1
00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:04,160
Speaker 1: If you like our conversations about the deeper layers of

2
00:00:04,200 --> 00:00:07,160
human behavior, the hidden dynamics of shape characters on screen,

3
00:00:07,160 --> 00:00:09,560
and the cry of forces that influence how we live

4
00:00:09,599 --> 00:00:12,320
and relate. And I wanted to invite you to something

5
00:00:13,759 --> 00:00:16,879
that our sponsor is doing. A sponsors called the Prestige

6
00:00:16,920 --> 00:00:20,839
Couch and every week they published thoughtful, longer form explorations

7
00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:24,519
the psychological ideas to the lens of fictional characters from

8
00:00:24,600 --> 00:00:29,559
TV and film. So if this resonates with you, I

9
00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:33,039
definitely recommend that you join the Prestige Couch at substack.

10
00:00:33,159 --> 00:00:37,880
It's the Prestigecouch dot substack dot com.

11
00:00:38,320 --> 00:00:41,479
Speaker 2: Depends on how you interpret it. The French spy and

12
00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:47,640
triple agent knowns Less Shots marked Matilda Carre. She was

13
00:00:47,679 --> 00:00:51,880
born in Chateaurou, France, in nineteen oh eight. She joined

14
00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:55,079
the Army Army Nurse Corps start of World War Two

15
00:00:55,119 --> 00:00:59,799
became leading member of the Interay spy network. She was

16
00:00:59,799 --> 00:01:03,159
a interrogated by the Germans in nineteen forty one and

17
00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:07,480
turned against her former comrades and began working for the Gestapo.

18
00:01:08,000 --> 00:01:09,640
We're going to learn the rest of this story in

19
00:01:09,680 --> 00:01:12,079
a minute, so let's start off She's known as the cat,

20
00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:14,760
despised by her former comrades and the French resistan moved

21
00:01:14,840 --> 00:01:18,640
because of her treachery. Matilda Carey lived in pre war

22
00:01:18,680 --> 00:01:21,760
existence that was almost dull in his conventional contours. As

23
00:01:21,799 --> 00:01:24,760
many of the spies that we have read about, she

24
00:01:24,760 --> 00:01:28,280
earned a law degree at Sarbonne. After graduation, she married

25
00:01:28,319 --> 00:01:34,000
Maurice Carey, a school teacher, and moved with him to Olron, Algeria.

26
00:01:34,079 --> 00:01:36,799
They divorced after just six years and she returned to

27
00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:39,319
France on the evil World War Two. During the brief

28
00:01:39,359 --> 00:01:42,120
struggle to hold back the German onslaught, resulting in a

29
00:01:42,200 --> 00:01:46,040
catastrophic defeat for the French, Mattilda Carey served as a

30
00:01:46,040 --> 00:01:49,640
member of the French Army's and nurse Corps. After the defeat,

31
00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:52,439
she was evacuated to the southern southern city of Tulau,

32
00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:55,879
where she met a Polish military intelligence officer by the

33
00:01:55,920 --> 00:02:04,040
name of Captain Roman Sisnarski cze rna w Ski. He

34
00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:06,200
remained who remained in France as part of a network

35
00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:08,759
to spy on the Germans and transmit the data to

36
00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:13,560
the Polish embassy in Madrid. Garbie Ssnarski had been recruited

37
00:02:13,599 --> 00:02:18,120
by the overall chief of Polish intelligence in France, Colonel Zarevensky,

38
00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:21,759
the man responsible for brilliantly improvising the creation of an

39
00:02:21,759 --> 00:02:26,400
anti German spy operation using the papers of a Frenchman

40
00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:31,240
killed in the fighting. Sarzinsky went under the code name Valentine,

41
00:02:31,719 --> 00:02:34,560
who was a bold operative who quickly organized an effective

42
00:02:34,599 --> 00:02:37,439
network of agents that called itself it There it was

43
00:02:37,479 --> 00:02:41,199
a combination of French and Polish intelligence. From his headquarters

44
00:02:41,159 --> 00:02:44,800
Imparisey masterminded a rapidly growing organization and by the time

45
00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:48,080
wireless contact was established, the ring consisted of agents operating

46
00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:50,560
in almost all of the German occupied zone in France.

47
00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:53,759
He and until the Karree had become lovers, and she

48
00:02:53,840 --> 00:02:57,280
quickly emerges one of their most valuable members, cool headed

49
00:02:57,280 --> 00:03:00,680
and capable of inspiring confidence in her fellow spy. That's

50
00:03:00,680 --> 00:03:04,000
how she earned her the code name the Cat. By

51
00:03:04,080 --> 00:03:06,840
late summer nineteen forty one, the Interire network was operating

52
00:03:06,879 --> 00:03:10,280
at a maximum effectiveness when it had operative operatives working

53
00:03:10,319 --> 00:03:14,240
in fourteen districts of German controlled France. It had over

54
00:03:14,280 --> 00:03:19,960
one hundred agents strategically located. Unfortunately, the luck ran out

55
00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:22,919
in November nineteen forty one. This was part due to

56
00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:28,479
the arrival in Paris of Sergeant Hugo Bleicher or Bliker Blicchr,

57
00:03:28,840 --> 00:03:32,039
a former Geschappo agent who had been assigned to work

58
00:03:32,039 --> 00:03:36,919
for the ABO ABWHR that's the German or the Nazi

59
00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:43,759
intelligence service. Back thenists especially chosen to wipe out interirea

60
00:03:43,879 --> 00:03:47,520
Bliker possessed talents as an intelligence agent, the guaranteed doom

61
00:03:47,599 --> 00:03:50,159
for the Allies by network. The fatal blow came after

62
00:03:50,199 --> 00:03:53,680
a major lapse of security in Charbou in early November

63
00:03:53,759 --> 00:03:56,879
nineteen forty one, which provided the Germans with crucial information

64
00:03:56,960 --> 00:03:59,199
about the ring and enabled them to round up most

65
00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:03,919
of the members. Harsh interrogation methods, including physical torture, provided

66
00:04:03,919 --> 00:04:07,479
Blacker's men with major pieces of information, and a few

67
00:04:07,479 --> 00:04:14,199
hours later Blaker arrested and unsuspecting Matilda Carey when Valentine

68
00:04:14,319 --> 00:04:17,600
codenamed Valentine refused to reveal any useful information to his

69
00:04:17,680 --> 00:04:21,639
German interrogators. Despite many hours of torture, Blacker decided to

70
00:04:21,680 --> 00:04:24,480
concentrate on Carey. The strategy, which is very different in

71
00:04:24,480 --> 00:04:28,160
her case, emphasized a psychological offensive against the prisoner rather

72
00:04:28,160 --> 00:04:31,759
than the affliction of pain. First, he initiated a dramatic

73
00:04:31,879 --> 00:04:34,120
change in surroundings, having he moved from a blaque prison

74
00:04:34,160 --> 00:04:38,199
cell to a place of startling contrast, the five star hotel.

75
00:04:39,079 --> 00:04:42,199
The hotel also happened to be abbwere headquarters in Paris.

76
00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:46,040
Over a wonderful meal, Blaker was able to convince Cary

77
00:04:46,040 --> 00:04:48,720
that by working for him, she would only save herself

78
00:04:48,759 --> 00:04:51,439
from torture and probable death, but also save the lives

79
00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:54,120
of her comrades, with whom he would protect from execution.

80
00:04:54,879 --> 00:04:57,360
All that was required as a Carey now began working

81
00:04:57,360 --> 00:05:00,879
for the abwear become a double agent, helping them to

82
00:05:00,879 --> 00:05:05,040
deceive the British by feeding them false information. And her

83
00:05:05,079 --> 00:05:07,800
memoirs written at the end of her life, care would

84
00:05:07,839 --> 00:05:10,399
later admit that within hours of being interrogated by Bliker,

85
00:05:10,959 --> 00:05:14,560
she would commit the greatest act of cowardice in her life.

86
00:05:17,360 --> 00:05:20,839
Within days of turning, care was working to assist Bliker

87
00:05:20,879 --> 00:05:23,279
and rounding up the remaining members of Interorey who still

88
00:05:23,319 --> 00:05:26,319
remained at large. Now operating as a double agent, the

89
00:05:26,399 --> 00:05:28,759
cat led Bliker to the homes and meeting places of

90
00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:31,240
a number of women and men who only days before

91
00:05:31,279 --> 00:05:36,040
have been her trusted comrades. She identified one of them,

92
00:05:36,079 --> 00:05:39,000
Claude Joufrey, by greeting him with a kiss at the

93
00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:43,439
cafe at Little fourteenth. Blaker's agencies the four radio transmitters

94
00:05:43,439 --> 00:05:45,639
of the Interra network moving to a Paris suburbs so

95
00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:48,279
as to continue sending messages to London as if nothing

96
00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:52,920
had happened. Since Care provided the Auboy with all necessary codes,

97
00:05:53,399 --> 00:05:56,240
transmission schedules, and pre arranged security checks, that was little

98
00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:59,240
that might arouse the suspicion of British intelligence. However, one

99
00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:01,360
of the few members of Vorey who still remained free,

100
00:06:01,519 --> 00:06:08,839
Pierre Devo Moncau vome Coort, began to suspect that Care

101
00:06:09,160 --> 00:06:13,800
was in some way acting suspiciously To test her loyalty.

102
00:06:13,879 --> 00:06:16,399
In January nineteen forty two, he asked her to procure

103
00:06:16,519 --> 00:06:19,759
some forged identity documents. She showed up the next day,

104
00:06:19,879 --> 00:06:22,319
bringing with her a perfect set of papers, complete with

105
00:06:22,360 --> 00:06:25,680
authentic German stamps. On top of this, she produced a

106
00:06:25,720 --> 00:06:30,040
photograph with an air of studied conage. Casualness asked Devo

107
00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:32,160
Moccoy if he recognized the man in the photo who

108
00:06:32,199 --> 00:06:36,720
was an agent of British Special Operations Executive SOE, British's

109
00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:41,600
former intelligence service, especially created for the Nazis in World

110
00:06:41,639 --> 00:06:46,639
War Two. His suspicious confirmed Devo mokayheedually accused Carey of

111
00:06:46,639 --> 00:06:49,160
treachery and working for the Nazis. Confronted by the facts,

112
00:06:49,160 --> 00:06:52,319
she broke down in tears and confessed. Within the rules

113
00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:55,360
governing the precarious world of espionage, it would not have

114
00:06:55,399 --> 00:06:58,480
been unreasonable for Devo Mocco to kill Correy, warned the

115
00:06:58,519 --> 00:07:01,600
remaining members, and flee himself off. But his plans were

116
00:07:01,680 --> 00:07:04,920
much more complex. You see, he persuaded care to once

117
00:07:04,959 --> 00:07:08,120
more work for the Allies, making her now a triple agent.

118
00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:11,480
Soon after this dramatic change in her loyalty, she informed

119
00:07:11,519 --> 00:07:13,720
Bliker that Drumbar Deavia Morcaux was planned to go to

120
00:07:13,720 --> 00:07:16,560
England for an important meeting with British intelligence, and that

121
00:07:16,639 --> 00:07:19,519
she was being considered for inclusion. Though she convinced Bliker,

122
00:07:19,600 --> 00:07:23,519
he in turn had considerable difficulty convincing his superiors of

123
00:07:23,560 --> 00:07:26,160
the value to the abware of allowing kra to make

124
00:07:26,199 --> 00:07:30,839
a secret trip to Britain. Eventually, though Blaker received permission

125
00:07:30,879 --> 00:07:34,519
for care and Devamrcaux to leave France after two failed

126
00:07:34,560 --> 00:07:37,199
attempts by British intelligence agents to locate the two key

127
00:07:37,279 --> 00:07:39,480
agents on an isolated beach. They were finally picked up

128
00:07:39,480 --> 00:07:44,279
and taken to London. Safely aggrived across the Channel. At Dartmouth,

129
00:07:44,519 --> 00:07:48,000
Carey was debriefed by British intelligence. She broke down almost immediately,

130
00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:51,399
admitting her capitulation under Bliker's interrogations and her work for

131
00:07:51,439 --> 00:07:54,879
the Abware. She also explained her return to the entirea

132
00:07:55,319 --> 00:08:01,360
fold under Deva Morcau's leadership several months previously. Her January

133
00:08:01,480 --> 00:08:04,519
nineteen forty nine trial. The lasted four days and resulted

134
00:08:04,519 --> 00:08:07,160
in a death sentence, but upon appeal it was reduced

135
00:08:07,199 --> 00:08:10,120
to a life imprisonment. Her defense attorney did not dispute

136
00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:12,600
her treasonous behavior, but argue that the judge should consider

137
00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:14,639
that this woman was faced with a choice of life

138
00:08:15,040 --> 00:08:17,680
or death. Do not forget that from the beginning of

139
00:08:17,720 --> 00:08:20,120
the resistance she was a heroine. Would you put to

140
00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:22,160
death those who at the beginning sow the seed of

141
00:08:22,199 --> 00:08:25,560
faith and later overestimated their own strengths to the defense attorney.

142
00:08:26,319 --> 00:08:31,000
Caray was eventually released in nineteen fifty four and attempted

143
00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:33,039
to resume her life with a new identity. By the

144
00:08:33,039 --> 00:08:35,919
early sixties she published her memoirs. Her health had begun

145
00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:39,480
to fail and she was rapidly losing her eyesight. Caray

146
00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:44,360
died in total obscurity in the early nineteen seventies. So

147
00:08:44,440 --> 00:08:47,039
there is the story of the cat