1
00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:05,679
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Next Level Soul podcast, where we ask

2
00:00:05,719 --> 00:00:07,639
the big questions about life.

3
00:00:07,839 --> 00:00:08,720
Speaker 2: Why are we here?

4
00:00:09,160 --> 00:00:09,640
Speaker 1: Is this all?

5
00:00:09,679 --> 00:00:10,160
Speaker 2: There? Is?

6
00:00:10,759 --> 00:00:14,480
Speaker 1: What is my soul's mission? We attempt to answer those

7
00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:18,239
questions and more by bringing you raw and inspiring conversations

8
00:00:18,519 --> 00:00:21,280
with some of the most fascinating and thought provoking guests

9
00:00:21,359 --> 00:00:27,640
on the planet. Today, I am your host, Alex Ferrari. Now,

10
00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:30,359
before we dive into today's conversation, I want to invite

11
00:00:30,359 --> 00:00:34,560
you to experience something truly transformative. Next Level Soul TV

12
00:00:34,840 --> 00:00:38,280
our spiritual streaming platform where seekers from around the world

13
00:00:38,280 --> 00:00:42,640
can awaken, heal, and expand We've curated a powerful collection

14
00:00:42,679 --> 00:00:48,600
of life changing documentaries, deep dive interviews, original series, audiobooks, courses,

15
00:00:48,759 --> 00:00:53,600
master classes, and live events, all focused on conscious personal transformation,

16
00:00:53,799 --> 00:00:57,560
ancient wisdom and the soul's journey. This isn't just content,

17
00:00:57,799 --> 00:01:00,679
it's a calling. Whether you're exploring your spirit, virtual gifts,

18
00:01:00,719 --> 00:01:04,000
seeking answers from the beyond, or just craving something real

19
00:01:04,040 --> 00:01:07,000
in a noisy world, Next Level Soul TV was made

20
00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:10,439
just for you. And here's the best part. It's commercial free,

21
00:01:10,640 --> 00:01:13,799
available around the world, and growing every week with new

22
00:01:13,879 --> 00:01:17,079
soul expanding content. So If you're ready to go deeper,

23
00:01:17,400 --> 00:01:20,439
head over to next levelsoul dot tv and start streaming

24
00:01:20,480 --> 00:01:24,879
your awakening. Now let's begin today's episode. Disclaimer. The views

25
00:01:24,879 --> 00:01:28,519
and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the

26
00:01:28,599 --> 00:01:32,439
guests and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions

27
00:01:32,799 --> 00:01:35,840
of this show, its host, or any of the companies

28
00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:40,200
they represent. Now today on the show, we have Philip Goldberg,

29
00:01:40,359 --> 00:01:44,840
the author of the life of Paramahansa Yogananda. And I

30
00:01:44,879 --> 00:01:47,920
know many of you are thinking, well, then Paramhasa Yogananda

31
00:01:47,959 --> 00:01:51,719
write a very very famous book called Autobiography of Yogi.

32
00:01:51,760 --> 00:01:55,640
But Philip wanted to go deeper than that because apparently

33
00:01:55,680 --> 00:02:00,159
in that book, the original Autobiography of Yogi, Yogananda does

34
00:02:00,200 --> 00:02:03,359
not speak very much about his own life, talks about

35
00:02:03,400 --> 00:02:06,000
other stories and things. So if you want to learn

36
00:02:06,040 --> 00:02:10,319
more about the man's journey, this avatar, this ascended master,

37
00:02:10,439 --> 00:02:13,080
and how he walked this earth and the trials and

38
00:02:13,120 --> 00:02:16,080
tribulations he went through, this is the episode for you.

39
00:02:16,520 --> 00:02:17,159
Speaker 2: Let's dive in.

40
00:02:18,479 --> 00:02:21,560
Speaker 1: I like to welcome to the show Philip goldbrig Hey doing, Philip.

41
00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:24,159
Speaker 2: I'm well, thank you, Alex, how are you.

42
00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:27,039
Speaker 1: I'm very good, Thank you so much. For coming on

43
00:02:27,080 --> 00:02:30,680
the show. You and I have a love for a certain.

44
00:02:30,400 --> 00:02:35,919
Speaker 3: Guru who walked the earth a few years ago and

45
00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:38,520
really threw the earth upside down a little bit, especially

46
00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:40,840
the West, kind of tossed.

47
00:02:40,520 --> 00:02:44,520
Speaker 1: And turned and was a very strong spiritual teacher. And

48
00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:47,159
everyone who's ever listened to any of my episodes knows

49
00:02:47,199 --> 00:02:51,199
that that person is Barah Mahnsa Yogananda. And you know,

50
00:02:51,240 --> 00:02:54,759
he very famously wrote a little book called the Autobiography

51
00:02:54,759 --> 00:02:58,639
of a Yogi, which is that not so? No, it's

52
00:02:58,639 --> 00:03:02,719
about how an eight hundred page it's a lot, but

53
00:03:03,439 --> 00:03:07,159
it's a lot of pages. But that book really transformed

54
00:03:07,159 --> 00:03:09,759
a lot of people's lives. It's still transforming people's lives

55
00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:12,360
to this day. But you decided to write a book

56
00:03:12,360 --> 00:03:15,879
called the Life of Yogananda, which seems counter productive. Says,

57
00:03:15,919 --> 00:03:19,759
he already wrote an autobiography, So why.

58
00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:21,960
Speaker 2: Is the first question I was asked.

59
00:03:22,439 --> 00:03:24,439
Speaker 1: But he already wrote an autobiography. Why do you want

60
00:03:24,479 --> 00:03:27,080
to do it? So can you explain to everybody, first

61
00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:30,719
of all, who Yogananda was and what drew you to

62
00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:33,400
his life and his teachings, and then why you wrote

63
00:03:33,400 --> 00:03:33,879
this book?

64
00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:38,960
Speaker 2: Okay, we'll go in that order. Then Yoga Hondu was

65
00:03:39,759 --> 00:03:45,479
possibly the most important of the spiritual teachers who came

66
00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:49,120
to the West from India. But I don't but most important,

67
00:03:49,159 --> 00:03:53,840
I mean the most influential, certainly in the top three.

68
00:03:55,840 --> 00:04:04,639
I My prior book was called American Veda, and that

69
00:04:04,759 --> 00:04:13,599
covered the whole history of how India's ancient spiritual teachings

70
00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:21,839
found its way into America and transformed the cultural and

71
00:04:22,519 --> 00:04:31,040
spiritual landscape of the country in a way that's rarely

72
00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:39,879
appreciated sufficiently. Yoganando was a key player. He came here

73
00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:47,319
in nineteen twenty. There hadn't been that many Indian gurus

74
00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:54,959
prior to that. His illustrious predecessor, Swami Vivekananda came to

75
00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:59,639
the US actually the same year. Yogananda was born eighteen

76
00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:06,399
ninety three, and Swamis in his lineage were in America

77
00:05:06,439 --> 00:05:10,079
at the time Yogananda came, but they were pretty low key.

78
00:05:10,759 --> 00:05:17,079
Yogananda was the first to gain prominence and stay here.

79
00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:23,560
He's spent the last thirty two years of his life

80
00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:31,000
in America, and so he had time and the energy

81
00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:35,639
and the skill and the charisma to reach a great

82
00:05:35,720 --> 00:05:39,399
number of people and left behind when he passed in

83
00:05:39,519 --> 00:05:47,560
nineteen fifty two, his famous autobiography of Eogi, which has

84
00:05:47,639 --> 00:05:50,959
been called one of the most or one of the

85
00:05:50,959 --> 00:05:56,199
most important spiritual books of the twentieth century. And as

86
00:05:56,240 --> 00:06:01,000
you said, to this day, people's lives are changed by it.

87
00:06:01,600 --> 00:06:04,000
And so when I wrote America in Veda, I had

88
00:06:04,040 --> 00:06:08,800
a chapter on Yoga Onda and his impact, and afterward,

89
00:06:12,759 --> 00:06:16,040
in thinking what do I want to do next, it

90
00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:23,480
kept coming to me what an interesting human life Yogananda led.

91
00:06:24,240 --> 00:06:29,920
And I couldn't do it justice in the twenty some

92
00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:33,480
odd pages I could, you know, devote to it in

93
00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:37,279
the previous book. So I said, that's a story that

94
00:06:37,399 --> 00:06:40,199
should be told. But I had the same thought you did.

95
00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:44,759
But you know, why write a biography of somebody who's

96
00:06:45,279 --> 00:06:50,680
famous for an autobiography. So I reread Autobiography of a

97
00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:55,079
Yogi for you know, fourth or fifth time or whatever,

98
00:06:56,720 --> 00:07:03,040
and did a page count and realized that less than

99
00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:08,319
ten percent of that book is about his life after

100
00:07:08,519 --> 00:07:11,399
the age of twenty seven when he came to America

101
00:07:13,959 --> 00:07:20,480
and that and there were passages that read leg and

102
00:07:20,519 --> 00:07:25,839
then four years passed in Boston, and I thought, well, no,

103
00:07:26,000 --> 00:07:29,360
you can't get away with that. He came. His first

104
00:07:29,399 --> 00:07:34,000
stop was Boston in nineteen twenty. He was there for

105
00:07:34,040 --> 00:07:38,519
the first four years he was in America. How did

106
00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:42,720
he survive? How did he what did he do? How

107
00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:49,160
did he you know, fulfill his mission? How did he

108
00:07:49,240 --> 00:07:54,360
deal with winter in New England? You know? Give me details?

109
00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:58,680
So I said, Okay, there are gaps in his personal

110
00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:04,000
story and someone should fill them, and that so I

111
00:08:04,079 --> 00:08:07,120
took it on. And that's essentially what happened.

112
00:08:07,839 --> 00:08:11,759
Speaker 1: So yog Nanda was doing the YadA YadA YadA, I

113
00:08:11,839 --> 00:08:12,160
moved to.

114
00:08:12,240 --> 00:08:18,279
Speaker 2: La well in a sense. And also what's interesting is

115
00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:23,759
it's called autobiography of Yogi, but a big portion of

116
00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:31,120
it is about other people. People he met, interesting people's saints, scientists,

117
00:08:31,279 --> 00:08:38,000
all kinds of holy people, miracle workers, his gurus, and

118
00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:45,240
so the actual autobiography portion of it left a lot out.

119
00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:49,720
And so you know that fascinated me. I had already

120
00:08:49,759 --> 00:08:54,159
gotten hints in my prior research that there were stories

121
00:08:54,200 --> 00:08:58,720
to tell that he didn't tell, and details that are

122
00:08:58,759 --> 00:09:05,240
worth knowing, and a human story that holds up as

123
00:09:05,279 --> 00:09:08,039
a narrative that we can all learn from.

124
00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:13,759
Speaker 1: Where does one go for information like this, because I'm

125
00:09:13,799 --> 00:09:17,320
assuming it's a Self Realization Fellowship, which is his organization,

126
00:09:17,399 --> 00:09:20,200
because they're the ones that house pretty much everything that's

127
00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:23,440
available on yog Nanda, but most of that stuff is

128
00:09:23,480 --> 00:09:26,279
not public. So how did you get how did you

129
00:09:26,279 --> 00:09:27,480
get access to these stories?

130
00:09:27,919 --> 00:09:36,919
Speaker 2: Good question, But one thing, there's more available in public

131
00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:43,320
domain than people realize obscure. You know, articles and journals

132
00:09:44,000 --> 00:09:47,679
or you know, memoirs written by people who knew him.

133
00:09:48,519 --> 00:09:54,519
But yeah, including one by his brother who wrote about

134
00:09:54,559 --> 00:10:01,559
their childhood. But you're right, the principal archive is held

135
00:10:01,960 --> 00:10:06,039
in La by the Self Realization Fellowship, so I could

136
00:10:06,039 --> 00:10:14,000
not have undertaken the project without their cooperation. It's not

137
00:10:14,159 --> 00:10:19,080
like there's a room and they said, here's the key. Go.

138
00:10:20,879 --> 00:10:27,559
I had a liaison who was essentially, you know, the

139
00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:34,519
most knowledgeable historian in the organization, and I would ask questions.

140
00:10:35,360 --> 00:10:39,039
That person would bring me documents from the archive or

141
00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:44,759
an explanation an answer, and that was invaluable.

142
00:10:46,679 --> 00:10:49,159
Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor

143
00:10:52,799 --> 00:10:54,039
and now back to the show.

144
00:10:57,080 --> 00:11:02,960
Speaker 2: And then in the process, people outside of Self Realization

145
00:11:03,200 --> 00:11:07,600
Fellowship there were, you know, like any other spiritual organization,

146
00:11:07,759 --> 00:11:12,720
there's always breakaway groups, small small ones, but some of

147
00:11:12,759 --> 00:11:17,519
them were people were started by people who were direct

148
00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:22,480
disciples of Yoga Onda and they had stories, they had documents,

149
00:11:23,159 --> 00:11:27,159
they had letters, and people heard I was doing this

150
00:11:27,279 --> 00:11:31,320
and they said, oh, you know, I've got this file

151
00:11:31,440 --> 00:11:35,840
cabinet full of stuff. And you know, you find things

152
00:11:36,200 --> 00:11:39,799
and people hear about you. So you just do your homework.

153
00:11:39,919 --> 00:11:42,440
And some of it was things like going into the

154
00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:46,960
Los Angeles Times archive and seeing articles from the nineteen

155
00:11:47,039 --> 00:11:53,000
twenties and thirties, travel documents from you know, like you

156
00:11:53,320 --> 00:11:57,759
his passport and the you know, when he left the

157
00:11:57,799 --> 00:12:02,080
country and you know they're there are things that you

158
00:12:02,559 --> 00:12:07,000
come across and it adds. You know, also went to

159
00:12:07,120 --> 00:12:12,799
India and talked to people there, you know, his certain

160
00:12:12,799 --> 00:12:18,320
family members, you know, who didn't necessarily know him because

161
00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:22,360
you know, he died in nineteen fifty two, but who

162
00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:25,399
had letters and who had stories, and you know, so

163
00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:27,960
you just do your you do your research.

164
00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:31,279
Speaker 1: So let me ask you this, then, what happened to him?

165
00:12:31,360 --> 00:12:33,639
I always wondered that too, about those those four years

166
00:12:33,639 --> 00:12:37,679
in Boston, because he shows up, he's horrified that they're

167
00:12:37,960 --> 00:12:39,919
that they're selling hot dogs. He thinks, oh my god,

168
00:12:39,960 --> 00:12:42,039
what kind of country have you brought me to that

169
00:12:42,120 --> 00:12:49,039
they eat dogs, those kinds of stories. But what what

170
00:12:49,159 --> 00:12:52,720
did he do those years? Because he came essentially on

171
00:12:52,799 --> 00:12:56,519
a boat, showed up. No one knows who he is.

172
00:12:56,720 --> 00:12:58,919
He is dressed in a way that people from the

173
00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:02,759
nineteen twenties and Austin he looked essentially like an alien

174
00:13:02,840 --> 00:13:05,399
because people even they've heard of India maybe, but they

175
00:13:05,399 --> 00:13:07,919
had never seen an Indian, you know.

176
00:13:08,559 --> 00:13:12,480
Speaker 2: They did, you know, maybe a few rarefied people did

177
00:13:12,559 --> 00:13:15,159
as I said. They were. You know, the occasional yoga

178
00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:19,320
person Swami viv Cananda had spent time near twenty or

179
00:13:19,320 --> 00:13:24,000
so years earlier. But you're right, nineteen twenty it was

180
00:13:24,080 --> 00:13:27,519
the he arrived two months before women voted for the

181
00:13:27,559 --> 00:13:31,840
first time. You know, that's a long time ago, and

182
00:13:34,519 --> 00:13:40,480
racism was ascendant. The Ku Kux Klan was being you know,

183
00:13:40,519 --> 00:13:47,639
had a huge revival at that time. So if you

184
00:13:47,679 --> 00:13:52,200
look at his passport photo, you see him bearded. He

185
00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:55,080
shaved it. He shaved his beard on the boat because

186
00:13:55,120 --> 00:13:58,559
people warned him that he didn't want to stand out

187
00:13:58,679 --> 00:14:03,360
that much in the streets. But he didn't cut his hair.

188
00:14:03,639 --> 00:14:05,759
He had you know, that would have been a violation

189
00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:12,600
of the order of Swamis that he was in and

190
00:14:12,679 --> 00:14:15,440
he learned over time to do things like tuck his

191
00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:18,960
long hair into his collar, you know, in the back,

192
00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:23,159
and wear a hat and wear Western clothing when he

193
00:14:23,200 --> 00:14:26,080
was in public. But you know, at first he didn't.

194
00:14:26,399 --> 00:14:31,279
But he wasn't entirely a stranger because he came to

195
00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:36,399
speak at a conference that was being held in Boston

196
00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:43,039
and he had acquired the he was substituting for the

197
00:14:43,080 --> 00:14:53,279
originally scheduled representative of Hinduism in this interfaith setting, and

198
00:14:53,519 --> 00:14:57,279
you know, he was very young, was very uncertain about

199
00:14:57,320 --> 00:15:01,759
his command of English. But he came year and stayed

200
00:15:01,799 --> 00:15:03,799
at the y m c A for a few days

201
00:15:03,799 --> 00:15:09,480
before the sponsors of the conference, you know, housed him

202
00:15:09,519 --> 00:15:13,919
in a proper way and ended up staying. And there's

203
00:15:13,960 --> 00:15:19,320
a lot of funny stories of his adjusting to American

204
00:15:19,480 --> 00:15:22,840
like writing a subway for the first time, not knowing

205
00:15:22,879 --> 00:15:27,200
how a drinking fountain operated, you know, and being a

206
00:15:27,279 --> 00:15:30,919
vegetarian and all that. You know, it was there's a

207
00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:34,200
lot of funny stories. But on the other hand, there

208
00:15:34,279 --> 00:15:38,960
was harassment too. And you know, he was a dark

209
00:15:39,039 --> 00:15:43,559
skinned foreigner at a time when even the Irish and

210
00:15:43,679 --> 00:15:49,000
Jews were being discriminated against, you know, so you can imagine.

211
00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:51,519
Speaker 1: So he did. I would imagine he had some struggles

212
00:15:51,559 --> 00:15:54,519
and he I mean, did he have a job to

213
00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:57,759
pay the bills? How did so? Who was who was

214
00:15:57,759 --> 00:15:59,919
paying his bills these four years while he was here?

215
00:16:00,159 --> 00:16:03,840
Speaker 2: Asking the kind of questions a biographer has to ask.

216
00:16:05,159 --> 00:16:07,799
He had some money from his father. He was raised

217
00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:14,559
in an affluent household by a hardworking father who worked

218
00:16:14,559 --> 00:16:18,320
for the British railway system. And also it should be noted,

219
00:16:19,000 --> 00:16:22,360
you know, this is twenty seven years before India gained

220
00:16:22,399 --> 00:16:27,039
its independence, So he was a subject of the British

221
00:16:27,120 --> 00:16:31,240
Empire and could have been deported at any time. And

222
00:16:31,279 --> 00:16:35,840
they were spying on him because you know, they didn't

223
00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:39,879
They were on the lookout for people raising money and

224
00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:46,240
guns in the West to support the freedom movement, and

225
00:16:46,600 --> 00:16:49,759
more prominently became the more they looked out, you know,

226
00:16:49,879 --> 00:16:53,360
kept an eye on him. But so he came to

227
00:16:53,399 --> 00:16:56,039
speak at this conference. His father had given him some

228
00:16:56,159 --> 00:17:02,799
money and paid for the ship's passage. And then he said,

229
00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:11,240
if I'll be back unless the Americans need me. And

230
00:17:11,880 --> 00:17:16,839
after his first talk at that conference, which was his

231
00:17:17,079 --> 00:17:22,400
talk was titled the science of religion. He hung around

232
00:17:23,359 --> 00:17:26,599
and waited to see what would happen, and then somebody

233
00:17:26,599 --> 00:17:34,640
invited him to speak at a church outside of Cambridge

234
00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:39,599
in Somerville, Massachusetts, and people heard him speak, and so

235
00:17:39,720 --> 00:17:43,039
somebody said, oh, I have a study group, come speak

236
00:17:43,079 --> 00:17:46,559
in my living room. And it was the same kind

237
00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:51,480
of story that every visiting grew or Buddhist monk or

238
00:17:51,480 --> 00:17:57,559
whatever followed. Started out small, with a small group of

239
00:17:57,680 --> 00:18:01,440
people who liked what he had to say say and

240
00:18:03,359 --> 00:18:07,240
supported him and paid, you know, had some money, helped

241
00:18:07,279 --> 00:18:12,319
out arranging for him to speak here and there, and

242
00:18:12,359 --> 00:18:15,119
so it went from ten to fifteen people and someone

243
00:18:15,279 --> 00:18:18,559
was a living room to a few years later filling

244
00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:22,759
the Symphony Hall in Boston. It just grew in that way.

245
00:18:23,279 --> 00:18:28,000
And there were always money issues and always organizational issues

246
00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:30,559
that he had to deal with in those kind of

247
00:18:30,640 --> 00:18:37,559
concerns only grew as his fame and success grew.

248
00:18:38,160 --> 00:18:40,880
Speaker 1: Now you mentioned that he had a mission in this

249
00:18:41,559 --> 00:18:44,960
life to do something. What exactly were the parameters of

250
00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:45,599
that mission?

251
00:18:46,319 --> 00:18:50,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, it wasn't, you know, like a mission statement that

252
00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:55,319
we're used to, you know, careful, carefully crafted by you know.

253
00:18:55,400 --> 00:18:58,279
Speaker 1: But since we've already seen what he did, we could

254
00:18:58,359 --> 00:19:00,000
kind of guess what his mission was.

255
00:19:00,319 --> 00:19:06,680
Speaker 2: Well, his mission it was essentially to bring the teachings

256
00:19:06,359 --> 00:19:11,680
that you know of the Indian tradition what we think

257
00:19:11,720 --> 00:19:18,680
of now as Hinduism, but really a certain core philosophical

258
00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:26,799
and principles and methods practices that we think of as yoga,

259
00:19:27,559 --> 00:19:34,880
the yoga philosophy, yoga practices, the Danta philosophy, so not

260
00:19:35,160 --> 00:19:40,599
all of Hinduism, which is very vast and diverse, but

261
00:19:40,839 --> 00:19:47,440
certain core principles that were acceptable to Western culture, Western thinkers,

262
00:19:47,559 --> 00:19:57,720
western values, and in particular the teachings of his particular lineage,

263
00:19:58,759 --> 00:20:04,079
which he called create Yoga. So he was bringing pre

264
00:20:04,240 --> 00:20:09,920
a yoga which you know embedded in the larger overall

265
00:20:10,279 --> 00:20:15,599
principles of the of the Upanishads and the bug of

266
00:20:15,680 --> 00:20:21,599
Udgita to the West. That was his you know destiny,

267
00:20:22,359 --> 00:20:26,319
which you know, according to what I've read, you know,

268
00:20:26,559 --> 00:20:31,039
was told to his parents when he was an infant

269
00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:34,599
that he would have some that kind of mission, and

270
00:20:34,680 --> 00:20:41,119
his gurucery Testwar had been told by his Guru that

271
00:20:41,319 --> 00:20:44,039
he would one day have a disciple who would go

272
00:20:44,119 --> 00:20:50,160
to America and sre Testwar recognized in the young Yoga

273
00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:55,119
Nanda before he was called Yoga Nanda, that he would

274
00:20:55,119 --> 00:20:59,400
be that one, and he was essentially trained for that mission.

275
00:21:01,119 --> 00:21:03,599
Speaker 1: Will be right back after a word from our sponsor,

276
00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:11,680
and now back to the show. And he also when

277
00:21:11,720 --> 00:21:16,480
he brought over crea yoga and aspects of the yoga

278
00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:20,480
philosophies and things like that, he also introduced meditation. Is

279
00:21:20,519 --> 00:21:22,359
he the first to do Is he the first to

280
00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:25,359
do meditation or was the other I mean in a

281
00:21:25,359 --> 00:21:27,240
big way, in a big way, in a big way.

282
00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:33,319
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, first to make it accessible to that number

283
00:21:33,359 --> 00:21:39,480
of people. Yes, Swami vive Canon is known mostly for

284
00:21:39,759 --> 00:21:46,599
articulating they Doanta philosophy in a way that he sort

285
00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:50,319
of set the template for the how to use, which

286
00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:54,920
language to use, what to emphasize to the Westerners, and

287
00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:59,359
his swami's carried that on. But they had meditation practices.

288
00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:03,480
They just you know, it was more low key. Yogananda

289
00:22:03,599 --> 00:22:13,039
reached for more people and perhaps taught more systematic methods

290
00:22:13,599 --> 00:22:19,319
of meditation practices, we should say, because that wasn't just

291
00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:23,680
And then you know, that set the stage for the

292
00:22:23,799 --> 00:22:26,880
nineteen sixties and seventies when there were a whole lot

293
00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:32,640
of gurus and when the Beatles picked up on transcendental meditation.

294
00:22:32,799 --> 00:22:38,839
That of course that exploded, and so what Vivikananda started

295
00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:44,359
and Yogananda brought forth to large numbers of people eventually

296
00:22:44,559 --> 00:22:49,799
became mainstream in America through this succession of teachers and

297
00:22:49,839 --> 00:22:54,920
the available access to you know, through technology and so forth.

298
00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:56,160
Now the Beatle.

299
00:22:56,200 --> 00:22:58,359
Speaker 1: You brought up the Beatles because it's probably one of

300
00:22:58,400 --> 00:23:00,240
my favorite bands of all time, is I'm not the

301
00:23:00,279 --> 00:23:04,759
loan in that, uh? And I was fascinated to know

302
00:23:04,839 --> 00:23:06,480
that I was a Beatles fan all my life, but

303
00:23:06,519 --> 00:23:09,359
I had no idea the impact that yog Nanda and

304
00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:12,799
autobiography of a yogi had on them, so much so

305
00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:21,000
that his lineage is in Sergeant Pepper's the album the

306
00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:24,759
very the famous cover you see Yoga Nanda Babajwa. I

307
00:23:24,759 --> 00:23:26,599
think here Mahashai is in there as well.

308
00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:28,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, all four, all four.

309
00:23:28,559 --> 00:23:30,880
Speaker 1: Of them are in there. And I'm I was like,

310
00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:34,759
oh my, how did they what is happening? I mind,

311
00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:36,240
tell me how that happened.

312
00:23:36,319 --> 00:23:44,200
Speaker 2: It's George. George was the driving spiritual force of the Beatles.

313
00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:48,720
And if you know, after the Beatles broke up, George,

314
00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:57,559
you know, was such a sincere Yogi and practitioner, and

315
00:23:57,599 --> 00:24:00,640
that carried through to the rest of the life. And

316
00:24:00,759 --> 00:24:06,640
you know, I've given presentations just about George and you

317
00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:10,200
could see it in the lyrics of his some of

318
00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:13,160
the songs he wrote with the Beatles and then later

319
00:24:13,519 --> 00:24:19,480
in his solo career. He was a strong advocate of

320
00:24:19,680 --> 00:24:25,000
Indian philosophy and Indian spirituality and his real sincere seeker

321
00:24:25,039 --> 00:24:29,640
and it started with him musically when he discovered the

322
00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:32,640
sitar and went to India to study with Robbie Shankar

323
00:24:33,079 --> 00:24:36,039
and Rabbi Shankar gave him two books, one of which

324
00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:39,839
was Autobiography of Yogi and the other was one of

325
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:44,680
the Kananda's books called raj Yoga, and those transformed George's life.

326
00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:50,880
There's actually four or five different guru lineages that have

327
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:56,480
a claim on George. So you know, when they were

328
00:24:56,559 --> 00:25:00,440
conceiving the album cover for Sergeant Pepper, which came out

329
00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:05,799
in nineteen sixty seven, each of the Beatles could choose

330
00:25:05,839 --> 00:25:10,680
four cultural icons to put on the cover. So you

331
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:16,920
see Muhammad Ali and Bob Dylan and May West and W. C.

332
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:20,680
Fields and all these people. George is four were the

333
00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:21,960
four gurus.

334
00:25:22,279 --> 00:25:25,640
Speaker 1: Wow I didn't know that one. That's a new little

335
00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:26,839
bit of information.

336
00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:30,480
Speaker 2: Because they should be said that over the course of

337
00:25:30,519 --> 00:25:34,160
his life he would keep stacks of autobiography around to

338
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:38,920
give to people. But you know, the Transcendental meditation people,

339
00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:45,200
they don't, the society people, the Hari Christians, because George

340
00:25:45,279 --> 00:25:49,559
was a big devotee and of Chanting and Harry, they

341
00:25:49,599 --> 00:25:51,880
all have a claim on George.

342
00:25:53,079 --> 00:25:56,759
Speaker 1: But yet, but yet, But George put the four the

343
00:25:56,759 --> 00:25:59,359
four Gurus on the cover. So that says something. I'm

344
00:25:59,400 --> 00:25:59,960
just throwing that up.

345
00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:02,559
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that says a lot. It does a lot

346
00:26:02,599 --> 00:26:05,839
of Go and visit SRF when he was in La

347
00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:10,839
and he would he would give out copies of autobiography

348
00:26:10,839 --> 00:26:14,359
of Yogi. But you know, he didn't limit himself to anyone.

349
00:26:15,559 --> 00:26:18,000
Speaker 1: Yes, as he shouldn't. As he shouldn't. And you're the

350
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:19,880
first to say as yoga, to be the first to

351
00:26:19,920 --> 00:26:23,720
say that, it's like quite right to go to all teachings.

352
00:26:24,039 --> 00:26:26,200
One thing that I found really fascinating when I first

353
00:26:26,839 --> 00:26:29,759
was introduced to yoga, nanda I was used. I was

354
00:26:29,799 --> 00:26:32,039
introduced to Autobiography of a Yogi when I was in

355
00:26:32,039 --> 00:26:36,160
my mid twenties. I started reading it. Could not it

356
00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:38,599
was I was so not ready. I'm just so not

357
00:26:38,680 --> 00:26:42,960
ready for it. I was reading like guys levitating biolocation.

358
00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:47,200
This this guru walking around who's still alive after twenty

359
00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:49,279
five hundred years in the MLA is like it was

360
00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:52,519
so far out of my comfort zone that I put

361
00:26:52,519 --> 00:26:55,160
the book away. It was only until my mid thirties

362
00:26:55,559 --> 00:26:58,720
where I picked it up again, and then I started

363
00:26:58,759 --> 00:27:01,519
to understand, and then I started to really dig deep

364
00:27:01,559 --> 00:27:04,519
into it. But what I found fascinating about Yoga Nanda,

365
00:27:05,519 --> 00:27:08,759
that kind of I think set them apart from his contemporaries,

366
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:11,480
is that he brought Jesus Christ into the mix.

367
00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:13,720
Speaker 2: Oh man, big time, yeah.

368
00:27:13,759 --> 00:27:16,319
Speaker 1: And he was talking about Jesus and he put them

369
00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:20,279
up there. He put Jesus up there with his other lineage,

370
00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:23,039
and that Jesus was part of his lineage. And that

371
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:25,920
was such a I'm not saying it was a smart

372
00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:30,039
marketing play, but I don't think. I don't think he

373
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:33,559
was looking at it that way. But in hindsight, it

374
00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:36,039
opened the door to so many people in the West

375
00:27:36,079 --> 00:27:38,319
because everyone here knows Jesus that you know, the the

376
00:27:38,319 --> 00:27:41,799
West was basically, you know, built upon Christian values and

377
00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:44,519
you know, so on and so forth. But it was

378
00:27:44,559 --> 00:27:46,400
really fascinating. What do you know about that?

379
00:27:46,519 --> 00:27:49,960
Speaker 2: Why are you not like you've touched on a lot

380
00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:52,680
of things. First of all, I want to say for

381
00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:59,799
your listeners, I teach courses from time to time through

382
00:28:00,319 --> 00:28:04,200
Hindu University of America h U A dot E d U.

383
00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:11,039
They have a wonderful curriculum of classes and online courses.

384
00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:13,799
And one of the courses I do is going through

385
00:28:13,839 --> 00:28:18,599
autobiography of a Yogi chapter by chapter, and so I

386
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:22,640
would invite people to look at that because I can

387
00:28:22,759 --> 00:28:24,960
I bring in all the stuff that's not in the

388
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:30,799
book that I learned in my own research. But about

389
00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:40,680
the presence of Jesus. One thing that is common across

390
00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:45,359
the Eastern traditions essentially, you know, if you go to

391
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:51,240
India and you mention Jesus, people just think of him

392
00:28:51,279 --> 00:28:57,400
as a great spiritual teacher, and they they're happy to,

393
00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:02,920
you know, tole him and quote him and all that,

394
00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:05,839
and all the gurus who came here had nothing but

395
00:29:06,079 --> 00:29:10,319
respect and reverence for Jesus. It's very common. It's one

396
00:29:10,319 --> 00:29:14,440
of the beautiful things about the Hindu and Buddhist cultures

397
00:29:14,559 --> 00:29:20,200
is the openness to you know, any great saint or teacher.

398
00:29:21,319 --> 00:29:27,839
Yogananda took that to another level. He didn't just hold

399
00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:30,960
Jesus up and quote him and hold him up as

400
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:36,200
an example. He claimed that Jesus was essentially part of

401
00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:40,519
his own lineage, and that he and the aforementioned Baba

402
00:29:40,599 --> 00:29:47,359
Jee the Deathless Yogi or in some kind of communication.

403
00:29:47,759 --> 00:29:56,359
And you know, Yogananda's whole mission is essentially endorsed and

404
00:29:56,680 --> 00:30:01,640
set up by them. He spoke about Jesus so much

405
00:30:02,759 --> 00:30:11,519
that there's a two volume set totally about twelve hundred

406
00:30:11,599 --> 00:30:15,839
pages that's on your shelf. I'm sure right, yeah, I

407
00:30:15,839 --> 00:30:19,160
see it next to the Geeka, and you know it's

408
00:30:19,200 --> 00:30:21,960
called the Second Coming of Christ and it was assembled

409
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:25,359
by his devotees after he died of everything he said

410
00:30:25,359 --> 00:30:28,640
and wrote about Jesus. So that's all. It's a lot.

411
00:30:30,519 --> 00:30:33,000
Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,

412
00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:39,160
and now back to the show.

413
00:30:40,039 --> 00:30:44,720
Speaker 2: And he mastered, you know, how to talk about it

414
00:30:44,799 --> 00:30:49,519
and how to bring Jesus. It's not the interpretation of

415
00:30:49,599 --> 00:30:53,440
Jesus you'll find in the in the you know, next Sunday,

416
00:30:53,480 --> 00:30:58,240
he's sermon wherever you are. It's a more esoteric one,

417
00:30:58,359 --> 00:31:03,839
of course, but it's fascinating and you're absolutely right. I

418
00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:07,160
know you were joking when you called it a marketing ploy.

419
00:31:07,519 --> 00:31:10,519
He but that he was accused of that. He was

420
00:31:10,559 --> 00:31:13,359
accused of that. You know, he's selling out to the Christians,

421
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:16,880
he's pandering to them, you know, putting up Jesus and

422
00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:19,640
all that. But it was sincere, you know, when he

423
00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:26,799
when they acquired the property that to this day is

424
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:32,279
the headquarters of SRF internationally on a hilltop in La

425
00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:37,440
he scheduled the opening of that in nineteen twenty five

426
00:31:37,759 --> 00:31:45,680
for Easter Sunday morning. And you know, every Christmas he celebrated,

427
00:31:46,279 --> 00:31:49,400
you know, in ways that you know many Christians don't,

428
00:31:49,559 --> 00:31:55,160
you know, all day meditation practice on the day before,

429
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:58,440
and then of course gift giving and food and you know,

430
00:31:58,599 --> 00:32:03,279
celebratory thing. He he was very sincere in his reverence

431
00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:06,759
for Jesus as a as an avatar, as a great

432
00:32:06,799 --> 00:32:09,759
saint right up there with his you know, his own

433
00:32:09,799 --> 00:32:14,039
tradition of Krishna and you know, that sort of thing.

434
00:32:14,359 --> 00:32:20,359
So it was sincere. Did it also work as a

435
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:26,480
marketing device, sure, because many you know it it assuaged

436
00:32:26,519 --> 00:32:29,599
the conscience of many people who were curious about him

437
00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:33,759
and attracted to him, but also felt very strongly about

438
00:32:33,799 --> 00:32:38,880
their roots and Christianity. But let's not also overlook the

439
00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:42,400
fact that it was a turn off for many people.

440
00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:48,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, it searching I interview, Yeah, for searching, they're searching

441
00:32:48,039 --> 00:32:50,839
for something other than Jesus, like, man, Jesus is here again?

442
00:32:52,799 --> 00:32:56,559
Speaker 2: It was. I've interviewed so many people, and for one thing,

443
00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:02,000
Jews and atheists, they had all trouble with this Jesus presence.

444
00:33:02,640 --> 00:33:07,440
And many Christians who had given up, who had rejected

445
00:33:07,519 --> 00:33:10,880
the church and their own Christian roots, had to suddenly say,

446
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:15,680
wait a minute, what's this about? And wrestle with that

447
00:33:16,039 --> 00:33:21,759
and then but more common were Christians who had been

448
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:27,599
alienated from their faith, from their tradition, usually when they're

449
00:33:28,440 --> 00:33:35,240
high school or college age and all that, and found

450
00:33:35,279 --> 00:33:42,519
their way back to it through Yogananda because the interpretation

451
00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:50,000
they through Yogananda, they found that Jesus they could love again.

452
00:33:51,319 --> 00:33:54,480
Speaker 1: You know what when they were kids. Yeah, And I'll

453
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:56,559
tell you what I mean. I think that's essentially what

454
00:33:56,640 --> 00:33:59,559
happened to me. Because I'm a recovering Catholic, as I

455
00:33:59,559 --> 00:34:03,039
always OK, And I was introduced to that, but I

456
00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:07,039
rejected the church years ago because I plot holes in

457
00:34:07,119 --> 00:34:11,360
the story and the YadA YadA Jesus is from thirteen

458
00:34:11,400 --> 00:34:14,599
to thirty, you know that, you know, which they talk

459
00:34:14,639 --> 00:34:16,719
about is possible time in India and all this kind

460
00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:18,440
of stuff, which I'll ask you about in a second.

461
00:34:18,840 --> 00:34:23,639
But I I always loved the teachings of Jesus. Just

462
00:34:23,639 --> 00:34:27,159
just take religion out of it, just as a human

463
00:34:27,199 --> 00:34:31,079
being to another human being. His teachings are beautiful, but

464
00:34:31,159 --> 00:34:33,719
it was all mixed up in this dog mine and

465
00:34:33,840 --> 00:34:37,280
fear and anger that I just couldn't grab a. But

466
00:34:37,480 --> 00:34:40,280
through Yoga Nanda, you open up that door again to

467
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:44,079
his teachings and you look, oh, that's that's the Jesus.

468
00:34:44,119 --> 00:34:46,760
I can, I can. I can hang with that guy,

469
00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:48,800
you know, because he's not going to judge me. You know,

470
00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:50,599
he's not going to do this or that. And now

471
00:34:50,639 --> 00:34:53,440
it's been Now it's my mission in life to constantly

472
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:57,480
ask questions about everything that had to do with that.

473
00:34:58,559 --> 00:35:03,480
Speaker 2: Story mirrors a lot. In fact, it's a variation of

474
00:35:03,519 --> 00:35:06,039
my own story. And I've written about this, you know.

475
00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:11,719
I usually every Christmas I try to republish this essay

476
00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:16,719
I wrote about my own path. I was raised by

477
00:35:17,599 --> 00:35:23,079
atheist Jews to you know, think religion was for fools.

478
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:26,960
And I had no religious training or whatever, and I

479
00:35:27,039 --> 00:35:32,079
knew very little about you know, I just like everybody

480
00:35:32,119 --> 00:35:35,719
else raised in America. You know about Christmas in Eastern

481
00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:42,440
and you hear this stuff. But after getting into Indian

482
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:48,920
philosophy and starting my own meditation practice and everything, I

483
00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:54,400
read Autobiography of a Yogi and I said, oh, he

484
00:35:54,639 --> 00:35:58,320
writes about Jesus a lot. What's going on here? What

485
00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:01,360
have I missed? I may have maybe I missed something.

486
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:05,639
So I got a New Testament and read it. And

487
00:36:05,719 --> 00:36:08,119
I had already read the Bug of a Gita, I

488
00:36:08,159 --> 00:36:11,239
had already read the you know, some of the US

489
00:36:11,679 --> 00:36:15,760
and all this literature. So I'm reading the New Testament

490
00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:20,199
for the first time. And my thought was, oh, I

491
00:36:20,360 --> 00:36:25,920
get it. He was a girl, he was a yoga master,

492
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:30,800
he had disciples, and it's just like the US. And

493
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:36,360
so suddenly I found myself being open to stuff, and

494
00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:39,880
I'd go to and I started realizing how much I

495
00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:43,199
like Christmas, Carol. So I check out a different church

496
00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:47,400
every Christmas Eve to have a birthday party for a

497
00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:50,840
great yogi. It is, that's what happens.

498
00:36:51,079 --> 00:36:55,119
Speaker 1: So let me ask you this. In your research following

499
00:36:55,159 --> 00:36:58,599
Yogananda's life, when you went down the rabbit hole of

500
00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:03,719
Jesus's connection with Yogananda, did you find out any stories

501
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:08,280
about the time between the years thirteen and thirty where

502
00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:10,920
there's a lot of Jesus and India ideas or Tibetan.

503
00:37:11,159 --> 00:37:15,760
My understanding is India, Tibet, and Egypt. Those those are

504
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:17,360
the three places that he kind of hung out for

505
00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:17,800
a minute.

506
00:37:18,719 --> 00:37:25,840
Speaker 2: Also, I've heard Persia, yeah an hour on. Yeah, I don't.

507
00:37:26,440 --> 00:37:29,239
I heard all the stories. And it wasn't just in

508
00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:32,079
researching yoga in his life, you know, and all the

509
00:37:32,760 --> 00:37:38,039
I've taken tour groups to India, I've you know, investigated

510
00:37:38,199 --> 00:37:42,320
all the different guruves, teachings and everything, and you hear

511
00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:46,559
these stories. You know, there's even films made about Jesus

512
00:37:46,599 --> 00:37:50,159
in India. You know, people have been speculating about those

513
00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:58,519
missing years forever and it's plausible. I mean, people did

514
00:37:58,599 --> 00:38:02,039
travel from what we think of as the Holy Land

515
00:38:02,119 --> 00:38:07,159
and from Greece, you know, overland to Alexander the Great

516
00:38:08,039 --> 00:38:14,599
went to India, well what's now Pakistan, he met Yogi's

517
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:20,079
It said that the Thagoras and other Greek philosophers had

518
00:38:20,159 --> 00:38:27,440
contacts with Indian sages because there were trade routes between

519
00:38:27,480 --> 00:38:32,400
the Middle East and Greece and India. But what actually happened,

520
00:38:34,599 --> 00:38:37,320
you know, I had no idea.

521
00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:38,960
Speaker 1: They didn't have the film cameras.

522
00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:42,639
Speaker 2: And I always joke that if you're in India, especially

523
00:38:42,639 --> 00:38:48,079
if you're in Kashmir, which is one of the legends,

524
00:38:48,119 --> 00:38:51,440
for a few roupees, somebody will show you where Jesus

525
00:38:51,519 --> 00:39:01,719
is actually buried. He wasn't really crucified that he found

526
00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:05,119
his way to India and spent his life in the Malayas.

527
00:39:05,199 --> 00:39:08,119
Speaker 1: And I've heard all those stories as well. I heard

528
00:39:08,119 --> 00:39:11,599
the mother, mother Mary died along the route and that

529
00:39:11,679 --> 00:39:15,199
she's buried somewhere in Pakistan. Uh, you know that he was.

530
00:39:15,360 --> 00:39:18,119
It was the Vinci coach. He was married, he had kids,

531
00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:21,519
He was Mary Magdalene was not a whore. He was

532
00:39:21,559 --> 00:39:27,760
his wife and apparently the and apparently the proprietor of

533
00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:30,679
his entire mission Jesus because he had to someone had

534
00:39:30,719 --> 00:39:32,639
to pay the bills for Jesus. And she came from

535
00:39:32,639 --> 00:39:35,119
my purse. So these are that, These are stories we

536
00:39:35,159 --> 00:39:36,920
all hear. Have you heard these stories?

537
00:39:37,840 --> 00:39:41,360
Speaker 2: I've heard stories many stories like that. This is the

538
00:39:41,400 --> 00:39:45,800
first time I heard of Mary Magdalene being the the

539
00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:51,960
financeer of the organization. I knew, you know, they presumed

540
00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:57,280
presumably she they were husband and wife. I mean, people

541
00:39:57,320 --> 00:40:02,480
are guarding I I've heard so many stories about so

542
00:40:02,639 --> 00:40:06,199
many legendary people. You know, you live in la you

543
00:40:06,239 --> 00:40:12,039
have stories about celebrities, So why not Jesus exactly?

544
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:18,199
Speaker 1: Now, we touched upon a very pivotal figure in the

545
00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:21,920
autobiography of Yogi and in Yoga Nanda's life, which is

546
00:40:22,079 --> 00:40:26,480
Mahavatar Babaji and Baba G is one of the most

547
00:40:26,519 --> 00:40:32,119
fascinating characters in the autobiography of Yogi. We'll be right

548
00:40:32,159 --> 00:40:38,400
back after a word from our sponsor, and now back

549
00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:42,760
to the show. Can you talk a little bit about

550
00:40:43,159 --> 00:40:47,280
Baba G, what he's doing, what impact he had on Yogananda,

551
00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:49,960
because apparently Yogananda I think met him twice or three times.

552
00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:52,920
I'm not mistaken in the book at least I think

553
00:40:53,000 --> 00:40:55,440
at least twice, but it might be three times in

554
00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:58,599
his life where he actually had a conversation with the

555
00:40:58,639 --> 00:41:01,360
real Baba G and other than stories that he heard

556
00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:04,199
from his Guru. But can you talk a little bit

557
00:41:04,199 --> 00:41:07,239
about Baba Jee and his impact on this work, Yoganana's

558
00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:09,239
life and his impact on the world.

559
00:41:09,719 --> 00:41:17,119
Speaker 2: Well, again, we're in the realm of what's true, what's mythology,

560
00:41:18,639 --> 00:41:29,320
what's good storytelling? I'm not qualified to know. But babaj

561
00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:36,519
is a legendary Yogi in the Himalayas who you know,

562
00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:41,199
had such mastery of mind over a matter of consciousness

563
00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:47,480
as that he did in age and has lived for

564
00:41:47,719 --> 00:41:53,800
hundreds of years. And there are people today who claim

565
00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:57,559
to have met him and been ordained by him to

566
00:41:57,760 --> 00:42:03,280
have some teaching mission. Are they lying? Are they deluded?

567
00:42:03,920 --> 00:42:07,599
Is it real? I have no idea. I once met

568
00:42:07,639 --> 00:42:12,239
somebody who claimed to be Bobba Gee. That guy was deluted,

569
00:42:13,039 --> 00:42:18,559
but you know that was just too obvious. But who knows.

570
00:42:18,760 --> 00:42:26,159
But in Yoganando's world, you could say Bobba Ge is

571
00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:35,679
the custodian of the creat Yoga lineage and appeared to

572
00:42:36,519 --> 00:42:43,960
Yogananda's gurus Guru and Lahiri Mahasia when he was a

573
00:42:44,000 --> 00:42:48,719
young man and said, you will bring out these teachings

574
00:42:48,760 --> 00:42:55,119
from the obscurity that they've fallen into and make them

575
00:42:55,360 --> 00:42:59,599
more widely available, and you will do it without giving

576
00:42:59,679 --> 00:43:05,639
up your your job and your role as a husband,

577
00:43:05,760 --> 00:43:09,519
father and father. And because so you will set an

578
00:43:09,559 --> 00:43:15,559
example that these teachings are not just for renunciates, but

579
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:19,239
for you know, people living in the world. And that's

580
00:43:19,960 --> 00:43:23,880
was Lehiri Mahasia. Then he had a disciple named Shriu

581
00:43:24,039 --> 00:43:31,039
Teswar who was also a householder until you know, he

582
00:43:31,119 --> 00:43:38,760
was a widower and took renuncia advise and he became gurus.

583
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:44,320
So the lineage is passed down from Babaje to Lehiri

584
00:43:44,400 --> 00:43:49,159
Mahasia to shrew Testwar to Yogananda. And of course you

585
00:43:49,199 --> 00:43:54,599
know lesser known people, lesser known gurus who had their

586
00:43:54,599 --> 00:43:59,960
own branches of that lineage, you know, not the old

587
00:44:00,159 --> 00:44:04,679
we want. Other disciples of Lahiri and you tess War

588
00:44:04,960 --> 00:44:11,960
had their own smaller institutions. So that's who he presumably

589
00:44:12,159 --> 00:44:16,639
is and is presumably still alive. And as I said,

590
00:44:16,760 --> 00:44:20,719
people claim all kinds of things. Who knows what's true,

591
00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:30,000
But that's the legend of Bubba Gee. And I've taken

592
00:44:30,039 --> 00:44:35,920
tour groups to places in India where there's one place

593
00:44:36,519 --> 00:44:43,360
where the lineage maintains that. It's a cave where Bubbajee

594
00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:46,639
lived and where you know, and you know and these

595
00:44:46,639 --> 00:44:52,400
are powerful places and they're powerful stories, and some people

596
00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:55,840
believe them and some people don't. But I always like

597
00:44:55,920 --> 00:45:01,519
to say it doesn't matter. You know, the teachings are

598
00:45:01,599 --> 00:45:06,960
the teachings, the methods of Crea Yoga, just like the

599
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:13,480
methods of other yoga lineages. They work, they have an

600
00:45:13,480 --> 00:45:17,760
effect on people. That's what really matters. And you know,

601
00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:24,239
whether you believe Yoga Nanda's stories or not, whether you

602
00:45:24,719 --> 00:45:28,639
talked earlier about reading autobiography and your reaction to all

603
00:45:28,639 --> 00:45:34,880
the miracles and the healings and the feats of Yogi

604
00:45:35,360 --> 00:45:41,719
powers and all that. My experience with people is there

605
00:45:41,719 --> 00:45:45,320
are two kinds of people who really love the Autobiography

606
00:45:45,320 --> 00:45:50,039
of Yogi. People who love the miracles and can't get

607
00:45:50,159 --> 00:45:53,079
enough for them, and people who don't believe a word

608
00:45:53,159 --> 00:45:57,039
of it. But they they get a lot out of

609
00:45:57,039 --> 00:46:00,880
the book for other reasons, because it's the book is

610
00:46:00,920 --> 00:46:03,239
a lot of things to you know, there's a lot

611
00:46:03,320 --> 00:46:07,079
in there. And every time I reread it to teach

612
00:46:07,159 --> 00:46:10,360
one of those courses I mentioned, I find something new,

613
00:46:11,039 --> 00:46:15,800
and there's there's a lot there. So some people just

614
00:46:16,119 --> 00:46:20,119
oop oo the miracles or say, well, some of them

615
00:46:20,159 --> 00:46:23,159
may be true, But I don't believe this one in

616
00:46:23,199 --> 00:46:28,159
that one, and I think Yoga Nando was fooled or whatever.

617
00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:32,599
Here's a but here's a point about it. This is

618
00:46:32,639 --> 00:46:41,039
interesting he made. They're so prominent in the book. And

619
00:46:41,119 --> 00:46:46,039
at the same time, if you read the commentaries about

620
00:46:46,280 --> 00:46:48,840
his own commentaries about it, he'll tell you, but that

621
00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:57,480
are not what what's important. What's important is the experience

622
00:46:58,719 --> 00:47:06,360
inside you when you practice these methods of yoga. These stories,

623
00:47:06,400 --> 00:47:11,440
you can believe them. They're meant to make a point. So,

624
00:47:11,960 --> 00:47:15,320
and that's consistent with all the great spiritual teachers, all

625
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:20,159
the gurus, all the yogis bore to himself. They tell you, Yeah,

626
00:47:20,199 --> 00:47:26,039
these feats of consciousness and everything, they're absolutely true. I

627
00:47:26,119 --> 00:47:30,840
you know, these are things that an advanced yogi can do,

628
00:47:31,920 --> 00:47:34,519
but they're not important. Don't get caught up in them.

629
00:47:34,679 --> 00:47:39,559
Don't waste your time trying to attain these things or

630
00:47:39,599 --> 00:47:43,199
think about them. What matters is the inner peace and

631
00:47:43,280 --> 00:47:49,320
the expanded awareness and the love that these methods bring

632
00:47:49,400 --> 00:47:55,519
about in practice. But yet there's all these stories. So

633
00:47:55,679 --> 00:48:02,519
one day, when I was researching my biography him, I

634
00:48:02,639 --> 00:48:07,760
was meeting with Aswami cha Nananda, who became the head

635
00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:13,599
of the organization after, you know, not long after, I

636
00:48:13,719 --> 00:48:18,400
was meeting with him about my research, and I said,

637
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:21,239
why do you think jog Nanda included so much? Why

638
00:48:21,400 --> 00:48:25,920
there's so many of these stories in the book. And

639
00:48:25,960 --> 00:48:29,400
he said, he tells you in the book. And I said,

640
00:48:29,400 --> 00:48:34,280
what do you mean? And he opens the front of

641
00:48:34,320 --> 00:48:38,800
the book. And if you if you have a copy

642
00:48:38,840 --> 00:48:41,280
of artobiography of you, if you have a copy of

643
00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:47,639
any book, you'll see what's called the copyright page. Where well,

644
00:48:47,760 --> 00:48:50,599
not the copyright page, the title page. There's always a

645
00:48:50,639 --> 00:48:56,320
page with just the title, the author, the publisher. On

646
00:48:56,440 --> 00:49:01,519
that page, there's a quote from from the Bible, from

647
00:49:01,519 --> 00:49:06,440
the New Testament, and it says, except you see signs

648
00:49:06,480 --> 00:49:11,400
and wonders, you will not believe. That's from the Book

649
00:49:11,440 --> 00:49:14,679
of John. He put it in there. It was like

650
00:49:14,800 --> 00:49:18,159
he's he's telling you at the beginning. That's why I

651
00:49:18,239 --> 00:49:21,360
did this, because some people need to see miracles and

652
00:49:21,440 --> 00:49:26,000
everything in order to now pay attention.

653
00:49:26,599 --> 00:49:29,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, pay attention. You know, from my from my studies

654
00:49:31,079 --> 00:49:35,360
in yoga philosophies, I've understood that these ideas, these powers,

655
00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:38,679
the yogaic powers, and there's a handful of them. Levitation

656
00:49:38,840 --> 00:49:43,519
by a location, manifestation, basically all the stuff that Jesus did,

657
00:49:43,559 --> 00:49:48,960
which again goes back to your theory of zach. But

658
00:49:49,159 --> 00:49:53,920
they can be traps for yes, for the yogi going

659
00:49:53,960 --> 00:49:57,719
through it, because because you know what, when you levitate

660
00:49:58,440 --> 00:50:01,760
pretty pretty darn off cool, uh, to leve it day

661
00:50:01,840 --> 00:50:04,079
and to show all that off, the ego will come

662
00:50:04,079 --> 00:50:06,079
in like, you know what, I think I can show this,

663
00:50:06,239 --> 00:50:08,679
or if you're able to manifest something, or if you're

664
00:50:08,679 --> 00:50:12,480
able to biolocate, these are things that the ego would

665
00:50:12,559 --> 00:50:15,719
just love it because you're so much superior to everyone

666
00:50:15,760 --> 00:50:19,239
else that it is a trap for many yogis and yogi,

667
00:50:19,280 --> 00:50:22,239
and some yogis get caught up in that and they

668
00:50:22,360 --> 00:50:25,360
just try they focus on just learning how to levitate

669
00:50:25,400 --> 00:50:27,960
for thirty years and that's what they do.

670
00:50:28,039 --> 00:50:32,119
Speaker 2: But that's not good to read minds to all kinds

671
00:50:32,159 --> 00:50:32,760
of stuff.

672
00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:37,440
Speaker 1: That will be right back after a word from our sponsor.

673
00:50:41,039 --> 00:50:42,320
And now back to the show.

674
00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:48,519
Speaker 2: And the question is are these real? You know? And

675
00:50:48,639 --> 00:50:52,400
I have no doubt that these are attainments you know,

676
00:50:52,519 --> 00:50:57,159
that have been witnessed and observed and attained, and some

677
00:50:57,239 --> 00:51:01,639
of them, like the mind powers, you know, they're just

678
00:51:02,719 --> 00:51:07,199
it's like you could pick up a basketball and shoot

679
00:51:07,280 --> 00:51:11,199
and maybe square because we all can do that, but

680
00:51:12,159 --> 00:51:16,800
not everybody's little Lebron James. So we all have intuition

681
00:51:17,239 --> 00:51:21,039
and hunches and feelings and you know, all that stuff,

682
00:51:21,639 --> 00:51:25,679
and we've experienced certain psychic things happening in our lives.

683
00:51:26,079 --> 00:51:28,880
Take that to an extreme and you have you know,

684
00:51:28,920 --> 00:51:33,159
the Lebron James is of Yogi's doing what we think

685
00:51:33,199 --> 00:51:36,519
of as extraordinary things. So I have no doubt. The

686
00:51:36,599 --> 00:51:40,679
question is, so what when Buddha was asked if he

687
00:51:40,679 --> 00:51:45,079
could perform miracles, he said, yes, when I'm hungry, I eat,

688
00:51:45,519 --> 00:51:48,880
When I'm thirsty, I drink. That's a mirac Those are miracles.

689
00:51:49,400 --> 00:51:56,760
And you know, so are they happy? Are they in

690
00:51:56,880 --> 00:52:03,719
bliss consciousness? Have they transcend? Did the you know, sufferings

691
00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:08,679
of the world. That's why people follow Yogic paths, not

692
00:52:08,880 --> 00:52:12,760
so they can manipulate other people with their mind or

693
00:52:13,559 --> 00:52:16,960
you know, float.

694
00:52:16,480 --> 00:52:20,719
Speaker 1: Exactly exactly, you know, And you mentioned Lahi in Mahashai,

695
00:52:20,840 --> 00:52:24,400
who's one of my favorite of the gurus because he

696
00:52:24,519 --> 00:52:28,599
had a family, and that's unlike most gurus are usually

697
00:52:28,719 --> 00:52:32,400
you know, they are monastic in many ways and they

698
00:52:32,440 --> 00:52:36,079
stay away from having that because and I have family.

699
00:52:36,159 --> 00:52:38,400
I have a family, And I always like to say,

700
00:52:38,440 --> 00:52:40,599
I always like to joke. I'm like, I wonder how

701
00:52:40,679 --> 00:52:43,159
yogur Nanda would have done if you had five kids

702
00:52:43,239 --> 00:52:45,159
running around and a wife and a mortgage and all

703
00:52:45,199 --> 00:52:48,360
this kind of stuff. It's easy to find enlightenment. You

704
00:52:48,440 --> 00:52:51,719
don't have to deal with that. I'm joking, but it's easier.

705
00:52:51,760 --> 00:52:54,159
And then Lahar Mahasha is that one guru that I

706
00:52:54,280 --> 00:52:57,360
look to like. He had a family, he had a job,

707
00:52:57,599 --> 00:53:00,280
he was an accountant. I mean he he and he

708
00:53:00,440 --> 00:53:05,599
still slowly but surely became the spiritual teacher. So it

709
00:53:05,639 --> 00:53:09,719
is doable in Babaji if he does exist. Baba Ji

710
00:53:10,960 --> 00:53:16,960
was so smart in allowing someone like Lehira Mahashai to

711
00:53:17,079 --> 00:53:20,000
be the catalyst of prey A Yoga as an example

712
00:53:20,039 --> 00:53:22,480
to others to go, No, you don't have to be

713
00:53:23,000 --> 00:53:26,119
in the Himalayan mountains for one hundred years meditating.

714
00:53:26,760 --> 00:53:26,880
Speaker 2: Uh.

715
00:53:27,239 --> 00:53:29,239
Speaker 1: You know from what I understand. What I understand now

716
00:53:29,320 --> 00:53:32,280
that the age and not for everybody, but the age

717
00:53:32,280 --> 00:53:36,599
of this enlightenment in the Himalayans. Uh, you know, in

718
00:53:36,639 --> 00:53:39,599
a cave somewhere away from the world or even in

719
00:53:39,280 --> 00:53:42,159
a in a in a in a church, or in

720
00:53:42,199 --> 00:53:44,840
you know, a monk, you know, retreat a castle somewhere.

721
00:53:45,519 --> 00:53:50,639
That world is great. But from my understanding is now

722
00:53:50,639 --> 00:53:52,599
it's the time for them to come down from the

723
00:53:52,639 --> 00:53:56,760
mountains and to start doing these kind of teachings within

724
00:53:56,800 --> 00:54:00,719
the mass media, getting jobs within companies, doing these things

725
00:54:00,719 --> 00:54:03,760
to be actually to do change in the world and

726
00:54:04,079 --> 00:54:06,480
elevate everyone's awaken consciousness.

727
00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:12,079
Speaker 2: Would you agree, yeah, I Well, there's a role for monastics.

728
00:54:12,599 --> 00:54:13,760
Speaker 1: Correct.

729
00:54:15,079 --> 00:54:18,679
Speaker 2: Most of the teachers who came here, whether Buddhist or

730
00:54:18,760 --> 00:54:26,800
Hindu or whatever, were monks, but they taught householders. They

731
00:54:26,840 --> 00:54:30,440
made it very plain, you don't have to this is

732
00:54:31,280 --> 00:54:34,440
many are called, but few are chosen. You know, most

733
00:54:35,000 --> 00:54:39,400
the great majority of human beings are meant to be

734
00:54:39,519 --> 00:54:43,320
in families and have careers and jobs, and that's the

735
00:54:43,679 --> 00:54:49,159
curriculum for our you know, most of our incarnations. But

736
00:54:49,320 --> 00:54:54,199
there's a role to be played for monks and nuns,

737
00:54:54,840 --> 00:55:02,760
and essentially they're specialists. You know, they don't have the

738
00:55:03,119 --> 00:55:08,480
distractions of family life and careers, so they can devote

739
00:55:08,519 --> 00:55:13,559
themselves fully to this. This is why Yogananda, who himself

740
00:55:13,679 --> 00:55:18,840
was a monk, he made he empowered the people around

741
00:55:18,960 --> 00:55:24,400
him to run the organization and carry on his legacy.

742
00:55:25,480 --> 00:55:28,079
He put that in the hands of the monastics. He

743
00:55:28,199 --> 00:55:33,960
created a monastic order for Westerners. So did other gurus.

744
00:55:34,559 --> 00:55:38,920
All of them had them some equivalent of that. And

745
00:55:39,400 --> 00:55:42,400
you know, it's a very attractive proposition for people who

746
00:55:42,440 --> 00:55:47,719
get involved in a deep, serious spiritual path, but it's

747
00:55:47,760 --> 00:55:53,559
not for everybody. It has its own challenges. You know, Uh,

748
00:55:54,400 --> 00:55:58,920
you give up, you're giving up a lot, and you

749
00:55:59,199 --> 00:56:03,039
are It's a lot is expected of you. You're not

750
00:56:03,480 --> 00:56:08,400
just sitting in a cave. You're running an organization and

751
00:56:08,480 --> 00:56:13,400
you have people to deal with and managerial responsibilities, teaching

752
00:56:13,480 --> 00:56:17,440
responsibilities and all that, and you have to, you know,

753
00:56:17,920 --> 00:56:21,840
remain unattached from certain things. And you know, even I

754
00:56:22,480 --> 00:56:25,360
it's very tempting once you get onto a yoga path

755
00:56:25,440 --> 00:56:28,480
to say, oh, all this stuff is a distraction. I'm

756
00:56:28,519 --> 00:56:31,920
just going to go live in an ashram or you know,

757
00:56:32,719 --> 00:56:37,559
a monastery. You know, maybe it'll last a short period

758
00:56:37,559 --> 00:56:41,199
of time. Before I used to joke that I got

759
00:56:41,239 --> 00:56:43,000
I did that for a while. I would go on

760
00:56:43,119 --> 00:56:46,360
long meditation retreats and say, oh, I'm not going back.

761
00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:48,320
I want to just do this, I'm going to take

762
00:56:48,440 --> 00:56:52,000
vows and then you know, a week later, I'm thinking,

763
00:56:53,480 --> 00:57:00,360
how are the Mets doing, you know, and probably where

764
00:57:00,400 --> 00:57:04,639
are the women? And you know, I wonder if the

765
00:57:04,639 --> 00:57:08,519
Beatles have a new album. You know, just some of

766
00:57:08,599 --> 00:57:11,800
us are not meant to be that way. You know,

767
00:57:12,920 --> 00:57:15,000
we all have a role for each.

768
00:57:15,719 --> 00:57:18,440
Speaker 1: Correct your role was to do the work that you're doing.

769
00:57:18,880 --> 00:57:21,119
And you couldn't do that in an ashram. I mean,

770
00:57:21,440 --> 00:57:24,280
you have to be out mingling with the world. And

771
00:57:24,320 --> 00:57:25,519
look Yoga Nanda.

772
00:57:26,159 --> 00:57:26,920
Speaker 2: You know he was.

773
00:57:27,239 --> 00:57:30,480
Speaker 1: He was, you know, a person who was not in

774
00:57:30,519 --> 00:57:34,320
a cave somewhere. He built an organization, He traveled, he spoke,

775
00:57:34,679 --> 00:57:37,400
He interacted with people on a constant basis for thirty

776
00:57:37,400 --> 00:57:40,480
two years in the United States. That is as far

777
00:57:41,079 --> 00:57:43,920
beyond being a monks.

778
00:57:43,719 --> 00:57:47,639
Speaker 2: That's right. And you know, and this is in my

779
00:57:48,079 --> 00:57:50,960
biography of him because it shows up a lot in

780
00:57:51,000 --> 00:57:55,159
his letters and other things. There were times when he said,

781
00:57:55,599 --> 00:57:58,320
I don't want to do this anymore. This is too

782
00:57:58,440 --> 00:58:02,559
much hassle. I ha to think about money and these

783
00:58:03,320 --> 00:58:07,840
foolish people who get into squabbles with one another, and

784
00:58:08,039 --> 00:58:12,880
aren't you know, and people attacking me and people suing

785
00:58:13,000 --> 00:58:18,039
me and people making accusations and people opposing me. I

786
00:58:18,199 --> 00:58:22,960
just wanted to live the peaceful life of of a yogi.

787
00:58:23,400 --> 00:58:26,800
I want to go live by the Ganges River and

788
00:58:27,039 --> 00:58:32,440
in Malayas and but it didn't. You know, he had

789
00:58:32,480 --> 00:58:35,880
a mission and it wasn't to be. But there were

790
00:58:35,960 --> 00:58:40,480
times when he, you know, the people around him thought

791
00:58:40,760 --> 00:58:44,079
he's not coming back. You know, he's he's he wants

792
00:58:44,119 --> 00:58:47,679
to give this up. But he couldn't. It was his mission.

793
00:58:47,920 --> 00:58:54,480
But he had a lot of responsibility and worked very hard.

794
00:58:55,440 --> 00:58:58,440
And you know, anybody you know just think of it.

795
00:58:58,519 --> 00:59:01,920
You start a business or something thing, it's a lot

796
00:59:01,960 --> 00:59:05,199
of work. And essentially, you know, he had a mission.

797
00:59:05,239 --> 00:59:09,920
And the more successful he was, the more administrative headaches,

798
00:59:10,039 --> 00:59:14,280
the more you know, public relations headaches. So you know,

799
00:59:14,519 --> 00:59:17,760
he worked. He worked very hard. And that's a great example.

800
00:59:18,320 --> 00:59:22,119
I've had people read my book and say, oh, I'm

801
00:59:22,199 --> 00:59:26,079
so happy that I read it because part of me wanted,

802
00:59:26,360 --> 00:59:28,840
you know, thinking why is my life so difficult? And

803
00:59:28,840 --> 00:59:32,000
then I realized even yoga and on the had challenges,

804
00:59:32,119 --> 00:59:35,000
this is you know, this is life in the world.

805
00:59:35,159 --> 00:59:38,719
So I feel better about things now.

806
00:59:41,039 --> 00:59:42,880
Speaker 1: Yeah. And he I mean he did have. He had

807
00:59:42,920 --> 00:59:45,119
a lot of struggles, a lot a lot of struggles

808
00:59:45,199 --> 00:59:47,159
in his day and during the end of his life.

809
00:59:47,559 --> 00:59:49,599
And please correct me if I'm wrong, But he started

810
00:59:49,639 --> 00:59:53,679
to write like so much. He was trying to get

811
00:59:53,719 --> 00:59:55,920
it all because he knew, because he knew when he

812
00:59:56,000 --> 00:59:58,320
was going to go. He knew that the clock was

813
00:59:58,400 --> 01:00:03,159
running out for himself. And he was writing, apparently just

814
01:00:03,159 --> 01:00:08,039
just insanely, books after books after books, translating translated, I

815
01:00:08,039 --> 01:00:11,639
mean or dictating, dictating, dictating books on top of books, right.

816
01:00:11,840 --> 01:00:15,639
Speaker 2: And not only that, you know, making sure his organization

817
01:00:16,079 --> 01:00:20,760
was in place for his departure, making sure it would

818
01:00:20,960 --> 01:00:26,199
it would be financially secure, making sure the people who

819
01:00:26,239 --> 01:00:29,679
were going to carry on his legacy were properly trained

820
01:00:29,760 --> 01:00:35,119
and properly oriented. He continued to give public talks, all

821
01:00:35,159 --> 01:00:38,760
of which were transcribed and you know, ended up in books.

822
01:00:38,960 --> 01:00:43,719
So he was working very hard. He stopped traveling first

823
01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:47,119
fifteen years or so. Here he traveled all the time.

824
01:00:48,480 --> 01:00:53,840
Stopped traveling after a while and just stayed in southern California.

825
01:00:55,719 --> 01:00:58,199
Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,

826
01:01:01,840 --> 01:01:03,119
and now back to the show.

827
01:01:05,119 --> 01:01:08,400
Speaker 2: You know, if if he were around now, he'd be

828
01:01:08,519 --> 01:01:14,039
making YouTube videos. In those days he was writing books.

829
01:01:15,599 --> 01:01:19,519
Speaker 1: That was that was that was the medium of his time.

830
01:01:19,880 --> 01:01:21,199
That was the way to get out to the masses.

831
01:01:21,239 --> 01:01:24,159
Now he would be absolutely a YouTube star, no question,

832
01:01:24,880 --> 01:01:28,679
no question about it, whatsoever. One last thing, Philip, I

833
01:01:28,679 --> 01:01:33,280
wanted to ask you about. I heard this from from

834
01:01:33,360 --> 01:01:37,159
somewhere that when he died, when Yoguna in the past,

835
01:01:37,320 --> 01:01:41,760
he basically was he was speaking and he told us

836
01:01:41,920 --> 01:01:45,239
his disciples that night, tonight, I'm leaving you, and they're like, no, no, no,

837
01:01:45,320 --> 01:01:45,960
that's impossible.

838
01:01:45,960 --> 01:01:47,719
Speaker 2: He didn't he didn't tell them that.

839
01:01:47,719 --> 01:01:49,519
Speaker 1: Oh he didn't. He didn't say that, okay.

840
01:01:49,920 --> 01:01:53,760
Speaker 2: But they inferred it later from some of the things

841
01:01:53,800 --> 01:01:55,760
he said, got.

842
01:01:55,559 --> 01:01:57,519
Speaker 1: It, okay, So he was he was dropping some hints.

843
01:01:58,760 --> 01:02:00,800
But then he in the middle of talk just fell

844
01:02:00,840 --> 01:02:02,760
and he apparently was from cardiac arrest.

845
01:02:04,679 --> 01:02:08,000
Speaker 2: True, but it was at the end of his talk,

846
01:02:08,960 --> 01:02:14,760
and it was I have to say, researching and writing

847
01:02:15,920 --> 01:02:22,039
that chapter about his final years and days and final night,

848
01:02:23,159 --> 01:02:27,119
it was really moving for me to to do that.

849
01:02:27,639 --> 01:02:30,760
It was a beautiful thing he had. He had. He

850
01:02:30,840 --> 01:02:35,840
loved his homeland, he loved India and what it stands for.

851
01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:41,679
And one of the things was he always wanted to

852
01:02:41,719 --> 01:02:46,119
go back again and visiting it, and he only did

853
01:02:46,199 --> 01:02:50,039
once in this whole time after he came here and

854
01:02:50,079 --> 01:02:54,480
he wanted to go back, but he never did. But

855
01:02:54,599 --> 01:02:57,519
he once said that he would die with India on

856
01:02:57,599 --> 01:03:02,159
his lips, and he did. It was the final His

857
01:03:02,280 --> 01:03:09,760
final night was a banquet celebration. This is what five

858
01:03:09,840 --> 01:03:14,960
years after, almost five years after India became independent and

859
01:03:15,039 --> 01:03:21,840
its first the first post independence ambassador to the US

860
01:03:22,119 --> 01:03:25,840
was visiting Los Angeles and they had banquets for him

861
01:03:25,880 --> 01:03:29,679
and every yoga and Nanda hosted them. And he gave

862
01:03:29,719 --> 01:03:35,400
a talk at this banquet and he concluded his talk

863
01:03:36,159 --> 01:03:39,880
by reading a section of a poem of his about

864
01:03:39,920 --> 01:03:43,599
his love for India. And as soon as he finished,

865
01:03:43,719 --> 01:03:44,440
he collapsed.

866
01:03:45,159 --> 01:03:49,199
Speaker 1: He died with Indiana's lips. Now, one last thing when

867
01:03:49,239 --> 01:03:55,000
he passed. The legend goes that he didn't decay, that

868
01:03:55,159 --> 01:03:57,639
he was as vibrant as the day he was alive.

869
01:03:57,920 --> 01:04:00,880
And there was there's video of it. There's actual of

870
01:04:01,039 --> 01:04:03,760
him at his as they were burying him, I think,

871
01:04:03,880 --> 01:04:08,519
or wherever. That's ser Yeah, but what do you don't

872
01:04:08,519 --> 01:04:08,760
you hear?

873
01:04:09,320 --> 01:04:14,760
Speaker 2: I have to be you know, that's all the issues

874
01:04:14,840 --> 01:04:18,360
I've ever seen of autobiography of Yogi have this thing

875
01:04:18,440 --> 01:04:25,039
about how his body didn't corrupt, and people have disputed that.

876
01:04:25,079 --> 01:04:29,079
For one thing, he was embalmed and and the body

877
01:04:29,239 --> 01:04:34,280
was open casket only for a short period of time.

878
01:04:35,039 --> 01:04:39,719
No one knows. No one's opened the casket since, and

879
01:04:39,960 --> 01:04:48,519
you know, according to one what is called corner, they

880
01:04:48,679 --> 01:04:53,199
started to see some signs of decay. Others say, oh no,

881
01:04:53,440 --> 01:04:57,639
this he held up. The body held up much longer

882
01:04:57,679 --> 01:05:01,960
than is the norm, and other people would dispute that,

883
01:05:02,920 --> 01:05:04,760
And personally, I don't care.

884
01:05:06,079 --> 01:05:11,800
Speaker 1: Rights. It's fascinating because that's basically every great spiritual teacher.

885
01:05:11,840 --> 01:05:15,840
Speaker 2: There's always there's always legends, there's always stories. You know,

886
01:05:16,400 --> 01:05:20,280
Jesus isn't the only one who was supposed to have

887
01:05:20,320 --> 01:05:24,719
a virgin birth or was resurrected or any of that.

888
01:05:25,320 --> 01:05:27,400
You know, so you know know what to believe. And

889
01:05:27,639 --> 01:05:30,599
I always thought, if they were open yoga on this

890
01:05:30,760 --> 01:05:33,800
casket and find him looking like he did in nineteen

891
01:05:33,840 --> 01:05:39,360
fifty two, it would be miraculous. But would it change anything.

892
01:05:39,679 --> 01:05:46,840
Would it make his methods any more valuable, any more practical?

893
01:05:47,320 --> 01:05:53,480
Would it make the philosophies he espoused any less true

894
01:05:53,639 --> 01:05:56,719
or more true. No, that's what really matters.

895
01:05:57,239 --> 01:05:59,119
Speaker 1: Where is do you know where he's buried? I don't

896
01:05:59,159 --> 01:06:00,239
know where He's buried.

897
01:06:00,199 --> 01:06:04,440
Speaker 2: In Forest Lawn cemetery outside of Los Angeles.

898
01:06:04,719 --> 01:06:06,599
Speaker 1: He's a force Lawns. I didn't know he was a

899
01:06:06,639 --> 01:06:07,480
force Lawns.

900
01:06:07,880 --> 01:06:08,079
Speaker 2: Yeah.

901
01:06:08,400 --> 01:06:10,320
Speaker 1: My next trip to l A, I'm making.

902
01:06:10,480 --> 01:06:14,480
Speaker 2: There was there was an effort to move to disinenter

903
01:06:14,559 --> 01:06:18,280
it and move it to srf's headquarters. But the people,

904
01:06:18,599 --> 01:06:22,880
the people who live in the neighborhood stopped it. They

905
01:06:22,920 --> 01:06:26,239
didn't want they didn't want pilgrims coming, you know, passing,

906
01:06:26,639 --> 01:06:29,840
going to visit his tomb all the time.

907
01:06:30,800 --> 01:06:33,480
Speaker 1: Fair enough, fair enough, No, Philip, I'm gonna ask a

908
01:06:33,519 --> 01:06:35,840
few questions to ask all of my guests. What is

909
01:06:35,880 --> 01:06:38,000
your definition of living a fulfilled life?

910
01:06:38,679 --> 01:06:40,920
Speaker 2: Knowing who we truly are?

911
01:06:41,920 --> 01:06:43,559
Speaker 1: If you had a chance to go back in time

912
01:06:43,800 --> 01:06:49,760
and speak to little Philip, what advice would you give him?

913
01:06:49,800 --> 01:06:54,599
Speaker 2: You could have been a major league pitcher. Now I'm kidding.

914
01:06:56,239 --> 01:07:02,320
Speaker 1: The Mets needed you. The Mets, No I would.

915
01:07:02,400 --> 01:07:10,840
Speaker 2: I would say, be grateful for every moment, live with

916
01:07:10,880 --> 01:07:12,000
no regret.

917
01:07:12,360 --> 01:07:14,559
Speaker 1: How do you define God or source?

918
01:07:15,159 --> 01:07:18,239
Speaker 2: I really stay away from the g word. It means

919
01:07:18,280 --> 01:07:20,639
so many different things to so many pe people.

920
01:07:20,719 --> 01:07:21,480
Speaker 1: That's why I said.

921
01:07:23,280 --> 01:07:32,320
Speaker 2: Yes, that which is always, was, always will be, was

922
01:07:32,440 --> 01:07:37,159
never born, will never die. And to circle back to

923
01:07:37,199 --> 01:07:41,519
your first question, that is who we truly are? What

924
01:07:41,639 --> 01:07:44,880
is love that which binds everything?

925
01:07:45,639 --> 01:07:47,400
Speaker 1: And what is the ultimate purpose of life?

926
01:07:48,159 --> 01:07:55,039
Speaker 2: To know who we truly are, live our full potential

927
01:07:56,880 --> 01:07:57,440
and serve.

928
01:07:58,320 --> 01:07:59,960
Speaker 1: And Philip, where can people find out more about you

929
01:08:00,360 --> 01:08:02,320
and the amazing work you're doing in the world.

930
01:08:03,239 --> 01:08:12,559
Speaker 2: My website Philipgoldberg dot com when it's working properly as everything,

931
01:08:13,199 --> 01:08:18,560
and my podcast which is called Spirit Matters, which find

932
01:08:18,600 --> 01:08:23,640
out mind Bodyspirit dot fm. My books of course, which

933
01:08:23,720 --> 01:08:27,840
you'll find out about on my website. But the website

934
01:08:27,000 --> 01:08:29,479
is the first stop.

935
01:08:30,880 --> 01:08:33,520
Speaker 1: Do you have any party messages for the audience if

936
01:08:33,560 --> 01:08:35,720
you were channeling Yoga Nanda Today.

937
01:08:39,119 --> 01:08:46,119
Speaker 2: We live in very difficult times. Protect yourself, find the

938
01:08:46,159 --> 01:08:52,359
sanctuary of peace within yourself, anchor yourself there and then

939
01:08:52,439 --> 01:08:55,039
come out and do something to help.

940
01:08:56,800 --> 01:08:59,239
Speaker 1: Philip, it has been a pleasure and honor speaking to

941
01:08:59,319 --> 01:09:02,119
you about your work and Yogananda. Anytime I can talk

942
01:09:02,119 --> 01:09:04,840
about Yogananda, I'm happy, so thank you so much. For

943
01:09:05,279 --> 01:09:08,880
spreading his pleasure and spreading his story in the world.

944
01:09:08,880 --> 01:09:13,159
Speaker 2: My friend, Thank you, thanks for your great questions and

945
01:09:13,840 --> 01:09:15,800
for the invitation. It was a pleasure.

946
01:09:17,439 --> 01:09:19,079
Speaker 1: I want to thank Phillips so much for coming on

947
01:09:19,119 --> 01:09:21,279
the show and sharing his knowledge with all of us.

948
01:09:21,479 --> 01:09:23,000
If you want to get links to anything we spoke

949
01:09:23,000 --> 01:09:24,960
about in this episode, head over to the show notes

950
01:09:25,199 --> 01:09:30,239
at next levelsoul dot com forward slash four five four. Now.

951
01:09:30,239 --> 01:09:33,720
If this conversation stirred something in you, there's more waiting.

952
01:09:34,119 --> 01:09:37,560
You can listen to this episode completely commercial free on

953
01:09:37,680 --> 01:09:41,960
next level Soul TV's app where soul meets streaming. Watch

954
01:09:41,960 --> 01:09:47,159
and listen on Appleios, Android, Apple TV, Ruku, Android TV Buyer,

955
01:09:47,199 --> 01:09:53,000
tv LG and Samsung apps anytime anywhere. Begin your awakening

956
01:09:53,359 --> 01:09:57,319
at next levelsoul dot tv. Thank you so much for listening.

957
01:09:57,520 --> 01:10:01,159
As I always say, trust the journey. It's there to

958
01:10:01,199 --> 01:10:03,239
teach you. I'll see you next time.