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Speaker 1: You are now listening to soft core History?

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Speaker 2: What is up? Welcome back to soft Core History. I

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am your host for the week, Rob Fox, joined as

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always by Dan Regester.

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Speaker 1: If you're hearing this right now, we could be dead.

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We don't know, We have no idea. We're recording this

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early storm of the century coming in. I'm gonna schedule

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it for its normal release time and who knows. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Now, if you're a new listener, you might be thinking

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to yourself, Oh, do they live in Chicago or something

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like that where the storm's really bad.

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Speaker 1: No, well, the storm's actually not hitt in Chicago. But

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th it's cold, is I guess?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: The cold doesn't matter there.

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Speaker 2: It's getting bad. It's getting tree exploding cold.

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Speaker 1: We're getting less than an inch of ice, so the

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entire state we'll shut down of Texas. The power will

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go out. Yep, it'll break into chaos, anarchy, and everyone

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will have to fend for themselves.

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Speaker 2: With thunderdome is coming over. The temperature briefly dropping below freezing.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we're not made for this.

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Speaker 2: Here that no one, no one here is made for this.

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It's the most It's like a yearly display of how

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pathetic Texas can get Listen.

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Speaker 1: This is the once in a lifetime storm that happens

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every year. There's no way we could prepare.

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Speaker 2: For No, how could we see this coming. It's so

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hot in July, though, Why would it be cold in

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the winter. It's so hot in the summer.

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Speaker 1: Gets hot in August. Now, it's true, the seasons are

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shifting a bit here.

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Speaker 2: Soon it will be one hundred degrees here. It probably

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will be one hundred.

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Speaker 1: Degrees in like three weeks, doesn't I'm fine with that.

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I know you are. I want to go back to

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Florida with Jake.

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Speaker 2: I just want to wear tank tops and flip flops.

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Speaker 1: You know what it is today in our land though,

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eighty five. Yeah, Jake's not feeling perfect. Jake's not feeling

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the pain, absolutely not. No, he's just on the beach.

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But it is wiping at least a good portion of

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the nation, the whole middle part. No, it's going all

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the way to these coasts like DC's getting crushed, Philly's

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gonna get crushed, all right, Yeah, no, this is effecting

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the entire I guess you haven't been paying attention to

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the the models.

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Speaker 2: No, no, I don't care. I don't care what happens

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to the rest of the country. I can barely keep

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control what happens inside my own house.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I was gonna say, you don't really care what

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even happens on the side of the street.

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Speaker 2: It's yeah, like it's like three children running around like

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what Okay, great, let me know when it's over.

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Speaker 1: Oh God, you're into Boris with parent in talk.

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Speaker 2: No, no, okay, I'm gonna entertain you with.

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Speaker 1: It's what people want, weather and child.

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Speaker 2: Ye, I'm gonna entertain you with history talk today, as

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we are wont to do on this podcast.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I actually know the subject today because you asked

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if we did.

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Speaker 2: It or not, would you look them up?

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Speaker 1: No? Okay, but I know the name now, okay. And

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I know because you asked, because we've been knowing the

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show for six years now whether or not we cover them,

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and I'm the encyclopedia of the podcast. Yeah, well I'm

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the only guy that knows because your ADHD friddle brain

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is just too weak.

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Speaker 2: I googled it, but Google was not much help, so

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I had to double check.

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Speaker 1: It was not very good at all. Now, no, those

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AI tools are not useful A.

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Speaker 2: I was like, yes, software history did seven episodes on

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Porter Rockwell.

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Speaker 1: Just go through the episodes, Yeah, a lot through the list.

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There's so goddamniti it's one a week on the main

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feed for five years too. On Patreon. Yeah, the Patreon

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what really gets you? Yeah, because that's where there's a lot.

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On patreon dot com slash softcore, there's so much content

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for you, a shit ton of gon that just a

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giant back catalog. Check it out if you haven't.

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Speaker 2: Already, it's evergreen.

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Speaker 1: Support our families because obviously we're gonna be dead at

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this point, yeah, we when this episode comes out, So

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support our families by going to that Patreon.

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Speaker 2: My children will be refusing to eat me, not because

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they wouldn't eat me, but because they'll just won't like

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the way my wife prepared me.

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Speaker 1: Oh no, she's a terrible cook.

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Speaker 2: Yeah it's you know, I mean she could be a

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great cook. They stillouldn't need it doesn't matter.

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Speaker 1: Just not listening to your wife. Yeah, it's just like, no,

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I want this. They're with her all day. You kind

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of build up a tolerance.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's true for bs. Anyway, let's get into this

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week's episode.

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Speaker 1: Let's do it.

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Speaker 2: Porter Rockwell is our subject, Porter Rockwell. I guess the

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best way to describe him.

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Speaker 1: It's a strong name. It also sounds like he would

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have been a titan of industry, which is not the case.

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Speaker 2: What did you look him up or not?

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Speaker 1: No? Okay, but just by the name Porter Rockwell, yeah,

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it sounds like he should have buildings named after him.

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Speaker 2: Uh. He does have stuff named after him, Okay, because

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he is a very big figure in the Mormon Church.

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Speaker 1: Oh see, I only saw like American Frontiersman and then

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I just checked out. Yeah, because that's kind of my

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lane and you you're encroaching. You're encroaching on my therapy.

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Speaker 2: Frontiersman did cultures run? I did the Frontiersman that got

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attacked by the yetti.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Rockwell is really the best way to put it. Joseph

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Smith and Brigham Young's enforcer bodyguard. Yeah, in force, he

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was their bodyguard, but honestly, enforcer is a better way

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to put it. He is there fucking archangel Michael, their

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goddamn angel of war, and he stabbed bodies for the

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Mormon Church.

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Speaker 1: He's essentially a bodyguard for influencers nowadays. Yeah. Yeah, that

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start shit and then back away and be like, oh, No,

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he's got this. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Ye, he'll kill someone for Logan Paul or Jake Paul

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or not.

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Speaker 1: The pause Paul's. They fight their own battles. They do. Now,

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I'm talking about like the little shits, the little pranksters.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like a streamer with.

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Speaker 1: The body the one Jack kid. He's not Jacked, he's

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uh opposite, but his name is Jack something And yeah,

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he like hits people's hats off and then has his

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bodyguard step in when they try to fight him.

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Speaker 2: What a fucking piece of shit.

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Speaker 1: Your kids are probably gonna find them to be role

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models one day.

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Speaker 2: Hm.

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Speaker 1: They will.

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Speaker 2: They will, And I will not let them watch any

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of it. I will literally like, if I catch them

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watching it, I will turn it off. I will be like,

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just fucking stop.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so you cannot throw the Palls under the bus

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right now. They're probably gonna be future leaders of the country. Yeah,

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they're gonna do the senators, maybe you know, secretary State.

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Speaker 2: Probably a Supreme Court justice in there.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I gotta think one imagines actually the kard Kim

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Kardashian will be on Scotas So if anyway influencers.

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Speaker 2: She has a law degree, Yeah, yeah, she does. She'll

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be on Scotis.

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Speaker 1: Do you think she went at night? When did she

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have the time to do that?

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Speaker 2: It feels like it feels like a night school situation.

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Speaker 1: And seven an honorary degree.

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Speaker 2: Several people helped their get it type of the situation.

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Speaker 1: There's so many honorary doctorates. They just hand those out,

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Like Candy, I don't think you can an honorary JD.

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But I don't know honorary passed the bar. Yeah, she

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did pass the bar. So.

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Speaker 2: Rockwell was born in what is known as dark the

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quote unquote dark Corner section of Belchertown, New Hampshire. But

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in eighteen seventeen, when he was four, his family moved

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to New York and they became neighbors of the Smith family.

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Speaker 1: Rockwell they started up shop in New York. People forget

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that they did.

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Speaker 2: It was Mormonism. Is is it a New York religion?

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Speaker 1: Was not a Missouri thing? Try to distance yourself. Well,

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we legally distanced ourselves from Well, yeah, that you could

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legally hunt a Mormon until like nineteen seventy in the

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state of Missouri.

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Speaker 2: We forgot to overturn it.

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Speaker 1: There's a lot of laws like that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, a shit time and that law comes into play

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in this episode. Smith and Rockwell were said to be

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related through just like past ancestral lines, although that might

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have just been made up to make Rockwell seem more.

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Speaker 1: It's a family tree that goes directly to Jesus.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it starts at Jesus, it spreads out, and Rockwell

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and Smith were kind of right next.

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Speaker 1: To each other on it allegedly.

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Speaker 2: Yeah so, Rockwell was eight years younger than Smith, and

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while Smith was publishing the Book of Mormon, Rockwell would

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pick berries at night and haulwood into town.

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Speaker 1: Joseph Smith wrote the Book of Mormon. You say, publish.

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It's a great play.

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Speaker 2: Published the Book of Mormon.

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Speaker 1: I can't believe he was such an oteur.

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Speaker 2: He people forget he's a great musical genius.

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Speaker 1: Yeh, like problems to him. We don't give him enough credit. No,

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I mean his artistry.

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Speaker 2: They basically, Joseph Smith wrote Book of Mormon. The way

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he he got the real Book of Mormon is Trey

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Parker looked in a hat and as Joseph Smith fed

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him everything.

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Speaker 1: The lines, yeah yeah, yeah, yeah. You should really have

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to hold it to your ear like a seashell so

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you can hear the ocean, you hear Jesus talk to

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you through the hat into the ear.

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Speaker 2: It would be more profound to hear.

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Speaker 1: Him then see him. Yeah, yeah, I think so and

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see words. But also yeah, I mean you as a kid,

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you hold up a tin can with a string, tame principles. Yeah,

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you should have to do that with the hat to

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hear God.

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Speaker 2: That's the biggest hole in the Mormon story. I would say, yeah,

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like make it cooler.

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Speaker 1: You're just seeing words.

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Speaker 2: You heard you could have heard Jesus' voice God.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: And I actually ascribed to the Dogma version of like

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the movie Dogma version of God, where if you hear

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God's voice your.

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Speaker 1: Head will explode. It's a female God.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well that's anything.

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Speaker 1: It's a female God.

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Speaker 2: It's alanis morset.

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Speaker 1: God is a woman.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So yeah.

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Speaker 2: Rockwell just worked night jobs to help Smith publish the

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book in eighteen thirty at sixteen years old.

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Speaker 1: So he was like foot in the bill. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Basically he was making money and taking all of it

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to pay to give to Joseph Smith so you.

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Speaker 1: Can cover rent.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, pretty much. At sixteen, Rockwell was baptized and

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he in the Mormon Church. And he was the youngest

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member of the first group to be baptized into the church,

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and soon after he became Joseph Smith's personal bodyguard and

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Mormon enforcer.

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Speaker 1: Is it a situation where you see him and you're like,

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that'll do or does he have to like prove his

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skill set? No, he's pretty.

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Speaker 2: He's pretty terrifying dude, just a bigger guy.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: In eighteen seventy a guy wrote about him about porta.

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Speaker 1: Rockwell, this is a quote.

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Speaker 2: He was that most terrible instrument that can be handled

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by fanaticism. A powerful physical nature welded to a mind

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of very narrow perceptions. So he was strong and stupid.

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Speaker 1: Put that on my tombstone. Then as long as you

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say I'm strong, Yeah, that's all. Yeah, he was real strong.

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All I hear is big.

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Speaker 2: They also said, very narrow perceptions, intense convictions, and changeless

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tenacity in his build. He was a gladiator in his humor,

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a Yankee lumberman in his memory, a bourbon in his vengeance,

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an Indian, a strange mixture only to be found on

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the American continent.

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Speaker 1: Sounds like he would have been awesome on the defensive line.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, he's an edge for sure.

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Speaker 1: No, clog him up the middle, give him the detackle position.

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Speaker 2: This dude, No, this dude's rolling around the edge.

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Speaker 1: You just you throw them anywhere in the defensive lines,

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just rot in them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. On the evening of May sixth, eighteen forty two,

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a man by the name of Lilburn Bogs was shot

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by an unknown party who fired at him through a

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window at his home as he read the newspaper in

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his study. Lilburn Bogs was the ex governor Lilburn litl Burn,

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l I l Burn, Little lil Burn.

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Speaker 1: Lil Wayne little Burn.

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Speaker 2: Lil Burn's a good yeah, but that's his real name,

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lil Burn, that's his government name. That's his Chris, his

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Christian name.

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Speaker 1: Okay, well not really Christian, right.

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Speaker 2: No, this guy is not Mormon, Okay. This guy's a

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probably a Baptist or something, little Burn, little Burn. So

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he's sitting there in his study reading the newspaper and

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somebody just sticks a gun through the window and lights

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them up. Bogs was the governor of Missouri who'd signed

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Executive Order.

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Speaker 1: Forty four, yeah, which Lucas probably stole straight up, straight

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up without was it Order sixty six? Order sixty six.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, other than Nazis might have had some orders like

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that too. For all I know, the Empire was heavily

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lifted from the Nazis. You don't say yeah, could never

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get yeah right. They also did look like tight as hell.

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Speaker 1: They looked up.

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Speaker 2: They even used uh they even modeled the a lot

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of the UH Empire weapons in the original Star Wars

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off of German weapons in World War Two, specifically like

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the MG forty two.

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Speaker 1: I mean they're called storm troopers, right, come on.

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Speaker 2: So Boggs gets lit up. He was the one that

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wrote the extermination order evicting more from Missouri and making

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it legal to hunt.

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Speaker 1: Them, which again was on the books until nineteen seventy something.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, until the seventies. The legislator had more get yourself

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a scalp.

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Speaker 1: You could have done it.

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Speaker 2: I got someone. I know it's wrong, like you shouldn't

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just go kill people, but someone really should have tested

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le galley of it. Like, why couldn't some like a

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serial killers, a serial killer in Missouri could have just

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gone bananas?

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Speaker 1: I probably did. We should look into that. Maybe there

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was a serial killer that just got a bunch of

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Mormon heads and then got.

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Speaker 2: Off they swept. They swept it under the rug. They're like, fuck,

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we can't prosecute him. But no one can know about this.

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Speaker 1: Or they found a legal loophole. They're like, no, it's

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on the books. He's fine, he's good to go. Yeah,

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he actually gets a reward.

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Speaker 2: You gotta pay him cover oh, some money for killing

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like twenty Mormons.

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Speaker 1: And that got passed him on the eighteen.

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Speaker 2: Thirty eighteen thirty eight. Yeah, Bennett, a man named John C. Bennett,

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who was a recently excommunicated Mormon, immediately immediately implicated Rockwell

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in the assassination attempt, and he actually published an op

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ed in a local paper explaining that it was definitely

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port of Rockwell who did this. He's a goon, yeah,

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he he knew he was in the morning church. He

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knew Rockwell is a fucking goon. And but he was

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also at a Mormon congregation when he was still in

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the church, and he wrote in the paper. In eighteen

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forty one, Joe Smith predicted or prophesied in a public

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congregation that Lowburn W. Boggs, ex governor of Missouri, should

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die by violent hands within one year. So Smith gets

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up at church and is like I have a profiser

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the little Lowburn bogs where we die violently.

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Speaker 1: H that was an open hit. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so he keeps writing from one or two months

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prior to the attempted assassination of Governor Boggs.

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Speaker 1: Except you don't have to pay him. You just give

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them God's graces.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you pay him in god bucks. Yeah, your planet

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gets a whole lot nicer.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, your future after death, you're going to be able

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to roll over those god bucks.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you're just loading up the god bucks first.

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Speaker 1: When you get to heaven, you get to you gotta

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spend something.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, what do you think heaven doesn't have an economy.

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I mean they got to just keep track of things.

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Speaker 1: Right, Even in heaven, you still have to work.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a.

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Speaker 1: Grinder's dream unless you have the savings, right, you have

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that retirement built in for death.

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Speaker 2: It's gotta save up the god bucks, which probably feels

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like a thing that would be real in the Mormon church.

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Speaker 1: Uh, he keeps traffoic church too, buddy, Nah, pass the

339
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basket around? Ah Ah, what if God actually gave out

340
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a collection's basket While you're up.

341
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Speaker 2: There, you're just hanging out playing beach volleyball in heaven.

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Speaker 1: The collection basket comes through, its passed around. It's like, man,

343
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we really gotta tying up the corners over here. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Space time is kind of fracturing on the end of

345
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heaven and we need to get past that. Yeah, so

346
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come on, this dimension is crumbling a little bit. It

347
00:17:07,039 --> 00:17:09,720
takes it takes money and work to upkeep a dimension.

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Speaker 1: I'll be so disappointed. I'd be like, God, damn it,

349
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but not surprised. Yeah, non surprised.

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Speaker 2: I guess this is better than oblivion, but God damn it.

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Speaker 1: Uh.

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Speaker 2: He kept writing from one or two months prior to

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the attempted assassination of Governor Boggs. Mister O. P. Rockwell

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left Nuavo, Missouri, for parts unknown to the citizens Atlas.

355
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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, parts unknown. Yeah, he's like the undertaker.

356
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Speaker 2: I was then on terms of close intimacy with Joe

357
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Smith and asked him where Rockwell had gone gone. He said,

358
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gone to fulfill the prophecy. Rockwell then returned Nuovo the

359
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day before the report of this assassination reached there. Okay,

360
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so Joseph Joseph Smith sat Rockwell to jose Smith made

361
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a prophecy.

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Speaker 1: Allegedly when I don't get sued.

363
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Speaker 2: Yeah, we don't want to get sued by the family

364
00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:04,759
of Smith, Joseph Smith.

365
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Speaker 1: There's a large Smith contingent probably, well everyone's named Smith. Yeah,

366
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I just assume he's all related to them.

367
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Speaker 2: It wouldn't he's He might be on a Genghis Khan

368
00:18:15,240 --> 00:18:19,839
level to be honest leader of a polygamist church, and

369
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a big one at that.

370
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Speaker 1: Yeah, the leader, the guy well, actually that was the

371
00:18:24,119 --> 00:18:28,039
whole fraction with the Mormon Church was bring him young

372
00:18:28,079 --> 00:18:30,440
and his boys wanted multiple wives.

373
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Speaker 2: Yeah, and the one who went to Michigan didn't.

374
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Speaker 1: I think so Beaver Island, Yeah, by the up James Strang, Yeah,

375
00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:40,400
for strange Strang. I think it's strang.

376
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Speaker 2: Why would you cut the best part of your religion?

377
00:18:42,839 --> 00:18:45,599
Speaker 1: Go go out in the desert, have yourself. It was

378
00:18:45,599 --> 00:18:49,000
Burning Man before Burning Man really really was. Mormon Church

379
00:18:49,119 --> 00:18:50,240
started as Burning Man.

380
00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:54,240
Speaker 2: Mormon's invented Burning Man, like full stop everything that Burning

381
00:18:54,279 --> 00:18:56,440
Man wishes it was is what the Mormon Church is.

382
00:18:56,799 --> 00:18:58,160
Speaker 1: You just go out to the middle of nowhere in

383
00:18:58,200 --> 00:19:01,759
the desert and get a bunch of bang maids.

384
00:19:01,839 --> 00:19:06,240
Speaker 2: Really yeah, yeah, and uh talk about how you found

385
00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:09,000
your spirituality?

386
00:19:09,119 --> 00:19:13,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, actually Bernanman is super Mormon coded.

387
00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:22,680
Speaker 2: It really is, so Smith. This is like classic Joseph Smith, Right,

388
00:19:23,279 --> 00:19:26,640
he makes a prophecy and then sends a guy to

389
00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:28,839
go fulfill that prophecy that he made so that then

390
00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:30,359
he can come back to the church and be like,

391
00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:32,079
my prophecy has come true.

392
00:19:33,119 --> 00:19:35,359
Speaker 1: Welly are you doing like a Martin Luther King voice?

393
00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:35,880
I don't know.

394
00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:37,839
Speaker 2: I just imagine Joseph Smith to be.

395
00:19:37,839 --> 00:19:42,319
Speaker 1: Like, oh, I bet he had like a high pitched

396
00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:43,279
voice like Lincoln.

397
00:19:44,160 --> 00:19:46,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, that actually is how he kind of sounds on

398
00:19:47,039 --> 00:19:48,359
Like he does sound like what I was doing on

399
00:19:48,519 --> 00:19:50,559
I think in Book of Mormon, Like he's like.

400
00:19:50,519 --> 00:19:54,319
Speaker 1: Oh, I'm Joseph Smith. I've actually never seen this, so

401
00:19:54,519 --> 00:19:55,640
oh it's good. Okay.

402
00:19:55,839 --> 00:19:58,440
Speaker 2: But the thing, I had a friend who saw it

403
00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:00,319
a Broadway in like twenty eleven, and I was like,

404
00:20:00,319 --> 00:20:01,960
I was it, I was it, I was I was it,

405
00:20:02,319 --> 00:20:06,920
and she was like it was really funny. But I

406
00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:11,200
think the reason it's blowing people's brains out is because

407
00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:14,480
a lot of the Broadway people don't watch South Park,

408
00:20:15,279 --> 00:20:18,599
and this is their first exposure to that their sense

409
00:20:18,599 --> 00:20:22,039
of humor, and because we're both big south Park and

410
00:20:22,119 --> 00:20:24,240
she was like it was really funny, but like I was.

411
00:20:25,119 --> 00:20:28,559
Speaker 1: I was used to it. Yeah, it's like, oh that's

412
00:20:28,599 --> 00:20:30,000
Butter's or that's Cartman.

413
00:20:30,119 --> 00:20:32,759
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah yeah, like it was like you like it

414
00:20:32,799 --> 00:20:35,000
was like, yeah, oh yeah, you clearly Trey Parker wrote this,

415
00:20:35,039 --> 00:20:37,400
but all the Broadway people not south Park people, so

416
00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:39,440
they what they get. They basically got south Park for.

417
00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:41,359
Speaker 1: The first There's also so many ways you can make

418
00:20:41,400 --> 00:20:47,359
your voice sound. It's like Seth McFarlane, Oh, it's that's Brian. Yeah,

419
00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:49,759
if he does anything, it's usually a Brian voice or

420
00:20:49,799 --> 00:20:51,640
a Peter voice or Ted.

421
00:20:51,839 --> 00:20:52,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, Ted is just Peter.

422
00:20:53,119 --> 00:20:53,640
Speaker 1: Yeah.

423
00:20:53,799 --> 00:20:59,519
Speaker 2: It's literally the safe thing, just like a little less stupid. Essentially,

424
00:21:00,519 --> 00:21:02,359
Dad's pretty dumb. Yeah, it's a Teddy Bear.

425
00:21:02,599 --> 00:21:05,119
Speaker 1: It's true. That show is really funny. By the way

426
00:21:05,599 --> 00:21:08,440
you watch it the movies, no the show, and then

427
00:21:08,519 --> 00:21:09,599
watch the show. Show's good.

428
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:13,640
Speaker 2: So yeah, Joseph Smith basically just does his own bullshit

429
00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:16,839
prophecy and has Rockwell go fu phill it. Now, Bog survived,

430
00:21:17,279 --> 00:21:20,599
he did not die, so Smith's prophecy doesn't even come

431
00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:24,200
true anyway. But Rockwell is arrested in Saint Louis in

432
00:21:24,319 --> 00:21:26,119
eighteenth March six, eighteen forty three Am.

433
00:21:26,200 --> 00:21:28,000
Speaker 1: He's like young dof how the fuck you miss a

434
00:21:28,039 --> 00:21:31,200
whole hundred shots? Yeah, I know, or I guess you

435
00:21:31,279 --> 00:21:34,279
mean Dolph eventually gets caught at a cookie shop in Memphis.

436
00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:38,039
It's maybe more like fifty Yeah, fifty get shot nine times, survives,

437
00:21:38,359 --> 00:21:39,160
build an empire.

438
00:21:40,039 --> 00:21:42,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, Rockwell didn't get the job done this time.

439
00:21:42,279 --> 00:21:46,960
Speaker 1: Fifty cent as the ages only gets better with all

440
00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:49,039
the investments he made his music Actually, if you go

441
00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:51,920
back and listen to it holds up and he never

442
00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:55,839
got caught up with all the weird gay Diddy stuff.

443
00:21:55,880 --> 00:22:00,160
In fact, he made a documentary about his enemies and

444
00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:02,680
did he if you told me and she trashed.

445
00:22:02,359 --> 00:22:04,119
Speaker 2: Him if you told me in two thousand and three.

446
00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:08,640
Fifty cents going to be a really lovable, great guy

447
00:22:08,799 --> 00:22:12,000
that is like the best person in rap, like the

448
00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:14,559
maybe the best like human being morally in rap.

449
00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:18,119
Speaker 1: And he's like always on the right side of history. Yeah,

450
00:22:18,279 --> 00:22:22,680
when it comes to like Floyd Mayweather Diddy, anybody he

451
00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:25,880
started a clothing brand, remember Gie Unit Clothes.

452
00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:28,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, someone would, I guarantee you someone would chime in

453
00:22:28,279 --> 00:22:30,000
too and be like, what about Kanye, I mean.

454
00:22:31,319 --> 00:22:36,359
Speaker 1: Got in on vitamin water early. Oh he cashed in.

455
00:22:36,279 --> 00:22:38,160
Speaker 2: The amount of money. So much he made on vitamin

456
00:22:38,200 --> 00:22:39,359
Water's got to be obscene.

457
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:42,839
Speaker 1: Now, Vitamin Water did get sued, but I think he

458
00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:43,400
got app before.

459
00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:46,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, he ejected, he's good to go. But yeah, if

460
00:22:46,519 --> 00:22:48,160
you had told me twenty and the fifty cent was

461
00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:50,319
going to be the most morally upstanding person from that

462
00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:54,039
generation of rap, not taking that bet.

463
00:22:55,079 --> 00:22:56,480
Speaker 1: Here we are though, yeah, here we are.

464
00:22:57,519 --> 00:23:01,559
Speaker 2: Rockwell was never indicted for the attempted to sayassination, but

465
00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:06,599
he had escaped jail after being arrested, so he was

466
00:23:07,119 --> 00:23:09,160
tried and found guilty of escaping jail.

467
00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:10,200
Speaker 1: He was on the lamb.

468
00:23:10,279 --> 00:23:11,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was on the lamb.

469
00:23:11,079 --> 00:23:11,559
Speaker 1: For a little bit.

470
00:23:11,599 --> 00:23:14,079
Speaker 2: So he spent nine months in prison after his arrest

471
00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:18,200
for the jail break. But he was never and no

472
00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:24,000
one was ever charged for the attempted assassination of Bogs.

473
00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:26,599
No one ever figured out who it was. It was Rockwell,

474
00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:28,240
but no one ever figured out who it was.

475
00:23:28,519 --> 00:23:30,640
Speaker 1: But it was Rockwell. At least he's not sloppy with

476
00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:33,400
his assassination attempts.

477
00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:36,920
Speaker 2: No, I mean obvious maybe, but not sloppy.

478
00:23:38,279 --> 00:23:40,599
Speaker 1: It's not what you know, it's what you can prove exactly.

479
00:23:40,599 --> 00:23:42,720
Speaker 2: They couldn't prove. I don't even understand you prove anything

480
00:23:42,720 --> 00:23:46,079
back then, like unless literally someone like saw you, was

481
00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:47,599
like standing next to you.

482
00:23:47,599 --> 00:23:49,440
Speaker 1: You know, you leave the gun around.

483
00:23:49,319 --> 00:23:52,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, with your initials carved into it.

484
00:23:53,720 --> 00:23:54,599
Speaker 1: That's the only way.

485
00:23:56,640 --> 00:24:00,759
Speaker 2: So he continued to serve as Joseph Smith's person no bodyguard,

486
00:24:00,759 --> 00:24:04,920
and he was also part of a group called the Danites.

487
00:24:05,920 --> 00:24:08,400
Speaker 1: No, I don't know if you know nights are of

488
00:24:08,559 --> 00:24:10,359
the night the day?

489
00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:13,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, the Danites, probably Danites, the Danites.

490
00:24:13,960 --> 00:24:14,920
Speaker 1: I think it's the Danites.

491
00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:17,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, where a do you know this group?

492
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:19,240
Speaker 1: No, but my name's in it.

493
00:24:19,279 --> 00:24:23,880
Speaker 2: Okay, the Danites, you'll like it. Then we're essentially the

494
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:28,480
Mormon Special Forces. They were a secret Mormon vigilante group.

495
00:24:29,799 --> 00:24:33,160
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, they wore the hoods, did they?

496
00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:35,319
Speaker 2: I don't even the bags.

497
00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:37,319
Speaker 1: Over there they kind of had. They were KKK coded.

498
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:39,880
Speaker 2: Really, I think the KKK was just doing what a

499
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:42,960
lot of people did back then. And yeah, they but

500
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:45,920
they just like kept doing it after people stopped doing it.

501
00:24:46,839 --> 00:24:50,480
Speaker 1: Okay, I think this is the group in American primeval then, yeah,

502
00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:51,960
does all the dirty work.

503
00:24:52,079 --> 00:24:57,279
Speaker 2: I mean, these guys fucking fuck people up. It started

504
00:24:57,319 --> 00:24:58,680
in Missouri, but obviously they went.

505
00:24:58,599 --> 00:25:00,000
Speaker 1: Out to Utah. Uh.

506
00:25:00,039 --> 00:25:06,640
Speaker 2: On September sixteenth, eighteen forty five, Lieutenant Frank Warrel of

507
00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:14,400
the Carthage Missouri Militia came across Rockwell, and Rockwell after

508
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:19,759
refusing in order to stop by a different sheriff shot

509
00:25:19,799 --> 00:25:23,000
and killed Warrel just was like, I'm not going to

510
00:25:23,039 --> 00:25:25,920
follow your order, not going to comply, and they fucking

511
00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:31,480
shot and killed Lieutenant Frank Warrel. Warrel, this was probably

512
00:25:31,519 --> 00:25:35,039
on purpose, like you probably came across him on purpose,

513
00:25:35,559 --> 00:25:39,960
because Warrel was the sergeant of the guard at the

514
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,559
prison where Joseph Smith was killed.

515
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:47,960
Speaker 1: Lynch mob got him, yeah, because they were gone and

516
00:25:48,039 --> 00:25:50,920
probably let him go, right, I think so. Yeah, And

517
00:25:51,279 --> 00:25:52,519
the town was not having.

518
00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:54,200
Speaker 2: The town was like this is hold on. First off,

519
00:25:54,200 --> 00:25:56,119
it's legal to kill him.

520
00:25:55,880 --> 00:26:00,079
Speaker 1: Yeah, strung him up, yeah, him and his brother. Yeah.

521
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:02,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so, because a couple of people died

522
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,720
in it. And it says that Smiths were assassinated.

523
00:26:05,160 --> 00:26:07,599
Speaker 1: But again not in Missouri, right across the state line.

524
00:26:07,599 --> 00:26:08,960
Speaker 2: I believe that was in Illinois.

525
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:11,480
Speaker 1: Illinois, I believe that happened. Yeah, So he was in

526
00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:15,519
the jail cell waiting to be transported and then and

527
00:26:15,559 --> 00:26:17,799
I think he was eventually just going to get off

528
00:26:17,839 --> 00:26:21,799
and the town was just like na, nah nah hang him. Yeah.

529
00:26:21,799 --> 00:26:24,680
So actually, if it was in Illinois, wasn't legal there

530
00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:26,599
you go damn. Yeah.

531
00:26:27,079 --> 00:26:28,599
Speaker 2: You think Rockwell would have let it go if it

532
00:26:28,599 --> 00:26:29,079
was in Missouri.

533
00:26:29,079 --> 00:26:31,759
Speaker 1: It's like, well, the law is a law, probably, yeah,

534
00:26:32,599 --> 00:26:37,400
the law well, I mean Rockwell, No, Rockwell, yeah, seek vengeance,

535
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:39,839
but anybody else, yes.

536
00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:43,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, anyone else but well, my hands are tied. It's

537
00:26:43,079 --> 00:26:48,519
kind of the fucking law. So Rockwell gets his vengeance

538
00:26:48,599 --> 00:26:52,240
on the man who essentially let Smith die.

539
00:26:52,599 --> 00:26:56,599
Speaker 1: Can you really fight against an entire mob by yourself?

540
00:26:56,759 --> 00:26:59,200
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I know right. There was a dude I

541
00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:01,599
saw a crazy this is about a lynch mob. Actually,

542
00:27:02,839 --> 00:27:08,640
I think it was Henry Fonda, the actor. It was

543
00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:10,400
an old video. He's like on a news program in

544
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:12,279
the nineties and he was talking about like how he

545
00:27:12,319 --> 00:27:16,720
grew up in Omaha. Yeah, and you know in the

546
00:27:16,759 --> 00:27:21,519
early nineteen hundreds, and the reporters like, now, when you

547
00:27:21,599 --> 00:27:26,799
were a boy, you've recounted before you saw lynch mob,

548
00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:32,960
didn't you, And Fonda's like, yeah, there was a black

549
00:27:33,079 --> 00:27:37,839
guy in jail for some crime. And my dad worked

550
00:27:37,839 --> 00:27:40,839
downtown and a mob. There was a mob out there

551
00:27:40,839 --> 00:27:42,680
all day. They're got real worked up. So my dad

552
00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:45,640
comes home for dinner and we eat dinner and he

553
00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:48,079
takes me back to the office so we can look

554
00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:50,279
out at the mob. Like he wanted to show me

555
00:27:50,759 --> 00:27:52,720
what a lynch mob was because he was against it

556
00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:55,279
street justice. He was like, son, you got to learn

557
00:27:55,319 --> 00:27:57,319
that this is wrong. And he just made like young

558
00:27:57,359 --> 00:28:01,240
Henry Fonda watch as they like they went into the jail,

559
00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:06,319
they like overpowered the sheriff and then pulled the strung

560
00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:08,799
them up black heet out and strung him up, and

561
00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:11,200
Henry Fond was just like sitting there watching.

562
00:28:10,799 --> 00:28:14,599
Speaker 1: It as a child, right, so he's a child, and

563
00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:17,160
the reporter was kind of like blaming him for doing that.

564
00:28:17,319 --> 00:28:19,480
Speaker 2: No, no, no, he was just like, interesting piece of

565
00:28:19,559 --> 00:28:21,680
history you saw. And Henry Fond is like, yeah, it

566
00:28:21,839 --> 00:28:23,440
was an interesting piece of history. There's just like a

567
00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:26,759
black dead, black kid. It's like, yeah, that's what I

568
00:28:26,799 --> 00:28:28,480
learned that lynch mobs were bad. It's like, oh, do

569
00:28:28,480 --> 00:28:29,200
you need to see it?

570
00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:31,480
Speaker 1: It's an interesting time to laugh. Yeah, do you need

571
00:28:31,519 --> 00:28:34,079
to see it? By you what you were laughing as

572
00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:35,799
you said that what black kids strung up.

573
00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:39,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, because it's a ridiculous thing for him to just

574
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:41,519
be like, yo, yeah, I saw it, just showing your

575
00:28:41,559 --> 00:28:45,359
true character, just so it's okay, it's a ridiculous. Like

576
00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:46,680
the way they were talking about it.

577
00:28:46,759 --> 00:28:48,680
Speaker 1: Didn't realize I was doing a show with such a

578
00:28:48,720 --> 00:28:49,359
piece of shit.

579
00:28:49,519 --> 00:28:52,480
Speaker 2: The way they were talking about it was so absurd,

580
00:28:52,640 --> 00:28:54,400
Like it was just like, yeah, I saw that piece

581
00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:57,359
of history, Like there's a human being just fucking hanging

582
00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:00,039
and he's like, yeah, oh, it's history. I saw it.

583
00:29:00,119 --> 00:29:00,680
And that's the day.

584
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:02,720
Speaker 1: I imagine going to a public hanging for a dude

585
00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:05,640
that took a horse. I know, all right, at least

586
00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:08,440
he's guilty. We don't know that. Again, how did you

587
00:29:08,519 --> 00:29:09,319
prove this stuff?

588
00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:13,119
Speaker 2: Just the last man with the horse, Yeah, he probably

589
00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:14,720
bought it from the guy that stole the horse, and

590
00:29:14,799 --> 00:29:16,559
that is he's the one that ends up with the

591
00:29:16,559 --> 00:29:18,559
news around his neck. That is a famous tombstone in

592
00:29:18,599 --> 00:29:21,359
the west of the guy who was hung for being

593
00:29:21,359 --> 00:29:23,000
a horse. If he just bought the stolen didn't know

594
00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:23,839
it was stolen.

595
00:29:24,359 --> 00:29:29,000
Speaker 1: How could you the papers? Right? I guess they might have,

596
00:29:29,039 --> 00:29:31,519
but you had to hold on to that at all times.

597
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:34,720
It's like if you had to like carry around your

598
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:36,319
birth certificate all the time.

599
00:29:37,359 --> 00:29:40,240
Speaker 2: Right, or like the papers for your car even or

600
00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:43,240
your social Security title. Yeah, you give your car title

601
00:29:43,279 --> 00:29:45,599
at all times. If you don't have it, it's stolen.

602
00:29:45,839 --> 00:29:47,079
Speaker 1: You don't want to do that. You don't want to

603
00:29:47,119 --> 00:29:48,880
keep your car title in your car because your car

604
00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:50,720
will be stolen and now it's their vehicle.

605
00:29:51,279 --> 00:29:52,160
Speaker 2: It's a bearer bond.

606
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:56,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's how it works. Man. If the person that

607
00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:59,720
steals your car has your title, it's their car.

608
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:02,240
Speaker 2: They're like, all right, well the name on the title.

609
00:30:03,279 --> 00:30:04,920
Speaker 1: Is just crossed out and sharpie.

610
00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:07,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, like I don't know its title says that. The

611
00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:08,880
title says.

612
00:30:09,519 --> 00:30:09,599
Speaker 1: So.

613
00:30:09,839 --> 00:30:15,720
Speaker 2: Following Smith's death, Rockwell pledges his loyalty to bring him

614
00:30:15,759 --> 00:30:21,960
young and he follows the church to Utah and now

615
00:30:23,119 --> 00:30:24,319
he's Bringham Young's enforcer.

616
00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:26,720
Speaker 1: Yeah.

617
00:30:26,799 --> 00:30:30,240
Speaker 2: In eighteen forty nine, Rockwell is appointed Deputy Marshal of

618
00:30:30,279 --> 00:30:34,720
Salt Lake City and he remained a cop until his death.

619
00:30:35,039 --> 00:30:35,880
Speaker 1: And that's the story.

620
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:40,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, believe it or not, he did not.

621
00:30:42,279 --> 00:30:44,000
He did not do the badge much honor.

622
00:30:45,559 --> 00:30:51,680
Speaker 1: You don't say no no. But also he's a cop

623
00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:54,839
on behalf of the Mormon Church, which is not really

624
00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:59,559
fully recognized by the US government. Yeah, so like his

625
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:07,799
jersey is not, you know, unchallenged. It's true. He's really

626
00:31:07,839 --> 00:31:08,839
like not really a cop.

627
00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:11,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean he's just like self appointed. Like it's

628
00:31:11,799 --> 00:31:13,880
like in Deadwood when they make Bullock Marshall, but they're

629
00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:15,799
not a part of Yeah, you take over.

630
00:31:15,839 --> 00:31:17,960
Speaker 1: A wild West town and you could just become the sheriff,

631
00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:20,960
even if you're an outlaw yourself. Yeah, that's actually the

632
00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:24,119
best way to hide your sheriff. Now you want to

633
00:31:24,119 --> 00:31:28,440
be the cop. That's common trope. A bounty hunter comes

634
00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:33,400
into town looking for an outlaw. Turns out he runs

635
00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:36,599
the town of sheriff, hiding red out in the open,

636
00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:41,640
and he's like, you can dry to take me. Yeah, certainly,

637
00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:42,160
not alive.

638
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:45,599
Speaker 2: You got twenty deputies with me, and.

639
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:48,880
Speaker 1: They're all up in the top of them buildings ready

640
00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:49,359
to fire.

641
00:31:49,839 --> 00:31:54,519
Speaker 2: On April twenty first, eighteen fifty one, a group of

642
00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:59,359
I don't know how to say, is goshoot Indians, go

643
00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:06,079
shoot Indians. They stole some horses that had are they

644
00:32:06,119 --> 00:32:08,839
I guess they confiscated some horses that had gone into

645
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:14,839
their territory and h General Daniel Wells sent a posse

646
00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:19,119
led by Rockwell to pursue the Indians and get the

647
00:32:19,119 --> 00:32:23,680
horses back. They lost the trail of these Indians that

648
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:28,319
had taken the horses, but lucky them, they found twenty

649
00:32:28,400 --> 00:32:33,519
or thirty other people Indians belonging to the Ute tribe,

650
00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:36,160
and uh, they just took them prisoner.

651
00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:39,000
Speaker 1: Shouting my boys rocking with the Utes.

652
00:32:39,119 --> 00:32:41,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, they were just like, eh, all right, we'll take

653
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:43,839
you prisoner because since we can't find the Indians who

654
00:32:43,839 --> 00:32:45,319
stole the horses at the.

655
00:32:45,319 --> 00:32:47,240
Speaker 1: End of the day, that's the result they wanted.

656
00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:50,680
Speaker 2: Right, right, get some get some Indians. Well they took

657
00:32:50,759 --> 00:32:53,559
them prisoner, but they didn't disarm them, and I guess

658
00:32:53,599 --> 00:32:56,400
they were taking them back to their territory. And uh,

659
00:32:58,079 --> 00:33:03,039
eventually some of them try to escape and the posse

660
00:33:04,119 --> 00:33:06,480
just started opening fire.

661
00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 1: Well, honestly, every criminal should be able to have access

662
00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:15,480
to their weapons because it should be a trial by combat.

663
00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:19,920
Speaker 2: Is this America or not? You know, I don't think

664
00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:21,960
anyone's gun should ever be taken, even when they go

665
00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:22,400
to prison.

666
00:33:23,799 --> 00:33:25,559
Speaker 1: But you're in the court of law, right you think

667
00:33:25,599 --> 00:33:27,839
things are going bad for you, you don't have the

668
00:33:27,839 --> 00:33:32,400
proper funds to hire a decent lawyer. Just call trial

669
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:33,039
by combat.

670
00:33:33,279 --> 00:33:36,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, go full Tyerian just like halfway through, just be

671
00:33:36,920 --> 00:33:38,519
like this sucks. Trial by combat.

672
00:33:39,799 --> 00:33:42,119
Speaker 1: I think that holds up in the US court of law.

673
00:33:43,079 --> 00:33:45,319
Speaker 2: Have to check the constitution if you ask for it.

674
00:33:45,319 --> 00:33:47,160
It's like it's sort of like when you how you

675
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:50,039
can in some states you can ask you can request

676
00:33:50,079 --> 00:33:51,079
your method of execution.

677
00:33:51,599 --> 00:33:56,519
Speaker 1: Ooh speakin the Constitution and Declaration of Independence, all the

678
00:33:56,559 --> 00:34:01,240
proper documents of this. You know, young country. They got

679
00:34:01,319 --> 00:34:05,720
us going. Yeah, unaware of this, but when the White

680
00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:09,239
House was being burnt down in the War of eighteen twelve,

681
00:34:10,079 --> 00:34:13,639
there was a dude that went back and like saved

682
00:34:13,679 --> 00:34:18,280
all our proper documents. Who was it? I got to

683
00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:21,920
look into it. Somebody sent me just kind of intel

684
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:23,960
for a future episode I don't have to do it on.

685
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:28,039
Speaker 2: And meanwhile, Dolly Madison gets all the shine for saving

686
00:34:28,039 --> 00:34:28,559
a painting.

687
00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:33,119
Speaker 1: Yeah no, uh, this dude saved everything you hold near

688
00:34:33,159 --> 00:34:36,800
and dearer to your heart. Wow, for our country. I

689
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:39,360
got to look into it. But perhaps stay tuned future

690
00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:40,679
episode of for Solive.

691
00:34:40,480 --> 00:34:43,440
Speaker 2: The man who saved the but Dolly Madison just gets painting.

692
00:34:43,559 --> 00:34:46,159
It was like, oh wow, Dolly Madison. Yeah, he saved

693
00:34:46,159 --> 00:34:46,599
a painting.

694
00:34:46,679 --> 00:34:48,360
Speaker 1: Who gives a fuck about the pain, which is a

695
00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:50,079
fucking painting. We got the constitution.

696
00:34:50,159 --> 00:34:55,079
Speaker 2: Yeah, so essentially, like not even a Mexican standoff breaks out,

697
00:34:55,159 --> 00:34:59,599
just like everyone shooting, everyone breaks out. All but four

698
00:34:59,719 --> 00:35:05,000
or five of the prisoners escape in the chaos, but

699
00:35:05,039 --> 00:35:08,840
those who didn't escape were immediately.

700
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:11,280
Speaker 1: Executed by Rockwell point blank.

701
00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:17,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, just fucking bullet in the head. Rockwell was also

702
00:35:19,119 --> 00:35:22,760
kind of an interesting Mormon because he ran a brewery

703
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:25,760
in Salt Lake Valley.

704
00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:30,920
Speaker 1: Yeah. I don't know if like early Mormon church was

705
00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:33,599
down with not drinking, you would think they would.

706
00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:35,280
Speaker 2: Be like the teetollers, you know what I mean, like

707
00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:36,840
the most like of all.

708
00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:39,360
Speaker 1: Again, it kind of like breaks off in all these

709
00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:44,559
different sects. Yeah, so I am not super familiar with

710
00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:48,519
Brigham Young's portion of this. He was about the multiple wives.

711
00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:50,719
Maybe he was about drinking too, having a good time.

712
00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:53,400
Speaker 2: I see, I don't there. From what I read, they

713
00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:55,639
were kind of they were. They were definitely like not

714
00:35:56,719 --> 00:36:00,599
like into drinking, but Rockwell for we drank.

715
00:36:01,159 --> 00:36:01,639
Speaker 1: Uh.

716
00:36:01,679 --> 00:36:04,039
Speaker 2: He was at this point a famous mountain man by

717
00:36:04,079 --> 00:36:06,719
like eighteen sixty famous like frontiersman.

718
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:11,559
Speaker 1: And uh, it would actually be scarier if he was sober, right,

719
00:36:12,519 --> 00:36:17,119
it makes sense, you know, giant bearded enforce her. He's

720
00:36:17,159 --> 00:36:20,960
a little loose on the liquor. Yeah, he's like if

721
00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:22,800
he's sober brand. If he's sober, he's like.

722
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:27,840
Speaker 2: Determinator basically, like just a mindless coming for you. Doesn't

723
00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:30,000
think about anything. Nothing can distract him.

724
00:36:30,039 --> 00:36:31,920
Speaker 1: But they might also have to drink back then, because

725
00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:32,880
it's cleaner than water.

726
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:36,159
Speaker 2: I don't think the whiskey hydrates you very well, but

727
00:36:36,199 --> 00:36:41,519
the beer m And also they don't even have water.

728
00:36:41,639 --> 00:36:44,159
They just they're the only civilization on Earth that set

729
00:36:44,199 --> 00:36:45,519
up shop next to a salt lake.

730
00:36:46,039 --> 00:36:48,559
Speaker 1: Listen, they didn't realize it was salt lake. Who would

731
00:36:48,599 --> 00:36:49,840
have thought it was a salt lake?

732
00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:50,559
Speaker 2: Yeah, like, what do you?

733
00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:51,199
Speaker 1: What?

734
00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:53,159
Speaker 2: Were miles from an ocean?

735
00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:56,159
Speaker 1: How the fuck is there salt in there? God damn it.

736
00:36:57,800 --> 00:37:03,599
Speaker 2: Uh. So Rockwell's fame attracted the explorer Richard Francis Burton.

737
00:37:04,079 --> 00:37:06,400
He was going across America in eighteen sixty and he

738
00:37:06,440 --> 00:37:08,559
wanted to stop and meet the famous port of Rockwell.

739
00:37:09,079 --> 00:37:13,159
So Dayton invites rock another guy who invites Rockwell to

740
00:37:13,199 --> 00:37:16,599
dinner with Burton, and Rockwell sends for a bottle of

741
00:37:16,599 --> 00:37:22,039
whiskey and he and Burton drink shot for shot throughout

742
00:37:22,400 --> 00:37:22,760
the night.

743
00:37:23,519 --> 00:37:25,039
Speaker 1: What do you think that conversation's like.

744
00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:29,880
Speaker 2: So, what we know about Rockwell according to that one

745
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:34,400
op ed or quote or whatever is he's dumb, he's strong,

746
00:37:35,159 --> 00:37:38,039
he's a fanatic. Yeah, and he's not very huge. He

747
00:37:38,039 --> 00:37:40,039
doesn't have a good sense of humor, all.

748
00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:44,280
Speaker 1: The combination for a sweet ten. Yeah. So he's just

749
00:37:44,320 --> 00:37:44,960
getting ripped.

750
00:37:45,039 --> 00:37:47,440
Speaker 2: Gotta think he's a great drunk, probably.

751
00:37:47,159 --> 00:37:48,159
Speaker 1: Trying to fight everyone.

752
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:51,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, at least he's big, Like hopefully he didn't get

753
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:52,519
too drunk.

754
00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:56,320
Speaker 1: He probably tries to fight you. You're having a nice,

755
00:37:57,199 --> 00:38:00,519
you think time with him out and about on town,

756
00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:05,280
drinking right at the saloon, you say the wrong thing,

757
00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:08,320
and all of a sudden, he's just throwing haymakers at

758
00:38:08,760 --> 00:38:09,679
just you.

759
00:38:09,639 --> 00:38:11,400
Speaker 2: Think he's like a Honestly, it's like probably like a

760
00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:15,360
Johnny Manziel situation, just gets bored, wants to start punching shit.

761
00:38:15,599 --> 00:38:17,920
Speaker 1: It's only a matter of time. It's not whether or

762
00:38:18,000 --> 00:38:19,039
not he will fight.

763
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:22,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just when. If you the only way you

764
00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:24,920
have to just keep him entertained, It's like a baby

765
00:38:24,960 --> 00:38:28,119
you can't put down or it'll start crying you if

766
00:38:28,159 --> 00:38:30,039
you are not constantly entertaining him.

767
00:38:30,119 --> 00:38:32,639
Speaker 1: But the ultimate consequence, he will kill you. Yeah. Yeah,

768
00:38:32,760 --> 00:38:37,400
he will murder a giant baby that just has the

769
00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:38,719
touch of death with his hands.

770
00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:41,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, so you just have to constantly keep him happy.

771
00:38:43,480 --> 00:38:49,599
In eighteen fifty seven, Rockwell participated in perhaps his most

772
00:38:49,679 --> 00:38:56,679
famous act as a as a lawman, the ach And Massacre,

773
00:38:57,679 --> 00:39:05,519
in which several Californian travelers were slaughtered by Mormons on

774
00:39:05,679 --> 00:39:06,760
the orders of Brigham Young.

775
00:39:07,000 --> 00:39:10,400
Speaker 1: Yeah. So that's I believe what they cover in American

776
00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:14,320
Prime Eval. I looked at the cast. Rockwell not in

777
00:39:14,360 --> 00:39:19,480
the show really. Yeah. The guy who I thought it

778
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:21,639
would have been was James Wardley.

779
00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:25,599
Speaker 2: I saw his name in this. Yeah, he doesn't really

780
00:39:25,599 --> 00:39:29,079
play role see Rockwell though, Damn dude, what at least.

781
00:39:28,920 --> 00:39:31,840
Speaker 1: As like a you know, first twenty characters to show up?

782
00:39:31,880 --> 00:39:34,000
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, maybe he's just like too high up.

783
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:36,920
Speaker 1: For the maybe yeah, or maybe if they did an

784
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:38,880
American Prime Eval season two, will show up.

785
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:42,360
Speaker 2: I mean he is. His fingerprints are all over every

786
00:39:42,440 --> 00:39:48,639
fucking thing the Mormons did, the victims and the Ache

787
00:39:48,639 --> 00:39:49,239
and massacre.

788
00:39:49,760 --> 00:39:52,440
Speaker 1: Also maybe a different masker. There could have been multiple maskers.

789
00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:56,360
Speaker 2: Definitely multiple maskers. They the Mormons got to their land

790
00:39:56,599 --> 00:40:00,920
and really lock it down, like they were just like

791
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:02,360
they wanted to make a bubble.

792
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:05,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean they moved to the end of the

793
00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:08,960
earth what they thought was the end for right, Like,

794
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:11,960
no one's gonna if you come out here, you get

795
00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:14,559
an answer for your crime of coming out here, coming

796
00:40:14,599 --> 00:40:17,719
out here, encroaching on our territory.

797
00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:20,760
Speaker 2: So these guys were just traveling through and they were

798
00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:24,920
arrested on you know, trumped up charges of spying for.

799
00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:27,480
Speaker 1: The US government. Yeah, and then they were.

800
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:32,280
Speaker 2: Imprisoned and executed. Two of them escaped though, but Rockwell

801
00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:34,039
tracked him down and killed him two days later.

802
00:40:34,440 --> 00:40:37,239
Speaker 1: All right, so he has quite a bit of skill

803
00:40:38,679 --> 00:40:39,400
as a tracker.

804
00:40:39,480 --> 00:40:42,400
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I mean this guy, he's good at his job,

805
00:40:42,599 --> 00:40:46,199
I guess, just bad hang, Yeah, bad, real bad hang.

806
00:40:46,920 --> 00:40:48,360
Speaker 1: But definitely the man for the job.

807
00:40:48,679 --> 00:40:50,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, you don't want to be arrested by this dude.

808
00:40:52,320 --> 00:40:56,360
A couple fun facts about Rockwell. So he was Joseph

809
00:40:56,360 --> 00:41:02,480
Smith's enforcer, right, Joseph Smith is. Joseph Smith allegedly gave

810
00:41:02,559 --> 00:41:06,519
Rockwell a prophetic blessing in the early eighteen forties. As

811
00:41:06,559 --> 00:41:10,000
long as he never cut his hair like Samson, no

812
00:41:10,159 --> 00:41:12,800
bullet or blade would harm him and he would never

813
00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:14,440
be taken by enemies.

814
00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:15,800
Speaker 1: Now was that the case?

815
00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:24,079
Speaker 2: He never cut his hair and the man died peacefully

816
00:41:24,119 --> 00:41:27,320
in his sleep, but never got shot, never got stabbed.

817
00:41:27,360 --> 00:41:31,559
He definitely took some damage, but not a lot, like

818
00:41:31,639 --> 00:41:32,920
nothing serious.

819
00:41:33,639 --> 00:41:37,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, I might just be the mentality to going into

820
00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:42,280
a fight, going into battle thinking you're invincible. There might

821
00:41:42,320 --> 00:41:50,199
be like a psychological advantage to that. Yeah. I mean, look,

822
00:41:50,239 --> 00:41:53,599
you you could also go horribly wrong, like a Homeboy

823
00:41:53,679 --> 00:41:57,719
from the Pacific, which was the guy that went back

824
00:41:57,840 --> 00:42:01,239
after doing like a US battle, Yeah and just got domed.

825
00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:06,480
Speaker 2: Well, that'll happen on the beaches of e with gema.

826
00:42:06,639 --> 00:42:08,639
Speaker 1: Yeah, but he thought he was untouchable.

827
00:42:09,079 --> 00:42:11,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, you can't go in with too much confidence. But yeah,

828
00:42:11,519 --> 00:42:13,440
if you go in a certain amount of confidence is

829
00:42:13,440 --> 00:42:14,800
absolutely gonna make you move better.

830
00:42:15,599 --> 00:42:20,199
Speaker 1: You're not doubting yourself, yeah, yeah, no second guesses you're playing,

831
00:42:20,480 --> 00:42:21,320
You're not reacting.

832
00:42:21,559 --> 00:42:25,199
Speaker 2: Yeah, Smith, Actually the prophet he's written down. I think

833
00:42:26,119 --> 00:42:29,480
I prophesies in the name of the Lord you or

834
00:42:29,559 --> 00:42:33,440
in port Rockwell, so long as ye shall remain loyal

835
00:42:33,559 --> 00:42:37,199
and true to thy faith, need fear. No enemy cut

836
00:42:37,239 --> 00:42:41,280
not thy hair, and no bullet or blade can harm thee.

837
00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:45,079
And yeah, he kept it long his entire life and

838
00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:49,760
was never seriously wounded. Now this is an interesting one.

839
00:42:49,800 --> 00:42:52,199
Speaker 1: Can you give me that type of promise if I

840
00:42:52,199 --> 00:42:52,800
don't cut my.

841
00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:57,320
Speaker 2: Beard, I can't. I can't make you anything. Unfortunately, the show.

842
00:42:59,119 --> 00:43:03,119
Speaker 1: Dan will not be to a podcasting and having a beard.

843
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 2: I can pretty much guarantee you will never be harmed

844
00:43:05,039 --> 00:43:05,840
while podcasting.

845
00:43:06,320 --> 00:43:11,159
Speaker 1: I can't guarantee that for you. I know, you say

846
00:43:11,199 --> 00:43:13,039
the wrong thing, I might act like rock Well.

847
00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:16,480
Speaker 2: Gonna pop off. I know, dude, I'll pop off all

848
00:43:16,519 --> 00:43:21,199
over you, pop off all over your face. It's it's

849
00:43:21,239 --> 00:43:25,960
something I resign myself to every time I walk in here.

850
00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:29,400
Speaker 1: You know the risk. Yeah, say the wrong thing. There

851
00:43:29,400 --> 00:43:30,440
will be consequences.

852
00:43:30,599 --> 00:43:34,559
Speaker 2: It's it's like the other HBO World War two show

853
00:43:34,599 --> 00:43:37,920
Band of Brothers when Spears tells, uh, I forget the

854
00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:39,840
guy's name, but he tells me, He's like, here's the key.

855
00:43:40,880 --> 00:43:42,800
You gotta accept that you're already dead.

856
00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:45,000
Speaker 1: That's how I feel every time I walk through the door,

857
00:43:46,440 --> 00:43:50,400
and I feel that energy. Yeah, you you are dead man,

858
00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:52,920
walk in of like I know I'm dead, just like,

859
00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:56,400
please give us a little energy, Bud. I'm all on you.

860
00:43:56,480 --> 00:43:57,199
Resuscitate you.

861
00:43:57,679 --> 00:44:00,440
Speaker 2: I'm full of energy today, baby. Yeah, I gotta kool

862
00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:02,440
eight hours last night.

863
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:10,519
Speaker 1: You won't tomorrow. No, No, was gonna be shit, showed Rockwell.

864
00:44:12,159 --> 00:44:17,239
Speaker 2: Also in a fight, a bit of a lunatic, like

865
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:24,079
in your nose off like I don't kind of allegedly

866
00:44:25,039 --> 00:44:29,400
supposedly like when he was riding into a fight, you know,

867
00:44:29,519 --> 00:44:30,360
like charging in.

868
00:44:31,519 --> 00:44:34,320
Speaker 1: You know what his battlecry was? Was he playing a

869
00:44:34,320 --> 00:44:35,119
little credence?

870
00:44:35,599 --> 00:44:41,840
Speaker 2: No, it was he would just yell wheat, wheat, wheat.

871
00:44:42,079 --> 00:44:45,280
Speaker 1: He would what the grain you grow?

872
00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:50,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, he would just scream the word wheat, not sweet, nope.

873
00:44:50,239 --> 00:44:56,480
Speaker 1: Wheat wat Okay he's fueled by carbs. Yeah.

874
00:44:56,599 --> 00:45:00,320
Speaker 2: Or he would also potentially yell, do you wheat?

875
00:45:00,880 --> 00:45:02,559
Speaker 1: Does it mean anything? I don't know.

876
00:45:03,239 --> 00:45:04,320
Speaker 2: He's not a smart guy.

877
00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:09,440
Speaker 1: He's a simpleton. He's a simple bad He might just

878
00:45:09,519 --> 00:45:13,239
be like a ho do or type giant. He really

879
00:45:13,400 --> 00:45:16,840
might be. And you really can't even blame him for

880
00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:20,199
his violence because he's just there's nothing going on upstairs.

881
00:45:20,360 --> 00:45:22,760
Speaker 2: No, it really doesn't sound like there is.

882
00:45:23,960 --> 00:45:25,599
Speaker 1: I think maybe he thinks his name is Wheat.

883
00:45:25,679 --> 00:45:29,239
Speaker 2: He might just yeah, he might not know hold on,

884
00:45:29,480 --> 00:45:34,840
hold on wheat, wheat, wheat, wheat just loves bread, loves it, dude,

885
00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:37,679
who doesn't. I mean he started a brewery.

886
00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:43,760
Speaker 1: He's into grains, clearly homemade sourdough. Yeah, nothing better.

887
00:45:43,960 --> 00:45:46,920
Speaker 2: Just the last thing you hear before you die is

888
00:45:46,960 --> 00:45:49,119
a giant simple man screaming.

889
00:45:48,679 --> 00:45:51,679
Speaker 1: Wheat as he smashes your face. And yeah, with a

890
00:45:51,800 --> 00:45:56,079
rock I can think of better ways to go out. Yeah,

891
00:45:56,239 --> 00:45:59,280
I agree with that. Like if I met my end

892
00:45:59,760 --> 00:46:02,880
because of that man, I have some questions for God.

893
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:09,480
I get upstairs first with just being what fuck was that?

894
00:46:09,840 --> 00:46:10,719
Speaker 2: Why?

895
00:46:10,760 --> 00:46:12,079
Speaker 1: What the fuck was that?

896
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:19,760
Speaker 2: Rockwell did not die violently, as I said. He died

897
00:46:19,840 --> 00:46:22,400
of natural causes in his sleep on June ninth, eighteen

898
00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:25,880
seventy eight. He was buried in Salt Lake City Cemetery,

899
00:46:25,920 --> 00:46:28,320
and at the time of his death, he was the

900
00:46:28,400 --> 00:46:33,840
longest living Mormon in terms of like he had been

901
00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:37,119
in the church, the longest of anyone who was alive,

902
00:46:39,920 --> 00:46:45,320
and in true Mormon fashion, Rockwell had three wives and

903
00:46:45,360 --> 00:46:47,599
twenty one children by them.

904
00:46:47,599 --> 00:46:49,920
Speaker 1: Just pumping them out. Yep, you can get a good

905
00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:52,440
kind of pace. Go and you do one a year

906
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:54,920
with each wife. Oh my god, yeah, three kids a year.

907
00:46:55,679 --> 00:46:56,960
It's only seven years.

908
00:46:57,480 --> 00:46:59,039
Speaker 2: You want to space it out though. You don't want

909
00:46:59,079 --> 00:47:01,400
them all to be born same time. That's a nightmare.

910
00:47:02,920 --> 00:47:04,960
Speaker 1: You want to like a there's got to be an

911
00:47:05,000 --> 00:47:05,960
advantage to it, though.

912
00:47:06,039 --> 00:47:07,679
Speaker 2: You want you got like a spring, summer, fall.

913
00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:10,159
Speaker 1: You get it all out of the way, though, right,

914
00:47:10,760 --> 00:47:12,559
I mean, I guess you'd want to have kind of

915
00:47:12,599 --> 00:47:16,199
a wife that's not pregnant, so you can kind of

916
00:47:16,599 --> 00:47:17,920
it's on pap for all that.

917
00:47:18,320 --> 00:47:20,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, you can't have three pregnant at the same time.

918
00:47:20,880 --> 00:47:22,559
What's the point, Like you got then you got you

919
00:47:22,639 --> 00:47:24,119
got three pregnant wives, you got no wives?

920
00:47:24,119 --> 00:47:26,880
Speaker 1: You do a rotation? Yeah, yeah, one pregnant a year

921
00:47:27,119 --> 00:47:29,079
maybe then you have two that aren't. Yeah, so you

922
00:47:29,119 --> 00:47:30,280
can just kind of do whatever you want.

923
00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:32,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, And you want to only have one pregnant because

924
00:47:32,159 --> 00:47:36,000
you want to still have a rotation, yeah, because otherwise

925
00:47:36,039 --> 00:47:37,719
what's the point of having three wives? Right?

926
00:47:38,559 --> 00:47:42,519
Speaker 1: It's like today I'm feeling vanilla. Today I'm feeling strawberry. Yeah,

927
00:47:42,559 --> 00:47:44,760
today I'm feeling chocolate. Yep.

928
00:47:45,320 --> 00:47:48,119
Speaker 2: And I think he probably had a system in place. Yeah,

929
00:47:49,000 --> 00:47:50,199
you knew what he knew what he was doing.

930
00:47:50,960 --> 00:47:53,800
Speaker 1: Do you think it's like that Ronnie Dangerfield movie where

931
00:47:53,800 --> 00:48:01,400
he just pulls a Deli ticket probably like every wife

932
00:48:01,639 --> 00:48:05,880
who gets me to tonight pull the tickets. Yeah, we'll see,

933
00:48:05,960 --> 00:48:06,960
we'll see. It's a draw.

934
00:48:08,079 --> 00:48:11,480
Speaker 2: That was my favorite part of Big Love, as he

935
00:48:11,519 --> 00:48:13,440
would like bang the different wives, you know, on different

936
00:48:13,519 --> 00:48:18,679
nights whatever, and he needed viagra for the two like

937
00:48:18,800 --> 00:48:21,400
super Mormon wives, but like the hot young wife he

938
00:48:21,440 --> 00:48:24,039
didn't need viagra for and the other wives found out

939
00:48:24,400 --> 00:48:28,039
and were like what the fuck. He was like, yeah,

940
00:48:28,480 --> 00:48:30,400
like I don't have VD. I just don't find you

941
00:48:30,599 --> 00:48:31,079
very hot.

942
00:48:33,280 --> 00:48:37,559
Speaker 1: That'll happen. Yeah, I know. I can't tell him that though. No, no, no.

943
00:48:39,119 --> 00:48:43,519
Speaker 2: According to legend, Rockwell told a crowd listening to the

944
00:48:43,639 --> 00:48:48,320
US Vice President Skyler Colfax in eighteen sixty nine on

945
00:48:48,440 --> 00:48:55,320
the topic of his vigilanteism his lawman career, I never

946
00:48:55,440 --> 00:49:00,559
killed anyone who didn't need killing, which is obviously untrue.

947
00:49:00,639 --> 00:49:06,320
Speaker 1: But yeah, I just don't know if you can totally

948
00:49:06,400 --> 00:49:08,360
with confidence say that was the case.

949
00:49:10,119 --> 00:49:12,599
Speaker 2: It seems like it extremely was not the case.

950
00:49:13,320 --> 00:49:15,360
Speaker 1: Seems like it's open to interpretation.

951
00:49:15,760 --> 00:49:19,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I guess it's subjective, right, who didn't

952
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:21,800
need killing? He thought they needed killing.

953
00:49:23,159 --> 00:49:25,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, if it crosses his mind they need killing, he's

954
00:49:25,280 --> 00:49:25,920
gonna kill him.

955
00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:28,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, once you get that those wheat flashes.

956
00:49:28,960 --> 00:49:31,679
Speaker 1: But he didn't really get the star body he needed.

957
00:49:32,440 --> 00:49:33,639
He didn't get the governor.

958
00:49:33,400 --> 00:49:37,840
Speaker 2: He didn't get low Burn Bogs. He'll regret that. He

959
00:49:37,920 --> 00:49:39,400
and I assume he regretted that for the rest.

960
00:49:39,239 --> 00:49:39,719
Speaker 1: Of his life.

961
00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:42,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, couldn't take him down because.

962
00:49:42,320 --> 00:49:43,679
Speaker 1: Let's take a second shot at him.

963
00:49:43,719 --> 00:49:46,840
Speaker 2: He also failed Joseph Smith. Yeah, not a good body.

964
00:49:47,119 --> 00:49:47,760
Speaker 1: Made him a liar.

965
00:49:48,599 --> 00:49:50,960
Speaker 2: He died, He died one but two he made one

966
00:49:51,039 --> 00:49:56,000
under his protection. Prophecy didn't come true. He got revenge

967
00:49:56,039 --> 00:49:57,519
for Joseph Smith sort of.

968
00:49:58,039 --> 00:50:04,639
Speaker 1: But the cop that was watching over on watch Yeah cool,

969
00:50:06,239 --> 00:50:09,320
totally on him, right, Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely his fault,

970
00:50:09,400 --> 00:50:11,199
not the mob of hundreds of people.

971
00:50:11,280 --> 00:50:13,159
Speaker 2: I mean, look, maybe he let him in. I don't know.

972
00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:15,679
I don't know the whole story port of rockwell though,

973
00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:17,679
just started seeing week on a certain point.

974
00:50:18,320 --> 00:50:20,679
Speaker 1: There's nothing you can do, No, there's absolutely just accept

975
00:50:20,679 --> 00:50:23,800
the fate. You're like, all right, my hands are clean,

976
00:50:23,840 --> 00:50:24,599
punch his pilot.

977
00:50:24,760 --> 00:50:27,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's up.

978
00:50:27,000 --> 00:50:30,800
Speaker 1: To the Jews, the Romans, Jews.

979
00:50:30,880 --> 00:50:34,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, uh, but that is the story of port of Rockwell,

980
00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:38,559
the Mormon enforcer. Would you learn today?

981
00:50:39,199 --> 00:50:42,199
Speaker 1: I guess the life of crime pays like. He doesn't

982
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:45,239
really answer for any crime, never answered for a single crime.

983
00:50:45,360 --> 00:50:47,559
Speaker 2: And he's got like he's a Mormon hero. Still he's

984
00:50:47,559 --> 00:50:49,480
got like shit named after him in Salt Lake City.

985
00:50:49,559 --> 00:50:54,360
Speaker 1: And yeah, but again it sounds more like a renaissance

986
00:50:54,400 --> 00:51:00,159
man of the late eighteen eighties. Yeah, eighteen nineties might

987
00:51:00,199 --> 00:51:03,400
be more because it's guy like the Rockefeller he does.

988
00:51:03,599 --> 00:51:07,039
Yeah he well, Porter a is I think is like

989
00:51:07,039 --> 00:51:10,599
a Vanderbilt. Yeah, Porter is a great fancy name. And

990
00:51:10,719 --> 00:51:14,239
Rockwell makes you think of the Rockefellers, stuff like that.

991
00:51:15,280 --> 00:51:18,360
But he was the exact opposite. He was a filthy,

992
00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:23,119
murderous frontiersman, more of a drifter than anything else.

993
00:51:23,599 --> 00:51:26,719
Speaker 2: Well, I mean he always had a community, Yeah, but.

994
00:51:26,559 --> 00:51:28,119
Speaker 1: At least had the aesthetic of a drift.

995
00:51:28,159 --> 00:51:30,400
Speaker 2: Oh he dude. Hit the pictures of him because he

996
00:51:30,400 --> 00:51:32,840
doesn't cut his hair, he looks like he just.

997
00:51:32,800 --> 00:51:35,559
Speaker 1: Crawled out of a cave. I think your wife said

998
00:51:35,559 --> 00:51:36,920
that about me. When I was growing out my hair

999
00:51:37,000 --> 00:51:41,400
last year probably and my beard as well. I want

1000
00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:45,880
to do it again. I regret cutting my hair because

1001
00:51:45,920 --> 00:51:47,480
right now my could have hair down to like here

1002
00:51:47,519 --> 00:51:48,079
at this point.

1003
00:51:48,400 --> 00:51:50,239
Speaker 2: Will you don't want that? Why do you want that?

1004
00:51:50,440 --> 00:51:53,679
It's sweet, dude, So I want flow at some point.

1005
00:51:53,679 --> 00:51:54,360
It's not flow.

1006
00:51:54,480 --> 00:51:57,360
Speaker 1: It's flow, and you're gonna be jealous. I could promise

1007
00:51:57,400 --> 00:51:58,880
you won't want to stunt all over you.

1008
00:51:59,360 --> 00:52:03,000
Speaker 2: Okay, I could promise you jealousies now it's gonna now,

1009
00:52:03,039 --> 00:52:04,159
it's not what I'm gonna feel.

1010
00:52:04,519 --> 00:52:06,199
Speaker 1: I want to be big, strong and long hair. I

1011
00:52:06,239 --> 00:52:10,480
want to be Samson okay? Or Porter? Yeah, Porter kind

1012
00:52:10,480 --> 00:52:12,840
of sucks. Just yell wheat every time you lift weights.

1013
00:52:14,599 --> 00:52:21,800
What if it works, you just should barbell through the ceiling. Yeah, dude,

1014
00:52:21,840 --> 00:52:23,760
I've never lifted ways like this.

1015
00:52:24,159 --> 00:52:25,400
Speaker 2: It's on fucking real.

1016
00:52:25,480 --> 00:52:29,159
Speaker 1: Dude, forget creatine. Just scream wheat. That's all you gotta do.

1017
00:52:30,159 --> 00:52:33,039
Trick your brain. You know, the carbs are essential for

1018
00:52:33,079 --> 00:52:35,719
a good workout anyway, So if you have carbs on

1019
00:52:35,760 --> 00:52:40,320
the brain, yeah, maybe it has this effect.

1020
00:52:40,599 --> 00:52:41,559
Speaker 2: It's a multiplier.

1021
00:52:41,760 --> 00:52:44,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it makes you strong.

1022
00:52:44,639 --> 00:52:45,480
Speaker 2: I think give it a shot.

1023
00:52:46,400 --> 00:52:53,159
Speaker 1: Who's today's hitler. I'm gonna say Rockwell is in consideration.

1024
00:52:53,360 --> 00:52:55,360
I'm trying to think of anyone else that we could

1025
00:52:55,360 --> 00:53:01,119
put the blame on. Joseph Smith. Get this guy involved

1026
00:53:02,280 --> 00:53:05,920
kind of sets him in motion, but he also eventually,

1027
00:53:07,800 --> 00:53:12,320
you know, suffers consequences for his actions. Bring them Young?

1028
00:53:12,400 --> 00:53:14,480
Does he die peacefully? I don't even know how Bringham

1029
00:53:14,519 --> 00:53:14,960
Young died.

1030
00:53:15,039 --> 00:53:17,400
Speaker 2: I think he does, and Rockwell does most of his

1031
00:53:17,440 --> 00:53:18,760
dirty work under Brigham Young.

1032
00:53:18,880 --> 00:53:21,920
Speaker 1: Bring him Young kinda seems like a scumbag. He yeah,

1033
00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:24,079
at least the way he's portrayed in media. I don't

1034
00:53:24,119 --> 00:53:27,239
know if that's propaganda, but he seems like a bad dude.

1035
00:53:27,280 --> 00:53:30,760
Speaker 2: He seems like a real piece of shit. Let's see

1036
00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:36,559
how he did peacefully? Right, he had color? He died

1037
00:53:36,599 --> 00:53:39,320
of appendix rupture.

1038
00:53:40,360 --> 00:53:46,840
Speaker 1: Peacefully? Yeah, peacefullysh Was he older he got to Yeah

1039
00:53:46,840 --> 00:53:50,000
he's in the seventies. Yeah he's fine. Yeah. They just

1040
00:53:50,039 --> 00:53:51,480
didn't have medicine out there that well.

1041
00:53:52,039 --> 00:53:54,599
Speaker 2: Yeah, well you're with one of your organs explodes.

1042
00:53:54,760 --> 00:53:57,119
Speaker 1: What are you gonna do? Kind of cooked? Yeah, throw

1043
00:53:57,199 --> 00:54:02,760
him into the salt lake. He'll heal, He'll float to

1044
00:54:02,800 --> 00:54:05,039
the top. It's like the dead sea.

1045
00:54:05,760 --> 00:54:07,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, pretty much. Actually, I think Brigham Young died

1046
00:54:09,320 --> 00:54:15,800
right before Porter Rockwell did Well Rockwell's watch was over. Yeah, yeah,

1047
00:54:15,920 --> 00:54:17,079
he could die peacefully.

1048
00:54:17,360 --> 00:54:20,559
Speaker 1: He just yeah, he kind of evaporated into the the

1049
00:54:20,599 --> 00:54:22,280
Mormon ghost land.

1050
00:54:22,360 --> 00:54:24,679
Speaker 2: Yeah, into the ether. He had no one left to like,

1051
00:54:24,760 --> 00:54:25,840
no one else was giving.

1052
00:54:25,639 --> 00:54:26,960
Speaker 1: Him orders to murder people.

1053
00:54:27,000 --> 00:54:29,880
Speaker 2: He was pretty rudderless after that, just became Yoda.

1054
00:54:30,039 --> 00:54:35,519
Speaker 1: Yeah, just that solid episode.

1055
00:54:36,000 --> 00:54:38,320
Speaker 2: I think Brigham Young is today is probably today's sailor

1056
00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:38,719
to be hot.

1057
00:54:38,920 --> 00:54:41,079
Speaker 1: He was the one really filling out the order. Yeah.

1058
00:54:41,199 --> 00:54:44,360
And I also don't think the massacre that you mentioned

1059
00:54:44,400 --> 00:54:47,320
is actually the massacre that I keep thinking of. There

1060
00:54:47,400 --> 00:54:51,719
was just too many maskers, so many of them. It

1061
00:54:51,760 --> 00:54:56,639
was all driven by paranoia, really yeah, and understandably right.

1062
00:54:57,119 --> 00:55:01,880
You know you're in your group was hunted in the

1063
00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:06,400
state of Missouri, Yeah, Illinois, to anywhere in the Midwest,

1064
00:55:06,480 --> 00:55:08,960
so you go as far away as possible as you can.

1065
00:55:10,679 --> 00:55:15,159
And yeah, all these other people that kind of come

1066
00:55:15,199 --> 00:55:17,760
onto your land, you get a little sketched out, get

1067
00:55:17,800 --> 00:55:18,559
a little tessie.

1068
00:55:18,639 --> 00:55:18,880
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1069
00:55:19,760 --> 00:55:22,280
Speaker 1: It's like every interaction I've had with other people that

1070
00:55:22,400 --> 00:55:26,960
aren't Mormons has been negative, really bad. Who are you

1071
00:55:27,239 --> 00:55:32,039
sorry them trying to you know, self preservation. I need

1072
00:55:32,320 --> 00:55:35,960
to kill you guys, even if you're not a threat.

1073
00:55:36,599 --> 00:55:38,440
I can't take that chance. I just you could be

1074
00:55:38,480 --> 00:55:39,719
working for the government.

1075
00:55:39,400 --> 00:55:41,360
Speaker 2: Don't know. I don't even want you to tell people

1076
00:55:41,360 --> 00:55:44,920
that I'm here, to be honest, So I gotta bury

1077
00:55:44,920 --> 00:55:45,840
you in the desert.

1078
00:55:47,239 --> 00:55:51,519
Speaker 1: Because from what I recall to the US Goodman and

1079
00:55:51,639 --> 00:55:55,880
bring them young clashed quite a bit, even if it

1080
00:55:55,920 --> 00:55:56,599
was just by mail.

1081
00:55:56,880 --> 00:55:59,320
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, they didn't get along.

1082
00:56:00,079 --> 00:56:02,280
Speaker 1: Because I think that he was trying to be named

1083
00:56:02,320 --> 00:56:05,159
governor of Utah, and he might have been named governor

1084
00:56:05,159 --> 00:56:09,800
of Utah the Utah territory. They might have allowed that,

1085
00:56:09,840 --> 00:56:11,880
but I think they were constantly at odds.

1086
00:56:12,000 --> 00:56:14,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, because the guy, I assume the government was like,

1087
00:56:15,039 --> 00:56:16,559
we can't have a cult running.

1088
00:56:16,280 --> 00:56:20,599
Speaker 1: A whole territory. I'm really relying on my episode about

1089
00:56:20,599 --> 00:56:23,079
the Mormons in Utah that I did, like with Lopez

1090
00:56:23,119 --> 00:56:25,639
a year and a half ago. I'm just trying to.

1091
00:56:25,559 --> 00:56:27,480
Speaker 2: Like remember, go back to that.

1092
00:56:28,000 --> 00:56:32,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, fishing those ponds in my brain and it's all

1093
00:56:32,559 --> 00:56:37,880
up there, but it's all scattered. Yeah, fine, we're softcore history. Yeah,

1094
00:56:38,599 --> 00:56:41,960
but I want to be the Mormon expert the Mormon whisperer.

1095
00:56:42,000 --> 00:56:42,480
That's fair.

1096
00:56:44,119 --> 00:56:45,599
Speaker 2: I'll leave the rest of the Mormons to you.

1097
00:56:45,800 --> 00:56:50,239
Speaker 1: What if they're right? I hope. So it's again South

1098
00:56:50,239 --> 00:56:50,719
Park joke.

1099
00:56:51,559 --> 00:56:52,519
Speaker 2: The Mormons got it right.

1100
00:56:52,599 --> 00:56:56,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, And to be fair, the Mormons have at least

1101
00:56:56,480 --> 00:56:59,599
in my life than anyone that I've encountered that is Mormon.

1102
00:57:00,000 --> 00:57:03,440
I've been like the nicest people I've ever met. Yeah, really,

1103
00:57:03,559 --> 00:57:05,960
you never met like a mean, terrible Mormon.

1104
00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:07,960
Speaker 2: You gotta go like a couple of layers deep to

1105
00:57:08,000 --> 00:57:09,840
get to the like real fucked up ones.

1106
00:57:10,960 --> 00:57:13,320
Speaker 1: I also think they might be like talking behind your

1107
00:57:13,320 --> 00:57:17,119
back and say you move to Utah now, they probably

1108
00:57:18,039 --> 00:57:20,800
are keeping an eye on you. Oh yeah, like what's

1109
00:57:20,800 --> 00:57:21,880
this outsider.

1110
00:57:21,440 --> 00:57:23,719
Speaker 2: Doing when you walk into the like den? Like the

1111
00:57:23,800 --> 00:57:24,440
thick of it all.

1112
00:57:25,639 --> 00:57:27,360
Speaker 1: They might be nice to your face, but they might

1113
00:57:27,440 --> 00:57:30,599
just totally hate you. Yeah, like he's on your back,

1114
00:57:31,159 --> 00:57:34,840
he won't convert. Keep an eye on him. M M.

1115
00:57:35,199 --> 00:57:39,559
Speaker 2: I don't like it doesn't drink soda or.

1116
00:57:39,599 --> 00:57:42,239
Speaker 1: He does drink soda with caffeine.

1117
00:57:42,280 --> 00:57:44,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, he drinks caffe and soda.

1118
00:57:44,880 --> 00:57:46,639
Speaker 1: I don't even know. That's the thing. I know it's

1119
00:57:46,679 --> 00:57:50,480
a Christian. There's some certain sects of Christianity where caffeine

1120
00:57:50,519 --> 00:57:51,239
is not allowed.

1121
00:57:51,000 --> 00:57:53,679
Speaker 2: Right, No Mormons, one Mormon still, yeah, okay, they're not

1122
00:57:53,760 --> 00:57:55,840
They're not big on caffeine, so.

1123
00:57:55,760 --> 00:58:00,199
Speaker 1: They got to really hit up that caffeine free. Is

1124
00:58:00,440 --> 00:58:01,880
there a soda option caffeine free?

1125
00:58:02,039 --> 00:58:04,679
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a crisp and clean no caffeine.

1126
00:58:06,039 --> 00:58:09,559
Speaker 1: What that's that's like a tagline for soda one of

1127
00:58:09,559 --> 00:58:11,320
the sodas, So like a Seerra I missed.

1128
00:58:11,400 --> 00:58:14,679
Speaker 2: Yeah. Probably, Actually it's not even Sierra missed anymore. It's

1129
00:58:14,719 --> 00:58:19,119
called something else now, who cares, it doesn't matter storry Yeah, yea, yeah, yeah, yeah,

1130
00:58:19,159 --> 00:58:21,840
that's what it is. I haven't drank a soda in

1131
00:58:21,880 --> 00:58:23,880
like twenty years, so I can't even remember.

1132
00:58:24,840 --> 00:58:28,480
Speaker 1: I've done little binges here and there of like dia sotus.

1133
00:58:29,480 --> 00:58:33,119
Speaker 2: I just like I can't get it, like a coke zero. Yeah.

1134
00:58:33,159 --> 00:58:35,679
The only soda I can remotely drink is a root beer.

1135
00:58:35,800 --> 00:58:39,559
Speaker 1: Or an ollipop. Get those pre biotics. Yeah, get those probiotics.

1136
00:58:39,679 --> 00:58:44,440
Speaker 2: Courtney likes those Corney drinks so a lot. Okay, Yeah,

1137
00:58:44,519 --> 00:58:47,480
I'm not in, not into it, but try to get

1138
00:58:47,519 --> 00:58:49,800
that healthy good bye. Yeah, that's like a thing with

1139
00:58:49,840 --> 00:58:52,440
my my mom's generation. She whenever she visits, she's like,

1140
00:58:52,440 --> 00:58:53,920
can you get go to the store and get me

1141
00:58:53,960 --> 00:58:57,280
a twelve pack coke? She always wants fucking coke.

1142
00:58:57,639 --> 00:59:00,000
Speaker 1: I was at Costco the other day. Didn't realize how

1143
00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:00,880
it was so expensive.

1144
00:59:01,480 --> 00:59:03,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't buy it, so I don't even fucking know.

1145
00:59:03,199 --> 00:59:09,880
Speaker 1: Thirty six pack of coke at Costco's about like nineteen bucks. Shit. Yeah,

1146
00:59:10,159 --> 00:59:12,599
I would have thought, especially you're buying bulk, it would

1147
00:59:12,599 --> 00:59:14,519
have been closer to like.

1148
00:59:14,440 --> 00:59:17,360
Speaker 2: Twelve Yeah, especially because soda sales I feel like they've

1149
00:59:17,400 --> 00:59:19,039
plummeted in the last thirty years.

1150
00:59:19,039 --> 00:59:20,840
Speaker 1: We're getting hit with the soda tacks right now. I

1151
00:59:20,880 --> 00:59:29,079
guess so fat tax ridiculous. Rfk's America pretty much.

1152
00:59:29,840 --> 00:59:31,320
Speaker 2: Uh well, that's all I got for today on Port

1153
00:59:31,440 --> 00:59:33,800
Rock Well the Mormon Enforcer.

1154
00:59:34,119 --> 00:59:36,880
Speaker 1: Check out our Patreon, Patreon, dot com, slash software history again,

1155
00:59:36,880 --> 00:59:40,880
support our families, support we needed our families. Two episodes

1156
00:59:40,880 --> 00:59:43,239
every week on the lower tier, higher tier, you get

1157
00:59:43,239 --> 00:59:46,280
a sports show. We do sports stuff. We had a

1158
00:59:46,320 --> 00:59:50,840
lot coming yes, big future, big things.

1159
00:59:52,079 --> 00:59:53,880
Speaker 2: A lot of college basketball talk coming up.

1160
00:59:54,719 --> 00:59:57,400
Speaker 1: Big combs, yeah, big debths.

1161
00:59:58,239 --> 01:00:00,440
Speaker 2: Well that's all I got for today for damn Register.

1162
01:00:00,599 --> 01:00:01,400
I'm Rob Fox.

1163
01:00:01,920 --> 01:00:02,960
Speaker 1: You just got saw served