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<v Speaker 1>There's been a push throughout California to get rid of

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<v Speaker 1>at large seats for various kinds of municipal entities, school districts,

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<v Speaker 1>and also city councils. And here to talk with me

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<v Speaker 1>about this change happening in a pretty large municipality within

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<v Speaker 1>the Sanwaquin Valley from the City of Clovis. He is

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<v Speaker 1>a several year now, how many years have you been

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<v Speaker 1>a city council in now?

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<v Speaker 2>Just finish?

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<v Speaker 1>You just finished your seventh year. Okay, in his second

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<v Speaker 1>term as a city council member. Currently the mayor of Clovis.

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<v Speaker 1>My friend Vong Muanatua. Good have you on the show far.

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<v Speaker 2>Thanks for having me, John.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, yeah, so let's let's dig into this. So

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<v Speaker 1>the City of Clovis this week had its city council meeting,

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<v Speaker 1>and among the issues it was discussing was the topic

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<v Speaker 1>of moving the closed city council seat elections from at

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<v Speaker 1>large seats where every member, every citizen of Clovis votes

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<v Speaker 1>for all of the members of the Clovis City Council,

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<v Speaker 1>and shifting to each council member representing a specific geographic

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<v Speaker 1>district within the City of Clovis. So maybe you could

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<v Speaker 1>tell me about why that change is happening and what's

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<v Speaker 1>sort of prompting that change. It seems like it's part

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<v Speaker 1>of a larger trend that's happening throughout California.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, this is all sort of initiated by the California

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<v Speaker 2>Voting Reiights Act CVRA. So under that act, which has

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<v Speaker 2>been around for a while, and usually the thresholders when

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<v Speaker 2>you reach one hundred thousand, kind of the population mark,

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<v Speaker 2>you sort of transition, and so we've been at one

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<v Speaker 2>hundred thousand for several years. But what prompts it is

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<v Speaker 2>an attorney will usually write a demand letter.

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<v Speaker 1>So yeah, as so much of the world works, so.

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<v Speaker 2>Once they write the demand letter you then it puts

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<v Speaker 2>you sort of in a cycle in which you would

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<v Speaker 2>have to switch sort of like a ninety five day

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<v Speaker 2>but forty five days from when you first receive it.

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<v Speaker 2>You have to respond and said yes, we will or

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<v Speaker 2>you say no, and then he will.

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<v Speaker 1>Most likely you say no, he's going to sue this.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, And so we received that from an attorney down

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<v Speaker 2>south who's been doing this all over the states, sort

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<v Speaker 2>of like when the ADA, the American with Disabilities Act,

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<v Speaker 2>all these attorneys was just writing the shows.

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<v Speaker 1>It strikes me as odd that there isn't just a

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<v Speaker 1>clear like dividing, like a hard line rule like you

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<v Speaker 1>pass x population threshold, you have to switch to it,

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<v Speaker 1>as opposed to a system where you're just waiting for

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<v Speaker 1>you know, the sword of damnicles to fault, like like

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<v Speaker 1>some random attorney to sue you to prompt it. And

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<v Speaker 1>I guess did you guys just basically assess that after

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<v Speaker 1>you receive this demand that it was unlikely for the

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<v Speaker 1>city to win an a legal challenge.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, there has not been one jurisdiction who has received

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<v Speaker 2>a demand letter and or who has actually contested as

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<v Speaker 2>everyone okay, so that it's sort of a you know,

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<v Speaker 2>financial decision more so than a we want are district?

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<v Speaker 1>Are you going to waste the citizen of clothes the

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<v Speaker 1>citizens of clothes money, Like, let's fight this thing, as

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<v Speaker 1>opposed to all right, well, we seems like this is

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<v Speaker 1>just something we have to do, Okay.

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<v Speaker 2>So the intent of the law, though, is to try

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<v Speaker 2>to get diversity and or get certain sectors of the

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<v Speaker 2>community who are underserved underrepresented. And so, for example, the

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<v Speaker 2>argument has made that since I am mong and I

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<v Speaker 2>ran and I never got in it could be because

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<v Speaker 2>it's at large, so the white population is drowning my

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<v Speaker 2>Mong vote.

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<v Speaker 1>But the irony of it, yes, here you are.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, the irony of it is John, it actually dilutes

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<v Speaker 2>my vote. Really, So if it's at large, I could

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<v Speaker 2>have gotten the Mong vot from every single Mong citizen

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<v Speaker 2>resident in Clovis, but now they actually divide me up.

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<v Speaker 1>Well because it kind of it kind of seems to

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<v Speaker 1>assume that racial ethnic minorities are congregated in like little

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<v Speaker 1>ethnic enclass, almost as opposed to the reality and many

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<v Speaker 1>I'm sure throughout California, which is that, I don't know.

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<v Speaker 1>The Mong community is probably about is. I don't know.

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<v Speaker 1>There's probably some neighborhoods where they're more among people, but

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<v Speaker 1>it seems like it's pretty diffused.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and especially in Clovis. Yeah, you will not be

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<v Speaker 2>able to find. Oh, there's the Latino community, there's the

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<v Speaker 2>black community.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and so we're all, yeah, what's the Mong part

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<v Speaker 1>of town. I don't know. I lived in close my

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<v Speaker 1>whole life. I don't know what that is.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, the the the insulting thing about this law is

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<v Speaker 2>that it assumes every ethnic group votes the same as well,

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<v Speaker 2>so they're assuming that all mong will just vote for

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<v Speaker 2>the Mong candidate, all Latinos will vote for the Latino candidate, right,

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<v Speaker 2>and that that is totally absurd.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, yeah, and it seems like I can kind of

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<v Speaker 1>understand that it's it's rooted in like, you know, the

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<v Speaker 1>there were these historically racist practices in the American South,

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<v Speaker 1>where like you would take the African you know, the

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<v Speaker 1>one African American neighborhood in a Southern city and you know,

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<v Speaker 1>either just have that be one district and all the

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<v Speaker 1>other districts had no Black people voters in it, or

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<v Speaker 1>you take the black neighborhood and divide it up like

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<v Speaker 1>a you know, a bunch of pizza slices to totally

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<v Speaker 1>dilute its power. But I just don't feel like that

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<v Speaker 1>historical context is relevant to California of today, like like that,

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, I you know, the situation of racial and

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<v Speaker 1>ethnic minorities like Latinos or whatever in California is just

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<v Speaker 1>not the same as you know, African Americans living under

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<v Speaker 1>Joe Crow, you know. So anyway, so regardless of that,

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<v Speaker 1>now and then the cynical side of me thinks that

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<v Speaker 1>the idea of this is Clovis is at large a

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<v Speaker 1>very very conservative city, and if you divide it into

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<v Speaker 1>individual districts, maybe there's some thought that Democrats can you

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<v Speaker 1>pick up maybe one or two individual districts if you carve.

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<v Speaker 1>If you carve Clovis up the right way, quote the

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<v Speaker 1>right way, which I'm sure for liberals will mean in

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<v Speaker 1>a way that's politically advantageous for them, maybe you can

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<v Speaker 1>get one or two seats to be controlled by Democrats.

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<v Speaker 1>So I want to ask you about the individual proposals

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<v Speaker 1>for dividing the city into city council districts. So the

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<v Speaker 1>two main divisions seem to be one. Should Clovis adopt

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<v Speaker 1>a strong mayor system where we have four city council

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<v Speaker 1>members and a mayor, kind of more analogous to like

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<v Speaker 1>the city of Fresno, where Jerry Dyer is not a

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<v Speaker 1>member of the city council. The current vong you are

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<v Speaker 1>the mayor of clothes, but really you're the premus into paras.

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<v Speaker 1>You're the first among equals. You're you're you're just a

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<v Speaker 1>member of the city council and you as mayor, you

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<v Speaker 1>just direct the meetings.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right.

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<v Speaker 1>The big question before you, guys, is four council members

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<v Speaker 1>with a strong mayor or just keep five council members

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<v Speaker 1>with the mayor just being you know, the president of

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<v Speaker 1>the council. So I want to ask what your thoughts

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<v Speaker 1>are on those two options and and what what is

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<v Speaker 1>your personal preference. I'm curious to hear how you think

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<v Speaker 1>about this issue.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, m you just clarify, with the four plus one,

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<v Speaker 2>it is not a strong mayor system.

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<v Speaker 1>It's not really a strong not so it's.

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<v Speaker 2>Still just five council members. Only that the mayor is

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<v Speaker 2>neglected at large. So that's the only difference.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay.

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<v Speaker 2>To have a strong mayor, we would have to actually

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<v Speaker 2>revamp everything, put new ordinances in to actually empower the

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<v Speaker 2>mayor to have the authorities that we see in Fresno

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<v Speaker 2>really is just one voted at large R four through districts.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, well, wow, I did I didn't even realize that. Okay, Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>Well that's that's an interesting difference. All right, Well, I

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<v Speaker 1>guess between those two options, what what would be your pick?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, too, in order to keep some sort of where

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<v Speaker 2>the citizens feel like they are having influence, have the

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<v Speaker 2>opportunity to reach everyone, I'd like the five at large.

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<v Speaker 2>So all five five districts, so that way the mayor

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<v Speaker 2>is rotated like how we have right now, Okay, So

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<v Speaker 2>that way every council member knows they're going to have

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<v Speaker 2>to answer to the whole community at some time. I

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<v Speaker 2>think the biggest fear of Clovis citizens is if we

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<v Speaker 2>do go to districts, we will start only answering to

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<v Speaker 2>our constituents instead of answering to the city as a whole.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, that's always like a criticism in Fresno, like whoever

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<v Speaker 1>represents I think it's District six, which is kind of

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<v Speaker 1>the North Fresnok kind of woodward parky thing. Whoever's there

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<v Speaker 1>is always hit with the accusation you don't care about

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<v Speaker 1>what's happening in South Presny. You just care about all

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<v Speaker 1>the rich fat cats up there. And that is one

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<v Speaker 1>of the I think one of the worst things about

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<v Speaker 1>switching from at lard to at large to individual geographic

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<v Speaker 1>districts is that there is kind of that natural I

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<v Speaker 1>mean maybe there there is to a certain extent, maybe

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<v Speaker 1>a natural temptation towards that, and you you know, it's

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<v Speaker 1>a little bit I mean, if you elect virtuous people

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<v Speaker 1>to office, who have a real civic minded attitude. Who

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<v Speaker 1>who say, yes, I'm elected to represent this district of Clovis,

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<v Speaker 1>but I care about the well being of all of clothes. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>I mean you, yes, there are good people like that,

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<v Speaker 1>but sometimes there aren't, and and and and there are

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<v Speaker 1>natural little tribalisms that can develop.

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<v Speaker 2>And that's that's what you just said there, because the

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<v Speaker 2>the rest of the city cannot vote me out right,

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<v Speaker 2>So as long as my little you know, tribe here

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<v Speaker 2>keeps voting me in, right, who cares what old town says?

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<v Speaker 2>Because I'm in close he's here. Who cares what Harlan

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<v Speaker 2>Ranch says now? Because I I'm only from close east.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, and even like for I mean, like for your

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<v Speaker 1>just your most recent election, as an example, how many

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<v Speaker 1>people actually voted for I mean, do you know off

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<v Speaker 1>the top of your head.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's in almost thirty thousand, so twenty five twenty

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<v Speaker 2>eight depending And that's so you know, that's a large

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<v Speaker 2>increase from when we used to be odd year March elections. Right,

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<v Speaker 2>this is the second and it's a presidential as well.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so you're getting only twenty five thousand people to

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<v Speaker 1>vote for you in an at large election. So let's

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<v Speaker 1>divide that by five, you know. I mean, so then

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<v Speaker 1>one individual council member can secure their seat with five

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<v Speaker 1>or six thousand people voting for them. I mean that

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<v Speaker 1>that seems like that makes you a lot less kind

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<v Speaker 1>of accountable. I mean, there's a lot fewer people that

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<v Speaker 1>have to be accountable.

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<v Speaker 2>To and it takes away the rights of the individual

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<v Speaker 2>citizens who are voting. Yeah, off, five make a decision

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<v Speaker 2>that affect you. Sure you can only select.

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<v Speaker 1>One, right, Yeah, yeah, well that's that's true.

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<v Speaker 2>The one positive though, John is Okay, now I'm trying

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<v Speaker 2>to get one hundred and twenty five, one hundred and

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<v Speaker 2>thirty thousand people to know my message. Okay, maybe it's

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<v Speaker 2>less expensive to run a campaign. Sure, you have to

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<v Speaker 2>reach fewer people, and so maybe on that end it

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<v Speaker 2>helps someone who has less connections as a city. In

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<v Speaker 2>a city, now you only want to reach five thousand people.

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<v Speaker 1>Sure, but it is still I mean it's not like,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, Clovis is not that big. I mean, it's

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<v Speaker 1>not like we're talking to city of six hundred thousand

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<v Speaker 1>people or anything. Anyway, I digress. So, well, let me

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<v Speaker 1>go through. So in your personal preference, then would be

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<v Speaker 1>five council members, not the four council members with districts

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<v Speaker 1>plus one at large council. That is correct.

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<v Speaker 2>That is your view, okay, and I think that's the

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<v Speaker 2>consensus of the council from this last meeting. We've directed

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<v Speaker 2>and ultimately it's the council who makes the decision, even

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<v Speaker 2>though there's a lot of input from the citizens. We

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<v Speaker 2>did direct the demographer and also made a sort of

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<v Speaker 2>a decision that citizens, unless there is a huge group

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<v Speaker 2>that is submitting mass with a four plus one, we're

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<v Speaker 2>directing citizens to just submit the five district maps.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay. Yeah, because I had seen I think a week

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<v Speaker 1>or so ago when I first talked with you about this,

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<v Speaker 1>I had seen there were different proposals from citizens that

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<v Speaker 1>were on the website. It seemed like half and half.

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<v Speaker 1>But obviously this is a thing that the council can direct,

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<v Speaker 1>So it's you're sort of settled on five, you know.

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<v Speaker 1>Let me ask you. One of the things with recentmap

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<v Speaker 1>redrawing of the map that happened with the Fresno County

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<v Speaker 1>Board of Supervisors was there was a lot of fighting

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<v Speaker 1>over it, and a lot of the fighting was from

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<v Speaker 1>certain kinds of left wing groups like Dolores Weerta's organization

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<v Speaker 1>was really pushing for a certain kind of map. The

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<v Speaker 1>County Board of Supervisors, excuse me, the County Board of

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<v Speaker 1>Supervisors adopted a different map, which was much to the

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<v Speaker 1>displeasure of the Dolores wwareses of the world. Has there

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<v Speaker 1>been any kind of really politicized map proposals that have

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<v Speaker 1>come to you, guys, or proposals that you've identified as such.

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<v Speaker 2>No, that there are very very strict rules with regards

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<v Speaker 2>to sort of the social economic makeup, the variance within

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<v Speaker 2>the population of the five districts, and so the maps

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<v Speaker 2>that have been proposed the three for the five at large,

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<v Speaker 2>and the variance in population between the five districts, it's

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<v Speaker 2>only about five percent, okay, So the threshold is nine percent,

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<v Speaker 2>and if it goes over nine percent, then that map

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<v Speaker 2>is dead.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, yeah, yeah, And so there are.

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<v Speaker 2>Strict rules that they try to make it where it

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<v Speaker 2>has the most diverse amount of diverse meaning home types,

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<v Speaker 2>to income, to education, so it has all that breakdown.

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<v Speaker 2>So if you go to the website you actually look

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<v Speaker 2>at the map, the map actually gives you data on

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<v Speaker 2>the back end. If you click the next page, it'll

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<v Speaker 2>tell you Okay, how many of this economic level, income level,

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<v Speaker 2>and so it gives you all that in the right,

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<v Speaker 2>so we try to make it as diverse as possible.

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<v Speaker 1>One way that I feel like the California Voter Rights

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<v Speaker 1>Act has been used is to sort of basically to

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<v Speaker 1>make being Latino being a minority of some sort almost

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<v Speaker 1>it's that is something that can't be broken up when

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<v Speaker 1>I think the real goal of the people pushing that

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<v Speaker 1>is we want more, you know, solid powerful enclaves of

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<v Speaker 1>Democrat voters. Is the real motivation behind that. Have you

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<v Speaker 1>found with any of the map proposals, because you have

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<v Speaker 1>to kind of respect the California Voter Rights X, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>provisions about not breaking up you know, ethnic minority populations,

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<v Speaker 1>although in Clovis, I'm not sure if our ethnic minority

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<v Speaker 1>is the majority. I'm not sure if Latinos are actually

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<v Speaker 1>the majority in Clovis or if.

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<v Speaker 2>All they're the majority. Whites are actually a minority, right.

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<v Speaker 1>Right, Okay, some whites have a plurality anyway, Has there

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<v Speaker 1>been any so you haven't really seen with any of

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<v Speaker 1>the proposed maps any kind of shenanigans that are that

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<v Speaker 1>are clearly designed for, you know, just Democrats. To try

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<v Speaker 1>to pick up some seats or something.

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<v Speaker 2>No, I mean, it does give breakdown on registration, and

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<v Speaker 2>so it does give that, but it a couple of

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<v Speaker 2>the maps do show where there is the highest percentage

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<v Speaker 2>of Latino voters, okay, and so it does give that

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<v Speaker 2>sure information. But other than that, it's it's hard to tell.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, all right, Well, it sounds like it's not something

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<v Speaker 1>you guys are thrilled with, but hopefully it's going to

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<v Speaker 1>happen in a way that's you know, at least still

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<v Speaker 1>having somewhat representative council that does represent the citizenry as

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<v Speaker 1>a whole. So, and any last thoughts on the whole time.

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<v Speaker 2>I believe that if Clovis has to do this, we

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<v Speaker 2>can do it better. Sure, And not only that, I

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<v Speaker 2>am encouraging and I am encouraged that the smaller pockets

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<v Speaker 2>of voters will then be able to organize easier and

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<v Speaker 2>actually vote and hold accountable their individual council members and

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<v Speaker 2>so on that end it it'll be easier. So there's

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<v Speaker 2>a smaller group we can go No, we don't want

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<v Speaker 2>you just to represent us. We're voting you to represent

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<v Speaker 2>the entire city. And you've been voting this way, so

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<v Speaker 2>I am hopeful that the citizens will be able to

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<v Speaker 2>do that.

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<v Speaker 1>So I hope so too.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, please stay, engage close residents, and please draw your

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<v Speaker 2>maps and come to you have three more meetings, so

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<v Speaker 2>two more map meetings and one final meeting in which

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<v Speaker 2>the council will look at whatever maps are available and

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<v Speaker 2>make that decision, and that'll be on I think the

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<v Speaker 2>adoption meeting is March tenth.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so by March tenth we'll kind of know what

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<v Speaker 1>we're doing, all right, Close City Council Member maryor Clovis

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<v Speaker 1>vong Wana twa, thanks so much for being on the show.

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<v Speaker 1>Thanks for having me, John, all right, we'll be back

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<v Speaker 1>with more on The John Girardi Show. It really fills

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<v Speaker 1>me with resentment that liberals throughout the state of California

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<v Speaker 1>just bully municipalities like Clovis into changing the structure of

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<v Speaker 1>their city council. So we just had vong wan Atua,

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<v Speaker 1>who's the close city council member, the mayor of Clovis,

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<v Speaker 1>who is discussing all this in the last segment or

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<v Speaker 1>thanks to vong for coming on the show. It just

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<v Speaker 1>frustrates me how cities have to do this now that

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<v Speaker 1>basically you have a city it's got at large elections

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<v Speaker 1>for its city council members, and some left wing lawyer

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<v Speaker 1>who wants to just make a buck suing cities comes

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<v Speaker 1>over and says, hey, you need to change your whole

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<v Speaker 1>elections structure, as if there wasn't some way for California

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<v Speaker 1>just to institute the change. Hey, once you have a

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<v Speaker 1>population that is measured to be over x threshold for

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<v Speaker 1>five consecutive years, then you have to switch to you

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<v Speaker 1>Then you have to switch from at large city councils

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<v Speaker 1>to individual district city councils. Instead of clear guidance like that, No,

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<v Speaker 1>we have to have cities living in fear of litigation

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<v Speaker 1>and be bullied into it by some lawyer sending a

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<v Speaker 1>threatening letter. And it's not just cities that are impacted

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<v Speaker 1>by this. By the way, Clovis Unified School District is

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<v Speaker 1>being bullied into this as well. And I think it's

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<v Speaker 1>even worse for school districts than it is for city councils.

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<v Speaker 1>One for the reason Vong talks about, I mean, in Clovis,

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<v Speaker 1>it used to be that all of the city council

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<v Speaker 1>members were accountable to all of the citizenry of Clovis.

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<v Speaker 1>You had to have broad based support from a fairly

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<v Speaker 1>large population base. Now you you know, he got twenty

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<v Speaker 1>five thousand votes in his most recent election. Now he's

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<v Speaker 1>you know, if he gets five thousand votes as an

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<v Speaker 1>city council member representing a little chunk of Clovis, five

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<v Speaker 1>thousand votes will get him in. Well, that's the same.

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<v Speaker 1>Maybe that's even worse. When you're talking about school districts.

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<v Speaker 1>You're going to be accountable to just the voters from

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<v Speaker 1>this high school, just the voters from that high school,

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<v Speaker 1>as well as the kind of petty regional jealousies that

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<v Speaker 1>can result. I think it's really bad for city councils.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean that has always been the problem. Within Fresdent

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<v Speaker 1>Unified people will always accuse the Bullard representative of oh,

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<v Speaker 1>you just care about all the rich people who live

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<v Speaker 1>near Bullard, you don't actually care about blah blah blah

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<v Speaker 1>blah blah. Those kinds of petty squabbles immediately happen. So

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<v Speaker 1>it's frustrating to me. How it really is frustrating to

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<v Speaker 1>me how we're being pushed into this change in the

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<v Speaker 1>city of Clovis. And I'm sure it's gonna happen with

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<v Speaker 1>other cities in the salon Kin Valley once they get

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<v Speaker 1>over a certain threshold of about one hundred thousand people,

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<v Speaker 1>that we're going to have to change our whole system

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<v Speaker 1>of city government to something that's not clearly better, but

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<v Speaker 1>something where Democrats think that they can pick up more

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<v Speaker 1>seats and manipulate the redistricting system. When we return, we're

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<v Speaker 1>going to talk a little bit about immigration stuff, immigration

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<v Speaker 1>news changes to that the Trump administration is brought about,

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<v Speaker 1>and I want to talk about how this works from

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<v Speaker 1>a justice standpoint. That's next on the John Girardi Show.

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<v Speaker 1>I want to talk about changes the Trump administration has

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<v Speaker 1>made with immigration policy, as well as even just the

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<v Speaker 1>change the proposal from the Trump administration the Executive Order

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<v Speaker 1>to change the national understanding of birthright citizenship. Are you

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<v Speaker 1>a citizen just by virtue of being born on American soil.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm going to talk about these two topics in different

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<v Speaker 1>ways about the course of this segment, all right, I

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<v Speaker 1>want to start just with Trump immigration policy. So Trump

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<v Speaker 1>has obviously changed a lot with immigration enforcement. As soon

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<v Speaker 1>as he comes in, it's going to go back to

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<v Speaker 1>the remain and the remain in Mexico. Policy is going

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<v Speaker 1>to come right back into play, and there's now I

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<v Speaker 1>guess this is one of the terrible things about the

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<v Speaker 1>Biden policy, the Biden immigration policies, is the whiplash for

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<v Speaker 1>the immigrants themselves coming into the country illegally or in

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<v Speaker 1>the weird quasi legal structure that Biden put in place.

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<v Speaker 1>And this is the point I want to set up

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<v Speaker 1>that there is some aspect of what's happening that is,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, I'm concerned about illegal immigration for a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of reasons, a lot of reasons because it's deeply unfair

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<v Speaker 1>to the citizens in this country, because our lacks immigration

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<v Speaker 1>standards have led to criminals coming into this country who

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<v Speaker 1>commit crimes against our own citizenry, because our lax immigration

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<v Speaker 1>policies lead to just a cheap basically, there's this desire

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<v Speaker 1>to maintain an almost helot like cheap labor force in

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<v Speaker 1>this country that white liberals act as though as some

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<v Speaker 1>kind of virtue. That was the silliest thing from Remember

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<v Speaker 1>the episcopal bishop who was lecturing Trump advance at the

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<v Speaker 1>National Cathedral her the way she was justifying her critique

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<v Speaker 1>of Trump's policies. When it came to immigration was to ask,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, where are people going to come who serve

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<v Speaker 1>us our food and you know, work in our hotels

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<v Speaker 1>and stuff, As if it's like a good thing to

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<v Speaker 1>have this permanent underclass in a perilous non citizen status

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<v Speaker 1>constantly there to serve us, as if that is something just,

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<v Speaker 1>as if that liberal reality, that effect of liberal immigration

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<v Speaker 1>policy is something good, and as if I'm supposed to

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<v Speaker 1>feel like I'm an unjust person for saying, Hey, no,

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<v Speaker 1>I don't think we should allow unrestricted immigration for service

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<v Speaker 1>industry jobs, where we can pay people under the table,

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<v Speaker 1>and pay them under the table in ways that are

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<v Speaker 1>somewhat abusive, because these employees know if they make too

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<v Speaker 1>much noise given their illegal status, they could be their

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<v Speaker 1>employer could ship their rear home with one call to

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<v Speaker 1>ice or whatever. No, that's not a just system anyway,

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<v Speaker 1>I digress. One of the ways in which Biden allowed

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<v Speaker 1>people to get into the country in a legal slash

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<v Speaker 1>illegal way, basically a thing that gave legal cover of

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<v Speaker 1>law to people who were just coming unlawfully, was through

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<v Speaker 1>this thing called the CBP one app. And this app

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<v Speaker 1>basically allowed people people were coming They're coming through Mexico.

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<v Speaker 1>They're coming to a border point, some sort of border

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<v Speaker 1>patrol point to make an asylum claim. The app basically

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<v Speaker 1>allowed people to sort of grease the skids for that process.

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<v Speaker 1>Get all your stuff ready, get you get to an

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<v Speaker 1>immigration checkpoint, you make an asylum claim, we just let

420
00:25:23.519 --> 00:25:28.160
<v Speaker 1>you in. We give you basically this automatic parole status

421
00:25:28.200 --> 00:25:31.799
<v Speaker 1>to allow you to come into the country. Well, President

422
00:25:31.839 --> 00:25:35.599
<v Speaker 1>Trump has basically decided this is an insane policy, which

423
00:25:35.640 --> 00:25:41.079
<v Speaker 1>it is. They've shut down the CVP one app. So

424
00:25:41.160 --> 00:25:44.039
<v Speaker 1>now the question is for those people who've been sort

425
00:25:44.039 --> 00:25:47.160
<v Speaker 1>of released into the United States, what is their status?

426
00:25:47.400 --> 00:25:52.599
<v Speaker 1>Do they have their court dates set up any more?

427
00:25:53.279 --> 00:25:58.359
<v Speaker 1>Or are they going to be just shipped back? And

428
00:25:58.400 --> 00:26:02.880
<v Speaker 1>this is the thing that there's some sort of whiplash

429
00:26:03.000 --> 00:26:05.079
<v Speaker 1>that this is the one aspect of this where I

430
00:26:05.440 --> 00:26:10.440
<v Speaker 1>somewhat feel bad for people who come and came into

431
00:26:10.440 --> 00:26:14.279
<v Speaker 1>the country illegally. Here are all these this population of

432
00:26:14.279 --> 00:26:19.599
<v Speaker 1>people who is given this green light, come on in

433
00:26:21.079 --> 00:26:25.759
<v Speaker 1>and they expend tons of time, energy, money, this humongous

434
00:26:25.799 --> 00:26:30.480
<v Speaker 1>shift in their whole lives to come to a foreign country,

435
00:26:31.279 --> 00:26:34.839
<v Speaker 1>and now within four years a whiplash totally the other way,

436
00:26:34.920 --> 00:26:38.400
<v Speaker 1>where now they're going to live in this somewhat powerless

437
00:26:38.519 --> 00:26:46.960
<v Speaker 1>non legal status awaiting possible deportation. I mean, there's a

438
00:26:47.880 --> 00:26:52.480
<v Speaker 1>it's a bizarre sort of whiplash for those individual people. Now,

439
00:26:53.440 --> 00:26:55.319
<v Speaker 1>I'm not going to say that every single one of

440
00:26:55.319 --> 00:27:01.920
<v Speaker 1>these individual people deserve our pity or our concern. One

441
00:27:01.920 --> 00:27:04.240
<v Speaker 1>of the things I've heard from a friend of mine

442
00:27:04.279 --> 00:27:12.799
<v Speaker 1>who does immigration law stuff is the role that cartels

443
00:27:12.880 --> 00:27:17.839
<v Speaker 1>can play in getting people to the border. That in

444
00:27:17.960 --> 00:27:23.319
<v Speaker 1>his assessment, for any person the car, for any person

445
00:27:23.359 --> 00:27:25.839
<v Speaker 1>who's getting to the border to be picked up by

446
00:27:25.880 --> 00:27:30.319
<v Speaker 1>the border patrol, they have to pay off the cartel

447
00:27:30.440 --> 00:27:37.039
<v Speaker 1>about twenty five hundred bucks to get over the border undetected.

448
00:27:38.240 --> 00:27:46.279
<v Speaker 1>The cartel makes like twelve thousand bucks. That's his assessment,

449
00:27:46.359 --> 00:27:49.119
<v Speaker 1>not mine. I'm not saying that's the gospel truth necessarily,

450
00:27:49.160 --> 00:27:52.559
<v Speaker 1>but I mean he knows a lot more about this

451
00:27:52.640 --> 00:27:58.640
<v Speaker 1>than I do. So, you know, here are people actively

452
00:27:58.880 --> 00:28:04.640
<v Speaker 1>funding Mexican drug cartels and the cartels playing an active

453
00:28:04.720 --> 00:28:09.880
<v Speaker 1>role in facilitating people getting over the border. And by

454
00:28:09.920 --> 00:28:12.400
<v Speaker 1>the way, you've got to think that this is somehow

455
00:28:13.039 --> 00:28:15.160
<v Speaker 1>you know, the drug cartels are what are they? They

456
00:28:15.160 --> 00:28:20.559
<v Speaker 1>are cartels for drugs. You gotta think this is contributing

457
00:28:20.599 --> 00:28:24.079
<v Speaker 1>to or part of the flow of narcotics into the

458
00:28:24.160 --> 00:28:28.480
<v Speaker 1>United States. So I'm not gonna act as though I'm

459
00:28:28.519 --> 00:28:32.279
<v Speaker 1>crying big alligator tears for every single individual person involved.

460
00:28:32.440 --> 00:28:35.759
<v Speaker 1>But there is some real, genuine whiplash with all of this,

461
00:28:35.880 --> 00:28:40.039
<v Speaker 1>and I guess my hope, my prayer for the Trump administration,

462
00:28:44.680 --> 00:28:48.920
<v Speaker 1>I want deportations. I want the application of American law

463
00:28:48.960 --> 00:28:51.440
<v Speaker 1>to be done in a way that's just and fair.

464
00:28:52.440 --> 00:28:55.200
<v Speaker 1>I want the priority first and foremost obviously to be

465
00:28:55.279 --> 00:28:58.160
<v Speaker 1>on anyone who's here who had a criminal record in

466
00:28:58.200 --> 00:29:04.680
<v Speaker 1>Mexico or or there, whatever their home country was, whom

467
00:29:04.720 --> 00:29:06.440
<v Speaker 1>we never would have allowed into the country in the

468
00:29:06.480 --> 00:29:10.319
<v Speaker 1>first place, or anyone who's committed any crime here. Get

469
00:29:10.359 --> 00:29:19.519
<v Speaker 1>them out. I guess my concern is that there are

470
00:29:20.599 --> 00:29:26.240
<v Speaker 1>real when you get rid of the criminals and you

471
00:29:26.440 --> 00:29:31.480
<v Speaker 1>shove them aside, there are people who are in the

472
00:29:31.559 --> 00:29:36.960
<v Speaker 1>country who were here under some kind of cover of law,

473
00:29:37.119 --> 00:29:40.799
<v Speaker 1>some kind of colorable legal claim that they thought they

474
00:29:40.799 --> 00:29:42.839
<v Speaker 1>were allowed to come here. And this is maybe the

475
00:29:42.880 --> 00:29:46.400
<v Speaker 1>biggest injustice of the Biden administration policy. Why did you

476
00:29:46.519 --> 00:29:48.960
<v Speaker 1>let these people in? Why did you let these people

477
00:29:49.000 --> 00:29:52.240
<v Speaker 1>in with this perilous legal status. When you know American

478
00:29:52.279 --> 00:29:55.960
<v Speaker 1>immigration policy ping pong's back and forth between Republicans and

479
00:29:55.960 --> 00:30:01.599
<v Speaker 1>Democrats every four years. At the very least, the greater

480
00:30:01.880 --> 00:30:06.200
<v Speaker 1>justice of the Republican sort suite of policies is it's

481
00:30:06.440 --> 00:30:09.759
<v Speaker 1>just letting people know, don't get involved in this on

482
00:30:09.799 --> 00:30:12.400
<v Speaker 1>the front end, because we're you know, you're gonna be

483
00:30:12.400 --> 00:30:15.319
<v Speaker 1>in a perilous state if you come here, you're gonna

484
00:30:15.359 --> 00:30:18.880
<v Speaker 1>be living in fear of deportation. Don't come in illegally.

485
00:30:18.960 --> 00:30:20.799
<v Speaker 1>The door is shut. You want to come in, you

486
00:30:20.839 --> 00:30:24.519
<v Speaker 1>come through a legal process, but the door is otherwise shut.

487
00:30:24.880 --> 00:30:30.400
<v Speaker 1>No more abuse of the asylum system. You want to

488
00:30:30.880 --> 00:30:32.839
<v Speaker 1>try and make an asylum claim, you got to remain

489
00:30:32.880 --> 00:30:36.759
<v Speaker 1>in Mexico, but we're not. The door is not open.

490
00:30:37.480 --> 00:30:41.400
<v Speaker 1>And that's actually the Trump administration saying that on the

491
00:30:41.440 --> 00:30:45.039
<v Speaker 1>front end. There's actually a far greater justice in that

492
00:30:45.119 --> 00:30:47.480
<v Speaker 1>because it deters people from trying to get in in

493
00:30:47.519 --> 00:30:49.559
<v Speaker 1>the first place. One of the things the Border Patrol

494
00:30:49.599 --> 00:30:52.279
<v Speaker 1>has been reporting, just in this first you know, we're

495
00:30:52.319 --> 00:30:55.480
<v Speaker 1>not even a full week into the Trump administration. One

496
00:30:55.519 --> 00:30:58.960
<v Speaker 1>of the things they're reporting is a massive decrease in

497
00:30:59.039 --> 00:31:05.880
<v Speaker 1>the number of counters they're having with potential illegal aliens.

498
00:31:06.480 --> 00:31:11.200
<v Speaker 1>The message. You know, everyone knows what Trump Everyone in

499
00:31:11.240 --> 00:31:15.200
<v Speaker 1>the Western hemisphere knows what it means when Donald Trump

500
00:31:15.279 --> 00:31:21.279
<v Speaker 1>selected the illegal immigration door is closed, don't try it.

501
00:31:23.000 --> 00:31:25.279
<v Speaker 1>And that's a lot of it is. There is a

502
00:31:26.000 --> 00:31:34.160
<v Speaker 1>closing of the door. But at the same time, I

503
00:31:34.400 --> 00:31:37.559
<v Speaker 1>guess this is my fear. And you know, you might

504
00:31:37.599 --> 00:31:41.039
<v Speaker 1>say John's a softy liberal. John's not hardcore. All right,

505
00:31:41.160 --> 00:31:47.039
<v Speaker 1>John is a softy liberal and he's not hardcore. I dislike,

506
00:31:49.160 --> 00:31:58.079
<v Speaker 1>I strongly don't want to see family separations in ways

507
00:31:58.119 --> 00:32:01.920
<v Speaker 1>that are unjust. I don't want to see people who

508
00:32:02.359 --> 00:32:06.200
<v Speaker 1>came into the country, perhaps illegally, have had a difficult time,

509
00:32:06.599 --> 00:32:10.880
<v Speaker 1>with chaotic lives whatever, getting themselves a kind of stable

510
00:32:10.880 --> 00:32:15.920
<v Speaker 1>immigration status, who maybe have had kids here, have lived

511
00:32:15.920 --> 00:32:19.480
<v Speaker 1>here for years and years and years living in fear

512
00:32:19.519 --> 00:32:22.480
<v Speaker 1>of being rounded up by the border patrol. Sorry, I

513
00:32:22.720 --> 00:32:26.240
<v Speaker 1>just don't like that. I think that the whiplash effect

514
00:32:26.839 --> 00:32:31.079
<v Speaker 1>of different administrations signaling different things, and people making large

515
00:32:31.079 --> 00:32:34.920
<v Speaker 1>scale lifestyle decisions, people with people who don't speak our

516
00:32:35.000 --> 00:32:39.400
<v Speaker 1>language in some cases, who don't one hundred percent understand

517
00:32:39.440 --> 00:32:42.880
<v Speaker 1>what's going on. People who have been at various points

518
00:32:43.000 --> 00:32:48.680
<v Speaker 1>lied to who came into the country on the basis

519
00:32:48.720 --> 00:32:52.519
<v Speaker 1>of those representations now having to live in fear who

520
00:32:52.559 --> 00:32:56.400
<v Speaker 1>are otherwise law abiding. I don't know how many people

521
00:32:56.480 --> 00:33:00.640
<v Speaker 1>that is, but it's not enough. It's not enough. And

522
00:33:01.279 --> 00:33:03.559
<v Speaker 1>knowing the number of people I do who work with

523
00:33:04.799 --> 00:33:10.200
<v Speaker 1>various kinds of lower income persons and work with farm

524
00:33:10.240 --> 00:33:14.599
<v Speaker 1>workers and things like that, I don't want these people

525
00:33:14.640 --> 00:33:19.119
<v Speaker 1>to live in fear. I hate the whole system of

526
00:33:19.799 --> 00:33:22.680
<v Speaker 1>how our illegal immigration has set up. I hate the

527
00:33:22.799 --> 00:33:31.480
<v Speaker 1>false liberal compassion to say that having this permanent subclass

528
00:33:31.559 --> 00:33:38.680
<v Speaker 1>of illegal, cheap labor who work in our service industries

529
00:33:41.160 --> 00:33:46.039
<v Speaker 1>under the fear of being deported, that that is somehow

530
00:33:46.079 --> 00:33:50.240
<v Speaker 1>better than having Americans work those jobs, that that is

531
00:33:50.279 --> 00:33:54.599
<v Speaker 1>somehow better than having strict border enforcement. It is not fair,

532
00:33:54.640 --> 00:33:57.000
<v Speaker 1>it is not just, It is not right. I mean,

533
00:33:57.079 --> 00:34:00.640
<v Speaker 1>it reminds me of the helots in ancient Sparta. Ancient

534
00:34:00.680 --> 00:34:05.440
<v Speaker 1>Sparta was in many ways an incredibly unjust society, sort

535
00:34:05.440 --> 00:34:09.360
<v Speaker 1>of five hundreds four hundreds pc Sparta. It was one

536
00:34:09.400 --> 00:34:13.159
<v Speaker 1>of the major city states of ancient Greece. It was

537
00:34:13.679 --> 00:34:20.920
<v Speaker 1>fought against Athens. Sparta had this city near it, I

538
00:34:20.920 --> 00:34:24.159
<v Speaker 1>think it was called Messenia, and they made the citizens

539
00:34:24.159 --> 00:34:30.280
<v Speaker 1>of that region into a permanent class of slaves, the

540
00:34:30.360 --> 00:34:35.440
<v Speaker 1>helots whom they subjugated and made them into the sort

541
00:34:35.480 --> 00:34:42.679
<v Speaker 1>of their permanent slave class for decades, decades, decades, decades, permanently.

542
00:34:44.840 --> 00:34:49.000
<v Speaker 1>Is that what we want with Latino immigration into this country.

543
00:34:49.079 --> 00:34:51.199
<v Speaker 1>I don't want. I don't think that is just. And

544
00:34:51.239 --> 00:34:54.639
<v Speaker 1>that is basically how liberals have said, Well, they're doing

545
00:34:54.679 --> 00:34:57.760
<v Speaker 1>the jobs Americans don't want to do, so we should

546
00:34:57.800 --> 00:34:59.840
<v Speaker 1>permanently have this subclass. Even with the H one B

547
00:35:00.119 --> 00:35:04.119
<v Speaker 1>visa issue. Okay, you know why employers like H one

548
00:35:04.199 --> 00:35:08.039
<v Speaker 1>B visa employees rather than American employees. One you can

549
00:35:08.079 --> 00:35:14.079
<v Speaker 1>pay them less. Two if you fire them, they get deported.

550
00:35:15.599 --> 00:35:18.159
<v Speaker 1>If you fire an American, or you you lay off

551
00:35:18.199 --> 00:35:21.880
<v Speaker 1>an American or an American's unhappy with their job, they

552
00:35:21.880 --> 00:35:25.280
<v Speaker 1>can just go work somewhere else. And H one B

553
00:35:25.400 --> 00:35:28.639
<v Speaker 1>visa holder if they get fired, they go back to India.

554
00:35:29.639 --> 00:35:34.280
<v Speaker 1>So they're not going to complain about anything. I mean,

555
00:35:34.400 --> 00:35:39.559
<v Speaker 1>it's this wildly unjust system where here you've got someone

556
00:35:39.599 --> 00:35:41.840
<v Speaker 1>here on an H one B visa who's like, oh,

557
00:35:42.599 --> 00:35:44.679
<v Speaker 1>I'm not going to complain about any The employer can

558
00:35:44.719 --> 00:35:47.960
<v Speaker 1>be doing all kinds of unjust, unfair practices, and their

559
00:35:48.199 --> 00:35:50.480
<v Speaker 1>h one B visa employee will just sit there meekly

560
00:35:50.519 --> 00:35:53.880
<v Speaker 1>and take it. Your illegal immigrant dishwasher is not going

561
00:35:53.960 --> 00:35:59.320
<v Speaker 1>to complain about an owner, you know, skimming money or whatever.

562
00:36:02.239 --> 00:36:04.559
<v Speaker 1>Why because he's afraid he'll get deported if he speaks

563
00:36:04.599 --> 00:36:10.559
<v Speaker 1>up about anything bad happening. So it's a wildly unjust system.

564
00:36:12.440 --> 00:36:15.280
<v Speaker 1>And people who have been brought here have been brought

565
00:36:15.320 --> 00:36:17.920
<v Speaker 1>into this unfair, unjust system in many cases on the

566
00:36:17.960 --> 00:36:21.280
<v Speaker 1>basis of representations from this country. Yeah, maybe it was

567
00:36:21.280 --> 00:36:25.159
<v Speaker 1>on the basis of Joe Biden's representations. So I guess

568
00:36:25.199 --> 00:36:29.840
<v Speaker 1>I'm just nervous about the human toll of all this.

569
00:36:31.239 --> 00:36:36.400
<v Speaker 1>Do I want criminal illegal aliens to port it? Yes, yesterday.

570
00:36:36.519 --> 00:36:40.519
<v Speaker 1>It's shockingly evil how the Biden administration sort of allowed

571
00:36:40.559 --> 00:36:45.360
<v Speaker 1>this to come about. But I also can't sit here

572
00:36:45.400 --> 00:36:50.320
<v Speaker 1>and act like, you know, total mass deportation of everyone

573
00:36:50.360 --> 00:36:54.840
<v Speaker 1>with a non legal status is necessarily a good thing,

574
00:36:54.880 --> 00:36:58.559
<v Speaker 1>particularly when you're talking about people who made large scale

575
00:36:58.559 --> 00:37:03.119
<v Speaker 1>family arrangements in relative good faith on the basis of

576
00:37:03.280 --> 00:37:08.159
<v Speaker 1>our country representing things a certain way to them when

577
00:37:08.159 --> 00:37:12.079
<v Speaker 1>we return. It's the fifty second anniversary of Rov Wade

578
00:37:12.079 --> 00:37:14.320
<v Speaker 1>a quick thought on that on the John Girardi Show.

579
00:37:16.280 --> 00:37:19.599
<v Speaker 1>Just a quick thought. Earlier this week, on the twenty second,

580
00:37:19.960 --> 00:37:23.320
<v Speaker 1>was the fifty second anniversary of Roe v. Wade, and

581
00:37:23.719 --> 00:37:26.599
<v Speaker 1>there have been some pro lifers. You know, today as

582
00:37:26.639 --> 00:37:29.320
<v Speaker 1>the National March, was the National March for Life in Washington,

583
00:37:29.400 --> 00:37:32.559
<v Speaker 1>d C. Tomorrow is the Big Walk for Life West Coast.

584
00:37:32.599 --> 00:37:34.880
<v Speaker 1>I'm going up there with a bus full of supporters.

585
00:37:35.039 --> 00:37:36.719
<v Speaker 1>Some people have said, why are we having all these

586
00:37:36.719 --> 00:37:40.400
<v Speaker 1>pro life marches still on January twenty second. ROV Wade

587
00:37:40.480 --> 00:37:45.199
<v Speaker 1>is overturned. Well, ROV Wade is overturned. As a question

588
00:37:45.239 --> 00:37:48.800
<v Speaker 1>of constitutional law, abortion is not legal. Abortion is not

589
00:37:48.880 --> 00:37:53.760
<v Speaker 1>part of the fundamental law of the United States of America. However,

590
00:37:53.840 --> 00:38:00.320
<v Speaker 1>January twenty second represents a massive cultural, ethical, moral shift

591
00:38:00.679 --> 00:38:04.719
<v Speaker 1>in this country for the worse, and as such, I

592
00:38:04.760 --> 00:38:08.840
<v Speaker 1>think it deserves to be remembered with sorrow and penance.

593
00:38:09.559 --> 00:38:13.360
<v Speaker 1>So that legacy of Roe is still with us. A

594
00:38:13.400 --> 00:38:16.239
<v Speaker 1>million children still being aboarded every year. That'll do it,

595
00:38:16.280 --> 00:38:18.000
<v Speaker 1>John Giordy Show, See next time on Power Talk