Speaker 1: So of course, you know, for the universe to come
Speaker 1: into being, it has to be created by someone. For
Speaker 1: it to continue functioning smoothly, there has to be a
Speaker 1: preserver or a manager. And at the end of time,
Speaker 1: because we believe time is cyclical, it's not linear. So
Speaker 1: there's creation, there's preservation, there's destruction, and then again creation begins.
Speaker 1: So somebody has to be responsible for that destruction bit
Speaker 1: as well. So we have three major gods. It is
Speaker 1: a Hindu trinity, just like you have in Christianity. There's
Speaker 1: a trinity. There's a trinity in Hinduism as well of
Speaker 1: Brahma who's the creator, Wishnood who's the preserver, and Shiver
Speaker 1: who's the destroyer.
Speaker 2: What is happening? And what is a sold out your glass?
Speaker 2: Because we're about to feel it up.
Speaker 3: All things continually lead back to serpents, dragons, fairies, nepheline
Speaker 3: and fallen angels. In the distance, looms a mystical mountain.
Speaker 3: As Mike Kaiser used to say, if it's in the
Speaker 3: Bible and it's weird, it's probably important. At its peak,
Speaker 3: a great fire burns, concealing the Prometheus lens.
Speaker 2: This development of this knowledge that's being talked about within
Speaker 2: the Mystery.
Speaker 3: Schools, an ancient artifact said to reveal the hidden truth
Speaker 3: within a deliberately darkened world. There is a hidden history
Speaker 3: that's been deliberately obscated from the people's little world. Join
Speaker 3: us as we travel and explore the vast unknown. It's
Speaker 3: a hero's journey with dragons to slay, damsels to save,
Speaker 3: and innumerable treasures to hoard torches high.
Speaker 2: The Smithsonian, they called wind of the Giant's help, would
Speaker 2: send their agents out to get it.
Speaker 3: But it takes courage to move forward, to move out
Speaker 3: of the shadows, out of the under reality that we
Speaker 3: think of this reality.
Speaker 2: We are all on the hero's journey.
Speaker 3: Mankind has been in contact with and influenced by extraterrestrials.
Speaker 4: Leave the citient mound of bull feathers out of it, you.
Speaker 5: Know, look at it from a different perspective, different perspective.
Speaker 4: Different pet What is happening and what is up?
Speaker 2: Hold out your glass because we are about to hit
Speaker 2: Welcome to the Prometheus Lens podcast, the place where the
Speaker 2: conversations are always enlightening. I'm your host, Justin and here
Speaker 2: we like to use the allegory of the Prometheus lens
Speaker 2: to take a second look at everything. Hey, if you
Speaker 2: new to the channel, welcome to the Hero's Journey. Hit
Speaker 2: that like button, hit that subscribe button, and if you
Speaker 2: don't care coming down.
Speaker 4: Below, we'll have our socials.
Speaker 2: Be sure to check us out on our various platforms
Speaker 2: to be much appreciated.
Speaker 4: And once again just to reach out guys.
Speaker 2: If you are an author, a researcher, had a supernatural
Speaker 2: experience something that would be an interesting conversation, feel free
Speaker 2: to go to the website, reach out to me, or
Speaker 2: even hit me up on my dms on social media.
Speaker 2: I'd love to sit down and have a conversation with you.
Speaker 2: But today, guys, we're going to dive into a subject
Speaker 2: that has been really fascinating to me. And I've not
Speaker 2: really just taken a deep dive yet. I was looking
Speaker 2: on YouTube into the Hindu belief and the Hindu mythology
Speaker 2: and all these different things, and I come across this
Speaker 2: man that was very well researched, very well spoken, and
Speaker 2: he has the doctor title in front of his name
Speaker 2: to even back up all of his smart talk too.
Speaker 2: So I actually reached out to this person. He was
Speaker 2: more than willing to come and sit down and talk
Speaker 2: with us today. So I'm just extremely thankful for this
Speaker 2: man and his time to sit down and talk with us.
Speaker 2: But i'd like to introduce for the first time the show,
Speaker 2: doctor venit Agrivall. I like to just thank you for
Speaker 2: coming on and welcome to the Prometheus Lands.
Speaker 4: Doctor Vanie.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much, Justin for having me on your show.
Speaker 1: It's a pleasure to be here, and thanks for all
Speaker 1: the kind words of introduction that you mentioned. I might
Speaker 1: add that I'm not a PhD doctor. I'm not a doctorate.
Speaker 1: I'm a medical doctor, and this just happens to be
Speaker 1: a passion that a bass you, so you know, just
Speaker 1: to be clear, I'm not a doctorate in Hindu scriptures
Speaker 1: or Hindu mythology, but it's definitely something that I've pursued
Speaker 1: since more than a decade now. So that's why I
Speaker 1: do sound a little intelligent.
Speaker 2: Well, if you don't care, just let everybody know a
Speaker 2: little bit about your past and how you got into
Speaker 2: this and just give everybody a feel for who you
Speaker 2: are for sure.
Speaker 1: So justin, as I said, or as you said, rather
Speaker 1: than I'm a doctor.
Speaker 5: So that's my basic education. I did my medicine and then.
Speaker 1: I did my management. Actually I did not pursue practice.
Speaker 1: I did not join a hospital. I decided to join
Speaker 1: the pharmaceutical industry. And I'm currently working in a pharma
Speaker 1: sector with an Indian pharmaceutical And during my work, I
Speaker 1: actually got to travel a lot, you know, I handle,
Speaker 1: I interact with a lot of international colleagues across Asia,
Speaker 1: sometimes Europe, Middle East Africa. And the more I traveled,
Speaker 1: the more I realized, you know, there is so much
Speaker 1: and there's so many similarities amongst the beliefs that we have,
Speaker 1: especially the traditional beliefs, you know, the traditional belief systems
Speaker 1: in each country, whether it's the African nations, whether it's
Speaker 1: just South East Asia, China, Japan, everything you know, comes
Speaker 1: from from it appears to come from a single source
Speaker 1: because there's just too many similarities for it to be
Speaker 1: a coincidence. And that's how I started to explore it.
Speaker 1: And I do have a decent knowledge of the Hitdo
Speaker 1: belief system. But then I decided to dig deeper and
Speaker 1: you know, find out all these similarities which were popping
Speaker 1: up everywhere, and I decided to put it down in
Speaker 1: a blog. And this was back in twenty eleven. So
Speaker 1: you know, blogs were the in thing at that time.
Speaker 1: You feel so old talking about blogs, but you know,
Speaker 1: it used to feel good to be called a blog up.
Speaker 1: And so this blog is called.
Speaker 4: You remember the dial up internet day is, don't?
Speaker 1: Yeah, So this blog is called Decored Hindu Mythology. And
Speaker 1: you know, so this the blog actually took off. You know,
Speaker 1: I did not know whether anybody would even you know,
Speaker 1: chance upon it because there was no Internet marketing, There
Speaker 1: was no Facebook promotions at that time.
Speaker 5: I did not know how to promote it.
Speaker 1: But to my surprise, there were people landing on those
Speaker 1: articles that I had put on in the blog through
Speaker 1: my research, you know, every day about a thousand hits,
Speaker 1: you know, from random people across the globe. And that
Speaker 1: actually kind of showed me that, you know, there is
Speaker 1: an interest in this topic, and there are others like
Speaker 1: me who are also trying to explore and understand these
Speaker 1: commonalities or similarities. Though primarily I have researched more into
Speaker 1: the Hindu myths, legends, and scriptures, but also tied them up,
Speaker 1: you know, with the similarities in different world religions, the
Speaker 1: ancient religions especially, and I think that's how it all started,
Speaker 1: and then then after they came the books and then podcasts, etc.
Speaker 1: So now I'm doing this on my weekends, and that's
Speaker 1: Friday night here in India and I'm sitting here talking
Speaker 1: to you.
Speaker 4: That's right, We're the weekend Warriors of the world.
Speaker 5: True.
Speaker 2: But yeah, like you said, we was even talking before
Speaker 2: the show started and how my path was very similar
Speaker 2: to yours, just looking through all these different things and
Speaker 2: all the commonalities and the common threads, and we even
Speaker 2: said before we got started that we are both We
Speaker 2: don't believe in coincidence theory. You know, there has to
Speaker 2: be an ancient source where all this stuff extends, and
Speaker 2: it's a journey, you know, you have to go out
Speaker 2: into the unknown and explore these things and bring back
Speaker 2: the treasures to share with the world.
Speaker 1: Definite, definitely, because there's just too much to explore.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 1: It's it's unfair on our part if we do not
Speaker 1: try to do that, whether it is of our interest
Speaker 1: or not, whether it you know, it catches your fancy
Speaker 1: or not. Uh, that's a different thing. But you will
Speaker 1: never know unless you actually start exploring. And there's so
Speaker 1: many movies that have come up now, especially you know,
Speaker 1: from Hollywood, there's so many movies that are based on mythology.
Speaker 5: Everybody knows.
Speaker 1: Everybody knows, you know, the Clash of the Titans, et cetera,
Speaker 1: the Percy Jackson movies, Harry Potter had so many references,
Speaker 1: you know, from Greek and Roman mythologies. So there is
Speaker 1: an interest, you know, in this the treasure that we
Speaker 1: have of knowledge from various ancient mythologies. And it would
Speaker 1: be foolish too, you know, not dig deeper and not
Speaker 1: try to find out, you know, if there is anything
Speaker 1: of value besides entertainment, if there is any knowledge, if
Speaker 1: there's any historical knowledge, if there's any scientific data, if
Speaker 1: there's any large that can be gleaned out of all
Speaker 1: these stories, and what are they trying to tell us?
Speaker 1: How can it help us in our everyday likes today,
Speaker 1: whether it is relevant or not. You know, we'll only
Speaker 1: find out if we explore them.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you can't rely on other people too, because
Speaker 2: anybody that knows the Noah's Ark story, for instance, when
Speaker 2: they come out with that movie Noah, yeah, yeah, I
Speaker 2: mean they did go off a lot of common biblical themes,
Speaker 2: but they took a lot of liberties and put a
Speaker 2: lot of exists be in on stuff.
Speaker 4: So it's like, you know, they tell you a partial truth.
Speaker 2: So if you enjoy the movies and stuff, you really
Speaker 2: need to read the material because there's so much more
Speaker 2: to find out and get your story straight by actually
Speaker 2: reading the material versus relying on someone else to give
Speaker 2: you the information.
Speaker 5: Definitely, definitely.
Speaker 1: In fact, Noah's arc has a battle in Hindu scriptures
Speaker 1: as well. And you know a lot of people l
Speaker 1: aanaware that you know, this is not just Abrahamic religion
Speaker 1: related myth. It is actually a belief that is held
Speaker 1: by many, many ancient cultures, you know, across geographies, right
Speaker 1: from Philippines to Africa, to the Native American civilizations to
Speaker 1: Sumeiria to Egypt. There's just too many coincidences, you know,
Speaker 1: there's too many people doing the same thing as what
Speaker 1: Noah had done. And interestingly, I was just recently visiting
Speaker 1: a temple in India. It's it's in the northern part
Speaker 1: of Indiana near the Himalayan mountains, in the himalaia As actually,
Speaker 1: and the place is called Manali. It's a hill station
Speaker 1: and I'd gone for a trek just ahead of Manali
Speaker 1: a couple of days trek a height and the place
Speaker 1: is actually named after Manu, who's the Hindu counterpart of Noah,
Speaker 1: and Manu is in Hindu scriptures, he's the first man.
Speaker 1: And interestingly, the root of the English word man is
Speaker 1: I think it is German or you know German route,
Speaker 1: which is Manus, which is very similar to Manu, which
Speaker 1: is the Sanskrit name of the first Man. And you know,
Speaker 1: it just hit me that, you know, it is not
Speaker 1: a coincidence. There has to be some relationship here and
Speaker 1: Manu's ship, the art, the Noah's art is supposed to
Speaker 1: have landed because the entire world was flooded, so where
Speaker 1: would it land at the highest peaks, So it makes
Speaker 1: kind of makes sense that it landed in the Himalayas,
Speaker 1: and you know the mountains where the ship landed. That
Speaker 1: particular place was called Manu Alay, which means the home
Speaker 1: of Manu or the aboard of Manu, which has now
Speaker 1: got corrupted into Manali. So it comes from Manu Alah
Speaker 1: and this is Manali. It is a popular head station.
Speaker 1: Many Indians visited and most of them still don't know
Speaker 1: that this is, you know, related to the Noazak story.
Speaker 5: So is this amazing?
Speaker 1: You know what you can find if you just keep
Speaker 1: your eyes and ears open and mind, especially your mind
Speaker 1: open and see the possibilities that could be there.
Speaker 4: Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2: It's hard to teach anybody anything if they already know
Speaker 2: it all. You know, you have to be willing to
Speaker 2: have these conversations. And wisdom is often found, in my experience,
Speaker 2: from the most unexpected places.
Speaker 4: And nobody's got it all right.
Speaker 2: So it's like everybody has a little piece of the
Speaker 2: golden puzzle.
Speaker 4: So we need to try to gather those.
Speaker 2: Pieces from as many people as we can and put
Speaker 2: together a whole picture.
Speaker 1: Yes, and we we hope we'll get a true picture, please,
Speaker 1: as close to the complete picture as we can by
Speaker 1: putting all the pieces together.
Speaker 5: And that's what you're doing. So that's great.
Speaker 1: I watched a couple of your podcasts, not complete, but I
Speaker 1: did get a sense of you know what, the kind
Speaker 1: of interactions you have is definitely useful, you know, to
Speaker 1: know whatever is available in the and whatever theories are there,
Speaker 1: whatever experiences people have had, and how it can actually
Speaker 1: give us a sort of a unified or holistic vision
Speaker 1: of where humanity is headed or where or where should
Speaker 1: we should be headed?
Speaker 5: Ideally?
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, because a lot of people who we like
Speaker 2: to get in our little tribal boxes, you know, and
Speaker 2: section ourselves off, and it's like a lot of times
Speaker 2: we forget, you know, we are one race.
Speaker 4: We are the human race, you know.
Speaker 5: Yeah, Man newst Children.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, I wanted to go through some of these
Speaker 2: stories and have you just go into detail and inform
Speaker 2: us on some of it. But I definitely wanted to
Speaker 2: hear about the creation and the flood story. And I
Speaker 2: know you touched on.
Speaker 4: That a little bit.
Speaker 2: But if we can, like this rewind a little bit
Speaker 2: and go to the creation and get that from your
Speaker 2: perspective in all the stories surrounding creation.
Speaker 1: Sure, so I think you know, the story of creation
Speaker 1: and Hinduism is a bit different from how it is
Speaker 1: told in the Abrahamic religions, and it is a little
Speaker 1: more it starts a little more abstract and then it
Speaker 1: becomes more concrete. So the oldest scriptures that we have
Speaker 1: in Hinduism, which is the Riga Da, you know, the Vedas,
Speaker 1: and they are believed to be at least from fifteen
Speaker 1: hundred PC one thousand and five hundred PC. That was
Speaker 1: when they were written down, but they existed for the
Speaker 1: longest time. They survived and they thrived through an oral
Speaker 1: tradition of passing down the scriptures. So we really don't
Speaker 1: know the antiquity of these scriptures, but it runs into
Speaker 1: thousands of years, you know, before.
Speaker 5: The common error.
Speaker 1: And the scriptures talk about and a primal man a
Speaker 1: cosmic porosh.
Speaker 5: So the so man is.
Speaker 1: Not literally a man or a male. It just means
Speaker 1: the primal being. So the primal being actually created this
Speaker 1: entire universe around us.
Speaker 5: That's what the riguea tells us.
Speaker 1: Now, the stories are more detailed in other scriptures, other
Speaker 1: Hindus scriptures, which are called the Puranas. The Puranas have
Speaker 1: detailed stories, you know, where whereas rigue that has prayer
Speaker 1: has more verses or hymns or prayers to the gods.
Speaker 5: They are the odes to the gods.
Speaker 1: But the Puranas detail the stories of the gods and
Speaker 1: the kings. So in the Puranas you find the entire
Speaker 1: creation story way beautifully narrated, and it begins with a
Speaker 1: form of Lord wish No, I'll have to give you
Speaker 1: a little bit of background before I go into the story. Right,
Speaker 1: So primarily. You know, a lot of people believe that
Speaker 1: Hinduism is a polytheistic religion. You know, we have multiple gods,
Speaker 1: just like the Greeks or the Romans did, or the
Speaker 1: Egyptians did. But that's only partially true. You know, what
Speaker 1: is actually believed in Hinduism is that all these multiple
Speaker 1: gods or multiple forms of the God, and they are
Speaker 1: actually emanating from the same supreme being. So there's one
Speaker 1: universal supreme being whom we know as God, and there's
Speaker 1: God manifests himself or herself itself let's be gender neutral here,
Speaker 1: but God manifests in various forms for various functions. So
Speaker 1: three of these major forms that we believe in Hinduism
Speaker 1: of the creator, the preserver, and the destroyer. So of course,
Speaker 1: you know, for the universe to come into being, it
Speaker 1: has to be created by someone. For it to continue
Speaker 1: functioning smoothly, there has to be a preserver or a manager.
Speaker 1: And at the end of time, because we believe time
Speaker 1: is cyclical, it's not linear. So there's creation, there's preservation,
Speaker 1: there's destruction, and then again creation begins, so somebody has
Speaker 1: to be responsible for that destruction bit as well. So
Speaker 1: we have three major gods. It is the Hindu trinity,
Speaker 1: just like you have in Christianity, there's a trinity. There's
Speaker 1: a trinity in Hinduism as well of Brahma who's the creator,
Speaker 1: Vishno who's the preserver, and Shiver who's the destroyer. So
Speaker 1: these are the three major gods, and besides them is
Speaker 1: the Shakti, which is energy, who's considered as the feminine
Speaker 1: aspect of God. So this is you know, the divine
Speaker 1: feminine who's also worshiped in Hinduism along with the male gods.
Speaker 1: So again, you know, these are symbolic. The male and
Speaker 1: female genders are very symbolic. But what it is trying
Speaker 1: to tell us is that, you know, there are different
Speaker 1: aspects to this universe, you know.
Speaker 5: And one concept cannot cover everything.
Speaker 1: You have to have multiple angers or multiple perspectives of
Speaker 1: understanding the supreme being of you know, the reality.
Speaker 5: So from here the creation begins.
Speaker 1: Now Brahma is the creator and Brahma emerges from Wishno,
Speaker 1: and very symbolically, you know, the A lot of people
Speaker 1: think of these stories as very fantastical, uh, you know,
Speaker 1: and they don't believe that it's actually true, but they
Speaker 1: are very symbolic stories. You know, Lord wish no who
Speaker 1: is giving rise to multiple universes. There's also the concept
Speaker 1: of multiverse in Indusen and it is said that every
Speaker 1: time wish Snow exhales, there is a universe that pops
Speaker 1: out from each of his body poor So you know
Speaker 1: we have I don't know a million, more than a
Speaker 1: million body poores probably, so there's millions of universes coming
Speaker 1: out of Vishnu's body every time he exhales.
Speaker 5: And when he is.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, I was gonna say, I was going to say,
Speaker 2: don't they say to you? And when he inhales, that
Speaker 2: is the destruction cycle exactly for every universe he creates.
Speaker 4: There's a brahma also.
Speaker 1: Yes, so when he inhales, the universes go back into
Speaker 1: his body and that is the life of the universe.
Speaker 1: The life of the universe is one breath of Wishnoo.
Speaker 1: So imagine the grand concept of God that is there
Speaker 1: in the Puranas. And for each universe the visional again
Speaker 1: manifest and another four other.
Speaker 2: Are you a hunter, a hiker, prepper, We're just someone
Speaker 2: that enjoys.
Speaker 4: The great outdoors.
Speaker 2: Well, if you are, you know that good quality gear
Speaker 2: it's hard to come back. Squat Survival Gear is an
Speaker 2: American veteran owned company and everything they make is one
Speaker 2: hundred percent American sourced.
Speaker 4: And what makes it.
Speaker 2: Even more badass is that they have a drypted inspired
Speaker 2: wine everything from Sasquatch to Mothman.
Speaker 4: Head on over to.
Speaker 2: Squats survival gear dot com and use the code p
Speaker 2: LP ten or ten percent.
Speaker 4: Off store wide. Hey, what is going on, guys?
Speaker 2: Hey? Are you enjoying the show? Are you just geeking
Speaker 2: out and binge watching every minute the promo on the
Speaker 2: podcast that you've got available? And now you've found yourself
Speaker 2: at the end of the line, like, Man, I've seen
Speaker 2: them all, I'm all caught up. Now, I just gotta
Speaker 2: wait till every Monday at eight pm Easter Standard for
Speaker 2: the Lives Heyden. Let you in on a little secret. Now,
Speaker 2: We've got this thing called the All Access Pass, and
Speaker 2: there is tons of exclusive members only content there. We
Speaker 2: have all kinds of episodes. You get these episodes forty
Speaker 2: eight hours early. You get monthly Q and a's, and
Speaker 2: access to the private Facebook community and so much more
Speaker 2: that is coming on down the line. And it's your
Speaker 2: way of supporting the show and help me to keep
Speaker 2: doing what I love to do and what you obviously enjoyed.
Speaker 2: So head on over to the website methiuslimspar guest dot com.
Speaker 4: Sanah, see you guys. On the other.
Speaker 1: Side again, another Vishnow form for that particular universe. And
Speaker 1: from that Vishnow, from his navel, emerges a lotus flower. Okay,
Speaker 1: that's a story, all right. So and in that lotus
Speaker 1: flower is Brahma, who is the first mortal being in
Speaker 1: that universe. Because Brahma has a fixed lifespan of one
Speaker 1: hundred years, which is the life of the universe. It's
Speaker 1: not human years, it's not human We're not talking about
Speaker 1: solar years here. We're talking about uh in truth. You know,
Speaker 1: if you do the calculation, it comes out to about
Speaker 1: three hundred and eleven trillion human years the life of Brahma.
Speaker 1: And this is the calculation that comes from the scriptures.
Speaker 1: So Brahma emerges, and again it's very symbolic. Vishno applies space,
Speaker 1: you know, the concept of Vishtu that you're talking about,
Speaker 1: because there's multiple universes coming out of him. He's space
Speaker 1: manifested as a deity, right, And Brahma is the material
Speaker 1: creation and from Brahma. So Brahma joining coming out from
Speaker 1: a lotus which is joined to Vishnu's naval. It's against
Speaker 1: symbolic of the umbilical cord that connects a child with
Speaker 1: its mother.
Speaker 5: Right. So this is the symbolism that you find in puranas.
Speaker 1: A lot of people just criticize the scriptures without understanding
Speaker 1: the meaning. But this these are this is what they're
Speaker 1: trying to show. That Vishnu is the parent of Brahma.
Speaker 1: Space is the parent of this material world. And along
Speaker 1: with uh which since we have discussed Vishnu and Brahma,
Speaker 1: the third entity on the trinity is Shiva. And Shiva
Speaker 1: he's also called Maha Kal. Kal means time and Maha,
Speaker 1: just as you have in Mahatma Dandhi. So Maha means
Speaker 1: great okay, So Shiva is Maha karl or great time.
Speaker 1: So yeah, you have the space aspect covered with whish snow,
Speaker 1: you have the time aspect covered with Shiva. And within
Speaker 1: the space time continuum exists the material creation and that
Speaker 1: is represented by Brahma. So that is the origin of
Speaker 1: this entire multiverse, not just our universe, not just our
Speaker 1: planet or our solar system, but the entire multiverse that
Speaker 1: is believed in Indism to exist. So I can go
Speaker 1: on and on, So please picture if you have any goes,
Speaker 1: any doubts.
Speaker 2: And that's as I was looking into this, because I
Speaker 2: do read a lot of other material and I know
Speaker 2: it's it's steeped with esoteric meaning in symbolism and allegory.
Speaker 2: So when I was reading into that, I was like, yeah,
Speaker 2: that's pretty cool. That's another trinity and it's time, space, matter.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, you see.
Speaker 1: That in energy, Yeah, defying feminine, you know, which is
Speaker 1: just you know, swirling around in this universe and matter
Speaker 1: and energy they keep transforming. So it's a very important
Speaker 1: role that energy also. Please so Brama now he's given
Speaker 1: the task of creating the world. So the steps that
Speaker 1: are again detailed in our puranas are also very symbolic,
Speaker 1: you know, in the sense that first is the existence
Speaker 1: of non tangible creation, the first couple of steps of
Speaker 1: the creation. There's about seven or eight steps that are detailed,
Speaker 1: but at least the first three happen even before Brahma
Speaker 1: is born, even before.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So sometimes it's called an egg, but it's generally a lotus.
Speaker 5: Is the golden lotus right from it.
Speaker 2: Okay, and as seeing some video they were talking about
Speaker 2: it was I'm trying to think it was Vishna or
Speaker 2: Vishnu laying on a large serpent with a thousand heads,
Speaker 2: and that an egg.
Speaker 1: Appears, right, So that is some puranas it's called the egg,
Speaker 1: so sometimes it's called the golden lotus. But from it
Speaker 1: comes Brahma, right, But so Vishnuda again, since you mentioned
Speaker 1: the serpent on which Vishnu lies is also representing time
Speaker 1: because that serpent is called ananta, which means endless.
Speaker 5: That serpent is also called shesher, which means remainder.
Speaker 1: So what is left when the entire creation is destroyed,
Speaker 1: it's still time is still there. You know, even if
Speaker 1: I do not exist today or this world does not
Speaker 1: exist today, time does not end.
Speaker 5: Time does not stop.
Speaker 1: It stops for me relatively subjectively, but not you know,
Speaker 1: in a universal manner. So again there's a bit of
Speaker 1: symbolism there. So Brahma is given the task of creation.
Speaker 1: So before Brahma is born, there's all these intangible substances
Speaker 1: which probably you know, the irons and the molecules and
Speaker 1: the elements, you know, floating around in the nuverse, the
Speaker 1: plasma that existed. And after this, you know, when Brahma
Speaker 1: starts creating, Brahma takes over. That's when forms come into being.
Speaker 1: And Brama first starts with uh, the immovable objects. So
Speaker 1: it's not right, you know there on the first day
Speaker 1: itself that he starts creating living beings. First, the living
Speaker 1: beings need a place to stay. He knows that task
Speaker 1: is to create living beings. But before that he has
Speaker 1: to do a lot of work, a lot of preparation.
Speaker 1: So there's the immove objects like the you know, planets,
Speaker 1: the landmasses.
Speaker 3: What.
Speaker 1: Of course, planets move, but they don't move out of
Speaker 1: their own volition, right, it's it's because of the effect
Speaker 1: of gravity. So for all practical purposes, they are immovable objects,
Speaker 1: immovable objects, but they are moving because of the force
Speaker 1: of a higher gravitational field or a stronger gravitational field.
Speaker 1: So Brahma creates all these places for living beings to
Speaker 1: stay in before creating them, and before creating beings that
Speaker 1: can talk, walk, eat, mate, he first creates the vegetation.
Speaker 1: So you know, that is a sustenance on which you know,
Speaker 1: these later lifeforms will thrive. So there's the vegetation that
Speaker 1: comes up. There's trees, there's plants, the you know, and
Speaker 1: thereafter there is the mention of some divine.
Speaker 5: Entities being created.
Speaker 1: Even before humans came, Brahma creates the rest of the
Speaker 1: entire pantheon.
Speaker 5: Which is there in Hinduism.
Speaker 1: So all the gods, the goddesses, the demons, the other
Speaker 1: divine beings, the semi divine beings, all of them come
Speaker 1: from Brahma through different processes, and then come the humans
Speaker 1: and humans when they're created, uh, Brahma assigns them this
Speaker 1: planet Earth's, and he gives Manu, whom we talked about earlier,
Speaker 1: the first man. And he gives Manu and his counterpart,
Speaker 1: who's called Shatrupah. Again it's symbolic, you know, Shatrupa means
Speaker 1: somebody who has a hundred poems. So, you know, initially
Speaker 1: when life was developing, you know, there was no fixed features,
Speaker 1: there was no fixed you know, all of us, even
Speaker 1: though all of us are humans, all of us have
Speaker 1: very different features, right, very different genetic maker, very different
Speaker 1: morphological makeup, you know, the racial differences that we had.
Speaker 1: So Shatrupa probably represents she's the mother of all these
Speaker 1: different light on human forms that are going to come right,
Speaker 1: so mandu and shocking.
Speaker 2: And the one thing I found fascinating was the name,
Speaker 2: Like how close it is because in different translations. I
Speaker 2: even wrote it down if I can find it, it was.
Speaker 4: It was Sarah.
Speaker 5: Yeah. So there's also a name called Shraddha, which is yeah,
Speaker 5: it is similar to Sarah.
Speaker 2: But I thought of Sarah in the Bible, you know,
Speaker 2: because Sarah and Abraham and she, you know, couldn't have
Speaker 2: a child and God blessed her with a child. So
Speaker 2: I thought of that correlation when I was looking into this.
Speaker 2: But before we go further, I thought the creation or
Speaker 2: the manifestation of Shiva that I thought that story was
Speaker 2: very fascinating.
Speaker 4: Could you touch on that we go any further.
Speaker 1: So, just as Vishnu has multiple forms, Shiva also has
Speaker 1: multiple bombs and you know, one form that form of
Speaker 1: time exists before immaterial. You know, it's a material whether
Speaker 1: the universe has come into being or not. Shiva is
Speaker 1: always there, just as Vishna is always there. But Brama
Speaker 1: emerges with the birth of the universe, and so do
Speaker 1: a couple of forms of Chivan Vishnu as well, you know,
Speaker 1: to assist him in the process. So this form of Shiva,
Speaker 1: which exists in this universe, who's a time deity of
Speaker 1: time so to say, you know, in our universe, he
Speaker 1: emerges from Brahma's forehead when Brahma is completely flabbergasted. Brahma
Speaker 1: is trying to create in the initial steps, He's trying
Speaker 1: to create life, but he's unable to do it. And
Speaker 1: the life forms that he does create, they refuse to
Speaker 1: help him in you know, further spreading, you know, or
Speaker 1: further taking over. There is responsibility of creating new life forms.
Speaker 1: So Brahma is, you know, a little sad, he's a
Speaker 1: little dejector, he's in a very negative dark zone. And
Speaker 1: that's when you know, from his forehead, which is the
Speaker 1: region of the third eye, you know, which we believe,
Speaker 1: which is actually corresponding to your penial gland, and you know,
Speaker 1: from here, from this region comes out a dark colored baby.
Speaker 1: And this baby's crying, so which is called rudan in Sanskrit,
Speaker 1: you know, crying is called ruden So Brahma tells him,
Speaker 1: don't cry, and that's why the baby is named Rudra.
Speaker 1: The one who was crying, and this is Shiva okay,
Speaker 1: and Shiva is asked again by Brahma to help him
Speaker 1: in this purpose of creation or spreading light, propagating light.
Speaker 1: And because it's a tedious job, right think of Brahma,
Speaker 1: You're just sitting and individually creating each being's.
Speaker 5: It's an ever ending and it's a thankless task. So
Speaker 5: he wants us.
Speaker 1: He wants somebody to help, somebody to suggest some way
Speaker 1: for it to become self propagating.
Speaker 5: And that's where Shiva comes in.
Speaker 1: So Shiva first divides himself into ten more of his kind,
Speaker 1: which is very suggestive of binary fission, you know, the
Speaker 1: the process through which the early life forms on this
Speaker 1: planet actually reproduced.
Speaker 5: There was no sexual reproduction.
Speaker 1: So the early life forms, through my tosses, they you know,
Speaker 1: there was binary fission, and they are propagated. And that's
Speaker 1: exactly what Shiva does. There is now instead of one,
Speaker 1: there's eleven ruthdras. So Brama's happy and then he asks
Speaker 1: him to go one step further, so from each of
Speaker 1: the rudras from the left hand side separates another entity
Speaker 1: and for the first time in this universe, we have
Speaker 1: a se peration of gender, and we have the Rudras
Speaker 1: and the rudra nis, who are the female forms of
Speaker 1: the Rudras. So now we have a male form and
Speaker 1: a female form, and thereafter the process of you know,
Speaker 1: sexual reproduction would come into play because still now there
Speaker 1: was no difference of sexes. Now there is two different genders.
Speaker 1: And that is how now copulation, the sexual or the
Speaker 1: coitus would become meaningful where a child can be conceived
Speaker 1: just by the help of the mother and the father
Speaker 1: and Brahma has no role to play in it. And
Speaker 1: that is how you know, the next steps of creation happen,
Speaker 1: of course, not by Shiva and not by Rudra himself immediately,
Speaker 1: but just the manifestation of the feminine principle gives idea
Speaker 1: to Brahma to create the female counterparts of all the
Speaker 1: male beings that he had created earlier.
Speaker 5: And one of them is I.
Speaker 1: Mean, he's called the thought born or mind born son
Speaker 1: of Brahma because Brahma did not have any raw material
Speaker 1: to create it. He was just thinking of you know,
Speaker 1: beings and they were coming into they were actually manifesting.
Speaker 1: So this being is called Dutch and his wife is
Speaker 1: called Prasuti. Now interestingly, again Prasuti means labor labor as
Speaker 1: in not in physical work, but labor as in a
Speaker 1: delivery room. So in sanscrit or in Hindi, we use
Speaker 1: the word prasuti couch for the labor room where the
Speaker 1: mother is about to deliver. That tells us that this
Speaker 1: is where, you know, the creation became self propagating after
Speaker 1: Dutch and prasuti, and Dutch is called a prajapati or
Speaker 1: he's the lord of the beings because it is his
Speaker 1: decis so for the populated this entire universe. So hinduscriptures
Speaker 1: do not talk just about the Earth. There are multiple
Speaker 1: locas that some believe are different dimensions, are different you know, realms,
Speaker 1: But there's different locas within this universe that I mentioned
Speaker 1: in the scriptures, and it is ductious progeny that have
Speaker 1: populated the entire.
Speaker 5: Universe or all these locos at least.
Speaker 2: Which I know, every culture, you know, they have various
Speaker 2: you know, stories and stuff, and I love hearing the
Speaker 2: ones that you're coming up with because they are ones
Speaker 2: that I've not heard. And that's why I'm just kind
Speaker 2: of sitting here like okay, because the one I had
Speaker 2: heard about it was.
Speaker 4: Basically the eggs split.
Speaker 2: And Brahma, and that was the heaven and the earth,
Speaker 2: and he made the material objects of the universe and
Speaker 2: earth and created the guy.
Speaker 4: And it was just a time of the gods.
Speaker 2: Where the gods were just you know, walking around Earth
Speaker 2: and enjoying Earth or whatever. And that Brahma and Vishnu
Speaker 2: crossed paths, and Vishnu was bragging how he was the
Speaker 2: supreme and all the creation, you know, worships him and
Speaker 2: all this stuff, and Brahma is like, well, they forget
Speaker 2: that I was the one that created it, you know,
Speaker 2: they praised me instead of you.
Speaker 4: And they kind of get into this head.
Speaker 2: Butt match, and then Vishnu says, well, if there's a
Speaker 2: god greater than me, then let him manifest. And then
Speaker 2: this huge pillar of fire shoots up from the earth
Speaker 2: in between them, and it has no end in sight,
Speaker 2: going into the ground or up into the space. So yeah,
Speaker 2: So Brahma turns himself into a goose and tries to
Speaker 2: fly up to see what's at the end, and at
Speaker 2: the same time, Issue turns itself into a bore and
Speaker 2: uses his tusks to dig and go down to try
Speaker 2: to find the bottom, and neither one can find the end.
Speaker 2: Then they meet back at where they were before, and
Speaker 2: both of them are saying there is no end inside.
Speaker 4: And then this is when Shiva steps from the flame.
Speaker 1: Yes, so all so interestingly, justin you know, let me
Speaker 1: give you another perspective to this, just as I started.
Speaker 1: You know, initially, I said, you know, there's a recognition
Speaker 1: in Induism that there's no one way to describe God.
Speaker 1: So there's multiple perspectives. And the puranas that I was
Speaker 1: talking about, the Indo scriptures that give us all these stories.
Speaker 1: Each of the puranas it tells us about a different
Speaker 1: day of Brahma. So Brahma's lifespan, as I said, you know,
Speaker 1: there's three hundred and eleven trillion human years, but if
Speaker 1: you break it down into Bruhma years, it is just
Speaker 1: one hundred bruma years. Each of his ear has you know,
Speaker 1: again months, three sixty days pell months, so thirty days.
Speaker 5: In each month. Now, each of this day of Brahma
Speaker 5: is called it culper. And each puran that we have, the.
Speaker 1: Scriptures, they narrate the stories of the events that happened
Speaker 1: in one day of Brahma. So the story that I
Speaker 1: am telling you it comes from a puran called Bagworth
Speaker 1: Puran which is from a different day. It is called
Speaker 1: the Sarasworth culp so that is a different day of Brahma.
Speaker 1: And then the story about Shiva emerging from the pillar
Speaker 1: of fire that comes from a schwat Culpa from a
Speaker 1: different puran shift Puran, which was written in the schwait
Speaker 1: culpur which is another day of Brahma. So what the
Speaker 1: puranas tell us is that there is different ways divinity
Speaker 1: manifests in different time periods. So even the whole multiverse thing, yes,
Speaker 1: and even in this lifespan of Brahma, there is still
Speaker 1: events that are happening in different ways.
Speaker 5: So that is why sometimes you.
Speaker 1: Have wish To emerging first and from him comes Brahma,
Speaker 1: and sometimes you have Shiva emerging as a pillar of fire.
Speaker 1: Sometimes it is the goddess who emerges first, and she's
Speaker 1: looked upon as the mother of the creation because she
Speaker 1: manifests the entire you know, she manifests the trinity itself,
Speaker 1: Brahma wish To enshiver. So there is no real competition,
Speaker 1: you know, between them, you know, between the different forms.
Speaker 1: It's just each of them takes up the responsibility or
Speaker 1: a different day of Brahma of creating things or manifesting
Speaker 1: things in a different way. So that is the beauty
Speaker 1: of the purans that fascinates me. That there is so
Speaker 1: many stories. You can never say that you know it all.
Speaker 1: There's just too much to read, and there's so many
Speaker 1: new fascinating aspects that come up every time you read.
Speaker 1: And even in the same Shiv Puran which has the
Speaker 1: mention of the pillar of Fire story, it mentions that
Speaker 1: Shiva to be the original form of Shiva. So as
Speaker 1: I said, Shiva has multiple forms, but it also contains
Speaker 1: this story of Shiva as Rudra emerging from from us forehead.
Speaker 1: So it does mention that there are different forms of
Speaker 1: Shiva and one form of Shiva emerges from from us forehead.
Speaker 1: So it all ties up, you know, in the grand
Speaker 1: scheme of sayings in the multiverse of madness that we
Speaker 1: have in Hinduism. It's it's just beautiful the way it
Speaker 1: all ties up. And it's almost like you know the
Speaker 1: Game of Thrones series, you know, for a lack of
Speaker 1: a better reference, where you know, you see a character
Speaker 1: in the first season and the same character turns up
Speaker 1: in the fourth season and you realize, oh this, I've
Speaker 1: seen this one before. And you know, this guy's connected here.
Speaker 1: So that's how deep the stories go. You know, it's
Speaker 1: if somebody had.
Speaker 2: The same thing, though you know that the details might
Speaker 2: change a little bit, but the overall arching theme is
Speaker 2: the same. But one thing I thought was it was
Speaker 2: intriguing to me, and I wanted to ask you specifically
Speaker 2: about that story because you know, as we talked before,
Speaker 2: I know it's steeped with esoteric stuff and symbolism, but
Speaker 2: in that particular story, it goes into great detail to
Speaker 2: describe Shiva, and Shiva is known as the destroyer and
Speaker 2: even the what was it called the the Lord of Demons? Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: but when it steps out, it talks about that third
Speaker 2: eye and that it was gleaming on fire and had
Speaker 2: a mace in one hand of a victory or judgment,
Speaker 2: I can't remember. But then it had a trident in
Speaker 2: the other hand and a snake coled around its neck.
Speaker 2: Like well, in your opinion and studies, like, what does
Speaker 2: those symbols mean?
Speaker 1: So I've explained a couple of more aspects more than
Speaker 1: this as well, you know, not just about Shiva, but
Speaker 1: also about Brahma and vishno, you know, just to make
Speaker 1: it a little more holistic. So since we started with
Speaker 1: Vishno earlier and I mentioned that, you know, Vishno is space,
Speaker 1: He's the deity of space.
Speaker 5: Why do I say that one? There's too many stories
Speaker 5: related to Vishno.
Speaker 1: Where he's manifesting the universe, He's manifesting the creation, he's
Speaker 1: creating the creator. The color of Hindu gods is always
Speaker 1: very different, right, it's it's Vishn is blue, just like
Speaker 1: the Avatar movies. You know, In fact, the word avatar
Speaker 1: comes from the Sanskrit scriptures. Avatar is the name of
Speaker 1: Vishno's incarnations that Vishnu takes, you know, to preserve the
Speaker 1: universe or the earth, and you know, to bring back
Speaker 1: the balance of good and evil in this world, which
Speaker 1: too comes down. So Ava taran from which the word
Speaker 1: avatar comes, it means descent. So wish now, the supreme
Speaker 1: Being is descending into our world, our loga, our dimension
Speaker 1: as an avatar, which is the concept, you know, which
Speaker 1: the movie also has. And they are also showing them blue.
Speaker 1: So Vishnu is blue. Why Vishno is dark? You know,
Speaker 1: he's either portray darth or blue. You know why, because
Speaker 1: he represents space. So it's either the darkness of space
Speaker 1: in which you can depict him or the blue sky
Speaker 1: in which you depict him.
Speaker 5: So you know, that's the symbolism that Vishnu has. As
Speaker 5: you know we.
Speaker 1: Discussed earlier, he lies down on the serpent of time,
Speaker 1: you know, the endless serpent of time, right.
Speaker 5: The infinite, the anantha or the shash the remainder.
Speaker 1: Now, Shiva is associated with time, as I said, you know, mahatal,
Speaker 1: he's a great time. So you always see symbolism of
Speaker 1: three with Shiva. So the trident has three spokes, right,
Speaker 1: so it's past, present, and future. So it's the three
Speaker 1: aspects of time. Shiva has a mark on his forehead.
Speaker 5: Which is like this.
Speaker 1: It is three lines which again depict you know, it
Speaker 1: can be interpreted in multiple ways.
Speaker 5: You know, it's a physical, mental, emotional, spiritual.
Speaker 1: Whatever, but primarily it tells us about the three forms
Speaker 1: of time.
Speaker 5: It's the past, the present, and the future. He also
Speaker 5: has the serpent of time oiled on around his neck.
Speaker 1: Whish to lie down on the serpent of time and
Speaker 1: Shiva has the time serpent coiled around his neck. Shiva
Speaker 1: has the newborn moon on his forehead. It's creating its
Speaker 1: forehead Shiva's forehead. Why because in Hinduism the calendar was
Speaker 1: a lunar calendar, so the phases of moon actually represent
Speaker 1: different dates. So you see the symbolism of moon comes
Speaker 1: in there. And there's so many beautiful ways in which
Speaker 1: you know, this is conveyed. A lot of people think that,
Speaker 1: oh it's this is how it is, you know, this
Speaker 1: is how Seva looks. But these are symbolic, right.
Speaker 5: Then he again holds a.
Speaker 1: Small drum in his hand. So in one hand is
Speaker 1: a trident and in the other hand he holds a drum.
Speaker 1: And this drum is the cosmic.
Speaker 4: Vibration, the musical spears.
Speaker 1: Yes, and this is the sound, the sound aspect, you know,
Speaker 1: even in Bible, as you know, they say that, you
Speaker 1: know in the beginning, was the word what is that word?
Speaker 5: That's the sound.
Speaker 1: It's the vibration, and that is the vibration that Shiva controls.
Speaker 1: And this frequency, this vibration that can be you know,
Speaker 1: uh utilized to also destroy at the end of time.
Speaker 5: You know, Shiva is the consumed dancer.
Speaker 1: He's you know, it's it's very surprising the contradictions that
Speaker 1: you see in his personality. He's the destroyer. He's the
Speaker 1: angry god, but he's also the consummate dancer. He's the
Speaker 1: best dancer. He's the lord of dance, is the king
Speaker 1: of dance. So he's called Nut Rajah. So Raja means
Speaker 1: king as in Maharaja and Raja. Right, So Raja is
Speaker 1: king and Nut is the dancer. So he's the king
Speaker 1: of dancers. And the cosmic dance that Shiva performs is
Speaker 1: the is the dance of destruction of this universe. So
Speaker 1: this dance of destruction again does not only happen at
Speaker 1: the end of this universus lifetime. But if you see
Speaker 1: every minute, every moment, there's something which is being destroyed
Speaker 1: and something which is being created new out of it.
Speaker 1: Out of the raw material that was destroyed, something new
Speaker 1: comes out. You know, we see it in the cycle
Speaker 1: of life. We see it in the you know, in
Speaker 1: plants and animals, in objects, in physical objects is entropy.
Speaker 1: Everything goes breaks down into pieces sooner or later. Right,
Speaker 1: So that is the concept of time. With time, destruction
Speaker 1: will happen. That is why Sheva is the time, is
Speaker 1: the destroyer. So he he's not a negative guy who's
Speaker 1: out there, you know, against everyone, but he is the
Speaker 1: concept of time. It but sooner or later everything will
Speaker 1: unrevel and you know, entropy will make you break down
Speaker 1: into pieces. So that's that's what he represents. Interestingly, Brahma
Speaker 1: has four heads, right, so if you if.
Speaker 4: You, if you see his that was the interesting story too.
Speaker 5: Has four heads and what does it represent? So I'm
Speaker 5: going to the symbolism here.
Speaker 1: There's many stories, you know to explain it, but the
Speaker 1: four heads actually represent the four dimensions of this universe.
Speaker 1: Because interestingly, there are stories about multiple other Brahmas. There's
Speaker 1: a very beautiful story about Krishna, who's again one of
Speaker 1: the very popular gods in Hinduism. And Brahma goes to
Speaker 1: visit Krishna in his palace when he's on Earth, and
Speaker 1: Brahma asks the watchman, you know that the door man,
Speaker 1: the doorkeeper that you know, to announce him that you know,
Speaker 1: Brahma has come, you know, the Lord, the creator has come.
Speaker 5: And Krishna smiles, you know.
Speaker 1: And Christian is always a very mischievous, naughty uh you know,
Speaker 1: he's all being, you know, and he's always involved in.
Speaker 5: Something more symbolic than you would realize.
Speaker 1: And Krishna tays a Watchman to go and ask him
Speaker 1: which Brahma is it, and Brahmas flabber aster.
Speaker 5: He's like, what does it mean? What does that question
Speaker 5: even imply?
Speaker 4: I am the creator and born and only.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that said, you know Krishna and why it's
Speaker 1: Brahma inside And he says, there are one hundred different
Speaker 1: Brahmas waiting to meet Krishna, and there are others who
Speaker 1: are surrounding Krishna, and all of them have multiple heads,
Speaker 1: some have ten heads, some have one hundred heads, and
Speaker 1: Brahma are Brahma is the one who has fore heads.
Speaker 1: And the only way I can make sense of it,
Speaker 1: of these multiple heads of Brahmas or different numbers of heads,
Speaker 1: is that if it represents the physical dimensions of this world,
Speaker 1: you know, the four dimensions that we live in. And
Speaker 1: there's an interesting story where Brahma actually was born with
Speaker 1: five heads, but Shiva of one of those and Brahma
Speaker 1: is left with pol So what does it trying to
Speaker 1: tell us? Maybe a universe was five dimensional to begin with,
Speaker 1: and Shiva we fail. Shiva, who's time with the time,
Speaker 1: it's settled into a more, you know, probably a more,
Speaker 1: a better equilibrium. It found a better equlibrium in the
Speaker 1: four dimensional space, so so much, so much, you know,
Speaker 1: symbolism exists in these stories that if you do not
Speaker 1: read them with open minds, they'll just appear as some
Speaker 1: fantastical stories written down by ancient storytellers. But they're clearly
Speaker 1: not just stories. They're meant to convey a lot more,
Speaker 1: a lot more meaning to us.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and like when you mentioned that from like
Speaker 2: just a biblical perspective, was the fall of Adam and Eve.
Speaker 2: He says that, you know, we were once in the
Speaker 2: garden of God and God walked with us, and then
Speaker 2: we broke the rules, so we were kicked out of
Speaker 2: Eden and out of the presence of God.
Speaker 4: So we, you know, fail.
Speaker 2: So it's like, you know, you can easily put together
Speaker 2: in your mind that we were designed to live forever,
Speaker 2: to be all knowing and be in the presence of God,
Speaker 2: and then when that happened, you know, Sin entered the world.
Speaker 2: So therefore, you you know, like we were maybe even
Speaker 2: changed on a molecular level, we were no longer self regenerating,
Speaker 2: and we fail, and we went from the possible fifth
Speaker 2: dimension down to the to the four where we are now.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and in fact, in our scriptures, justin you know,
Speaker 1: there's there's a clear mention that, you know, the human
Speaker 1: form is not to be taken lightly, you know, and
Speaker 1: there's a concept of trance might of souls because we
Speaker 1: believe in reincarnation and we believe in karma.
Speaker 5: So karma is your actions.
Speaker 1: So whatever you are doing today, good or bad, will
Speaker 1: have a reaction, which is the law of physics. Every
Speaker 1: action has an equal and opposite reaction. So the same
Speaker 1: applies to our lives as well. Some of those reactions
Speaker 1: or repercussions we see in our lifetime, some we do not,
Speaker 1: but they do carry on with our soul and they
Speaker 1: manifest in our next life, in our next birds. So
Speaker 1: we have this concept of transmigration across eighty four lack,
Speaker 1: which is eight hundred and forty thousand birds.
Speaker 5: After which you get the human form.
Speaker 1: So in our scriptures they tell us that once you
Speaker 1: have received this human form, you should not let it
Speaker 1: go waste. You are the only species. And interestingly, they
Speaker 1: are about eight hundred and seventy thousand. I'm sorry, this
Speaker 1: is not interne two thousands. It's close to eight point
Speaker 1: four million. The calculation, you know, because in calculation. We
Speaker 1: use different terms, so it's close to eight point four
Speaker 1: million lives that you pass through, progressing, evolving before you
Speaker 1: become a human. Science has I think about, identified about
Speaker 1: eight point seven million species on this planet. So there's
Speaker 1: eight point four million life forms that the scriptures are
Speaker 1: talking about are probably a different species that populate this planet.
Speaker 1: And it is just a reminder that there is so
Speaker 1: many life forms that do not have the conscience, they
Speaker 1: do not have the consciousness to understand the gravity of
Speaker 1: the human form that you have the opportunity that the
Speaker 1: human form provides. And see, I'm not a religious person,
Speaker 1: I'm not a you know, I'm not a preacher. I'm
Speaker 1: not talking from a religious perspective. I'm talking from a
Speaker 1: spiritual perspective. You know, what else is there in our
Speaker 1: life besides our physical aspects, the mental, intellectual aspects, you know,
Speaker 1: the emotional, uh, the social aspects of your life. There
Speaker 1: is some higher power. There's some higher being that you
Speaker 1: know we all feel at some point of time, right,
Speaker 1: whether you can call it God, whether it's the universe
Speaker 1: manifesting itself, spirit whatever, but this entity, you know, the
Speaker 1: goal of human life is to understand that there's something
Speaker 1: beyond this physical life. There's something beyond eating, eating, meeting,
Speaker 1: sleeping and you know, reproducing. There's something beyond this and
Speaker 1: that only the human form allows you to understand the
Speaker 1: existential questions of life. You know that humanity has Where
Speaker 1: have we come from? Why are the scientists looking for
Speaker 1: life across the knew us? You know, we're looking for aliens.
Speaker 1: We are hoping there are others. All these existential questions
Speaker 1: can be asked only by humans, so we definitely are special.
Speaker 4: There were definitely.
Speaker 2: I know, I don't want to take up all your time,
Speaker 2: We're getting close up to an hour, but I definitely
Speaker 2: want to pick your brain on what we touched on
Speaker 2: at the beginning of the show, or we talked about
Speaker 2: the Grateful Wood, because I thought your traditions of that
Speaker 2: account were really fascinating and just really cool story in
Speaker 2: how you know, you had mentioned the similarities and stuff,
Speaker 2: but could you go through that and break that down
Speaker 2: for us?
Speaker 5: Shut shut.
Speaker 1: So I'm not very good with a remembering names, so
Speaker 1: I may not be able to tell you, you know,
Speaker 1: the exact counterparts in each mythology. But just as you know,
Speaker 1: I'm sure a lot of people would be aware of
Speaker 1: the Noah's art story, you know, the biblic story, which
Speaker 1: also finds mentioned in a lot of you know, other
Speaker 1: Ibrahamic traditions. So in Hinduism, you know, we have the
Speaker 1: concept as I said, you know, Manu was born, right,
Speaker 1: So now the interesting aspect comes here, which is that
Speaker 1: there is no single Manu. There are multiple Manus that
Speaker 1: are created at different time periods. Just as I said,
Speaker 1: you know, there's different times of Brahma, different days of Brama.
Speaker 1: Each of these days is further broken down, you know,
Speaker 1: into hours and minutes counterparts to hours and minutes. They're
Speaker 1: not the exact same, but all these time periods have
Speaker 1: multiple manus. So every day of Brahma has fourteen manus.
Speaker 1: And the story of Noah actually you know, matches with
Speaker 1: the story of our seventh Manu, which is the present Manu.
Speaker 1: We believe that this is the present age of seventh
Speaker 1: Manu that we are living in of this day of Brahma.
Speaker 5: And this Manu. You know, this is an interesting story.
Speaker 1: Where so this Manu, he was a king, right, So
Speaker 1: again it's psychical. It's talking about you know, life already
Speaker 1: being present when a calamity happens, and this Manu is
Speaker 1: a king and he's praying in the river near the river.
Speaker 1: So we generally morning and evening we're supposed to offer water,
Speaker 1: you know, to the ancestors. We fill it in our
Speaker 1: palms and we just offer it, you know, towards east,
Speaker 1: towards the sun. So he's doing that right early morning,
Speaker 1: and he finds this tiny fish in his palms, uh,
Speaker 1: and you know, the fish is a talking fish apparently,
Speaker 1: and the fish you know, requests Manu not to throw
Speaker 1: it back into the water because it's afraid of all
Speaker 1: the bigger fishes out there. The fish asks Manu to
Speaker 1: give it shelter. Manu takes it home, puts it into
Speaker 1: a small vessel. The fish grows in size, you know,
Speaker 1: in a couple of hours, man who has to shift
Speaker 1: it to bigger vessel again, it grows up in size.
Speaker 5: The you know, fish keeps growing.
Speaker 1: Throughout the day and Manu has to continuously move that
Speaker 1: fish from one vessel to the other, to a pond,
Speaker 1: to a lake, to a river again and ultimately to
Speaker 1: the ocean.
Speaker 3: And the.
Speaker 1: Fish is you know, it's magnificent, it's golden, it's beautiful
Speaker 1: to look.
Speaker 5: At, but it is giant.
Speaker 3: It is.
Speaker 1: It is massive, and Manu is again stunned at what
Speaker 1: has happened, you know, and he then he realizes this
Speaker 1: is God, you know, trying to give him a message.
Speaker 1: And the fish tells Mano that seven days from that
Speaker 1: day there would be a deluge, a great deluge would come.
Speaker 1: There would be incessant range for forty days and forty nights, and.
Speaker 5: The entire world would be flooded.
Speaker 1: And the advice that the fish gives to Manu is
Speaker 1: to collect the raw material for restarting life after the
Speaker 1: flood settles down, So which includes you know, of course
Speaker 1: all the species, the plants, animals, the same story as
Speaker 1: we have as for Noah's art. Interestingly, there's another aspect,
Speaker 1: another layer to it, where the fish also asks Manu
Speaker 1: to take the seven Sages, the sages who are the rishis,
Speaker 1: who are the learned men of that time. So every
Speaker 1: time period of Manu, we have seven different stages, you know,
Speaker 1: who are like his advisors. So the fish advice is
Speaker 1: to also take the seven Sages with him on the ship.
Speaker 1: Why is this important because the seven Sages will ensure
Speaker 1: the continuity of information. They are the most learned people
Speaker 1: with all the data stward in their mind. It's like
Speaker 1: having a supercomputer with you. You know, when you are
Speaker 1: landing into Manali or Himalayas. You know, you land there,
Speaker 1: there's nothing existing there. You do not know how to
Speaker 1: restart life. And these are the sages, the learned men,
Speaker 1: who will share that knowledge with you, you know. So
Speaker 1: that's of course there's some differences there.
Speaker 5: Now.
Speaker 1: Interestingly, what I have, uh, you know, discovered, is that
Speaker 1: all the world mythologies from Africa to the Latin Americas,
Speaker 1: you know, to the uh as far down as Polynesia,
Speaker 1: you know, in Philippines, in Samaria, in Mesopotamia, in Egypt, of.
Speaker 4: Course North America to you the Indians, yes, yes, so.
Speaker 1: The Native American civilizations, all of them had the belief
Speaker 1: of a flood, of a you know, a flood that
Speaker 1: encompassed the entire land mass, you know, which drowned everything,
Speaker 1: and there was only one man or a couple, sometimes
Speaker 1: a brother and sister, who are sometimes a giant, you know.
Speaker 1: In the Norse myths, Norse myths, it is a giant
Speaker 1: and his wife who survived. Uh there's you know, in
Speaker 1: the in the Egyptian myths, I think it's the Horus
Speaker 1: who's a god who's uh, you know, traveling in a
Speaker 1: ship looking for a safe space, and he realizes that
Speaker 1: if I remember correctly, there's six creations that have drowned,
Speaker 1: and he finally lands in the seventh one, which probably
Speaker 1: is Egypt, you know, where you know, there was still
Speaker 1: land masks, and you know, so there are these tales
Speaker 1: from across the globe. How do you how do you
Speaker 1: explain it that, you know, how could these civilizations, you know,
Speaker 1: the Mayas or the you know Hindus, you know, separated
Speaker 1: by an ocean, by multiple landmasses and two oceans, you know,
Speaker 1: how did they develop the same story or the same
Speaker 1: legend or the same belief. So clearly there was some
Speaker 1: global catastrophe that did happen, you know, which resulted in
Speaker 1: all this flooding and the myths and the stories being created.
Speaker 1: And I personally feel that it points out to a
Speaker 1: time which did exist in our Earth's history, which is
Speaker 1: the Ice ages.
Speaker 5: You know, we have had cyclical.
Speaker 1: Periods again in Hindus in this deluge, it's called pralay,
Speaker 1: and prel is not one time phenomenon, you know, it
Speaker 1: is it happens at cyclical intervals, and the Ice Ages
Speaker 1: also happened at cyclical intervals. So the last ice age,
Speaker 1: you know, when the meltdown happened. And see what happens
Speaker 1: when the temperatures go down, the water is on up
Speaker 1: from the oceans and.
Speaker 5: It is converted into ice.
Speaker 1: But when the ice is melting, all that water goes
Speaker 1: back into the oceans, and the coast line would change dramatically.
Speaker 1: The sea levels would rise drastically. So imagine all these civilizations.
Speaker 1: Most civilizations have developed across the coasts, along the coast,
Speaker 1: along riverbanks, along water bodies, because.
Speaker 5: That is very essential.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 1: So even today you see the most populous or most
Speaker 1: prosperous or the biggest, you know, cities of this world,
Speaker 1: they're very close to the coast, you know, or they're
Speaker 1: very of course, you know, there may be trade centers,
Speaker 1: et cetera. But traditionally all civilizations came up along water bodies.
Speaker 1: So all these civilizations, whether it is in the Philippines,
Speaker 1: whether it is in Africa, whether it is in South America,
Speaker 1: all of them living along the ocean, suddenly.
Speaker 5: Find that, you know, their homes are gone.
Speaker 1: So I feel that, you know, that's one way to
Speaker 1: explain why all these diverse geographies or civilizations that emerge
Speaker 1: and diverse geographies. There was time periods, you know, there
Speaker 1: are thousands of years apart, you know, and still they
Speaker 1: have the same concept, same story, which was possibly passed
Speaker 1: down from their older generations. So somebody did remember that
Speaker 1: something a catastrophe like this had happened, and we have
Speaker 1: survived that, and they have passed down those stories. So
Speaker 1: that is how we get all this And that's my
Speaker 1: take on it. So I'm not sure, you know, how
Speaker 1: many people would agree with it. But we know ice
Speaker 1: ages happen. We know meltdown happens. It is inevitable after
Speaker 1: an ice age, So I mean, just putting two and
Speaker 1: two together, it kind of makes sense.
Speaker 4: To doctor Walt Brown. Are you familiar with him.
Speaker 2: He wrote a book called In the Beginning, and he
Speaker 2: worked for NASA, and he had a theory about some
Speaker 2: kind of catastrophic event happened, whether it was an earthquake, asteroid,
Speaker 2: or whatever. But he said a lot of people miss
Speaker 2: in the Noah's arc story that they just focus on
Speaker 2: the rain, he said, but when you read in the
Speaker 2: Hebrew Scriptures, it says that not only did the rains
Speaker 2: come from the sky, it also the Abyss burst forth
Speaker 2: from underneath the waters of the Abyss, he said, so's
Speaker 2: you can find that oceanic ridge fault line that wraps
Speaker 2: around the globe like the seam of a baseball, he said.
Speaker 2: When that asteroid hit or earthquake happened, he said, it
Speaker 2: just pushed all these continents further apart, he said, and
Speaker 2: all that water rushing up through up Earth and earth
Speaker 2: and soot, and he said, that explains the pelts on
Speaker 2: the near side of the moon, he said. And then
Speaker 2: all the plate tectonics happening made volcanoes erupt and ash
Speaker 2: sit when they are darkened. The sun lowered the temperatures
Speaker 2: on Earth, he said, and then slowly brought on the
Speaker 2: first ice Age. And then maybe like you know, twelve
Speaker 2: thousand years ago, we had that same bailt of comets
Speaker 2: come through, and that's where you get the young a
Speaker 2: dryass event. It hit all these ice caps and rapid
Speaker 2: mail and got another flood.
Speaker 1: Yes, we don't know what exactly causes it, what exactly
Speaker 1: leads to it. You know, there's a lot of theories.
Speaker 1: Of course, there's asteroids, comets. There's also the concept of
Speaker 1: the precession of equinoxes, the tilt of the axis, that
Speaker 1: Earth's axis might change, which does happen. You know, it's
Speaker 1: also a cyclical phenomenon, so we really don't know what
Speaker 1: would actually trigger, but definitely it all ties up. You know,
Speaker 1: there are situations that arise again and again, and that
Speaker 1: is when you know, a civilization was surviving at that
Speaker 1: time or thriving at the time, would find it difficult
Speaker 1: to survive, you know, in these circumstances, and those stories
Speaker 1: would be imprinted upon their minds and their scriptures, and
Speaker 1: that is how they're passed down, and that is why
Speaker 1: we all of us have these stories coming down to us.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and when you get that story too, I thought
Speaker 2: it was fascinating how it said that it was Vishnu
Speaker 2: right that appeared as this fish.
Speaker 1: It was a manifestation because he's a preserver and he
Speaker 1: he is the avatar. He takes the avatar of the
Speaker 1: fish to warn humanity that you know, this is this
Speaker 1: is what's coming, so save yourselves.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then that the horn grew up out of
Speaker 2: his head and that he used I can't remember the
Speaker 2: name of the snake, but it said he had a
Speaker 2: snake that he used to wrap around the horn and
Speaker 2: then raped its body around the boat.
Speaker 4: Yes, and tugged it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's sneak.
Speaker 4: And then you told me it was it was symbolic
Speaker 4: for time too, exactly.
Speaker 1: And it's actually the snake that Shiva has around his neck.
Speaker 1: So it's a serpent of time, you know, so clearly
Speaker 1: you know, And there's there's more. There's more symbolism there actually,
Speaker 1: justin you know, if you if you read the Puranas,
Speaker 1: they're fascinating scriptures. Okay, if you don't get bogged down,
Speaker 1: but too many details, and if you like a good story,
Speaker 1: you know, just just deep dive into it. So in
Speaker 1: the Puranas, our milky way, you know, the universe, or
Speaker 1: the rather the it's actually the universe.
Speaker 5: That we see at the night is the milky way.
Speaker 5: We call it milky way. Right. It's a galaxy, so
Speaker 5: galax sy. It appears curved right in the sky.
Speaker 1: There's a slight curve, and in our Puranas it is
Speaker 1: called it is it is uh equated with the shape
Speaker 1: of a jumping dolphin. Okay, now that fish could actually
Speaker 1: present the jumping dolphin. The universe, you know, the milky Way, right,
Speaker 1: and the subter ishy the seven Sages. It's actually the
Speaker 1: constellation of Big Dipper, the Great Beer constellation in Sanskrit
Speaker 1: and h most in their languages, we still call it
Speaker 1: subter Ishi, which means seven sages. And that is the
Speaker 1: constellation that you see very clearly in the northern hemisphere,
Speaker 1: which points you towards the North Star, the Pole Star,
Speaker 1: which again has a lot of significance and enzosen. So
Speaker 1: there you have a story where you see the Milky
Speaker 1: Way probably tilting, maybe the Earth's axis tilted right, and
Speaker 1: you see some connection between that, you know, the curve
Speaker 1: that you see and the Big Dipper constellation. There's probably
Speaker 1: a comet, you know, which is coming in that direction.
Speaker 1: It's linking them because comets have these long tails, the
Speaker 1: tails of et cetera. You know, which was trailing behind it.
Speaker 1: It's probably a tail that is equated with that snake,
Speaker 1: you know, tying up. And I don't know, you know
Speaker 1: what observation they noticed or they may have noticed. But
Speaker 1: again it's it's again my crazy idea.
Speaker 5: You know that it could probably I don't think you're crazy,
Speaker 5: you're just kying it.
Speaker 1: But I think it is quite possible that they're trying
Speaker 1: to tell us something, even more deeper, you know, than
Speaker 1: the concept of space and time. It's actually telling us
Speaker 1: about a tilt in Earth's axis or tilt in the
Speaker 1: Earth's orbit. You know, there's something called the Milankovich cycles.
Speaker 1: I don't know whether I pronounced it correctly, it's I
Speaker 1: think it's called the Milankovich cycles. And so there's these
Speaker 1: three recorring things that happen with our Earth. One are orbit, uh,
Speaker 1: you know, from an ellipse, it changes into a circle again,
Speaker 1: goes back into an ellipse, and this happens across four
Speaker 1: hundred thousand years or so.
Speaker 5: Okay, then you have the tilt up axes.
Speaker 1: Earth's axis tilts between I think about twenty one degrees
Speaker 1: and the higher tilt is about twenty.
Speaker 5: Four degrees or something.
Speaker 4: Twenty five degrees.
Speaker 1: So between that range this change happens around forty one
Speaker 1: forty two thousand years, and the precession of equinoxes happens
Speaker 1: around twenty six thousand years. So imagine a time if
Speaker 1: all of this is happening, you know how crazy it
Speaker 1: would be. And even if one of this is happening
Speaker 1: the universe the sky line would shift, you know, for
Speaker 1: someone who's observing it, and probably that is what they've
Speaker 1: tried to narrate in that story. So God knows, you know,
Speaker 1: we can only yeah, we can only this, We can
Speaker 1: only figure out we can to figure out.
Speaker 5: But I hope, I hope.
Speaker 1: You know, these are pointers for humanity to look deeper
Speaker 1: into what has been passed down to us, all this knowledge,
Speaker 1: you know, the knowledge of the Seven Sages preserved for us,
Speaker 1: you know, for humanity. Many civilizations have that kind of
Speaker 1: belief that you know, they were the ancient men or
Speaker 1: ancient people, you know, whochy right, so they had they
Speaker 1: passed down this knowledge. So we believe these were the
Speaker 1: Seven Sages, who are you know, still existing and they
Speaker 1: passed down this knowledge to us and we believe they
Speaker 1: live in the Big Dipper constellation. So that's how it's
Speaker 1: called the Subsucy, you know. So so it could be
Speaker 1: aliens coming down to say as it could be you know,
Speaker 1: there's so many possibilities.
Speaker 5: There's just too much.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, And when you like read that book it's
Speaker 2: called Hamlet's Meal, that's one of my favorite books, and
Speaker 2: it's talking about all the mythologies of the world and
Speaker 2: not only how they are all similar, how these three
Speaker 2: authors got together and wrote this. It was they called
Speaker 2: it an essay, but this thing was like that big.
Speaker 2: But they went through and said that all of the
Speaker 2: major miss throughout the world point back to astronomical events
Speaker 2: and constellations and in the stars. So it's right in
Speaker 2: line with what you're talking about. So that's why it's like,
Speaker 2: now you don't sound crazy to me. I've read this stuff.
Speaker 2: Good well, doctor Bena, thank you so much for your time.
Speaker 2: I'm so so appreciative, And whenever you got some free
Speaker 2: time to come back again, I would love some more conversations.
Speaker 2: I want to try to soak up as much from
Speaker 2: you as I can.
Speaker 1: My pleasure justin thank you again for having me here
Speaker 1: on your show. And I hope my accent was not
Speaker 1: too difficult to understand. And I hope your audience, you know,
Speaker 1: we're all so kind and useful, you know, to know
Speaker 1: these stories. And of course you know, one message that
Speaker 1: I would want to leave, you know, with you and
Speaker 1: your audience is that, you know, do explore the Eastern myths,
Speaker 1: you know, or the legends or the scriptures, because there's
Speaker 1: a very superficial level of knowledge that you'll get from
Speaker 1: online sources.
Speaker 5: You know, it's very superficial, it's very basic.
Speaker 1: It has been written down by people who do not
Speaker 1: understand the religion, who do not understand the significance of
Speaker 1: a lot of things, just as I shared. But if
Speaker 1: you're really interested, I do not see it as you know,
Speaker 1: the stories of Hindus or the stories of Indians. I
Speaker 1: see it as the stories of mankind. You know, these
Speaker 1: are stories that were passed down to us bad and
Speaker 1: sistors when probably all of us were one society, right,
Speaker 1: And you know, it's our responsibility to find out more.
Speaker 1: It's our it should be our endeavor to find out
Speaker 1: more and to know, you know, what they wanted to
Speaker 1: with us, what the wisdom they wanted to pass down
Speaker 1: to us, and how it can be useful to us
Speaker 1: as numerous ways we can you know, utilize it to
Speaker 1: make our lives better, not just you know a lot
Speaker 1: of people know about yoga, but you know it's not
Speaker 1: just about that.
Speaker 5: It's about you know, connecting with your.
Speaker 1: Environment, connecting with your universe in a more holistic manner,
Speaker 1: in a more conducive manner, you know, just helpful for
Speaker 1: you for your growth as well as a sustained uh
Speaker 1: you know, environment sustainable future, for the entire world, for
Speaker 1: the universe. So that's my message and thank you again
Speaker 1: for having me are justin. Wish you all the best
Speaker 1: for all your podcasts, and do let me know how
Speaker 1: this one performs.
Speaker 4: Oh definitely.
Speaker 2: And before I'll let you go, let everybody know where
Speaker 2: they can find you, know, your website, your books, where
Speaker 2: can they connect with you and find your stuff site?
Speaker 1: But I think if you could just search my name,
Speaker 1: doctor vini Agarwala, I have a very different way to
Speaker 1: spell my name, which probably would have to write down
Speaker 1: in your description. But if they search my name, they
Speaker 1: can probably find you know, books and blog. The blog
Speaker 1: is especially you know, for people could be interested people
Speaker 1: who are interested in reading more. I think the blog
Speaker 1: could could be a good place to start rather than
Speaker 1: jumping into a big put on or a big scripture.
Speaker 1: So because that's kind of a summary of all these
Speaker 1: and I think you found me through you didn't find
Speaker 1: me through the blog, but you did go through the
Speaker 1: blog or did you find it useful?
Speaker 4: Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2: That's why I've said I find your stuff in these
Speaker 2: little videos and kind of get my toesy and so
Speaker 2: but yeah, I definitely want to get a reading list
Speaker 2: and some recommendations from you for my future deep dives.
Speaker 5: For sure, thank you, thank again.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, guys, I hope you enjoy that. Go check
Speaker 2: out his h his work, he's he's all over YouTube
Speaker 2: and his blog. Uh As you can see, he's a
Speaker 2: very very intelligent guy and well spoken, well researched and
Speaker 2: uh so, until next time, guys, Torch is high.