WEBVTT 1 00:00:02.200 --> 00:00:04.839 You see somethings going to happen. 2 00:00:06.320 --> 00:00:10.599 What's going to happen? 3 00:00:17.039 --> 00:00:28.399 A Welcome to the Occult Rejects. Today's episode, we got 4 00:00:28.440 --> 00:00:30.920 a very very special guest. I'm very excited to have 5 00:00:31.000 --> 00:00:34.320 this man on. But before we get to uh Toby Chapel, 6 00:00:34.359 --> 00:00:37.640 we will introduce the other rejects on tonight. Tonight, I 7 00:00:37.679 --> 00:00:41.119 got with me Lisa the cult reject mad scientist. What 8 00:00:41.200 --> 00:00:42.240 is up, Lisa? How are you? 9 00:00:43.200 --> 00:00:44.759 I'm good, I'm good, wesome. 10 00:00:44.880 --> 00:00:47.200 Thank you very much for showing up tonight, and uh 11 00:00:47.359 --> 00:00:49.039 you is there anything you want to plug all rnything? 12 00:00:50.240 --> 00:00:53.079 Sure, I'm a guilt research institute dot orren. Go check 13 00:00:53.119 --> 00:00:55.079 out some of the stuff that we've got going on there, 14 00:00:55.119 --> 00:00:59.200 people writing some of their contributions there if you want 15 00:00:59.240 --> 00:01:01.520 to absorb media in that form. 16 00:01:01.640 --> 00:01:04.400 Thank you awesome, Thank you very much. And we also 17 00:01:04.480 --> 00:01:06.280 got Gin the Ninja jin What is going on? 18 00:01:06.319 --> 00:01:06.480 Sir? 19 00:01:06.519 --> 00:01:08.439 Thank you very much, and let everybody know where they 20 00:01:08.480 --> 00:01:09.239 can find your work. 21 00:01:10.239 --> 00:01:16.519 Sure, thanks boss, and thanks Lisa, Ethan and Robbie and Toby. 22 00:01:16.560 --> 00:01:18.680 I'm really excited to speak with you. I don't know 23 00:01:18.680 --> 00:01:21.640 how much I'll have to contribute, but I'll try. I'm 24 00:01:21.920 --> 00:01:24.519 Nick knows I was very chattery before we started recording. 25 00:01:25.000 --> 00:01:28.319 So you can find my show A Threshold Saints on 26 00:01:28.400 --> 00:01:31.159 Spotify and Apple and anywhere you get your podcasts. Can 27 00:01:31.200 --> 00:01:34.000 follow me on Twitter or x at Wukong Reborn to 28 00:01:34.079 --> 00:01:37.680 be a Ukong Reborn or at the show account Threshold Saints. 29 00:01:38.079 --> 00:01:39.280 Awesome, Thank you very much. 30 00:01:39.680 --> 00:01:42.560 D D's episode just dropped, oh five minutes ago. 31 00:01:42.599 --> 00:01:47.719 So it's awesome. And Robbie Marx, what is going on, sir, storyteller? 32 00:01:47.840 --> 00:01:50.959 Let everybody know where they can find you. Oh you 33 00:01:51.079 --> 00:01:52.000 muted again? My man? 34 00:01:52.200 --> 00:01:55.239 Yeah, how's everybody doing? Thanks for having me on. This 35 00:01:55.280 --> 00:01:57.719 is gonna be a fun one. If anybody wants to 36 00:01:57.760 --> 00:01:59.879 check out my other stuff, you can check out my 37 00:02:00.040 --> 00:02:03.079 link tree at our m A r X and that'll 38 00:02:03.079 --> 00:02:03.799 pull up everything. 39 00:02:04.200 --> 00:02:06.760 Awesome. Thank you, Thank you, sir. Last but not least 40 00:02:06.840 --> 00:02:08.039 Ethan Indigo. 41 00:02:09.599 --> 00:02:10.199 Always. 42 00:02:10.360 --> 00:02:12.840 Thanks Nick for putting this together. Everyone. 43 00:02:12.879 --> 00:02:14.520 It's honored to be here with you all. And I'm 44 00:02:14.520 --> 00:02:18.439 excited to hear what Toby all say talk about. And 45 00:02:18.599 --> 00:02:23.319 I have a couple of books on Amazon and website 46 00:02:23.400 --> 00:02:25.319 I believe is down below, and I'm going to be 47 00:02:25.439 --> 00:02:28.080 dropping an article as soon as I can get my 48 00:02:28.800 --> 00:02:32.400 junk together on Occult Research Institute and the next day 49 00:02:32.479 --> 00:02:33.039 or two. 50 00:02:33.000 --> 00:02:34.560 I keep pulling you on the show too, so I'm 51 00:02:34.560 --> 00:02:37.080 sure that takes time away. Thank you. 52 00:02:37.120 --> 00:02:42.599 No, my, that's not my excuse for not writing. Certainly 53 00:02:42.599 --> 00:02:46.639 there I have better, more more lag than that. 54 00:02:47.639 --> 00:02:49.840 Well, thank you all for joining us. And finally, finally 55 00:02:50.159 --> 00:02:54.479 to the guest himself, Toby, please introduce yourself. Let everybody 56 00:02:54.599 --> 00:02:56.840 know like where they can find your books, and maybe 57 00:02:56.840 --> 00:02:58.719 give a little bit of background about who you are. 58 00:03:00.199 --> 00:03:03.639 Sure. So, my name is Toby Chappel. I am an 59 00:03:03.680 --> 00:03:07.080 author here to talk about my second book tonight, and 60 00:03:07.240 --> 00:03:10.199 maybe the first one too. We'll see when any questions 61 00:03:10.199 --> 00:03:14.240 come up around that. First one was Infernal Geometry in 62 00:03:14.280 --> 00:03:17.039 the Left Hand Path, which is now six years old. 63 00:03:17.159 --> 00:03:19.680 I believe it or not, I certainly can't believe it. 64 00:03:20.479 --> 00:03:23.560 And then coming out I'm not sure when this will air, 65 00:03:23.680 --> 00:03:27.360 but coming out soon April eighth, is The Languages of Magic. 66 00:03:28.800 --> 00:03:34.639 And my background for this is I've long had an 67 00:03:34.719 --> 00:03:39.439 enthusiasm for things that are weird, whether it's things that 68 00:03:39.479 --> 00:03:42.439 are not of this earth. You know, I've been an 69 00:03:42.439 --> 00:03:47.000 amateur astronomer for most of my life, but also reading 70 00:03:47.159 --> 00:03:50.879 things often the wild and strange corners of what's possible. 71 00:03:51.599 --> 00:03:55.919 I've long been fascinated by language, how we use language 72 00:03:55.919 --> 00:03:57.800 to community, just to communicate with each other, which is 73 00:03:58.000 --> 00:04:00.960 obviously a very important part of it, but also, as 74 00:04:01.000 --> 00:04:03.039 I write about in the Languages of Magic, how we 75 00:04:03.159 --> 00:04:08.680 use language as part of magic itself. My theory, which 76 00:04:08.719 --> 00:04:10.800 I argue for very strongly in the book, is that 77 00:04:10.879 --> 00:04:14.599 magic is at its core process of communication, and I'm 78 00:04:14.639 --> 00:04:16.319 sure we'll be talking quite a bit more about that 79 00:04:17.199 --> 00:04:20.040 by other means of background. I am a master of 80 00:04:20.079 --> 00:04:22.519 the Temple in the Temple of set I have been 81 00:04:22.560 --> 00:04:26.000 part of that organization for will be twenty five years 82 00:04:26.720 --> 00:04:31.360 coming up this fall. But before that, I've been interested 83 00:04:31.360 --> 00:04:33.759 in many things that the Temple is interested in, namely, 84 00:04:34.279 --> 00:04:36.800 what does it mean to be a self and what 85 00:04:36.800 --> 00:04:41.240 does it mean to create more of what that self is, 86 00:04:41.759 --> 00:04:44.959 Whether that's becoming more potent and powerful out in the world, 87 00:04:45.040 --> 00:04:48.040 whether it's becoming more able to meet your own goals 88 00:04:48.319 --> 00:04:52.120 and ideas and ideals, and what that may mean for 89 00:04:52.199 --> 00:04:55.279 us when we're no longer have this meat sack to 90 00:04:55.279 --> 00:04:58.439 carry around and give our consciousness something to manifest through. 91 00:05:00.040 --> 00:05:04.160 That's been a lifelong fascination of mine as well. I 92 00:05:04.199 --> 00:05:07.000 spent a number of years in the bit minds as 93 00:05:07.040 --> 00:05:10.800 I like to call it, aka the tech industry, but 94 00:05:11.199 --> 00:05:16.160 finally departed from that white last year and uh have 95 00:05:16.199 --> 00:05:20.240 returned to private study to continue some of my deeper, 96 00:05:20.720 --> 00:05:24.920 uh deeper thoughts than just uh what sort of system 97 00:05:24.920 --> 00:05:27.759 to set up this week to serve some corporate overword. 98 00:05:28.839 --> 00:05:31.199 Uh that sounds good. 99 00:05:31.879 --> 00:05:34.319 Let's let's let's start from there and see where it goes. 100 00:05:34.879 --> 00:05:38.920 Awesome, awesome. Uh. I guess if you don't I mean, 101 00:05:38.959 --> 00:05:42.800 if you don't mind what you did, you could you 102 00:05:42.879 --> 00:05:45.480 maybe give a little bit of an idea, I guess, like, 103 00:05:45.560 --> 00:05:47.920 what was your experience like with the Temple of Set? One? 104 00:05:47.959 --> 00:05:49.639 I have one question I did want to ask, is 105 00:05:49.639 --> 00:05:52.000 that I do think on your one of your books, 106 00:05:52.000 --> 00:05:54.720 your last book. Michael Aquino did the forward for did 107 00:05:54.759 --> 00:05:55.399 You Actually Know? 108 00:05:56.959 --> 00:06:00.120 Yes, I knew doctor A Queena very well well a 109 00:06:00.160 --> 00:06:04.399 guest in his home several times. He was very supportive 110 00:06:04.439 --> 00:06:08.079 of that book because it was based originally in a 111 00:06:08.120 --> 00:06:12.439 large part among something that he wrote. When so, as 112 00:06:13.480 --> 00:06:16.399 some of your readers, our listeners may not know, the 113 00:06:16.439 --> 00:06:21.839 Temple of Set originally began as sort of a a 114 00:06:21.920 --> 00:06:25.000 sequel of sorts to what certain people saw in the 115 00:06:25.040 --> 00:06:28.120 early years of the Church of Satan in nineteen seventy five, 116 00:06:28.160 --> 00:06:29.920 there was a bit of a disagreement with Anton Leave 117 00:06:30.079 --> 00:06:33.040 about the direction he wanted to take things in. Some 118 00:06:33.079 --> 00:06:36.759 people took that as a as a betrayal of what 119 00:06:36.839 --> 00:06:40.959 the church was originally about, and they left and then 120 00:06:41.240 --> 00:06:42.959 up forming the Temple of Set. And why it was 121 00:06:43.000 --> 00:06:45.680 Temple of Set and not not Temple of Satan or 122 00:06:45.720 --> 00:06:48.639 something along those lines is as much longer topic, but 123 00:06:48.680 --> 00:06:53.160 we can also talk about that if need be. But 124 00:06:53.360 --> 00:06:55.759 the so the Temple kind of has its roots in 125 00:06:55.800 --> 00:06:58.360 the Church of Satan. When Anton Olive was writing the 126 00:06:58.399 --> 00:07:01.959 Satanic Rituals, which came out in seteen seventy two, he 127 00:07:02.120 --> 00:07:04.079 was sort of pressed for a deadline and he asked 128 00:07:04.600 --> 00:07:07.680 a Quino, who was sort of his left hand man, 129 00:07:07.720 --> 00:07:10.120 if you will, at the time, to contribute a couple 130 00:07:10.120 --> 00:07:14.240 of things to it, or along basically ideas about how 131 00:07:14.279 --> 00:07:20.160 one might use the fiction of HP Lovecraft to create magic. Lovecraft, 132 00:07:20.240 --> 00:07:23.759 as most people know, was a staunch materialist, was very opposed, 133 00:07:24.040 --> 00:07:27.399 very skeptical about the idea of magic itself. So it's 134 00:07:27.399 --> 00:07:29.839 a bit strange to take something from someone who was 135 00:07:29.879 --> 00:07:32.560 that skeptical about the idea and then turn it into 136 00:07:32.600 --> 00:07:34.759 something you can actually use. But one of the things, 137 00:07:34.800 --> 00:07:36.120 and I talk about this quite a bit in the 138 00:07:36.199 --> 00:07:38.920 languages of magic as well, one of the things about 139 00:07:38.959 --> 00:07:42.480 that is it doesn't matter if something like that is real, 140 00:07:42.639 --> 00:07:45.399 or even if its author thinks that there is reality 141 00:07:45.439 --> 00:07:47.800 to it, you can't use it as part of the 142 00:07:47.839 --> 00:07:50.480 things that the mind is capable of creating. You can 143 00:07:50.600 --> 00:07:53.720 use it as part of our imagination. But it's not 144 00:07:53.759 --> 00:07:57.560 just imagination. It's not just spinning a story. It's creating 145 00:07:57.600 --> 00:08:02.240 something new out of those pieces. We we have this 146 00:08:02.439 --> 00:08:05.240 strange ability as humans to take pieces of what we 147 00:08:05.360 --> 00:08:09.759 find in culture, whether it's from other people or some 148 00:08:09.839 --> 00:08:12.480 things that we create on our own, and to recombine 149 00:08:12.480 --> 00:08:15.839 them to make assemblages out of them into new things 150 00:08:16.040 --> 00:08:19.560 that now are They are just as real as you 151 00:08:19.600 --> 00:08:21.519 know the share that I'm sitting on in one sense, 152 00:08:22.160 --> 00:08:25.720 but that doesn't mean that they're actual. They have reality 153 00:08:25.720 --> 00:08:27.079 and that we can talk about them, we can think 154 00:08:27.120 --> 00:08:29.399 about them, we can we can picture them in our minds. 155 00:08:30.519 --> 00:08:33.759 But when you take something that is that has a 156 00:08:33.799 --> 00:08:36.279 real existence but is not yet actual within the world 157 00:08:36.679 --> 00:08:39.360 and then turn it into something that you know makes 158 00:08:39.399 --> 00:08:42.679 a thud on the table if you will, then you've 159 00:08:42.679 --> 00:08:46.879 given it something beyond just mirror uh speculation. You've turned 160 00:08:46.919 --> 00:08:49.440 into something that now has an effect, has a presence 161 00:08:49.480 --> 00:08:54.679 that can be further used. So the things that the 162 00:08:54.720 --> 00:08:57.679 two things, well three things actually that Aquino contributed to 163 00:08:58.159 --> 00:09:01.879 the Satanic rituals, where the rituals the ceremony of the 164 00:09:01.960 --> 00:09:05.080 Nine Angles and the call to Cthulhu. And he also 165 00:09:05.120 --> 00:09:08.080 contributed an essay called the Metaphysics of love Craft where 166 00:09:08.080 --> 00:09:10.200 he talks about some of these same ideas how you 167 00:09:10.240 --> 00:09:15.279 would use these fictional creations to create real things, and 168 00:09:15.320 --> 00:09:19.679 that the sort of the magical system implied by those 169 00:09:19.679 --> 00:09:23.480 two rituals is the thrust of this book, which I 170 00:09:23.519 --> 00:09:25.519 talked quite a bit about HP lef Craft. I talk 171 00:09:25.639 --> 00:09:28.039 quite a bit about the left hand Path as a concept. 172 00:09:28.080 --> 00:09:33.879 I talk quite a bit about how you can combine 173 00:09:33.879 --> 00:09:35.840 some of the influences that came into left Craft, and 174 00:09:35.879 --> 00:09:39.120 some of the influences came into Michael Aquino, like the 175 00:09:39.200 --> 00:09:43.679 number of mysticism of Pythagoras, things like this, and combine 176 00:09:43.720 --> 00:09:46.519 them into a new magical system that opens up new 177 00:09:46.559 --> 00:09:49.639 ways of working within the world that maybe weren't quite 178 00:09:49.639 --> 00:09:56.519 there in the same form before, and the last thing 179 00:09:56.559 --> 00:09:58.559 I was going to mention for that is where this 180 00:09:58.759 --> 00:10:03.399 led to the closer association with Aquino of several reasons. One, 181 00:10:03.440 --> 00:10:06.559 he was an extraordinarily generous and friendly man. He was 182 00:10:06.840 --> 00:10:08.840 certainly willing to talk to anyone who wanted to drop 183 00:10:08.879 --> 00:10:10.840 a mcneila in chat, whether they were in the Temple 184 00:10:10.960 --> 00:10:13.320 or not. But for people who were in the Temple 185 00:10:14.639 --> 00:10:17.799 that he was more than willing to support them on 186 00:10:17.840 --> 00:10:19.759 the projects, to give them feedback, to give them help, 187 00:10:19.799 --> 00:10:22.360 to mentum them in a sense. It also helps that 188 00:10:22.399 --> 00:10:25.639 I had become the Grand Master of the Temple's Order 189 00:10:25.639 --> 00:10:28.200 of the Trapezoid, which was a subgroup within the Temple 190 00:10:28.200 --> 00:10:30.759 that was originally founded by a Quino. So it was 191 00:10:30.879 --> 00:10:33.360 sort of since I had taken over, you know, something 192 00:10:33.399 --> 00:10:34.759 that was near and near to his heart. I'm sure 193 00:10:34.799 --> 00:10:38.360 that held quite a bit, and so when I began 194 00:10:38.360 --> 00:10:42.159 to write this book, I immediately asked him that he 195 00:10:42.159 --> 00:10:45.080 would be willing to contribute something to it, both to 196 00:10:45.159 --> 00:10:47.440 honor that influence that I took from him, but also 197 00:10:47.799 --> 00:10:50.120 because he was uniquely positioned to say something about it 198 00:10:50.159 --> 00:10:52.799 that no one else could same thing with asking Stephen 199 00:10:52.840 --> 00:10:57.559 Flowers to do the afterword the nine Angles, the system 200 00:10:57.600 --> 00:10:59.320 created out of the ceremony of the nine Angles, which 201 00:10:59.320 --> 00:11:02.039 has nothing to do those those idiots that call themselves, 202 00:11:02.759 --> 00:11:05.080 you know, a magical group of nine angles in the name. 203 00:11:07.279 --> 00:11:08.200 I was I'm. 204 00:11:10.080 --> 00:11:10.639 Weird question. 205 00:11:11.399 --> 00:11:13.879 Yeah, it was largely take was only developed by Flowers 206 00:11:13.879 --> 00:11:17.519 within the temple. So Aquino was kind of and a 207 00:11:17.519 --> 00:11:18.879 lot of things he wrote about he was kind of 208 00:11:18.879 --> 00:11:21.480 the idea man, you know. He would have an idea 209 00:11:21.600 --> 00:11:23.000 thrown out of the world other people to run with 210 00:11:23.039 --> 00:11:24.320 it and make new things out of it. 211 00:11:24.879 --> 00:11:25.159 Uh. 212 00:11:25.200 --> 00:11:29.600 And this system, magical system that we call the nine Angles, 213 00:11:29.679 --> 00:11:32.320 is one of those things. And so it was a 214 00:11:32.399 --> 00:11:36.000 natural progression to ask the two people most responsible for 215 00:11:36.080 --> 00:11:38.720 turning this into something we could work with, uh, to 216 00:11:38.759 --> 00:11:40.279 write a ford and afterward to. 217 00:11:40.320 --> 00:11:41.759 The book makes sense. 218 00:11:43.000 --> 00:11:46.039 And Stephen Flowers was also kind enough to write a 219 00:11:47.120 --> 00:11:50.039 four to my My book came out soon, which again 220 00:11:50.159 --> 00:11:53.039 is appropriate because his ideas were the root of what 221 00:11:53.120 --> 00:11:56.679 became this book. That was my first exposure to the 222 00:11:56.759 --> 00:11:59.320 idea of magic and communication as having something to do 223 00:11:59.360 --> 00:12:01.399 with each other. But sides just the fact that we 224 00:12:01.440 --> 00:12:02.960 happen to use words in a ritual. 225 00:12:04.279 --> 00:12:04.679 I like it. 226 00:12:05.919 --> 00:12:06.240 I like it. 227 00:12:06.399 --> 00:12:08.519 I guess I have I guess two other questions before 228 00:12:08.519 --> 00:12:10.080 we start getting into the book, or a least from me. 229 00:12:12.240 --> 00:12:14.000 Two of them. One, I really just want you to 230 00:12:14.000 --> 00:12:17.759 maybe kind of give you a brief description, because I 231 00:12:17.799 --> 00:12:19.919 don't know if I've ever had anybody on my show before. 232 00:12:20.080 --> 00:12:21.559 I'm not saying there's a problem with it. It's just 233 00:12:21.639 --> 00:12:23.679 I never had anybody on my show before who said 234 00:12:23.679 --> 00:12:25.600 they were into the left hand path. I would like 235 00:12:25.639 --> 00:12:27.960 you to at least maybe tell my listeners what does 236 00:12:28.000 --> 00:12:28.639 that mean to you? 237 00:12:30.080 --> 00:12:33.320 Sure? So, the left hand path is one of those things. 238 00:12:33.480 --> 00:12:35.159 It has a lot of different shades of meaning depending 239 00:12:35.200 --> 00:12:37.759 on the perspective one is approaching it from. If you 240 00:12:37.799 --> 00:12:39.480 go back to sort of the origin of the term 241 00:12:39.799 --> 00:12:43.879 in India, it has a specific meaning there which is 242 00:12:44.120 --> 00:12:46.320 similar to, but not exactly the same as we use 243 00:12:46.360 --> 00:12:50.639 in the West. The idea was brought into Western esotericism, 244 00:12:50.679 --> 00:12:54.600 if you will buy Madam Bolvatski the theosophy and all that, 245 00:12:55.240 --> 00:12:58.039 and originally it was sort of a shorthand for the 246 00:12:58.039 --> 00:13:00.279 things that she didn't like. These were the evil things 247 00:13:00.279 --> 00:13:02.639 that you shouldn't do, and she contrasted with the right 248 00:13:02.639 --> 00:13:04.879 hand path, which was the good and the light and 249 00:13:04.919 --> 00:13:08.159 the things you should aspire to. You see a similar 250 00:13:08.240 --> 00:13:11.320 usage carried on coming from the same place by Alistair 251 00:13:11.360 --> 00:13:14.519 Crowley when he talks about you know, a brother of 252 00:13:14.559 --> 00:13:19.519 the left hand path. He's using that in very pejorative term. 253 00:13:19.639 --> 00:13:23.039 What the left hand path means within the temple is 254 00:13:23.840 --> 00:13:27.159 it means primarily two things. It means one that it 255 00:13:27.279 --> 00:13:32.000 is a path toward some level of self deification, meaning 256 00:13:32.039 --> 00:13:35.960 that we can become like God's in some way, in 257 00:13:36.000 --> 00:13:38.000 part by doing the things that gods do. If you 258 00:13:38.039 --> 00:13:40.639 want to create, you do things that creators do. If 259 00:13:40.679 --> 00:13:42.000 you want to become a god, you do things that 260 00:13:42.039 --> 00:13:45.960 gods do. And this is done through introspection, is done 261 00:13:45.960 --> 00:13:49.240 through magic, is done through a continual process of refining 262 00:13:49.240 --> 00:13:51.519 the self. As I spoke of earlier, that's something in 263 00:13:51.519 --> 00:13:55.200 the temple we call kever. This is an Egyptian term. 264 00:13:55.320 --> 00:13:58.879 It means, depending on the context, it means the dawn, 265 00:13:59.320 --> 00:14:01.919 but it also means to become or to come into being. 266 00:14:03.000 --> 00:14:06.240 And this is the idea that you should always be 267 00:14:06.279 --> 00:14:09.039 striving to become something more than you are currently. To 268 00:14:09.080 --> 00:14:11.879 take what's the best of you now and make that 269 00:14:11.919 --> 00:14:15.799 ever more potent, ever stronger, ever have a greater reach. Now, 270 00:14:15.840 --> 00:14:18.879 the catch is is you can't make it infinite. You 271 00:14:19.480 --> 00:14:22.000 If it becomes infant, then you've now become exactly the 272 00:14:22.000 --> 00:14:24.360 same as the universe as a whole, and that's not 273 00:14:24.559 --> 00:14:28.080 what we're seeking to do. So you have to have 274 00:14:28.120 --> 00:14:31.840 some level of definition, some level of boundaries around it. 275 00:14:32.159 --> 00:14:35.440 But that's doesn't mean that you're limited. The boundaries just 276 00:14:35.519 --> 00:14:38.480 become where the edges of what you're capable of. Now 277 00:14:39.120 --> 00:14:40.759 that can be expanded as part of the way that 278 00:14:40.799 --> 00:14:42.639 you grow, as part of the way that you gever 279 00:14:43.000 --> 00:14:46.320 if you will. And so the way that we approach 280 00:14:46.360 --> 00:14:49.759 the left hand path is through the process of initiation, 281 00:14:50.799 --> 00:14:54.240 which is that refinement of the self, through through magic, 282 00:14:54.320 --> 00:14:59.240 through introspection, through study, through through seeking out those things 283 00:14:59.240 --> 00:15:00.960 that are holding us back from being what we could 284 00:15:00.960 --> 00:15:05.039 be and finding new way, finding new places in which 285 00:15:05.080 --> 00:15:09.320 to grow ourselves. That can be, you know, some new 286 00:15:09.399 --> 00:15:11.600 level of knowledge, it can be some new level of 287 00:15:12.240 --> 00:15:15.639 strength and power within within the world. It could be 288 00:15:15.799 --> 00:15:17.960 it's really up to the person what what that means 289 00:15:17.960 --> 00:15:19.840 to them, because it ultimately it has to be self 290 00:15:19.919 --> 00:15:22.279 defined that's another part of the left hand path, as 291 00:15:22.279 --> 00:15:25.279 we see it, is that you are ultimately responsible for it. 292 00:15:25.480 --> 00:15:27.240 No one can tell you what it is. You must 293 00:15:27.279 --> 00:15:30.759 decide what it needs to be for you, and the 294 00:15:30.840 --> 00:15:34.000 extent to which you are faithful to that quest, you know, 295 00:15:34.200 --> 00:15:38.000 is that's the measure of success, not what anyone else 296 00:15:38.039 --> 00:15:40.279 thinks about what you're doing or thinks about the things 297 00:15:40.279 --> 00:15:42.159 that you may study, your things about the things you 298 00:15:42.200 --> 00:15:45.360 may you right and become. Now we do stress, of course, 299 00:15:45.440 --> 00:15:48.240 not if you start off as an asshole and you 300 00:15:48.279 --> 00:15:50.519 initiate yourself, sometimes you just become a bigger asshole, and 301 00:15:50.559 --> 00:15:53.039 that's not the goal. If you start off as an 302 00:15:53.039 --> 00:15:55.600 asshole and you encounter initiation, then the goal is to 303 00:15:55.600 --> 00:15:58.639 become less of an asshole. You know, to be a 304 00:15:58.679 --> 00:16:02.600 bit crued with it, because we when you when you 305 00:16:02.720 --> 00:16:06.679 undergo initiation, when you're trying to expand the boundaries of yourself, 306 00:16:07.159 --> 00:16:09.759 your entire self is along for the ride. You may, 307 00:16:11.000 --> 00:16:14.759 you know, just say, for example, you know have some 308 00:16:14.360 --> 00:16:17.759 some addiction. You know that that you also carry along 309 00:16:17.840 --> 00:16:20.320 if you don't also seek to evaluate that for what 310 00:16:20.360 --> 00:16:22.200 it is, and it's up to you to decide whether 311 00:16:22.240 --> 00:16:23.840 that needs to still be a part of yourself or not. 312 00:16:24.200 --> 00:16:25.919 But if you're not looking for something like that that 313 00:16:25.960 --> 00:16:28.799 may be holding you back in some way, it's only 314 00:16:28.960 --> 00:16:32.360 become more powerful along with everything else. So we have 315 00:16:32.399 --> 00:16:34.159 to approach is in a very holistic manner. You have 316 00:16:34.200 --> 00:16:36.080 to think about your entire self, even if you may 317 00:16:36.120 --> 00:16:39.639 be concentrating on one part of yourself. Everything is along 318 00:16:39.679 --> 00:16:43.919 for the ride, and that's a crucially important aspect of 319 00:16:44.120 --> 00:16:46.120 the way we approach this within the Temple at least. 320 00:16:46.879 --> 00:16:50.480 I like that. Thank you. Anybody have any questions before 321 00:16:50.480 --> 00:16:51.159 I ask another one. 322 00:16:53.879 --> 00:16:55.559 I have a quick question for Toby. 323 00:16:55.759 --> 00:16:58.360 It's not from me, but it is from someone who 324 00:16:58.440 --> 00:17:01.000 I have been reading some of the we'll say outer 325 00:17:01.519 --> 00:17:06.759 the available online available Michael Quino, specifically the colored tablets. 326 00:17:06.799 --> 00:17:09.839 I've read the Onyx, the Ruby, and the Sapphire. So 327 00:17:10.400 --> 00:17:12.799 someone else that I've been reading them with he had 328 00:17:12.839 --> 00:17:15.279 a question and I and I promise that if I 329 00:17:15.319 --> 00:17:18.519 had this opportunity, I would ask it for him. 330 00:17:18.759 --> 00:17:20.599 So I'm sorry, Just give me a second and I 331 00:17:20.599 --> 00:17:21.400 will pull it up. 332 00:17:22.880 --> 00:17:26.920 Okay, So he is asking if the properties of the 333 00:17:26.960 --> 00:17:31.519 angles I either psychological effects and their utility and magical operations, 334 00:17:31.960 --> 00:17:36.039 is exhausted when the consciousness decouples from its physical from 335 00:17:36.079 --> 00:17:39.680 its physical support in the body. So I think he's asking, 336 00:17:39.759 --> 00:17:45.799 is there like it does an angle inherently imply perception 337 00:17:46.039 --> 00:17:50.559 and point of view, like a positionality, a cosmology, and 338 00:17:50.640 --> 00:17:53.240 an ontology. If I understand his question, that's what I 339 00:17:53.240 --> 00:17:53.960 think he's asking. 340 00:17:54.759 --> 00:17:57.839 Right, Well, that's that'd be quite a long answer to 341 00:17:58.160 --> 00:17:59.960 answer in full, but let me let me do that 342 00:18:00.039 --> 00:18:01.839 because I think the little help web of varstination. So 343 00:18:02.039 --> 00:18:07.400 what you're referring to here, there's there's a symbol at 344 00:18:07.400 --> 00:18:12.720 the top, which is what's called within the nine angles. 345 00:18:12.759 --> 00:18:15.240 This is called the seal of Aruna. Runa is mystery. 346 00:18:15.319 --> 00:18:18.039 That's the root of the word for rune, but its 347 00:18:18.079 --> 00:18:23.640 original sense in the Germanic languages was mystery. These are 348 00:18:23.680 --> 00:18:25.200 not There's not just the mystery of like where you 349 00:18:25.319 --> 00:18:26.920 where you left your car keys. This is like the 350 00:18:26.920 --> 00:18:30.119 eternal mysteries that you're attempting to go. When I spoke 351 00:18:30.160 --> 00:18:33.720 earlier about the idea of initiation and expanding the boundaries 352 00:18:33.759 --> 00:18:35.960 of yourself, part of what you're doing is you're finding 353 00:18:35.960 --> 00:18:39.279 those things that are mysterious to you, that pull you forward, 354 00:18:39.440 --> 00:18:42.640 and you're attempting, they become the fuel that you use 355 00:18:42.759 --> 00:18:47.359 for initiation. So with within the symbol, you'll if you 356 00:18:47.400 --> 00:18:49.240 imagine this without the trapezoid in the middle, if you 357 00:18:49.319 --> 00:18:51.920 imagine just the pentagram and the circle around it, you 358 00:18:51.960 --> 00:18:55.000 have what we call the temple of the pentagram of set. 359 00:18:55.480 --> 00:18:58.240 And what the pentagram of set signifies. The reason is 360 00:18:58.279 --> 00:19:02.640 the the symbol for the temple in a sense is 361 00:19:02.680 --> 00:19:05.559 it signifies as something very core about or cosmology. And 362 00:19:05.599 --> 00:19:08.319 that is the distinction between the subjective universe and the 363 00:19:08.359 --> 00:19:12.000 objective universe. The way these terms are used is that 364 00:19:12.039 --> 00:19:14.240 the subjective universe will actual when they start the objective. 365 00:19:14.279 --> 00:19:18.440 The objective universe is the universe of matter and the 366 00:19:18.519 --> 00:19:21.680 law physical laws, things you can touch and things that 367 00:19:21.720 --> 00:19:25.440 affect things that can be touched. In the physical sense, 368 00:19:27.880 --> 00:19:32.160 this has this has no intelligence of guiding it. You know, 369 00:19:32.279 --> 00:19:35.839 it's driven by the physical laws that hold it together. 370 00:19:36.640 --> 00:19:42.519 The pentagram signifying the subjective universe is the individual awareness 371 00:19:42.559 --> 00:19:46.039 of any sentient being. This could be humans. They could 372 00:19:46.079 --> 00:19:50.880 also be you know, animals and even arguably plants have 373 00:19:51.279 --> 00:19:54.519 some degree of sentience that they that they display, meaning 374 00:19:54.519 --> 00:19:59.319 that they can respond to things that they sense and 375 00:19:59.519 --> 00:20:02.119 in depending on the nature of what it is they 376 00:20:02.119 --> 00:20:04.400 sense and sometimes they can decide how to respond. It's 377 00:20:04.440 --> 00:20:06.920 not just an instinctual thing, but it's also a deliberate, 378 00:20:07.000 --> 00:20:10.799 deliberative thing that can be done. And the reason these 379 00:20:10.839 --> 00:20:13.519 are shown in the panagram upset is not touching is 380 00:20:13.559 --> 00:20:16.119 the idea that this idea of self awareness is not 381 00:20:16.279 --> 00:20:20.480 something that is explainable through the laws of the material universe. 382 00:20:20.880 --> 00:20:23.559 It's something that seems to arise somehow above It emerges 383 00:20:23.640 --> 00:20:27.880 somehow from the interactions of things within the universe, comes 384 00:20:27.880 --> 00:20:32.279 from outside it in a sense, when you add in 385 00:20:32.440 --> 00:20:36.359 the trapezoid to become to become the seal over in them. 386 00:20:37.200 --> 00:20:42.720 This is this This is short of shortly the implicit 387 00:20:42.720 --> 00:20:44.759 connection between the two. When I said earlier that the 388 00:20:44.759 --> 00:20:46.920 subjective universe is not dependent on the objective universe, it 389 00:20:46.920 --> 00:20:48.839 doesn't mean that doesn't touch it. Clearly it does. If 390 00:20:48.880 --> 00:20:51.839 I decide to reach out and you know, push a 391 00:20:51.880 --> 00:20:54.960 book off off my bookshelf in the back, I have just, 392 00:20:55.039 --> 00:20:58.640 through the power of my mind, implemented that in the 393 00:20:58.640 --> 00:21:01.240 world to cause some physical thing to happen. So clearly 394 00:21:01.279 --> 00:21:04.519 we can have effects on that objective universe. But what 395 00:21:04.559 --> 00:21:07.720 it means is that I can I can conceive the 396 00:21:07.799 --> 00:21:10.359 things that are not possible within the objecutive universe. I 397 00:21:10.359 --> 00:21:16.200 can conceive, you know, creatures that don't exist. Like in fact, 398 00:21:16.240 --> 00:21:19.400 the representation of set to the ancient Obgyptians is an 399 00:21:19.400 --> 00:21:22.880 animal that there is no It's not there is no 400 00:21:22.960 --> 00:21:25.400 one animal that represents It's an amalgam of different things 401 00:21:25.440 --> 00:21:28.519