Speaker 1: Saint Helens and Wire got a big headache. Both losses
Speaker 1: would have been tough to take. Yorkham Bulls both chalked
Speaker 1: winds up. Giants look condemned for the Wooden Spoon Cup
Speaker 1: leads set the paced KR lost to Lee for all
Speaker 1: the updates here, John Lee. Welcome to the twenty eighth
Speaker 1: episode of Super League three sixty, a podcast primarily about
Speaker 1: the top tier of British rugby league, but we talk
Speaker 1: about the NRL and whatever else takes our fancy too.
Speaker 1: My name is Lee Addison, my name is John Davidson.
Speaker 1: I'm a coaching Australia. John a journalist in the UK
Speaker 1: with an Aussie accent, and I'm pretty convinced you can
Speaker 1: tell by my voice that I wasn't born and raised
Speaker 1: in Brisbane where I live. To read more about us,
Speaker 1: have a look at the intro or listen to all pods.
Speaker 1: You can also listen to this on the Ashes Rugby
Speaker 1: League Rugby League Coach podcast platforms, as well as a
Speaker 1: Rugby League YouTube too, where you can watch. It may
Speaker 1: be a little late today, but if you subscrib to
Speaker 1: those you want, mister thingo. So thanks to Rugby League
Speaker 1: dot Com, the Super League table as it stands right now, John,
Speaker 1: do you want to preview it for us? Well, I
Speaker 1: just click on the link to get rid of the
Speaker 1: awkward silence.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a lot of movement in the table, speaking
Speaker 2: of a lot of people going up, a lot of
Speaker 2: people going down, a lot of jocking for positions and
Speaker 2: what we've got nine rounds to go. Roughly when Warrington
Speaker 2: the whole car, I've gone next one. But yeah, we're
Speaker 2: really getting to the business time, so it's getting very interesting.
Speaker 1: So eighteen games played already, and as John just intimated,
Speaker 1: ok Are and Warrington still got an extra game to play.
Speaker 1: So they're on seventeen. Giants has rock bottom still and
Speaker 1: looked to be condemned to there for good, I think,
Speaker 1: because they're six points behind all Left C who are
Speaker 1: falling down quite considerable as well. The Giants are in
Speaker 1: fourteenth on four, were Left C in thirteenth on ten.
Speaker 1: We then have a cluster of four on twelve and
Speaker 1: working backwards, it's cast in twelfth, Bradford eleventh, York Night's
Speaker 1: tenth and to lose in ninth my team in eight.
Speaker 1: The Catalan Dragons are on sixteen, Saint Helen's are fall
Speaker 1: from grace and now outside the playoff Sports there seventh
Speaker 1: on twenty two. But they need not despair too much
Speaker 1: because they're one of three teams on twenty two. Lee
Speaker 1: Leopards and sixth and Jo k Are in fifth. But
Speaker 1: like I said, O k Are have that extra game
Speaker 1: to play against Warrington who are above them on fourth.
Speaker 1: They've got twenty four. We've got two teams on twenty six.
Speaker 1: That's Wakefield Trinity in third and Wigan Warriors in second,
Speaker 1: but leading the pile at the moment and it's looking
Speaker 1: pretty much rusted in for a good while. That's Lee
Speaker 1: Rhinos at the top of the tree on thirty points.
Speaker 1: So what jumps out to you there, Johnny boy.
Speaker 2: Well, I think the big ones are obviously hullo Ce
Speaker 2: moving down to second last, and then we've got York
Speaker 2: and to Loose jumping up obviously to Loose now in ninth,
Speaker 2: which is a great achievement in York three wins in
Speaker 2: a row now in tenth. And then the other big
Speaker 2: one is obviously Saint Helen's slipping out of the top six.
Speaker 2: Obviously embarrassed is what their coach described. They're lost to
Speaker 2: to lose today, Lee moving up and Warrington slipping down
Speaker 2: a bit as well, with Wigan now in second and
Speaker 2: Wakefield just ahead of them as well. So More in
Speaker 2: turn have been in first and second for most of
Speaker 2: the season slipping in four. So what's to play for
Speaker 2: at the moment.
Speaker 1: There are a few things in the ladder that do
Speaker 1: jump out to me, Wakefield cementing themselves as one of
Speaker 1: the one of the top side, Saint Helen's dropping out
Speaker 1: of the seven league climbing up now, but also Hull
Speaker 1: Left C's slipping to close to oblivion. The only reason
Speaker 1: they're not in oblivion is Huddersfield are already there. York
Speaker 1: twenty beat Hull Left C sixteen tries to offer luma
Speaker 1: for your to York for enough Aluma Benison, bam, fourth
Speaker 1: Williams and two goals to Bennerson. Hu Left C's points
Speaker 1: came from Caesar Briscoll Bachelor and two goals from Hardacre.
Speaker 1: That's a third consecutive Super League victory for York and
Speaker 1: that's actually the first time it's ever happened in there
Speaker 1: in their illustrious time in Super League.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a big it's a big result. Three wins
Speaker 2: that are pushing them up again at the table, and
Speaker 2: as we all know with the kind of IMG criteria,
Speaker 2: performance is a big one. So the higher York can
Speaker 2: finish up the table be better for them. Same with
Speaker 2: to lose in terms of them staying in Super League
Speaker 2: this year. Cody Hunter again very influential for York. The
Speaker 2: Australian half pack, but I think it's really hol of c.
Speaker 2: I mean, just poor, so many errors, bad defense. It's
Speaker 2: just another season pretty much of the same for it
Speaker 2: has been for quite a while.
Speaker 1: Now let's go back to York. They've had some investment
Speaker 1: or they could have some investment coming. Can you elaborate
Speaker 1: on that? Yeah, weave in the news item. I can
Speaker 1: elaborate a little bit. I haven't had the investment yet.
Speaker 2: They're in talks with I think some of the reporting
Speaker 2: around this has been wrong, But what I do understand
Speaker 2: is there and talks with two groups. One is local
Speaker 2: based and one is not. Nothing's over the line as yet,
Speaker 2: but it seems like they're in a good place in
Speaker 2: terms of this happening. So that's a positive for York
Speaker 2: in terms of their future and their financial security. There
Speaker 2: has been I think reports about Clint goodshoal leaving now.
Speaker 2: I don't think that's nailed on either, but you know
Speaker 2: that's a wait and see at this stage. But yeah,
Speaker 2: there's obviously things happening behind the scenes at York. We've
Speaker 2: talked about them a fair bit in terms of their finances,
Speaker 2: but I think most people would say, with York their
Speaker 2: first ever season in Super League, you know, a good,
Speaker 2: good coach. You know, they're on a very very low
Speaker 2: cap spend, but they've got potential. You know, nice stadium,
Speaker 2: fantastic city, They've got potential as a club. So I
Speaker 2: think the smart thing would be to give them time
Speaker 2: to build on that potential and give them an extended
Speaker 2: stay in Super League to see what they can what
Speaker 2: they can do long term. I think, much like to
Speaker 2: Lose a few years ago, you in one Super League,
Speaker 2: when you're in Super League and then you kick them out,
Speaker 2: what does that really achieve? Not a lot?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean the rumors are starting to spread out
Speaker 1: now that it could come down again to led screens
Speaker 1: and things like that. I mean, if York haven't been
Speaker 1: in a great addition to Super League, then I'm the pulp.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think I think to Loose have
Speaker 2: been a very good in addition too, and then you
Speaker 2: look at their scores. What are those scored one hundred
Speaker 2: and six points in the last two games against Catalans
Speaker 2: and St. Helens. Yeah, I think it's a I think
Speaker 2: it's a similar story. Both those clubs are competing with
Speaker 2: less money and they've not really, you know, complained about
Speaker 2: it publicly. They've just sort of copped at sweet basically,
Speaker 2: And you know, I think I think in both those
Speaker 2: places there's potential. You know, I think we need to
Speaker 2: help the French game, and having two Super League clubs
Speaker 2: in France is a big bonus for the for the
Speaker 2: sport globally, for Europe being regularly. I don't think either
Speaker 2: of those it's coming down to IMG. It's not going
Speaker 2: to be about solely on the table. But I don't
Speaker 2: think either those clubs should be out of super League
Speaker 2: having come in what six months ago or whatever it was.
Speaker 1: Well, if Toulouse haven't added something to super League, then
Speaker 1: I am papa or whatever they call it in French,
Speaker 1: are mad, which is French for shit?
Speaker 2: What? What? What?
Speaker 1: What do you senses going on with all the whole
Speaker 1: f C at the moment, because they seem to have
Speaker 1: started to really fall off the perch.
Speaker 2: Look, I think we look back to last year. They
Speaker 2: had a good year and John Carter right his first day.
Speaker 2: I think recruitment wise, they had made some odd decisions
Speaker 2: to sign a lot of senior players, a lot of
Speaker 2: older players, some with some gubius injury records. I don't
Speaker 2: think that's necessarily paid off for them. And I think
Speaker 2: the whole facade around John Cartwright and getting rid of him,
Speaker 2: you know, and then the kind of excuses that they
Speaker 2: shot out as a club was was very poor, you know.
Speaker 2: And I don't I don't think you know, I don't
Speaker 2: think it's washed the Steve mtt namara. He is a
Speaker 2: good coach and maybe a great appointment next year you
Speaker 2: might be able to turn things around. But they're getting
Speaker 2: worse at the club now, and I think you know
Speaker 2: that there needs to be real changes there. Yeah, it's
Speaker 2: just it's just clearly not good enough for French.
Speaker 1: For the Pope is la pop. I knew everybody was
Speaker 1: worried about that, so I thought that just quickly google it.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, yeah, for for a problem size of policy,
Speaker 2: for being down, you know, the fan base size that
Speaker 2: they have, They've they've been very ordinary for part too long.
Speaker 1: There's something a bit bigger there going on than can
Speaker 1: be fixed by changing a coach. Are you are right
Speaker 1: to pull you up blind down a bit, John the Yes,
Speaker 1: the English summer is beaming through your window. Huddersfield fourteen
Speaker 1: Bradford thirty. Another team that I've had plenty to Super
Speaker 1: League Bradford on the road there. Thirty came from Sutton, Nicarima, Blake,
Speaker 1: Ryan and they all scored tries, but Actin added seven
Speaker 1: goals tries for Huddersfield, two from Swift, one from Mill
Speaker 1: and a goal from Russell. So apparently that's Bradford's first
Speaker 1: away win of the season.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's that's an interesting start.
Speaker 1: Look, well, if you're going to get one, if you're
Speaker 1: going to get one, yeah, at.
Speaker 2: Least early on. I think Addisfield had a bit of
Speaker 2: a dig and showed some showed some character as a
Speaker 2: soft opening try. But for Hard it's eleventh loss in
Speaker 2: a row. Jim Learning he still looking for a winner's
Speaker 2: new coach.
Speaker 1: And I thot that was a bit I thought that
Speaker 1: was a bit ropy what he said about I thought
Speaker 1: he was going into the territory of doubting the integrity
Speaker 1: of refereees and officials there, which is never a good sign.
Speaker 2: No, I think the worrying thing is that what was
Speaker 2: a four diary against Wakefield it looked like, okay, they've
Speaker 2: maybe they've turned a bit of a corner and you know,
Speaker 2: showed some real courage and then magic they were very
Speaker 2: poor and then for the majority of the game against
Speaker 2: Bradford they were poor. They did have patches you know,
Speaker 2: with of course bradasts and problems. But yeah, much like
Speaker 2: say I think with Huddersfield, the issues are you know,
Speaker 2: in the front office and off the field. And I
Speaker 2: have been for quite a while the you know, the
Speaker 2: people who are doing the hiring and fire of coaches,
Speaker 2: who are making the decisions at the club, who are recruiting.
Speaker 2: It's not the head coach is I think it needs
Speaker 2: a major overhaul from start to finish. And as you said,
Speaker 2: you know, they can bring in all the led boards
Speaker 2: at the stadium that they're not going to be playing
Speaker 2: out next year all they like, and that will doubtly
Speaker 2: help the Iron j create criteria, but they're rubbish on
Speaker 2: the field. Their fanbase is dwindling, they've got next to
Speaker 2: no media profile, and they say the sponsorship is going
Speaker 2: up and that may be the case, but I don't
Speaker 2: really understand if you're a brand, why would you want
Speaker 2: to sponsor Huddersfield Giants right now? Like what would you
Speaker 2: appel be?
Speaker 1: I think if Huddersfield survive in Super League and say
Speaker 1: York didn't because of some which is like criteria could happen?
Speaker 2: Could happen?
Speaker 1: I don't think that passes the smell test, the pub
Speaker 1: test or THETF test.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I think the thing is the criteria.
Speaker 2: There are different ways, aren't they. So it's not all
Speaker 2: performance based, the is it is obviously London. Now London
Speaker 2: being in the Championship just basically dilutes the kind of
Speaker 2: whole idea of the Championship. You know, when you're putting
Speaker 2: one hundred points on or more on teams and they're
Speaker 2: a full time operation, it just makes zero sense. But
Speaker 2: if you're not going to go to fifteen teams, you
Speaker 2: need one team in Super Lea to drop out. Now,
Speaker 2: you know, Huddersfield have been pretty rubbish for well, I mean,
Speaker 2: if we want to be if we want to be
Speaker 2: technical for a decade, barring one or two seasons.
Speaker 1: That have mald most of the vast majority of their
Speaker 1: Super League tenure has been very poor.
Speaker 2: Yes, yes they're not. They're not really advanced as as
Speaker 2: a club. They've not had any succe sustained success. Easy
Speaker 2: for you to say, yeah, it is so yeah. I
Speaker 2: think from the small test you would think york Can
Speaker 2: to loose deserve a longer run, But stranger things have happened. Lee.
Speaker 2: I think it would be very rugby league for Haddersfield
Speaker 2: to end up staying in and then and London to
Speaker 2: stay in the Championship and you know, Yorking to lose
Speaker 2: to to stay in Super League, or a combination of
Speaker 2: to loose dropping out. I think people forget there is
Speaker 2: a lot of any French sentiment in the game. And
Speaker 2: I think the only reason really that to Loose came
Speaker 2: in is because they won the Grand Final. I think
Speaker 2: if they'd lost that Grand Final there would have been
Speaker 2: an easy continue to say well we don't we don't
Speaker 2: want them, But the fact that they won the Grand Final,
Speaker 2: if they didn't get into Super League, it would have
Speaker 2: looked very poor, wouldn't it.
Speaker 1: So for another project, yesterday I was looking at the
Speaker 1: history of the Rugby League World Cup and what was
Speaker 1: very evident was that around about the seventies fans started
Speaker 1: turning away from it because of all the tinkering that
Speaker 1: rugby league did with the tournament, i e. Sometimes it
Speaker 1: was just a group stage, other times it was a
Speaker 1: knockout thing, so on and so forth. So it actually
Speaker 1: made a shambles out of the whole concept of a
Speaker 1: World Cup. And I think the mini rugby league administrators,
Speaker 1: particularly in the UK, start to be a bit too
Speaker 1: cute with their thinking. Ie some of the thoughts that
Speaker 1: are going into why one team should stay in Super
Speaker 1: League and another shouldn't. Honestly, it just makes the general
Speaker 1: populace think WTF when they look at this. And I
Speaker 1: think it would be good for Huddersfield, regardless of your criteria,
Speaker 1: in two to channel some England football fans chance they
Speaker 1: can stick their IMG gradings up their dairy air, because
Speaker 1: I think sometimes there's things that come outside of whatever
Speaker 1: gradings you put down on a piece of paper, and
Speaker 1: I actually genuinely think it would be good for Huddersfield
Speaker 1: to drop down for a little bit to recalibrate as
Speaker 1: an organization, to recalibrate as a football side, rather than
Speaker 1: constantly trying to survive in Super League and paying goalvers
Speaker 1: for people, it would actually be good for them. It
Speaker 1: would be good for rugby league people in the town
Speaker 1: to drop down and to have a good think, not
Speaker 1: for two months and come out with some gimmicks that
Speaker 1: make people feel all warm and fuzzy for a while.
Speaker 1: And yes, I'm going to say the word unleashed. The
Speaker 1: only thing they've unleashed is a pile of manure all
Speaker 1: over this super League this year. So they need to
Speaker 1: have a good sit down and a good think everybody
Speaker 1: involved in the game as to what we do with
Speaker 1: a club that is based And I think this is
Speaker 1: part of the problem. We're so desperate to keep them
Speaker 1: in because it's the birthplace of the game, but we
Speaker 1: are hostage to something that happened one hundred and thirty
Speaker 1: one years ago to an extent. So I really really
Speaker 1: really felt awful this week when I was reading, because
Speaker 1: I sent you a message to saying Huddersfield going to
Speaker 1: stay in and York drop at Any hint of that
Speaker 1: to me would probably want me to not watch super
Speaker 1: League for a bit.
Speaker 2: Put it that way, Yeah, it's definitely possibility that that
Speaker 2: could happen. I think on the relegation and it's interesting
Speaker 2: that happened, what was it twenty one, twenty two years ago,
Speaker 2: when Tony Smith was there, and they obviously came back
Speaker 2: into Super League straight away and that was a good
Speaker 2: period for the club. Yeah, I think the other and
Speaker 2: think the championship would help them essentially get their roster
Speaker 2: because there's a lot of players there, you know, who've
Speaker 2: been this' been there for a while, who are onovers
Speaker 2: and who aren't delivering, and they really need to, you know,
Speaker 2: have a complete rethinking about their recruitment. But the type
Speaker 2: of player they sign, the type of characters they want
Speaker 2: at the club, and they you know, whatever they're doing
Speaker 2: to scaut players and you know how they're trying to
Speaker 2: build a squad, they really need to overhaul that because
Speaker 2: it's clearly not been working for quite some time.
Speaker 1: And you know, they're in real trouble. When the coach
Speaker 1: came out saying for those who don't know what I'm
Speaker 1: talking about, google Jim Lenihan, was it subconscious bias or
Speaker 1: unconscious bias about referees and compare that to compare and
Speaker 1: contrast is the essay question with what Thomas Tukele said
Speaker 1: to the media immediately after England's quarter final victory and
Speaker 1: the FIFA World Cup. He would have every reason to
Speaker 1: doubt some of the decisions that the referee made in
Speaker 1: that game, but his first reaction was to say you
Speaker 1: can get more out of the players basically, and I'm
Speaker 1: very much paraphrasing there, and I think Jim Lennhan is
Speaker 1: also pushing for the panic button a little bit too early.
Speaker 1: In my thoughts there, I note's about their opposition to
Speaker 1: Bradford Bulls. There must be some serious grit in that organization.
Speaker 1: There must be some serious resilience and in to lose
Speaker 1: and in York quite frankly, but we're on Bradford right now. Well,
Speaker 1: first of all, the way their fans have turned out
Speaker 1: in force this year been really good to see. And
Speaker 1: I do know once again that in terms of the
Speaker 1: smell test and the pub test, there's a few questions
Speaker 1: students as to why Bradford got brought into the division
Speaker 1: but in all fairness, they finished in the top three
Speaker 1: of the division below, so play on if you ask me.
Speaker 1: And what a great addition they've been to Super League
Speaker 1: this year and it's something different. They're playing on a
Speaker 1: smaller field at home, as have mentioned five hundred and
Speaker 1: eighty five times on this pod, and it's good to
Speaker 1: see something different.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think he's done a great job there galvanizing
Speaker 2: the team. There was a lot of late recruitment and
Speaker 2: I think they'll look very different next year. Quite a
Speaker 2: bit ambitious with who they're trying to sign, but I
Speaker 2: think that the style of play he's put together is
Speaker 2: quite easy on the eye and it's a little bit
Speaker 2: different than a lot of the other teams. So they
Speaker 2: are they are doing a good job. It'll be interesting.
Speaker 2: I think we're all wondering how that those three will
Speaker 2: fare at the end of the season. I think most
Speaker 2: people would have them between tenth and fifteenth, but who
Speaker 2: finishes what we're or if someone could finish higher, and
Speaker 2: what are to lose? Are they ninth at the moment?
Speaker 2: I think they are ninth? Yeah, I mean that. I think,
Speaker 2: you know, one of those clubs finishing eighth or ninth
Speaker 2: would be would be massive, and it's not It's not impossible,
Speaker 2: particularly considering only four point spot on cat Lands at
Speaker 2: eighth now, So it's going to be it's going to
Speaker 2: be an interesting what two three months We've got a
Speaker 2: footy to come.
Speaker 1: How much waiting in AMG is actual performance on the field, I'd.
Speaker 2: Have to double check exactly, but I think it's I
Speaker 2: think it's a fifth. I think it's twenty percent. So
Speaker 2: I have to lose one the cup. Yeah, I mean
Speaker 2: led screen. They might be in trouble. It's taken over
Speaker 2: a three a three year period. But yes, if they
Speaker 2: won the if they won this year, that would definitely
Speaker 2: help them a lot. But they're not going to win
Speaker 2: the CAMP mean, we can safely say.
Speaker 1: That they only have to finish the top six and
Speaker 1: it's a new competition. Catalan six Leeds Rhinos twenty eight.
Speaker 1: But the Catalan six came from Titan. I don't think
Speaker 1: it was the boxer and Sexton kicked the goal. Leeds
Speaker 1: Rhinos twenty eight came from Newman, three from Croft and
Speaker 1: another one from Miller and Connor got four. Where was
Speaker 1: Civo Brody Croft scoring the hat tricks today? Well, when
Speaker 1: they played and that's a four point lead thanks to
Speaker 1: their success in France, But here the Catalans have been
Speaker 1: described in relatively glowing terms as stubborn, So I don't
Speaker 1: assume the Catalans didn't roll over to be trampled on
Speaker 1: by a set of rhinos. No, not completely. I think
Speaker 1: you know, the first try was off a kick. One
Speaker 1: of the Brady Croft tries was sort of an error
Speaker 1: from Lewis Dodd that he picked up and did quite well,
Speaker 1: the kind of you know, dashdown sixty meters in a
Speaker 1: vader tackle on score.
Speaker 2: I think it's just the way Leads are playing. Maybe
Speaker 2: you know they're they're winning basically every week. They're very confident,
Speaker 2: They've got a well balanced team. I think they hadn't
Speaker 2: won Leads had one impurposely on for quite a few years.
Speaker 2: So I think that was another big motivation. And I
Speaker 2: think it might have been Callum Watkinson's three hundredth game
Speaker 2: for the club, which was also another big motivation. So
Speaker 2: bigger all from Bradi Croft with the with the hat
Speaker 2: trick and you know Leeds I think, I mean, I
Speaker 2: know it's mathematically possible for Wigan and Wakefield to catch them,
Speaker 2: there's only four points, but I think the way they're
Speaker 2: going Leads, I can't see them not winning the League
Speaker 2: Leaders Shield and finishing top at this point. I think
Speaker 2: the minor Premiership is there's the playoff system. The top
Speaker 2: two get a week off, don't we? Yeah? You were you?
Speaker 2: Really that's you know, you want to finish first or second?
Speaker 2: I think that that's the big you know the fact
Speaker 2: that you only really need to get a week off,
Speaker 2: and you only need to win one game and then
Speaker 2: you're basically through and you get a home game, don't
Speaker 2: you you do? Yeah? So really first or second?
Speaker 1: Tomato tomato, except you get a trophy if you finish top.
Speaker 1: Back to cattle Ands, and there's rumors abound that John
Speaker 1: cart Right might be staying longer.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think I think that's the obvious choice, and
Speaker 2: I think it'd be a decent choice. They've been very
Speaker 2: busy obviously in the transfer market the other week with
Speaker 2: Tyson game. But it looks like Toby Rudolph from Kranala
Speaker 2: he might be joining them too. I don't think there's
Speaker 2: any deal done yet, but I think he's going to
Speaker 2: be leaving Cranala and he's looking for a move. Wasn't
Speaker 2: there there's another signing potentially coming from for cattle Lands.
Speaker 2: Off the top of my head, I can think. But look,
Speaker 2: I think, as we all know, they've kind of got
Speaker 2: a bit of a makeshift squad this year with Sexton
Speaker 2: going to Perth. There's a few others who are who
Speaker 2: were moving on as well. Benk carc is retiring, so
Speaker 2: it's a bit of sort of a fluid squad for them.
Speaker 2: So I expect, you know, quite a bit of recruitment
Speaker 2: and they've already done with it. Jesse. Arthur's going from
Speaker 2: the Broncos to to Catlans as well. The thing with Catalans,
Speaker 2: it's obviously such a lovely place to live, and also
Speaker 2: the tax is quite a lot lower, so in terms
Speaker 2: of a salary being paid in euros equivalent to the UK,
Speaker 2: you can take home a lot more with the lower
Speaker 2: tax freight as well.
Speaker 1: I think this is the result of the week. Oh no,
Speaker 1: potentially to lose his Wakefield went to whole k Are
Speaker 1: and inflicted their first on them for eleven games. Wakefield
Speaker 1: got twenty at the home of aull Kr, who scored six,
Speaker 1: so only three goals from Martin no tries, and Wakefield's
Speaker 1: tries were far till he got two. Smith scored another
Speaker 1: try and Smooth kicked three goals.
Speaker 2: Did you see this game, John, I did? I mean yeah,
Speaker 2: I think the to loose result is the one of
Speaker 2: the round. But that's taking nothing away from Wakefield, big
Speaker 2: big result for them. They're obviously in a really rich,
Speaker 2: finer form at the moment, a very tight game, a
Speaker 2: lot of penalty cars, not a lot happening in terms
Speaker 2: of attack. But the christ fatility showed two tries basically
Speaker 2: you know, Barge hit ups right in the trial line,
Speaker 2: taking several defenders over him. He's a massive unit. But
Speaker 2: you know, okay, I'm sure they've done They did the
Speaker 2: video on before and would have known he was danger
Speaker 2: but it just couldn't contain him. Considered another try close
Speaker 2: to the line from the hook go early on. So
Speaker 2: it's a bit of a worry for Okay. I mean,
Speaker 2: there's real cracks developing there. I think we've all seen
Speaker 2: this year that they're nowhere here as dominant or as
Speaker 2: omnipotent as they were in twenty twenty five. But they've
Speaker 2: just lost that invisibility and you know, they're in danger
Speaker 2: of missing the sixth their fifth at the moment. I
Speaker 2: don't think they will miss the top six, but I
Speaker 2: think it's going to take a bit of a turnaround
Speaker 2: towards the end of the year to sort of, you know,
Speaker 2: show that they can go on and really challenge in
Speaker 2: the big games. I don't think that's impossible, but I
Speaker 2: think also it is a bit of an aging squad
Speaker 2: and you think maybe they're not really I don't they've
Speaker 2: got much player movement happening at that club. I think
Speaker 2: maybe that's something they might need to look at, just
Speaker 2: to kind of spice things up a bit, because without
Speaker 2: Matthalaurum and Hargraves have just seemed to have lost a
Speaker 2: bit of bike, particularly in the middle and in the
Speaker 2: forward pack.
Speaker 1: Lee twenty four Caster for eighteen. Lee no doubt inspired
Speaker 1: by the fact that the new Prime Minister elect, sorry
Speaker 1: not elect, nobody elected him, just a few people in
Speaker 1: Makerfield is as a Lee man, I think as a
Speaker 1: rule or a former MP there at least they're twenty
Speaker 1: four came from Lamb two from Armstrong and Hanley, who
Speaker 1: seems to be in a streak of form at the moment.
Speaker 1: Cook cooked up four goals, Cass eighteen from Hall rather
Speaker 1: Lawa Lao Lao ta Ganga and Stimpson. Stimpson kicked a goal.
Speaker 1: I didn't think he could kick a habit. Stimson is
Speaker 1: one of my old players. I used to call him
Speaker 1: the drill because he used to drill holes in the
Speaker 1: opposition defense and Arsi scored scored two. I don't know
Speaker 1: if this is necessarily a negative result for cattle FD either.
Speaker 1: I think they've obviously took the fight to Lee there
Speaker 1: and Lee are heading definitely in the right direction. They've
Speaker 1: got their ship together.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know how many wins now and is
Speaker 2: in a row for Lee, but they're on a big role.
Speaker 2: They've got some great momentum behind them. Lockie Lane was
Speaker 2: very good. David Armstrong is on fire at the moment.
Speaker 2: Two tries and after the blinder he scored of magic
Speaker 2: the week before, so they've got a lot of attacking
Speaker 2: weapons and I thought this game went right down to
Speaker 2: the last set cast. We're riding at so much better
Speaker 2: from cass after they were diabolical a magic.
Speaker 1: Magic Wigans Youth Team thirty tried from Cartwright Ken because
Speaker 1: Liam McDermott and Daniel care And kick five goals. I
Speaker 1: can't believe Keran didn't score a try this week. Probably
Speaker 1: probably in the two old bracket. It's only the eighteen
Speaker 1: to thirty group this week Warrington eighteen. Their tries came
Speaker 1: from Popowarti, Irwin and Ashton and three goals for Erwin,
Speaker 1: I joke, but Wigan did have a few young standings
Speaker 1: and good good result for Wigan and Wigan's future.
Speaker 2: Yeah, a big.
Speaker 1: Worry for Warrington, I think too, to not put many
Speaker 1: gloves up there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think. I think both both clubs fielded a
Speaker 2: lot of young players and I think, you know, both
Speaker 2: teams Shiner academies are really delivering just you know, some
Speaker 2: bright young talents both those teams. Wigan just you know
Speaker 2: sinder will that that toughness and that grind to get
Speaker 2: out a result. I really liked to share kind of
Speaker 2: coming off the bench Shay O'Connor coming off the bench relation.
Speaker 2: I don't believe so, but I can, I can find out.
Speaker 2: But yeah, he really caught the eye and cart right
Speaker 2: as well a fallback getting his first ever Super le try. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think I think for Warrington's they are they're on
Speaker 2: a bit of a downward spot and I think I
Speaker 2: think they might have lee next week or they've got
Speaker 2: some tough games ahead, but then they've got an easier run,
Speaker 2: so I don't I don't think there's any concern that
Speaker 2: they will make the six, but they have got some
Speaker 2: injuries and I think you know, the a bit long
Speaker 2: confidence at the moment. There was a big call when
Speaker 2: you and Earl went over. But I think it was
Speaker 2: the right call in terms of the knock on. But yeah,
Speaker 2: I think Warrington were writing in this.
Speaker 1: Warrington have lost three in the last month, which I think.
Speaker 2: Against what leads Lee and now I think Wigan.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Bob again, I said anyway that their big tests
Speaker 1: were to come and right now they're not passing them. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but I think you put you put Cartel, you put
Speaker 1: Josh the others, you put Luke Rids, you put George Williams,
Speaker 1: she puts, I don't know who else, and Andrew Johns,
Speaker 1: reg Inglis.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you put your puts and I think that we'll
Speaker 2: have some of those players back quite soon. So yeah,
Speaker 2: I don't I don't think there's real danger signs of
Speaker 2: Warrenton for me at the moment. I mean it might
Speaker 2: be different in a Fortnite, but yeah, I don't think
Speaker 2: that too. I don't think the hitting the panic baton
Speaker 2: as we speak.
Speaker 1: To lose Hammered Saint Helen's and I can't believe Paul
Speaker 1: Sculthorpe hasn't tweet tweeted about it that was gonna be
Speaker 1: my I was prepared. I was subconscious, but subconscious bias.
Speaker 1: I look for Paul Schulthorpe's tweets. But at home, Saint
Speaker 1: Helen's zero zip zilch to lose forty six and twenty
Speaker 1: of them were at half time, so it's not as
Speaker 1: if they had one but half Masami scored three or Jami, Okaine,
Speaker 1: chan Ulberg, Tropis and Laguerre scored the rest of the tries.
Speaker 1: Everyone had a crack basically, and Sharucks kicked seven goals.
Speaker 1: Where do we start from this game?
Speaker 2: I think olia Hershaw Bot had two or three tries
Speaker 2: this again, he was sensational, just like you was last week.
Speaker 2: He's I mean, he's having a good year anyway, but
Speaker 2: I think he's gone to a different level in the
Speaker 2: last couple of weeks. So I think we've got to
Speaker 2: give to lose credit because they absolutely destroyed Catalans last
Speaker 2: week and then they've done this in Saint Helen's. It's
Speaker 2: the biggest loss St Helens have ever had at the
Speaker 2: totally or whatever it's called now. It was the totally
Speaker 2: wicked stadium at their home ground and they moved in
Speaker 2: in twenty twelve. It's the biggest ever loss they've had.
Speaker 2: So that's a bit of an I saw and poor role.
Speaker 2: He wasn't poorny punches was he was called it embarrassing,
Speaker 2: he said some of his players gave up, and some
Speaker 2: mitigation in they've got fifteen or sixteen players out, but
Speaker 2: you still look at those who were playing and on paper,
Speaker 2: you know, they just they were woeful.
Speaker 1: The first time they've failed to score at home in
Speaker 1: the league since nineteen eighty.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean the interesting thing at that club is
Speaker 2: that they do eat their own. Remember what happened with
Speaker 2: Karen Cunningham, Remember what happened with Paul Wells last year.
Speaker 2: And I think the knives for some of them, some
Speaker 2: fans at least they're already out for ball rollie, you know,
Speaker 2: and I'm not saying they should be. But it's a
Speaker 2: real rebuild at the club now. I don't think you
Speaker 2: can argue against that. You look at all the the
Speaker 2: staff who have left, players who have left obviously off field,
Speaker 2: you know, Wellens was going to the end of the
Speaker 2: end of last year. Paul sorry, James Roby left along
Speaker 2: with him, and then there's more the head of the
Speaker 2: academy is going, assistant coaches have gone, and I think
Speaker 2: some of the recruitment there not being disrespectful to some
Speaker 2: of the players that signed, but you wouldn't call them
Speaker 2: some Helen signings, and I think that's kind of showing
Speaker 2: as well. So yeah, I thought they might struggle this
Speaker 2: year just with their spine and who they signed, and yeah,
Speaker 2: you just you wouldn't expect a lack of effort in
Speaker 2: conceding that kind of amount of points. That's a real
Speaker 2: that's a real shocking result.
Speaker 1: For what Paul Rowlie can do this week going to
Speaker 1: the team and say, boys, it wasn't our record defeat
Speaker 1: as a club. That happened in nineteen oh nine when
Speaker 1: Warrington beat them seventy eight six, and I think, looking
Speaker 1: at the way it's written here, that was in Saint
Speaker 1: Helen's too, so so something for him to chew on
Speaker 1: this week. I should have mentioned this when we talked
Speaker 1: about the Wigan game, but unfortunately Junior and December were
Speaker 1: subjected to something not so nice on social media. But
Speaker 1: it seems that it's been acted upon by police. John, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I believe an arrest has been made.
Speaker 2: Look, I don't think it sadly it's something that we
Speaker 2: still have to address in twenty twenty six. But you know,
Speaker 2: it's just disgusting people. I don't get like why you
Speaker 2: would even why you would think that that's an appropriate
Speaker 2: thing to make a comment about our type.
Speaker 1: But yeah, what I do with some of these people
Speaker 1: is tell them to put a jersey on and promote
Speaker 1: them into Super League next week.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, well just get them to go down a
Speaker 2: Wigan training and you can you can try and tackle
Speaker 2: some places, but yeah, hopefully the appropriate action is taken
Speaker 2: by the police and he gets a he also gets
Speaker 2: a band from any rugular league games or any involvement,
Speaker 2: because yeah, there's no place for that kind of it's
Speaker 2: definitely a he I assume, yes. Yeah. Look.
Speaker 1: The sickening thing too is that rugby league in the
Speaker 1: UK has been an absolute trailblazer for gas relations. The
Speaker 1: first black professional coach in the country, the first black
Speaker 1: great national captain.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 1: I could go on and on and on, and if
Speaker 1: there's one sport where we do welcome absolutely everybody unless
Speaker 1: they're from Saint Helen's and you're from Wigan or something
Speaker 1: like that. But yeah, the one sport where we welcome everybody.
Speaker 1: I think it leaves a very sour taste in the
Speaker 1: mouth and that certainly won't be the Rugby League tweet
Speaker 1: of the week. But a late entry from Gavin Wilson,
Speaker 1: when he was watching the Saint Helen's game, said, I
Speaker 1: wish John Wilkins was on the broadcast today, So that's
Speaker 1: my tweet of the week Johnny's tweet of the week.
Speaker 1: Have a quick think about a jab as well, because
Speaker 1: your tweet of the week was playing tennis in this weather?
Speaker 1: Wasn't the smartest? Now sweating like all some Wells in
Speaker 1: the Sahara. Maybe he should have changed that to Paul
Speaker 1: Wellens in the Saint Helen's boardroom. The first of all
Speaker 1: playing tennis?
Speaker 2: Is that? Are you inspired by Wimbledon? Is that was
Speaker 2: that worried? No? No, I played tennis because I'm old
Speaker 2: now and unfortunately there's no touch I love. I'd love
Speaker 2: to play touch fuddy, but there's no touch fuddy where
Speaker 2: I live. I played tennis semi regularly, but yeah, it
Speaker 2: was it was a bit hot, but yeah, the beers
Speaker 2: but we had afterwards were very refreshed. Did you win? Ah?
Speaker 2: We actually we stopped at for four in the first
Speaker 2: set because partly because we weren out of time because
Speaker 2: my partner had to go and pick up his son,
Speaker 2: and then partly because it was two body hot. So yeah,
Speaker 2: but usually.
Speaker 1: So that's that's the definition of a hydration break if
Speaker 1: you went straight for the beers as well.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we played on a loan. We were playing on
Speaker 2: a loan. You tweeted a picture, didn't you? Was that alone?
Speaker 2: Was that grass? No? No, I don't know what you
Speaker 2: would call it as some sort of acrylic concrete Sheffield crab.
Speaker 1: Basically that that would have been great for the heat
Speaker 1: as well, to really absorb the heat for you rather
Speaker 1: than reflect it back to your or or bemis. Back up,
Speaker 1: Have you got a job this week or are you
Speaker 1: feeling really good?
Speaker 2: I mean, I've got I've probably got a number of jobs.
Speaker 2: I mean, I find it interesting. I've put out a
Speaker 2: few tweets about about Huddersfield and just in my opinion,
Speaker 2: I mean, Huddersfield don't have any fans, but but a
Speaker 2: few of them have jumped into me and I think,
Speaker 2: I mean, I understand the concept of fandom. You know,
Speaker 2: you support your club no matter what, but it's not
Speaker 2: an attack on the club itself or the coach or
Speaker 2: the players. It's just honest observations, you know. I think
Speaker 2: most people would be and Arson would if Hudsfield were thriving,
Speaker 2: they'd be great. If they were getting you know, eight
Speaker 2: nine thousand games or more, they're at the top of
Speaker 2: the table and they were flourishing, that would be good.
Speaker 2: But they're not, you know, and that's why they're in
Speaker 2: the firing line. It's nothing personal, I think on that line.
Speaker 2: I think it was interesting. I'm sure we'll talk about
Speaker 2: origin later on the podcast, but yeah, well Laurie Daly's
Speaker 2: press was interesting after Save It.
Speaker 1: Save It, Okay, Yeah, because I'm going to talk about
Speaker 1: fandom after reading your free read that you did after
Speaker 1: the new South Wales game. Ian Nolan has been appointed
Speaker 1: as the Rugby Football League's new Chief executive. Officially, the
Speaker 1: forty four year old will start his role on the
Speaker 1: first of October, and he's previously held roles at Manchester United,
Speaker 1: BO and Science Sport.
Speaker 2: There's no point, there's.
Speaker 1: No point being too upset about them at the morning
Speaker 1: because at the moment, because the crap, so it's not
Speaker 1: that big a deal really. Any comment on the new RFL.
Speaker 2: I think we talked about that a week ago, two
Speaker 2: weeks ago, and we look. I think I think we
Speaker 2: mentioned how it was unusual that he was kind of
Speaker 2: parachuted last minute, wasn't it. He wasn't short listed. I
Speaker 2: just don't know how much power he'll say, you know, well,
Speaker 2: Sylvie Nigel Wood pulling the strings. I would imagine. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think it's interesting that he's an outsider. He's not
Speaker 2: come from the RFL or from Clubland, because I think
Speaker 2: the last person to do that in a senior role
Speaker 2: was probably Richard Lewis, which was quite a while ago.
Speaker 2: So maybe he'll be more independent and challenge the status
Speaker 2: quo more than others. But we shall see. I think
Speaker 2: it's a hold year judgment at this point in on.
Speaker 1: Been good week for Wakefield. They extended their back roller
Speaker 1: as I have agna for five more years, and he's
Speaker 1: still on the twenty six.
Speaker 2: I've noticed. Yeah, I mean I think, I think, what's
Speaker 2: I think Wakefield are building a really good squad and
Speaker 2: particularly their forward pack. I know we talked about Fatilli before,
Speaker 2: but you know Fatilli Caleb hamlin Uelli might be making Obviously,
Speaker 2: it looks like Tyson Smith will be going the end
Speaker 2: of the year. But him, they've just they've just got
Speaker 2: a really big, tough rodwell tough forward pack, which I
Speaker 2: think they can really you know, basing a lot of
Speaker 2: their success around, and a lot of those players were,
Speaker 2: except perhaps mcmakon, sort of unheralded or unheard of arguably,
Speaker 2: but they're they've been great fines and they're really leading
Speaker 2: the way. State of Origin. Then go on, well, as
Speaker 2: the resident queens Lander on this podcast, Queenslander, Sorry, Queensland resident,
Speaker 2: I have no I have no I change every year
Speaker 2: who I want to win, sometimes of change mid game
Speaker 2: who I want to win. So well, I have to
Speaker 2: give you credit because last week you did tip the
Speaker 2: Blues and you and you called it. I was I've
Speaker 2: been watching Origin for well probably forty years, and it
Speaker 2: seemed to be a similar script in that, you know,
Speaker 2: decider in some corps. You know. Obviously the the Jay
Speaker 2: Arrow perhaps element added some extra emotion to Queensland and
Speaker 2: also the sort of feace, criticism and in fighting in
Speaker 2: the U SOL side. It looked pointed to me to
Speaker 2: to Queensland victory. But I thought the Blues were sensational.
Speaker 2: I thought that the selections were very good they played
Speaker 2: with a lot of passion, a lot of efficiency played
Speaker 2: out of their skins really throughout the team, and I thought, yeah, well,
Speaker 2: obviously being from you, so Well's I loved it. That
Speaker 2: was very enjoyable.
Speaker 1: I think the key word you used there was the script,
Speaker 1: and I think our media.
Speaker 2: Have been.
Speaker 1: Awful in terms of trying to write scripts. The phrase
Speaker 1: that I would like to use is hyperbole permeates. So
Speaker 1: Queensland one game one, sorry, Queensland won game two.
Speaker 2: In an era.
Speaker 1: Where because Rocks are so quick in the NRL right now,
Speaker 1: if you do get some momentum you can rack up
Speaker 1: the points. Basically New South Wales one game one, basically
Speaker 1: because Ponger got sent off.
Speaker 2: Yes, and.
Speaker 1: Our media and whoever listens to them couldn't wait to
Speaker 1: give Nathan Cleary Man of the match even though he
Speaker 1: did what he did against twelve people. The pressure put
Speaker 1: on that bloke is I've got a problem with the
Speaker 1: way that's done as well, because in game three he's
Speaker 1: now been talked about as a future immortal, etcetera, etcetera.
Speaker 1: He played well, but that's it. We need more sober
Speaker 1: analysis and I think I mean, since when has somebody
Speaker 1: backing up in support. Since when there's somebody doing a
Speaker 1: one on one strip, since when there's a half back
Speaker 1: dumming and going and scoring a trying been something more
Speaker 1: that needs to be immortalized, Like I just find our well,
Speaker 1: Like I said, I use the term hyperbole.
Speaker 2: I don't, Yeah, I don't. I don't think you. I
Speaker 2: don't think necessarily he's ashowing to be an immortal right now.
Speaker 2: But I would imagine those saying that would be basing
Speaker 2: it on his whole career and what he's achieved, not
Speaker 2: just one game. But I think by his own admission,
Speaker 2: the Cleary was very poor in Game two, particularly defensively,
Speaker 2: but it was one of his worst games in recent memory.
Speaker 2: And I think, yeah, I think he was brilliant on Wednesday,
Speaker 2: and I thought I was Mitch Moses. You know, he
Speaker 2: was pretty poor in game too as well, but he's
Speaker 2: passing his long kicking game. We're huge for Lynn Martin.
Speaker 2: You know, it was probably unlucky not when a man match,
Speaker 2: because he was sensational paineheas for no Blake Rhys Robson,
Speaker 2: you know, But I think I think we're clearly as
Speaker 2: we all know, he gets he gets to a long groove,
Speaker 2: particularly from himself. I thought he I thought he delivered.
Speaker 1: I look at it exactly for what it is, as
Speaker 1: opposed to try and come up with a a critique
Speaker 1: that is premeditated. I think it comes from a good
Speaker 1: place in a way, in the sense that I think
Speaker 1: the journals would like to crown a king. Yes, honestly, honestly,
Speaker 1: I mean, I've not found anybody who can tell me
Speaker 1: what Nathan clear he did apart from those three things
Speaker 1: I mentioned, push up and support, did a one on
Speaker 1: one strip that happened to lead to a try players
Speaker 1: try stripping the ball on about thirty percent of tackles
Speaker 1: in every game. And then the other thing was the
Speaker 1: dummy and goal. The amount of times I've seen Nathan
Speaker 1: Cleary and I've analyzed this and I've put stuff out
Speaker 1: there where he gets lost because he doesn't organize properly
Speaker 1: around himself, because he gets lost when he's not in
Speaker 1: the Penrith system, and sometimes he just goes a best run. Well,
Speaker 1: if you keep knocking on a door, eventually somebody's going
Speaker 1: to open the door. So look, I am not arguing
Speaker 1: that Nathan Cleary didn't play very play well. He did,
Speaker 1: but let me tell you this, Moses next to him was.
Speaker 2: Well.
Speaker 1: First of all, his statistically was a lot better, kicked
Speaker 1: for a lot further, ran for a lot more meters.
Speaker 1: It takes it takes both halves to steer a team around,
Speaker 1: particularly when both of them are minded to be the
Speaker 1: organizers normally as well. So I just find the whole
Speaker 1: media narrative ridiculous.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I think that's a that's a separate thing.
Speaker 2: I think he's goalkicking clear, he was perfect, particularly the
Speaker 2: pressure one late in the second half when Whens were
Speaker 2: coming back. And I think it's also you know, the
Speaker 2: delivering those certain moments, particularly Origin, you know, opening try,
Speaker 2: beating four defenders, those are special things that not everyone
Speaker 2: can do well.
Speaker 1: So so no, not everybody. So nobody else on the
Speaker 1: field is capable of scoring the opening try in an
Speaker 1: Origin match? Is that what you're saying.
Speaker 2: No, what I'm saying is looking at that moment when
Speaker 2: he had the ball with nothing on and beating four
Speaker 2: players to score in that in that position, Well, no
Speaker 2: one else did it on that night. It doesn't happen
Speaker 2: in Origin like that in that instance. That often it
Speaker 2: has happened, and it will happen again. But I think
Speaker 2: that's the mark of a champion player who owned the occasion.
Speaker 1: I just think his hyperbole. Mate, He had a decent game,
Speaker 1: had a decent game, and he did most of the
Speaker 1: things he does. He does every every week anyway, kick well,
Speaker 1: move the ball around, good defender. As a rule, anybody
Speaker 1: could do a one on one strip. I don't honestly.
Speaker 1: And then pushing up in support, well, anyone, that's what happened.
Speaker 1: That's what happens when you get go forward.
Speaker 2: But he was the one who was who did it.
Speaker 2: Wasn't he He's the one who did it. I mean,
Speaker 2: anyone can push out and support, but he was the
Speaker 2: one that was there and scored the tryer. If he
Speaker 2: wasn't there, there was no try.
Speaker 1: So so how many how many times? How many times
Speaker 1: I've tried been scored in origin?
Speaker 2: Just this year?
Speaker 1: With people pushing up in support, why aren't they they
Speaker 1: getting rounders? Having owned origin?
Speaker 2: Well, I think it's a combination of things. That's not
Speaker 2: a one off support owning gorriaging. Owning gorriaging is a
Speaker 2: combination of things. Well, I think game, Yeah, own origin,
Speaker 2: owning origing. Think about that term. You didn't use. So
Speaker 2: it's not it's not the first Origin he's playing in.
Speaker 2: It's not the first Origin series is one either fift
Speaker 2: series is one one. Just playing I think I think
Speaker 2: the stat that I saw that he'd been first decided
Speaker 2: he's won as a half more try involvements in Origin
Speaker 2: than Willy Lewis and Andrew Johns because he played more games.
Speaker 2: Maybe the case. Yeah, I mean he's going to play
Speaker 2: if he continues his career. Considering his twenty eight he's
Speaker 2: probably got another seven years.
Speaker 1: Arguably with Origin, I have no problemination clear of getting
Speaker 1: praise I get. I have a real problem with the
Speaker 1: hyperbole that is being used, with the with the absolutes
Speaker 1: that are being used a lot. He had a good game,
Speaker 1: he had a good game. I think it's an insult
Speaker 1: some of the things that have been written two people
Speaker 1: like Hudson Young and Liam Martin, and some of the
Speaker 1: things that have been said to who if if people
Speaker 1: if people. And I won't often use this phrase, but
Speaker 1: anybody who's played rugby league, coach rugby league knows that
Speaker 1: you don't have anything without people like Hudson Young, Liam Martin,
Speaker 1: Paying House, et cetera. The same things and our game.
Speaker 2: Is the same that Andrew John's had. You know, Ben
Speaker 2: Kennedy and Steve Simpson and Danny Bdeiris and and you
Speaker 2: know Wally Lewis said Ala Langer and ye know they
Speaker 2: didn't you don't. Yeah, it's a team sport. I completely
Speaker 2: agree with you there. I think the key element, particularly
Speaker 2: compared with Game two was the bench rotation that worked,
Speaker 2: and and particularly his middles. You know, for now a
Speaker 2: bloke was great, paying helfs was We're saying Rhys Robson
Speaker 2: I thought was quite poor in game two, but he's
Speaker 2: he's work. In Game one. His passing was very crisp,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: You know the difference was John, They've got to go forward.
Speaker 1: They won the collisions, they won the rocks. Yes, who
Speaker 1: does that? Guess who does that for you? In ninety
Speaker 1: percent of games? Did you get Did you get any questions?
Speaker 2: John? A lot of questions are we're not talking about.
Speaker 1: Us as Oh yeah, worked out as well. That's another
Speaker 1: thing as well. Right, So look, I've been in Lourie
Speaker 1: Daly's company for about five minutes, and you know, when
Speaker 1: you just know somebody's a good bloke, he's a good bloke,
Speaker 1: and everybody says.
Speaker 2: Everyone says that that's right, right, but.
Speaker 1: They said out assistant coaches before the game on the
Speaker 1: morning of the game to brief the media on their
Speaker 1: interchange plans. On before Game three. They also tipped off
Speaker 1: to the media in the three weeks prior that players
Speaker 1: were backing Lorry Daily and Bloody Bladdy Blah so much
Speaker 1: so that I got the intel, if you like, and
Speaker 1: the vibe of what was coming because I tip Queensland
Speaker 1: to win the series three nil or two to one,
Speaker 1: with Ashley Klein getting the one. I think what's happened
Speaker 1: with New South Wales it has bottomed out so much
Speaker 1: and so quickly by game two again because of people's
Speaker 1: hyperbole about the outcome of Game two, rather than looking
Speaker 1: at it objectively, there's been panicing New South Wales. Lorrie
Speaker 1: Daly has gone, I'm not up to this.
Speaker 2: I think.
Speaker 1: He won't use those words. But because after Game three
Speaker 1: then goes somebody said some to him in a press conference,
Speaker 1: he goes, I'm a leader. I'm a leader. That's what
Speaker 1: that's what we do. In other words, I use other
Speaker 1: people to to give me, to give me ideas. And
Speaker 1: the other thing is it took them three games to
Speaker 1: get their interchange thing right. And then the other thing
Speaker 1: as well is the other fellow coaching in the other
Speaker 1: coaching box who's never coached anything in his life before
Speaker 1: he coached Origin.
Speaker 2: We're watching him learning on the job. It took News.
Speaker 1: It's taken New South Wales three series to work out,
Speaker 1: or two series and two games that Queensland take three
Speaker 1: carries in and then shift the ball and play for
Speaker 1: second of that long to work that out. And they
Speaker 1: worked it out on Wednesday. And it works a hell
Speaker 1: of a lot better when you're completely dominating the rook
Speaker 1: and winning the battle in the rook and getting the
Speaker 1: go forward and stopping the opposition go forward, which is
Speaker 1: earned by in ninety nine percent of the cases forwards.
Speaker 1: So yeah, you used you to talk about Lorrie Daly's
Speaker 1: comments as well.
Speaker 2: Well. I think he was obviously very fired up, wasn't it?
Speaker 2: And I think though he wasn't specifically, he didn't name
Speaker 2: and I think the main point of his upset or
Speaker 2: angst was that that Korean courier male story, wasn't it.
Speaker 2: I think between after game one before game two and
Speaker 2: that that he was putting some of the New so
Speaker 2: Weals players to sleep. I believe that was the gist
Speaker 2: of the article. You could have just laughed at that. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean the interesting thing is I mean, look, you
Speaker 2: would like to think that the people who wrote it
Speaker 2: had numerous sources for that, or very good sources for that.
Speaker 2: But look, I think we also, and I'm not accusing
Speaker 2: them in this instance, we also know there are certain
Speaker 2: agendas running the sport. I know I've been the the
Speaker 2: subject of stories that were blatantly false, but that were
Speaker 2: pushed out by you know, certain people origin though too.
Speaker 2: I mean, it is no, it is odd. I'm not
Speaker 2: having a crack at Lorry. Look, I think you know,
Speaker 2: if you deliver in that and A, that's your opportunity
Speaker 2: to buy back, isn't it. And look he did that
Speaker 2: in spectacular fashion. Personally. You know I was critical after
Speaker 2: after game one end game two, but it's it's it
Speaker 2: was about the selections in the bench rotation. It has
Speaker 2: nothing to do with his you know, him being a
Speaker 2: human being or being a good bloke or not.
Speaker 1: I had to laugh at your message to me in
Speaker 1: the immediate aftermath, los Ball, What what's happened to fosball?
Speaker 2: By the way, Well, I believe I believe that was
Speaker 2: the NRL admin putting out los ball. Everything. It was
Speaker 2: you know we had angeball, didn't we and we had
Speaker 2: do we have petball? You know we've got every pepism
Speaker 2: I think, Yeah, yeah, I mean fosball. I don't really
Speaker 2: want to talk about that. But if you're you're winning by,
Speaker 2: I insist.
Speaker 1: Now, if you're winning by, where's where's your hyperbolic comment?
Speaker 2: Now? You should you should close that out. Really, That's
Speaker 2: that's all I got to say about that. Have they
Speaker 2: lost three of the last five something like that? Uh,
Speaker 2: they've lost the last two and I know that probably
Speaker 2: three of the last.
Speaker 1: Four, and they're outside the eight right now. Tooflect media
Speaker 1: guru that I am bulldogs, mate, they're even worse.
Speaker 2: Well, look, I think you know it could be worse.
Speaker 2: They could have been the Dolphins this weekend.
Speaker 1: They went to the have you know former Saint Helen's
Speaker 1: coach as well, the coach and the Dolphins. There must
Speaker 1: be something something in the water in the region.
Speaker 2: Paul Wells is on the Cowboys staff, so I'm sure
Speaker 2: he enjoyed the victory. This morning.
Speaker 1: While you search for the questions you've got, I did
Speaker 1: get one that I found one somewhere. I've forgotten who
Speaker 1: sent it. What's the ruling on a captain's challenge after
Speaker 1: the final hooter has blown? To laugh at that? What
Speaker 1: three weeks later? Or can we go back to twenty
Speaker 1: twenty four?
Speaker 2: It?
Speaker 1: Is it possible? And how much time do they have
Speaker 1: to raise the challenge? Can it be done when the
Speaker 1: teams are halfway up the motorway on the way home?
Speaker 1: The end of the actual official end of the game
Speaker 1: is when the referee blows the whistle, isn't it the
Speaker 1: In theory the hooter is an indicator from the timekeepers,
Speaker 1: or it used to be anyway, And so in theory
Speaker 1: it's not a bad question because I assume this must
Speaker 1: have happened. Somebody must have tried something on captain challenge
Speaker 1: wise after the after a hooter, And that's why that's
Speaker 1: that question has been sent, and I'm sorry to have
Speaker 1: ever sent it. I forgot to make a note of
Speaker 1: who did.
Speaker 2: We did? We did have a question from James Valley
Speaker 2: what on earth has Hattenederson Helens? But what a transformation
Speaker 2: we had to lose two? I mean, I think we
Speaker 2: talked earlier on a fair bit about Hends and to lose,
Speaker 2: but I think think you know St. Helen's area, they're
Speaker 2: in a big rebel rebuild there and I don't think
Speaker 2: you know their attack is particularly good and I think
Speaker 2: it's the most harmonious squad there. I think some of
Speaker 2: the recruitment has been pretty poor. What's happened to Jack
Speaker 2: Wellsby as a player? You really do wonder it? Just Yeah,
Speaker 2: it seems like the club is in a big, big
Speaker 2: hole at the moment. But we have got we have
Speaker 2: got some other questions as well. With me briefly, I'll
Speaker 2: put some background music on while you search. Should we
Speaker 2: question from Ben Blackwell? Whoever wins the TV deal for
Speaker 2: Super League, which I think will more than likely be
Speaker 2: Sky must improve the video referee technology for referees. The
Speaker 2: disappearing arm on the VR for Daniel's no trial was
Speaker 2: quite embarrassing. The repay looked like it was filming on potato.
Speaker 2: And the sport deserves better despite its failings. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 2: I think you know, the production values, the fact that
Speaker 2: they're doing every game, the production values have definitely dropped.
Speaker 2: I think we talked about that earlier this year, didn't we. League.
Speaker 2: I personally think I don't agree they're having every game
Speaker 2: otherwise there's been a big win for the sport. I
Speaker 2: think maybe having three or four games around would be
Speaker 2: But yeah, that's just a personal opinion question from Mark
Speaker 2: Williams and this did this did make me laugh. Come on,
Speaker 2: John Channel, you're in a glad hill. I'll give you
Speaker 2: the question as platform. How deep can Mandly go in
Speaker 2: the playoffs? Sea goals unleashed? I mean it's quite seagulls
Speaker 2: unleashed or see Eagles. No, that's what I was about
Speaker 2: to say. They're not the seagulls, So that's the first
Speaker 2: bit wrong right, and a whole albion unleashed. But he said,
Speaker 2: but seriously, with the Sharks pumping the informed goals, do
Speaker 2: you mainly have the squad under Foz to make a run? Look,
Speaker 2: I I think they do, but I think the ACL
Speaker 2: injury to what's his buddy name, Luke Brooks has heard
Speaker 2: them will learn ow to coach now or not. But yeah,
Speaker 2: I think I think they can. I can definitely make
Speaker 2: a run the playoffs, but yeah, they'll I need to
Speaker 2: turn things around next week, that's for sure.
Speaker 1: They got next week, Manly, I don't I don't know
Speaker 1: if I've a look. Well, I'll love a look for you.
Speaker 2: J question from NRL inside UK. Do you think there's
Speaker 2: an appetite for mid season internationals potentially against France, Ilan,
Speaker 2: Scotland or exiles. I would say no, there isn't because
Speaker 2: the players for several of those players, their best players
Speaker 2: would be playing in the NRL. No one's got the
Speaker 2: money to bring them over and if you look at
Speaker 2: the crowds for mid season internationals, they've generally been poor,
Speaker 2: as has been the media coverage see traveling to Gold Coast. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean that's definitely a winnable game. The second point
Speaker 2: of the question was should the Super League follow Should
Speaker 2: the Super League follow suit and implement the six man bench?
Speaker 2: If so, it should be some kind of rule in
Speaker 2: put by the Super League that one spot of the
Speaker 2: six men bench mus schedule and an academy player each
Speaker 2: game to try and improve the England national team in
Speaker 2: the long run.
Speaker 1: I don't mind the academy player idea, but it all
Speaker 1: comes back to costs, doesn't it.
Speaker 2: Right, So.
Speaker 1: You put two extra players on duty, you'll have to
Speaker 1: compensate them financially.
Speaker 2: Yes, And I think if we're going to talk about
Speaker 2: academy players, Like, surely if we want to improve the
Speaker 2: English national team we'd lower the quota. That's absolutely yeah,
Speaker 2: instead of increasing it. Question from Mick Dickinson, can we
Speaker 2: go back to promotion and relegation and get rid of
Speaker 2: irongine grading and brackets giants fan the bottom team deserves
Speaker 2: to be relegated. I actually saw some praise for IMG somewhere. Oh.
Speaker 2: The thing with the thing with IMG is they had
Speaker 2: lifted standards, like lifted standards in digital, lifted standards at clubs.
Speaker 2: But I think the problem with the grading is some
Speaker 2: of it can be manipulated. You know, clubs can bring
Speaker 2: in led boards for one week, rent them and they
Speaker 2: get classed as an improvement and then move them out
Speaker 2: the next week.
Speaker 1: And compare it to I mean, you've just got married
Speaker 1: now to a lovely lady, and now that you're married,
Speaker 1: you're probably going to play less tennis, drink more beer,
Speaker 1: eat more pizzas and just let your body go. And
Speaker 1: if your lady is I MG, and she'll keep you
Speaker 1: on your toes and keep you you know, she'll keep
Speaker 1: you getting Mun'tchi and Johnny.
Speaker 2: Play more tennis. Mate. We need you, we need you better.
Speaker 1: And that's probably the good thing that IMG do, isn't
Speaker 1: it They keep everybody be honest.
Speaker 2: I think that's the idea. Yes. Question from Brennan loftus,
Speaker 2: is the dominant tackle still thing in the NR on
Speaker 2: super don't recall hearing ref's court during games? So that again, no,
Speaker 2: the dominant tackle? Is it something? Yeah? Sort of? You
Speaker 2: know another one that came in and then sort of
Speaker 2: just was massive. I haven't heard it in too many
Speaker 2: games of.
Speaker 1: Like the sky microphone probably not working, the referees started
Speaker 1: going back eleven meters over here so that they could
Speaker 1: look at the defensive line in front of them.
Speaker 2: Mm hmm.
Speaker 1: Didn't communicate it very well. Led to even more occasions
Speaker 1: of got them one side, and then I think they've
Speaker 1: just sort of messaged massage that out. However, some referees
Speaker 1: still do it.
Speaker 2: Another question from Aby saying should we get rid of
Speaker 2: the action of putting an incident on report? I would
Speaker 2: say no easily that One question from Matt I want
Speaker 2: to know your thoughts on seven tackle sets. Should it
Speaker 2: be a seven tackle set if you drop the ball
Speaker 2: over the line, et cetera. The rules born and stop
Speaker 2: people just pulling it dead from distance? I think the
Speaker 2: rule that needs changing. MM. Why yeah, I don't have
Speaker 2: any problem with the rule as it stands. Question from
Speaker 2: John Hodgson. It is the constant complaining about the restaurant,
Speaker 2: coaches and fans. The reason for the gradual increase in
Speaker 2: video ref interventions.
Speaker 1: Not that I'm aware of, doesn't happen when Pilkington's play
Speaker 1: against Portico either there's no video ref there there's no
Speaker 1: blame about the ref and in several other grounds Westall
Speaker 1: versus Thotill whoever?
Speaker 2: You know? The question from Joss be with landing arguably
Speaker 2: better than half of Super leg I mean that's a
Speaker 2: that's a fake calder. Just will they be in an
Speaker 2: next shoe or get shafted as rumored? I don't think
Speaker 2: anyone knows the answer to that. It's awful, isn't it.
Speaker 2: I mean the Australian delegates that came to look after
Speaker 2: London Broncos fortunes led in terms of profile by Darren Lockyer.
Speaker 2: They came over to London, or went over to London
Speaker 2: as I sit here in Brisbane.
Speaker 1: With obviously with a thought that they would be in
Speaker 1: Super League a year down the line, the fact that
Speaker 1: that potentially might not happen now and we're in the
Speaker 1: middle of July. H pub tests and if test whatever
Speaker 1: tests you want to look at.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and a couple more on Facebook, Chris J. Linley.
Speaker 2: Should subjective decisions be adjudicated on by the video referee,
Speaker 2: who may who may have a different opinion to the
Speaker 2: on field referee? I would say no.
Speaker 1: I think I think the problem with technology is we've
Speaker 1: got too much room to discuss the outcomes. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: I think the problem comes when you have technology. Let's
Speaker 1: let's go. Let's take another sports faith for World Cup
Speaker 1: England versus Norway. The ball hits the string at the
Speaker 1: top the spider cam thing. Is it called the spider
Speaker 1: cam web? Is it because it comes from the spider
Speaker 1: It looks like it hits it and the deviation changes.
Speaker 1: Var didn't notice it, and the fever's chip in the
Speaker 1: ball didn't pick it up either, allegedly, But to the
Speaker 1: naked eye, if it looks like a dog, it's fairy
Speaker 1: like a dog, wags and tail like a dog, et cetera.
Speaker 2: Just sounds like we're standing English cheating. If you ask me,
Speaker 2: I didn't know the referee was English. Like the diving
Speaker 2: for that penalty what moving on question Christia, sorry, the
Speaker 2: question from Simon paul a deep diving to Haddersfield please
Speaker 2: and why they should stay up if they finish bottom.
Speaker 2: There's no relegation brew performances like these, there's nothing to
Speaker 2: fear that. Yeah, we're talked about. I think the whole
Speaker 2: thing about people saying, oh well there's no relegation, that
Speaker 2: they don't want to finish bottom, that's nonsense. I mean,
Speaker 2: you look at the the Dragons, you know, you look
Speaker 2: at clubs and super League. If you were losing every week,
Speaker 2: not only is your crowds dropping, the coaches under pressure
Speaker 2: to keep his job players in the future. Yeah, this
Speaker 2: whole sort of you know, it keeps clubs. Honest, I
Speaker 2: don't necessarily agree with that. No one wants to win
Speaker 2: a wooden spoon, do they. I can remember, and this
Speaker 2: is nothing close to professional sport, but I can remember
Speaker 2: playing soccer at nineteen or twenty and a very very
Speaker 2: crap team, and I think we might have won one
Speaker 2: game or had one win and one draw, and there
Speaker 2: was a few ten year losses in that season, but
Speaker 2: that one win or that one draw was celebrated like
Speaker 2: it was everything, because you know what, I mean, you're
Speaker 2: fighting for every scrap and every result, so I disagree
Speaker 2: with that. And then we did have two questions about
Speaker 2: the more brothers. Why do they hate cars for Tigers?
Speaker 2: And now I don't think the referees the walls hate
Speaker 2: as for tigers. Yeah, I think that's true. Anyway, you
Speaker 2: can be sit there and call what can we do
Speaker 2: to destroy Castle? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, I mean I think
Speaker 2: that's why generally people get become referees because they want
Speaker 2: the prospective teams to to win every weekend. I'll do
Speaker 2: everything to screw over certain times. Was that it for questions?
Speaker 2: I believe that is all the questions. I'm sorry if
Speaker 2: I missed anyone, but there was there was quite a few.
Speaker 2: But I think we're I think we're all done.
Speaker 1: The pressure is on you now for this week's tipping,
Speaker 1: because there's no way you tipped Saint Helen's to lose
Speaker 1: to Toulouse, So.
Speaker 2: No, I didn't.
Speaker 1: Thursday at eight Belts, Bradford Bulls host Wakefield.
Speaker 2: Look, I think you know, Breadford will give it a
Speaker 2: good shake, but I think the way Wakefield play and
Speaker 2: you'd definitely be backing them in that one.
Speaker 1: Friday at eight Belts Both games were eight bells on Friday.
Speaker 1: Huddersfield Giants are unleashed against Wigan Warriors.
Speaker 2: They can be unleashed as much as they want. Ralph
Speaker 2: Rommer can make all the glowing media speak comments in
Speaker 2: newspapers and say everything's awesome and we're going to win
Speaker 2: Super League in twenty thirty. But no.
Speaker 1: Maybe the reason I don't think the more Brothers hate
Speaker 1: Castleford as I think they obviously hate Huddersfield. All the referees.
Speaker 2: Look, the funny thing is that the Hardersford actually beat
Speaker 2: with you. It would be quite ironic and hilarious.
Speaker 1: If they don't win this week, it'll be regression. Sat
Speaker 1: Helen's host Catalans. I think they'd better win or else
Speaker 1: the coach might be chased out of Ellen's.
Speaker 2: Yeah no, Catlans generally don't travel well in the UK.
Speaker 2: They've lost a few. But yeah, I think I think
Speaker 2: there'll be a response from Saint Helens because, yeah, I
Speaker 2: don't think that performance today was acceptable, so I'm expecting
Speaker 2: a reaction.
Speaker 1: Warrington play hul Kingston Rolevers at three o'clock on Saturday.
Speaker 2: Yeah, another you know, two teams probably struggling slightly, probably
Speaker 2: just tip hole car in this one, but yeah, that
Speaker 2: could be a game that goes either way. Pull left
Speaker 2: C host Lee at five thirty. Look, I think holl
Speaker 2: of C a rubbish this year and that's been proven,
Speaker 2: and you know, LUI will win that game comfortably to
Speaker 2: lose play York at eight o'clock. Yes, very evenly matched teams.
Speaker 2: A tough one to pick. I think maybe just short.
Speaker 2: But then again, it would not surprise me if to
Speaker 2: listen with that one.
Speaker 1: On our solitary Sunday fixture, Castleford host Leed Rhinos. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so the question before we go, John, is it coming home.
Speaker 2: Now? I'm not coming home. I'm already I'm already at
Speaker 2: home made, I'm hand a bed after this. Okay. Will
Speaker 2: England win the fief for World Cup? I don't know. Look,
Speaker 2: I think it's interesting that I haven't played that particularly well,
Speaker 2: but they've still managed to pull it out of the
Speaker 2: bag in numerous games, which shows a lot of finding
Speaker 2: spirit and a lot of characters. So look, the messy
Speaker 2: Falklands war Derby should be they however, send before I'm
Speaker 2: looking forward to that one. Me too, Me too. Anyway,
Speaker 2: this is a Rugby league podcast.
Speaker 1: Indeed, and you've been listening to Lee Addison. You can
Speaker 1: get an admin at Rugby League Coach dot com. Bete
Speaker 1: you which is the email address at Rugby League Coach
Speaker 1: on socials, please send a message on Instagram or Facebook
Speaker 1: log because I don't look at the messages on TikTok
Speaker 1: and things like that. And I'm also on Rugby League
Speaker 1: coach dot com dot au. John, Where can we get
Speaker 1: you apart from the tennis court.
Speaker 2: You can get me on exit Johnny d Davidson. You
Speaker 2: can get me on Facebook a John Davidson journalist and
Speaker 2: on Instagram as well. Did you watch Wimbledon? No? I
Speaker 2: did not. Okay, take care