Speaker 1: Well, it's my pleasure to welcome to our podcast this
week and it's the WBC. Here's theweight world champion, bad
new Jack that due. It's been a while since we've talked,
but you have an important fight coming up. You'll be
defending your title in a rematch against Duel mccallian, former champion,
take place December thirteenth at the Ace Mission Studios in
Los Angeles. It's the headliner of the Vast Promotions pay
perview that's going to be a babble all over. I
was looking at all the places people can see it,
Integrated Sports, PPV, dot Com, Prime Video, Triller TV, so
anybody can can check it out. So welcome to the show.
Thank you very much for doing this. Thank you appreciate that.
All right, So you have one bad Do world titles
at super middleweight at light heavyweight, and in twenty twenty
three had a very big win, a great knockout victory
against Junior Macabu to win this WBC cruiserweight title. And
then I know there was word from the WBC was
discussed at their convention that you were interested to go
up to their newly created weight division to try to
become a champion, he yet another weight class. If that
did not happen, there was a lot of back and
forth politics, fights that didn't happen, that fell out, this
and that, and then you ended up not fighting for
two years. Can you just briefly explain sort of what
was going on there and the disappointment of not getting
that opportunity and having that very long way off.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: So basically at the time I was with the Skills Challenge, Yeah,
the other Saudi promoter before Turkey took over, and yeah,
I guess they paid them beside money to the to
the guy that was the mandatory for that title or something.
So they wanted me to become a fourth division champion
and that was the plan against this I think it
was a Polish guy. Then Saudi politics whatever, the Prince
Khalet who was ahead of Skilled Challenge. Yeah, they removed
in from boxing or whatever, and so that fight never happened,
and then yeah, a lot of politics been waiting for
a fight since then, and uh, I guess they put
me in champion in recess while I was going to
move up.
Speaker 2: And then.
Speaker 3: That's the reason why Mchueleam fought for for my vacant belt.
Speaker 2: And then we were trying to fight him and he
his brother.
Speaker 3: At the WC convention last year, his brother represented him
and they I talked to him and he said, yeah,
let's let's.
Speaker 2: Make the fight blah blah blah.
Speaker 3: And then when the Sunday we were supposed to get
over on stage and talk in front of the WBC
and they didn't want that fight. And then Mauricio said,
we're here to solve this situation. You have a mandatory
champion in recess, current champion. This is all a mess,
and you don't want to fight the champion and he's
the biggest name out of all of you guys too,
and then so they so I was like, yeah, who
don't I fight the mandatory whatever the Canadian guy. Yeah,
so they so they downgraded him to champion in recess
and they upgraded me back and then yeah, and then
he got.
Speaker 2: Injured, so I so the was like, who you want
to fight?
Speaker 3: I said, because this is a mess with all the
mandatories and champion reason, let me just fight Michael so
I can move on and fight the unification fights.
Speaker 2: Well, so you're right, the easier fights, but but I said,
give me him.
Speaker 1: You use the perfect word the WBC cruiserweight title situation
has been an absolute mess, not for the fault of
the fighters so much, but a lot of the scheduling issues, injuries,
politics has But you ultimately had the two year layoffs. Yeah,
how frustrating. Was that very very frustrating. Yeah, I mean
I was back on top.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I had a great fight and everything, and then yeah,
we lost the momentum a little bit. But uh yeah
I'm still here. I'm still I've been training super hard
ever since. And uh yeah, now we got that fight.
It wasn't my best fight, but I clearly won in
my opinion, and it was a close fight. But nobody
except from his team, you know, and thought that was
you're you're talking about the fight that took place this
past May. In read it was on the undercard when
Canelo Alvarez had the headliner against Williams Skull, And like
you said, you won. You won that fight very close.
One thing I wanted to ask about that, and I
find this very fascinating. I've talked to some other fighters
who've been in the same situation because the fight was
in Saudi Arabia and they were doing it to make
it more conducive to the North American time zone, where
Canelo's fans were. You guys fought in the middle of
the night, which is a weird thing I think for
most fighters.
Speaker 2: Actually morning. It was six am or five am something. Yeah,
well that's right, that was right.
Speaker 1: What was that like, just because it was kind of
a weird vibe because it's not like a regular time
where you would be in a boxing match.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's the same thing for everybody though, so
so my opponent.
Speaker 3: Everybody that was on the car is weird, weird, But yeah,
we had to train like fight week, like at two am,
three am.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was. It was a little difficult, but no excuses.
Speaker 3: We it's a fight, so who cares what time it
is if somebody jumped you on the street, right, take
what time it is.
Speaker 2: No, you gotta fight.
Speaker 1: So that's a great way that I never thought about
it like that, but you're right about it. So you
guys had a Yeah, it was a pretty good fight,
but a very close fight, as you mentioned. But in
the end, the two judges had to fight one fifteen
to one thirteen for you, the third judge had at
one fourteen one fourteen. You win the majority decision. You
said just a minute ago, it wasn't your best fight.
Could you more uh more assess your performance in that,
because I've certainly seen you fight better over the years.
Speaker 3: Now. Yeah, maybe a little bit of a ring offs
and uh you know, switch up opponent five in the morning,
all that stuff. But yeah, he if to me in
the before the twelve round. My coaches are, yeah, all right,
it's a twelve round.
Speaker 2: Last round. It was the last round.
Speaker 3: I feel like it was like seven eight was like
a sparing session, so it was in. Yeah, I was
definitely not tired and nothing. I didn't push myself. So yeah,
but but I'm glad that we have the fight again
so I can show everybody that this guy is not
on my level. But at the same time, we're wasting
time and stuff for the big fights.
Speaker 2: But it is what it is. Don King promoter appealed,
which is crazy.
Speaker 3: But yeah, I guess he's been a good friend with
the WC, but the same thing with me, Mauricia, and
then they showed me a lot of love and I
got nothing but respect for them.
Speaker 1: So you mentioned that he did take the match out
about three weeks notice. Because your original opponent, Rosiki Ryan
Rosiki from Canada had suffered an injury, and so, like
you said, when the fight was over and it was
close and they had a very you know, like a
one point or one round decision to win for you
on the two cards, they appealed to the WBC to
ask for a rematch.
Speaker 2: It was ordered. Uh.
Speaker 1: I know you said, you want to, you know, prove
to him that you're the better man. But were a
little disappointed the ordered the rematch because, like you said,
time's a waste and there's some other bigger fights out there.
You had other champions that were looking for uh other
other unific you know, unification fights and bigger fights themselves.
But now you're in a position where you have to
run it back.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean, like, uh, it's insane to me. Nobody wanted
to see this fight other than you know, his teammates,
his his manager maybe and his family. So nobody want
to see that. But but now it is what it is.
Speaker 2: We're here.
Speaker 3: But imagine all the time that I've been robbed maybe
four times from bullshit draws, and with Deguil and Stevenson,
I never got no rematch, and this is a closed
fight with a with a no name guy nobody care
about and they're going to order remits.
Speaker 2: But yeah, it is what it is.
Speaker 1: You know, one of the craziest things I have ever
seen in my time. I've been covered boxing almost twenty
six years. They did a purse fit for this match,
this rematch, and and Dashed Promotion, which is ultimately going
to be the company that's promoting this pay per view fight,
and Don King his promoter, they did the same amount.
I had never seen a tie perspect. I asked Marcy
Solomon from the WBC about that. He said, in all
of his years in boxing, and he's conducted and been
involved with a thousand perspects, also has never seen a tie.
Perspect Both of them did two hundred and fifty thousand dollars.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: I mean when you heard that, like, did you? I mean,
you're going to be the answer to a trivia question.
I think for a long long time. What's the purspid
that was a tie? When you heard that? What were
your thoughts? That was wacky?
Speaker 3: Yeah, to be I didn't even follow it. I know
this is craning gap money, not even so. Yeah, it's crazy,
but that's that's what I'm saying. Nobody want to see.
Speaker 2: This fight, So the WC would have.
Speaker 3: Made more money. All everybody would have made more money.
Fight like a real name. You know the other champions
are you?
Speaker 1: You're doing this? I guess too. You want to preserve
your title. Yeah, of course you can't make a guy fight.
I mean if you don't, you know, but if you
want to keep the belt, you got to do the rematch.
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, no, I want to fight. This is not
there was not like a great performance. I won though,
to me, I clearly won. It was a close fight,
but it wasn't like he was holding I was the aggressor.
I was landing the cleanup punches. I mean, like, I
don't I don't even understand why.
Speaker 1: So what do you think you learned them from the
first fight that you want to make sure that you
do better when you face him in this rematch?
Speaker 3: Everything everything, I feel like, I'm stronger, I'm faster, I'm
a smarter fighter, have better defense, I have better experience everything,
So yeah, I look better everything.
Speaker 1: Was there anything that he did in the first fight
that you feel like he did well, or at least
well enough in the eyes of the judges to have
it so close?
Speaker 2: Yeh?
Speaker 3: I mean he's a consistent. He was, He was okay,
but nothing exceptional. He's a decent fighter. But yeah, when
I'm on my game, it's not gonna be no close fight.
Speaker 1: You have been a professional bat dude for a long time.
Sixteen years. Uh, that's a that's a that's a that's
a long career by any stretch in terms of boxing.
What kind of goals do you still have? Is it
a matter of that still you you harbor desires to
move up and try to win a title in the
bridgerweight division. Is it to unified titles in the cruiserweight
division or is there something else?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Definitely unified, Uh, and the cruise of weight.
Speaker 2: I want to become undisputed and and then we'll see.
Speaker 1: So bridger weight's not so much on your mind anymore,
I guess no.
Speaker 3: It was just uh at that time, you know, just
to say you became a champion and for different weight classes,
you know, and I was actually gonna just gonna.
Speaker 1: Go beat that guy and then continue that cruiser it. Okay,
So you mentioned about unification fight. So Ji Opataia, he
is considered the lineal champion, he has the IVF title,
he has a mandatory that's coming up. You have Zerdo
Ramirez who has two of the belt. The other two
belts obviously you have the fourth belt.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 1: Zerdo is coming off of a surgery. He's at a
gonna have a tune up fight in January, and then
he signed to defend against David Benavitez in May. Uh,
if you could choose as a unification fight, assuming you
do well and everything works out for you on December thirteenth,
is there one of those two that you would most
rather fight for a unification?
Speaker 2: I mean, look at it two ways.
Speaker 3: I want to fight the guy do they they say
is the best out of them, and it looks like
they're saying Apataia is the best. But but then again,
also who's bringing the most money? He got a country
behind him, uh ramires but uh yeah, like he's busy
with he's actually fighting a guy from my country and
one of my boys, one of my he used to
be my sparing bunny.
Speaker 2: He's a good kid.
Speaker 1: Rob your far Oh so that's that who? Uh that's
who Zero is gonna fight come up in January?
Speaker 3: January, Yeah, and then he fights Beneveta so so uh,
I guess Opataiah is the only one that's uh going
to be available, So I would love to fight him.
I called him out last year. I'm trying to make
that fight. We did a face off in Saudist I've
been waiting for that fight.
Speaker 1: I mean, neither one of them would probably be you know,
interesting matchup and obviously a lot of stake because of
the belts and the fact that you guys are all
at the top of the division.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I want to take you back just for a minute,
because every time your name coming up or I think about,
but dude, Jack fight, this fight was, you know, being
promoted and getting ready to take place. Take you back
for a minute. I was ringside at the Barclay Center.
You had a unification fight. You mentioned James Degall's name
a little earlier. It was a WBC IBF super middleweight
unification fight. You got knocked down in the first round,
you knocked him down in the twelfth round, and there
was all kinds of chaos in between. It was one
of the best fights I can remember being at for
a very very long time. Just a superb fight. I
think dramatically underrated when when people talk about the great
fights of of that era. What are your membories of
that fight, and why did we never get the rematching
you and James de Gail.
Speaker 2: I couldn't make the way, but it was a great fight. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Knocked down it was a flash knock. That was a
balance shot. Then in the first round, I think I
knocked out his teeth. Yep, I hit the ref and
not down. I dropped the ref.
Speaker 1: It was a crazy by accident, right by accident.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Gavonta Davis became he was Cole Maine, he became
a champion.
Speaker 1: It was good, It was a good night. That was
a I was a bonkers fight. Though this is back
in so people have time reference twenty seventeen. Uh one
of I think probably one of the best super midle
white fights frankly in the history of the division.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was a great fight.
Speaker 3: So yeah, I've struggled to make uh wait for for
the fight before that against Luciamboute. So I was like that,
I was good almost. I couldn't make the waight uh
for that fight, but I made it, and I was like, yeah,
this is my lit Let's do the unification. That's my
last fight at super middle right, and then even like heavy,
it wasn't easy for me. So yeah, that's the reason.
But uh, yeah, after that, he was done. After that
fight he loves pretty much. Yeah, get it, so he
actually can have been almost ten years later.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know who really won that fight. That's a
good point. He actually came back not that long ago,
and I think he had a bare knuckle fight, you know,
in the recent weeks. Yeah, but dude, you are You're
forty two years old. Like I said, you've been doing
this sixteen years. You're still on top in terms of
being a champion in the cruiserweight division. But if you
given thought about, like how much long do you want
to do this? I mean, it's been a long career.
Forty two not forty three. I said forty two. Forty two.
Speaker 2: Oh I thought I said. I heard it wrong. I
don't know. We'll see.
Speaker 1: Uh you saw that to keep training and keep putting
yourself for all the struggles.
Speaker 3: Always, always, always, And now that I've moved up in weight,
I don't really have to struggle to make weight that much.
Speaker 2: So I feel good. I feel great.
Speaker 3: So we'll see. I take one pin at a time.
We love to become undisputed, and we'll see.
Speaker 1: Well it starts with Doell McKellan in the rematch. I
know you want to have a more clear cut victory
in the second fight than you did in the first fight.
So I wish you best of luck on December thirteenth,
and I appreciate you doing this money.
Speaker 2: Best of luck for you. Thank you, I appreciate it.
Thank Cam