WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.199 --> 00:00:03.720 A model Roman Catholic call right there. Why can't all 2 00:00:03.759 --> 00:00:05.480 the Roman Catholics be like that guy? That was cool? 3 00:00:06.919 --> 00:00:11.199 I'm determined to find this freaking Bitcoin Island video that 4 00:00:11.240 --> 00:00:12.919 I watched. I watched the whole video and now I 5 00:00:12.919 --> 00:00:14.839 can't find it. It's not even in my history. I 6 00:00:14.839 --> 00:00:18.079 didn't remove it from my history. In fact, I think 7 00:00:18.120 --> 00:00:20.359 I saved it because I thought this is kind of cool. 8 00:00:20.399 --> 00:00:23.480 Actually I might am I gonna moved to Bitcoin Island 9 00:00:23.519 --> 00:00:24.160 one day if. 10 00:00:24.039 --> 00:00:26.239 Things get if they get really crazy, I'm gonna move 11 00:00:26.280 --> 00:00:29.920 to Bitcoin Island. Let me see. I'm still looking for it. Uh, 12 00:00:30.719 --> 00:00:32.920 watch later. I probably put it on their watch later. 13 00:00:33.039 --> 00:00:41.079 Let's see. 14 00:00:45.960 --> 00:01:02.520 Now it was something like was it Nicaragua, Bitcoin, bitquain City, 15 00:01:02.640 --> 00:01:05.959 Nicaragua something. It wasn't El Salvador. I know all about Ol Salvadors. 16 00:01:06.280 --> 00:01:08.799 This just videos popped up though. It was crazy, So 17 00:01:11.879 --> 00:01:12.760 I bet this is it? 18 00:01:16.760 --> 00:01:26.920 Here it is, I found it, Okay, pull it. 19 00:01:26.959 --> 00:01:27.640 Up for you guys here. 20 00:01:32.599 --> 00:01:32.760 Now. 21 00:01:33.000 --> 00:01:37.120 This is to address the libertarian discussion earlier. So Business Insider, 22 00:01:37.120 --> 00:01:43.840 I guess did this profile on bit quain City in Honduras, 23 00:01:43.959 --> 00:01:45.519 not Nicaraga. Couldn't think of where it. 24 00:01:45.480 --> 00:01:46.079 Was, so. 25 00:01:47.519 --> 00:01:50.040 This is like some small community, uh, and they have 26 00:01:50.159 --> 00:01:54.079 like it's I think going for the libertarian idea of 27 00:01:54.879 --> 00:01:56.000 everything's voluntary. 28 00:01:56.159 --> 00:01:56.840 We're gonna have like. 29 00:01:56.760 --> 00:02:02.239 A private security force that's gonna maintain order you opt 30 00:02:02.280 --> 00:02:04.920 into it and all this stuff. And I mean a 31 00:02:04.920 --> 00:02:06.920 lot of it sounds pretty cool. The only thing is 32 00:02:06.959 --> 00:02:12.000 like it sounds like it also sounds kind of uh, 33 00:02:14.280 --> 00:02:17.560 not as libertarian as you think it is initially because 34 00:02:17.560 --> 00:02:18.520 it's almost. 35 00:02:18.159 --> 00:02:21.719 Like a super corporate h O. 36 00:02:21.879 --> 00:02:26.560 A type of setup where you gotta you gotta sign 37 00:02:26.639 --> 00:02:31.039 onto all this crap and like you're gonna you're basically 38 00:02:31.120 --> 00:02:33.400 governed by some kind of corporate board. And I'm like, 39 00:02:33.479 --> 00:02:35.719 is this I guess this? I mean, is this a 40 00:02:35.800 --> 00:02:38.439 libertarian I guess it is. It's like, well, you have 41 00:02:38.479 --> 00:02:40.360 to opt into it, but if you don't, so what 42 00:02:40.400 --> 00:02:43.439 happens if I don't? So if I don't opt into it, 43 00:02:43.479 --> 00:02:47.360 do I not get the security force coming to my 44 00:02:47.439 --> 00:02:48.240 house to protect? 45 00:02:48.280 --> 00:02:50.439 I mean, I don't. I don't know how this is 46 00:02:50.479 --> 00:02:53.840 gonna work. But I mean, I guess is we're moving 47 00:02:53.879 --> 00:02:55.319 in the right direction. I guess. 48 00:02:55.400 --> 00:02:58.639 Let's see what this says here about city life here 49 00:02:58.680 --> 00:02:59.479 in Bitcoin. 50 00:02:59.240 --> 00:03:02.800 City, the normal public services you'd expect in a city 51 00:03:03.159 --> 00:03:07.680 aren't exactly there. For safety, the city relies on a 52 00:03:07.719 --> 00:03:08.960 security guard service. 53 00:03:11.639 --> 00:03:14.000 So as just this one dude sitting here in the 54 00:03:15.000 --> 00:03:18.840 sitting in this wooden crate, Like, here's your security for us. 55 00:03:18.879 --> 00:03:21.919 It's just this guy. I mean, maybe he's really good. 56 00:03:22.000 --> 00:03:23.199 I don't know. I'm just saying. 57 00:03:24.840 --> 00:03:29.120 There's one private Montessorian elementary school that charges five hundred 58 00:03:29.159 --> 00:03:32.800 and fifty dollars a month for tuition. Around one hundred 59 00:03:32.840 --> 00:03:36.400 and twenty businesses had registered here as of January twenty 60 00:03:36.439 --> 00:03:37.000 twenty three. 61 00:03:37.759 --> 00:03:40.159 In Andreas, it will take you somewhere around six months 62 00:03:40.280 --> 00:03:43.800 or more to get the proper licenses to operate your business, 63 00:03:44.199 --> 00:03:47.439 and here you can get your business to an operational 64 00:03:47.520 --> 00:03:49.000 stage and listen two weeks. 65 00:03:49.319 --> 00:03:53.280 The new companies include a gene therapy startup, a dive shop, 66 00:03:53.680 --> 00:03:58.360 and a bitcoin education center run by Duzan Matuska, who 67 00:03:58.439 --> 00:04:03.280 moved from Slovakia. So here is where we pay. 68 00:04:04.120 --> 00:04:09.120 So like, obviously this is not really operating yet, but 69 00:04:10.120 --> 00:04:12.599 maybe this is I don't know, maybe this is the 70 00:04:12.599 --> 00:04:13.240 way of the future. 71 00:04:13.479 --> 00:04:13.960 I don't know. 72 00:04:14.599 --> 00:04:17.439 So they have they have a legal system, but it's 73 00:04:17.519 --> 00:04:20.560 like judges through Skype. 74 00:04:23.360 --> 00:04:25.759 It just sounds funny. I watched this so that this 75 00:04:25.839 --> 00:04:26.959 is fantasy island, but. 76 00:04:26.959 --> 00:04:30.000 Like there's nobody there yet, so maybe maybe you want 77 00:04:30.000 --> 00:04:32.839 to be first a fantasy island, like Tattoo is not 78 00:04:32.879 --> 00:04:34.720 even there yet, so you could you could even beat 79 00:04:34.720 --> 00:04:37.279 Tattoo to fantasy perhaps if you got bitcoin. 80 00:04:37.319 --> 00:04:41.399 Did you say bitcoin? I've been telling you. You didn't 81 00:04:41.439 --> 00:04:41.920 listen to me. 82 00:04:42.560 --> 00:04:47.120 You thought crazy internet goofball didn't know what he's talking about, 83 00:04:48.120 --> 00:04:49.480 but I knew what I was talking about. 84 00:04:49.600 --> 00:04:52.800 The most controversial part about the city state is the 85 00:04:52.879 --> 00:04:57.279 judicial system. Prospero has set up its own online court 86 00:04:57.399 --> 00:04:58.519 to settle disputes. 87 00:04:59.680 --> 00:05:01.480 Many prosper. 88 00:05:03.560 --> 00:05:03.639 So. 89 00:05:04.480 --> 00:05:07.240 I guess the the wealth. 90 00:05:08.439 --> 00:05:11.720 Tier is intended to keep bad actors out, but there's 91 00:05:11.759 --> 00:05:14.040 a lot of rich people that are bad actors. 92 00:05:14.079 --> 00:05:15.279 So I don't know. I just don't know this. 93 00:05:16.560 --> 00:05:19.480 I mean, there probably already is some Galt gulch somewhere. 94 00:05:19.519 --> 00:05:21.720 Maybe they're trying to make El Salvador into golf's culture. 95 00:05:21.759 --> 00:05:23.279 I don't know. I don't know. I don't know what 96 00:05:23.360 --> 00:05:23.920 the answer is. 97 00:05:23.959 --> 00:05:27.000 But one thing there could happen is that if El 98 00:05:27.079 --> 00:05:30.199 Salvador or Bitcoin City or whatever, if these things are 99 00:05:30.240 --> 00:05:32.519 really actually successful and they work really well, which I 100 00:05:32.560 --> 00:05:36.439 think some of them probably will. They might be examples 101 00:05:36.519 --> 00:05:38.920 for other countries to say, hey, we want to do 102 00:05:39.040 --> 00:05:41.839 like that. Like they're actually building communities that actually work. 103 00:05:42.600 --> 00:05:48.399 They're not you know, socialist hell holes, democratic blue city nightmares. 104 00:05:49.160 --> 00:05:51.240 Let's set one of these up or something, and then 105 00:05:51.279 --> 00:05:53.639 it becomes like a light to the nations, right, something 106 00:05:53.680 --> 00:06:01.000 like that maybe. But I don't know, Gabriel, what's up? 107 00:06:05.800 --> 00:06:08.399 Somebody said this sounds like a front. That's also possible. 108 00:06:08.480 --> 00:06:11.360 This could be some kind of a CIA front. 109 00:06:11.519 --> 00:06:16.000 It could be some kind of a it could be 110 00:06:16.040 --> 00:06:17.240 a cult. I don't know. 111 00:06:17.360 --> 00:06:20.959 I mean, I would definitely want to like have spent 112 00:06:21.199 --> 00:06:26.639 time here, have like due diligence research before I moved 113 00:06:26.639 --> 00:06:28.560 into like some kind of cult community where I'm being 114 00:06:28.639 --> 00:06:29.160 my control. 115 00:06:29.240 --> 00:06:32.720 But I don't, you know, like who knows? What's up? 116 00:06:32.720 --> 00:06:32.920 Man? 117 00:06:33.040 --> 00:06:35.199 I'm you Joe Jay. 118 00:06:35.800 --> 00:06:38.879 Can you hear me, sir, man, I'm a huge fan. 119 00:06:39.160 --> 00:06:42.079 I have a couple of questions. It shouldn't take too long, Okay, 120 00:06:43.040 --> 00:06:48.120 all right? So my first question is if the Earth 121 00:06:48.240 --> 00:06:50.600 is old, is that disproved the Bible or no. 122 00:06:52.959 --> 00:06:55.160 I just don't think you can prove that the Earth 123 00:06:55.279 --> 00:07:00.120 is old. So I don't see how you prove that 124 00:07:00.240 --> 00:07:06.639 without assuming things that wait, the data or the instruments 125 00:07:06.879 --> 00:07:11.040 already assuming the date right, like, for example, well, the 126 00:07:11.079 --> 00:07:16.240 red light couldn't come here unless there was a big bang. 127 00:07:16.800 --> 00:07:19.120 And it's like, well, but if God created the universe, 128 00:07:19.199 --> 00:07:21.839 then the red light was already here. It didn't have 129 00:07:21.879 --> 00:07:24.240 to come here from the big bang. So in other words, 130 00:07:24.240 --> 00:07:28.480 the argumentation assumes a big bang in the case of 131 00:07:29.040 --> 00:07:31.759 the red light coming from the stars or whatever. But 132 00:07:31.800 --> 00:07:33.600 that's the thing in question, So how do you prove 133 00:07:34.720 --> 00:07:36.680 how do you I don't understand, and like, well, well, 134 00:07:36.759 --> 00:07:39.519 let's look at the rock layers and the. 135 00:07:38.920 --> 00:07:39.800 Geology or whatever. 136 00:07:40.319 --> 00:07:44.399 But you're attributing age to what you see what it 137 00:07:44.480 --> 00:07:46.240 had to take millions of years for that layer to 138 00:07:46.240 --> 00:07:49.160 form that, And then we see counter examples where there's 139 00:07:49.240 --> 00:07:53.519 a fossil or a tree that extends between these geological 140 00:07:53.560 --> 00:07:56.000 layers that are supposed to millions of years. So I 141 00:07:56.079 --> 00:08:00.240 just don't see how you prove the old age. Even 142 00:08:00.240 --> 00:08:04.279 carbon dating, well, even carbon dating does the exact same thing, 143 00:08:04.319 --> 00:08:07.839 where it oftentimes assumes that, well, we know that for 144 00:08:08.120 --> 00:08:11.000 this to decay at this rate, it takes billions of years. 145 00:08:11.040 --> 00:08:13.120 But that's the thing in question again, how do we 146 00:08:13.160 --> 00:08:14.240 know it takes billions of years? 147 00:08:15.160 --> 00:08:16.560 All right, Okay, that makes sense. 148 00:08:17.279 --> 00:08:19.600 Yeah, that's just my skeptic take on a lot of 149 00:08:19.600 --> 00:08:20.120 that stuff. 150 00:08:21.839 --> 00:08:27.000 And again, I'm actually a skeptic on the things that 151 00:08:27.040 --> 00:08:30.279 most people are not skeptics on, and I'm actually an 152 00:08:30.360 --> 00:08:33.399 argument for certitude on the things that most people think 153 00:08:33.480 --> 00:08:36.399 aren't certain and don't know about. So, in other words, 154 00:08:37.360 --> 00:08:41.399 I flip it. The philosophical stuff I actually think is 155 00:08:41.440 --> 00:08:46.519 certain and theoyant stuff is actually not certain. And that's 156 00:08:46.519 --> 00:08:50.399 I think something that people oftentimes misunderstand about this stuff 157 00:08:50.559 --> 00:09:04.399 that I argue and where I'm coming from, Matt, what's up, yore? 158 00:09:04.480 --> 00:09:04.720 Y'all? 159 00:09:04.879 --> 00:09:08.799 Hey, Hey, just a quick question. 160 00:09:09.320 --> 00:09:13.559 I had the unfortunate mispleasure of watching the Alex O'Connor 161 00:09:13.600 --> 00:09:16.960 and Cliff Connecting You or whatever his name is debate. 162 00:09:17.120 --> 00:09:19.240 I've been hearing about this. I haven't watched it yet. 163 00:09:19.480 --> 00:09:20.679 Is this something I should watch? 164 00:09:22.240 --> 00:09:25.039 Not unless you want to stick two pencils in your eyes? 165 00:09:25.919 --> 00:09:26.120 Is it? 166 00:09:27.720 --> 00:09:27.919 Ah? 167 00:09:28.039 --> 00:09:29.279 This is horrible. 168 00:09:29.480 --> 00:09:34.159 I mean I gave up evidentialist apologetics a long time ago, 169 00:09:34.399 --> 00:09:38.480 and I think I sort of was leaning towards presup. 170 00:09:38.559 --> 00:09:40.600 But then when I listened to your arguments on TAG 171 00:09:41.519 --> 00:09:46.080 and FDA, I couldn't really come up with anything to 172 00:09:46.159 --> 00:09:51.000 kind of refute it. But in saying that, one of 173 00:09:51.000 --> 00:09:53.440 the things I point to in this debate is the 174 00:09:53.519 --> 00:09:55.919 problem of suffering for animals, which I thought was just 175 00:09:57.159 --> 00:10:01.960 not really a good point anyway. But I wanted to 176 00:10:02.120 --> 00:10:07.360 ask if you have heard of well you probably have, 177 00:10:07.519 --> 00:10:14.360 but about Angelic for Theodyssey. And let's just assume that 178 00:10:15.159 --> 00:10:17.720 you know they're not going to argue get into the 179 00:10:17.759 --> 00:10:21.080 pre sup game, right, but would you say the Angelic 180 00:10:21.120 --> 00:10:25.279 for theodssey is a good argument for the problem of suffering, 181 00:10:25.360 --> 00:10:26.799 especially in light of like C. S. 182 00:10:26.919 --> 00:10:29.039 Lewis and also J. R. 183 00:10:29.279 --> 00:10:33.720 Tolkien with his work on the Cymarillion, that kind of reasoning. 184 00:10:35.879 --> 00:10:39.159 Maybe I'm not familiar with that specific thesis. Can you 185 00:10:39.279 --> 00:10:43.559 lay it out for me? What is this idea basically? 186 00:10:44.360 --> 00:10:45.679 And I think it can tie in. 187 00:10:45.679 --> 00:10:51.080 With logos and the LOGI was that the angels were 188 00:10:51.120 --> 00:10:54.279 created first and then when we read and it's almost 189 00:10:54.440 --> 00:10:57.600 kind of similar to gap theory where the angels have 190 00:10:58.080 --> 00:11:02.279 ready for all in Genesis one. So whoo, who you know, 191 00:11:02.360 --> 00:11:08.519 the chaotic mess and God is actually restoring the creation, 192 00:11:09.320 --> 00:11:13.120 and that because the angels have left their heavenly abode 193 00:11:13.120 --> 00:11:19.159 and the responsibilities that they were given, Creation has already fallen. 194 00:11:19.879 --> 00:11:22.559 Because God doesn't say it's perfect, he said it's good, 195 00:11:23.679 --> 00:11:27.080 and so kind of Genesis talks about the kind of 196 00:11:27.639 --> 00:11:31.320 I suppose the garden as being that I suppose that 197 00:11:31.440 --> 00:11:36.679 rescue mission of the creation, which was purpose always in Christ. 198 00:11:36.799 --> 00:11:38.960 But you know, Adam is the first one. 199 00:11:39.399 --> 00:11:41.879 And so we have suffering. 200 00:11:43.320 --> 00:11:48.000 With you know, animal death or suffering simply because Creation 201 00:11:48.120 --> 00:11:53.279 has already suffered a fall through the angelic beings who 202 00:11:53.320 --> 00:11:56.440 were in charge of all of these different areas. 203 00:11:56.679 --> 00:11:59.679 So the immediate problem I would see with this is 204 00:12:01.000 --> 00:12:06.639 the Orthodox view posits the timeless Aon, which is where 205 00:12:06.720 --> 00:12:10.200 the angels are. And so because the Aon is a 206 00:12:10.240 --> 00:12:16.960 timeless created eternity, the angels either continued in grace or 207 00:12:17.000 --> 00:12:20.240 fell in an instant, so it's timeless. So their immediate 208 00:12:20.320 --> 00:12:24.519 choice determined whether they were angels or demons, and so 209 00:12:25.200 --> 00:12:28.159 that caused a kind of fall, you could say, in 210 00:12:28.240 --> 00:12:32.279 the spiritual realm. But as Orthodox we couldn't say that 211 00:12:32.279 --> 00:12:37.200 that angel fall affected the created realm, because that doesn't 212 00:12:37.200 --> 00:12:41.159 happen until Adam consents, and that's why Adam is the 213 00:12:41.440 --> 00:12:44.559 basically the high priest and steward of all the created order. 214 00:12:45.080 --> 00:12:47.519 So that's why when Adam falls, according to Romans eight, 215 00:12:48.120 --> 00:12:51.559 that fall then affects all the created order, whether it's 216 00:12:51.720 --> 00:12:56.519 entropy on the moon or whether it's Hamster's dying, all 217 00:12:56.559 --> 00:13:00.440 of that's a result of Adam's fall. But the angelic 218 00:13:00.519 --> 00:13:03.519 fall only affects the spiritual realm for us. 219 00:13:05.480 --> 00:13:07.399 Okay, good, all right, thank you sir. 220 00:13:07.639 --> 00:13:10.720 That's a great question, you'd say. Man, yeah, that's a 221 00:13:10.720 --> 00:13:12.679 great question. I've never had a I can't. 222 00:13:12.480 --> 00:13:14.159 Remember the last time we had our like a deep 223 00:13:14.240 --> 00:13:17.679 angel type of question. But if you want a good 224 00:13:18.159 --> 00:13:21.279 passage on the Aon, if you get Vladimir Lawski's book 225 00:13:21.279 --> 00:13:25.639 Dogmatic Theology, there's a really good four page explanation of 226 00:13:25.679 --> 00:13:29.120 the Orthodox view of the timeless Aon and the reason 227 00:13:29.159 --> 00:13:30.200 that matters in theology. 228 00:13:30.559 --> 00:13:32.519 John Deamascus mentions the a on two. 229 00:13:32.600 --> 00:13:34.559 But the reason it matters in theology is that it 230 00:13:34.559 --> 00:13:38.960 actually distinguishes us from Platonism. Not not many people know this, 231 00:13:39.159 --> 00:13:43.039 but so for Platonism you have time and eternity, and 232 00:13:43.240 --> 00:13:45.840 really that's it. There's just those two, and eternity is 233 00:13:45.879 --> 00:13:49.519 really equated ultimately with the forms or the one, and 234 00:13:49.720 --> 00:13:50.159 there's no. 235 00:13:50.360 --> 00:13:51.919 Kind of there's nothing in between. 236 00:13:52.399 --> 00:13:56.360 But in Orthodox Christianity, there's not just God, the uncreated 237 00:13:57.000 --> 00:13:57.960 and man. 238 00:13:58.159 --> 00:13:58.799 And then in the. 239 00:13:58.799 --> 00:14:05.000 Temporal realm there's also the timeless created a which is 240 00:14:05.120 --> 00:14:09.159 where the angels are. So there's this other realm uh 241 00:14:09.320 --> 00:14:11.799 and hence the you know, God creates the worlds or 242 00:14:11.799 --> 00:14:14.960 the realms and so forth. So we in that in 243 00:14:15.120 --> 00:14:17.279 part when you read Maximis and other people who talk 244 00:14:17.320 --> 00:14:20.840 about it, it's it's another angle by which we are 245 00:14:20.879 --> 00:14:25.600 distinguished from the Platonic view. There is no created, timeless 246 00:14:25.639 --> 00:14:28.159 alon and Platinism pop by Daddy, what's up? 247 00:14:35.440 --> 00:14:35.679 Hey? 248 00:14:37.559 --> 00:14:40.240 I had a quick question on the view on the 249 00:14:40.360 --> 00:14:42.919 Orthodox Church on Eastern Catholics. 250 00:14:44.039 --> 00:14:44.679 What's the view? 251 00:14:47.200 --> 00:14:47.720 What do you mean? 252 00:14:47.799 --> 00:14:50.679 Like what like do you guys see do you guys 253 00:14:50.720 --> 00:14:53.240 see it as heretical or that. 254 00:14:55.159 --> 00:14:56.480 Since we communion with Rome? 255 00:14:57.039 --> 00:15:00.000 Yeah, I mean, ultimately, unfortunately, even though you guys should 256 00:15:00.039 --> 00:15:02.960 a lot of our theology, we do not believe that 257 00:15:03.440 --> 00:15:07.799 entering into communion with Rome makes it still it's no 258 00:15:07.840 --> 00:15:08.600 longer Orthodox. 259 00:15:11.240 --> 00:15:11.480 Yeah. 260 00:15:11.519 --> 00:15:16.000 But also with the philioque if we change or they 261 00:15:16.080 --> 00:15:21.240 say they can use through the sun instead of from 262 00:15:21.360 --> 00:15:21.799 the sun. 263 00:15:22.320 --> 00:15:24.600 That yeah, but that would just be to admit that way. 264 00:15:24.720 --> 00:15:26.639 But that would just be to admit that you're part 265 00:15:26.679 --> 00:15:28.159 of a church that has two creeds. 266 00:15:28.240 --> 00:15:30.919 I mean, there's only one creed. There's not two creeds. 267 00:15:30.960 --> 00:15:34.879 So even if there's a theological explanation for two different creeds, 268 00:15:35.360 --> 00:15:38.159 merely having two different creeds I think is a pretty 269 00:15:38.159 --> 00:15:40.399 good argument that that's not the true church. 270 00:15:40.799 --> 00:15:43.320 The church has one creed, It's always had one creed. 271 00:15:44.720 --> 00:15:49.000 And beyond that, it's like Rome used to say that if. 272 00:15:48.879 --> 00:15:53.080 You, you know, believe the theology of Palamas, you're excommunicated. 273 00:15:53.240 --> 00:15:55.679 Oh but now it's cool since John Paul the Second, 274 00:15:55.799 --> 00:15:58.679 you know, revered Palamas or whatever. And oh, by the way, 275 00:15:58.759 --> 00:16:00.559 Eastern Catholics, by the way, you can use the same 276 00:16:00.600 --> 00:16:04.679 festial manion, and you can you know, Revere Sergius or 277 00:16:04.759 --> 00:16:06.960 Ratinees and all these, you know, people that are supposed 278 00:16:06.960 --> 00:16:09.240 to be schismatics. I mean, I just read Kantate Domino, 279 00:16:09.320 --> 00:16:11.519 which says, if you die at a communion with Rome, 280 00:16:11.960 --> 00:16:15.080 you're damned. Oh but not anymore, because the pope says 281 00:16:15.080 --> 00:16:19.039 that Russian Orthodox Saints are cool now, Like, it just 282 00:16:19.080 --> 00:16:19.919 doesn't make sense. 283 00:16:21.879 --> 00:16:25.200 Also, do you know if like I'm like just studying 284 00:16:25.200 --> 00:16:27.039 into Eastern Catholics right now, but do you know if 285 00:16:27.039 --> 00:16:31.600 Eastern Catholics can say the philioquick Creed too, is it 286 00:16:31.639 --> 00:16:32.399 allowed or not? 287 00:16:32.799 --> 00:16:35.919 I mean, I don't see why you couldn't, because technically 288 00:16:36.080 --> 00:16:40.559 you're supposed to accept everything that room teaches, all right, 289 00:16:40.879 --> 00:16:45.639 But Eastern Catholics are basically in a like double mind, 290 00:16:45.679 --> 00:16:48.120 double thing position because many of them say, well, we 291 00:16:48.120 --> 00:16:52.080 don't accept all this papal stuff, like the Malchi Catechism 292 00:16:52.120 --> 00:16:55.759 says we believe in seven ecumenical councils. There's no there's 293 00:16:55.759 --> 00:16:58.200 no Roman Catholic position that allows you to only believe 294 00:16:58.240 --> 00:17:01.919 seven ecumenical councils. That's just crazy, It's ridiculous. It's not true, 295 00:17:03.120 --> 00:17:05.920 which shows that it's not actually about the theology, it's 296 00:17:06.000 --> 00:17:08.279 about political geopolitical stuff. 297 00:17:11.240 --> 00:17:15.599 Also, can I get your thoughts on CCC two forty eight. 298 00:17:15.599 --> 00:17:17.480 It talks about the Eastern tradition. 299 00:17:20.480 --> 00:17:22.519 How the father is the first of origin, and the 300 00:17:22.559 --> 00:17:26.799 Western tradition expresses it like the father and the son 301 00:17:26.960 --> 00:17:27.359 has the. 302 00:17:27.359 --> 00:17:33.279 Same consubstantial essence, like go. I'm not sure, but it's 303 00:17:33.519 --> 00:17:34.400 I have to look at it. 304 00:17:34.440 --> 00:17:36.480 But so it's the catechism. 305 00:17:36.599 --> 00:17:40.519 Well on catechism, I don't have it, I have the 306 00:17:40.759 --> 00:17:43.480 I have Denzing, or I don't have the current Catholic 307 00:17:43.480 --> 00:17:44.400 Catechism in front of me. 308 00:17:44.519 --> 00:17:45.119 What is the. 309 00:17:45.160 --> 00:17:56.519 Number forty eight? 310 00:18:00.119 --> 00:18:00.599 The outset. 311 00:18:00.640 --> 00:18:03.359 The Eastern tradition expresses the father's character as the first 312 00:18:03.400 --> 00:18:05.359 origin of the spirit by confessing the Spirit as he 313 00:18:05.400 --> 00:18:07.839 proceeds from the Father. It affirms that he comes from 314 00:18:07.839 --> 00:18:10.799 the Father through the Son. The Western tradition expresses the 315 00:18:10.799 --> 00:18:13.000 first constitential community between the Father and son by saying 316 00:18:13.039 --> 00:18:15.119 that those spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son. 317 00:18:15.599 --> 00:18:18.400 It says this legitimate and with good reason, for the 318 00:18:18.400 --> 00:18:22.119 eternal order of the divine persons of their consubstantiality. Consential 319 00:18:22.160 --> 00:18:25.480 communion implies that the Father, as the principle without principle, 320 00:18:25.559 --> 00:18:27.920 is the first origin of the spirit, but also as 321 00:18:27.920 --> 00:18:30.039 the father of the Son, he is with the Son, 322 00:18:30.480 --> 00:18:34.079 a single principle from which the Holy Spirit precedes. That's 323 00:18:34.119 --> 00:18:37.039 the line that Orthodox would have a problem with, because 324 00:18:37.079 --> 00:18:41.440 that's from Florence, and that that's granting a special type 325 00:18:41.480 --> 00:18:44.799 of unity that shared between the Father and the son 326 00:18:45.279 --> 00:18:48.039 that the spirit lacks. And if you read the Cavedocians, 327 00:18:48.079 --> 00:18:52.279 they all are pretty unanimous that there's no property that 328 00:18:52.359 --> 00:18:55.519 two persons have that one lacks, because in the trinity, 329 00:18:55.599 --> 00:18:58.279 you either say something that's a hypostatic property proper to 330 00:18:58.319 --> 00:19:01.880 one person, or it's an actual property that all three have. 331 00:19:02.160 --> 00:19:05.319 So for example, love, love is a common attribute of 332 00:19:05.359 --> 00:19:09.559 property that all three persons in the trinity share, being 333 00:19:09.680 --> 00:19:12.839 cause that's the hypothetic property that picks out the father, 334 00:19:13.319 --> 00:19:17.119 and it's non communical and not shareable. So the Cappadocians say, 335 00:19:17.160 --> 00:19:20.400 and this is the teaching of constantin nomber one. Everything 336 00:19:20.480 --> 00:19:24.920 that the father has the son has, except being the cause. 337 00:19:25.480 --> 00:19:29.640 That's directly in contrast to what the Council Florence and 338 00:19:29.720 --> 00:19:31.359 Roman Catholic theology says. 339 00:19:32.759 --> 00:19:35.119 All right, thank you those basically it appreciate it. 340 00:19:35.640 --> 00:19:38.160 Also, you might want to read from the Vatican the 341 00:19:38.519 --> 00:19:40.799 I think it's from the nineties. It's called the Vatican 342 00:19:40.839 --> 00:19:43.960 Clarification with philia O Clay, because even though it's a 343 00:19:44.039 --> 00:19:48.640 Vatican document, basically it just admits that these views are 344 00:19:48.640 --> 00:19:52.920 still intention over that very point, whether or not the 345 00:19:52.960 --> 00:19:56.440 hypesite property the father could be something shared by another person. 346 00:19:57.079 --> 00:20:03.680 So even the Vatican's minist minded documents admit these two 347 00:20:03.799 --> 00:20:07.119 views are still intention. So even if we even if 348 00:20:07.119 --> 00:20:11.759 the Vatican concedes points about proceeding through or eternal manifestation 349 00:20:12.119 --> 00:20:16.240 and that many Eastern brothers teach Eastern Father's teach manifestation, 350 00:20:17.799 --> 00:20:22.680 the views are still still intention on that point. From Florence, 351 00:20:25.880 --> 00:20:28.480 all right, let's see, let me read a few. We're 352 00:20:28.519 --> 00:20:30.559 still going where I need to read a few, super chess, 353 00:20:30.599 --> 00:20:33.599 because we've got quite a few here. I didn't read 354 00:20:33.599 --> 00:20:36.240 the rest of sincere hypocrite. Excuse me, he said, Uh, 355 00:20:36.319 --> 00:20:38.640 what didn't Dick Todd? Is Pape and Vatican one make 356 00:20:39.000 --> 00:20:42.039 it impossible for a pope to be judged by a layman. Yeah, absolutely, 357 00:20:42.119 --> 00:20:44.519 and not just those as many other statements. 358 00:20:44.680 --> 00:20:50.799 See de legas of pious. We just pulled this up 359 00:20:50.839 --> 00:20:52.279 the other day see de legas. 360 00:20:58.480 --> 00:21:02.359 This actually a dreat us is in the Roman Catholic 361 00:21:02.480 --> 00:21:07.960 Church lay theologians, So this is actually above random internet 362 00:21:08.000 --> 00:21:09.839 goobers trying to judge the pope. 363 00:21:09.880 --> 00:21:10.960 This is actually. 364 00:21:11.000 --> 00:21:14.920 Literal like lay PhD people, and the whole it basically 365 00:21:15.000 --> 00:21:18.000 says that, yeah, that's cool that you're a lath theologian 366 00:21:18.079 --> 00:21:20.240 or whatever. But you have no authority in the church 367 00:21:20.359 --> 00:21:24.920 and it doesn't really matter. So there's many documents that 368 00:21:25.039 --> 00:21:29.640 basically point out that no Roman, no Rando guy gets 369 00:21:29.680 --> 00:21:35.640 to decide Francis is orthodoxy. Does this prove that they 370 00:21:35.640 --> 00:21:39.680 are Protestants in practice? Absolutely? And that is pretty much 371 00:21:39.720 --> 00:21:42.039 the thesis of this stream for the first hour, mean 372 00:21:42.160 --> 00:21:47.119 gene three dollars, no goofy gubers all out up in here. Well, actually, tonight, 373 00:21:47.160 --> 00:21:49.680 everybody's been super cool. We haven't had any goofy gebers. 374 00:21:49.720 --> 00:21:53.160 It's all been pretty much high tier. Maybe I should 375 00:21:53.200 --> 00:21:57.319 go back to doing evening streams because the reason I 376 00:21:57.359 --> 00:21:59.440 started doing the afternoon streams was that I noticed that 377 00:21:59.480 --> 00:22:03.799 the YouTube is super high from like two to five PM. 378 00:22:03.920 --> 00:22:06.000 That's like the for whatever reason, that's like the most 379 00:22:06.000 --> 00:22:11.599 traffic on YouTube. So we were doing that and we 380 00:22:11.599 --> 00:22:14.839 were getting pretty consistently like thirteen hundred. I think I 381 00:22:14.880 --> 00:22:17.480 was even getting like fifteen hundred, almost two thousand live 382 00:22:18.279 --> 00:22:22.640 for a few times, and we got up to one 383 00:22:22.680 --> 00:22:30.599 thousand tonight, which is cool. But maybe the quality callers 384 00:22:30.720 --> 00:22:34.759 are in the evenings and the fair Isle foaming at 385 00:22:34.839 --> 00:22:39.319 the mouth goofy goobers are during the daytime. Haiti's Undead 386 00:22:39.359 --> 00:22:46.039 fifteen dollars, shorter videos and more concise information addressing FAQs. Yeah, 387 00:22:46.079 --> 00:22:49.640 I've been actually thinking about doing this, and you know, 388 00:22:49.759 --> 00:22:52.440 they don't actually get that. 389 00:22:52.519 --> 00:22:53.480 Many more views. 390 00:22:54.000 --> 00:22:55.839 One or two of them can, like I think, like 391 00:22:55.880 --> 00:22:59.200 my Pope when Francis said, all the religious lead to God. 392 00:22:59.279 --> 00:23:02.720 This one got four one thousand views, which for a 393 00:23:02.880 --> 00:23:06.319 twelve minute video on my channel is pretty good. The 394 00:23:06.519 --> 00:23:10.759 Dogmatic Contradiction video that's eighteen minutes got twenty four thousand. 395 00:23:13.640 --> 00:23:17.279 I do think that the long form stuff is actually 396 00:23:17.359 --> 00:23:22.920 hurting the potential viewership, just because so many people are 397 00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:26.079 much more likely to click my twelve minute video than 398 00:23:26.200 --> 00:23:27.359 the five hour videos. 399 00:23:27.839 --> 00:23:28.599 But here's the thing. 400 00:23:28.680 --> 00:23:32.240 Guys like I make a living doing this, and when 401 00:23:32.279 --> 00:23:35.799 I got demonetized, there was no incentive to make the 402 00:23:35.839 --> 00:23:41.200 short videos except to make them concise. So here's part 403 00:23:41.240 --> 00:23:43.880 of the solution. And I don't care if you guys 404 00:23:44.000 --> 00:23:48.920 monetize your clips channels. We've gotten now about probably four 405 00:23:49.039 --> 00:23:51.599 or five dudes out there that have been making clips 406 00:23:51.680 --> 00:23:54.279 channels using my stuff, and they monetize it. I mean, 407 00:23:54.279 --> 00:23:56.039 it's not going to be like a lot of money. 408 00:23:56.319 --> 00:23:57.839 But I don't care. If you guys do that and 409 00:23:57.880 --> 00:24:00.079 you can monetize it, go for it. 410 00:24:00.160 --> 00:24:03.400 So and we've got obviously Kyle does it with the 411 00:24:03.480 --> 00:24:06.680 dire clips. I don't care if Kyl does that, he 412 00:24:06.720 --> 00:24:08.920 can do it. We got a new guy who's been 413 00:24:08.960 --> 00:24:11.759 doing it. He's doing really good clips. Where's going at? 414 00:24:14.920 --> 00:24:29.160 Where is that one? It's an Orthodox guy? Where's it at? 415 00:24:33.000 --> 00:24:35.440 Anyway, it's on her somewhere. Maybe I passed the scroll 416 00:24:35.480 --> 00:24:40.359 past it. But we got orthodox dude. Another Orthodox dude 417 00:24:40.359 --> 00:24:42.240 that's doing them. Job was doing them for a while. 418 00:24:42.279 --> 00:24:43.599 Those were getting a lot of views. I guess he 419 00:24:43.680 --> 00:24:46.799 got tired of doing it. Anyway, long story short, I 420 00:24:46.799 --> 00:24:49.880 don't care if you guys clip and go for it 421 00:24:50.279 --> 00:24:54.880 because actually, you guys, remember. 422 00:24:55.920 --> 00:24:57.279 The way that Tate blew. 423 00:24:57.119 --> 00:25:01.519 Up back in twenty twenty was because of his stupid 424 00:25:01.559 --> 00:25:06.079 Hustlers university stuff. Was like telling all these dudes to 425 00:25:06.079 --> 00:25:08.559 clip his videos and you get like free access to 426 00:25:08.759 --> 00:25:12.240 hustlers or whatever his thing is. And this actually blew 427 00:25:12.319 --> 00:25:14.480 up his chance like his stuff, right, That's how he 428 00:25:14.519 --> 00:25:18.519 got so famous, was doing all this like online marketing 429 00:25:18.519 --> 00:25:21.279 through telling other people to promote the stuff and clip 430 00:25:21.319 --> 00:25:24.480 it be my guest, Dude, go for it, clip all 431 00:25:24.519 --> 00:25:27.119 of it, start a clip channel, monetize it. 432 00:25:27.160 --> 00:25:28.559 I don't care, go for it. 433 00:25:29.599 --> 00:25:32.440 I'm happy to see anybody clipping my stuff because you 434 00:25:32.440 --> 00:25:35.559 know what, I spend half of my day doing uploading 435 00:25:35.599 --> 00:25:37.640 and clipping, and I don't like doing it. 436 00:25:37.640 --> 00:25:38.279 It's no fun. 437 00:25:38.400 --> 00:25:41.640 It actually detracts from all the mental time and energy 438 00:25:41.880 --> 00:25:44.359 that I want to put into actually reading books and 439 00:25:44.400 --> 00:25:45.400 actually doing content. 440 00:25:45.880 --> 00:25:49.359 But I have to spend half of my day. 441 00:25:49.200 --> 00:25:53.160 Clipping and uploading crap, and honestly, I get sick of it. 442 00:25:53.799 --> 00:25:55.759 But if you want to make some side cash and 443 00:25:55.799 --> 00:25:57.319 monetize my stuff, I don't care. 444 00:25:57.319 --> 00:25:57.839 Go for it. 445 00:25:59.599 --> 00:26:03.640 Or coma. 446 00:26:04.240 --> 00:26:12.000 Have any people who disagree, Hey man, thanks for taking 447 00:26:12.079 --> 00:26:12.880 my call a big fan. 448 00:26:15.640 --> 00:26:17.799 We're talking earlier about the age. 449 00:26:17.519 --> 00:26:20.440 Of the Earth, you know, hold Earth versus Young Earth, 450 00:26:21.359 --> 00:26:21.880 and it just. 451 00:26:21.839 --> 00:26:24.079 Made me get to thinking, what about like the size 452 00:26:24.079 --> 00:26:25.920 of the cosmos and the size of the universe and 453 00:26:25.960 --> 00:26:30.000 the fact that we as a human species, as an 454 00:26:30.119 --> 00:26:33.599 orthodox believer right, as an orthodox Christian. 455 00:26:35.240 --> 00:26:38.279 And following Father Star from Rose and demons and everything, 456 00:26:38.759 --> 00:26:43.200 how does that play into our belief of if the 457 00:26:43.240 --> 00:26:47.079 size of the universe is what scientists say they are say. 458 00:26:46.920 --> 00:26:47.480 It is right. 459 00:26:47.559 --> 00:26:50.400 Of course, you have to believe that in the first place, 460 00:26:51.240 --> 00:26:53.960 But if you humored death for a second, how would 461 00:26:53.960 --> 00:26:56.000 that have an effect if there were others out there? 462 00:26:56.039 --> 00:26:58.759 Would there be other humans that would have the same 463 00:26:59.440 --> 00:27:00.559 concept salvation? 464 00:27:02.640 --> 00:27:05.000 Are you talking about, like this argument that the universe 465 00:27:05.079 --> 00:27:07.279 is so big that there's got to be alien life 466 00:27:07.319 --> 00:27:07.680 out there. 467 00:27:08.880 --> 00:27:10.839 Yeah, that's just something I've been thinking about. 468 00:27:14.039 --> 00:27:14.960 Yeah, I think that's stupid. 469 00:27:15.000 --> 00:27:16.319 In fact, if you listened to a lot of my 470 00:27:16.400 --> 00:27:21.880 recent alien analysis podcasts, we've been addressing that argument. I 471 00:27:21.880 --> 00:27:24.720 think that's just a really I mean, it literally relies 472 00:27:24.799 --> 00:27:29.640 on the Big Bang, you know, infinite universe narrative that well, 473 00:27:29.720 --> 00:27:32.759 if the universe is infinite, then it stands to reason 474 00:27:32.759 --> 00:27:35.319 that there would be life evolving on other planets. I 475 00:27:35.319 --> 00:27:39.680 think it's old, just nonsense, and yeah, I would just 476 00:27:39.680 --> 00:27:41.640 say go listen to some of those pods. I just 477 00:27:41.680 --> 00:27:43.960 I don't think that the universe is infinite. In fact, 478 00:27:44.559 --> 00:27:49.160 it was an esoteric goober. Giordano Bruno was one of 479 00:27:49.200 --> 00:27:53.079 the first people to start arguing that the universe was infinite, 480 00:27:53.680 --> 00:27:55.400 and he did that on the basis of a bunch 481 00:27:55.400 --> 00:27:58.039 of weird esoteric philosophy had nothing to do with quote science. 482 00:27:58.079 --> 00:28:00.960 It was just like he's like the early he's an 483 00:28:00.960 --> 00:28:07.519 early proponent for multiple worlds Bruno, and he got to 484 00:28:07.960 --> 00:28:10.039 he didn't I don't know if he explicitly says multiple worlds, 485 00:28:10.039 --> 00:28:13.720 but he get to that from infinite universe. And there's 486 00:28:13.759 --> 00:28:17.599 a whole nerdy rabbit hole that you can go down 487 00:28:17.839 --> 00:28:23.119 from theories of space and time after the Enlightenment. So 488 00:28:23.440 --> 00:28:25.599 Newton and all these different characters is like, it's this 489 00:28:25.720 --> 00:28:28.240 really neat rabbit hole. It's so nerdy that nobody really 490 00:28:28.279 --> 00:28:31.240 cares about it except for like physics astronomy nerds, which 491 00:28:31.319 --> 00:28:33.480 is like one percent of this channel. So it's not 492 00:28:33.480 --> 00:28:36.359 really even any point going into that stuff. I don't know, 493 00:28:36.400 --> 00:28:37.920 I mean know a little bit about it. Because we 494 00:28:37.920 --> 00:28:42.000 had a class on this modern European philosophy class. We 495 00:28:42.039 --> 00:28:45.440 spent some time on different theories of space, and some 496 00:28:45.480 --> 00:28:48.519 of these philosophers, for example Kant, consider space to be 497 00:28:48.559 --> 00:28:52.880 a transceittal category. But then other philosophers around that time 498 00:28:52.880 --> 00:28:55.079 were positing that the universe was infinite. 499 00:28:55.079 --> 00:28:56.640 So what you start to notice is that. 500 00:28:56.680 --> 00:29:00.559 They take divine attributes and no longer are those divine 501 00:29:00.599 --> 00:29:05.240 attributes transcendent, they're actually smushing them into the created realm. 502 00:29:05.279 --> 00:29:10.920 So now the universe becomes infinite in Bruno, and I'm 503 00:29:10.960 --> 00:29:13.240 not joking about it. Like this literally leads like a 504 00:29:13.279 --> 00:29:18.319 few generations later to some of the early multiverse proponents who. 505 00:29:18.160 --> 00:29:19.599 Are getting it from the. 506 00:29:24.000 --> 00:29:28.559 Weirdo Giordano Bruno, who was explicitly an esoteris by the 507 00:29:28.559 --> 00:29:33.839 way he influences Hegel. Let me show you what I'm 508 00:29:33.880 --> 00:29:36.119 talking about. I've got a couple books on this that 509 00:29:36.480 --> 00:29:40.400 are pretty cool, but but nobody cares about this. This 510 00:29:40.519 --> 00:29:42.480 is just like super nerd stuff. 511 00:29:42.559 --> 00:29:42.880 Dude. 512 00:29:42.880 --> 00:29:47.880 So this guy who's a complete weirdo, if you look 513 00:29:47.960 --> 00:29:57.200 him up, I'm looking for Stanford Encyclopedia philosophy, not this stuff. 514 00:30:02.240 --> 00:30:02.680 Here we go. 515 00:30:07.039 --> 00:30:10.359 So yeah, see you'll notice right away a lot of 516 00:30:10.400 --> 00:30:14.079 this is pretty esoteric stuff, right Like this is platonics, 517 00:30:14.119 --> 00:30:17.400 the universal soul, universal matter, universal intellect. 518 00:30:17.400 --> 00:30:19.279 This is like Platonic stuff, the hidden God. 519 00:30:19.960 --> 00:30:20.279 Hmmm. 520 00:30:20.920 --> 00:30:24.720 Yeah, well this is like Crole not just Crowley is 521 00:30:24.759 --> 00:30:30.519 way late, but like Hegelian stuff. Who's that other medieval 522 00:30:30.559 --> 00:30:50.559 mystic who's has the same Eckhart meister Eckhart stuff, panpsychism. 523 00:30:50.680 --> 00:30:54.319 Let's see Bruno mm hmm. 524 00:30:58.400 --> 00:31:05.680 Verse Giordano Reno positive the universe was infinite and populated 525 00:31:05.680 --> 00:31:08.839 with many worlds. So here is yeah, here we go, 526 00:31:08.960 --> 00:31:09.680 universe infinite. 527 00:31:10.440 --> 00:31:12.079 That's what I meant to go to the first time. 528 00:31:23.000 --> 00:31:27.480 So notice that this is coming from like by the 529 00:31:27.480 --> 00:31:33.759 Copernicus was also a neoplatonic chrometic thinker too. If the 530 00:31:33.799 --> 00:31:39.119 heavens are infinite, then the outermost regions would revolve infinitely, 531 00:31:39.160 --> 00:31:42.160 and this would be an infinitely revolving cosmos like an onion. 532 00:31:42.920 --> 00:31:45.839 It said it was an infinite homogeneous expanse popular by 533 00:31:45.880 --> 00:31:48.680 an infinite number of solar systems. So now we're getting 534 00:31:48.720 --> 00:31:53.240 to infinite worlds from these guys, right. So notice multiverse 535 00:31:53.519 --> 00:31:59.799 was always from esoteric occultic people. I'm not saying it's 536 00:31:59.799 --> 00:32:01.440 fault because of that. I'm just saying that you do 537 00:32:01.559 --> 00:32:03.559 have to know the origins of it, that it really 538 00:32:03.559 --> 00:32:05.880 has nothing to do with anything in terms of like 539 00:32:05.880 --> 00:32:11.599 biblical theology. It's literally just esoteric occulta chrometic stuff anyway. 540 00:32:11.640 --> 00:32:17.519 So let's get down to where Bruno says. But you'll 541 00:32:17.559 --> 00:32:21.440 notice that he is taking divine attributes and. 542 00:32:21.400 --> 00:32:25.400 Just smushing them into the creative order. Bruno's explanation of 543 00:32:25.400 --> 00:32:28.079 how bodies you're composed has proved outright the dominant risk 544 00:32:28.160 --> 00:32:32.160 telling view that the universe was infinitely divisible. It also 545 00:32:32.279 --> 00:32:36.519 just proved atomism. The universe is infinite and comprised of 546 00:32:36.519 --> 00:32:40.039 an infinite number of finite, indivisible atoms. So it's just 547 00:32:40.039 --> 00:32:43.119 getting it's getting pretty wild. And then it goes into 548 00:32:43.160 --> 00:32:46.799 like just straight up like full on Plato stuff, universal 549 00:32:46.839 --> 00:32:50.799 sole sole, universal matter, universal intellect. And I think it 550 00:32:50.839 --> 00:32:55.920 wasn't Bruno at the time condemned by the papacy. I 551 00:32:55.920 --> 00:33:00.960 think that's true. And then the this is the clips 552 00:33:01.000 --> 00:33:03.759 channel guy that's recently started doing clips over here. Shout 553 00:33:03.799 --> 00:33:07.440 out to him. His name's Orthodox Clips. He's used a 554 00:33:07.480 --> 00:33:09.880 bunch of mind videos. The only thing I would recommend 555 00:33:09.920 --> 00:33:11.519 is if you do start a clips channel, just please 556 00:33:11.559 --> 00:33:12.359 do link back. 557 00:33:12.240 --> 00:33:15.000 To my video. Otherwise you can do whatever. It's fine, 558 00:33:16.960 --> 00:33:17.319 all right. 559 00:33:17.680 --> 00:33:24.440 So we went down the Jordano Bruno rabbit hole. Osmotic 560 00:33:24.480 --> 00:33:26.880 twenty five dollars. Why do Protestants pray the blood of 561 00:33:26.960 --> 00:33:27.599 Christ over you? 562 00:33:27.680 --> 00:33:30.160 What does that mean? I think they just think that 563 00:33:30.200 --> 00:33:33.559 it's kind of like a like a supercharged prayer. If 564 00:33:33.599 --> 00:33:34.559 they do that right. 565 00:33:34.960 --> 00:33:44.000 I mean, I guess because the Bible does mention in 566 00:33:44.039 --> 00:33:46.160 many places the blood of Christ. But I also think 567 00:33:46.160 --> 00:33:48.720 that Protestants don't ever think about the Blood of Christ 568 00:33:48.799 --> 00:33:52.279 actually having reference to the Eucharist, like to the actual 569 00:33:52.319 --> 00:33:55.839 wine in this Like you know, when you read chapters 570 00:33:55.839 --> 00:33:58.640 in like Romans where Paul talks about, you know, baptizing 571 00:33:58.680 --> 00:34:01.480 to his death, and Paul mentions, you know, in other 572 00:34:01.519 --> 00:34:04.359 places that the blood of Christ, you know, does this 573 00:34:04.440 --> 00:34:07.079 and that, and the protest of mind that's just this 574 00:34:07.160 --> 00:34:10.079 sort of ethereal thing that you call upon, and they 575 00:34:10.079 --> 00:34:12.840 don't think about it being embodied in the actual Eucharist. 576 00:34:13.280 --> 00:34:16.199 And I think, no, Paul's actually talking about the Lord's 577 00:34:16.199 --> 00:34:19.480 Supper when he says the blood of Christ redeems you 578 00:34:19.519 --> 00:34:20.960 and all this kind of stuff, like they just think 579 00:34:21.000 --> 00:34:22.599 of it as divorced from the sacrament. 580 00:34:23.159 --> 00:34:25.679 Michale three dollars, Merry Christmas. I don't tune in much, 581 00:34:25.719 --> 00:34:27.039 but I appreciate what you do. Thank you. 582 00:34:28.119 --> 00:34:30.480 Off topic, if you looked into this character, Ammon Hillman, 583 00:34:30.599 --> 00:34:33.039 his claims are disturbing. I mean, I just kind of 584 00:34:33.039 --> 00:34:37.480 think it's so sometimes people are really out there in 585 00:34:37.519 --> 00:34:41.440 their claims that it's almost not really worth addressing, you know, 586 00:34:41.639 --> 00:34:45.719 like Jesus. Other people say, oh Jesus is a vast 587 00:34:45.800 --> 00:34:52.000 Jewish conspiracy. Really, I mean, come on, oh Jesus was 588 00:34:52.039 --> 00:34:56.400 actually gay? I mean, is it really worth It's just 589 00:34:56.480 --> 00:34:58.400 kind of crazy? Jv Free five dollars? 590 00:34:58.519 --> 00:35:02.400 Jay? Why? Jay? 591 00:35:02.920 --> 00:35:06.159 Or Jay why? I don't know what you're whying? Vane 592 00:35:06.239 --> 00:35:08.559 five dollars Merry Christmas? What do I need to read? 593 00:35:08.559 --> 00:35:14.639 The refute universalism? Well, three ecumenical councils refute Originism in Toto, 594 00:35:14.800 --> 00:35:19.440 including his entire system. At the six Ecamenical Council, the 595 00:35:19.480 --> 00:35:23.320 Confession of Saint Sophronius is a four page full refutation of. 596 00:35:23.239 --> 00:35:24.840 The entire system of origin. 597 00:35:27.079 --> 00:35:30.360 Those combinations are repeated at the seven Ecumenical Council and 598 00:35:30.440 --> 00:35:33.880 in the Sonoticon. So those things reputed, but in a 599 00:35:34.039 --> 00:35:38.719 metaphysical theological sense. David Rhan's video is still a classic 600 00:35:38.800 --> 00:35:43.800 on this topic, which is pointing out that if you 601 00:35:43.840 --> 00:35:49.639 don't have the nature person distinction in anthropology, it also leads. 602 00:35:49.440 --> 00:35:50.960 To the universalists conclusion. 603 00:35:51.000 --> 00:35:55.440 So, for example, David Bentley Hart correctly understands that when 604 00:35:55.480 --> 00:35:59.000 Christ assumes universal human nature, he's going to universally restore 605 00:35:59.119 --> 00:36:02.199 and resurrect all human nature. He then concludes that that 606 00:36:02.360 --> 00:36:05.280 must mean that all human beings are saved. No, no, no, 607 00:36:05.760 --> 00:36:07.639 it means all human beings are saving this since their 608 00:36:07.719 --> 00:36:11.719 nature is restored. But how each individual hypostasis uses that 609 00:36:11.840 --> 00:36:15.760 nature is what determines the experience of the escoton. So 610 00:36:15.920 --> 00:36:20.079 look up David Rhan and it's actually not even a 611 00:36:20.159 --> 00:36:24.039 very long video, but it's probably still a good easy 612 00:36:24.320 --> 00:36:29.400 reputation of David Bentleyheart on this point, because usually people 613 00:36:29.400 --> 00:36:32.960 are thinking of David Biley Hart when they come to 614 00:36:33.000 --> 00:36:33.639 this conclusion. 615 00:36:34.599 --> 00:36:36.840 Here it is right here, short reputation of universal. There 616 00:36:36.840 --> 00:36:41.440 are many people, and he makes the point that you 617 00:36:41.440 --> 00:36:42.360 hear me making here. 618 00:36:43.840 --> 00:37:03.360 So I'll link you that video right there. Who's debating 619 00:37:03.400 --> 00:37:03.920 in the chat? 620 00:37:03.920 --> 00:37:04.119 Here? 621 00:37:08.400 --> 00:37:10.159 Is there a Roman Catholic debating in the chat? You 622 00:37:10.159 --> 00:37:13.760 need to come on the stream dog where y'all hiding it? 623 00:37:17.039 --> 00:37:22.840 Anyway, we got a lot of we got good ninth 624 00:37:23.039 --> 00:37:26.920 twenty three people. We've never had twenty three people requesting 625 00:37:26.960 --> 00:37:30.800 to debate. That's crazy. Where did all these people? 626 00:37:31.000 --> 00:37:31.079 So? 627 00:37:31.079 --> 00:37:32.360 I guess I need if I want to really want 628 00:37:32.360 --> 00:37:34.320 people coming into debate. I didn't do it at night 629 00:37:35.639 --> 00:37:37.519 let's get some of these people at the end. David A, 630 00:37:37.760 --> 00:37:38.199 what's up? 631 00:37:43.639 --> 00:37:50.239 David? Ah, what's up? Young Newton? 632 00:37:55.280 --> 00:37:55.800 Hey day? 633 00:37:55.840 --> 00:37:56.199 What's up? 634 00:37:56.679 --> 00:37:56.880 Hey? 635 00:37:58.079 --> 00:37:58.400 Love it? 636 00:37:58.760 --> 00:38:02.599 M Uh well, I gotta I got a couple. 637 00:38:03.960 --> 00:38:07.880 Uh h, I want to thank the Maybe you know what. 638 00:38:07.840 --> 00:38:12.280 About I can't hear? Can you speak like it's super muffled? 639 00:38:14.079 --> 00:38:14.880 Can you can be better? 640 00:38:14.920 --> 00:38:15.079 Now? 641 00:38:15.840 --> 00:38:17.039 Not really? But what's the question? 642 00:38:19.039 --> 00:38:19.360 Uh? 643 00:38:19.599 --> 00:38:24.400 The question is that there are difference between. 644 00:38:24.159 --> 00:38:25.480 Rogue and. 645 00:38:27.880 --> 00:38:31.679 Yeah, So they're different jurisdictions. Ro corp is Russian Orthodoxy 646 00:38:31.760 --> 00:38:39.519 and Greek orthodox are Greek jurisdiction. So appreciate your question. Uh, Colin, 647 00:38:39.599 --> 00:38:39.960 what's up? 648 00:38:40.000 --> 00:38:40.159 Man? 649 00:38:40.559 --> 00:38:45.800 Looking for people who disagree to get it today. Guys 650 00:38:47.199 --> 00:38:52.280 mean Jeane, I'm mute. You are muted. Three dollars you're mute. Boomer, 651 00:38:52.320 --> 00:38:54.719 I'm mute, mean Jane, we can't hear you. I'm your mute. 652 00:38:55.199 --> 00:38:57.480 I'm muted, dude. One dollar. I'm mute, dude. 653 00:38:57.559 --> 00:39:03.199 Yes, I did fall prey to my own critiques because 654 00:39:03.400 --> 00:39:05.880 the stupid little button that you have to hit to 655 00:39:06.079 --> 00:39:08.159 mute when I play a video, I have to mute 656 00:39:08.199 --> 00:39:11.519 me and it does not always register when you unmute 657 00:39:11.519 --> 00:39:15.159 it because there's so many programs running that it just 658 00:39:15.239 --> 00:39:16.840 doesn't register what's up. 659 00:39:17.920 --> 00:39:23.559 Hey, Jay, I had a question about epistemology. I watched 660 00:39:23.559 --> 00:39:26.039 a couple of videos you made about it, and I 661 00:39:26.079 --> 00:39:28.679 think you were talking about like the parapateetic axiom and 662 00:39:28.719 --> 00:39:33.400 how like that is bad and like you can't like 663 00:39:33.519 --> 00:39:36.280 really know anything, and I was wondering how you like 664 00:39:36.320 --> 00:39:38.360 how the orthodox position gets around that. 665 00:39:38.920 --> 00:39:42.480 Well, the parapateetic axiom is from Aristotle and it says 666 00:39:43.159 --> 00:39:45.400 that there's nothing in the intellect that's not first in 667 00:39:45.440 --> 00:39:49.519 the senses. So I believe that a lot of things 668 00:39:49.679 --> 00:39:52.079 must be in the senses before they're in the intellect. 669 00:39:52.079 --> 00:39:54.760 But the problem with the paradetic axiom is more fundamental 670 00:39:54.760 --> 00:39:57.679 than that. It's just that if you have that paradigm, 671 00:39:57.760 --> 00:40:01.280 or if you're going to be an empiricist, the parapatetic 672 00:40:01.360 --> 00:40:05.920 axiom itself is not in sense experience, and so it's 673 00:40:05.960 --> 00:40:08.519 self refuting. So it's kind of like an empiricist who 674 00:40:08.559 --> 00:40:11.880 says that all knowledge comes from sense data, Well, how 675 00:40:11.920 --> 00:40:13.199 do you know that all knowledge. 676 00:40:12.960 --> 00:40:15.679 Comes from sense data? Because that's a universal claim which 677 00:40:15.719 --> 00:40:18.400 is not found in sense data. Does that make sense? 678 00:40:19.400 --> 00:40:23.079 Yeah, you said that, I believe that you said, like, 679 00:40:23.239 --> 00:40:26.079 your knowledge is ultimately grounded in God, can you? 680 00:40:26.559 --> 00:40:29.639 Well, yeah, but I also don't accept the belief that 681 00:40:29.800 --> 00:40:34.079 all knowledge, that everything that's in my mind was first 682 00:40:34.119 --> 00:40:36.559 in my senses. I don't believe that there's all kinds 683 00:40:36.559 --> 00:40:40.239 of things that are not in sense data that are 684 00:40:40.440 --> 00:40:46.480 that can be in the mind. Abstract concepts, love, numbers, universals. 685 00:40:46.719 --> 00:40:48.840 I mean, all of these things are not technically in 686 00:40:49.000 --> 00:40:53.199 sense data, meaning the meaning and a proposition that's not 687 00:40:53.280 --> 00:40:57.840 in sense data, that's not found in the physical God 688 00:40:58.159 --> 00:41:03.800 is not typically in the physical domain. So obviously God 689 00:41:03.880 --> 00:41:05.880 is in the intellect, but he's not in the sense 690 00:41:06.199 --> 00:41:07.880 You see how this goes along with tomism, right, and 691 00:41:07.960 --> 00:41:14.679 tomism You know God by the creative effects. Well, God 692 00:41:14.760 --> 00:41:16.239 is not in my immediate sense. 693 00:41:16.119 --> 00:41:19.880 Data, so how is he in my intellect? 694 00:41:20.880 --> 00:41:21.199 Okay? 695 00:41:21.360 --> 00:41:24.159 I like, I definitely, I'm just not understanding. 696 00:41:25.039 --> 00:41:26.880 I will try to watch more of your videos and stuff. 697 00:41:27.519 --> 00:41:28.880 Hold on, So what are you not understanding? 698 00:41:31.119 --> 00:41:33.320 I don't understand how you. 699 00:41:35.199 --> 00:41:39.880 Like get to knowing God exists without your using your 700 00:41:39.880 --> 00:41:42.800 sense data, Like, I know he doesn't first. 701 00:41:42.320 --> 00:41:45.119 But that's not what I'm doing. So I'm not getting 702 00:41:45.199 --> 00:41:52.079 to God without sense data. It's rather that empiricist approaches 703 00:41:52.519 --> 00:41:55.519 don't work to prove the thing that they're trying to prove. 704 00:41:56.280 --> 00:41:59.960 So I'm happy with saying that everything in sense data. 705 00:41:59.760 --> 00:42:01.599 Point to and testifies to God. 706 00:42:02.000 --> 00:42:05.320 But that's not what the empiricist or a parapatetic axiom 707 00:42:05.400 --> 00:42:10.199 is trying to say. It's starting from a finite human 708 00:42:10.280 --> 00:42:15.480 perspective and then trying to say that anything that I 709 00:42:15.599 --> 00:42:18.559 know or that's in my mind has to first be 710 00:42:18.719 --> 00:42:19.599 in sense data. 711 00:42:20.280 --> 00:42:22.119 And I'm saying we don't even have to go to. 712 00:42:22.159 --> 00:42:25.000 Theology in God's existence to show that that's not true, 713 00:42:25.559 --> 00:42:29.199 because just the proposition itself is not in sense data. 714 00:42:29.480 --> 00:42:32.159 The parapatetic axiom itself is not in sense data, so 715 00:42:32.280 --> 00:42:36.920 it's self refuting as a starting point for epistemology. So 716 00:42:37.679 --> 00:42:41.039 Thomass thought that it was a good idea to use 717 00:42:41.079 --> 00:42:45.119 Aristotle as a starting point for religious epistemology, and I'm 718 00:42:45.119 --> 00:42:46.039 just pointing out why. 719 00:42:45.840 --> 00:42:46.480 That doesn't work. 720 00:42:46.519 --> 00:42:49.719 So if I'm an Orthodox person, I can use insights 721 00:42:49.719 --> 00:42:51.199 from Aristotle or from whoever. 722 00:42:51.599 --> 00:42:52.280 I'm not going to. 723 00:42:52.239 --> 00:42:56.840 Adopt an Aristotelian epistemology as the first starting point for 724 00:42:56.960 --> 00:42:57.880 my theology. 725 00:42:58.000 --> 00:42:58.880 That's the stupid thing. 726 00:43:00.360 --> 00:43:04.880 Okay, and I have one last question, sure, Like with 727 00:43:05.199 --> 00:43:10.280 your pismology, how do you know that what you're experiencing 728 00:43:10.320 --> 00:43:12.039 around you is real? 729 00:43:12.280 --> 00:43:15.519 Like that the external world is actually real? 730 00:43:17.079 --> 00:43:19.960 Well, I'm not an empiricist, so I don't begin my 731 00:43:21.239 --> 00:43:24.199 worldview or my belief system from my immediate sense data. 732 00:43:24.280 --> 00:43:25.039 If I was an. 733 00:43:24.960 --> 00:43:28.960 Empiricist, I would end up in a David Humian's skeptical 734 00:43:29.000 --> 00:43:33.079 type of position, where I couldn't necessarily know with justificable 735 00:43:33.119 --> 00:43:36.599 with justified true belief certitude, that the external world exists, 736 00:43:36.719 --> 00:43:40.039 or that the past exists, or that objects of identity 737 00:43:40.039 --> 00:43:42.880 over time, all of those things would be very difficult 738 00:43:42.960 --> 00:43:45.440 or impossible for me to know or prove. But as 739 00:43:45.519 --> 00:43:50.559 Orthodox Christians, we are not empiricists as a school of thought, 740 00:43:50.800 --> 00:43:54.599 So there's not a problem with empirical sense data. But 741 00:43:54.679 --> 00:43:59.599 my theology, my worldview does not begin with mere sense data. 742 00:44:00.239 --> 00:44:03.239 I begin with divine revelation and the totality of that 743 00:44:03.440 --> 00:44:07.719 worldview as my presupposition. That's what grounds my belief that 744 00:44:08.320 --> 00:44:11.159 God has made a world where my senses are generally 745 00:44:11.159 --> 00:44:14.400 speaking reliable, and so I don't have good reason to. 746 00:44:14.440 --> 00:44:16.599 Doubt the external world and I have good. 747 00:44:16.440 --> 00:44:18.840 Warrant to believe that there is an external world based 748 00:44:18.880 --> 00:44:22.760 on God's promises to my providence, the metaphysical structure of 749 00:44:22.760 --> 00:44:25.079 the world, etcetera. All those things are the reasons I 750 00:44:25.079 --> 00:44:28.639 would believe in the external world. And precisely because I'm 751 00:44:28.679 --> 00:44:32.559 not a naive empiricist, would I be in some sort 752 00:44:32.559 --> 00:44:33.480 of skeptical trap. 753 00:44:35.159 --> 00:44:36.599 Okay, thank you. I appreciate that. 754 00:44:36.679 --> 00:44:39.119 I think I understand more and I want to say 755 00:44:39.199 --> 00:44:41.519 thank you. I used to be a project for a 756 00:44:41.559 --> 00:44:46.119 long time, and your videos on like the transcendental argument 757 00:44:47.119 --> 00:44:50.119 in like other church history things made me like I'm 758 00:44:50.199 --> 00:44:50.920 converting right now. 759 00:44:50.920 --> 00:44:52.119 I'm in the catechumen process. 760 00:44:52.679 --> 00:44:53.199 That's great. 761 00:44:53.639 --> 00:44:55.360 I would say if you're looking for a good readable 762 00:44:55.360 --> 00:45:00.000 book on just that topic specifically, not so much theology, 763 00:45:00.239 --> 00:45:06.800 but the WJ. Woodbook Epistemology Becoming Intellectually Virtuous. This book, 764 00:45:07.119 --> 00:45:10.519 it's a really really good book that's very readable and 765 00:45:10.599 --> 00:45:13.400 from a Christian perspective on epistemology. 766 00:45:13.440 --> 00:45:16.360 So I would recommend checking out that book. Nikki, what's 767 00:45:16.440 --> 00:45:16.760 up man? 768 00:45:24.639 --> 00:45:25.400 Hey Jay? 769 00:45:25.400 --> 00:45:25.960 Can you hear me? 770 00:45:28.079 --> 00:45:28.920 Yeah? 771 00:45:28.960 --> 00:45:31.800 I kind of want to talk about philosophy, religion, science, 772 00:45:32.119 --> 00:45:36.000 constitutional republic. And then I thought I might hit on 773 00:45:36.039 --> 00:45:38.960 a few of the rejections as science that you've been 774 00:45:39.000 --> 00:45:40.159 going through, and. 775 00:45:40.159 --> 00:45:41.159 Actually some of it. 776 00:45:41.280 --> 00:45:43.840 If you would not reject science, it could actually further 777 00:45:44.000 --> 00:45:48.199 your cause. So I guess we could start there. I'll 778 00:45:48.199 --> 00:45:50.119 just go straight on to it on. 779 00:45:50.159 --> 00:45:53.159 So, first of all, I don't, strictly speaking quote reject science. 780 00:45:53.880 --> 00:45:56.360 I made some posts and made some jokes about how 781 00:45:56.400 --> 00:45:58.559 I don't believe in science. That was a joke, But 782 00:45:58.960 --> 00:46:02.480 I do believe that the scientific method does enable human 783 00:46:02.480 --> 00:46:06.079 beings to hypothesize and master and learn the natural world, 784 00:46:06.159 --> 00:46:09.000 and that they can create refrigerators and computers. 785 00:46:08.800 --> 00:46:09.760 Based on science. 786 00:46:10.159 --> 00:46:15.079 I think science is properly speaking, things like engineering. But 787 00:46:15.199 --> 00:46:18.840 I don't believe that everything that quotes science in terms 788 00:46:18.840 --> 00:46:23.159 of some academic exercise at the top, people like at 789 00:46:23.159 --> 00:46:28.719 the Lancet or Harvard, that climate science and gender science, 790 00:46:28.760 --> 00:46:31.280 like all the things that are now called science, I'm 791 00:46:31.320 --> 00:46:33.480 generally skeptical of. So you need to be more precise 792 00:46:33.559 --> 00:46:35.639 and exactly what you think I'm rejecting. 793 00:46:36.239 --> 00:46:38.440 Okay, so first of all, I agree with you. 794 00:46:38.519 --> 00:46:41.039 I think there's a lot of Gaelian dialectics out there, 795 00:46:41.039 --> 00:46:43.320 and I think one of them is that religion is 796 00:46:43.360 --> 00:46:47.079 separate from science. I think if you operate with I 797 00:46:47.079 --> 00:46:50.000 think you can learn from the empiricists, the rationalist and 798 00:46:50.039 --> 00:46:55.800 the Enlightenment thinkers with the same presupposition that there is 799 00:46:56.360 --> 00:46:59.119 divine providence and a divine revelation. 800 00:47:00.159 --> 00:47:02.239 So then you can use I don't disagree with any 801 00:47:02.239 --> 00:47:02.440 of that. 802 00:47:03.119 --> 00:47:06.199 Yeah, then you can use those as secular tools that 803 00:47:06.360 --> 00:47:10.119 reveal what the creation is and how it's created, you know, 804 00:47:10.199 --> 00:47:10.679 et cetera. 805 00:47:11.199 --> 00:47:13.159 Well, so when you say divine revelation, what are you 806 00:47:13.199 --> 00:47:14.239 referring to it? What does that mean? 807 00:47:15.599 --> 00:47:18.000 Well, I mean, you know a lot of people point 808 00:47:18.039 --> 00:47:21.960 to things like sacred geometry, the Fibonacci sequence. 809 00:47:22.320 --> 00:47:23.880 Are you a Mason? Are you a free Mason. 810 00:47:25.920 --> 00:47:27.159 I've never been in a temple. 811 00:47:27.199 --> 00:47:29.119 I've read a lot of manly Palmer Hall, I've read 812 00:47:29.199 --> 00:47:30.199 all kinds of stuff. 813 00:47:30.320 --> 00:47:31.880 So what you're. 814 00:47:31.760 --> 00:47:34.280 Giving is kind of like a Masonic perspective. 815 00:47:33.800 --> 00:47:38.920 Right, it's influenced by that. Sure, Yeah, I'll confess to that. 816 00:47:39.519 --> 00:47:39.840 Yeah. 817 00:47:39.880 --> 00:47:44.039 So I don't deny that there's sacred geometry or any 818 00:47:44.039 --> 00:47:45.920 of that. But I mean I think that the problem 819 00:47:45.920 --> 00:47:47.639 I would have with that kind of take is like 820 00:47:48.039 --> 00:47:51.239 that ends up really just being deism and no. 821 00:47:51.360 --> 00:47:54.679 Clear idea as to what the divine revelation is. 822 00:47:55.360 --> 00:47:58.199 So, you know, if I read Morals and Dogma, you know, 823 00:47:58.760 --> 00:48:01.840 Albert Pike says, basically, all the religions are kind of 824 00:48:02.320 --> 00:48:05.960 generic revelation, and really they're teaching you the secret principles 825 00:48:06.000 --> 00:48:11.519 of geometry, and ultimately it's neoplatonism. And so basically it's 826 00:48:11.599 --> 00:48:13.079 not really any divine revelation. 827 00:48:13.159 --> 00:48:16.719 It's just deism agnosticism. 828 00:48:16.760 --> 00:48:19.800 And if we're at the point of like deism, that's 829 00:48:20.079 --> 00:48:24.039 a logical step before atheism. So why what do you 830 00:48:24.079 --> 00:48:26.320 even mean by divine revelation? There's no content to that. 831 00:48:28.280 --> 00:48:31.360 Well, I have not read Albert Pike's Morals and Dogma, 832 00:48:31.559 --> 00:48:33.599 but I've read a lot of other texts, so I 833 00:48:33.639 --> 00:48:34.440 can't speak on that. 834 00:48:34.559 --> 00:48:36.280 Well, Well, I mean I would imagine Maley Palmer. 835 00:48:36.320 --> 00:48:37.960 I mean I've read some Maley Pee Hall, and I 836 00:48:38.000 --> 00:48:40.480 mean he, you know, in Secret Teaching, he basically says 837 00:48:40.559 --> 00:48:42.719 kind of the same type of stuff as Albert Pike. 838 00:48:42.920 --> 00:48:46.639 So, I mean I read a lectures on Ancient Philosophy. 839 00:48:46.679 --> 00:48:48.960 I didn't read The Secret Teachings of All Ages. I 840 00:48:49.000 --> 00:48:52.719 read the companion book to it, Lectures on Ancient Philosophy. 841 00:48:52.719 --> 00:48:56.599 Okay, anyway, whatever they think. The point is just that, like, 842 00:48:56.719 --> 00:48:58.480 what does it even mean to stay divine revelation? 843 00:49:02.199 --> 00:49:04.880 Well, I guess what I'm referring to when I say 844 00:49:04.880 --> 00:49:07.480 that right now is I'm speaking of you know, when 845 00:49:07.519 --> 00:49:10.360 you talk about physics and geology and stuff. Let's go 846 00:49:10.440 --> 00:49:13.239 back to Gabriel's question for a second. Is the world 847 00:49:13.320 --> 00:49:16.039 old or new? It's like, why not both? And so 848 00:49:16.239 --> 00:49:18.719 what I mean by that is, you know, we as humans, 849 00:49:18.719 --> 00:49:22.719 we're operating with either a geocentric or a heliocentric worldview. 850 00:49:22.760 --> 00:49:23.320 But who's to. 851 00:49:23.280 --> 00:49:25.800 Say God is you know, we at least know there's 852 00:49:25.840 --> 00:49:29.039 a galaxy and a universe. And then who's to say that, 853 00:49:29.400 --> 00:49:31.840 you know, if there is a heaven, which you know, 854 00:49:31.880 --> 00:49:34.000 when they talk about a heaven, it's like, who's to 855 00:49:34.000 --> 00:49:37.440 say there's not a warden of this universe Jesus or 856 00:49:37.599 --> 00:49:41.400 you know, God or something that that decides whether or 857 00:49:41.440 --> 00:49:42.840 not you can go to heaven? And so what if 858 00:49:42.840 --> 00:49:46.800 heaven is the multiverse where you you understand the laws 859 00:49:46.840 --> 00:49:50.199 of natural law and you have to apply to principles 860 00:49:50.239 --> 00:49:56.760 of natural law. And maybe maybe there's also people you know, 861 00:49:56.840 --> 00:50:02.119 with informed consent, maybe you know they can visit each 862 00:50:02.119 --> 00:50:02.760 other in heaven. 863 00:50:02.800 --> 00:50:03.159 I don't know. 864 00:50:03.280 --> 00:50:04.039 I don't really know. 865 00:50:03.960 --> 00:50:05.000 What what. 866 00:50:08.840 --> 00:50:09.760 I'm talking about is. 867 00:50:10.440 --> 00:50:13.599 Like, all these different denominations of Christianity are very confusing 868 00:50:13.639 --> 00:50:16.079 to me on what their worldview of the afterlife is. 869 00:50:16.119 --> 00:50:17.119 I don't even know what it is. 870 00:50:17.159 --> 00:50:19.000 And most of them are just making stuff up. 871 00:50:19.079 --> 00:50:26.480 And That's what I'm talking about, Okay, Like, look, I agree. 872 00:50:26.679 --> 00:50:33.519 In the multiverse, the Demiurge is Tattoo from Fantasy Island, 873 00:50:34.159 --> 00:50:37.719 and he determines whether or not you have informed consent 874 00:50:37.840 --> 00:50:41.199 to talk to your loved ones. Again, go watch Contact. 875 00:50:41.719 --> 00:50:43.320 When Jodie Foster goes. 876 00:50:43.079 --> 00:50:48.320 Into the atheist alien space Heaven, she talks to her dad, 877 00:50:48.880 --> 00:50:53.119 but that was only with the informed consent of Tattoo 878 00:50:53.519 --> 00:50:54.480 from Fantasy Island. 879 00:50:55.039 --> 00:51:00.840 He is the Demiurge, Alex, what's up? It's not the plane, 880 00:51:00.840 --> 00:51:03.440 the plane, it's the ship. The ship. It's the spaceship 881 00:51:03.960 --> 00:51:06.760 us this ship, this ship? What's up? Man? 882 00:51:09.280 --> 00:51:09.920 Hey, Jake. 883 00:51:11.360 --> 00:51:12.119 Uh So? 884 00:51:13.199 --> 00:51:14.400 Through watching the stream. 885 00:51:14.159 --> 00:51:17.039 Tonight, I I just have a quick question. 886 00:51:18.000 --> 00:51:20.440 Sorry if this comes off a little silly, but I 887 00:51:20.480 --> 00:51:23.480 just genuinely want to know, what do you think the 888 00:51:23.519 --> 00:51:29.360 compatibility of being an orthodox Christian living in Bitcoin island. 889 00:51:30.280 --> 00:51:33.320 How would that be feasible? Like, I don't think do 890 00:51:33.360 --> 00:51:34.920 you think they would include. 891 00:51:34.519 --> 00:51:37.360 An Orthodox church on the Bitcoin island, Like, how would 892 00:51:37.360 --> 00:51:41.360 you go about doing Orthodox you know, faith, you know, 893 00:51:41.480 --> 00:51:42.760 how would you go about doing that. 894 00:51:42.719 --> 00:51:48.039 On the Bitcoin I guess is gonna be a bitcoin state. 895 00:51:48.119 --> 00:51:50.599 I'm sure that there could be an Orthodox church and 896 00:51:50.639 --> 00:51:53.159 a like why would those things be incompatible? 897 00:51:54.599 --> 00:51:58.119 Because the first thing when I think about bitcoin, just 898 00:51:58.280 --> 00:52:02.599 bitcoin things related and like bitcoin communities whatever, I don't 899 00:52:02.639 --> 00:52:05.079 think they're like Orthodox first, you know, I really don't 900 00:52:05.079 --> 00:52:06.360 think they would carry if there's an. 901 00:52:06.679 --> 00:52:08.119 America is not Orthodox first? 902 00:52:08.800 --> 00:52:11.800 Well no, no, no country except for maybe one or 903 00:52:11.840 --> 00:52:14.679 two at least on paper, is Orthodox first. 904 00:52:14.760 --> 00:52:19.000 So so then do you don't you think there's like 905 00:52:19.119 --> 00:52:22.079 a path or there's like a there's gonna be a 906 00:52:22.400 --> 00:52:23.920 come a point where you're just gonna have to give 907 00:52:24.039 --> 00:52:27.559 up on the whole thing of living in a bitcoin civilization, right, Like, 908 00:52:27.880 --> 00:52:30.320 don't you think at some point it's going to become unfeasible? 909 00:52:30.599 --> 00:52:34.039 You know, like this idea of well. 910 00:52:33.880 --> 00:52:36.159 I don't know what I mean, the you know, we 911 00:52:36.239 --> 00:52:38.320 could all die tomorrow and there could be into the 912 00:52:38.360 --> 00:52:40.199 world tomorrow. So yeah, I don't know, but I mean, 913 00:52:40.239 --> 00:52:42.800 there might be another two thousand and five thousand. 914 00:52:42.599 --> 00:52:45.760 Years left of the earth. So since we don't know, like, 915 00:52:47.519 --> 00:52:50.000 how is that just how is that a defeat for 916 00:52:50.880 --> 00:52:51.360 why a. 917 00:52:53.440 --> 00:52:58.639 Libertarian fantasy island, bigcoin island wouldn't work. I mean, I mean, 918 00:52:58.960 --> 00:53:04.039 America hold on America is a worse scenario than say, 919 00:53:04.119 --> 00:53:08.320 Bitcoin island for hypothetical purposes. Here, America is far more 920 00:53:09.400 --> 00:53:13.440 anti Orthodoxy being first than Bitcoin island would be. 921 00:53:13.639 --> 00:53:16.239 So I don't understand the argument. 922 00:53:17.760 --> 00:53:19.519 No, it wasn't really an argument. 923 00:53:19.559 --> 00:53:21.880 I was just wondering, you know, like how someone of 924 00:53:22.039 --> 00:53:26.159 orthodox or really any religion from any standpoint, honestly, like, 925 00:53:26.280 --> 00:53:28.800 how they could live in one of those communities, because 926 00:53:28.800 --> 00:53:31.960 I don't think any sort of bitcoin community would really 927 00:53:32.000 --> 00:53:33.880 even care about religion, honestly, I don't. 928 00:53:33.920 --> 00:53:35.679 I think they would eventually become like. 929 00:53:36.000 --> 00:53:37.519 Just come to the point where we don't even need religion, 930 00:53:37.559 --> 00:53:39.760 you know, we're just we're just a bitcoin community, and 931 00:53:39.880 --> 00:53:42.159 they might just become like some kind of weird bitcoin cult, 932 00:53:42.199 --> 00:53:42.679 you know what I mean. 933 00:53:42.800 --> 00:53:43.719 Well, that could happen. 934 00:53:44.280 --> 00:53:47.760 But again, if bitcoin becomes like let's say, for the 935 00:53:47.800 --> 00:53:51.159 sake of argument, it becomes like the future currency or 936 00:53:51.559 --> 00:53:55.519 world reserve currency or whatever. Like would that mean that 937 00:53:55.960 --> 00:54:01.199 that Orthodoxy goes away because there's a new currency, or or. 938 00:54:01.159 --> 00:54:05.719 Would Orthodox he uh create their own bitcoin infused community. 939 00:54:05.719 --> 00:54:10.039 Do you think that could be something that could happen. Well, yeah, yeah, 940 00:54:12.159 --> 00:54:15.800 think bitcoin island is only for U or Orthodox. 941 00:54:15.480 --> 00:54:19.440 Well actually on the libertarian ethos, yeah, that would be 942 00:54:19.760 --> 00:54:21.599 entirely They would have to argue that they would have 943 00:54:21.679 --> 00:54:25.199 to argue that Orthodox could set up their island of 944 00:54:25.639 --> 00:54:29.920 uh you know, Orthodox fantasy island that runs on bitcoin. 945 00:54:30.360 --> 00:54:33.559 Sure, sorry, this is another silly thing to say too, 946 00:54:33.679 --> 00:54:35.840 but like do you think do you think Jesus would 947 00:54:35.880 --> 00:54:39.159 approve of Like, yes, I want I want my Orthodox 948 00:54:39.239 --> 00:54:41.840 community to you know, have bitcoin, Like I don't know, 949 00:54:41.880 --> 00:54:43.880 it sounds stupid, but like you's trying to say, like 950 00:54:44.199 --> 00:54:46.760 you think Jesus would be cool with like the whole bitcoin. 951 00:54:46.480 --> 00:54:47.239 Structure and all that. 952 00:54:48.039 --> 00:54:53.280 Well, given that it's the opposite of debt based slave money. Yes, 953 00:54:53.480 --> 00:54:55.679 in fact, it's better than gold. I mean the Bible 954 00:54:55.760 --> 00:54:59.159 says to use fair weights and measures, which means that 955 00:54:59.239 --> 00:55:03.519 you don't rip off with monetary transactions and proverbs. That's 956 00:55:03.559 --> 00:55:05.079 the entire purpose of big one. 957 00:55:06.199 --> 00:55:08.480 All right, well, thank you very much, Sae, appreciate your time. 958 00:55:09.599 --> 00:55:13.000 Yeah, I mean every not you, but every objection that 959 00:55:13.079 --> 00:55:18.400 people have turns ten times worse on Fiat currency. So 960 00:55:18.920 --> 00:55:20.760 I want to see if people really believe the stuff 961 00:55:20.800 --> 00:55:22.480 they're saying. Then I want to see you guys like 962 00:55:22.599 --> 00:55:25.599 totally not using fiat because it's like ten times worse 963 00:55:25.639 --> 00:55:29.679 with fiat. And by the way, if you read the scriptures, 964 00:55:30.199 --> 00:55:33.360 it does not ever say that money itself is evil. 965 00:55:34.920 --> 00:55:38.079 It doesn't say gold itself is evil. It says that 966 00:55:38.599 --> 00:55:43.280 unjust weights and measures, and you know, enslaving people with 967 00:55:43.440 --> 00:55:49.119 usury is what's evil. So that presupposes that we ought 968 00:55:49.280 --> 00:55:52.599 to be just in our transactions. And take, for example, 969 00:55:52.800 --> 00:55:55.880 the first thousand years of Christianity had, as everyone knows, 970 00:55:55.960 --> 00:56:01.480 both East and West, prohibition on Christians using usury. That 971 00:56:01.679 --> 00:56:04.679 right there shows you that the Church told and spoke 972 00:56:04.760 --> 00:56:08.280 to the culture that you weren't supposed to engage in 973 00:56:08.679 --> 00:56:13.800 those types of money abusive scenarios. So the idea that 974 00:56:14.000 --> 00:56:16.360 like Jesus has nothing to do with the political order 975 00:56:16.480 --> 00:56:18.800 or this kind of stuff that's all like weird Protestant 976 00:56:18.840 --> 00:56:19.800 gnostic type stuff. 977 00:56:21.159 --> 00:56:26.840 Uh, pepe, what's up, hatty? 978 00:56:26.960 --> 00:56:31.559 Hattie that was abrupt, So yeah, I get just sort 979 00:56:31.559 --> 00:56:34.159 of joined the conversation. So, uh, sticking on the theme 980 00:56:34.199 --> 00:56:36.280 of bitcoin, what if what if Trump all of a 981 00:56:36.320 --> 00:56:39.360 sudden decided to accept bitcoin or doge and we were 982 00:56:39.400 --> 00:56:41.719 able to circumvent the Fed because you've got to figure 983 00:56:41.760 --> 00:56:45.760 England wanted to force the US colonies to use the 984 00:56:45.800 --> 00:56:49.239 pound sterling an interest and we were like, I screw that, 985 00:56:49.360 --> 00:56:49.960 We're done here. 986 00:56:50.280 --> 00:56:51.360 And then the FED does it. 987 00:56:51.440 --> 00:56:54.599 Everyone's like, oh, yeah, that sounds good, So like it's 988 00:56:55.079 --> 00:56:58.280 it's kind of goofy. And then like on the actual 989 00:56:58.519 --> 00:57:01.039 theme of the thing, one thing I can never get 990 00:57:01.039 --> 00:57:03.800 an answer on is why do people believe the Old 991 00:57:03.880 --> 00:57:06.480 Testament just like by itself. 992 00:57:08.480 --> 00:57:11.880 Well, well, to answer the first question, the question was 993 00:57:12.440 --> 00:57:19.400 if Trump is pro bitcoin and crypto, could its go 994 00:57:19.639 --> 00:57:21.440 around or subvert the Federal Reserve? 995 00:57:22.639 --> 00:57:23.719 I mean, I think the Federal. 996 00:57:23.519 --> 00:57:28.079 Reserve is kind of connected to the old legacy fiat system. 997 00:57:28.199 --> 00:57:31.400 It's really the embodiment of that. I think that old 998 00:57:31.400 --> 00:57:35.119 system is eventually dying, so if the dollar is to survive, 999 00:57:35.360 --> 00:57:37.440 it's going to have to in some. 1000 00:57:37.639 --> 00:57:42.079 Way you marry bitcoin. However, they do this with strategic 1001 00:57:42.159 --> 00:57:43.360 reserve or whatever. 1002 00:57:43.400 --> 00:57:43.599 They do. 1003 00:57:43.719 --> 00:57:49.119 I don't know. I think that's the only lifeline for 1004 00:57:49.400 --> 00:57:53.679 the dollar. As for the Old Testament, I mean, one. 1005 00:57:53.760 --> 00:57:56.679 Reason that many people believe it is that it had 1006 00:57:56.800 --> 00:57:59.679 so many prophecies of the time of Christ's birth that 1007 00:57:59.719 --> 00:58:02.360 were accurate, as well as his life, ministry and what 1008 00:58:02.360 --> 00:58:03.320 would happen afterwards. 1009 00:58:06.199 --> 00:58:08.519 Well yeah, but that's especially if you look at it 1010 00:58:08.559 --> 00:58:11.079 through the lens of apologetics, and like that is like 1011 00:58:11.159 --> 00:58:12.000 the most common thing. 1012 00:58:12.039 --> 00:58:12.480 I figure. 1013 00:58:12.519 --> 00:58:14.639 It's like, well, I like this one book, so by 1014 00:58:14.719 --> 00:58:19.119 default I have to like this other book. But it's 1015 00:58:19.199 --> 00:58:22.119 kind of strange, like the variations and how much people 1016 00:58:22.239 --> 00:58:25.000 really believe it. So like I'll talk to a rabbi 1017 00:58:25.079 --> 00:58:27.119 and he'll be like, yeah, you know, it's just important 1018 00:58:27.159 --> 00:58:31.599 cultural stories. A lot of it is historical fiction, a 1019 00:58:31.679 --> 00:58:33.519 lot of it's not to be taken literally. And then 1020 00:58:33.559 --> 00:58:37.320 you got like the infallibilists and the literalists and they're like, no, 1021 00:58:37.519 --> 00:58:41.800 every single word actually happened, Jodah and the belly. Like 1022 00:58:43.559 --> 00:58:46.199 it's just like if people were to isolate just the 1023 00:58:46.280 --> 00:58:52.760 Old Testament without the Jesus parts, like cause there are 1024 00:58:52.840 --> 00:58:55.760 still Jews, but it's like I don't even know why, 1025 00:58:56.079 --> 00:59:00.960 Like I was people tell me I'm Jewish because birth things. 1026 00:59:01.360 --> 00:59:05.960 But yeah, I still I don't even believe the Old Testament, 1027 00:59:06.000 --> 00:59:07.119 so I can't believe the New Testament. 1028 00:59:07.159 --> 00:59:10.360 Well, I mean most most right, Well, and actually most 1029 00:59:10.480 --> 00:59:13.519 Jews don't actually believe the Old Testament. They believe, if 1030 00:59:13.559 --> 00:59:17.480 they're serious, they believe the Talmud, which takes precedence over 1031 00:59:18.360 --> 00:59:21.400 the Old Testament. But I'm saying that in general, outside 1032 00:59:21.400 --> 00:59:25.440 of Judaism, the reason people would believe that the Old 1033 00:59:25.440 --> 00:59:30.239 Testament profits or profits is because of many precise predictions 1034 00:59:30.280 --> 00:59:31.360 about Christ himself. 1035 00:59:31.519 --> 00:59:32.800 So not. 1036 00:59:34.880 --> 00:59:37.599 Like one or two things, but many, many, many, many 1037 00:59:37.679 --> 00:59:52.039 many predictions. Daniel, what's up? Starting to get a headache? 1038 00:59:52.039 --> 00:59:54.159 So I'm I mean, I'm gonna keep going because we've 1039 00:59:54.159 --> 00:59:57.920 still got twenty one people requesting to debate. That's crazy, 1040 01:00:00.440 --> 01:00:00.840 are you there? 1041 01:00:00.920 --> 01:00:01.039 Man? 1042 01:00:01.079 --> 01:00:06.239 What's up? Christian? Three dollars? Jay? 1043 01:00:06.280 --> 01:00:08.960 I was thinking about Protestants. My church is Wesley and 1044 01:00:09.000 --> 01:00:12.719 I'm blown away by the spirit moving in my church. 1045 01:00:15.000 --> 01:00:17.119 I mean, that's kind of subjective. I don't know what 1046 01:00:17.280 --> 01:00:21.400 you mean. Like, so like some bum comes in and 1047 01:00:21.559 --> 01:00:23.599 decides he wants to enter AA. 1048 01:00:23.679 --> 01:00:24.000 Like is that? 1049 01:00:24.119 --> 01:00:26.679 I mean, I don't know what that means. I know 1050 01:00:27.079 --> 01:00:32.880 many go too far, but I don't think all yeah, 1051 01:00:32.920 --> 01:00:34.960 but I just I still don't think that what you're 1052 01:00:35.039 --> 01:00:35.559 calling the. 1053 01:00:35.599 --> 01:00:39.440 Movements of the Holy Spirit necessarily quote prove that the 1054 01:00:39.719 --> 01:00:43.480 Methodists or the Church. I mean, I could be at 1055 01:00:43.559 --> 01:00:46.480 AA and a dude come in and like, you know, 1056 01:00:47.840 --> 01:00:49.880 he wants to quit drinking or whatever, and that's a 1057 01:00:49.920 --> 01:00:52.079 good thing. But I wouldn't say that, oh cee AA 1058 01:00:52.239 --> 01:00:53.880 is the true Church because look at look at the 1059 01:00:53.920 --> 01:00:56.239 positive effect. It's just not enough to say what the 1060 01:00:56.280 --> 01:00:59.119 true church is. Agent zero five dollars work as safe 1061 01:00:59.119 --> 01:01:01.159 for a I watch a lot of boomers buy artificial 1062 01:01:01.199 --> 01:01:04.320 foods all day long. Boomers love fake food. Uh yeah, 1063 01:01:04.920 --> 01:01:06.960 something about it. By the way, what do you think 1064 01:01:07.000 --> 01:01:08.880 of dark journalists? He was on info Wars a couple 1065 01:01:08.920 --> 01:01:11.000 of times. He seems like a morn to me, no 1066 01:01:11.079 --> 01:01:15.199 respect to AJ. I met dark journalist. The first time 1067 01:01:15.239 --> 01:01:15.559 I ever. 1068 01:01:15.480 --> 01:01:18.159 Did a speaking engagement was at a. 1069 01:01:19.679 --> 01:01:22.639 Secret it's called the Secret Space Program. Of course, I 1070 01:01:22.760 --> 01:01:24.760 was just there to talk about movies. You can still 1071 01:01:24.800 --> 01:01:26.880 watch that video on YouTube. 1072 01:01:26.880 --> 01:01:27.559 It's called. 1073 01:01:29.079 --> 01:01:32.079 It's like Esoteric Hollywood or something. It's like the first 1074 01:01:32.159 --> 01:01:35.920 presentation that I'm doing with slides behind me from like 1075 01:01:36.000 --> 01:01:38.440 twenty fourteen or fifteen, that's when I did. 1076 01:01:38.440 --> 01:01:41.320 It might be uploaded later. But he was a nice 1077 01:01:41.360 --> 01:01:42.000 guy in person. 1078 01:01:42.199 --> 01:01:44.519 We didn't really spend much time talking, so I don't 1079 01:01:44.840 --> 01:01:46.199 I never really heard his views. 1080 01:01:47.679 --> 01:01:49.280 I heard about half. 1081 01:01:49.199 --> 01:01:50.920 Of the interview that he did the other day with AJ, 1082 01:01:51.199 --> 01:01:53.280 so I don't know enough about his positions. 1083 01:01:53.400 --> 01:01:56.519 But does he believe in aliens? 1084 01:01:56.519 --> 01:01:59.880 I'm not even sure what his views Jacob ten dollars. 1085 01:02:00.360 --> 01:02:02.599 My family and I were received Orthodoxy after I grew 1086 01:02:02.599 --> 01:02:04.239 at Roman Catholic I was then a set of a 1087 01:02:04.280 --> 01:02:06.880 contest for a time at same situation here. Glad to 1088 01:02:06.880 --> 01:02:09.119 hear that, Jacob, I can't thank you enough for your work. 1089 01:02:09.159 --> 01:02:09.679 Thank you so much. 1090 01:02:09.719 --> 01:02:09.840 Man. 1091 01:02:09.920 --> 01:02:12.199 Glad to hear that. I think you're gonna find it 1092 01:02:12.519 --> 01:02:13.239 a much more. 1093 01:02:14.760 --> 01:02:20.000 Peaceful, freeing situation than the trad crazy, trad cat world. Now, 1094 01:02:20.400 --> 01:02:24.000 everybody should keep in mind like the Orthodox world is 1095 01:02:24.119 --> 01:02:25.519 not problem free. 1096 01:02:26.559 --> 01:02:27.159 There's a lot of. 1097 01:02:28.960 --> 01:02:33.559 Annoying people in the Orthodox world. You're gonna meet priests 1098 01:02:33.679 --> 01:02:36.119 that will make you mad, You're gonna meet bishops that 1099 01:02:36.320 --> 01:02:37.960 let you down. I mean that you're gonna have bad 1100 01:02:38.000 --> 01:02:40.679 experiences in the Orthodox world too. So everybody should be 1101 01:02:40.719 --> 01:02:46.880 aware that you're not escaping problems by becoming Orthodox. It's 1102 01:02:46.920 --> 01:02:49.320 just different problems, right, So like the problems in the 1103 01:02:49.400 --> 01:02:52.639 Roman Catholic world, this many many years removed from that, 1104 01:02:54.239 --> 01:02:56.360 so I kind of don't even remember what that was 1105 01:02:56.519 --> 01:03:00.800 like anymore. But I would ever go back to the 1106 01:03:00.920 --> 01:03:03.440 Romancolic position ever. But you know, it's not like you're 1107 01:03:03.480 --> 01:03:06.280 gonna because you're still dealing with human beings, so you're 1108 01:03:06.320 --> 01:03:11.639 still gonna deal with, you know, difficult people. My situation 1109 01:03:11.800 --> 01:03:15.320 might be worse because of being public profile or. 1110 01:03:15.360 --> 01:03:18.400 Whatever, but. 1111 01:03:20.920 --> 01:03:23.159 I would over I would say, overall though most of 1112 01:03:23.280 --> 01:03:25.880 the experiences I've had, even though I've had several bad experiences, 1113 01:03:26.000 --> 01:03:27.920 most of my experiences have been good, Like most of 1114 01:03:28.039 --> 01:03:30.920 the Orthodox people that I've met spent time with. Everybody's great, 1115 01:03:31.840 --> 01:03:34.920 it's just a minority of kind of vicious, malicious people. 1116 01:03:35.559 --> 01:03:39.119 User two O nine five dollars? Have you ever read Gogol? 1117 01:03:39.280 --> 01:03:40.280 Especially as short stories? 1118 01:03:40.280 --> 01:03:40.360 Now? 1119 01:03:40.400 --> 01:03:42.440 Actually, I think my priest was telling me to read 1120 01:03:42.480 --> 01:03:46.159 gogle so I need to get to that. What is 1121 01:03:46.199 --> 01:03:47.519 your opinion of them? I don't know. 1122 01:03:49.880 --> 01:03:52.400 Weren't Dosciewski and flannering Ot Connor fans. I think I've 1123 01:03:52.440 --> 01:03:55.679 heard that. I think Father Vladimir told me that I 1124 01:03:55.719 --> 01:03:59.280 do need to read that doctor Chilling five dollars a 1125 01:03:59.440 --> 01:04:00.400 homeboyd I'll. 1126 01:04:00.239 --> 01:04:04.119 Be triggered by Bobby's perspective. I'm not triggered. 1127 01:04:04.199 --> 01:04:08.840 It's just that, I mean, if you go back, like 1128 01:04:08.920 --> 01:04:11.840 four years ago, Tristan was having Bobby on all the 1129 01:04:11.920 --> 01:04:14.639 time and they were talking about Orthodox stuff, that was 1130 01:04:14.679 --> 01:04:16.760 you know, Tristan was kind of new to look at 1131 01:04:16.760 --> 01:04:19.800 an Orthodoxy, maybe even twenty nineteen eighteen somewhere in there, 1132 01:04:20.199 --> 01:04:20.519 and then. 1133 01:04:20.480 --> 01:04:25.840 Bobby was like, Orthodox, so let's talk about Orthodoxy and diets. 1134 01:04:26.000 --> 01:04:28.559 And then suddenly it's like I didn't even realize that 1135 01:04:28.760 --> 01:04:31.000 they talked the triunity is pigan. 1136 01:04:32.159 --> 01:04:34.159 That's a bad Bobby. I can do a better Bobby 1137 01:04:34.159 --> 01:04:37.719 if and Tristan does a really good Bobby. But I'm 1138 01:04:37.760 --> 01:04:41.760 not triggered by him. I just think it's goofy. He's Bulgarian, 1139 01:04:43.280 --> 01:04:47.559 vegan meat eater. He's now Muslim. 1140 01:04:48.239 --> 01:04:51.760 However, I cannot imagine a bigger grifter than Bobby. He 1141 01:04:51.800 --> 01:04:53.559 will never do a debate, no, I know that, Like 1142 01:04:53.679 --> 01:04:56.239 we we tried to get Bobby to not even do 1143 01:04:56.360 --> 01:05:02.119 a debate, but to come have a discussion, and he 1144 01:05:02.119 --> 01:05:04.599 wouldn't even do that, so of course he's not gonna 1145 01:05:04.599 --> 01:05:05.039 do a debate. 1146 01:05:06.159 --> 01:05:08.760 Bobby C. Ten dollars, Good evening. I am blocked on X. 1147 01:05:08.960 --> 01:05:12.480 Was it by accident? Did I do something? Would you 1148 01:05:12.519 --> 01:05:14.320 consider unblocking me? I don't know. 1149 01:05:15.239 --> 01:05:17.519 I block a lot of people because basically, if I 1150 01:05:17.960 --> 01:05:25.000 sense idiocy, it's a media block. So perhaps I made 1151 01:05:25.000 --> 01:05:28.400 a mistake, perhaps you were an idiot, perhaps. 1152 01:05:28.719 --> 01:05:30.559 None of the above, and I accidentally hit a button 1153 01:05:30.639 --> 01:05:31.000 or something. 1154 01:05:32.079 --> 01:05:33.719 I don't know who you are because when I type 1155 01:05:33.719 --> 01:05:36.639 in Bobby C, I don't see anybody's profile that comes 1156 01:05:36.719 --> 01:05:39.320 up Bobby C. So you got to tell me what 1157 01:05:39.360 --> 01:05:42.719 your profile is to unblock you, because, to be honest 1158 01:05:42.719 --> 01:05:45.840 with you, I have about probably three thousand people blocked, 1159 01:05:47.000 --> 01:05:50.320 so and my life is pretty good when it comes 1160 01:05:50.320 --> 01:05:53.519 a lot of Like I don't if somebody's really ridiculous 1161 01:05:53.639 --> 01:05:56.039 unless they later come and apologize, Like I'm happy. 1162 01:05:55.920 --> 01:06:01.840 Just not interacting with a lot of idiots. Schooma bear 1163 01:06:01.960 --> 01:06:02.320 ten dollars. 1164 01:06:02.360 --> 01:06:04.320 My friend wanted to ask what you thought about calling 1165 01:06:04.400 --> 01:06:07.639 Jesus an avatar. I mean that's kind of like a 1166 01:06:07.840 --> 01:06:10.519 typically a new age hinduist. 1167 01:06:10.760 --> 01:06:14.159 You know type of concept. It's not doesn't really make sense. 1168 01:06:14.239 --> 01:06:17.280 And because it suggests that there are many avatars, right 1169 01:06:18.079 --> 01:06:20.559 and no, we think Jesus has way truth in the life. 1170 01:06:21.239 --> 01:06:23.639 Tony teb ten dollars, blessings to the family, Thank you 1171 01:06:23.760 --> 01:06:26.239 so much. Do you mean Charles Manson's family or mine? 1172 01:06:26.920 --> 01:06:31.000 Ultra three dollars. Hey, this is how I see you. 1173 01:06:33.039 --> 01:06:37.840 You're sending me YouTube video links that I can't see 1174 01:06:37.920 --> 01:06:41.920 on stream labs. Mister goofy, have you watched Secret Level? 1175 01:06:42.000 --> 01:06:42.760 No, I don't know what that is. 1176 01:06:42.960 --> 01:06:48.360 Space Marines equals Bays demon slayers, Gay dire baysed demon slayer. Oh, 1177 01:06:48.440 --> 01:06:51.760 it sounds like an extreme evangelical who is going. 1178 01:06:51.679 --> 01:06:53.360 To put me in my place? Why don't you call 1179 01:06:53.440 --> 01:06:54.800 in Ultra. 1180 01:06:56.239 --> 01:06:59.239 I can't see what your YouTube videos are that you're 1181 01:06:59.360 --> 01:07:01.920 posting and turner five dollars. When I try to follow 1182 01:07:02.000 --> 01:07:05.679 the line of all who accredits theological schools in America, 1183 01:07:06.400 --> 01:07:10.480 I come to ats. I can't find any real information 1184 01:07:10.599 --> 01:07:13.760 on this or its affiliations. This seems strange to be 1185 01:07:13.840 --> 01:07:17.000 such an opaque organization for holding so much power. 1186 01:07:17.079 --> 01:07:17.760 This is a good question. 1187 01:07:17.840 --> 01:07:19.440 In fact, somebody brought this up the other day, like 1188 01:07:20.400 --> 01:07:22.159 because there was a discussion in one of my mod 1189 01:07:22.719 --> 01:07:29.119 chats about like who who decides accreditation? And I mean, 1190 01:07:29.159 --> 01:07:30.679 on one level, it makes sense that there would be 1191 01:07:30.760 --> 01:07:33.480 some kind of accredited crediting thing, but on the other hand, 1192 01:07:33.880 --> 01:07:36.440 like I've been in academia and grad school and all that, 1193 01:07:36.679 --> 01:07:37.880 and I've been in. 1194 01:07:37.960 --> 01:07:44.880 Schools that were not accredited and accredited. So uh, accreditation usually. 1195 01:07:44.639 --> 01:07:46.920 Generally speaking, is just a tool of control because they 1196 01:07:47.000 --> 01:07:50.119 decide that, oh, well, if you're going to be accredited, 1197 01:07:50.159 --> 01:07:52.559 you're going to teach blah blah blah blah blah. And 1198 01:07:53.400 --> 01:07:55.559 I feel sure nowadays that that's all a bunch of 1199 01:07:55.639 --> 01:08:00.440 woke crt stuff. So I would imagine your ap absolutely 1200 01:08:00.519 --> 01:08:03.400 on point here that whoever does this, and I've never 1201 01:08:03.440 --> 01:08:08.079 actually looked into this, it is probably some shady United 1202 01:08:08.159 --> 01:08:12.360 Nations rock filler globalist institution California prober one dollar. How 1203 01:08:12.400 --> 01:08:15.679 can something create a be eternal? Well, God creates a 1204 01:08:15.880 --> 01:08:22.640 timeless eternity, so that's one, so look up again, So 1205 01:08:23.079 --> 01:08:26.239 meaning that it's not subject to the motions of space 1206 01:08:26.319 --> 01:08:30.960 and time. It's hence a time less created eternity. Why 1207 01:08:31.039 --> 01:08:34.079 can't there be a created eternity? If God creates us 1208 01:08:34.279 --> 01:08:36.880 to be creatures who are eternal, so there can be 1209 01:08:37.000 --> 01:08:41.640 created eternities because we are created eternities. Look at the 1210 01:08:41.720 --> 01:08:47.199 medieval theologians called this all eternity ae, the eternity, all 1211 01:08:47.199 --> 01:08:51.079 of eternity, So that shows that there's nothing inherently impossible 1212 01:08:51.079 --> 01:08:58.159 about a creative thing being given eternality. But it's just 1213 01:08:58.279 --> 01:09:04.880 not discussed a lot in theology because most people don't 1214 01:09:04.920 --> 01:09:21.079 read Maximus Confessor and you need to read UH Laws 1215 01:09:21.079 --> 01:09:22.279 Scus Dogmatic Theology. 1216 01:09:31.520 --> 01:09:31.640 UH. 1217 01:09:31.840 --> 01:09:34.680 For example, even Protestant websites know that when you look 1218 01:09:34.760 --> 01:09:39.159 up the word aon, it means simply a boundless time, 1219 01:09:44.039 --> 01:09:45.279 aon in. 1220 01:09:45.359 --> 01:09:50.399 Greek timeless eternal essence. So for us, they're obviously there's 1221 01:09:50.439 --> 01:09:51.000 not gods. 1222 01:09:54.479 --> 01:09:57.640 And in fact, in the Latin the word is avonm, 1223 01:10:00.159 --> 01:10:03.319 which in the Greek is aon, and which I'm telling 1224 01:10:03.359 --> 01:10:06.079 you in the theology is a timeless eternity. 1225 01:10:06.239 --> 01:10:09.399 So go look up what I'm telling you. 1226 01:10:09.520 --> 01:10:13.039 Go read the book vy Vladimir Lowski Dogmatic Theology and 1227 01:10:13.079 --> 01:10:16.319 read the five pages on the timeless aon. 1228 01:10:18.199 --> 01:10:28.239 I'm not going to recommend that website. I've never heard 1229 01:10:28.279 --> 01:10:32.199 anybody talk about this, by the way, until I read 1230 01:10:32.239 --> 01:10:32.880 it in Losky. 1231 01:10:45.079 --> 01:10:46.960 It doesn't even look like you can really find even 1232 01:10:47.000 --> 01:11:04.520 any Orthodox websites discussing it. Even in Plato, the word aon. 1233 01:11:05.840 --> 01:11:05.960 Is in. 1234 01:11:06.079 --> 01:11:08.840 Here's father John Whiteford talking about it, but he's talking 1235 01:11:08.920 --> 01:11:15.399 about critiquingdavidanly Hard. I think, all right, well, this is 1236 01:11:15.439 --> 01:11:18.600 about universalism, This isn't what i'm This will probably be 1237 01:11:18.640 --> 01:11:21.359 a good refutation of universalism, this isn't exactly what I'm 1238 01:11:21.359 --> 01:11:21.680 looking for. 1239 01:11:29.279 --> 01:11:30.279 I think the point is that. 1240 01:11:33.039 --> 01:11:38.039 Time suggests beginning an end, and since we're talking about 1241 01:11:38.079 --> 01:11:42.920 something that is time less, it's not functioning in a 1242 01:11:43.520 --> 01:11:46.880 beginning end sense. It's an ever existing present, but it's 1243 01:11:47.000 --> 01:11:51.840 not eternal or it's not uncreated. So it's a time 1244 01:11:52.039 --> 01:11:56.279 less created realm where the angels exist. And that's why 1245 01:11:56.880 --> 01:11:59.640 when the trust's father's talk about the angels falling, it 1246 01:11:59.800 --> 01:12:04.920 was outside of time and hence it was instantaneous. But 1247 01:12:05.600 --> 01:12:17.000 this isn't really dealing with that. Alulah, five dollars add 1248 01:12:17.079 --> 01:12:19.520 me to your prayers. God knows I love you brother 1249 01:12:19.600 --> 01:12:24.399 as always. Thank you appreciate that. Lula, will we'll do that, silly, 1250 01:12:24.439 --> 01:12:26.680 give us five dollars. Do you have any thoughts on 1251 01:12:26.800 --> 01:12:31.239 Dan McClellan. I think we did him on We covered 1252 01:12:31.319 --> 01:12:33.119 him on that stream that Cootel and I did about 1253 01:12:33.159 --> 01:12:34.359 deconstructing Christianity. 1254 01:12:35.520 --> 01:12:36.359 So you can go watch that. 1255 01:12:37.199 --> 01:12:39.319 He will not debate people. But if you have rebuttals, 1256 01:12:39.960 --> 01:12:42.920 what are they? Go watch our video together about We 1257 01:12:43.039 --> 01:12:46.119 did two. We did one on my channel deconstructing Christianity 1258 01:12:46.119 --> 01:12:48.039 and then one on his channel deconstructing Christianity. 1259 01:12:49.399 --> 01:12:50.119 I think we deal with. 1260 01:12:50.640 --> 01:12:54.640 McClellan in his video on his channel. Gabriel twenty five dollars. 1261 01:12:54.680 --> 01:12:56.520 What happens to people who never hear of Jesus? 1262 01:12:56.600 --> 01:12:57.279 Do they go to Hell? 1263 01:12:58.039 --> 01:13:00.720 We don't make that judgment. We're not told the destiny 1264 01:13:00.760 --> 01:13:02.960 of people. We're just told to tell people to come 1265 01:13:03.000 --> 01:13:06.199 into the arc. It seems the moral to witness to 1266 01:13:06.279 --> 01:13:07.920 them and give them a chance to reject it. If 1267 01:13:07.920 --> 01:13:09.760 they would immediately go to heaven, well, we don't say 1268 01:13:09.800 --> 01:13:10.760 they immediately go to heaven. 1269 01:13:12.199 --> 01:13:14.760 God doesn't tell us, and how he judges of people, 1270 01:13:14.920 --> 01:13:17.800 we don't know. There's inklings of how he does that 1271 01:13:17.880 --> 01:13:22.199 in Romans two in regard to natural law. But our 1272 01:13:22.319 --> 01:13:25.079 job is to tell them to join the church. Well 1273 01:13:25.119 --> 01:13:27.560 at annual five dollars I didn't even notice that this 1274 01:13:27.760 --> 01:13:29.239 was a late stream. Thanks. 1275 01:13:29.760 --> 01:13:34.560 Yeah, it's like midnight here. Appreciate that Albanian do ninety 1276 01:13:34.600 --> 01:13:36.119 eight two dollars. 1277 01:13:36.199 --> 01:13:40.239 Contaxation in society be viewed as a divine judgment and 1278 01:13:40.319 --> 01:13:43.000 consequence because the sins of self interest and greed. From 1279 01:13:43.000 --> 01:13:48.840 an Orthodox perspective, I think all things like that can 1280 01:13:48.920 --> 01:13:52.840 be chastisements. Yeah, like any anything that comes our way, right, 1281 01:13:52.920 --> 01:13:58.199 if a plague comes, right, that's a chastisement. And you know, 1282 01:13:58.520 --> 01:13:59.279 in the. 1283 01:13:59.359 --> 01:14:02.239 Covenants to be relations in Deuteronomy and in the Covenant 1284 01:14:02.279 --> 01:14:05.600 stipulations to the churches and Revelation two and three, the 1285 01:14:05.800 --> 01:14:10.600 blessings and the cursings that come to chastisements, all of 1286 01:14:10.680 --> 01:14:12.239 them are for are good. 1287 01:14:12.680 --> 01:14:17.640 So yeah, I would I would say so. In fact, 1288 01:14:17.680 --> 01:14:21.680 I think there's a text in Ezekiel. Yeah, there's a 1289 01:14:21.760 --> 01:14:23.039 text in Ezekiel. 1290 01:14:22.640 --> 01:14:26.720 That says that God gave them over to bad laws 1291 01:14:27.880 --> 01:14:32.199 because they were disobedient. And I remember Scott Hahn back 1292 01:14:32.239 --> 01:14:33.560 in the day when I was cat. I remember he 1293 01:14:33.680 --> 01:14:36.720 was a big letdown to me because he actually took 1294 01:14:36.800 --> 01:14:39.720 a like a modernist. 1295 01:14:43.840 --> 01:14:47.399 Documentary hypothesis view about that. I kid you not. 1296 01:14:47.520 --> 01:14:50.000 You could probably go look it up where he's trying 1297 01:14:50.000 --> 01:14:51.680 to grapple with this text, but I wish I don't 1298 01:14:51.680 --> 01:14:52.920 even think it's that weird of a text. 1299 01:14:52.960 --> 01:14:57.359 He's like, I could not extense of distract, And he's like, 1300 01:14:57.800 --> 01:15:00.000 so I came to the conclusion that it's the Old 1301 01:15:00.159 --> 01:15:03.119 Testament itself and its laws that God is here saying 1302 01:15:03.239 --> 01:15:04.000 are bad laws. 1303 01:15:04.800 --> 01:15:09.000 What God gave bad laws, which are the Torah? That 1304 01:15:09.159 --> 01:15:10.520 makes absolutely no sense. 1305 01:15:11.960 --> 01:15:14.800 What he's saying is that since you wouldn't obey my laws, 1306 01:15:14.920 --> 01:15:17.319 I gave you up to bad human laws. 1307 01:15:19.479 --> 01:15:20.119 Not even to me. 1308 01:15:20.199 --> 01:15:22.159 It's not even a mysterious text. I don't know where 1309 01:15:22.720 --> 01:15:24.279 or why Scott Hank came up with that. 1310 01:15:25.600 --> 01:15:27.640 Big way five dollars, Jay. I got to ask you, 1311 01:15:28.079 --> 01:15:30.359 why do you do some of the debate streams. I 1312 01:15:30.439 --> 01:15:31.880 hear a lot of Goober's showing up. 1313 01:15:31.960 --> 01:15:35.000 Does it get tiring? It does get tiring, and I 1314 01:15:35.159 --> 01:15:37.199 enjoy it at the same time. So it's a love 1315 01:15:37.239 --> 01:15:46.079 hate relationship with debating. It seems to help a lot 1316 01:15:46.119 --> 01:15:49.039 of people. I get tons and tons of people saying 1317 01:15:49.079 --> 01:15:50.720 they love this. I mean the debate streams. 1318 01:15:51.319 --> 01:15:56.399 If you guys watched my movie and book streams and 1319 01:15:56.600 --> 01:15:58.119 they got thirty thousand views. 1320 01:15:58.199 --> 01:16:01.159 I would do that all the time, but ten thousand 1321 01:16:01.199 --> 01:16:04.720 people watch those and thirty forty fifty thousand people watch these. 1322 01:16:05.039 --> 01:16:07.520 So that's part of the reason why I do it, 1323 01:16:07.640 --> 01:16:08.439 that nobody. 1324 01:16:08.199 --> 01:16:10.319 Watches the book streams and the movie streams. 1325 01:16:11.479 --> 01:16:14.880 I still do them because I enjoy them. But Bitcoin 1326 01:16:15.000 --> 01:16:17.119 Island three dollars. I love these late night streams. 1327 01:16:17.239 --> 01:16:17.600 Keep it up. 1328 01:16:17.640 --> 01:16:17.800 Jay. 1329 01:16:17.800 --> 01:16:20.600 Hey, if you want to support my work and you do, 1330 01:16:20.800 --> 01:16:24.560 happen to be a bitcoin tattoo Fantasy Island bro. 1331 01:16:25.680 --> 01:16:28.479 This is my wallet rye here. People always ask what's 1332 01:16:28.520 --> 01:16:31.640 like QR code? That's to support me buy bitcoin? If 1333 01:16:31.680 --> 01:16:34.319 you would like to get started with bitcoin, there is 1334 01:16:34.399 --> 01:16:36.960 a link in my show description to swan Bitcoin. They're 1335 01:16:37.000 --> 01:16:39.079 a purchasing bitcoin only company. 1336 01:16:39.159 --> 01:16:39.680 That's all it is. 1337 01:16:40.199 --> 01:16:43.119 You buy it and then you transfer it to your wallet. 1338 01:16:43.840 --> 01:16:49.520 Very simple, very smooth process. Also, if you want to 1339 01:16:50.159 --> 01:16:54.640 support my work and your own health in the sense 1340 01:16:54.680 --> 01:16:58.520 of increasing toxic masculinity, then head on over to chalk 1341 01:16:58.560 --> 01:17:02.039 dot com. They're the best and supplement take particularly male vitality. 1342 01:17:02.920 --> 01:17:04.840 I recommend that chalk Stack right there. Use promo co 1343 01:17:04.960 --> 01:17:06.760 j forty four life to get forty four percent off. 1344 01:17:06.800 --> 01:17:10.359 You can cancel at any time and you will absolutely 1345 01:17:10.479 --> 01:17:15.960 up your toxic masculinity promo code Jay four four L 1346 01:17:16.079 --> 01:17:19.479 I F E. I recommend that performance stack, particularly the 1347 01:17:19.560 --> 01:17:24.600 tonk Ketally. Now, also we have ten percent ladies. There's 1348 01:17:24.640 --> 01:17:26.520 only ten percent of this audience as ladies. You can 1349 01:17:26.600 --> 01:17:29.119 go get that the female vitality Sack. 1350 01:17:29.520 --> 01:17:30.960 And if you don't want to recurrence the description, you 1351 01:17:30.960 --> 01:17:33.119 can use the promo coach JAY four zero to get 1352 01:17:33.199 --> 01:17:37.439 forty percent off chalk dot com mer curious one dollar. 1353 01:17:38.640 --> 01:17:40.880 If I'm under a jurisdiction that promotes a humunism or 1354 01:17:40.920 --> 01:17:44.000 some other scandal, is there precedent for how to combat 1355 01:17:44.159 --> 01:17:47.439 heresy within a community or an Orthodox situation supposed to 1356 01:17:47.479 --> 01:17:49.800 admit with docility as. 1357 01:17:49.720 --> 01:17:50.640 Our Roman Catholics. 1358 01:17:51.399 --> 01:17:55.119 I mean, really, it just depends on how far we're talking. 1359 01:17:55.319 --> 01:17:56.720 I mean, are you talking about the bishop, are you 1360 01:17:56.800 --> 01:18:00.239 talking about a priest who says something liberal? Or I mean, 1361 01:18:00.279 --> 01:18:02.279 I guess ideally it probably would just be best to 1362 01:18:02.319 --> 01:18:05.880 find a better jurisdiction if you can. But there's not 1363 01:18:06.199 --> 01:18:12.600 an easy answer to these kinds of questions. We still 1364 01:18:12.680 --> 01:18:13.880 got twenty people over here. 1365 01:18:14.560 --> 01:18:25.239 Let's find vesper. We got Eva Green over here? What's up? 1366 01:18:26.039 --> 01:18:33.520 Vesper Lend? Hello? 1367 01:18:35.319 --> 01:18:41.159 Seconds, see if I can hear you? 1368 01:18:41.880 --> 01:18:42.159 Hello? 1369 01:18:42.920 --> 01:18:45.880 All right, it's working now, all right, So I disagree 1370 01:18:45.920 --> 01:18:48.960 with the whole host of stuff you said, but let's 1371 01:18:49.000 --> 01:18:50.000 go with universalism. 1372 01:18:50.039 --> 01:18:51.039 What's your issue with then? 1373 01:18:52.439 --> 01:18:55.800 Well, the New Testament pretty clearly doesn't teach universalism. The 1374 01:18:55.920 --> 01:18:58.119 Church has condemned it at least three times and three 1375 01:18:58.159 --> 01:18:59.279 ecumenical councils. 1376 01:18:59.479 --> 01:19:00.640 So that's enough for me. 1377 01:19:01.479 --> 01:19:02.279 Are you sure about that? 1378 01:19:02.840 --> 01:19:03.039 Yeah? 1379 01:19:04.520 --> 01:19:07.079 Because doesn't the Eastern Orthodoxy believe in this sort of 1380 01:19:07.119 --> 01:19:11.600 purgatory No, with like the aerial toll houses, Well. 1381 01:19:11.560 --> 01:19:14.319 That's not purgatory. Purgatory has created fire, that God has 1382 01:19:14.399 --> 01:19:15.119 no creative fire. 1383 01:19:16.119 --> 01:19:19.680 Okay, But you believe in like a purification of the souls, But. 1384 01:19:19.800 --> 01:19:22.520 That's not purgatory because purgatory is bound up with the 1385 01:19:22.600 --> 01:19:26.199 Roman Catholic doctrine of temporald that's for sins and created 1386 01:19:26.319 --> 01:19:27.159 fire from God. 1387 01:19:28.199 --> 01:19:30.880 Okay. And what happens to the souls in hell at 1388 01:19:30.920 --> 01:19:32.479 the end at the end times. 1389 01:19:34.239 --> 01:19:36.359 They are joined back to their body and they are 1390 01:19:36.600 --> 01:19:40.520 experiencing the wrath of God and not the love of God. 1391 01:19:41.640 --> 01:19:43.079 They experience unity with God. 1392 01:19:43.199 --> 01:19:46.560 Right, No, the wrath of God, because God's love to 1393 01:19:46.880 --> 01:19:50.880 them is wrath, the. 1394 01:19:50.960 --> 01:19:54.800 Full presence of God. You take that to mean something nefarious. 1395 01:19:56.119 --> 01:19:59.600 Well, the lake of fire for us as Orthodox is 1396 01:19:59.640 --> 01:20:03.079 the same thing as the river of life. What distinguishes 1397 01:20:03.119 --> 01:20:05.319 these two experiences is are you laughing? 1398 01:20:09.239 --> 01:20:14.000 Let's see, do you see the experience eternal torment? 1399 01:20:15.000 --> 01:20:15.279 All right? 1400 01:20:15.319 --> 01:20:17.800 So the Orthodox view is that the river of life 1401 01:20:18.000 --> 01:20:22.079 is the lake of fire. But your recapitulation of the 1402 01:20:22.159 --> 01:20:26.079 virtues or lack thereof, is what determines your individual experience 1403 01:20:26.119 --> 01:20:26.800 of the escaton. 1404 01:20:29.479 --> 01:20:33.039 So there's no reconciliation for people. 1405 01:20:34.159 --> 01:20:36.680 Not if they, to the end of their life persist 1406 01:20:36.960 --> 01:20:39.159 in what Jesus calls the unforgivable sin. 1407 01:20:39.279 --> 01:20:45.000 Correct, But they could theoretically be saved from hell in 1408 01:20:45.159 --> 01:20:49.079 this life, I mean, after being sent to hell. 1409 01:20:49.960 --> 01:20:53.920 No, there's no precedence for that. There's no reason to 1410 01:20:54.000 --> 01:20:55.760 believe that. What's the basis to believe that? 1411 01:20:58.640 --> 01:21:00.560 I don't know. It just it seems weird that their 1412 01:21:00.600 --> 01:21:03.279 souls are eternally tortured. 1413 01:21:03.680 --> 01:21:06.000 I said, they're joined to their body and resurrected and 1414 01:21:06.079 --> 01:21:10.520 they experience what they chose, So they're not eternally tormented. 1415 01:21:10.600 --> 01:21:11.359 As if God is. 1416 01:21:11.479 --> 01:21:14.920 Okay, Okay, so they're basically reincarnated. 1417 01:21:16.279 --> 01:21:20.720 No, the resurrection is not is not reincarnation. No, it's not. 1418 01:21:20.760 --> 01:21:33.520 We're gonna move on, Jake, what's up? What's up? Jake? 1419 01:21:33.640 --> 01:21:43.359 And I'm mute, Jake, unmute, unmute, dude. 1420 01:21:43.560 --> 01:21:47.039 All right, Oh sorry, Hey, I have a couple of 1421 01:21:47.119 --> 01:21:50.520 questions about the GEOC speaking of kind of schismatics. What 1422 01:21:52.560 --> 01:21:55.920 you know, the genuine Orthodox Church quote unquote okay, so 1423 01:21:57.720 --> 01:22:01.359 is anything of them worth debating or using their content? 1424 01:22:02.640 --> 01:22:05.079 So I'm just asked. 1425 01:22:04.840 --> 01:22:07.479 Because some of their stuff might be confusing some of 1426 01:22:07.520 --> 01:22:11.319 the new converts or people who are just kind of inquires, 1427 01:22:12.199 --> 01:22:13.680 you know. Some of the things they say is kind 1428 01:22:13.720 --> 01:22:16.640 of like it seems pretty kind of like donatists. 1429 01:22:18.039 --> 01:22:19.199 Yeah, I don't know if you're kind of. 1430 01:22:19.359 --> 01:22:22.119 Tracking any of the stuff that they that they talk about, this. 1431 01:22:22.239 --> 01:22:27.439 Is like five people, ten people, It's like nothing like 1432 01:22:27.439 --> 01:22:31.479 it's like it's smaller than set of a countism So no, people. 1433 01:22:31.279 --> 01:22:33.119 Should just not waste their time with any of that. 1434 01:22:33.960 --> 01:22:40.880 And every schismatic group will, you know, have some legitimate gripe, 1435 01:22:41.319 --> 01:22:44.520 but that doesn't justify the actions or the reactions of 1436 01:22:44.560 --> 01:22:45.039 those groups. 1437 01:22:45.159 --> 01:22:46.000 Kevin, what's up? Man? 1438 01:22:46.359 --> 01:22:49.399 Looking for people who disagree. So if you're Orthodox and 1439 01:22:49.520 --> 01:22:52.760 you're asking me catechumen questions, I'm not doing that tonight. 1440 01:22:52.880 --> 01:22:56.760 So please if you disagree with me, if you want 1441 01:22:56.840 --> 01:23:02.640 to argue Catholicism, Atheism, protestantsm Calvinism, Islam, libertarianism, Gnocissism. 1442 01:23:02.920 --> 01:23:06.079 It's not Orthodox ataq and I what's up? Kevin on you? 1443 01:23:13.159 --> 01:23:18.920 Kevin on? Mute? Ken is Kevin from the office. What's up? 1444 01:23:19.000 --> 01:23:19.439 Kevin on you? 1445 01:23:20.560 --> 01:23:20.720 Hey? 1446 01:23:20.800 --> 01:23:20.960 Jay? 1447 01:23:21.039 --> 01:23:23.119 Sorry about that's up? 1448 01:23:24.600 --> 01:23:24.720 Uh. 1449 01:23:24.880 --> 01:23:29.000 Yeah, So I'm a pretty new listener. I've been watching 1450 01:23:29.079 --> 01:23:32.039 recently all of your debates and all that. So I'm 1451 01:23:32.079 --> 01:23:33.840 wondering if you wanted to talk a little bit about 1452 01:23:34.039 --> 01:23:34.920 Jeovah's witnesses. 1453 01:23:35.720 --> 01:23:40.399 Okay, so really really quick summary. Uh. 1454 01:23:41.000 --> 01:23:44.600 I was raised in the Jehovah's witness household, and uh 1455 01:23:45.079 --> 01:23:48.600 for in my late teens, I became an anti uh 1456 01:23:49.239 --> 01:23:50.479 anti theist, like an. 1457 01:23:50.399 --> 01:23:52.279 Atheist anti seis kind of thing. 1458 01:23:53.680 --> 01:23:58.640 I'm recently confining my way back to spirituality overall, and 1459 01:23:58.760 --> 01:24:00.920 I'm starting to lean forward Orthodogray. 1460 01:24:01.600 --> 01:24:03.479 But my question to you is, and hopefully you. 1461 01:24:03.479 --> 01:24:06.399 Can help me out here, is my family is super 1462 01:24:06.520 --> 01:24:10.560 intrussed in this belief to this date, So I'm wondering, 1463 01:24:10.640 --> 01:24:14.640 what maybe if you have some arguments to help maybe 1464 01:24:14.760 --> 01:24:15.680 take himself out of that. 1465 01:24:16.760 --> 01:24:19.079 Yeah, I would say a couple places to start. One 1466 01:24:19.159 --> 01:24:23.880 would be right here. This video is Jesus God is 1467 01:24:23.920 --> 01:24:26.680 God at Trinity. This is a video I made almost 1468 01:24:26.720 --> 01:24:29.199 six years ago. It'said about fifty thousand views on it. 1469 01:24:30.119 --> 01:24:33.159 I would start with that video because I go through many, many, 1470 01:24:33.239 --> 01:24:38.479 many Old Testament passages that prove that Christ is the 1471 01:24:38.760 --> 01:24:41.920 second person of the Godhead, and he's called yeahweh, He's 1472 01:24:42.000 --> 01:24:44.279 called God, not just in the New Testament, but all 1473 01:24:44.359 --> 01:24:47.680 throughout the Old Testament. Next, I would say watch the 1474 01:24:47.920 --> 01:24:51.159 recent video that I did Trinity in the Old Testament, 1475 01:24:51.199 --> 01:24:55.600 which is a step beyond this initial video, where I 1476 01:24:55.720 --> 01:24:59.039 actually go through all of the references to the Trinity 1477 01:25:00.079 --> 01:25:04.279 in the Torah, so very precise, very specific that we're 1478 01:25:05.079 --> 01:25:09.039 literally going to walk through. This ends up being ultimately 1479 01:25:09.079 --> 01:25:12.159 about three hours, and I think I missed one passage 1480 01:25:12.760 --> 01:25:16.119 in either numbers. I think in numbers, so I got 1481 01:25:16.199 --> 01:25:18.359 almost all of them. I missed one in numbers. But 1482 01:25:19.279 --> 01:25:25.680 it's another three hours of textual evidence and proofs that 1483 01:25:26.159 --> 01:25:28.760 the Old Testament literally teaches the train Now If the 1484 01:25:28.800 --> 01:25:32.520 Old Testament uses the Trinity, that's the end of Joe's Witnesses. 1485 01:25:32.680 --> 01:25:34.880 We don't even need or have to go to the 1486 01:25:34.960 --> 01:25:37.279 New Testament passages, which we can because there's plenty of 1487 01:25:37.319 --> 01:25:39.479 those in the New Testament as well. You could just 1488 01:25:39.600 --> 01:25:42.760 google New Testament passages that show the duty of Christ. 1489 01:25:43.159 --> 01:25:45.800 But I really think the Old Testament passages are the 1490 01:25:45.920 --> 01:25:51.000 most forceful because it really destroys Islam, Judaism, and jose 1491 01:25:51.039 --> 01:25:54.000 Witnesses all at the same time. So check out those videos. 1492 01:25:54.239 --> 01:25:58.079 Appreciate that, Kevin, and glad to see you moving. 1493 01:25:57.960 --> 01:26:00.520 In the right direction. Bro, Jeff, what's up man? 1494 01:26:05.239 --> 01:26:07.840 Hello? Hey, Hey, what's up man? 1495 01:26:08.880 --> 01:26:13.760 So I am a new listener recently, you know, pretty 1496 01:26:13.800 --> 01:26:17.359 much accepted Jesus into my heart and this has really helped. 1497 01:26:17.520 --> 01:26:19.840 But I just wanted to kind of debate with you 1498 01:26:19.920 --> 01:26:22.399 about the way maybe I've thought about things in the past, 1499 01:26:23.079 --> 01:26:26.520 and you know, just to kind of see, like, wheread 1500 01:26:26.560 --> 01:26:29.239 go from it, even though I'm already kind of, you know, 1501 01:26:29.319 --> 01:26:30.159 on your side on it. 1502 01:26:30.359 --> 01:26:33.880 Does that make sense on what topic? Well? 1503 01:26:33.960 --> 01:26:35.279 So just kind of the concept of. 1504 01:26:38.239 --> 01:26:38.920 Good and evil. 1505 01:26:39.399 --> 01:26:42.039 You know, I didn't really consider the fact that there 1506 01:26:42.239 --> 01:26:44.760 was a good or evil. It just kind of was 1507 01:26:45.359 --> 01:26:47.359 you know, I didn't believe that I even had free will. 1508 01:26:47.840 --> 01:26:52.199 I'm just a robot of meat, you know, going through, 1509 01:26:52.439 --> 01:26:57.079 going through life and survival is the mechanism in which 1510 01:26:57.479 --> 01:27:00.319 I do everything, you know, run away from pain and 1511 01:27:00.479 --> 01:27:01.479 run towards pleasure. 1512 01:27:02.039 --> 01:27:03.560 That makes sense. 1513 01:27:05.800 --> 01:27:07.640 In the sense, but I'm not, you know, like a 1514 01:27:08.199 --> 01:27:12.880 hetonistic person like I. At the same time, I see, 1515 01:27:13.199 --> 01:27:18.600 you know, doing things like drinking, as dipping into a 1516 01:27:18.760 --> 01:27:21.479 river that the more I dip my foot in, the 1517 01:27:21.600 --> 01:27:24.000 more it submerges me and takes me down. It's past 1518 01:27:24.199 --> 01:27:25.720 and then I'm unable to get out of that river. 1519 01:27:26.319 --> 01:27:28.279 So that's the way I would consider doing things that 1520 01:27:28.640 --> 01:27:29.279 I didn't think. 1521 01:27:29.159 --> 01:27:29.680 It was bad. 1522 01:27:29.920 --> 01:27:32.880 It's not like that river is an evil river. It's 1523 01:27:33.000 --> 01:27:37.159 just that river is drinking porn, you know, doing crazy shit. 1524 01:27:37.399 --> 01:27:40.319 And sometimes I, you know, get in a river, probably 1525 01:27:40.399 --> 01:27:42.960 more than I should, but I never got lost in that. 1526 01:27:43.800 --> 01:27:44.560 Does that make sense? 1527 01:27:45.600 --> 01:27:48.520 Yeah, you say, basically you're saying, like vices didn't run 1528 01:27:48.600 --> 01:27:51.039 your life exactly. 1529 01:27:51.199 --> 01:27:54.640 So I try to do try to do positive things, 1530 01:27:55.039 --> 01:27:56.840 and you know, for the most part, I was pretty 1531 01:27:56.920 --> 01:27:59.720 happy doing that. So I kind of was like, you know, 1532 01:27:59.760 --> 01:28:03.399 and I grew up evangelical type of Christian uh, And 1533 01:28:03.479 --> 01:28:05.880 I just didn't really see a reason to to go 1534 01:28:06.039 --> 01:28:08.840 to God. You know, I'm not a depressed guy, didn't 1535 01:28:08.880 --> 01:28:09.479 fear death. 1536 01:28:10.439 --> 01:28:10.560 Uh. 1537 01:28:10.800 --> 01:28:14.279 And even coming back to Christianity, it wasn't the the 1538 01:28:14.479 --> 01:28:20.039 hell heart that kept me, you know, kept me from 1539 01:28:20.119 --> 01:28:20.520 coming in. 1540 01:28:20.920 --> 01:28:22.399 It's not like I was like, oh shit, hell. 1541 01:28:22.840 --> 01:28:24.439 It was just like a logical conclusion. 1542 01:28:24.520 --> 01:28:26.159 It was very like, you know what, I'm picking the side. 1543 01:28:26.159 --> 01:28:28.119 I'm picking this side. How do you talk to somebody 1544 01:28:28.359 --> 01:28:31.119 like me about Christianity? Because I feel like even bringing 1545 01:28:31.119 --> 01:28:35.279 it up back to my friends, like dude, Jeff gone crazy, you. 1546 01:28:35.319 --> 01:28:35.760 Know what I mean? 1547 01:28:37.279 --> 01:28:37.479 Yes? 1548 01:28:37.520 --> 01:28:38.000 So what so? 1549 01:28:38.159 --> 01:28:39.079 What is the question? 1550 01:28:40.039 --> 01:28:43.079 So it's just like, how how do I explain good 1551 01:28:43.119 --> 01:28:43.479 and evil? 1552 01:28:44.119 --> 01:28:44.279 You know? 1553 01:28:44.399 --> 01:28:45.479 How do you even like. 1554 01:28:47.439 --> 01:28:49.199 Because like in my sense that there is no good 1555 01:28:49.239 --> 01:28:51.520 in evil in my older sense, you know, how would 1556 01:28:51.560 --> 01:28:53.399 you say that there is a good and there isn't 1557 01:28:53.479 --> 01:28:54.159 an evil? 1558 01:28:54.760 --> 01:28:56.880 I guess how do you pro I mean, I would 1559 01:28:56.880 --> 01:28:59.279 say those are kind of like good as a you know, 1560 01:28:59.479 --> 01:29:02.680 kind of a train incidental. It's like a necessary category 1561 01:29:02.880 --> 01:29:06.960 that like has there has to be some good or 1562 01:29:07.039 --> 01:29:09.960 else you couldn't make value judgments. You couldn't say that 1563 01:29:10.079 --> 01:29:12.800 this thing is not good or this is better or worse. 1564 01:29:13.399 --> 01:29:15.399 So there's got to be some account of the good 1565 01:29:15.880 --> 01:29:18.439 rather than just saying there is the good. And I 1566 01:29:18.520 --> 01:29:20.680 think if you start to, you know, ask kind of 1567 01:29:20.680 --> 01:29:22.960 basic philosophical questions, Okay, well, what does it mean to 1568 01:29:23.000 --> 01:29:23.800 say something is good? 1569 01:29:23.880 --> 01:29:25.560 What is the good? How do I know the good? 1570 01:29:26.680 --> 01:29:27.479 Where is the good? 1571 01:29:27.640 --> 01:29:27.760 Right? 1572 01:29:27.840 --> 01:29:31.880 Those kinds of questions lead you into the domain of well, 1573 01:29:31.920 --> 01:29:32.680 then what isn't good? 1574 01:29:32.840 --> 01:29:33.359 Is there evil? 1575 01:29:34.079 --> 01:29:36.520 And that leads to the questions like, well, is there 1576 01:29:36.840 --> 01:29:40.239 an ultimate good, the highest good God? And then is 1577 01:29:40.279 --> 01:29:44.079 there things that are against God? Angels, demons, et cetera. 1578 01:29:44.399 --> 01:29:48.239 So if you're asking for the kinds of questions that 1579 01:29:48.359 --> 01:29:51.960 I would ask to people who don't believe, those are 1580 01:29:52.039 --> 01:29:54.600 the sort of philosophical questions I would ask that lead 1581 01:29:54.720 --> 01:29:59.079 to theology. So a lot of philosophical questions we don't 1582 01:29:59.119 --> 01:30:01.000 think of them as the logical, but they actually kind 1583 01:30:01.039 --> 01:30:04.680 of end up in the domain of theology, uh. 1584 01:30:07.079 --> 01:30:21.319 Daniel. So I would start with those kinds of questions. Maybe, yeah, I. 1585 01:30:21.319 --> 01:30:23.800 Don't claim it's a mystery and then claim the universalism 1586 01:30:23.920 --> 01:30:27.399 is false because there's aspects that I claim are mysterious 1587 01:30:27.479 --> 01:30:28.239 and others. 1588 01:30:28.039 --> 01:30:28.359 That are not. 1589 01:30:28.720 --> 01:30:30.560 So it's just like. 1590 01:30:32.279 --> 01:30:41.039 Not even basics. Uh, Daniel can't connect Nathan, So we're 1591 01:30:41.039 --> 01:30:42.199 looking for people who disagree. 1592 01:30:42.760 --> 01:30:57.159 Tonight, i'man. 1593 01:31:00.119 --> 01:31:01.439 I was just wondering. 1594 01:31:02.159 --> 01:31:06.840 So I have a friend at work that he is 1595 01:31:07.359 --> 01:31:11.199 into the faith healing and it's based in gnoscissism, and 1596 01:31:11.319 --> 01:31:14.640 I was wondering what the best argument against that is. 1597 01:31:23.319 --> 01:31:26.479 I mean, you know, it's hard to argue with people 1598 01:31:26.600 --> 01:31:30.039 like that because most of the time they're really based 1599 01:31:30.079 --> 01:31:32.520 on emotion, So they're really only going to believe or 1600 01:31:32.600 --> 01:31:35.960 accept on the basis of the emotional highs and lows 1601 01:31:36.039 --> 01:31:36.479 that they get. 1602 01:31:37.000 --> 01:31:38.079 So I don't even know. 1603 01:31:38.319 --> 01:31:40.560 You might not even be able to have like an 1604 01:31:40.720 --> 01:31:43.439 argued type of position with that kind of person. It 1605 01:31:43.520 --> 01:31:45.199 might be better to just like invite him to an 1606 01:31:45.439 --> 01:31:47.640 Orthodox church or something like that rather than trying to 1607 01:31:47.720 --> 01:31:48.319 debate with him. 1608 01:31:48.800 --> 01:31:50.520 If I was going to debate with somebody like that. 1609 01:31:50.600 --> 01:31:52.880 I would just try to get him to start questioning 1610 01:31:53.680 --> 01:31:57.960 whether he's really seeing miracles, whether he's really seeing prophecies, 1611 01:31:58.079 --> 01:32:00.760 and all kinds of whatever he believes is going on 1612 01:32:00.920 --> 01:32:03.680 at his Pentecostal group. 1613 01:32:04.760 --> 01:32:06.800 Emmanuel Herrera really for people who disagree. 1614 01:32:16.359 --> 01:32:20.520 Hey, hello something Okay, So I just kind of wanted 1615 01:32:20.520 --> 01:32:23.640 to talk about like the LPT kind of. 1616 01:32:24.319 --> 01:32:27.159 So basically the argument that was good to me was 1617 01:32:27.920 --> 01:32:29.600 if the Father didn't quote the essence. 1618 01:32:29.680 --> 01:32:31.640 Yeah, we've covered this many times, we did the whole 1619 01:32:31.680 --> 01:32:32.159 talks on it. 1620 01:32:33.000 --> 01:32:36.000 No, but like particularly for the essence at like particular 1621 01:32:36.119 --> 01:32:39.159 and universals like not just like the standard LPT argument. 1622 01:32:41.439 --> 01:32:43.960 So basically, how would the logical problem of trinity relate 1623 01:32:44.039 --> 01:32:45.880 to universals? I don't understand. 1624 01:32:46.640 --> 01:32:48.640 It isn't more of the LPT, more just a God 1625 01:32:48.760 --> 01:32:51.119 being three like the Trinity being three gods. 1626 01:32:54.920 --> 01:32:57.159 Well, strictly speaking, it's not three gods. 1627 01:32:57.199 --> 01:33:00.520 I mean it's one God, the Father, and then the 1628 01:33:00.640 --> 01:33:04.119 Son and the Spirit participate in his divine essence. So 1629 01:33:04.960 --> 01:33:07.720 I mean, are you just like, what's the problem, Like, Well, 1630 01:33:07.720 --> 01:33:11.279 I've covered the LPT explicitly extensively multiple times. 1631 01:33:11.640 --> 01:33:13.279 Yeah, and I've watched I'll watch your videos on it. 1632 01:33:13.399 --> 01:33:16.399 Okay, this is like a distinct argument because it was like, 1633 01:33:16.880 --> 01:33:19.439 if I believe the fathers identical to the Essence, but 1634 01:33:19.520 --> 01:33:22.119 then I believe the divine essence is a universal does 1635 01:33:22.199 --> 01:33:23.720 I mean the Father's universal. 1636 01:33:23.920 --> 01:33:26.199 Most of the church fathers don't believe the divine Essence 1637 01:33:26.319 --> 01:33:29.159 is a universal. Some do, some don't, so that might 1638 01:33:29.239 --> 01:33:35.520 be a problematic terminological use. I would inquate the divine 1639 01:33:35.560 --> 01:33:38.479 essence with a universal. It's like a universal in the 1640 01:33:38.520 --> 01:33:41.960 way that something can be one and many, just like 1641 01:33:42.039 --> 01:33:44.560 particular as the universals can be both, and so in 1642 01:33:44.640 --> 01:33:47.840 the trinity it can be both in But I don't 1643 01:33:47.920 --> 01:33:51.359 know that the Divine Essence is a universal per se. 1644 01:33:51.439 --> 01:33:53.880 I think maybe Nissa thinks that if I go going 1645 01:33:53.920 --> 01:33:56.680 for memory, but most church fathers don't think that. 1646 01:33:57.720 --> 01:34:01.479 So then so then if I say that it's three particulars, 1647 01:34:01.760 --> 01:34:03.920 he said, well, then that means if you count God 1648 01:34:04.039 --> 01:34:06.720 by particulars, there's a sense some which you have three gods. 1649 01:34:07.560 --> 01:34:09.239 Yeah, but it's just a different use of the word 1650 01:34:09.319 --> 01:34:12.760 God than what's being picked out by the essence. So 1651 01:34:13.439 --> 01:34:16.439 I mean nice, and Creed says, you know, God from God, 1652 01:34:16.600 --> 01:34:19.800 light from light. So there, the word God is just 1653 01:34:19.880 --> 01:34:21.279 picking out hypostasis. 1654 01:34:22.199 --> 01:34:24.479 Okay, okay, so yeah, answer my question. 1655 01:34:24.600 --> 01:34:24.800 Thank you. 1656 01:34:25.039 --> 01:34:26.239 I haven't merry Christmas you. 1657 01:34:26.279 --> 01:34:29.600 Too, man, I'm just starting to get a little tired 1658 01:34:29.640 --> 01:34:32.359 of I'm not frustrated with you it's just my mind 1659 01:34:32.439 --> 01:34:34.359 is kind of turning to most of a certain point. 1660 01:34:34.399 --> 01:34:41.840 Lewis V. What's up women going for? I'm your due 1661 01:34:41.880 --> 01:34:43.319 one dollar? How do you claim to be a Christian 1662 01:34:43.359 --> 01:34:46.479 when you've never had visions of huge breasticles in gorge 1663 01:34:46.520 --> 01:34:47.880 with milk? Well, how do you know? I haven't had 1664 01:34:47.960 --> 01:34:50.039 that dream? I just haven't told you guys about it. 1665 01:34:52.640 --> 01:34:55.279 Anonymous three dollars. I love your work. What do you 1666 01:34:55.319 --> 01:34:55.920 think is the best? 1667 01:34:56.680 --> 01:34:56.840 Who? 1668 01:34:57.079 --> 01:35:03.359 Wait, what you think is the best better quality? And 1669 01:35:03.560 --> 01:35:07.800 what should you focus on? I think the best thing 1670 01:35:07.880 --> 01:35:08.239 you can. 1671 01:35:08.199 --> 01:35:10.319 Do in debate is to. 1672 01:35:13.640 --> 01:35:20.399 Try to be defeated and being serious. What yes, I'm 1673 01:35:20.439 --> 01:35:22.960 being one er percent serious. Why would you try to 1674 01:35:23.000 --> 01:35:27.039 be defeated? Because what I want to do in a 1675 01:35:27.119 --> 01:35:33.399 debate is know everything about the other position as good 1676 01:35:33.439 --> 01:35:37.399 as or better than they do, And I want the 1677 01:35:37.560 --> 01:35:40.520 truth so bad that I actually want. 1678 01:35:40.479 --> 01:35:45.279 Them to show me if I'm wrong. I think that's 1679 01:35:45.359 --> 01:35:45.680 the key. 1680 01:35:45.800 --> 01:35:48.239 But I think most people probably think that I go 1681 01:35:48.399 --> 01:35:50.479 into a debate or I go about this kind of 1682 01:35:50.520 --> 01:35:55.279 stuff just to show off or just to always cop 1683 01:35:55.319 --> 01:35:59.399 a win. Actually know the way that I think I 1684 01:35:59.479 --> 01:36:02.359 got to be good at what I do in this 1685 01:36:02.520 --> 01:36:09.239 domain is through always wanting to be corrected if I 1686 01:36:09.359 --> 01:36:11.399 was wrong, and I've been wrong about many things. 1687 01:36:11.399 --> 01:36:14.239 In fact, I was thinking the other day about making. 1688 01:36:14.039 --> 01:36:17.119 A YouTube video about all the places I was wrong, 1689 01:36:17.680 --> 01:36:20.359 because YouTube now like all these the videos that are popular, 1690 01:36:20.359 --> 01:36:21.920 the ones that pop up are like these kinds of 1691 01:36:22.000 --> 01:36:25.520 like personal. You know, I was wrong about everything, So 1692 01:36:25.920 --> 01:36:27.800 I was thinking about making some kind of video like that. 1693 01:36:28.159 --> 01:36:32.840 So I think people mistakenly think the debate is a 1694 01:36:32.960 --> 01:36:36.199 thing where you're just going in to demonstrate how right 1695 01:36:36.279 --> 01:36:38.960 you are. That's actually not what you're doing. What you're 1696 01:36:39.000 --> 01:36:41.560 doing is you want to go in and you actually 1697 01:36:41.680 --> 01:36:45.520 want to be corrected if you're wrong, and so, well, 1698 01:36:45.640 --> 01:36:49.479 how would that make me win debates? Because if I 1699 01:36:50.119 --> 01:36:53.720 am debating somebody who's a Muslim and I'm listening to 1700 01:36:53.800 --> 01:36:57.960 their debates, I want to know what their good arguments 1701 01:36:58.000 --> 01:37:00.720 are and where they're right and if they are right. 1702 01:37:00.920 --> 01:37:04.760 Maybe they're not, but maybe they are. So this process 1703 01:37:04.880 --> 01:37:09.560 of always and not every human being is going to 1704 01:37:09.600 --> 01:37:10.279 be successful in this. 1705 01:37:10.439 --> 01:37:12.840 Sometimes you're gonna fail at it because you're human, you're limited, 1706 01:37:12.880 --> 01:37:14.560 you're weak, you don't have not all the time in 1707 01:37:14.600 --> 01:37:19.119 the world. But if you're at least trying to understand 1708 01:37:19.399 --> 01:37:23.760 the other position. You're gonna be much better off than 1709 01:37:24.000 --> 01:37:27.880 if you're not and you're just playing games and you're whatever. 1710 01:37:28.039 --> 01:37:30.399 And some of you might think that, oh, he's ignored 1711 01:37:30.479 --> 01:37:33.880 my argument. It's because I can already since within about 1712 01:37:34.119 --> 01:37:37.159 twenty thirty seconds, that you don't have a good argument. Sorry, 1713 01:37:37.960 --> 01:37:39.720 And you can interpret her however you want. You can 1714 01:37:39.760 --> 01:37:41.119 think I'm ignoring you and I'm scared of you. 1715 01:37:41.279 --> 01:37:42.760 Whatever. It's fine. I'm not. 1716 01:37:43.399 --> 01:37:46.520 I can tell right away. And that's because I've been 1717 01:37:46.520 --> 01:37:49.279 doing this since I was eighteen or nineteen. So some 1718 01:37:49.359 --> 01:37:52.920 people have been playing guitar since they were teenagers. I've 1719 01:37:52.920 --> 01:37:56.479 been doing this, and that's why I do have a 1720 01:37:56.560 --> 01:38:00.399 reputation of not losing debates, because I go into debates 1721 01:38:00.439 --> 01:38:03.880 wanting to lose debates, meaning that I want to know 1722 01:38:04.279 --> 01:38:08.920 the actual position and arguments of the opponent. And I 1723 01:38:09.000 --> 01:38:11.399 can only think of a couple times in public debates 1724 01:38:11.439 --> 01:38:13.399 since I've been doing them on YouTube at least. I mean, 1725 01:38:13.399 --> 01:38:15.760 I've been doing debates since I was eighteen nineteen, but 1726 01:38:16.520 --> 01:38:19.800 in terms of public YouTube debates, I can only think 1727 01:38:19.840 --> 01:38:22.960 of a couple times where and this is this happens 1728 01:38:23.000 --> 01:38:25.239 in debates because you don't always know, for example, what 1729 01:38:25.279 --> 01:38:27.560 people are going to bring in their opening statement, and 1730 01:38:27.640 --> 01:38:29.439 you don't always know what they're going to bring across 1731 01:38:29.680 --> 01:38:34.199 examinations or rebuttals, right, so they might bring some. 1732 01:38:34.199 --> 01:38:35.600 Of the table that you've never heard. 1733 01:38:37.239 --> 01:38:40.000 They might in their opening statement throughout something that you 1734 01:38:40.079 --> 01:38:42.079 don't know about. And I can think of a couple 1735 01:38:42.239 --> 01:38:46.359 times in public debates where people through curve balls or 1736 01:38:46.479 --> 01:38:47.279 through stuff at me. 1737 01:38:47.319 --> 01:38:48.520 That I wasn't really familiar with. 1738 01:38:49.199 --> 01:38:51.720 But even that doesn't necessarily mean you lose the whole debate, 1739 01:38:51.920 --> 01:38:54.600 because debates cover a lot. They can cover, you know, 1740 01:38:55.079 --> 01:38:58.640 a lot of broad topics, a lot of information, a 1741 01:38:58.720 --> 01:39:02.439 lot of disputed points. So I think winning and losing 1742 01:39:02.520 --> 01:39:07.960 debates ultimately ends up being about who has overall the 1743 01:39:08.039 --> 01:39:12.359 best argument. Unfortunately, a lot of debates nowadays ends up 1744 01:39:12.479 --> 01:39:16.600 coming down to thirty second clips, which is really lame. 1745 01:39:17.680 --> 01:39:19.520 There's not really any way to stop that, but. 1746 01:39:21.199 --> 01:39:23.960 People have such shot attention spans and everybody's so lazy 1747 01:39:24.079 --> 01:39:26.560 that I guess that's kind of unavoidable. 1748 01:39:26.600 --> 01:39:27.000 But I don't know. 1749 01:39:27.039 --> 01:39:30.119 I just spent like twenty minutes replying to a question 1750 01:39:30.159 --> 01:39:33.840 about debate. So I think if you wanted to be 1751 01:39:33.920 --> 01:39:35.479 a good debater. What I would focus on. 1752 01:39:35.720 --> 01:39:38.840 I always tell people go listen to the Monson Steining 1753 01:39:38.880 --> 01:39:42.439 debate about five or ten times, take notes on it. 1754 01:39:43.319 --> 01:39:45.319 Learn the way that Bonson. 1755 01:39:44.960 --> 01:39:47.159 Debates, because he was probably one of the best debaters 1756 01:39:47.199 --> 01:39:51.159 at least the last century. He's just a master at 1757 01:39:51.199 --> 01:39:53.319 It doesn't mean I agree with all his positions, but 1758 01:39:53.399 --> 01:39:54.199 he was a really good debater. 1759 01:39:55.119 --> 01:39:57.600 I wish. Actually, the sad part is that I wish 1760 01:39:57.840 --> 01:39:59.199 Monson had done more debates. 1761 01:40:00.000 --> 01:40:02.159 I've had a lot of really fascinating, great debates to 1762 01:40:02.239 --> 01:40:04.319 study if he had done more. 1763 01:40:04.479 --> 01:40:05.680 Of course, Bonson died. 1764 01:40:05.520 --> 01:40:11.119 Somewhat young, but I would say study Greg Bonson's Gornstein 1765 01:40:11.199 --> 01:40:13.880 debate and his other debates, because even the Tabash debate 1766 01:40:13.920 --> 01:40:14.600 there's stuff. 1767 01:40:14.399 --> 01:40:17.000 To study there as well. I've done reviews of all 1768 01:40:17.039 --> 01:40:18.920 those debates on my channel if you go into the archives. 1769 01:40:20.399 --> 01:40:23.800 But yeah, it's not for everybody. It's not a. 1770 01:40:25.359 --> 01:40:28.600 It's not a talent or a thing that many people respect. 1771 01:40:28.680 --> 01:40:31.680 I guess the Internet makes it somewhat respectable, but. 1772 01:40:33.279 --> 01:40:33.600 I don't know. 1773 01:40:34.439 --> 01:40:35.399 People just think that. 1774 01:40:35.520 --> 01:40:38.840 You're a jerk and that you're just trying to be mean, 1775 01:40:39.039 --> 01:40:41.199 or that you just want to show out and that's 1776 01:40:41.279 --> 01:40:43.399 not really what it is. I mean, it really is 1777 01:40:43.479 --> 01:40:45.319 about pursuit of truth. 1778 01:40:48.439 --> 01:40:55.600 Anyway. So you say, what should I focus on? 1779 01:40:56.159 --> 01:40:58.359 Well, if I was just starting out, I would say, again, 1780 01:40:58.520 --> 01:41:01.920 watch the Boston Stein debate and learn the basic fallacies. 1781 01:41:01.960 --> 01:41:02.840 That's like step one. 1782 01:41:04.680 --> 01:41:07.039 And obviously, you know, if you watch a lot of debates, 1783 01:41:07.520 --> 01:41:09.680 you're gonna notice how how it goes, the. 1784 01:41:09.760 --> 01:41:16.279 Flow, how people operate. And I would just start taking 1785 01:41:16.319 --> 01:41:19.199 philosophy classes. I mean, you really can't. You can't be 1786 01:41:19.239 --> 01:41:24.079 an effective debater if you haven't had some basic philosophy classes. 1787 01:41:24.279 --> 01:41:26.800 You need a logic class, you need a pistemology class, 1788 01:41:28.359 --> 01:41:31.439 you probably need metaphysics class, ethics class. 1789 01:41:33.039 --> 01:41:36.039 I mean, it just depends on how far you want 1790 01:41:36.079 --> 01:41:37.840 to go. Same with like people say this about music, 1791 01:41:37.960 --> 01:41:40.159 I want to learn the guitar, Well are you sure? 1792 01:41:40.279 --> 01:41:41.960 I mean, you're gonna have to do some work. 1793 01:41:42.840 --> 01:41:45.199 You're not gonna be able to like listen to the 1794 01:41:45.279 --> 01:41:47.359 bonds and signed debate and then suddenly you're a debater. 1795 01:41:47.439 --> 01:41:49.720 It just doesn't work like anything like this. Just like 1796 01:41:49.800 --> 01:41:52.119 playing guitar classical, like you have to put a lot 1797 01:41:52.119 --> 01:41:55.840 of time in so but that's the start, David, A 1798 01:41:55.920 --> 01:41:56.720 one dollar take is so much? 1799 01:41:56.760 --> 01:41:59.159 Clip and trim one dollar? You should? Should we open 1800 01:41:59.239 --> 01:42:00.239 up a clip and trim him? 1801 01:42:00.439 --> 01:42:03.359 On Bitcoin Island, you can try because it's going to 1802 01:42:03.399 --> 01:42:05.159 be libertarian fantasy island. 1803 01:42:05.239 --> 01:42:07.279 And I mean it's that means it's a free market, bro. 1804 01:42:07.880 --> 01:42:09.399 So you know, if you want to be over there 1805 01:42:09.439 --> 01:42:15.239 cutting tattoos hair, maybe, but also if tattoo is our 1806 01:42:15.359 --> 01:42:19.840 private security contractor enforcer, if you cut his hair wrong, 1807 01:42:20.920 --> 01:42:21.720 you might wake. 1808 01:42:21.680 --> 01:42:27.159 Up missing a finger or two. So that's your Jess McCall. 1809 01:42:28.760 --> 01:42:33.840 Trevor, it's a very nineties preppy dude named Trevor. 1810 01:42:36.920 --> 01:42:37.880 Hello, can you hear me? 1811 01:42:38.239 --> 01:42:38.479 Huh? 1812 01:42:39.680 --> 01:42:40.199 How's it going? 1813 01:42:40.279 --> 01:42:42.800 Chair good? I mean, I'm a little tired of my 1814 01:42:42.840 --> 01:42:43.960 mind as motion, but what's up? 1815 01:42:45.239 --> 01:42:47.920 Yeah, I've been on here. I get why you didn't 1816 01:42:47.920 --> 01:42:50.159 pick me for the last few times i've been on here. 1817 01:42:50.199 --> 01:42:52.560 I'm a pretty like ain't on account, but I have 1818 01:42:52.640 --> 01:42:58.039 a few questions about tag if you'll answer them, Okay, Yeah, 1819 01:42:58.119 --> 01:43:02.000 they're the generic questions us from the outset. I just 1820 01:43:02.079 --> 01:43:05.039 get the impression that it's begging the question, and uh, 1821 01:43:05.880 --> 01:43:08.640 I do have a problem with the premise, the impossibility 1822 01:43:08.680 --> 01:43:09.439 of the contrary. 1823 01:43:11.279 --> 01:43:14.199 So, so if I say X is a necessary condition 1824 01:43:14.279 --> 01:43:16.520 of why why therefore X? Do you think that's not 1825 01:43:16.720 --> 01:43:17.600 a valid form? 1826 01:43:20.119 --> 01:43:20.279 Yeah? 1827 01:43:20.359 --> 01:43:22.159 I think I think the form is correct. I just 1828 01:43:23.000 --> 01:43:24.319 proving proving the premise. 1829 01:43:24.520 --> 01:43:26.800 The impossibility of the contrary is just something I have 1830 01:43:26.960 --> 01:43:28.439 a I'm just curious about. 1831 01:43:28.960 --> 01:43:31.199 Well, I mean, that's not the only way that you 1832 01:43:31.520 --> 01:43:33.720 can state the argument. You can state the argument that 1833 01:43:34.560 --> 01:43:38.640 only the Christian paradigm gives an account for ethics, metaphysics, 1834 01:43:38.680 --> 01:43:41.640 and epistemology. I could phrase it like that, so I 1835 01:43:41.680 --> 01:43:43.039 don't have to use I don't use you have to 1836 01:43:43.159 --> 01:43:46.439 use the phraseology of by the impossibility of the contrary? 1837 01:43:47.520 --> 01:43:50.960 Okay, how do you how do you prove the well? 1838 01:43:51.079 --> 01:43:54.159 Because any other paradigm is not going to be able 1839 01:43:54.199 --> 01:43:58.640 to give an account for knowledge ethicsstem, I mean metaphysics, 1840 01:43:59.520 --> 01:43:59.920 mm hmm. 1841 01:44:00.039 --> 01:44:00.920 How do you How do you prove that? 1842 01:44:01.000 --> 01:44:01.159 Though? 1843 01:44:01.520 --> 01:44:05.359 Because there's a limited number of starting points for any 1844 01:44:05.520 --> 01:44:11.079 possible position in ethics, epistemology, in metaphysics, it's not an 1845 01:44:11.119 --> 01:44:12.039 infinite variety. 1846 01:44:13.600 --> 01:44:15.560 Sure, I get that, but how do you demonstrate that 1847 01:44:15.640 --> 01:44:17.119 the other world views can't account for that? 1848 01:44:18.680 --> 01:44:23.199 Because the other worldviews have to choose some binary in 1849 01:44:23.479 --> 01:44:28.119 either in either those three disciplines. So for example, either 1850 01:44:28.479 --> 01:44:35.720 knowledge is objective or it's subjective. Okay, there's not an 1851 01:44:35.760 --> 01:44:38.840 infinite there's not an infinite series of options that you 1852 01:44:38.880 --> 01:44:42.119 could choose to give an account for that binary. 1853 01:44:43.399 --> 01:44:47.159 Yeah, and either one you either route you choose is. 1854 01:44:47.239 --> 01:44:49.880 Going to determine a bunch of other things in the 1855 01:44:49.960 --> 01:44:52.640 system or in the worldview. So likewise, with metaphysics, like 1856 01:44:53.319 --> 01:44:57.359 either the universe you know, is eternal or it has 1857 01:44:57.479 --> 01:44:58.000 a beginning. 1858 01:44:58.960 --> 01:45:00.960 Yeah, there's not an infinet variation in there. 1859 01:45:02.239 --> 01:45:02.439 Yeah. 1860 01:45:02.479 --> 01:45:05.000 How do you also handle the begging the question part? 1861 01:45:05.000 --> 01:45:07.359 Because for me on the outset, it just seems like it's. 1862 01:45:07.279 --> 01:45:09.960 Begging the question. How would you handle that type. 1863 01:45:09.760 --> 01:45:12.319 Of Well, why is it begging the question? I mean, 1864 01:45:12.399 --> 01:45:14.640 if you admitted that the form is valid, why would 1865 01:45:14.680 --> 01:45:16.439 it be begging the question? That would that would call 1866 01:45:16.439 --> 01:45:17.319 it a question the form? 1867 01:45:18.159 --> 01:45:24.000 Yeah, well, isn't God accounting for the transcendentals and stuff? 1868 01:45:24.199 --> 01:45:30.079 In the premise, The argument is that there is knowledge. 1869 01:45:30.680 --> 01:45:34.800 Knowledge is only possible if there are transcendental categories. Transcendental 1870 01:45:34.880 --> 01:45:38.880 categories are only grounded or made sense if it can 1871 01:45:38.960 --> 01:45:40.600 only be made sense of if God exists. 1872 01:45:42.960 --> 01:45:46.000 Okay, so you're saying it's just am I mistaking the 1873 01:45:47.000 --> 01:45:48.239 conclusion for a premise here? 1874 01:45:48.319 --> 01:45:48.920 Is that what I think? 1875 01:45:48.960 --> 01:45:49.000 So? 1876 01:45:49.239 --> 01:45:52.199 Like, well, I mean if I lay it out that way, 1877 01:45:52.479 --> 01:45:54.760 you can tell me what the problem is, so the 1878 01:45:54.920 --> 01:45:57.359 argument and maybe you just disagree with the argument, then 1879 01:45:57.399 --> 01:46:03.600 I need to know why if knowledge exists, knowledge is 1880 01:46:04.039 --> 01:46:09.720 predicated on the preconditions of knowledge, which are the transital categories. 1881 01:46:10.239 --> 01:46:16.000 Transnal categories are not like self evident or in a 1882 01:46:16.079 --> 01:46:19.000 vacuum like they also have to be grounded in something. 1883 01:46:19.520 --> 01:46:21.039 God does the grounding work for those. 1884 01:46:22.920 --> 01:46:24.920 Okay, yeah, that makes sense. 1885 01:46:27.760 --> 01:46:30.359 Yeah, that's my version of how I present tag. 1886 01:46:30.399 --> 01:46:32.920 I mean other people, there's a lot of goofballs and 1887 01:46:33.000 --> 01:46:34.840 goobers like Matt Slick and people that I. 1888 01:46:34.880 --> 01:46:36.600 Think are idiots that try to do it but they're 1889 01:46:36.640 --> 01:46:38.159 not very good at it. Right. 1890 01:46:38.640 --> 01:46:38.840 Yeah. 1891 01:46:39.520 --> 01:46:40.119 I'll read. 1892 01:46:41.680 --> 01:46:43.840 Father Deacon in and Issa's paper as well, because I 1893 01:46:43.920 --> 01:46:45.359 just wanted to ask you a few of these because 1894 01:46:45.359 --> 01:46:47.319 I know these are popular objections. 1895 01:46:47.800 --> 01:46:48.880 And I welcome those. 1896 01:46:49.000 --> 01:46:52.600 And he actually I think his latest paper addresses the 1897 01:46:54.640 --> 01:46:57.920 last objection that you had. If you haven't read that one, Okay, 1898 01:46:58.039 --> 01:46:59.119 I'll check that out, thank you. 1899 01:47:00.319 --> 01:47:04.119 Yeah, good questions were likely BO disagree. 1900 01:47:05.720 --> 01:47:05.760 Ed. 1901 01:47:05.960 --> 01:47:17.720 D Hey, hey, how you doing. 1902 01:47:18.039 --> 01:47:18.560 What's up man? 1903 01:47:19.279 --> 01:47:20.199 Good to talk to you again. 1904 01:47:20.319 --> 01:47:22.680 Thanks for staying up with a sonatam A bit of 1905 01:47:22.680 --> 01:47:23.079 a night. 1906 01:47:23.000 --> 01:47:26.319 Oul, so appreciate that longevity of the stream. 1907 01:47:29.079 --> 01:47:33.479 I was listening in on some of the libertarian Fantasy 1908 01:47:33.520 --> 01:47:36.680 Island stuff earlier, and uh, pretty funny stuff, but I. 1909 01:47:36.760 --> 01:47:39.079 Kind of liked that idea. I actually kind of want 1910 01:47:39.119 --> 01:47:41.159 to go to libertarian fantasy Island, be honest. 1911 01:47:40.920 --> 01:47:42.680 With you, Yeah, I'm wondering if a guy that talks 1912 01:47:42.680 --> 01:47:47.199 about setting up a barbershop needs to ask for consent 1913 01:47:47.640 --> 01:47:53.560 every time he sniffs the scissors. Yes, actually, yeah, I 1914 01:47:53.800 --> 01:47:56.760 just wanted to pick your brain on the idea of 1915 01:47:58.079 --> 01:48:01.840 what what do you think is the ideal form of government? 1916 01:48:01.840 --> 01:48:04.319 Obviously nothing is perfect and yep. 1917 01:48:04.199 --> 01:48:04.279 But. 1918 01:48:07.760 --> 01:48:10.520 I a libertarian monarchy, that's what I think. 1919 01:48:11.840 --> 01:48:14.399 See, I was phrasing it to a friend of mine 1920 01:48:14.439 --> 01:48:19.640 as a constitutional monarchy. Would that be, I mean, in 1921 01:48:19.760 --> 01:48:21.359 line with what you're saying or think. 1922 01:48:21.640 --> 01:48:24.880 Yeah, it's just that, like the historical versions of constitutional 1923 01:48:25.000 --> 01:48:28.079 monarchies are kind of gay. So as long as we can, 1924 01:48:28.199 --> 01:48:30.119 as long as we could divorce it from like the 1925 01:48:30.279 --> 01:48:31.880 constitutional monarchy that like. 1926 01:48:33.439 --> 01:48:34.079 There's a lock. 1927 01:48:34.279 --> 01:48:36.800 I think somebody one of the Enlightenment guys was like, 1928 01:48:37.600 --> 01:48:43.000 we've got to move away from dynastic hereditary monarchy. I 1929 01:48:43.079 --> 01:48:45.079 don't know about that one. That That's what I've never 1930 01:48:45.319 --> 01:48:49.239 been able to figure out whether I think that because 1931 01:48:49.239 --> 01:48:52.600 there's a lot of positives to a dynasty, but there's 1932 01:48:52.640 --> 01:48:54.720 also setbacks drawbacks, So. 1933 01:48:54.800 --> 01:48:57.000 I don't know. I really don't know right. 1934 01:48:58.720 --> 01:48:58.840 Now. 1935 01:48:58.960 --> 01:49:02.800 I know the reference is a bit cringe and overweight, 1936 01:49:02.920 --> 01:49:05.319 but the I don't know. If you're into the Game 1937 01:49:05.359 --> 01:49:06.359 of Thrones, that all right? 1938 01:49:06.520 --> 01:49:06.960 George R. 1939 01:49:07.079 --> 01:49:09.760 Martin being a kind of a strange I watched the show, 1940 01:49:09.880 --> 01:49:11.640 but I've never never read the book. 1941 01:49:12.359 --> 01:49:15.119 There's there's kind of a line in the show talks 1942 01:49:15.119 --> 01:49:18.720 about the crown in the faith or the twin pillars 1943 01:49:18.760 --> 01:49:22.399 of the world, and I thought, you know that that 1944 01:49:22.560 --> 01:49:22.800 kind of. 1945 01:49:22.800 --> 01:49:27.520 Stuck with me, like, yeah, expresses that expressview right. 1946 01:49:28.560 --> 01:49:31.760 Thinking thinking about that, I mean that's more ideal, right, 1947 01:49:31.800 --> 01:49:35.520 we talk about like I guess, grievances with the papacy 1948 01:49:35.640 --> 01:49:41.680 and deposing emperors and stuff of that nature, but I 1949 01:49:41.760 --> 01:49:45.319 mean wanting something that's more cohesive, right, Like. 1950 01:49:49.279 --> 01:49:50.119 Am I am I wrong? 1951 01:49:50.159 --> 01:49:51.600 In saying like the. 1952 01:49:53.720 --> 01:49:59.199 Bishops sat next to the Byzantine emperor like a two 1953 01:49:59.359 --> 01:50:00.279 thrones suation. 1954 01:50:01.239 --> 01:50:03.439 Well, that's the whole purpose of the double headed eagle. 1955 01:50:03.520 --> 01:50:05.800 So yeah, right, uh. 1956 01:50:07.199 --> 01:50:11.239 I mean, and it gets into I guess a dodgy territory. 1957 01:50:11.319 --> 01:50:14.039 And I've had quite a few arguments with these guys, 1958 01:50:14.399 --> 01:50:17.520 but I mean, I'm leaning into the idea of at 1959 01:50:17.560 --> 01:50:19.159 that point Christian nationalism. 1960 01:50:20.199 --> 01:50:23.720 And you say that and people get afraid of that one. 1961 01:50:24.760 --> 01:50:26.800 It doesn't bother me or I'm not afraid of it. 1962 01:50:26.920 --> 01:50:29.680 It's just that a lot of the discourse right now 1963 01:50:29.800 --> 01:50:33.720 about Christian nationalism, people think that that's a thing that 1964 01:50:33.760 --> 01:50:34.960 we're going to enact right now. 1965 01:50:36.239 --> 01:50:38.359 I don't know how. I just don't think that's very feasible. 1966 01:50:38.520 --> 01:50:40.880 I think the reason is that, you like, we've already 1967 01:50:40.920 --> 01:50:43.439 been turned into this pagan culture, so I think we 1968 01:50:43.479 --> 01:50:46.600 would have to re christianize the culture, which will take 1969 01:50:46.680 --> 01:50:47.920 which will take a long time. 1970 01:50:48.800 --> 01:50:53.039 Sure, So I think there's there's models in where, you know, 1971 01:50:53.199 --> 01:50:58.119 like I had actually mentioned this too, Owen Schreyer talked 1972 01:50:58.159 --> 01:51:01.000 about discrepancies and payout an x or something like that, 1973 01:51:01.840 --> 01:51:08.199 and how in a way it promotes pornography and that 1974 01:51:08.359 --> 01:51:14.199 being kind of one of the avenues of rotting the culture. Yeah, 1975 01:51:14.399 --> 01:51:20.359 like it monetizes beginning things that were pornographic in nature. 1976 01:51:20.560 --> 01:51:23.600 In my opinion, I'm not saying you can't post it, post. 1977 01:51:23.399 --> 01:51:26.119 What you want and gorge milkers. 1978 01:51:28.279 --> 01:51:32.319 Yeah, leaking overies, leaking memories and. 1979 01:51:32.520 --> 01:51:37.000 Yeah, so spiritual though, right it's uh. 1980 01:51:39.840 --> 01:51:43.720 Okay, So what so you're saying, uh, there's a ethical 1981 01:51:44.039 --> 01:51:46.479 you know, issue with monetizing that. 1982 01:51:46.920 --> 01:51:48.079 And so what was the argument? 1983 01:51:49.399 --> 01:51:51.279 Well, I was making the point to him, it's it's 1984 01:51:51.359 --> 01:51:55.520 what's being monetized pornography kind of rotting the culture, Like 1985 01:51:55.600 --> 01:51:58.399 you said, you know, walk the culture back before something 1986 01:51:58.520 --> 01:52:03.279 like Christian nationalism could take place in the Chinese. You know, 1987 01:52:03.439 --> 01:52:06.520 for all their flaws, they are pretty on the ball 1988 01:52:06.560 --> 01:52:09.960 when it comes to culture war right there. Their social 1989 01:52:10.039 --> 01:52:14.199 media is promote uh, academia like the like they know. 1990 01:52:14.279 --> 01:52:16.520 What damages and doesn't damage populations. 1991 01:52:16.600 --> 01:52:20.880 Yeah, yeah, exactly, And that's something that I think that 1992 01:52:21.880 --> 01:52:25.880 you know, I mean, people are very black and white. 1993 01:52:26.279 --> 01:52:28.720 If he are whatever on Elon Musk. 1994 01:52:29.399 --> 01:52:33.760 It don't matter if you're black, girl, white, that's gonna. 1995 01:52:33.520 --> 01:52:36.680 Be one of his responsibilities, I would think, or anyone 1996 01:52:36.720 --> 01:52:41.279 who owns and manages Western social media. If we want 1997 01:52:41.319 --> 01:52:45.880 to go that way is don't promote the pornography, don't. 1998 01:52:45.720 --> 01:52:49.800 Promote they're saying, yeah, eventually, Yeah, So if we're going 1999 01:52:49.840 --> 01:52:54.319 to have like Christian ethic and nationalism on a social scale, 2000 01:52:54.960 --> 01:52:58.760 there would need to be you know, enactments against a 2001 01:52:58.800 --> 01:53:00.920 lot of this online generousy Yeah. 2002 01:53:00.960 --> 01:53:03.439 I think so. I think we're a good ways away 2003 01:53:03.479 --> 01:53:03.760 from that. 2004 01:53:03.800 --> 01:53:07.560 Though, And I'm not trying to be like, there is 2005 01:53:07.680 --> 01:53:13.159 something to this point that Alex talks about that a 2006 01:53:13.239 --> 01:53:18.199 lot of the legislation I'm suspicious is not ultimately about 2007 01:53:18.279 --> 01:53:21.239 saving kids. I think that I'm concerned that some of 2008 01:53:21.279 --> 01:53:25.520 the legislation that they claim is about prawn might actually 2009 01:53:25.600 --> 01:53:26.359 be about. 2010 01:53:27.000 --> 01:53:33.840 Shutting down dissident political speech. So because a lot of 2011 01:53:33.920 --> 01:53:34.600 times they'll. 2012 01:53:34.439 --> 01:53:36.319 Couch it in this all we care about the they 2013 01:53:36.319 --> 01:53:39.960 don't care about kids, that nobody believes they care about kids. 2014 01:53:41.399 --> 01:53:44.680 And I think the UK was the most recent version 2015 01:53:44.720 --> 01:53:46.119 of this where they were like, oh, we're going to 2016 01:53:47.159 --> 01:53:50.680 set up like age restrictions on the Internet, which makes 2017 01:53:50.760 --> 01:53:54.720 sense theoretically, but I don't think that's really what they want. 2018 01:53:54.800 --> 01:53:57.880 I think ultimately it's about probably eventually trying to have 2019 01:53:58.000 --> 01:54:07.000 some kind of Internet ID type of thing. So I 2020 01:54:07.079 --> 01:54:12.039 don't know what this is all like super complex stuff. 2021 01:54:12.079 --> 01:54:13.079 I don't know what the answer is. 2022 01:54:15.279 --> 01:54:18.239 Read what we need Libertarian fantasy island, I don't know, 2023 01:54:18.399 --> 01:54:21.479 and like everyone like what if everybody has their own. 2024 01:54:21.359 --> 01:54:26.039 Island or something? This is so crazy, I don't know. 2025 01:54:29.439 --> 01:54:30.760 It's like orson Scott. 2026 01:54:30.600 --> 01:54:34.600 Carr's Mormon, like his universe where there's like a Mormon 2027 01:54:34.720 --> 01:54:38.640 planet and a Catholic planet, like like maybe. 2028 01:54:38.479 --> 01:54:40.279 We get out, Like I don't really believe in all 2029 01:54:40.319 --> 01:54:42.680 the space stuff, but could we. 2030 01:54:42.760 --> 01:54:46.359 Have, like instead of nation states, what if we could 2031 01:54:46.399 --> 01:54:48.960 just divide up the Earth to have like you go 2032 01:54:49.119 --> 01:54:53.239 have your degenerate society over here. And if all the 2033 01:54:53.720 --> 01:54:56.319 purple haired freaks want to go live in a crazy cult, 2034 01:54:56.479 --> 01:54:56.840 go do it. 2035 01:54:57.039 --> 01:54:59.600 Go here, go over here, you know what I mean? 2036 01:54:59.680 --> 01:55:01.840 That would the ideal, But of course that's never gonna happen. 2037 01:55:01.920 --> 01:55:06.399 But orthodox bitcoin island over here to go test that out, 2038 01:55:06.840 --> 01:55:09.600 you know, Roman Catholic trad world. 2039 01:55:09.760 --> 01:55:12.439 Go over there, go do your thing over there? Could 2040 01:55:12.479 --> 01:55:12.800 we do that? 2041 01:55:12.960 --> 01:55:13.319 I don't know. 2042 01:55:13.720 --> 01:55:15.880 I mean, that's totally idealistic, it's not realistic, but it 2043 01:55:15.960 --> 01:55:28.039 sounds fun. What's up Rachel. Hello, Hey, Hey, I only 2044 01:55:28.079 --> 01:55:30.640 wanted to say one thing, which is that I already 2045 01:55:30.960 --> 01:55:31.960 I can already tell you. 2046 01:55:32.479 --> 01:55:35.800 That libertarian Fantasy Island is just gonna end up being 2047 01:55:35.880 --> 01:55:36.479 busted uff. 2048 01:55:38.079 --> 01:55:39.039 That is a danger. 2049 01:55:39.119 --> 01:55:43.079 It does seem like, Yeah, I mean the TV show 2050 01:55:44.000 --> 01:55:46.079 I remember watching it as a kid. Wasn't it like 2051 01:55:46.920 --> 01:55:49.039 where they create your fantasy or something. 2052 01:55:50.479 --> 01:55:50.960 I don't know. 2053 01:55:51.079 --> 01:55:51.800 I never watched. 2054 01:55:55.000 --> 01:55:56.880 No, I should have, I'm an eighties kid, but I 2055 01:55:57.319 --> 01:55:58.359 just never watched it. 2056 01:55:58.720 --> 01:55:58.800 An. 2057 01:56:00.720 --> 01:56:02.840 I just know from debating libertarians for. 2058 01:56:02.960 --> 01:56:05.279 Years now, it just ends up being Look, look, I 2059 01:56:05.399 --> 01:56:08.720 want to put something in my buck, so bring me alone. 2060 01:56:09.279 --> 01:56:12.720 Right, Yeah, basically, basically. 2061 01:56:13.760 --> 01:56:14.359 That's all I have. 2062 01:56:14.920 --> 01:56:17.840 Uh, fair enough, great point. That's why we need like 2063 01:56:18.079 --> 01:56:20.800 orthodox bitcoin Fantasy Island. 2064 01:56:24.479 --> 01:56:26.920 So let's see. They made they remade this five years ago. 2065 01:56:27.039 --> 01:56:28.840 Did I see this? I can't remember if I watched this. 2066 01:56:29.439 --> 01:56:35.600 They made a TV show, Fantasy Island. Oh, I did 2067 01:56:35.680 --> 01:56:38.560 see this. I did see Fantasy Island. It was mid. 2068 01:56:43.199 --> 01:56:46.000 In the TV show. It was not what you expect 2069 01:56:46.039 --> 01:56:50.399 you think it's going to be, like I mean, in 2070 01:56:50.479 --> 01:56:53.359 the movie the remake, it just didn't make sense. It 2071 01:56:53.479 --> 01:56:59.640 wasn't very good. It's funny too, because he's like, have 2072 01:56:59.800 --> 01:57:01.720 these path of people don't even know what I'm talking about. 2073 01:57:01.800 --> 01:57:03.399 They've never heard of Fantish. But when you're a kid. 2074 01:57:03.479 --> 01:57:06.520 When I was a kid, I never liked this show. 2075 01:57:06.560 --> 01:57:09.479 I just remember it coming on, right, and you've got 2076 01:57:09.640 --> 01:57:12.119 Ricardo Montalban, who's like the host of this island. 2077 01:57:12.119 --> 01:57:14.199 I don't even know what his pet midget dude is even, Like, 2078 01:57:14.359 --> 01:57:15.399 what's the point of this dude? 2079 01:57:15.960 --> 01:57:18.000 I just he just comes out and screams the plane. 2080 01:57:18.720 --> 01:57:21.560 If you're a kid in the eighties, everybody you you'll 2081 01:57:21.640 --> 01:57:24.680 never forget this because there's this plane bringing the new 2082 01:57:26.039 --> 01:57:28.479 I don't know what they are test. 2083 01:57:28.359 --> 01:57:31.680 Subjects to mk ultra Fantasy Island. I'll show you, guys, 2084 01:57:33.760 --> 01:57:35.399 Fantasy Island. Okay, what is this? 2085 01:57:39.000 --> 01:57:39.239 You got? 2086 01:57:39.319 --> 01:57:41.439 Retard O Montalban. That's one of my favorite jokes of 2087 01:57:41.479 --> 01:57:47.600 all time. So here comes the plane that's bringing the 2088 01:57:47.720 --> 01:57:53.640 new couple. It's arriving at Fantasy Island, and then the 2089 01:57:53.680 --> 01:57:57.760 little midget dude is going to scream Boss Boss the 2090 01:57:57.800 --> 01:57:58.760 plane to plane. 2091 01:58:09.159 --> 01:58:10.880 Delan Slain. 2092 01:58:15.600 --> 01:58:17.880 There you go, they playing they plan. 2093 01:58:18.520 --> 01:58:21.359 I think he does it again too, when uh Ricardo 2094 01:58:21.560 --> 01:58:33.399 Ritardo Montalban picks him up. So you got like little 2095 01:58:33.600 --> 01:58:36.640 like Hawaiian chicks running around. I think this is supposed 2096 01:58:36.640 --> 01:58:39.399 to be some kind of hint hint situation. 2097 01:58:40.880 --> 01:58:46.319 Look, how do you like my new can oh Handsome 2098 01:58:46.520 --> 01:58:48.279 the True very handsome. 2099 01:58:48.720 --> 01:58:49.640 It's my new hobby. 2100 01:58:51.479 --> 01:58:54.399 By the way, did you know Ricardo montalban I think 2101 01:58:54.399 --> 01:58:55.199 he's a tradcat. 2102 01:58:56.000 --> 01:58:58.680 I remember when I was Roman Catholic watching a Rosary 2103 01:58:59.479 --> 01:59:03.279 document and it had Ricardo Montabon in it. 2104 01:59:05.760 --> 01:59:07.720 Anyway, so people. 2105 01:59:07.800 --> 01:59:10.479 Land and then I guess the island makes your fantasy 2106 01:59:10.520 --> 01:59:16.239 come true, but they can't show like whatever degenerate fantasies 2107 01:59:16.279 --> 01:59:19.880 everybody has in an eighty show. So I'm trying to 2108 01:59:19.880 --> 01:59:22.600 remember what the premise of the show is. Let's find out, 2109 01:59:30.399 --> 01:59:42.920 and I'm about done for So what is the premise? 2110 01:59:44.640 --> 01:59:49.720 A luxury, luxurious, remote island resort. The enigmatic mister Rourke 2111 01:59:50.600 --> 01:59:53.880 makes the secret dreams of well healed guests come true, 2112 01:59:54.720 --> 01:59:58.319 although twist of fate turn those dreams sometimes into the nightmares. 2113 01:59:58.720 --> 02:00:03.359 He's assisted by Tattoos, a little person who is always 2114 02:00:03.399 --> 02:00:06.319 trusted to sing out the plane the plane as the 2115 02:00:06.439 --> 02:00:07.079 guests arrive. 2116 02:00:13.279 --> 02:00:15.760 Okay, well that doesn't really tell me exactly what I 2117 02:00:15.840 --> 02:00:16.960 don't know him. It's weird stuff. 2118 02:00:17.039 --> 02:00:23.439 It's probably some kind of mk ultra island or something. Okay, 2119 02:00:26.000 --> 02:00:27.680 I don't know what you're thumbing down. What are you 2120 02:00:27.760 --> 02:00:36.760 thumbing down? You're go ahead, man, what's up? I'm emissary. 2121 02:00:39.960 --> 02:00:41.439 Yeah, I'm just curious. 2122 02:00:41.159 --> 02:00:43.680 As to why you would open a room about debate 2123 02:00:43.840 --> 02:00:47.960 and then you never speak anything about the topic of 2124 02:00:48.239 --> 02:00:49.239 what the room is about. 2125 02:00:50.439 --> 02:00:52.720 I mean, we've been speaking about that for four and 2126 02:00:52.760 --> 02:00:54.079 a half hours. What are you talking about? 2127 02:00:55.319 --> 02:00:57.680 Okay, I've only been here for close to one hour, 2128 02:00:57.880 --> 02:01:01.119 but nothing's been said at all about what it is 2129 02:01:01.239 --> 02:01:03.680 that you believe. I've looked at your profile, I've looked 2130 02:01:03.720 --> 02:01:06.640 at your website. I've looked at a number of things 2131 02:01:06.680 --> 02:01:09.520 that you've posted. The last thirty posts you've made on 2132 02:01:09.640 --> 02:01:13.239 your profile. I have nothing to do with any type 2133 02:01:13.279 --> 02:01:16.680 of scripture. So, and one of the posts that you 2134 02:01:16.800 --> 02:01:20.119 had made, I think it's the twenty ninth post on 2135 02:01:20.239 --> 02:01:22.640 your profile. I was trying to count all the posts 2136 02:01:22.680 --> 02:01:25.199 that you'd made, but one of them said that you 2137 02:01:25.279 --> 02:01:28.920 are not Protestants, you are not Muslim, you're not atheists. 2138 02:01:29.000 --> 02:01:30.520 So what are youthodox? 2139 02:01:31.239 --> 02:01:35.880 Very clear, it doesn't seem very clear at all Orthodox? 2140 02:01:36.279 --> 02:01:36.760 Orthodox? 2141 02:01:37.920 --> 02:01:38.399 Orthodox? 2142 02:01:38.520 --> 02:01:39.279 What Christian? 2143 02:01:43.960 --> 02:01:44.319 Okay? 2144 02:01:44.439 --> 02:01:47.239 You do realize that Christianity came from Judaism, right? 2145 02:01:48.119 --> 02:01:48.319 Yes? 2146 02:01:49.920 --> 02:01:50.279 Okay? 2147 02:01:50.439 --> 02:01:53.800 Do you realize that Passover was not in a tournament offering? 2148 02:01:57.239 --> 02:01:59.479 Okay? It's a meal? Sure? 2149 02:02:01.279 --> 02:02:01.600 Okay? 2150 02:02:02.000 --> 02:02:04.000 So when should Jesus have died? 2151 02:02:04.039 --> 02:02:08.000 If, if, if at all, y'all had accepted sacrifice, when 2152 02:02:08.039 --> 02:02:10.199 should he have died if he was going to be 2153 02:02:10.279 --> 02:02:14.039 an acceptable offering, if y'all even accepted human offerings, which 2154 02:02:14.079 --> 02:02:18.640 he doesn't, can you tell me when he should have died? 2155 02:02:19.319 --> 02:02:19.359 So? 2156 02:02:19.880 --> 02:02:19.920 What? 2157 02:02:20.239 --> 02:02:22.520 What is your group? You're what kind of a weird 2158 02:02:22.600 --> 02:02:23.439 Messianic cult? 2159 02:02:23.520 --> 02:02:23.920 What are you in? 2160 02:02:25.600 --> 02:02:28.239 No, I'm saying if you read the first. 2161 02:02:28.079 --> 02:02:30.239 I want to know your position. You asked me my position? 2162 02:02:30.359 --> 02:02:32.079 I said it? So what group are you from? 2163 02:02:32.920 --> 02:02:33.920 What group are you from? 2164 02:02:34.560 --> 02:02:35.479 The First Commandment? 2165 02:02:35.640 --> 02:02:36.920 What group are you from? 2166 02:02:38.880 --> 02:02:39.760 I'm not a part of a. 2167 02:02:39.760 --> 02:02:41.800 Group, but you're not a part of any group. 2168 02:02:42.039 --> 02:02:42.319 What what? 2169 02:02:42.720 --> 02:02:46.920 You have a bunch of hebrew Ish on your profile? 2170 02:02:47.039 --> 02:02:47.279 Like that? 2171 02:02:47.439 --> 02:02:49.199 Like that makes you better? So you're some sort of 2172 02:02:49.239 --> 02:02:50.279 weird Messianic cult. 2173 02:02:50.359 --> 02:02:52.560 I think anything that you would like to know from 2174 02:02:52.680 --> 02:02:55.560 scripture based upon Hebrew or the Old Testament? 2175 02:02:55.760 --> 02:02:57.600 I will definitely delineate it for you. 2176 02:02:57.720 --> 02:02:59.560 So you're in a cult. Do you believe that you're 2177 02:02:59.560 --> 02:03:02.119 an MS area of the Most High or whatever? So 2178 02:03:02.520 --> 02:03:05.000 you're you're a judaizing heretics. So you don't you're not 2179 02:03:05.119 --> 02:03:06.720 in the church. You don't believe in Christianity. 2180 02:03:06.800 --> 02:03:08.359 Right? Is Jesus divine? 2181 02:03:10.880 --> 02:03:11.560 Absolutely not? 2182 02:03:12.079 --> 02:03:13.439 Yeah, so you're a heretic exactly. 2183 02:03:14.199 --> 02:03:18.880 So you're thinking that that y'all impregnated someone someone. 2184 02:03:18.640 --> 02:03:22.159 Who you can't even talk, You can't even get your 2185 02:03:22.199 --> 02:03:24.560 words out. So do you accept the Bible or not? 2186 02:03:26.359 --> 02:03:29.279 I accept what y'all had given to his people originally? 2187 02:03:29.439 --> 02:03:33.960 You accept the New Testament? No, So are you a 2188 02:03:34.039 --> 02:03:34.880 Messianic or not? 2189 02:03:36.479 --> 02:03:38.439 I'm trying to teach you the First Commandment? 2190 02:03:38.560 --> 02:03:41.520 Right, So you're not going to answer. You're absolutely you're 2191 02:03:41.520 --> 02:03:43.720 a lunatic, So you're not going to answer my questions. 2192 02:03:43.840 --> 02:03:45.279 Moving on, Halo, what's up man? 2193 02:03:56.439 --> 02:03:56.840 He? He? 2194 02:03:57.279 --> 02:03:57.319 This? 2195 02:03:57.560 --> 02:03:57.600 He? 2196 02:03:58.039 --> 02:04:00.079 I think this is a person in total delusion and 2197 02:04:00.159 --> 02:04:03.319 who doesn't even believe anything. He's like his own made 2198 02:04:03.399 --> 02:04:05.680 up things. I don't even think he's a rabbinical Jew. 2199 02:04:05.760 --> 02:04:08.159 He's just like some kind of made up he. 2200 02:04:08.520 --> 02:04:09.920 I mean, they won't say he won't say what his 2201 02:04:10.000 --> 02:04:14.039 position is. So hello, i'm you look where people would disagree. 2202 02:04:14.560 --> 02:04:21.279 Please state your arguments. Don't dissimulate and not tell me 2203 02:04:21.359 --> 02:04:21.840 your position. 2204 02:04:22.000 --> 02:04:22.359 What's up? 2205 02:04:23.760 --> 02:04:23.800 No? 2206 02:04:24.079 --> 02:04:24.239 Much? 2207 02:04:25.239 --> 02:04:27.640 So you guys, I'll see you in here having the 2208 02:04:29.159 --> 02:04:32.399 illusion the conversation. 2209 02:04:33.680 --> 02:04:37.039 I'll like to pay party. Okay, sure, what's what's your position? 2210 02:04:37.119 --> 02:04:38.159 I'm Orthodox Christian. 2211 02:04:41.159 --> 02:04:44.239 I'm also Christian born again Christian? 2212 02:04:46.399 --> 02:04:49.920 Orthodox? Was the difference more like Roman. 2213 02:04:51.560 --> 02:04:52.479 Type Christian or what? 2214 02:04:53.600 --> 02:04:55.720 No, we're not papists. We don't believe in the papacy, 2215 02:04:55.840 --> 02:05:00.279 but we do believe in real sacraments. We do believe 2216 02:05:00.319 --> 02:05:03.520 in the historic you know, church based on appslock succession. 2217 02:05:04.159 --> 02:05:09.439 We believe in tradition seven, eight, nine, ecumenical councils, et cetera, 2218 02:05:09.439 --> 02:05:09.840 et cetera. 2219 02:05:12.479 --> 02:05:15.680 How do you get to become an Orthodox Christian? 2220 02:05:15.760 --> 02:05:18.720 I guess well, I mean to become that is like 2221 02:05:18.840 --> 02:05:21.319 a process called becoming a catechumen So you go to 2222 02:05:21.319 --> 02:05:24.079 an Orthodox church, you attend it for one to three 2223 02:05:24.159 --> 02:05:28.039 years and then learn the faith and then decide. 2224 02:05:27.720 --> 02:05:28.960 If you want to become Orthodox. 2225 02:05:29.840 --> 02:05:32.920 So is this more of a a when you mentioned tradition, 2226 02:05:33.199 --> 02:05:35.640 so is this more of a religious type of thing? 2227 02:05:35.880 --> 02:05:43.239 Not more spiritual base, but more like by deeds, practices, 2228 02:05:43.680 --> 02:05:44.720 things you have to do to. 2229 02:05:46.439 --> 02:05:48.119 Sounds more like Catholic. 2230 02:05:47.800 --> 02:05:52.720 Right, probably to an evangelical. Yes, you would think that 2231 02:05:52.840 --> 02:05:55.560 we are quote Catholic, but we are not Roman Catholic. 2232 02:05:55.640 --> 02:05:58.479 But yes, we do believe in the necessity of good works, 2233 02:05:59.199 --> 02:06:01.199 so it's open look for people who disagree. 2234 02:06:01.279 --> 02:06:04.199 What's up, James? Thank you for those questions. 2235 02:06:06.119 --> 02:06:08.880 That's me who asked to debate one dollar. Thank you, 2236 02:06:09.079 --> 02:06:13.039 appreciate you, Thank you. What's up, James, I'm you. 2237 02:06:16.640 --> 02:06:19.119 I just wanted to ask what your opinion of David 2238 02:06:19.199 --> 02:06:21.479 Bentley hart is theology. 2239 02:06:21.000 --> 02:06:22.119 And works is. 2240 02:06:24.279 --> 02:06:27.079 I think his first work is usually accepted as a 2241 02:06:27.079 --> 02:06:30.000 pretty good book, but he's pretty much become a perennialist 2242 02:06:30.680 --> 02:06:33.800 and so we don't really accept him anymore. 2243 02:06:37.960 --> 02:06:38.640 Interesting, Thank you. 2244 02:06:38.840 --> 02:06:40.680 I mean, how many of his works have you read? 2245 02:06:41.479 --> 02:06:43.760 I read some of the first book, and then I 2246 02:06:43.840 --> 02:06:47.760 stopped reading him when he joined the Democratic Socialist of 2247 02:06:47.800 --> 02:06:59.840 America Party. By the way, we discussed him earlier tonight. 2248 02:07:00.000 --> 02:07:01.720 If you want to look at the critiques of. 2249 02:07:03.640 --> 02:07:13.239 Universalism, Lord Mullin, well he's not just universalists. 2250 02:07:13.239 --> 02:07:16.319 He actually has said on his blog that he's pretty 2251 02:07:16.399 --> 02:07:19.479 much a perennialist. So it's even worse. Go ahead, what's up, man, 2252 02:07:21.399 --> 02:07:22.319 you have a disagreement? 2253 02:07:23.279 --> 02:07:26.159 Uh yeah, I have a question. So do you know 2254 02:07:26.560 --> 02:07:30.560 of the Roman Catholic guye Duong? He's like a a YouTuber. 2255 02:07:31.880 --> 02:07:33.319 I know of him. I don't know him. 2256 02:07:34.359 --> 02:07:36.079 Okay, he did a video. 2257 02:07:36.199 --> 02:07:41.840 I'm just like curious of relations of opposition, and he 2258 02:07:42.039 --> 02:07:45.319 brought a quote of Saint Basil saying that this is 2259 02:07:45.359 --> 02:07:49.279 part of the quote within the identity of substance, the 2260 02:07:49.359 --> 02:07:53.159 properties are distinguished from one another by opposing themselves. 2261 02:07:54.119 --> 02:07:58.960 That's not what is the tonistic relations of opposition doctrine 2262 02:07:59.000 --> 02:08:03.239 that has formulated. Admittedly, according to Kongar and Loski later 2263 02:08:03.359 --> 02:08:05.319 on the Middle Ages, it's not the same thing. Besils 2264 02:08:05.359 --> 02:08:08.920 not saying that the persons are distinguished by a relation 2265 02:08:09.000 --> 02:08:12.880 of opposition. He's saying that there are relations, but and 2266 02:08:13.000 --> 02:08:14.800 that you could say that the father is in a 2267 02:08:14.880 --> 02:08:17.600 sense of posed, but that is not a relative opposition 2268 02:08:17.760 --> 02:08:20.560 by which you try to distinguish a triad, because. 2269 02:08:20.359 --> 02:08:22.520 It's a that would be only applied to a diad. 2270 02:08:22.760 --> 02:08:26.640 Does that make sense? I mean, I've actually addressed this 2271 02:08:26.800 --> 02:08:28.880 like ten times. I don't know why it keeps coming up. 2272 02:08:29.920 --> 02:08:31.680 Okay, I didn't hear you address it? 2273 02:08:33.039 --> 02:08:33.239 Is there? 2274 02:08:33.399 --> 02:08:35.319 Like, is there a video I can go and look 2275 02:08:35.399 --> 02:08:36.520 to get a full Ye? 2276 02:08:37.680 --> 02:08:38.319 Well what would that be? 2277 02:08:38.439 --> 02:08:45.319 I'm pulling it up. So have you read the entire. 2278 02:08:46.840 --> 02:08:51.319 The article that I've referenced multiple times on this from 2279 02:08:51.880 --> 02:08:53.079 not Loski and Congar. 2280 02:08:54.319 --> 02:08:55.560 No, I've never heard this. 2281 02:08:57.039 --> 02:08:59.520 I've never even seen this quote or heard this argument 2282 02:08:59.600 --> 02:09:00.439 from Efflis. 2283 02:09:02.239 --> 02:09:05.520 So what they're doing is they're looking for terminology that 2284 02:09:05.680 --> 02:09:08.880 basil uses that they think is the medieval relations of 2285 02:09:08.920 --> 02:09:13.319 opposition doctrine. The only reason that relations of opposition comes 2286 02:09:13.439 --> 02:09:16.439 up as something that they want to try to use 2287 02:09:17.359 --> 02:09:22.279 is because of distinguishing in a absolutely simple essence. So 2288 02:09:22.760 --> 02:09:28.960 it's literally against the very premise of the Kappadocian triadological formulation, 2289 02:09:29.079 --> 02:09:32.039 which is based on the fathers the sole cause. So 2290 02:09:32.279 --> 02:09:35.880 when you don't have hyposthetic properties, then you need other 2291 02:09:36.079 --> 02:09:40.479 things as a way to distinguish persons. So what medieval 2292 02:09:40.520 --> 02:09:43.560 theologians came up with, and for example, here's the first 2293 02:09:43.640 --> 02:09:46.760 thing to read, which is a Roman Catholic scholar saying this. 2294 02:09:47.159 --> 02:09:50.640 This is Eves Congar, very famous Roman cathol theology and 2295 02:09:50.680 --> 02:09:55.479 it's called Augustine, the Trinity and the Filioque by Eavest Congar. 2296 02:09:56.000 --> 02:09:57.960 If you read this paper, he's going to tell you 2297 02:09:58.079 --> 02:10:02.920 that the develop of relations of opposition is a development 2298 02:10:02.960 --> 02:10:06.720 in the Middle Ages out of Augustinian presuppositions. Okay, so 2299 02:10:06.880 --> 02:10:10.800 that's from Congar, the famous Romemcalaity theologian, and he's going 2300 02:10:10.880 --> 02:10:14.159 to tell you that this isn't what the Kaba Dotionans mean. 2301 02:10:14.239 --> 02:10:18.800 They're not talking about the same thing. Then you're going 2302 02:10:18.880 --> 02:10:24.960 to want to read Laski's paper critiquing the medieval idea 2303 02:10:25.159 --> 02:10:29.159 called the procession of the Holy Spirit and Orthodox Trinitarian doctrine. 2304 02:10:29.319 --> 02:10:33.000 So when this came up, I brought both of these 2305 02:10:33.039 --> 02:10:36.000 things up to multiple Catholics involved in this argument. 2306 02:10:36.199 --> 02:10:38.159 And they said, yeah, I we'll read that. They never 2307 02:10:38.239 --> 02:10:39.359 read it, which to. 2308 02:10:39.439 --> 02:10:42.000 Me says that they're not actually interested in seeing what 2309 02:10:42.319 --> 02:10:46.039 the issues really are. What they wanted was quote mine 2310 02:10:46.199 --> 02:10:50.560 to make it look like Basil teaches the medieval Tomus 2311 02:10:50.680 --> 02:10:56.760 doctrine of relations of opposition, which is dumb. Literally, Congar 2312 02:10:56.840 --> 02:11:02.479 will tell you the capit oceans don't have the Augustinian idea. 2313 02:11:02.359 --> 02:11:07.000 Of transparent theology, and that's why Constantinople one is not 2314 02:11:07.079 --> 02:11:10.279 Augustinian transarent theology. It accepts Cappadocian model stuff. 2315 02:11:10.439 --> 02:11:13.600 So read these two articles because they will make clear 2316 02:11:13.800 --> 02:11:15.920 what I'm what I was arguing from the get go, 2317 02:11:16.880 --> 02:11:21.640 especially the Lasky paper where in the first four pages 2318 02:11:21.800 --> 02:11:24.720 he critiques the notion of relations of opposition. 2319 02:11:27.600 --> 02:11:30.159 Okay, I'll uh, I'll. 2320 02:11:30.039 --> 02:11:30.640 Read those through. 2321 02:11:31.079 --> 02:11:33.960 I have one last question, what do you What did 2322 02:11:34.039 --> 02:11:37.920 you make of Father Josida Trenham going on a voice 2323 02:11:37.960 --> 02:11:39.479 of reason in that whole discussion. 2324 02:11:41.319 --> 02:11:48.359 So I was curious to know if, uh, perhaps the 2325 02:11:48.439 --> 02:11:50.359 guy I don't remember his name, but he may have 2326 02:11:50.479 --> 02:11:55.319 presented himself as an Orthodox person or a cateculum or an. 2327 02:11:55.279 --> 02:12:00.279 Inquirer reason huh voice of reason? 2328 02:12:00.399 --> 02:12:01.720 No, No, the other guy, I I don't know that 2329 02:12:01.760 --> 02:12:04.319 guy's name, the roots of Orthodoxy. 2330 02:12:04.399 --> 02:12:08.479 Yeah, yeah, like he might have said to Father Trunbacher 2331 02:12:08.520 --> 02:12:11.800 whatever his name is, and Father Josiah, hey, I'm Orthodoxy inquirer. 2332 02:12:11.840 --> 02:12:13.079 Will you come to an interview. Now. 2333 02:12:15.159 --> 02:12:18.079 I don't know how he presented himself to them, but 2334 02:12:18.960 --> 02:12:21.159 I will think I will say that it's odd that, 2335 02:12:22.279 --> 02:12:25.199 you know, I think Father Josiah had said some years 2336 02:12:25.279 --> 02:12:28.680 back that in the case of I think he meant me, 2337 02:12:28.800 --> 02:12:30.520 and he don't know if he named me, but he said, 2338 02:12:30.920 --> 02:12:33.079 you probably shouldn't be making content. 2339 02:12:32.800 --> 02:12:34.079 If you're a new convert. 2340 02:12:34.199 --> 02:12:34.359 You know. 2341 02:12:34.600 --> 02:12:37.640 This is something he said around the time of my 2342 02:12:38.000 --> 02:12:40.600 coming into Orthodoxy twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen. A lot of 2343 02:12:40.640 --> 02:12:42.720 people thought he was talking about Maybe maybe he wasn't. 2344 02:12:42.760 --> 02:12:43.119 I don't know. 2345 02:12:43.680 --> 02:12:47.359 But my point is that it is interesting that in 2346 02:12:47.479 --> 02:12:51.039 my case he would say you're held to this high standard, 2347 02:12:51.680 --> 02:12:53.119 but he didn't seem. 2348 02:12:52.960 --> 02:12:56.319 To care to check. In the case of Roots of Orthodoxy, 2349 02:12:59.399 --> 02:13:00.880 was the reason was. 2350 02:13:00.880 --> 02:13:03.399 That interview like set up by Roots? 2351 02:13:05.159 --> 02:13:05.800 I've heard. 2352 02:13:05.840 --> 02:13:07.560 I don't know this is the case, but I've heard 2353 02:13:07.680 --> 02:13:11.880 that the Roots of Orthodoxy guy is the content person 2354 02:13:11.960 --> 02:13:13.840 that runs Voice of Reason stuff. 2355 02:13:15.039 --> 02:13:17.680 Oh, I mean maybe that's not true. 2356 02:13:17.680 --> 02:13:18.039 I don't know. 2357 02:13:19.119 --> 02:13:21.239 Okay, well that was all. 2358 02:13:21.600 --> 02:13:26.239 Thanks, but be sure and uh, please do read the 2359 02:13:26.279 --> 02:13:30.600 the Kungar paper. It's not that long, and then read and. 2360 02:13:30.640 --> 02:13:34.279 Please do read the loss Key paper because I think 2361 02:13:34.319 --> 02:13:36.840 you'll see that you'll see what I'm saying, and that 2362 02:13:37.039 --> 02:13:40.199 the stuff that they're saying is really kind of ridiculous. 2363 02:13:40.319 --> 02:13:41.840 It would be things would go a lot better if 2364 02:13:41.840 --> 02:13:42.840 they would just look at this stuff. 2365 02:13:44.239 --> 02:13:45.479 What's up? You keep thumbing down? 2366 02:13:45.520 --> 02:13:45.640 Man? 2367 02:13:45.680 --> 02:14:13.079 What's your problem? Go ahead? What's up? 2368 02:14:13.119 --> 02:14:13.319 Hello? 2369 02:14:13.840 --> 02:14:19.319 Yeah, yeah, I'm from I'm from Nigeria. I came across 2370 02:14:19.359 --> 02:14:24.039 your contents recently, like two two weeks ago. It was 2371 02:14:24.119 --> 02:14:26.239 through Andrew Wilson. Actually I watched one of his debates 2372 02:14:26.720 --> 02:14:28.640 shout out Rachel as well, I can see her hair. 2373 02:14:29.800 --> 02:14:33.359 So he was talking about how you're apparently good debate 2374 02:14:33.560 --> 02:14:37.640 for theological arguments and stuff. But I have a couple 2375 02:14:37.680 --> 02:14:41.000 of atheist friends, kind of atheists, kind of adious friends, 2376 02:14:41.000 --> 02:14:43.279 and you talked about how the transgender argument is one 2377 02:14:43.279 --> 02:14:46.920 of the best arguments for the existence of God. So 2378 02:14:47.640 --> 02:14:50.199 I watched a couple of your debates my dealer Auntie 2379 02:14:50.239 --> 02:14:54.279 and some other people about the arguments. But you also 2380 02:14:54.359 --> 02:14:56.600 mentioned something. You said that when it gets to the 2381 02:14:56.680 --> 02:15:01.800 pragmatic level, that arguments are inherently circular, like because you're 2382 02:15:02.039 --> 02:15:05.520 using God to justify the existence of God something like that. Right, 2383 02:15:06.039 --> 02:15:07.880 But then I started thinking about it, why can't and 2384 02:15:08.000 --> 02:15:10.800 it is just see because me I also, like I am, 2385 02:15:11.399 --> 02:15:14.079 I'm questioning my own beliefs, right, so I want to 2386 02:15:14.119 --> 02:15:17.319 really understand I like gets distinct fully fleshed out why can't. 2387 02:15:17.560 --> 02:15:20.960 And it is constantly just see that's logic or inductions, 2388 02:15:21.239 --> 02:15:23.840 saying that, like this thing, these things just exists, the 2389 02:15:23.880 --> 02:15:27.279 preconditions for the existence of knowledge, things like the self 2390 02:15:27.800 --> 02:15:30.039 causition teleology. 2391 02:15:31.720 --> 02:15:33.920 To come to a debate and to say that they 2392 02:15:34.119 --> 02:15:37.840 just are doesn't do anything, and you can't do that 2393 02:15:37.920 --> 02:15:39.359 in the bay. But that's just as certain. 2394 02:15:40.039 --> 02:15:42.319 But I get that, I get that, I get that, 2395 02:15:42.319 --> 02:15:44.399 but I'm saying that so if they can do that, 2396 02:15:44.479 --> 02:15:48.840 I can be an induction to see. Yeah, But the 2397 02:15:48.920 --> 02:15:51.000 thing is, it can be a justification for because I'm 2398 02:15:51.079 --> 02:15:53.720 using logic to justify the existence of logic, because induction 2399 02:15:53.880 --> 02:15:56.199 is a form of logic. I don't know if that's falicious, 2400 02:15:57.439 --> 02:15:59.520 because that's just what It's not a justification. 2401 02:16:03.640 --> 02:16:09.199 Okay, So the fact that you're using logic to talk 2402 02:16:09.279 --> 02:16:12.680 about can you can you mute the background stuff like 2403 02:16:12.920 --> 02:16:14.640 I'm echoing, yeah, sure. 2404 02:16:14.680 --> 02:16:15.920 That's that's going. 2405 02:16:20.000 --> 02:16:21.399 Yes, true. 2406 02:16:21.560 --> 02:16:23.520 I can't just use logic to just by the existence 2407 02:16:23.520 --> 02:16:25.279 of logic then, right. 2408 02:16:25.279 --> 02:16:28.680 But it's unavoidable. So the fact that if you talk about, 2409 02:16:29.239 --> 02:16:31.479 how do we know that logic is logical? Right? 2410 02:16:31.600 --> 02:16:35.120 We have to utilize logic to talk about logic, but 2411 02:16:35.440 --> 02:16:38.520 that doesn't justify logic. So it's a higher order question. 2412 02:16:38.719 --> 02:16:41.719 So you're raising the bar and you're saying, Okay, what's 2413 02:16:41.799 --> 02:16:47.319 the meta grounding that makes logic possible? So the fact 2414 02:16:47.319 --> 02:16:50.639 that you're using logic it's a category error, that doesn't 2415 02:16:50.639 --> 02:16:54.680 mean it's justifying its use. That's just unavoidable. So you 2416 02:16:54.799 --> 02:16:57.959 need something beyond its use to justify it in an 2417 02:16:57.959 --> 02:16:58.920 epistemic sense. 2418 02:16:58.959 --> 02:17:00.639 How do we know that loge it works? 2419 02:17:01.040 --> 02:17:02.680 The only way to do that is to appeal to 2420 02:17:02.840 --> 02:17:07.239 something that's bigger, larger, you're more universal. That grounds that, 2421 02:17:08.799 --> 02:17:09.280 hen Scott. 2422 02:17:09.440 --> 02:17:10.159 But the thing is. 2423 02:17:10.879 --> 02:17:13.239 Apists could just see what if I just go one 2424 02:17:13.280 --> 02:17:16.200 step for the tracks to find something that's transcendent though 2425 02:17:16.239 --> 02:17:16.559 too good? 2426 02:17:17.680 --> 02:17:18.719 If that makes sense. 2427 02:17:19.319 --> 02:17:23.000 Well by definition that that would be impossible. By definition, 2428 02:17:23.159 --> 02:17:25.959 God is the thing of which there's nothing greater, So 2429 02:17:26.239 --> 02:17:29.200 you can't find another transcend altar ground God. 2430 02:17:30.600 --> 02:17:33.760 But themselves could just tell me that logic would be 2431 02:17:34.360 --> 02:17:37.479 the I guess you would see first or the for 2432 02:17:38.120 --> 02:17:40.719 like the justification for all that exists. They wouldn't have 2433 02:17:40.879 --> 02:17:43.680 to know the existence of good because. 2434 02:17:44.600 --> 02:17:46.520 No, but it doesn't work to do that, Like you 2435 02:17:46.600 --> 02:17:49.879 can't just say it just is like just as what like, 2436 02:17:50.040 --> 02:17:51.399 that's not given an account for it. 2437 02:17:55.040 --> 02:17:57.159 But he could also see that how do I knew 2438 02:17:57.159 --> 02:17:58.840 that good justice is because I would be picking, because 2439 02:17:59.120 --> 02:18:01.159 I'll be using good by the ext. 2440 02:18:01.120 --> 02:18:09.559 That we're not arguing God just is. So again it's echoing. Man, 2441 02:18:09.639 --> 02:18:11.879 hold on, I can't deal with the echo. 2442 02:18:12.479 --> 02:18:15.840 So the transital argument is not saying that all arguments 2443 02:18:15.879 --> 02:18:18.280 a circular so therefore God just is. What we're saying 2444 02:18:18.399 --> 02:18:21.399 is that everybody is at a certain point unavoidable in 2445 02:18:21.440 --> 02:18:24.600 their argumentation, and when you get to that paradigm level, 2446 02:18:24.920 --> 02:18:29.440 you're forced to do some kind of self recursive referencing. 2447 02:18:30.079 --> 02:18:33.440 So the question isn't who can be circular who can't? 2448 02:18:33.520 --> 02:18:38.840 The question is how do you avoid a contradiction within 2449 02:18:38.959 --> 02:18:42.840 the system that negates the system. That's the argument. So 2450 02:18:42.959 --> 02:18:45.520 you can't just say, well, I'm an atheist in logic, 2451 02:18:45.719 --> 02:18:49.399 just is right. And because we're not saying well, God 2452 02:18:49.600 --> 02:18:52.879 just is no, No, we're saying that God does the 2453 02:18:53.000 --> 02:18:56.079 grounding work in an epistemic sense, to ground the transcendal 2454 02:18:56.159 --> 02:18:57.920 categories which make knowledge possible. 2455 02:18:58.079 --> 02:19:00.479 That's not the same thing as saying God just is. 2456 02:19:03.840 --> 02:19:05.760 I'm looking for people who disagree. So you guys are 2457 02:19:05.799 --> 02:19:07.520 raising your hand, please raise your hand. 2458 02:19:07.360 --> 02:19:10.399 If you disagree. And I'm not trying to be rude 2459 02:19:10.399 --> 02:19:12.000 to that guy. If he can fix the echo in 2460 02:19:12.040 --> 02:19:13.399 the background noise, he can come back. 2461 02:19:13.440 --> 02:19:16.319 It's just I can't hear every time I talk, I 2462 02:19:16.440 --> 02:19:23.639 hear myself that going, hey can you hear me? 2463 02:19:23.879 --> 02:19:25.760 Huh hey. 2464 02:19:27.399 --> 02:19:32.440 So I'm pretty new to your channel. I've I've been 2465 02:19:32.479 --> 02:19:38.600 on a journey out of Protestantism, and I don't I 2466 02:19:38.639 --> 02:19:40.920 don't like listening to a whole lot of people, like 2467 02:19:41.239 --> 02:19:43.040 I've already had to deal with a lot of confusion. 2468 02:19:44.040 --> 02:19:50.159 But I've spent I've probably spent like the past ten 2469 02:19:50.559 --> 02:19:54.959 sixteen hours on Sam's channel, and I was listening to 2470 02:19:55.200 --> 02:20:01.719 the responses of the Oriental Orthodox to emphasis and Calcedone, 2471 02:20:02.040 --> 02:20:06.040 and I haven't I haven't found like a good source 2472 02:20:06.360 --> 02:20:08.600 for the Eastern Orthodox position. And I didn't want to 2473 02:20:08.680 --> 02:20:10.159 Just like I said, I didn't want to just listen 2474 02:20:10.200 --> 02:20:10.760 to anybody. 2475 02:20:12.399 --> 02:20:15.399 I mean, we're currently going through an entire, multiple part 2476 02:20:15.520 --> 02:20:17.319 lecture series on my channel. 2477 02:20:18.200 --> 02:20:20.559 Okay, is it what's it called? 2478 02:20:20.719 --> 02:20:24.680 Refuting each Oriental Orthodoxy. We've done two parts in about 2479 02:20:24.760 --> 02:20:26.719 six hours of talk and it's going to be about 2480 02:20:26.760 --> 02:20:29.760 twenty hours, so go watch the first two and be 2481 02:20:29.840 --> 02:20:31.920 on the lookout for that. Nikki D what's up. 2482 02:20:31.840 --> 02:20:52.159 Man, I guess smile on huh okay, cool. 2483 02:20:52.639 --> 02:20:54.479 Yeah, I think we might be a little more productive 2484 02:20:54.520 --> 02:20:58.000 if we focus on civics and political science and maybe 2485 02:20:58.120 --> 02:21:01.559 culture if need be. I'd like to advocate for our 2486 02:21:01.760 --> 02:21:05.440 constitutional republic at the Constitution of the United States of America. 2487 02:21:08.520 --> 02:21:11.600 Okay, I mean that's not really in the topics of debate, so. 2488 02:21:13.040 --> 02:21:17.959 Wow, libertarian is So I figured its civics and political 2489 02:21:18.000 --> 02:21:20.239 science around the table, and I've heard you advocate for 2490 02:21:20.319 --> 02:21:22.760 a theocratic monarchy, So I don't know if you're really 2491 02:21:22.799 --> 02:21:23.520 in favor of that. 2492 02:21:23.639 --> 02:21:26.879 Or if ultimately I don't think we're going to actually 2493 02:21:26.959 --> 02:21:29.920 see that, but I think it's the better form of government. 2494 02:21:31.760 --> 02:21:34.280 Well, I think we just need to restore integrity of 2495 02:21:34.360 --> 02:21:37.479 public servants. I mean, the Securities and Exchange Commission and 2496 02:21:37.520 --> 02:21:40.280 the Federal Trade Commission haven't been doing their job for 2497 02:21:40.399 --> 02:21:45.120 at least decades, and the Federal Reserve Bank hijacked our 2498 02:21:45.239 --> 02:21:46.559 nation in nineteen thirteen. 2499 02:21:46.920 --> 02:21:48.479 Yeah, I agree with that, but how does that tell 2500 02:21:48.479 --> 02:21:49.399 you what integrity is? 2501 02:21:51.239 --> 02:21:55.200 Well, integrity is when I'm referring to the public servants 2502 02:21:55.639 --> 02:21:59.680 right now. They're a bunch of insider trading, regulatory captured, 2503 02:21:59.719 --> 02:22:04.879 black mail, extored it and bribed, compromise, financial conflicts of interest, 2504 02:22:04.959 --> 02:22:05.959 in foreign influence. 2505 02:22:06.200 --> 02:22:08.280 Yeah. I agree with all that, well aware, but that's 2506 02:22:08.319 --> 02:22:10.479 not really the topics of debate today. But thank you man. 2507 02:22:11.280 --> 02:22:16.159 So the topics are listed as Catholicism, atheism, Muslims, libertarianism 2508 02:22:16.280 --> 02:22:21.200 in terms of the philosophy, and protestansm So, if you disagree, 2509 02:22:21.319 --> 02:22:23.440 raise your hand. So we're taking people who disagree. 2510 02:22:25.200 --> 02:22:26.399 I don't we Are we done? 2511 02:22:26.440 --> 02:22:30.239 Are we down to the no more disagrees? Thaie soccer 2512 02:22:40.719 --> 02:22:43.239 ed Flores twenty bucks. Thank you so much, Ed, appreciate that. 2513 02:22:43.440 --> 02:23:22.280 Welcome Jesse, he can't connect. Jordan's right, Hello. 2514 02:23:27.479 --> 02:23:30.239 Hello, what's up? All right? 2515 02:23:30.280 --> 02:23:32.959 Yah yah, mister Jay, thank god. I've been on a 2516 02:23:33.000 --> 02:23:34.479 stay for a lot for a little minute, but thank 2517 02:23:34.520 --> 02:23:39.000 you Christ Okay, So we talked a little bit last week, 2518 02:23:39.239 --> 02:23:42.000 I think on your stream, Thank you very much. And 2519 02:23:42.159 --> 02:23:45.479 so Mike so I'm still the Protestant, but we talked. 2520 02:23:45.719 --> 02:23:48.239 And I also I watched your video on John six 2521 02:23:48.920 --> 02:23:52.799 and the the flash like a two hour video on 2522 02:23:52.879 --> 02:23:56.319 the Eucharist, and because I just wanted to understand, and 2523 02:23:56.360 --> 02:23:58.440 then I read John six for myself and I just 2524 02:23:58.600 --> 02:24:00.920 wasn't I just I wasn't getting like I wasn't convinced. 2525 02:24:01.000 --> 02:24:03.959 And then you but you kept talking about serial the 2526 02:24:04.120 --> 02:24:04.600 thorough guy. 2527 02:24:04.879 --> 02:24:07.239 I don't know if it was of Jerusalem Alexandria, so 2528 02:24:07.319 --> 02:24:10.079 I just assumed it was of Alexandria. I listened to 2529 02:24:10.200 --> 02:24:13.840 his commentary on John six and I was like, Okay, 2530 02:24:13.879 --> 02:24:16.840 now I'm convinced of the Eucharist, but this is that. 2531 02:24:17.200 --> 02:24:19.959 Now I'm convinced of it, but the issues that I 2532 02:24:20.079 --> 02:24:23.360 have is and like this is the basically is the. 2533 02:24:23.360 --> 02:24:24.159 Issue that I have, so. 2534 02:24:26.879 --> 02:24:30.479 That I can relate a lot more to Catholicism because 2535 02:24:31.000 --> 02:24:33.920 like they will define things right, but when like I 2536 02:24:34.000 --> 02:24:37.479 look at the Lucim position on the Eucharist and the 2537 02:24:37.639 --> 02:24:41.479 Orthodox position, the only difference from what I'm looking searching 2538 02:24:41.879 --> 02:24:44.360 is that they just used like orthodox will state is 2539 02:24:44.760 --> 02:24:48.159 versus the loosener state under and so I'm confused. I'm like, well, 2540 02:24:48.159 --> 02:24:49.079 I don't think I know is that. 2541 02:24:49.159 --> 02:24:54.319 Like now we believe in a real priestly based transformation 2542 02:24:54.920 --> 02:24:59.000 into body, blood, soul, and uncreated energy or divinity. 2543 02:24:59.360 --> 02:25:00.719 That's not the Lutheran position. 2544 02:25:01.680 --> 02:25:04.600 Okay, so my question is, in what would you still 2545 02:25:05.000 --> 02:25:07.239 is the all top position? Then it's still bread because 2546 02:25:07.760 --> 02:25:09.479 it past like bed. It looks like bed. 2547 02:25:09.920 --> 02:25:14.399 I'm like it, or and and then and whin I mean, 2548 02:25:14.440 --> 02:25:18.639 we don't typically have the Roman, Catholic, Tomistic medieval idea 2549 02:25:18.799 --> 02:25:21.319 that you know, it has the essence. 2550 02:25:21.079 --> 02:25:23.600 Of God or whatever, but it's or ascuse me that 2551 02:25:23.680 --> 02:25:23.920 it's the. 2552 02:25:25.479 --> 02:25:28.680 Body of blood of Christ, but it's the accidents of 2553 02:25:28.799 --> 02:25:30.799 bread and wine, like I mean, we don't really go 2554 02:25:30.920 --> 02:25:33.479 into that because we do affirm it to be a mystery. 2555 02:25:35.159 --> 02:25:38.159 But I don't I'm not aware of like whether. 2556 02:25:38.040 --> 02:25:42.040 The church fathers explicitly state to what degree there's still 2557 02:25:42.120 --> 02:25:44.600 bread or not, because most of the time they just 2558 02:25:44.680 --> 02:25:48.360 state that it's changed into body, blood, soul, and divinity. 2559 02:25:49.600 --> 02:25:52.000 The divinity there is the uncreated energy. So you have 2560 02:25:52.079 --> 02:25:54.239 to understand that the only way to have this consistent 2561 02:25:54.319 --> 02:25:57.360 position of it really being the deified flesh is to 2562 02:25:57.440 --> 02:25:59.879 have the energy's doctrine, and only the Orthodox Church has. 2563 02:25:59.879 --> 02:26:05.000 The Lutherans, they've been all over the place with consentantiality, 2564 02:26:05.120 --> 02:26:08.840 and Luther himself argued that Jesus flesh became omnipresent and 2565 02:26:08.920 --> 02:26:12.399 that's how it's there, which is silly. That's actually a 2566 02:26:15.000 --> 02:26:18.040 that would be more of like a Monophysite type of position. 2567 02:26:18.280 --> 02:26:21.879 So I think if you, if you dig into it more, 2568 02:26:21.920 --> 02:26:24.280 you'll notice that really the only the Orthodox position is 2569 02:26:24.360 --> 02:26:26.600 consistent on that, and it really does tie into the 2570 02:26:26.719 --> 02:26:29.520 essence energy doctrine. Not trying to be rude, but like 2571 02:26:29.639 --> 02:26:31.680 my mind is turning the mush. So I'll give tie 2572 02:26:31.719 --> 02:26:32.600 one last time. 2573 02:26:33.120 --> 02:26:36.040 And Jordan be sure to come back next time. I apologize. 2574 02:26:36.200 --> 02:26:37.920 I'll try to go to you quicker, go ahead, man, 2575 02:26:38.079 --> 02:26:38.600 last chance. 2576 02:26:39.040 --> 02:26:41.120 I'm you Hey, can you hear me? 2577 02:26:41.280 --> 02:26:41.479 Yep? 2578 02:26:42.719 --> 02:26:42.920 Yeah. 2579 02:26:43.120 --> 02:26:48.120 So I have one question maybe to have you read 2580 02:26:48.159 --> 02:26:51.639 the book Did Jesus Pray for Those Living in the World? No, 2581 02:26:53.799 --> 02:26:59.840 So basically it's a book about Orthodox spirituality by Elder 2582 02:27:00.120 --> 02:27:04.799 from Spiritual Spiritual Child, I guess. 2583 02:27:05.440 --> 02:27:09.280 And one thing I don't understand is that he talks about. 2584 02:27:11.959 --> 02:27:15.559 Ignoring, you know, visions during prayer, even. 2585 02:27:15.399 --> 02:27:16.280 The most Selvafic. 2586 02:27:16.440 --> 02:27:19.639 That's one thing he says specifically, but also the angle 2587 02:27:19.799 --> 02:27:23.360 of Orthodox spirituality is actually like having a vision of 2588 02:27:23.479 --> 02:27:26.879 the uncreated light, so you're kind of doing both at 2589 02:27:26.920 --> 02:27:29.280 the same time, ignoring visions but expecting a vision I 2590 02:27:29.319 --> 02:27:30.000 don't understand. 2591 02:27:31.000 --> 02:27:33.120 Well, the vision of the uncreated light is only going 2592 02:27:33.200 --> 02:27:37.479 to happen at a most likely a very advanced stage 2593 02:27:37.600 --> 02:27:40.600 of a person's spiritual life. And that also comes with 2594 02:27:40.799 --> 02:27:44.479 the presupposition that you are under a spiritual father. So 2595 02:27:44.799 --> 02:27:46.959 one reason in the Orthodox Church that there's a stress 2596 02:27:47.000 --> 02:27:49.680 on having a spiritual father is precisely because he's going 2597 02:27:49.760 --> 02:27:51.799 to be there to help guide you in that process 2598 02:27:52.360 --> 02:27:54.319 so that you don't fall into the delusions like we 2599 02:27:54.440 --> 02:27:58.920 saw earlier with Taylor Marshall thinking in his pre last 2600 02:27:59.040 --> 02:28:01.479 that Mary's appear to him, and with the engorged Milkers, 2601 02:28:01.840 --> 02:28:04.040 that's precisely the kind of thing that the spiritual Father 2602 02:28:04.079 --> 02:28:06.959 would be like, that's not God speaking to you, So 2603 02:28:07.600 --> 02:28:11.079 he would be there to say, you know this, you know, 2604 02:28:11.719 --> 02:28:13.920 you were praying and you felt like, you know, God 2605 02:28:14.120 --> 02:28:16.120 was telling you, you know, in your mind, to go 2606 02:28:16.280 --> 02:28:19.479 do something that's probably not God. But he would also 2607 02:28:19.799 --> 02:28:21.879 you know, be there hopefully for the long term too. 2608 02:28:22.159 --> 02:28:24.399 You know, if in several years you felt like you 2609 02:28:24.479 --> 02:28:27.559 were having real spiritual experiences, he could help guide you 2610 02:28:27.639 --> 02:28:28.399 through that process. 2611 02:28:28.520 --> 02:28:29.719 So there are real. 2612 02:28:29.600 --> 02:28:33.000 Spiritual experiences, but because humans are so susceptible to delusion 2613 02:28:33.120 --> 02:28:35.879 or pre last, it's always under the guide of a 2614 02:28:35.959 --> 02:28:37.159 more advanced type of person. 2615 02:28:38.319 --> 02:28:39.959 Goh, sure, all right, that's it. 2616 02:28:40.159 --> 02:28:44.079 Thank you, Yeah, thank you. I thought you disagreed. Dude, 2617 02:28:44.479 --> 02:28:46.280 you were raising your hand like you disagree. Does anyone 2618 02:28:46.319 --> 02:28:48.840 else disagree? The last chance you got to disagree? Though, 2619 02:28:49.040 --> 02:28:52.520 if you don't disagree, and you're just asking me catechuymic questions, 2620 02:28:52.559 --> 02:28:55.399 which I'm not mad at you. I'm just I'm gonna 2621 02:28:55.639 --> 02:28:59.239 I'm gonna pass out, hippo. Are you disagreeing? 2622 02:29:06.520 --> 02:29:11.799 Mhm, Hello, hey, HODI. 2623 02:29:13.319 --> 02:29:15.959 So this is more of a question. 2624 02:29:16.639 --> 02:29:18.959 I guess disagree. 2625 02:29:20.479 --> 02:29:22.000 I mean, I'm LDS. 2626 02:29:22.120 --> 02:29:22.920 So let's start there. 2627 02:29:27.920 --> 02:29:31.959 My question is, and I've tried to have other people. 2628 02:29:31.760 --> 02:29:33.840 Explain it to me, but I just felt they weren't 2629 02:29:33.920 --> 02:29:36.079 like in a position to be like a teacher of 2630 02:29:36.159 --> 02:29:43.000 this subject. Okay, I'm very sympathetic to a lot of 2631 02:29:43.120 --> 02:29:47.120 what the Orthodox Church uh said and what's in their doctrine, 2632 02:29:47.319 --> 02:29:51.120 Like they believe in theosis similarly to the LDS Church. 2633 02:29:52.440 --> 02:29:55.840 I wouldn't say that it's similar, but okay, go ahead. 2634 02:29:59.040 --> 02:30:02.440 But the ones thing that has always got me and 2635 02:30:02.559 --> 02:30:07.399 why I have not been able to bring myself to 2636 02:30:07.920 --> 02:30:13.200 go to an other sect of Christianity is that I 2637 02:30:13.559 --> 02:30:19.159 cannot wrap my head around the trinity or why Jesus 2638 02:30:19.280 --> 02:30:27.520 Christ would speak in the New Testament to his father specifically, 2639 02:30:27.760 --> 02:30:31.479 if he is both a father and the son simultaneously. 2640 02:30:31.479 --> 02:30:33.639 Well, he's not the Father. That's the whole point of 2641 02:30:33.639 --> 02:30:37.840 the trinity. Trinity is three really distinct and different hypostases. 2642 02:30:39.479 --> 02:30:43.639 So who believes that he is the Father? That's that's modalism, 2643 02:30:43.760 --> 02:30:44.600 That's not the Trinity. 2644 02:30:46.479 --> 02:30:50.200 I guess from what I've understood of how the Trinity 2645 02:30:50.239 --> 02:30:52.440 has been explained to me is that they are. 2646 02:30:53.879 --> 02:30:55.680 Three separate entities. 2647 02:30:55.319 --> 02:30:56.159 But one God. 2648 02:30:56.760 --> 02:30:59.879 No, the three persons are not separate, in fact, that 2649 02:31:00.239 --> 02:31:02.959 dwell one another perfectly in a perfect unity. So I 2650 02:31:03.000 --> 02:31:05.600 would say the first thing to watch is the video 2651 02:31:05.760 --> 02:31:07.600 that we recommended earlier tonight. 2652 02:31:07.399 --> 02:31:10.520 That I did. It's called is Jesus God and is 2653 02:31:10.600 --> 02:31:11.399 God a Trinity? 2654 02:31:11.600 --> 02:31:13.920 And I did this video about six years ago. It's 2655 02:31:14.000 --> 02:31:19.159 right here that will walk through about three hours of passages. 2656 02:31:18.719 --> 02:31:19.559 In the Old Testament. 2657 02:31:20.280 --> 02:31:24.879 And then I did a more specific focused video called 2658 02:31:25.120 --> 02:31:27.959 the Trinity in the Old Testament. And so I think 2659 02:31:28.000 --> 02:31:30.520 when you start to see this throughout the Old Testament, 2660 02:31:30.639 --> 02:31:33.319 you'll notice very clearly that, Okay, this is definitely the 2661 02:31:33.399 --> 02:31:34.600 teaching of the Old Testament. 2662 02:31:35.079 --> 02:31:35.920 And then I did an. 2663 02:31:36.000 --> 02:31:38.280 Entire lecture through all of the Gospel of John, which 2664 02:31:38.280 --> 02:31:39.799 you can also find on my channel. And what we 2665 02:31:39.920 --> 02:31:42.399 noticed in the Gospel John lectures was that every chapter 2666 02:31:42.440 --> 02:31:46.600 of the Gospel of John literally has a reference to 2667 02:31:46.680 --> 02:31:49.159 the deed of Christ and or the Trinity. So the 2668 02:31:49.360 --> 02:31:52.959 entire Gospel of John also harmonizes perfectly with all of 2669 02:31:53.040 --> 02:31:55.799 these Old Testament passages. So I'm not trying to just 2670 02:31:55.920 --> 02:31:58.639 pass it all pass you off, but like literally those 2671 02:31:58.920 --> 02:32:03.760 things will definitely I think, make this point clear, and 2672 02:32:04.000 --> 02:32:05.799 no modalism is different from the Trinity. 2673 02:32:06.639 --> 02:32:08.360 I don't have any more energy. I'm starting to slur 2674 02:32:08.479 --> 02:32:10.879 my words. I'm super tired. Made by Jim Bob with 2675 02:32:10.959 --> 02:32:13.760 a big fat super Chat fifty bucks. Wow, thank you 2676 02:32:13.799 --> 02:32:14.559 so much, Jimbob. 2677 02:32:15.600 --> 02:32:19.239 Guys, be sure if you're not subscribed. Jimbob is over there, 2678 02:32:20.239 --> 02:32:23.639 really powering through debating the atheists. 2679 02:32:23.719 --> 02:32:28.360 He's like, just you thought I had fortitude over here 2680 02:32:28.559 --> 02:32:29.120 with this No. 2681 02:32:29.200 --> 02:32:29.239 No. 2682 02:32:29.440 --> 02:32:32.959 Eight, Jimbob is like got five times of fortitude. I 2683 02:32:33.079 --> 02:32:36.120 do to deal with the atheists for four to five 2684 02:32:36.959 --> 02:32:42.280 four three hours time, So be sure and check out Jimbob. 2685 02:32:42.879 --> 02:32:45.360 Do you disagree, Alex, I'll go to you if you disagree, 2686 02:32:46.200 --> 02:32:51.440 but please no FAQ questions. Only people that disagree. We've 2687 02:32:51.479 --> 02:32:53.799 had a lot of fun tonight. We're going to Libertarian 2688 02:32:53.840 --> 02:32:56.520 Fantasy Island. We're gonna put things in our butt. As 2689 02:32:56.680 --> 02:33:01.799 Rachel said, literally, I'm joking. You have to disagree, dude, 2690 02:33:02.879 --> 02:33:03.879 or else I'm just leaving. 2691 02:33:07.239 --> 02:33:07.399 Yo. 2692 02:33:07.520 --> 02:33:11.879 I disagree, and it's I'm rate to in the way 2693 02:33:11.959 --> 02:33:13.000 you say, espresso. 2694 02:33:14.079 --> 02:33:16.719 I knew it was gonna be a fake disagree or 2695 02:33:16.840 --> 02:33:19.000 I knew it. I knew it. 2696 02:33:21.399 --> 02:33:25.280 I'm going immediately to Libertarian Island, and I'm not passing go. 2697 02:33:25.479 --> 02:33:28.159 I'm not stopping to collect two hundred dollars. Oh no, 2698 02:33:28.280 --> 02:33:32.200 I am passing go Right, nobody disagrees. 2699 02:33:32.760 --> 02:33:35.520 I'm done. I don't have no more energy. But hey, 2700 02:33:35.719 --> 02:33:36.920 be sure and follow Jim Bob. 2701 02:33:37.799 --> 02:33:41.360 He's throwing out fat money super chats, he's throwing out 2702 02:33:41.399 --> 02:33:44.239 that getty Green, he's throwing out that chetta. 2703 02:33:45.120 --> 02:33:47.319 Head on over there to Jim Bob channel and be 2704 02:33:47.399 --> 02:33:51.760 sure and follow and support our buddy Jim