, because I mean, you really do bring out

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that art of creativity, because I mean you did everything

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in the book. I mean, from illustrating it to writing

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the storyline. I love it when people allow their creativity

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to reach other people.

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Speaker 2: Oh, thank you. I appreciate that.

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Speaker 1: This is the ninth book in this series.

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Speaker 2: Oh my god, I know, right.

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Speaker 1: Does it start off as a doodle and then all

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of a sudden you know you've got a story. How

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is it that you're able to be able to pull

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all this together?

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Speaker 2: Oh? Wow? Yeah. Actually, because I'm on pretty tight deadlines,

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usually one book comes out per year, I have to

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have a lot of structures, so I pretty much have

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the story down path before I start illustrating it, although

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I'll indicate where the art's going to go and what

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it's going to be like as I write, just because

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it is so into graded into the story, I was.

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Speaker 1: Going to ask you what came first, the pictures or

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the words? And now now that I know that, it's

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the storyline that comes first. But isn't that a shift

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in personality? To suddenly become the illustrator.

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Speaker 2: I guess in retrospect, yes, but at the same time,

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I've evolved a lot in my creativity. It's as far

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as well, I should say, in my creative path, because

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even though I trained in illustration, I'm so much of

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a cartoonist. I used to write a syndicated comic strip

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for a long time, and so both the writing and

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the art are so ingrained in me, and both are

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so integral to this process. So it's more of like

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a marriage of writing and artwork. They both kind of

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go hand in hand.

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Speaker 1: For me, I could totally tell that you were a

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cartoonists because these characters are something that I would see

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in the Sunday morning paper or I would love to

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see them on like Nicket Night or something in action.

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Speaker 2: Thanks.

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Speaker 1: I'm a big fan of graphic novels only because that's

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how my grandson learned how to read, and to this

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day he picks up a writing instrument and he will

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sit there and draw his own characters. You are changing

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people's lives on this side of the pages. Thank you.

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Speaker 2: I love to hear that. Yeah, I always say, man,

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if graphic novels like these not just mine, but all

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these wonderful kids graphic novels that they existed back when

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I was a kid, I would have never left my room.

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I would have read everything.

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Speaker 1: You're so right. You're right about that, because I mean,

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it's like it's at one place where I can go,

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where where A I can feel secure, and B I

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can get a storyline inside my imagination.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think it's wonderful, especially for reluctant readers

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or maybe readers who are just more visually inclined. It's

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such I mean, they're great books in and of themselves,

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but they're also such great gateways to other types of

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reading too. And that's kind of how I started. Even

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though we didn't we didn't have these typtographic novels. I

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grew up on a diet of comics, so I read.

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I read the funnies, I read comic magazines and books

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things like that, and that opened up my whole world.

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Speaker 1: I would love to see your adult numbers, because with

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a book like this, I mean, my god, I mean

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I would love to see the adults that are picking

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this book up and they're reading it too. Because it's

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like an old song. We go back to those old songs.

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To pick up on memories of our childhood.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I hope so well. I hope like parents

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or grandparents read them with their kids and grandkids, et cetera,

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because I think I think it's fun for everybody, and

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there's so much humor in these books, just that I

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think grown ups can appreciate just as much as kids.

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Speaker 1: You talk about that humor. Joe's jokes aren't always a

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home run. I mean, you're not afraid to say that,

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you know that, you know you not. This is not

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your day today, Joe. But I'm gonna put this joke

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up here anyway.

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Speaker 2: Well, that is Joe. He's definitely more of a prankster.

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His jokes still, you know, they're working progress.

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Speaker 1: Hey. Coming up next, we're going to go even deeper

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with author Terry Libinson. Hey, thanks for coming back to

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my conversation with author Terry Libinson. The name of the

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book entirely Immy. I love the fact that you've mixed

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Joe with Emmy in the way that Emmy is very shy,

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and you know, and I always think of a shy

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person as being a very creative person because they're inside

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always thinking about something. And then you've got Joe, who

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is the class clown, who doesn't who can't keep it inside.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, it's an odd pairing for sure. That's that's

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and that's really the whole you know, heart and soul

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of this book too, that I wanted to thrust these

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two opposites together. Actually Night my editor at the time,

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she was the one who came up with this pairing,

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and I thought, I thought.

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Speaker 3: It was great, but just you know, to see where

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it would go, because yeah, because it's such an unlikely pairing,

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and they're put together almost accidentally, because it takes place

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at during this three day camping trip.

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Speaker 2: It's a class trip and everybody has to be paired

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off together for activities, and Joe and Emmy find themselves

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kind of buy themselves like they were supposed to have

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their other friends, but I want they what happen, and

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they find themselves alone in the end, and so they

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are partnered up by the teachers and they're not very

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happy about it. But surprising things kind of happen, some

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good some dads and just you know, and just some

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fun campgrounding things.

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Speaker 1: But see, what's great here is that is that you're

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showcasing something for a lot of readers that go out

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and find somebody who is the opposite of you and

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build that friendship. You don't have to have somebody who

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agrees with you all the time, you don't have to

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have somebody who's always going to make you feel good.

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Just go out there and find your friend. They're all

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out there.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's some And I wanted to One

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of the one of the reasons I read this story

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was I wanted to see what happened if Yeah, it's

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two different kinds of kids who who didn't become friends

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like more organically. I guess you could say, like so many,

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so many friendships happened through shared interests or or or

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the like, And I wanted to do what happened if

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too kind of opposite spared ups and uh, if there

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would be you know, like an explosion of things. And

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actually what happens is these these two kind of learn

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to like trust each other and to trust themselves, and

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they kind of learned about opening up the lines of

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communication not just among themselves but with their other friends

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as well.

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Speaker 1: I too, am an author. I know how stories come

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to me and how I have to answer that call.

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What when did you know that this was going to

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be the next story. Where were you at the mall?

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Were you at the park? Where were you at.

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Speaker 2: Oh? I gosh, I was probably at my desk. Yeah.

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Well for this story, I'm trying to remember, I'm already

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I'm I've already moved on to the next one. So

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it's kind of hard for me to to think back.

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But I know, I know, I wanted to use Joe.

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This is more character centered because so many kids wrote

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to me and clamored for Joe to be a main character.

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And I could not resist Joe. He was definitely a

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challenge righter. But but I wanted I wanted the books

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to focus partly on him. And I think my editor

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at the time asked if I would want to circle

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back to any and and I you know, and I thought, wow, okay,

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that's going to be pretty combustible, so let's do it.

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So really, I think the story, I think we're kind

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of brainstorming and thought about taking taking the setting outside

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the box and take can get to different sites so

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that this time I didn't have to draw lockers. I

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could draw trees and havens things like that. That was

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pretty refreshing, just you know, just to make it a

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little different and so yeah, so then we're just like

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sort of brainstorming different activities they can do, and then

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the general storyline.

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Speaker 1: How do you keep it so simple because there are

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some graphics in here that it's just one thing on

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the page. I mean, you're giving me as the reader,

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You're giving me the opportunity to breathe, to digest it,

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to sit there and just kind of just take things

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and instead of you know, like like like so many

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different graphic novels as well as comic books are so overcrowded,

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but you choose not to be.

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Speaker 2: Wow. I think you're the first person who's mentioned that.

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I appreciate that. I don't know. I think part of

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it is just instinctual with my training as a cartoonist.

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I know, I you know, I kind of I feel

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like I know my pacing pretty well, although know that

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changes too the story goes through edits and sometimes you know,

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I'll have to throw on an extra panel or condensed

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or something like that. I just kind of rely on

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my instinct to that. But I did want I definitely

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wanted to keep it a little simpler, partly because I'm

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on a deadline and I can't make it so detailed

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because I'm writing and illustrating the whole thing. It goes

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through edits and it's a yearly thing, so so I

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can't like make it overly complicated or I just won't

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get it finished it by But the other part is

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that's kind of the way I like to work anyway.

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And I think it's great for kids too. I think

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it's just you know, it keeps their eye moving and

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keeps the story flowing. So you know, a lot of

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different components there.

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Speaker 1: Is that your way of saying that the perfectionist has

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no room in your workspace.

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Speaker 2: Well, I am a perfection so this is just another

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way of going about it.

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Speaker 1: I think, Well, no, I totally get that, because I

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mean I have daily writing disciplines. I mean if I

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don't follow my disciplines, then I get lost and then

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I start overcrowding everything I'm doing as a writer or

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a thinker. So I mean I totally get where you are.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's so interesting. I'm curious about the way

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you were too that. Yeah, I definitely do that. Get

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myself little goals, give myself guardrails and guidelines. Yeah, I

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think that helps.

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Speaker 1: Well, I do a thing called a defragging. In other words,

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when I when I sit down and I create something,

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I go in there and I start asking the questions

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and questioning the answers. I want to know how it

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came into being, how can I make it better? And

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then and I've got to answer those questions so that

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it makes things even better.

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Speaker 2: Oh that's a great idea. I actually just wrote that down.

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Speaker 1: Well, where can people go to find out more about

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you and your adventures because you're just so exciting.

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Speaker 2: Those things.

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Speaker 3: Well you can.

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Speaker 2: You can find entirely emmy at your local bookstore or

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online retailer. It should be pretty much everywhere, I hope,

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and you can find me online. I've got a website

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Terry Leibnson dot com. Or I'm also on Facebook and

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Instagram and blue Sky that's at my name Terry Levinson,

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so pretty easy to find.

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Speaker 1: I love it. Please come back to the show anytime

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in the future, Terry. The door is always going to

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be open for you.

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Speaker 2: Oh. I really appreciate that. Thank you.

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Speaker 1: Will you be brilliant today?

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Speaker 2: Okay, thanks you as well.

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Speaker 1: And if you see Ammy or Joe later on today,

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let him know I was thinking about him.

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Speaker 2: I will do