1 00:00:05,519 --> 00:00:07,360 Speaker 1: What is up, Fellawsikos. 2 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:09,480 Speaker 2: I am Dana Valley coming at you with the one, 3 00:00:09,759 --> 00:00:13,839 the only, this certified, fantabulous mister Grant, who is back 4 00:00:14,240 --> 00:00:18,120 after powering through an illness of epic proportions. 5 00:00:18,199 --> 00:00:19,920 Speaker 1: We are so happy you are here, Grant. 6 00:00:20,079 --> 00:00:22,359 Speaker 2: We're gonna dive into some NBA Finals talk because hey, 7 00:00:22,399 --> 00:00:23,640 why not the NBA Finals are going on. 8 00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:27,000 Speaker 1: We haven't heard from Grant since they started. He is here. 9 00:00:27,120 --> 00:00:29,760 Speaker 2: I can't wait to ask him about it. First and foremost, though, sir, 10 00:00:29,960 --> 00:00:30,679 how the heck are you? 11 00:00:31,120 --> 00:00:33,479 Speaker 3: It feels weird to be here, Dan one, because it's 12 00:00:33,479 --> 00:00:38,119 past both our bedtimes, seven pm being mine. We're changing 13 00:00:38,200 --> 00:00:39,560 up the schedule because we just. 14 00:00:39,520 --> 00:00:39,960 Speaker 4: Had to talk. 15 00:00:40,200 --> 00:00:43,520 Speaker 3: I have no idea what you think about the finals. 16 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:45,880 We haven't talked about it at all. I don't know 17 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:48,600 if we even like did much of a run up 18 00:00:48,600 --> 00:00:50,840 to them. So this this is gonna be I'm excited 19 00:00:51,280 --> 00:00:52,520 h to get into this with. 20 00:00:52,439 --> 00:00:55,960 Speaker 2: You, my before we hop in with some of your thoughts. 21 00:00:56,000 --> 00:00:58,640 I think my biggest takeaway from the finals so far 22 00:00:58,679 --> 00:01:00,240 is that the Pacers are up two to one. 23 00:01:00,399 --> 00:01:03,759 Speaker 4: That's probably I mean, let's get will debate. I don't 24 00:01:03,799 --> 00:01:05,799 know if that's actually true. We'll see. 25 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:08,879 Speaker 2: One of the things you had mentioned to me before 26 00:01:08,879 --> 00:01:11,560 we hopped on was kind of the adaptability or the 27 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:14,280 physicality or the tactics of the Indiana Pacers, and so like, 28 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:16,359 what are you kind of like, how did they end 29 00:01:16,439 --> 00:01:16,760 up here? 30 00:01:17,799 --> 00:01:18,000 Speaker 4: Well? 31 00:01:18,079 --> 00:01:21,640 Speaker 3: So okay, yeah, right, So that's like kind of one 32 00:01:21,680 --> 00:01:25,519 of my most recurring thoughts, certainly in games one and three, 33 00:01:26,079 --> 00:01:29,439 where like I I don't know, I wouldn't say that 34 00:01:29,439 --> 00:01:33,719 I'm rooting for either team, but but I I'm confess 35 00:01:33,879 --> 00:01:36,719 I find the Pacers kind of more confounding, and because 36 00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:40,319 I have a harder time understanding like how this is happening, 37 00:01:40,760 --> 00:01:43,239 I almost feel like I don't I'm not rooting against 38 00:01:43,280 --> 00:01:44,840 the Pacers. It's just like this is too weird. I 39 00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:47,599 don't understand it. Obviously we'll get into what's actually happening. 40 00:01:47,879 --> 00:01:50,439 But have you had that where it's sort of like disbelief, 41 00:01:50,599 --> 00:01:53,799 like after Game one, for example, like oh my god, 42 00:01:53,840 --> 00:01:57,480 they did it again, this incredible comeback. Did you find 43 00:01:57,519 --> 00:02:00,239 yourself like I did after the fact, thinking like, yeah, 44 00:02:00,239 --> 00:02:02,200 they got that one. That's just kind of what they do. 45 00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:04,719 But like, I'm not adjusting my priors. I would just 46 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:07,719 bet the house on okay See winning Game two by thirty, 47 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:09,879 and this is just gonna be a five game series. 48 00:02:10,439 --> 00:02:12,400 Speaker 4: That is that where you sort of were. 49 00:02:13,199 --> 00:02:14,159 Speaker 1: I was basically there. 50 00:02:14,199 --> 00:02:16,560 Speaker 2: I thought Game two was actually going to be closer 51 00:02:16,639 --> 00:02:19,479 because I thought there was low hanging fruit the Pacers 52 00:02:19,479 --> 00:02:21,360 could just clean up to keep the game closer to 53 00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:23,199 begin with. But that okay See was gonna win, and 54 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:25,360 I framed it. I went on a couple shows and said, 55 00:02:25,800 --> 00:02:27,439 I think the Thunder could go down two to oh 56 00:02:27,599 --> 00:02:30,199 lose Game two, just completely forfeit home court advantage and 57 00:02:30,240 --> 00:02:32,240 they would still be favored to win this YERI. 58 00:02:32,159 --> 00:02:35,719 Speaker 3: Because okay, well, so game three was different though Game 59 00:02:35,759 --> 00:02:37,759 two was kind of like all right, order restored a 60 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:41,199 little bit, just the Thunder just kind of did more 61 00:02:41,199 --> 00:02:45,319 Thunder things and just were physically overwhelming all the usual stuff. 62 00:02:45,560 --> 00:02:47,919 Game three, it's just kind of like, Okay, now, I 63 00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:50,520 really can't believe this is happening, because and this is 64 00:02:50,599 --> 00:02:52,639 kind of what I wanted to sort of the core 65 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:54,919 of what I've been thinking most about and trying to 66 00:02:54,960 --> 00:02:57,199 compare these two teams and trying to and it also 67 00:02:57,319 --> 00:03:00,719 does specifically tie to the Haliburton versus. It's not like 68 00:03:00,719 --> 00:03:02,719 they're guarding each other all the time or almost ever, 69 00:03:02,800 --> 00:03:05,360 but it's like they're the two sort of centerpieces of 70 00:03:05,360 --> 00:03:09,039 those of these two teams, and they're so different. And 71 00:03:09,759 --> 00:03:13,280 so what I think I'm kind of landing on is 72 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:17,960 Indiana to me because of the style they play, which 73 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:21,159 I really do think is just an outgrowth of having 74 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:23,599 Halliburton in the middle of it. Because of how he 75 00:03:23,719 --> 00:03:26,400 operates and thinks and sees the game and. 76 00:03:26,319 --> 00:03:27,639 Speaker 4: The things he wants to do. 77 00:03:29,000 --> 00:03:33,039 Speaker 3: They have tactical advantages and I think that partly explains 78 00:03:33,439 --> 00:03:37,280 the comebacks. I don't know if anything explains the comebacks, 79 00:03:37,280 --> 00:03:38,919 but I'm like trying to draw connection here. 80 00:03:39,639 --> 00:03:42,159 Speaker 4: But what seems to happen with them, and specifically with. 81 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:47,360 Speaker 3: Haliburton, is they look for the right play all the time, 82 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:51,439 and that really Halliburton's like, that's his like core programming 83 00:03:51,599 --> 00:03:54,439 is like what's the right play right now? And sometimes 84 00:03:54,439 --> 00:03:56,280 and he gets criticized for this, the right play for 85 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:58,680 him is like go hide off the ball and don't 86 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:00,879 be involved, because that's just better for the way the 87 00:04:00,919 --> 00:04:03,159 defense is scheming and we're going to get a better 88 00:04:03,159 --> 00:04:05,560 shot out of it now. He was more aggressive in 89 00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:07,680 Game three took some of what you might call like 90 00:04:07,800 --> 00:04:10,039 not great shots, which he doesn't tend to like to do. 91 00:04:10,680 --> 00:04:13,719 But I think when you compare and the pacers are 92 00:04:13,719 --> 00:04:15,199 just looking around for how do we get. 93 00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:16,519 Speaker 4: The best shot possible? 94 00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:21,279 Speaker 3: And defensively, how it's just different than okay, see how 95 00:04:21,319 --> 00:04:23,680 do we what points can we pick at? 96 00:04:23,680 --> 00:04:24,639 Speaker 4: Where are the pressure point? 97 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:27,000 Speaker 3: Like what's the right thing to do defensively? I know 98 00:04:27,079 --> 00:04:30,680 that's broad, but compared to the Thunder and Sga, where 99 00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:33,360 it's like Sga wants to score and he'll pass the ball. 100 00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:35,600 He's not a selfish player, but it's like he really 101 00:04:35,639 --> 00:04:37,680 is sort of wired to get to his spot and 102 00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:40,079 score and he will pass if the pass is there. 103 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:43,600 I don't get the sense that he is wired the 104 00:04:43,639 --> 00:04:46,519 same way Haliburton is to where the objective of every 105 00:04:46,519 --> 00:04:49,480 possession is to get the best possible chance, no matter who, 106 00:04:50,319 --> 00:04:53,360 like who creates the chance, who finishes the chance, what 107 00:04:53,480 --> 00:04:55,519 things need to happen leading up to it, And I 108 00:04:55,519 --> 00:04:59,600 think that makes that helps me understand why the Thunder 109 00:04:59,600 --> 00:05:04,519 can look so lacking in like offensive dynamism. Sometimes Game 110 00:05:04,519 --> 00:05:07,160 three was just like if Sga is not creating it, 111 00:05:07,199 --> 00:05:09,560 shit's not getting created. And now that's like partly an 112 00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:12,399 indictment on well, yeah, like lou Dort's not creating anything. 113 00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:15,279 Alex Crusso, that's not his bag. Jaylen Williams, That's been 114 00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:18,240 the knock on him forever, Like you're not gonna find 115 00:05:18,240 --> 00:05:21,399 a bigger supporter. Jed Holmgren a hard time creating credit 116 00:05:21,439 --> 00:05:24,720 in these defense. But I do think while the Thunder 117 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:29,759 have massive physical advantages, they're bigger, stronger, faster, more athletic, quicker, 118 00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:35,879 more aggressive generally speaking, especially on defense, the Pacers just 119 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:39,360 kind of like they're the quintessential like let's play the 120 00:05:39,480 --> 00:05:43,000 right way, let's play smarter, and like that's just working 121 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:46,480 and it seems more consistent because when the Thunder look great, 122 00:05:46,480 --> 00:05:48,759 they look like NOAK team can possibly touch them, And 123 00:05:48,800 --> 00:05:51,519 then it's like, how is it possible they just can't 124 00:05:51,519 --> 00:05:55,120 score in fourth quarters? Like you know, and so it's 125 00:05:55,199 --> 00:05:59,600 like tactics versus physicality or like talent or something. Is 126 00:05:59,680 --> 00:06:02,240 just sort of me trying to get my head around 127 00:06:02,319 --> 00:06:04,040 why the Pacers have been able to do this. 128 00:06:04,079 --> 00:06:05,360 Speaker 4: Does any of that resonate with you? 129 00:06:05,439 --> 00:06:07,639 Speaker 3: Is that like I know it's an oversimplification, but I'm 130 00:06:07,639 --> 00:06:09,600 just trying to like make broad sense of it. 131 00:06:09,959 --> 00:06:12,560 Speaker 2: No, I think the oversimplification is actually how I'm starting 132 00:06:12,560 --> 00:06:14,240 to feel is that the Pacers are just a team 133 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:17,360 of destiny at this point, because it's just I think 134 00:06:17,399 --> 00:06:20,240 you look at it with Indiana and it I think 135 00:06:20,240 --> 00:06:24,079 it gets into should we be surprised that they're here? 136 00:06:24,319 --> 00:06:26,279 And I would count myself after saying I was out 137 00:06:26,319 --> 00:06:29,079 on the Pacers. I feel like we were a little 138 00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:30,759 bit in front of during the regular She's like, no, 139 00:06:30,800 --> 00:06:32,560 like this team is legit. We said they were the 140 00:06:32,560 --> 00:06:34,040 third best team in the East, no worse than it, 141 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:35,959 even more so than the Knicks, even though we both 142 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:36,920 picked the next to beat Human. 143 00:06:37,120 --> 00:06:37,680 Speaker 4: No, you did. 144 00:06:38,000 --> 00:06:40,600 Speaker 3: You have to give yourself credit here. I was much 145 00:06:40,639 --> 00:06:42,839 slower to come around to the Pacer, I mean, the 146 00:06:42,879 --> 00:06:44,920 Pacers in any series this whole time. 147 00:06:45,240 --> 00:06:47,439 Speaker 1: I have we both picked him in the first round. 148 00:06:47,439 --> 00:06:48,759 I bet against the Bucks. We had to. 149 00:06:51,759 --> 00:06:54,040 Speaker 2: But again, and it's just like after the first twenty 150 00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:56,040 five games of the season, they have a top five 151 00:06:56,040 --> 00:06:58,079 net rating and a top ten defense, because what was 152 00:06:58,120 --> 00:07:00,759 the knock on this team defense? And so to your 153 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:02,480 point about Halle though, because I want to like actually 154 00:07:02,480 --> 00:07:04,800 respond to that, that's really interesting. I don't know that 155 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:06,959 I've thought about it that way because I think if 156 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:09,759 you look at it, could it be like, are the 157 00:07:09,800 --> 00:07:12,399 Pacers just like so much greater than the sum of 158 00:07:12,439 --> 00:07:16,240 their parts? And is Tyree's Haliburton the driving force of that? 159 00:07:16,319 --> 00:07:19,480 Because you mentioned some of the offensive limitations that OKAC 160 00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:23,000 can go through, I guess you could say that Indiana's 161 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:26,519 second option is better than any of Oklahoma City's second 162 00:07:26,519 --> 00:07:28,639 options offense at this point. I mean, why wouldn't you 163 00:07:28,879 --> 00:07:30,680 when you look at what Pascal Siakum has been able 164 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:34,120 to do. But it's not like they're You look at 165 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:37,160 the Pacers and say like, oh, they have another top 166 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:40,160 tier superstar scorer, and it's have you said do they 167 00:07:40,160 --> 00:07:40,839 even have one? 168 00:07:41,199 --> 00:07:43,240 Speaker 1: Because of the way that Haliburton is wired. That's not 169 00:07:43,279 --> 00:07:43,879 an insult. 170 00:07:43,920 --> 00:07:47,319 Speaker 2: This team is deep, it's dynamic, and I think there 171 00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:49,560 might just be something to that. And it's also just 172 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:53,120 kind of done in service of really using I mean, 173 00:07:53,199 --> 00:07:55,360 even so, they won by nine points in Game three, 174 00:07:55,759 --> 00:07:58,199 Tyre's Haliburton was a team high thirty. 175 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:01,680 Speaker 1: Six minutes and twenty seconds. That's insane. Yeah, that we're 176 00:08:01,680 --> 00:08:02,600 talking about this team. 177 00:08:02,759 --> 00:08:04,759 Speaker 2: I said coming out of the two things I got 178 00:08:04,759 --> 00:08:07,839 wrong coming out of Game two. I said that you 179 00:08:07,839 --> 00:08:10,639 could probably stand to up some of like the minutes 180 00:08:10,759 --> 00:08:14,079 for certain Pacers guys, and maybe maybe you should play 181 00:08:14,079 --> 00:08:16,079 TJ McConnell less is what I said. 182 00:08:16,199 --> 00:08:18,120 Speaker 1: That's from my exact words, and. 183 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:19,360 Speaker 3: I think he ended up he I would have co 184 00:08:19,439 --> 00:08:21,959 signed both. I would have Yet you're right, of course. 185 00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:24,360 Speaker 2: He played fifteen minutes and had a trillion steals though, 186 00:08:24,839 --> 00:08:27,879 And I really just I'm starting because I've said this 187 00:08:27,920 --> 00:08:30,240 about the Thunder with their depth, but I think when 188 00:08:30,279 --> 00:08:32,720 you look at indies, do you think there's maybe something 189 00:08:32,759 --> 00:08:34,879 too Okay? Yeah, it's Halliburton in the way that he 190 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:38,480 is wired, which I think right now it looks borderline infallible. 191 00:08:38,879 --> 00:08:40,919 But then there's like you go through stretches like Game 192 00:08:40,960 --> 00:08:42,879 two and it's like, could the Pacers have done more 193 00:08:42,879 --> 00:08:45,480 to get him shots? Can he be more aggressive? But 194 00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:48,279 then he has hit these insane shots throughout the playoffs, 195 00:08:48,279 --> 00:08:51,679 And so someone who has the ability to toggle between 196 00:08:51,759 --> 00:08:55,120 kind of those existences, even if the one that I 197 00:08:55,159 --> 00:08:56,799 think is the low hanging through, like why can't he 198 00:08:56,840 --> 00:08:58,799 score more or be more aggressive as a shot taker, 199 00:08:59,039 --> 00:09:00,799 feels like it doesn't come to actually to him, like 200 00:09:00,840 --> 00:09:03,759 you said, But like who's the last player, because that's 201 00:09:03,799 --> 00:09:05,759 not You're right, that's not the way that Shay is 202 00:09:05,759 --> 00:09:06,639 why he's the MVP. 203 00:09:06,799 --> 00:09:08,000 Speaker 1: And we both love Shay. 204 00:09:08,039 --> 00:09:10,399 Speaker 2: He's the second best player in the NBA, quite frankly, 205 00:09:10,759 --> 00:09:13,840 but like, there's just something that feels a little bit 206 00:09:13,879 --> 00:09:16,399 more dynamic about the way that you can build your 207 00:09:16,399 --> 00:09:19,080 team or play your team around Tyre's haliburt. And that's 208 00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:21,120 not to say that I think Shay is limiting, but 209 00:09:21,200 --> 00:09:23,399 the way that the Thunder have kind of built their team, 210 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:26,879 like it's almost like, I mean, what would Indy be 211 00:09:26,919 --> 00:09:28,799 with howt Tyre's haliburn. Yes, we can ask that question, 212 00:09:28,799 --> 00:09:32,679 but the Thunder are so uncomfortably reliant on Shay is 213 00:09:32,759 --> 00:09:35,840 just like the scorer, and it's like with Indy, it's 214 00:09:36,200 --> 00:09:39,039 if Tyri's Haliburton is gonna take thirteen shots in a game, 215 00:09:39,159 --> 00:09:41,559 that's actually okay, right, No. 216 00:09:41,639 --> 00:09:44,799 Speaker 3: I think this touches on something tying two things together. 217 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:48,759 You mentioned Sakam has been like you can another credit 218 00:09:48,840 --> 00:09:51,519 to you. You've been in on Sacam so much harder 219 00:09:51,559 --> 00:09:53,320 than me for so much longer. I think he's great 220 00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:54,519 as an All Star player, but like. 221 00:09:54,480 --> 00:09:56,559 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean we the Warriors and the King should 222 00:09:56,559 --> 00:09:59,279 be like shamed to hell for like no, like Pascal 223 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:01,200 Siakam is not the guy we want to go after. 224 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:03,559 And by the way, very quickly with that, oh no, 225 00:10:03,559 --> 00:10:05,279 actually go ahead, I was gonna have Seakam at the 226 00:10:05,279 --> 00:10:07,600 five in this series has just been like destroying worlds. 227 00:10:07,639 --> 00:10:09,279 Speaker 1: I was just gonna make so no. 228 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:11,120 Speaker 3: No, we can kind of stay on Seacam because it 229 00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:13,720 gets to something I want to talk about, because I 230 00:10:13,799 --> 00:10:18,840 think the disparity in offensive dynamism is very clear, and 231 00:10:18,879 --> 00:10:21,960 I've attributed a lot of that to Haliburton versus SGA 232 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:23,879 and how they play and how the supporting cast fit 233 00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:26,639 around those two guys in the In the early stages 234 00:10:26,639 --> 00:10:28,399 of Game three, Siakam got I don't know how many 235 00:10:28,399 --> 00:10:30,600 of they were, probably three or four, it seemed like ten, 236 00:10:31,360 --> 00:10:35,480 just like not open but like very concerted efforts to 237 00:10:35,639 --> 00:10:37,600 enter the ball to him around the free throw line 238 00:10:37,600 --> 00:10:39,279 because that was the soft spot, and he had a 239 00:10:39,279 --> 00:10:41,559 mismatch half the time, and he was hitting tough like 240 00:10:41,600 --> 00:10:45,600 turnaround or like kind of ISO jumpers around the elbows 241 00:10:45,759 --> 00:10:47,320 in the I think it was all in the first quarter, 242 00:10:47,799 --> 00:10:51,080 and so I found myself thinking, because I'm still just 243 00:10:51,120 --> 00:10:53,639 so reluctant to give the Pacers credit. I was like, 244 00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:56,559 you know what, the Thunder are smart because they're gonna 245 00:10:56,559 --> 00:10:59,399 say if if Pascal Siakam's gonna beat us with with 246 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:03,399 sixteen foot contested jumpers in isolation, will just tip our hat. 247 00:11:03,679 --> 00:11:06,000 Speaker 4: And it's like, but the but the. 248 00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:08,519 Speaker 3: Pacers diagnosed that, like that's where we can eat for 249 00:11:08,559 --> 00:11:11,399 a minute until the thunder adjust. And they did that 250 00:11:11,840 --> 00:11:14,240 and those points all still counted. That wasn't how the 251 00:11:14,240 --> 00:11:16,679 Pacers won, but they banked all those points by doing 252 00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:19,080 the smart thing and having scouted what the Thunder we're doing. 253 00:11:19,399 --> 00:11:22,039 And Haliburton is part of that, exploiting the way that 254 00:11:22,240 --> 00:11:26,720 that the Thunder we're defending. And I like, is Mark 255 00:11:26,799 --> 00:11:30,080 Dagnall just getting badly out coached, because like we agree, 256 00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:32,159 we've just annoyed him. He's been a great coach all year. 257 00:11:32,200 --> 00:11:33,919 We love how do you get guys to defend this hard? 258 00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:36,559 That's all part of it. But like, I don't think 259 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:40,399 there's any argument to be made that Dagnall has coached 260 00:11:40,440 --> 00:11:44,159 a better like it, has put out better tactics offensively, 261 00:11:44,480 --> 00:11:47,639 has deployed his players more intelligently than Rick Carlisle has, 262 00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:49,679 just like the talent disparity is still I don't care, 263 00:11:49,759 --> 00:11:51,679 it's still on the side of the Thunder. It's like 264 00:11:51,720 --> 00:11:54,440 they just have more talent, just if you're like lining 265 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:57,639 guys up and you're picking teams. But the Pacers just 266 00:11:57,639 --> 00:11:59,559 put it all in the right place way more often, 267 00:11:59,600 --> 00:12:02,360 and they change what they're doing way more often. Now 268 00:12:02,399 --> 00:12:04,320 I'm sure there's great x's and those people out there 269 00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:05,679 that will tell me I'm wrong. In the Thunder have 270 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:08,159 made a million adjustments, and like, for whatever reason, it's 271 00:12:08,240 --> 00:12:11,279 not working. I just know when I'm watching it's way 272 00:12:11,320 --> 00:12:14,840 harder to figure out where the Pacers are gonna get 273 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:18,679 you from because it keeps changing and it's like situationally 274 00:12:18,720 --> 00:12:20,960 based than it is for the Thunder, And that's just 275 00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:22,960 you know, Oh, Sga is just trying to get his 276 00:12:23,039 --> 00:12:24,879 That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying, like that's what 277 00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:28,000 the offense is. It basically like way in down the 278 00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:30,840 stretch of that fourth quarter in Game three, it's it's 279 00:12:30,840 --> 00:12:33,960 not one four flat, but it's like corners and wings 280 00:12:33,960 --> 00:12:35,799 and SGA is trying to beat his guy and maybe 281 00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:38,240 there's a screen and maybe there's not, and it's just 282 00:12:38,279 --> 00:12:42,360 like it's not quite superheliocentric, but it's close enough that 283 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:44,559 you can't get away with that all the time against 284 00:12:44,559 --> 00:12:46,879 the smart, well coached team that on the other end 285 00:12:46,919 --> 00:12:48,600 is going to hit you from angles you're not expecting. 286 00:12:48,679 --> 00:12:51,360 It's just like, we got to give it up to Carlisle. 287 00:12:51,399 --> 00:12:53,960 I guess right, because it's not just oh, Haliburton plays 288 00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:57,519 this way, SJA plays this way and Haliburton's is working better. 289 00:12:57,600 --> 00:13:01,240 It's coaching, it's it's the lineups, it's everything. The Pacers 290 00:13:01,279 --> 00:13:04,600 just seem like they've had real advantages in all those areas. 291 00:13:05,279 --> 00:13:07,679 Speaker 2: It does seem Mike Carlisle, at least for the series, 292 00:13:07,720 --> 00:13:09,759 has had a better feel of like what types of 293 00:13:09,799 --> 00:13:12,120 lineups or who to roll with when you're looking at 294 00:13:12,120 --> 00:13:14,840 I mean like Ben Shephard in Game three, like yeah, 295 00:13:14,879 --> 00:13:16,399 you like you come out, you go slow down Shage 296 00:13:16,440 --> 00:13:17,639 Gill just Alexander. 297 00:13:17,360 --> 00:13:19,639 Speaker 4: And then tire him out for six minutes at a time. 298 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:23,639 Speaker 2: And also just like making Shaye work on defense, Like 299 00:13:23,639 --> 00:13:26,600 I think that's been a big thing. And another part too, 300 00:13:26,639 --> 00:13:29,600 is I I very rarely come away like just wondering 301 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:32,279 like what was Mark Dagnolt like thinking, But after Game 302 00:13:32,320 --> 00:13:35,600 one I wonder why they didn't set screens for Shay 303 00:13:36,080 --> 00:13:38,440 like higher on the floor. They did that in game two. 304 00:13:38,759 --> 00:13:41,039 Then he's struggling to create separation in game three, and 305 00:13:41,080 --> 00:13:43,159 it's like, at that point, set screens in the back 306 00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:44,759 court for him if you have to, just if you're 307 00:13:44,799 --> 00:13:46,320 gonna put the ball in his hands that much or 308 00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:48,960 that's the basis of your offense, why can't you do that? 309 00:13:49,039 --> 00:13:50,720 And the other thing I'm still sort of puzzled by. 310 00:13:51,039 --> 00:13:53,879 And this isn't to say that the dual big lineups 311 00:13:53,879 --> 00:13:56,919 have been killer for them, but like, why isn't this 312 00:13:57,000 --> 00:13:59,919 in Isaiah Hartenstein series? Like are we just gonna every 313 00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:02,120 time he picks up a foul because like you're worried. 314 00:14:02,279 --> 00:14:04,559 I'm sorry, Obi, Top, it's been great. 315 00:14:04,360 --> 00:14:06,159 Speaker 1: Like I've at both ends the floor of this series. 316 00:14:06,159 --> 00:14:09,120 Speaker 2: But if that's like like that's the response, it's just 317 00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:10,679 like I'll be top, and like we don't know if 318 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:11,480 we I just don't. 319 00:14:11,919 --> 00:14:13,399 Speaker 1: That doesn't sit right with me. 320 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:15,840 Speaker 2: And I think that we're talking about screening for Shay 321 00:14:15,919 --> 00:14:18,399 like I think it's I say, Hartenstein is pretty clearly 322 00:14:18,480 --> 00:14:20,759 not just their best screener, but if you're looking for 323 00:14:20,799 --> 00:14:22,559 someone to make a decision off the catch, out of 324 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:26,360 those screens. I just maybe it's ye, maybe it's his frame, 325 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:28,480 maybe it's just his vision, Like I'm trusting him to 326 00:14:28,519 --> 00:14:31,000 do that more than Chet. Yeah, if I want a 327 00:14:31,080 --> 00:14:33,600 jumper hit, yes, I will trust Shay Gills Up, I 328 00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:35,720 will trust Up. I'll trust Shay more. But I would 329 00:14:35,720 --> 00:14:37,639 trust Chet Holmgrin more than what I say at Hartenstein. 330 00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:40,120 But he just feels too critical to what they're able 331 00:14:40,159 --> 00:14:42,200 to do offensively. And I'm just you look at all 332 00:14:42,200 --> 00:14:44,639 this defensive talent and it's the Pacer is really gonna 333 00:14:44,679 --> 00:14:47,080 find a way to exploit you because you played Hartenstein 334 00:14:47,120 --> 00:14:49,639 more than eighteen minutes in a game I've been I've 335 00:14:49,679 --> 00:14:51,039 been pretty perplexed by that. 336 00:14:51,399 --> 00:14:55,039 Speaker 3: I have too, And I wonder just just thinking of 337 00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:58,279 this now, like, do you think because I feel like 338 00:14:58,320 --> 00:15:00,320 the Pacers some of the lineup choices they've made, it 339 00:15:00,600 --> 00:15:02,720 felt like, oh, that feels like a risk, Like it's 340 00:15:02,720 --> 00:15:05,279 Siakam at center. That feels like, I don't know, man. 341 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:06,799 Speaker 1: Someone like the bench mob lineups. 342 00:15:06,840 --> 00:15:09,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, you're just like, boy, that's a that's a 343 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:12,879 flex like or it's just like that's feels desperate. But 344 00:15:13,279 --> 00:15:16,440 I wonder if because coming into this series, the Thunder 345 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:19,080 were such overwhelming favorites that the Pacers are just like, 346 00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:21,080 fuck it, what do we got to you know, let's 347 00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:23,200 stick with this. If it doesn't work for five possessions, 348 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:26,039 we'll keep going, Whereas like with the Hartenstein stuff or 349 00:15:26,399 --> 00:15:29,240 or I'm trying to think of other examples, but like 350 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:32,879 the Thunder, they feel like almost tight sometimes where it's like, ah, 351 00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:35,320 that didn't work, we can't stick with that, like or 352 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:38,240 or they're just like they're thinking about the limitations of 353 00:15:38,279 --> 00:15:39,960 lineups as opposed to like, well, how can we just 354 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:43,799 get huge advantages. I don't know something about like just 355 00:15:43,879 --> 00:15:46,759 prohibitive favorite status, which is out the window now because 356 00:15:46,759 --> 00:15:49,399 you're down to one. But like it does feel like 357 00:15:49,840 --> 00:15:54,159 there's less willingness to just try stuff. It's like it's 358 00:15:54,159 --> 00:15:56,559 almost like we're so good that we should just be 359 00:15:56,600 --> 00:15:59,120 able to rely on like what we've done well all year, 360 00:15:59,159 --> 00:16:01,679 which is not like an insane approach, right, Like you 361 00:16:01,720 --> 00:16:04,159 win sixty eight games and you put up these monster 362 00:16:04,240 --> 00:16:06,600 margins in the playoffs, like you don't want you probably 363 00:16:06,600 --> 00:16:08,960 do want to kind of like have the mindset of 364 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:12,080 like let's stick to what works, but like every series 365 00:16:12,159 --> 00:16:14,559 is different and they only get harder and they only 366 00:16:14,600 --> 00:16:18,000 demand more like creativity, And I wonder if maybe the 367 00:16:18,039 --> 00:16:22,480 Thunder are like a little like a little too hesitant 368 00:16:22,639 --> 00:16:26,519 to to like change things up. I don't know, Like, look, 369 00:16:26,559 --> 00:16:27,559 I'm just flailing. 370 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:30,679 Speaker 4: I'm searching. Also, we can I say now that, like 371 00:16:31,120 --> 00:16:31,519 if the. 372 00:16:31,399 --> 00:16:34,080 Speaker 3: Thunder just win the next three games by twenty five 373 00:16:34,120 --> 00:16:37,639 points apiece, like that won't be a shocking result. 374 00:16:37,879 --> 00:16:39,120 Speaker 1: I could. 375 00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:41,440 Speaker 3: Would you believe that if if you fast forward it 376 00:16:41,480 --> 00:16:43,639 a couple of weeks and that's the that's how it happened, I. 377 00:16:43,639 --> 00:16:44,200 Speaker 1: Would believe it. 378 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:45,639 Speaker 2: I think at this point you could tell me on 379 00:16:45,679 --> 00:16:47,720 any outcome though, you could tell me that the Pacers 380 00:16:47,720 --> 00:16:49,559 one in five. At this point, I'd be like, you 381 00:16:49,559 --> 00:16:51,320 know what, I look, and I still think the Thunder 382 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:53,919 are gonna win this series because I'm still just kind 383 00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:56,440 of dealing with that larger sample size and the pinnacle 384 00:16:56,480 --> 00:16:58,879 we've seen from the Thunder where it's just they can 385 00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:02,399 run rough shot yep over anyone. The Pacers don't have 386 00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:05,839 that level, Like they're more of the scrappy come from 387 00:17:05,839 --> 00:17:08,759 behind and just barely eke out these victories teams, or 388 00:17:08,759 --> 00:17:10,519 they'll take care of business kind of like we saw 389 00:17:10,599 --> 00:17:12,640 and but they've led for what ten percent of the 390 00:17:12,640 --> 00:17:14,559 minutes in this series. I'm not even trying to denigrate them. 391 00:17:14,599 --> 00:17:18,119 It's just ken Oklahoma City ever sustain the peak that 392 00:17:18,160 --> 00:17:20,720 we know that they have. And there's there's we've had 393 00:17:20,880 --> 00:17:24,960 underlying questions here about the offense specifically, but I also 394 00:17:25,039 --> 00:17:27,279 kind of, you know, we're mentioning all these adjustments that 395 00:17:27,279 --> 00:17:29,119 they haven't made or why aren't they trying to do this. 396 00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:33,000 I'm assuming you'll probably get like more even offensive performances 397 00:17:33,039 --> 00:17:34,640 from j dub at some point, but I really just 398 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:37,960 think Mark dagnelt is gonna start pushing more buttons the rest. 399 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:39,640 Speaker 1: I don't know how you don't you bet? 400 00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:40,559 Speaker 2: Yeah? 401 00:17:40,599 --> 00:17:42,640 Speaker 4: You better? You can't go back? 402 00:17:42,680 --> 00:17:43,599 Speaker 1: Couldn't you look at it. 403 00:17:43,599 --> 00:17:46,440 Speaker 2: And say, like, of the you know what have they played? 404 00:17:46,559 --> 00:17:51,200 So they've played like one hundred and forty six minutes 405 00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:52,920 of the series, and I think the thunder of led 406 00:17:52,920 --> 00:17:54,599 for like what one hundred and thirty minute or whatever 407 00:17:54,599 --> 00:17:56,079 it ends up being, Yeah, cauld you just look at 408 00:17:56,079 --> 00:17:58,319 it and say like, no, like that'll win out Like 409 00:17:58,359 --> 00:18:00,519 you're kind of dealing with small nose samples to where 410 00:18:00,559 --> 00:18:04,359 it doesn't matter. But I I am, and this probably 411 00:18:04,359 --> 00:18:06,759 comes across as disrespectful to the Pacers, but like, I'm 412 00:18:06,799 --> 00:18:11,119 sort of just still amazed that we're here when you've 413 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:13,559 watched the games, Like, yes, it made like the pay 414 00:18:13,640 --> 00:18:15,839 I mean Game one doesn't. Not none of the Pacers 415 00:18:15,839 --> 00:18:18,240 comebacks make any sense. This is just this is insane, 416 00:18:18,599 --> 00:18:21,319 but like they're so good, but I just wouldn't have 417 00:18:21,319 --> 00:18:25,000 predicted that, Like they're just they're probably they're not favored 418 00:18:25,039 --> 00:18:26,720 to win the series right now, but I wouldn't. I 419 00:18:26,799 --> 00:18:29,279 had the Thunder in five, and I said when I 420 00:18:29,319 --> 00:18:31,480 picked them that I was more tempted to go with 421 00:18:31,559 --> 00:18:33,880 Thunder and four than the Pacers in six. And that's 422 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:37,519 just for someone who considers like I really do try 423 00:18:37,519 --> 00:18:40,480 and like think critically most of the time about this 424 00:18:40,559 --> 00:18:43,319 and consider myself higher on the Pacers than most. Just 425 00:18:43,319 --> 00:18:46,039 for me to be continuously wrong. Oh, I picked them 426 00:18:46,039 --> 00:18:47,799 to lose against the Calves, I picked them to lose 427 00:18:47,799 --> 00:18:49,880 against the Knicks. I picked them to get trucked by 428 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:52,319 the Thunder, Like yeah, okay, I'm an idiot, but this 429 00:18:52,319 --> 00:18:53,599 team's also really special. 430 00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:54,319 Speaker 4: Yeah. 431 00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:59,000 Speaker 3: No, I think I still think the Thunder will and 432 00:18:59,039 --> 00:19:02,799 should win the series, but I will come whatever happens 433 00:19:02,799 --> 00:19:04,400 it's like you just sort of have to give it 434 00:19:04,480 --> 00:19:07,319 up because I like and really like I do think 435 00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:10,039 the Pacers not to take anything away from the Thunder, 436 00:19:10,039 --> 00:19:12,200 because like the way they're built and like the kind 437 00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:14,359 of the way their cohesiveness and all this stuff, like 438 00:19:14,359 --> 00:19:16,480 that's laudable. We should root for that kind of thing. 439 00:19:16,799 --> 00:19:19,880 The Pacers are just like even more so because they're 440 00:19:20,319 --> 00:19:21,480 they're not supposed to be here. 441 00:19:21,559 --> 00:19:22,680 Speaker 4: They didn't tank everybody. 442 00:19:22,680 --> 00:19:24,160 Speaker 3: You know, Oh they want to be in the middle 443 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:27,240 for a while. How unambitious and they just they they 444 00:19:27,400 --> 00:19:30,480 they're just here. And the way that they play, and 445 00:19:30,519 --> 00:19:34,160 the way Haliburton plays is like it's it's everything you 446 00:19:34,200 --> 00:19:39,000 should want. Like he's this like preternaturally unselfish superstar that 447 00:19:39,119 --> 00:19:42,119 just wants to make the right decision and create the 448 00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:44,119 best shot for everybody, whoever it is. 449 00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:47,119 Speaker 4: And it's like that sort of it's very Steve. 450 00:19:46,920 --> 00:19:49,680 Speaker 3: Nash and like I'll just I'll just die loving Steve 451 00:19:49,759 --> 00:19:52,599 Nash forever. Like everything about how he plays is just 452 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:56,039 like my favorite thing. And Haliburton does feel like sort 453 00:19:56,079 --> 00:19:58,000 of an evolutionary version of that. 454 00:19:58,759 --> 00:20:01,839 Speaker 1: Uh the villain the villain arc of Steve Nash, Right. 455 00:20:02,160 --> 00:20:06,440 Speaker 3: I guess I don't know, uh, but I just we 456 00:20:06,519 --> 00:20:09,119 should be rooting for the Pacers, right, Like is it? 457 00:20:09,160 --> 00:20:11,279 Speaker 4: Aren't the Pacers just everything you should want? They're an 458 00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:12,960 underdog like all this other stuff. 459 00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:16,039 Speaker 3: And I guess maybe we got to talk about what's ahead. 460 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:20,039 I mean, insofar as anything is predictable about this series, 461 00:20:20,079 --> 00:20:24,119 But like, I don't know, I just I I find 462 00:20:24,119 --> 00:20:27,160 myself wanting the Thunder to win because that makes sense 463 00:20:27,240 --> 00:20:29,599 to me and it would align with like how I 464 00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:33,839 understand the league, But like, shouldn't I want the Pacers 465 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:36,759 to win because that's way cooler and I like so 466 00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:38,359 much of what Halibert represents. 467 00:20:38,799 --> 00:20:40,880 Speaker 2: I root for chaos, which means that I probably should 468 00:20:40,920 --> 00:20:43,559 be rooting for the Pacers. But I'm so just I 469 00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:46,039 really don't have a rooting interest in this other than 470 00:20:46,079 --> 00:20:47,920 like I feel like we were in front of the 471 00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:50,279 Thunder before they were actually really good and where everyone's like, 472 00:20:50,319 --> 00:20:51,240 oh this is despicable. 473 00:20:51,359 --> 00:20:53,039 Speaker 1: It was like, oh no, no, like they're gonna be fine. 474 00:20:53,839 --> 00:20:57,079 Speaker 2: But I find myself fearing the discourse around Oklahoma City 475 00:20:57,119 --> 00:21:00,559 if they've lose this series, and h when you're talking 476 00:21:00,599 --> 00:21:04,640 about saying it helps you understand the game, but also 477 00:21:04,720 --> 00:21:08,240 kind of rooting for the Thunder is evading because you 478 00:21:08,279 --> 00:21:11,079 can't if there's anything that all the Pacers need to 479 00:21:11,079 --> 00:21:12,440 break it up or they need to go trade for 480 00:21:12,440 --> 00:21:14,400 your honest right now because they lost to the thunder 481 00:21:14,400 --> 00:21:18,200 team in a minimum of six games. No STFU if 482 00:21:18,200 --> 00:21:22,000 anyone's saying that. So I like, but that's it. I'm 483 00:21:22,079 --> 00:21:25,160 just I think I'm more so. It's uncomfortable, but in 484 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:27,119 a really fun way to where I don't feel like 485 00:21:27,160 --> 00:21:29,039 I have a great hold on this series anymore. And 486 00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:30,400 I came in I thought I had a great hold 487 00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:32,559 on what was gonna happen even after Game one. I 488 00:21:32,559 --> 00:21:35,720 can't know like this stuff, but yeah, I like and 489 00:21:35,759 --> 00:21:37,799 loath that feeling at the same time, if it makes 490 00:21:37,839 --> 00:21:38,319 any sense. 491 00:21:38,759 --> 00:21:45,039 Speaker 3: So, looking ahead, do you think that Oklahoma City will 492 00:21:45,160 --> 00:21:49,519 find ways to more consistently generate offense, particularly like down 493 00:21:49,559 --> 00:21:50,480 the stretch of games. 494 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:53,519 Speaker 4: And if you do, what does that look like? 495 00:21:53,960 --> 00:21:56,039 Speaker 3: Because that's the core issue right now is like just 496 00:21:56,119 --> 00:21:58,440 laid in two of these games, they've gone cold and 497 00:21:58,480 --> 00:21:59,480 they've lost. 498 00:22:00,599 --> 00:22:01,400 Speaker 1: What does that look like? 499 00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:03,920 Speaker 2: I do expect it to hit at some point, and 500 00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:06,720 I think Jay Dubbs showed flashes in Game three that 501 00:22:06,839 --> 00:22:08,599 we hadn't really seen through the first two games of 502 00:22:08,640 --> 00:22:11,039 the series, and I do think that what it's probably 503 00:22:11,079 --> 00:22:13,119 gonna look like is and maybe that's a win for 504 00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:17,319 UH Indiana. I do feel like their late game offense 505 00:22:17,400 --> 00:22:20,119 is gonna be more variable to whereas you're not it's 506 00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:21,640 like what it And by the way, I guess you 507 00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:23,640 could say it was variable in game three because didn't 508 00:22:23,640 --> 00:22:26,960 Shaye take one shot in the fourth quarter. I just 509 00:22:27,759 --> 00:22:29,640 I just feel like they need to find a way 510 00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:32,640 to give him more like offensive in game breaks to 511 00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:34,240 where and I think that's gonna come back to like, well, 512 00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:36,440 what is the secondary cast doing? And I don't know 513 00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:38,119 if that means I know what Aaron Wiggins have like 514 00:22:38,200 --> 00:22:40,880 nine fouls and eight minutes or something in game three. 515 00:22:40,720 --> 00:22:42,200 Speaker 1: Like can you get more out it? 516 00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:44,119 Speaker 2: Because like that's someone you're looking for a scoring punch 517 00:22:44,319 --> 00:22:46,440 that doesn't feel like it's an Isaiah Joe series. He 518 00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:48,559 comes in in game three and the paces are immediately 519 00:22:48,599 --> 00:22:51,799 going after him. I think I think what it's gonna 520 00:22:51,799 --> 00:22:53,559 look like is they're either going to figure out a 521 00:22:53,599 --> 00:22:56,480 way to get more separation for Shay or there's just 522 00:22:56,559 --> 00:22:59,480 gonna be more variability to their attack when you're looking 523 00:22:59,480 --> 00:23:01,440 like a specially especially down the street, in a way 524 00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:05,039 that's by design and not necessarily like forced or coaxed 525 00:23:05,279 --> 00:23:05,960 by the Pacers. 526 00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:07,559 Speaker 1: And look, another thing we haven't mentioned it. 527 00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:10,119 Speaker 2: They had a lot of like kudos to TJ McConnell 528 00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:12,039 on the Pacers defense, but like they just had a 529 00:23:12,039 --> 00:23:15,000 lot of like brain farty turnovers the Thunder did in 530 00:23:15,039 --> 00:23:15,440 game three. 531 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:17,079 Speaker 1: I think Shay even said something about it, like. 532 00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:20,720 Speaker 2: You can't three pickpockets by TJ McConnell out of the 533 00:23:20,759 --> 00:23:21,839 inbound Like come on. 534 00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:23,319 Speaker 1: You can't. You're the Thunder. You can't do that. 535 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:27,079 Speaker 4: You know, he won? Like what like how many. 536 00:23:27,279 --> 00:23:29,680 Speaker 1: The first one? Like maybe maybe think about it. 537 00:23:29,759 --> 00:23:32,440 Speaker 3: That and like how many seconds into the TJ McConnell 538 00:23:32,519 --> 00:23:35,319 like scouting film is, does someone come on it and 539 00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:37,160 say like hey and tap on the screen and say 540 00:23:37,319 --> 00:23:39,920 he tries to steal the ball in the back court dummies, 541 00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:42,720 Like we'll pay attention, he's gonna do that, Like that's 542 00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:44,880 so yeah, Unforced errors, I think is the term that 543 00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:46,880 all the Thunder guys kept using, And yeah, like that's 544 00:23:47,039 --> 00:23:50,200 if TJ McConnell gets backward steals, that is an unforced 545 00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:53,000 error because you should know that's what he's trying to 546 00:23:53,039 --> 00:23:55,960 do like all the time. I I think I agree 547 00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:58,960 with you that just almost by default, the Thunders offense 548 00:23:59,000 --> 00:24:02,160 has to start looking more variable and dynamic, Like they 549 00:24:02,240 --> 00:24:05,039 got to know that it can't just be an exhausted 550 00:24:05,119 --> 00:24:08,559 SGA with a screen or not trying to get into 551 00:24:08,759 --> 00:24:10,480 get to a spot and make something happen. 552 00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:13,079 Speaker 4: I don't. 553 00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:18,400 Speaker 3: I just think like you have to have Jalen Williams 554 00:24:19,599 --> 00:24:24,279 be hyper aggressive, like for more than the opening minutes 555 00:24:24,279 --> 00:24:25,920 of I think it was the third quarter in Game 556 00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:27,640 three where he got to the basket like three times 557 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:29,960 in a row, and it's like that's an element this 558 00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:33,359 team really needs, if only because SGA doesn't have to 559 00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:36,200 do anything when Jalen Williams is playing like that, And 560 00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:38,839 maybe that is all it takes for him to have 561 00:24:39,279 --> 00:24:42,039 another ninety seconds of wind at the end of the game, 562 00:24:42,240 --> 00:24:45,400 like it just somebody else run the show, be aggressive, 563 00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:48,759 bend the defense, create a shot just a few more 564 00:24:48,759 --> 00:24:52,119 times in the first forty two minutes of the game, 565 00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:55,319 and maybe that's just the difference and all that's enough 566 00:24:55,359 --> 00:24:58,279 for the Thunder to hold on and stave off Indy 567 00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:02,920 runs and or comebacks. Defensively, I still think there's gonna 568 00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:05,319 be you could say it was Game two, But I 569 00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:08,000 do think we're gonna get another Thunder game where it's 570 00:25:08,039 --> 00:25:11,440 like they forced how many turnovers, they created, how many 571 00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:13,279 fast break points off those where they just win a 572 00:25:13,319 --> 00:25:15,079 game like that, because I don't. 573 00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:16,519 Speaker 4: I don't. 574 00:25:16,559 --> 00:25:18,400 Speaker 3: I think that's more likely, in fact, than the Thunder 575 00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:20,720 suddenly looking like you know, the seven seconds or less 576 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:22,599 suns on offense. I think I think they're gonna have 577 00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:25,279 a game where defensively they just do the they are. 578 00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:26,799 Speaker 4: Who we thought they were kind of thing. 579 00:25:27,839 --> 00:25:29,400 Speaker 3: And if they could do that more than once the 580 00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:31,440 rest of the series, then then you feel really good 581 00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:33,759 about the thunders chances. But defensively, I think that's where 582 00:25:33,759 --> 00:25:35,920 it's gotta happen. But I agree, like, if the Thunder 583 00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:38,920 can't and don't just look like something going. 584 00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:41,200 Speaker 2: This is so unscientific, but I don't know that I've 585 00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:44,480 ever watched multiple Thunder games with it. I don't know 586 00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:46,240 if I watch a single Thunder game this year before 587 00:25:46,279 --> 00:25:48,759 this year is coming away thinking, man, they look gassed, 588 00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:50,880 and just in the fourth quarters where it's like they're 589 00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:53,599 averaging a point per possession on offense for the fourth 590 00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:55,920 quarter and give this is the bigger one Indie in 591 00:25:55,920 --> 00:25:58,039 the fourth quarter is aftering one point four to two points, 592 00:25:58,200 --> 00:25:59,440 which is you're. 593 00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:01,359 Speaker 4: Gonna win a lot of quarters if you're doing that right. 594 00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:04,000 Speaker 2: And I just like I'm watching the Thunder defense, it's like, yeah, 595 00:26:04,039 --> 00:26:06,680 like there they can still be exhaustive, but they look 596 00:26:06,839 --> 00:26:09,920 exhausted and I don't know when the last I mean again, 597 00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:13,400 I think it's look if you watch the Pacers, like 598 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:15,480 away from the ball in the half court when they're 599 00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:17,759 actually in it, or just the idea that have the 600 00:26:17,799 --> 00:26:20,119 Thunder ever faced a team that will look and they 601 00:26:20,119 --> 00:26:22,039 haven't done it all series, like the Pacers will look 602 00:26:22,079 --> 00:26:24,440 to run after these makes, like that's what they were 603 00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:26,920 able to do that in Game one some and then 604 00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:28,160 they I feel like they were really able to do 605 00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:31,000 that in Game three. So maybe that's just putting like 606 00:26:31,039 --> 00:26:33,119 a pressure point on the Thunder defense. They haven't really 607 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:34,480 had a reconcile. 608 00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:34,960 Speaker 1: With just yet. 609 00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:37,599 Speaker 2: But that's just like that's what just makes it so 610 00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:40,599 uncomfortable is I'm fine with adjusting my priors, but it's 611 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:43,279 so hard to project forward in this series other than 612 00:26:43,319 --> 00:26:45,599 to say that I am excited and we're getting a 613 00:26:45,599 --> 00:26:48,039 hell of a series that feels like, I mean, it's 614 00:26:48,079 --> 00:26:50,079 going at least six, and at this point I kind 615 00:26:50,079 --> 00:26:51,839 of expect it to go seven, I. 616 00:26:51,759 --> 00:26:54,039 Speaker 3: Know, and I hope it does, just because I want 617 00:26:54,119 --> 00:26:56,799 more of this. Yeah, it's been awesome so far. It's 618 00:26:56,799 --> 00:26:59,960 been surprising, it's been revealing in good and bad ways. 619 00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:02,839 Is about both of these teams? Well, I mean mostly 620 00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:05,119 good for the Pacers, to be honest. But yeah, I 621 00:27:05,559 --> 00:27:08,759 think it's been great and this is not what I expected. 622 00:27:08,839 --> 00:27:11,279 I thought this series was gonna be pretty lame and 623 00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:14,079 over quickly, and it has been neither of those things. 624 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:16,519 Speaker 2: All right, let's do forty five minutes on the ratings 625 00:27:16,559 --> 00:27:19,039 talk now, don't care. 626 00:27:19,279 --> 00:27:20,640 Speaker 1: Are you ready to take us out of here unless 627 00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:20,759 you have. 628 00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:23,640 Speaker 4: Anything else that Thanks everybody. No, I think we've spoken plenty. 629 00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:26,000 Speaker 3: It'll all be dated by the time this goes up, anyway, 630 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:29,599 So whatever. Glad to talk to you about this, Glad 631 00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:32,359 to be listened to and watched. If you're doing that, 632 00:27:32,599 --> 00:27:34,880 and if you would like to do that, rate review, subscribe, 633 00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:37,799 join our discord. Make sure if you're checking this out 634 00:27:37,839 --> 00:27:40,000 on YouTube, let us know what you think is one. 635 00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:41,759 Let us know what you think is happening because we 636 00:27:41,799 --> 00:27:43,960 clearly don't know. And two, let us know what you 637 00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:46,759 think is going to happen for the rest of the series. Um, 638 00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:49,160 it's been so long since I've done an outr, I 639 00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:49,680 can't remember. 640 00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:51,400 Speaker 4: Join our discord. I think I said that. Links for 641 00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:54,400 that YouTube and podcast description. Tell your friends, say your enemies, 642 00:27:54,440 --> 00:27:56,680 shouts frankly Keen. Apologies, Jarrett Allen.