Speaker 1: To be an antimedic because chapter eight is about Jesus
punishments in hell in the Talmud. So that's all true.
But the thing is that probably if you're debating with
a knowledgeable person, which not many evangelical zide and zions
are going to be that knowledgeable, but they may say
something like, well, you know, the tumbutic discussions are a
bunch of rabbinical debates, and they don't all necessarily constitute
a universal opinion in Judaism. Which the problem is that, okay,
that's that might be the case, but most of the
time when you talk about rabbinic Judaism that it's completely relativized,
such that you just follow whatever your local rabbi tells you,
and you're not supposed to go asking a bunch of
This is a rabbinic principle. You don't go ask a
bunch of other rabbis what the truth is because you
just go by what yours says, and well, if you say, well,
what if they contradict each other, it doesn't matter. So
it's a relativized type of position.
Speaker 2: So kind of similar to like Islam in that way too.
Speaker 1: It is very similar. Yeah, it's like, yeah, you have
hatdieths wh's were all insane and you've got He's insane
temeletic things. And by the way, the hadieths Uh and
the Quran borrow heavily from the Talmud.
Speaker 3: Yes, I heard that actually the other day that someone
was giving me an explicit example from the Uh.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have one, say, I have some example saved
in my bookmarks here.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's that's pretty wild, honestly, but that that's it.
I just wanted to know what your thoughts were on that.
I appreciate it, and Uh, keep up the good work, Jay,
We all appreciate you.
Speaker 1: Get Jesus and the Talment by Peter Schaeffer, who is
himself I think some kind of rabbi.
Speaker 4: Chris again, Hey, so on that point of Islam and
Judaism being similar, do you find any distinctions or similarities
between Christian Zionism and let's say the Zohar that places
this like undue emphasis.
Speaker 5: On spirituality and sort of just like being Did you
find any similarities between the Kabbalism and the drive of
the Christian Zionist movement.
Speaker 1: I mean, there probably is some connection there, but much
of the kabbala is like repurposed and retooled Neoplatonism and
neoplatonic sort of world structures, or the Porphyrian tree, for example.
So I don't think evangelicals even know what any of
that is, and they're really just too stupid to even
look into that. So I doubt there's much philosophical depth
to that degree, but I wouldn't be surprised if there's
not some connection anybody else. It's open for him, hit
request to speak. If you'd like to discuss any of
the topics we've covered tonight, you can come to the
head of the line.
Speaker 6: Jam Hello, sorry again part of my ignorance, but could
you give a brief summary on like the canonical justification
for Sunday worship.
Speaker 1: Canonical, I mean it has to do with the New
Testament talking about that the Sabbath of the Jews is
fulfilled in Hebrews four and in the Book of Acts,
they consistently meet to worship the Lord on the Lord's Day,
such as John saying that he was in the spirit
on the Lord's Day, that's the day of the Resurrection.
Speaker 7: Okay, I appreciate it, sure, Onion, I mean, hellon yes, sir, Hey, Jay, First.
Speaker 8: Of all, I just wanted to say, I'm you're probably
your greatest answer. I'm twenty years old. I was like
a suicide and nihilist before I found your stuff, So.
Speaker 9: I really appreciate everything you do. I really appreciate everything
you do.
Speaker 8: My question was just about what are your main criticisms
of Mormonism. I find them very fascinating because not a
lot of people talk about them. And is it okay
if I ask a second question?
Speaker 10: Sir?
Speaker 1: Yeah? I mean you can see if you look on
my clips channel or on if you just type in
on YouTube. Jadaur Comma Mormon. We've had multiple debates with Mormons.
Mormonism is polytheistic, it's borrowing heavily and its rituals from Freemasonry.
It has a lot of Gnostic space opera theology to it.
Joseph Smith added eleven verses to Genesis at the end
of Genesis to predict himself. So I mean these are
like pretty much defeaters for Mormons.
Speaker 11: Okay, thank you? Is it fine if I ask a
second question?
Speaker 1: Then sure?
Speaker 8: So I was watching your debate with Trent Horn, and
I remember he asked a question about what it is
about uniquely about the orthodox God that makes him necessary
for the transcendental argument. And you said something about his
unique revelatory nature. Could you go further into detail on
what that means for me?
Speaker 12: Please?
Speaker 1: Yeah. I argue that the type of being that God is,
with his attributes such as omniscience and omnipresence and the
divine mind, is the type of being who could ground
such universal, immaterial, invariant abstract categories like mathematics and the
laws of logic.
Speaker 11: Okay, yeah, thank you, sir.
Speaker 13: We have a good day.
Speaker 1: Absolutely good questions, sir. Yeah, be sure to look up
those Mormon debates because those are pretty funny. But Nanatine Emperor,
I remember the last Mormon guy that that I had
a debate with. He said, I remember when when I
I could you not this was I've actually heard two
Mormons argue this when I brought up the fact that
Joseph Smith added these prophecies to predict himself in Genesis
fifty when it's talking about Joseph the patriarch, Joseph Smith
saw an opportunity to add himself, pigeonhole himself in there,
like wedge himself in there, as as if it was
talking about Joseph Smith because it was mentioning Joseph. So
he adds eleven verses to Genesis fifty, and then the
Mormon guy was talking to He's like, well, the Apostles
did this with Jesus. They added all these verses to
make the Old Testament about Jesus. I'm not kidding, like
that was the actual, Like two Mormons have actually argued this,
like the Apostles or con men like Joseph Smith, and
they just kind of crafted the New Testament to make
it work with the Old Testament. Like literally that stupid
I seen him either. That was so chid.
Speaker 14: Did you notice yesterday during the debate that he was
like pretending to be Catholic.
Speaker 1: Well, I don't know what you mean, because I just
went by what he said and then he claimed he
had this uh novousorto priest that was supposedly Zionis.
Speaker 14: So yeah, I was just curious because like I was
like rewatching the debate and then you mentioned the kope
he was going through on Twitter. The guy is still
today throughout the entire day basically acknowledging that, like he
was trolling you and pretending that he's Catholic just because
he was this is not made up because he was
raised Catholic, so it sounds weird to say anything else.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Kristin pointed that out to me a few minutes ago,
that like he's he's so basically just admitting that he lied.
So weird.
Speaker 14: Ill, So I had a funny thing happened with a
Mormon that was like the same thing the other day.
I was obviously just wasting time on Twitter. But when
you bring up the Genesis additions and then point out
that there's supposed to be no future revelation, they just
get into a like a continuous circular argument on the
Mormon point that you just brought up.
Speaker 1: Well, no, those are two different points. So the Genesis,
the additions to Genesis are fraudulent because there is no
eleven extra verses that refer to Joseph Smith. That's fraudulent
adding to the scriptures. That's not an argument on the
basis of the finality revelation. The finality relation to a
separate argument that that cuts out any cult, whether Mormon
or Joe's witness that after the death of the Apostles,
the faith was once we're all delivered to the Saints.
Thus there can never be any more new revelations that
are public divine revelation period. Gotcha, yeah, Mormons, this cuts
out jos I mean, what's her name, the founder of
the Alan White, the seventy Avenist woman. She claims that
she had the gift of prophecy and she has new
revelations battle groups. Right, that's all cut out.
Speaker 14: Immediately got it because when I was bringing this up
to a Mormon, I see where you're saying that they're
separate arguments, but they actually try to make it be
the same argument in a way I've heard before. Basically,
they claim the reinterpretation was essentially what you're saying in Genesis,
that there were quote not additions, but they were reinterpretations.
Speaker 1: Because there are no attacks prior to the existence of
Mormonism that have eleven extra verses about Joseph Smith.
Speaker 14: No, exactly, No, I totally agree. But they actually get
into this circular thing where they then bring up how
one it was a you know, they were real additions,
and I'm like, that's not the case. And their argument
is essentially for reason that they could have found more additions,
even though it has obvious implications on the now.
Speaker 1: There where is the basis for more additions to Genesis.
Speaker 14: No, there isn't any. My point is if you've ever
argued I don't know if you've ever heard like, but
more Mormons actually argue this. Then if you point out
that there can't be any additions, they say that there
is there just is.
Speaker 1: Oh I thought you said additions like ed I no, no,
and so wait, so they're saying that there can be
new additions to Genesis.
Speaker 14: Basically there was a reinterpretation.
Speaker 1: It wasn't an addition.
Speaker 14: And then when you point out that there's like clear
implications of the addition that would you know, have impact
on the religion that they then claim that it was
just poorly interpreted the whole time. And then if you
try to get into the argument that it couldn't have been, yeah, exactly,
So you can't like literally they just argue in a circle.
Speaker 1: But that's the well, see that's the same move that
the that the Muslims make to try to defend the coron.
So that's why you can't have this circular argument whether
you're not more Mormon.
Speaker 14: Yeah, I just didn't know if you've you've ever heard that,
because you literally can't have an honest conversation with them
it's probably not.
Speaker 1: I mean I've only had Mormon discussions actually, probably in
the last couple of years, so I've not had that
much exposure to Mormon base. Actually, Tarzan, what's up? I'm you?
Are you there, Tarzan? I'm you. You have to unmute
to speak, man, can you hear me? Yeah?
Speaker 15: Hey, Jay had a question for you if the Romans,
when they destroyed the Temple in seventy a d. All
the archives of the tribal genealogies for the Jews was destroyed,
so that means that they can't say with any precision
any Jew that they are actually have any lineage or
anything to do with Abraham.
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, there might be questions as to the
veracity of their claims, but I don't think that it's
true that because the Temple was destroyed, nobody knows if
there are any Jews, because all the Church fathers in
every century after the first century treat Jews as Jews.
Speaker 15: Would would you say that only us Orthodox Christians can
say without a doubt, by taking part of the sacraments
of the Blood and Body of Jesus Christ, that we
can actually say undeniably that we do have a lineage
through Jesus Christ, through Abraham without any doubt.
Speaker 9: Now we are.
Speaker 1: That's what Galatians three is all about. That's what last
line is today was about.
Speaker 15: Because Protestants can't say that they have like, let's say,
a inferiority complex before Jews, but we actually partake in
the sacraments, we can actually say we have a direct
lineage to Abraham.
Speaker 1: Sure exactly, that's what That's the entire thing they're missing,
and that's why the historicity of the church, the historical church,
is what matters.
Speaker 15: One more question, if I may, if in terms of
I'm sure, like from your research, after we die, there's
a branch of thought. I think a father Seraphim Rose
he also believed in the toll houses, and we find
that in many of the canons. But there isn't always
a consensus on that, something like professor Quiller, I think
his name was Alexander the Greek.
Speaker 1: The Greeks oftentimes are if you on where they looks.
Speaker 15: Up, so there isn't like a consensus. We don't really know.
Speaker 1: I think there is a tradition of the toll houses,
but I think that it can get kind of weird
and insane that people say every statement literally. I don't
know that you know, it can turn into some kind
of like Orthodox version of purgatory. But I do think
there is some some outline of that as part of
our tradition, but it might not constitute you know, hard
dogma for sure. By the way, Father Deacon, are you there? Yeah? Sorry,
what did you say? I noticed another verse that I
think could relate to that topic when we are encountering
Mormons or Charismatics. The prediction in Daniel nine, which that
guy brought up last night, when it talks about the
Messiah being cut off, one of the things it says
is that he brings in everlasting righteousness and seals up
vision and prophecy. To me, that suggests that the notion
of visions and prophecies are something in the in that
you know, prophetic Old Testaments since are sealed up mine. Yeah, yeah, good.
Call anybody else. If you're a Charismatic, if you're a Pentecostal,
if you're a Mormon, if you're a Muslim, if you're
a Hebrew roots for Blacky Burris, or that you're a
Catholic papist, dispensationalist, you go to the head of the line.
Even atheist. If there's an atheist, if they want to
call in hit requests, speak on bringing up to the top.
Still got almost foreign to people through sixty five. Maybe
we should call it a night. I don't see anybody
Else's your last chance if anybody wants to hop on
good news for everybody. I finished Calliwood three today. I
stayed up last night. Thank you. Grok finished it today.
Grok wrote the entire book. I didn't write a single thing.
I just said, Groc write an entire ast caly with three.
So I'm taking it easy. Take it easy, Bloomerton's take it.
Don't let the sound of your own gone hit the ground.
I don't know the words. I'm not an Eagles fan.
I listening to that boom or shit. I only listen
to the grateful Dead, like Dirty d and Fish Grayful
Dead and Fish is the only band I listened to.
Were you were You're the biggest ninety two? Oh? Yeah?
Did you ever follow bands? Followed? Yeah?
Speaker 9: I followed the Dead Fish.
Speaker 1: Are you joking?
Speaker 9: I know, I know you were joking, but I'm not
dead serious. Get it dead serious.
Speaker 1: You've actually been to a dead Yeah?
Speaker 9: I went to a dead I went to a dead
show and then used to I mean, I was quite
a clectic in my music, so I was I.
Speaker 1: Was gonna say, I remember a picture of you had
a rave. I didn't know you were a deadhead.
Speaker 9: Yeah, the Ray for rasta punk, hardcore jam band anything.
But let's see, let's go through. Let's use the apathetic
approach to definitely not country.
Speaker 1: Country and rap.
Speaker 9: I guess, yeah, maybe some like kind of cool underground
hip hop stuff, old school eighties rap and stuff like that.
I like that stuff, but yeah, and uh, what would
either be another no go music.
Speaker 16: For you?
Speaker 17: Uh?
Speaker 1: For me, I'm not a huge fan of like anything
contemporary adult contemporary radio crap like like mom music like
Peter Setera, or like none of that.
Speaker 9: How about He's been worship No kl is the Deer Pond.
Speaker 1: No, I'm not a huge country fan either, except for
some of the old country like Hank Williams Junior.
Speaker 9: Fantastic.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that kind of stuff is cool. Countries Billy, what's
up man? What's on your mind?
Speaker 10: How you guys doing?
Speaker 1: Hey?
Speaker 4: Uh?
Speaker 10: Is was this meant to be some sort of religious
uh space?
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's an open debate on the topics of Christian Zionism, dispensationalism, Evangelicalism, Catholicism,
Hebrew Roots Islam, Mormonism, you name it.
Speaker 10: Very soon Israel will build a third temple and they're
gonna name Trump Messiah. He is the anti Christ, Trump's
anti Elon Musk is the false prophet.
Speaker 9: Okay, that's what Grox said.
Speaker 1: I typed in, Yeah, exactly, make.
Speaker 9: A prophecy that Grock is going to be the Antichrist
that goes into the and do the abomination of desolation.
Speaker 1: Yes, doctor Michael, what's up? Good, I'm you, doctor Michael.
Speaker 18: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 15: So I have a brother.
Speaker 18: Who's Hebrew Roots Christian and uh, you know he's he
keeps telling me about the whole Bible, and uh he
celebrates some of the Jewish holidays and says that you
must do this.
Speaker 12: And so what.
Speaker 18: Would your argument be to refute this, which I think is,
you know, this Judaea sized Christianity that's that some of
these people are are pursuing.
Speaker 1: Right. Well, the first thing is that two epistles were
written precisely to combat this this heresy, the Book of
Galatians and the Book of Hebrews, first and foremost, and.
Speaker 9: Secondly, for get two Theologians.
Speaker 1: There was Act fifteen the Jerusalem Council, which settled the
issue about what is expected for gentiles who convert to
the Church. So all of those things are first and
foremost as kind of easy defeaters. But beyond that, we
did a whole documentary on Orthodox Shahada. My friend Lewis
put together a documentary that's really good called Orthodox Christian
Worship and the Old Testament, and it kind of demonstrates
that what these people are looking for is actually in
the Orthodox Church. Right, so they want to have, you know,
Judaic pentecost services, Well, that's what the church has. We
have pasca, we have Pentecosts. That's in the Orthodox Church. Also,
it's say, another easy to is the fact that the
Jews never considered that any of these things would be
celebrated outside of the land. It's actually impossible to keep
many of these ceremonies and celebrations that are mentioned in
the Mosaic Law outside of the land of Israel, and
Jews never considered that that would be something that the
gentiles will be expected to keep, which is funny because
they have this idea of, well, the gentiles are supposed
to keep the noe at Covenant. Well, that's exactly what
Acts fifteen looks to when they decide what's required for
gentiles converting to the Church. So all these issues have
been solved in those three things. Fermando, Fernando, what's that?
Speaker 19: Hey, what's up?
Speaker 20: Jay?
Speaker 1: Yes, sir a J.
Speaker 19: So I'm a current Protestant trying to figure shit out
right now, really trying to figure my way, you know,
on a journey, I guess you can say. Uh kind
of started listening to Shamoon and I guess that was
like the first domino to drop when I started finding
out that, you know, Christian Zionism was erroneous and stuff,
and and I thought it was kind of cool that
what's his name Andrew Wilson kind of mentioned like that
you should find some Christian Zionists debate because that's one
of the one of the doctrines.
Speaker 9: I think that fell.
Speaker 19: That kind of started, you know, helping me kind of
work through and sorting out all this stuff. And right
now I'm kind of in the in the closet Protestant.
My family still really doesn't know. My wife doesn't know.
Speaker 17: Uh.
Speaker 19: I haven't really figured out a way to break it
to them.
Speaker 9: And stuff. I had a question about.
Speaker 19: So you know that you were saying that a lot
of the promises in the nation state of Israel applying
now to the Church.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Paul says, the sacred there is one that all
the promises are yea in Christ, and he means the
Covenant promises. So all the covenants literally point to Christ
and are consistent and incontinuity with the Final Covenant. With
Jeremiah thirty one and thirty three call the New Covenant.
Speaker 19: Okay, So then so so now I've heard I've heard
that argument that the promises now apply to the church.
Speaker 9: And does that that also mean?
Speaker 1: I mean Galatian six sixteen says the church is the
Israel of.
Speaker 19: God, right right, right right, and that that also means
the land as well. The dispute as far as the land,
does that mean?
Speaker 1: Explains that when the Jews took the land and the
Old Testament, that's a type of the Church taking the world.
The land is the type of the entire world and
Romans for Paul applies that to the entire world being
taken over by the Church through the Gospel.
Speaker 19: So, so would you say it would be so as
a Christian, would we not take take sides as far
as with like Palestinians or.
Speaker 1: The traditional Christian position is that that land has been
sanctified by the Church and that's ultimately a Christian place,
a Christian pilgrimage site, even back to Byzantium. So that's
the classic Christian perspective. And at one time you had
a Byzantine you know, Christian government government there. But in
terms of the modern situation, it's difficult really to take
a side other than that we support the Orthodox Palestinian
Christians who are the minority there. But no, we don't
take a side between Rabbinic Judaism and Hamam. John Ross,
I'm your hey, Jay, can you hear me? Yes?
Speaker 21: Awesome, Hey, I I'm looking for some resources to debunks
at papacy and look at papal forges. So I wanted
to see if you had any recommendations.
Speaker 1: The probably the easiest introduction book that deals with that,
at least in a few chapters, is Michael Welton's book
Two Paths. I mean, they've been brought up pretty much
in every non papal apologetic book since uh like the
last few hundred years. So I mean ed Guiney's book
Cabalism will mention it as well, But I don't know
have a single book I'll tep my hand that just
deals with papal forgeries. But I'm sure you could easily
find one. But I mean most even orthodox treatments of
church history, like may endorphanm. Papadoccus's book on Medieval Church
and the Papacy. I mean it has a whole chapter
on the papal forgeries. But I don't have a single
bass to like.
Speaker 9: If you have access to j store, even academia dot
edu and just type in the search engine, you might
be able to find some good articles.
Speaker 1: You know what. It would be nice, though, to find
like a single volume. If I'm sure there is some
academic single volume on the papal forgeries, there's got to
be one, because there's a bunch of them. There's like
thirty or so. Thank you appreciate it. Yeah, anybody else
open forum you want a hof on. We got just
Dawna here also one of the top trans apologists. Uh,
there's not a whole lot of Christian transapologists, but we
do have the premiere one here. If he's able to speak, no,
he's not able to speak dirty D wants to speak.
What's up, Dirty D?
Speaker 22: Hey, man, I'm good to hear you on here.
Speaker 9: Bro.
Speaker 22: I'm a I'm a member of AME, the AMI denomination.
Speaker 11: And I really I really enjoyed.
Speaker 1: This is dark. This is dark. Hope you know that,
I know, I know, Okay, cool, And I.
Speaker 22: Really enjoyed my church and all. This is like full
circle that I'm really just thirde of debate last night.
Speaker 23: Loved it.
Speaker 1: Man, it was hilarious. It was great.
Speaker 22: This is all new to me as a Christian, as
a believer in Christ. This is just all new to
me to hear about the Orthodox Church. I've heard of
the Orthodox Church, but I didn't know the information that
you have have. So I'm just remaining open minded and
enjoying this. And I wanted to hear more about how
the Orthodox feels about other denominations. As AMB stands for
African Methodist Episcopal it's predominantly all black church.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm familiar with it. I remember I think I
visited one one time back when I was proud of something.
But yeah, I would say watch a docum. There's like
a documentary on YouTube if you're interested, called The Icon,
a seven part documentary it's kind of long, but it's
a good introduction to Orthodox Church in a documentary form,
so you might want to check something like that out.
But I mean, I don't think like the Orthodox Church
doesn't immediately condemn individual people. But we do think that
the Orthodox Church is the true church. All right? Who
else wants to come up open form chat? You want
to come to the top of the line, You want
to ask a question, you want to refute Tristen Haggard,
which by the way, is easy to do. He is
in the chat. He is our resident runner up e
deva celebrity. Tonight we have a couple of those. Tonight,
we have Father Deacon, doctor Annias, we have little aids Is.
He's sometimes known as he's clapping his hands together, which
I think means he's praying for us emoji. He's pray
He's doing a prey emoji for us. So we can
thank Tristan for praying for us. We know that his
prayers will be heard with certitude because it is Tristan.
He's not able to speak with us at this moment.
He is probably wrapped up in being in a mystical
state at the moment, so he probably he's written.
Speaker 9: Already got a head start on the lent, and he's
taken a ball as silent.
Speaker 1: He's already raising a Black Lives Matter fist. So I
think he's on our side. He's an ally. We can
definitely kind of as an ally. I wish that he
could grace us with his voice, but he's not able
to anybody else open for him. We can go back
to talking about grateful dead songs, we can go back
to talking about fish songs. We can go I don't,
I don't actually know. You know, there's that what's that one?
Here we go, we got we gotta, we gotta fed
here Agent zero zero zero, what's up fed?
Speaker 11: Hello?
Speaker 16: Yes, sir, Hey ja, what's up?
Speaker 1: Man? Yes? What's the agency telling you to do tonight?
Speaker 10: Oh?
Speaker 16: Nothing? I actually just have a quick question. Do you
feel like the Israel question is kind of gets blown
out of proportion? Like in my in my humble opinion,
the transhumanists, you know, like you've all and Klaus are
a much bigger threat to us. What do you think
of that.
Speaker 1: I haven't spent a whole lot of time on evangelical
Zionism just because it's kind of a I mean, I
was into that stuff when I was like nineteen twenty
and then I kind of grew out of it. So
it's not as something I've thought a lot about in
a long time. But I don't remember what happened the
last few days. Oh it's a because we got into
the spat with a past prophet and then some other people.
So that's why we've talked about the past few days.
It's not sometime I spent a whole lot of time
on because it's kind of a pretty low tier issue.
I do think that it's a serious issue in America
because it dupes so many evangelicals to replace the nation
instead of Israel or America with the church because they
have no conception of like a historical church. It de
facto gets replaced with the Israel as the church, or
the Constitution is the new you know. They basically these
people worship the Constitution or they treat America as the Church.
Vain It was me, yes, sir, oh.
Speaker 24: So first, can do you have any Orthodox author recommendations
for like the modern Zionism topic?
Speaker 1: Father a spirit On Bailey talks about it and critiques
it in his book Uh Kingdom of Satan. I think
Kingdom of Satan. It's supposed to be the sequel to
the surferm Roses. What you gonna call it? Yeah, I'm
going I'm going blank because I've been I've been talking,
says Father Bailey. Well the spirit on Bailey's book Satan,
and he critiques I mean, it's not just Zionism, it's
basically all the globalization institutions. Thanks, and.
Speaker 24: So I know you did a young guy's riz stream
the other day, but I have to confess to you
that I did what you said not to do. And
I freaking prese up this girl and gave her tag,
and she gave me her phone number.
Speaker 1: I even have to ask.
Speaker 24: So that does work sometimes if anyone was asking, well, I.
Speaker 1: Would say that, Yeah, you have to read the room, right,
So like good comedians read the room. They know kind
of from a sense of being, you know who they're around,
like what's gonna work on, what's not gonna work? So, yeah,
there could be some out of the box scenarios where
talking about the ology actually could you know, could do
good with a girl?
Speaker 24: Yeah, to be clear, I didn't like chase after this person.
If anyone's having that idea, now, she came to me, so.
Speaker 1: It's like you're applying the second effectively. I'm proud of you.
So I'm also a dating coach on the side, like
I'm basically Will Smith in the movie Hitch. If you've
ever seen, that's my Will Smith. Laugh, Jamie's over, They're
cracking up. So the one thing I would recommend is
to not listen to Tristan because if he starts talking
about women, you're pretty much assured of being single. So
if you want to be single, you could listen to
Tristan if you want a good dating coach. In the
vein of you know, Hitch, it's pretty much like I'm
Will Smith and Tristan is like Kevin James and Hitch.
That's kind of the parallel I would make if you
want to understand you know, Riz, Mojo, etcetera. Who else?
And he left. I guess I had too many insults,
too much, too much below the belt activities going on
with my swipes and jabs. Tristan might be blocking me. Now,
I don't know. Let's pray that Tristan doesn't block me,
but he may. Poka Poka hunters poke, Yeah, Hey.
Speaker 25: J Dyer, Hey father NaNs. So I'm actually Oriental Christian.
Thank y'all for even giving me a chance to come
up here and talk. But I'm Oriental Christian. I was
wondering if you had any book recommendations for Oriental Orthodox Christians.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think the the it's a little bit of
a difficult read, but The Christological Controversy by John mcguckun
is probably the most relevant to this because you can't really,
I can't really deal with this topic apart from the theology,
and it does get pretty tense. I guess you.
Speaker 25: Could say, I'm sorry, what was it called again.
Speaker 1: Say, Throw of Alexander and The Christological Controversy is probably
the best book on that topic by John mcguckan. I'm
not recommending anything else from JOm mcguck and he's pretty bad,
but that book's good.
Speaker 25: Okay, Well, thank you guys, God, great.
Speaker 2: Day, you too, Cruise, Sader, Hey, Jake, can you hear me, sir?
Speaker 26: I was just wanted a a few questions about what
you said a little earlier about how American Protestants are
kind of longing for a historical connection, so they kind
of like attach it to.
Speaker 9: The modern nations.
Speaker 12: State of Israel is like it's.
Speaker 1: Either America or Israel is their church and like the
founding fathers or like their church fathers.
Speaker 26: Do you think that's also kind of emblematic of like
Protestantism as a whole globally, just because I was just
thinking of.
Speaker 2: A comparison.
Speaker 26: Of how like they used the masoretic texts instead of
the septuagen.
Speaker 1: I think it's kind of defaults in that direction. Yeah,
defaults in that direction because of the reformer's decision to
try to get rid of the Dudo canon by default
appealing to the matter of Masera etexts. But I think that, uh,
the indoctrination into evangelical dispensationalism is something pretty unique to America,
but I think that that has spread, you know, through
evangelical mission work to places like Africa and Latin South
America and even places like Ukraine. The US was funding
not just the schismatic fake Orthodox Church in the Ukraine,
they were also funding and promoting a bunch of charismatic groups.
So charismatics have been used by the State Department in
the CIA as well to push American soft power, and
a lot of times that could include with a dispensational ideology.
So that's probably one.
Speaker 26: Right perfect, And one extra question. So my family is
all Christian Zionists, grew up Baptists. Is there like a
good maybe avenue of like introducing because every single time
I talk about it, it's it's shut down immediately, as in,
like you know, Israel is in the Bible, and it's
you can't talk about this nation state of Israel and
any negative light.
Speaker 1: Basically, well, just write down all the passages that I
brought up to, like goober last night, I mean, Matthew
twenty one, So is the Kingdom of God will be
taken from you and given to a nation producing the
frust thereof?
Speaker 20: So?
Speaker 1: Gotcha?
Speaker 26: And is there any is there any good books? Maybe
I can like show them about the history too, about
how rabbinical Judaism is not the fulfillment of Old Testament Christianity,
but Orthodox Christianity is.
Speaker 1: Yeah. The documentary that we that I just referenced here
by my friend lewis Christian worship in the Old Testament.
I'll put it underneath the chat here be the top
comment right here.
Speaker 9: Perfect.
Speaker 1: That will actually that will actually go to proving this point.
Speaker 11: Perfect.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because that documentary, Yeah, that documentary demonstrates that the
temple worship and all of the animal sacrifices and all
that really is pointing to the worship in the Orthodox Church. James.
Speaker 27: Hello, Hey, Jay, this is James. I'm a first time listener.
I'm also a Protestant Evangelical Baptist. I just was wondering,
like I grew up with all the Israel talk and
end times talk, and I've seen how the world is
going with like all the evil that's going on, and
you know, the atheists are talking about overpopulation and everything,
and they're killing people at an unprecedented rate, and it's
really concerning to see. And I see those arguments for
end times, but I just was wanting your clarity on
what you see going forward for that because I don't
really subscribe to this anymore because it's ridiculous. I've seen
all the chaos that causes and people's minds when they
go thinking about crazy stuff about the end of the
world and they don't plan their own lives anymore. So
I'm just looking for maybe advice and things about that.
Speaker 11: Thanks, Jay.
Speaker 1: Advice about like why or what I've already forgot what
the question was. Advice about how to go about proving
that this is not true? I mean all the passages
that we talked about. So again, the Book of Galatians
the Book of Hebrews are written to refute this specific error.
They explicitly say that the Church is the israel God.
In Galatians sixteen Matthew twenty one, Jesus says in the
Parable Divine Dressers that the kingdom has taken from the
Jews and given to a nation producing the fruits thereof
which is the largely gentile Church. Doesn't mean the Jews
can't be part of the Church. They have to convert,
and there have been many famous Jewish converts to Orthodox Christianity.
So that's how we would interpret those passages. Romans eleven,
which says that Jews were grafted out of the Covenant
because of unbelief, can be grafted back in through a
belief in Christ. You see. So, I mean, the New
Assessmen is really abundantly clear on a lot of these passages.
So really shouldn't even be an issue to debate. Perimeter,
Get on me, perimeter. Do you want to talk again?
Speaker 20: On mute?
Speaker 1: Hey?
Speaker 28: Jay, how's it going? Have some questions about lint? So
I'm a cate of human and the meat fairy Jessey obviously,
and so I stopped eating meat starting today, and I
just want to know what kind of stuff you eat.
I'm getting conflicting, various different informations.
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to be mean man, but like, as
I point out, like we don't do diet canonical issues
on the open form de Bay streams. So I would
say take that up with your priests, as I always
do my heros. Yes, sir, Yeah.
Speaker 29: I was talking to a product and friend of mine.
He's very well versed, well educated in a lifer, and
I had him kind of listening. He was curious about
the experience that I'm undergoing in learning about Orthodoxy and
becoming as a catechumen. I was talking about church tradition
and kind of brought up your argument of where does
he get the Bible from? And his sticking point was
that one way or another God would have provided him
and everyone with the proper books to learn from. I
didn't really know how to kind of continue from there,
which seems to be very stubborn.
Speaker 1: Assertion, But that's just an assertion that doesn't answer the question,
which is, well, how do you know that you have
the proper books that God wants you to learn from.
For example, if the doodle canon is part of scripture,
then praying for the dead is a good thing. If
the doodle canon is not part of scripture, then, as
Luther said, there's no reason to pray for the dead.
So that extent of the cannon will affect what we
do in practice. So your friend can say all day
long that, well, God's going to give me the means,
but it's like, well, how do you know the words
of our churches and the means? Right, that's the thing
in question. So you can't let people just assert things.
You always have to say, okay, right, so and where
do you where are you getting that from? What's what's
the basis to believe that that's the case? Hang your head?
Speaker 30: Hey jay, yes sir, Hey, well I'll say I just
spoke with Tristan and he said he was sorry he
couldn't come on and talk. He's rearranging his crystals and anticipation,
anticipation of the changing season. So maybe maybe when spring
rolls around from.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, he follows like the solstice or something,
so yeah, yeah, I'm not into the wicker stuff. He
can he can explain that if you can.
Speaker 30: I have the Copplestone about the Coppleston Frederick Coppleston thirteen
volume mass of set of the history of what Stern Philosophy,
and I was wondering, I'm kind of getting bogged down
in it. I was wondering, if you knew or recommended
a single volume overview that that you know of that
maybe I could read first.
Speaker 1: I think this is actually a classic problem in the
history of philosophical discourse. I've only ever heard philosopher men
complaining that there's not a single history of philosophy that's
any good. A lot of people criticize the Will Durrant one,
a lot of people criticize Persian Russells. Maybe Father Deacon
could point to one that he thinks is good.
Speaker 9: I mean Copplison's good Will Durrant's note.
Speaker 1: But he's but he's ayes for a single volume and
not a fourteen volume.
Speaker 30: Yeah. I planned to work my way through it. I
like everybody else, I've got a shelf full of books
I want to read.
Speaker 9: And I started.
Speaker 30: I started in the first volume, and I got about
halfway through, and I just got down on it, and
I just thought, maybe if I had maybe if I
could read a single volume.
Speaker 9: Maybe world around then that might be. It's just it's
really how would you describe it, ja like a pop
It's like a pop book.
Speaker 1: Like I said, all I've ever heard is philosophy professors
complaining that there.
Speaker 9: Isn't one There really isn't. I mean, And that's the
problem is that if you're going to get if you're
gonna get like that's a massive corpus and work things
to cover in order to do it any justice whatsoever,
you're gonna need a fourteen volume set. Well, otherwise it's
just gonna be just kind of a pop you know.
Speaker 30: Just how far up does your philosophy course cover?
Speaker 1: I did pre Socratics up to Nietzschean postmodernism.
Speaker 30: Okay, I would probably be that would probably be a
better format for me, really, So maybe I'll check that out.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean I tried to, you know, I tried
to engineer it to be like the best you know,
single course introduction. And Father Deacon makes an appearance in that,
by the.
Speaker 30: Way, I'm wonderful.
Speaker 9: All right, cool, Well, thanks a lot, I appreciate it.
Speaker 1: Yes, Father Deacon is there for the epistemology class.
Speaker 9: I think maybe I should make a history of Philosophy book.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I.
Speaker 9: Wanted to do the color in your Own Adventure Philosophy book.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, I think. I think Tristan's working on
an introduction to Wickup book right now, so he could
probably give you some pointers on how to go about it. Tristan,
how come you don't want to speak? Are you just
too good for us? Or I'm confused? He's giving us
the style treatment, so he's like, a, I mean this,
crystals need to be he's ghosting, Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 31: I just wanted to have a bit of a more
of a throwaway question about Christian Zionism, which is just
like I don't I don't really see what it is
about it that is so convincing to these like certain
you know, like evangelical boomer demographics. Uh, and not just
like convincing, but they're kind of like what is it?
They're very like zealous and intense about it, and I
don't really understand why what is it about that position
that causes people to act that way?
Speaker 1: And again I think that because there's not a historical connection,
they don't see, you know, the church that they're a
part of really grounded in anything other than this appeal
to uh, you know, the nation state of Israel throughout
the Bible, and so that for them is it's sort
of a default church history for them.
Speaker 9: And you have to keep in mind to the the
geopolitical influence in the manufacturing of consent among in terms
of politics of the American people.
Speaker 1: That.
Speaker 9: The Schofield Bible, how that was disseminating the seminaries and
funding exactly like all of that is because I was
just the reason why I'm thinking about that is it
just did this week last week all my classes on
basically no Chompsky's manufacturing consent basically an institutional analysis of
propaganda and how that works through and so my mind
is just immediately thinking about that. That's that, well, that's
really easy. I mean obviously, especially with boomers and stuff
like that, to con you know, through a propaganda model,
had to actually manufacture them. So because all of that,
it's not even biological, it's all about its politics.
Speaker 1: Well, in about this domain, I'm pretty sure it was
through the apture of the the Seats of Theology at
Dallas Theological Seminary. So that's been the hub of dispensationalism
in the Baptist Church for decades and decades and decades.
Speaker 9: And notice the Baptist is the largest group of Christians
in the United States, I believe, remember correctly, So you
would want to if you're an institution trying to kind
of manufacturing consent to support the state of Israel and
various you know, political things. Isn't that the exact group
that you wouldn want to infiltrate, right?
Speaker 31: Yeah, I didn't even think about the geopolitical part of it.
Speaker 13: Anyways, Thank you, guys, have a good night.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a huge part. In fact, that's what we've
been talking about for the last few days. Greg, did
you want to come back and say something.
Speaker 32: Yeah, So at the beginning of the stream I asked
above about grounding I remember, right, Yeah, So you say
God grounds the law of identity, logic, that sort of thing.
So you probably you may have answered this already, or
you may think it's a real question, But what do
you mean by God?
Speaker 1: What is God? Exactly? I mean, specifically the orthodogic ch
Christian conception of the trine God with all of his attributes,
particularly the personhood of God and the omnies. As an
example would be the means metaphysically speaking, by which those
categories would be grounded.
Speaker 32: Could you repeat those words again, personhood?
Speaker 1: Yes, In other words, God is personal and not impersonal,
meaning that there's intentionality and purpose to his actions and
his creation. It's not meaningless, it's not disteleological, it's purposive,
and that's connected to God being personal. And then the
other attributes like being omniscient and omnipresent, would would relate
to how something like a law of identity could be universal, immaterial, invariant,
and apply at all times because it's grounded in the
mind of God.
Speaker 32: So you call this the Orthodox conception of God?
Speaker 1: Correct?
Speaker 32: Okay, I'd be able to find a definition of this
somewhere if I if I wanted to.
Speaker 1: Well, I'm just saying the Orthodox trinity, like the Orthodox
doctrin that not the Roman Catholic doctrine of the trinity,
but rather the Orthodox monarchical trinitarian view. Okay, a lot
of a lot of words being precise. The reason I'm
using those terms is to be precise.
Speaker 32: Right, I did ask you to be precise Orthodox monarch
cheo trinity. Yes, okay, Okay, I'll look into these things.
Thank you for your time, Jay, Sure, Jose.
Speaker 1: Here it was.
Speaker 33: So the regarding the previous question of why people or
evangelicals are persuaded but Sianism, I can provide some insight
at least on what I what I saw growing up
in evangelical who you know, believe in all this Scianism.
So something interesting kind of related to prosperity Gospel kind
of like Joe Osteine where you kind of it's kind
of like transactional Christianity where everything you do is for
like your own you know, uh profit, like even financial
profit or well being, Like, oh, I worship God so
he can bless me with with money and stuff, which
is pretty huge in evangelical Christianity. So something I heard.
Speaker 1: That a good point. There is a connection between the
prosperity gospel and a lot of this dispensational stuff. Yeah.
Speaker 33: Yeah, something I heard growing up very adamantly was we
pray for Israel and we send money to Israel so
we can be benefited monetarily.
Speaker 1: And because they think they don't understand the Church, they're
missing the entire history of Christianity as the church, which
is the Israel.
Speaker 9: I just realized when you're saying that it's literary. It's
literally belief in magic. If I do this certain thing,
I'll get this. And how crazy is that?
Speaker 1: I don't think, Well, that's the thing, that's the Yeah,
that's the word of faith, you know. Kenneth Cope and
BENI had.
Speaker 9: It's total occultic magic. Yeah wow.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 33: And their basis for this that I heard, they argue
from some texts on the eutronomy and I think Malacai
as well, when they say, oh uh, those nations who
bless you Israel will be blessed, and those who curse
you Israel will be cursed as well. So they say, oh,
therefore we must send money to Israel so we could
be blessed, which is like a very we.
Speaker 1: They're missing the fact that Israel is a type of
the Church. So type moves to fulfillment. The type doesn't
continue on for forever when the fulfillment comes common sense. Hello, Jake, Yes, sir?
Speaker 34: All right, Jay, how you doing great?
Speaker 9: Talking with you? I'll like keep it short.
Speaker 34: I wanted to jump on, but I was driving, so
was I just wanted to say it was I met
you last year when you were in LA and wanted
to say that was a great evening. I'd encourage anyone
who is interested in all the other topics you cover
to to check that out. Are you planning on coming
back to southern California this year or next door?
Speaker 1: I mean imagine that sometime we'll come back. I don't
know specifically.
Speaker 34: When, though, that was That was a great night. So
thank you real quick. Just what the last person was
saying is so true. That being uh, you know, Christian
evangelical circles the Boomer generation, my parents and myself even
till you know, a few years ago. It's literally, you
know what we're taught, people follow it blindly. It's like
a spell that's on all these people.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was, I was trought the same stuff as
a as an evangelical group.
Speaker 34: And they don't really know any better. My mom, the
first time I brought it up and started talking to
her about it, you know, she started crying as if
I was, you know, going to hell for it. And
now after you know, showing her, I don't know if
you pruit like the movie or not, but it works
on a lot of Christians as marching design. I show
it to a lot of Christians and it's you know,
I don't agree with everything about all the pastors in it,
but it goes point by point and for Protestants and
Evangelicals it's a good thing. I mean, my parents now
left a church over that because they were bringing it
up so much in Bible studies, and my mom and
Daubt were speaking out against it. Now after just you know,
two years, so there's a way to wake up.
Speaker 1: And I've not actually watched this. You said it's a
documentary called Marching Design. Yeah, I'll have to check that.
I'm guessing it's a critique of evangelical Zionism.
Speaker 34: Correct, it's it's on YouTube or you.
Speaker 9: I mean, I have it on my page too. You
can look at it there.
Speaker 34: I've replied to Greg Locke and all the craziness he's
been saying the last few days, so you can find
it on there.
Speaker 1: Because yeah, well all of these people are paid.
Speaker 34: So yeah, I mean, could I ask you and the father.
I'm in southern California.
Speaker 9: I've looked up.
Speaker 34: I'm Protestant missionary kid growing up, but listening to you
and what not, very interested and I think that you know,
been being led to dig deeper into Orthodoxy. And I've
looked up online and there's you know, Russian Orthodox and
all these different in the area. Do you have one
that you'd recommend in southern California, like Orange County, South
Orange County area.
Speaker 9: That's where I moved from. I lived there about four
years ago. Okay, So especially where you're coming from, i'd recommend,
like your background, I'd recommend Saint Barnabas and Coast Basic California. Okay,
if that's not too far. I'm trying to think South County.
It's just right off the four or five and by, yeah,
right right by it's Harbor in the four or five. Basically,
let's St. Barnabas. Yeah, because that church was formed out
of kind of like Evangelicals, and it's Orthodox, but you
feel familiar, you know what I mean. It's from me.
It's not as jarring as right.
Speaker 34: Well, my background is French, so I mean I've had
Catholic in my background, so I mean, and I enjoy
the you.
Speaker 9: Know, Okay, I mean so good. I'm trying to think too,
as far as South.
Speaker 34: I'm not for this, you know, the I'm trying to
get away from that.
Speaker 9: Okay. Well, I mean, I'm just saying if you came
from that, but I could pick it out.
Speaker 34: If you recommend it, I'll go check it out.
Speaker 9: That's where I was baptized. But I served in a
really ethnic parish. Uh all Romanian parish and Anaheim. But
I'm trying to think South County. There's a Serbian parish
down there. There's a good parish. There's a Serbian parish
and a Russian parish in uh. And what's the Irvine
and then what's the lake Forest? So that closer to.
Speaker 34: You, Okay, so Saint Barnabas and then the other one
is the coast to Mesa.
Speaker 9: And then Father Blosco's parish. I'm trying to remember it's
like Holy Protection or something like that. I can't remember.
It's a Serbian parish, it's in Irvine.
Speaker 34: Yeah, that's you said, it's father what's his name?
Speaker 9: I'm sorry, Bloso, let me the parish name is real quick.
These are people that I know really well and that
like I can recommend, like as far as the priests, uh,
let's see.
Speaker 12: I have I have a lot of questions.
Speaker 34: I'm still working through things, so I just want somewhere
that's kind of open to you know, let's see.
Speaker 9: And then there's a Russian Orthodox Church in uh in
Lake Forest. St. Barbara's my godfather goes there, so you
need to, you know, get connected. He to help you out,
all right.
Speaker 12: So say.
Speaker 1: Thanks for coming on, appreciate that journey. Go ahead, Prime minister,
Prime Minister, I'm you.
Speaker 9: Hey, how you guys doing.
Speaker 15: What's up?
Speaker 35: I don't know if this is the right place to
bring this up, but I'm a Protestant, kind of grew
up my whole life Protestant. My father's a pastor, and uh,
I've just felt really kind of like confused about the
whole Protestant reform. And I really feel that God has
called me to the to the Orthodoxy in a way.
Speaker 9: And I I just.
Speaker 35: Joined the space maybe like five minutes ago, but I
saw that you guys were talking about Orthodoxy, and you
guys have a father, and here I was wondering if
I can maybe ask a couple of questions in regards
to Orthodoxy.
Speaker 1: Sure.
Speaker 35: So I've been attending an Orthodox church for a little
while now, and I know that God is calling me there,
but I'm just a little confused on the tradition and
how things work, and uh, just the different denominations within
orthodox You're a little confusing mainly, I understand that Christ
came for everybody, but the Eucharist and purgatory are just
very like confusing topics. So I don't know if you have.
Speaker 1: Orthodox Church doesn't teach purgatory, but we believe in the
real presence of Christ and the Eucharist. So I would say,
if you want a good Orthodox book to read to
get an introduction to those topics as you're attending, check
out the book Orthodox Dogmatic Theology from Palmazansky. Palmazansky is
what you want to look at. What's up? I'm mute, beam,
you're gonna immune? Are you there?
Speaker 11: Oh?
Speaker 1: Hello?
Speaker 9: Hear me? Yeah?
Speaker 36: I was gonna ask you what would you response be
to the youth frow dilemma? Because I was having a
discussion with the classman. I guess he was trying to
bring up that point. My response was that he's I guess,
creating this false dichotomy, like where you can't separate goodness
from God.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean it's based on an assumption of Hellenic
metaphysics too, that the good is the one that you
can't have distinctions, you know, the essenceentery distinction would be
something that our metaphysics posits that's different from Greek metaphysics.
Speaker 23: Fernando Fernando, hey Man, sorry about that, Jay, I was
just wanting to kind of see it, just emphasize, like
how how important for for me it was when.
Speaker 9: When the whole doctrine of.
Speaker 19: Christian Zionism fell for me like it was, it was freaking,
like mind blowing. I tried to tell my wife about it,
and she was like, why is that such a big deal.
She didn't really see like how explosive it was. But
I know you mentioned it, like how it's like low tier.
But man, I was wanting to kind of I think
the I think the connection with with with Protestants is
like the connection with end Time's prophecy and like the Jews,
uh connection with that because I know our pastor would
our pastor would say like that whenever he would talk
about revelation and antimes prophecy, like our our attendants would
like skyrocket.
Speaker 1: Yeah, everybody's obsessed with that stuff because it's it's sensationalist
and it's, oh, you know, dragons flying around in heaven.
I remember the seventy Avenue Church here in my town.
They used to put out these prophecy flyers for their conferences,
and one of the flyers actually had like they actually
thought there would be dragons flying around in space in
the times.
Speaker 9: I just kind of idea you should do, you know how,
you just sports fool take. You should do like.
Speaker 1: A procy dragons. Yeah, that would be funny, like like
the book Revelations as a comic book like Avengers or
something where you know, Robert Downey Junr. Is going to
fight like dragons coming out of portal helicopter dragons. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
I mean that's why preterism is a sho a valuable
force to destroy all this nonsense, because if preterism is true,
all this evangelical nonsense goes out the window. Because those
prophecies in Luke twenty one Matthew twenty four book Revelation
are in the historical grammatical historical reference referring to the
destruction of the Temple in seventy eight D. Plus they're
powerful proofs of the validity of the New Testament, which
these idiot evangelicals destroy one of their biggest proofs that
the Gospels are legitimate, because they're predicting what happened in
seventy eight D. And all these goobers push all that
to the end of the world. Roger, Hey, Jake, can
you hear me?
Speaker 11: Yes, sir? Cool.
Speaker 17: Yeah, So I was just wondering, since your Christian hitch,
you know, what would be your most orthodox pick up
line and then have a follow up question.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't make orthodoxy part of a pickup one. That
was kind of what I argued to my video.
Speaker 17: Oh fair enough, Yeah, okay, I guess I won't ask
you if it hurt when you fell from heaven then anyway.
Speaker 1: I guess that that sounds like a definitely like a
Protestant evangelical pickup one for sure.
Speaker 9: Fair enough.
Speaker 17: Yeah. I really enjoyed your debate yesterday with Misfit. It
was kind of crazy watching him talk it like, I
don't know, I guess he thinks that like Catholicism is
some sort of ethnicity. He was making this claim that like,
since his parents were Catholic, that he much more enjoyed
his non denomn church over Catholicism. He even called like
the Catholic Church embarrassing.
Speaker 1: So it's kind of christ And Tristan told me that
today I quit following that guy as soon as I
booted him from the room, but Tristan said today that
he was like admitting, oh, yeah, I don't really care
about Catholicism. I just said I was Catholic, but I'm not.
So basically it was lying, uh yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 17: He crashed out pretty pretty bad today on X was
kind of kind of embarrassing to watch.
Speaker 1: But he also lied about his notes, remember.
Speaker 9: The he broke his vowel silence there. He also lied
about his notes.
Speaker 37: He claimed that he had notes that he goes, oh, yeah,
I got some notes that I took, and then he
starts reading some sort of chat GPT generated slop and
he thinks he's actually reading scripture, but he's quoting summaries
of evangelical terrible exegesis of Daniels, and then he goes
and then Jay calls him out. Jay calls him out,
and then he goes, oh, well, actually I think you misunderstood.
Speaker 1: This is someone else's notes named Grock.
Speaker 9: Oh I thought the Bible, but it was really the Necronomicicon. Sorry,
he was reading.
Speaker 38: Thinks pretty sure that he I'm pretty sure he claimed
that he was he was directly quoting it, and Jay
kind of interrupted him to point out, like, no, this
is not these are not quotes, and he kept going,
He's like.
Speaker 1: No, this is just this is the scriptures.
Speaker 17: That's what the AI and Saints stands for.
Speaker 1: Yes, you're correct, AI and Saints stands for for that.
Now people have been saying, I don't know anything about
this dude, but apparently all the there's a bunch of
background lore to this guy that I had no idea.
He had like an actual fist fight with Bryson.
Speaker 38: If you say that, they basically.
Speaker 1: They basically fall over in the gravel and just kind
of like roll over on each other and then Bryson
punches him. Watching that guy nuts and then Bryson called
the fight. Bryce is like.
Speaker 6: He he got up and ran away.
Speaker 1: Oh, I mean that was crazy, but well, I mean
they're both just clowns. I mean it's like two peas
in a pod there between then two Savio.
Speaker 39: I was watching your YouTube channel the other day and
I saw that you were having discussions or you had
a debate, which your naturalist atheist professor. My question is like,
do you have any of your debates like prior to
you being on YouTube recorded.
Speaker 1: No, man, there would have been no reason to record
a debate back in two thousand and five. Okay, my bad, Sorry,
I mean it would have been interesting, but I basically
just argued this basic presup. He was an atheist materialist professor.
He was my philosophy science professor. Forget his name, but
sincere hypocrite, Yes, sir.
Speaker 12: Your debates against atheists, and I've noticed a lot of
them come with like Protestant priests oppositions like solid scripture.
Speaker 1: That's a good insight actually, that most atheists are reacting
to weird Protestant theology sture.
Speaker 12: Yes, sir, I was just wondering why do the atheists
do that a lot? Like is it just because a
lot of asists come from Protestants?
Speaker 1: Or yeah, I would say, so, okay, just another question.
Speaker 12: So in mark Mark seven, I think where Jesus heals
the death Man, Jesus says to like, not tell anyone,
but they do tell others that Jesus healed them. So
is this disobedience like a good thing or a bad thing?
Speaker 1: Well, I guess if he disobeyed, it wouldn't be a good.
Speaker 12: Thing, right, But there's many verses like that where Jesus
heals and he explicitly says don't tell anyone, But yet
they'll tell people. So why is that something that happens often?
Speaker 1: I think that he just had an intention for certain
things being kept secret until the work of redemption had
been complete. And that's why he says, I have many
things to say to you, Like to the apostles, he says,
I have many things to say to you, but you
cannot yet bear them. But you know, he says, like
when the Holy Spirit comes, then you'll be able to
deal with it. You'll be able to remember what I
taught you. So I would assume that it's in anticipation
of Pentecost.
Speaker 12: Okay, that makes sense, thank you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that is actually a good question. What's hey, Jake?
Speaker 12: Can you hear me?
Speaker 1: Yes, sir, hey man, just a quick question.
Speaker 40: I'm sure you've talked about this a million times, and
I've just started getting into Christianity and philosophy and all
of that.
Speaker 9: But I have some you know.
Speaker 40: Non denominational and Protestant.
Speaker 41: Friends and stuff like that, and all of them focus
on you know, they're kind of just hyper individualists, I
guess where you know, they just only want to focus
on the you know, quote unquote relationship with.
Speaker 40: God and that's all important and all that. But how
do you kind of approach it from the Orthodox perspective?
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, in the New Testament, we're taught in
any places, like in Ephesians, that were members of a
of a corporate body, of an institution, one Lord, one faith,
one body, one baptism. So there's no such thing as this,
you know, individualized situation. It doesn't really exist. I'm not
saying that that means they're in bad faith, but they're
excluding all of these other aspects of the New Testament
that say that we do have to be involved in,
say the corporate worship of the church. Right, So Paul
says not to forsake the assembling together, you know, and
when you read all these epistles, it's pretty clear that
Paul expects that you're going to be going to and
attending the divine liturgy. So, for example, the things that
we're that we're told to do is to eat his
blood and drink excuse me, eat his flesh and drink
his blood to abide him in John six. Right, And
so how are you doing that on your own if
you're not attending the divine liturgy?
Speaker 40: Absolutely perfect, Thanks so much, Jack.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And if you look at you know, Hebrews eleven.
If you look at Revelation, you know five or nine.
The liturgical worship of the Church is the liturgical worship
ship in heaven, and it's a corporate, collective, universal thing.
Speaker 11: Piccolo here, can you hear me? Yes, I had a
I had a quick question. So I'm a I'm a
catech human, but I recently had this thought and it's
it's about Catholicism. So okay, So when it so you
you would agree in that the the main reason we
have icons is too to pick the incarnation of Christ, right.
Speaker 1: Well, that's the root of iconography. But I mean the
icons also picture the other saints and their windows into heaven.
Speaker 11: Okay, because because I know I believe it was the
sixth Ecumenical Council where they where It's where they pretty
much said you can't depict the Father, right it's.
Speaker 1: The seventh seventh, Yeah, I think, But I think Trollo
might mention it too. So I think Trello and the
Southern the Council mention it explicitly, and then it's reaffirmed
in other places. But yeah, we're not supposed to engage.
The exception to that is like the ancient of days.
But beyond that, no, we don't depict the hypostasis of
the Father.
Speaker 11: Yeah, yeah, I know, I know in the I want
to say, it's in the ro Corps building in New York.
They have they have an icon of the Father, but
it's uncanonical. But but that that, that's besides the.
Speaker 1: Point it has. Yeah, this so this is not always
strictly adhered to. I would argue it ought to be.
But like it's not gonna it's not like oh the
well the church is, you know, doesn't count anymore. They
they're they're canceled. I mean, people don't always follow the counts,
and a lot of people don't don't do it knowingly either.
Speaker 11: Okay, Yeah, the point, the point that I was trying
to make.
Speaker 1: Was also, by the way, hold on one point, there
is that there are exceptions to that, one of them
being the Ancient of days. So and I don't know
which are you talking about the one in San Francisco
where Saint John's relics are? Oh?
Speaker 11: No, I was, I was, I was refered.
Speaker 1: I mean, I mean, excuse me out, no, wait, where's uh,
where's Saint John's relic that's San Francisco.
Speaker 11: Right, I'm I'm actually not sure. I was referring to
the one in uh in New York.
Speaker 1: Oh, I'm sorry. I was thinking, l Ah, we've been
to the Rock Cork Cathedral in West Coast l A.
Or where I'm all mixed up. I can't you remember. Oh,
but I didn't think that there was an image of
the Father there. But there could be, and I'm just
not aware of it. So you're talking about ro Corp
Cathedral in New York. What's it called?
Speaker 11: Uh, I'm I'm the name. The name escapes me at
the moment. I just I just remember, I just remember
seeing it.
Speaker 1: Uh is it the ancient of days or you don't know.
Speaker 11: I'm not entirely sure, but uh.
Speaker 1: Well, that is that that is an acceptable image of
the Father. If it's the ancient days, that is what
I'm saying. So, yeah, that's the one exception.
Speaker 11: Yeah, I guess.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 11: The point that I was trying to make was if
if the if the Catholics to pict the Father in
the in their iconography, aren't they in a way saying
that that, uh, that the Father was incarnate.
Speaker 1: That's exactly the argument of the Moscow iconsent not correct. Okay.
Speaker 11: And then and then uh one. One more question.
Speaker 1: So, by the way, it is uh St. It's Holy
Virgin Cathedral in San Francisco is what I was thinking of,
where we visited several years ago. Okay, Holy Vision Cathedral.
Speaker 11: Okay, that's good to have. Other question, so, do you
have any good book recommendations on like deconstructing Calvinism.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I think if you read uh St, cir Ol
and Alexander their Christological controversy, that will deconstruct Calvinism because
Christology really undoes it.
Speaker 42: Christopher, Hello, hey, Jay, what's up? I was actually on
earlier and I thought you were going to get off.
That was like maybe an hour and a half or
two of those. I'm glad you're still on.
Speaker 1: Well, I was every time I'm about to quit, then
people pile in.
Speaker 42: So okay, well, I wanted to just share a quick
horror story about Christian Zionism.
Speaker 9: If that's okay.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 42: So in my last church that I was in, it
was a charismatic church and we had a speaker com
who was a quote unquote prophet, and he came and
just started preaching and was letting everybody know about U
over seventh and how Israel was just conducting.
Speaker 1: All of the air you're cutting out.
Speaker 9: I can't hear I'm sorry, can you hear me out?
Speaker 1: Yes? Yes, go ahead, me out Okay.
Speaker 42: So the prophet was saying to everybody that while Israel
was conducting its uh I guess raids or air raids
or the bombing stuff. Uh, this guy said that it
doesn't matter if you agree with it or if you think.
Speaker 9: It's right or whatever you think.
Speaker 42: If it's if you think it's wrong or anything, you
have to agree with Net and Yahoo. You have to
pray for Net and Yahoo and for their success. And
then also during the offering time.
Speaker 1: This is crazy. So basically now the new pope is
not not Yah. So we have an infallible pope of
the churche. It's Pope BB.
Speaker 42: I mean.
Speaker 20: I was uh.
Speaker 42: I was sitting in there like like on, I was
like looking around, and I mean people were just.
Speaker 9: Like hey man, hallelujah.
Speaker 42: And another thing too though, when the uh when the
offering time came, you know, sometimes they'll have like flag
flag people that wave flags and stuff like that. They
had uh Israeli flags. They were waving Israeli flags like
higher than anything else in the in the church, and
I just to me, that was such a clear depiction
of like the deception and how how how deep it runs.
Speaker 1: It's I don't know what your problem is. Clearly the
New Testament says that Yahoo is the head of the church.
Simple gospel, Simple gospel. Have to unmute simple gospel. Do
you want to talk? You have to unmute Anglo?
Speaker 4: Oh hi?
Speaker 1: Yes?
Speaker 20: Uh So how's your day good?
Speaker 1: What's something?
Speaker 2: So?
Speaker 43: I just wanted to I just wanted to bring in
a question right quick. And it's a question about the
philiok way. So I wanted to propose to you this
question right quick.
Speaker 20: So where do you think that the Eastern Orthodox view
of an issue like the philiog way might be?
Speaker 44: Intellect like we like like we flawed in this sense
that like if you if like if if the Holy
Spirit only comes from the Father, would that relegate the
son to some type of lesser divine of forty Because
we know that through the Trinity, the Holy Spirit is
like is of God and stuff.
Speaker 20: So we're talking about the three persons sharing the same
divine essence. How does the Holy Spirit not come from
the son unless the son has some type of lesser
like divine of forty and so in that sense, I
don't know.
Speaker 1: So this argument is hinging on the idea that to
lack a hypostatic property would necessitate ontological uh diminished status.
But that would mean that the Holy Spirit has a
ontologically diminished status because he doesn't produce a person. So
if the argument is that the son must produce a
person to have equality with the Father, is to confuse
hypostatic properties with natural attributes. So any natural common attribute
is what all three share. Any hypostatic property is unique
to that single soul hypostasis because it's what picks that
hypostasis out. So Bezil says, for example, the Father alone
is cause in the trinity. That's why the son cannot
take on cause, because that would make it a father
son duality with a diminished status Holy Spirit who does
not produce a person.
Speaker 44: Oh oh okay, yeah, I think that's all I really
have to say.
Speaker 1: Have a good one, thank you, And you know, check
out the cappaditions on that, because they're pretty consistent that
the Father does not in any way share his role
as cause or arcade or films grant hello, hear me, yes, sir,
hey uh.
Speaker 13: One of the one of the main things that I've
struggled with coming from Catholicism is the concept of economia,
you know, with the legalistic presuppositions and stuff of the West.
And I was wondering if you have any like book
recommendations or anything on that.
Speaker 1: I don't know about a book on it. Well, like
if you watch like if you watch Ubi Patriss's documentaries,
he gives a lot of good examples as to why
there's you know, reason for flexibility in the canons.
Speaker 13: Okay, do you know about is are there any like
examples from the Church Fathers that I could read, like
like from you know.
Speaker 1: Because because in Ubi's documentaries he cites a lot of
canonical like on the if you watching the Divorce Remarriage documentary,
he did, Okay, lot of a lot of that deals
with Patristic quotations. Okay, that's that's all I really had,
thanks man. Yeah, that's a good question. Also, the Canons
of Saint Basil are pretty obviously like not the modern
Roman Catholic position, yet Rome accepted the Canons of Basil
from many centuries. Okay, last couple questions here, I'm getting
kind of worn out.
Speaker 30: Oh here we are, can you hear me, yes, sir,
Hey you mentioned DTS earlier when that guy was talking
about the air that a lot of evangelicals make specifically
with Israel, when they're talking about those who bless Israel.
We bless those who curse Israel will be cursed. And
that comes from something that was I heard ad nauseum
from my preaching professors and throw in.
Speaker 1: Something really quick the refuse that very easily. If you
read Revelation two and three, when Jesus talks to the
seven churches of Asia minors through through John right when
John writes those letters, you'll notice the blessings and cursings
model is applied to the church, and that means that
the church that is the inheritor of the blessings and
the cursings covenant, the old right no longer the type.
Speaker 30: The interesting thing about it was so I lived on
the campus of DTS for a while, and I wasn't
a student there. I was a student at another school
that shared married housing. But I got to be a
part of all the little seminars and stuff that was
going on, and in the side the campus was kind
of split in the professors where they were there was
like the old guard who were you know, old school dispensationless.
And then there were the other guys who were trying
to publish papers at SBL and stuff and kind of
were secret kind of progressives that they had to.
Speaker 1: Be quiet about.
Speaker 30: And all of my friends who we were trying to
get papers published at SBL too, we liked those guys,
and they kind of poo pooed that interpretation of kind
of the classic evangelic way of thinking about Israel, the
way they do for a different way to interpret things
like that's not what the Jews who wrote it thought,
And it all comes back to like, well, the meaning
of the text is in what the meaning the jew
who wrote it thought it meant. And so the classic,
the classic like example that I was taught was in
the beginning of Genesis, that's not the Trinity because they
would have no concept of the Trinity, and therefore that's
a later delp.
Speaker 1: That's exactly that's exactly where it would lead into like
you know, humanitarian horn type and nonsense.
Speaker 30: Yeah, and it's funny because it's kind of the same
words just mean what they say and say what they mean, and.
Speaker 1: The academic that's why they don't believe in typology.
Speaker 30: Yeah, the academic type still rely on that, but they
think that they're above it by saying, well, that's not
what I know what the Jew actually thought?
Speaker 9: Who wrote this?
Speaker 30: Because I've read bah blah blah.
Speaker 1: I was just they're committing the very mistake that Paul
talks about when he says that they follow the letter
and not the spirit.
Speaker 45: Interesting, all right, thanks, yeah, uh, last comment and we'll
close it up.
Speaker 1: Jose get on mute because that you want to talk
good on mute. All right, Well, I don't see anybody else.
Thank you, guys, a lot of fun tonight.
Speaker 9: It was fun man. Thanks having on us.
Speaker 1: Thank you for hopping on and helping out tonight. I'll
go out a goodnight