WEBVTT 1 00:00:04.919 --> 00:00:08.880 You're listening to Sorry for Asking, Sorry for Asking. I'm 2 00:00:08.919 --> 00:00:12.240 Cold Connor and I'm Adam Ramsey. This is where we 3 00:00:12.279 --> 00:00:14.519 talk shop, ask questions. 4 00:00:14.119 --> 00:00:17.760 Tell stories, and laugh some laughs about being creators as. 5 00:00:17.640 --> 00:00:20.640 Well as consumers of adult content. We love watching too, 6 00:00:20.960 --> 00:00:21.839 we certainly do. 7 00:00:22.399 --> 00:00:25.800 We also discuss the impact adult films have had on us, 8 00:00:25.839 --> 00:00:27.640 on our guests. 9 00:00:27.079 --> 00:00:32.280 And on the LGBTQ community. So strap on and strap in. 10 00:00:32.679 --> 00:00:43.759 And here we go. Hello, Hello, welcome back to Sorry 11 00:00:43.799 --> 00:00:44.520 for Asking. 12 00:00:44.640 --> 00:00:45.600 I'm Cold Connor. 13 00:00:45.920 --> 00:00:49.560 I'm Adam Ramsey, Hi Adam, Hi Cole. It's just been 14 00:00:49.640 --> 00:00:54.119 so long, I know, my goodness. Yeah, welcome back everybody. 15 00:00:54.159 --> 00:00:57.880 This is our third episode of season four. Sorry for Asking. 16 00:00:58.679 --> 00:01:00.920 We had such a good time with the guests last time, 17 00:01:00.960 --> 00:01:03.000 we decided to throw someone else in the mix who 18 00:01:03.000 --> 00:01:06.680 we like very much, the very sexy and as I 19 00:01:06.760 --> 00:01:11.439 call him, a multi hyphen it mister Logan's team is day. 20 00:01:13.400 --> 00:01:16.079 Bring that mic a little closer to that pretty face. 21 00:01:17.519 --> 00:01:18.439 How you doing, Logan? 22 00:01:18.680 --> 00:01:19.120 I'm good. 23 00:01:19.519 --> 00:01:23.239 Wet outside, It is wet outside. Yeah, this random little rainy, 24 00:01:23.959 --> 00:01:26.120 rainy spring day or almost spring. 25 00:01:26.159 --> 00:01:28.000 I guess supposed to have rain and spring though, and 26 00:01:28.000 --> 00:01:29.200 then we just didn't get it. 27 00:01:29.879 --> 00:01:32.159 Yes, I think that was that was very that's an 28 00:01:32.200 --> 00:01:34.280 accurate description. Yeah. 29 00:01:34.359 --> 00:01:36.280 Instead we had like a second fire season. 30 00:01:36.640 --> 00:01:40.599 Mm hmmm, yeah, a winter fire season. How fun that was. 31 00:01:41.120 --> 00:01:43.879 You survived. We survived, and you were You have been 32 00:01:43.920 --> 00:01:45.959 spending a lot of time in Big Bear lately, is 33 00:01:45.959 --> 00:01:46.519 that correct? 34 00:01:47.359 --> 00:01:51.400 Not like during the winter, because like my place rents out, 35 00:01:51.719 --> 00:01:52.640 okay during the winter. 36 00:01:53.319 --> 00:01:56.519 Yeah, he's a property owner now, really graduated. 37 00:01:56.760 --> 00:01:58.760 Yeah, I know about that in a bit. 38 00:01:58.920 --> 00:02:02.640 Anytime. When did you get your place up there? 39 00:02:02.959 --> 00:02:05.200 I bought it two years ago. Yeah, it's coming up 40 00:02:05.200 --> 00:02:05.760 in two years. 41 00:02:05.840 --> 00:02:08.000 And you spend moss, You spend like the most of 42 00:02:08.039 --> 00:02:08.560 the summer. 43 00:02:08.719 --> 00:02:11.240 I mean, yeah, I prefer being out there. I think 44 00:02:11.280 --> 00:02:14.120 I'm kind of like I'm done with my city era. 45 00:02:14.439 --> 00:02:14.759 Yeah. 46 00:02:15.280 --> 00:02:17.639 Yeah, I was never I was never a city person. 47 00:02:17.680 --> 00:02:20.479 But that's just where you go if you're a homosexual. 48 00:02:20.599 --> 00:02:24.960 So right, yeah, we met. We met in twenty ten. 49 00:02:25.120 --> 00:02:28.319 I want to say, during your New York quirdo era, 50 00:02:28.639 --> 00:02:30.120 how long were you living in New York. 51 00:02:30.639 --> 00:02:34.039 I don't actually know, because if I go back and 52 00:02:34.080 --> 00:02:36.280 I try and create like a chronology of like dates 53 00:02:36.319 --> 00:02:38.199 and stuff like that, I always feel like I'm making 54 00:02:38.240 --> 00:02:40.800 mistakes and I didn't keep like if I were to 55 00:02:40.840 --> 00:02:43.919 go and do like Instagram Digital archaeology or not Instagram, 56 00:02:43.960 --> 00:02:46.680 but like Facebook digital archaeology, like I could figure it 57 00:02:46.719 --> 00:02:48.599 out and like your you know, comb and dates some 58 00:02:48.599 --> 00:02:50.719 photos and that's that's not far. 59 00:02:50.680 --> 00:02:53.319 Off from what I did to research before this interview. 60 00:02:53.479 --> 00:02:57.159 Oh yeah, great Facebook archaeology. You find you've always like 61 00:02:57.319 --> 00:02:59.479 moved around a lot or I like. 62 00:02:59.479 --> 00:03:03.960 A bold move and I like trying things out and stuff, 63 00:03:04.000 --> 00:03:06.639 you know, and as a person who doesn't have kids 64 00:03:06.639 --> 00:03:09.800 and stuff, I'm kind of my only priority. So I 65 00:03:09.879 --> 00:03:12.159 go and I do what I think is going to 66 00:03:12.199 --> 00:03:12.560 be fun. 67 00:03:13.080 --> 00:03:16.439 Yeah, yeah, nice, I want to I mean, I have 68 00:03:16.719 --> 00:03:18.599 a few photos to share, but I want to start 69 00:03:18.639 --> 00:03:21.080 with a very crude one. Everyone look away if this 70 00:03:21.120 --> 00:03:22.719 is too much. This is the one of me and 71 00:03:22.840 --> 00:03:28.080 Logan in our first scene together. Yeah, look at that. 72 00:03:28.360 --> 00:03:30.120 I might have to cut that out for YouTube, but 73 00:03:30.159 --> 00:03:33.000 we'll see if you know, we can take that down. 74 00:03:33.280 --> 00:03:36.240 And then I'm gonna say to the microphone, all right, 75 00:03:36.280 --> 00:03:38.840 take it down, now, get rid of that. Wow, that 76 00:03:38.960 --> 00:03:41.479 was a photo, a photo that I just shared of 77 00:03:41.840 --> 00:03:45.560 Logan and I, I think in twenty fourteen working with 78 00:03:45.759 --> 00:03:49.520 Raging Stallion, Steve Kruz was our director, and I was 79 00:03:49.520 --> 00:03:51.360 so excited to work with you because, you know, we'd 80 00:03:51.560 --> 00:03:55.719 had this, you know, sometimes friendship, even across the country. 81 00:03:56.199 --> 00:03:57.759 We would see each other in a place that we 82 00:03:57.800 --> 00:04:00.960 frequented it once a year, and I was just very 83 00:04:01.000 --> 00:04:03.759 fascinated by your life as somebody who's like a multi 84 00:04:03.840 --> 00:04:08.360 creative person. But I also remember feeling at that time 85 00:04:08.639 --> 00:04:12.639 that your time as Logan Stevens was coming to an end. 86 00:04:12.879 --> 00:04:13.840 Yeah, I really thought that. 87 00:04:14.400 --> 00:04:17.360 And then now you are, like, in my opinion, a 88 00:04:17.399 --> 00:04:22.120 gay adult industry juggernaut. Did you at all see this coming? 89 00:04:22.759 --> 00:04:25.160 Not really, I didn't see any of it coming. But 90 00:04:25.360 --> 00:04:28.319 you know, like when we all went to school, and 91 00:04:28.600 --> 00:04:30.920 or if you did or didn't go to school, we 92 00:04:30.920 --> 00:04:33.439 were kind of given this narrative that, you know, like 93 00:04:34.120 --> 00:04:36.959 education was going to be the most valuable thing, that 94 00:04:37.079 --> 00:04:39.639 it was going to lead to these jobs and stuff. 95 00:04:40.079 --> 00:04:42.439 And then you get out of school and I'd be like, Okay, 96 00:04:42.480 --> 00:04:45.279 I've got my brain, let's go. And then you they're like, okay, 97 00:04:45.319 --> 00:04:48.879 well we can offer you an internship or we can 98 00:04:48.959 --> 00:04:50.959 offer you this, and I was like, well, I thought 99 00:04:50.959 --> 00:04:53.720 my brain was supposed to be valuable and they're like, 100 00:04:53.800 --> 00:04:57.399 well maybe someday, yeah, you know. And then and then 101 00:04:57.439 --> 00:04:58.959 so you're like, well, what the fuck do I do? 102 00:04:59.519 --> 00:05:02.079 So then and then I discovered I had a body, 103 00:05:02.079 --> 00:05:05.079 and they're like, oh, well right this way, sir, Like oh, 104 00:05:05.120 --> 00:05:06.720 why didn't you say so? Right? 105 00:05:08.000 --> 00:05:10.800 When did your I want to get into like your 106 00:05:10.800 --> 00:05:12.959 original history too, but just to kind of start off 107 00:05:12.959 --> 00:05:17.040 this conversation, I'm curious when your journey as Logan Stevens started. 108 00:05:17.560 --> 00:05:21.439 It started when I moved to New York, which okay, yeah, 109 00:05:21.519 --> 00:05:25.759 and I had like these little sort of like kind 110 00:05:25.800 --> 00:05:30.199 of novelty jobs and international development as like a recent 111 00:05:31.240 --> 00:05:32.759 college graduate. 112 00:05:33.279 --> 00:05:34.199 Is that what you studied? 113 00:05:34.560 --> 00:05:37.600 No, I studied anthropology, but they kind of like related 114 00:05:37.639 --> 00:05:40.560 and stuff. And so it was like these little nonprofit 115 00:05:40.680 --> 00:05:43.480 organizations that I worked for, and I was like, I just, 116 00:05:44.079 --> 00:05:48.519 you know, lost a job in Kenya and I was 117 00:05:48.560 --> 00:05:51.360 really trying to get another job out there and nothing 118 00:05:51.480 --> 00:05:53.720 was happening. And this was like, you know, two thousand 119 00:05:53.720 --> 00:05:56.519 and I guess it was two thousand and nine, so 120 00:05:56.600 --> 00:05:58.920 it was the beginning of that next recession or whatever. 121 00:06:00.120 --> 00:06:02.720 And I was there in Kenya and being like I'm 122 00:06:02.800 --> 00:06:07.120 young and gay and I have access by birth to 123 00:06:07.199 --> 00:06:09.560 the United States and all of these places where I 124 00:06:09.560 --> 00:06:13.319 can go be like a young, happy gay. Why am 125 00:06:13.319 --> 00:06:17.040 I living in Africa? Why am I living in Kenya? 126 00:06:17.560 --> 00:06:21.879 And so I so I wanted to I wanted to 127 00:06:21.959 --> 00:06:25.000 have that experience. I wanted to go like so my 128 00:06:25.040 --> 00:06:28.639 oats or whatever. So I kind of like thought about 129 00:06:28.920 --> 00:06:31.360 what my options would be in the US, and I 130 00:06:31.480 --> 00:06:33.240 kind of landed on the idea of New York. It 131 00:06:33.360 --> 00:06:37.199 sounded the most dramatic and the most fun. And so 132 00:06:37.360 --> 00:06:39.160 I got there and I didn't know what to do. 133 00:06:39.240 --> 00:06:41.000 I tried to tried to get work. 134 00:06:41.040 --> 00:06:47.319 There wasn't any work in that field. You mean just anything, okay. 135 00:06:47.279 --> 00:06:49.959 Literally anything that wasn't waiting Because I have a tendency 136 00:06:50.000 --> 00:06:52.240 to get fired very quickly from things like that. So 137 00:06:54.560 --> 00:06:57.279 I waited tables briefly for several tries. 138 00:06:57.360 --> 00:07:01.199 And I can't imagine that would have gone well for you. No, 139 00:07:03.920 --> 00:07:04.920 You're like, fuck this. 140 00:07:05.319 --> 00:07:08.240 No, I have a low I have a low tolerance 141 00:07:08.360 --> 00:07:11.600 for discomfort, and I have no filter. 142 00:07:12.240 --> 00:07:15.680 Uh huh. So you started in two thousand and nine. 143 00:07:15.920 --> 00:07:17.879 Pretty much like right off the bat. I landed in 144 00:07:17.920 --> 00:07:20.079 New York, and I didn't know what to do. And 145 00:07:20.079 --> 00:07:23.079 then I was like somebody had offered me to stay 146 00:07:23.480 --> 00:07:26.560 in their place for free, like they had an extra room. 147 00:07:26.600 --> 00:07:30.319 And he happened to be like a photo editor or 148 00:07:30.360 --> 00:07:34.040 maybe a video editor or something for Lucas and some 149 00:07:34.079 --> 00:07:36.920 other sites or something, and he was like, well, you 150 00:07:36.959 --> 00:07:40.959 should probably consider doing this, and I thought, oh, that's terrifying. 151 00:07:40.959 --> 00:07:41.759 Maybe I should try. 152 00:07:42.079 --> 00:07:47.000 Yeah, so you started in video work with studios before 153 00:07:47.399 --> 00:07:49.839 or after you kind of dabbled. If you don't mind 154 00:07:49.839 --> 00:07:52.040 me talking about private intimate work. 155 00:07:52.120 --> 00:07:55.839 I can't remember which came first. Okay, Honestly, I think 156 00:07:55.839 --> 00:07:57.240 they just happened at the same time. 157 00:07:57.319 --> 00:07:59.800 I don't know if you remember that boy when you 158 00:07:59.839 --> 00:08:03.000 were in l A and it was before I did anything. 159 00:08:03.319 --> 00:08:06.639 I was I was a personal trainer and I we 160 00:08:06.639 --> 00:08:08.439 were like a grinder hook up. 161 00:08:08.439 --> 00:08:09.240 I came over. 162 00:08:09.879 --> 00:08:14.439 And it was like just when the blue page was 163 00:08:14.480 --> 00:08:18.920 starting to gain some traction, okay, and it was it 164 00:08:19.000 --> 00:08:21.120 was definitely the very very Yeah, you hadn't done it 165 00:08:21.199 --> 00:08:23.759 yet because you brought you were like, we started talking 166 00:08:23.800 --> 00:08:26.879 about like some photos that I some of your photography 167 00:08:26.920 --> 00:08:29.240 that I saw around your apartment, and you. 168 00:08:29.199 --> 00:08:32.320 Were like, yeah, no, he's like I used to do porn. 169 00:08:33.039 --> 00:08:36.559 Maybe I should start one of those spicy pages and 170 00:08:36.639 --> 00:08:39.639 I was like, well, I mean like, you're definitely equipped 171 00:08:39.679 --> 00:08:40.080 for it. 172 00:08:41.919 --> 00:08:46.600 Whatever do you mean, Cole, I don't want to be crass. 173 00:08:46.759 --> 00:08:48.879 I mean, so do we have you to thank for 174 00:08:48.960 --> 00:08:50.399 the rebirth of Logan Stevens. 175 00:08:51.679 --> 00:08:55.320 It's actually full time. Poppy was the one really was 176 00:08:55.720 --> 00:08:58.200 was the one that tip the scales? 177 00:08:58.240 --> 00:09:01.559 And is that diego? Okay? Yeah? Yeah. 178 00:09:01.559 --> 00:09:04.000 He was my neighbor and we hooked up a couple times, 179 00:09:04.000 --> 00:09:05.679 and one time he was like, oh, can we do 180 00:09:05.720 --> 00:09:07.720 a video? And I was like, well, all my shit's 181 00:09:07.720 --> 00:09:10.399 already out there, so sure, why not? And then he 182 00:09:10.600 --> 00:09:13.120 was like you should really do this and I was like, no, 183 00:09:13.440 --> 00:09:14.519 I think I'm done with that. 184 00:09:14.799 --> 00:09:16.159 What year was that? Do you remember? 185 00:09:16.320 --> 00:09:18.519 This would have been twenty eighteen? 186 00:09:18.720 --> 00:09:20.759 Okay, yeah, wow. 187 00:09:20.559 --> 00:09:23.039 Because I had just moved to West Hollywood from that 188 00:09:23.120 --> 00:09:25.759 sort of like silver lakish place that I had. 189 00:09:26.360 --> 00:09:28.840 Oh yes, yes, okay, so it was twenty fourteen. We 190 00:09:28.919 --> 00:09:32.159 filmed that scene with Raging Stallion, and I remember having 191 00:09:32.200 --> 00:09:34.639 this very thoughtful conversation with you where I kind of 192 00:09:34.679 --> 00:09:35.960 was like, you know, I had only been doing this 193 00:09:36.000 --> 00:09:38.840 for about a year, and I had never done sex work, 194 00:09:39.360 --> 00:09:41.519 and I think you know you you were kind of 195 00:09:41.559 --> 00:09:43.519 I was looking to you for a little bit of 196 00:09:43.519 --> 00:09:47.519 guidance because I was very very careful then and still 197 00:09:47.639 --> 00:09:50.559 kind of am now to make sure that sex never 198 00:09:50.600 --> 00:09:53.919 felt like work, right, super important. Yeah, you you were 199 00:09:54.039 --> 00:09:57.320 very much like an advocate for that way of thinking. 200 00:09:58.399 --> 00:10:01.720 When did you stop doing that stuff? And what did 201 00:10:01.759 --> 00:10:02.799 you do in the interim? 202 00:10:03.279 --> 00:10:05.679 Like, oh, you mean like when I when I had 203 00:10:05.720 --> 00:10:06.879 my porn hiatus? 204 00:10:06.919 --> 00:10:08.759 Yes, whatever, Yeah, Like how long did that last? And 205 00:10:08.759 --> 00:10:09.440 what did it look like? 206 00:10:11.000 --> 00:10:13.559 I guess it lasted maybe like four or five years, 207 00:10:13.600 --> 00:10:16.320 and it was there was there was overlap with this other, 208 00:10:16.440 --> 00:10:18.360 like you know, brief career that I had as a 209 00:10:18.399 --> 00:10:21.120 costume designer in Hollywood working for like TV shows and 210 00:10:21.120 --> 00:10:22.120 commercials and things. 211 00:10:22.200 --> 00:10:23.159 Uh huh. 212 00:10:23.200 --> 00:10:25.840 You know, that career was really picking up a lot 213 00:10:25.840 --> 00:10:27.639 of steam, and I was quite good at it. So 214 00:10:28.159 --> 00:10:30.799 I wanted to put a lot of like energy and 215 00:10:30.840 --> 00:10:33.360 time towards that because I thought that was like the time, 216 00:10:33.399 --> 00:10:36.440 I thought it was a more sustainable thing than doing 217 00:10:36.639 --> 00:10:39.559 any kind of like sex work and stuff. So so 218 00:10:39.600 --> 00:10:42.159 I put all my effort into that and then quickly 219 00:10:42.240 --> 00:10:44.279 realized I was going to burn out way faster on 220 00:10:44.360 --> 00:10:45.120 that than anything. 221 00:10:45.360 --> 00:10:46.919 Is that what happened? It felt a little bit like 222 00:10:46.960 --> 00:10:47.440 you were burning. 223 00:10:47.759 --> 00:10:50.879 Yeah, I mean it's it's absolutely insane the sort of 224 00:10:50.919 --> 00:10:54.480 demands that get placed on you in the world of 225 00:10:54.559 --> 00:10:58.279 like television production and stuff. The demands are really high, 226 00:10:58.279 --> 00:11:00.320 you know, Like there were certain projects where I would 227 00:11:00.600 --> 00:11:02.799 I would get a job and I would have basically 228 00:11:02.840 --> 00:11:05.960 seventy two hours to create like a six foot mustache dress, 229 00:11:06.240 --> 00:11:08.320 and I would have to stress the materials. I would 230 00:11:08.360 --> 00:11:11.000 have to do all this stuff, and you know, I 231 00:11:11.039 --> 00:11:13.120 would spend a day sourcing the materials, and then I 232 00:11:13.159 --> 00:11:15.720 would pull together the team that was necessary to create 233 00:11:15.759 --> 00:11:19.519 the thing, and then I would have, you know, less 234 00:11:19.559 --> 00:11:21.320 than a day and a half to actually do all 235 00:11:21.399 --> 00:11:23.639 the construction in that sort of a thing. And I 236 00:11:23.639 --> 00:11:25.720 would work for thirty hours straight and then I would 237 00:11:25.720 --> 00:11:27.559 get two or three hours of sleep, and then I'd 238 00:11:27.559 --> 00:11:29.480 have to be at a fitting at a celebrities house 239 00:11:29.559 --> 00:11:31.519 wow for like a couple hours, and then I would 240 00:11:31.519 --> 00:11:33.159 get a few more hours sleep, and then I would 241 00:11:33.200 --> 00:11:34.799 have to be on set for fourteen hours. 242 00:11:35.519 --> 00:11:37.600 Who was that mustache dress for that? 243 00:11:37.720 --> 00:11:41.039 It was worn by Anna Faris for one of those 244 00:11:41.159 --> 00:11:44.000 like Hey, come visit California commercials where all the right. 245 00:11:45.600 --> 00:11:46.120 Yes, right. 246 00:11:46.480 --> 00:11:48.480 I keep referencing that one because that was probably one 247 00:11:48.480 --> 00:11:51.080 of the most dramatic jobs that I ever had, and 248 00:11:51.440 --> 00:11:54.279 it got me a lot of attention. Yeah, because it 249 00:11:54.320 --> 00:11:56.679 was quite a construction feat like that was. 250 00:11:56.879 --> 00:11:59.120 Yeah, it was probably like thirty six. 251 00:11:59.000 --> 00:12:03.240 Cans of aquinet and like multiple layers of Like wow, 252 00:12:03.279 --> 00:12:06.919 if I had like a like a construction absolute triumph, 253 00:12:07.039 --> 00:12:07.480 it was that. 254 00:12:07.840 --> 00:12:10.399 Yeah, how did they even find you? Like I I'm 255 00:12:10.440 --> 00:12:12.519 always so always word of mouth, okay. 256 00:12:12.240 --> 00:12:14.159 And like you know, TV kind of works. There's like 257 00:12:14.279 --> 00:12:17.799 production families that people always work with the same people 258 00:12:17.840 --> 00:12:20.000 and stuff like that because they're comfortable with each other 259 00:12:20.080 --> 00:12:23.200 and they have like an established working relationship and so 260 00:12:23.720 --> 00:12:26.480 you know, I would sort of get shared between different 261 00:12:26.559 --> 00:12:29.159 production families that had relationships with each other. 262 00:12:29.320 --> 00:12:33.679 Mm hmm. Passed around costume because this may have been 263 00:12:33.679 --> 00:12:35.799 more of a passion project of yours, but I was 264 00:12:35.919 --> 00:12:38.519 really really excited for the time being. I don't know 265 00:12:38.519 --> 00:12:40.159 if this is something you love doing, but can you 266 00:12:40.159 --> 00:12:44.519 throw up some of those slamin scram photos. This was 267 00:12:44.559 --> 00:12:47.879 like an era of yours, Like these were so much fun. 268 00:12:48.039 --> 00:12:51.840 Like for those of you listening Logan was designing for 269 00:12:51.919 --> 00:12:54.039 this clothing line that he had created with a friend 270 00:12:54.039 --> 00:12:57.600 of ours named James Serni who I guess, I mean 271 00:12:57.639 --> 00:13:01.360 people know now is another name. But anyway, but look 272 00:13:01.360 --> 00:13:06.399 at these Gep Ransom, sorry sorry, but like these are these? 273 00:13:06.480 --> 00:13:09.480 I feel like every drag race girl would like kill 274 00:13:09.559 --> 00:13:12.519 for work like this. What was it like creating this? 275 00:13:12.679 --> 00:13:14.039 And do you miss it at all? 276 00:13:14.240 --> 00:13:16.679 No? I don't miss it at all, not in the least. 277 00:13:16.960 --> 00:13:19.039 If I never sat down at a sewing machine again, 278 00:13:19.159 --> 00:13:23.600 I'm perfectly happy. Yeah, it was fun. I this was 279 00:13:23.679 --> 00:13:26.120 because when I first moved to New York, I met 280 00:13:26.159 --> 00:13:29.320 all of these like, yeah, that's right. I had all 281 00:13:29.360 --> 00:13:33.440 of these young like queers that were doing, you know, 282 00:13:34.039 --> 00:13:36.919 going to really cool parties and wearing really cool things. 283 00:13:36.960 --> 00:13:39.120 And I, you know, I came from the Midwest and 284 00:13:39.159 --> 00:13:41.240 I had never seen like anything besides like the T 285 00:13:41.399 --> 00:13:43.600 shirt and jeans, combo and stuff. So this was just 286 00:13:43.639 --> 00:13:47.000 like absolutely blowing my mind. And everybody was making their 287 00:13:47.039 --> 00:13:50.759 own clothes and stuff, and I've found that really inspiring. 288 00:13:50.960 --> 00:13:54.480 So I got myself. Actually, well there's a lot more 289 00:13:54.519 --> 00:13:56.279 to the story, but that's just too many chapters. 290 00:13:56.399 --> 00:13:57.120 I got myself. 291 00:13:57.200 --> 00:14:00.639 I got myself a sewing machine and started making things, 292 00:14:00.759 --> 00:14:03.519 and they were really terrible, but I was brave enough 293 00:14:03.519 --> 00:14:07.799 to wear them out regardless, and I just like slowly 294 00:14:07.799 --> 00:14:10.159 got better and better and better. And I think the 295 00:14:10.200 --> 00:14:12.399 thing that was really exciting for me about it was 296 00:14:12.440 --> 00:14:14.840 like learning a new skill. And then so once it 297 00:14:14.879 --> 00:14:16.559 became a job and a career and all that kind 298 00:14:16.600 --> 00:14:19.960 of stuff, and once once you know, I was getting jobs, 299 00:14:19.960 --> 00:14:22.320 and it no longer felt like I was discovering something 300 00:14:22.320 --> 00:14:24.279 in the process. It just became work and it was 301 00:14:24.279 --> 00:14:26.559 all about like how much time do I have to 302 00:14:26.600 --> 00:14:28.919 do this and how much am I getting paid? And 303 00:14:29.039 --> 00:14:32.039 like does this feel worth whatever sacrifice I have to 304 00:14:32.080 --> 00:14:35.159 make to do it? And it ultimately was not, And 305 00:14:35.240 --> 00:14:38.919 like my mental health was suffering. I was definitely developing 306 00:14:38.960 --> 00:14:42.919 like an unhealthy habit with like cocaine and alcohol and stuff. 307 00:14:42.960 --> 00:14:45.399 And so I kind of took a look around at 308 00:14:45.399 --> 00:14:48.200 my colleagues that were like further along in their career 309 00:14:48.200 --> 00:14:52.440 than I was, and the forecast was grim. Like it 310 00:14:52.480 --> 00:14:54.879 wasn't like people were getting that much better jobs than 311 00:14:54.879 --> 00:14:56.320 the ones that I were getting. They were just getting 312 00:14:56.399 --> 00:14:58.840 more of it. And I didn't want to sort of 313 00:14:58.919 --> 00:15:00.720 like sell my entire life to work. 314 00:15:00.919 --> 00:15:03.399 When you say the forecast was grim, do you mean 315 00:15:03.559 --> 00:15:07.159 in terms of having a future and was happy? Oh? 316 00:15:07.200 --> 00:15:08.480 Like, I want to look around and I want to 317 00:15:08.519 --> 00:15:10.480 see the people who were farther along in their career 318 00:15:10.639 --> 00:15:13.600 being like happy and having a life that I that 319 00:15:13.679 --> 00:15:15.919 I wanted, and I didn't want any of their lives. 320 00:15:16.080 --> 00:15:20.399 Yeah. Yeah, So then when you decided to stop that 321 00:15:21.159 --> 00:15:24.320 is that when Logan Stevens kind of had his comeback. 322 00:15:24.639 --> 00:15:27.799 Almost No. At that point, I had a friend who 323 00:15:27.840 --> 00:15:31.159 had just gotten trained as a massage therapist, and I 324 00:15:31.240 --> 00:15:33.360 knew if I just added in like a hand job 325 00:15:33.440 --> 00:15:34.799 to that, I could make twice as much. 326 00:15:34.919 --> 00:15:35.320 So, huh. 327 00:15:36.879 --> 00:15:40.360 I got that friend to train me how to do massages, 328 00:15:40.360 --> 00:15:41.919 and then I hired a few other friends who knew 329 00:15:41.919 --> 00:15:44.200 how to do it to train me, you know, to 330 00:15:44.240 --> 00:15:45.799 like give me a massage and give me a lesson 331 00:15:45.840 --> 00:15:48.320 and stuff. And then so from this combination of like 332 00:15:48.360 --> 00:15:50.720 different people than I kind of put together my own 333 00:15:50.799 --> 00:15:53.399 routine based off of the things that I thought were 334 00:15:53.480 --> 00:15:56.039 the things that I liked the best. And then I 335 00:15:56.200 --> 00:16:00.840 just I started doing like massages for a number of years, 336 00:16:00.840 --> 00:16:03.879 and that was just kind of like a placeholder until 337 00:16:03.919 --> 00:16:07.799 I could figure out what I felt inspired to do. 338 00:16:09.039 --> 00:16:12.480 You do have very strong hands, I will say from experience. 339 00:16:13.360 --> 00:16:16.519 Yeah, and uh and then and then only fans came along, 340 00:16:16.559 --> 00:16:18.240 and I didn't expect that at all. Wait, I'm not 341 00:16:18.279 --> 00:16:20.080 supposed to say that you're saying blue blue. 342 00:16:20.200 --> 00:16:22.639 Yeah, I don't know, Like, I guess we'll see. I 343 00:16:22.679 --> 00:16:24.720 don't know. That's I mean, we've said it before, but 344 00:16:24.759 --> 00:16:25.159 I don't know. 345 00:16:25.679 --> 00:16:30.440 Like the sites came along, yeah, and kind of changed everything. 346 00:16:31.120 --> 00:16:33.840 Sorry, YouTube, don't don't cut us out. We only just 347 00:16:33.919 --> 00:16:37.120 mentioned it. We're not promoting it. 348 00:16:37.200 --> 00:16:40.600 Was it a quick rise in like the response you 349 00:16:40.639 --> 00:16:41.639 got when the when. 350 00:16:41.559 --> 00:16:45.120 The pandemic hit, that's when that's when everything exploded, of course. 351 00:16:45.159 --> 00:16:47.440 And I feel very lucky to have been like in 352 00:16:47.480 --> 00:16:50.159 this sort of unique position, to have been one of 353 00:16:50.159 --> 00:16:52.879 the few people that was already doing it and primed 354 00:16:52.960 --> 00:16:55.600 for the explosions. So I just kind of rode the wave. 355 00:16:55.519 --> 00:16:57.120 Up, you know. Yeah. 356 00:16:57.159 --> 00:17:01.000 I always feel like like because I started kind of 357 00:17:01.039 --> 00:17:04.920 as the pandemic was calming down and so like, and 358 00:17:04.960 --> 00:17:09.039 then I started doing studio work, and I feel like 359 00:17:09.160 --> 00:17:12.359 the people that had done studio work before saw a 360 00:17:12.519 --> 00:17:15.640 rise and stayed there where I think some people that 361 00:17:15.759 --> 00:17:19.079 started after the pandemic see a rise in a quick drop. 362 00:17:19.559 --> 00:17:22.119 Yeah, that was a little bit what mine was like. 363 00:17:22.319 --> 00:17:24.279 And I've just been doing that for so long, and like, 364 00:17:24.319 --> 00:17:27.039 you know, my relationship with adult work has always been 365 00:17:27.119 --> 00:17:29.640 kind of tenuous. But I started doing the Blue the 366 00:17:29.920 --> 00:17:33.039 Blue site, I want to say, in like twenty seventeen, okay, 367 00:17:33.200 --> 00:17:35.119 and it was it was fun. It was fun to 368 00:17:35.160 --> 00:17:38.160 be like, oh this extra cash. How nice it was. 369 00:17:38.720 --> 00:17:41.519 I mean anything, we could do anything. It was so cool. 370 00:17:41.559 --> 00:17:43.839 I had all kinds of stuff, didn't tag people. It 371 00:17:43.920 --> 00:17:47.279 was you know, outside inside. And then yeah, the whole 372 00:17:47.279 --> 00:17:49.799 pandemic thing. You know, we call a lot of people 373 00:17:49.839 --> 00:17:52.000 pandemic porn stars because like that's like a lot of 374 00:17:52.000 --> 00:17:53.960 times where their careers started. 375 00:17:54.200 --> 00:17:56.319 Well, this is this is this moment where the world 376 00:17:56.400 --> 00:17:59.200 really taught us what they actually well, I mean, I 377 00:17:59.240 --> 00:18:01.359 think the world is teaching me my whole life what 378 00:18:01.440 --> 00:18:04.400 they actually value. There's what the world there's what the 379 00:18:04.440 --> 00:18:07.759 world says that they value, is what the world actually values. 380 00:18:08.960 --> 00:18:11.680 And I've learned to just follow what the world actually 381 00:18:11.759 --> 00:18:14.319 values because it's a far I'm not going to say 382 00:18:14.319 --> 00:18:16.599 it's an easier route because we can talk about all 383 00:18:16.640 --> 00:18:18.680 of the all of the ways that the world likes 384 00:18:18.680 --> 00:18:20.880 to make that path very difficult. 385 00:18:20.400 --> 00:18:25.680 But especially for us, Yeah, especially for US sure industry. 386 00:18:25.839 --> 00:18:31.119 Yeah, from you know, community stigma to censorship to like 387 00:18:31.240 --> 00:18:33.440 you name it. I call it a fugitive industry because 388 00:18:33.440 --> 00:18:35.720 you're always getting chased around the Internet and having to 389 00:18:35.799 --> 00:18:38.880 hide in corners to try and make this stuff work. 390 00:18:39.640 --> 00:18:42.680 Because there's an ever changing landscape of like little tiny 391 00:18:42.759 --> 00:18:46.960 legislations that don't trigger any public interests whatsoever, but have 392 00:18:47.039 --> 00:18:49.960 a huge impact on how our business works, on our 393 00:18:50.000 --> 00:18:54.200 ability to promote what we do, tiny tiny little laws 394 00:18:54.240 --> 00:18:56.559 that nobody would ever notice except for like a few 395 00:18:56.640 --> 00:18:59.960 niche people out there, you know, but protesting and sending 396 00:19:00.119 --> 00:19:03.200 letters to a congress person and who never get read. 397 00:19:03.240 --> 00:19:07.079 And right, Yeah, it's really kind of it's it's it's intense. 398 00:19:06.920 --> 00:19:08.960 And the odds are stacked against us. I mean for 399 00:19:09.000 --> 00:19:11.200 our listeners. You probably don't know. And we've mentioned in 400 00:19:11.240 --> 00:19:14.039 the past before, but like they change these laws on 401 00:19:14.160 --> 00:19:16.920