Speaker 1: What's going on. Thank you so much for listening to
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Speaker 2: Yeah a second, let me just check the market here
real quick.
Speaker 1: Okay, So yeah, it's sell off continues. But this is
the short term gain or pain, sorry, short term pain.
This is the short term pain for the long term gain.
And I'm just curious how long is the short term pain?
I know, is it like a month, two, three, four, five, six,
or does it have you even thought about that? Is
this a litmus test that you're putting me and anybody
else through? And right now I'm speaking to people who
really love Donald Trump. And once again, just to be clear,
I voted for Donald Trump. However, Donald Trump is an
elected politician. He is the head of the government. I
don't trust my government. I don't trust anybody that is
in that office to tell me the truth at all times.
I think American history is pretty replete with examples of
why we should not. Now I've been told that U
and I went over this all yesterday, and I apparently
have to keep hammering away to say, I don't know
if Donald Trump's tariff regime is going to work.
Speaker 2: It freaking better.
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna say that it better because a lot
of people are going to get hurt really badly if
it doesn't.
Speaker 2: So I hope it does. I hope he is the
one guy who.
Speaker 1: Can crack the code that virtually every economist of the
last century has said, this is not a good economic
policy to pursue. It creates inflation, it drives up prices,
it's attacks on your own people like all of all
of that that school of thought, every one of them
are wrong, and and Donald Trump is right. That's what
I'm being told I have to I have to believe. Now,
you may not know this about me, but I am
a bit I have a bit of an anti authority
streak in me. Now, It's true. From the very beginning,
I was like this a bit of contrarianism, oppositional defiance,
whatever you want to call it, and so when Gov.
Coe people tell me things, I'm a little skeptical. And
so when somebody comes along and says the way that
we have been doing this stuff for you know, one
hundred years, and the you know, the free and fair trade,
this idea that trade is a rising tide that lifts
all boats and has lifted you know, the globe out
of poverty, which, by the way, it has just for
the case you weren't aware of that, Like, there are
fewer people living in poverty now than ever before, and
we have a larger population than ever before on the
face of the planet. And I would submit that that's
that's probably better than the alternative, right where more people
become impoverished. But that whole, that whole philosophy, the whole
idea that setting up protectionist policies ends up hurting the
country that sets them up. As I said yesterday, maybe
I'm just a fish that doesn't know it's wet because
this is the water I've been swimming in. Because this
has been the accepted understanding of economic theory my entire life.
Because the mistakes were made in prior generations, they learned
from those mistakes said let's not do that let's repeal
those things, let's you know, change course. And they said
this is a better course. And now we're going back
to say no, no, no, that's all been wrong. What
the original thing that they shifted away from. That's what
we need to go back to. And that's what that's
what we're all being brought along for. And that's why
I said, Donald Trump better be right, because he's pinned
his legacy on it. He's pinned your fortunes literally on it,
your standard of living, my standard of living. He is,
you know, risking global trade wars. He's upending everything. And
I know people who love Donald Trump and trust him.
I know that you are trusting that he knows what
he's doing. And maybe for you, it's not even a
thought that crosses your mind that he may be wrong
on this. There's no way he could be wrong on it.
But again, I have a little bit of skepticism about it.
And here's the thing. You're not going to shame me
for it. I've seen your emails and your tweets and
all this. You're not going to shame me for being
skeptical of it. Because when I'm skeptical of the Democrat
in the White House.
Speaker 2: You love it.
Speaker 1: But if I'm skeptical of Donald Trump, now I'm a globalist,
do you hear yourselves? It's just and I'll say this like,
I don't have any animosity or anything.
Speaker 2: It's just this is not so.
Speaker 1: If you're going to set this up as a litmus
test and you're going to say that if I don't
agree with Trump on every single thing that he does,
that flies in the face of not just what I
prior believed and still do, but also all of the
U the understanding of economists, Austrian economists and such that
I'm now supposed to just discard all of those those beliefs,
those ideas because Trump is saying something else.
Speaker 2: Now you can do that. That's totally fine if you would.
Speaker 1: You know, you hadn't had any thoughts about these things before,
and now Trump says no, no, no, everybody's wrong. I'm right,
and you're like, okay, I'm gonna go with Trump. Okay,
but it's not going to change. It's that doesn't force
me to change too, and threatening my job is not
going to do it either. I made a good living
before I got back to WBT. So your threats about
that stuff don't. Actually they don't land the way you
may think they do. And if this isn't, if you
haven't thought these things, said, these things, emailed these things,
And I'm obviously not talking to you. I'm just letting
others know that it doesn't work on me. I don't
need to cheer lead for policy that I don't think
is correct, and me pointing out the problems or raising
the questions of the policy doesn't mean I hate Trump,
and it doesn't mean that I want him to fail,
and it doesn't mean I hate American and it doesn't
mean I'm a globalist all of these things. Okay, So
I just want to set that, set that out on
the table before we begin, because this is going to
be a bumpy ride, that's what the White House says.
So if you don't want to hear about the bumps,
then I guess you know, tune out from the news
for however long the short term pain is. And again
I don't know how long that short term pain is
going be. There was a famous quote, I think it
was Reagan. He said, you know, he's looking for.
Speaker 2: A one arm economist. Do you ever hear this joke?
The one armed economist?
Speaker 3: All right.
Speaker 1: If you're listening to this show, you know I try
to keep up with all sorts of current events, and
I know you do too, And you've probably heard me
say get your news from multiple sources. Why well, because
it's how you detect media bias, which is why I've
been so impressed with ground News. It's an app, and
it's a website, and it combines news from around the
world in one place, so you can compare coverage and
verify information. You can check it out at check dot ground,
dot news slash pete. I put the link in the
podcast description too. I started using ground News a few
months ago and more recently chose to work with them
as an affiliate because it lets me see clearly how
stories get covered and by whom. The blind spot feature
shows you which stories get ignored by the left and
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only helps my podcast, but it also supports ground News
as they make the media landscape more transparent. Kevin writes
in to Pete at the Pete klenershow dot com. He says,
I really do hope this is six dimensional chess with
these tariffs. But Pete, remember this is the same guy
that said Haitians are eating the dogs and eating the cats.
Speaker 2: That one, that one statement flip the switch in my head.
I hoped, I hoped I was wrong, but had suspected
something isn't quite right.
Speaker 1: All right, So I said, I would tell you about
the one armed economist. I believe it was Ronald Reagan,
and he made a joke about how he wished he'd
only had one arm economists on staff, because whenever he
would talk to his economists, they would say, well, on
the one hand, this could happen and it would be good.
But on the other hand, this could happen and it
would be bad. And then on the other hand, this
and that and whatever, right, and what's the uh, what's
the premise of the joke? There the truth, the truth
that makes the joke funny, which is that it is
nearly impossible to predict a national global economy and the
reactions and the movements and all of that because of
all of the factors in an economy. I keep hammering away.
At this point, the free market is all of us.
It is you, it is me. That is the free market.
When you go to the store, from the from the
the time you choose to go right to the sale
that they may be offering, to the products that you
purchase at every single step along that way, along that journey,
there are an infinite number of factors at play. Impulse
buying at a grocery store, stuff like that marketing you saw.
Do you remember did I need to get that coffee?
I don't remember. I'll just go ahead and buy it.
You see, like there were all these factors that central
planning can never account for. So stay free. And the
more that you get GOV co involved in these kinds
of command control decisions, the less free the free market
you will be. That's always been sort of my baseline.
That's like my default position is always towards more freedom.
That's not to say I cannot be persuaded. As I
have repeatedly said, but people don't hear, which is that
if this all turns out to be to play out
exactly as everybody is telling me it's going to play out,
and this is all going to be awesome for America,
then I will obviously change my opinion because I don't
hold opinions that I know to be false. But my
question is, if it doesn't turn out that way, do
the proponents change their opinions or is somebody else to
blame for that? Is it going to be another sort
of not my fault like Gary mcfatten our sheriff pulls.
It's always somebody else's fault if it doesn't work out.
You know, there was a call I got years ago
during the two thousand and eight election. It was right
after the two thousand and eight election. I was sitting
right in this chair and a guy called in and
he said he never thought he would see the day
when America would elect a black president. And I asked
him why, and he said, well, as a as a
black man, I didn't think that white Americans would ever
vote for a black candidate. This is after Obama had won.
And so I asked him, does your opinion of Americans
white Americans? Does that now change? And he said no.
So even even when the evidence came back and proved
that his opinion, his belief was incorrect, he still couldn't
change his opinion. That's bigotry, by the way, that's what
that is. So that's what I guard against for myself. Again,
your mileage may vary. All right, Let's go over and
talk with Clyde. Hello, Clyde, welcome to the show.
Speaker 4: Thank god after me, Thank you, sir.
Speaker 2: What's going on?
Speaker 4: I think he's playing a big game of chicken in
this deal. And if you're not going to see all
these tariffs on there for very long, he knows how
to make deals, and I'm thinking within a few days
you're gonna start seeing a bunch of them disappear because
he's pulling out these people for screwing us for years
that nobody else has had to go the ads to
address this problem. But I think he's just playing chicken
with these guys and they're going to blink first on
this deed.
Speaker 1: So when playing chicken, I'm thinking in terms of like,
you know, two guys in the fifties, you know, with
their hot rods driving towards each other, and then one
of them is going to pull away, you know, So
what happens if neither side pulls away.
Speaker 4: Well, then that's the problem. And you're exactly right, you
don't know what's going to happen, but you've got the
leverage on this, and we you know, the riches and
so forth, and I think it's what's gonna happen. That's
just my opinion.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I mean that's speculative, and I'm hoping that
if that is the play, which by the way, the
White House said it wasn't that they're not trying to
negotiate this stuff. But maybe they are, and they're just
lying and saying that they're not trying to negotiate.
Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know.
Speaker 1: And that's the concern is that they may not have
a strategy. You're assuming that that is the strategy and
hoping that it is the case, and because if it's not,
then it's it's going to get very bad.
Speaker 4: That's true. And I'm just hoping that's, you know, the
way he's dealt with things in the past, and he's
got this little brain power that we don't know about.
I'm thinking that's exactly what he's gotten in mind.
Speaker 1: Well, let's hope so Clyde have a great weekend, sir.
I appreciate it, hiybody, Yeah, I see it. China announced
today that it's imposing tariffs on us. It's increasing its
tariffs imposed thirty four percent tariffs on the US. That's
the same amount that Trump put on them. So reciprocal,
you might say, although ours were reciprocal, but now there's
a reciprocal You see how trade wars start because there
is a there is an incentive to escalate. The new
tariffs from China against the US go into effect April tenth,
according to the Wall Street Journal. And then there's this
from the communists over there, this gravely VI he's there
talking about this is hang on a second.
Speaker 2: This is their.
Speaker 1: Foreign Ministry spokesperson Gaun who said, I think I pronounced
that right.
Speaker 2: He says, I think it's a He says.
Speaker 1: This gravely violates World Trade Organization rules and undermines the
rules based multilateral trading system. And we have a lot
of experience doing this too, so we would know, like, guys,
you're you're not the ones to make this argument China,
you guys are not the ones to make it. And
remember rule number one when dealing with communists is what
communists lie, they lie. So I don't care what you're
rat estional is you want to slap the tariffs on
and retaliation, go for it. I expected that, I expect
by the way, me personally, I have no idea if
this will happen, and I hope it doesn't. But my
expectation is that a whole bunch of other countries are
going to hit hit us with uh these taxes too,
with the tariffs also, that's my expectation. Now, I hope
I'm disappointed, not disappointed, but I hope I'm wrong. So like,
because if I'm wrong, then they don't hit us with
all of the tariffs and we've got a good resolution.
Speaker 2: That's awesome.
Speaker 1: But yeah, no, I'm I'm yeah, maybe uh maybe that's
a little pessimistic, but that's how I think these other
countries are going to start reacting if they can't get
their own carve outs.
Speaker 2: As Clyde said, so.
Speaker 1: Now everyone's going to go and negotiate with Donald Trump
separately to try to get the deals and all of this. So,
by the way, I have a question regarding because Clyde
also mentioned that, you know, no one else has stood
up to these other countries and did this thing. And
and it's important to keep in mind that there is
a difference between a trade deficit and barriers that includes tariffs,
trade barriers. A trade barrier yes, can can impact the
trade deficit, but a deficit does not automatically mean that
there are barriers in place or tariffs in place. That's
not an automatic thing. It's like a square is a rahmbus,
but a rambas is not a square kind of a thing.
A barrier can, yes, create more trade deficit, but a
trade deficit doesn't automatically mean that they've got barriers. It
might just mean, for example, if I'm digging a lot
of coal, by country is dirt poor, but we got
a lot of coal, and so are people. My people
are digging coal. We don't have any factories to do
anything with it because we are poor. We have no investment,
we have no roads, we have a barely functioning government
or whatever. And so we dig out this coal and
America comes along and says, hey, we'll buy that coal. Okay,
this was like a decade or so ago before we
band all the coal, but you get the idea here,
so like, we'll buy that coal. So they buy all
of the coal. So now my poor country is selling
all of this coal, but we have no money to
buy anything from America.
Speaker 2: So we have a surplus. We have a trade surplus.
Speaker 1: Because we don't have any money to buy the stuff
that you're making because we're poor, So are we.
Speaker 2: Are? Are we cheating? Are we taking advantage of America?
Speaker 1: Are?
Speaker 3: Like?
Speaker 1: This is the problem with this way of thinking about
a trade deficit. A trade deficit is different than just
like a fiscal deficit on your government books. And I
think a lot of people are conflating these things together
that somehow it's a loss of money and it simply
means that we are buying more from another country than
they are buying from us. And by the way, the
data that the White House was using is only for goods,
it's not for services, and America is seventy seven percent
service based economy.
Speaker 2: So keep in mind.
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so let's get to some of the emails. First Joseph,
who says, Pete, you're letting the markets and the business
pundits activate your spiritual boomer.
Speaker 2: That's not true. It's been two days.
Speaker 1: So when I started the show, I made a joke
about the markets being down again as they were yesterday,
and so I asked the question, how long is the
short term paint? And so this is the attack on
me for asking how much pain are we actually looking
at and for how long?
Speaker 2: And for just asking the question.
Speaker 1: I am what did he say here activating my spiritual
boomer dude? I'm a gen xer pound sand dude. It's
like that doesn't that doesn't work on me. The gen
x like I am more towards the individual than the
collective than the Boomers were. So this globalist con has
been going on for forty years. It's not going to
go quietly, but it must go. The two hundred dollar
fifty inch flat screen isn't worth a hollowed out nation
of gig workers and onlyfan models. That is a false choice.
But duly noted that we will own nothing and be happy,
which sounds a lot like somebody else I've heard recently
talking about a new reset of the global order. No, look,
I'm sure, I'm sure everybody's going to be very satisfied
going back to a factory job twisting caps onto toothpaste tubes.
Sewing Nike sneakers and such, and then making you know,
eighty ninety one hundred thousand dollars a year for that
factory job, and only being able to afford you know,
a single television in the home.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 2: See, I can play the false choice game too, Joseph.
Speaker 1: Come on, man, Greg says, My biggest gripe with Donald
Trump being the nominee in this recent election is his
loyal MAGA following. There are a lot of independent thinkers
and smart folks in Maga, sure, but most of the
mega people I know are much more shallow on the issues,
and they just love Donald Trump no matter what. And
by the way, that is always the case in you know,
in any election with any candidate, there are people that
just love the candidate and you know, the facts don't
matter or whatever. That's enough, that's their god. They look
at it like a team sport. I think there's a
main source or sorry, I think that's a main source
of this crazy tariff Dumpy just released. He knows that
he will remain the savior to most of his base
no matter what he does. My point is a politician
that doesn't fear losing his base is sure to be
reckless and take large risks like the one we are
witnessing now.
Speaker 2: But I hope it works.
Speaker 1: Rick says, I suspect that Thomas Sole is highly regarded
across the political spectrum, but particularly so among those who
lean to the right. His book Basic Economics is an
excellent source of information to help one better understand how
economics work. In Basic Economics the book, there is a
chapter on international trade. He explains very clearly why tariffs
have unintended negative consequences and cites historic examples. I recommend
this book highly. I do actually have Thomas Sol gave
an interview a couple of m there's a couple of
years ago, but it was I think during the first
I've got it here someplace in the stack of stuff.
His commentary on the first round of tariffs that Trump
did in the first term. So let's see here is Chuck.
It sounds like you climbed on the fence, Pete.
Speaker 2: See.
Speaker 1: This is the kind of stuff I get when when
I disagree with anything Donald Trump does. I don't have
to attack Donald Trump. I don't have to say anything
negative about him. No, No, it's just hey, he did something.
It's like I don't Yeah, I'm not a fan of
that policy. And it's like you suck pete Like guys, really,
so you're saying that I have to agree with every
single thing Donald Trump says and does. That's ridiculous. That's ridiculous.
There isn't anybody you should agree with one hundred percent
of the time.
Speaker 2: Goes on.
Speaker 1: He is not a politician. He is the president. No, chuck,
he's a politician. In fact, he said he was. He
said he was. He made a comment at a stump
speech a couple of years ago, and he talked about politicians,
and then he said, well, I guess I guess I'm
one of those politicians. Now, huh Yeah. When you run
for a political office and then you win that political
office and hold it and then run again for reelection
and win it again, you're a politician. He's not not
a politician just because you like him. Politicians have been
running this kacas show for how long He's had to
fight dang near everyone every step of the way. Why not,
good Lord, give him a chance?
Speaker 2: What have I said?
Speaker 1: What have I said for the last twenty four hours
since they unveiled this regime?
Speaker 2: What have I said?
Speaker 1: This goes against everything that I have ever learned about
tariffs and international economics. And maybe I'm wrong, and maybe
all those other people have been wrong all this time.
And if you think that that's the case, good on you.
It doesn't matter to me. I really don't care if
people disagree with me, But apparently people think people really
do care if.
Speaker 2: I disagree with them. So I hope it works.
Speaker 1: It would be fantastic if whatever it is that they're
trying to do works and it redounds to the benefit
of Americans, and then I will discard all that I
knew or thought I knew about international economics and tariffs.
Speaker 2: That's what I've said. But this is too far. This
is a bridge too far, all right?
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video dot com. I was also advised yesterday to stop
scaring people by talking about the tariffs and the concerns
that I have about them.
Speaker 2: No, I'm I'm.
Speaker 1: Not gonna stop talking about the concerns I have about
what I'm seeing.
Speaker 2: That's like, literally what I do.
Speaker 1: You're talking about a reset of the global international trade order.
I think it's worth a couple of conversations now, Eric,
Welcome to the show.
Speaker 3: Hello, Eric, Hey, Pete, Hey, what's up. It's not that
here's my point or my problem with the argument that
you've been taking is which argument that the terrorists, like
you know that all these economics are economicists that you
know they they're against terrorists. It's bad, it's going to
be terrible. All that.
Speaker 2: I've not made that argument.
Speaker 3: Okay, here's much. Let me just talk my point.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, but if you're gonna but it sounds like
you don't know what my argument what I've said, So
if you're going to make a point that's like encounter
to it's a counter argument is something I've said, I
would like it to be something.
Speaker 3: I've said, Well, haven't you said that you know, all
these economists throughout the years, through you know, one hundred
years of history or saying tariffs are bad.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that they write they for well, they do a
number of things that are you know, unintended consequences. They
create inflation, they stifle innovation, They are tax on the uh,
the domestic population.
Speaker 3: Okay, well here's here's my problem is Okay, we know
I think I think we agree that all these other
countries are using tariffs. Now I know you've made the
point because I listened yesterday that said well that's bad too,
But the problem is they're doing it. So how can
we fight that do we just unilaterally say, which is
what we've been doing for forty years and not have
a lot of tariffs. So countries have taken advantage of that,
So what's our response? How can we correct that? Right?
Speaker 1: So if and I said this yesterday too, that if
the approach was to actually do reciprocal tariffs. For example,
you got a country that you know, sells a lot
of bananas into our country, and uh we and then
we try to sell something into their country, say you know,
I don't know banana milkshakes, and they are like, well,
we're going to tear if you're banana milkshakes. Okay, well
then we're going to tear if you're banana is at
the same rate. But like, that would be a reciprocal tariff, right.
Speaker 3: Right, But isn't what Trump's I agree, I agree. I
would have liked to see Trump just do reciprocal. If
Vietnam is charging US thirty percent, we would do thirty.
But I think his approach was, Okay, I'm not going
to go that hard line yet, so I'll say I'll
cut these guys at break and say we won't we
won't do full reciprocal yet. But I just this this
is the argument from the one side that doesn't like
this seems to be like a unilateral surrender, like let's
just keep doing what we're doing, which look what has
bought us.
Speaker 2: No, that's not, but.
Speaker 1: That's not I have not heard anybody say let's just
keep doing what we're doing. There's no dis agreement that
if you've got an unfair trade practice going on and
you want to target with reciprocal tariffs, that that is
a legitimate thing to pursue, right to go after another
country or to you know, to slap them with tariffs,
which apparently that's the only thing you can do with tariffs.
Speaker 2: It's only slapping. I don't know why, but you only slap, right,
So that's yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So like I like, I'm I've not seen anybody
making the making the case that we have to you know,
keep on the same path. Everybody has known what Donald
Trump has thought about tariffs for you know, decades, right,
He said the same thing about tariffs, but he also
seems to just like tariffs as the end in and
of itself. He sees tariffs as just a good thing
to do, and it may not even be a means
to a different end, because if you could go to zero,
like for example South Korea. South Korea, you know what
their their tariff is on America. It's like less than
one percent, and we just nailed them with the ten
percent baseline plus more. Brazil has a We have a
surplus trading against Brazil and they got hit with terriffs.
Speaker 2: That's what I mean.
Speaker 1: This doesn't make sense, unless, of course, it's just because
you like terrafs.
Speaker 2: That's the problem.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I agree if that, I don't know that kind
of detail, and if that's true, then yeah, I don't
agree with that. I agree with I think where you're
at that you said, yes, I agree with doing reciprocal
in Paris, but I just don't think we just do nothing,
which is pretty much is what's been happening for the
last whatever since maybe NaSTA nineties, and it seems like
that's not the way to go. And Trump's at least
trying to address it.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: No, Look, he is definitely trying to, you know, turn
over the tables and prompt a a you know, a
radical realignment of some kind. And the problem is, I
don't know what that what that looks like. I don't
know what the end goal is, and I keep getting
mixed messages, and then I'm told, well, that's part of
the strategy is for everybody to be confused, and so
then when I express the confusion, I'm then attacked because
I'm confused, and I'm told basically shut up and just
follow along, It'll all work out, and like, I'm not
going to do that, so I keep So I'm just
pointing out the confusion and the questions that I've got.
Like Brazil, I think you mentioned somebody mentioned Vietnam. I
think you may have mentioned just mentioned Vietnam. You know,
Vietnam just moved a whole bunch of or companies moved
a whole bunch of their production lines out of China
into Vietnam in order to comply with Trump's tariff stuff
last time. So now they've moved everything to Vietnam, and
now Vietnam just got nailed.
Speaker 2: So it's like, what do you like? What is it
that we're trying to do?
Speaker 1: And you know, if the tariffs go up and they
reduce consumption of these foreign made products in America, and
those companies are going to try to stay in business
and make sales, who do you think they're going to
sell to? I suspect they're going to sell to their neighbors,
and that's a concern Also that I've got is that
you're basically pushing these uh, these other countries to deepen
their ties with communists China and help communists China when
it actually looks like right now they're in some severe problems.
They're having severe problems.
Speaker 3: True, but don't don't we have the leverage. I mean,
everybody wants to we have some Yeah, yeah, it is China.
I mean, they're not going to let other like France
or some of these other countries get into their market either.
So it feels I feel like we have the leverage
if we can.
Speaker 1: Let they'll let Southeast Asian nations like they're going to
just like their belt in Road initiatives, they're going to
they're going to try and deepen those ties with their
neighbors because they're trying to create h hegemony there or
hegemony there. You know, they're trying to as certain control
over that sphere, that hemisphere. And so my concern is
that this gives them a really good, a really wide lane.
Speaker 2: To run in.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I agree with you that. I'm also in the
camp of Okay, there's definitely some skeps is a little
worry of where's this going to go? But again it's
this hasn't been ever tried. Like, I think it's worth
the effort. Yes, this could turn out badly, but I
think something had to be done, right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Look again, I can agree that that the course
needed to be corrected. I can agree that reciprocal tariffs
would be appropriate when you're dealing with barriers put up
by other countries. Absolutely, but I like, I don't know
if this is the way that is that you best
achieved that. And again, like as I said, like, there
are unintended consequences to this, and this has like tariffs
have been done over the course of the last you know, millennia.
These things have been done, and America has a history
that economists look at and they see the results and
it's like, yeah, this is generally not a great thing.
And also, these figures that the Trump administration has been
using are not They don't include services, and we quote
export a lot of services, and people disagree with that,
and that's a fundamental question.
Speaker 2: I think that's at the heart of this.
Speaker 1: Also is that there are people that want to see
America go back to a predominantly manufacturer manufacturing export country
versus a services export country. And so that's why they
like this idea is they think it's going to get
them there, it's going to get us there, but we're already.
We're still the number two manufacturing country in the world
behind China. All right, that'll do it for this episode.
Thank you so much for listening. I could not do
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